WEBVTT - Normal People (Part 2) 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:05.520 Hi, I'm Danish Sports and this is Popcorn Book Club 0:00:05.519 --> 0:00:08.320 for my heart radio show, where four of my smartest 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:11.119 and funniest friends get together to talk about books that 0:00:11.160 --> 0:00:14.880 are getting the Hollywood treatment. This episode, we continue our 0:00:14.920 --> 0:00:18.920 conversation about Sally Rooney's Normal People, and things are really 0:00:19.000 --> 0:00:21.079 heating up. I just wanted to know what you guys 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:23.159 thought about that for those of you who watched the 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.239 show and got to the nak parts. At the risk 0:00:26.280 --> 0:00:30.200 of sounding like the creepiest pervert in the entire world, 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:33.839 I'm so excited. Here we go. Yeah, thank you for listening. 0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:38.120 Let's get into it. I think right now we're at college. 0:00:38.720 --> 0:00:42.840 Connell has you know, come into their friends group. Um, 0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:46.720 this is a place where Marian has more social capital 0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:49.560 over him, and he is someone who is both worth 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:52.239 off financially and is having a little bit of a 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:55.280 tougher time fitting in. Jennifer, you want to sort of 0:00:55.320 --> 0:01:00.520 take the next step. Um. Yeah, so she we've touched 0:01:00.520 --> 0:01:02.680 on this a little bit, but she has an apartment 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:07.000 in the city. Um of where Connal is working at 0:01:07.000 --> 0:01:09.880 a restaurant. I think the restaurant shuts down or he 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:15.600 gets fired. Um, and something happens. Um. If he's going 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:17.959 to spend the summer in the city, he needs to 0:01:18.000 --> 0:01:21.240 find a place to stay without paying any rent, and 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:23.679 he wants to ask Marianne if he can stay at 0:01:23.680 --> 0:01:26.039 her place, and he kind of has a conversation planned 0:01:26.080 --> 0:01:29.800 out in his head, and then he never is able 0:01:29.840 --> 0:01:32.080 to articulate that, I just want to move in with 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:34.520 you for the summer. I want us to be together 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:38.240 in the way that you know, it wouldn't be that 0:01:38.319 --> 0:01:40.920 big a deal if you'd been dating someone for a 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:43.200 significant amount of time. And it seems like he had 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:45.720 been staying like most nights at her place. He was 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:51.480 already there most nights, and yeah, yeah, um, so that 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:54.440 does not happen, and that's kind of parting of the 0:01:54.480 --> 0:01:58.000 ways for them again. I think that scene, which I 0:01:58.040 --> 0:02:00.200 do want to talk about zoom in a little bit 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:03.360 in focus, was the most effective use of the book's device, 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:07.440 which is switching between their perspectives the book chapter my chapter. 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:09.880 We get a story from Maryann's side, and then we 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:13.000 you know, either jump forward in time or just flipped 0:02:13.040 --> 0:02:16.600 to Connal's side. And I think that scene seeing it 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:20.000 from hearing it, I think first we hear mary Anne's 0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:23.799 memory of it, playing out where he just sort of said, like, well, 0:02:23.840 --> 0:02:25.880 I'm going back and I want to see other people, 0:02:25.919 --> 0:02:28.680 and she's sort of is heartbroken about it, and he 0:02:29.120 --> 0:02:32.440 sort of breaks his own heart accidentally because he doesn't 0:02:32.440 --> 0:02:36.480 know how to say, Hey, I'm you know, don't have 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:39.120 enough a job right now? Can I live at your apartment? 