1 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:06,800 Speaker 1: Four homes are filled with people coming out of chronic homelessness. 2 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 1: On average, they were on the streets for ten years. 3 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,920 Speaker 1: If this church hadn't stepped in and invited them home, 4 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 1: they would have died on the streets. They are the 5 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 1: most expensive to the public because they cycle in and 6 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:21,880 Speaker 1: out of the emergency rooms and detoc centers and jails, 7 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 1: because we make homelessness illegal, most expensive to the public, 8 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:30,080 Speaker 1: with the least amount of options available. This is the 9 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:32,520 Speaker 1: group of people that we look away from. We step over, 10 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:36,519 Speaker 1: we see them holding a sign saying anything, anything, anything, 11 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: and we make all of our quick judgments. 12 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 2: Welcome to an army of normal folks. I'm Bill Courtney, 13 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,600 Speaker 2: I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband, I'm a father, 14 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:52,240 Speaker 2: I'm an entrepreneur, and I'm a football coach and Inner 15 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 2: City Memphis, And that last part it somehow led to 16 00:00:56,520 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: an oscar for the film about one of our teams 17 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 2: films called Undefeated Guys. I believe our country's problems are 18 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 2: never going to be solved by a bunch of fancy 19 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 2: people and nice suits using big words that nobody ever 20 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 2: really uses on Sannon and Fox, but rather by an 21 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 2: army of normal folks. That's us, just you and me 22 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 2: deciding hey, maybe I can help. That's what Gabrielle Cloudius, 23 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 2: the voice you just heard, has done. Gabrielle is the 24 00:01:28,480 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 2: founder of Settled, which partners with churches to build tiny 25 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:39,319 Speaker 2: home villages on church land for both people experiencing homelessness 26 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 2: and church members to live in community together. And while 27 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 2: it started as a homelessness ministry, she's discovered that really 28 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:52,919 Speaker 2: it's a ministry for all of us, as we all 29 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 2: have some homelessness in us, a desire for human connection 30 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 2: that's greater than what we have today. A really cannot 31 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 2: wait for you to meet Gabrielle right after these brief 32 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 2: messages from our general sponsors. Gabriella cloud Ust No, Gabrielle, 33 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 2: what I say? 34 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: He said, Gabriella, like, which, in. 35 00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 2: A second, can we just call you Gabby? 36 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 1: No? 37 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:29,519 Speaker 2: Well, it's the a go to make this difficult. I 38 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:36,840 Speaker 2: was so I was so focused on not saying Gabriella 39 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 2: and making the first a hard for gabriel L. I 40 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:44,640 Speaker 2: put an a where the E is and now my 41 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 2: vowels almost. 42 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: It's happy cheese God, gay bri L gay gay hel God, 43 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 1: happy God. 44 00:02:56,919 --> 00:03:01,480 Speaker 2: You know that's interesting because if I drew a horse, okay, 45 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:04,400 Speaker 2: all right, and then I grew the ocean. Yeah, and 46 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 2: I grew a and drew a bird speaking what is 47 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 2: that course? See bird speaking meyorcy boku. Yes, so I 48 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 2: do phonetic imagery for things all the time. So, gabriel Oh, 49 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:26,639 Speaker 2: how hard is that? 50 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 1: The only person that's ever helped? 51 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 2: I got it? Okay, Gabrielle uh Childice. Welcome to Memphis. 52 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 2: Thanks from you. Fill out of Minneapolis. I guess dry 53 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 2: flight straight to Memphis like delta, so nice. It takes 54 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 2: two hours. Yeah, so you flew in today? Are you 55 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 2: flying out to nider. 56 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 1: Staying flying out tonight? 57 00:03:57,120 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 2: You're not even gonna enjoy city girls. 58 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 1: I need to get home. Yeah, I'm so sorry. 59 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 2: Whoever another taking care of the four little girls can 60 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 2: give you one day off? 61 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:07,960 Speaker 1: I love them? 62 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, well I loved mine too, but I sure needed 63 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:12,839 Speaker 2: a day off of them. I need a day off 64 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:14,360 Speaker 2: of them all the time. I don't know how Lisa 65 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 2: did it. Ours were one, two, three, and four. 66 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:21,080 Speaker 1: Okay, that's crazy, that's crazy. We staggered. I mean we've 67 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: got three years apart. 68 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:30,040 Speaker 2: That's pretty sure. Yeah, okay, so welcome to Memphis. And everybody. 69 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 2: Gabriel L. Cloudis is the founder of Settled in Saint Paul, Minnesota, 70 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:42,159 Speaker 2: which is a really kind of groovy, interesting deal that 71 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:47,160 Speaker 2: you're doing. And I love the word settled. I mean, 72 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 2: it makes so much sense. What a great title. And 73 00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 2: obviously I'm gonna cliffhang it a little bit. We'll get 74 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 2: to that, okay, obviously, because that's why you're here. But 75 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 2: let's go back to the beginning and my information you 76 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 2: picks up about when you were twelve and when on 77 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 2: a mission trip, and I just kind of want to 78 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 2: hear about that experience and how that kind of formed 79 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 2: and evolved who you are and why you went this way. 80 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:17,599 Speaker 1: Sure, okay, I'm twelve years old. My parents just get 81 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 1: a divorce. It's in the nineties. It was the thing 82 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:24,600 Speaker 1: to do. And I get invited. 83 00:05:24,839 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 2: Where were you living? 