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Speaker 1: Old media.

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Speaker 2: This is it could happen here. Executive Disorder, our weekly

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Speaker 2: newscast covering what's happening in the White House, the crumbling world,

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Speaker 2: and what it means for you. I'm Garrison Davis today

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Speaker 2: I'm joined by James Stout, Miya Wong, and Robert Evans.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 2: This episode, we're covering the week of September eleven to

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Speaker 2: September eighteenth.

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Speaker 4: Normally a week in history when very little happens.

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Speaker 2: The most normal week of American politics.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Traditionally, nothing around the first third of September's days

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Speaker 1: has as ever mattered in American history.

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Speaker 2: We should schedule our calendar just to block out this

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Speaker 2: whole section of the year each time.

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Speaker 1: I already have it written down in micah calendar as

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Speaker 1: the week to forget, so I just spend it drinking.

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Speaker 2: Robert, do you want to introduce our first topic?

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Speaker 1: Yes, I mean our first topic, as we talked about

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Speaker 1: last week, is the fallout from the murder of Charlie Kirk,

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Speaker 1: particularly its impact on free speech and the pretext it's

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Speaker 1: being used for to justify a crackdown on the quote

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Speaker 1: unquote left. Different NGOs and other organizations that are being

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Speaker 1: accused of being part of a vast and let's say,

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Speaker 1: unlikely conspiracy to commit terrorism that has nothing to do

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Speaker 1: with what's actually been discovered about Tyler Robinson Charlie Kirk's killer,

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Speaker 1: but nonetheless it's being used that way, and kind of

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Speaker 1: the first thing to probably talk about is what's come

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Speaker 1: out about Tyler Robinson's motivations in the time since we

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Speaker 1: recorded our last episode. Honestly, I was kind of surprised

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Speaker 1: Gerre when we recorded on Friday.

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Speaker 3: I had expected us.

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Speaker 1: To need to do an update before Monday in order

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Speaker 1: to catch up. Really, there wasn't much that came out.

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Speaker 2: No, I did a brief update confirming that he was

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Speaker 2: living with a transperson, but that was really all we

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Speaker 2: knew with the time that could be confirmed. That was

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Speaker 2: pretty evergreen as we suspected it might be, and I

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Speaker 2: will say, frankly, the motive still remains not entirely clear,

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Speaker 2: but we do have some more concrete details about his

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Speaker 2: online background. Yeah, and a few others like ancillary pieces

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Speaker 2: which is included in the charging document, as well as

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Speaker 2: reporting on his discord logs.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I think we should talk first about the whole

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Speaker 1: trans roommate thing of it all because obviously, first off,

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Speaker 1: this is one of the most massive reaches I've seen,

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Speaker 1: Like they're always desperate to have a trans connection anytime

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Speaker 1: there's a shooting.

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Speaker 2: They were trying to establish this literally like seconds after

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Speaker 2: it happened.

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Speaker 1: And that's been the case with like the last year

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Speaker 1: and a half or two worth of mass shootings yea,

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Speaker 1: or at least a sizeable number of them.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that was a meme.

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Speaker 4: Right for why it's like a four Chan thing to

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Speaker 4: suggest that any mass shooter was trans and now it's

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Speaker 4: just become reality.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And in this case, the legation started coming out from

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Speaker 1: the police that his roommate was transgender. This was before

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Speaker 1: the discord logs had leaked. So I want you to

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Speaker 1: talk a little bit. Gare you found the Reddit profile

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Speaker 1: of Tyler Robinson's roommate. Yeah, So first question is do

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Speaker 1: we know if they actually were trans and do we

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Speaker 1: know if they actually were in some sort of a relationship.

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Speaker 1: What is the actual evidence that exists to suggest that

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Speaker 1: based on what we have so far, they.

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Speaker 2: Did post about their transition on multiple subreddits and public

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Speaker 2: facing posts, and they referred to having a boyfriend BF

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Speaker 2: that was helping them cope with the results of the

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty four election. But that's really all we can

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Speaker 2: tell from this at the time of public Reddit profile

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Speaker 2: for the roommate of Tyler Robinson, who had again some

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Speaker 2: sort of romantic relationship with the like nitty gritty you know,

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Speaker 2: arc of their whole relationship is like not explicitly clear,

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Speaker 2: but but certainly a pad a romantic relationship.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I want to make it clear, which should

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Speaker 1: be obvious to anyone who has like a third of

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Speaker 1: a brain cell to rub together against the inside of

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Speaker 1: their skull. There's not any evidence that this roommate was

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Speaker 1: tied in any way to the Tyler Robinson's crimes, and

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Speaker 1: in fact, the exit evidence.

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Speaker 2: The state is arguing this that the roommate had no

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Speaker 2: prior knowledge and has been fully cooperative. That the roommate

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Speaker 2: is not involved.

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Speaker 1: Not only is fully cooperative, but turned Tyler in.

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Speaker 2: In part or produced evidence that was now used in

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Speaker 2: the charging documentary. Tyler turned himself in with his father,

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Speaker 2: like officially, but there was certainly conversations happening.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's one of those things you can come

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Speaker 1: down morally on that however you want. It's just a

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Speaker 1: matter of there's absolutely no evidence, as people like Matt

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Speaker 1: Walsher saying that this is part of some grand LGBT conspiracy.

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Speaker 1: Their roommates seemed horrified to have been and you know,

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Speaker 1: understandably terrified to have been potentially implicated in a massive act,

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Speaker 1: massively faced active murder, right, Like, that's a that's a

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Speaker 1: scary thing to come. You like get a discord message realizing, oh, fuck,

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Speaker 1: now I'm potentially implicated in this.

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Speaker 3: So I do have some.

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Speaker 1: Understanding for what a shocking moment that is. Like, it's

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Speaker 1: hard to imagine, yeah, dealing with that in any way,

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Speaker 1: shape or form. That's just a wild thing to have

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Speaker 1: happened in the middle of your fucking day, presumably while

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Speaker 1: you're at work or some shit. This would have been

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Speaker 1: around noon, so I'm guessing they were on the job

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Speaker 1: when they got these messages. She's a horrible, horrible thing

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Speaker 1: to deal with.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's go over some of the text exchanges included

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Speaker 2: in the charging document. It's technically not an indictment because

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Speaker 2: they did not charge via grand jury. Yeah, it's a

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Speaker 2: placeholder for that. Yeah, but it's referred to as like

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Speaker 2: a charging information document that they included some text messages

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Speaker 2: because it was the clearest evans to lay out to

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Speaker 2: charge them with the crime. So not the only evidence,

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Speaker 2: as we will soon discuss. And these text logs are

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Speaker 2: are core to like people like Walsh's current argument that

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Speaker 2: the trans roommate must have actually been involved because they

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Speaker 2: think that the messages that I'm going to read here

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Speaker 2: we were like scripted between the roommate and the shooter

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Speaker 2: specifically to exonerate the roommate, and that's the conspiracy that

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Speaker 2: people like Walsher spreading. Let's go over this section of

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Speaker 2: this document.

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Speaker 4: Quote.

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Speaker 2: The police interviewed Robinson's roommate, a biological male who was

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Speaker 2: involved in a metal relationship with Robinson. The roommate told

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Speaker 2: police that the roommate received messages from Robinson about the

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Speaker 2: shooting and provided those messages to police. On September tenth,

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, the roommate received a text message from

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Speaker 2: Robinson which said, drop what you are doing, look under

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Speaker 2: my keyboard. The roommate looked under the keyboard and found

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Speaker 2: a note that stated I had the opportunity to take

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Speaker 2: out Charlie Kirk and I'm going to take it unquote.

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Speaker 2: Police found a photograph of this note. The following text

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Speaker 2: exchange then took place. After reading the note, the roommate responded,

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Speaker 2: what with many question marks? You're joking, right, Robinson? I

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Speaker 2: am still okay, my love, but I am stuck in

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Speaker 2: orm for a little while longer yet, shouldn't be long

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Speaker 2: until I can come home. But I got to grab

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Speaker 2: my rifle still. To be honest, I'd hoped to keep

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Speaker 2: this secret till I died of old age. I'm sorry

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Speaker 2: to involve you, roommate. You weren't the one who did it, right,

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Speaker 2: many question marks, Robinson, I am sorry, roommate. I thought

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Speaker 2: they caught the person, Robinson. No, they grabbed some crazy

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Speaker 2: old dude that interrogated someone in similar clothing. I had

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Speaker 2: planned to grab my rifle from my drop point shortly after,

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Speaker 2: but most of that side of town got locked down.

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Speaker 2: It's quiet, almost enough to get out. There's one vehicle lingering.

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Speaker 3: Roommate.

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Speaker 2: Why Robinson, Why did I do it? Roommate? Yeah, Robinson,

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Speaker 2: I had enough of his hatred. Some hate can't be

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Speaker 2: negotiated out. If I'm able to grab my rifle unseen,

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Speaker 2: I will have left no evidence. Going to attempt to

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Speaker 2: retrieve it again. Hopefully they have moved on I haven't

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Speaker 2: seen anything about them finding it. Roommate, how long have

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Speaker 2: you been planning this, Robinson? A bit over a week.

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Speaker 2: I believe I can get close to it, but there's

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Speaker 2: a squad car parked right by it. I think they

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Speaker 2: already swept that spot. But I don't want to chance it, Robinson.