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:41.800 Which is a you know, embarrassing thing to say, but 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:45.560 with a girlfriend, the type of intimacy that you hope 0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:47.600 someone would have. Melissa, what do you What did you 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:51.240 make of that scene? I mean it broke my heart 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:55.880 because it felt like I felt like I've had those 0:02:55.919 --> 0:03:00.399 conversations in my like college and post college is where 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:04.760 I like can't quite say the thing that I planned 0:03:04.919 --> 0:03:06.919 to say. Like that was a moment where I did 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:11.160 feel like sympathetic and related to Connell, where there was 0:03:11.200 --> 0:03:15.679 something embarrassing or like a little bit It's something that 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:19.200 I would feel and secure bringing up and then I 0:03:19.280 --> 0:03:22.000 just don't, you know, like I like write it down 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:26.520 and like figure out the words, and then I just 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:30.800 don't say it. And I think that is so common, 0:03:30.880 --> 0:03:34.160 and it's like that heartbreak of like if one of 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:36.880 them had just said what they wanted it would have 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:39.920 they would have not broken up. I mean it's embarrassing 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:43.160 for Connell. He I mean, I think Salarly Rooney establishes 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:45.280 really well, like the fact that his mom is a 0:03:46.440 --> 0:03:53.480 what did we say, house house cleaner house? Yeah, um, 0:03:53.520 --> 0:03:56.520 I mean that is you know, in in especially in 0:03:56.560 --> 0:03:59.720 like young people. I think that is not humiliating a 0:03:59.800 --> 0:04:03.120 nor more job, but as type of subservience that I 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:07.120 think for insecure people, uh does communicate this sort of 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:10.240 embarrassing position. And I think it what is something that 0:04:10.320 --> 0:04:13.000 Kneal is embarrassed to say, like I can't afford the 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:16.400 situation right now? Do you think that's part of why 0:04:16.440 --> 0:04:20.160 he relishes his power over Maryanne so much that now 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:24.680 he has complete power over a girl whose mother used 0:04:24.720 --> 0:04:27.760 to be her housekeeper, and yet he didn't use his power, 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:30.360 Like if you have complete power over this person and 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:33.640 you need a place to stay, why why couldn't you 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:35.560 do that? What do you what? What do you guys 0:04:35.600 --> 0:04:38.360 think was his big Maybe thought would have put him 0:04:38.360 --> 0:04:40.279 in a position for he would have had to have 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:46.279 seen himself as powerless. Yeah, he's spending his power giving 0:04:46.279 --> 0:04:49.680 her power over him. That definitely was a moment that 0:04:49.760 --> 0:04:51.880 I felt most sympathetic to Konel as well, and then 0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:55.840 remember that like he's like one. I would have felt 0:04:55.880 --> 0:04:58.719 the same way to have just like being this person 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:01.279 who you're in college and you want to think that 0:05:01.320 --> 0:05:05.080 you're an adult that can like live and work and 0:05:05.120 --> 0:05:08.760 like provide for yourself, and to be in this relationship 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:11.640 that you haven't labeled or like is in a kind 0:05:11.680 --> 0:05:14.440 of weird gray zone. I would have been the same 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:17.800 move just like not knowing what to say or feeling 0:05:17.800 --> 0:05:21.400 too embarrassed to say, and like that that weird gap 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:24.279 of feeling immature and also that I should be a 0:05:24.320 --> 0:05:30.520 full formed adult at felt it brought me back. Yeah, yeah, 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:33.760 And I went to a college that had a lot 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:36.480 of wealthy people, and I was friends with a lot 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:38.680 of wealthy people and I was not wealthy, and it 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:41.160 was it was the same in high school, but in 0:05:41.240 --> 0:05:44.960 college it was different because you have you you stay 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:47.400 in place that you stay in different kinds of apartments. 0:05:47.560 --> 0:05:50.279 You either you're working in college or you're not working. 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.279 And I think it's the first time where you really 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:57.320 see that divide between friends where it is you have 0:05:57.400 --> 0:06:01.800 to make different choices and so one you're learning how 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:03.720 to be an adult, even if you're not fully an 0:06:03.760 --> 0:06:08.080 adult yet, and I feel like you bungle that a 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.040 lot of the time. And at the same time, like 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:15.640 Maryanne doesn't recognize her privilege and realize that, like oh'connell 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:19.360 doesn't have a job, he might need something that I 0:06:19.400 --> 0:06:22.160 have never thought to need, you