1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: The club expects their golf proth and their assistant pros 2 00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: to make sure everything's perfect. 3 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:08,399 Speaker 2: We want a club row that can play like Tiger, 4 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:12,520 Speaker 2: teach like butch merchandise like Ralph Lauren, and tell jokes 5 00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:15,360 Speaker 2: like Bob Hope. Right, it is absolutely The problem is 6 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 2: the amount of pay for the amount of work. 7 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:19,760 Speaker 1: It doesn't mesh for clubs. 8 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:22,119 Speaker 3: If you don't make these changes, you're not going to 9 00:00:22,120 --> 00:00:22,959 Speaker 3: get the people you want. 10 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:24,200 Speaker 1: Your product is going to suffer. 11 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 3: People are not going to want to come play there, 12 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,159 Speaker 3: They're going to go elsewhere, and you're eventually going to 13 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:31,319 Speaker 3: go out of business. Is Seth Will helping? He's the 14 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 3: right guy in the driver's seat, But is there a 15 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 3: vehicle he can drive that can make it any better? 16 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:41,839 Speaker 2: People are put on earth to make everybody's lives better, right, Like? 17 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 2: How can he not want to be surrounded by those people? 18 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: Right then? 19 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:50,480 Speaker 2: And that's what our PGA professional is. You know, it's 20 00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 2: not perfect, We're not perfect times far from perfect. 21 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:55,720 Speaker 1: We're moving the needle, making a lot. 22 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:59,560 Speaker 2: Of progress and I hope people are noticing it. But 23 00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 2: that's not the point either, right. The point is leaving 24 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 2: the room better. And I'm going to keep fighting to 25 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 2: do that every day. 26 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:19,040 Speaker 4: Put another log on the fire. Nobody here is to 27 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:19,839 Speaker 4: get the time. 28 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: Welcome to the fire pit with Matt Janella. 29 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 3: We're back and not so fresh off what I would 30 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 3: consider a wonky US Open. Congrats to Wynd and Clark 31 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 3: for what he pulled off. My condolences to Ricky and 32 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 3: Rory for missing yet another opportunity to win a big one. 33 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:43,640 Speaker 3: As for Lacc, I've said my piece on Twitter. I 34 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,440 Speaker 3: felt compelled to know more about the club and possibly 35 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 3: play the course before watching all week the way it 36 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 3: was presented, what we heard about the rules and the membership, 37 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 3: small crowds, the commandeering of tickets which led to that 38 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 3: lack of volume and energy. It was all a bit 39 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 3: of a turn off for me, but for a lot. 40 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 3: More on the US Open stories and podcasts by my 41 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 3: colleagues Alan Schipnook and Michael Bamberger go to Firepicollective dot com. 42 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,519 Speaker 3: As for this week, the women are at Baltis Rawl 43 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 3: for the KPMG Women's PGA Championship. A perfect time to 44 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 3: wrap up this series on the club pro crisis, especially 45 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 3: considering my guest is Susie Whaley who in twenty eighteen, 46 00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:25,760 Speaker 3: became the first female president of the PGA of America, 47 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 3: a position she held for two years. Whaley is a 48 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 3: dual member of the PGA of America and LPGA Teaching 49 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 3: and Club Professional Division. She was an LPGA Tour member 50 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:39,240 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety and nineteen ninety three. She is a 51 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 3: two time Connecticut PGA Teacher of the Year. She's a 52 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 3: three time Connecticut Women's Open Champion, and in two thousand 53 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 3: and three, at the Greater Hertford Open, she became the 54 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 3: first woman since Babes Ziharius in nineteen forty five to 55 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 3: qualify for APGA Tour event. A nineteen eighty nine graduate 56 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 3: of the University of North Carolina with the degree in economics. 57 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 3: In twenty fifteen, Whaley received the Margodideck Award from the 58 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 3: WNBA's Connecticut son for her ability to engage, challenge, and 59 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 3: inspire while serving as a role model. In twenty sixteen, 60 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 3: she was inducted into the Greater Syracuse Sports Hall of Fame, 61 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 3: and in twenty seventeen, she was honored with the Betsy 62 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 3: Rawls Award from the American Junior Golf Association for her service, dedication, 63 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 3: and contributions to women's golf. Whaley's husband, Bill is also 64 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 3: a PGA member and they have two daughters, Jennifer and Kelly. 65 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 3: Before we get to my uninterrupted conversation with Susie, I 66 00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 3: want to thank Dormy Workshop, my sponsor of this podcast. 67 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 3: Dormy Workshop is an incredible golf family business based in Halifax, 68 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 3: Nova Scotia, where all they do is make quality leather 69 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:50,320 Speaker 3: headcovers and accessories. I found the Bishop Brothers at the 70 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 3: PGA Merchandise Show almost ten years ago. I've been promoting 71 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,440 Speaker 3: their people and products ever since. Go to Dormy Workshop 72 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 3: dot com and use promo code fire Pit fifteen for 73 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,760 Speaker 3: fifteen percent off your next purchase. Or go to the 74 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 3: Pit shop at Firepitcollective dot com and order one of 75 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 3: our Dormy headcovers or stash bags. And now Susie Wailey 76 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 3: and the conversation we had in April, what makes a 77 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 3: good club pro looky? 78 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: There's twenty nine thousand of us, right, and I always 79 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: think of us as PGA professionals, which is just a 80 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:28,839 Speaker 1: anacular right because many of those PGA professionals don't actually 81 00:04:28,839 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: work at a club. Some of them work for manufacturers, 82 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:34,160 Speaker 1: some of them work in the media. Some of them 83 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 1: work as engineers, some of them work is across the board. 