WEBVTT - Civic Cipher 072421 ft. Q. Ward & Ramses Ja 0:00:00.600 --> 0:00:03.240 Welcome to another episode of Civic Cipher. I am your host, 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:10.280 rams Is Jah. Okay, so dj Q woard, good run. 0:00:11.560 --> 0:00:15.400 We'll talk about it for now. Y'all gonna just call 0:00:15.480 --> 0:00:21.279 me cu Yes indeed, and you know, another great show 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:24.160 for you, another great episode. Some some things I'm really 0:00:24.160 --> 0:00:28.400 excited to talk about. So stick around your radios because 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:34.040 we are going to I believe, coin a new term word. 0:00:34.200 --> 0:00:36.480 I love when we do that. Yes, and it's going 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:41.880 to be based on just experience, but I think it's 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:44.760 very real and I think a lot of especially black folks, 0:00:44.760 --> 0:00:48.080 who have similar experiences, we'll be able to relate to. 0:00:49.320 --> 0:00:52.320 Stick around for that. We also are going to talk 0:00:52.400 --> 0:00:57.840 about a study that was published in the Los Angeles 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:01.639 Times and was recorded to us by the new about 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:09.280 how police officers interact with different races differently. And you know, 0:01:09.319 --> 0:01:11.280 for those of us who know better who that kind 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:14.160 of goes without saying. But I think that, you know, 0:01:14.160 --> 0:01:16.280 we're gonna peel away a few layers and really see 0:01:16.319 --> 0:01:21.040 what that feels like and some of the outcomes that 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.760 are the result from those types of interactions, and you know, 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:29.120 maybe what we can do better moving forward to prevent 0:01:29.280 --> 0:01:32.600 some of what we've been seeing and throughout the history 0:01:32.640 --> 0:01:34.240 of this country, to be honest with you, and we 0:01:34.319 --> 0:01:39.200 also have an excellent BABA segment. Today are become a 0:01:39.200 --> 0:01:43.520 better ally segment. And I also think it's important for 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:47.400 us to start off with some ebony excellence. So we'll 0:01:47.480 --> 0:01:51.040 kick it off right here and give a shout out 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:52.440 to LeVar Burton. 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:56.960 All I do is win and win no matter what. 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:04.040 Now, for those who don't know LeVar Burton is He's 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:06.560 Jordy Laford's from Star Trek. I'm a Star Trek nerd. 0:02:07.040 --> 0:02:09.320 I'm sorry. I know that you're probably listening to this 0:02:09.480 --> 0:02:11.600 on a really cool radio stage. I'm just not that guy. 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:15.440 I'm super nerd. And fortunately I'm in good company because 0:02:15.520 --> 0:02:17.880 Q is a nerd to and I would venture to 0:02:17.919 --> 0:02:20.120 guess that so is DJ Swirl, our show producer. 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:23.120 He's the star of reading Rainbow to Me. Yeah, so 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:26.600 that luckily for y'all, I can't sing because I would 0:02:26.680 --> 0:02:33.240 be giving you the reading listen. Don't don't do it, 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:35.399 bro take a look. 0:02:35.480 --> 0:02:40.040 Okay, I stopped. I stopped anyway, you know, shout out 0:02:40.040 --> 0:02:43.000 to him having a great career. But you know, something 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:46.160 that happened recently is as we all know, Alex Trebek 0:02:46.400 --> 0:02:52.320 from Jeopardy passed away and uh, just another legendary icon 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.359 in the entertainment world. And uh, you know, I caught 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:59.079 win that LeVar Burton wanted to step in and take 0:02:59.080 --> 0:03:02.080 over that role. And as we know, typically that role 0:03:02.120 --> 0:03:06.720 has been held by a white man, and so it's 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:12.080 sometimes uncomfortable, especially in Middle America, to see that job 0:03:12.360 --> 0:03:15.960 shift away from a white skinned person to a black 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:19.679 skinned person, and so he's had to campaign for this. Unfortunately, 0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:21.520 it looks like they're gonna give him a shot. So 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:25.240 we're really excited to see what comes of that. LeVar 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:28.600 Burton should always stay unbothered and moisturized, as he puts 0:03:28.600 --> 0:03:30.240 on his Twitter feed, and we love to see it. 0:03:31.240 --> 0:03:34.480 And you know, next stop is Idris Elba becoming the 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:37.880 next James Bond. I still believe. I believe it's possible. 