84 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: I lived in Austin, Texas. 85 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 2: Got it. 86 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 1: Get invited on a mission trip with my best friend's family. 87 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 1: We're going to Guatemala this summer. Do you want to come? 88 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 2: Why not? 89 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:37,840 Speaker 1: What else do I have going on? 90 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 2: Yeah? 91 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 1: That's cool, stay at home when my parents are fighting 92 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:42,359 Speaker 1: over me? No? 93 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 2: Thanks? 94 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:45,160 Speaker 1: All right, Let's go on a mission trip to Guatemala. 95 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:50,920 Speaker 1: Get to Guatemala within days, see real poverty for the 96 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 1: first time. Visit the city landfill where there was a group, 97 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 1: a community of three thousand people living in the landfill. 98 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 1: They were literally carving their homes out of trash. 99 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 2: What do you mean, like making igloos out of trash heaps, 100 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 2: like compacted trash heaps and carving shelter. 101 00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,600 Speaker 1: Yes, really, yeah. 102 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:15,360 Speaker 2: I mean I've seen some of the pictures, and I've 103 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 2: heard of the children, the unparented children, and parts of 104 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 2: the world hanging around traffic. I think I've read about 105 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 2: in India, but hanging around or maybe South Africa, I 106 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:30,680 Speaker 2: can't remember, but that. 107 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 3: Peter Muda, Basi and Uganda. Yeah, but I've never heard 108 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 3: of Yeah, your experience, I've never heard of in the 109 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 3: world before. 110 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,359 Speaker 2: Neither. But I've heard of kids living around just basically 111 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:44,720 Speaker 2: for this. But you're saying a whole community of three thousand, 112 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 2: we're talking on a small town in Guatemala. Yeah, and 113 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 2: they're making igloo hugs out of compacted trash heaps. How 114 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 2: do they eat, how do they clothe, how do they bathe? 115 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:58,040 Speaker 2: How do they do anything? How do they educate? 116 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 1: I don't know about that education, but clothing and food 117 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 1: is being picked out of the trash. I mean that 118 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 1: is their entire world. 119 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 2: So they're literally human waste, don't they're literally humans in waste? 120 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: Yeah? 121 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 2: I don't think there is such thing as human waste, 122 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 2: So don't hang on what I said there. But what 123 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 2: I am said, I see your face, But what I'm 124 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:25,000 Speaker 2: saying is literally they're humans in waste. 125 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: Yeah. So as a young white girl from America seeing that, 126 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 1: I couldn't unsee it. It was like, Okay, now that 127 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: I have seen this, what do I do with it? 128 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:40,560 Speaker 2: How long were you there? 129 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: Two weeks doesn't take long. 130 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 2: What were you doing with the three thousand people in 131 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 2: the human waiste? 132 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:51,239 Speaker 1: Huse? We just came to share the love of God? 133 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: And you know, how do. 134 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,000 Speaker 2: You share the love? Let me ask seriously, how does 135 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 2: someone that's living in it to have reaked stench? Wise? 136 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: Yeah? 137 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: All right, so these people had to wreak themselves because 138 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 2: that's what they lived in, and I can't imagine there's 139 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 2: a lot of running water or bathing going on. Okay, 140 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 2: So how when you're living in a trash igloo searching 141 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 2: other people's literally waste for your means? Why does anybody, 142 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 2: they even want to hear about God. I would think 143 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:30,040 Speaker 2: they'd be wanted to hear about just how they're going 144 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:31,920 Speaker 2: to get their next meal. You understand what I'm saying. 145 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 2: I mean, how could that be on their hierarchy of needs? 146 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 2: I mean, a twelve year old kid coming to say 147 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 2: God loves you even though you live in a waste 148 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:43,880 Speaker 2: how does that even work? I really, when I read that, 149 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 2: I was like, how does that even? How does that work? 150 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 2: You know? 151 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. I mean the most impactful experiences 152 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 1: in life are ones where it changes everyone involved, right, 153 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: And so when we we we drove a bus to 154 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: the landfill, we showed up. The stench is uh revolting, 155 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 1: It's it's beyond what you can imagine. I didn't even 156 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:13,320 Speaker 1: want to get out of the bus. And and then 157 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:15,560 Speaker 1: I heard the laughter of kids outside the bus and 158 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 1: was just sort of drawn out of it. And the 159 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 1: kids were happy and laughing, and they just wanted you know, 160 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: there were foreigners there that probably were bringing treats, and 161 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:30,439 Speaker 1: they wanted to play. And so we came with our 162 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: treats and they embraced us as as friends instantly, and 163 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 1: and we were just playing and somehow God's love was 164 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:46,559 Speaker 1: present and it transformed us and you know, certainly brought 165 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 1: joy to them. It didn't change their circumstance. They were 166 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 1: still in extreme poverty. But it did, you know, it did. 167 00:09:55,679 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: It did touch us. It did transform my life to say, 168 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:04,840 Speaker 1: now that I've seen this, my life will look different. 