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Speaker 2: I'm wishing i'd circle back and grabbed it as soon

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Speaker 2: as I got to my vehicle. I'm worried what my

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Speaker 2: old man would do if I didn't bring back Grandpa's rifle.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if it had a serial number, but

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Speaker 2: it wouldn't trace to me. I worry about Prince. I

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Speaker 2: had to leave it in a bush where I changed outfits.

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Speaker 2: I didn't have the ability or time to bring it

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Speaker 2: with I might have to abandon it and hope they

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Speaker 2: don't find Prince. How the fuck will I explain losing

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Speaker 2: it to my old man. Only thing I left was

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Speaker 2: the rifle wrapped in a towel. Remember how I was

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Speaker 2: engraving bullets. The fucking messages are mostly a big meme.

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Speaker 2: If I see notices bulge ooh wu on Fox News,

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Speaker 2: I might have a stroke. All right, I'm gonna have

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Speaker 2: to leave it that really fucking sucks. Judging from today,

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Speaker 2: I'd say Grandpa's gun does just fine. IDK, I think

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Speaker 2: that was a two thousand dollars scope, Robinson, Delete this exchange, Robinson.

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Speaker 2: My dad wants photos of the rifle, he says, Grandpa

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Speaker 2: wants to know who has what. The Feds released a

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Speaker 2: photo of the rifle and it is very unique. He's

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Speaker 2: calling me r n not answering, Robinson. Since Trump got

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Speaker 2: into office, my dad has been a pretty diehard Mega.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to turn myself in willingly. One of my

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Speaker 2: neighbors here is a deputy for the sheriff. You are

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Speaker 2: all I worry about, love roommate. I'm much more worried

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Speaker 2: about you, Robinson. Don't talk to the media. Please, don't

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Speaker 2: take any interviews or make any comments. If police ask

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Speaker 2: you questions, ask for a lawyer, and stay silent. That's

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Speaker 2: the end of the exchange.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 4: It seems like this person fairly wisely stopped engaging with their.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's not a good response to give to that. No,

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Speaker 1: that's not and discord again. One of the one thing

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Speaker 1: I would hope this would bust is the This has

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Speaker 1: to have been a professional hit man, assassin of some sort,

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Speaker 1: which is a job that I mean, it technically exists.

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Speaker 1: Like there are guys who are for the fucking crypts

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Speaker 1: of the Bloods. You could call them professional hitmen, and

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Speaker 1: that they kill people for money. But they're not like

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Speaker 1: the people you see in movies, Like they're guys who

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Speaker 1: will walk up with a thirty eight and gut shoot

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Speaker 1: somebody and run the fuck off like they're they're not

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Speaker 1: We're not talking about like smooth operators. Those people almost

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Speaker 1: don't exist as a profession and certainly not as a

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Speaker 1: standard thing in the United States. And that that like

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Speaker 1: the fact that he was having this kind of conversation

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Speaker 1: on discord.

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Speaker 2: This is I believe, regular text.

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Speaker 3: So these are regular regular text.

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Speaker 4: This is straight up yeah sms right, Like, yeah.

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Speaker 1: He's messaging this shit through unencrypted lines and left a

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Speaker 1: note under his keyboard and dropped the rifle in the woods,

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Speaker 1: Like this is all about what you respeck from a

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Speaker 1: twenty two year old kid who's a reasonably good shot

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Speaker 1: with a rifle and had no real other skills, Like

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Speaker 1: it's what it looked like.

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Speaker 4: Yes, this doesn't even seem like someone who spent a

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Speaker 4: great deal of time planning, right, like learning about that.

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Speaker 2: They said they've been planning about it for about a week.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, this lines up with what they said, right, like

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Speaker 4: like yeah, and they seem almost surprised.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I got this weird feeling reading it, Like Tyler

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Speaker 1: almost is shocked that they did it. Like there's this

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Speaker 1: almost sense of being pulled by history.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's seemingly confused by his own actions in his CeNSE.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, like watching himself almost like.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and like I I inscrite, like one of the things.

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Speaker 1: It sounds like and this is a little unclear, but

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Speaker 1: it sounds like in terms of those memes winding up.

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Speaker 1: But he was doing that before, maybe even before he'd

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Speaker 1: ever planned to shoot Kirk. That's just like a thing

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Speaker 1: he did for shit.

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Speaker 3: For people.

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Speaker 2: People have pointed to that as being like, oh, well,

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Speaker 2: obviously the roommate knew something was up. If if the

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Speaker 2: roommate was aware that that Robinson was carving bullets, that's,

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Speaker 2: first of all, that's not a crime. No, people just

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Speaker 2: do weird shit sometimes, especially if someone goes to the range.

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Speaker 2: Often maybe they're gonna fucking scribble on a bullet. Like

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Speaker 2: that's not indication of anything that's legitimately concerning frankly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's indication again that this guy was very online

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Speaker 1: in the gamer right, yea, right.

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Speaker 3: But that's it.

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Speaker 2: So it's not just people like Walsh who are casting

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Speaker 2: doubt on the authenticity of these messages. Plenty of liberals

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Speaker 2: and people on the left have taken to suspecting that

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Speaker 2: these could have been written by an quote unquote FBI

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Speaker 2: agent or law enforcement as fake evidence to frame the shooter.

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Speaker 2: And people have pointed towards some weird verbiage like calling

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Speaker 2: his dad his old man and referring to quote unquote

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Speaker 2: like law enforcement type language like interrogate And Yeah, to me,

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Speaker 2: this is not very confusing. He talks like this because

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Speaker 2: he's raised Mormon and plays a lot of tactical video

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Speaker 2: games thousands of hours I have. I have a Steam profile, huge,

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Speaker 2: huge gamer. And he might talk a little odd because

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Speaker 2: he just did a fucking crazy thing.

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Speaker 3: I don't even think it's that odd.

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Speaker 1: It's nice people call someone they're in love with, my love.

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Speaker 1: That's a thing that happens in the world.

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Speaker 3: Like, that's not like a.

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Speaker 2: Very normal what are we doing here?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, why are we questioning this part of the story?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: But and again, like these texts were handed over to

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Speaker 2: local police by Robinson's roommate. Why fake evidence that would

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Speaker 2: jeopardize the case when the police already have a lot

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Speaker 2: of other evidence DNA ballistic evidence, the friend group discord

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Speaker 2: chat where he also admitted to the crime right before

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Speaker 2: he turned himself in. Like, these textlogs don't even like

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Speaker 2: make him out to be a crazy leftist. He talks

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Speaker 2: like very vaguely about Kirk, like spreading hatred.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he says nothing about politics. And again, as we'll

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Speaker 1: talk about because there's some evidence here suggesting that both

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Speaker 1: Tyler and their roommate, like their politics were mixed from

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Speaker 1: what little we can glean.

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Speaker 2: About them, right, or a very minor part of their

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Speaker 2: lives in a sense, like yeah.

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Speaker 1: They're not talking about redistribution of wealth, they're not talking

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Speaker 1: about overthrowing the government.

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Speaker 2: Oh no, they're not talking about politics in that way.

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Speaker 2: This seems more like personal to him.

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Speaker 1: Yes, he's in love with a transperson and he didn't

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Speaker 1: like what Charlie Kirk said about trans people.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and like if the government's going to fake messages,

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Speaker 2: why would they do so in a way that exonerates

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Speaker 2: the trans roommate the real ideological target here.

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Speaker 1: Especially look at what the government is doing right now.

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Speaker 1: Right they're going after quote unquote Antiva, They're going after

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Speaker 1: the Open Society Foundation, George Soros, all of these left

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Speaker 1: wing NGOs. If they were faking this, would he not

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Speaker 1: have referenced one of those organizations? Would there not be

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Speaker 1: a fucking black and red flag somewhere in there?

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Speaker 4: It would be so easy. If you're going to implicate someone,

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Speaker 4: you could implicate it in text messages really easily, Like

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Speaker 4: it's ridiculous to suggest that, yeah, the state did this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, why would you fake that?

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Speaker 3: Why would you fake it that way?

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Speaker 2: Baffling, incomprehensible. These texts are not load bearing to this case.

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Speaker 2: Plenty of other there's plenty of other evidence. And this

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Speaker 2: isn't the same thing as like cops planting evidence or

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Speaker 2: like a district attorney making subjective claims about intent, like

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Speaker 2: you don't need to overestimate state intelligence here.

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Speaker 1: No, we don't even need her what we have. There

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Speaker 1: was no need for them to have done anything at all,

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Speaker 1: because Robinson specifically notes that as soon as pictures of

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Speaker 1: the rifle were posted online by police, his dad fucking

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Speaker 1: Costs family knew because it is a unique gun Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is.

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Speaker 3: It is.

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Speaker 1: It is an antique mouser that was sportized and rebarreled,

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Speaker 1: presumably personally by his grandfather. Both his grandpa and his

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Speaker 1: dad seem to have recognized it immediately. There was no

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Speaker 1: getting away with it once the rifle was found.

