WEBVTT - #378 Wrongful Conviction: False Confessions - Hamid Hayat 0:00:04.720 --> 0:00:07.480 Hey guys, it's Laura and I writer. This week, it's 0:00:07.520 --> 0:00:10.680 the story of Hamed Hyatt, a US citizen who was 0:00:10.800 --> 0:00:13.880 charged with terrorism in the frenzied time after the nine 0:00:13.920 --> 0:00:16.840 to eleven attacks. Hamed was one of the Muslim Men 0:00:16.880 --> 0:00:20.400 that were targeted by the FBI during its frantic search 0:00:20.480 --> 0:00:24.200 for terrorists still at large. But the story the FBI 0:00:24.280 --> 0:00:28.600 concocted about Hamed was full of crazy imagery and drama, 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:31.880 almost like a movie or a comic strip. And that's 0:00:31.920 --> 0:00:35.760 because it wasn't true. Hamed Hyatt was innocent, but he 0:00:35.840 --> 0:00:39.800 served years behind bars before being exonerated. Now since we 0:00:39.840 --> 0:00:42.760 aired this episode, Hamed has gotten a new job with 0:00:42.880 --> 0:00:46.440 Amazon and he's working to rebuild his life. His new 0:00:46.479 --> 0:00:49.400 coworkers are often surprised to learn that he's been through 0:00:49.440 --> 0:00:52.200 the worst of the wrongful conviction stories and how well 0:00:52.240 --> 0:00:56.200 known his story is online. In fact, Hamed's story was 0:00:56.240 --> 0:01:01.160 featured prominently on comedian Hassan Minaja's Netflix special Patriot Act. 0:01:01.480 --> 0:01:04.640 Hasan Manaj even cited Hamed's story as the inspiration for 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:07.360 the title of the show. While we wish that none 0:01:07.360 --> 0:01:09.760 of us had ever happened to Hamid, we're so glad 0:01:09.800 --> 0:01:12.560 his message is reaching a larger audience, and we wish 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:22.559 him all the best. Welcome to Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:23.520 I'm Laura and I. 0:01:23.480 --> 0:01:25.080 Writer and I'm Steve Drisin. 0:01:26.000 --> 0:01:28.479 In the wake of nine to eleven, keeping America safe 0:01:28.640 --> 0:01:32.600 was everyone's priority. But what happens when an innocent man 0:01:32.680 --> 0:01:36.880 gets accused of terrorism based on a false confession. Today's 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:40.679 case includes one of the most outlandish confessions I've ever heard. 0:01:41.280 --> 0:01:46.320 A thousand pole vaulting terrorists, all dressed up like Ninja turtles. 0:01:46.800 --> 0:01:48.760 It's a story that sounds like the punchline of a 0:01:48.840 --> 0:01:51.880 joke instead of the path to a conviction. But for 0:01:52.120 --> 0:02:05.720 US citizen Hamid Hyatt, the verdict was no joke at all. 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:08.680 Usually we start each episode by telling you about a crime, 0:02:09.440 --> 0:02:11.800 but in today's story, there was both a crime on 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:15.440 a scale we'd never seen before and no crime at all. 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.720 You see, this case took place right after the horrific 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:23.320 nine to eleven attacks. Thousands of Americans had died, and 0:02:23.400 --> 0:02:26.600 pressure was building on our government to prevent more attacks. 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:29.800 Make no mistake, there was a lot of good police 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:33.600 work done to keep us all safe, but sometimes fear 0:02:33.840 --> 0:02:38.480 started to override good decision making. Some law enforcement efforts 0:02:38.520 --> 0:02:44.240 became driven by panic and even prejudice, not proof. This 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:46.400 story is one of the times we got it wrong. 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:50.560 In two thousand and five, California native and US citizen 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:54.680 Hamid Hyatt was accused of being part of a homegrown 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:59.560 terrorist sleeper cell. Years later, the government admitted that no 0:02:59.639 --> 0:03:04.400 such sleeper cell ever existed, but Hamid had falsely confessed. 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:08.520 He spent more than a decade in prison before being cleared. 