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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.

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Speaker 2: The can Film Festival has begun in the south of France,

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Speaker 2: but the traditional launch pad for European cinema is seeing

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Speaker 2: something different for twenty twenty five. This year, a bit

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Speaker 2: of West Africa is coming to the Cote Dozersk. My

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Speaker 2: Father's Shadow is making history as the first Nigerian film

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Speaker 2: to be an official selection at the festival, showing the

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Speaker 2: rising prominence of Nollywood on the world stage and investors

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Speaker 2: are starting to take notice. I'm bursting with excitement about

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Speaker 2: the opportunities that I believe are going to come with

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Speaker 2: this younger generation that are producing some really awesome stuff.

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Speaker 2: On this week's Next Africa Podcast, we look at the

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Speaker 2: rise of Nollywood and the asset managers looking to invest

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Speaker 2: in the industry, betting on blockbuster returns for a new

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Speaker 2: wave of Nigerian cinema. I'm Jennifer Zabasaja and this is

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Speaker 2: the Next Africa Podcast, bringing you one story each week

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Speaker 2: from the continent driving the future of global growth with

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Speaker 2: the context only Bloomberg can provide. Joining me to discuss

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Speaker 2: this this week is our Nigeria Bureau Chief, that is

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Speaker 2: Anthony os Brown. Anthony wrote a story on this that

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Speaker 2: is now available, but he's here with us to talk

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Speaker 2: through it. Maybe you can just start here and give

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Speaker 2: us a bit of a sense of how big Nigeria's

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Speaker 2: film industry is. What are we looking like when we

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Speaker 2: compare Nollywood to the bollywoods and the hollywoods.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, actually, when we compare Nollywood to Bollywood and Hollywood

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Speaker 1: is actually not in terms of value, but my in

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Speaker 1: terms of numbers. The Nigeria movie industry produce is and

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Speaker 1: outage of stone official figures more than two thousand movies

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Speaker 1: in a year, more than three four movies in a day.

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Speaker 1: So there's a lot of movies to produce, and I

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Speaker 1: think it's only second to Bollywood. It employs more than

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Speaker 1: a million people, possibly directly and more indirectly.

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Speaker 3: It's estimated to be what's.

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Speaker 1: Close to maybe six point five billion dollars or thereabout,

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Speaker 1: So yeah, it's a huge industry.

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Speaker 3: Most most of the.

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Speaker 1: People who operating that sector are self employed producers who

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Speaker 1: started producing movies on their own and gradually is beginning

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Speaker 1: to take shape. So it's quite a huge industry locally.

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Speaker 2: And it gains a lot of attention obviously online because

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Speaker 2: people are talking about different films and the cultural aspects

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Speaker 2: of it. Right, I think I've only seen one Nollywood film.

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Speaker 2: I must admit, Yeah, you're in the minority.

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Speaker 1: It's quite huge online, mostly Nigerians induspheal. I love it

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Speaker 1: because there is a means for them to connect to

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Speaker 1: their homeland, to culture, to let their children see what

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Speaker 1: it dislike to live in Nigeria and the cultural aspects

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Speaker 1: of Nigeria. But even locally it's huge. Years ago, most

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Speaker 1: people will watch Hollywood movies, but increasingly, if you put

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Speaker 1: a Hollywood movie and a Nollywood movie in Nigerian cly mass,

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Speaker 1: you'll get more people going towards the Nigerian movie than

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Speaker 1: the Hollywood movie. So increasingly is becoming dominant. Is quite

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Speaker 1: popular on YouTube, and it's quite popular across Africa most

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Speaker 1: African countries, and Nollywood dominates the TV screens. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: and the stars are quite popular across Africa.

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Speaker 2: Do you find yourself watching a few films here and

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Speaker 2: there in Hollywood films.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I do.

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Speaker 1: I have my favorite producers and once I see their movies,

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Speaker 1: I definitely want to watch. Maybe because of the quantity

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Speaker 1: of movies producing Nollywood, not all of them have the

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Speaker 1: quality that most people will want to watch, so they

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Speaker 1: are specific producers for me that once I see I

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Speaker 1: know the movies a bit, the quality is higher than

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Speaker 1: the normal Nollywood movies, so I will want to watch.

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Speaker 1: I'll definitely go out to watch them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you mentioned the quality aspect of it, which

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Speaker 2: which brings to light the likes of Netflix and Amazon

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Speaker 2: that have also over time obviously become more and more

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Speaker 2: entrenched and aware of what is happening with Nollywood. What

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Speaker 2: have their investments meant for the industry.

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Speaker 1: One of the uniqueness of Nollywood is the fact that

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Speaker 1: they produce very low cost movies. I don't think anywhere

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Speaker 1: in the world you can get the low cost movies

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Speaker 1: that Nollywood produces.

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Speaker 3: They can produce a.

