Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Civic Cipher. I am your host,
Speaker 1: rams Is Jah. Okay, so dj Q woard, good run.
Speaker 1: We'll talk about it for now. Y'all gonna just call
Speaker 1: me cu Yes indeed, and you know, another great show
Speaker 1: for you, another great episode. Some some things I'm really
Speaker 1: excited to talk about. So stick around your radios because
Speaker 1: we are going to I believe, coin a new term word.
Speaker 1: I love when we do that. Yes, and it's going
Speaker 1: to be based on just experience, but I think it's
Speaker 1: very real and I think a lot of especially black folks,
Speaker 1: who have similar experiences, we'll be able to relate to.
Speaker 1: Stick around for that. We also are going to talk
Speaker 1: about a study that was published in the Los Angeles
Speaker 1: Times and was recorded to us by the new about
Speaker 1: how police officers interact with different races differently. And you know,
Speaker 1: for those of us who know better who that kind
Speaker 1: of goes without saying. But I think that, you know,
Speaker 1: we're gonna peel away a few layers and really see
Speaker 1: what that feels like and some of the outcomes that
Speaker 1: are the result from those types of interactions, and you know,
Speaker 1: maybe what we can do better moving forward to prevent
Speaker 1: some of what we've been seeing and throughout the history
Speaker 1: of this country, to be honest with you, and we
Speaker 1: also have an excellent BABA segment. Today are become a
Speaker 1: better ally segment. And I also think it's important for
Speaker 1: us to start off with some ebony excellence. So we'll
Speaker 1: kick it off right here and give a shout out
Speaker 1: to LeVar Burton.
Speaker 2: All I do is win and win no matter what.
Speaker 1: Now, for those who don't know LeVar Burton is He's
Speaker 1: Jordy Laford's from Star Trek. I'm a Star Trek nerd.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I know that you're probably listening to this
Speaker 1: on a really cool radio stage. I'm just not that guy.
Speaker 1: I'm super nerd. And fortunately I'm in good company because
Speaker 1: Q is a nerd to and I would venture to
Speaker 1: guess that so is DJ Swirl, our show producer.
Speaker 2: He's the star of reading Rainbow to Me. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: that luckily for y'all, I can't sing because I would
Speaker 2: be giving you the reading listen. Don't don't do it,
Speaker 2: bro take a look.
Speaker 1: Okay, I stopped. I stopped anyway, you know, shout out
Speaker 1: to him having a great career. But you know, something
Speaker 1: that happened recently is as we all know, Alex Trebek
Speaker 1: from Jeopardy passed away and uh, just another legendary icon
Speaker 1: in the entertainment world. And uh, you know, I caught
Speaker 1: win that LeVar Burton wanted to step in and take
Speaker 1: over that role. And as we know, typically that role
Speaker 1: has been held by a white man, and so it's
Speaker 1: sometimes uncomfortable, especially in Middle America, to see that job
Speaker 1: shift away from a white skinned person to a black
Speaker 1: skinned person, and so he's had to campaign for this. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: it looks like they're gonna give him a shot. So
Speaker 1: we're really excited to see what comes of that. LeVar
Speaker 1: Burton should always stay unbothered and moisturized, as he puts
Speaker 1: on his Twitter feed, and we love to see it.
Speaker 1: And you know, next stop is Idris Elba becoming the
Speaker 1: next James Bond. I still believe. I believe it's possible.
Speaker 2: You think they're gonna let it happen.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna believe. Man. I'm a believer. I'm an optimist, and.
Speaker 2: You guys listen, so you know this is definitely a
Speaker 2: believer and an optim and you.
Speaker 1: Know the thing is we can share he can be
Speaker 1: James Bond for a couple movies and then it could
Speaker 1: go back to someone white, and man, we can have
Speaker 1: some other folks, you know, maybe Middle Eastern. You know,
Speaker 1: I think it's possible, Man, James, Bond is an idea
Speaker 1: and we can share it ideas with each other as
Speaker 1: brothers and sisters, and I very much look forward to
Speaker 1: the day when that is normalized. But that is a
Speaker 1: perfect opportunity to segue into our first topic for discussion
Speaker 1: today and something that I really wanted to get into
Speaker 1: for a long time. This has kind of been on
Speaker 1: my mind for a bit recently. I heard it was
Speaker 1: just in the background, some sort of arbitrary dialogue or
Speaker 1: something like that, but the term white guilt came up.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: It's a term that in our arena is you know,
Speaker 1: thrown around quite a bit, and white guilt is one
Speaker 1: of the things that, in my belief and my understanding,
Speaker 1: is basically the feeling that some white people have when
Speaker 1: coming to terms with the fact that people who are
Speaker 1: not white have a tougher go in some areas of
Speaker 1: their lives, and it's because they're not white, that's the
Speaker 1: primary reason for it. And so some white folks feel
Speaker 1: guilty about that, and as a result, they will try
Speaker 1: in their own way to bring a little bit of
Speaker 1: balance to the universe. And so it's it sounds bad.
Speaker 2: For some it is though, because there are others who
Speaker 2: that guilt makes them push back the other way. Yeah, sure, No,
Speaker 2: that's not true, because it makes them feel bad about themselves.
Speaker 1: Sure sure. And that's that's something that a lot of
Speaker 1: white people resist. And we see that, I don't have
Speaker 1: to guess, and we actually see that in media and
Speaker 1: in real life and day to day interactions. But in
Speaker 1: any event, that is what it is. You know, that's
Speaker 1: how that term is used when discussing, you know, the
Speaker 1: way that we interact and relate to each other as
Speaker 1: as racist as as black people with respect to white
Speaker 1: people and brown people and Native people and so forth.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of well documented instances of
Speaker 1: if we're talking about a people, white people doing very
Speaker 1: hurtful and harmful things and damaging things to races of
Speaker 1: people that are not white. You know, we're gonna speak
Speaker 1: later on in the show about our Native brothers and sisters,
Speaker 1: and obviously they have a well documented history of getting
Speaker 1: the short end of the stick when you know, when
Speaker 1: it comes to their interactions with white folks, which is
Speaker 1: why we need critical race theory in schools. Every time
Speaker 1: you give me a microphone, I'll say it. But yeah,
Speaker 1: so that's white guilt, and I believe that there is
Speaker 1: such a thing as black guilt. Now, hear me out,
Speaker 1: and I do want to get your thoughts on this
Speaker 1: expound Yes, hear me out.
Speaker 2: For me.
Speaker 1: I recognize that, oh God, this is going to be
Speaker 1: tough to say, because there are some people who listen
Speaker 1: to our show that are very fiery individual, fiery speakers,
Speaker 1: and they know that we've been done wrong and they
Speaker 1: know that it's our time and we need to get
Speaker 1: our reparation all these things. And they're not wrong, they're right.
