1 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:11,119 Speaker 1: Welcome to Prognosis. I'm Laura Carlson. It's day since coronavirus 2 00:00:11,240 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: was declared a global pandemic. Our main story today. The 3 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 1: question of whether healthy people should wear masks to protect 4 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:23,799 Speaker 1: from COVID nineteen has been surprisingly hard to answer, Even 5 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: as more places adopt widespread maskius, health agencies can't agree 6 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 1: on their official recommendations. The shifting rules around covering our 7 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:36,159 Speaker 1: faces have made it harder to trust authorities about what 8 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: will control the spread of the virus. But first, here's 9 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: what happened today. New York State reported its largest increase 10 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: in coronavirus deaths on Tuesday. Even so, there are signs 11 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: that infection rates in New York are leveling off. The 12 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: number of new cases reported has steadily dropped since Friday's peak. 13 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 1: The United Kingdom also reported a record number of deaths 14 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 1: in a single day, but in China, for the first 15 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,119 Speaker 1: time since the pandemic emerged in December, the country said 16 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:23,759 Speaker 1: it had no new deaths. The Chinese government formally ended 17 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:27,119 Speaker 1: the lockdown in Wuhan, the city where the outbreak first emerged, 18 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 1: after seventy six days. The strict measures imposed to combat 19 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 1: the virus have been lifted. How Speaker Nancy Pelosi says 20 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 1: Congress's next stimulus bill to prop up the U S 21 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:42,920 Speaker 1: economy will be at least another one trillion dollars. On 22 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: a private conference call with Democrats, the Speaker said the 23 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 1: package would focus on replenishing funds for programs. Those funds 24 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: had been established in Congress's two point to trillion dollar 25 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 1: virus Relief Bill, which was signed into law last month. 26 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: Pelosi said there should be a dish a direct payments 27 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 1: to individuals, extended unemployment insurance, more resources for food stamps, 28 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,519 Speaker 1: and more funds for the Payroll Protection Plan that provides 29 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 1: loans to small businesses. Now for today's main story, US 30 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: health officials and the World Health Organization are sending conflicting 31 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 1: signals on the value of wearing masks in public. At 32 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:31,519 Speaker 1: the start of the coronavirus outbreak, the world's leading health 33 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: authorities told the public that there was no need for 34 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: masks unless you were ill or looking after someone who was. 35 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 1: But after more studies suggested people without symptoms could be 36 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: spreading the virus, the US Centers for Disease Control and 37 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 1: Prevention recently changed their guidelines suggesting people cover their faces 38 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 1: to help slow transmission. The World Health Organization, though held 39 00:02:56,080 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: back from making the same recommendation. The confused and over 40 00:03:00,520 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: face masks is just one more example of how our 41 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 1: understanding of the virus and how to fight against it 42 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 1: is constantly changing. As London based Bloomberg News reporter James 43 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 1: Payton explains, this changing messaging makes it hard for the 44 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:20,360 Speaker 1: public to know what information to take seriously. It also 45 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: presents challenges in persuading people to change their behavior to 46 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:30,120 Speaker 1: help prevent future pandemics. The streets of London or New 47 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: York today look much different than they did even a 48 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 1: week ago. Lots of people have their faces covered somewhere 49 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 1: commercial surgical mass, others improvised with bandanas or so their own. 50 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 1: A few even sport that coveted, and nine mass that 51 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 1: are in such short supply among healthcare providers. What's clear 52 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: is that something has changed in these cities. Until recently, 53 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:54,480 Speaker 1: few people were mass in public. What's not clear is 54 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: how much they help. Outside of hospitals and clinics. The 55 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 1: w h O and CDC are now at odds so 56 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: over whether everyone should wear mass. Dr Anthony Fauci is 57 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 1: America's top medical expert on the coronavirus. He recently appeared 58 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 1: on Fox News to say even simple coverings could make 59 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: a difference, especially for those situations when you're at the 60 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: grocery