Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Civic Cipher. I am your
Speaker 1: host Rams' job.
Speaker 2: They called me q Ward and I think they called
Speaker 2: me that because my mom actually named me Quentin, and
Speaker 2: Q was easier to say.
Speaker 3: That's how I think that worked out.
Speaker 1: I think it works too, man. And yeah, man, I
Speaker 1: needed that laugh. Man, it was a heavy week.
Speaker 4: I'm tired of heavy weeks.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 2: Like I promise y'all, we have so much intention on
Speaker 2: doing a celebratory, joyous, happy show, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: We want to come on here, laugh, smile, joke, uplift
Speaker 2: our people. But they keep giving us more.
Speaker 3: Stuff.
Speaker 2: That's just like, man, come on, and they gave him
Speaker 2: to us bike to bike.
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: In case over this past week, and in case you've
Speaker 1: been under a rock this past week, you know, obviously
Speaker 1: there was uh well if you've been on the rock,
Speaker 1: I guess it's not that obvious, but there was a
Speaker 1: mass shooting in Georgia that was disproportionately uh affected.
Speaker 4: The Asian American community.
Speaker 1: After all of the stuff that they've already been through,
Speaker 1: you know, the terror and the you know, racism and
Speaker 1: all that sort of stuff. Now to have a mass
Speaker 1: shooting take place it's just a lot by itself. But
Speaker 1: you know, a few days ago, you know, someone opened
Speaker 1: fire in a grocery store in Colorado, and.
Speaker 4: You know, we're here to make sense of that.
Speaker 2: We're here to try to make sense of it. I
Speaker 2: don't I don't know that that that will be successful.
Speaker 2: We're gonna give it a shot, though, you know.
Speaker 1: You you never think that you're going to end up
Speaker 1: in this position have these conversations about this sort of stuff.
Speaker 1: But life has a funny way of bringing stuff to
Speaker 1: your doorstep and leaving it there, and you have to
Speaker 1: deal with it. And so it wouldn't be right if
Speaker 1: we didn't address it on a show like this. Now, granted,
Speaker 1: we have to bear in mind that we're looking at
Speaker 1: it through a black lens, and we have to figure
Speaker 1: out what it means to us, you know, because I
Speaker 1: think we're all to wonder gre another, trying to find
Speaker 1: our place in the world relative to each other as
Speaker 1: brothers and sisters on this planet and above that, and
Speaker 1: before we even get to that point, I think that
Speaker 1: there's a human component there that, you know, begs us
Speaker 1: to consider it. You know, these are human beings that
Speaker 1: once upon a time were alive that are not alive anymore,
Speaker 1: and it's just sad, and they were just living their
Speaker 1: lives and never at any point expected that that would
Speaker 1: be the life day that they were alive, and then
Speaker 1: their families and their communities have to continue on about that.
Speaker 1: But the reason why this is important for this type
Speaker 1: of space is because every time something like this happens,
Speaker 1: and certainly if it happens twice in a week on
Speaker 1: this level, the conversation turns to, you know, what are
Speaker 1: we going to do about these guns? And what does
Speaker 1: the Second Amendment really mean in terms of, you know,
Speaker 1: our right to bear arms.
Speaker 4: In this country? And I think this is.
Speaker 1: Kind of timely for us because you know, behind the scenes,
Speaker 1: you and I have had some conversations about this very thing, and.
Speaker 4: Today is the day that you know, we'll just kind
Speaker 4: of share.
Speaker 1: Our dialogue with our listeners so that you know, they
Speaker 1: know that there's a few different ways to think about this,
Speaker 1: and you know, you got to find what's right for
Speaker 1: you and move through the universe with that intention.
Speaker 4: But hopefully, you know, will help you flesh out some.
Speaker 1: Thoughts that maybe you hadn't considered before, or you know,
Speaker 1: maybe reaffirm something that you know to be true for yourself.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of folks that talk about
Speaker 1: background checks. There's a lot of folks that talk about,
Speaker 1: you know, whatever, how these things are going to work,
Speaker 1: and how these things are going to get fixed and
Speaker 1: so forth, And the truth is, none of them really
Speaker 1: sound like they're going to work. Unless everybody takes all
Speaker 1: the guns away, then nobody can shoot anybody and you
Speaker 1: don't have to worry about this sort of thing.
Speaker 4: I get it.
Speaker 1: That's a pie in the sky and it's not realistic,
Speaker 1: and there's always going to be a bad guy with
Speaker 1: a gun and blah blah blah. But you know, that's
Speaker 1: that tends to be the way those conversations go. But
Speaker 1: you know, if we've made an effort towards that, then
Speaker 1: you know, maybe the reality of no more mass shooting
Speaker 1: might you know, I know that they did this in Australia,
Speaker 1: and so I know it's possible because once upon a
Speaker 1: time they have mass shootings and then after a bunch
Speaker 1: of kids got shot up, they're like, you know what,
Speaker 1: no more guns, give us all the guns back, And
Speaker 1: they haven't really had anything like that since, so I
Speaker 1: know it's possible.
Speaker 4: I believe it's possible.
Speaker 1: But one thing that was said by someone who I'm
Speaker 1: a fan of a he's a great orator and a comedian,
Speaker 1: Dave Chappelle. He said that the only way that they're
Speaker 1: going to change the law, he says, you know, it's
Speaker 1: an election year. The only way they're going to change
Speaker 1: the law. I heard this is if every single black
Speaker 1: person in the country, you know, fulfills their civic duty
Speaker 1: and registers for a legal firearm. And the joke there
Speaker 1: was that he was kind of leading you to say
Speaker 1: that you want to register to vote, but he was
Speaker 1: imploring folks to register to get guns black people specifically
Speaker 1: because his I'm deducing that his the idea behind that
Speaker 1: was that conservative white folks would be so alarmed at
Speaker 1: the amount of guns going into black communities that they
Speaker 1: would change the laws. Because if there's one thing historically
Speaker 1: speaking that we've learned as black people that is scarier
Speaker 1: to conservative white folks than black people, it's black people
Speaker 1: with guns.
Speaker 2: Well, the last time there was an assault rifle band,
Speaker 2: it was because of the Black Panther Party. Yeah, you
Speaker 2: see what I mean. So he was historical basis rooted
Speaker 2: in some very authentic truth.
Speaker 1: Sure, and then there are people who are not like
Speaker 1: Dave Chappelle, who are perhaps a bit more like me,
Speaker 1: who you know, I'm not a gun person. I don't
Speaker 1: believe that, you know, a gun is for me. But
Speaker 1: I'll talk about me in just a bit. First, I
Speaker 1: want to hear from you because you know, the thing
Speaker 1: that I fear is that it's just a matter of
Speaker 1: time before this mass shooting. Excuse me, mass shooting sort
Speaker 1: of a thing is on our doorstep, and it's such
Speaker 1: a scary thing, but you know, it's something we have
Speaker 1: to talk about. You know, there was an attempted mass
Speaker 1: shooting maybe a year ago where we live, and you.
Speaker 3: Know, I'm not sure if it was that long ago
Speaker 3: out in Glende.
