Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.
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Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints
Speaker 3: dot com. At the same time, we got to take
Speaker 3: a look at an insane crypto shitcoin scandal sweeping Argentina
Speaker 3: and ensnaring personalities here in the United States, like Dave
Speaker 3: Portinoi's called Libra. Let's go ahead and put this one
Speaker 3: up there on the screen. So Javier Malay, the literal
Speaker 3: president of Argentina, has been ensnared in this mean coin
Speaker 3: scandal Libra, after promoting it on social media. When he
Speaker 3: promoted the Libra coin on social media within quote five hours,
Speaker 3: over four point four billion dollars of market cap was
Speaker 3: erased in a classic pump and dumb scheme where it
Speaker 3: went from basically worth nothing to a couple of dollars
Speaker 3: worth a coin where insiders were able to have a
Speaker 3: rug pull were able to sell for hundreds of millions
Speaker 3: of dollars by their own admission, several secret insiders and
Speaker 3: others who are involved. The tail is traced back to
Speaker 3: some American citizens, it seems, and other kushety characters, one
Speaker 3: of whom the person who appears do you want to
Speaker 3: help me with any of this? Appears mister Hayden, who
Speaker 3: is orchestrating this entire thing behind the scenes. But what's
Speaker 3: unclear to me is how many other people are involved
Speaker 3: with his firm. It's like his father and his brother
Speaker 3: and their secret investors. Coffee Zilla, friend of our show,
Speaker 3: interviewed them. But anything you want to fill in.
Speaker 2: Before this dude is one of he describes him. Coffee
Speaker 2: describes him as one of the big four creators of Libra. Now,
Speaker 2: he tries to say in this interview with Coffee like, oh,
Speaker 2: I was just like, you know, making the decisions on
Speaker 2: behalf of I'm not really the guy I'm like taking
Speaker 2: all the key, but I'm.
Speaker 4: Not really the guy.
Speaker 2: But he also, you know, he cops to a lot
Speaker 2: in this interview, including this just very nihilistic view of effectively, well,
Speaker 2: these are all scams, and I'm just getting mine. And
Speaker 2: if you're you're just pissed off because you're not an
Speaker 2: insider and you're not the one who's getting cash in
Speaker 2: these meme.
Speaker 4: Coin scam pumping them.
Speaker 2: So I truly recommend you watch this entire interview if
Speaker 2: you have any interest in this subject, because he really
Speaker 2: does admit to the whole thing. Yes, he really does
Speaker 2: admit to the whole scheme in this interview with Coffee.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so let's get to actually that insider quote in
Speaker 3: particular where Coffee still oppresses him on the structure of
Speaker 3: all this.
Speaker 1: Let's take a listen.
Speaker 5: The idea of insiders, to me is always bullshit because
Speaker 5: every meme coin I've ever known, or vested in, or
Speaker 5: been a part of, like the people that benefit are
Speaker 5: the people that know like the people that benefit the
Speaker 5: most of the people that structure the deal. Similar to
Speaker 5: any other business in the world, people that are closes
Speaker 5: normally make the most money or lose the most money,
Speaker 5: one of the two.
Speaker 6: So I don't.
Speaker 4: I think that's a bit of bullshit.
Speaker 5: And that's just like crypto people that are angry that
Speaker 5: they're like, there's always an unfair there's an unfair advantage
Speaker 5: if you're a genius on chain and you know how
Speaker 5: to game the system on Meteora, and there's thirty guys
Speaker 5: in the world that know how to do that better
Speaker 5: than anybody, so it's like there's no.
Speaker 6: Wa wait, there's unfair games. Right. There's people who know
Speaker 6: everything about socks.
Speaker 7: You can be Warren Buffett, but there's a difference between
Speaker 7: being Warren Buffett and being a guy with insider knowledge
Speaker 7: on like Pfizer pharmaceutical and trading on your insider knowledge.
Speaker 7: So I think the frustration is people are frustrated that
Speaker 7: not that you're good at trading, but that you knew something,
Speaker 7: know what the public didn't know, and you trade it
Speaker 7: on that information, which in the public markets it would
Speaker 7: be illegal be insider trading.
Speaker 5: Right, But on meme coins, A, it's not, and B
Speaker 5: that's what happens on every single deal, I mean every
Speaker 5: kol every single one globally. That's how their main money
Speaker 5: gets made. They know about a deal, they agree to
Speaker 5: a deal, and then they make money on the deal.
Speaker 3: So Kol is key opinion leader. I've had to learn
Speaker 3: that from all of this crypto bullshit. And the thing
Speaker 3: is about Hayden is he's one of the most honest
Speaker 3: brokers in this entire thing, in that he's an honest crook.
Speaker 3: There are text messages and others that have come out
Speaker 3: from Hayden being like, Yeah, let's just pull it all.
Speaker 3: Let's pull as much as we can out of these idiots.
Speaker 3: And we were debating this before the show. I'm of
Speaker 3: a couple of minds to be honest at this point,
Speaker 3: if you invest your money in a meme coin or
Speaker 3: a shit coin, I don't feel bad for you, and
Speaker 3: you're an idiot and you deserve to lose your money
Speaker 3: because every single person who is involved in this should
Speaker 3: know at this point that the structure is always the same.
Speaker 3: You have insiders who hold like twenty to thirty percent
Speaker 3: in this case, it was like eighty percent of the coins.
Speaker 3: Then Libra, you have some guy like Javier Malay do
Speaker 3: the pumpin of the classic like, hey, guys, check this out.
Speaker 3: Here's the contract address, so you can all get involved.
