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Speaker 1: Tot Mom Casey Anthony, why won't she go away or

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Speaker 1: do something productive with her life, like raise money for

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Speaker 1: the poor, go work at a homeless shelter, do something

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Speaker 1: other than get into fights at bars. Now listen, unless

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Speaker 1: it's got crime scene tape around it, I'm not concerned.

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Speaker 1: But it's just striking to me that when her daughter,

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Speaker 1: two year old Kelly, was found wrapped in a blanket

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Speaker 1: with duct tape all around her mouth and nose on

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Speaker 1: her skull which was by then skeletonized, wrapped in a

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Speaker 1: blanket and in a trash bag a few houses down

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Speaker 1: from the Anthony home, in a swampy area behind a school,

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Speaker 1: tot Mom Casey Anthony insisted at trial that her daughter

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Speaker 1: had actually drowned, and that for some reason, instead of

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Speaker 1: calling nine one one, they decided to bag her body

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Speaker 1: and throw it in a swamp. That said, why is

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Speaker 1: it so easy for her to call nine one one?

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Speaker 1: At a fight between bar flies? A bar fight, barfly

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Speaker 1: taught mom Casey Anthony gets a drink thrown on her

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Speaker 1: and then she thinks to call nine one one. You

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Speaker 1: know what, let's hear it from the horse's mouth. Take

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Speaker 1: a listen to this, No goad nine one one. What

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Speaker 1: if he had to hear emergency nine emergency. Can you

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Speaker 1: have West Palm come over for and incident report? Okay?

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Speaker 1: What is the address? Um, it's o shade, it's right

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Speaker 1: next to the department. It's in the five hundred blocks. Okay,

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Speaker 1: thirty one from out of street. Let's see incident. Um,

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Speaker 1: it's an assault. It's a throne drink. It's an assault.

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Speaker 1: It's a throne drink. I just paused there because I thought,

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Speaker 1: certainly there had to be more to a nine one

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Speaker 1: one call calling nine one one because you got wet

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Speaker 1: at a bar because you had a hair fight when

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Speaker 1: another woman over some guy you both dated. But when

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Speaker 1: you're a daughter, according to you drowned in the pool,

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Speaker 1: which of course is not what happened. You didn't call

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Speaker 1: nine one one. You know what, Let's listen to a

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Speaker 1: little bit more of this nine one one call that

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Speaker 1: has just emerged repeated into no, I'm still here. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there was a repeated incident. It was harassment on top

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Speaker 1: of the repeated drink throwing drink and they threw a

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Speaker 1: drink at you. Yeah, thank you, I'm finally it was

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Speaker 1: a repeated incident. It was a verbal of thought outside

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Speaker 1: and that's throw drinking inside, Okay, And I would like yeah, no,

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Speaker 1: I would just like to make an official report, make

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Speaker 1: an official report with me an all star panel to

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Speaker 1: make sense of it all. First of all, John W.

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Speaker 1: Deal personal injury lawyer joining me out of that jurisdiction, Florida,

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Speaker 1: author of the method proven Techniques for Winning jury Trials

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Speaker 1: at John W. Deal dot com, and he actually represented

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Speaker 1: Zenaida Gonzalez. Does that name ring a bell? It does

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Speaker 1: to me because in one of talking Abo'm Casey Anthony's

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Speaker 1: other stories, she told police as to why she waited

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Speaker 1: over a month to report her baby missing was because

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Speaker 1: the nanny had taken the baby and that nanny was

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Speaker 1: Zenaida Gonzales. Well, there is a real Zenaida Gonzalez, not

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Speaker 1: the ones she made up in her head, who suffered

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Speaker 1: a great deal after being named the kidnapper of Little KILLI,

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Speaker 1: which was of course a lie. He knows this case

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Speaker 1: inside and out, and with me were now New York

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Speaker 1: psychologist who has covered the case from the very beginning.

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Speaker 1: Along with me, Karen started joining us out of Manhattan.

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Speaker 1: You can find her at Karen start with ac dot com.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Tim Gallagher medical examiner for the entire state of Florida,

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Speaker 1: while I wish he had been on that witness stand,

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Speaker 1: Doctor Gallagher. You can find him at pathcaremed dot com.

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Speaker 1: Also University of Florida Medical School for Instinct Medicine. Renowned

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Speaker 1: lecturer Chris Byers, former police chief John's create twenty five

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Speaker 1: years on the force, now private investigator and polygrapher at

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Speaker 1: Chris Buyers Investigations and polygraph dot com. But first to

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Speaker 1: Steve Helen, senior writer with People dot com. Wow, I

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Speaker 1: gotta say we should have a lot of memories from

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Speaker 1: the top mom Casey Anthony trial. Steve Helling, and he

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Speaker 1: is the author of Outrage the Casey Anthony's Story. But

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Speaker 1: wait a minute, Steve Helling, First, there's more. Take a

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Speaker 1: listen to this. Okay, where is the person that threw

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Speaker 1: the drink? She's already left around as the whole Okay,

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Speaker 1: but I have your information, her data, birth, her phone number. Okay,

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Speaker 1: just so if it happens again, so I can file

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Speaker 1: her restraining order. It has happened repeatedly. Okay, what is

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Speaker 1: your name? Please? Any good data? Birth? I near phone number?