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:12.840 As prosecutors prepare for trial, they review the evidence that 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:17.560 the FBI agents obtain in the case, and they look 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:22.360 at the interrogation tapes, and you have to wonder what 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:25.720 the prosecutors in this case were thinking when they saw 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:30.480 these tapes. What were they thinking when the corroboration of 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:32.000 this case was so thin. 0:03:32.480 --> 0:03:34.920 Hammed is one of the first post nine to eleven 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:38.600 terrorism defendants to be exonerated, and he probably won't be 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:42.160 the last. His story is a caution to us all 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:46.560 when we're talking about our national security, there's nothing more 0:03:46.600 --> 0:03:55.000 important than getting it right. Hamid's story takes place in Lodi, California, 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:59.000 a medium sized town halfway between San Francisco and Sacramento. 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.640 Lodi's downtown looks like the set of an old Western, 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:06.280 complete with a train depot from gold rush days. But 0:04:06.320 --> 0:04:09.240 if you go south a mile, you'll find a large 0:04:09.280 --> 0:04:14.200 Pakistani American community where families wear traditional clothing and center 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:18.279 their lives around the local mosque. We'll get to Lodi 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:22.120 in a minute, but our story starts in Oregon. That's 0:04:22.160 --> 0:04:26.360 where FBI agents traveled in October two thousand and one 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:31.560 looking for a suspected terrorist named Nasim Khan. The Nasim 0:04:31.640 --> 0:04:34.799 Khan they've found was a twenty eight year old convenience 0:04:34.839 --> 0:04:39.119 store employee. The FBI quickly realized this guy had nothing 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.960 to do with terrorism. He simply had the same name 0:04:42.000 --> 0:04:45.279 as their suspect. But with the FBI at his door, 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:50.360 Nasim smelled an opportunity. He gave the agents the biggest 0:04:50.360 --> 0:04:53.240 tip he could conjure up. He claimed to have seen 0:04:53.360 --> 0:04:56.760 i'm In al Zawahiri, one of the most wanted terrorists 0:04:56.800 --> 0:05:00.400 in the world, at a mosque in Lodai, Colorlifornia. 0:05:00.720 --> 0:05:05.039 It's ludicrous, absolutely ludicrous that Osama bin Lan's number two 0:05:05.080 --> 0:05:08.839 person would make it into the United States without detection, 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:13.040 and of all places, settle in Lodie, California. 0:05:13.400 --> 0:05:17.080 The FBI, to its credit, didn't believe Nasim. They figured 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:19.920 out soon enough that he had a reputation for lying. 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:24.080 Even his own mother later called Nasim a bag full 0:05:24.160 --> 0:05:28.200 of lies, air and deceit. But this was a month 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:31.200 after nine to eleven, and the government was desperate to 0:05:31.240 --> 0:05:35.600 recruit informants who could infiltrate Muslim American communities and expose 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:40.280 any sleeper cells. Somehow, they decided Nasim was their guy. 0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:44.240 Being hired as an informant was a pretty big deal 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:47.719 for Nasem. He went from working in a convenience store 0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:52.640 to getting a cool FBI nickname Wildcat. He earned hundreds 0:05:52.680 --> 0:05:55.920 of thousands of dollars on the US government payroll. The 0:05:55.960 --> 0:05:59.760 FEDS even paid for his car washes in exchange. They 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:04.640 asked him to target the Lodi, California community. By early 0:06:04.640 --> 0:06:07.680 two thousand and two, Nassim wormed his way into Lodei's 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:12.520 Pakistani neighborhoods. He started befriending people looking for any information 0:06:12.600 --> 0:06:16.520 the FBI might consider useful, and pretty soon Nissin began 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:21.200 focusing on the Hyatt family, especially nineteen year old Hamid. 0:06:22.240 --> 0:06:25.080 Now the Hyatt family was well known in Lodi. They 0:06:25.120 --> 0:06:31.159 had no history of political involvement or extremism whatsoever. Hahmad's dad, Umer, 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:33.440 was the local ice cream truck driver. 