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Speaker 2: This is totally different from like the MS thirteen tattoo thing,

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Speaker 2: where the trumpetministration argued for an interpretation of tattoos and

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Speaker 2: then printed out a picture with like very clearly photoshopped

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Speaker 2: letters to draw a parallel between what they think the

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Speaker 2: tattoos meant and with their interpretation of it as letters

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Speaker 2: and numbers, which trump in all of his genius, mistook

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Speaker 2: for being actual tattoos. And then they just ran with

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Speaker 2: it because no one has the capacity to tell the

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Speaker 2: president you're wrong. This is completely different than faking all

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Speaker 2: these text messages. There's metadata, there's cell phone records, it's

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Speaker 2: probably still on the roommate's own phone. Like physical a

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Speaker 2: physical evidence, and like subjectively saying that you don't know

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Speaker 2: any gen z that talks like this, that's not valid evidence.

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Speaker 2: Twenty two year olds know how to use punctuation.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, let me tell you of someone who crades hundreds

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Speaker 4: of papers every year from people who are largely but

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Speaker 4: not all, between eighteen and twenty five. Yeah, young people

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Speaker 4: can use punctuation. This is not like some kind of

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Speaker 4: forensic fucking literary analysis required.

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Speaker 2: And the information obtained in these chat logs and through

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Speaker 2: interviews with his parents match reporting by Ken Klippenstein, who

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Speaker 2: got leaked messages from the shooter on Discord, very very similar.

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Speaker 2: Like lots of libs and people on the left are

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Speaker 2: saying this is fake because they wanted the shooter to

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Speaker 2: be conservative and they think that these texts damage the

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Speaker 2: narrative that they have chosen. I think that's why we're

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Speaker 2: seeing people react so strongly to this. It's not about

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Speaker 2: actually evaluating the evidence on like a base level, right,

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Speaker 2: Like this guy grew up in a conservative Mormon family.

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Speaker 2: His dad's pretty mega Robinson figured out he was bisexual

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Speaker 2: and started to move a little bit to the left

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Speaker 2: on like gender and sexuality issues. And even like a

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Speaker 2: lot of gen Z straight guys kind of have this

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Speaker 2: political profile, right, they're like pro gun, but their life

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Speaker 2: revolves around like gaming Discord and read it more than

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Speaker 2: like the political and.

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Speaker 1: They're probably often pro capitalist, just not bigoted against queer people. Yea,

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Speaker 1: because that's not as common anymore. These aren't political partisans.

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Speaker 2: They're not even on our slash bread tube, Like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's that's not what's happening. He played, he played furry

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Speaker 2: sex games on Steam when he was younger. One of

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Speaker 2: his Steam names was Donald Trump because yeah, he's twenty

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Speaker 2: two years old. Trump was an Augury when he was

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Speaker 2: like thirteen or whatever.

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Speaker 4: Like, god, yeah, it's crazy.

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Speaker 3: We fucked the kids up so bad.

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Speaker 2: It's it's a largely it's largely a political and like

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Speaker 2: this what he did is is existential violence manifesting a

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Speaker 2: political action from someone who isn't otherwise overtly political, right,

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Speaker 2: because shooting Charlie Kirk incredibly political action, even if that's

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Speaker 2: not the way that that the shooter maybe conceived it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, like this person happened, So it happened across a

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Speaker 4: queer person who they are very fond of. Right, they

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Speaker 4: have queer people in their lives. That is not indicative

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Speaker 4: of any politics other than they have a queer person

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Speaker 4: in their.

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Speaker 3: If this person stand the Soviet Union, we would fucking

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Speaker 3: know about.

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Speaker 2: It because they would be running with that.

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Speaker 3: Used a mos in.

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Speaker 5: For one thing.

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Speaker 1: So they would have missed a little bit of Moses

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Speaker 1: slander for you today to break up the horrors. Speaking

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Speaker 1: of crackdowns, crack down on your wallet by buying these.

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Speaker 2: Products and services.

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Speaker 4: Beautiful, lovely.

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Speaker 3: And we're back.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, First Amendment crackdown. Massive rhetoric coming out of Stephen

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Speaker 1: Miller and from Pam Bondi and basically every mouthpiece of

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Speaker 1: the administration about going after the left, about dismantling particularly

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Speaker 1: organizations like the Open Sciety Foundation, going after George Soros

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Speaker 1: and his son. There's talk about prosecuting people criminally and

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Speaker 1: using the death penalty, even on folks who are quote

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Speaker 1: unquote funding terrorism, a term which has been so broadly

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Speaker 1: described by mouthpieces of the administration as to include potentially

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Speaker 1: just about anybody.

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Speaker 2: This could be like bail funds, environmental NGOs, legal support NGOs,

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Speaker 2: like It's it's really unclear at the exact form that

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Speaker 2: this is going to take, but this is stuff that

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Speaker 2: the administration has pined about doing for a while.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's unclear. You know, it's one of the

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Speaker 1: big pieces of news that's happened. Within twenty four hours

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Speaker 1: of us recording this episode, which we recorded on Thursday,

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Speaker 1: the eighteenth is that Trump has designated Antifa a domestic

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Speaker 1: terrorist organization.

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Speaker 3: Of that's not he's said that.

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Speaker 1: What I'm saying is he said that, he said up

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Speaker 1: to me, those words that he has said.

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Speaker 2: Words that he has said before, including in twenty twenty.

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Speaker 3: For the letter of the law.

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Speaker 1: For one thing, there's a wild difference between what you

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Speaker 1: could do legally to an international foreign terrorist organization, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and in domestic terrorist organization.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Because of the First Amendment, you can't just declare legally

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Speaker 1: in terms of what is written law, the president can't

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Speaker 1: just declare a group of people to be a domestic

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Speaker 1: terrorist organization. It's usually an enhancement charge, yes, and then

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Speaker 1: just go after people who have spoken out or donated

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Speaker 1: money to legal charities that are randomly declared to be

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Speaker 1: in support of that that's not legal, which doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: it what happened. Let me be really clear. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but that's not what the law is about.

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Speaker 2: And they've tried to do that in Atlanta was Top

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Speaker 2: Crop City and the Lena Solidarity Fund and going after

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Speaker 2: the Bail Fund and people who had donated money to

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Speaker 2: like the Forest Defense Fund, right, and this Trump is

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Speaker 2: similarly actually to Atlanta Is also talked about using Rico

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Speaker 2: charges to get people in trouble who are funding these

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Speaker 2: quote unquote domestic terror organizations, and on Yeah, September seventeenth,

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Speaker 2: Trump Truth, I am pleased to inform our many USA

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Speaker 2: patriots that I'm designating Antife, a sick, dangerous radical left disaster,

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Speaker 2: as a major terrorist organization. I will also be strongly

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Speaker 2: recommending that those funding Antifa be thoroughly investigated in accordance

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Speaker 2: with the highest legal standards and practices. Thank you for

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Speaker 2: your attention to this matter.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, for a use the word major right,

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Speaker 4: which doesn't like there's a domestic terrorism is a concept

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Speaker 4: that's nebulous FTO, Foreign terrorist organization is an extremely clear

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Speaker 4: legal definition. He didn't use either of those. This is yeah,

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Speaker 4: this is a thing that like Ted Cruz, and I

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Speaker 4: think he enjoyed it. I'm sure there are other people involved.

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Speaker 4: But Ted Cruz in before twenty twenty twenty nineteen, tried

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Speaker 4: to introduce a resolution in the Senate condemning Antifa like

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Speaker 4: this has been a thing.

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Speaker 2: Marjor Taylor Green introduced legislation which went nowhere, or talked aboutization.

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Speaker 2: I don't even know if she actually introduced it like

440
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:54,320
Speaker 2: this year about designating Antifa terrorist organization. It's been It's

441
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,679
Speaker 2: been something like Andy know has been advocating for for years.

442
00:22:56,800 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 1: It's a really important point that they have attempted and

443
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,919
Speaker 1: failed to do this numerous times because the law doesn't

444
00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,560
Speaker 1: let them. And this is something that if you have

445
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 1: been in the riot reporting on public shootings business as

446
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 1: long as I have been, christ one thing I can

447
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:16,399
Speaker 1: tell you is that in the wake of something like this,

448
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 1: it was the same with christ Church and the immediate

449
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 1: wake of christ Church, there was this really shocking moment

450
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 1: where a bunch of conservative I talked to these people

451
00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 1: because I published the art the defining article on that shooting. Yeah,

452
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 1: a shitload of conservative organizations came out and said, you

453
00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:33,520
Speaker 1: know what, maybe we've been wrong about demonizing Muslim immigrants.

454
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:35,680
Speaker 1: Maybe like that was really fucked up and we should

455
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:39,000
Speaker 1: like those people were talking about that, people who you

456
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:42,040
Speaker 1: would not expect that now, they didn't keep talking that way.

457
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 1: They got a pretty quick But what you have in

458
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 1: a moment like this is there's a limited period of

459
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 1: time where people's shock and horror and surprise at what

460
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:59,600
Speaker 1: has happened creates spaces of possibility for folks who have

461
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 1: an agenda and you have a clear plan for what

462
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:08,480
Speaker 1: to push, to push the overton envelope in their direction. Right,

463
00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 1: this is not a period of time that lasts for ever.

464
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:17,920
Speaker 1: And the folks who are largely orchestrating the conservative response

465
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,159
Speaker 1: to Charlie Kirk's murder are aware of this, and they

466
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,640
Speaker 1: are making the best use of this period of time

467
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 1: that they can get. Now, that doesn't mean the fact

468
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,159
Speaker 1: that this is a limited period of time doesn't mean

469
00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 1: there aren't long term consequences, doesn't mean that they can't

470
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:35,879
Speaker 1: make significant progress on their plan to stifle free speech.