Speaker 1: Recently, yeah, And so you know it's it's one of
Speaker 1: those things where it's like, Okay, well, it feels like
Speaker 1: it's like waiting for an earthquake. You know, I grew
Speaker 1: up in California, and you know, you're in a constant
Speaker 1: state of awareness that an earthquake could hit at any time,
Speaker 1: and you know where the exits are, and you know
Speaker 1: what the earthquake drills are, and but this is for
Speaker 1: mass shooting, and you know they have those mass shooting
Speaker 1: drills in schools for kids, you know, because school shootings
Speaker 1: and matches are.
Speaker 2: I can't even imagine sure Grayson coming home from school
Speaker 2: to explain the mass shooting drill that they practice that
Speaker 2: school today.
Speaker 1: Well there's that, But for the rest of us in
Speaker 1: the general population, you know, there is no grocery store
Speaker 1: drill for shooting, you know what I mean. So having
Speaker 1: that constant state of awareness, like if you're living in
Speaker 1: California where an earthquake could pop out at any time,
Speaker 1: you come to terms with the fact that you know
Speaker 1: it's just a matter of time before it happens.
Speaker 4: It will happen. I just got to know what to
Speaker 4: do when it happens. Right.
Speaker 1: It feels like that with a mass shooting. And I'm
Speaker 1: sure that everyone listening to us right now, to some
Speaker 1: degree or another, feels like, you know, they're not You're
Speaker 1: not gonna you know, there's nothing you can do in
Speaker 1: terms of living your life, like a normal life that
Speaker 1: will keep you beyond the line of fire. You know,
Speaker 1: you can go to a country concert in Vegas, you
Speaker 1: can go to the growth to Walmart and church Texas.
Speaker 1: You can go to church and pray to God. It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. You can be sleeping in your bed, be
Speaker 1: a kindergartener and go to school and you're like, if
Speaker 1: someone will execute you with a gun, you know it's
Speaker 1: possible for that to happen because we've seen it in
Speaker 1: recent years. I remember I picked up my older son,
Speaker 1: Christian from school that day the Sandy Hook happened. I
Speaker 1: was like, you know what, let me just go over
Speaker 1: here and get my son right now, because I don't
Speaker 1: know what's going on in his planet and his world,
Speaker 1: and you know, here we are.
Speaker 4: So the gun debate is one that is a little
Speaker 4: bit messy.
Speaker 1: It's not my favorite thing because I'm not a big
Speaker 1: gun fan, you know, as I stated, but you know
Speaker 1: there I'm not. This show is not for me to
Speaker 1: just get off my ideas. This is his show for
Speaker 1: black people to share their black ideas and to share
Speaker 1: the space with our brothers and sisters who are allies
Speaker 1: or themselves might have some sort of struggles or you know,
Speaker 1: something to overcome, but someone with a different perspective is
Speaker 1: you que So your thoughts on these things.
Speaker 4: First.
Speaker 2: It's always very, very difficult to talk about these things
Speaker 2: because I always try to and you help me a
Speaker 2: lot with this not place people in a space of
Speaker 2: obvious ignorance.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: The answers to this test are not difficult. Someone gets
Speaker 2: shot with an assault rifle every time. Yeah, what would
Speaker 2: you think would be the simple answer to all of
Speaker 2: these mass shootings with the salt rifle?
Speaker 3: Well, I want you to be.
Speaker 2: Specific, because the Constitution exists in a way that it
Speaker 2: does as long as there's something that has not been amended,
Speaker 2: because that's an amendment. But you're never allowed to make
Speaker 2: any more amendments. Those amendments are the best ever, they're perfect,
Speaker 2: never amend more. Right, as long as those amendments exist
Speaker 2: in the way that they do, you're always going to
Speaker 2: have some pushback. Right, So in preparation for that pushback,
Speaker 2: what would be the most simple and obvious compromise to
Speaker 2: not take away people's second amendment, right, but to do
Speaker 2: a little bit of something towards this assault rifle problem.
Speaker 2: The assault rifles perhaps, but everything don't have tanks. But
Speaker 2: every time someone suggests that, they're met with a lot
Speaker 2: of pushback. And the thing about the gun issue, more
Speaker 2: specifically is it is a bipartisan thing.
Speaker 3: The support for it is bipartisan.
Speaker 2: And I didn't realize that I thought that one side
Speaker 2: felt way in one way, on the other side felt
Speaker 2: the other way.
Speaker 4: But that's not true. I've seen a lot.
Speaker 2: Of pushback from both sides with regard to they're gonna
Speaker 2: come in your house and take your guns, the scare
Speaker 2: tactic that they use to rile people up and scare
Speaker 2: people into holding fast to their guns of any type.
Speaker 2: But I can't understand how we can watch children be murdered,
Speaker 2: how we can watch church goers be murdered, how we
Speaker 2: can watch people doing what you and I did today,
Speaker 2: just simply out living their life. Honey, I'll be back.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go to the grocery store. Do you need anything.
Speaker 2: That's the last conversation some of those people ever had.
Speaker 2: They didn't wrong someone, They didn't get into a fighter
Speaker 2: and cut someone off in traffic and anger that person,
Speaker 2: and that person irrationally responded far too extreme. They just
Speaker 2: went to get milk, eggs, juice.
Speaker 3: Baby.
Speaker 2: I'll be right back, honey, I'll be right back to
Speaker 2: their kids, to their spouse, just like we did today.
Speaker 2: They go to this meeting, then we're gonna go to lunch,
Speaker 2: and going to lunch is dangerous.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 2: I went to the post office a couple of days ago.
Speaker 2: We're all wearing masks now, so you're talking about a
Speaker 2: heightened sense of I hope this isn't it. Every time
Speaker 2: anyone walks in with the mask on. I hope this
Speaker 2: person is like me, just here to send or receive parcel,
Speaker 2: not here to angrily live out a match of call
Speaker 2: of duty. And that because they had a bad Day's funny.
Speaker 2: So that's something that I want to talk about.
Speaker 1: So, you know, there can you can make an argument
Speaker 1: that the vast majority of these mass shootings have their
Speaker 1: roots in white supremacist ideologies, right, not all of them,
Speaker 1: but the vast majority, you know, maybe seventy percent.
Speaker 4: Of them, right, I think maybe higher, but being conservative, sure.
Speaker 1: And then there's probably another good number on top of
Speaker 1: that seventy percent quote unquote that is born out of
Speaker 1: a response to this American brand of white supremacy, you know.
Speaker 1: And there's another way to tackle it by dealing with
Speaker 1: that what is it that's making It's gonna sound crazy,
Speaker 1: but what is it that's making these often white males
Speaker 1: feel so disconnected from society, so divorced from reality, and
Speaker 1: so isolated and so forth. Now, now that I'm not
Speaker 1: going to go down that rabbit hole. But you know,
Speaker 1: these are conversations, These are the sorts of questions that
Speaker 1: need to be asked. In addition to what do we
Speaker 1: do about these guns? I don't want to even talk
Speaker 1: about that because that's a whole other thing that has
Speaker 1: to do with psychology. What I'm talking about today is
Speaker 1: and let me say my piece.
Speaker 4: Okay, I'm a.
Speaker 1: Black man, I have two black sons, I live a
Speaker 1: black life. I do a black radio show. Right, I've
Speaker 1: got death threats for doing this show.
Speaker 4: You know that. I mean, there's nothing to worry about.
Speaker 3: These well, right, that's what That's how we want to feel.
