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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discuss the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds and Congress and Matt Gates has leaked

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Speaker 1: a draft of emotion for Majority Leader McCarthy to vacate

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Speaker 1: his speaker chief. What he left it on a baby's

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Speaker 1: changing table.

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Speaker 2: We have a.

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Speaker 1: Star studded show today. White House Chief of Staff Jeff

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Speaker 1: Zeitz talks to us about the Biden Administration's move to

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Speaker 1: negotiate drug prices for the American people. Then we'll talk

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Speaker 1: to pollster John Delavalpi about the grains of salt we

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Speaker 1: should be taking with many of these polls that are

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Speaker 1: lighting up the op eds these days. But first we

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Speaker 1: have the host of the Lawrence O'Donnell shows, and Miss

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Speaker 1: Senbyc's own Lawrence O'Donnell. Welcome back to Fast Politics. Lawrence o'donnald.

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Speaker 3: Thank you. There's a little flaw in the booking system here.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, because when.

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Speaker 3: You asked me to do this, you never ask is

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Speaker 3: there anything you'd like to talk about?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 3: Because the answer the answer would always be no. So

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Speaker 3: I begin with nothing to say, okay, and so it's

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Speaker 3: kind of a game to see if we can pull

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Speaker 3: anything out of thin air for me.

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Speaker 1: To say, it's funny because when I was just about

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Speaker 1: to record him, thinking like, poor Lawrence has to deal

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Speaker 1: with our American political system right now, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: just the kind of cirrus. I honestly just want your take.

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Speaker 3: Well, I just saw Jamel Bowie's latest piece about how

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Speaker 3: unbelievably ridiculous is He charitably did not use the word

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Speaker 3: childish for punditry to have ever talked about, oh, you know,

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Speaker 3: Biden should not run for a second term, or Kamala

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Speaker 3: how should be dumped from the ticket, and these things

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Speaker 3: that were always ludicrous every single day they were said.

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Speaker 3: And one of the things that that comes from is

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Speaker 3: that when your job is writing about politics, and I

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Speaker 3: mean politics, not government, and there's a huge difference. Government

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Speaker 3: is a huge and complex subject that requires career study,

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Speaker 3: and politics is a game that you can get up

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Speaker 3: to speed on in less than a baseball season. And

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Speaker 3: your opinion is of exactly the same value as anyone

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Speaker 3: who's been throwing around such opinions for thirty years. And

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Speaker 3: that is not to in any way to mean the

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Speaker 3: value of the new opinions. It's just to say that

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Speaker 3: they're all ridiculous. You don't get better at it if

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Speaker 3: you are talking about and predicting in politics and just

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Speaker 3: politics and campaigning and all of that sort of stuff.

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Speaker 3: I've never seen anyone get better at it. I've never

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Speaker 3: seen anyone be better at it in their twenty fifth

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Speaker 3: year than in their first year, because it is a goofy,

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Speaker 3: mostly uninformed, guessing game of idle minds that have to

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Speaker 3: guess about something because they aren't authorities on anything.

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Speaker 2: I could go on and on.

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Speaker 1: I read that same piece and I had almost all

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Speaker 1: of the same thoughts, and I did wonder why there

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Speaker 1: wasn't more talk just about the power of incumbency, And

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Speaker 1: because I had written about this, I also was thinking

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Speaker 1: about In that Jonathan Jade piece, he talks about the

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Speaker 1: four presidents who had been primaried and what happened to them.

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Speaker 3: I didn't see that piece, but primaries against incumbent presidents

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Speaker 3: do have a relatively short history. It's a thing that

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Speaker 3: kind of started, you know, in my lifetime, in nineteen

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Speaker 3: sixty eight, and the Democratic Party, the professionals in the

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Speaker 3: Democratic Party, the potential future presidential candidates in the Democratic

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Speaker 3: Party would have to have taken the defeat of Donald

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Speaker 3: Trump by Joe Biden lightly in order to decide, now,

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Speaker 3: let's mess with the formula that did that. Let's four

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Speaker 3: years later have a big Democratic primary, which, as you know,

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Speaker 3: is what political reporters want right desperately, West Berkley want

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Speaker 3: to do that. They want this big primary with presumably

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Speaker 3: everyone except Biden who ran last time, and more you know,

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Speaker 3: Gavin news stars, you know, these kind of dream candidates

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Speaker 3: who they dream about, and that that would be better

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Speaker 3: for the Democratic Party. While you have defendant Trump in

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Speaker 3: four different courthouses around the country, it would be great

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Speaker 3: to have this big, confused Democratic primary, in which, by

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Speaker 3: the way, remember you would have to to some degree

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Speaker 3: run against Joe Biden. You'd have to say here's what

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Speaker 3: was in attic about the Biden presidency, that I will

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Speaker 3: do better. And there actually isn't a candidate who's going

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Speaker 3: to be able to run for president and the Democratic

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Speaker 3: side and say this is what I will do better

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Speaker 3: than Joe Biden. There isn't one, because there isn't a

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Speaker 3: thing within the jurisdiction of the presidency that Joe Biden

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Speaker 3: hasn't actually done better than all you modern Democratic presidents.

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Speaker 3: By modern I would say what I now mean by

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Speaker 3: that is all presidents who included the environment and morphed

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Speaker 3: into the subject of climate change as a serious subject.

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Speaker 3: So that takes you back basically to Bill Clinton and forward.

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Speaker 3: It's really childish if you think that it's easy for

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Speaker 3: the Democratic Party to just go through a nominating process

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Speaker 3: and find a good candidate who is better than Biden,

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Speaker 3: which is precisely what they set out to do last time.

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Speaker 3: And pretty much everyone thought that there were candidates better

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Speaker 3: than Biden, including me at the beginning. I looked at

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Speaker 3: the polling and I looked at this situation, and I

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Speaker 3: thought there were better candidates than Biden, and I was wrong.

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Speaker 3: The voters said, no, this is the candidate we want,

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Speaker 3: This is the candidate we will support. This is the

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Speaker 3: candidate who we will elect presidents. And there hasn't emerged somebody,

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Speaker 3: either from the last field or now who could reasonably

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Speaker 3: take that away from him. And Gavin Newsom knows that.

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Speaker 3: Gavin Newsom knows. Among other things that Gavin Newsom knows

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Speaker 3: is that if he did run a primary against Joe Biden,

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Speaker 3: he'd lose. And so you know, he might do very

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Speaker 3: well he might get forty percent of the votes you know,

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Speaker 3: in the primary.

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Speaker 2: But he'd lose.

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Speaker 3: He wouldn't get the nomination. And this is especially the

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Speaker 3: time period, which is the year before the year of

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Speaker 3: a presidential election, in which punditry is at its worst

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Speaker 3: because it's it's desperately waiting for you know, voters to

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Speaker 3: show up in Iowa, and waiting for them for New

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Speaker 3: Hampshire and for South Carolina, and so in all the

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Speaker 3: idle time that they have before the real votes start,

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Speaker 3: they come up with absolute nonsense. Imagine if the professional

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Speaker 3: baseball season had a year of spring training before the

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Speaker 3: first pitch is thrown out at Yankee Stadium for the

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Speaker 3: actual season, I mean, baseball journalism would be a disaster.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's what we're looking at right now. I

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Speaker 1: think Trump has some legal problems. You talked about this yesterday.

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Speaker 1: Give us the TLDR on that.