0:06:34.040 --> 0:06:37.480 The pairing of Nassim and Hahmed was a strange pairing 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:42.000 from the get go. Nassin was ten years older than Hamid, 0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:46.720 and Hamid nineteen or so at the time, acted much 0:06:46.800 --> 0:06:50.760 more immaturely than his age. He had suffered a terrible 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:55.120 batt of meningitis years earlier, which left him cognitively and 0:06:55.200 --> 0:06:56.360 physically slower. 0:06:56.839 --> 0:06:59.479 As a child, Hamed had split his time between his 0:06:59.600 --> 0:07:02.520 home and the US and his relative's home in Pakistan. 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:06.159 Because of all the travel, he'd only finished elementary school, 0:07:06.520 --> 0:07:09.280 and he didn't have many friends in the States. So 0:07:09.360 --> 0:07:13.800 when Nassim, the informant, befriended him, Hamed couldn't believe his luck. 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:18.560 Nassim was paying attention to Hamid, and very few people 0:07:18.680 --> 0:07:22.239 in the community in lord I paid much attention to Hamid. 0:07:22.880 --> 0:07:26.120 Nasim was older, he had a fancy car, and apparently 0:07:26.280 --> 0:07:29.120 endless money. This is the guy who wanted to chat 0:07:29.200 --> 0:07:34.360 up Hamed. Hamed was in Nasim Andhmmed became friends, or 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:37.760 at least so Hamid thought. Over the next year or two, 0:07:38.040 --> 0:07:41.920 Nasim and Hahmed started having hours of phone conversations that 0:07:42.040 --> 0:07:46.920 Nassim was secretly recording. On those calls, Nasim portrayed himself 0:07:47.000 --> 0:07:50.160 as an extremist and told Hamed he'd been involved in 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:55.440 jihadi activities for years. Pretty Soon, hapless Hamed started trying 0:07:55.440 --> 0:07:58.840 to impress Nasim by making up fake stories about his 0:07:58.880 --> 0:08:03.400 own exploits. Once, Hamed said he participated in a Taliban attack, 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:07.000 another time he claimed he'd been held in a Pakistani jail. 0:08:07.960 --> 0:08:09.960 And when Nasim said that he wanted to go to 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:15.600 a terrorist training camp, Hamad said that sounded cool. Fast 0:08:15.600 --> 0:08:19.200 forward a year to two thousand and three, Hamid's twenty 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:22.120 one and his parents take him to Pakistan to find 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:25.960 a bride for Nasim. This trip was a chance to 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:29.720 up the ante to bully Hamed into actually going to 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:33.280 a terrorist training camp. He starts telling Hamed that he's 0:08:33.320 --> 0:08:36.640 going to come to Pakistan himself and force Hamed into 0:08:36.720 --> 0:08:42.160 Jihati training, but Hamid refuses. He fends Nasim off with 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:45.240 one excuse after another. It's too hot to go to 0:08:45.280 --> 0:08:48.160 a training camp, it's too difficult, I need to stay 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:51.840 with my sick mother. It's pretty obvious Hammad has zero 0:08:51.920 --> 0:08:55.840 interest in becoming a terrorist. Finally, he straight out tells 0:08:55.920 --> 0:08:59.160 Nasim he's never going to a camp. It was their 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:03.040 last phone call. Hamed gets married in Pakistan and ends 0:09:03.120 --> 0:09:05.720 up staying there for two years until June two thousand 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:08.320 and five, when he decides to go back to the 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:11.800 United States. He boards a plane in Pakistan. 0:09:11.400 --> 0:09:12.559 With his whole family, but the. 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:16.080 Plane gets diverted to Tokyo because it turns out Hamit 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.760 is on the no fly list. The whole Hyatt family 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:22.800 is ushered off the plane and the FBI questions them 0:09:22.840 --> 0:09:25.360 about why they were overseas and who they were with. 