Speaker 3: And then the people who got in at the beginning, sell,
Speaker 3: not even necessarily at the top, but they sell once
Speaker 3: it's exploded. They take a tidy prophet and you're the
Speaker 3: person left holding the bag. But in general, the people
Speaker 3: who are doing this, from what I can tell based
Speaker 3: on Portnoy and all the other Robin Hood bro day
Speaker 3: traders and others, they're just trying to do that to
Speaker 3: other people. They're just the ones who are caught before.
Speaker 3: They're the ones caught holding the bag because they were
Speaker 3: not insider or fast enough to be able to sell
Speaker 3: the contract. I think it's despicable and it's disgusting behavior
Speaker 3: on the part of Hayden Davis, but the honesty behind
Speaker 3: it is one which belies so much of American financial
Speaker 3: life at this time that I have of heart. I
Speaker 3: have a hard time at this point feeling bad for
Speaker 3: a single person that's involved.
Speaker 2: Well, but the thing is that you Hayden Davison's interview
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, it's all a scam and only then
Speaker 2: siders make money and that's the whole game. But that
Speaker 2: is not the way that they portray these coins at
Speaker 2: the time. I mean, there's a reason and why so
Speaker 2: we've mentioned Portnoy, so Portnoy is brought into this. They
Speaker 2: originally they told him about beforehand and gave him millions
Speaker 2: of tokens in order to promote it. He gave back
Speaker 2: the tokens, but he did buy in with his own money,
Speaker 2: and I think posted about it as well. And see,
Speaker 2: the thing is that they take advantage of the fact
Speaker 2: that there is so little institutional trust and what people
Speaker 2: have instead is these parasocial relationships with like trusted creators
Speaker 2: and personalities. So they use these celebrity endorters to make
Speaker 2: it feel like, oh, well, Kim Kardashian or Deve Portnoy
Speaker 2: or the freakin talk to a girl or who or
Speaker 2: Javier Malay, the president of Argentina, who is an icon
Speaker 2: for many of the like you know, libertarian right, including
Speaker 2: Elon Musselman that's running our government right now.
Speaker 4: Will they back it?
Speaker 2: So it must be real, right When Javier Malay is
Speaker 2: posting about this, he's not saying this is a scam
Speaker 2: you know I'm getting mine, or you know the insiders
Speaker 2: are getting He's saying, this is a phenomenal opportunity for
Speaker 2: you to get wealthy and also for people to invest
Speaker 2: in Argentina's small business creators.
Speaker 4: Blah, blah blah.
Speaker 2: So people are getting lied to and they're getting taken
Speaker 2: advantage of. And you know, it is the case that
Speaker 2: whatever you have actually number one big technological transitions, which
Speaker 2: is we're in the midst of and also break down
Speaker 2: an institutional trust trust. It becomes a golden age of
Speaker 2: scam artists. And we have never seen like in world history,
Speaker 2: we have never seen scams on the size of what
Speaker 2: these crypto mean coin rug poll scams are on a
Speaker 2: routine basis. And one of the things that's important to
Speaker 2: note here is that the same characters, some of the
Speaker 2: same characters who are behind this crypto pump and dump
Speaker 2: with the backing of Javier and Malay, we're also involved
Speaker 2: with the Millennia coin launch, which also has lost plummeted
Speaker 2: and lost the vast majority of its value, leaving almost
Speaker 2: all of the retail that investors completely high and dry.
Speaker 2: Coffee asked Hayden this question directly. He's reluctant to answer,
Speaker 2: but ultimately he does answer. Let's take a listen to that.
Speaker 7: A lot of people have linked you to the Millennia launch,
Speaker 7: and that is a big question on everyone's mind, mine,
Speaker 7: especially which is were you part of the Millennia launch
Speaker 7: and was that sniped as well.
Speaker 5: I mean, look, I think that I mean, I told you,
Speaker 5: like beforehand this but before this started. I mean, I'm
Speaker 5: happy to share the truth, but uh, I mean, you're you're, you're, you're,
Speaker 5: you're asking a question that's it's just I mean, I'll answer,
Speaker 5: but it's uh, factually going to put me into a
Speaker 5: lot of danger, which is fine, I'll answer. I was
Speaker 5: part of it. I think the team did want to
Speaker 5: snipe it because of how big the snipe was on
Speaker 5: Trump's and we weren't the We definitely weren't the big sniper.
Speaker 5: We were not. That was what we were trying to avoid.
Speaker 5: And we didn't make any There was no money made
Speaker 5: from the Malania team on any We didn't take any
Speaker 5: liquidity out zero.
Speaker 7: Okay, wow, that's shocking news. But I want to zoom
Speaker 7: in on that point. We said, like, well, we didn't
Speaker 7: take any liquidity out. One of the wallets we traced
Speaker 7: to the Portinoy thing, the Portannoy United thing, your wallet
Speaker 7: or not, I don't know if it's your what Whoever's
Speaker 7: wallet that was sent money to a wallet which had
Speaker 7: like got sent one point five million dollars of Malania
Speaker 7: token from something called Milania Dash liquiditytwo dot sol and
Speaker 7: then that while it seemed to sell Malania tokens that
Speaker 7: it received for free.
Speaker 6: So you said, y'all didn't sell any liquidity, but I.
Speaker 5: Didn't didn't didn't swap liquidity, didn't swap liquidity, didn't swap
Speaker 5: into single sided. I didn't say there was no there
Speaker 5: was no money sold. There's a difference between swapping the
Speaker 5: liquidity and selling liquidations. Those are two different things.
Speaker 7: Okay, So y'all swapped, you didn't sell or the other
Speaker 7: way around.
Speaker 6: No other way around, other way around sold, you didn't swap.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that dealed on.
Speaker 1: What he's saying is a little bit lost with me.