84 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 1: So when you're talking about a club professional, I would 85 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 1: say somebody who's actually physically going day in and day 86 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: out to a facility that has a area where you 87 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:49,359 Speaker 1: check in to go play golf. You know, that's what 88 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 1: I consider a club professional. And I think what makes 89 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 1: a great golf professional is somebody who knows their customers, 90 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 1: somebody who has a welcoming and inclusive environment that people 91 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:01,359 Speaker 1: want to return to. And I think when you accomplish 92 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,480 Speaker 1: that with any customer, you are being successful. What are 93 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,599 Speaker 1: the traits that great club protests have. They're diligent, they're loyal, 94 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:11,839 Speaker 1: they're service hearted, they're task oriented people, very detail oriented. 95 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 1: They're good players. They wouldn't be a PGA professional if 96 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: they weren't a good player. They have to pass the 97 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: pat They're typically friendly, high energy, and work extremely long 98 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:23,480 Speaker 1: hours without complaint. And so you know, as you look 99 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 1: at club professionals around the country and you think of 100 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 1: the jobs that they're doing, most of us are incredibly 101 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:32,280 Speaker 1: passionate about golf. We love the game, or we wouldn't 102 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: be doing what we're doing. We probably grew up most 103 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:37,200 Speaker 1: often in the game, but I can't speak for all. 104 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 1: Some of them have come in later in life as 105 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: a second career. But I've worked at golf courses since 106 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 1: I was fourteen years old, and I just, I truly 107 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: can't imagine. I was going to go to law school 108 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: out of college, thought that was going to be my path, 109 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:54,719 Speaker 1: ended up going to tour school. Told my parents, you know, 110 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: and I'm not going to go to law school. I'm 111 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: going to go to tour school. Took a right turn and 112 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: actually got on tour somehow made it through your school, 113 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: and it changed my life forever. But when I think 114 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: about it, and I have to think I relate to 115 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:10,200 Speaker 1: so many others like me. I don't want to talk 116 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 1: for them. But I can't imagine being inside. I can't 117 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,800 Speaker 1: imagine being behind a desk. I love being outside. I 118 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: love people. I love interacting on a day to day 119 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,000 Speaker 1: with people. I love people who love golf, even if 120 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:26,280 Speaker 1: they're terrible at it, you know, I mean, it's just 121 00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:30,599 Speaker 1: for me. It gives me great joy. So I also 122 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:33,520 Speaker 1: think really good club professionals are people who like what 123 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 1: they do. 124 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:39,159 Speaker 3: The word crisis as it relates to club pros meaning 125 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 3: trying to make sure there's a feeder system of people 126 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 3: who are willing to do this job for the hours 127 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,720 Speaker 3: it requires, for the amount of pay. That is kind 128 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 3: of is kind of the model right now, would you 129 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 3: say there is you know that word crisis? Is that accurate? 130 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,040 Speaker 3: What's your perspective on sort of the state of this 131 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 3: industry as it relates to kind of making sure we 132 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 3: have people that are willing to kind of keep coming 133 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:16,720 Speaker 3: and keep taking these positions and roles and keep being successful. 134 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, now, I wouldn't call it crisis. So, you know, 135 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 1: I think that certainly what we're in is the time 136 00:07:22,680 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 1: that nobody else has ever experienced. Right, So, we had 137 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 1: this pandemic and I certainly didn't think I would ever 138 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: live through a pandemic. I'm sure most people didn't. And 139 00:07:32,080 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 1: what it turned into was when the pandemic hit, we 140 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: had literally twenty nine thy thousand people out of work. 141 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 1: I happen to be president of the association at the time. 142 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 1: When you get the call that work is over, everybody 143 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: go home and then the first thing you think of is, 144 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 1: you know, calling your CEO and your board and saying, okay, 145 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 1: we had to pivot as quickly as possible, how we're 146 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 1: going to help our PGA professionals. So that a crisis 147 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: one hundred percent because we had people out of work 148 00:07:57,240 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 1: and at the time there was no subsidies from the government. 149 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: We knew golf courses were closing instantaneously. We knew jobs 150 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 1: were at jeopardy if the manufacturers couldn't produce and couldn't work. 151 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: We didn't have people with equipment. So we pivoted from 152 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:15,400 Speaker 1: every one of our strategies right to how do we 153 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: help our membership. That's who we are, that's what we do, 154 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 1: that's why we're in association, and what do we need? 155 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 1: What do we do? First? And then secondly was how 156 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 1: do we get golf courses open as quickly as possible 157 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 1: and how do we convince government and legislature that we 158 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 1: can do it in a responsible way and keep people safe. 159 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 1: And we couldn't promise that, but we could promise that 160 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 1: we could have PGA professionals literally delivering facilities in a 161 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 1: responsible manner as they self fit with the CDC. That 162 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 1: took an enormous, herculean effort to get golf courses back 163 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: open and to convince cities, states and counties to do it. 164 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 1: Because you