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:28.320 They even ask if the men Hamid was hanging out 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:32.079 with had facial hair. Eventually, the family is allowed to 0:09:32.080 --> 0:09:35.320 get back on the plane and fly to California, but 0:09:35.400 --> 0:09:38.040 a day or two later, the FBI shows up again 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:41.280 at the Hyatt family home and brings Hamed in to 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:47.080 the Sacramento office for more questioning. Now let's step back. 0:09:46.920 --> 0:09:47.520 For a minute. 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:50.160 By June two thousand and five, there'd been a three 0:09:50.280 --> 0:09:56.440 year multi agency Federal Terrorism Task Force investigation that revolved 0:09:56.480 --> 0:10:00.720 around Nasim Khan and his stories. None of seems claims 0:10:00.760 --> 0:10:04.600 yielded any real information about terrorism despite all the money 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:07.520 he'd been paid, So by mid two thousand and five, 0:10:07.920 --> 0:10:11.440 the FBI was feeling pressure to show results in the 0:10:11.480 --> 0:10:14.880 worst way, and they got results from the Hyatt family 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:19.839 in the worst way. 0:10:26.480 --> 0:10:30.439 Hamud's interrogation begins on June third, two thousand and five, 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:34.160 at about eleven thirty in the morning, and it would 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:38.520 go on for hours and hours before the agents turned 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:40.000 on the video cameras. 0:10:40.600 --> 0:10:43.720 They start taping at five o'clock in the afternoon. You 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:47.800 can see skinny little Hamed, very nervous, sitting in a 0:10:47.920 --> 0:10:52.200 chair that's pushed against the wall of a small windowless room. 0:10:52.840 --> 0:10:55.800 He's facing two FBI agents who are staring him down. 0:10:56.480 --> 0:11:00.160 The policy of the FBI at this time was that 0:11:00.280 --> 0:11:04.239 the decision to record interrogations was left in the discretion 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:08.800 of agents, so it was unusual that they would record 0:11:08.920 --> 0:11:14.160 these interrogations. But thank god they did, because otherwise we 0:11:14.200 --> 0:11:17.720 wouldn't have the record that we do have about how 0:11:17.800 --> 0:11:22.400 at least some of Hamid's interrogation went down as. 0:11:22.240 --> 0:11:25.640 Soon as the tapes rolling. The agents accuse Hamid of 0:11:25.720 --> 0:11:29.640 spending between three and six months at a terrorist training 0:11:29.679 --> 0:11:34.920 camp in Pakistan and then come to lies. First they 0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:38.040 say he failed a polygraph that he apparently took earlier 0:11:38.080 --> 0:11:42.680 that day. Second, they claimed to have satellite photographs of 0:11:42.720 --> 0:11:47.240 a camp, implying Hamid's in those photos. Neither was true. 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.520 And then the agents offer him help. As long as 0:11:51.520 --> 0:11:56.200 he talks over and over and over, they promise that 0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:59.520 they're there to help him. Hamid looks desperate to please 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:03.600 these guys. He says he wants to cooperate for my country. 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:06.360 From my country, I do anything, you know, because you know, 0:12:06.480 --> 0:12:09.400 these guys are hurting our country about well. 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:10.120 I appreciate that. 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:13.280 I mean it's important because you know, every day in 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:15.400 and as we see her, you know, our troops Arooko, 0:12:15.440 --> 0:12:17.680 they're very hard for you know, making peace in the 0:12:17.679 --> 0:12:18.640 whole world front. 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:21.000 Why they're making peace, they're making peace. 0:12:20.760 --> 0:12:22.439 For us so we can live together, all of us. 0:12:22.559 --> 0:12:24.280 Yeah. And what do they do with these camps. 0:12:24.800 --> 0:12:26.560 What they're doing is to teaching people out to how 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:28.800 to kill American truth of course, right, that's what the. 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:29.520 Camps are all about. 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:33.439 The interrogation goes on for hours into the night, until 0:12:33.520 --> 0:12:37.560 Hamid starts breaking. He tells the agents he did go 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:40.640 to a camp in Pakistan for several months. But his 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:42.480 story makes no sense. 