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Speaker 3: Jurisprudence is actually more predictable than politics. Okay, So I

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Speaker 3: have dropped out of the political predicting field, so this

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Speaker 3: is not political predicting. So one thing to know about

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Speaker 3: the country you live in is that depending on the

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Speaker 3: jurisdiction you're in the guilty verdict at trial rate hovers

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Speaker 3: somewhere in the ninety percent. Okay, there's plenty of places

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Speaker 3: where it's ninety nine ninety eight. You know, the best

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Speaker 3: places for defendants have like ninety two percent guilty verdict

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Speaker 3: rates in trials that go to jury's Okay, that go

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Speaker 3: all the way to jury's. So he's facing four different

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Speaker 3: criminal juries, okay, with four different judges, one of whom,

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Speaker 3: let's just presume in Florida, is going to try to

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Speaker 3: tilt everything she can in Donald Trump's favor. That is

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Speaker 3: still a fairly limited way to influence the trial. The

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Speaker 3: judge has influence, but other than outright dismissal of the case,

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Speaker 3: which the judge is empowered to do, it's very difficult

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Speaker 3: for the judge to steer the case and a criminal

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Speaker 3: trial to a not guilty verdict. So you have to

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Speaker 3: assume that minimum of three out of four of these

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Speaker 3: cases are going to end up in guilty verdicts. And

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Speaker 3: the guilty verdict, as I've said before, is just the

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Speaker 3: first day of the appeals process, and the appeals process

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Speaker 3: in each case is going to take at least two years.

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Speaker 3: But this is the most real thing that's happening both

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Speaker 3: in our politics and in Donald Trump's life, and in

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Speaker 3: this history of the Trump era, which is defendant Trump,

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Speaker 3: which is why I concentrate on that on my show

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Speaker 3: without ever mentioning a presidential poll. I couldn't care less

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Speaker 3: what the presidential polls say. I couldn't care less that

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Speaker 3: someone in New Hampshire is mad because South Carolina is

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Speaker 3: going to go first. I don't care. There's not a

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Speaker 3: single voter in New Hampshire who's not going to vote

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Speaker 3: for Joe Biden in the general election because the South

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Speaker 3: Carolina went before New Hampshire for the nom press. It's

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Speaker 3: all just child's play. That stuff, and this thing is

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Speaker 3: real with real evidence that is ultimately going to to

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Speaker 3: stop the madness of the Trump era. It won't stop

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump. He will be if he gets a sentence.

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Speaker 3: The most he's going to get his home confinement because

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Speaker 3: they're never going to figure out how to send the

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Speaker 3: Secret Service to prison with him and all that. He

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Speaker 3: will rant for the rest of his life, that's for sure.

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Speaker 3: But those verdicts are going to be very, very very

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Speaker 3: powerful definers and punctuation points on the era.

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Speaker 1: You know, I think that's a really good point and

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Speaker 1: like maybe a little bit cinematically disappointing, but probably it's

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Speaker 1: very unlikely that Trump will actually have bars in front

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Speaker 1: of him.

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Speaker 3: I actually am a liberal, and a kind of light

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Speaker 3: sentencing liberal. I've been in courtroom when I was ten

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Speaker 3: years old watching someone be sentenced to the death penalty

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Speaker 3: to be electrocuted. And in Massachusetts when that used to happen,

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Speaker 3: the way they would read that verdict is the word

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Speaker 3: death would come at the very end of the verdict

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Speaker 3: and it would be this very specific thing where electrical

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Speaker 3: current will pass through the body until death was very

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Speaker 3: very specific. I've seen people, you know, sentenced to life.

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Speaker 3: I've seen them sentenced to twenty years. I've seen them

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Speaker 3: sentenced to one year. I'm not a hard sentence guy.

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Speaker 3: I'm not the guy to ask to put someone away for.

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Speaker 2: A long time.

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Speaker 3: So I got to say, you know, the sentences never

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Speaker 3: matter to me as much as the verdicts do. And

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Speaker 3: so if someone gets twenty years, I'm never going to

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Speaker 3: complain and say they should have gotten life. And so

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Speaker 3: but anyway, that's the long winded way of saying I'm

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Speaker 3: very defendant sympathetic basically, but home confinement is going to

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Speaker 3: be its own wonderful comedy. There's going to be Trump

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Speaker 3: Home Confinement Broadway plays one hundred and fifty years now.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: It took one hundred and fifty years for the British

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Speaker 3: to finally write, you know, the Madness of King George,

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Speaker 3: and it was a phenomenally wonderful play, but no playwright

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Speaker 3: could see him that way. It took over one hundred

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Speaker 3: years to see George that way, you know. And the

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Speaker 3: thing about Trump is, you get every playwright's going to

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Speaker 3: see him that way, like right now today.

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Speaker 2: But the ripening of it will go on forever.

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Speaker 3: I believe the Trump Home Confinement play of one hundred

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Speaker 3: and fifty years from now will be better than the

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Speaker 3: one ten years from now. It will just get better

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Speaker 3: and better. It will give forever. There will be sitcoms,

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Speaker 3: there will be It'll just be its own giant entertainment genre.

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Speaker 1: George Conway always says to me that he thinks that

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Speaker 1: the Republican Party will have to die in order for

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Speaker 1: it to get Trump out of his system. I don't

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Speaker 1: want to ask you to predict the future, but it

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Speaker 1: does seem like they are really addicted to Trump.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, the corporate structure of the parties I

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Speaker 3: think makes it functionally impossible for them to die, especially

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Speaker 3: in a two two party system that the media supports energetically.

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Speaker 3: The media needs it to be a two party system

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Speaker 3: because they don't know how to cover a four party

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Speaker 3: system or a seven party system as they have in

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Speaker 3: other countries. It's just too many cameras, you know, too

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Speaker 3: many camera crews. They can't handle it. The structure of

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Speaker 3: the two party system is probably unbreakable and probably has

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Speaker 3: such enormous barriers to entry to a third party that

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Speaker 3: I suspect there's going to be this thing we call

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Speaker 3: the Republican Party going forward, and the question becomes who's

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Speaker 3: running it, who gets control of it. If you look

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Speaker 3: at your examples of parties changing utterly, the Democratic Party

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Speaker 3: is the example you have, and the Republican Party, the

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Speaker 3: Republican Party was the most subt It just changed on

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Speaker 3: a dime with the madness of Donald Trump and the

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Speaker 3: madness by the way of millions upon millions upon millions

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Speaker 3: of Republican voters who said, oh, this would be great,

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Speaker 3: he should be present. Those people are nuts, and so

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Speaker 3: no one knew they were nuts because they were offered

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Speaker 3: Mitt Romney or they were offered John McCain. So the

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Speaker 3: same people who voted for John McCain and Mitt Romney

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Speaker 3: then said, oh, no, I want to vote for the clown.

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Speaker 3: I want to vote for the abject buffoon clown right,

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Speaker 3: And so those voters have been exposed. And the question

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Speaker 3: is the question is all about them. It's entirely about them,

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Speaker 3: And what are they going to do when Trump is

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Speaker 3: out of the picture and there are these Trump pretenders

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Speaker 3: who are running.

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Speaker 2: And are the vives?

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Speaker 3: Are those kinds of candidates going to become like they

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Speaker 3: used to be in the Republican primary, this temporary bubble

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Speaker 3: of oh isn't that interesting and fun Herman Kain? You

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Speaker 3: know that kind of character, And they will bubble for

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Speaker 3: a month and a half on the polls, and then

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Speaker 3: they'll go down and you'll end up back in the Romney,

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Speaker 3: McCain Bush territory. I don't know who the Romney, mccains

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Speaker 3: and Bushes are. I know who all the clown characters,

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Speaker 3: but I don't know who those Romney and McCain and

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Speaker 3: type people can be in the future, because that's not

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Speaker 3: who you're putting in the Senate. That's not who you're

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Speaker 3: putting in the House representatives in the Republican Party. That's

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Speaker 3: not really who their governors are. And it's not how

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Speaker 3: you get on Fox. It's not how you get the

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Speaker 3: following in the past. Nineteen sixty eight was a big

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Speaker 3: kind of an attempted revolution within the Democratic Party that

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Speaker 3: people think didn't work.

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Speaker 4: They're wrong.

