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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and welcome back to Coast to Coast George Norri

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Speaker 1: with you. We've got a grade show for you tonight.

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Speaker 1: Let me tell you about our first guest. Olof Grout

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Speaker 1: is the foundered managing partner of the Cambrian Group. He's

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Speaker 1: also the co author of Solomon's Code. The other co

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Speaker 1: author is Mark Knitzburg. He's a Professor of Strategy and

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Speaker 1: Economics at Holt International Business School and executive for the

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Speaker 1: Evolving Global Innovation Economy. With twenty plus years of experience

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Speaker 1: and corporation consulting firms academia, he has helped build new

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Speaker 1: ventures and change management initiatives for employers and clients and

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Speaker 1: energy technology aerospace in a number of countries at least

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Speaker 1: thirty plus Olof welcome to the program, looking forward to this.

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Speaker 1: It's a pleasure to be with you, George and with

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Speaker 1: your listeners. Thanks for having me. Artificial intelligence. Give us

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Speaker 1: your definition of what that is. Well, artificial intelligence is

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Speaker 1: essentially software algorithms that mimic functions of the brain. And

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Speaker 1: the most loose, uh you know, loose way of defining it, right, So,

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Speaker 1: what the brain does well is recognized patterns and distill

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Speaker 1: insights for us right, and based on those insights, we

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Speaker 1: then make decisions. And so AI tries to mimic that

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Speaker 1: with very simple structures of algorithms UM and UH and

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Speaker 1: make our lives hopefully easier and better. Are you Are

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Speaker 1: you hopeful with AI or are you a little skittish?

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Speaker 1: You know, we're we're and I am a net optimist.

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Speaker 1: You know, at the end of the day, it'll I

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Speaker 1: think it will lead to better lives and richer lives

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Speaker 1: and more growth in the economy and in society. But

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Speaker 1: you know there's there's big drawbacks and big pitfalls as well.

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Speaker 1: So we're optimistic, but we're critically optimistic. I had a

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Speaker 1: story on last week where Uber was found really not culpable.

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Speaker 1: Uber the car company, not culpable of a car driverless

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Speaker 1: car that ran over a woman in the Arizona A. UM.

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Speaker 1: They had a guy in a car Uber did, but

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Speaker 1: it wasn't obviously paying attention, but the car itself was driverless.

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Speaker 1: That's artificial intelligence, isn't it. Well, it's artificial intelligence, but

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Speaker 1: it also tells you that, you know, as we interact

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Speaker 1: with artificial intelligence, we can completely abdicate our responsibility, right,

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Speaker 1: So it's I think it's a fallacy to assume that

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Speaker 1: the machine will get everything right and we can just

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Speaker 1: sit back and let it happen. And that obviously backfired

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Speaker 1: in this case. So you know, it's one of the

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Speaker 1: big lessons we have to learn as we engage in

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Speaker 1: this you know, this cognitive future, as we say, with

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Speaker 1: artificial intelligence as as a partner to our human decision making.

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Speaker 1: I was getting my car repaired last week, so the

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Speaker 1: dealership gave me a lease car. It was evolval. They

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Speaker 1: were letting me use and that's what It's the only

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Speaker 1: thing they had in their inventory. And I have never

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Speaker 1: driven a car like that. And I was in it,

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Speaker 1: and somewhere along the line on the freeway, somebody decided

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Speaker 1: to stop. And so this car I was in decided

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Speaker 1: on its own, I've got to stop two. And though

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Speaker 1: it was not an accident situation or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: it freaked me out because it started breaking before I did.

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Speaker 1: It took over basically, and I've never been in a

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Speaker 1: situation like that before. I mean, how far will artificial

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Speaker 1: intelligence go? Yeah, you know, that's that's a that's a

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Speaker 1: good question. Right, Artificial intelligence doesn't really understand us yet

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Speaker 1: and how we make decisions, as sciences are trying to

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Speaker 1: teach it that. Um, but it's a it's a it's

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Speaker 1: a really wickedly complex thing to do because you know,

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Speaker 1: humans all have different goals and values and ways of

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Speaker 1: making decisions. Right, You, George might make decisions about you know,

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Speaker 1: how close to uh, you know, drive to another car

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Speaker 1: in front of us then than I do, and UH,

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Speaker 1: and AI will eventually have to pick up those preferences

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Speaker 1: because otherwise, you know, as you say, right, people get

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Speaker 1: freaked out. Um. And and that's not yet happened, so

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Speaker 1: there's still a lot of sort of rough negotiation between

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Speaker 1: us and these algorithms. What would you say are the

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Speaker 1: great aspects of artificial intelligence which would convince you it's

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Speaker 1: the right way to go? Well, you know, if we

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Speaker 1: just stick with traffic, right, and with with autonomous driving,

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Speaker 1: you know, um, computer vision jointly with light R and

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Speaker 1: you know, laser radar and artificial intelligence algorithms can see

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Speaker 1: miles ahead, right, and it can link up with other

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Speaker 1: cars that are further ahead of us, and you know,

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Speaker 1: develop sort of a traffic picture for us that you know,

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Speaker 1: the human eye and the human brain can possibly grasp

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Speaker 1: all without all those tools. So that's a good thing

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Speaker 1: because eventually we'll be able to avoid a lot of

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Speaker 1: accidents and have fewer traffic jams, and be less aggravated

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Speaker 1: in traffic and spend less energy on it. Right, And

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Speaker 1: so that's all good and and and of course there's

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Speaker 1: lots of promising development and AI and healthcare AI and education. Heck,

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Speaker 1: we can even use AI to understand climate change better

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Speaker 1: or things like food cris right by modeling all these

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Speaker 1: very complex interconnections. So there's lots of great horizons out

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Speaker 1: there if we get it right. But that's a big if. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's true. We'll talk about that if tonight. All if,

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you one of the things I really like

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Speaker 1: about AI, especially with the kind of hours I keep

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Speaker 1: a lot of times in the wee hours, when you're

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Speaker 1: driving home, you come across you come up to a

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Speaker 1: red light and there are no cars there. There's no cars.