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Speaker 1: All right, I had a column for service. You're gonna

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Speaker 1: get someone out there as soon as possible. Okay, thank

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Speaker 1: you so much. I appreciate it. No com bo by

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Speaker 1: to Chris Buyer's former police chief, John's Creek Chief. When

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Speaker 1: you are dealing with murders, rapes, child molestations, arsons, aggravated assault,

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Speaker 1: arm robberies, and you get a call from a bar

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Speaker 1: that somebody got a drink pored on them, yeah, that's Unfortunately.

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Speaker 1: Calls like that happened way too often and take the

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Speaker 1: focus of law enforcement away from actual enforcement of the

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Speaker 1: law and investigating actual crimes to deal with petty stuff

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Speaker 1: like this and people that can't solve their own problems,

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Speaker 1: and especially when you put this in the perspective of

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Speaker 1: who this is, it really is just an annoyance. Now

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Speaker 1: to Steve Helling, senior writer with People dot Com and

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Speaker 1: author of Outrage that Casey Anthony Story, Steve Helling, she

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Speaker 1: talks like she's a cop. She talks about an incident report,

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Speaker 1: She rattles off dB and phone number, a lot of

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Speaker 1: cop jargon when she calls the police. Now she claims

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Speaker 1: that she and her quote arch nemesis had dated the

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Speaker 1: same guy co incidentally in law enforcement. I don't know

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Speaker 1: what he was thinking. But what happened, Steve Helling, tell

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Speaker 1: me the whole thing. And this is with the back

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Speaker 1: drop of her not calling nine one one when she

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Speaker 1: claimed her daughter drowned in the pool. Instead of calling

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Speaker 1: nine one one, they went, oh, let's just put her

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Speaker 1: in a trash bag and throw her in the swamp. Now,

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Speaker 1: I'll take care of that. And then when her daughter's

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Speaker 1: missing over a month, it's her mother that calls nine

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Speaker 1: one one. She still doesn't call nine one one, but

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Speaker 1: her shirt gets wet as she calls nine one one. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I mean. The ridiculous thing about this is it was

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Speaker 1: really a very minor incident that she and this woman

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Speaker 1: get into this barroom argument. It needs to be noticed

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Speaker 1: that the other woman claims that Casey threw a drink

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Speaker 1: at her first. Oh my goodness, now we're going to

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Speaker 1: have a credibility contest. Wow, who should I believe? And

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Speaker 1: let me make it clear, whoever the other woman is.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that woman is a bar fly

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Speaker 1: or not, but I do know that top mom Casey

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Speaker 1: Anthony is, And I'm not judging. I don't care she

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Speaker 1: is or is not a bar fly. But every time

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Speaker 1: I hear about her. She's wearing a pair of hot

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Speaker 1: pants at a bar every time, doing shots. Every time

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Speaker 1: I hear about her. Why is it she out working

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Speaker 1: at a homeless shelter or soup line, Because that's not

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Speaker 1: who Casey is. Casey has returned to her life that

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Speaker 1: she was, you know when she was saying hot body

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Speaker 1: contests in two thousand and eight. She's in the same

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Speaker 1: world now as she was then. Nothing has changed with Casey.

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Speaker 1: And you know, we're seeing that you're bringing back a

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Speaker 1: very bad memory of her in a mini dress with

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Speaker 1: a piery go go boots on a stripper pole at

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Speaker 1: a hot body contest. You just brought that back to me.

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Speaker 1: Thanks Steve Halling for conjuring that image up in my mind.

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Speaker 1: So you're saying that this is the life she wanted,

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Speaker 1: and that's why Kelly is dead, and that's what it

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Speaker 1: seems like the life she went back to. I mean,

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Speaker 1: most of us, if we had suffered a trauma in

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Speaker 1: our life like losing a child, would reassess our lives

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Speaker 1: and think, Okay, this isn't the life I want to live.

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Speaker 1: She reassessed and said, that's the life I want. How

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Speaker 1: do I get back to it? That's what happened there,

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Speaker 1: Climb Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we are talking about

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Speaker 1: todd Mom. Casey Anthony back in the news again, and

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Speaker 1: it's not for doing something good. It's for yet another

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Speaker 1: bar incident. You were just hearing her nine one one call.