store or pharmacy, for instance, and it's difficult to 61 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 1: stay six ft away from others. Because of some recent 62 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 1: information that the virus can actually be spread even when 63 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:29,279 Speaker 1: people just speak, as opposed to coughing and sneezing, the 64 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 1: better part of valor is that when you're out and 65 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 1: you can't maintain that six foot distance, to wear some 66 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:44,799 Speaker 1: sort of facial covering. Health officials say basic mass won't 67 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 1: protect you if you're healthy, but they worry that if 68 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:49,600 Speaker 1: you are infected and don't show any signs of sickness, 69 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 1: you could unwittingly spread the disease. A number of countries 70 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 1: and cities around the world have already embraced the idea 71 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 1: of wearing masks in public check citizens have in ordered 72 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: to wear masks outside their homes, and officials from New 73 00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:06,040 Speaker 1: York to Los Angeles have instructed residents to cover up. Meanwhile, 74 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: the WHO is still urging people to wear mass if 75 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,280 Speaker 1: they show symptoms or they're taking care of those who 76 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: are ill. The shifting recommendations are coming as scientists race 77 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: to understand the virus and how it spreads. A study 78 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 1: published last week and the journal Nature showed that flat 79 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: surgical face masks reduced the droplets released from the nose 80 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: and mouth into the air, and there are some indications 81 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:31,680 Speaker 1: the widespread wearing of mass could have helped lower transmission 82 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:36,479 Speaker 1: and outbreaks of other respiratory illnesses such as stars and influenza. 83 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:40,160 Speaker 1: While a scientific consensus has yet to emerge, the research 84 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 1: and supportive face mass is growing. But while health officials 85 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: are pushing this message that everyone should wear masks, it 86 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: also could create new problems. Scott Gottlieb is a former 87 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 1: Food and Drug Administration commissioner. Key points to one debate 88 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:56,920 Speaker 1: around wearing a mask. Even if it can cut down 89 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: on transmission, it's likely a lot of people will use 90 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 1: it incorrectly and still potentially spread the virus. They'll reuse 91 00:06:04,920 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: the mask. If they have a mask on, they're going 92 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:08,560 Speaker 1: to be more apt to touch their face, and so 93 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 1: that's why health professionals say, well, masks in the general 94 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,720 Speaker 1: population don't really reduce the risk because most people aren't 95 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: gonna wear it right. They're gonna wear one mask for 96 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 1: a whole week. They're not going to change it. It's 97 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: gonna get more, it's gonna get contaminated. When they have 98 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:22,560 Speaker 1: the mask on, they're gonna be constantly adjusting it, and 99 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 1: that's going to increase the risk that they transmit infection 100 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: because a lot of the transmission is through touching of 101 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:31,120 Speaker 1: contaminated surfaces and then touching your face. But the value 102 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:34,239 Speaker 1: of the mask, the real substantial value is in cutting 103 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: the risk of transmission. So when you have a virus 104 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:39,919 Speaker 1: like this where a lot of the transmission is asymptomatic, people, 105 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 1: if you mandate that they wear masks when they go out, 106 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:45,520 Speaker 1: it's gonna cut their risk of giving the infection to you. 107 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 1: Another risk is that promoting mass will give the public 108 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 1: a false sense of protection that would encourage them to 109 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: go out more and abandon physical distancing. Health authorities also 110 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: discourage wearing mass out of fear that people would hoard 111 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,720 Speaker 1: them that could worsen shortages for doctors, nurses, and other 112 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 1: healthcare workers. Even if authorities aren't recommending the highly protective 113 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: surgical grade products that are scarce and used in hospitals, 114 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 1: wearing masks to limit disease transmission is a common practice 115 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 1: in many Asian countries. It took off during the Stars 116 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: epidemic of two thousand three, and health authorities there say 117 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 1: wearing masks can make a real difference. Widespread mask use 118 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 1: was cited as one of the reasons Hong Kong limited 119 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 1: the number of coronavirus cases and deaths. Now the CDC 120 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 1: is following. Asia's lead officials say mass do help limit 121 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: that transmission, and to solve the issue of shortages, have 122 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: emphasized that the type of mass ordinary people where need 123 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: not be hospital grade. New York City mayor build A Blasio, 124 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: ordered the city's residents to cover their face with just 125 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: about anything last week. Let's be clear, this is a 126 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 1: face covering. Again. We'll talk about the details in the moment. 