Speaker 2: I think that I was reading about there's a way
Speaker 2: you can pull out just the cash and leave like
Speaker 2: the token in which tries to to maintain the market
Speaker 2: so that people don't see that you're just completely selling
Speaker 2: out and tanking it. And I think he's saying we
Speaker 2: didn't do that when they're talking about sniping. So you
Speaker 2: can imagine, if you know the coin is about to
Speaker 2: drop and nobody else knows, you buy it immediately, and
Speaker 2: so at part of the other. So he admits not
Speaker 2: only is involved with Milania and with Libra, the Javier
Speaker 2: malay one, that he was part of this market manipulation
Speaker 2: tactic of sniping, where you buy a bunch at the beginning,
Speaker 2: you pump it up, and then what happened both with
Speaker 2: Milania and in the case of Libra is then once
Speaker 2: the market sort of hits the top, you start selling out.
Speaker 4: The whole thing.
Speaker 2: Crashes and that's what makes it a rug pole. Now
Speaker 2: he claims, Oh, we weren't the biggest snipers on Milania,
Speaker 2: and we saw with Trump that there were all these
Speaker 2: people that got in that were market manipulation. So we
Speaker 2: didn't want, you know, we didn't want to be left
Speaker 2: out basically of the fun. So so he admits that
Speaker 2: they engage in this market manipulation with the Millennia coin
Speaker 2: and with the Libra coin, and it's just incredible wasting,
Speaker 2: fraud and scams all around.
Speaker 3: More on Trump that they admitted to the insider trading
Speaker 3: aspect of people being told at that crypto ball here
Speaker 3: in Washington about some of that.
Speaker 1: Let's take a listen.
Speaker 6: You kind of were like, hey, people should think about
Speaker 6: these things.
Speaker 7: Should they think about from your perspective, like what what
Speaker 7: is going on on the inside.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think the best one to look at, like
Speaker 5: from ah because I know, like like both money was
Speaker 5: raised and the most amount of money was made was
Speaker 5: on Trump. I think that's the best example, just being honest,
Speaker 5: because you know that, right, you know that people were
Speaker 5: able to buy in at five hundred million.
Speaker 6: Yeah yeah yeah, like people snipe that coin too, you.
Speaker 5: Mean no no, no, no, no, no, like at the
Speaker 5: when before it launched, at some private dinner that they
Speaker 5: gave people special access to buying it.
Speaker 6: What yeah yeah wait wait what yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 8: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Who who get who gave that? Who? Who gave that?
Speaker 5: But that was that was I mean, that was what
Speaker 5: I was told, Like there were people at a some
Speaker 5: sort of crypto event in Washington, DC.
Speaker 6: Uh if that's true, I don't know if that's true.
Speaker 6: But if that's true, that's I don't I told Okay.
Speaker 3: Okay, see that was the biggest one to me about
Speaker 3: that five hundred million buy into the Trump shit coin.
Speaker 3: That pube was posted immediately after Trump became president, leading
Speaker 3: to the immediate sell off and all of that.
Speaker 1: We don't have a ton of time because they have
Speaker 1: a guest standing by.
Speaker 3: But it's like I said, I certain point, I don't
Speaker 3: feel bad for these people anymore, every single person involved,
Speaker 3: from Portnoy to Hayden Davis to any of these others,
Speaker 3: people who are buying in the seventy five thousand or
Speaker 3: so people who bought in. It's like, look, you guys
Speaker 3: are trying to do a get rich quick stream and
Speaker 3: you got burned. It's like, well, you know, listen, idiots,
Speaker 3: the path to wealth is out there.
Speaker 1: You can buy s and P five hundred. People don't
Speaker 1: want to do that. They want to do single game
Speaker 1: parlays and do all of this. It's like, well, you
Speaker 1: get what you deserve at a certain point. What's the point.
Speaker 4: Stupid people deserve protection too, soccer.
Speaker 1: This is the capitalist country again.
Speaker 2: But they're taking advantage of the trust that people have
Speaker 2: in a Dave Portnoy, in a hobby or Malay in
Speaker 2: these other creators and influencers. That's why they get these
Speaker 2: like twitch streamers and whatever to promote these things. They're
Speaker 2: taking advantage of that trust and they're scamming people who
Speaker 2: are ripping them off. And I think it should be illegal.
Speaker 2: I think it should be I think it's really wrong.
Speaker 2: I think it should be completely I mean, these things
Speaker 2: are just brazen pod these schemes.
Speaker 4: I don't even understand how it is legal.
Speaker 2: It is such an open pyramid scheme, that's all it is.
Speaker 4: There is no value here.
Speaker 2: It's just this imaginary bullshit thing pumped up by whatever
Speaker 2: influencer or President of the United States or First Lady
Speaker 2: of the United States or president of Argentina. So I
Speaker 2: find it just the whole thing to be so dystopian,
Speaker 2: so grotesque, should be illegal, and I don't really understand
Speaker 2: how it's not. But you know, like the people like
Speaker 2: Hayden Davis, they're getting rich well.
Speaker 1: On the presidents side, and I couldn't agree with you more.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Look, this is what I don't get. I'm just
Speaker 3: a silly YouTuber. Somebody came to me with a pump
Speaker 3: and dumb cryptos game. Even if it was enough to retire,
Speaker 3: I would never do it. It's like, dude, you're the
Speaker 3: president of Argentina. It's like, presumably you're gonna get filthy
Speaker 3: rich off of this, right, especially with all of your connections.
Speaker 4: Why well, what's the point we should say? For the lawyers.
Speaker 2: He deleted his original post, and he claims he really
Speaker 2: didn't know, and he claims he didn't benefit from it,
Speaker 2: But this president here certainly did know and did benefit
Speaker 2: from it, etc.