Speaker 1: I agree one hundred percent. But me, being the person
Speaker 1: that I am in the middle of myself, I recognize
Speaker 1: that no matter what happens, we all have to get
Speaker 1: there together wherever there is right. And I recognize that
Speaker 1: the world is changing for white people, perhaps at a
Speaker 1: faster pace than it ever has before. You know, I
Speaker 1: think that this show illustrates that point because it's very
Speaker 1: likely that the person who owns the radio station that
Speaker 1: you're listening to our voices on and the sh shareholders
Speaker 1: is a majority white folks, right, But they've allowed us
Speaker 1: to have a little bit of time to speak with you,
Speaker 1: the listener, so that we can share our thoughts on
Speaker 1: what it's like to be black in America and hopefully
Speaker 1: empower you as our allies, and empower our black brothers
Speaker 1: and sisters and Native and Hispanic and so forth. But
Speaker 1: the world is very much changing, you know, the population
Speaker 1: is changing, the you know, the life expectancy for white
Speaker 1: people is getting shorter. And when you've been in that
Speaker 1: position for such a long time where you don't have
Speaker 1: to worry about those sorts of things, you're just kind
Speaker 1: of secure, comfortably in your space, when the world starts
Speaker 1: changing around you, any human being would be a little
Speaker 1: bit unsettled by that, you know. And so there's a
Speaker 1: part of me that has to recognize that this is
Speaker 1: not easy for white people. You know, white people that
Speaker 1: are well intentioned and mean well and want an equitable
Speaker 1: experience for all of us in this country, and you know,
Speaker 1: the white people that don't want that, the white people
Speaker 1: that resist it. It's got to be uncomfortable on some
Speaker 1: level for everyone. Because we're talking about race, and we're
Speaker 1: talking about shifting away from a traditional hierarchy of race
Speaker 1: in this country toward a more equitable one. And even
Speaker 1: if that is one hundred years in the future, when
Speaker 1: we actually achieve that, the fact that the conversation is
Speaker 1: center stage, you know, more so now than in the
Speaker 1: past twenty thirty years in this country, it's got to
Speaker 1: be a bit unsettling. I know, in the back of
Speaker 1: people's minds, they have to worry, like, are you going
Speaker 1: to harm me? Are you going to you know, this
Speaker 1: is if I give up some power, is it going
Speaker 1: to come back to affect me negatively?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: And as a feeling athetic black person, I try to
Speaker 1: recognize the human experience that my Caucasian brothers and sisters
Speaker 1: are enduring or experiencing. Enduring is kind of you know,
Speaker 1: me being a little bit it's a little bit too
Speaker 1: heavy a word, but experiencing, you know, and empathizing and
Speaker 1: recognizing like, hey, listen, you know, let me make sure
Speaker 1: that you understand and you're secure, and you know that
Speaker 1: I love you. This needs to happen, But I love
Speaker 1: you and you're and I'll be there for you. I'll
Speaker 1: be an ally the same way that you're being an
Speaker 1: ally to me. I'll stand with you if you stand
Speaker 1: with me these sorts of things. And you know, we
Speaker 1: saw we saw a video the other day where there
Speaker 1: was a woman who was and I want to say,
Speaker 1: it was like a makeup store and she was getting
Speaker 1: filmed in the makeup store. She was going full Karen and.
Speaker 2: It was a Victoria's Secrets?
Speaker 1: Was that it? Okay? Sorry, Victoria's Secret story. She was
Speaker 1: going full Karen and you know she's on video and
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden she drops to the floor
Speaker 1: and starts wailing right full full on Karen one hundred
Speaker 1: and ten percent. So those tears to the right audience
Speaker 1: makes her the victim in that story. And you know
Speaker 1: it seemed like, you know, she just slipped right into
Speaker 1: that role.
Speaker 2: You know, well she she performed passing out first.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like.
Speaker 3: You have to see the videos.
Speaker 1: Sure she will make that available before you Yeah, but
Speaker 1: you know, for now, you know this, just take my
Speaker 1: word for it. But I recognize that not every white
Speaker 1: person is that. But you know, there's there's I'm sure
Speaker 1: there's a spectrum, you know, and there's some folks who
Speaker 1: well intentioned, they mean well, they do their best, they
Speaker 1: try to live a good life, and they might make
Speaker 1: a mistake, they might misspeak, they might not know the
Speaker 1: social the new social norms. Don't touch my hair, you know,
Speaker 1: for those that can't see me, I have a lot
Speaker 1: of hair, and that happens to me quite a bit.
Speaker 1: And I know that the right thing to do is
Speaker 1: correct everybody right. But sometimes it's hard for me to
Speaker 1: do that because I know that A I need you
Speaker 1: to keep believing that I'm your friend, that that we're
Speaker 1: on the same team here, and so I'll let you
Speaker 1: have that. And I think that that is the black guilt,
Speaker 1: where it's like, oh, I got it's it's it's a
Speaker 1: tricky game we've got to play here, because I don't
Speaker 1: want you to start crying and thinking that I'm canceling
Speaker 1: you and I don't, you know, And I feel guilty
Speaker 1: because I know that you mean well. But you know,
Speaker 1: we have to learn that some things we we still
Speaker 1: we still have a ways to go in a lot
Speaker 1: of areas. And I can't afford to lose you as
Speaker 1: an ally. So I can't afford to lay all of
Speaker 1: my demands at your feet right now.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: I gotta do it one at a time, incrementally. And
Speaker 1: so there's some things that might happen, and I just
Speaker 1: have to look past them. Some things I can't, you know,
Speaker 1: but you know, for those that know, you know, this
Speaker 1: show was born out of UH an old radio programmer
Speaker 1: telling me that he did not want to do a
Speaker 1: black show. That was his exact words, but a little
Speaker 1: bit more was that he didn't want to do a
Speaker 1: show that spoke to what was going on in the
Speaker 1: streets in twenty twenty. And I felt that that was necessary.
Speaker 1: And when he made that decision, you know, Q and
Speaker 1: I we decided to step away and do our own show,
Speaker 1: which you're hearing now. Also, that station doesn't exist anymore,
Speaker 1: so everybody that supported us, we appreciate you. But wow,
Speaker 1: but you know, that's a battle that I had to pick.
Speaker 1: But there were many other battles in that radio station
Speaker 1: that I could. I could not die on those hills.
Speaker 1: And I think that what I was experiencing in hindsight
Speaker 1: was black guilt. I know that you don't know what
Speaker 1: my experience is like, and I also know that I
Speaker 1: can't put too much on you, otherwise I risk losing you.
Speaker 1: Because the rights narrative is these people ask for too much.