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Speaker 3: They just didn't understand the length of the time it

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Speaker 3: takes for a revolution to work. It was a four

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Speaker 3: year revolution.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: It began in nineteen sixty eight and was victorious in

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Speaker 3: nineteen seventy two with the most liberal nominee for the

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Speaker 3: Democratic Party in history and George mcgovernment. And you can

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Speaker 3: tell how much of a revolution it was because McGovern

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Speaker 3: went on to lose forty nine states. That's how far

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Speaker 3: the Democratic Party went from kind of a kind of

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Speaker 3: establishment centrism to what was the current real leftism of

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Speaker 3: the Democratic Party. And you know, then it kind of

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Speaker 3: pulled back a little bit in the direction of Jimmy

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Speaker 3: Carter and was finding its way along and getting in

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Speaker 3: fits and starts, sometimes with two steps forward and one

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Speaker 3: step back, increasingly liberal to the point where Joe Biden

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Speaker 3: is in fact the most liberal president in history, and

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Speaker 3: no one would have told you. No one would have guessed,

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Speaker 3: you know, in the nineteen seventies, you know that Joe

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Speaker 3: Biden was going to grow up to be the most

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Speaker 3: liberal president in history. And so that's a slower evolution

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Speaker 3: of a party, but it's all based on thinking and

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Speaker 3: considering issues. And the first time that anyone in the

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Speaker 3: United States Senate in the nineteen eighties or nineties, whatever,

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Speaker 3: was the first time any one of those people heard

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Speaker 3: the phrase gay marriage. Every one of them thought, well,

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Speaker 3: that's crazy, that's crazy, right, that's a joke. And eventually

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Speaker 3: it becomes a taken for granted element, you know of

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Speaker 3: the Democratic Party's range of sympathies and interests, and what

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Speaker 3: that is is a party and politicians listening and thinking

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Speaker 3: and having their gay relatives and having their gay friends

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Speaker 3: and having you know, this story evolves publicly for them

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Speaker 3: in ways in which they actually open their minds and learn.

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Speaker 3: I can't think of an example of anything like that

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Speaker 3: in the Republican Party. I can't think of one, Like,

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Speaker 3: not one thing did the Republican Party think their way

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Speaker 3: through collectively, by the way, with the majority of the

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Speaker 3: country who was also thinking their way through it to

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Speaker 3: get to a new position. That's not anything the Republican

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Speaker 3: Party's ever done. And so Stuart Stevens is my favorite

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Speaker 3: because he was Romney's campaign manager. He was the last

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Speaker 3: campaign manager of a Republican presidential nominee who was saying

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Speaker 3: and Stuart, you know, he was the most thoughtful person

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Speaker 3: I know in that field. He's a novelist, he's a writer,

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Speaker 3: he's a thinker. When he sat down to do his

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Speaker 3: book about what happened that gave us Donald Trump, he

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Speaker 3: just kept staring at it, the situation, and kept staring

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Speaker 3: at the situation, kept staring at the situation. And it's

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Speaker 3: all in the title of his book. It was all

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Speaker 3: a lie. And I never would have said that. I

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Speaker 3: never would have said to you, Mitch McConnell was lying

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Speaker 3: to us in the Senate in nineteen ninety four, nineteen

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Speaker 3: ninety six, nineteen ninety seven, when he appeared to be

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Speaker 3: a completely reasonable Republican senator, he was just lying to us.

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Speaker 3: He was just getting through the day, believing in nothing.

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Speaker 3: And it was all a lie. If that's true, and

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Speaker 3: I think it is, it leaves the thing we call

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Speaker 3: the Republican Party with absolutely no fulcrum on which to turn.

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Speaker 1: Lawrence is so interesting, important and also quite depressing. Thank

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Speaker 1: you for joining us.

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Speaker 3: Depressing is my specialty. They're supposed to be a warning

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Speaker 3: about that on my phone number. When you call it,

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Speaker 3: they're supposed to be it pops up. But you call her,

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Speaker 3: ID is supposed to say to you, depressing, depressed, be careful.

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Speaker 1: Jeff Science is the Biden White House chief of staff.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Fast Politics.

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Speaker 5: Can I call you, Jeff, of course, and thank you

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Speaker 5: for having me. It's an honor to be with you.

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Speaker 1: You're not like the right honorable chief of staff, right, there's.

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Speaker 5: No, absolutely not. And he talked to my children, you

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Speaker 5: do your much worse things. So let's just stick with Jeff.

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Speaker 1: You are the chief of staff for the President of

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Speaker 1: the United States. These are enormous shoes to fill. Left

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Speaker 1: by Ron. Ron has been on this podcast twice. He's

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Speaker 1: friend of the pod, but you know, he was pretty

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Speaker 1: burnt out. I mean, it's a really rough job. Can

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Speaker 1: we talk about that.

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Speaker 4: It's a hard job.

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Speaker 5: I mean I think all these jobs are hard and

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Speaker 5: probably getting harder, just in terms of how fast things

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Speaker 5: are moving, how difficult the political environment is, how complex

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Speaker 5: the world is you know, obviously the hardest job is

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Speaker 5: the president's job, but those of us who are lucky

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Speaker 5: enough to serve around but we do have our jobs.

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Speaker 5: And you know, I think Ron did a spectacular job.

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Speaker 5: I mean, the results speak for themselves, the historic accomplishments

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Speaker 5: across the first couple of years that President Biden achieved,

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Speaker 5: and you know Ron was his right hand person chief

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Speaker 5: of staff, So huge credit to Ron, and you know,

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Speaker 5: massively big shoes to fill. I think the way I

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Speaker 5: approach I've approacheached to my challenges is getting the right

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Speaker 5: thing together, and to me, that means diverse backgrounds, different experiences,

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Speaker 5: low ego about it for the right set of reasons,

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Speaker 5: and have each other's back. And if you get that

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Speaker 5: team around a table literally figuratively, you can do everything,

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Speaker 5: meaning you can deal with any crisis, you can capture

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Speaker 5: any opportunity. And having that team together means all so

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Speaker 5: that they function as a team well. And I think

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Speaker 5: we have that going here. Ron had that team together.

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Speaker 5: Many of the same players are still here. We've added

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Speaker 5: some new folks, and I think that the way you

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Speaker 5: get through these very difficult periods of different issues both

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Speaker 5: domestically and internationally and get a lot of great things done.

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Speaker 5: As this president has is to have that team around

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Speaker 5: the table and work together and have each other's back.

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Speaker 5: That's a lot of how I view my job is

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Speaker 5: to serve the president by ensuring that he gets the

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Speaker 5: right team at the table. And that's true both here

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Speaker 5: in the White House and it prop the cabin right.

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Speaker 1: You come from National Economic Council. You were involved in

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Speaker 1: the COVID roll out, the coordination there. I think of

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Speaker 1: you as like a numbers guy and very much about

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Speaker 1: sort of setting into motion the work of government. How

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Speaker 1: does that track to what you do now?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and I call myself a numbers guy. I am

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Speaker 5: the analytic, and I think that it's always important to

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Speaker 5: be rigorous in thinking through the situation and what are

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Speaker 5: the considerations for a decision and what are the options

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Speaker 5: or recommendations for the president to make decisions on hard issues.

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Speaker 5: So I think I'm rigorous on making sure that there's

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Speaker 5: strong analytics research, every view is considered, every perspective, and

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Speaker 5: to me, again that comes back to ID. My job

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Speaker 5: is making sure that we have the right team and

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Speaker 5: they're functioning as a team. And that's how I approach

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Speaker 5: the challenges when I was at the National Economic Council,

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Speaker 5: it's certainly how I approach the challenges as COVID coordinator,

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Speaker 5: and it's all about teamworking, coordination and prioritization and holding

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Speaker 5: each other accountable. And I think that's how you get results.

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Speaker 5: And you know, I think one of the things that

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Speaker 5: particularly in this period of time, a lot of people

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Speaker 5: coming into the federal government, into the White House or

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Speaker 5: into cabinet agencies with policy priorities. You know, they have

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Speaker 5: an idea for a piece of legislation or an executive action,

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Speaker 5: and that's where they focus, and that is a lot

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Speaker 5: of the focus at the beginning of most administrations, you know,

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Speaker 5: so the infamous hundred day Policy Agenda, and it's a

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Speaker 5: big deal to get a piece of legislation signed into

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Speaker 5: law you'll call the Affordable Care Act. That was certainly

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Speaker 5: a lost piece of legislation, and thank goodness, it passed

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Speaker 5: congresson was signed into the law by the Obama Biden administration.