Speaker 3: Even if you take Marley's explanation at face value, considering
Speaker 3: all of the recent just two month track record of Hawktua, Trump,
Speaker 3: shit Coin, Milania and all of this, why would you
Speaker 3: ever put your fingers on any of this stuff? Do
Speaker 3: you have no judgment? Like up here it sounds like,
Speaker 3: why do I have better judgment than you?
Speaker 2: So my thing is how to expect ordinary people to
Speaker 2: be more savvy about this than you know, the freaking
Speaker 2: president of Argentina it was like a global celebrity now,
Speaker 2: and these libertarians are I just.
Speaker 3: I don't know what to do in a society where
Speaker 3: people are desperate to legalize get rich quick, Like we
Speaker 3: were talking about sports betting, they want to be ripped off.
Speaker 3: That's what you Every single time that people use sports
Speaker 3: betting app, you're going to lose in the long run.
Speaker 3: If you're a winner, they'll just ban you people. I
Speaker 3: was just talking earlier today, Mark Cuban's got a new
Speaker 3: credit card.
Speaker 1: Out there, secured by your car equity.
Speaker 3: Amazing, But thirty percent thirty percent APR people are signing
Speaker 3: up left and right for key locks and balloon loans.
Speaker 2: But the be sure with sports betting isn't to make
Speaker 2: it more unregulated. The answer, as you laid out in
Speaker 2: the big momologue you did, is to make it.
Speaker 1: More They don't want that. Don't put the.
Speaker 2: Guardrails on and make sure that people are actually protected
Speaker 2: so they're not losing their whole life savings and you know,
Speaker 2: killing themselves in the worst of circumstances or having their
Speaker 2: entire life ruined, et cetera. It's not to just be like, well,
Speaker 2: let's a fair I guess, let's just let everybody get If.
Speaker 3: You put it to the ballot box, it would pass
Speaker 3: by eighty percent. To make it, they want to make
Speaker 3: it even easier to place bets. They want to place
Speaker 3: bets on every play, every touch some people.
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm not sure how it would fare at the
Speaker 2: ballot box. I'm not sure about but is at least
Speaker 2: somewhat regulated. This is you know, he's just admitting brazenly
Speaker 2: like insider trading and manipulation or whatever.
Speaker 4: I don't think he's going to face any legal trouble.
Speaker 3: I actually do think it face legal trouble because he
Speaker 3: admitted to literal insider trading now under the current SEC
Speaker 3: regime and all of that exactly possible times.
Speaker 2: And they're there is to let guys like this steal
Speaker 2: your money.
Speaker 3: So they actually disagree because you're a crypto person. They're
Speaker 3: the people, the real crypto insiders, the bigcoin ETF guys,
Speaker 3: the winkle Vine and all that. They hate these mean
Speaker 3: coin shit coins stop because it makes them look bad.
Speaker 3: Because they want to they want more integration to the
Speaker 3: financially not.
Speaker 2: Really any different. I don't hate that's what Hayden Davis says.
Speaker 1: That's not true. He's talking about mean coins.
Speaker 2: We talked about bitcoins specifically in this interview as well.
Speaker 4: Just last notes before we wrap this up.
Speaker 2: Number one important Portnoy got paid his money back.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's right, I mean at least so you got
Speaker 1: that's screwed.
Speaker 2: But don't worry. Hayden Davis made sure to make Portnoy whole.
Speaker 2: And yes they did disclose it and his own the
Speaker 2: open but that is grotesque because Dave Portnoy has plenty
Speaker 2: of money. He's going to be just fine. But they
Speaker 2: made sure to make him whole.
Speaker 4: Okay. And then the other thing is that.
Speaker 2: Javier Malay is actually if they're looking at like impeachment
Speaker 2: and charging him with corruption and fraud whatever, I don't
Speaker 2: know if any of that goes anywhere. I have no
Speaker 2: idea that you know, argent justice system, et cetera. But
Speaker 2: this has been a massive political scandal for him. I
Speaker 2: don't think there's any doubt about it. Yeah, that was
Speaker 2: a big problem for him because the very people who
Speaker 2: you know were hurt the most by this were the
Speaker 2: biggest believers in him, and it's just such a brazen
Speaker 2: scam that Yeah, I think it is a genuine political
Speaker 2: problem for him in Argentine.
Speaker 1: That is correct.
Speaker 3: I looked this morning on how the Argentine Argentine press
Speaker 3: is covering it.
Speaker 1: But I have no idea. It's not like you have
Speaker 1: the greatest track record in terms of their judicial system.
Speaker 1: That's right though.
Speaker 3: About Portnoy, it's absolutely I mean, he disclosed it. He's like, hey,
Speaker 3: he paid me back five million or whatever. But that
Speaker 3: just gives you some insights. So listen, if you're out
Speaker 3: there and you're watching a Twitch stream and somebody's trying
Speaker 3: to encourage you by coin, but I know nobody will listen.
Speaker 3: What's the point. But you know what, joy shit coins
Speaker 3: and enjoy your single game parlays. Yeah, I'm gonna keep
Speaker 3: put my money in the S and P five hundred.
Speaker 2: When the trumping launched, you saw something, Oh we're all
Speaker 2: getting rich, blah blah blah, like people bought the Just don't, guys,
Speaker 2: just don't.
Speaker 4: Hayden Davis told you.
Speaker 2: The only people who make money or the insiders, they're
Speaker 2: just trying to fool you and rip you off.
Speaker 1: Please. Same with the sports gambling companies.