Speaker 1: They're looking at it the wrong way. You know slavery
Speaker 1: was a thing that happened all over the world, and
Speaker 1: they completely ignore the fact that there was a very
Speaker 1: unique form of slavery that took place in this country
Speaker 1: that really existed to like dehumanize and brutalize. It didn't
Speaker 1: incorporate people into the family and the fabric society. And
Speaker 1: though you know there and there's a million things we
Speaker 1: could talk about for a million hours. But you know,
Speaker 1: if you want to tell yourself a different story, you can,
Speaker 1: and if you want to recruit people, you can. And
Speaker 1: if I'm the person in your office demanding that you
Speaker 1: check all these boxes right now, it's it's so easy
Speaker 1: for you to subscribe to a different narrative that fits
Speaker 1: the worldview that you have, and so that black guilt,
Speaker 1: it creeps in and it causes me to feel like
Speaker 1: I shouldn't ask for too much, you know, I you know,
Speaker 1: I can't afford for this to get away from me,
Speaker 1: and so I think it's a real thing that exists,
Speaker 1: and I can't be the only one, right.
Speaker 2: So it's really interesting that you bring this up because
Speaker 2: I've expressed to you before how sometimes it is difficult
Speaker 2: to do our show because I feel like someone's gonna
Speaker 2: hear it, they're gonna feel bad, and for that reason
Speaker 2: they'll tune us out completely. And it's hard to not
Speaker 2: pile on when there's so much nuance. Right if there
Speaker 2: was ever a collective expression of guilt, right, you mentioned
Speaker 2: the word reparations earlier. The idea that hasn't happened is
Speaker 2: insane when you review the truths of black people on
Speaker 2: this soil. And that's why the piwing on for people
Speaker 2: like us sometimes feels necessary, Like how are there people
Speaker 2: that still want that still don't want to acknowledge our plight,
Speaker 2: So it seems unfair to those that do. And when
Speaker 2: they're both a part of the same group, it's hard
Speaker 2: not to speak to both people. It's like giving a
Speaker 2: lecture to both of your children and one of them
Speaker 2: is the class president and the valedictorian and has never
Speaker 2: been in trouble and the one you just bailed out.
Speaker 2: Giving them the same lecture is not fair, even though
Speaker 2: they're both your kids. They're both in the same car,
Speaker 2: they're in the same age group, they live in the
Speaker 2: same house, they have the same rules. The one that's
Speaker 2: the class president and valedictorian is sitting there almost enraged
Speaker 2: that they have to sit through this conversation Mom, Dad,
Speaker 2: I know. So it's very difficult doing the show the
Speaker 2: way that we do it, with the topics that we're
Speaker 2: forced to address, because we hope that if you're listening
Speaker 2: to a station that has our show on it, that
Speaker 2: there are going to be a lot of things that
Speaker 2: you can at least empathize with us on. Right, But
Speaker 2: sometimes if you're a white person, you can feel attacked by.
Speaker 1: A show like this. Yeah, and even if.
Speaker 2: At your core you actually agree with what we're saying,
Speaker 2: when it sounds like we're identifying you as the culprit,
Speaker 2: it's hard to say.
Speaker 1: It's hard not to say.
Speaker 2: Well, wait a minute and want to stand up for
Speaker 2: yourself even though you're not the person that we're talking about.
Speaker 1: So I've felt that.
Speaker 2: Black guilt, if that's what we're calling it, because even
Speaker 2: in our production meetings, when we're talking with Swirl, I'm like, Man,
Speaker 2: are we piling on? Are we talking about the same
Speaker 2: types of things too much? And the reason why I'm
Speaker 2: so quick to say to snap out of it and
Speaker 2: say no, is because we're not talking about We never
Speaker 2: have a show where the things we're talking about happened
Speaker 2: nine months ago. It might be the same thing that
Speaker 2: happened nine months ago, but it's a brand new story.
Speaker 2: So it's like, you guys can't see me the shrug
Speaker 2: and facial expression that you're getting from me right now.
Speaker 2: It's like, well, it's still happening, it's regularly still happening.
Speaker 2: Regularly isn't even a good enough word, right. There's things
Speaker 2: that with frequency, at a frequency that we can't keep
Speaker 2: up with. There's stories that we've missed just because our
Speaker 2: show isn't on frequent enough, and the weeks in between,
Speaker 2: so much more happens that you know, we just kind
Speaker 2: of end up moving to the next or most recent
Speaker 2: thing that happened that might sound and feel the same. So, man,
Speaker 2: you're absolutely right because I felt it. I've dealt with that.
Speaker 2: I try to reconcile, and like I said, even when
Speaker 2: we're doing our show, it's something that I think about, Like, man,
Speaker 2: I do not want to alienate people that support us,
Speaker 2: because the description sounds like them, right, because it's so
Speaker 2: in so many occurrences it's police officer or white man
Speaker 2: or white people, and because there's such variance, we can't
Speaker 2: say the white lady whose name we don't know at
Speaker 2: the Victoria's Secret and whatever city that's in. With every occurrence,
Speaker 2: we can't point specifically to name, person, time, date, description,
Speaker 2: so we just generally say white police officer, for instance.
Speaker 2: So yeah, man, it's it's not black and white. It's
Speaker 2: not straightforward, it's not cut and dry. It's really it's
Speaker 2: a really really difficult line to toe because we have
Speaker 2: to address the things that we address, but it is
Speaker 2: not easy to keep from alienating people that are a
Speaker 2: part of that group but not of it, you know,
Speaker 2: in the group, but not of it, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: I know what you mean. And there's something that happens
Speaker 1: in media and this show doesn't really fit that format
Speaker 1: and I don't think that it ever will, but for
Speaker 1: different reasons. And there's kind of like a saying, if
Speaker 1: it bleeds, it leads, and so these are the sorts
Speaker 1: of things that dominate the news cycle. But the nature
Speaker 1: of our show is a little different, and we have
Speaker 1: an objective. We don't inform people for the sake of
Speaker 1: informing people, because you can just be alive and click
Speaker 1: on any news whatever in your pocket and become informed.
Speaker 1: We try to provide context and have long form discussions
Speaker 1: about really about race relations and about how do we
Speaker 1: empower each other to reach the level of equity that
Speaker 1: I think that we can reach. And this is kind
Speaker 1: of what we're going for. And so the stories that
Speaker 1: we choose to you know, deal with are pointed in
Speaker 1: that direction. And so that's why this is not a
Speaker 1: blood and gut show every time. That's why we can
Speaker 1: talk about things like concepts like this one black guilt
Speaker 1: and so forth, and so it's it's a little bit
Speaker 1: different show. But I think that you know, in doing so,
Speaker 1: like you said, we have to also reconcile, how how
Speaker 1: is this going to hit people? Because we know, you know,
Speaker 1: someone said it was actually been said quite a bit
Speaker 1: that black people are not looking for revenge at all,
Speaker 1: just looking for, like, you know, a fair go at life.