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Speaker 5: And I remember the signing ceremony. The most signing ceremonies

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Speaker 5: are in the Oval Office, but when it's a really

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Speaker 5: big deal, you move across the street to the old

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Speaker 5: Executive Office. Building and the Southport Auditorium you can sit

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Speaker 5: more people, And there were a lot of people at

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Speaker 5: that signing ceremony, and you know everyone's crowding to get

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Speaker 5: into the picture. If you're really lucky, you get a pen.

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Speaker 5: The President youth to find a piece of legislation. Remember

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Speaker 5: that's when the ben and Vice President Biden was caught

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Speaker 5: on the hot mic describing how big a deal it

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Speaker 5: was to sign that piece of legislation. Do you remember that, Yes,

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Speaker 5: I will repeat it here, but it was a big,

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Speaker 5: big something deal, and it was that piece of legislation

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Speaker 5: which has had such an impact on tens and millions

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Speaker 5: of people's lives. It's state lives, right. It almost stell

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Speaker 5: with art because of allows e website. And the point

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Speaker 5: I'm making is that execution getting stuck done. Look, it's hard.

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Speaker 5: It's hard in any setting, private sector or NGO. I

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Speaker 5: think it's particularly hard in the federal government just given

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Speaker 5: the scale, the scrutiny, the oversight, the politics. But getting

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Speaker 5: stuck done executing is really important in the federal government.

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Speaker 5: And I think this team is this president has this

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Speaker 5: team very focused on execution and implementation of the historic

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Speaker 5: legislation and actually making these trillions of dollars in investments

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Speaker 5: in America lower prescription drug prices real to the American people.

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Speaker 5: American people are benefiting from thirty five dollars insulin. American

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Speaker 5: people are benefiting from the new jobs that are created

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Speaker 5: through new bridges and roads and new factories. And how

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Speaker 5: do we get more and more done, and also how

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Speaker 5: do we tell our story to the people of how

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Speaker 5: this is making a difference in their lives.

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Speaker 1: You know, when I was writing about you guys, and

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Speaker 1: I asked a straight reporter who's a friend of mine,

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Speaker 1: I said, this drug program where they're negotiating these drug

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Speaker 1: prices like this is something that every president has tried

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Speaker 1: to do.

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Speaker 4: Every president has tried to do right.

437
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:25,359
Speaker 1: And nobody has ever done it. And I said, and

438
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:29,440
Speaker 1: now here's Fiden doing it. His complaint was this administration

439
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 1: is aggressively boring. He said they are so boring that

440
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:38,720
Speaker 1: he said, it's like a cudgel.

441
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 5: If boring is head down doing work, then I'll take boring.

442
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:45,119
Speaker 5: But I think, you know, I'll actually push it back

443
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,360
Speaker 5: a little bit to the press. And maybe it's what

444
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,959
Speaker 5: people are interested in in terms of online and all

445
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 5: the rest, But the press likes controversy. I mean what

446
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 5: you're talking about on prescription drugs or gossip, that's just

447
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 5: plain old with me. It's the first time in history

448
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 5: that Medicare can negotiate drug prices.

449
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 4: It makes total sense.

450
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 5: That Medicare is the largest purchaser of drugs, should be

451
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:11,280
Speaker 5: able to negotiate drug prices. But as you said, no

452
00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 5: one's being able to get that done. And President Biden

453
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 5: got that done. We now have thirty five dollars insilent,

454
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 5: and that matters. And I think the challenge here is

455
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,960
Speaker 5: I maybe good stuff is somehow considered boring.

456
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,440
Speaker 4: I think good stuff is good stuff.

457
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 5: And it's our job to implement and get more and

458
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 5: more stuff done, but also to tell the story and

459
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 5: break through to the American people about how this is

460
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 5: changing their lives.

461
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,919
Speaker 1: So, the drug price negotiation, what does that look like?

462
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,360
Speaker 1: He's doing it now, When will this happen? What will

463
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: look like? Pharma is pushing back? Will you sort of

464
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,159
Speaker 1: debunk the ads and explain what this will look like

465
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:49,879
Speaker 1: if it works?

466
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 5: Well, this is ten drugs that are high cost to

467
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,800
Speaker 5: the federal government, the highest cost, and it's negotiating for

468
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,680
Speaker 5: better prices in the amount of drug that the government

469
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:08,280
Speaker 5: is purchasing for Medicare recipients. It makes sense that the

470
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 5: government should get a good deal, and the prices are

471
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 5: too high and they can be lower. And so now

472
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,680
Speaker 5: we're negotiating those ten and that impact will be seen

473
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 5: across the coming years, and we'll negotiate more drug prices

474
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 5: across time each year, and that will result in lower

475
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:27,399
Speaker 5: prices for Medicare recipients, and hopefully that'll trickle over to

476
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 5: the rest of the American people through lower prices, because

477
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,440
Speaker 5: oftentimes the pricing of Medicare is what insurers and other

478
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,640
Speaker 5: healthcare providers will gravitate toward. And you know, I think

479
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 5: that it's look, big pharmas fighting it because this cuts

480
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 5: their profit right and it cuts their ability to buy

481
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 5: back stock. There's still plenty of money for big pharma

482
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 5: and biotech and other companies to invest in future drugs.

483
00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 5: So look, this is maybe something that people will cover

484
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,440
Speaker 5: because there is a.

485
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,400
Speaker 4: Lot of controversy around this. I think, plain old good stuff.

486
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 5: It's long overdue, and President Biden got it done, but

487
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 5: making no mistake that drug companies don't want this to happen,

488
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:11,440
Speaker 5: and Republicans on the hill, no one voted for this legislation.

489
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 4: No Republicans voted for it.

490
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 5: In fact, they're trying to take back the legislation and

491
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 5: cancel the legislation so we don't have cheaper prescription drugs.

492
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,800
Speaker 5: And I think all Americans are most Americans agreed to

493
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,040
Speaker 5: drug prices are too high.

494
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,479
Speaker 1: Right. It's such an interesting thing because it's like one

495
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,680
Speaker 1: of these things where the polling really supports it and

496
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:33,040
Speaker 1: people really want it, and Republicans, of course are against it.

497
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 1: Speaking of which, many newsrooms believe that we are going

498
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 1: to have a shutdown. What is happening?

499
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 4: Good question.

500
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 5: I'd start by saying, we absolutely absolutely should not have

501
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 5: her shut down and we should not rab a government

502
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 5: shut down, right, but particularly now because back in June,

503
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 5: remember in June, we had a bipartisan agreement that averted

504
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 5: America defaulting.

505
00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 4: On its debt for the first time. So we didn't

506
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,080
Speaker 4: do that, that's a good thing.

507
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 5: As part of that, we agreed to budget levels and

508
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 5: those are the budget levels that we're now debating again.

509
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 5: And look the Senate, both Democrats and Republicans, most of

510
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 5: the House, certainly Democrats and many Republicans want to honor

511
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 5: that agreement that was made back in June. It was

512
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 5: a bipartisan agreement.

513
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 4: You know.

514
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 5: I think through President Biden's uncanny ability to lead bipartisan solutions,

515
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,719
Speaker 5: we got to a bipartisan solution on the budget. And

516
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 5: now because it's some extreme Republicans in the House, they

517
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 5: want to reopen that agreement by proposing to cut by

518
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 5: a significant amount the services that the American people rely

519
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:45,719
Speaker 5: on in need, food safety inspectors, education, law enforcement, head Start, childcare,

520
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:49,600
Speaker 5: meals on wheels. These are programs that really matter to

521
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 5: Americans across the country, across all communities. It's totally wrong

522
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 5: to threaten to shut down the government over these extreme

523
00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 5: far right demands. The bottom line is the how else

524
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 5: should do its job? Honor the agreement that was made

525
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 5: a couple of months ago and fund the government, and

526
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 5: we should not be discussing government shutdowns at this point. Unfortunately,

527
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:12,720
Speaker 5: that's not what's happening right now. There's still a couple

528
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 5: of weeks left, and I'm vopeful that the agreement will

529
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:17,360
Speaker 5: be honored and we won't shut down the government.