know. And another thing 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:26.119 that the book establishes about Connell's central personality trait early 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:28.640 on in high school is like he is someone who 0:06:28.760 --> 0:06:31.880 is terrified of rocking the boat in any way, of 0:06:31.920 --> 0:06:37.279 like being a burden or a strain on the smooth 0:06:37.360 --> 0:06:41.400 flowing system in any capacity where it's like as someone 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:45.400 who would rather stab myself than ask a human being 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:48.520 for anything. Ever. Um, that is something I'm working on, 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:52.880 but it's like something I relate to very very uh profoundly. 0:06:53.600 --> 0:06:57.000 I do wonder if the option were instead of the 0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:00.599 option in the book right now as it's stands, is 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:04.680 that he had to either stay in Dublin with her 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:09.840 or go back to Karrickly when he can't afford rent. Yeah, right, 0:07:10.200 --> 0:07:12.360 so he can't afford rent, but he will have a 0:07:12.400 --> 0:07:16.240 place to stay either way, if it were either homelessness, 0:07:16.320 --> 0:07:20.400 like genuine homelessness, or staying with her, do you guys 0:07:20.400 --> 0:07:22.320 think he would have opened his mouth and said something. 0:07:22.360 --> 0:07:24.440 Do you think because he had a safety net of 0:07:24.520 --> 0:07:27.240 staying with his mother and karrically that he didn't say anything. 0:07:27.280 --> 0:07:29.200 And it was just because when because when he was 0:07:29.320 --> 0:07:32.440 mug when he was robbed. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he was 0:07:32.520 --> 0:07:37.920 very comfortable when he was Melissa asking for well and 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:40.480 also like asking for money. He was ashamed of it, 0:07:40.560 --> 0:07:44.360 but then like happily took the hundred dollars and did 0:07:44.400 --> 0:07:47.480 it in it even then while he was breaking her heart, 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:50.520 which was so like, oh, by the way, I have 0:07:50.600 --> 0:07:53.640 a girlfriend and I'm just mad you have a boyfriend. 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:56.520 That that was a bad look for Conall as she 0:07:56.640 --> 0:07:58.720 literally told him get out, and he was like, yeah, 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:02.600 but couldn't have that money me first, But it was 0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:07.040 needed to your point, it was the need. He did 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:09.920 need it. He needed to get to get a right 0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:12.960 to get a cab home, so he did ask her 0:08:13.040 --> 0:08:16.200 for the thing. Let's when it was dire. Let's talk 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:18.400 about that scene, Jennifer. You want to dive back in 0:08:18.480 --> 0:08:22.720 and walk us through this really bad, really painful. I 0:08:23.120 --> 0:08:25.520 actually do want to talk just a little bit in general, 0:08:25.600 --> 0:08:28.760 if we can about Conal's relationship with money, because it's 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:31.800 kind of fascinating to me, especially if we're supposed to 0:08:31.840 --> 0:08:35.400 have a Marxist reading on this book, that Conal's fantasy 0:08:35.400 --> 0:08:36.880 of what he'll do with his life is he'll go 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:39.720 off and become a lawyer and he'll make like, he'll 0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:41.760 make a really solid amount of money. And that's what 0:08:41.800 --> 0:08:46.120 he initially thinks he's going to do and living. He's 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:47.840 going to make a comfortable living and people are going 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.760 to say he did well. Um. And the minute he 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:54.280 gets a scholarship and he has disposable income, he talks 0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:59.280 about how dirty and sexy it feels. Um and um. 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:03.160 I I think that's an interest in money that we 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:05.720 never really see from Marianne because she never needs to 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:09.079 think about it in that way. And um. Yeah. The 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:13.360 scene that we're talking about where he gets mugged, Maryanne 0:09:13.400 --> 0:09:17.000 is having a party, um, and he goes over to 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:20.280 her house. Her boyfriend is there at the time. He 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:23.120 goes over to her house, kind of stumbles in, very 0:09:23.240 --> 0:09:28.760 drunk and just having been mugged, and tells her tells 0:09:28.760 --> 0:09:31.760 her that he needs money and he needs help getting home, 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:37.520 and also he has a girlfriend. He's burning to mary Anne. 