Speaker 4: I mean, you know that's how I feel. But you
Speaker 4: know they're not.
Speaker 1: If you're hiding behind the screen and you don't have
Speaker 1: like an icon on your social media and you just
Speaker 1: want to get something off because you're having a bad day,
Speaker 1: quote unquote, you know that's all good.
Speaker 2: There's nothing randomized therein lies my point. Though there once
Speaker 2: upon a time, once upon a time, you could responsibly
Speaker 2: respond that way, it would be irresponsible to respond that
Speaker 2: way now because of Yeah, okay, that's when you're the
Speaker 2: face of a show like this, where you're speaking up
Speaker 2: against the very men who you just described.
Speaker 1: Okay, I might have to reel that back. But the
Speaker 1: point I'm making here is even for me being black
Speaker 1: and doing all of these things and having maybe more
Speaker 1: of a I don't want to call it a target,
Speaker 1: but be more visible than most people. You know, I cannot,
Speaker 1: for myself justify.
Speaker 4: Owning a gun. It's just not for me.
Speaker 1: And I tried to think about it, and I'm saying
Speaker 1: this on air because there might be some people who
Speaker 1: think about this like me. Whenever I look at a gun,
Speaker 1: I only see a tool that exists to end a life.
Speaker 1: It does nothing other than end a life. It terminates
Speaker 1: something that has been animated by our common creator. And
Speaker 1: for me, that tool has no place in my life.
Speaker 1: And if I do make the decision to own a gun,
Speaker 1: that by definition, at least for me, is a decision
Speaker 1: that I made out of fear. And as a rule,
Speaker 1: I don't make decisions out of fear.
Speaker 4: What could go wrong, what.
Speaker 1: Could happen bad? I don't live in that space. I
Speaker 1: don't live my life in that space. You know, we
Speaker 1: are often very critical of policing systems, but you know,
Speaker 1: we also recognize that there's a place.
Speaker 4: For that in society.
Speaker 1: Right there should be someone that you call that might
Speaker 1: have a gun, maybe in the trunk of their car,
Speaker 1: that they might need to access in a worst case
Speaker 1: scenario sort of a situation. But as far as Ramses
Speaker 1: is concerned, I do not want to live my life
Speaker 1: with a tool constantly at the ready to execute someone's life.
Speaker 1: It just feels like if I'm living that life, I'm
Speaker 1: already halfway dead. Why am I that afraid? Why am
Speaker 1: I carrying that fear with me? Everywhere I go? I
Speaker 1: carry my keys in my phone with me. My phone
Speaker 1: it doubles as my wallet, so there are only two
Speaker 1: things I have to carry. Cause you're mad at me
Speaker 1: carrying a murder. That's all it does. My phone will
Speaker 1: tell me the time it is. I could talk to people,
Speaker 1: I can play a game, you know, whatever, FaceTime, you know,
Speaker 1: listen to some music, all these things, and then a
Speaker 1: gun is way bigger. It's only purpose is to end
Speaker 1: to life. So for me, on a fundamental level, it
Speaker 1: just doesn't. It's not something that really makes sense for me.
Speaker 1: That's not to say that I don't understand why other people,
Speaker 1: you know, I've had this conversation before once, once upon
Speaker 1: a time, my sister, the world is a very different
Speaker 1: place for a woman, right, and women it doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: Sometimes they just have that fear because they're so vulnerable
Speaker 1: so much of the time. She told me a story
Speaker 1: about walking to her car at night from when she
Speaker 1: was in college at Arizona State, and she's like, you know,
Speaker 1: the reason I call you every day is so you're
Speaker 1: on the phone with me while I'm walking to my car.
Speaker 4: And I just didn't get like, why do you keep calling?
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: And then finally she pulled up. She's like, Ramas, do
Speaker 1: I want to talk to you? Like, the world is
Speaker 1: very different from me. I need to talk to my
Speaker 1: big brother when I'm walking to the car. If nothing
Speaker 1: ever happens to me, at least I feel better about that.
Speaker 1: So I get that some folks their life is based
Speaker 1: in a more they've had more traumatic experiences, or they're
Speaker 1: a lot more vulnerable, you know, So far be it
Speaker 1: for me to tell anybody else how to live their life.
Speaker 1: But I do recognize that, you know, I'm not one
Speaker 1: of those people that's going to fight against you know,
Speaker 1: everybody's guns getting taken away because I'm like, well, shoot
Speaker 1: everybody's guns?
Speaker 4: Who who made you?
Speaker 3: God?
Speaker 1: Who made you the decider of who gets to live
Speaker 1: and die? You know, if you believe in that sort
Speaker 1: of a thing, and you know, if somebody's coming for
Speaker 1: you and they have a gun, how likely is it
Speaker 1: that you're going to recognize the threat and be able
Speaker 1: to respond to that threat accurately enough to neutralize that
Speaker 1: threat using a gun?
Speaker 4: If you really are that, if you if you really buy.
Speaker 1: A gun for protection, I think that you're telling yourself
Speaker 1: a story. You buy a gun for fear. If you
Speaker 1: need protection, you buy a vest. That's what I think.
Speaker 1: And I think that most people buy a gun because
Speaker 1: they want that power, and then when they have that
Speaker 1: power and they don't get their way, they are able
Speaker 1: to wield that power to suit their immediate needs and
Speaker 1: to kind of create some immediate gratification. And I think
Speaker 1: that human beings are exceptionally irresponsible when it comes to that.
Speaker 1: We are supposed to love each other. That's why love
Speaker 1: feels better than anger and hurt, and we don't cry,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, that's our natural state. Let's
Speaker 1: chill this so you know, I could rant all day
Speaker 1: about that sort of a thing.
Speaker 2: But except I'm sitting here as a gun owner and
Speaker 2: would not allow you to do so.
Speaker 4: Right, Well, that's why I'm talking to you about it.
Speaker 4: So the other side, love absolutely feels better.
Speaker 2: Except and for those of you you listen to us
Speaker 2: on a regular you know that my partner is a
Speaker 2: forever optimist. We used to joke with Ramses when we
Speaker 2: when we first met in the infancy of our friendship,
Speaker 2: that the world is rainbows and butterflies to him. However,
Speaker 2: Ramses is from Compton, Q is from Detroit, and we
Speaker 2: are from places where you it's almost and I'll use
Speaker 2: the word irresponsible again to think one hundred percent of
Speaker 2: the way that Ramses does nine you be all right,
Speaker 2: because love should rule and conquer all. We should be
Speaker 2: more protective of one another. We should not have to
Speaker 2: own a gun to defend ourselves. But in the same
Speaker 2: way that you know, Ramses does not move in a
Speaker 2: world where the worst case scenario is how he makes
Speaker 2: his decisions. But you don't think you're house is gonna
Speaker 2: get flooded, but you buy home insurance. You don't think
Speaker 2: your house is gonna catch on fire, but you have
Speaker 2: a fire extinguisher. You have car insurance. You buy cell
Speaker 2: phone insurance, not because you're gonna throw your phone on
Speaker 2: the ground, but any event that you drop it one day,
Speaker 2: you sure not, You sure rather not spend another thousand
Speaker 2: dollars on a new iPhone. I came home one day
Speaker 2: with my son, my pregnant woman to a gentleman sitting
Speaker 2: on my porch claiming that my house was his. I'll
Speaker 2: pause for a second to let everybody. Let everybody imagine
Speaker 2: that you just bought the house too.