530
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: I don't want to be Pollyanna here, but a government

531
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 1: shutdown is still much less cataclysmic than American defaulting on its.

532
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:30,520
Speaker 4: Dat Yes, we'll stop by that terribly.

533
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 5: They're sure, even we're talking about, you know, people's lives

534
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 5: and food safety and law enforcement and housing like. Yes,

535
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:43,080
Speaker 5: you are correct that technically this is not as devastating

536
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,240
Speaker 5: as a default would have been.

537
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 4: But I think we're not in a good space. We're

538
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 4: talking about degrees of devastating.

539
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: Right, No, it's true, and I want to get to

540
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 1: now the strike. The WGA is striking, the Screen Actor's

541
00:30:56,840 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: Guild is striking, and then the people who will looking

542
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 1: on the manufacturing lines and some of these car companies

543
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: are striking. Donald Trump is toying with the idea of

544
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: going there bafflingly. Talk to me about how this administration

545
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: is connected to this union.

546
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, I won't attempt to debaffle on that front. I've

547
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 5: known the president now since two thousand and nine, so

548
00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 5: almost fifteen years. He is a union guy, and that's

549
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 5: been clear in all the interactions I've had with him

550
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 5: across time.

551
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 4: He's certainly the most pro union president in our history.

552
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 5: I'll speak to the UAW because the President spoke to

553
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 5: it on Friday. He believes in collective bargaining. He wants

554
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 5: the parties to stay at the table. And he believes,

555
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 5: and I'm quoting the President here, that record corporate profits

556
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 5: deserve record contracts for the UAW workers, and we want

557
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 5: an automobile future in this company that's made in America.

558
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,240
Speaker 5: He supports twenty four to seven world at the table

559
00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 5: to get to an agreement that keeps.

560
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 4: Workers at the heart of our auto future.

561
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 5: President is a union guy and believes in collect and bargaining,

562
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:10,400
Speaker 5: and that's what he's pushing for right here.

563
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: I wrote about this this week in my column. I

564
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 1: write about it all the time. Donald Trump numerous indictments,

565
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 1: impeachments guy is an armed insurrection Joe Biden a lot

566
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 1: of accomplishments. His thing that the media is using to

567
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 1: make a false equivalency is his age. Just like with

568
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton, they used her emails. I think it's the

569
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 1: structure of the way mainstream media a lot of the

570
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 1: time operates. I say this as a member of the

571
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: mainstream media. I mean, what do you say to.

572
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 5: That look at the results of what's happened under this

573
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 5: president's leadership. I mean a decade or more than a

574
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 5: decade worth of historic legislation done in two years, more

575
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 5: jobs created in two years than in any other war

576
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 5: year term of any president. We talked about the progress

577
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,880
Speaker 5: prescription drugs. We haven't talked about, but think about all

578
00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 5: of the progress that the President is making on the climate.

579
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 5: With the biggest investment ever in clinnement. All the electricity

580
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 5: in the US is going to be generated by clean

581
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 5: energy by twenty thirty five. That's pretty remarkable.

582
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 4: So look at the results of this period of time.

583
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 4: It's off the charts.

584
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:23,120
Speaker 5: And as I said, we have a huge opportunity to

585
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:27,480
Speaker 5: continue to implement every day things that really matter to

586
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 5: people's lives. Better roads, better bridges, more prescription drug costs, reductions,

587
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 5: getting rid of junk fees, like barging parents with kids

588
00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 5: extra in order to sit with their kids on an airplane.

589
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:42,800
Speaker 5: We're at it every day, building on this tremendous first

590
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,239
Speaker 5: two and a half years. One of the privileges I

591
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 5: have is working very closely with the President. And you know,

592
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,800
Speaker 5: I'm a firm believer and put your head down, work hard,

593
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,720
Speaker 5: and good things happen. Watching this president work is a

594
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 5: case study and hard work, being relentless, all of his

595
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:03,320
Speaker 5: six coming to bear. He's relentless and hard to keep

596
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:05,880
Speaker 5: up with. I mean you know, just last week he

597
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 5: left here the White House. Yeah, but you know that

598
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 5: was after a full day work. He gets on a plane,

599
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,879
Speaker 5: he travels twenty odd hours to India. He gets off

600
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 5: the plane, he has a bilateral meeting with Prime Minister Mody.

601
00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 5: You know, across a couple of days, he meets with

602
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:24,759
Speaker 5: thirty world leaders at the same time. I'm talking in

603
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 5: all hours of the day and night, because you know,

604
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 5: we're twelve hours apart on time, and he's staying on

605
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:33,280
Speaker 5: top of you know, what's happening with the weather situation,

606
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:37,120
Speaker 5: what's happening with workers here at UAW and elsewhere, what's

607
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 5: happening in Congress. Then he's off the Vietnam late night

608
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 5: press conference. You know, he goes and meets with embassy

609
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,640
Speaker 5: staff and military people even to somehow down in time

610
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 5: and all of that to go to manass So he

611
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 5: eats his priorities even when he's that hectic.

612
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 4: So my answer is, look at the results.

613
00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 5: And then you know, given this lucky seat that I

614
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 5: get to sit in, I can tell you, hey, study

615
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 5: and hard work coupled with experience just get gets things done.

616
00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:08,640
Speaker 4: And that's what we need now, and that's what we need.

617
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:11,120
Speaker 5: For the next many years, the next several years here

618
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:12,800
Speaker 5: in America under his leadership.

619
00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,440
Speaker 1: And this is like something I talk about all the

620
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:18,280
Speaker 1: time to everyone. I know, why is the polling not better?

621
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 5: Look, it's not where we spend time here. Our focus

622
00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 5: is you've bird over and over again. It's getting things done.

623
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 5: And that's what the President holds this team accountable for

624
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 5: as results. And you know, there's so much more to

625
00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 5: do when you look at how Americans steel job satisfaction.

626
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:36,919
Speaker 4: Is at a thirty six year high.

627
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,440
Speaker 5: Over seventy percent of Americans have a positive view of

628
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 5: their own financial situation. Look, there's you know, we have

629
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:49,120
Speaker 5: had high inflation, inflation is moderating, We are seeing real

630
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:53,400
Speaker 5: wages growing, and the invest in America agenda which we

631
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 5: talked about starting to bear real fruit here. You know,

632
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,479
Speaker 5: we think Americans will continue to have an improve view

633
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 5: of the overall economy. You know, as the polling this

634
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:06,319
Speaker 5: is a very similar place to where President Obama was

635
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:09,760
Speaker 5: in twenty eleven. I was at OMB at the time,

636
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 5: across the way in the old Executive Office building. So

637
00:36:12,239 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 5: I remember those days and as you know, the story

638
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 5: ended with him beating Mitt Romney handily.

639
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 4: So President. The main thing is, you know, keep your

640
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:20,919
Speaker 4: head down into your work.

641
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:22,640
Speaker 5: But I think it's also you know, as you've heard

642
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 5: the President say before, don't compare him to the almighty

643
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 5: or the unknown compared to the alternative. And I think

644
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 5: that's what the American people will do.

645
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,240
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, thank you. I really appreciate getting

646
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 1: you on. John de la Volpi is a poster and

647
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:42,800
Speaker 1: author of Fight How gen Z is channeling their fear

648
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,960
Speaker 1: and passion Do You Save America? As well as the

649
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:53,240
Speaker 1: sub stack j dv on gen Z. Welcome back, Too

650
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:54,200
Speaker 1: Fast Politics.

651
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 4: John.

