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Speaker 1: I am a very different person now than I was

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Speaker 1: thirty years ago. In certain ways, I'm still the same.

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Speaker 1: I'm still a very loving person, a very compassionate person,

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Speaker 1: a very affectionate person, but I have a mental illness

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Speaker 1: that is treated now.

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Speaker 2: So over the last thirty years on death Row, a

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Speaker 2: lot has changed for Krista, even as much as stayed

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Speaker 2: the same. She's been medicated for her mental illness, She's

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Speaker 2: engaged in therapy and undergone brain scans. She says she

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Speaker 2: spent time trying to understand what she did and why

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Speaker 2: she did it, and how she might become a better person.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I was really misunderstood. I was very

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Speaker 1: loving and wanted to be loved, and I'm still very

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Speaker 1: buved and what they loved that. I know what that

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Speaker 1: means now as in a healthy way as you know.

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Speaker 3: Then.

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Speaker 1: I didn't understand what what healthy love looks like, and

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Speaker 1: I do now. I feel I don't know I'm someone

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Speaker 1: over my words.

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Speaker 2: The idea that Krista can and has changed even as

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Speaker 2: she sits in solitary is at the heart of the

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Speaker 2: final efforts to save her life, But her decades of

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Speaker 2: appeals focused on the problems at her trial, what the

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Speaker 2: jury heard, but more important, what they didn't hear about

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Speaker 2: her short life before her arrest. Her attorneys say that

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Speaker 2: she is now someone loving and remorseful and generous, someone

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Speaker 2: who deserves to live. But the decades long process of

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Speaker 2: trying to save her life by convincing a court that

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Speaker 2: she didn't get a fair trial, that her attorney was

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Speaker 2: ineffective hasn't been easy. I think we just need to

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Speaker 2: understand the appellate process.

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Speaker 4: So she's convicted a trial, there's a direct appeal that

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Speaker 4: I believe that her trial council handled that. Then at

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Speaker 4: that point, because it's a death case, that goes up

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Speaker 4: to the Tennessee Supreme Court.

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Speaker 2: Sarah Trelevan and I are sitting in Randy Spidey's office.

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Speaker 2: He's a post conviction defense attorney in Nashville and he's

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Speaker 2: been a part of Christa's legal team for five years.

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Speaker 4: Then it comes back to our office, and then it

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Speaker 4: begins to work its way through the post conviction process,

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Speaker 4: which is back in the trial court but very limited

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Speaker 4: to constitutional issues and effective assistance of counsel, that kind

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Speaker 4: of thing.

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Speaker 2: We're both staring at Randy trying to absorb this incredibly

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Speaker 2: dense and lengthy process.

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Speaker 4: This is what I did when I taught folks.

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Speaker 2: Randy takes out a post it note and he starts

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Speaker 2: to draw little boxes, leading to more little boxes until

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Speaker 2: we can clearly see the flow chart of three decades

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Speaker 2: of trying to save Christa's life.

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Speaker 4: So Trial CCA UH Spring Court, Tennessee Supreme Court, US

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Speaker 4: Spring Court is up here, and then I.

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Speaker 5: Might have to take this to Keinotsen.

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Speaker 2: Since her conviction in nineteen ninety six, Christa's case has

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Speaker 2: bounced around Tennessee's state and federal courts. The nine basic

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Speaker 2: steps in her appellate process primarily challenged the constitutionality of

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Speaker 2: issues at the trial, violations of the sixth Amendment right

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Speaker 2: to effective council, for example, and over the years, Christa's

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Speaker 2: team has made several key arguments, many of them stemming

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Speaker 2: from that right to effective council, but other issues raised

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Speaker 2: included that the court should have granted the motion for

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Speaker 2: a change in venue, that death by electrocution is cruel

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Speaker 2: and unusual punishment, that Christa has brain damage, likely from

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Speaker 2: her premature birth and from her mother's drink, which later

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Speaker 2: showed up in brain scans. It goes on and on

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Speaker 2: and the whole time Christa has been sitting in solitary.

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Speaker 6: Obviously she has run through all of her appeals, They've

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Speaker 6: all been denied.