0:03:37.920 --> 0:03:39.040 You think they're gonna let it happen. 0:03:39.280 --> 0:03:42.680 I'm gonna believe. Man. I'm a believer. I'm an optimist, and. 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:46.320 You guys listen, so you know this is definitely a 0:03:46.360 --> 0:03:47.920 believer and an optim and you. 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:49.480 Know the thing is we can share he can be 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:51.200 James Bond for a couple movies and then it could 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:52.960 go back to someone white, and man, we can have 0:03:53.000 --> 0:03:55.880 some other folks, you know, maybe Middle Eastern. You know, 0:03:56.280 --> 0:03:58.600 I think it's possible, Man, James, Bond is an idea 0:03:59.040 --> 0:04:01.320 and we can share it ideas with each other as 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:04.160 brothers and sisters, and I very much look forward to 0:04:04.160 --> 0:04:10.480 the day when that is normalized. But that is a 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:17.560 perfect opportunity to segue into our first topic for discussion 0:04:17.560 --> 0:04:20.320 today and something that I really wanted to get into 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:22.159 for a long time. This has kind of been on 0:04:22.279 --> 0:04:29.600 my mind for a bit recently. I heard it was 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:33.680 just in the background, some sort of arbitrary dialogue or 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:37.400 something like that, but the term white guilt came up. 0:04:37.560 --> 0:04:37.720 Right. 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:41.039 It's a term that in our arena is you know, 0:04:41.120 --> 0:04:44.320 thrown around quite a bit, and white guilt is one 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:48.880 of the things that, in my belief and my understanding, 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:55.520 is basically the feeling that some white people have when 0:04:55.880 --> 0:04:59.480 coming to terms with the fact that people who are 0:04:59.480 --> 0:05:04.320 not white have a tougher go in some areas of 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:09.920 their lives, and it's because they're not white, that's the 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:13.160 primary reason for it. And so some white folks feel 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:17.320 guilty about that, and as a result, they will try 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:19.680 in their own way to bring a little bit of 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:22.680 balance to the universe. And so it's it sounds bad. 0:05:23.640 --> 0:05:25.880 For some it is though, because there are others who 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:29.560 that guilt makes them push back the other way. Yeah, sure, No, 0:05:29.680 --> 0:05:32.680 that's not true, because it makes them feel bad about themselves. 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:36.599 Sure sure. And that's that's something that a lot of 0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:39.640 white people resist. And we see that, I don't have 0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:42.680 to guess, and we actually see that in media and 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:47.560 in real life and day to day interactions. But in 0:05:47.600 --> 0:05:50.640 any event, that is what it is. You know, that's 0:05:50.680 --> 0:05:55.279 how that term is used when discussing, you know, the 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:58.880 way that we interact and relate to each other as 0:05:58.960 --> 0:06:01.800 as racist as as black people with respect to white 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:03.880 people and brown people and Native people and so forth. 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:09.480 You know, there's a lot of well documented instances of 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:16.120 if we're talking about a people, white people doing very 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:22.960 hurtful and harmful things and damaging things to races of 0:06:23.000 --> 0:06:26.239 people that are not white. You know, we're gonna speak 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:30.320 later on in the show about our Native brothers and sisters, 0:06:30.360 --> 0:06:33.279 and obviously they have a well documented history of getting 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:35.640 the short end of the stick when you know, when 0:06:35.640 --> 0:06:37.880 it comes to their interactions with white folks, which is 0:06:37.920 --> 0:06:41.040 why we need critical race theory in schools. Every time 0:06:41.040 --> 0:06:45.240 you give me a microphone, I'll say it. But yeah, 0:06:45.279 --> 0:06:51.200 so that's white guilt, and I believe that there is 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:56.240 such a thing as black guilt. Now, hear me out, 0:06:56.320 --> 0:06:57.560 and I do want to get your thoughts on this 0:06:57.839 --> 0:07:00.159 expound Yes, hear me out. 0:07:01.720 --> 0:07:02.080 For me. 