652
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 2: Great to be back with you. Thanks so much for

653
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 2: having me.

654
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 4: Mollie.

655
00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:00,439
Speaker 1: I'm delighted to have you. And actually I've been trying

656
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 1: to get you for like three weeks because the moment

657
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:06,760
Speaker 1: I started seeing polls, I was like, I knew, John

658
00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:10,799
Speaker 1: here to explain to us what's happening, and I want

659
00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 1: to start with what does the landscape look like right now?

660
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 2: So listen. The reason that you know it took us

661
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 2: a while to book this is because I've been on

662
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 2: the road, you know, end of the summer, I've been

663
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,239
Speaker 2: on the road. I've been talking to voters. Came back

664
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,320
Speaker 2: from a week in Florida. I've been talking to voters

665
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,160
Speaker 2: across the country. Here's the thing. I think there's just

666
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 2: a massive disconnect between kind of what the media polls

667
00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:33,200
Speaker 2: are telling us the country cares about, and what everyday

668
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:37,239
Speaker 2: Americans are caring about, whether they're Democrats or Republicans. I

669
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,560
Speaker 2: think broader picture, all the polls, you know, are showing

670
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 2: this race to be a toss up. That's I think

671
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,839
Speaker 2: just the cycle of national politics today. But I think

672
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,719
Speaker 2: when you get beyond this, I think the issues that

673
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 2: I'm most concerned about that could affect the election of

674
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:55,480
Speaker 2: a year plus from now, they're not being covered by

675
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 2: the polls. And I think that's a disconnect. And I

676
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,840
Speaker 2: think that's my concern, you know, as someone who cares about,

677
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:03,840
Speaker 2: you know, kind of empowering voters of an understanding public opinion.

678
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: I want to do like a quick lightning round with

679
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 1: you about polling national polls four hundred plus days out

680
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:13,919
Speaker 1: from the election accurate or not well.

681
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 2: Recent iSER say they're not accurate or not only are

682
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:19,840
Speaker 2: they not accurate, they're not relevant. I mean, it's okay

683
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:22,879
Speaker 2: as one data point to see where we are right,

684
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 2: It's okay to see what you know one data point.

685
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:26,439
Speaker 2: But if that's the case, plenty of people have talked

686
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:28,040
Speaker 2: about this. You know, we'd be seeing, you know, a

687
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:31,719
Speaker 2: president Giuliani, President McCain, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

688
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,520
Speaker 2: So Bob Dahl exactly, we could go on, you go

689
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:37,040
Speaker 2: on for decades. Right, helpful but not insightful.

690
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:40,319
Speaker 1: Okay, So that's interesting. Also, I want you to just

691
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:42,799
Speaker 1: talk about like the nuts and bolts of polling for

692
00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:45,799
Speaker 1: a second. Are they still happening on landlines? I mean,

693
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: talk to me about the methodology. Has it changed?

694
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:53,719
Speaker 2: So there are some polls, some high quality polls are

695
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,560
Speaker 2: conducted using land lights, not a lot, but they're still used,

696
00:38:57,560 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 2: you know, as as a relatively small percentage of the

697
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:03,399
Speaker 2: overall interviews. But here's the thing. There's two basic kinds

698
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:08,240
Speaker 2: of polls. Okay. You can think of a probability based survey, okay,

699
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 2: which means that every voter or every American has an

700
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 2: equal chance of being included in the survey. And then

701
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:18,320
Speaker 2: you have a non probability or convenience sample where people

702
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 2: sign up from lists and or recruited and are compensated

703
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:25,720
Speaker 2: for them. Okay. The idea of the probability the high

704
00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 2: quality research, you don't need to conduct that over the

705
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,439
Speaker 2: telephone anymore. We recruit people to take these surveys based

706
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,160
Speaker 2: upon not what kind of telephone you have, but based

707
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 2: upon where you live, an address based approach. So the

708
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 2: highest quality survey research today is based upon that probability

709
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 2: based polling, which uses it's basically agnostic in terms of

710
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:52,720
Speaker 2: technology telephone, mobile phone, internet device, et cetera. So that's

711
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,800
Speaker 2: basically how we how we think about that. And what's

712
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 2: tricky is that there are some questions in some polls

713
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 2: between a convenience and a probability sample where there are

714
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 2: no differences, and there are other questions where there could

715
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:08,880
Speaker 2: be a ten or fifteen point difference. So it's just

716
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,800
Speaker 2: a very perilous time both as someone who collects data

717
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:14,960
Speaker 2: but also someone who interprets data.

718
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:18,080
Speaker 1: So I want to just talk a little more about this.

719
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: And again, I think that this is all super interesting,

720
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: and I know what this is like sort of boring

721
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 1: nuts and baltsa stuff for you, but I know for me,

722
00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:29,720
Speaker 1: like I want more information on all of this because

723
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: it's just so it feels so relevant right now. One

724
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:34,839
Speaker 1: of the things that I wanted to know though, is

725
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: like with the midterms, and the midterms, we saw junkie polls,

726
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 1: we saw a lot of resmutant kind of polling that

727
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 1: would shape the averages. And remember, I mean, I think

728
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 1: the best story about this is Patty Murray, right was

729
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:56,319
Speaker 1: you know, that's a deep less ten thousand seat and

730
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 1: for a minute it looked like she might really have

731
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 1: a challenger. So would you talk to us about that

732
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 1: phenomenon of these junkie red poles and whether or not

733
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:07,759
Speaker 1: you see that this cycle.

734
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:11,239
Speaker 2: It's an increase in concern for memal it's polling as propaganda.

735
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 2: The barrier to entry polling today is relatively low. You know,

736
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 2: when we talk about again the high quality address based

737
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,360
Speaker 2: sampling probability, that costs upholster tens of thousands of dollars

738
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 2: just to collect that data. That's very expensive and it

739
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 2: takes a long time. Okay, On the other hand, for

740
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 2: one thousand dollars or a couple thousand dollars, anyone in

741
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 2: this audience can conduct a pole and you can get

742
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:39,279
Speaker 2: it on one of these averaging sites pretty quickly. Right,

743
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 2: And what therefore happens is there's an incentive, in my opinion,

744
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:48,839
Speaker 2: right to change a narrative, whether it's to ask irrelevant

745
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 2: questions to get them into the media environments. It's the

746
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:56,480
Speaker 2: oftentimes hard right media environment based upon what some proportion

747
00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:59,680
Speaker 2: of Americans say. And as we could see less cycle,

748
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:04,040
Speaker 2: there was a group of polls that people questioned who

749
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 2: was paying for them, that were showing a very different

750
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 2: election outcome. They were predicting this red wave. A lot

751
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 2: of the traditional pundits looked at those polls, and they

752
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:17,040
Speaker 2: also looked at the history of you know, incumbent first

753
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 2: term presidents, et cetera, et cetera, and they change our narrative.

754
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 2: That's one thing, but it's also driving millions of dollars

755
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 2: of spending, right, it's driving cable news coverage. It's it's

756
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 2: really I think, having an effect that again further erodes

757
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,879
Speaker 2: trust in media, trust in news, in trust in institutions,

758
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,960
Speaker 2: including academic research and survey research. So it's now a

759
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:42,080
Speaker 2: political tool. Sadly.

760
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 1: So, one of the questions I have about all of

761
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 1: these Biden news to old polls is a lot of

762
00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:54,239
Speaker 1: these polling the questions that people are asking, will you

763
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:56,720
Speaker 1: talk to us about this sort of kind of innate

764
00:42:56,760 --> 00:42:59,240
Speaker 1: bias in some of these questions and what that means

765
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:00,280
Speaker 1: and what that looks like.

766
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,239
Speaker 2: And this is something I'm most concerned about, right, so

767
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 2: we could have a thoughtful conversation about the way in

768
00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:09,480
Speaker 2: which data is collected, probability and non probability. But my

769
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 2: biggest concern about the polls that your audience and other

770
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 2: people see is just like the lack of curiosity right

771
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,839
Speaker 2: in the rehashing the same questions day after day, month

772
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 2: after month, year after year, cycle after cycle. That is

773
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:27,440
Speaker 2: where I think many of us fall prey to misinterpreting

774
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 2: public opinion. Let me give you an example of this.