169 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:08,920 Speaker 1: I will spend my life thinking about what I have 170 00:10:08,960 --> 00:10:14,240 Speaker 1: seen and caring for people that are living in extreme poverty. 171 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 2: And then you did it again, but not to go 172 00:10:16,559 --> 00:10:17,320 Speaker 2: out them all right. 173 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, So the next year I went to Russia. I 174 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 1: was thirteen. I saw girls my same age being drugged 175 00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 1: and prostituted, and it was so shocking. It was just so. 176 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 2: Shocking when you didn't think the trash heap could get worse, 177 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 2: Let us show you this, I mean honestly, Yeah, yeah, 178 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:40,679 Speaker 2: how heartbreaking. 179 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's really heartbreaking. You know. I didn't go back 180 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:49,920 Speaker 1: the third year. It took me a lot of years 181 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 1: to process what I had seen in Russia. 182 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 2: I'm actually surprised that a mission took someone your age 183 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 2: to see that. That is that's I mean, that's traumatic. 184 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 1: It's also the moment, you know, I mean, it's the 185 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:09,880 Speaker 1: coming of age. It's the time when you're defining and 186 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:12,559 Speaker 1: deciding who you are as a human right, like what 187 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: am I going to do? Why am I here? What's 188 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: my purpose? What's my plan? And so it's such a 189 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,400 Speaker 1: defining moment in a human life at twelve or thirteen 190 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:28,839 Speaker 1: years and it was so significant. 191 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 2: Did you have any perspective on who was drugging these 192 00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 2: children and putting in the prostitution? I mean, how did 193 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:39,600 Speaker 2: that even happen? Is what I'm saying. 194 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not sure. That wasn't really explained to us. 195 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,079 Speaker 2: So would you just talking to girls who'd been rescued 196 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 2: from that we're trying to No. 197 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: No, we were watching it happening. 198 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, yeah, oh my gosh. That I don't 199 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:58,760 Speaker 2: guess that's an impression that could ever be a race 200 00:11:58,840 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 2: for you can't unsee that. 201 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:02,640 Speaker 1: No, you can't un see that. And not only can 202 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 1: you not unsee it, but there's there's some responsibility that 203 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: comes with it, you know. I think often we talk 204 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 1: about human rights, and it's also like and what is 205 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 1: our human duty? Like what is our duty to one another? 206 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:17,920 Speaker 1: If I have seen something, if I have been exposed, 207 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: if I know now now what? And that seems to 208 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:24,959 Speaker 1: be true for just about anything. Once I learned about 209 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: slavery and chocolate, or slavery and in coffee, it's like, okay, well, 210 00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 1: now I'm not gonna support that anymore. If you know, 211 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:39,199 Speaker 1: if I know about oceans being polluted, okay, now I'm 212 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:44,480 Speaker 1: going to make different decisions. Or I know about Chinese factories, Okay, 213 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 1: I'm going to I'm gonna buy my things differently. It's 214 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 1: every time we're exposed to a truth, we we get 215 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 1: the choice to make a new decision and to be 216 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: part of upholding what is good and what is right 217 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 1: and what is lovely in the world. And you know, 218 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 1: it's every time our eyes are open to something, it's 219 00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: such a gift and then we have the opportunity to 220 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:08,719 Speaker 1: make new decisions. 221 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 2: And now a few messages from our generous sponsors, But first, 222 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:24,079 Speaker 2: please consider signing up to join the Army at Normalfolks 223 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 2: dot us. By signing up, you'll receive a weekly email 224 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:32,560 Speaker 2: with updates about the Army and short episode summaries in 225 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:35,920 Speaker 2: case you happen to miss an episode or you prefer 226 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:41,080 Speaker 2: reading about our incredible guests. Please sign up. The more numbers, 227 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 2: the more impact. We'll be right back. 228 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 4: Okay, so you're thirteen, You've experienced a lot, you're starting 229 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:06,839 Speaker 4: to form the beautiful things that you just said, which 230 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 4: are phenomenal. 231 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 2: And as I was listening to you, I was thinking, 232 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:16,280 Speaker 2: I don't know how, with the over abundance of news 233 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 2: channels we have, and the over abundance of social media 234 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 2: that we just flood our brains with, how any American 235 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 2: could not be aware of some of the things that 236 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 2: you say. But how very few change their lifestyle or 237 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 2: their purchasing habits or anything as a result of it. 238 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 2: I don't know if that's apathy or a lack of concern, 239 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 2: or just choose not to think of it. But it's 240 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 2: interesting what you just said about slavery and chocolate, slavery 241 00:14:50,200 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 2: and coffee, children working in Chinese factories, ugurs being re 242 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 2: educated and forced to work in Chinese factories that are 243 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 2: now exporting products that we buy every day in the US. Yeah, 244 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm guilty of it. I don't think about 245 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,400 Speaker 2: it every time I make a purchase or any of that. 246 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 2: So I just think it's interesting that you have this 247 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 2: constructed as a teenager as a result of these mission experiences. 