471
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,480
Speaker 1: It doesn't mean we're not in massive danger. Because we

472
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 1: are in danger, folks. I'm not telling you we're not.

473
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:47,160
Speaker 1: I'm telling you these spaces of possibility don't last for ever,

474
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 1: in part because the public moves on, and in part

475
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,080
Speaker 1: because there is always a backlash to the backlash, and

476
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 1: you're seeing pieces of that already.

477
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 2: They are seeing pieces of that.

478
00:24:56,680 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 1: Carl Rove of all motherfucking people wrote it article about

479
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:05,600
Speaker 1: how the administration is unfairly blaming liberals and leftists for

480
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,880
Speaker 1: the actions of an individual shooter. Tucker Carlson came out

481
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: and it made a statement that like, if the government

482
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:13,080
Speaker 1: is able to go after you for this, they'll come

483
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 1: after conservatives at some point. He's not wrong about it.

484
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:17,680
Speaker 1: I don't credit him doing that because of a serious

485
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: moral thing. I credited him to be a relatively intelligent

486
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 1: guy who was like, no, no, no, if they're able

487
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,680
Speaker 1: to do this to you know whatever, milktoast liberals, eventually

488
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:26,439
Speaker 1: it will happen to me.

489
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 2: Right and specifically, like Pam Bondi is, the etern General

490
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 2: made some statements a few days ago about them going

491
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:36,440
Speaker 2: after quote unquote hate speech, yeah, which spawned a whole

492
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,520
Speaker 2: bunch of conservative commentators Steven Krawdertucker Carlson, as well as

493
00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 2: Matt Walsh. And under no circumstances do you have to

494
00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:44,480
Speaker 2: hand up to Matt Walsh. But this prompted them to

495
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 2: be like, no, actually, we don't believe in hate speech

496
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 2: as a legitimate legal category. There should be social consequences

497
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 2: for people who celebrate the murder of an innocent man,

498
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 2: but there should not be legal consequences for hate speech. Right,

499
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 2: We're fine with the government helping us like docks you

500
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 2: and get you fired from your job, but prosecuting hate

501
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 2: speech as a category is something that we do not

502
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:09,400
Speaker 2: agree with, and neither did Charlie Kirk. So there's been

503
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 2: like that small reaction, which then prompted Pambondi to be like, no,

504
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 2: when I say hate speech, what I really mean is

505
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:17,440
Speaker 2: like threats and assignment of violence, and like, yeah, okay.

506
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 4: Fighting words I think is a legal term, right, Like

507
00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:21,160
Speaker 4: incitements to violence.

508
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, And you know, there's some stuff that's always been

509
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 1: illegal and never been punished. For example, when conservatives, I've

510
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:31,199
Speaker 1: been dealing with this for years, threaten to kill and

511
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:34,119
Speaker 1: rape activists and show up outside of their houses and

512
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,960
Speaker 1: harass them. As a general rule, the police don't do anything. Yeah,

513
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 1: if those activists are on the left, right, even though

514
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 1: that crosses the boundary into fighting words, however, they have

515
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 1: legally could they choose not to.

516
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:44,720
Speaker 2: Right.

517
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 1: But if someone is out there saying in the wake

518
00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,760
Speaker 1: of the Charlie Kirk shooting, I want to incite people

519
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 1: to kill this person, that is illegal. You're not allowed

520
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 1: to say I want to incite people to murder this person.

521
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 1: That is a crime. If you're posting insane say that

522
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,439
Speaker 1: you have broken the law. They won't go after a

523
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,400
Speaker 1: conservative for doing that. But they'll go after you, right

524
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: like that is how things work, you know. However, we

525
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: have seen people who have been attacked for speech that

526
00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 1: absolutely is not crossing the line into fighting words.

527
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:17,880
Speaker 6: Right.

528
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,120
Speaker 1: One of the better examples for this happened at Texas Tech.

529
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 3: It happened.

530
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 1: You've had variends of this happened at a couple of

531
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 1: colleges all around the country. They're specifically at Texas Tech,

532
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:32,040
Speaker 1: which is, you know, one of Texas's kind of premier

533
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 1: state schools.

534
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 3: There was a video of.

535
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 1: An incident on the day that Charlie Kirk was killed,

536
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:42,719
Speaker 1: where a student scene jumping up and down, yelling profanity

537
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 1: at a vigil in a free speech zone outside of

538
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:49,040
Speaker 1: a student union building on the campus, saying y'all, Homie dead,

539
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 1: making fun of people who were mourning Kirk's death. At

540
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 1: one point, she touched a guy's hat. The video of

541
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: her went viral. Governor Greg Abbott called for her to

542
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 1: be arrested and expelled. She was expelled immediately. She was

543
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 1: arrested and charged with assaults shortly thereafter. Her family has

544
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,399
Speaker 1: not made a statement. Very wisely, There's really nothing they

545
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 1: could say that would be great.

546
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:11,840
Speaker 3: At this point.

547
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:16,199
Speaker 1: There has been some pushback from student organizations in the

548
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: state because this is blatantly illegal. Calling what she did

549
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 1: assault is nonsense. In my opinion from watching the video,

550
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,639
Speaker 1: she was at a free speech zone. Laughing y'all homely

551
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 1: dead when someone is killed is not fighting words. That

552
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 1: is not illegal. You are allowed to say stuff like

553
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: that under the letter of the law. Does this mean

554
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:40,960
Speaker 1: this person won't get convicted of a crime. It's Texas,

555
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: and she's a black woman, she might. And this is

556
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 1: very chilling. This is deeply concerning, right. This is not

557
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 1: the only case. There's a universe, smaller university outside of

558
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: Austin where again a student was videotaped celebrating individual for

559
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: Kirk's death. That person was expelled as well. There have

560
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,560
Speaker 1: been a number of teachers fired obviously, stuff like this

561
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: has been happening all over the country, right, And this

562
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 1: is deeply worrying. And even if even if the space

563
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 1: of possibility closes on these people faster than they're expecting,

564
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 1: if the crackdown on the Open Society Foundation doesn't happen,

565
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 1: if this Antifa stuff doesn't go any further than the

566
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 1: last time they've talked about going after Antifa, stuff like

567
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 1: this is going to continue to happen, and it will

568
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 1: only accelerate over the next couple of years, right, and

569
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: that is a massive problem.

570
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 2: Part of this culture shift can be seen in what

571
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 2: some people are probably not very smartly calling the biggest

572
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 2: attack on free speech they've ever seen in their life,

573
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: which is on Wednesday evening, ABC put Jimmy Kimmel's show

574
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 2: on hold quote unquote indefinitely, following pressure from the FCC

575
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 2: and affiliate stations owned by Nextstar. Before ABC's announcement next

576
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 2: our release statement quote, Next Stars owned and partner television

577
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 2: stations affiliated with the NBC Television Network will preempt Jimmy

578
00:29:57,720 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: Kimmel Live for the foreseeable future, beginning with.

579
00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 4: To it's show.

580
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 2: Next to Our strongly objects to the recent comments made

581
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 2: by mister Kimmel concerning the killing and Charlie Kirk and

582
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 2: will replace the show with other programming in its ABC

583
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 2: affiliated markets unquote. Sinclair Broadcasting also stated it would not

584
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 2: air Kimmel's show and called on Kimmel to apologize to

585
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:17,920
Speaker 2: the Kirk family and donates to the Kirk family as

586
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 2: well as TPUSA. Earlier that Wednesday, FCC Chairman Brendan Carr

587
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 2: advocated on the conservative podcaster Benny Johnson's show. Quote, it's

588
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 2: really sort of past time that a lot of these

589
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 2: licensed broadcasters themselves push back on Comcast Disney and say,

590
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 2: we are not going to run Kimmel anymore until you

591
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 2: straighten this out, and we, the licensed broadcaster, are running

592
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 2: the possibility of fines or license revocation from the SEC

593
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 2: if we continue to run content that ends up being

594
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 2: a pattern of news distortion unquote. Carr then made vague

595
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 2: threats towards like direct FCC involvement. Quote, we can do

596
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,800
Speaker 2: this easy way or the hard way. These companies can

597
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 2: find ways to change con it can take action frankly

598
00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 2: on Kimmel, or there's going to be additional work for

599
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 2: the FCC ahead on quote. The FCC controls broadcast licenses

600
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 2: for local TV channels, and next Star is planning a

601
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 2: merger with Tegna, which requires SEC approval. And this is

602
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 2: obviously a coerced attack on free speech.

603
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: And we've seen a lot of people shows and whatnot

604
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 1: getting polled and people speaking out getting in trouble because

605
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: they're companies. They're trying to do a merger. Right, that's

606
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 1: not new.

607
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 2: Yes, this has happened with ABC already, this happened with

608
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:36,360
Speaker 2: a CBS and paramount. I think some people, including people

609
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 2: on the right, are misunderstanding some of the circumstances of

610
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 2: the firing or the being put on hold, as well

611
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 2: as what like Kimmel said, Like kim wasn't joking about

612
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: or celebrating Kirk's death. What he did do is possibly

613
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 2: like falsely insinuate that the shooter was Mega when evidence

614
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 2: at the time pointed otherwise. Kimmell said, quote, we hit

615
00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 2: some new lows over the weekend with the Maga gang

616
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,840
Speaker 2: desperately trying to characterize the kid who murdered Charlie Kirk

617
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 2: as anything other than one of them and doing everything

618
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 2: they can to score political points from it.