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Speaker 1: An officer takes time to go to the bar when

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Speaker 1: she's called because her shirt is wet. And now we're

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Speaker 1: hearing the body cam video and footage. We're hearing what

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Speaker 1: we can also see. Take a listen to this for

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Speaker 1: the first time, we're seeing body camp footage of cops

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Speaker 1: responding to Casey Anthony's nine one one call. I got

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Speaker 1: a drink thrown abby. This girl has been harassing me

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Speaker 1: for a while. The woman in the fedora is Casey Anthony,

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Speaker 1: the notorious mom who was acquitted ten years ago for

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Speaker 1: the murder of her daughter Kayley. We the jury finally

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Speaker 1: defendant not guilty. Now she's back in the news and

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Speaker 1: in a familiar setting, a bar. She's telling a cop

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Speaker 1: that the altercation at the bar in Florida was over

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Speaker 1: a guy like what happened person for a couple of years.

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Speaker 1: Alcolm Alison with one of your sergeants, that's right, the guy,

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Speaker 1: Casey says, they were arguing over is a police sergeant

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Speaker 1: in West Palm Beach. Whether they're together not together. She

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Speaker 1: got upset that he had texted me. I let her

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Speaker 1: know that he had and she came inside to joy

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Speaker 1: a drinking me. Do you know her name is Thelmamoia? Okay,

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Speaker 1: so she immediately rats out the other woman who I

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Speaker 1: can tell you so far as in this right, Jackie's

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Speaker 1: minute to take quiet and does not want to get

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Speaker 1: dragged into more controversy with top mom. Casey, Anthony, you

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Speaker 1: know what, congratulations of Thel Memoia. Take a listen more

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Speaker 1: of that bodycam video. Are you with him? No, he

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Speaker 1: was one of the witnesses, Eli, All of these people

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Speaker 1: were witnesses. Unfortunately, I try not to make a big

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Speaker 1: deal of things. But she's been a problem in my

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Speaker 1: late three years. Are changed her phone, I'm hill several years,

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Speaker 1: So this is the last I try doing up training. No,

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Speaker 1: this is a lost some throwing your drinking knees. But

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Speaker 1: I'm still wearing. I have several witnesses over and over,

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Speaker 1: she says, I'm still wet. I'm still wet. You know,

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Speaker 1: I want to go to a special guest joining us,

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Speaker 1: who actually handled a case for the I guess I

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Speaker 1: should say infamous or famous, depending on what your point

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Speaker 1: of view is. Zenia Gonzalez, who taught mom Casey Anthony

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Speaker 1: blamed for Keilly's disappearance. They didn't even know each other.

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Speaker 1: She taught Mom Casey Anthony got miss Gonzalez's name. We

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Speaker 1: think off an apartment visitationalist where she had visited looking

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Speaker 1: at apartments according to her, or just pulled it out

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Speaker 1: of the air. But whatever the reason, taught Mom Casey

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Speaker 1: Anthony named Sania Gonzalez is the real perpetrator. It ruined

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Speaker 1: Miss Gonzalez's life, ruined it to John W. Deal, PI

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Speaker 1: lawyer joining us out of Florida, author of the method

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Speaker 1: Proven Techniques for Winning Jury Trials. John W. Deal, thank

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Speaker 1: you for being with us. I mean, do you believe

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Speaker 1: anything that comes out of top Mom Casey Anthony's mouth. No,

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Speaker 1: it's she has an amazing skill to take facts, you know,

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Speaker 1: twist them to her advantage. Certainly, we think that's what

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Speaker 1: happened with with Senaida. It's sort of like in the

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Speaker 1: movie Usual Suspects when the person was just making up

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Speaker 1: things from words he saw, and we think that's what happened.

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Speaker 1: But unfortunately she's not above involving police because obviously the

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Speaker 1: police interviewed my client, you know, drugger through the mud

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Speaker 1: at a suspect and a kidnapping when she knew full

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Speaker 1: well that wasn't the case. So it's it's not out

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Speaker 1: of the ordinary. I don't think there's anything that miss

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Speaker 1: Anthony will say or do that surprises me at this point.

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Speaker 1: I'm really surprised, back to you, Steve Helling, that a

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Speaker 1: law enforcement officer is dating taught mom Casey Anthony. I mean,

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Speaker 1: that was to be the craziest part of the thing.

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Speaker 1: That's the craziest part. To you. The craziest part of

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Speaker 1: this is that a cop is aiding her because see,

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Speaker 1: I think the craziest part is that she murdered her

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Speaker 1: daughter and she got to quit it. To me, that's

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Speaker 1: the craziest part. I'm talking about the craziest part of

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Speaker 1: the latest development. I mean, you and I sat through,

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Speaker 1: you know, sat through two months worth of crazy in

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Speaker 1: that trial. But you know, after all of that, why

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Speaker 1: would any I don't wondered, why would anybody ate Kacy

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Speaker 1: Anthony who wants that type of baggage. But if you're

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Speaker 1: a cop. You certainly know that this is somebody who's

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Speaker 1: on the wrong side of the law, and why would

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Speaker 1: you want to beat her? I just don't understand it. Well.