Speaker 3: I had just bought my house.
Speaker 2: And when you have your baby and your pregnant woman
Speaker 2: with you, there's a lot of decision making that has
Speaker 2: to happen really really fast in that moment. I'm gonna
Speaker 2: give you guys some time to kind of digest and
Speaker 2: reflect in your own head what you think you'd do
Speaker 2: in that situation, and in a few seconds, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: come back to it.
Speaker 4: If that's fair, absolutely so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you're just tuning in to uh civic scipher,
Speaker 1: i'my host Ramsy's job.
Speaker 2: They call me q Ward for reasons I sometimes can't explain,
Speaker 2: but I think the most obvious one is because my
Speaker 2: mother named me Quentin.
Speaker 3: And Q is just easier to say.
Speaker 4: And what we're talking about is where do guns fit
Speaker 4: in our lives? And you know, we're having.
Speaker 1: A spirited gun debate on whether or not owning guns
Speaker 1: really makes sense, especially in the aftermath of all these
Speaker 1: mass shootings that we've seen in recent years.
Speaker 2: Less of a debate, less of a debate than ramses
Speaker 2: thinks though, because I agree with a eleven out of twelve,
Speaker 2: nine out of ten, whatever, high percentage of reasons why
Speaker 2: and why not on this particular topic.
Speaker 4: But my reasons are very.
Speaker 2: Very specific because soon after this incident, and for those
Speaker 2: of you that are just tuning in, you know, we're
Speaker 2: speaking about the practical reasons why owning a gun makes sense.
Speaker 2: And Ramsay spoke earlier about guns have a singular purpose,
Speaker 2: and he's absolutely right. There's the only reason the machine
Speaker 2: exists is to end life. Even if you're a person
Speaker 2: that I only have a gun for hunting, even then
Speaker 2: that's the only point. But again, I get home, this
Speaker 2: gentleman is sitting on my porch. This house is his.
Speaker 2: According to him, I opened the garage, I let my
Speaker 2: family go into the garage, call the police, and then
Speaker 2: I close the garage. But I'm still left outside to
Speaker 2: deal with this man sitting on my porch. Now, luckily,
Speaker 2: I'm pretty good with these hands, and he did not
Speaker 2: have a weapon. But in the event that he did,
Speaker 2: my only resolve cannot be to just die because it's
Speaker 2: my time. Because this guy said so Echo is on
Speaker 2: the way, she'll be here in a few days. I
Speaker 2: can't just die right now because I guess it's my time,
Speaker 2: and I don't believe in having guns.
Speaker 4: This iscu's daughter.
Speaker 2: This guy believes in having them, but I don't. So
Speaker 2: baby's baby. I guess this is it for us because
Speaker 2: this guy had a bad day, right so I Then,
Speaker 2: after the police arrived, I had a conversation with the
Speaker 2: officer who simply asked me if I was a gun owner.
Speaker 2: Now I look like me, the police officer does not.
Speaker 2: So my answer to this question was unequivocally no. It
Speaker 2: was the truth. But if I had a full bazooka
Speaker 2: and tank in the backyard, the answer still would have
Speaker 2: been no, sir, Absolutely not, sir, never sir. Yeah, But
Speaker 2: his response to me saying no struck a nerve. He says,
Speaker 2: where you're from, man, I very very proudly said Detroit Michigan.
Speaker 2: If anybody knows me, you know I spent a lot
Speaker 2: of time reminding the world where I'm from. But he says, well,
Speaker 2: just a reminder. You're in an open carry state. You
Speaker 2: don't have to have a permit to carry a gun here,
Speaker 2: and you might be the only person in your neighborhood
Speaker 2: that doesn't have one. That didn't make me afraid. I
Speaker 2: didn't tremble, but I definitely processed, especially during a pandemic
Speaker 2: where you go to the grocery store and there's no
Speaker 2: meat or toilet paper. We'll never understand the shortage of
Speaker 2: toilet paper, but these sources are scarce. And I'm the
Speaker 2: only person in my neighborhood, in my brand new house
Speaker 2: with a portion of driveway, and I'm also the one
Speaker 2: who don't have a gun. So I'm the have surrounded
Speaker 2: by have nots with guns and I don't have one.
Speaker 2: That's not fear, that's protection.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: If the only way to stop you from ending my
Speaker 2: life is to end yours, that's the decision you forced
Speaker 2: me to make.
Speaker 4: I have to be here for Igo. She's one her
Speaker 4: story with Meet on End today. Because I didn't think
Speaker 4: having a gun was a nice thing to do.
Speaker 2: So. I don't want it to be rooted in the
Speaker 2: belief that everyone that has a gun is afraid, even
Speaker 2: if that's your truth, just some understanding from somebody that
Speaker 2: you love, knowing trust that is a gun owner. All
Speaker 2: those decisions aren't just I'm scared, but very very like
Speaker 2: maybe you are. I don't know this, but I was very,
Speaker 2: very uncomfortable around guns from childhood. I was always around them, unfortunately,
Speaker 2: always around them, but very uncomfortable around them. So I
Speaker 2: had to go get some training because now I do
Speaker 2: have this thing in my possession that could kill someone
Speaker 2: and myself and my loved ones if I'm not trained properly,
Speaker 2: if I'm not being responsible, if I don't know how
Speaker 2: to handle this in a distressed situation when there's no preparation,
Speaker 2: when I didn't expect it. But I do not disagree
Speaker 2: with you. However, if the idea was everybody don't have
Speaker 2: a gun makes it better, I'm down. You can have
Speaker 2: all mine, like I'm down for us. I hope I
Speaker 2: never have to use mine. I'm down for nobody using their.
Speaker 2: That would be even better, that would be way better.
Speaker 2: But the decision to own one was not Oh my god,
Speaker 2: I'm scared.
Speaker 3: It was yo. That situation was brought to my.
Speaker 2: Doorstep in a very literal sense, and I cannot be
Speaker 2: that unprepared moving forward. I have a family that I
Speaker 2: have to be here for. I owe them that.
Speaker 4: That's why I'm glad you said that, because.
Speaker 1: Those stories need to be shared so that folks that
Speaker 1: feel the way that you feel understand that. You know,
Speaker 1: that's a very important and huge decision being black to
Speaker 1: purchase a gun.
Speaker 4: Of what we saw what happened with Lande, sir. He
Speaker 4: had he was a.
Speaker 1: Card carrying gun owner, had the gun on him, and
Speaker 1: the police shot him in the car. You know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, So we recognize it. Having a gun makes
Speaker 1: us a target even.
Speaker 2: More, and being black makes it hard to be a
Speaker 2: responsible gun owner. Right, And if the idea is protection,
Speaker 2: I should always have it, except I'm scared to death
Speaker 2: to get pulled over with it, right right, You see
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. So there's a there's some give and
Speaker 2: take there in some gray area there that makes it
Speaker 2: very very difficult. Because you heard me talk about and
Speaker 2: Rams just talk about American skin. All those rights and
Speaker 2: liberties are not afforded to us. So we can't. We
Speaker 2: you know, we can't be so naive as to think that,
Speaker 2: you know, all those liberties are ours.