Speaker 3: The only people making money you're FanDuel and draft can
Speaker 3: here stock is up by chwe percent in the last
Speaker 3: month off the Super Bowl. Thanks for your coin, coinage money.
Speaker 3: That's the only thing that they're telling you.
Speaker 2: Very fortunate to be joined this morning by April Verrett.
Speaker 2: She's a president of the SEIU. They've been involved in
Speaker 2: a number of actions against this current government and their
Speaker 2: illegal behavior.
Speaker 4: Great to see you, April. Welcome, Thank you so much.
Speaker 9: Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, so we can put this first hair
Speaker 2: sheet up on the screen. I know you all have
Speaker 2: been involved in some of the lawsuits about accessing data
Speaker 2: at Department of Labor, at AHHS, at CFPB, also at
Speaker 2: the Treasury just talk to us a little bit about
Speaker 2: your thinking and your decision to get involved in these lawsuits.
Speaker 9: Yeah, you know, there has been such an extreme amount
Speaker 9: of chaos and uncertainty since the inauguration on January twentieth,
Speaker 9: and working people have had enough, and so we were
Speaker 9: proud to lend our voice, along with others in the
Speaker 9: labor movement and the progressive movement, to try to put
Speaker 9: a stop to this outrageous overreach. And we believe that
Speaker 9: what the so called DOGE is doing is highly illegal.
Speaker 9: Going into personal data of folks is just unwarranted, unnecessary,
Speaker 9: and we're happy to do our parts to put a
Speaker 9: stop to it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what are you hearing from your members because one
Speaker 2: of the one of the debates that Zager and I've
Speaker 2: been having here is about how much this is landing
Speaker 2: with working people since you know, Social Security hasn't been
Speaker 2: cut yet, Medicaid hasn't been cut yet. We'll get to
Speaker 2: more on that in a moment. Medicare hasn't been cut yet.
Speaker 2: So far, it's a huge spectacle. Is this giant power grab?
Speaker 2: But maybe it's not biting and hitting people's pocketbooks just yet.
Speaker 4: What is your sense from your membership?
Speaker 2: Of how engaged they are, how concerned they are, or
Speaker 2: do they feel like, oh, well, they're you know, making
Speaker 2: the government more efficient.
Speaker 4: Who wouldn't support that.
Speaker 9: I don't know, knowing my Social Security number or yours,
Speaker 9: or having access to my tax returns or yours or
Speaker 9: billions of other people in the country is making the
Speaker 9: government more efficient. Not only that, we have folks who
Speaker 9: have filed complaints wage in our violation complaints against companies
Speaker 9: owned by Elon Musk, and that data lies inside of
Speaker 9: the Department of Labor, and so for him to have
Speaker 9: access to everything, including information about folks who have filed
Speaker 9: complaints against him, hmm. I think American people, you know,
Speaker 9: have something to say about that. It just goes against
Speaker 9: the tenets of our democracy and just what's fair and right.
Speaker 2: So one of the things that I wanted to talk
Speaker 2: to you about is, you know, they've taken these actions
Speaker 2: so quickly and made Elon Musk, I mean basically like
Speaker 2: this sort of ceo dictator of the country, and they're
Speaker 2: betting on it all happening so fast that the system
Speaker 2: can't really react. And you know, obviously Republicans in Congress
Speaker 2: have just sort of laid down they're just going to
Speaker 2: go along with it, see their own power to the executive.
Speaker 2: The Democrats in Congress seem to be struggling to figure out.
Speaker 4: What exactly they can do to deal with the situation.
Speaker 2: So you're only really left with the court system, which
Speaker 2: I know is why you got involved with these lawsuits.
Speaker 2: Have there been broader conversations though, between you and other
Speaker 2: labor leaders about maybe some more creative or more coordinated
Speaker 2: actions with the labor movement and the you know, all
Speaker 2: of the millions of union members that exist nationwide.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I think we have to remember this is I
Speaker 9: lose count of the days, right, but there's certainly far
Speaker 9: more days ahead of us with this administration than we
Speaker 9: have behind us, and so we have to pace ourselves.
Speaker 9: This is going to be a marathon. It is absolutely
Speaker 9: not a sprint, and they seem to be throwing everything
Speaker 9: and the kitchen sink at us. But I expect there's
Speaker 9: going to be a lot more to come, and so
Speaker 9: it's important that we all take a deep breath, that
Speaker 9: we pace ourselves, that we are strategic as we possibly
Speaker 9: can be, that we choose the smart battles to wage,
Speaker 9: but that we have to stand up against what is
Speaker 9: un American and just not right. And so I think
Speaker 9: we will see in the coming weeks and months ahead
Speaker 9: a much more strategic, escalated, coordinated pushback not just from
Speaker 9: the labor movement, but from all corners of the country,
Speaker 9: where we seek to continue to build the power of
Speaker 9: working people, to break this hold that this administration seems
Speaker 9: to have over our country, to bridge the gap between
Speaker 9: us and others who may not share all of our
Speaker 9: political beliefs, but wan a country right that actually is
Speaker 9: one that has a vibrant and healthy democracy, and to
Speaker 9: you know, and to begin to fix and heal I
Speaker 9: think some of what's wrong in the country right now.
Speaker 4: I know you also have been involved.
Speaker 2: Your union's been involved in pushing back against looming Medicaid cuts.
Speaker 2: We can put E two up on the screen. Your
Speaker 2: Republicans are getting their sort of budget proposals together. Piece
Speaker 2: of that is a giant for jrillion dollar tax.
Speaker 4: Cut for the rich.
Speaker 2: Another thing that is a major priority here from House
Speaker 2: Republicans are cuts to Medicaid. According to The Hill, they
Speaker 2: say they put that at the top of their list
Speaker 2: of budget cuts to help pay for their wide ranging
Speaker 2: agenda that spans tax cuts, Energy Production, and border security.