Speaker 1: And you know, and and we get to decide based
Speaker 1: on our vantage point and how the world looks to
Speaker 1: us what that is because you know, so many times
Speaker 1: throughout history, forgive me, white people have been the ones
Speaker 1: dictating what is fair, and almost invariably it is way
Speaker 1: more fair if you are also white, and way less
Speaker 1: fair if you are not a white person as well.
Speaker 1: And you know, there's obviously examples of white folks discriminating
Speaker 1: against other white folks as well, But you know, it's
Speaker 1: a power struggling. More often than not, it's.
Speaker 2: And that typically isn't because they're white. And that's that's
Speaker 2: the that's the very clear and obvious difference they're you know,
Speaker 2: maybe it's because they're poor, maybe it's because they have
Speaker 2: different religious beliefs, maybe because their accent is different, they
Speaker 2: were born on a different soil, But it's not typically
Speaker 2: because they're white. It's for some other reason. Sure, and
Speaker 2: way too many cases, this shell that we walk around
Speaker 2: in is our crime. It is the reason why we're
Speaker 2: being held back, discriminated against, judged.
Speaker 3: No hurt.
Speaker 1: And you know, there's something else to be said. I
Speaker 1: just while we're here, I want to say it. You know,
Speaker 1: we we we are very critical of policing as an institution,
Speaker 1: and certainly critical of certain officers as well. But you know,
Speaker 1: we do have a dialogue with a few officers. One
Speaker 1: that comes to mind is there's a guy named Marcel.
Speaker 1: There's a guy named Kevin. You know these are Kevin
Speaker 1: is a sheriff's officer. Marcel reaches out to us on
Speaker 1: our social media and we recognize that police are humans too.
Speaker 1: We prefer the police who are humans first, you know,
Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that we can't be critical of
Speaker 1: the system that employs them and advocate for change on
Speaker 1: their behalf and hopefully inspire them to advocate for change
Speaker 1: from within. And so, long story short, these are my
Speaker 1: thoughts on black guilt. But if you're white and listening,
Speaker 1: just know, hey, we love you, and we know that
Speaker 1: you love us, and that's not lost on us. And and
Speaker 1: we're going to get through this thing together.
Speaker 3: And now my mic.
Speaker 1: Back likes behind. And if you're just tuning into CIPI
Speaker 1: side Around, your host Rams is Jock, you call me
Speaker 1: que que. Okay, let's just go with cute. That's all right,
Speaker 1: And uh yeah, if you're just tuning in, I definitely
Speaker 1: want you to stick around. We're going to be talking
Speaker 1: about a study that was done a little later in
Speaker 1: the show where it was determined on a scientific basis
Speaker 1: what we already know, but that's that police officers speak
Speaker 1: to and interact with black drivers less respectfully than white drivers.
Speaker 1: Also going to discuss a way black history fact. This time,
Speaker 1: we're gonna stand in solidarity with our Native brothers and sisters.
Speaker 1: The story been wanting to get to for a long
Speaker 1: time of uncovering some bodies that were buried of some
Speaker 1: Native children. We're going to get into that in just
Speaker 1: a bit, but first let's discuss how to become a
Speaker 1: better ally. So if you don't know, there is a
Speaker 1: we'll call him a social media activist. This is a
Speaker 1: term that Q came up with. His name is Maximilian Clark.
Speaker 1: And for those that follow our social media at Civic Cipher,
Speaker 1: I think it's up on our Instagram. You can go
Speaker 1: and check it out. It might be a few posts
Speaker 1: to go, but it's still there. And basically this guy
Speaker 1: is he just gets on stage in this video and
Speaker 1: he has like a stream of consciousness and a microphone
Speaker 1: and an audience. And of course he's a white man,
Speaker 1: so you see, you're not critical of everyone, you know,
Speaker 1: but see that's my black guilt having to having to
Speaker 1: establish that right anyway, at first glance, seems to be
Speaker 1: a wonderful human being. You know, We've been able to
Speaker 1: share a few of his videos in our group chats,
Speaker 1: and he very much deals with the reality of the
Speaker 1: world that he lives in and is not afraid to
Speaker 1: tell the truth. He doesn't obscure anything. He like puts
Speaker 1: it all out there in the front. And the level
Speaker 1: of confidence that he speaks with when he's talking about
Speaker 1: the importance of critical race theory, I mean, he kind
Speaker 1: of speaks to an audience with some irony, you know,
Speaker 1: to make him laugh and to you know, help him
Speaker 1: to understand. He says something about MLK, He's like, we
Speaker 1: should teach people about MLK, but we shouldn't teach him
Speaker 1: that the FBI try to ruin his life. And we
Speaker 1: should teach people about you know, you know, World War Two,
Speaker 1: but we shouldn't teach about the the internment cancer of
Speaker 1: the Japanese, you know. And you know, everyone gets to
Speaker 1: chuckle out of that. But he's making some valid points,
Speaker 1: and I thought we all thought that that would be
Speaker 1: an excellent example to share with you the listener on
Speaker 1: how to become a better ally, because that's what an
Speaker 1: ally looks like in our estimation. So once again, check
Speaker 1: out her social media on Instagram at Civic Cipher.
Speaker 2: Yeah, him pointing out the obvious hypocrisy and the emissions
Speaker 2: that our government is trying to make an education. It's funny,
Speaker 2: but in a way where it disarms your.
Speaker 1: Aversion to it listening. Yeah, absolutely, So now to the
Speaker 1: good stuff.
Speaker 2: Were you being facetious there and you say to the
Speaker 2: good stuff?
Speaker 1: Yeah, brace yourselves?
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 1: So the route is another place where we source show
Speaker 1: content The Atlanta Black Star. You know, black publications that
Speaker 1: highlight black stories. So I read this on the route.
Speaker 1: I think it's fair to share those whenever we come
Speaker 1: across them. Basically, the story, the headline is police officers
Speaker 1: speak to black drivers less respectfully than white drivers. Before
Speaker 1: we get into this, I want to ask two questions
Speaker 1: to two people that I know. One of them is
Speaker 1: DJ Swirrel. Swirrel, does this surprise you that police officers
Speaker 1: speak to black drivers less respectfully than white drivers? Are
Speaker 1: you surprised by that.
Speaker 3: You're talking about speaking facetiously?
Speaker 1: No? No, no, it does it?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 1: Does it surprise you? Just you know, straight answer not.
Speaker 2: And iota Q same question, does it surprise you? I
Speaker 2: was completely taken aback when I learned of this information.
Speaker 2: I'm actually offended that you act. Not sure how I
Speaker 2: feel about the point that you're trying to make or
Speaker 2: the type of light that you're shining on our men
Speaker 2: and women in law enforcement.