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:43.440 It's laughable. 0:12:43.559 --> 0:12:46.079 They ask him when he'd gone to the camp. At 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:48.840 first Hamad said it was during the hot season, but 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:51.640 then he says it was during the cold season. When 0:12:51.640 --> 0:12:54.440 they ask him to describe the camp, Hammud's answer is 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:58.000 just pathetic. He says the whole place had only four 0:12:58.040 --> 0:13:01.920 weapons in it, a shotgun, two pistols, and a machine gun. 0:13:02.120 --> 0:13:04.280 He said the only weapon that he had handled was 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:07.520 actually a pistol, and he'd only shot it three or 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:10.080 four times. What kind of training is that? 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:13.040 The agents ask comed where the camp was and he 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:16.160 keeps switching his story there too. First it was in 0:13:16.200 --> 0:13:19.280 rural Afghanistan, then it was in rural Pakistan. 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:21.760 You're all over the map here, oh yeah, and yeah, 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:24.439 helping yourself out it by doing that, you know, Okay, 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:26.840 when one minute you're saying Northwest Frontier, next minue you're 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:29.240 saying cash from you, you're saying where this building was? 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:30.320 Which city was it? 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:32.520 Yes, yeah, I'll say about court. 0:13:33.040 --> 0:13:35.400 It's not that you will say you know where it is, 0:13:35.720 --> 0:13:38.480 you know where the building is, Tell me where was it? 0:13:38.880 --> 0:13:42.080 Gon A Gourd and the BFP in NWFP. 0:13:41.679 --> 0:13:45.440 Calling for and of course, remember Hamad had said none 0:13:45.480 --> 0:13:50.560 of this to Nassm Khan, despite years of recorded phone calls. Instead, 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:53.760 he told Nasim he'd never go to a training camp. 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:58.559 It's only after this interrogation that Hamad starts saying whatever 0:13:58.640 --> 0:14:01.880 he thinks the agents want to hear, and piece by piece, 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:06.120 the agents feed him nearly all the information in his confession, 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:09.160 down to the types of buildings he was supposedly going 0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:10.720 to attack in the United States. 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:13.000 There are certain kinds of targets that you know, are 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:15.320 are good targets. You know, if you're gonna be worth 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.280 your salt as a geode, you to know about his targets, 0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:21.800 like buildings, And I'll say buildings. 0:14:22.600 --> 0:14:24.960 What kind of buildings you take your bags? You know? 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:30.640 Okay, financial buildings, uh are private buildings, commercial buildings, big 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:34.320 of the Unity's commercial arctics and like those kind of buildings. 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:37.200 I see, all right, you're. 0:14:36.920 --> 0:14:39.760 Not yeah, but I'm not sure about the big things. 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:41.800 You guys are talking about, the big ones that will 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:44.400 see him, you know, finance. 0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:45.880 Let's say, And what else? 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:48.160 What else did they tell you about coscuds? 