Speaker 2: Put the next one up on the screen to your
Speaker 2: point about some unlikely bedfellows. Here, Steve Bannon is actually
Speaker 2: warning Republicans about this move.
Speaker 4: He says, Medicaid.
Speaker 2: You got to be careful because a lot of magas
Speaker 2: are on Medicaid. I'm telling you. If you don't think so,
Speaker 2: you are dead wrong. So talk to us about some
Speaker 2: of the efforts to your union is making a push
Speaker 2: back against these cuts.
Speaker 9: Yeah, so we have to know and remember eighty million
Speaker 9: Americans depend on Medicaid for their health care coverage in
Speaker 9: this country. Most of those are children, half our children,
Speaker 9: and a lot of them are seniors. And so it
Speaker 9: is just incompatable to believe that we will take away
Speaker 9: health care access and coverage for the most vulnerable among us.
Speaker 9: And I don't ever say this, I think maybe the
Speaker 9: first time ever, but I agree with Steve Bannon. Medicaid
Speaker 9: is not a blue issue. It's not a red issue.
Speaker 9: It's not right or left. It's American, and it's Americans
Speaker 9: health care coverage. And so we know that Republicans and
Speaker 9: Democrats alike depend on this program. Red states and blue states.
Speaker 9: Thirty percent of state budgets is Medicaid and health care
Speaker 9: related costs. And so if you make those types of
Speaker 9: cuts so deep into state budgets, it doesn't just effect Medicaid,
Speaker 9: it affects every single part of a state budget. And
Speaker 9: so we need to raise our voices. We had over
Speaker 9: three hundred people on Capitol Hill a couple of weeks
Speaker 9: ago lobbying Democrats and Republicans alike on this issue, because
Speaker 9: working people are not going to stand by and watch
Speaker 9: this type of devastation happen to our communities.
Speaker 2: Last question for you, April, what do you make of
Speaker 2: some of the political trend towards Republicans among union members,
Speaker 2: and specifically towards Donald Trump, who's made a pretty concerted
Speaker 2: effort to appeal to some union members.
Speaker 9: Look, union members are regular, everyday people, right. We don't
Speaker 9: have a country without working people, and that includes folks
Speaker 9: who belongs to unions. And I believe that folks want
Speaker 9: lower prices, they want more control, more agency over their lives.
Speaker 9: They want to know that they can take care of
Speaker 9: their families and keep a roof over their heads, and
Speaker 9: send their kids to college, and hey, maybe take a
Speaker 9: vacation every once in a while while. And I believe
Speaker 9: that's what folks thought that they were voting for. But
Speaker 9: we are, you know, almost a month in and I
Speaker 9: haven't seen the price of the eggs get any lower.
Speaker 9: I haven't seen people more certain about the stability of
Speaker 9: our country. All that I've seen is chaos and uncertainty.
Speaker 9: And so I think if they continue to do what
Speaker 9: they do, folks will know what the truth is, and
Speaker 9: that is that they voted for someone who is not
Speaker 9: really on the side of working people. It is clear
Speaker 9: he is on the side of his billionaire cronies and
Speaker 9: the corporations that they lead, and it's time for us
Speaker 9: to take our country back and make sure it's one
Speaker 9: where working people stand a chance to get ahead.
Speaker 2: April Vert, president of a Service Employees International Union. Great
Speaker 2: to have you, welcome, Thank you so much for joining us.
Speaker 9: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Joining us Now is front of the show, Ali Betstucky.
Speaker 3: She is the host of Relatable and it's great to
Speaker 3: see you.
Speaker 8: Great to see you too.
Speaker 3: Thank you all right, So Ali's here to horseshoe people
Speaker 3: into traditional values reacting, it seems to this Elon musk saga.
Speaker 3: Let's put this up there on the screen for those
Speaker 3: who have not yet seen the news Ashley Saint Clair.
Speaker 1: She's a conservative influencer. I guess you would call has.
Speaker 3: Had claimed now to have had Elon Musks thirteenth child
Speaker 3: reveals she sat down for a tabloid interview here a
Speaker 3: life of secrecy after a whirlwild romance with a down
Speaker 3: to earth billionaire.
Speaker 1: What we learn a little bit more.
Speaker 3: From this entire saga is that there's been some disputes
Speaker 3: between miss Saint Clair between Elon Musk about paternity, it seems,
Speaker 3: in terms of his responsibility, and it spawned a lot
Speaker 3: of discussion online amongst the conservative intelligency. I guess over
Speaker 3: having a child out of wedlock, about these arrangements for
Speaker 3: her family and what is the ideal outcome if you
Speaker 3: want to live a good and a happy life. So
Speaker 3: let's put her statement here where she says, five months ago,
Speaker 3: I welcomed a new baby into the world, Unmuscus, the
Speaker 3: father of not Previously you disclosed this to protect our
Speaker 3: child's safety and privacy, But in recent days has become
Speaker 3: clear the tabloid media intends to do so, regardless of
Speaker 3: the harm it will cause. Initially, she was saying there
Speaker 3: it's a tabloid story. However, she did participate later in
Speaker 3: that report from the New York Post. So, Ali, what
Speaker 3: do you make of all this as participating in the discourse?
Speaker 8: Yes, okay, So when I saw this news, I was
Speaker 8: so shocked by it. I literally woke my husband up
Speaker 8: out of his slumber, and he didn't. He was like delirious.