Speaker 1: Well, here's something that I will do before we even
Speaker 1: get into this. I would say that there's a lot
Speaker 1: of people in positions of authority who, especially if they're
Speaker 1: not black, people, who are going to speak more respectfully
Speaker 1: to non black people than they will to black people.
Speaker 1: That I think that's very much woven into the culture
Speaker 1: of this country, not just in the law enforcement. I
Speaker 1: don't think there are many people who are black or
Speaker 1: melanated who would disagree with that. But now we have
Speaker 1: a scientific basis to have this conversation with respect to
Speaker 1: policing in this country. And so I'll give you a
Speaker 1: little bit of background on how the story was or
Speaker 1: how this study was done. So, the American Psychological Association
Speaker 1: conducted an analysis of bodycam footage and they would take
Speaker 1: like ten fifteen seconds of you know, police interactions, perhaps
Speaker 1: when they were first walking up to the door. I didn't,
Speaker 1: you know, it's an article, so it's not a full
Speaker 1: scientific published paper, but from what I read, that's kind
Speaker 1: of how they gathered their research. They took thousands of videos,
Speaker 1: and they quantified and the I'm sure they had parameters
Speaker 1: for what was respectful and decidedly less respectful, and they
Speaker 1: you know, checked each box accordingly, and you know, found
Speaker 1: along the lines of race that white motorists were approached
Speaker 1: in a more respectful manner by police. And this this
Speaker 1: this study was backed by the Los Angeles Times and
Speaker 1: published in LA Times. And I think that everybody, everybody,
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's some people that you know, look
Speaker 1: at police and say, you know, the police really are
Speaker 1: here to protect us. I'm talking about everybody of every color.
Speaker 1: There's some there's there's a group of people that it
Speaker 1: doesn't matter what color they're they say, the police are
Speaker 1: here for us. I've never had a bad experience with
Speaker 1: the police. I've always done what I was supposed to do.
Speaker 1: I don't worry about the police. That is a real
Speaker 1: segment of every population. I will see that entirely. But
Speaker 1: what I think more often happens is there are people
Speaker 1: who would prefer to have no interaction with the police whatsoever,
Speaker 1: because if the police show up, usually it's because of
Speaker 1: some drama, saying with the fire department. God blessed the
Speaker 1: fire department. If I never saw him, that'd be fine
Speaker 1: with me. That just means nothing in my world is
Speaker 1: burned down, right, So I'm glad they're there. You know,
Speaker 1: no no disrespect, you know, shout out to the to
Speaker 1: the to the fire department. But I'm sure they don't
Speaker 1: want to put out fires because usually that means that
Speaker 1: people are suffering and dealing with you know whatever. It'd
Speaker 1: be better to prevent fires, you know, in the first place,
Speaker 1: defund the police anyway. So most folks will say, you know,
Speaker 1: police are just you know, no one likes getting a ticket,
Speaker 1: no one likes, you know, interacting.
Speaker 3: With the police.
Speaker 1: If the police show up and you try to tell
Speaker 1: your story and they're not on your side, and or
Speaker 1: they come with a bad attitude, you know, I'm sure
Speaker 1: that if you've lived long enough, you've come across, you know,
Speaker 1: a police officer with a god complex and a gun
Speaker 1: and with that badge is able to kind of move
Speaker 1: with impunity and so has no regard for you as
Speaker 1: a human being. You are beneath him or her, and
Speaker 1: they have no problem letting you feel that. And so
Speaker 1: there's lots of people who have had those types of experiences,
Speaker 1: and I would guess that those are people who interact
Speaker 1: with the police more frequently, because it's more often that
Speaker 1: you're gonna it's more likely rather that you'll come across
Speaker 1: those types of police officers, which, as we know around here,
Speaker 1: are plentiful, you know, those god complex police officers that
Speaker 1: do what I say, now what I said I said?
Speaker 1: Do that? You know, no, no officer, I'm not you know, yeah, anyway,
Speaker 1: you know the story que, So a lot of people
Speaker 1: will be able to say something similar, will be like,
Speaker 1: you know, police don't talk respectfully to me either, and
Speaker 1: I'm not even black, you know, police, that's just how
Speaker 1: police are. You know, you just try to avoid them,
Speaker 1: staying in your own lane and you know whatever. But
Speaker 1: the reality of this situation is that the the culture
Speaker 1: of policing has shifted away from like investigative policing and uh,
Speaker 1: you know responsive you know, like Okay, something happened, let
Speaker 1: me go and respond to it, more toward let's just
Speaker 1: find what we can get on the streets. You know,
Speaker 1: they have computers that run your license plates. They don't
Speaker 1: even type it in. And when I was little, they
Speaker 1: used to have to type in a license plate if
Speaker 1: they suspected a car of something, if it was swerving whatever.
Speaker 1: Now it's a computer that does it. You know, they're
Speaker 1: just checking every car just to see, you know, if
Speaker 1: there's somebody worth pulling over. Part of that might be
Speaker 1: because they're trying to be safe and keep both hands
Speaker 1: on a wheel, but I maintain that they're just looking
Speaker 1: for trouble. And you know, if you're looking for something,
Speaker 1: you'll find it even if it's not there, as you
Speaker 1: and I both know. So the problem is that that
Speaker 1: establishes that it's not really it's not realistic to just
Speaker 1: move through life knowing full well that if you just
Speaker 1: keep your nose clean, that the police will never interact
Speaker 1: with you. Right, you can do your very best, you know,
Speaker 1: As you know and as I know, we've never neither
Speaker 1: of us Q have done a drug. We've never even
Speaker 1: drunk alcohol. Certainly, don't break the law. You know, we
Speaker 1: don't have any reason to break the law. Why would
Speaker 1: we ever do that? And I probably get pulled over
Speaker 1: all the time, you know, I'm out late because I'm
Speaker 1: a DJ, you know, I whatever. And then the many
Speaker 1: cars I've had over the years, some of them look
Speaker 1: like drug dealer cars. I'll admit that, you know, not
Speaker 1: something I'm proud of. But once upon a time, I like, Rims,
Speaker 1: what are you gonna do? It's cultural? Let me live, so.
Speaker 2: Shout out to Rims.
Speaker 1: Once upon a time. But anyway, what happens is you
Speaker 1: end up interacting with these police, and my experience has
Speaker 1: been less than pleasant most of the time, mostly because
Speaker 1: the police are it's like I've already been convicted of
Speaker 1: the crime that they are looking for, and it seems
Speaker 1: like you got something to say, so I'd love you
Speaker 1: to jump in right there.