775
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:33,520
Speaker 2: At my company's social sphere, I published a very detailed

776
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 2: survey Midsummer I as Democrats Republicans, I asked all Americans

777
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:39,760
Speaker 2: on a scale from zero to ten, just as an example,

778
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 2: how they felt about the economy. Okay, we found massive differences.

779
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:48,440
Speaker 2: We found that forty three percent of Republicans said it

780
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,799
Speaker 2: was bad on a scale from zero to ten, zero

781
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: one or two, okay, twice as many as Democrats. Huge differences.

782
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 2: Same thing on the other end, okay, But when I

783
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 2: ask how their financial situation is, there's no difference. There's

784
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:02,920
Speaker 2: literally no difference. Thirty four percent Democrats say it was excellent.

785
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 2: Thirty percent of Republicans said theirs was excellent, and only

786
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,360
Speaker 2: fourteen percent of Republicans say it was the worst. Okay,

787
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:12,960
Speaker 2: to me, that's incredibly insightful that we as pollsters need

788
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 2: to throw out the old playbook if it's not giving

789
00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:19,000
Speaker 2: us data that informs us, if it's not reflective of

790
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 2: what our neighbors and our family members, you know, and

791
00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:24,640
Speaker 2: our community members are feeling right and think about how

792
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:27,879
Speaker 2: and how to do this the right way. And that's

793
00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 2: the concern about whether it's the age question or some

794
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 2: of these directional questions. You know, people are now just

795
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 2: predisposed to put on their political hat whenever we start

796
00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:39,960
Speaker 2: asking them questions, and we need to take a few

797
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:43,040
Speaker 2: steps back and really understand as much about like their

798
00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 2: humanity in their lives compared to kind of what partisan

799
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 2: camp they are, because that doesn't provide us real insight.

800
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 1: It's pretty interesting what you're talking about, this idea that

801
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:57,600
Speaker 1: you can have these partisan questions and the thing you're

802
00:44:57,600 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 1: talking about right now, the difference between how is the

803
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:03,640
Speaker 1: economy and how is your financial situation? That's a pretty

804
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 1: interesting disconnect, right, And I mean that is that partisanship issue.

805
00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:11,560
Speaker 1: I mean, did that not exist ten years.

806
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 2: Ago, not to this degree, Molly.

807
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:13,320
Speaker 4: No.

808
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:17,239
Speaker 2: And by the way, Democrats Republicans, there is no significant

809
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,200
Speaker 2: difference on whether or not they have enough night to

810
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:22,879
Speaker 2: take a vacation, whether they're saving money, whether they could

811
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,439
Speaker 2: afford a home. I'm not saying that the economy isn't

812
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:27,840
Speaker 2: an issue. I'm not saying the commy doesn't put pressure

813
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:30,680
Speaker 2: on people and it needs to be addressed. Of course

814
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:34,839
Speaker 2: it does. But when you ask people like in English right,

815
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 2: how their day is going. They just did ten focus

816
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:39,800
Speaker 2: groups the last week or so. In the first hour,

817
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 2: that's the conversation I'm having. What's a good day, what's

818
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 2: a bad day? What stresses you well, what makes you happy? Okay?

819
00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 2: And it was nearly impossible to know whether I was

820
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 2: in a Republican focus group or a Democrat focus group,

821
00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 2: you know, until we turn to the news. It was

822
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 2: nearly impossible because Americans care about the same things based

823
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:01,959
Speaker 2: upon where you live. Traffic is a big deal, road

824
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 2: rage is a big deal in states with traffic and

825
00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 2: a lot of guns. Right, that transcends party. And I

826
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:10,560
Speaker 2: just don't think we get that level of insight about

827
00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:12,760
Speaker 2: the issues, Nor do we get the level of insight

828
00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:14,560
Speaker 2: as you know, something I care a lot about in

829
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:17,399
Speaker 2: terms of like some of these really important subgroups who

830
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 2: are likely to decide the outcome of the election, right,

831
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:23,879
Speaker 2: whether it's people of color, younger people, women, et cetera.

832
00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:26,120
Speaker 2: We don't nearly have as much insight in terms of

833
00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 2: those important groups as well.

834
00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:31,640
Speaker 1: That's really interesting. So when you get to news and

835
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:35,400
Speaker 1: you see the disconnect, what does it look like?

836
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,960
Speaker 2: People put their blinders on, and it's nearly impossible to

837
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:43,480
Speaker 2: have a conversation or for Republicans to give Biden credit

838
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 2: on anything in similar Democrats on Republicans. But I think

839
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:51,000
Speaker 2: it's harder, you know, for Republicans. The mental gymnastics I

840
00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 2: see in some of these focus groups is just difficult

841
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:56,800
Speaker 2: for me to understand and process. You know, how someone

842
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:58,919
Speaker 2: can feels one hundred and eight degrees different when we're

843
00:46:58,920 --> 00:47:01,799
Speaker 2: talking about like an individual's family based upon whether they're

844
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:04,759
Speaker 2: Republican or Democrats. So I definitely see kind of more

845
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:09,799
Speaker 2: of a blinder situation in Republicans programmed to basically kind

846
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 2: of hate anything associated with the Democrat Party. However, as

847
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,359
Speaker 2: I said ten minutes early, in those focus groups, I'll

848
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 2: find Republicans will say one of the biggest challenges in

849
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,560
Speaker 2: America and then their lives is not enough access to

850
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:26,400
Speaker 2: healthcare or reproductive healthcare, you know, or issues that Democrats

851
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:27,920
Speaker 2: have been fighting for for generations.

852
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 1: But they're not open to the possibility that that's what's

853
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 1: going on.

854
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 2: So this is why when I walked out of the scrip,

855
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 2: I said, I don't want to give up on some

856
00:47:34,600 --> 00:47:37,120
Speaker 2: of these kind of independent minded people who have just

857
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:40,880
Speaker 2: not had a relationship with civic life, with politics, with government.

858
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:44,400
Speaker 2: You know, who watch their news generally from Fox News,

859
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:47,240
Speaker 2: but their values and the things that they care about,

860
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:51,919
Speaker 2: in my opinion, are much more aligned with Democrats than Republicans.

861
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:54,440
Speaker 2: So it's the question of, I think, how do Democrats

862
00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:58,719
Speaker 2: begin to have conversations with these voters at a much

863
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:02,000
Speaker 2: earlier age. We now have a generation that's been raised

864
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:05,319
Speaker 2: or two generations have been raised exclusively based upon where

865
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:08,520
Speaker 2: you live on Fox TV, and they're seeing this quote,

866
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 2: as I said, this polling propaganda.

867
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 1: I mean, when you talk to these Republicans, do they

868
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:16,560
Speaker 1: just say, like, is Fox sort of the answer to

869
00:48:16,719 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 1: all of this? Like when you ask them about their

870
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 1: media diet, is it always Fox, so well, I don't

871
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 1: watch cable news.

872
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:25,600
Speaker 2: I tuned out from that, right, So, or they say,

873
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:28,279
Speaker 2: you know, I'm a fan of Trunk, but there's a

874
00:48:28,360 --> 00:48:31,120
Speaker 2: lack of pride associated with that. I listened to how

875
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:32,759
Speaker 2: I watch it, and you can certainly kind of hear,

876
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:35,160
Speaker 2: you know, see the through lines there in their rhetoric.

877
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:38,640
Speaker 1: It's so interesting. So when you're polling, I mean, is

878
00:48:38,680 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 1: there a sense like when you said, when they say, well,

879
00:48:41,480 --> 00:48:44,400
Speaker 1: Biden's too old, is there any sense like, well Trump

880
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:46,759
Speaker 1: is two and a half years younger than he is,

881
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:47,560
Speaker 1: or does it?