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:40.760 I think that it's worth, it's well. He says that 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:42.959 her number was the only number that you could remember 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:46.079 by that right, which I think also is emblematic of 0:09:46.120 --> 0:09:48.800 the fact that this is a modern story and not 0:09:49.160 --> 0:09:51.680 like a jay No novel. Dress stop. But I think 0:09:51.679 --> 0:09:53.760 that it's important to say that he tells her that 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:56.320 he has a girlfriend after he says that he would 0:09:56.440 --> 0:09:59.760 rather she date literally anyone other than Jamie, including the 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:03.440 guy who just nu him. Yes, that's true. YEA quick 0:10:03.640 --> 0:10:06.560 A quick note on the only knowing her number by heart. 0:10:06.600 --> 0:10:09.560 I thought that was a very sweet and nostalgic sort 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:12.040 of memory about high school and like you're the friends 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:15.000 you have growing up, because I don't know anyone's numbers, 0:10:15.360 --> 0:10:19.000 but I still know like my elementary school's best friends 0:10:19.000 --> 0:10:22.080 home number by heart and my brain where it's like 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:25.840 you have that sort of weird intimacy with people that 0:10:25.880 --> 0:10:27.960 you're friends with and close with when you're young, that 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:30.440 you kind of never get with people that you meet 0:10:30.480 --> 0:10:32.640 and are friends with when you're older, which is sort 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:36.760 of something that Connell and uh Marianne come to again 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:39.440 and again. So I found that detail, whether it was 0:10:39.440 --> 0:10:43.880 on purpose or not, like very evocative. But about the 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:47.840 dropping of the break up with your boyfriend. He sucks. 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:50.640 Please date anyone else. Also, I have a girlfriend. Friend, 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:53.760 it's basically break up with your girlfriend because I'm bored 0:10:53.800 --> 0:11:00.000 by Ariana Grande. Yeah, Melissa, did you have a response 0:11:00.080 --> 0:11:05.720 to that scene? I mean, I think that was one 0:11:05.760 --> 0:11:08.640 of the worst scenes I thought for Connal to me 0:11:08.960 --> 0:11:12.520 of like, you know, he comes in in a sympathetic way. 0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:16.160 Of course he got mugged, like he's very vulnerable. But 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:19.520 then I mean, Marianne just literally kicks everybody out and 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:22.280 including her boyfriend. I mean, her boyfriend sucked. But that's 0:11:22.280 --> 0:11:26.560 beside the point to to tend to Connall and like 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:29.959 have her full attemps, full attention, and then he just 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:33.720 ships on the boyfriend. I mean again rightfully so, but 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:37.560 then just burying the lead of like, by the way, 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:41.840 I have a girlfriend, and like how hurtful that is? 0:11:42.040 --> 0:11:46.640 And it again is a moment like Deb's where he 0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:50.960 refuses to understand why it's so hurtful, you know, like 0:11:51.040 --> 0:11:54.760 he doesn't he waits and he knows that he shouldn't wait, 0:11:55.400 --> 0:11:58.600 and he just keeps repeating these same mistakes of like 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:01.640 waiting to tell her different gold information and then refusing 0:12:01.679 --> 0:12:05.600 to take responsibility for the effect, even though he knows 0:12:05.880 --> 0:12:08.560 it to be. It's almost like the power had to 0:12:08.600 --> 0:12:12.840 shift because there was the imbalance of she had financial 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:15.640 power over him, because you know, she needed her to 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:17.520 pay for the cab and give her money and take 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:21.720 care of him. That almost like an unconscious thing like 0:12:21.720 --> 0:12:24.439 like the uh you know how water when you pour 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:27.320 it like reaches a level like their power dynamic had 0:12:27.360 --> 0:12:29.559 to go back to their level, which is Connall having 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:32.720 power and I have a girlfriend, okay, back to neutral 0:12:34.360 --> 0:12:38.439 such another like again just him, I think, being emotionally manipulative, 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:41.880 like he knows he has that power over her, like 0:12:42.040 --> 0:12:45.000 dominance of her emotions, like he knows that from the 0:12:45.080 --> 0:12:48.439 jump from the beginning. So like that scene of him 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:54.679 