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Speaker 1: I have a couple of reasons. I think he may

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Speaker 1: be dating her, but I don't think Fox Nation or

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Speaker 1: serious XM one eleven would like me to blurt that

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Speaker 1: out on the air. There are still a few SCC censorships.

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Speaker 1: Let's go to cut twenty three. This is part of

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Speaker 1: Top Mom Casey Anthony's interrogation where the investigator, your detective,

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Speaker 1: your emailed. It's like, I'm so tired of the lies.

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Speaker 1: Please stop listen. I can tell you, just for a certainty,

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Speaker 1: that everything you've told me so far has been why.

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Speaker 1: I can tell you with a certainty, and let me

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Speaker 1: explain why. Since I left you this morning, I've got

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Speaker 1: to every addressing you told me, every hang of every

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Speaker 1: person that you wanted me to talk you try to.

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Speaker 1: I've reached out. I thought to your exployfriend, thought that Amy,

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Speaker 1: I thought to Tony. I came over here. I've hardy

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Speaker 1: talked to all the employees I talked about. All these

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Speaker 1: names you're giving me are people that either have never

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Speaker 1: worked here or have been fired you for a long

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Speaker 1: time ago. Okay, so where we are right now is

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Speaker 1: in a physician that doesn't look very good for you.

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Speaker 1: We can sit here and go back and forth all

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Speaker 1: day long. Though I don't, I don't, I do. It's

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Speaker 1: pretty obvious that with everything that you tell us nothing

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Speaker 1: has been truth. You know where she is. Can you

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Speaker 1: imagine sitting in that interrogation room going round and Karen Stark,

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Speaker 1: what is that ability to just stick with your story

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Speaker 1: and look at a detective in the eye when they

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Speaker 1: keep saying, well, we call this person and that person,

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Speaker 1: and we check this employee, employer and that employee. Everything

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Speaker 1: you've said is a lie, everything, And she's like, no,

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Speaker 1: it's not. It's almost like one of those Saturday Night

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Speaker 1: Lives gets when there's the liar and they look right

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Speaker 1: at you and say, no, it's not it's true, and

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Speaker 1: they have the people say no, she doesn't work here,

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Speaker 1: No she hasn't been staying here. No, that's not what happened.

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Speaker 1: What is that called? There's got to be something in

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Speaker 1: your DSM manual that's a bad the logical liar. And

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Speaker 1: I do remember using that very analogy Nancy of the

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Speaker 1: Lyar on Saturday Night Lives because she's so classic. When

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Speaker 1: she says something and then it's proved that it's life,

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Speaker 1: she immediately goes to the next life and the next light,

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Speaker 1: and then the next light, and absolutely her face is

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Speaker 1: in passage. You can't imagine that she's telling the lie.

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Speaker 1: She looks so authentic. She's classic, and she's a narcissist,

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Speaker 1: so she needs constant and part of that is the

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Speaker 1: ability to tell those ways. Well, I guarantee you that's

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Speaker 1: why she did not take the stand, because finally she

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Speaker 1: would be on cross examination and a jury would see

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Speaker 1: exactly what you're talking about, Karen Stark. Yes, they would

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Speaker 1: remember we talked about that. The jury would see it.

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Speaker 1: And she doesn't come across authentically. You don't see emotion.

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Speaker 1: Even I'm hearing her voice on getting the shills, because

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Speaker 1: that's the person that we know, right Nancy. She's very calm,

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Speaker 1: and she knows her lodge, she knows her words, and

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Speaker 1: she's talking nonsense, saying nonsense. It all boils down to

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Speaker 1: what happened to two year old Kelly, her daughter. Let's

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Speaker 1: cut to our number eight, our cut eight, Jackie, take

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Speaker 1: a listen to Carson chambers and what we learn at

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Speaker 1: trial about the condition of top mom Casey Anthony, baby

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Speaker 1: girl Keyley Casey Anthony sobbed into a tissue hearing what

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Speaker 1: happened to Kayley's remains in the woods. What we're looking

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Speaker 1: at here the top of the bones. These have actually

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Speaker 1: been shoot on by animals. The gallery was filled with

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Speaker 1: surprise faces, including an expecting mother whose mouth hung wide

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Speaker 1: open as autopsy photos were shown in court. There is

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Speaker 1: no child that should have duct tape on its face

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Speaker 1: when it dies. There is no reason to put duct

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Speaker 1: tape on the face after they die. Doctor jan Garavaglia,

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Speaker 1: also known as Doctor G medical examiner on her Discovery

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Speaker 1: Channel show, says she classified Kayley's death as a homicide

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Speaker 1: based on red flags. The child was reported missing thirty

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Speaker 1: one days late and her remains were hidden in the woods.