248 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 2: So what happens after that? I mean, you're a kid. 249 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:35,160 Speaker 1: I'm a kid. It takes a long time to process 250 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 1: what I've seen. 251 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 2: Are you talking to friends about it? Or are you 252 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 2: internalizing it? 253 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,520 Speaker 1: Probably internalizing it? Yeah, you know, so I'm still also 254 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:44,760 Speaker 1: going through my own. 255 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 2: You're also a kid. You're trying to figure out what's 256 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 2: going on with your body and your brain and who 257 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 2: you are. 258 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: Sure. Yeah, and in the meantime, my family is breaking apart. Yeah, 259 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 1: so just internally kind of processing what is this? What 260 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 1: does God think about this? How what is my role 261 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: in responding? I go to college for architecture. I'm really 262 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 1: interested in humanitarian architecture. Where go to Texas Tech. 263 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 2: That's cool, school, hold it, But what's humanitarian architecture? I 264 00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 2: don't know what that is. 265 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 1: It's like, Okay, you're building your homes out of trash. 266 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 1: What if we could, you know, come up with designs 267 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,920 Speaker 1: with the kind of vernacular materials that you have available 268 00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: to you that would add more durability, strength, beauty. 269 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 2: That's interesting? All right, So you're going to school for architecture. 270 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: Going to school for architecture, Start traveling again, specifically in 271 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: Central America. Start going around Central America. Go get my 272 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:04,480 Speaker 1: master's in humanitarian architecture. Continue down this path. 273 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:08,440 Speaker 2: There is such a thing a master's Humanitarian Architecture also 274 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 2: from Texas Tech. 275 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:13,439 Speaker 1: That is from New School of Architecture. Okay, cool, and 276 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:16,040 Speaker 1: I don't know if the degree is actually humanitarian architecture, 277 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 1: but that was my concentration and that was that was 278 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:27,880 Speaker 1: my real focus and finish my masters, I think, I'm I'm, 279 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: you know, start working for a nonprofit. We are converting 280 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: shipping containers into preschools and orphanages and clinics and c 281 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 1: South America actually kind of all over the world. Really, 282 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: it was a really neat, little nonprofit, scrappy and uh, 283 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 1: you know, I'm I don't know, twenty two years old, 284 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:49,959 Speaker 1: and they put me as like a head of architecture. 285 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:56,360 Speaker 1: Tiny and and you know, way bigger of a role 286 00:17:56,440 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: than I probably should have taken on, but doing cool stuff, 287 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 1: and just felt like, Okay, this is this is the path, 288 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 1: this is what we want to do. Eventually move I 289 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: want to move overseas and and continue on in this 290 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 1: We I get married and we have this really cool 291 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 1: opportunity to spend a year renovating a home on a 292 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 1: private beach in Florida. 293 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 2: Okay, so that's pretty nice. 294 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:27,440 Speaker 1: We say yes to that, and so we moved from 295 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:31,679 Speaker 1: southern California to Florida. We live at this home, renovating 296 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: it for a year, and my husband and I we 297 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 1: our lives were so full in southern California, like so 298 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 1: so full full with really good things, amazing things. We 299 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,480 Speaker 1: volunteered and we worked at nonprofits, and we taught at 300 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:51,120 Speaker 1: our university, and we part of social clubs and went 301 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:53,160 Speaker 1: to a lot of different churches and we're very very 302 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,359 Speaker 1: active in them, like full of really good things, but 303 00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:59,240 Speaker 1: we desperately wanted to hear the voice of God for 304 00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 1: our lives, like we I'm forgetting who said it. There's 305 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 1: a famous saying that's like I'm I'm just a coin 306 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:11,359 Speaker 1: in the pocket of God, like spend spend me, spend 307 00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:14,240 Speaker 1: my life however you wish. And that was our heart. 308 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: It was like, you can do whatever you want with 309 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: our lives. You can whatever you want. What do you want? 310 00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:22,440 Speaker 1: And so we just spent that year we just kind 311 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 1: of committed to like not making friends, not being on 312 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 1: the internet, not watching TV, just you know, not being 313 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:32,720 Speaker 1: involved in church, like just going to church, consuming and 314 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 1: then leaving, not helping and just like a year of 315 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 1: really just lisp whisp like waiting for the whisper of God. 316 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 1: We just feel like God often talks in a whisper 317 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: because he's so interested in us coming really close to 318 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 1: his heart, and and so he whispers so that we'll 319 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 1: come closer and closer. And so we just quieted everything 320 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:58,640 Speaker 1: in our lives and we said, we're just a coin 321 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: in your pocket. Spend us however you wish. And that 322 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: that led to deciding to get a PhD in housing 323 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 1: at the University of Minnesota. I know this sounds ridiculous, 324 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 1: but I didn't even know Minnesota was like a state. 325 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:24,880 Speaker 1: I'm like, where is Minnesota. 326 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:27,440 Speaker 2: It's up north, it's real near Canada. 327 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean maybe I knew it was a state, 328 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:34,840 Speaker 1: but like, I wasn't interested in visiting, let alone living there, 329 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,719 Speaker 1: and this is where we were going to move. It 330 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 1: was it was one of the only housing PhD programs 331 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:42,840 Speaker 1: in housing in the nation. 