telling Marianne about Helen, I think I was like, fuck you, Connall, 0:12:54.920 --> 0:12:58.880 you piece of ship like that like you to me, 0:13:00.120 --> 0:13:03.960 it just felt like he knowingly purposefully said it to 0:13:04.200 --> 0:13:08.520 hurt her, Like I don't know if he did honestly, 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:11.560 don't credit I don't. I don't think he did it 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:14.840 on purpose. I think that you're right that he's emotionally manipulative, 0:13:15.000 --> 0:13:17.400 but I think he's the worst kind of emotionally manipulative 0:13:17.400 --> 0:13:19.560 where he doesn't even know he's doing it half the time. 0:13:19.640 --> 0:13:24.120 He thinks he's a good guy. I don't think he 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:27.040 did it on purpose. I think he's just like, she 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:30.760 has a boyfriend. I should tell her this. He's like, 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:34.280 he's the baby wants it all. He just wants um. 0:13:34.320 --> 0:13:38.760 I have the theory about Donald Okay, well my theory 0:13:39.240 --> 0:13:41.800 my secret ending for this book is I think he's 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:44.559 going to go off to New York become an investment 0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:49.200 manker Mary the first model he needs, send any long 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:53.160 rambling email to Marry Anne about it um and just 0:13:53.320 --> 0:13:57.280 leave her devastated in Ireland and feel like he has 0:13:57.280 --> 0:13:58.959 a ton of money now and a ton of power 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:02.000 over people. And he's gonna buy like a vulgar sports 0:14:02.000 --> 0:14:05.560 car I do kind of thing in New York. Yeah, 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:08.240 she's a car in New Yard. It's not even going 0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:10.240 to drive it. He's just like, in case he wants 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:12.040 to go up to the Hampton's for the weekend, in 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:16.400 case you're like any cool parties that he was going 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:18.120 to get an m f A in writing and then 0:14:18.200 --> 0:14:22.560 write the book about them. And then she reads the 0:14:23.280 --> 0:14:33.280 Great conn is Sally Rooney. Yes, oh no, it's I 0:14:33.360 --> 0:14:36.560 don't necessarily think that it's like a prequel version. It's 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:40.040 the Carry Diaries version of the last five years. I 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:44.280 love the Carry Diaries. I love it so much. And 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:46.560 I'm so glad you mentioned that show. Not because I'm 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:50.560 gonna elaborate any further, just because people need to remember 0:14:50.640 --> 0:14:54.280 that show. Lovely show, right he was such a sweet show. 0:14:54.320 --> 0:14:57.000 I never saw it, and now I just I'm tuning 0:14:57.080 --> 0:14:59.800 like so sweet. I'm a fake for right now, just 0:15:00.040 --> 0:15:04.560 like really great. It's very lovely and very enjoyable to watch. 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:07.840 Much like this show, I really think that for now, 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:09.640 I think we should just like take a second breathe, 0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:13.160 come back to it later. Yes, there's clearly more to say, 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:22.880 so much to discuss. You're listening to Popcorn Book Club 0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:25.240 for my Heart Radio. We'll be right back after this 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:33.640 quick break, all right, so let's get back into it. 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:37.080 I actually wanted to talk about something I wrote it 0:15:37.120 --> 0:15:41.080 down about the no no no. It is about normal people, 0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:44.200 I promise, and it's about the show adaptation. And I 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:48.520 am tragically American and so nudity on screen is always 0:15:48.560 --> 0:15:51.480 kind of a shock for me. And this show had 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:55.840 not like an like an extravagant amount of nudity, but 0:15:56.160 --> 0:16:00.000 it had like full frontal male nudity in a way. 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:02.880 It was very shocking to me. I was like, oh, right, 0:16:03.280 --> 0:16:08.480 sometimes men are naked, and it was really interesting to 0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:11.600 me to see this nudity because it felt like it 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:16.360 was about vulnerability and not about sexuality, and it wasn't 0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:19.880 like this male gaze nudity. And I just wanted to 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:21.600 know what you guys thought about that, for those of 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:24.680 you who watched the show and got to the naky parts. 