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:52.200 Maybe Hammid's confession is not very believable, so the FBI 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:57.480 needs corroboration. While those agents are questioning Hamid, other agents 0:14:57.560 --> 0:15:00.800 bring in his dad, Umer, the ice cream truck driver, 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:04.920 and start questioning him too. They tell Umer that Hamid 0:15:04.960 --> 0:15:07.920 admitted going to a training camp in Pakistan, and they 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:11.920 start pressuring Umer to say he also went to visit Hamid, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:16.119 just like a parent would check out his kids college. Eventually, 0:15:16.240 --> 0:15:19.360 Umer agrees that he had gone to visit Hamid, but 0:15:19.480 --> 0:15:23.800 his story is totally wild. Hamid had described a rural 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:26.760 camp in a forested area, but Umer says the camp's 0:15:26.800 --> 0:15:32.480 in rawal Pindi, a two million persons city. And Umer's description, well, 0:15:32.680 --> 0:15:35.640 he says he saw one thousand fighters at this camp 0:15:35.920 --> 0:15:40.040 and they're all in a huge underground basement practicing pole vaulting. 0:15:40.280 --> 0:15:42.520 Do you know how high a ceiling has to be 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:43.880 in order to pole vault? 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:45.720 I'll take shit you don't do in a basement for 0:15:45.800 --> 0:15:49.520 five hundred alex. And it gets even crazier because, according 0:15:49.520 --> 0:15:53.720 to Umer, those pole vaulters are dressed up like Ninja turtles. 0:15:54.280 --> 0:15:57.160 Umer later explained that he lifted this story from the 0:15:57.200 --> 0:16:00.480 movie Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. He'd recently we've seen it 0:16:00.520 --> 0:16:07.520 on TV. All this goes on and on. Both men 0:16:07.640 --> 0:16:11.160 keep spinning stories and the agents aren't really getting anywhere. 0:16:11.720 --> 0:16:15.240 At three am, Ahmad starts complaining that his head hurts. 0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:17.920 He asks to go home and gets in sleep. 0:16:18.160 --> 0:16:20.360 You tell me, Kashmir, you tell me if Cahn stand 0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:24.280 northwest seeing playing it on whatever you want to play on. 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:26.360 But what's goind of happening? That he's ran up the 0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:30.160 rest of you? Okay, so i'd beg here to over. No, 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:32.080 you're not leaving here tonight now, No. 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.320 I mean tomorrow. I'm going to be here tonight, staying. 0:16:35.040 --> 0:16:35.880 Here in that evening. 0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:37.480 You're going to go to jail and. 0:16:37.560 --> 0:16:39.440 Jed, So I'm going to get a place. 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:40.240 To steep older like that. 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:44.280 Instead, the agents arrest him and charge him with lending 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:49.320 material support to terrorism. Suddenly, he's facing up to thirty 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:54.440 years in prison for his part. Umer's also arrested based 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:57.960 on the crazy Ninja Turtle statement. He's charged with two 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:04.159 counts of lying to federal agents. The Hyat's arrest was 0:17:04.200 --> 0:17:08.240 a huge news story. Now, some media outlets were skeptical. 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:11.520 They ran stories highlighting the pole vaulting and the Ninja 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:14.840 Turtles and the crazy mismatch between what Hamad and his 0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:18.560 dad had said. But other media bought it all hook 0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:21.720 line and sinker. They covered the story as proof that 0:17:21.800 --> 0:17:24.000 domestic sleeper cells existed. 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:27.080 You throw a word out there, you throw the word terror, 0:17:27.119 --> 0:17:29.639 you throw the word martyr, you throw the word gihad 0:17:30.119 --> 0:17:34.600 out into public space, and people will believe almost anything 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:37.480 because the fear is so great. 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:40.399 There's a federal trial to get ready for, and the 0:17:40.480 --> 0:17:44.320 Hyatt family hires lawyers. But while the lawyer that Umer 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:48.840 hires is very experienced, Hamed gets a novice. She'd never 0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:51.800 gone before a jury before. The plan was for her 0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:55.439 to imitate whatever Umer's lawyer did, but that was no 0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:59.800 plan at all. The cases were totally different, very different charges, 0:18:00.240 --> 0:18:04.520 very different confessions. Hamid needed his own defense, but he 0:18:04.560 --> 0:18:07.400 didn't get one, or at least not a very good one. 