Speaker 1: So so here's here's one thing that before we move on,
Speaker 1: I want to say again, I'm glad that you said that,
Speaker 1: because I don't think that my truth in this matter
Speaker 1: is the truth. Sometimes I'll say, yo, my truth is
Speaker 1: the truth. That's what it is. In some matters that
Speaker 1: is the case, right, But this one I can't say that.
Speaker 1: And and before before we even get to your story again,
Speaker 1: my little sister, let me know that other people have
Speaker 1: different realities.
Speaker 4: Mine fortunately.
Speaker 1: Affords me the the the walk through life with peace
Speaker 1: as my companion and with you know, a sense of
Speaker 1: self worth and awareness and all these sorts of things.
Speaker 1: And other people they walk through life and fear is
Speaker 1: their companion, and they're worried, and they come from environments
Speaker 1: like I know those environments. I know those people, and
Speaker 1: I get it that the world is a different place,
Speaker 1: and they all death is around the corner.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: We hear it in the music, you know, in the
Speaker 4: music on these stations.
Speaker 1: And so for them, even if it makes them feel better,
Speaker 1: they sleep a little bit better at night to know
Speaker 1: that I have a fighting chance. You know, those stories
Speaker 1: need to be shared because again, my truth is not
Speaker 1: the truth. But I do want to say this for
Speaker 1: rameses Jah, Rudy King Taylor, the second for me, the
Speaker 1: one individual carbon unit sitting in the studio with you
Speaker 1: right now, I've been blessed to live thirty eight It'll
Speaker 1: be thirty nine years in a couple more months of life.
Speaker 2: We need at least thirty nine more, just a year,
Speaker 2: just so you know that I need thirty nine more
Speaker 2: out of.
Speaker 1: Course, and you're gonna get it. I believe you're gonna
Speaker 1: have all that right and then some. But in all
Speaker 1: that time, I've never I've been through some traumatic stuff too. Q.
Speaker 4: I've been I've been.
Speaker 1: Held at gunpoint, I've been robbed. I've been hid in
Speaker 1: the head with a gun. You know, I had my
Speaker 1: diamond stolen from me. You know, all that sort of stuff,
Speaker 1: you know, And what are you gonna do? You can't
Speaker 1: fight a bullet, you know, now. I probably would because
Speaker 1: I'm way too irrigating for my own good Like, all right,
Speaker 1: bring it, you know, but but uh, anyway, but you know,
Speaker 1: in my whole life, I've never had a gun, and
Speaker 1: I've made it through to this age, and I can't
Speaker 1: think back on any of the instances that I've been
Speaker 1: through where I know that my having a gun would
Speaker 1: have either changed the outcome or made you feel better
Speaker 1: about what was happening, or both. And you know, when
Speaker 1: something happens, like I mentioned one time, I got robbed
Speaker 1: someone I like you.
Speaker 4: I bought a new car. I bought.
Speaker 1: It was a fancy car, so I'm gonna say it
Speaker 1: was a Mercedes. I was very proud of that. I
Speaker 1: never had a fancy car before, right, And I was
Speaker 1: driving it and I just started working at you know,
Speaker 1: Power ninety two, and you know, I was doing all
Speaker 1: this cool stuff. And I'm driving home and a car
Speaker 1: starts following me, and you don't think anything of it until.
Speaker 4: It's too late.
Speaker 1: And I pulled up to I used to have a condo.
Speaker 1: I pulled up to my condo and you had to
Speaker 1: park on the outside, and the car was still following me,
Speaker 1: and I'm just thinking, you know, it's four in the morning.
Speaker 4: You know, I was.
Speaker 1: Hanging out with a young lady. She knows this story,
Speaker 1: so she's listening. I'll hear about it. This was many,
Speaker 1: many many years.
Speaker 4: Ago before children a long time, long time ago. But yeah,
Speaker 4: so this car follows me.
Speaker 1: I just dropped her off, you know, came back home
Speaker 1: and uh car pulls in behind me, and guy jumps
Speaker 1: out of the car and he runs up to me
Speaker 1: and he puts a gun in my head. And I
Speaker 1: remember he kept just saying what you got, what you got,
Speaker 1: and he was sweating and his nose was running. And
Speaker 1: the police said he might have been on drugs or
Speaker 1: something like that, but or.
Speaker 2: He might have been scared to death himself. Right, Like,
Speaker 2: like I said before, handling the gun is not comfortable.
Speaker 1: But here's the thing. My having a gun wouldn't have
Speaker 1: he had the drop on me before. Yeah, before I
Speaker 1: recognized that there was a threat. And so imagine me
Speaker 1: carrying a gun every single day just in case, only
Speaker 1: for that to happen and then me not even be
Speaker 1: able to do anything with it. This guy's it's I'm
Speaker 1: looking at the gun. It was a huge gun. It
Speaker 1: was bigger than him because he was kind of skinny.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm you know, I'm not acting like a
Speaker 1: tough guy. But if I hit him hard enough, that
Speaker 1: would have been, Yeah, it would have been.
Speaker 2: There's there's also a mindset adjustment as well, though, because
Speaker 2: you you were in the euphoria of no fear. But
Speaker 2: you've spoken not a need to go about you maybe
Speaker 2: would try to fight a gun now, what your arrogance.
Speaker 2: There's a level of arrogance to buying a brand new
Speaker 2: bands and being a young man and driving to your
Speaker 2: condo by yourself and not paying attention to the car
Speaker 2: that's following you because you just are not wired that way. However,
Speaker 2: if a car follows you now, that story will it's
Speaker 2: it's touching for It's like touching the stove and getting burned.
Speaker 2: If you've never done it before, you don't know that.
Speaker 4: That's hot the fire? What hot is? The fire?
Speaker 2: Teaches a lesson that's way different. You know, a car
Speaker 2: following you now does not resonate the same as it
Speaker 2: did before.
Speaker 4: Goin.
Speaker 1: Well, I I'm of course, our thoughts and our prayers
Speaker 1: go out to Yeah.
Speaker 3: I wish, I so wish that we could do more
Speaker 3: than thoughts and prayers.
Speaker 1: We are over again, but we are because we're talking
Speaker 1: about it here. You know, regardless of where you are
Speaker 1: on this issue, I think that you said something that
Speaker 1: was very potent. I'm glad you did. Is that certain
Speaker 1: kinds of guns really don't have a place. You know,
Speaker 1: if you have a weapon that you know, you can't
Speaker 1: hunt with an assault rifle.
Speaker 4: I mean you can, but there's no purpose for it. Yeah,
Speaker 4: there's no sport in that. You're just mowing down, you know.
Speaker 1: And then what we're seeing more and more is that
Speaker 1: people are using it to mow down people.
Speaker 4: And if you have a.
Speaker 1: Regular sized gun that goes in your hand and you
Speaker 1: can put it in a safe or put in your
Speaker 1: bedroom or whatever, and if the war comes and you
Speaker 1: united to buy some toilet paper and you need to
Speaker 1: take your pistols you to the grocery store or something
Speaker 1: like that, the best you're going to do is, I
Speaker 1: think those things have Okay, I'm sorry, I might date myself,
Speaker 1: but sixteen in the clip and one in the whole.
Speaker 2: Sure, all right. However, However, semi automatic weapons it's a
Speaker 2: different situation. You have to fire a bunch of times
Speaker 2: an automatic assault rifle. You don't pull the trigger in
Speaker 2: like you said, mow So.