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Speaker 2: This is Molly Kinkaid, another of Christa's lawyers. Christa's team

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Speaker 2: has only two options left. First, a request for a

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Speaker 2: certificate of commutation, meaning a request that her sentence be

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Speaker 2: reduced from death to life in prison, that is currently

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Speaker 2: before the Tennessee Supreme Court. The court is considering several

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Speaker 2: arguments already made in Christa's numerous appeals, but also that

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Speaker 2: nearly two hundred females in Tennessee convicted of first degree

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Speaker 2: murder receive life sentences, yet Christa, a traumatized, mentally ill teen,

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Speaker 2: received death, a sentence no female teen has received in

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Speaker 2: the US in the modern era. Second option, their Hail Mary,

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Speaker 2: is for clemency, essentially a plead to Governor Bill Lee

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Speaker 2: to show mercy on Christa's life. That's what her team

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Speaker 2: is currently focused on. One of the key arguments relates

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Speaker 2: to a two thousand and five US Supreme Court decision

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Speaker 2: that set a national standard that individuals under the age

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Speaker 2: of eighteen could not be executed for their crimes. Krista

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Speaker 2: was eighteen at the time she killed Colleen, so the

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Speaker 2: decision doesn't free her from death row, but her legal

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Speaker 2: team thinks maybe it could get a court or the

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Speaker 2: governor to start thinking differently about who she was at

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Speaker 2: the time of the murder and who she's become in

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Speaker 2: the decades, since.

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Speaker 6: She's grown a lot in prison, and she's become a

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Speaker 6: person that perhaps she always was meant to be.

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Speaker 2: I'm Beth Carris, and this is unrestorable Season two Proof

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Speaker 2: of Life, an original podcas asked from anonymous content and iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: So when it comes to that bright line of saying,

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Speaker 2: if you're this age, you can do this and or

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Speaker 2: you know you can't do that unless you're twenty one,

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Speaker 2: I mean, like, how old in Tennessee do you have

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Speaker 2: to be to drive a car?

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Speaker 4: Sixteen? Vote eighteen, drink twenty.

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Speaker 2: One, get married without parental permission.

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Speaker 4: I have no idea about eighteen.

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Speaker 2: I believe it's eighteen.

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Speaker 4: Die for your country, Oh eighteen, yeah, but rent a

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Speaker 4: car twenty five?

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Speaker 5: Yes?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, because we don't trust them to drive a car,

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Speaker 4: and we shouldn't.

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Speaker 2: The idea of youth and diminished responsibility that teenagers simply

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Speaker 2: aren't capable of handling certain things is already well baked

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Speaker 2: into our system. But the US Supreme Court's decision Robri v.

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Speaker 2: Simmons in two thousand and five was a clear line

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Speaker 2: in the sand. The execution of juveniles those under eighteen

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Speaker 2: at the time of their crime violated the eighth and

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Speaker 2: fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution, the prohibition on cruel and

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Speaker 2: Unusual punishment, and the right to do process in equal

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Speaker 2: protection under the law. Just as Anthony Kennedy, writing for

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Speaker 2: a five to four majority decision, stated that quote society

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Speaker 2: views juveniles as categorically less culpable end quote than other defendants,

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Speaker 2: he also concluded that quote when a juvenile offender commits

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Speaker 2: a heinous crime, the state can exact forfeiture of some

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Speaker 2: of the most basic liberties, but the state cannot extinguish

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Speaker 2: his life and his potential to attain a mature understanding

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Speaker 2: of his own humanity end quote. The implication was clear,

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Speaker 2: Those who committed even heinous crimes at an early age

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Speaker 2: must be given the opportunity to change.

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Speaker 4: It's not that they're broken if they get better, and

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Speaker 4: we know they get better, but there's a diminished sense

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Speaker 4: of consequence.

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Speaker 2: And that is the case for everything young people do,

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Speaker 2: whether they're shoplifting or robbing someone or murdering.

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Speaker 4: Tattoos or whatever like, there's no sense of what's in

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Speaker 4: the future.

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Speaker 2: In his opinion, just as Kennedy acknowledged the arbitrariness of

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Speaker 2: imposing a line between seventeen and eighteen, the idea that

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Speaker 2: a few months or even a single day might be

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Speaker 2: the difference between life and death, Christa is the youngest

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Speaker 2: woman sentenced to death in the US in the modern era,

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Speaker 2: and that arbitrariness seems particularly stark in her case. Her

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Speaker 2: boyfriend to Daryl and Christa killed calling together. But to

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Speaker 2: Daryl is a year younger than Krista, so he was

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Speaker 2: sentenced to life in prison and will be eligible for

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Speaker 2: parole later this year.

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Speaker 7: Knowing what we know about adolescent brain development, and there's

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Speaker 7: no distinction between a seventeen year old and an eighteen year.

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Speaker 2: Old, this is Kelly Gleeson, one of Christa's attorneys.