might have one county that was twenty miles 165 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: away from another, one's open and one's not. And so 166 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,079 Speaker 1: when we finally wrapped our arms around that, alongside the 167 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: other allies, we certainly didn't do it by ourself. We 168 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: had everybody in world Washington when we had the opportunity 169 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:05,440 Speaker 1: to get people back to work. Alongside it being really 170 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: thankful for the subsidies that were delivered to anybody that 171 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: was out of work. We also started a golf relief fund, 172 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:13,680 Speaker 1: and we I feel, I can't you know, there were 173 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:15,839 Speaker 1: certainly were people who suffered through this. So I don't 174 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: want to sound like we helped everybody, but we averted 175 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 1: a crisis for our membership, which I'm proud to have 176 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: been a part of. But again it was a group 177 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:26,600 Speaker 1: effort to do that. I think what occurred then, to 178 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:30,440 Speaker 1: your point from earlier is people started falling in love 179 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: with golf. Those that played golf and always loved to 180 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 1: just play more. Those that had left it were like, well, gosh, 181 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 1: I got to get outside, I got to go do something, 182 00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:39,439 Speaker 1: you know what, Let's dust off the clubs and get 183 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 1: back to it. Maybe they left because of illness or 184 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:45,120 Speaker 1: family or whatever. Child responsibilities, job changes, and then we 185 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 1: had people who've never played the game say, well, gosh, 186 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 1: at least we can go through that, you know, let's 187 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:54,679 Speaker 1: give that a try, and the golf just flat exploded. 188 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 1: We had more juniors. We still have more juniors than 189 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,840 Speaker 1: we've ever had. I think the last research that came 190 00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: out by the National Golf Foundation a couple of weeks ago, 191 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:06,079 Speaker 1: and I I'd be off on my weeks. But now 192 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,560 Speaker 1: we have actually more off course golfers than we even 193 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 1: have on course golfers, which is twenty six point five million, 194 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 1: So we have double plus that in off course. So 195 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: golf is just in an unbelievable place right now, where 196 00:10:19,080 --> 00:10:22,679 Speaker 1: t sheets are full, people are happy, and families are 197 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 1: playing the game like we've always wanted forever. I think 198 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:31,160 Speaker 1: where things got to see you and where some articles 199 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:36,720 Speaker 1: have shared what's happening is while facilities have less team, 200 00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: meaning less people on the ground, they are working double 201 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 1: hours and during COVID, I think most of our professionals 202 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: willingly did that. We understood that we were giving people 203 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:52,199 Speaker 1: a rest bit and I remember, like most of us 204 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:54,439 Speaker 1: really want to give back to our communities. That's why 205 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: we do what we do. And we felt really strongly 206 00:10:56,640 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 1: that we were doing that in an unbelievable way, and 207 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: I think at home feeling really good about ourselves, Like 208 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: we got to see people every day, which I think 209 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 1: was a gift for us and for our mental health. 210 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:09,200 Speaker 1: But we also got to see people getting outside and 211 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: enjoying it and maybe if we get a little a 212 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: little bit of joy in their day during this incredibly 213 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 1: scary time, we were doing the right thing. But what 214 00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: that turned into was a perception that we were able 215 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: to keep those hours going, that we could work very 216 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 1: long hours, seven days a week, with smaller teams and 217 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaker 1: with the same amount of club participants, if not more 218 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 1: than we had had prior, and so it turned into 219 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:44,560 Speaker 1: this really enormous balance that was getting out of balance crisis. 220 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 1: I would say no, but it's taken us still, And 221 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:53,599 Speaker 1: I say that loosely us being PGA professionals and leadership 222 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 1: to educate boards, to educate facilities, to educate municipalities, to 223 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:05,040 Speaker 1: educate consumers as to what's going on. And while revenues 224 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: are increasing at facilities because of Golf's participation dramatically, many 225 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 1: facilities are using those revenue increases for capital expensu sures 226 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: and I happen to believe that your human capital is 227 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 1: your best capital. So where I see an issue is, 228 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:25,840 Speaker 1: all right, let's help build these teams back, Let's help 229 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:28,880 Speaker 1: compensate the PGA professionals that are in these seats that 230 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,600 Speaker 1: are delivering these opportunities, and let's use some of the 231 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 1: revenues that we've actually been enhanced by to do that. 232 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,319 Speaker 1: And you take care of your human capital, I think 233 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:39,439 Speaker 1: your business runs better. 234 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 3: There is like this work life balance an awareness issue COVID, 235 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 3: you know, demand and at the end of the day 236 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 3: that you guys are an association, but you're not a union, right, 237 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,640 Speaker 3: so it's like it's still pretty splintered. So to fix 238 00:12:55,720 --> 00:13:00,559 Speaker 3: all of that takes time and communication. Is that affair assessment? 239 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 1: I think it does, and it does take education. It 240 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: just takes reminding people, you know. I think what was 241 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: if there was something good about COVID was certainly golf's surge, 242 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 1: but also the fact that people were able to be 243 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 1: home with their families more and we were home with 244 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:19,840 Speaker 1: our families less far less, And I just think when 245 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: people think about it for a second, and so let's 246 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 1: say your golf professional isn't there on a Friday morning. 