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Speaker 1: Could a child expose to a sufficient amount of chloroform

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Speaker 1: die as a result? Absolutely crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: now straight out to our estaimed medical examiner. Doctor Tim

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Speaker 1: Gallagher the medical examiner for the entire state of Florida

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Speaker 1: at pathcaremed dot com. He is a lecturer at University

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Speaker 1: of Florida Medical School forensic medicine. Doctor Gallagher, I know

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Speaker 1: that you have very carefully studied what happened to little Keiley,

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Speaker 1: and i'd like to get your thoughts, especially about the

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Speaker 1: duct tape on the child's face. Well, that was a

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Speaker 1: very difficult case, you know, and Jan garb Agley I

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Speaker 1: did a great job, and you know, you know you

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Speaker 1: have to use your best judgment. A medical examiner's diagnosis

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Speaker 1: is an opinion. It's an opinion based on a lot

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Speaker 1: of the evidence, all of the evidence, the scene, the body,

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Speaker 1: and all the events leading up to that. This is

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Speaker 1: a decomposed child who was in the woods with duct

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Speaker 1: tape around him, that it was already annual, predation had

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Speaker 1: already begun to start. Animals had found the body, and

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Speaker 1: we're chewing on the bones and scavenging the remains. This

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Speaker 1: is a just an awful case. And I mean, I

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Speaker 1: don't know that I can add anything that hasn't already

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Speaker 1: been in the news. But we still use this case

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Speaker 1: as a great teaching point as well as the interview

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Speaker 1: with Kaylee Anthony. And this is a classic teaching point

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Speaker 1: within So if any good can come from this, it's

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Speaker 1: that now students who are coming into the field are

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Speaker 1: educated more carefully about this type of finding and this

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Speaker 1: type of a person to deal with the theory that

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Speaker 1: was espoused at aile that Keielly had drowned in the

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Speaker 1: pool completely contradicts the medical findings that she was found

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Speaker 1: with our skull covered in duct tape. To you, Steve Helen,

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Speaker 1: you know that as well as any one, it completely

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Speaker 1: contradicts that theory. I mean, Jasey Anthony is just full

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Speaker 1: of contradictions. She has been since two thousand and eight,

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Speaker 1: and nothing surprises me with all of her contradictions. You know,

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Speaker 1: It's funny. We mentioned watching her again in action talking

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Speaker 1: to the police and did you ever were you listening

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Speaker 1: to that to it, I thinking I wonder if Alma

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Speaker 1: really exists because she's so convincing and everything that says,

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Speaker 1: and then you find out it's a lie. Obviously, you

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Speaker 1: know that's almost exists. It's just j full of contradictions,

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Speaker 1: full of rise and it's exhausting. It is exhausting. Guys

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Speaker 1: were talking about the most recent incident with top mom

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Speaker 1: Casey Anthony, who has told Investor Together she quote sleeps

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Speaker 1: really well at night, doesn't have any concerns about the

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Speaker 1: murder of her daughter Kelly. But in the most recent

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Speaker 1: event with Todd Mom Casey Anthony, she's back in a

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Speaker 1: bar and a pair of hot pants. Take a listen

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Speaker 1: to our cut twenty one. This is the body cam

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Speaker 1: sound that goes with the body cam video of Todd

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Speaker 1: Mom at O'she's bar. What's her fine? If you can

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Speaker 1: send that to me, I can send us to here. Yeah. No,

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Speaker 1: I haven't seemed her stuff like this, but I file

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Speaker 1: a retraining arder. I didn't have enough to have Actually,

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Speaker 1: her tax scene was not enough for showing up where

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Speaker 1: I wasn't got enough. This is in part witnesses. Sorry

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Speaker 1: to hear that because top one, Casey Anthony's in a

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Speaker 1: packed bar. But what I'm hearing is that she won't

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Speaker 1: file a restraining order. So to you former police Chief

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Speaker 1: John's Cree, Chief Chris Buyers, if you're worried about a

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Speaker 1: person you really are being harassed with and you file

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Speaker 1: a restraining order, yeah, absolutely, that's the path to get

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Speaker 1: that solved. You go file the temporary protective order and

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Speaker 1: gets the hearing. And that way, if this person contacts you,

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Speaker 1: follows you, anything else, it actually becomes a chromb At

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Speaker 1: that point. So, yeah, she needs to take that matters

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Speaker 1: into her hand and follow the way that the law works. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you're hearing this nine on one call from top

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Speaker 1: on Casey Anthony because her shirt's wet at a bar.

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Speaker 1: It's historic contrast to another nine on one call. Take

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Speaker 1: a listen to Cindy Anthony our cut two A little

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Speaker 1: chair emergency. I'm called a little bit to the deputy.