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:07.440 I recognize that, oh God, this is going to be 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:09.360 tough to say, because there are some people who listen 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:13.600 to our show that are very fiery individual, fiery speakers, 0:07:13.600 --> 0:07:15.760 and they know that we've been done wrong and they 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:17.800 know that it's our time and we need to get 0:07:17.800 --> 0:07:20.240 our reparation all these things. And they're not wrong, they're right. 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:23.840 I agree one hundred percent. But me, being the person 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:26.200 that I am in the middle of myself, I recognize 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:31.200 that no matter what happens, we all have to get 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:40.800 there together wherever there is right. And I recognize that 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:46.600 the world is changing for white people, perhaps at a 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:50.760 faster pace than it ever has before. You know, I 0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:55.200 think that this show illustrates that point because it's very 0:07:55.320 --> 0:07:57.560 likely that the person who owns the radio station that 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:00.720 you're listening to our voices on and the sh shareholders 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:05.200 is a majority white folks, right, But they've allowed us 0:08:05.200 --> 0:08:07.920 to have a little bit of time to speak with you, 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:10.280 the listener, so that we can share our thoughts on 0:08:10.800 --> 0:08:12.600 what it's like to be black in America and hopefully 0:08:12.640 --> 0:08:16.200 empower you as our allies, and empower our black brothers 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:21.600 and sisters and Native and Hispanic and so forth. But 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:26.000 the world is very much changing, you know, the population 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:29.880 is changing, the you know, the life expectancy for white 0:08:29.880 --> 0:08:33.200 people is getting shorter. And when you've been in that 0:08:33.240 --> 0:08:36.000 position for such a long time where you don't have 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:38.480 to worry about those sorts of things, you're just kind 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:41.560 of secure, comfortably in your space, when the world starts 0:08:41.640 --> 0:08:45.600 changing around you, any human being would be a little 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:48.680 bit unsettled by that, you know. And so there's a 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:55.720 part of me that has to recognize that this is 0:08:57.480 --> 0:09:01.480 not easy for white people. You know, white people that 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:05.320 are well intentioned and mean well and want an equitable 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:07.880 experience for all of us in this country, and you know, 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:11.640 the white people that don't want that, the white people 0:09:11.720 --> 0:09:14.559 that resist it. It's got to be uncomfortable on some 0:09:14.720 --> 0:09:17.679 level for everyone. Because we're talking about race, and we're 0:09:17.720 --> 0:09:26.559 talking about shifting away from a traditional hierarchy of race 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:30.000 in this country toward a more equitable one. And even 0:09:30.040 --> 0:09:32.199 if that is one hundred years in the future, when 0:09:32.200 --> 0:09:35.320 we actually achieve that, the fact that the conversation is 0:09:36.080 --> 0:09:39.280 center stage, you know, more so now than in the 0:09:39.320 --> 0:09:44.319 past twenty thirty years in this country, it's got to 0:09:44.360 --> 0:09:46.040 be a bit unsettling. I know, in the back of 0:09:46.080 --> 0:09:49.080 people's minds, they have to worry, like, are you going 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:51.600 to harm me? Are you going to you know, this 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:53.720 is if I give up some power, is it going 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:55.360 to come back to affect me negatively? 0:09:55.440 --> 0:09:55.640 Right? 