619
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 4: Unquote.

620
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 2: He then went on to tell a joke about how

621
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 2: Trump did not seem very sad in the wake of

622
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 2: Charliekirk's death, comparing the death to a goldfish in Trump's mind.

623
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 2: That was the way the joke was framed. Yeah, so

624
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 2: that's what Kimmel actually said. You can interpret that either way.

625
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 2: Whether he's just saying that megas are desperately trying to

626
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 2: make it look like he's not one of them, and

627
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 2: scoring political points. Or you can interpret it as Kimmel

628
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 2: kind of insinuating that the shooter probably is mega. I

629
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:40,520
Speaker 2: don't know Kimmel's mind. I'm not sure what he exactly

630
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 2: meant by that. But the Rolling Stone reported that sources

631
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 2: told them the quote. Senior executives at ABC, its owner,

632
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 2: Disney and affiliates convened emergency meetings to figure out how

633
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 2: to minimize the damage. Multiple execs felt Kimmel had not

634
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 2: actually said anything over the line, but the threat of

635
00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 2: Trump administration retaliation loomed. Yeah, and this is again, this

636
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 2: is chilling, absolutely chilling speech. The things he said, we're

637
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 2: not in line with the best available evidence at the

638
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 2: time that he said them. But they weren't hate speech,

639
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 2: they were not incitement to violence. There was nothing a

640
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 2: league know about them. And again you had a fucking

641
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,200
Speaker 2: right wing figure on television urging for homeless people to

642
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 2: be executed, the involuntary lethal ejection to solve the homeless crisis. Quote,

643
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 2: just kill them. He's not getting fired.

644
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 1: No, he had to make a half assed apology, but

645
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 1: that's it.

646
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,239
Speaker 5: Yeah, I can had to pretend to be sorry if

647
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 5: I had a nickel for every time someone on Fox

648
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:42,400
Speaker 5: News said that like any mass shooter at all was

649
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 5: linked to a trans person, Like none of my trans

650
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 5: friends would ever be homeless. Again, Like they say this

651
00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 5: shit all the time and nothing happens, even though it

652
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 5: is I mean literally just it is straight up tofammatory yep.

653
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 5: And they say that shit constantly and nothing happens. And

654
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 5: this is just a the pure I mean example of

655
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 5: just the latant political suppression of speech. And also this

656
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 5: sort of like we talked about this with the mergers,

657
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 5: is the structural problem with the way that like the

658
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 5: American quote unquote free press is supposed to be structured,

659
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 5: which is that they're all for profit companies and because

660
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 5: of that, all you need to do is just buy

661
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:25,359
Speaker 5: out or threaten their profit enough and they'll just fall

662
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 5: on line. And that's what we've been watching with news

663
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 5: outlet after news outlets, news outlet like firing anyone who

664
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:31,960
Speaker 5: said anything being about Kirk.

665
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:32,680
Speaker 3: Yep.

666
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 2: I think with that that concludes our Charlie Kirk assassination

667
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 2: aftermath discussion for now, But there is in fact other

668
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 2: news this week happening. James, do you have stuff, Yeah,

669
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 2: un Fortunately, I'm like, I'm like bracing myself because I

670
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:51,359
Speaker 2: know that James's news is never that good either.

671
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 4: Yeah.

672
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 3: So the good news these days.

673
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 2: Really the passport thing was killed, right, the Mark Ruvio.

674
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:01,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's some good news.

675
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:04,040
Speaker 1: Actually, there was a Senate bill, a writer on a

676
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,760
Speaker 1: bill that was introduced that would have given Marco Rubio

677
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 1: the power to revoke passports for citizens for effectively political

678
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 1: speech and the guise of speech protecting you know, quote

679
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: unquote terrorists. That failed, like that was pulled by the sponsor,

680
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:22,920
Speaker 1: which is good. There was a backlash to it, and

681
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:30,880
Speaker 1: again when there's backlashes, that's that's good. Yeah yeah, yeah.

682
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's it's so annoying to have to

683
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 2: like we all know that like pointing out the hypocrisy

684
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 2: doesn't work as like a real strategy. But like there's

685
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: if there's a way besides that to like actually channel

686
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 2: resistance to these authoritarian and like speech chilling measures besides

687
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 2: just smugly going like haha, the Party of free speech

688
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 2: strikes again, which I understand how that's emotionally compelling. Well,

689
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:56,319
Speaker 2: it's not going to stop them from taking away your

690
00:35:56,360 --> 00:36:00,319
Speaker 2: free speech. No, yeah, speaking of free speech, here's some

691
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 2: free ads.

692
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:16,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, we are back I don't worry, folks. It is

693
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 4: all downhill from here. I'm afraid because things have not

694
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 4: been good outside of the coverage and repercussions of the

695
00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:27,799
Speaker 4: Charlie Kirk shooting. And to start with, I want us

696
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 4: to talk about Ghana. This is one of those stories

697
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:33,440
Speaker 4: that unfortunately has been kind of eclipsed this week, but

698
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,239
Speaker 4: it shouldn't be, so we're going to talk about it. So,

699
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:38,600
Speaker 4: the United States has begun using Ghana as a pass

700
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 4: through to send people back to other countries in West Africa.

701
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:47,279
Speaker 4: In international law, when somebody has protection from being sent

702
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,960
Speaker 4: to a place and you send them back via another place,

703
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 4: that is called chain refoulment.

704
00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:53,359
Speaker 1: Right.

705
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,319
Speaker 4: One could probably also pronounce that it's a bit where

706
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 4: a French word, but I have decided not to. In

707
00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:00,719
Speaker 4: this instance, I'm sending people to Ghana when their home

708
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 4: countries has been deemed to be too dangerous by a

709
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:07,319
Speaker 4: United States court, or they are unable to send them

710
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:10,320
Speaker 4: back to that country for some other reason. Right, people

711
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:13,040
Speaker 4: in this part of the world don't need visas to travel,

712
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 4: so they can send them to neighboring countries without requiring

713
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 4: Like that, the Ghana can just bust them back, right,

714
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 4: it doesn't require a great deal of paperwork. So a

715
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 4: court has ordered the United States that there was an

716
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,080
Speaker 4: attempt right to secure protections for these people via them

717
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 4: into a temporary restraining order to prevent them either being

718
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 4: sent away. Some of them were in Ghana at the

719
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 4: time the case was filed, right, so to prevent them

720
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 4: being sent from Ghana to places where they may face

721
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 4: as we're about to hear, torture, death, pretty much the

722
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 4: worst ship that can happen to people. So the court

723
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 4: did order the United States to produce a document which

724
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:54,239
Speaker 4: details the exact nature of its agreement with Ghana. At

725
00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:57,319
Speaker 4: the time I'm writing, the United States has not produced that.

726
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 4: Gharanean sources have repeatedly suggest did that one exists. Right

727
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 4: in Ghanan government press conferences and internal Ghanan news reporting,

728
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 4: the case was bought by both Gambia and Nigerian citizens, right,

729
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 4: so people who don't want to be returned to those

730
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:20,440
Speaker 4: countries and their attempt to obtain a restraining order. In

731
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:23,040
Speaker 4: one instance, one of the people who bought the case

732
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 4: fled after torture by the police and military and was

733
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 4: explicitly told that if he came back they would kill

734
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 4: him and what the US is doing here is using

735
00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:34,360
Speaker 4: Ghana as a pass through to send him back.

736
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 1: Right.

737
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, some of them also detailed in the case they're

738
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 4: transport They said they were in straight jackets for sixteen

739
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:45,040
Speaker 4: hours on the flight the US. Right, the government, the

740
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 4: United States government in this instance has once again claimed

741
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,200
Speaker 4: that these people are out of its hands and it

742
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,399
Speaker 4: has no way of stopping the government of Ghana from

743
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 4: sending them back to these other countries. Right. This is

744
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 4: an argument that is attempted to make in several other instances,

745
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 4: and I do just want to fly that like this

746
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:05,719
Speaker 4: use of third party countries for deportation has much increased

747
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,319
Speaker 4: under the Trump administration, that it was the Biden administration

748
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 4: who begun funding Panamanian deportations right way before Donald Trump

749
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:18,279
Speaker 4: was even elected, and I have documented that extensively in

750
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 4: my series on the Darien Gap. The court determined in

751
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:25,720
Speaker 4: this case that it didn't have the jurisdiction to grant

752
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 4: the plaintiff's relief right, so that means that they're not

753
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 4: able to get a restraining order. One of the people

754
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:32,880
Speaker 4: had actually already been returned to the place where they

755
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:36,600
Speaker 4: had a convention against torture, protection from and was in

756
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,040
Speaker 4: hiding at the time. At the court case right, the

757
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:41,839
Speaker 4: judge said that the government's actions were part of a

758
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 4: quoting here pattern and widespread effort to evade the government's

759
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:50,799
Speaker 4: legal obligations by doing indirectly what it cannot do directly.