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Speaker 1: My griers I have been taking She has been listened

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Speaker 1: for her mother's finally literally that she's been missed. Okay,

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Speaker 1: what someone's weird? Now? Okay, what is the address that

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Speaker 1: you're calling from? Haley three seven Hope Spring Drive and

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Speaker 1: you're talking about her three years a little girl four

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Speaker 1: nine three seven White Hope Spring HLP E SPR I

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Speaker 1: mg FRO Rolando. My daughter finally admitted that the baby

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Speaker 1: ten flour. I need to find her. Your daughter admitted

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Speaker 1: that your the baby is later, but you kind of

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Speaker 1: took her a month together. That my daughter has been

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Speaker 1: looking for I told you my daughter was missing for

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Speaker 1: a month. I just found her today, but I can't

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Speaker 1: find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me, but she's

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Speaker 1: been trying to find her herself. There's something wrong. That's

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Speaker 1: not my daughter's car today, and it's not like there's

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Speaker 1: been a bread bough in the the long cloud. Okay,

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Speaker 1: what is the three year old? Name? Hayley c A

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Speaker 1: y l E E Anthony Kaylee Anthony. Yes, Okay, she white, black,

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Speaker 1: her panic hit. How long has she been missing for?

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Speaker 1: I have not seen her, so for seventh of two

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Speaker 1: I play that portions an I only call for a

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Speaker 1: reason to doctor Tim Gallagher, medical examiner for the entire

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Speaker 1: state of Florida, Doctor Gallagher, did you hear what Cindy

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Speaker 1: Anthony said in the nine on one call? The child's

390
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Speaker 1: been missing. I haven't seen her since June seventh. My

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00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: daughter's missing. I've got her. I can't find Keiley. The quote,

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Speaker 1: damn car smells like a dead body, Well, there's nothing

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Speaker 1: that smells exactly like a dead body and has a

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Speaker 1: very sickly sweet odor, and if you smell it once,

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Speaker 1: you'll remember it for the rest of your life. It's

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Speaker 1: actually part of the training that we do for recovery

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Speaker 1: animals and for other forensic personnel. They're required to know

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Speaker 1: what that odor is. And it is because of that

399
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 1: at that a lot of decomposed bodies have been recovered,

400
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:07,359
Speaker 1: but it is. It is one smell that you cannot

401
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 1: mistake for anything else. There is no food that smells

402
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: like that. There was no other animal that smells like

403
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,640
Speaker 1: a dead human. It is and it is a scent

404
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 1: that'll stick with you for the rest of your life.

405
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: When you smell it, you know it, and it's accurate.

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00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:26,600
Speaker 1: You know what, Steve Hailing hearing doctor Gallagher speake, We're

407
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 1: all kicking around that Top Mom, Casey Anthony's at another

408
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: bar and another pair of hot pant's getting in trouble.

409
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:37,280
Speaker 1: But when I hear him talking and that, you know,

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Speaker 1: there's that one picture of Cayley with the big brown

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Speaker 1: eyes looking at the camera, and I think about her

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Speaker 1: being torn apart by animals and a swamp with duct

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Speaker 1: tape wrapped around her head, and the smell of a

414
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Speaker 1: dead body and Top Mom's car that she abandoned. It's,

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Speaker 1: you know, it really never goes away, that the shock

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Speaker 1: that Top Mom had everything. I mean, she'd been lying

417
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 1: to her parents for years, I guess two years that

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00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:17,120
Speaker 1: she worked at Universal, the whole time just hanging around

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Speaker 1: the house watching TV, eating their food, using their cable,

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00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: talking on their phone. They totally supported her financially. They

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00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 1: totally supported little Kelly, no questions asked, and to do

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Speaker 1: this to Kelly. You know, we often think about, you know,

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Speaker 1: Casey is a side showing. She does all these things

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Speaker 1: that we kind of laugh at because they're so ridiculous,

425
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 1: but we can't fact site of the fact that there

426
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 1: is a little girl who would be fifteen years old

427
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 1: now or sixteen years old. You know, she'd be a teenager,

428
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 1: and she's not with us, and you know, her end

429
00:27:56,280 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 1: and her guests was horrific, and we always you know,

430
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: it's easy to forget that when Casey is doing her

431
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: antics in a bar somewhere, because Casey forgetting it. But

432
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:17,359
Speaker 1: the rest of us need to remember crime stories with

433
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:23,119
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, you know, Karen Starr, you and I covered

434
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:29,200
Speaker 1: the case together. And then you remember, I'm very clearly

435
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 1: you're at one of my baby showers. Remember I had two,

436
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: and you were at one of them. How much I

437
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: wanted to have the twins, and remember I almost lost

438
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: them during the pregnancy, and I'm remembering, remember you were

439
00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: there watching them grow up in New York and at

440
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 1: this age, you know, two three years old, their whole

441
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 1: world is mommy. Kelly had no idea top mom was

442
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: not taking care of her, not supporting her. She was