332 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 2: A PhD in housing, Yeah, just briefly, Okay, what is that? 333 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,000 Speaker 1: Well, it's not, it's no longer a thing. I was 334 00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: the last student that they accepted into their program and 335 00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:59,399 Speaker 1: the last student that that went through it. So I 336 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:05,159 Speaker 1: suppose as a society, the academic institute has decided that 337 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 1: we don't need to study housing. We figured it out. 338 00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:12,120 Speaker 1: But housing affects every single human being on the planet, 339 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 1: and it seems important to give some time and attention to. 340 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 2: So it was just getting an enormous amount of information 341 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:29,160 Speaker 2: and right dissertations on like US housing data and who 342 00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:33,120 Speaker 2: has housing and the cost of how it just all things. 343 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,560 Speaker 1: Have all things housing. It was called housing studies, And 344 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:36,120 Speaker 1: now I. 345 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:39,399 Speaker 2: Would think that that would be really interesting to people 346 00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 2: in New York. 347 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:41,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. 348 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 2: The reason is I'm in the lumber business, right and 349 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 2: when I read that, this is one of the reasons 350 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:53,360 Speaker 2: I was so interested is lumber is a really huge 351 00:21:53,520 --> 00:22:00,400 Speaker 2: predeterminer of future economic activity. The reason is you don't 352 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:05,399 Speaker 2: just go if you're going to build something, my lumber, hardwood, lumber, 353 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 2: softwood's build a house, hardwoods, furnish it. My lumber goes 354 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 2: to cabinets and flooring and millwork and doors. Well, you 355 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 2: can go. You can go to any building materials out 356 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:18,840 Speaker 2: and pretty much get a housing package in a week 357 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:21,480 Speaker 2: because they are two by fours four by six four rays. 358 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 2: But you have to order cabinets six months in advance. 359 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 2: You have to order doors four or five months in advance. 360 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 2: You have to order flooring months in advance, especially if 361 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:34,719 Speaker 2: it's custom to your application. So when our orders are robust, 362 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,800 Speaker 2: you can guarantee in six months the economy is going 363 00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 2: to be pretty good, because that's a real indicator that 364 00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 2: housing's happening, because people are pre ordering. When my business 365 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 2: and I'm the lumber so it takes me three months 366 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 2: to get lumber to a cabinet guy, it takes them 367 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:53,679 Speaker 2: five months to cabinet, so we're like eight months in 368 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 2: front of the bell curve pretty much all the time. 369 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:01,160 Speaker 2: If my orders stink, there aren't being cabinets and doors 370 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,200 Speaker 2: and flooring and millwork being ordered, which means the housing 371 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:07,159 Speaker 2: market in six, seven, eight months is probably going to 372 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,199 Speaker 2: be really really soft, which is going to have a 373 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 2: drag on the economy because housing is such a big 374 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:12,880 Speaker 2: thing in our economy. 375 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:14,120 Speaker 1: How are we doing right now? 376 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 2: Terrible? Shoot, I know, But the point is, I would 377 00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:28,400 Speaker 2: think that people in the world of stocks, bonds, economics, 378 00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:32,720 Speaker 2: to all these tea leave reader, people would love a 379 00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 2: person with a background and understanding housing like you would 380 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,560 Speaker 2: and looking at those indicators, and so I get your 381 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:45,080 Speaker 2: world was housing from more of a more practical sense 382 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 2: for those who need housing. But I'm just curious. Was 383 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 2: there any conversation about that and the PhD program and 384 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:52,200 Speaker 2: all that? 385 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah, I mean it was phenomenal. It was a 386 00:23:54,359 --> 00:24:00,640 Speaker 1: really phenomenal degree. And it's you know, everything from the 387 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 1: sociology of it, to the economics of it, to the 388 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: to the policies. I mean it was it was cool, 389 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: all right, So now I was not. They really shouldn't 390 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 1: have said yes to me. Okay, I don't know why 391 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:14,960 Speaker 1: I was accepted to the program. I have a bachelor's 392 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 1: and masters in architecture. 393 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 2: Well housing. 394 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,440 Speaker 1: The housing program really had nothing to do with design, 395 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: it was it was a social science. I'm a designer. 396 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,880 Speaker 1: And so we you know, we spent this year meditating, 397 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 1: listening to God's voice, what do you want with our lives? Right? 398 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,639 Speaker 1: And so then he moves us to the Midwest to 399 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: a PhD in housing and we get there and I 400 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: learned really quickly that like, I have no business being 401 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:49,560 Speaker 1: in this degree. I don't have the background for this degree. 402 00:24:51,920 --> 00:25:07,439 Speaker 2: We will be right back. What's your husband's name. 403 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:09,240 Speaker 1: My husband's name is John David. 404 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 2: John David. Does he go by John David John David. 405 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,320 Speaker 2: He should have come grown up in the South. We 406 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 2: do two first names. Oh that's Mary John David John 407 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 2: Paul Great, yeah, Mary Grace. I mean we're full of 408 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,080 Speaker 2: two name people. What's he do for a living? 