247 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 1: What would happen typically is that people would say, where 248 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: were you? You know, you weren't even here on Friday, 249 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 1: and you're thinking to yourself, oh my gosh, I've been 250 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: here the last sixty eight days in a row and 251 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: I needed to, you know, go home and go to 252 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 1: a doctor's appointment, or or I needed to handle something 253 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 1: in my you know, my family's life. But it wasn't. 254 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,600 Speaker 1: I don't I really believe this. It wasn't. It's not 255 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: an intentional aggression against what we do or what we're doing. 256 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,520 Speaker 1: It just became a habit for consumers to always have 257 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: that availability, and the one place they could go for 258 00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:02,520 Speaker 1: that sanctuary was their golf facility. And that's what we've 259 00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 1: always wanted. We've always wanted people to feel like this 260 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 1: was their community. We want you to feel like this 261 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: is a safe place, your home. We want you to 262 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:12,400 Speaker 1: be there, and I want to be there for you. 263 00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: But what got lost in the mix was we we 264 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:20,800 Speaker 1: trained the golf world that we were going to be 265 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: there twenty four to seven. And I just think when 266 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 1: you explain it to people in a way like that, 267 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 1: whether it's your board of directors, your managers, your town managers, 268 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: your owner, and you say, you know, look, I love 269 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: what I do and I'm passionate about what I do, 270 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: but I also have other things in my life that 271 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:42,000 Speaker 1: I have to handle so I can be better for 272 00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 1: you on the property. And here's the following. And I 273 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: think what we're trying to do, and the Association is 274 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 1: trying to do, is educate the leadership at clubs, to 275 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 1: educate municipalities. We're not complaining, we are not whining about it, 276 00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:58,000 Speaker 1: and I mean that sincerely. It's just let's just talk 277 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 1: about what is possible for PGA professional to actually be 278 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 1: the best PJA professional that can be at your facility. 279 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:07,320 Speaker 1: And let's make sure we're balancing not with what we 280 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,400 Speaker 1: know we can and can't do. 281 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 3: We know there's massive growth as it relates to women 282 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 3: coming to the game playing the game. Is that also translating? 283 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 3: Is it too soon to understand if that's going to 284 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 3: also result in a surge in women's leadership roles within 285 00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 3: the game as it relates to club pros and positions 286 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 3: of impact beyond people like yourself. 287 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I'm excited to see the growth in play. 288 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: So women's play is dramatically at women the amount of 289 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 1: beginners that are learning the game, I think close to 290 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:43,120 Speaker 1: I don't know my numbers correct, but sober fifty percent 291 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 1: of them are women. And what's really exciting is in 292 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,800 Speaker 1: the junior space, thirty five percent are girls. So when 293 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: you think about all that data, thirty five percent certainly 294 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: not being where we'd like it to be. Okay, I 295 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: want it a fifty one. Okay, let's just. 296 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 3: I want to be one up golf. 297 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: I'm at. Yeah, that's where I'm editor. And but you know, 298 00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: you think about that for where we used to be 299 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 1: in twenty ten, right, I mean, we're talking about massive growth, 300 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 1: and that's exciting. Ten years from now, I think golf 301 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: will look extremely different than it does today because of 302 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: that junior growth and because of new growth amongst women, 303 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 1: I think amongst our PGA professionals and LPGA professionals. So 304 00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: there's about and again don't quote me on these numbers, 305 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: there's about two thousand LPGA professionals. But that's global. There 306 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: are some in Asia as well. I'm a dual member. 307 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 1: I'm a member of the LPGA and I'm a member 308 00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:35,880 Speaker 1: of the PGA of America. We're about we're getting we're 309 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:39,320 Speaker 1: nearing five percent in the PGA of America. So you 310 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 1: think about five percent, and that's that's abysmal, right. So 311 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: you know, we've put in places intentional and actionable steps 312 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 1: to try to increase those numbers and to showcase what 313 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 1: golf is all about. We're an eighty six billion dollar 314 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: industry and there are many facets of this industry that 315 00:16:56,560 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 1: women can be a part of. I highlighted an engineer 316 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: who female engineer, the stealth driver for Taylor me. And 317 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 1: you know, I think as we think about rules in 318 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 1: golf for women, I think, oftentimes and again not unintentional, 319 00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 1: but people just think of us as coaches, right, they 320 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 1: think of women, they think, oh that you must teach 321 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 1: the juniors, right, And I love teaching the juniors. I 322 00:17:21,119 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 1: love teaching women. I love teaching men. I am a 323 00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:26,560 Speaker 1: coach at heart. I love it. But not all women 324 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:29,639 Speaker 1: want to coach. Women want to be owners and operators 325 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 1: and directors of golf and tournament operators and rules officials 326 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: and run manufacturing companies, which they are doing. But we 327 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,720 Speaker 1: don't hear