Speaker 8: He was like, I think I'm dreaming. There's no way
Speaker 8: that you're telling the truth. And as it started unraveling
Speaker 8: and we were digging more into it, we realized it
Speaker 8: is very much true. And I have a lot of
Speaker 8: conflicting feelings about it. I mean, I know exactly where
Speaker 8: I stand when it comes to marriage and children and families,
Speaker 8: formation of families. We need not just more babies, we
Speaker 8: need actually stable families for society to survive and thrive.
Speaker 8: And so I know Elon Musk is a part of this,
Speaker 8: like desire to repopulate the earth, like Genghis Khan. I
Speaker 8: think he's even said something like that before. Yeah, but
Speaker 8: we don't just need more babies, we need more stability.
Speaker 8: And from my understanding, this was the intentional creation of
Speaker 8: a child that they knew was not going to have
Speaker 8: a stable to parent home. And because of that, I
Speaker 8: couldn't participate in the celebration and the congratulation. It's not
Speaker 8: that I think that the baby is it valuable. Of course,
Speaker 8: the baby is so worthy of love and celebration and
Speaker 8: all of that. Absolutely, but this seems to be a
Speaker 8: very sordid and purposeful situation, and I just don't think
Speaker 8: that I can publicly be a part of celebrating.
Speaker 2: That well, and part of you know, we had a
Speaker 2: debate internally that I don't think zacher My may revealing.
Speaker 4: Of like should we cover this because it is does feel.
Speaker 2: Like, you know, it's like it's tragy, it's like, you know,
Speaker 2: it's very personal, all those sorts of things. But to
Speaker 2: your point, first of all, Elon Musk is one of
Speaker 2: the most powerful people on the planet at this point.
Speaker 4: And number two, to your point.
Speaker 2: It does speak to this like ideology that he has,
Speaker 2: so I think it is important to dig into it,
Speaker 2: not to mention. I think the legitimate points people have
Speaker 2: made of like if this was Barack Obama, people would
Speaker 2: certainly be covering it totally. But what did you make
Speaker 2: of some of the response from the right that was like, oh,
Speaker 2: she's winning it life, She's secured wealth and good genetics
Speaker 2: for her baby. That one makes me very very uncomfortable
Speaker 2: when you start talking in this language of like genetics
Speaker 2: and that that should be the sole goal of procreation,
Speaker 2: is having like the perfect baby with the perfect genetics.
Speaker 2: Obviously that's a dark road to go down. What did
Speaker 2: you make of some of that reaction?
Speaker 8: Yeah, because there were some different motivations behind the celebration.
Speaker 8: So I have a lot of pro life, very solid,
Speaker 8: socially conservative friends who congratulated, and we might disagree on that,
Speaker 8: but I do not doubt there since your values. They
Speaker 8: see it as I'm just celebrating the existence of a baby,
Speaker 8: and that's all they're doing. But then there were those
Speaker 8: like you said that were like, who cares, The world
Speaker 8: needs more babies. This is a good thing. We need
Speaker 8: more based babies. I saw something like that, and so
Speaker 8: we should just be happy for them. But clearly this
Speaker 8: is not a happy situation. That's first of all. We
Speaker 8: can see that. We can see that from Ashley's responses,
Speaker 8: some of them she deleted. This is actually a very sad, complicated,
Speaker 8: messy situation, and this little helpless child who didn't consent
Speaker 8: to any of this is right at the center of it.
Speaker 8: So I think we should actually be sad that this
Speaker 8: whole thing happened. But then also when we look at
Speaker 8: the conservative values of the right, you made a really
Speaker 8: good point. If this had been Barack Obama or a
Speaker 8: number of other kinds of people, no one would be celebrating.
Speaker 8: We would be calling it degenerate behavior, irresponsible, the problem
Speaker 8: with society, part of the breakdown of society and the
Speaker 8: breakdown of the family. But baby Mama, culture, I guess
Speaker 8: is okay when it's Elon Musk, and I just can't
Speaker 8: get on board with that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're absolutely right, and you know, to your point,
Speaker 3: this is deeply void and sad. So let's put this
Speaker 3: up there on the screen. You know what you were
Speaker 3: talking about. For some of their back and the forth,
Speaker 3: you can see here, she says. Elon, We've been trying
Speaker 3: to communicate for the past several days. You have not responded.
Speaker 3: When are you trying to going to reply to us
Speaker 3: instead of publicly responding to smears from an individual who
Speaker 3: just posted photos of me in my underwear at age
Speaker 3: fifteen years old? Like you said, she eventually deleted it.
Speaker 3: But this is not a happy situation, and so I guess,
Speaker 3: like bringing it back in terms of how we should
Speaker 3: all look at this arrangement, the eventual sad outcome where
Speaker 3: you have bickering online while yes there's an innocent child
Speaker 3: in the midst of all of this, and what the
Speaker 3: cultural takeaway should be in terms of celebration and or
Speaker 3: using it as a lesson for everybody out there for
Speaker 3: their personal lives.
Speaker 8: Yes, well, I think that it is an interesting picture
Speaker 8: at what the right is now, what the Republican Party
Speaker 8: is now, And we knew that when we kind of
Speaker 8: grabbed on to the MA movement, which includes a lot
Speaker 8: of amazing people that I agree with in a lot
Speaker 8: of ways, but who are also very socially liberal or moderate,
Speaker 8: we kind of rearranged the right to be a conglomeration
Speaker 8: of all different types of fundamental values, Like we agree
Speaker 8: on important things that want us an election, but we
Speaker 8: never got down to the basics. I mean, we disagree
Speaker 8: on fundamental things like the definition of marriage when life begins,
Speaker 8: the sanctity of life, if marriage is even necessary obviously,
Speaker 8: and so in some ways I think these debates are productive.