409 00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 1: Stay at home papa. 410 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:28,880 Speaker 2: Stay at home papa? Even then? 411 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, really, So when we moved to Minnesota, you know, 412 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: I was I was going I was going to school 413 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 1: research and and you know, working twelve hours a day, 414 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:45,720 Speaker 1: and so you really can't get like a nighttime architecture job. 415 00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:50,679 Speaker 1: He's also an architecture So we just really sensed like 416 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:52,399 Speaker 1: we didn't want to be put our We had our 417 00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: first child, we didn't want to put her in daycare. 418 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,199 Speaker 1: We're just like, you know, anyone's gonna be with her 419 00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: for eight hours a day. We want to be it. 420 00:25:58,800 --> 00:25:59,920 Speaker 2: So how old are you at this time? 421 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:05,520 Speaker 1: Ish twenty eight? 422 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:09,919 Speaker 2: Okay, twenty eight MoMA one getting a PhD doing an 423 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 2: architecture John Davidson. I'm taking care of the kid because 424 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:14,679 Speaker 2: you don't want to send him wish. I love that 425 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:21,200 Speaker 2: to whatever. And you've got all this back experience. You're 426 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:27,359 Speaker 2: obviously really bright, and you're going through life. I'm just curious. 427 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:32,160 Speaker 2: I'm a planner. What are you thinking about what's next 428 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:36,159 Speaker 2: at this point? Seriously? I mean, okay, you're coin and 429 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:39,880 Speaker 2: I get it, but there's a human reality to all 430 00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:41,480 Speaker 2: of it. Is you got to pay your bills, You 431 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:42,639 Speaker 2: got to think about what's next. 432 00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, here's the craziest part. My first date with 433 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,959 Speaker 1: my husband. On our very first date, he tells me 434 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: that he has one hundred and fifty thousand dollars in 435 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: student loans. 436 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:59,439 Speaker 2: Yikes. On the second date, what was he studying architecture 437 00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 2: where she was? 438 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,679 Speaker 1: We went to a private architecture school. 439 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:06,200 Speaker 2: He must be really really good looking. 440 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah he is, he is, he really is. My goodness, 441 00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 1: he's the best human I know. 442 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: That's pretty cool. 443 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 1: So I was twenty two and one hundred and fifty 444 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,480 Speaker 1: thousand dollars, didn't I didn't really know what that meant, 445 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,879 Speaker 1: and like a lot I was like, well, I mean, 446 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:25,200 Speaker 1: you're gonna be a famous architect. It's gonna be fine. 447 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 2: Oh good, great, John David Lloyd Wright exactly, Yeah, no problem. 448 00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:34,919 Speaker 1: No problem, this is going to be great. Yeah, you 449 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: will fund my humanitarian architecture. You'll be a famous architect. 450 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 1: The loans won't be a big deal. Turns out one 451 00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:43,960 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty thousand dollars a. 452 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 2: Lot, and you all go to Minnesota to get your doctorate. Okay, 453 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:52,320 Speaker 2: So anyway, so. 454 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,760 Speaker 1: We go, we moved to Minnesota. We put a fleece 455 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 1: out there. Are you familiar with the concept of a fleece. No, 456 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:02,879 Speaker 1: it's sort of like, hey, God, if this is you, you'll 457 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,959 Speaker 1: will you answer it in these ways? So we say, hey, God, oh, 458 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:05,880 Speaker 1: I thought maybe. 459 00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 2: It was you're fleecing your personal finances. Go ahead, No, there. 460 00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:15,240 Speaker 1: Were no personal finances to fleece, okay, And so hey, 461 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 1: if you really want us to do this, uh, you know, 462 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,199 Speaker 1: I'll get into I only applied to one program, just 463 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 1: the one at the University of Minnesota. If you want 464 00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 1: us to do this, I'll get into this program. I'll 465 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,719 Speaker 1: get this advisor, and they will not only pay for 466 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:32,359 Speaker 1: my schooling, but they'll pay me to go to school. 467 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: And so turns out they did all those things. So 468 00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: move to Minnesota, get in the degree, get the advisor. 469 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,480 Speaker 1: They pay me to do the work, but our pay 470 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,920 Speaker 1: was only enough to just cover our rent, nothing more 471 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: than that, and not enough to cover that student loan. 472 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: And then we also feel like John David's called to 473 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 1: just stay at home, be at home, stay at home 474 00:28:55,960 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: Papa for our first one, and it looked it looked bleak. 475 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:03,640 Speaker 2: I was about to say, dire. 476 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 1: I will say that we definitely had some family and 477 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 1: friends that were like, what are you doing with your life? 478 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 1: But if you've spent a year meditating in the presence 479 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 1: of God and just saying what do you want with 480 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,960 Speaker 1: our lives? It makes it really easy to, uh, to 481 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 1: take leaps of faith. And you know, and I feel 482 00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,480 Speaker 1: like so many times He's brought us to the edge 483 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: of the cliff and said, okay, jump and we looked 484 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,000 Speaker 1: down and you can't see the bottom and there's no net, 485 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 1: and uh, you know, several times in our lives we've 486 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,520 Speaker 1: just grabbed hands and we've jumped. And every time God 487 00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 1: has been faithful. Every time He's brought us to greater 488 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: heights and more favor and more calling and more joy. 489 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:52,600 Speaker 1: So I would never you know, I now welcome the 490 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: scary jumps, the scary leaps. But so we're living there. 