443
00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 1: basically like a tick, a parasite, living off her parents,

444
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 1: and they were the ones taking care of Kelly, not

445
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:15,880
Speaker 1: Tod mob He was taking care of Kelly because hot

446
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: Man was not able to do it. Nancy, When I

447
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,080
Speaker 1: think about you and the kind of mother that I

448
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 1: can still tex you racking the twins one at a time,

449
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 1: and I was sitting there and just in awe of

450
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: that connection that you had. Well, that connection that a

451
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 1: mother and a child has that you had did not

452
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 1: exist for her. She doesn't have it in her to

453
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 1: come to anyone. She's not assisted, and of course we

454
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 1: know that she's capable of murder. Is that there was

455
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 1: never any what about my daughter? It was always what

456
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: about me? When she was in jail talking to her parents,

457
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: it was well, what's gonna hap to me? What dook?

458
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 1: You never heard her say, you know, lose my girl?

459
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 1: What happened to my girl? So it's a stark comparison

460
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 1: of USA between let me know, a connection between a

461
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 1: mother and a child, a parent and a childhood, and

462
00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 1: this person who is in principle of feelings, and lying

463
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 1: and missing that little girl. And in the last weeks,

464
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: a taught mom Casey Anthony Jurar has come forward and

465
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:30,440
Speaker 1: said that they regret the not guilty Really, thanks day,

466
00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: late dollars short. Don't even bother wasting your breath telling

467
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,400
Speaker 1: me now that you regret your not guilty decision. I mean,

468
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 1: I don't even want to hear that. Just keep your

469
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:48,320
Speaker 1: pieholes shut, you hear, taught mom Casey Anthony at a

470
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: after a boozy barfight with some other woman, calling nine

471
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 1: on one because her shirt got wet when the woman

472
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 1: allegedly threw a drink on her. But listen to this

473
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 1: our cut number one, where you you here, Cindy, excuse me?

474
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:11,960
Speaker 1: Star cut number three practically begging taught mom to get

475
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 1: on the phone and speak to nine one one Our

476
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:25,280
Speaker 1: cut three first um three eight nine two thousand three,

477
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 1: two thousand and five sons true listen Curson a month ago.

478
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 1: So we're listening form. Okay, I just I mean, I understand,

479
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 1: I can you just can you come down for me

480
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:50,280
Speaker 1: for the semnut? I need to know what's going on. Okay,

481
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 1: I'm gonna try and sorry, is your is your daughter there?

482
00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:59,479
Speaker 1: The fall with them. Is your daughter there? Yeah? Can

483
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: I speak her? Do you minded body step with her?

484
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 1: Thank you? I called them two hours ago. They haven't

485
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 1: gotten here. Finally admitted the bay from I'm ma'am, ma'am.

486
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 1: They want to talk to you. Question. She's basically grabbing

487
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: top Mom and getting her to the phone. Tat Mom

488
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 1: on even speak to nine one one about her so

489
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: called missing daughter. You know why, because she knows they're

490
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 1: right down the street. Her daughter is in a trash

491
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 1: bag where she threw her in a swampy area. Take

492
00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 1: a listener more. When they finally get Top Mom, Casey

493
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 1: Anthony on the phone, our cut number four, Can you

494
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: tell me a little bit what's going on? My daughter

495
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 1: has been missived for the last thirty one days, and

496
00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:02,200
Speaker 1: you know who has her? I know who? After I

497
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 1: tried to contact her, I actually received a phone call

498
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: today now from a number of the business no longer

499
00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 1: in service. I didn't get to speak to my daughter

500
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 1: for aboutom moments, about a minute. Okay, did you guys

501
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 1: call an import a vehicle? Soone? Um, yes, my mom did. Okay,

502
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,400
Speaker 1: so there's been a vehicle stone too, No, this was

503
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:28,920
Speaker 1: my vehicle? What a vehicle or soon. Um, it's a

504
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: ninety pnyacsun fire. Okay, I have deputies on the way

505
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,720
Speaker 1: to you right now for that. But now you're now

506
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 1: you're three old, three old. I was missing Kaylee Anthony okay,

507
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,480
Speaker 1: white female? Yes? Wait? Female three years old eight nine,

508
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 1: two thousand five or day to birth? Yeah, And you

509
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:50,160
Speaker 1: last saw her a month ago, thirty one days from

510
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 1: thirty one days, Steve Helen, people dot com. Do you

511
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 1: notice how calm she is on the phone as a

512
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 1: compared to her mother, Cindy Anthony, who can barely even

513
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 1: speak and everything she says is a lie. There was

514
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,200
Speaker 1: no phone call from Zanai Gonzalez, there was no fake

515
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:13,759
Speaker 1: phone number. She did not speak to Keney. Based on

516
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 1: what the medical examiner said, Kenney was long dead, and