0:09:56.520 --> 0:10:02.880 And as a feeling athetic black person, I try to 0:10:02.920 --> 0:10:07.960 recognize the human experience that my Caucasian brothers and sisters 0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:12.640 are enduring or experiencing. Enduring is kind of you know, 0:10:12.760 --> 0:10:15.680 me being a little bit it's a little bit too 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:23.400 heavy a word, but experiencing, you know, and empathizing and 0:10:23.440 --> 0:10:26.200 recognizing like, hey, listen, you know, let me make sure 0:10:26.240 --> 0:10:30.600 that you understand and you're secure, and you know that 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:34.120 I love you. This needs to happen, But I love 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:36.400 you and you're and I'll be there for you. I'll 0:10:36.440 --> 0:10:38.480 be an ally the same way that you're being an 0:10:38.480 --> 0:10:41.120 ally to me. I'll stand with you if you stand 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:46.800 with me these sorts of things. And you know, we 0:10:46.880 --> 0:10:49.400 saw we saw a video the other day where there 0:10:49.440 --> 0:10:52.360 was a woman who was and I want to say, 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:55.000 it was like a makeup store and she was getting 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:59.280 filmed in the makeup store. She was going full Karen and. 0:10:59.600 --> 0:11:01.160 It was a Victoria's Secrets? 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:03.560 Was that it? Okay? Sorry, Victoria's Secret story. She was 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:07.240 going full Karen and you know she's on video and 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:09.360 then all of a sudden she drops to the floor 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:12.400 and starts wailing right full full on Karen one hundred 0:11:12.400 --> 0:11:21.040 and ten percent. So those tears to the right audience 0:11:21.400 --> 0:11:28.600 makes her the victim in that story. And you know 0:11:28.640 --> 0:11:31.320 it seemed like, you know, she just slipped right into 0:11:31.320 --> 0:11:31.760 that role. 0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:36.720 You know, well she she performed passing out first. 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:37.880 Yeah, like. 0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:41.120 You have to see the videos. 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:43.440 Sure she will make that available before you Yeah, but 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:45.400 you know, for now, you know this, just take my 0:11:45.480 --> 0:11:50.360 word for it. But I recognize that not every white 0:11:50.400 --> 0:11:57.000 person is that. But you know, there's there's I'm sure 0:11:57.000 --> 0:11:59.440 there's a spectrum, you know, and there's some folks who 0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:03.280 well intentioned, they mean well, they do their best, they 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.160 try to live a good life, and they might make 0:12:05.200 --> 0:12:08.240 a mistake, they might misspeak, they might not know the 0:12:08.280 --> 0:12:11.840 social the new social norms. Don't touch my hair, you know, 0:12:11.920 --> 0:12:13.640 for those that can't see me, I have a lot 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:15.360 of hair, and that happens to me quite a bit. 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:22.200 And I know that the right thing to do is 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:27.320 correct everybody right. But sometimes it's hard for me to 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:30.480 do that because I know that A I need you 0:12:30.600 --> 0:12:36.400 to keep believing that I'm your friend, that that we're 0:12:36.440 --> 0:12:39.360 on the same team here, and so I'll let you 0:12:39.440 --> 0:12:43.160 have that. And I think that that is the black guilt, 0:12:43.679 --> 0:12:46.360 where it's like, oh, I got it's it's it's a 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:48.320 tricky game we've got to play here, because I don't 0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:51.679 want you to start crying and thinking that I'm canceling 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.040 you and I don't, you know, And I feel guilty 0:12:54.080 --> 0:12:56.200 because I know that you mean well. But you know, 0:12:56.240 --> 0:13:01.720 we have to learn that some things we we still 0:13:01.920 --> 0:13:03.800 we still have a ways to go in a lot 0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:12.040 of areas. And I can't afford to lose you as 0:13:12.080 --> 0:13:16.080 an ally. So I can't afford to lay all of 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:19.120 my demands at your feet right now. 0:13:19.400 --> 0:13:19.560 You know. 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:21.760 I gotta do it one at a time, incrementally. And 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:25.080 so there's some things that might happen, and I just 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:28.679 have to look past them. Some things I can't, you know, 0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:32.600 but you know, for those that know, you know, this 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:38.359 show was born out of UH an old radio programmer 0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:41.600 telling me that he did not want to do a 0:13:41.640 --> 0:13:45.840 black show. That was his exact words, but a little 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:47.560 bit more was that he didn't want to do a 0:13:47.559 --> 0:13:49.560 show that spoke to what was going on in the 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:52.080 streets in twenty twenty. And I felt that that was necessary. 