Speaker 1: You know, maybe there's something you know, and we can
Speaker 1: always put pressure on our lawmakers and our legislators and
Speaker 1: you know, to you know, say that we've seen enough
Speaker 1: we've had enough. But I think that it's important just
Speaker 1: to touch on this last week of shootings and killings
Speaker 1: and to know that the conversation, as it always does,
Speaker 1: turns to what do we do about guns?
Speaker 4: And regardless of where you are.
Speaker 1: On that spectrum, I hope that you found at least
Speaker 1: an echo of a voice between you and I today
Speaker 1: on the show.
Speaker 2: My last thing on that topic before we move on.
Speaker 2: You hear around us, and I bring up our capitalist
Speaker 2: society and its ideals oft.
Speaker 4: There we go, let's get it.
Speaker 2: And again, only in a capitalist society can the financial
Speaker 2: incentive to profit be greater than the moral incentive to
Speaker 2: stop letting our citizens be murdered.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like, it's that simple, if it.
Speaker 2: Wasn't so profitable for the people who make these decisions
Speaker 2: for us, these people that we elect, some of these
Speaker 2: people that we elect over and over, even after their
Speaker 2: rap sheet is very very clear, the incentive for profit
Speaker 2: is much greater and much more important in this capitalist
Speaker 2: society than the safety, health and well being of its citizens.
Speaker 2: And that's really, really, really sad because this story doesn't
Speaker 2: even hit us as hard as it should because it
Speaker 2: just happened a few days before and it just happened
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks before, and it just happened a
Speaker 2: few months before that.
Speaker 4: It is as a matter of time before it happens
Speaker 4: where we'rein It's absolutely going to happen again.
Speaker 1: I want to say something real quick. I watched a
Speaker 1: documentary on like the how the gun culture in the
Speaker 1: United States and the roots of the gun culture here
Speaker 1: in this country because it's unlike anywhere else in the world,
Speaker 1: and essentially what it is, and I'm just telling the truth. Essentially,
Speaker 1: what it is, if you boil it down to its
Speaker 1: essential components, is.
Speaker 4: Fear.
Speaker 1: Folks that have a fiscal incentive to sell you a weapon,
Speaker 1: pedal fear to the masses. And then when there's some
Speaker 1: sort of resolution, they figure out a way to terrorize
Speaker 1: these people and make them fearful even more so, and
Speaker 1: that results in even more weapons getting sold.
Speaker 4: And so it's it's the most masterful money making operation
Speaker 4: in the world that I'm not in the world, I'm sure,
Speaker 4: but you know.
Speaker 2: Something of what I've seen one of though you have
Speaker 2: to understand how long this has been going on.
Speaker 1: It is okay, yeah, but you know, as I stated,
Speaker 1: and as a rule, I'm not giving to fear in
Speaker 1: the same way that a lot of other folks are.
Speaker 1: And that's because of some advantages and privileges that I
Speaker 1: might have. You know, I'm not I'm not female, So
Speaker 1: the world doesn't feel as I don't feel as vulnerable.
Speaker 1: Then then some of my sisters who I share this
Speaker 1: planet with might feel Yeah. So this is not me
Speaker 1: passing judgment. I'm not trying to say I'm the man.
Speaker 1: I don't think I'm cool. I just recognize it. It's
Speaker 1: different for a lot of folks, but for me, I'm
Speaker 1: very blessed and very fortunate, and that I'm not easily
Speaker 1: given to fear.
Speaker 4: In fact, I tell people about themselves.
Speaker 1: And I look them in the eye when I do it,
Speaker 1: So I'm not one of those people that like I
Speaker 1: kind of like that because I make other people feel fear,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: That's kind of been the way this has gone for me.
Speaker 1: So if you make the decision, you know, as you stated,
Speaker 1: you know, look, I had a real situation.
Speaker 4: I had an actual professional tell me this is blah
Speaker 4: blah blah, do this.
Speaker 1: And the third and even if you put a if
Speaker 1: you buy a gun, because it comes with a sticker
Speaker 1: and you can put the sticker on the window of
Speaker 1: your house. That feels more preventive than anything, because a
Speaker 1: gun is Okay. I can respond to something that's already happening,
Speaker 1: but to prevent something from happening in the first place
Speaker 1: and being.
Speaker 4: Strategic about it.
Speaker 1: Look, I've seen people that say, we don't call nine
Speaker 1: one one, we call whatever gun number.
Speaker 4: I don't know what gun numbers are. Nine millimeters, maybe
Speaker 4: there's plenty nine. That's A.
Speaker 3: That's A.
Speaker 1: Because Drey was always talking about his Nina, I learned that.
Speaker 1: So yeah, anyway, shot the hip hop one time if
Speaker 1: you don't mind, all right, So moving on that took
Speaker 1: a while.
Speaker 4: Moving on another thing I wanted to talk about.
Speaker 1: There's a few things I wanted to talk about, but
Speaker 1: I already know we're not going to be able to
Speaker 1: get to all of them. You know. I had a conversation,
Speaker 1: Uh this was late last week, and I wanted to
Speaker 1: bring it up on today's show. And the conversation had
Speaker 1: to do with how black people are supposed to act
Speaker 1: or what is it that what is is going to
Speaker 1: hang on? Let me let me paint the picture, because
Speaker 1: this is gonna be good. This conversation was about one
Speaker 1: black person and it was from another black person or
Speaker 1: a group of black people. Right, And I'm sure you've
Speaker 1: heard this before. Oh he doesn't act black, or he
Speaker 1: acts white.
Speaker 4: Even if he's black, you know, he acts white.
Speaker 3: Yes, this is the thing.
Speaker 4: I mean.
Speaker 1: You're a brilliant mind. You excelled in your education in
Speaker 1: an environment where there was a great deal of hopelessness.
Speaker 1: Education didn't perhaps feel like the golden ticket to get
Speaker 1: out of that place, and so it probably wasn't valued
Speaker 1: in the same way as it was in your house.
Speaker 1: It wasn't valued in that community in the same way
Speaker 1: as it was in your house, right, or whatever version
Speaker 1: of that story that there is, I'm familiar with sh Right,
Speaker 1: So all of a sudden, instead of saying, Okay, this
Speaker 1: person is kind of a little nerdy, or this person
Speaker 1: is eccentric, or this person is you know whatever, it
Speaker 1: becomes Oh, this person is not black, or this person is.
Speaker 4: Not real, or you know whatever.
Speaker 1: And I wanted to talk about that because for people
Speaker 1: who might say that or people who might think that,
Speaker 1: and I know there's a good number.
Speaker 4: You know, I'm a part of a lot.
Speaker 1: Of Facebook groups, you know, I kind of keep a
Speaker 1: finger on the pulse of the culture here and there.
Speaker 1: If I'm black, then no matter what I do, that's
Speaker 1: what black people do, or at least a black person
Speaker 1: is doing. And I'm entitled to be black while I
Speaker 1: do it. You know, that could be good, that could
Speaker 1: be bad, that could be amazing, it could be new,
Speaker 1: it could be old.
Speaker 4: Whatever. For my race to come into question, or my
Speaker 4: authenticity or any of those sorts of things to come
Speaker 4: into question.