517
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:21,759
Speaker 1: she did not report her own car stolen because she

518
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:27,359
Speaker 1: abandoned it because it smelled like a dead body. Why

519
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 1: would you lie to nine one one about your car

520
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: being stolen and about a fake phone call? I mean,

521
00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:36,640
Speaker 1: it's astonishing when you get down to it, not just

522
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:39,879
Speaker 1: how many lies there are and how she piles them

523
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 1: on top of each other, but how calmly she says them,

524
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:47,399
Speaker 1: how definitively she says them. You know, whenever you hear

525
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:50,640
Speaker 1: Casey there for a second of like, oh wait, maybe

526
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:54,960
Speaker 1: could that be true? Because I'm so convinced that herself,

527
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 1: I think that she's telling you, but it's all a lie,

528
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 1: you know, and I didn't stop lying. We clearly she

529
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 1: hasn't stopped mine to this day. Take a listen to

530
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 1: our cut twenty two. We're back to the present day

531
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 1: and top mom in a bar fight. Casey and Thelma

532
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: Moya were reportedly friends before they ended up in an

533
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:23,919
Speaker 1: altercation over the same guy. I don't that's the woman

534
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:26,840
Speaker 1: who allegedly threw a drink at Anthony was not charged.

535
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 1: She says the argument was about much more than an

536
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:34,360
Speaker 1: ex boyfriend, but she wouldn't elaborate. This woman is willing

537
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 1: to take down anybody to save her own skin, including

538
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:44,480
Speaker 1: her own family. Take a listen to our cut fourteen.

539
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:50,480
Speaker 1: This is her father, George Anthony speaking to our friend

540
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: doctor Phil and if this scenario that Casey had had

541
00:35:56,200 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: told to her defense about Kaylee drowning, and why go

542
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,880
Speaker 1: through all this elaborate stuff to tap her up, to

543
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:08,120
Speaker 1: put her in a launder bag, to put her in

544
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 1: aid a trash bag, and carry her in the woods.

545
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 1: I can't comprehend a human doing it, especially your daughter

546
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:23,800
Speaker 1: doing that to my granddaughter. I can't. I can't visualize that.

547
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: I don't want to visualize that. You can hear the

548
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,600
Speaker 1: heartbreak and his voice and his wife, Cindy's who I

549
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,279
Speaker 1: believe or portrayed very badly in the press. I've met

550
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 1: with them and I believe that they're very good people

551
00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 1: that have really been to hell and back. Now what

552
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:49,320
Speaker 1: did top mom Casey Anthony have to say? Listen to

553
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 1: our cut six. This is NBC's program. Listen. Kaylee went

554
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 1: missing in June two thousand and eight, but had been

555
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:02,240
Speaker 1: missing for a month before her mother contacted police. Casey

556
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 1: Anthony was eventually charged in her disappearance. Police later finding

557
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,960
Speaker 1: Kayley's remains in a wooded area near the family's home.

558
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:14,280
Speaker 1: Anthony says the last time she saw Kayley, she believed

559
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: that she was alive and that she was going to

560
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 1: be Okay, give me this is who when things went wrong?

561
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,720
Speaker 1: One of the things you were wrong. All of a sudden,

562
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 1: It's like, where's Kayley? Like? Is that hell? It? One know?

563
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: What I remember is being in bed, my mom coming

564
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,400
Speaker 1: in before she left her work and saying goodbye to us,

565
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 1: and then waking up several hours later and morning hour

566
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: two hours later, not knowing where she was. Don't you

567
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: wish you know what happened? Absolutely? I mean, Steve Helling.

568
00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 1: Now the story is she went to sleep and woke

569
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,800
Speaker 1: up and ky Elly was missing. I mean, the story

570
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,239
Speaker 1: has seen so many times. Who Kaye should crack at

571
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 1: this point, Nancy, what we do know and what everybody knows,

572
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 1: is that Kaylee, you know, is dead. She died and

573
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,640
Speaker 1: her mother should have known what happened, and her mother

574
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 1: should have been there to protect her and clearly was not.

575
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,120
Speaker 1: At this point, I don't even it's something. I don't

576
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: care what happened. It almost doesn't matter what happened. We

577
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 1: know that it's something wrong and it resulted in Kaylee's death,

578
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:31,920
Speaker 1: and no amount of backpacking and lying is going to

579
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 1: change that fact. We now know that top mom, Casey Anthony,

580
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: still living in South Florida. She's gotten a new tattoo

581
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:45,160
Speaker 1: to cover up her old tattoo that said the beautiful

582
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:51,240
Speaker 1: life Bella Vita. She got that tattoo just two weeks

583
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 1: after she says her daughter went missing. You know, sometimes

584
00:38:56,920 --> 00:39:01,160
Speaker 1: there is no Justice, Nancy Grace Come Stories, signing off

585
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:02,479
Speaker 1: goodbye friend,