0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:28.480 At the risk of sounding like the creepiest pervert in 0:16:28.520 --> 0:16:33.120 the entire world, I did. I thought that the nudity 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:36.520 was really well done and it didn't feel hyper sexualized. 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:39.720 I thought when she was nude, um, it felt you know, 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:42.920 very like vulnerable and I hope respectful. I mean, it 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:44.480 can't speak to how it was filmed and how she 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:46.800 feels like, I hope good. But I did like that 0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:50.440 it It always wasn't like, oh boom, sexy hot, so 0:16:50.480 --> 0:16:52.920 it was, well, she is notoriously flat chested, so I 0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:54.800 don't think it was ever going to be you know, 0:16:54.920 --> 0:17:04.200 what can be sexy hot Karama, Yeah, but I didn't 0:17:04.240 --> 0:17:10.880 mean it that way. Nearly a cups rule who felt 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:14.000 like I disrespected that I just met. From a filmic 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:16.399 point of view, I don't think that they were going 0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:20.600 to focus on the breast area as like I did. 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:26.520 I did notice that the first time they showed her nudity, 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:30.160 it was like it cut to a wide a two 0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:33.200 shot of the two of them and it was not 0:17:33.359 --> 0:17:35.680 a sexual not like they were about to have sex, 0:17:35.680 --> 0:17:38.560 but it was one of her awkward early lines where 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:41.000 it's like, should we take all all our clothes off? Now? 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:44.400 Like it was just very unsexual, and that's I feel 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:47.639 like that was the presentation of it. It was like 0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:51.520 setting the tone of how that would all transpire. It 0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:55.280 was very now. It felt reminded me obviously very different 0:17:55.320 --> 0:18:00.600 but of hustlers like that, Um it was Whstlers? Is 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:07.399 that the right the movie about? Yes? Um? I was like, 0:18:07.400 --> 0:18:10.239 oh no, is that the Anne Hathaway movie where she 0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:14.679 I think that movie is also called I Think the Hustle, 0:18:16.040 --> 0:18:18.680 And then of course it's American Hustle with Jennifer Lawrence 0:18:18.720 --> 0:18:22.520 all the hustling. But it was like it was intimate 0:18:22.920 --> 0:18:26.359 and sexy without it being from the male gaze. It 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:31.639 felt very like romantic and open rather than like objectifying 0:18:31.640 --> 0:18:33.520 a woman. I think they also probably had to be 0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:35.880 conscious of the fact that even though these actors are 0:18:35.880 --> 0:18:40.520 in their twenties, these are portraying high school students, and 0:18:40.560 --> 0:18:42.280 so they don't want it to be like porny where 0:18:42.280 --> 0:18:47.280 it's like these barely legal teens. In my head reading 0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:49.840 the book, I was never thinking of them naked, which 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:55.119 might be my own stuff, but I was like their children. Yeah, 0:18:55.160 --> 0:19:00.119 I mean, but they're still There's still teenage shows and 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:04.040 movies that don't show nudity that are way more objectifying 0:19:04.840 --> 0:19:11.040 of teenage girls Riverdale, like gossip Girl, they were like stripping, 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:14.720 Like there's a lot of that involve high school students, 0:19:15.119 --> 0:19:19.440 high school female students, like putting on stripped teases, which 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:22.720 is not something we did in our high school that 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:28.000 I was ever invited to. UM. It did throw me 0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:31.399 off a little that they are so beautiful in UM 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:33.600 in the first scene, because I remember in the book 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:37.920 they're like such wonderful, vivid details, like her underarms being 0:19:38.000 --> 0:19:40.840 all kind of white with deodoring because she smeared a 0:19:40.920 --> 0:19:45.239 lot of chalky deodorant on and um, yeah, sure, we 0:19:45.320 --> 0:19:49.520 we all have deodorant. It's not a secret, but yeah, 0:19:49.520 --> 0:19:52.000 those are details, so you know, obviously when you see 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:54.679 it on the screen, there's not gonna be like a 