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:10.359 I mean, I've had some trial experience in my career. 0:18:10.400 --> 0:18:13.600 I know my way around a criminal court room. We've 0:18:13.640 --> 0:18:18.239 had contested hearings in our own post conviction cases, and 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:20.919 I know more about false confessions than a lot of 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:24.800 other attorneys who practice in this area. But there is 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:28.639 no way that I would ever take a case like 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:33.200 this this case required a trial lawyer and one who 0:18:33.240 --> 0:18:37.320 had worked with a security clearance and had done cases 0:18:37.480 --> 0:18:40.040 in federal court against the FBI. 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:43.680 Hammid's lawyer had some of the best false confession experts 0:18:43.720 --> 0:18:47.840 in her backyard, including doctor Richard Leo at the University 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:51.439 of San Francisco, but when Hahmed's trial rolled around in 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.400 two thousand and six, his lawyer didn't call doctor Leo 0:18:54.480 --> 0:18:59.000 to testify. Hamed's lawyer also didn't adequately challenge the government's 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:02.880 claim that he carried a Jihati prayer in his wallet. 0:19:03.720 --> 0:19:08.240 Hamed did carry a note a tauiz, a standard Pakistani 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:11.480 Muslim prayer for good health and protection. It was a 0:19:11.480 --> 0:19:16.119 gift from Hamed's uncle after the meningitis, but Hamed's lawyer 0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:18.840 didn't clearly explain that the note had nothing to do 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:22.199 with terrorism, and the jury was left to think the worst. 0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:26.000 I mean, it's a travel prayer. You know, Jews travel 0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:28.399 with eighteen cents in their front pocket when they go 0:19:28.440 --> 0:19:29.080 on an airplane. 0:19:29.119 --> 0:19:30.880 All right, well, I feel comfortable traveling with you, Steve, 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:32.760 if you're going to be covered spiritually. 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:37.280 No, I kind of elapsed jew, okay, But people have 0:19:37.400 --> 0:19:39.960 these prayers with regard to travel, and that's what my 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:43.480 understanding of this Taouis was. Yeah, I mean the language 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:47.240 that that expert use makes it sound very ominous, but 0:19:47.280 --> 0:19:49.400 I'm not sure that that was the right translation. 0:19:49.880 --> 0:19:54.040 Despite a pretty weak defense, Hamed's conviction was far from guaranteed. 0:19:54.760 --> 0:19:57.920 Even after hearing his confession, the jury still took nine 0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:01.360 days to reach a decision, but in the end they're 0:20:01.440 --> 0:20:05.520 verdict guilty. Later it came out that there had been 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:09.920 instances of dury misconduct during deliberations. The jury foreman himself 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:12.560 had said that if you put all Muslims in the 0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:16.960 same costume, they all look alike. Umer Hyatt's trial, on 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:20.200 the other hand, ended in a mistrial, no verdict at all. 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:23.800 He ended up pleading guilty to some minor customs violations 0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:28.399 and was released but hamid. On September tenth, two thousand 0:20:28.400 --> 0:20:32.200 and seven, Hamed Hyatt was sentenced to twenty four years 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:36.280 in prison. It was one day before the sixth anniversary 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:43.280 of the nine to eleven attacks. Federal prison is no 0:20:43.359 --> 0:20:46.919 picnic for anyone, especially not a young muslinman who's been 0:20:46.920 --> 0:20:50.639 convicted of terrorism. Most inmates are allowed only a limited 0:20:50.680 --> 0:20:53.960 number of visits something like once a week. Hamed was 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:57.280 allowed only one visit per year from his family members. 