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Speaker 7: Then why should the State of Tennessee proceed with killing

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Speaker 7: an eighteen year old.

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Speaker 3: It's not normal to kill people, and it requires a

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Speaker 3: set of circumstances to place into some kind of context,

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Speaker 3: and those circumstances have to include our brain and how

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Speaker 3: it functions.

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Speaker 2: This is doctor Cecil Reynolds, emeritus Professor of Educational Psychology

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Speaker 2: and Professor of Neuroscience at Texas A and M University.

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Speaker 2: He's often called as an expert in cases involving youth

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Speaker 2: and the death penalty, and he says that adult and

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Speaker 2: adolescent brains are very different.

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Speaker 3: The frontal regions can control what the limbic system is

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Speaker 3: telling us to do and can modulate that behavior, and

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Speaker 3: unfortunately those brain systems don't develop at the same time.

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Speaker 3: They don't mature at the same time. Your limbic system

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Speaker 3: matures years before your frontal systems do.

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Speaker 2: The limbic system dictates basic survival instincts, sometimes causing us

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Speaker 2: to lash out, while the frontal lobes manage self control.

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Speaker 2: What that means is that the parts of the brain

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Speaker 2: we rely on to rein in our most volatile and

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Speaker 2: least rational behavior simply haven't fully matured by the time

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Speaker 2: we hit eighteen.

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Speaker 3: The limbic system often wins that that battle or control.

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Speaker 3: So that's the fundamental basis of what some people will

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Speaker 3: refer to as the team brain Disconnected. It's not really

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Speaker 3: a disconnect. The connection's just not there yet in a

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Speaker 3: mature way that allows the system to function as it's

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Speaker 3: designed to function, because it's still developing, and there's a

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Speaker 3: lot of debate over when that maturation occurs, but there's

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Speaker 3: no debate that it's after twenty one.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Reynolds says that all of this means that a

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Speaker 2: teenager or anyone younger than twenty one, is more prone

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Speaker 2: to impulsivity and poor decision making, less capable of meaningfully

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Speaker 2: considering not just consequences but the overarching morality of any action.

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Speaker 3: They're just highly reactive. What's best for me in this nanosecond?

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Speaker 3: What do I need to do to get away? I

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Speaker 3: don't know how many times I've had a defendant tell

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Speaker 3: me when I asked, why did you kill them? I

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Speaker 3: didn't know anything else to do. And you particular hear

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Speaker 3: that the younger of the defendant, So that speaks volumes

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Speaker 3: as well. So the brain processes involved in that moment

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Speaker 3: of hot cognition and their inability to find alternative behaviors,

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Speaker 3: alternative ways of acting that wouldn't put them on death road.

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Speaker 3: And by the way, the prospect of being caught in

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Speaker 3: charge with capital murder has zero to do with their

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Speaker 3: decision making. It doesn't deter a nineteen year old at all.

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Speaker 3: These are not carefully planned crimes where they set out

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Speaker 3: to kill somebody.

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Speaker 2: The answer to grappling with diminished responsibility, says doctor Reynolds,

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Speaker 2: is by diminishing the consequences that people who commit their

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Speaker 2: crimes at eighteen, nineteen, and even twenty should not be

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Speaker 2: held to the same standards as fully mature adults.

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Speaker 3: Raising the age of eligibility for death from seventeen to

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Speaker 3: eighteen was steeped in science. So what we're trying to

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Speaker 3: do now is put the science that we have back

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Speaker 3: in front of the court system and legislatures and say

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Speaker 3: there's good scientific reason to raise this age of eligibility

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Speaker 3: for death as a penalty from eighteen to twenty one.

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Speaker 3: We're going to have proper development of those communication fibers.

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Speaker 3: That's going to happen, which is another reason why people change.

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Speaker 3: Not only can they change, they are going to change,

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Speaker 3: take some people longer than others.

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Speaker 5: And what do we do now that we didn't know

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Speaker 5: when Krista was sentenced to death.

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Speaker 3: Huge changes into science of brain function and our ability

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Speaker 3: to image brain is so much better now than it

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Speaker 3: was third years ago. You can appeal a guilt verdict

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Speaker 3: on the basis of new science that would be persuasive

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Speaker 3: to a jury, that would demonstrate reasonable doubt or actual innocence.

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Speaker 3: But you can't get a new penalty here daring on

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Speaker 3: the basis of new science. And why shouldn't a jury

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Speaker 3: hear that before she's executed.