127 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 1: But it could be a scarf. Uh, It could be 128 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 1: something you create yourself at home. It could be a bandana. 129 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 1: It does not not need to be professional surgical mask. 130 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 1: In fact, we don't want you to use the kinds 131 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 1: of masks that our first responders need. Scott Gottlieb, the 132 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 1: former FDA commissioner, put together a roadmap for escaping the 133 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 1: crisis with several other experts, published by the American Enterprise Institute, 134 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:30,320 Speaker 1: the conservative think tank. They suggest everyone, including those without symptoms, 135 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 1: should cover up. Gotlieb says, we just need to get 136 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,560 Speaker 1: over our discomfort with the idea. Introducing the mask as 137 00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 1: you lift those shelter and place orders might be a 138 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 1: good way to have a slow transition towards, you know, 139 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,199 Speaker 1: people going out again, and we might become a culture 140 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: going forward where the wearing of masks in public, um, 141 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: you know, is more common. I think we might have 142 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 1: made a mistake by shaming the use of masks at 143 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:56,680 Speaker 1: the outset as heavily as we did. A lot of 144 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:59,480 Speaker 1: people have masks at home right now. They bought masks, 145 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 1: they have they've had them for a long time, and 146 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:03,440 Speaker 1: they're reluctant to wear them because they, you know, they 147 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: were ashamed into not wearing them. So they have something 148 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: that could potentially be affording them a certain degree of 149 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: protection and not even using it. And so I think 150 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: we need to rethink how we how we think about masks, 151 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 1: how we talk about masks with consumers, how we educate 152 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 1: consumers to use masks appropriately, because on the margin, they're 153 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: probably incrementally helpful when used appropriately in the right setting. 154 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: If wearing masks in public places where it's difficult to 155 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 1: maintain a distance. Is a prudent way to help slow 156 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 1: the spread of the coronavirus. It begs the question should 157 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,200 Speaker 1: we have been wearing them all along? The director of 158 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 1: the Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention, George Gau, 159 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:43,280 Speaker 1: told the journal Science last month he believes America and 160 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 1: Europe were making a big mistake by not telling the 161 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: public to wear masks during the widening epidemic. That suggests 162 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: we could look back on this as a missed opportunity. 163 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 1: For now, there's likely to be more confusion over mass wearing. 164 00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:00,679 Speaker 1: Maybe the best advice is just where something over your 165 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: face when you go out. As New York Governor Andrew 166 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: Cuomo said last week, it couldn't hurt. Assuming you keep 167 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,400 Speaker 1: your guard up, You'll probably have plenty of company. What 168 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: would have drawn stairs in the US or Europe just 169 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 1: a few weeks ago is increasingly normal. And that was 170 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,599 Speaker 1: James Payton in London. And that's it for the Prognosis 171 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:42,840 Speaker 1: Daily edition. For more on the pandemic from our bureaus 172 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: around the world, visit Bloomberg dot com slash coronavirus, and 173 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 1: if you like the podcast, please take a moment to 174 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:52,839 Speaker 1: rate us and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts 175 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: or Spotify. It helps more listeners find our global reporting. 176 00:10:57,320 --> 00:11:00,679 Speaker 1: The Prognosis Daily edition is hosted by Me Laura Carlson. 177 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 1: The show is produced by Me Tophor Forehaz, Jordan Gaspoure, 178 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: and Magnus Hendrickson. Additional reporting by James Peyton. Original music 179 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 1: by Leo Sidrian. Our editors are Francesco Levi and Rick Shine. 180 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 1: Francesco Levi is Bloomberg's head of podcasts. Thanks for listening.