760
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 4: We are recording this on the eighteenth of September. It's

761
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,800
Speaker 4: a Thursday, and about fifteen minutes ago, another United States

762
00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 4: flight just landed in Ghana. Practice of BSHB ongoing. Secondly,

763
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,920
Speaker 4: what I want to talk about is sadly another shooting,

764
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:11,799
Speaker 4: the killing of Silverio Viegas Gonzales in Chicago. Diegos. Gonzales

765
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:14,720
Speaker 4: was a thirty eight year old father, a Mexican national,

766
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:19,439
Speaker 4: and he was shot by either one or two ICE

767
00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 4: agents while driving away from them. An ICE statement claimed

768
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:25,359
Speaker 4: that he drove towards them and ended up dragging an

769
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 4: agent a significant distance. Surveillance camera footage at the scene

770
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:33,200
Speaker 4: shows one agent talking to Vegas Gonzales in his vehicle.

771
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 4: We then see the vehicle reverse away from them and

772
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:40,360
Speaker 4: then move around them to the left when it sees

773
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 4: a gap in traffic. The ICE agents have placed their vehicle,

774
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 4: which is an SUV, in front of his vehicle. Sort

775
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:49,719
Speaker 4: of cramping it into the curve right, so he has

776
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 4: to reverse backwards and then move forward and to the

777
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 4: left in order to try and drive away, which is

778
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:58,120
Speaker 4: what he's trying to do. Right. We can only see

779
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 4: one of the officers in the footooth We see the

780
00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 4: other officer later in other footage. The officer in the

781
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 4: footage does not appear to be dragged that he appears

782
00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 4: to draw his weapon in by standard footage. We then

783
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:13,560
Speaker 4: see two officers pull theegas Gonzales from the vehicle and

784
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 4: they begin administering first aid. We're just rewatching the footage

785
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:20,319
Speaker 4: now and you can see the other age and on

786
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:21,520
Speaker 4: the other side of the vehicle.

787
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 2: This sounds very similar to the time that Ice shot

788
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 2: at the car driving away just a few weeks ago.

789
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:32,879
Speaker 4: Sure, and Sam Beernardino absolutely, Yeah. Generally, I have no

790
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 4: idea of what rules Ice are operating under. It's not

791
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,799
Speaker 4: considered best practice to open fire a vehicle that is

792
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 4: moving away from you unless it is actively endangering no

793
00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 4: someone else's life, right.

794
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 1: In part because even if it's endangering someone else's life,

795
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:50,759
Speaker 1: a handgun will not stop a car. Yeah, maybe you

796
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 1: hit the driver, but the odds are just as good,

797
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,720
Speaker 1: if not much better, then it goes through a window

798
00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 1: and remains lethal going past the car during people's lives.

799
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:04,400
Speaker 5: And also it's worth mentioning on the other side of

800
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 5: the car from the officer who we see draw his

801
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 5: gun is the other agent. Yes, yeah, so if you're

802
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:14,640
Speaker 5: shooting at the car, you're you're shooting at your other.

803
00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 1: Agian guns don't stop cars generally, unless you're calling a

804
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 1: fifty caliber anti materiel rifle. Guns don't stop cars. Yeah,

805
00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:28,320
Speaker 1: they do stop people, but they but they keep bullets

806
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 1: keep going when they miss. It's just bad. It's a

807
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:33,919
Speaker 1: bad thing to do. It's irresponsible. It's normal cop shit.

808
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, so what we see is at least two shots fired,

809
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,399
Speaker 4: and then we begin to see that then they leave

810
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 4: the screen of the surveillance camera, right, so we don't

811
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 4: see exactly like we're unable to see. I guess where

812
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 4: those bullets impact the bystander. Footy Sen shows his vehicle

813
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,240
Speaker 4: crashed into the undercarriage of a large lorry like a truck,

814
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:04,400
Speaker 4: and he's hit that vehicle in a way that could

815
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 4: also have been fatal, right like the way that he's

816
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:10,200
Speaker 4: he's hit that vehicle, like the engine block of the

817
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 4: car goes underneath, so it would be the driver who

818
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,680
Speaker 4: would take the main impact because the because the trailer

819
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:19,399
Speaker 4: is higher off the ground. Right, Hopefully that's making sense

820
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 4: to people. Totally, he's traveled about one hundred feet in

821
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 4: this time period. Unraveled Press have a pretty good account

822
00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:28,360
Speaker 4: of this. I've cobbled together I think most of the

823
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:31,959
Speaker 4: open source video and also the surveillance video. There don't

824
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:36,200
Speaker 4: appear in those videos to be any other agents present,

825
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:39,480
Speaker 4: and when we see the agents rendering aid, none of

826
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:42,160
Speaker 4: them appears to be in the state someone would be

827
00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:45,840
Speaker 4: had they been dragged by a fast moving car. Also, again,

828
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:48,080
Speaker 4: like with reference to shooting at a moving vehicle, off

829
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:51,839
Speaker 4: the moving vehicle is dragging your colleague, you're shooting also

830
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:55,840
Speaker 4: at your colleague if you shoot at the vehicle. So, unfortunately,

831
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,360
Speaker 4: one of this changes the fact that this guy is

832
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 4: now dead. Right. The Mexican Consular has confirmed his age.

833
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 4: They said he was working as a cook as his profession,

834
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 4: and that he was from michual Pun. The consulate has

835
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:12,040
Speaker 4: been in touch with his family. Generally, I'm not familiar

836
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:14,960
Speaker 4: with this instance and what will happen. Generally, the Mexican

837
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:19,240
Speaker 4: Consulate will help with returning the remains of Mexican nationals

838
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:23,880
Speaker 4: to their families in Mexico. That's most of what I

839
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 4: have on his death. It seems to have moved like

840
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 4: very quickly through the news cycle, which is unfortunate because

841
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 4: obviously you have children who have lost a father here

842
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 4: like this. This is a tragedy too.

843
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, this is tragic. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

844
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,640
Speaker 5: You know, And I am sitting here haunted by the

845
00:44:40,680 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 5: fact that they killed this guy two days after the

846
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 5: Charlie Kirk shooting. I think most of the people who

847
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:48,880
Speaker 5: are listening to the show right now don't know this happened.

848
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, these agents aren't going to get prosecuted into court

849
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:54,360
Speaker 2: of law for this, the same way that absolutely the

850
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:55,560
Speaker 2: Charlie kirkisas ad will.

851
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, generally, like local dealer, there have been some cases,

852
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:02,840
Speaker 4: but I'm not really aware of any filed against Border

853
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 4: Patrol agents. Generally, DHS has an agency which investigates like

854
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 4: use of force incidents, right, and it is I will

855
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:15,280
Speaker 4: say it is extremely There have been times when agents

856
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 4: have been charged.

857
00:45:18,040 --> 00:45:22,800
Speaker 2: They are rare Stephen Miller's DHSS. That seems very unlikely.

858
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like I'm aware of some charges, for instance, in

859
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 4: San Diego for like agents who have allowed drugs to

860
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 4: cross the border.

861
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:32,839
Speaker 5: Right, sure, it is pretty rare. Yeah, So let's let's

862
00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:36,839
Speaker 5: talk about what ICE's occupation of Chicago has been. Like, Yeah,

863
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 5: I kind of want to start with something that's been

864
00:45:41,080 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 5: very frustrating, which is a lot of the way that

865
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:48,160
Speaker 5: Chicago has been discussed in the wake of Trump, like

866
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:53,399
Speaker 5: not deploying the National Guard. There has been about oh,

867
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 5: if you resist Trumpet will like, you know, you can

868
00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 5: defeat him, and like that's true. But also ICE and

869
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:02,600
Speaker 5: Border patrol are on the ground in Chicago as we're

870
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:04,960
Speaker 5: listening to this right now, dragging people from their homes.

871
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 5: The raids have gone to a significant extent the way

872
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:17,239
Speaker 5: that we expected them to. They have been largely very

873
00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,839
Speaker 5: very fast lightning raids. A lot of them have been

874
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:23,560
Speaker 5: an outlying part of Chicago land, which has been making

875
00:46:23,560 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 5: it difficult to both track them and determine numbers because

876
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:30,080
Speaker 5: a lot of these parts of these massive Chicago suburbs.

877
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,719
Speaker 5: We're going to talk about one later called Elgin that

878
00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:35,160
Speaker 5: has one hundred thousand people in it, but also doesn't

879
00:46:35,360 --> 00:46:38,360
Speaker 5: have the kind of I mean they have like local journalists,

880
00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:40,719
Speaker 5: but they don't have like the kind of press core

881
00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:44,960
Speaker 5: that they're like the city of Chicago proper has and

882
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,359
Speaker 5: so documentation isn't much harder, which is part of why

883
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:50,960
Speaker 5: they've been striking out there. It's largely been Ice, but

884
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:55,120
Speaker 5: Border Patrol has shown up, and part of the Border

885
00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,359
Speaker 5: Patrol appearing has been that this has also been a

886
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:02,160
Speaker 5: giant pr blitz for a Trump administration officials, as the

887
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 5: people at Unraveled have pointed out, and we'll be talking

888
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,000
Speaker 5: to them more next week about what things have been

889
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 5: like on the ground. A senior Border Patrol official, Gregory

890
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:15,840
Speaker 5: Bovino has claimed too, we don't actually have like photograph

891
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 5: everyone's in there, but he was posting on X that

892
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:21,720
Speaker 5: he was. He went to Franklin Park, which is where

893
00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 5: Ice shot that guy a couple of days after the shooting. Okay,

894
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:31,840
Speaker 5: he has been releasing an entire stream of TikTok and

895
00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 5: X posts to sort of like advertise his presence in

896
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:36,360
Speaker 5: the city and doing this whole we did this in

897
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 5: LA or doing this here now thing. JMC. You don't

898
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:40,319
Speaker 5: talk a little bit about who he.