0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:57.119 camera shot of like, oh, there's an awkward amount of 0:19:57.119 --> 0:20:02.960 deodorant showing. Now I did balk at her matching underwear set. 0:20:04.359 --> 0:20:07.960 There's not. They say that it's kind of like old 0:20:08.320 --> 0:20:12.800 not beautiful. Yeah, I will say, I the show is 0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:16.239 so beautiful, Like it looks so visually beautiful, and like 0:20:16.280 --> 0:20:19.440 the music is really like beautiful and pleasant. But it's 0:20:19.480 --> 0:20:23.240 so beautiful that at some points, I if I zone out. 0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:25.680 I am not sure whether or not Hulu has come 0:20:25.680 --> 0:20:28.760 back from commercial break, because all the commercials right now 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:31.399 are like really beautiful and calm, and they're like to 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:36.600 do do do, and these uncertain times, the vibe of 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:39.159 the show of like these like soft close ups of 0:20:39.200 --> 0:20:42.600 beautiful young people running on the beach. If you put 0:20:42.600 --> 0:20:45.760 a voice over, it's like, in these uncertain times, connection 0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:51.119 is all we had, Like like the vibe of the 0:20:51.200 --> 0:20:56.560 show is very beautiful, pandemic commercial. Yeah, I also will 0:20:56.600 --> 0:20:59.120 say I've been watching it. My boyfriend and I share 0:20:59.200 --> 0:21:02.560 one bedroom apart ment, and so we have like headphones 0:21:02.720 --> 0:21:05.520 that we can connect to our TV. And he didn't 0:21:05.560 --> 0:21:08.960 watch the show, and it was just like, every time 0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:12.520 I look over, there's just like naked teens on the screen, 0:21:12.600 --> 0:21:14.840 and I'm like, I'm so sorry. It's like, this is 0:21:14.960 --> 0:21:19.520 the show that is in fact what this show is 0:21:19.560 --> 0:21:25.120 sexy teen, sexy horn sexy horny team. You mentioned the music, 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:28.000 and I will say I was a little disappointed that 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:31.400 they didn't film the show as a period piece because 0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:33.960 it does specifically take place between the years of like 0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:38.040 two thousand eleven and two thousand and there was a 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:41.000 mention in the book. They mentioned specific songs and albums 0:21:41.040 --> 0:21:42.920 and stuff in the book and they talked about Watch 0:21:43.000 --> 0:21:47.160 the Throne by jay Z, and I was like, that's 0:21:47.200 --> 0:21:49.520 what I wanted. I mean, I did love that there 0:21:49.560 --> 0:21:50.960 was a scene where they were making out to Carly 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:54.240 Rae Jepson, because Carly is my girl. Carly, if you're listening, 0:21:54.320 --> 0:21:57.119 I worship you. You're not listening, but you need to 0:21:57.160 --> 0:22:00.560 know someone tell her. But um, I think that there's 0:22:00.560 --> 0:22:05.199 something really humbling about recent period pieces because it's just 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:07.720 a reminder that like ten years ago, we all wanted 0:22:07.760 --> 0:22:10.239 to wear Von Dutch Trucker hats. You know, we were 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:15.080 all so embarrassing. The most embarrassing thing about me is 0:22:15.119 --> 0:22:18.200 that in high school we all were like gaucho pants 0:22:18.240 --> 0:22:21.280 that ended at the widest part of your calve, and 0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:24.359 then ugg boots that ended just an inch below the 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:28.040 gaucho pants. And then also a big thing that I 0:22:28.119 --> 0:22:30.080 was like begging my mom to do because I saw 0:22:30.119 --> 0:22:32.080 all the Disney Channel stars do it was We're like 0:22:32.480 --> 0:22:36.359 a skirt or dress on top of jeans, which is 0:22:39.040 --> 0:22:40.639 I mean, I did that, and I feel like I 0:22:40.720 --> 0:22:42.760 pulled it off. If you showed me a picture now 0:22:42.800 --> 0:22:47.000 I'd burn it, but I feel like it was look 0:22:47.080 --> 0:22:50.479 and that that for me. Also, I wanted that for 0:22:50.520 --> 0:22:53.639 the show and I wanted them to live in that time. 0:22:53.880 --> 0:22:57.960 There was that scene before Deb's the dance, the fundraiser dance, 0:22:58.000 --> 0:23:00.960 where she goes to because she was they say on 0:23:01.000 --> 0:23:03.680 the committee may be voted on as a joke, which 0:23:03.720 --> 0:23:06.680 is sort of sweet and sad um, where she really 0:23:06.720 --> 0:23:11.639 goes all out as they say, and they're playing very backwards, 0:23:11.840 --> 0:23:15.800 you know, very retro music by our standards, and she 0:23:16.000 --> 0:23:19.240 is sexually assaulted by one of the boys and Connell 0:23:19.400 --> 0:23:22.840 defend that's the closest that moment is the closest he 0:23:22.960 --> 0:23:32.800 comes to publicly, Yeah, showing than he's him for it, Yeah, mercilessly? 0:23:34.119 --> 0:23:36.240 Did you ride her last night? And he's like, I 0:23:36.280 --> 0:23:40.719