about it very often. And so I do 328 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:41,880 Speaker 1: believe it, if you could see it, you can be it. 329 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 1: And I think as we showcase. My Journey app just 330 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: came out, which is really cool that we're using it 331 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 1: at the PGA of America. I'm one of the mentors 332 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 1: on it, so are multiple other women in golf. And 333 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:57,120 Speaker 1: I think when people can see different avenues and different tracks, 334 00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: we will have an opportunity to gain more attraction amongst 335 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:03,560 Speaker 1: women instead of them just thinking their pigeonholed into one 336 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: particular entity of the golf business. They want to be 337 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:10,680 Speaker 1: a coach. We have every platform possible to allow them 338 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: to do that, but I think we have to think 339 00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 1: about it in a different way and sort of clubs. 340 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: You know, men are still the employers at most clubs fact, 341 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 1: and people typically hire who they look like, right, And 342 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 1: we need more women promoted, We need more women elevated, 343 00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 1: and we need more clubs to think about women running 344 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:30,440 Speaker 1: their facilities, not just as general managers, but in head 345 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:34,199 Speaker 1: golf professionals, positions and directors of golf. That's not a 346 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: lot we have some You know, if some directors and 347 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,560 Speaker 1: instructions at high end clubs join a cos at Marion, 348 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: Kathy Kim's at Baltimore and we were you know, little 349 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:46,040 Speaker 1: by little you're starting to see those opportunities happen. We 350 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 1: have gms that are females, but it's woefully, woefully and 351 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:55,920 Speaker 1: painfully behind. So we put in recruiting efforts at the 352 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: PGA of America, at the collegiate level where we're showcasing 353 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,480 Speaker 1: to these young women. Look, if you choose not to play, 354 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 1: we encourage you to. But if you choose not to 355 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:07,440 Speaker 1: play and use that as your career, we would love 356 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:08,960 Speaker 1: to have you as a part of our industry and 357 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 1: let us share with you some of the opportunities that exist. 358 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:14,639 Speaker 1: And it's going to take us time. It's going to 359 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 1: take us time to grow that, but we're on it. 360 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: I know the leadership now, I'm not a part of 361 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: that now, but I know the leadership now is committed 362 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 1: to that. And we started programs like PGA Lead to 363 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: help women in governance. So now we have presidents of 364 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 1: sections that are women, we have boards of directors that 365 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 1: are women in PGA of America governance. I'm proud of that, 366 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 1: but we've got a long way to go. 367 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 3: Seth waw I say his name and his commitment to 368 00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:46,919 Speaker 3: the PGA of America, to the membership to trying to 369 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:50,720 Speaker 3: you know, to trying to advance the ball, leave the 370 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 3: world better than he found it, so to speak, because 371 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 3: it relates to this particular segment of golf. What are 372 00:19:57,800 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 3: your thoughts on him and the impact he's. 373 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 1: Had Well, A cherish my time with Seth A cherish 374 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: working with him. I was so fortunate to have somebody 375 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,679 Speaker 1: with his kind of experience in the seat when the 376 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:15,200 Speaker 1: pandemic hit, somebody that was incredibly calm and steady at 377 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:19,120 Speaker 1: the helm, that could navigate it and be a really 378 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: agile leader. I also think Seth truly wants to help 379 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 1: PGA professionals in a way that's authentic and believes in 380 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 1: their value and respects what we do. And I think 381 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:33,280 Speaker 1: as a leader, that's what you need to ask for. 382 00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:35,840 Speaker 1: You need to ask for somebody who's actually leading people 383 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:39,199 Speaker 1: that they respect. And I've never felt, with Seth in 384 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:43,480 Speaker 1: the room that being a golf professional was something I 385 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 1: shouldn't be proud of, and I think that's made an 386 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 1: enormous difference in what he's been able to accomplish. He 387 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:52,680 Speaker 1: has unbelievable connections within the game. We all know that. 388 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,399 Speaker 1: I think when you're thinking about a pandemic and hosting 389 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:59,399 Speaker 1: a PGA championship, during a pandemic and making a phone 390 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: call to the PGA tour to change dates to help 391 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:05,240 Speaker 1: us manage that maneuver that get a new data on 392 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:10,080 Speaker 1: the calendar. Those things don't happen without relationships and really 393 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: strong relationships. When you think about the Ryder Cup and 394 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 1: what we had to do to make that be an 395 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,800 Speaker 1: event still, because remember we had to move it, and 396 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:20,520 Speaker 1: that's not that easy to do in a tour calendar 397 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 1: year and a tour schedule alongside a President's Cup and people, 398 00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:28,199 Speaker 1: I don't know that people need to understand that, but 399 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 1: that was again a herculean effort by all involved to 400 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 1: make sure we still had a Ryder Cup. And the 401 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: Ryder Cup really truly is such a huge and an 402 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:44,440 Speaker 1: enormous part of our association because it helps fund education, employment, 403 00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:49,359 Speaker 1: everything we do for our members. We need that event 404 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: and seth in my opinion, and our board and our 405 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: staff alongside of everybody, all of our partners, any of 406 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: our worldwide partners are domestic partner, all of those had 407 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: to be talked to as we were trying to navigate 408 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: these two enormous championships for our membership. So when you 409 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:12,679 Speaker 1: think about talking to a Cadillac or a BMW. You 410 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 1: think about, Okay, what do they think? Are they just 411 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 1: going to pull? Can they hang in there with us? 412 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 1: Can we be great partners and extend for three more years? 