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:54.439 And when he made that decision, you know, Q and 0:13:54.520 --> 0:13:57.440 I we decided to step away and do our own show, 0:13:57.480 --> 0:14:02.120 which you're hearing now. Also, that station doesn't exist anymore, 0:14:02.400 --> 0:14:05.920 so everybody that supported us, we appreciate you. But wow, 0:14:07.040 --> 0:14:13.840 but you know, that's a battle that I had to pick. 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:16.880 But there were many other battles in that radio station 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.280 that I could. I could not die on those hills. 0:14:21.600 --> 0:14:25.440 And I think that what I was experiencing in hindsight 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:29.720 was black guilt. I know that you don't know what 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:32.880 my experience is like, and I also know that I 0:14:32.920 --> 0:14:37.040 can't put too much on you, otherwise I risk losing you. 0:14:37.120 --> 0:14:41.520 Because the rights narrative is these people ask for too much. 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:46.040 They're looking at it the wrong way. You know slavery 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:48.680 was a thing that happened all over the world, and 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:50.920 they completely ignore the fact that there was a very 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:53.440 unique form of slavery that took place in this country 0:14:53.440 --> 0:14:56.800 that really existed to like dehumanize and brutalize. It didn't 0:14:56.800 --> 0:15:00.600 incorporate people into the family and the fabric society. And 0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:02.680 though you know there and there's a million things we 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:06.640 could talk about for a million hours. But you know, 0:15:06.720 --> 0:15:08.720 if you want to tell yourself a different story, you can, 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:10.360 and if you want to recruit people, you can. And 0:15:10.400 --> 0:15:13.920 if I'm the person in your office demanding that you 0:15:14.080 --> 0:15:17.680 check all these boxes right now, it's it's so easy 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:20.840 for you to subscribe to a different narrative that fits 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:24.960 the worldview that you have, and so that black guilt, 0:15:25.400 --> 0:15:30.280 it creeps in and it causes me to feel like 0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:34.320 I shouldn't ask for too much, you know, I you know, 0:15:34.400 --> 0:15:37.040 I can't afford for this to get away from me, 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:39.840 and so I think it's a real thing that exists, 0:15:40.760 --> 0:15:43.120 and I can't be the only one, right. 0:15:44.600 --> 0:15:47.840 So it's really interesting that you bring this up because 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.880 I've expressed to you before how sometimes it is difficult 0:15:51.920 --> 0:15:56.760 to do our show because I feel like someone's gonna 0:15:56.800 --> 0:16:01.120 hear it, they're gonna feel bad, and for that reason 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:05.280 they'll tune us out completely. And it's hard to not 0:16:05.800 --> 0:16:13.080 pile on when there's so much nuance. Right if there 0:16:13.160 --> 0:16:19.800 was ever a collective expression of guilt, right, you mentioned 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:26.080 the word reparations earlier. The idea that hasn't happened is 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:31.800 insane when you review the truths of black people on 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:36.960 this soil. And that's why the piwing on for people 0:16:37.040 --> 0:16:41.840 like us sometimes feels necessary, Like how are there people 0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:45.680 that still want that still don't want to acknowledge our plight, 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:52.680 So it seems unfair to those that do. And when 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:57.960 they're both a part of the same group, it's hard 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:00.160 not to speak to both people. It's like giving a 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:02.200 lecture to both of your children and one of them 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.320 is the class president and the valedictorian and has never 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:08.240 been in trouble and the one you just bailed out. 0:17:08.600 --> 0:17:12.160 Giving them the same lecture is not fair, even though 0:17:12.160 --> 0:17:14.200 they're both your kids. They're both in the same car, 0:17:14.320 --> 0:17:16.359 they're in the same age group, they live in the 0:17:16.359 --> 0:17:19.680 same house, they have the same rules. The one that's 0:17:19.720 --> 0:17:24.240 