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Speaker 1: I feel old in so many ways, and still stuck

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Speaker 1: at eighteen in so many ways because I grew in

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Speaker 1: a concrete boxes here. I've been in solitary confinement for

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Speaker 1: thirty years, living in a room by myself. I just

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Speaker 1: turned forty nine, and I feel way older than that

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Speaker 1: in so many ways.

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Speaker 2: It's hard to compare Christa's life over the last thirty

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Speaker 2: years to anything familiar. So many of our common milestones,

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Speaker 2: going to college, finding a job, getting married, having kids,

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Speaker 2: finding a home, even worrying if you filed your taxes right,

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Speaker 2: they never happened to Krista. Instead, those years have been

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Speaker 2: spent in a concrete cell with one plexiglass window. Krista

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Speaker 2: has managed to carve out a life for herself inside

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Speaker 2: the debrak K Johnson Rehabilitation Center, but it's been a

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Speaker 2: long road, just.

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Speaker 1: Being able to wake up in the morning and want

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Speaker 1: to be awake, want to be alive, not having to

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Speaker 1: struggle to communicate with people, not feeling as it's like

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Speaker 1: when you're about polar and you're awake for days, you

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Speaker 1: feel like it really is an illness.

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Speaker 2: Christa's life improved significantly when she was finally properly diagnosed

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Speaker 2: with bipolar disorder and PTSD in her mid twenties.

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Speaker 1: It's like you're walking around with no skin, your nerves

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Speaker 1: are raw, you're physically in pain, you're mentally in pain.

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Speaker 1: It's horrible and there's no really from it. So everything

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Speaker 1: is a noxious stimuli that comes at you from every direction.

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Speaker 1: And so to just be able to walk around and

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Speaker 1: be normal and have normal conversations, normal interactions, eat normally,

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Speaker 1: sweet normally, and just live as a normal human being

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Speaker 1: is amazing.

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Speaker 2: As a death row inmate, Krista is not eligible for

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Speaker 2: formal rehabilitation programs, but she has had access to therapy.

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Speaker 8: When you have people who have been incarcerated for a

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Speaker 8: long time, they kind of experience burnout of their own.

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Speaker 2: Ali Winters is a social worker who started working with

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Speaker 2: Krista in twenty twelve. At the time, Krista was medicated

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Speaker 2: and stable, but she was frustrated with the turnover and

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Speaker 2: mental health professionals in the prison.

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Speaker 8: Like, I'm so tired of telling my story over and

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Speaker 8: over and over again, answering the same questions over and

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Speaker 8: over and over again, simply because I now have a

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Speaker 8: new therapist and over time there's a level of resistance.

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Speaker 5: One of the things that really occurred to me when

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Speaker 5: I was reading through the reams of mitigation in Christa's case,

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Speaker 5: very very very revealing personal details. You know of the

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Speaker 5: worst moments in Christa's life, so you know, everyone now

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Speaker 5: knows who she was molested by, everyone knows about her

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Speaker 5: being raped. It's in the public record. Every aspect of

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Speaker 5: your life becomes fodder for this system.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, yeah, And I think maybe this is why Christa

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Speaker 8: engaged in the therapeutic process so much. She got to

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Speaker 8: dictate what she needed from me, and that's exactly what

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Speaker 8: she got.

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Speaker 2: To gain back a small sice of control exactly.

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Speaker 9: Chris has been held in solitary confinement longer than I've

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Speaker 9: been alive. I don't know how to wrap my head

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Speaker 9: around that. I think it's a despicable thing to do.

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Speaker 9: To anybody.

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Speaker 2: This is Anna sent an investigator who works with Christa's

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Speaker 2: legal team, mostly tracking down mitigation evidence.

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Speaker 9: Even if you consider those on death row the worst

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Speaker 9: of the worst, to torture somebody like that, it's inhumane.

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Speaker 9: So Christa, in spite of the environment she's been in,

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Speaker 9: has chosen to be a compassionate person. Like she should

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Speaker 9: have evolved into just psychosis and she should be completely

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Speaker 9: detached from reality. She is not. Christa is a person

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Speaker 9: who builds relationships with people, who has intellectual interests, who

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Speaker 9: cares about others, who has a life, and that is

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Speaker 9: against the odds of an incredibly painful and dehumanizing life

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Speaker 9: that she lives. So I think if you look at

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Speaker 9: Christa in the context of that, and say thirty years

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Speaker 9: after this crime, Chris is somebody who shows remorse who

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Speaker 9: other people who are incarcated with her, they describe her

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Speaker 9: as a light on the unit, somebody who booies everybody

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Speaker 9: else's emotions. She doesn't get to see people face to face.