413 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 1: All of those conversations had by our teams are why 414 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,399 Speaker 1: we are an association that's stronger, in my opinion, and 415 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 1: even better today, and that's thanks to Seth and the 416 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 1: team he's put together and our board who literally was 417 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: a part of that every day. 418 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:43,119 Speaker 3: This idea of unionizing in some way, shape or form, 419 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 3: that is that just really unrealistic and not worth a 420 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 3: lot of time or energy, you know, some of these 421 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 3: other things that you have mentioned, programs, incentivizing awareness, education, information, unionizing. 422 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 3: You know, I've asked pretty much, Buddy, I've interviewed as 423 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,520 Speaker 3: a way of kind of wrapping your arms around the industry, 424 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,920 Speaker 3: and but it just but it doesn't seem like it's 425 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,919 Speaker 3: even remotely possible to me. I don't know. 426 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:14,679 Speaker 1: You yeah, I don't think it is. But I rarely 427 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 1: say things like that because I think anything is possible, 428 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 1: you know, if you kind of figure it out. So 429 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: you know, I'm not going to say it's not possible. 430 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: I'm just going to say that I don't think it 431 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 1: would be fortuitous for our for our members. I don't 432 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 1: think it would be the right play. But that's my 433 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: personal opinion. That's not a governance opinion of the PGA 434 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,239 Speaker 1: of America's opinion. I know, I'm a huge believer in 435 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 1: people being able to capitalize on their strengths and on 436 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 1: what they do best. And I think when you put 437 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,760 Speaker 1: people into a box of a certain requirement and a 438 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 1: certain amount of hours, I think I think you maybe 439 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 1: stifle people. And I think we have a lot of 440 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:56,359 Speaker 1: incredibly talented golf professionals who are in multiple lanes, and 441 00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 1: then we have golf professionals who on the same lane 442 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,200 Speaker 1: their whole career and love it. And there's nothing wrong 443 00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 1: with either space, right, But I would want to I 444 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: would want facilities and professionals to be able to grow 445 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,000 Speaker 1: and do it in a sense that they both felt 446 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,200 Speaker 1: productive doing it without being hampered by rules and regulations 447 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: that we impost. That's ja American post. 448 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 3: Your energy and passion and the way you articulate yourself 449 00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:24,440 Speaker 3: and you know you you said you have to see 450 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:25,840 Speaker 3: it before you know. If you see it, you can 451 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 3: feel like you can be it. I mean you must 452 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:34,919 Speaker 3: I mean, you're timing your role as president during that 453 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 3: time working with people like Seth managing that you know 454 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 3: your You've got platforms, You've got relationships. I mean you 455 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,439 Speaker 3: you really have a full set of fourteen clubs that 456 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:51,679 Speaker 3: you can hit to make a difference. Does it feel 457 00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 3: like the stars have aligned for you, specifically, Susie Whaley 458 00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:59,479 Speaker 3: to actually really have the kind of impact that you 459 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,360 Speaker 3: I've already have and are going to continue to. I mean, 460 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:07,200 Speaker 3: you seem like you are relentlessly in pursuit of making 461 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 3: a difference. 462 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:10,760 Speaker 1: Well, so I appreciate that very much. I thought about 463 00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: that fourteen clubs. I don't know, I feel like maybe 464 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:17,920 Speaker 1: half a set. I don't know how to go straight 465 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 1: to fourteen. I think you always have something to learn, 466 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:22,359 Speaker 1: and there's no way you got it all down right. 467 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 1: I Mean, every time I go to a teaching some 468 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 1: and I think I got it down, I'm like, heck, yeah, 469 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,520 Speaker 1: I know what I'm doing. I can teach anybody. And 470 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:30,119 Speaker 1: I go to teaching some and I get in the car, 471 00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,160 Speaker 1: I'm like, I know absolutely nothing. I have learned nothing 472 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 1: in the thirty years that I have taught golf, and 473 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:36,840 Speaker 1: I have to think about it. Like for another week. 474 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm constantly digging classes. I you know, I 475 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:43,720 Speaker 1: just subscribe to I hang out with people that are 476 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 1: just much smarter than I am, right, And and that's 477 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: like the way to be successful. It doesn't mean I 478 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:52,160 Speaker 1: don't learn and try to be smart, but I try 479 00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 1: to find people in my world who teach me something, 480 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,159 Speaker 1: who who absolutely have way more knowledge than I do 481 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 1: in the space. And my time spent with the PGA 482 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,359 Speaker 1: of America as a leader, I can stay absolutely it 483 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: helped me become a better leader. And you know, in 484 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:08,919 Speaker 1: the beginning, you just you know, you think you know 485 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,480 Speaker 1: what you're doing, and then you realize how many other 486 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:14,440 Speaker 1: micro little things need to be managed and handled, and 487 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 1: how to integrate with stuff, and then how to make 488 00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 1: sure you're telling your constituency and communicating to them on 489 