882
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:50,919
Speaker 2: Is it? Just like that's it, that's it, based upon

883
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:53,200
Speaker 2: what group I'm in, whether it's with a Democrat group

884
00:48:53,239 --> 00:48:57,359
Speaker 2: or Republican group. I played Devil's advocate out argue some points, Well,

885
00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:00,200
Speaker 2: you know, is he young enough for create thirteen point

886
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 2: five million jobs? Is young enough to gun you know, violence, etc.

887
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:04,200
Speaker 4: Et cetera.

888
00:49:04,480 --> 00:49:08,400
Speaker 2: They just are listening because in that political context, and

889
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:11,319
Speaker 2: they'll say, you know, he's too old and I like him,

890
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:13,319
Speaker 2: he's a nice guy, but he's just too old, right,

891
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:15,360
Speaker 2: So it makes them feel a little bit better, But

892
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:17,400
Speaker 2: just it's going to be really challenging to kind of

893
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:19,960
Speaker 2: break through, right, Like right now. That's a longer term

894
00:49:19,960 --> 00:49:21,799
Speaker 2: plan as far as I'm concerned. Right is to kind

895
00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 2: of re establish civic IQ, you know, and ability to

896
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:29,360
Speaker 2: discern propaganda from from facts. That's a longer term play.

897
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:33,360
Speaker 2: My concern for short term is the role that this

898
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:37,960
Speaker 2: is having in increasing levels of cynicism that would just

899
00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 2: incentivize people from voting or or voting for one of

900
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:42,880
Speaker 2: the two party candidates.

901
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:45,960
Speaker 1: One of the things that I think is pretty interesting

902
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:50,040
Speaker 1: right now is we find ourselves in a kind of

903
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:54,200
Speaker 1: disconnect between some of the survey stuff I've seen, so like,

904
00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 1: for example, I'm seeing survey stuff that shows that, like

905
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,920
Speaker 1: most Americans want some amount of gun control. You know,

906
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:06,280
Speaker 1: they don't really care about trans people being denied healthcare.

907
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 1: That's not something they care about. They just want people

908
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:11,120
Speaker 1: to live their lives. That kind of stuff is not

909
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:16,480
Speaker 1: particularly popular with the voters, but I guess is very

910
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:19,319
Speaker 1: popular with the Republican base. So they're going to have

911
00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 1: to pivot when they get to the main election. I mean,

912
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:22,399
Speaker 1: talk to me about that.

913
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:25,560
Speaker 2: There's going to have to be a significant pivot away

914
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:29,040
Speaker 2: from some of these culture war issues. I think that

915
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:31,840
Speaker 2: the discussion a year from now, in a general election

916
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 2: is going to be about basic rights and which party

917
00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 2: is defending and expanding basic rights. And we're not just

918
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:45,719
Speaker 2: talking about reproductive rights, obviously incredibly important. There are a

919
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:49,520
Speaker 2: number of younger women and younger men I've met in

920
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 2: the last couple of weeks who are the process of

921
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:56,360
Speaker 2: recently married, planning for a wedding, etc. Who are thinking

922
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:58,480
Speaker 2: about where they're going to live, whether or not they

923
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:00,879
Speaker 2: want to have children. Based up upon the Supreme Court

924
00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:04,799
Speaker 2: decision a year ago. This is directly impacting thousands, if

925
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:08,560
Speaker 2: not millions of lives. That's an example. The basic right

926
00:51:08,719 --> 00:51:12,320
Speaker 2: to access clean air, clean water, basic right to feel

927
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 2: safe in a movie theater or in a school classroom.

928
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 2: These are the basic rights, the basic right to work

929
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,800
Speaker 2: hard and to be able to afford college or home

930
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 2: if that's your choice. And I think that's going to

931
00:51:25,120 --> 00:51:28,640
Speaker 2: be the frame that this campaign will be run on.

932
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:30,920
Speaker 2: And I think, you know, that's going to be a

933
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:34,160
Speaker 2: more positive frame at this point for the Democrats than Republicans,

934
00:51:34,200 --> 00:51:37,960
Speaker 2: based upon I think, you know, their their legacy of

935
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 2: fighting and expanding for these rights. Now, whether they can

936
00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:42,920
Speaker 2: communicate to you know, to the right people in the

937
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:47,279
Speaker 2: right places, that's an incredible challenge. That's how I see,

938
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:49,680
Speaker 2: you know, the themes of the next fifteen month or

939
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:50,359
Speaker 2: so playing out.

940
00:51:50,640 --> 00:51:51,400
Speaker 1: Are you worried?

941
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:54,960
Speaker 2: I'm extremely worried. My book which has been focused on

942
00:51:55,160 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 2: gen z and I say, I'm not worried about the

943
00:51:57,160 --> 00:52:00,200
Speaker 2: future if we allow our kids to get there and

944
00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 2: our democracy is intact. But I am extremely worried, especially

945
00:52:05,080 --> 00:52:08,239
Speaker 2: coming off of the road for the last week or so,

946
00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:11,239
Speaker 2: just about again, which I think is this kind of

947
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:14,799
Speaker 2: propaganda machine which has made everything related to politics and

948
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 2: public service negative, which turn people away where they're not

949
00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:23,920
Speaker 2: able to see some of the good things that are happening.

950
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:26,840
Speaker 2: And this has been something that hasn't happened over the

951
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 2: course of this administration or the last couple of administrations,

952
00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:32,480
Speaker 2: but this is something that has been in our system

953
00:52:32,520 --> 00:52:35,839
Speaker 2: now for decades, and that's what concerns me. I think

954
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,720
Speaker 2: we need to kind of invest in systems that allow

955
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:44,440
Speaker 2: younger people to feel comfortable having conversations about civic life

956
00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:47,600
Speaker 2: and politics Part one. But I also think that we

957
00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:51,480
Speaker 2: need to as soon as possible, begin to tell those

958
00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:55,520
Speaker 2: stories about how government can do big things. This administration

959
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:58,319
Speaker 2: has done big things, and no one can set this

960
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:01,800
Speaker 2: thing out next year. Thank you, John, Thank you Molly.

961
00:53:01,800 --> 00:53:03,120
Speaker 2: It's great to be with you. As always.

962
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:13,920
Speaker 3: Jesse Cannon, Molly, Jong fastt Joe Manchin. He always thinks

963
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 3: he's right and he knows what's up when I think

964
00:53:17,760 --> 00:53:19,000
Speaker 3: the rest of us disagree.

965
00:53:19,360 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 1: Joe Manchin, who's toying with the third party run to

966
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:27,880
Speaker 1: make Trump president again, is very concerned about the Senate

967
00:53:27,960 --> 00:53:32,800
Speaker 1: dress code, which was changed for John Fetterman, because honestly,

968
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,720
Speaker 1: why should the Senate have a dress code. Mansion told

969
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:39,600
Speaker 1: a reporter that he spoke to Fetterman today about the

970
00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:42,399
Speaker 1: Senate dress code. I hope Fetterman talk to him about

971
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:45,960
Speaker 1: the child tax credit, I said, John, I think it's

972
00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:48,879
Speaker 1: wrong and there's no way I can comply with that. Well,

973
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:51,080
Speaker 1: you know what there's no way I can comply with

974
00:53:51,400 --> 00:53:56,839
Speaker 1: is you abolishing the child tax credit and protecting big

975
00:53:56,880 --> 00:54:00,720
Speaker 1: oil and gas. And for that, Joe Manchin, you are

976
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,600
Speaker 1: yet again, and your houseboat and your lack of charm,

977
00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:09,040
Speaker 1: you are our moment of fuck. That's it for this

978
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:12,759
Speaker 1: episode of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday and

979
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,879
Speaker 1: Friday to hear the best minds in politics makes sense

980
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 1: of all this chaos. If you enjoyed what you've heard,

981
00:54:19,320 --> 00:54:22,240
Speaker 1: Please send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.

982
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:24,320
Speaker 1: And again thanks for listening.