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Speaker 9: What Christa does is she talks to people through the events.

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Speaker 9: She encourages them when people get on the unit. I'm

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Speaker 9: gonna cry because Chris is a remarkable person. When people

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Speaker 9: come and they don't have support, she sends them food,

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Speaker 9: she sends them hygiene products. It is incredible to see

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Speaker 9: somebody who has been through so much, who has been

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Speaker 9: ostracized and made out to be entreated like a monster.

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Speaker 9: To see somebody with that history, with that narrative, in

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Speaker 9: these conditions who chooses to give things, not because she

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Speaker 9: receives anything. She isn't getting things from the women who

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Speaker 9: she gives food and hygiene products to. She doesn't get

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Speaker 9: things from the other people that she chooses to be

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Speaker 9: compassionate towards. She does that because that's who she is.

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Speaker 9: So if you're thinking about Krista and her progression as

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Speaker 9: the person I think we see now is the person

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Speaker 9: that could have been thirty years ago had she received

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Speaker 9: the right supports.

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Speaker 2: We heard over and over from the people closest to

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Speaker 2: Christa that she has become a loving, caring, generous person

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Speaker 2: who has worked very hard to create some kind of

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Speaker 2: better life for herself, even though confined to a prison cell.

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Speaker 2: But does that make what she did forgivable enough to

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Speaker 2: overturn her death sentence. That is a question now for

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Speaker 2: the Tennessee Supreme Court or the governor.

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Speaker 10: The anger that people feel when they hear about violent

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Speaker 10: crime is just this instinctive revulsion and disgust, and they

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Speaker 10: want to hit back. It's like, you know, being hit

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Speaker 10: by somebody on the playground as a kid. Your first

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Speaker 10: reaction is you want to hit him right back.

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Speaker 2: Sandra Babcock, a law professor at Cornell University and an

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Speaker 2: expert on women in the death penalty, says that part

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Speaker 2: of the sticking power of a death sentence is that

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Speaker 2: we gravitate towards the simplicity of retribution, and that's.

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Speaker 10: The challenge I think with people who know how the

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Speaker 10: death penalty is applied in practice, and they know that

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Speaker 10: it doesn't deter, they know the social science data, and

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Speaker 10: they also know that it doesn't protect, it doesn't make

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Speaker 10: people safer, and it's also bad penal policy. But those

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Speaker 10: kinds of rational arguments don't land with people emotionally. When

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Speaker 10: they hear about violent crime. They just want to punish

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Speaker 10: because it makes them feel like that person is getting

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Speaker 10: their just desserts. Executing ten more people in the year

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Speaker 10: that Christa was arrested for her crime would not have

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Speaker 10: stopped that crime. What would have stopped that crime is

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Speaker 10: if the state has invested in child protection services that

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Speaker 10: were thoughtful and that were attentive, and that were focused

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Speaker 10: on providing meaningful support to families that needed it, that

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Speaker 10: were able to pick up on the red flags that

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Speaker 10: were present in Christa's case, Like that's what could have

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Speaker 10: stopped that crime. But it's so much more complicated, right

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Speaker 10: than that very clean, Like she was just evil and

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Speaker 10: because she's evil, the only way that we can put

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Speaker 10: an end to this is just by killing her.

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Speaker 5: To look at a case like Christa's and say, well, fundamentally,

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Speaker 5: maybe there are there's no villain. That doesn't mean that

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Speaker 5: somebody you know didn't do something absolutely horrific, But this

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Speaker 5: isn't a battle between good and evil.

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Speaker 10: One of the things that I find oddly uplifting about

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Speaker 10: doing death penalty work is the not knowledge that there

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Speaker 10: are no evil people in the world. Like you grow

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Speaker 10: up thinking that there are evil people. It's what we're

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Speaker 10: told by movies and TV shows and the media, and

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Speaker 10: we grow up terrified of these evil people that are

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Speaker 10: out there. And if there's nothing else that I've learned

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Speaker 10: in the nearly thirty five years that I've been defending

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Speaker 10: people on death row, it is that there are no

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Speaker 10: evil people. There are people who do evil things, but

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Speaker 10: those people are deeply human, They are deeply flawed, and

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Speaker 10: they are very damaged. That is the story of violent

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Speaker 10: crime that nobody is telling.