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 1: a basis that they feel part of it. And there 490 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,080 Speaker 1: were times I didn't do that well, and there were 491 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:26,880 Speaker 1: times where I did do that well. And I think 492 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:28,679 Speaker 1: from that you learn, like what you just said in 493 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,879 Speaker 1: the beginning, where oh gosh, I made this air. This 494 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 1: is what I said, and that certainly wasn't intentional. I 495 00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,600 Speaker 1: think every leader at anybody that's out in public that 496 00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 1: happens to I think, I think what you have to 497 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,000 Speaker 1: turn to is okay, and it sounds so cliche, but like, 498 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 1: all right, let's crew that up. You know, what do 499 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 1: we learn from it? What did I miss? How did 500 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 1: I miss it? And how did I make sure I 501 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 1: don't miss it again? And then I think, to the 502 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 1: other side of that is when I say only have 503 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,720 Speaker 1: a half a set. You know, I really feel like 504 00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 1: I'm in the beginning of my career. And I know 505 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 1: that sounds really strating, but I feel like I'm in 506 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: the beginning of my career because I think I'm at 507 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,440 Speaker 1: a point in my life and my experiences of my 508 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 1: age where I've had it. I've had it, and I 509 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,920 Speaker 1: have a platform to talk about it in a respectful way. 510 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:18,439 Speaker 1: Understanding the history of the game and the culture of 511 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:21,160 Speaker 1: the game. You know, I get it. I get where 512 00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 1: we are today, and I'm proud of the progress that's 513 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: been made in golf and where we're headed. I'm proud 514 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:30,399 Speaker 1: of the fact that we are super popular, but I 515 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 1: want to know where the heck we're going. I want 516 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: to know how we're going to do it better, and 517 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 1: I want to be a part of that. Conversation. And 518 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 1: so when you say do I have fourteen? I don't 519 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:45,679 Speaker 1: feel like I've even started. And I'm ready. I'm ready 520 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: for that next challenge. 521 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,760 Speaker 3: When you're saying all that, are you are you directly 522 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 3: referring to women? Are you referring to women in golf? 523 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:55,919 Speaker 3: Are you referring to women in golf? Or are you 524 00:27:55,960 --> 00:28:00,040 Speaker 3: referring to PGA you know, PGA pros. Are you like 525 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,160 Speaker 3: or is it kind of all of it like you want? 526 00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:10,639 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, you just forgot the media. That is the 527 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:14,320 Speaker 1: bucket in there too. And again, I look at this, 528 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,360 Speaker 1: it's not a it's not a it's something that I'm 529 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,440 Speaker 1: passionate about. It's not something that I'm saying negatively. It's 530 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:24,720 Speaker 1: just I think, you know, I think a lot of 531 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,200 Speaker 1: us are just harder saying we're grateful for the opportunity, 532 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:28,719 Speaker 1: and yeah, that's where women come in. 533 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 3: Right. 534 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,800 Speaker 1: I'm done with hearing about why don't more people watch 535 00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 1: the LPGA? Well, where are we supposed to watch them? 536 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 1: You know? Where are they? Where are we seeing them? 537 00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: I mean, if you look in the paper, I won't 538 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: if they're in it. If you look in any digital publication, 539 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,840 Speaker 1: not the paper, That's how all day, any digital publication, right, 540 00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 1: any any Twitter feed? I mean, does anybody know who 541 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: won the last three LPGA? Like, like honestly likes it's 542 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:57,040 Speaker 1: It's actually appalling to me. And I don't think it's 543 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 1: necessarily intentional. I just think it's our culture in the 544 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: game that needs to be changed. When people talk about 545 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 1: the game, they talk about the professional men's game. Right. 546 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 1: When I have conversations with my juniors, I always say, 547 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 1: who's your favorite female player? 548 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 3: Right? 549 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 1: My juniors now know that, Right, there's so many young 550 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 1: girls playing and so many boys now watching women's golf. 551 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,080 Speaker 1: But I don't understand why we're not seeing it more. 552 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 1: And why is only five percent of media publications on 553 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 1: women's sports in general? Why is that? That's just a 554 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: question right for people? That Okay, that's where I get 555 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 1: all the king on Twitter, Like people will write me 556 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 1: back a thousand reasons why right, but none of them 557 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 1: make any sense? Like that doesn't mean make sense just 558 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: because you like to watch men's Okay, good for you, 559 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,320 Speaker 1: glad to watch men's sports. But I watch men's sports 560 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 1: and one in sports and some of these different women, 561 00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 1: like women need to watch women's sports. This isn't all 562 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 1: on men, right, we all we all just need to 563 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:53,440 Speaker 1: participate in it. And so I think when you ask 564 00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: me what is that all about, you know, it's about 565 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:01,000 Speaker 1: making sure that the next generation has it better than 566 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 1: we have. Right. The next generation is that to fight 567 00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 1: so hard. And I'm here to tell you that golf 568 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,840 Speaker 1: women have to fight really hard. And there is space 569 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: for women, and there is space for junior girls in golf. 570 00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 1: We shouldn't have to fight this hard. 571 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 3: I'm pumped up, I'm fired up. I want to go 572 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 3: through a wall for you