Speaker 2: Let me see you a really cool thing about being
Speaker 2: the official DJ of the Phoenix Suns. At Phoenix Sun's
Speaker 2: home basketball games, there are a lot of police officers
Speaker 2: on site, except I am head to toe and NBA
Speaker 2: and Phoenix Suns logos, and then I have this badge
Speaker 2: with a big picture of me on it.
Speaker 1: It's very very.
Speaker 2: Official, and I say hello to every officer in the
Speaker 2: arena when I see them, and in that setting, they
Speaker 2: all reflect the same energy that I give them, right
Speaker 2: because when they look at me, they get to already
Speaker 2: make up their mind, Oh, that guy works for the Suns.
Speaker 1: He's one of the good ones.
Speaker 2: Even if they didn't see me on the center, hang yeah.
Speaker 2: Walking towards you them, it's clear to see, oh, this
Speaker 2: guy works for the team. And there is a built
Speaker 2: in response for people that work for the team. Especially
Speaker 2: in an official capacity, because there's a lot of temporary
Speaker 2: workers that are work in sessions or our gsrs that
Speaker 2: greet our guest, but somebody that looks official, there's a
Speaker 2: built in response to that. You've heard me bring up
Speaker 2: on the show before. Part of what part of the
Speaker 2: response that was desired from the Black Lives Matter movement
Speaker 2: was not treat white people worse, not at all. Just
Speaker 2: give us the same resemblance of dignity and respect that
Speaker 2: you show white people, I think in most interactions, and
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter the race of the police officer when
Speaker 2: the person in question isn't black, they're a citizen that
Speaker 2: might have made a mistake, even when there's clear evidence
Speaker 2: that this person absolutely did something elite horrible. Yeah, but
Speaker 2: like you said, the officers a human being first, and
Speaker 2: they treat this person like they're a human being first too,
Speaker 2: and that's how that interaction goes down. So even if
Speaker 2: that person does end up in handcuffs and in jail,
Speaker 2: getting there was a lot more humane, dignified. The narrative
Speaker 2: for people that look like us for so long has
Speaker 2: been that we're by nature criminals. They approach us as
Speaker 2: the criminal who's just being a criminal, not a human
Speaker 2: being that may have made a mistake.
Speaker 1: And when.
Speaker 2: The very nature of what you do is colored in
Speaker 2: by that narrative, it's almost impossible to treat us the
Speaker 2: same because that starts before you become a police officer.
Speaker 1: That's the world that you grow up.
Speaker 2: In, and then the infrastructure that you enter yourself into
Speaker 2: as a police officer just fortifies all those thoughts and
Speaker 2: beliefs that you already had. So for us, this study
Speaker 2: was completely unnecessary. Absolutely, we live it. But as you know,
Speaker 2: and as we've talked about, there are a lot of
Speaker 2: people that would like to openly and proudly with their
Speaker 2: chest out deny any.
Speaker 1: Of that truth.
Speaker 2: That's why it's good, and that's why it's necessary to
Speaker 2: have the same study.
Speaker 3: Like that to happen.
Speaker 1: So watch this. I had a direct quote here. This
Speaker 1: comes from Diane Goldstein. It says she's one of the
Speaker 1: people that worked on the study. It really reflects the
Speaker 1: amount of work that law enforcement needs to continue to
Speaker 1: do right to approach people like their people first. Now,
Speaker 1: the reason that's significant is because you know, there's a
Speaker 1: very like a like a foundational story with respect to
Speaker 1: this show, and we've told it a few times on
Speaker 1: the air where Q and I were both pulled over
Speaker 1: in Mississippi driving from Florida to Arizona in a brand
Speaker 1: new Porsche and we got pulled over in Mississippi in
Speaker 1: the middle of night for those who don't know, and
Speaker 1: had a bit of an interaction, and you know, I
Speaker 1: don't need to tell the whole story again, but it
Speaker 1: took a long time.
Speaker 2: It was over nothing, and literally not over something small,
Speaker 2: over nothing.
Speaker 1: Literally there was nothing. But we were pulled over in
Speaker 1: the darkest of forests as you can say anything like
Speaker 1: there was no moonlight, nothing so dark even the even
Speaker 1: the fireflies left. It was just we're just out there.
Speaker 1: But I guess I have to tell a little bit
Speaker 1: of the story. So forgive me if you've heard this before.
Speaker 1: We get pulled over because there's a little bit of uh.
Speaker 1: There's grooves in the in the paint in Mississippi that
Speaker 1: make noise if the tire comes in contact with the paint.
Speaker 1: It's not the same in Arizona. The grooves light outside
Speaker 1: of the white line. And so we're driving and you know,
Speaker 1: listening to music, road tripping, you know, having a good time,
Speaker 1: make a little bit of noise for about a half second.
Speaker 1: It wasn't even a full second. It wasn't even that
Speaker 1: long in the way I remember it. But if it was,
Speaker 1: then sure, and a quarter mile later there's lights behind us.
Speaker 1: We get pulled over. Typically if a car is swerving,
Speaker 1: the officer will want to check to see if the
Speaker 1: driver is inebriated or if there's you know, the driver
Speaker 1: otherwise presents a threat to road safety. Now it's like
Speaker 1: two in the morning, there's no cars out, and this
Speaker 1: gentleman to my left is speaking to this officer, which,
Speaker 1: by the way, Q is one of the most intelligent
Speaker 1: human beings in the world. And I know, I know
Speaker 1: a lot of them.
Speaker 2: Scariest police siren light combination of my adult life.
Speaker 1: Nothing, they're blinding lights. But you know, we gets he
Speaker 1: gets pulled out of the car, and it was completely
Speaker 1: unnecessary because you could determine at first lance Okay, these
Speaker 1: guys just and we explained like, hey, that we didn't
Speaker 1: know that. In Arizona, where we're from, it's not like that.
Speaker 1: So we've never driven in Mississippi before. Our bad you know,
Speaker 1: no harm, no foul. We just made a little bit
Speaker 1: of noise in the middle of nowhere. That only you heard.
Speaker 1: We haven't committed any offense to anyone else. No need
Speaker 1: to go beyond that.
Speaker 2: However, yes, sir, I will step out.
Speaker 3: Of the car.
Speaker 1: Sure. And then long story short, they end up pulling
Speaker 1: me out of the car. We're like up against the
Speaker 1: police car. Now they're you know, checking the card, and
Speaker 1: they bring the dogs out to smell the car, you know,
Speaker 1: and then they tell us that the dogs smell drugs
Speaker 1: and the brand new Porsche, and then they have to
Speaker 1: search the car again. And so we're just stuck on
Speaker 1: the side of the road, and you know, it just was.
Speaker 1: It was a bunch of nonsense, and ultimately we were
Speaker 1: able to get out of there. It's a much scarier
Speaker 1: story than I'm telling you, but for the sake of time,
Speaker 1: you know, that's that's effectively what happened. Now, if we
Speaker 1: were an older white couple, Let's say, Q, you're sixty
Speaker 1: five year old privileged corporate executive and I am a
Speaker 1: CFO of a business, and we're.