491 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 1: We're two months into living in UH in Minnesota. We 492 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: live in the very cool artists Loft and you know, 493 00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 1: just barely making it. We get a call from a 494 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:15,880 Speaker 1: person that we're barely connected with, and they call and say, hey, 495 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:17,800 Speaker 1: how are you doing on those student loans. We had 496 00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 1: no idea that they even knew about the student loans. 497 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,200 Speaker 1: My husband says, hey, it's kind of like a David 498 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,160 Speaker 1: and Goliath story. Every month, like we're just like waiting 499 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:30,880 Speaker 1: on God to like pay our bills. And they say, well, okay, 500 00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:35,280 Speaker 1: like how much are they? I'm in a backtrack about 501 00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,600 Speaker 1: one month earlier than that, We're standing in our bedroom 502 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 1: in our new apartment and I say, hey, John, David, 503 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:42,560 Speaker 1: We've got forty six thousand dollars coming to us. He's like, 504 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,480 Speaker 1: what what do you know that? I don't know. I'm like, 505 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,200 Speaker 1: I have no idea. I don't even know why I'm 506 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:49,080 Speaker 1: saying this, but I just feel like God's saying that 507 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 1: we've got forty six thousand dollars coming to us. Okay, 508 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,479 Speaker 1: that's great. So fast forward a month, we get this 509 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:58,720 Speaker 1: phone call from this distant person. They ask how much 510 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 1: are your student loans? And I tell them, you know, 511 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:05,400 Speaker 1: there's there's five student loans. Two of them have ten 512 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 1: percent interest, which is can we just say like totally 513 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:12,440 Speaker 1: criminal that student loans can have that kind of interest, 514 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:16,840 Speaker 1: and so they were like, Okay, send me the information 515 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:18,600 Speaker 1: for those two loans. I'd like to pay those off 516 00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: for you. We're just like overjoyed. Get off the phone. 517 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: We're so excited. I don't know, I don't know why. 518 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:27,960 Speaker 1: We go look up those loans. I add up those 519 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 1: two loans. You'd think that I'd be able to add 520 00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: two simple numbers very easily in my own brain, but 521 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: I couldn't, and I was using my phone add it up. 522 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: I'm standing in the exact spot that a month earlier 523 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: I had been standing in and told John David and 524 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 1: the number on my phone is forty six thousand dollars. 525 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 1: So we fall to the floor. We're we're crying, we're 526 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 1: praising God. And by the time we pull ourselves off 527 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:55,960 Speaker 1: the floor, go to our computer to email them the 528 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 1: information for those two loans. We have an email back 529 00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 1: from them, and they said, I look through all my 530 00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 1: finances and it looks like I can pay off all 531 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:05,680 Speaker 1: five loans. Send me the information for all five of them, 532 00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 1: and I will pay them off tomorrow. 533 00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:09,080 Speaker 2: Why did this person do this? 534 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,640 Speaker 3: Because they love you so much and they're so impressed 535 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 3: by you. 536 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 1: They barely knew us. They said that the Lord told 537 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: them to pay it off. They asked that we never 538 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 1: share their name, and asked never to be repaid, but 539 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 1: that we would just we would just do the will 540 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: of God with our lives. 541 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 2: So can you tell us their name? I'd like to 542 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:41,920 Speaker 2: give them a shout out? Okay, so not as bleak, 543 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:43,080 Speaker 2: not as bleak. 544 00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, So when you experienced, send them. 545 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,800 Speaker 3: This podcast episode. I don't know if you want me 546 00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:50,600 Speaker 3: saying this out lot or not. Maybe we should send 547 00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:52,440 Speaker 3: them this podcast episode and you can talk to them 548 00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 3: about classics business loans. 549 00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:58,040 Speaker 2: Keep going, all right? 550 00:32:58,080 --> 00:32:59,240 Speaker 3: Are going to delete that out of there? 551 00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:01,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, well you could. You don't have to delete it, 552 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 2: but just let's just say I need a benefactor worth 553 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:05,360 Speaker 2: more than forty six thousand dollars. 554 00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 1: Go ahead, What is that you need a miracle? 555 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:10,360 Speaker 2: What's that you need a miracle? No? I got a 556 00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:12,840 Speaker 2: miracle about fifteen years ago. 557 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 1: You did? 558 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, different way, but yeah, yeah. I started my business 559 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 2: in two thousand and one, was seventeen thousand dollars on 560 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:27,640 Speaker 2: a wing and a prayer. And that was September first. 561 00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 2: Eleven days later our world fell apart, right not to eleven, 562 00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 2: and I'd spent every time I had, and somehow we 563 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 2: got over that. And then my first CFO at embezzled 564 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:48,600 Speaker 2: four hundred thousand dollars from us, which is all the 565 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 2: money we had, and I went back to zero, and 566 00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 2: I thought it was going broke, built up, and then 567 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:56,080 Speaker 2: the housing crisis of two thousand and seven happened, and 568 00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 2: it was then that I genuinely thought we were going 569 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:05,440 Speaker 2: to lose everything, and Mini did in my industry, and 570 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 2: Second Third and Fortune Rational companies did. And I was 571 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,560 Speaker 2: a guy who started five years earlier with no family money, 572 00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:17,279 Speaker 2: no backup, no dad, my parents. My mom was married 573 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:19,640 Speaker 2: divorced five times, so you went through it once. I 574 00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:23,640 Speaker 2: went through five times, so dad was not involved nothing. 