899
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:44,760
Speaker 4: Is, Yeah, I do. So. Beveno was, at least until recently,

900
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 4: he's appeared to be as you say working in Chicago now.

901
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:52,840
Speaker 4: His Twitter now reads Commander op at Large CA Gregory K. Bavino.

902
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:55,240
Speaker 4: He was a chief patrol agent in Neil Centro sector

903
00:47:55,480 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 4: when we saw Operation Return to Sender right. Operation Return

904
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:00,880
Speaker 4: Tocember was December of twenty t twenty four. That's happened

905
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:04,839
Speaker 4: under a Biden administration. This was the first of these

906
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 4: border patrol roving stops way north of the border, right

907
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 4: up in the central Valley, stopping people in home depots,

908
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:17,319
Speaker 4: stopping people people who appeared to be Latino, Latina Latine

909
00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:20,960
Speaker 4: on the street. I would say that cal Matters has

910
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:23,120
Speaker 4: had a really good coverage of that, and I can

911
00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:25,880
Speaker 4: link it in the show notes. We also saw the

912
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:28,400
Speaker 4: deployment of Border Patrol to La right, that was the

913
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:30,760
Speaker 4: El Centre section, So people aren't familiar with El Centro

914
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:33,799
Speaker 4: east of San Diego along the border right, it's sort

915
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 4: of most of the way to Arizona if your driving

916
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 4: from San Diego. He is really, like I would say,

917
00:48:39,080 --> 00:48:41,760
Speaker 4: a man of the moment in terms of Trump's border patrol.

918
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:44,920
Speaker 4: Right like, border Patrol is an agency that's changed a

919
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 4: lot over the years. There was a time with Border

920
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:49,840
Speaker 4: Patrol recruiter from the Peace corps now is not that time.

921
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 4: One thing that Bevino has been very good at in

922
00:48:55,160 --> 00:48:57,920
Speaker 4: the sense of like doing what the administration wants from

923
00:48:57,920 --> 00:48:59,520
Speaker 4: a border patrol agent right now is his use of

924
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:01,800
Speaker 4: social media. My understanding is that they have a whole

925
00:49:01,840 --> 00:49:04,759
Speaker 4: team dedicated to this in the El Centro sector, right,

926
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:07,640
Speaker 4: that they have videographers and photographers and such to make

927
00:49:08,160 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 4: social media for the border patrol. And Bavina really seems

928
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:16,560
Speaker 4: to have been stepping up in importance, like he has

929
00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:19,000
Speaker 4: this sort of he also cuts a very distinctive figure

930
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:22,839
Speaker 4: with this kind of crop side haircut, like you can

931
00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:24,239
Speaker 4: find a picture of his haircut online. I don't how

932
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:27,160
Speaker 4: to describe it. It's where the brick picture shows him

933
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:31,319
Speaker 4: holding an ar with a low powered variable octic Like

934
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 4: he is this new tactical, aggressive, very aggressive social media

935
00:49:37,560 --> 00:49:41,720
Speaker 4: presence border patrol officer. Right. And we've seen El Centro

936
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 4: Border Patrol station specifically be at the forefront of a

937
00:49:45,160 --> 00:49:48,480
Speaker 4: lot of these operations. As I said, even going back

938
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:52,800
Speaker 4: to the Biden era, if you're wondering, border patrol sectors

939
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:55,520
Speaker 4: are not just around the cities that they're named for, right,

940
00:49:55,719 --> 00:49:57,680
Speaker 4: They can go a long way north, So it's the

941
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:00,359
Speaker 4: San Diego sector, the El Centro sector. These are not

942
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:03,200
Speaker 4: necessarily defined by places that you would recognize as being

943
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:05,760
Speaker 4: close to San Diego or El Centro, which is why

944
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:07,759
Speaker 4: you would have seen them operating as far north as

945
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:11,200
Speaker 4: Los Angeles. I'm not as familiar with northern border sectors,

946
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:13,560
Speaker 4: haven't spent as much time there, but I would imagine

947
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:16,080
Speaker 4: that there is a border patrail sector that attains to

948
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 4: the area that Chicago is in. So perhaps, but you know,

949
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:21,640
Speaker 4: it's now doing some kind of operational command for these

950
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 4: urban things rather than working in that sector. I'm not

951
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:26,920
Speaker 4: entirely sure, but yeah, that's who he is.

952
00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:29,719
Speaker 5: Yeah, and he's been you know, he's been making an

953
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:33,279
Speaker 5: enormous deal of showing up in Chicago, and this has

954
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:37,080
Speaker 5: been something that's increasingly This is part of what it

955
00:50:37,160 --> 00:50:39,560
Speaker 5: means for ice and Border Patrol to show up in

956
00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:44,440
Speaker 5: the city, is you get these fucking, just absolutely hideous

957
00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 5: pr ops. On Tuesday, Kercy nome last scene shooting a

958
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:55,280
Speaker 5: dog joined a raid in Elgin, which is a pretty

959
00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:58,920
Speaker 5: far flung suburb of Chicago with about one hundred thousand

960
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:03,440
Speaker 5: people in it, and she showed up to do basically

961
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:07,400
Speaker 5: a PR junket at this raid at five in the

962
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:11,719
Speaker 5: morning in Elgin, where I survived with helicopters. They blew

963
00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:15,240
Speaker 5: up someone's door and they grabbed a bunch of people,

964
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:17,320
Speaker 5: and then they were forced to release two of the

965
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:19,880
Speaker 5: seven people they grabbed because they immediately turned out to

966
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 5: be US citizens. Kurst has denied that they detained them

967
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,600
Speaker 5: and said that, oh no, actually we just separated them

968
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 5: for their protection. What we did the operation like that

969
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,359
Speaker 5: doesn't seem to be true from everything that we've heard

970
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:41,440
Speaker 5: from witnesses the scene. But yeah, this is you know,

971
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:45,399
Speaker 5: these are the way that these enforcement operations, the way

972
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:47,719
Speaker 5: that these raids have gone is at the beginning of

973
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:50,799
Speaker 5: a major operation, cycles turned into these press circuits for

974
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:51,959
Speaker 5: people like Chursy Nome.

975
00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:54,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, GNOME's been on a few raids like this has

976
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:57,319
Speaker 4: been a consistent thing, right, that these raids are a

977
00:51:57,360 --> 00:51:59,960
Speaker 4: content creation exercises much tall law enforcement.

978
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: Yes, and it excuse to dress up all that good stuff.

979
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:05,560
Speaker 5: Yeah, and you know it. It's this, it's this like

980
00:52:05,719 --> 00:52:08,759
Speaker 5: reveling both in this you know, in this sort of

981
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:12,320
Speaker 5: like like constructed like I'm holding an air fifteen lookout

982
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:15,280
Speaker 5: tough I am image and also just in the cruelty

983
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:17,480
Speaker 5: and the suffering in the same way that the alligator

984
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:21,600
Speaker 5: Alcatraz stuff was. But it's worth noting that most of

985
00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:23,840
Speaker 5: the raids have not looked like this, Like this this

986
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:27,440
Speaker 5: was a raid where like, you know, people were woken

987
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:30,719
Speaker 5: up in this basically this random suburb at five in

988
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:32,879
Speaker 5: the morning because like they heard an explosion and ice

989
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:35,160
Speaker 5: had blocked off all of their streets and their armored

990
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,160
Speaker 5: vehicles and helicopters. Most of what they've been are not

991
00:52:38,400 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 5: like that. They've been following the pattern established in LA

992
00:52:42,360 --> 00:52:47,040
Speaker 5: of very very rapid raids to avoid rep response networks,

993
00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:50,800
Speaker 5: targeting accombination of houses, job sites, and you know, places

994
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:54,480
Speaker 5: like home depot and you know, when we talked about

995
00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:57,200
Speaker 5: this beginning a couple of weeks ago, we talked about

996
00:52:57,239 --> 00:53:00,960
Speaker 5: how these people are being deployed largely from this naval

997
00:53:01,040 --> 00:53:04,160
Speaker 5: base that is hours out from the city, right And

998
00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:06,479
Speaker 5: that's part of why these a lot of these raids,

999
00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:08,680
Speaker 5: although they have been going to the South Side, which

1000
00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:11,880
Speaker 5: is significantly far away, but a lot of these raids

1001
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:14,479
Speaker 5: have been in places like Elgin that are further north

1002
00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:18,239
Speaker 5: and are more outlying because they are closer to this

1003
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 5: naval base than the core of the city of Chicago,

1004
00:53:22,760 --> 00:53:25,360
Speaker 5: and it's easier to do there because there's less resistance.

1005
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:28,160
Speaker 5: There's been a bunch of raids in Elgin. They took

1006
00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:32,880
Speaker 5: a student from a community college. They've just been dragging

1007
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:36,200
Speaker 5: people from their homes and workplaces. There was a very

1008
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 5: very well publicized raid in Naperville, which is another sort

1009
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:42,759
Speaker 5: of outlying suburb, where they grabbed people who are like

1010
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:43,880
Speaker 5: fixing someone's roof.