Speaker 2: God, may I interject sure if we were just white,
Speaker 2: two older white people, right, because we wouldn't have worn
Speaker 2: our careers on our jackets, we wouldn't have presented them
Speaker 2: with a business card to know what we did right,
Speaker 2: So if our description was different, if we looked like
Speaker 2: we belonged in this nice car.
Speaker 1: While also glad you said that. I'm glad you said
Speaker 1: that because that's.
Speaker 2: Our interaction would have been incredibly different.
Speaker 1: And I know that the amount of dignity would have
Speaker 1: been higher.
Speaker 2: You're allowed to have so much more dignity and self respect.
Speaker 1: It just it's it's unfathomable that if you're white and
Speaker 1: older like you can be threatening and aggressive and mean
Speaker 1: and disrespectful respect they'll still be respectful back. And it's
Speaker 1: the craziest thing. And then of course we presented know threat, challenge,
Speaker 1: nothing the most benevolent hum rollover. Look, here's my belly.
Speaker 1: I mean you no harm. Please do not kill me
Speaker 1: on the side of the road because you're scared of
Speaker 1: something that doesn't.
Speaker 2: Please do not kill us on the side of this road.
Speaker 2: Was my only thought for the near two hours we
Speaker 2: spent outside on the side of the highway in Mississippi
Speaker 2: at what I think was like two or three o'clock
Speaker 2: in the morning.
Speaker 1: Please do not kill us, because they seem when they
Speaker 1: first walked up, it seemed like they came with a
Speaker 1: little bit of energy that we weren't really expecting.
Speaker 2: Especially officers Sergeant Drill, sergeant Sir, sergeants, sur detective inspector, yes,
Speaker 2: sure off, deputy officers, sergeant sir. Yeah, I think that
Speaker 2: was his name.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was especially. That was it. I saw his badge.
Speaker 1: But the point is is that, you know, this, this
Speaker 1: is the sort of interaction that's the norm. I've interacted
Speaker 1: with lots of police throughout my life. Never been arrested,
Speaker 1: you know it.
Speaker 3: That's something.
Speaker 2: Never been arrested, you know, handcuffed, been placed in the
Speaker 2: back of cars, shoved on the hood of cars. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: never arrest.
Speaker 1: A man, gone through my backpack when I was in school,
Speaker 1: you know, pulled me out of a car in front
Speaker 1: of my family. You know that sort of stuff. Is
Speaker 1: all that stuff has happened, never been because I never.
Speaker 2: Had officers take the seats out of my car before,
Speaker 2: you see what I mean. And then when they were finished,
Speaker 2: just left, just leave it, like I had to figure
Speaker 2: out how to reinstall seats.
Speaker 1: Listen, man bese like that, And so you know, there's
Speaker 1: there's definitely something to be said about this type of
Speaker 1: approach to black motorists escalating because Black people are no
Speaker 1: different from any other creature you know that's endowed with
Speaker 1: consciousness that you know, demands its respect and it's it's
Speaker 1: dignity and it's it's right to move about unencumbered by
Speaker 1: you know, uh, artificial restraints and so forth. And you know,
Speaker 1: some black people know how to play the game like
Speaker 1: we do, and they do it for most of their lives.
Speaker 1: And then there's you know, everyone has a day when
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, what, I deserve better than this,
Speaker 1: you know, And I say this quite a bit, you know,
Speaker 1: most of the time it's off the air, but you know,
Speaker 1: I say it all the time, like I don't want
Speaker 1: to die on a sidewalk. I don't want that to
Speaker 1: be my story. And I get death threats for doing
Speaker 1: this show all the time. People just pretty upset with
Speaker 1: me for doing this and saying these things. But you know,
Speaker 1: this is my path. I have to walk this path now,
Speaker 1: and I have to say these things. And I do
Speaker 1: recognize that it's okay to demand respect, it's okay to
Speaker 1: give respect and expect it in return, but it's also
Speaker 1: it has to be a two way street. And now
Speaker 1: that we have defendedative evidence of exactly what's going on
Speaker 1: here we can start to you know, do.
Speaker 2: Better, yes sir, And before you move on to our
Speaker 2: esteemed show producer DJ Swirl, how you are able to
Speaker 2: deal with the comments that we get from doing this show.
Speaker 1: I do not know.
Speaker 2: I got a glimpse of them from him the other
Speaker 2: day and made my stomach hurt. And it was like
Speaker 2: three kind of vanilla comments, but it was just knowing
Speaker 2: where they came from and what they represented, it just
Speaker 2: kind of turn my stomach. I know, we get way
Speaker 2: worse stuff than that that I make it my business
Speaker 2: not to ever see or read or come into contact with, because.
Speaker 1: Life is hard enough by yourself. I Swirl what you
Speaker 1: got for us?
Speaker 3: Kill the mood real quick. But today's way black history
Speaker 3: of fact.
Speaker 4: We are reaching out to our Native bless and sisters
Speaker 4: and highlighting a recent finding of one hundreds more unmarked
Speaker 4: graves found at formal residential schools in Canada. For decades,
Speaker 4: the Indigenous children were taken from their families, sometimes by
Speaker 4: forced and housing crowded church run boarding schools, where they
Speaker 4: were abused and prohibited from speaking their native tongue.
Speaker 3: Thousands vanished altogether.
Speaker 5: Now, a discovery offers chilling evidence that many of the
Speaker 5: missing children may have died at these schools. The remains
Speaker 5: of as many as seven hundred and fifty one mainly
Speaker 5: excuse me, seven hundred and fifty one mainly Indigenous children
Speaker 5: were found at the site of a former school in
Speaker 5: the province of Saskatchewan. The burial site, the largest one
Speaker 5: to date, was uncovered only weeks after the remains of
Speaker 5: two hundred and fifteen children were found in unmarked graves
Speaker 5: on the grounds of another former church run school for
Speaker 5: Indigenous students in British Columbia. The discoveries have jolted a
Speaker 5: nation grappling with the generations of widespread and systematic abuse
Speaker 5: for Indigenous people, many of whom are survivors of the
Speaker 5: boarding schools. For decades, they suggested through their oral histories
Speaker 5: that thousands of children disappeared from the schools, but they
Speaker 5: were often met with skepticism the relevations. The revelations of
Speaker 5: two unmarked grave sites are another seting reminder of this
Speaker 5: traumatic period in history. These recent unearthings of remains in
Speaker 5: Canada have reverberated globally, including in the US, where this
Speaker 5: week the Interior Secretary said the country would search federal
Speaker 5: boarding schools for possible burial sites as well of Native
Speaker 5: American children, hundreds of thousands of them were forcibly taken
Speaker 5: from their communities to be culturally assimilated in.