and for everybody behind you. 573 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 3: I'm just like, I just I really wow. I had 574 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 3: done enough things at Golf Channel, at the Golf Industry 575 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:32,480 Speaker 3: Show in which I realized there was a crisis around 576 00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 3: the agronome of the game. Getting young people to show 577 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 3: up early, work long hours, to tend to the golf 578 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 3: course itself is a problem. There's not you know, they're 579 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 3: closing or Granaby programs there, They're having kids, don't work 580 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:51,320 Speaker 3: that many hours for that kind of pay. They're like, 581 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:53,960 Speaker 3: I'll do something. I'll put you know, I'll be a 582 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:58,200 Speaker 3: gamer whatever it is. And then I just wasn't aware 583 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 3: that it also sort of relays to the club Pro 584 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,720 Speaker 3: World or the PGA Pro also that young people were like, 585 00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 3: wait a minute, that many hours for that kind of pay. 586 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 3: I like golf, but I just met somebody at my 587 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,200 Speaker 3: club that's now offered me a job in their law firm, 588 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:16,640 Speaker 3: and I'm going to go back to lawsuit, you know 589 00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 3: what I mean, Like, we got to keep good people 590 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 3: in this industry that seemed to be at the heart 591 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 3: of kind of this matter that I was getting into. 592 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 3: You know, when I started reporting, it was like, Wow, 593 00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 3: I get that. I didn't realize that also related to 594 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 3: managing clubs and not just managing the courses. So that 595 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 3: was my hole in my glove. And now I've know 596 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,920 Speaker 3: a lot more and I'll continue to learn and share 597 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:43,600 Speaker 3: what I learned. 598 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:46,479 Speaker 1: That's it so well. I love it. Anything you can 599 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: do that to support the effort is great and I 600 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:53,320 Speaker 1: appreciate the time and I really do. I think it's amazing. 601 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,520 Speaker 1: And the more we can educate and make aware, I mean, 602 00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 1: then we can help for some change. 603 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's going to happen. And I think the 604 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 3: good news is it's like, hey, we're in the middle 605 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:05,520 Speaker 3: of the drought, but guess what, we got a lot 606 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 3: of rain coming, Like you know, there is this you know, 607 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 3: you talked about an abysmal number as it relates to 608 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 3: women in the in the industry at five percent. But 609 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:19,200 Speaker 3: more women, more women are playing, more girls are playing 610 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,120 Speaker 3: there for there's it's only natural to know. And then 611 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 3: you have someone like you and others who are in 612 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:31,440 Speaker 3: these roles, leadership roles and have platforms that are going 613 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 3: to continue to make sure that you know these This 614 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:38,120 Speaker 3: mentorship happens where it's like, hey, let me help you 615 00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,720 Speaker 3: be who you want to be in this industry that 616 00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 3: you need that too. You need you to get people 617 00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,719 Speaker 3: who want to be you right to your point, so 618 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 3: right right, and we're getting there. 619 00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:51,120 Speaker 1: We're getting there. I mean, I'm really proud of the 620 00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,800 Speaker 1: work that's been put in. I just there's it's not enough. 621 00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 3: I love I love it. Well, God's read Susie Whaley 622 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 3: and keep going and I can't wait to continue to 623 00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 3: observe and report on the progress. 624 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 1: Well, I appreciate it, appreciate the time. 625 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:19,600 Speaker 3: Well that's it for now. At least I've already heard 626 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,479 Speaker 3: from countless PGA pros and club pros around the country 627 00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 3: offering their thoughts on how and why things need to change. 628 00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,480 Speaker 3: Some more positive than others. The plan is to revisit 629 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:32,480 Speaker 3: this in a few weeks with a wrap up podcast 630 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,360 Speaker 3: and another wave of voices and perspectives based on what 631 00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:38,480 Speaker 3: has been said throughout this series. If you want to 632 00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:40,760 Speaker 3: be one of those voices, I can be reached on 633 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,680 Speaker 3: my social channels or at Matt Janella at gmail dot com. 634 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 3: Thanks again to Susie Whaley, Seth Waugh, Chandler Withington, Butch Harmon, 635 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:53,320 Speaker 3: Shane Ryan, Rick Riley, Bryan Souley, Jack Davis, Robin's Manly, 636 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:57,480 Speaker 3: Cody Sinkler, Josh Doxeter Kieran Kenwar, Connor Evers, and Brad 637 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,640 Speaker 3: Sniper for their thoughts and perspectives on this industry. And 638 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 3: to Jake Muldowney, the producer of the fire Pit podcast. 639 00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 3: And thanks to you for listening and for your love 640 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,080 Speaker 3: of the game that, more than anything, continues to be 641 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 3: the common denominator here. It's a sport that's easy to hate, 642 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:16,799 Speaker 3: swing to swing, but also so easy to love. Round 643 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:19,760 Speaker 3: a round course to course, friend to friend, memory to memory, 644 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:23,840 Speaker 3: year to year that seems clear. And on that note, 645 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 3: the full fire Pit Anthem written and performed by Joe Horowitz, 646 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 3: a friend and pro in the Mets section, who might 647 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 3: be just as good with the guitar and Mike as 648 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:35,839 Speaker 3: he is with a bag of clubs. The song, which 649 00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 3: is called The Story, was produced by Jakir King, a 650 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 3: Grammy Award winning friend in Nashville who loves golf as 651 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:42,960 Speaker 3: much as we all do. 652 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:08,319 Speaker 4: Put another log on the fire. Nobody here is get 653 00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:08,800 Speaker 4: the time.