the class president and valedictorian is sitting there almost enraged 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:27.080 that they have to sit through this conversation Mom, Dad, 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:35.240 I know. So it's very difficult doing the show the 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:37.160 way that we do it, with the topics that we're 0:17:37.160 --> 0:17:43.120 forced to address, because we hope that if you're listening 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:47.119 to a station that has our show on it, that 0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:48.800 there are going to be a lot of things that 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:53.720 you can at least empathize with us on. Right, But 0:17:53.920 --> 0:18:01.800 sometimes if you're a white person, you can feel attacked by. 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:05.000 A show like this. Yeah, and even if. 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:09.800 At your core you actually agree with what we're saying, 0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:13.440 when it sounds like we're identifying you as the culprit, 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:15.120 it's hard to say. 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:16.360 It's hard not to say. 0:18:16.200 --> 0:18:19.359 Well, wait a minute and want to stand up for 0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:22.919 yourself even though you're not the person that we're talking about. 0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:25.240 So I've felt that. 0:18:26.680 --> 0:18:31.800 Black guilt, if that's what we're calling it, because even 0:18:31.840 --> 0:18:34.720 in our production meetings, when we're talking with Swirl, I'm like, Man, 0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:38.800 are we piling on? Are we talking about the same 0:18:39.000 --> 0:18:42.280 types of things too much? And the reason why I'm 0:18:42.320 --> 0:18:44.720 so quick to say to snap out of it and 0:18:44.760 --> 0:18:48.320 say no, is because we're not talking about We never 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:50.640 have a show where the things we're talking about happened 0:18:51.800 --> 0:18:56.800 nine months ago. It might be the same thing that 0:18:56.880 --> 0:18:59.640 happened nine months ago, but it's a brand new story. 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:03.840 So it's like, you guys can't see me the shrug 0:19:03.880 --> 0:19:06.120 and facial expression that you're getting from me right now. 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:09.840 It's like, well, it's still happening, it's regularly still happening. 0:19:10.680 --> 0:19:13.520 Regularly isn't even a good enough word, right. There's things 0:19:13.520 --> 0:19:16.400 that with frequency, at a frequency that we can't keep 0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.480 up with. There's stories that we've missed just because our 0:19:19.560 --> 0:19:23.280 show isn't on frequent enough, and the weeks in between, 0:19:23.440 --> 0:19:26.280 so much more happens that you know, we just kind 0:19:26.280 --> 0:19:29.440 of end up moving to the next or most recent 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:35.840 thing that happened that might sound and feel the same. So, man, 0:19:35.960 --> 0:19:39.600 you're absolutely right because I felt it. I've dealt with that. 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:42.160 I try to reconcile, and like I said, even when 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:44.440 we're doing our show, it's something that I think about, Like, man, 0:19:44.480 --> 0:19:47.360 I do not want to alienate people that support us, 0:19:47.960 --> 0:19:52.840 because the description sounds like them, right, because it's so 0:19:54.119 --> 0:19:59.600 in so many occurrences it's police officer or white man 0:20:00.480 --> 0:20:06.080 or white people, and because there's such variance, we can't 0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:08.959 say the white lady whose name we don't know at 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:12.560 the Victoria's Secret and whatever city that's in. With every occurrence, 0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:17.640 we can't point specifically to name, person, time, date, description, 0:20:18.160 --> 0:20:23.440 so we just generally say white police officer, for instance. 0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:31.120 So yeah, man, it's it's not black and white. It's 0:20:31.160 --> 0:20:34.280 not straightforward, it's not cut and dry. It's really it's 0:20:34.280 --> 0:20:40.240 a really really difficult line to toe because we have 0:20:40.320 --> 0:20:42.199 to address the things that we address, but it is 0:20:42.240 --> 0:20:48.639 not easy to keep from alienating people that are a 0:20:48.800 --> 0:20:52.639 part of that group but not of it, you know, 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:55.240 in the group, but not of it, if that makes sense. 