0:20:57.800 --> 0:21:00.440 His dad Umer didn't get permission to say see him 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:04.520 for more than eight years. But even while Hamad endured prison, 0:21:04.880 --> 0:21:07.720 he grew up. For the first time. He was meeting 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:12.479 people of different faiths and backgrounds, albeit behind bars, and 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:15.320 he began to realize that those things he'd said to 0:21:15.400 --> 0:21:21.000 impress Naseem about terrorism being cool or toxic. When a 0:21:21.000 --> 0:21:25.960 reporter interviewed him in twenty sixteen, Hamad retracted everything. He 0:21:26.040 --> 0:21:28.959 told the reporter. It was wrong what I said. I 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:32.760 totally disagree with myself. I didn't know much then. I 0:21:32.800 --> 0:21:34.760 wasn't open minded about a lot of stuff. 0:21:47.040 --> 0:21:50.359 So Hammed is in prison and he's doing his time, 0:21:50.440 --> 0:21:52.840 and his case is winding its way through the system. 0:21:52.920 --> 0:21:57.159 He's losing at every stage. And then Hahmad gets a new. 0:21:57.080 --> 0:21:59.960 Lawyer, a great lawyer by the name of Dennis rear 0:22:00.080 --> 0:22:03.399 And for those of you who are real true crime junkies, 0:22:03.520 --> 0:22:05.920 you might remember Dennis Reardon as one of the leading 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:09.000 lawyers on the team that freed the West Memphis three 0:22:09.880 --> 0:22:10.240 For us. 0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:13.160 Of course, the important thing about the case is that 0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:16.400 this was not about just a bad trial. You can 0:22:16.480 --> 0:22:20.320 have cases like that where someone's rights are violated. We 0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:24.040 passionately believe and knew, we knew it was an actual 0:22:24.080 --> 0:22:24.920 innocence case. 0:22:25.560 --> 0:22:28.560 So Dennis starts investigating the time that Hamid spent in 0:22:28.600 --> 0:22:33.200 Pakistan between two thousand and three and two thousand and five. Remember, 0:22:33.320 --> 0:22:36.960 the government said that during those two years, Hamad went 0:22:37.000 --> 0:22:40.000 off for three months to a training camp. And what 0:22:40.040 --> 0:22:44.000 does Dennis discover alibi witnesses, eighteen of them. 0:22:44.320 --> 0:22:47.800 They described in great detail his daily routine. He was 0:22:47.880 --> 0:22:52.000 generally almost every day in the native village, except for 0:22:52.040 --> 0:22:55.080 the time when he took two trips to raul Pindi 0:22:55.560 --> 0:22:58.840 with his mother. So there were witnesses from wyl Pindi, 0:22:59.000 --> 0:23:03.160 there were witnesses from the village of Babuti. He had 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:05.840 never been out of their site for more than at 0:23:05.880 --> 0:23:09.080 most a couple of days, and had never attended at 0:23:09.119 --> 0:23:12.840 camp as the government alleged, for three to six months. 0:23:13.160 --> 0:23:16.000 Person after person comes forward to say that when Hamad 0:23:16.119 --> 0:23:19.120 was in Pakistan, he was living with family and friends 0:23:19.240 --> 0:23:23.080 the whole time. There were no three month unexplained absences. 0:23:23.560 --> 0:23:26.560 He spent his days playing soccer, not training for jihad. 0:23:26.800 --> 0:23:29.680 Hamad was no terrorist. He was totally innocent. 0:23:30.000 --> 0:23:33.800 Dennis prepares an appeal based on these alibis. He's granted 0:23:33.800 --> 0:23:37.120 a hearing a chance to make the case for Hahmad's innocence. 0:23:37.680 --> 0:23:40.879 The alibi witnesses testify at the hearing over a live 0:23:41.000 --> 0:23:45.720 video feed from Pakistan. Dennis also calls that false confession 0:23:45.800 --> 0:23:48.440 expert to the stand doctor Richard Leo. 0:23:48.520 --> 0:23:52.359 And doctor Leo testified that this confession was useless. It 0:23:52.480 --> 0:23:55.000 wasn't worth the tape that it was recorded on. 0:23:55.280 --> 0:23:58.960 And of course, if you look at the interrogation itself, 0:23:59.400 --> 0:24:02.679 one of the owly humorous aspects of it was that 0:24:02.760 --> 0:24:07.240 he was painfully thin and hardly looked like someone who 0:24:07.240 --> 0:24:11.480 had trained for terrorist activities, and in fact gave this 0:24:11.560 --> 0:24:16.040