1011
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:46,640
Speaker 4: Was that the one where people remained on the roof?

1012
00:53:46,920 --> 00:53:49,400
Speaker 4: Yeah some time? Yeah, okay, yeah.

1013
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:53,799
Speaker 5: Yeah, really horrible seeing people are extremely pissed off. There's

1014
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 5: another story that I's gotten very very little coverage that

1015
00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 5: was horrifying in Displains, which is the suburb just north

1016
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 5: of Oha, where ice agents and masks did a very

1017
00:54:04,040 --> 00:54:05,560
Speaker 5: very standard thing that they've been doing.

1018
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 2: You know.

1019
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:07,520
Speaker 5: This is, I mean a kind of standard ice tactic

1020
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:10,880
Speaker 5: where they wait for people to get back into a

1021
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:13,080
Speaker 5: truck and then they block the truck off with their

1022
00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:16,360
Speaker 5: trucks to prevent it from leaving. And I'm going to

1023
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:19,200
Speaker 5: read a CBS report of what happened next because I

1024
00:54:19,239 --> 00:54:21,840
Speaker 5: think it's important to understand what is actually like for

1025
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 5: these people. Edgar, who's one of the people who was

1026
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:29,279
Speaker 5: in the car said that when the agent originally came

1027
00:54:29,320 --> 00:54:32,320
Speaker 5: to the passenger door, he tried holding the door closed

1028
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 5: for preventing him from opening it. He said at the

1029
00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 5: time that he and his family had no idea who

1030
00:54:38,760 --> 00:54:41,560
Speaker 5: was at the vehicle, and everyone was scared. When the

1031
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:44,640
Speaker 5: agent tried opening the door, Edgar said he was tased

1032
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:47,320
Speaker 5: in the face. That's when he told everyone in the

1033
00:54:47,360 --> 00:54:50,840
Speaker 5: truck to run for their lives. Despite being a US citizen,

1034
00:54:51,200 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 5: they ran out of fear. So what's happening here is

1035
00:54:55,120 --> 00:54:58,440
Speaker 5: there's these two brothers and their dad who is undocumented.

1036
00:54:58,480 --> 00:55:03,440
Speaker 5: The two brothers were born in Chicago, and they block

1037
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:06,360
Speaker 5: off this car. They show up in masks. The people

1038
00:55:06,360 --> 00:55:08,359
Speaker 5: in the car have absolutely no idea who they are,

1039
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 5: and when they try to not get their car broken into,

1040
00:55:12,080 --> 00:55:14,680
Speaker 5: they tase this guy, who is an American citizen in

1041
00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:17,479
Speaker 5: the face. He has to go to the hospital because

1042
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:22,680
Speaker 5: they tased him in the face. And this there are

1043
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:25,759
Speaker 5: stories like this. This is a particularly bad one, but

1044
00:55:25,760 --> 00:55:27,319
Speaker 5: there are stories like the rest of the raids that

1045
00:55:27,320 --> 00:55:31,440
Speaker 5: we've been talking about every single day in Chicago that

1046
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:34,440
Speaker 5: do not break containments at all. In a country that

1047
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:38,359
Speaker 5: is literally entirely just talking about Charlie Kirk. There are

1048
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:41,359
Speaker 5: people being dragged from their homes. There are people being

1049
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:43,760
Speaker 5: dragged from their fucking places of work, They're being dragged

1050
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:48,800
Speaker 5: from their schools. And this is just what the US

1051
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 5: is right now now, as fucking unbelievably bleak as this

1052
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:58,520
Speaker 5: is right, and people are terrified, but they're also angry,

1053
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:01,839
Speaker 5: and people are also organizing, and as we saw in LA,

1054
00:56:01,880 --> 00:56:04,359
Speaker 5: people are forming rapid response networks and they're showing up

1055
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,960
Speaker 5: in places that I never would have thought. I mean,

1056
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:10,640
Speaker 5: maybe there'd be NGO networks, but they're doing things in

1057
00:56:10,680 --> 00:56:14,000
Speaker 5: places I just wouldn't have thought possible. I want to

1058
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:16,160
Speaker 5: close this by there was a report on Thursday by

1059
00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:20,959
Speaker 5: Sean Molkay, who's the news editor at The Reader, which

1060
00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:25,000
Speaker 5: is a good independent outlet in Chicago. So ICE tried

1061
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:28,919
Speaker 5: the same tactic of blockading someone's truck and grabbing them

1062
00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:33,880
Speaker 5: in a suburb called Wheaton, Illinois, and a bunch of

1063
00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 5: people when they tried to do this smash and grab

1064
00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 5: of this person's truck, a whole bunch of people showed

1065
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,359
Speaker 5: up and confronted them and screamed at them and recorded them,

1066
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:44,400
Speaker 5: and this caused the ICE people to take off and

1067
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:47,279
Speaker 5: run away without detaining the person. And this is a

1068
00:56:47,360 --> 00:56:50,120
Speaker 5: stunning development if you know anything about either Chicago Land

1069
00:56:50,200 --> 00:56:54,680
Speaker 5: or evangelicalism. Wheaton is the home of Wheaton College, which

1070
00:56:54,719 --> 00:56:56,879
Speaker 5: is like, it's one of like the three big right

1071
00:56:56,920 --> 00:56:59,840
Speaker 5: wing like Christian universities, alongside like Brigham Young and Liberty.

1072
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:04,480
Speaker 5: This is wild. This was one of the home bases

1073
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:07,759
Speaker 5: of power of the Bush era moral majority right like

1074
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:10,840
Speaker 5: Wheaton College is a school where dancing was illegal and

1075
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:13,160
Speaker 5: until two thousand and three, like, they've banned dancing for

1076
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:16,680
Speaker 5: one hundred and forty three years. And if people in

1077
00:57:16,800 --> 00:57:19,920
Speaker 5: Wheaton are showing up to do direct actions against Ice,

1078
00:57:20,320 --> 00:57:23,840
Speaker 5: these people they're cooked, right, They will be able to

1079
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:25,560
Speaker 5: do a significant amount of damage. They have been doing

1080
00:57:25,560 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 5: significant amount of damage. We've just been talking about the

1081
00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:30,160
Speaker 5: amount of damage they've been doing. But if this is

1082
00:57:30,200 --> 00:57:32,480
Speaker 5: what is happening in places that used to be moral

1083
00:57:32,520 --> 00:57:37,840
Speaker 5: majority strongholds right, places that produce some of the most

1084
00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:42,320
Speaker 5: famous like Christian right wingers who shaped an entire half

1085
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:46,640
Speaker 5: century of American politics, if people there are showing up

1086
00:57:46,640 --> 00:57:49,600
Speaker 5: and doing direct actions against Ice and winning, things are

1087
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:55,120
Speaker 5: fucking changing. People are radicalizing very quickly, and despite everything

1088
00:57:55,120 --> 00:57:57,320
Speaker 5: that's been happening by all of the Kirk stuff Trump's

1089
00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:01,280
Speaker 5: pulling keeps getting worse and worse, And I think this

1090
00:58:01,400 --> 00:58:04,280
Speaker 5: is a good reminder that, like these people, part of

1091
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:06,360
Speaker 5: the reason they're moving so fast and so hard right

1092
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:09,640
Speaker 5: now is because they know they are staggeringly unpopular and

1093
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 5: they have to get their crack down and they have

1094
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:15,880
Speaker 5: to build a political and legal power right now before

1095
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:19,120
Speaker 5: it gets even worse for them, and they're terrified that,

1096
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:22,960
Speaker 5: you know, if there are a thousand wheatns, what if

1097
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:27,520
Speaker 5: enough people resist them, they don't have the capacity to

1098
00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 5: stop them. Because everybody fucking hates these people and they

1099
00:58:31,560 --> 00:58:35,320
Speaker 5: hate what they're doing. Nobody actually likes, you know, shock

1100
00:58:35,360 --> 00:58:37,920
Speaker 5: troopers showing up in the neighborhoods and dragging the people

1101
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 5: they love away from them. And it's going to be

1102
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 5: a really, really long and hard battle. But the fact

1103
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:47,960
Speaker 5: that people are fighting in places where that would have

1104
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:53,120
Speaker 5: been unimaginable even ten years ago is I think at

1105
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,640
Speaker 5: least a small sign of hope in the darkness.

1106
00:58:56,760 --> 00:59:00,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's probably where we ought to end, is

1107
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:01,840
Speaker 1: a small sign of hope in the darkness.

1108
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 4: If you would like to contact us, you can do

1109
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:08,840
Speaker 4: so by using our proton mail email address cool Zone

1110
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 4: Tips at proton dot me. It's encrypted if you use

1111
00:59:13,280 --> 00:59:15,000
Speaker 4: an encrypted email address to send.

1112
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:17,000
Speaker 2: We reported the news.

1113
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 3: We reported the news.

1114
00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:30,200
Speaker 6: It could happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.

1115
00:59:30,280 --> 00:59:33,360
Speaker 6: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

1116
00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:37,000
Speaker 6: coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1117
00:59:37,080 --> 00:59:40,640
Speaker 6: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can

1118
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:43,000
Speaker 6: now find sources where it could Happen here listened directly

1119
00:59:43,040 --> 00:59:45,320
Speaker 6: in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.