Speaker 3: The schools from more than a century.
Speaker 1: What article is that?
Speaker 3: This is from the New York Times.
Speaker 1: Okay, wow, I want to say things before we get
Speaker 1: into that. I want your reaction because you seem to
Speaker 1: really have something. But I want to say a couple
Speaker 1: of things.
Speaker 6: One, this show is a black space. We will always
Speaker 6: share this space with people who have similar plight with us,
Speaker 6: and it doesn't matter if they're black or not.
Speaker 1: If we get to make the rules, then that's our rule.
Speaker 1: So if you're Native, if you're Hispanic, this is your
Speaker 1: show too. Yes, but this show has to do with
Speaker 1: the United States of America and this story comes from Canada.
Speaker 1: But where we live in Phoenix, Arizona. Any One that's
Speaker 1: been to Phoenix before knows that there's a street called
Speaker 1: Indian School Road and it spans the length of the city.
Speaker 1: And on Indian School Road, you guessed it, there's an
Speaker 1: Indian School That's what they used to call it. And
Speaker 1: in the late nineties, I want to say, I remember
Speaker 1: hearing stories of the cruelty that took place in that
Speaker 1: school in the early nineteen hundreds and in the a
Speaker 1: and their efforts to assimilate the Native children and to
Speaker 1: strip them of their culture, and you know, all these
Speaker 1: sorts of things and the abuse that took place there.
Speaker 1: And I'm not an expert, so I will not speak
Speaker 1: on that. But you know, if you're listening to my
Speaker 1: voice and you're familiar with this story or any other stories, again,
Speaker 1: this space is your space too, and you're welcome to
Speaker 1: reach out to us and we'll you know, these stories
Speaker 1: need to be told and we need to discuss them
Speaker 1: so that we can all move forward together. But the
Speaker 1: reason that the story in Canada stood out to me
Speaker 1: is because I knew that story from growing up in Phoenix, Arizona,
Speaker 1: and I went to school on Indian School Road. I
Speaker 1: went to Central High School, shot out the Bobcats, and
Speaker 1: I went to uh Osborne Middle School. So that was,
Speaker 1: you know, the road I took to get to school
Speaker 1: when I was in middle school, and you know, learning
Speaker 1: about the horrors that took place in that school and
Speaker 1: then now it's a dilapidated bu building and they didn't
Speaker 1: even turn it into a museum. It's just they can't
Speaker 1: tear it down. I don't think they built. They build
Speaker 1: a park around it, but it's just in decay. It's
Speaker 1: this story from Canada really resonated with me because I
Speaker 1: think that that reflects kind of what was going on
Speaker 1: in the world, you know, with respect to native populations.
Speaker 1: And you know, I I recognize that, you know, the
Speaker 1: Native story is a different story. My grandmother was a
Speaker 1: Native American woman, uh. And you know, she often did
Speaker 1: not tell us stories about growing up because she really
Speaker 1: didn't like her life until she got older, and she
Speaker 1: she told me that. And I so a lot of
Speaker 1: that stuff is lost now that we've buried her. But
Speaker 1: I I do feel connected to these stories, and I
Speaker 1: I do feel like it's necessary to talk about them.
Speaker 1: My bad I ate up all that time. Do you
Speaker 1: want to hear your reaction.
Speaker 2: Cute to our Aboriginal brothers and sisters. I think the
Speaker 2: thing that caught me off guard more than the startling
Speaker 2: number of bodies that were found, is that these schools
Speaker 2: were church run and just the history of churches, and
Speaker 2: I'm assuming you know Christian churches, uh, and the kind
Speaker 2: of cloaking. They provided for really bad people for a
Speaker 2: very long time. It's pretty disgusting. Uh, church run schools
Speaker 2: being respond for people being murdered because they didn't look, speak,
Speaker 2: or believe the way you do. It's pretty disgusting. And
Speaker 2: I'll kind of leave it there that hearing those words
Speaker 2: is the part, you know, being raised by a Baptist
Speaker 2: minister myself, you know that definitely maybe shouldn't have caught
Speaker 2: me off guard, just based on some of the history,
Speaker 2: but definitely did. And like you said before, we do
Speaker 2: stand in solidarity not just with our Aboriginal brothers and sisters,
Speaker 2: but people all over this country and all over the
Speaker 2: world who have been marginalized, abused, torn down, segregated against.
Speaker 3: The list goes on.
Speaker 2: This space is for you as well, and we really
Speaker 2: want you to know that.
Speaker 1: Sure, sure, and you know, while we're here, this is
Speaker 1: a part of the reason why, like as much as
Speaker 1: we'd love to talk about Cuba, I would love to
Speaker 1: talk about Cuba, it lies just beyond the scope of
Speaker 1: what it is that we talk about on this show,
Speaker 1: what we're able to speak to, But I implore you to
Speaker 1: inform yourself about the goings on in Cuba and support
Speaker 1: in any way that you can. My other grandmother is
Speaker 1: from Cuba, so I'm kind of right in the middle
Speaker 1: of both of those stories right there. And I have
Speaker 1: a connection to the island of course, and to you know,
Speaker 1: my family in Florida. So but you know, for what
Speaker 1: we do, I'm very happy that we get to do it,
Speaker 1: and I'm very happy that you take the time out
Speaker 1: of your day to listen to our show. And I
Speaker 1: think that you know, you know, while we're on this
Speaker 1: subject of you know, Native children and kind of the history,
Speaker 1: I know that there's a lot of people who really
Speaker 1: don't like looking back at the past. You know, we've talked,
Speaker 1: we talk quite a bit about you know, critical race
Speaker 1: theory and you know, all these sorts of things. I
Speaker 1: recognize that, you know, it's uncomfortable, but I also recognize
Speaker 1: that the only way that we heal is if we
Speaker 1: acknowledge what's happened and we start trying to piece together
Speaker 1: a path forward that honors the experience that we've been through.
Speaker 1: So with that said, I think we're gonna leave it
Speaker 1: right there. So once again, thank you for tuning in
Speaker 1: the civic ccipher. I'm your host, Rams this's job.
Speaker 3: They call me.
Speaker 1: Q Ward Show producer DJ Swirl. Hit the website civicipher
Speaker 1: dot com. Download this in any previous episode that you
Speaker 1: would like to check out. You can also check us
Speaker 1: out on YouTube and make a donation. The show grows
Speaker 1: with your help. You can also suggest topics and follow
Speaker 1: us on social media if you so choose. And until
Speaker 1: next week, y'all, I can.
Speaker 2: Take a look.
Speaker 1: Seen a book reading rain.
Speaker 2: Oh, I thought you were gonna cut me off.