Speaker 1: Really shows your insecurities. And the thing that comes to
Speaker 1: mind is on The Fresh Prince of bel Air. For
Speaker 1: those old enough to remember this show, Will Smith was
Speaker 1: on the show and Carlton was his cousin, who was
Speaker 1: kind of a darky cousin. And you know, this guy
Speaker 1: wore turtlenecks. I don't know what whatever.
Speaker 3: Cardigan's that's the word.
Speaker 4: I'm looking for Cardigan's shirts. And he was not the
Speaker 4: coolest guy. He was privileged, Thank you, man.
Speaker 1: See you know how to say this stuff. Man, I'm
Speaker 1: glad I do a show with you. So yeah, Carlton
Speaker 1: was like super preppy. And there was an episode where
Speaker 1: his race got called in the question by someone else
Speaker 1: who was black, and you know, and thinking back to
Speaker 1: that episode, Carlton handled himself very well because he's like, listen, man,
Speaker 1: just because I listened to Barry Manilow, it doesn't mean
Speaker 1: that I'm not black?
Speaker 4: Is this when they were trying to get into that fraternity?
Speaker 4: Maybe I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't remember all the details, but I remember that
Speaker 1: part of the conversation, right, And I want to share
Speaker 1: something that.
Speaker 4: Let me make sure I get this gross woman's name right.
Speaker 4: I'm learning, y'all. Jane Elliott.
Speaker 1: So she went on the Oprah Winfrey Show in nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety two and she said something that I think loosely
Speaker 1: speaks this. You know, a connection can be made. She
Speaker 1: says that, you know, when someone says, you know, what
Speaker 1: I think we need is a color blind society.
Speaker 4: If you hear.
Speaker 1: Someone say that, you're listening to a racist, right, crazy? Right,
Speaker 1: Because if someone's like, yo, I think we need a
Speaker 1: color blind society, they sound like they're being inclusive, right.
Speaker 3: But she's not genuine. But you know it sounds nice,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: You got the spirit, you know, to quote Will Smith again,
Speaker 1: but she says, what you're listening to is a racist
Speaker 1: And again, this is Jane Elliott.
Speaker 4: If you don't know about her look her of.
Speaker 1: An incredible cultural ally and an older white woman who
Speaker 1: is an educator and a profound speaker, and someone who
Speaker 1: has taken the racial injustices that exist not just in
Speaker 1: education but in the world in society excuse me, and
Speaker 1: made it her mission to try to address those things.
Speaker 1: Even though she's white, even though this is not her fight,
Speaker 1: she still wants to make the.
Speaker 3: World a better place.
Speaker 1: I love teachers for that reason, because teachers, they for
Speaker 1: the most part, they love children.
Speaker 4: And it doesn't matter what kind of children. Children are
Speaker 4: first in teachers' minds, and.
Speaker 1: So they they most of ourn't teachers, most of them,
Speaker 1: and they wanted to make the world a better place
Speaker 1: for the kids.
Speaker 4: And I think that that's indeed it's going to be,
Speaker 4: you know.
Speaker 1: So moving on, she says, you know, yeah, So she
Speaker 1: says that if someone says they want a color blind society,
Speaker 1: you're listening to someone who's racist, because what that person
Speaker 1: is saying is that there's something wrong with this person's color.
Speaker 1: So we'll pretend he isn't his color right, that everyone
Speaker 1: is the same, or that it's you know, whatever.
Speaker 4: And then she goes on.
Speaker 1: To say that, Okay, this is in the same interview.
Speaker 1: In the same exchange, Oprah says back to her that
Speaker 1: she had a farmer, who says her farmer, her farmer
Speaker 1: neighbor was white. Her farmer says to Oprah, Oh, you're
Speaker 1: not black, You're just a neighbor. And Oprah responds, Oh, no,
Speaker 1: I'm I certain certainly am black. But that was his
Speaker 1: way of saying, you're not like what I think other
Speaker 1: black people are. Again, so what does it mean to
Speaker 1: be black? It means to be yourself. It means to
Speaker 1: be you, to be centered in who you are, your identity.
Speaker 1: You got to think that human beings. Again, this truth
Speaker 1: is universal and it's potent, and it's going to show
Speaker 1: up in so many of these episodes because it just
Speaker 1: is so relevant. But human beings. The natural state of
Speaker 1: a human is black, a black female, if we're being honest,
Speaker 1: because life began female. You know, life is female. We're
Speaker 1: here to ensure genetic diversity. We're meaning males. But that's
Speaker 1: why we have nipples because once we're female.
Speaker 4: And all life was. And so.
Speaker 1: I think that this is one of those things that
Speaker 1: needs to be mentioned and it needs to be said
Speaker 1: so that for folks who you know, let's say, like me,
Speaker 1: and they don't want to have a gun. I don't
Speaker 1: need to be a gangster. I don't need to be this.
Speaker 1: I don't need to be that.
Speaker 4: I'm me.
Speaker 1: I wear my hair, how wear I wear these clothes,
Speaker 1: how I wear I go where I want, do what
Speaker 1: I want, and.
Speaker 4: Nobody who could say something to me? You know what
Speaker 4: I mean?
Speaker 1: It's I would love to know who could. But one
Speaker 1: thing no one could ever call into question is whether
Speaker 1: or not I'm black, And that cultural identity is so
Speaker 1: important to me because it shapes who I am, how
Speaker 1: the world feels to me, how I raised my son,
Speaker 1: where I know I am, what I can do, what
Speaker 1: I can't do, you know, and knowing that I think
Speaker 1: those things are what helps ensure that I have as
Speaker 1: long and prosperous of a life as possible. Because if
Speaker 1: I didn't know and wasn't self aware, if I really
Speaker 1: thought that I was white.
Speaker 4: You know, you think you're white, don't you.
Speaker 1: If I really thought that, you know, the way that
Speaker 1: I moved would have been very different, and the way
Speaker 1: that I would have moved had I actually thought that.
Speaker 4: Resulted, it would have resulted in me perhaps losing.
Speaker 1: My life, it's very easy to lose your life when
Speaker 1: you think that you're not subject to the rules that
Speaker 1: you're very much subject to. So I wanted to make
Speaker 1: sure that I said that. And once again, if you're
Speaker 1: just tuning inna civic cipher, i'man houst ramses Jah.
Speaker 3: He calls me Q ward.
Speaker 2: Well, I guess my mother calls me Q two now
Speaker 2: once upon a time, Quintin is what she named me.
Speaker 2: It's my favorite name in the world because my mom
Speaker 2: picked it. But people like to call me Quentin, which
Speaker 2: is not my name. So we just go with Q
Speaker 2: because it's much easier. I like you, Q works for me.
Speaker 2: It's simple. And before we get out of here, one
Speaker 2: more thing I want to talk about. So this came
Speaker 2: up last week as well. So I have a son
Speaker 2: that's in high school, and.
Speaker 1: You know, we're talking about, you know, what the future holds,
Speaker 1: you know, and I'm considering what the future holds for
Speaker 1: my child, you know, And one of those things is,
Speaker 1: you know, Okay, you're gonna have to take the SATs
Speaker 1: and we're gonna have to figure out what that means,
Speaker 1: you know, in terms of what your future looks like,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And how we're gonna you know,
Speaker 1: what are we gonna do? How much money am I
Speaker 1: gonna have to spend? You know, that sort of stuff.