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Speaker 2: Sandra says that the clemency process, the official mechanism for

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Speaker 2: requesting mercy for someone on death row and decided by

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Speaker 2: the governor, is.

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Speaker 10: Brokenriginally, clemency was an act of grace. Clemency was a

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Speaker 10: fail safe. It wasn't designed to prevent innocent people from

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Speaker 10: being executed, because those people should be pardoned, they should

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Speaker 10: not be in prison at all. It was designed as

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Speaker 10: a way of recognizing people who had either turned themselves

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Speaker 10: around or had something that called out for an act

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Speaker 10: of grace and mercy. Clemency as it is currently practiced

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Speaker 10: in most states has lost that original purpose. It is

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Speaker 10: now seen as something that is only available for people

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Speaker 10: who are typically possibly innocent, and that is simply not

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Speaker 10: its function. So there is no fail safe. There is

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Speaker 10: no way that the legal system has sort of built

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Speaker 10: in a way of taking account of redemption and rehabilitation.

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Speaker 10: And that's one way in which our current prison system

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Speaker 10: has gotten so far removed from its original purpose. Right

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Speaker 10: its original purpose Departments of Corrections was to get people

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Speaker 10: ready to re enter society. You know, implicit in the

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Speaker 10: name Department of Corrections is that people can be corrected,

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Speaker 10: that people can change, and we have lost that.

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Speaker 5: Why do you think we've lost that?

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Speaker 10: I think partly it's politics. Politicians feel that they are

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Speaker 10: going to be punished for exercising mercy. I think that

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Speaker 10: they see it as a sign of weakness rather than

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Speaker 10: a sign of strength. And it's also due to these

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Speaker 10: narratives that we tell about people. The United States is

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Speaker 10: such a punitive country. It always has been, and I

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Speaker 10: think that tendency is only getting worse.

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Speaker 11: I think we have a myth about our justice system

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Speaker 11: that comes through the news and popular media.

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Speaker 2: This is Steve Ferrell, one of Christa's lawyers.

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Speaker 11: But I think that there's something about how doing this

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Speaker 11: fixes problems and that victims are made whole once someone

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Speaker 11: has been the victim. However, in a murder, rape, even robbery,

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Speaker 11: so it changes the victim and the victim will never

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Speaker 11: be whole. And we've developed a myth about our super

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Speaker 11: effective justice system that it does make people whole and

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Speaker 11: it can't.

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Speaker 2: At the heart of the retribution narrative, is the idea

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Speaker 2: that the balancing of the scales is possible. When we

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Speaker 2: talk about Christa spending twenty three hours a day in

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Speaker 2: a cell, others point out that Colleen doesn't even have that,

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Speaker 2: That Kristom might demonstrate some kind of generosity to her

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Speaker 2: fellow inmates, but Colleen never got the chance to show

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Speaker 2: the world how generous she could be. That Christa robbed

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Speaker 2: Colleen and Colleen's family of everything, and the only way

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Speaker 2: to make things right is to take everything from Christa,

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Speaker 2: including her life.

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Speaker 11: When we talk about justice, I think we ignore that

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Speaker 11: real justice is impossible on certain things, and that real

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Speaker 11: fairness will never be achieved in any way.

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Speaker 2: Perceptions of injustice and isolation have cultivated what seems like

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Speaker 2: unique devotion on the parts of Christal's lawyers as they

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Speaker 2: try to save her life. But death row lawyers often

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Speaker 2: develop close relationships with their clients in part because there's

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Speaker 2: some of the few people exposed to their client's humanity

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Speaker 2: in the context of a wildly dehumanizing situation.

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Speaker 7: I see you as a human being. I see what

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Speaker 7: you've alleged to have done, and if you did it,

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Speaker 7: you know I don't. That doesn't matter to me. I

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Speaker 7: still care about you, and I will fight for you

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Speaker 7: and we will get the best outcome possible. And it's

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Speaker 7: very rewarding to me because it's asking people to trust

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Speaker 7: to reveal the darkest, hardest secrets, the scratches on their heart.

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Speaker 2: That's next time on Proof of Life.

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Speaker 5: Unrestorable is executive produced and hosted by Me, Sarah Tchulevin,

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Speaker 5: and Beth Carris, Mixing and sound design by Rezadiya for

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Speaker 5: Anonymous Content. Jessica Grimshaw is our executive producer, Jennifer Sears

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Speaker 5: is our executive in charge of production, and Nicole Pronk

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00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 5: is our legal counsel for iHeart executive producer Christina Everett

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Speaker 5: and supervising producer Abu Zaphar