575 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:34,279 Speaker 2: I had no backboard whatsoever. And we just, out of 576 00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,920 Speaker 2: the blue, two big customers that we've been calling on 577 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 2: for five years who didn't want to do any business 578 00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:43,160 Speaker 2: the Legend company both showed up in one month and 579 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,040 Speaker 2: gave us fistfuls of orders, and it got us over 580 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:48,719 Speaker 2: the hump. And we now have one hundred and forty 581 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,920 Speaker 2: employees and we'll do almost steady mean and sales this 582 00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 2: year only fifteen years later. So yeah, no, I know 583 00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 2: what it is to be looking into the abyss things 584 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 2: to be dire and wonder how you're going to feature 585 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 2: kid when the gig is finally up. And I also 586 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 2: understand falling to your knees in the elation of andy 587 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:17,319 Speaker 2: weight being lifted off your shoulders of we may make it. 588 00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:18,400 Speaker 1: What do you attribute it to? 589 00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 2: We certainly have always been faithful insteadfaster our faith. You 590 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:36,720 Speaker 2: know a lot of people have different experiences with regard 591 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:44,360 Speaker 2: to look I don't ever feel like God has literally 592 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:50,759 Speaker 2: spoken to me. I, as a Christian obviously read the 593 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,040 Speaker 2: Bible and know there's miracles, and if miracles could happen 594 00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 2: a thousand years ago or two thousand years ago, why 595 00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:00,200 Speaker 2: can't they happen today? I get it all I do. 596 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:03,719 Speaker 2: I guess I'm a doubting Thomas ish I do have. 597 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:15,040 Speaker 2: I have personally a difficult time understanding that someone actually 598 00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 2: hears the word of God. I personally feel like, if 599 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,719 Speaker 2: you're quiet and you're still, and you're prayerful and you're faithful, 600 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 2: that the answers that come to you when you're in 601 00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:35,520 Speaker 2: a decision making mode or a crisis mode, but those 602 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,080 Speaker 2: are the words of God, the answers that you arrive 603 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:42,839 Speaker 2: at that's God leading you if you just put your 604 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 2: ego aside and have sense enough to listen to what 605 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,080 Speaker 2: your brain's trying to give you. The answer to that 606 00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 2: is to me, So what do I attribute it to? 607 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 2: Staying completely committed to the process of working hard, doing 608 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,920 Speaker 2: things honestly the right way, and being still long enough 609 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 2: to hear the answers when they're given to you. And 610 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,520 Speaker 2: yeah's I guess what I attributed to you? And the 611 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:18,520 Speaker 2: hard work of a whole bunch of really dedicated people 612 00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 2: who believed in my vision and believed in me enough 613 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:28,840 Speaker 2: to stick with it. When in two thousand and seven 614 00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:33,799 Speaker 2: I had sixty I'd laid I had, I had one 615 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:37,240 Speaker 2: hundred and ten employees, I had to lay off fifty 616 00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 2: and the rest of them all took a twenty five 617 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 2: percent back cup Wow, and nobody quit me. They took 618 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 2: the twenty five percent bay cut and stayed. So it 619 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,279 Speaker 2: doesn't also come with selflessness and dedication and commitment on 620 00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 2: a whole group of people who are buying into your 621 00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:59,120 Speaker 2: vision of what you can build. So in that too, Yeah, 622 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:01,080 Speaker 2: but I'm interviewed in you, I don't know why you're 623 00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:03,400 Speaker 2: asking the questions. So here we go. The only thing 624 00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:04,200 Speaker 2: ILL add is a right. 625 00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,200 Speaker 3: We have had several guests say they've heard the voice 626 00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 3: of God, and I also believe them. 627 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,279 Speaker 2: And but anyway, you keep going with your story. It's 628 00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 2: not that I don't believe them. You're not calling anybody 629 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:19,960 Speaker 2: who's ever said that dishonest. I am saying a hard 630 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:26,640 Speaker 2: time and that kind of physical revelation understanding that, And I. 631 00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:28,799 Speaker 3: Think it's an interesting conversation, that's all I'm saying. We've 632 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:30,640 Speaker 3: had a variety of perspectives on the show. 633 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,040 Speaker 2: It's a very interesting conversation. But I'm not saying I 634 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:35,400 Speaker 2: don't believe it. I'm just saying it hasn't. 635 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,239 Speaker 1: Happened to you, and you wanted to what do you 636 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 1: want it to? Nope, Okay, might be it hasn't happened. 637 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:46,560 Speaker 2: Sure don't. I don't want to because I don't want 638 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:50,120 Speaker 2: to have to explain it to anybody. So anyway, let's 639 00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 2: keep progressing with your story. I'm not sure that we're 640 00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:56,440 Speaker 2: not saying the same thing re built to us in 641 00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:03,359 Speaker 2: different ways. Yeah, and that concludes part one of our 642 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:07,400 Speaker 2: conversation with doctor Gabriel Claudis, and you want want to 643 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:11,400 Speaker 2: miss part two. It's now available to listen to. Together, guys, 644 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:15,400 Speaker 2: we can change this country, but it starts with you. 645 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:17,160 Speaker 2: I'll see in Part two.