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't have a red light. In the old days,

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Speaker 1: you had to wait for that red light to cycle

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Speaker 1: and it could be three to four minutes. Now they

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Speaker 1: know you're there. Somebody knows you're there and the light

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Speaker 1: turns green right away. It's unbelievable. Yeah, yeah, it's smarter

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Speaker 1: traffic management, right, it's one of the big promises. And

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Speaker 1: you know, you add quantum computing into the mix and

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Speaker 1: we can model all kinds of really tricky, complex systems

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Speaker 1: in our everyday life. So yeah, there's some really cool

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Speaker 1: horizons out there. Where does social media fit into this? Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, social media is a really tricky thing, right,

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Speaker 1: So on on hand, we all we all like it

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Speaker 1: because it does enable us to connect to people much

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Speaker 1: more easily. And if we're honest, right, how often do

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Speaker 1: we really call these friends on our regular phones? Now

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Speaker 1: it's much easier to keep up with people, and AI

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Speaker 1: helps with that, right. AI understands who's who and how

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Speaker 1: we relate to them and and hopefully get us a

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Speaker 1: bit closer to these people. But it can also do

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Speaker 1: the exact opposite, can drive us apart. And that's really

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Speaker 1: what's been happening if you think about the last election, right,

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Speaker 1: And it's not necessarily one political direction or another. These

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Speaker 1: algorithms are designed to play to you know, our current preferences, right,

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Speaker 1: So if they know that you have a certain preference,

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Speaker 1: for certain types of entertainment or certain types of politics,

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Speaker 1: it'll keep sending you messages that play to those interests

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Speaker 1: and drive you further into a corner, right, and then

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Speaker 1: automatically you start, you know, seeing the differences between you

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Speaker 1: and other people, and that's driving us apart, right, instead

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Speaker 1: of bringing us closer together and seeing the world through

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Speaker 1: each other's eyes, we get only enforced, reinforced to see

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Speaker 1: the world through our own pre existing mindsets. Right. So

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Speaker 1: that's really difficult, that's really tricky on a very large

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Speaker 1: scale to think about it. You know, Facebook has two

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Speaker 1: billion subscribers worldwide. So you release a book piece of

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Speaker 1: code that goes to ten hundreds of millions or even

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Speaker 1: billions of people, it can do some real damage out there.

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Speaker 1: It can do some real good, but also some real damage.

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Speaker 1: It sure can. Now we hear a lot about fake

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Speaker 1: news these days, and you know, I will admit that

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Speaker 1: there's some fake news out there that has been infiltrating us,

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Speaker 1: that has been snuck into the deal here to make

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Speaker 1: us think it's real. Part of what the President is

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Speaker 1: said about fake news is accurate, some of it is not.

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Speaker 1: Not everything is fake news. The problem is for people

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Speaker 1: who really aren't on the inside. How do they know

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Speaker 1: what's fake and what is it? That's a fantastic question, George,

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Speaker 1: And you know, frankly, we're all struggling with that, and

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Speaker 1: we're trying to figure this out of Cambrian as well,

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Speaker 1: where we're trying to build tools that people can use

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Speaker 1: to really figure out what is the what's the truth here?

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Speaker 1: What's the reality? Who is who? Right? Even just understanding

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Speaker 1: what people's identities are. Right now, you have these sophisticated

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Speaker 1: AI bots that can represent to be somebody that they're

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Speaker 1: actually not. They're they're just a piece of software, but

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Speaker 1: you think they're a person because they can near perfectly

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Speaker 1: mimic a real human being, right, which is which is

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Speaker 1: what we call deep fake, And it's it's really tricky,

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Speaker 1: if not impossible, for the average human being, for the

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Speaker 1: average citizen to figure out, you know, what's behind those bots. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's a brave new world and we've got

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Speaker 1: to give people some tools to really figure that out.

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Speaker 1: Have we gone too far all off? Should we go

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Speaker 1: back to the simpler days? You know, George, it's it's

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Speaker 1: always we always have sort of a certain type of

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Speaker 1: romanticism to you know, things being easier or better decades

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Speaker 1: or even hundreds of years ago. And you know when

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Speaker 1: you look at you know, where we are today with

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Speaker 1: regard to already levels, crime levels, uh, you know, people

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Speaker 1: dying child you know, child mortality and things like that.

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Speaker 1: The world is a better place to day than it was,

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Speaker 1: you know, one hundred years ago. So you know, I'm

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Speaker 1: of the opinion that, uh, you know, we rarely have

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Speaker 1: stopped technology through us right. So the major technology trends,

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Speaker 1: even when they have reak havoc on societies, but we

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Speaker 1: found a way to shape them right to make sure

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Speaker 1: that you know, some big cataclysm, some big catastrophe doesn't happen.

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Speaker 1: And I'm confident that we'll do this again here. So no,

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Speaker 1: I think the way forward is just that it's forward,

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Speaker 1: not backward. But we got to get on top of

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Speaker 1: this thing for sure. Yeah. Absolutely. Listen to more Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast AM every weeknight at one am Eastern and

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Speaker 1: go to Coast to Coast am dot com for more