0:20:55.640 --> 0:21:02.200 I know what you mean. And there's something that happens 0:21:02.240 --> 0:21:07.280 in media and this show doesn't really fit that format 0:21:07.440 --> 0:21:12.159 and I don't think that it ever will, but for 0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:16.640 different reasons. And there's kind of like a saying, if 0:21:16.640 --> 0:21:19.800 it bleeds, it leads, and so these are the sorts 0:21:19.840 --> 0:21:24.240 of things that dominate the news cycle. But the nature 0:21:24.240 --> 0:21:27.800 of our show is a little different, and we have 0:21:27.840 --> 0:21:33.399 an objective. We don't inform people for the sake of 0:21:33.440 --> 0:21:36.160 informing people, because you can just be alive and click 0:21:36.200 --> 0:21:39.760 on any news whatever in your pocket and become informed. 0:21:40.800 --> 0:21:44.960 We try to provide context and have long form discussions 0:21:45.000 --> 0:21:52.000 about really about race relations and about how do we 0:21:52.040 --> 0:21:59.040 empower each other to reach the level of equity that 0:21:59.160 --> 0:22:01.200 I think that we can reach. And this is kind 0:22:01.200 --> 0:22:03.159 of what we're going for. And so the stories that 0:22:03.200 --> 0:22:09.320 we choose to you know, deal with are pointed in 0:22:09.359 --> 0:22:11.159 that direction. And so that's why this is not a 0:22:11.160 --> 0:22:13.000 blood and gut show every time. That's why we can 0:22:13.040 --> 0:22:16.240 talk about things like concepts like this one black guilt 0:22:17.680 --> 0:22:20.960 and so forth, and so it's it's a little bit 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:27.399 different show. But I think that you know, in doing so, 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:32.120 like you said, we have to also reconcile, how how 0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:36.080 is this going to hit people? Because we know, you know, 0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:38.960 someone said it was actually been said quite a bit 0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.440 that black people are not looking for revenge at all, 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:47.879 just looking for, like, you know, a fair go at life. 0:22:47.920 --> 0:22:51.679 And you know, and and we get to decide based 0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:55.439 on our vantage point and how the world looks to 0:22:55.520 --> 0:23:00.880 us what that is because you know, so many times 0:23:00.920 --> 0:23:05.480 throughout history, forgive me, white people have been the ones 0:23:05.560 --> 0:23:11.000 dictating what is fair, and almost invariably it is way 0:23:11.040 --> 0:23:14.880 more fair if you are also white, and way less 0:23:14.920 --> 0:23:17.280 fair if you are not a white person as well. 0:23:17.880 --> 0:23:20.560 And you know, there's obviously examples of white folks discriminating 0:23:20.560 --> 0:23:23.360 against other white folks as well, But you know, it's 0:23:23.359 --> 0:23:26.040 a power struggling. More often than not, it's. 0:23:25.960 --> 0:23:29.440 And that typically isn't because they're white. And that's that's 0:23:29.560 --> 0:23:33.760 the that's the very clear and obvious difference they're you know, 0:23:33.800 --> 0:23:36.800 maybe it's because they're poor, maybe it's because they have 0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:40.280 different religious beliefs, maybe because their accent is different, they 0:23:40.359 --> 0:23:42.480 were born on a different soil, But it's not typically 0:23:42.480 --> 0:23:46.479 because they're white. It's for some other reason. Sure, and 0:23:46.920 --> 0:23:51.119 way too many cases, this shell that we walk around 0:23:51.160 --> 0:23:55.960 in is our crime. It is the reason why we're 0:23:56.000 --> 0:23:59.440 being held back, discriminated against, judged. 0:24:00.480 --> 0:24:01.720 No hurt. 0:24:01.880 --> 0:24:03.639 And you know, there's something else to be said. I 0:24:03.800 --> 0:24:05.399 just while we're here, I want to say it. You know, 0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:13.320 we we we are very critical of policing as an institution, 0:24:13.520 --> 0:24:18.320 and certainly critical of certain officers as well. But you know, 0:24:18.400 --> 0:24:21.600 we do have a dialogue with a few officers. One 0:24:21.640 --> 0:24:27.560 that comes to mind is there's a guy named Marcel. 0:24:27.760 --> 0:24:30.359 There's a guy named Kevin. You know these are Kevin 0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:33.560 is a sheriff's officer. Marcel reaches out to us on 0:24:33.600 --> 0:24:37.120 our social media and we recognize that police are humans too. 0:24:37.880 --> 0:24:40.639 We prefer the police who are humans first, you know, 0:24:41.480 --> 0:24:45.479 But that doesn't mean that we can't be critical of 0:24:45.520 --> 0:24:48.720 the system that employs them and advocate for change on 0:24:48.760 --> 0:24:51.720 their behalf and hopefully inspire them to advocate for change 0:24:51.720 --> 0:24:55.679 from within. And so, long story short, these are my 0:24:55.840 --> 0:25:01.440 thoughts on black guilt. But if you're white and listening, 0:25:01.600 --> 0:25:04.280 just know, hey, we love you, and we know that 0:25:04.320 --> 0:25:06.520 you love us, and that's not lost on us. And and 0:25:06.359 --> 0:25:07.720 we're going to get through this thing together. 0:25:07.840 --> 0:25:12.320 And now my mic. 0:25:12.320 --> 0:25:22.399