Speaker 8: I see my role in others like me to be
Speaker 8: an anchor on the right to move the overton window
Speaker 8: as much as I can, and to hopefully show people
Speaker 8: that it's not just about having traditional or old values
Speaker 8: but doing what works. If we really want society to win,
Speaker 8: if we want America to be first, we have to
Speaker 8: have a stable family unit. And we also have to know,
Speaker 8: in my opinion, where all of that comes from, which
Speaker 8: is from a creator who created objective, universal morality and
Speaker 8: all of that. I'm a Christian where I stand, but
Speaker 8: at the very least just looking at it pragmatically, this
Speaker 8: kind of stowing your wild oats when you're a fifty
Speaker 8: three year old going after I don't want to say
Speaker 8: going after, but being in a relationship. I guess with
Speaker 8: the twenty six year old conservative commentator, it's just not
Speaker 8: the way to go. If everyone did that, If everyone
Speaker 8: did that, then we would all be at a world
Speaker 8: of her. It would all be a mess. So maybe
Speaker 8: we should think about what is best not just for
Speaker 8: us in the moment, but for society in general as well.
Speaker 8: It's interesting you bring up Mahan Rfk Junior because my
Speaker 8: husband woke me up in the middle of the night
Speaker 8: when the Olivia Nuzzy Rfk Junior affair came out, And
Speaker 8: you know, I mean one of the questions I have
Speaker 8: for you is like, has this ship sailed in a
Speaker 8: sense when well, Trump himself is how many times divorced
Speaker 8: and kids with all these different you know women, and R. K.
Speaker 8: Junior is by his own admission, serial philander. You know,
Speaker 8: the history with him and his ex wife who was
Speaker 8: now deceased is deeply dark and horrifying.
Speaker 2: You know, has that ship sort of sailed? And I'm
Speaker 2: not saying those things were celebrated in the same way.
Speaker 2: I think that's part of what's different about this particular dynamic.
Speaker 2: But was the road laid out by celebrating certainly those individuals,
Speaker 2: even if those particular choices were not part of what
Speaker 2: was inherently celebrated.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think that's a fair question. But then you
Speaker 8: also have JD. Vance, who I think is being heralded
Speaker 8: as a hero rightly by a lot of conservatives, not
Speaker 8: only because he's just so strong and he's not afraid
Speaker 8: to say the truth, but also because of his clear
Speaker 8: family values, because he is so insanely normal, and it
Speaker 8: feels like a really long time that we've had a
Speaker 8: normal young family in the White House or you know,
Speaker 8: in d C. And so I think that really Trump
Speaker 8: and Elon Musk and RFK they were simply seen as
Speaker 8: the people who could get it done. And I still
Speaker 8: have hope that those who have come over to the
Speaker 8: right and who have changed a lot of their values
Speaker 8: over the past few years, that they can still change
Speaker 8: their values even more to come even further over, because
Speaker 8: I hear from a lot of these very influential Mahak
Speaker 8: people who tell me privately, you know, I used to
Speaker 8: be ardently pro choice, and now I'm rethinking that. So
Speaker 8: I think that there's an opportunity, and I think instead
Speaker 8: of compromising those of us on the social right over there,
Speaker 8: we really have to hold the line and be as
Speaker 8: persuasive as possible.
Speaker 2: Ali last question I have for you is how does
Speaker 2: this fit in? Like I feel like, you know, with
Speaker 2: Trump and with Elon and with RFK Junior, there's like
Speaker 2: a nexus with sort of like the Andrew Tait version
Speaker 2: of masculinity, where you know, philandering and you.
Speaker 4: Know, getting a lot of women and having.
Speaker 2: Like basically a hair like this is sort of like
Speaker 2: celebrated as that's part of what makes you an alpha male.
Speaker 2: The Trump administration is now trying to pressure Romania to, like,
Speaker 2: you know, I don't want to get into that whole thing,
Speaker 2: but let the Tate brothers off the hook, et cetera. Like,
Speaker 2: how do you Because I think that's part of what
Speaker 2: is intension with the direction you want to push the
Speaker 2: party in. Is that part of that definition of being
Speaker 2: an alpha and being a male has come along with
Speaker 2: that view and that approach to women and parenting, etc.
Speaker 8: Yes, so part of it is true this kind of masculinity.
Speaker 8: Being tough is masculine. Saying what is true while being
Speaker 8: unafraid to do so is masculine. Being strong. All of
Speaker 8: those things are masculine. But what I think is, like
Speaker 8: maybe piauk masculinity or one of the key parts of
Speaker 8: masculinity is self control. And when we have someone like
Speaker 8: Andrew Tage who can't even master himself and yet he
Speaker 8: is talking about conquering the world by impregnating a bunch
Speaker 8: of women, yeah, I mean every loser forever has done that.
Speaker 8: But if you can't even control yourself and your own
Speaker 8: based passions, then you really know better than an animal.
Speaker 8: So I understand why parts of Andrew Tate are like, wow,
Speaker 8: he's really unafraid to speak against feminism. But of course,
Speaker 8: I mean he is no better than any you know,
Speaker 8: degenerate that has ever lived, and I do really I'm
Speaker 8: very troubled and very worried about the lionization of someone
Speaker 8: like Andrew Tait on the right. I see that even
Speaker 8: growing now, and yeah, that greatly concerns me.
Speaker 3: Well, Ali, I respect you so much. I think you're
Speaker 3: so consistent, and I just always enjoy talking like you.
Speaker 3: So I really hope that you come back to the show.
Speaker 3: And it's been just been great hearing your perspective.
Speaker 8: Thank you, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Thank you guys so much for watching.
Speaker 3: We appreciate you, and we'll see you all on Thursday.