Speaker 4: And you know, every so often life just presents these
Speaker 4: little rabbit holes to me. And I love going down.
Speaker 1: These rabbit holes, and at the end of almost all
Speaker 1: of them you find either out white racism or the framework,
Speaker 1: a framework that can be only described as white supremacy.
Speaker 1: So I'm saying this to you, and I want you
Speaker 1: to listen. I don't find it there because I'm looking
Speaker 1: for it, because I promise you I'm not looking for it.
Speaker 1: It's there because it's I find it because it's just there.
Speaker 4: I think you said something to.
Speaker 3: Me recently.
Speaker 1: About you know, the reason that we always end up
Speaker 1: talking about these institutions and these ideas and these framework
Speaker 1: in which we live as being racist is because it
Speaker 1: just is. There's no two it. We're not finding it.
Speaker 1: We're not trying to make excuses or anything like that.
Speaker 2: I mean, we live in a country. This is not
Speaker 2: our history that we're creating live for you on the air.
Speaker 2: Google is free, and even the most conservative American history
Speaker 2: books acknowledge the Transatlantic slave trade, the foundation of the
Speaker 2: country on the back of white supremacy and racism. Now
Speaker 2: it's a dressed very quickly and moved on from and
Speaker 2: we treat the Pilgrims like they were great, and you know,
Speaker 2: we celebrate Thanksgiving in that way, the traditions that the
Speaker 2: Pilgrims and our Aboriginal Native American share with each other.
Speaker 2: But even that exchange was far more grim than we
Speaker 2: learn about in grade school. But these institutions, the entire
Speaker 2: framework of the country was built on these beliefs. So
Speaker 2: that's why you find them in everything. It's because they're there.
Speaker 3: Trust me.
Speaker 2: We have meetings about the show where it's like, man,
Speaker 2: do we even want to keep talking about things that
Speaker 2: are racist? And it's like, well, absolutely not. That's our job,
Speaker 2: but it's our responsibility. We can't ignore it. And if
Speaker 2: so many people wouldn't ignore it, or wouldn't have spent
Speaker 2: decades ignoring it, we'd be further along. Absolutely, But in
Speaker 2: the effort to make everyone comfortable and to not roughle
Speaker 2: any feathers, sometimes we just mosey along like these things
Speaker 2: don't exist, and we don't address them because we're not
Speaker 2: by nature confrontational.
Speaker 1: So dig this, this is what we're talking about the SATs.
Speaker 1: The SATs was literally created because too many students of
Speaker 1: color were getting into college. The creator of it, Carl Brigham,
Speaker 1: published that the increase in racial diversity in schools would
Speaker 1: cause the decline of American intelligence, and by nineteen thirty
Speaker 1: he admitted it was a eugenics test. And again, you know,
Speaker 1: before we sat down.
Speaker 3: To can you speak to eugenics?
Speaker 1: Well, real quick, let me say this, Before we sat
Speaker 1: down to do the show, we did a little bit
Speaker 1: of show prep, you know, just to kind of read
Speaker 1: about it.
Speaker 4: Whether or not this was true.
Speaker 1: And you know, as you mentioned, this is completely googleable.
Speaker 1: If you trust in Wikipedia, you can go and look up.
Speaker 3: And if you don't trust in Wikipedia, there are many.
Speaker 2: Sources, sources that you can even look at scholastic Scholastic sources.
Speaker 2: But yeah, even you know, sources like Team Vogue that
Speaker 2: are very much not run by us. We'll give you
Speaker 2: this same information at they're ready.
Speaker 1: And I don't think that what we're doing here today
Speaker 1: is meant to create any excuses, even though what we
Speaker 1: just read that said, I think the data was from
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety eight, so in the last twenty years, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. So most of the folks listening
Speaker 1: to us right now, this has happened in their lifetime.
Speaker 1: They would decide whether or not questions were admissible as
Speaker 1: test questions into the new version of the test based
Speaker 1: on whether or not a majority of white students got
Speaker 1: the test scores right. If the test scores if more
Speaker 1: black students got the test right, they would throw the
Speaker 1: question out if the black students did better than the
Speaker 1: white students.
Speaker 4: You can actually read it. This is right there.
Speaker 1: And so not only this guy invent this in the
Speaker 1: thirties or whatever. This was as a way of throttling
Speaker 1: to wonder or minimizing the amount of black students that
Speaker 1: were able to get into higher.
Speaker 4: Education and to a lesser degree.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of immigration taking place at
Speaker 1: that time, so you know, other students from other parts
Speaker 1: of the world. But this guy, he some of his
Speaker 1: some of the stuff that he says is like very
Speaker 1: extremely like it's like mean racist, like cuts clan racists,
Speaker 1: like he's not he doesn't You can tell this person
Speaker 1: does not like black people. And at that time, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't think black people were really a priority for
Speaker 1: this country. I don't think black people have ever really
Speaker 1: been a priority for this country. I mean as property,
Speaker 1: not as citizens. Yeah, thank you for that, but yeah,
Speaker 1: I just employ you look that up. I thought it
Speaker 1: was worth mentioning because you never know where you're going
Speaker 1: to find racism, and yet you know you're going to
Speaker 1: find it everywhere. And for those of you who are
Speaker 1: not thinking about SAT scores or whatever, it's just one
Speaker 1: more thing for you to know that whenever you hear
Speaker 1: someone say like, man, there's you know, and we have
Speaker 1: these conversations that I know, and I appreciate you kind
Speaker 1: of riding this train with us. We're doing this so
Speaker 1: that things can get better, not so that we can
Speaker 1: continue to reflect on the past. But I need to
Speaker 1: say these things because who would expect that the SATs
Speaker 1: and standards and from this was born standardized testing. So
Speaker 1: all these standardized tests have their roots and perhaps some
Speaker 1: of the modern practices even in racism. And you know,
Speaker 1: there's different ways to call it, you know, whatever you want,
Speaker 1: but if it favors one group of people and then
Speaker 1: it causes them to gain advantages and doesn't help the
Speaker 1: most vulnerable citizens, as black and LATINX students in this
Speaker 1: country tend to be.
Speaker 2: Than we have and not just in a way that's
Speaker 2: passive that it doesn't help the other groups designed yeah
Speaker 2: to repress and not help those other group. It's not
Speaker 2: just like we just built this to help us and
Speaker 2: it just so happened it didn't help you.
Speaker 1: So keep that in mind, please, And anybody who thinks
Speaker 1: the black people are lazy, I don't think anybody listening
Speaker 1: to this show with things black people are lazy because
Speaker 1: you listen to hip hop and every single song about
Speaker 1: hip hop is about hustling get money, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, So I don't want to hear that ever again. Anyway,
Speaker 1: that's our time for today. Once again, thank you for
Speaker 1: tuning in to Civic Cipher onmy house, Rams's job. They
Speaker 1: call me q Ward and please hit the website civiccipher
Speaker 1: dot com submit your questions topics, feel free to donate
Speaker 1: that really does help support the show. Follow our social
Speaker 1: media at Civic Cipher and be sure to download this
Speaker 1: or any other past episodes you may have missed. We
Speaker 1: got special announcement coming up next week, so be sure
Speaker 1: to tune in for that.
Speaker 4: Until then, y'all, peace, peace,