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Speaker 1: Movie with even a thousand dollars, so that's five thouars,

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Speaker 1: usually very low figures, so the shooting is done just

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Speaker 1: as they can actually produce movies in two three days

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Speaker 1: compared to most of the parts of the world. So

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Speaker 1: that makes the quality of the movies they produce normally

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Speaker 1: not that good. But with Amazon prim and Netflix, they

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Speaker 1: came in and then they put money invested money initially

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Speaker 1: and that helped the producers do better qualitating movies, those

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Speaker 1: that already had an idea of what qualitting movie is

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Speaker 1: all about, and that improved the whole the standard in

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Speaker 1: the industry, and I think changed somehow the direction of

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Speaker 1: the industry. So yeah, I think Amazon Prime and Netflix

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Speaker 1: actually had a very and still have a very positive

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Speaker 1: influence on the industry because if you want to get

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Speaker 1: your movie on their platform, it has to be of

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Speaker 1: a certain quality.

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Speaker 2: That's where it's interesting, especially based on your reporting, how

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Speaker 2: some filmmakers and streamers are changing the way that they

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Speaker 2: fund some of these films you mentioned a lot of

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Speaker 2: them can be made for you one thousand dollars here

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Speaker 2: and there. What's actually changed with the investment models and

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Speaker 2: do we know yet what the impact will be.

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Speaker 1: I think sometime late last year Amazon Prime and the

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Speaker 1: Netflix decided that they won't commission movies again, and that

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Speaker 1: means not going to give a movie producers money to

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Speaker 1: go ahead and produce the movie. But if you produce

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Speaker 1: a good quality movie they like, they can buy it

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Speaker 1: from you. That provided an opportunity for asset managers to

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Speaker 1: come into that industry in the sense that if you

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Speaker 1: can get show that you have a contract with Netflix

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Speaker 1: or his own prime that they will take your movie

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Speaker 1: from you, then they will help you fund the movie.

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Speaker 1: So that has changed the mode of funding for the

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Speaker 1: industry in the sense that now movie producers know that

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Speaker 1: there's an end market for their product. Asset managers see

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Speaker 1: that there's going to be a buy in the Netflix

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Speaker 1: and an exam prime will pay for the right to

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Speaker 1: air the movie, to stream the movies in dollars, and

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Speaker 1: that also is a hedge against currency es. Locally, the

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Speaker 1: Nira has been very volatile, so if you get any

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Speaker 1: source of dog like income, it becomes very positive for

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Speaker 1: local players. So the asset managers are seeing it as

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Speaker 1: an opportunity to end dollars by selling a product that

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Speaker 1: has a good upside, because if the movie is very

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Speaker 1: good and inns more money, then they could also make

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Speaker 1: more money from it. So that change the model, and

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Speaker 1: so is making asset managers look at that industry and

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Speaker 1: putting money down for movies to be funded.

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Speaker 3: Of course, that has also improved.

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Speaker 1: The quality of movies that is being produced because they

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Speaker 1: won't fund a movie that will not do well, so

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Speaker 1: they set the standards. They make sure that the movie

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Speaker 1: is of the right quality that their Netflix and Amazon

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Speaker 1: Prime will be interested in taking it up and streaming.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, so that has changed sort of. The industry

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Speaker 1: is inspiring more people to push for quality movies that

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Speaker 1: will in streaming.

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Speaker 2: Rise and Anthony, stick with us. When we come back,

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Speaker 2: we're going to talk more about who's stepping in to

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Speaker 2: invest and why they're hoping for blockbuster returns. We'll be

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Speaker 2: right back. Welcome back. Today, we're talking about Nollywood as

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Speaker 2: the Nigerian film industry continues to make waves on the

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Speaker 2: international stage and also domestically. Anthony ose Brown, our Bloomberg

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Speaker 2: Nigeria Bureau chief, is joining us this week to dig

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Speaker 2: into this. So, Anthony, you were explaining a bit more

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Speaker 2: about how asset managers and new forms of capital are

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Speaker 2: being injected into Nollywood and the industry more broadly. I

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Speaker 2: wonder in your reporting and when you were speaking to

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Speaker 2: some of these asset managers, what did they tell you

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Speaker 2: that stuck out to you? Why are they so keen?

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Speaker 2: Is it because of the currency hedging? Is it because

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Speaker 2: they're themselves interested in Nollywood? I mean, what sort of

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Speaker 2: anecdotes did they give you.

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Speaker 1: I think one of the things that's talk outs is

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Speaker 1: the fact that they see these as a very viable

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Speaker 1: source of long tandard income industry. So they're doing both

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Speaker 1: depth and equity. On the equity side, they see that

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Speaker 1: there's no end to it because I think of it

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Speaker 1: their movies that were shot in nineteen sixties, nineteen seventies

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Speaker 1: that are still being shown today. So for them, once

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Speaker 1: you have the intellectual property rights sorted out, that means

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Speaker 1: a good movie how and where you have an equity interest,

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Speaker 1: could become an endless source of income because if it's

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Speaker 1: very good, maybe twenty years down the line, thirty years

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Speaker 1: down down the line, people will stay want to buy

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Speaker 1: the IP rights to either train it or to show

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Speaker 1: it somewhere, or to maybe make redoing, a remake, a sequel, whatever.

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Speaker 1: So once you put you get the right movie down,

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Speaker 1: there's an endless possibility to it. Then, besides the returns

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Speaker 1: that they are making in terms of the investing in it,

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Speaker 1: they are making returns of on the equity side, someone

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Speaker 1: in one of the key find founders, they're making returns

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Speaker 1: of thirty to forty percent return on equity, which is high.

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Speaker 3: You can hardly make that in any other.

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Speaker 1: Investments locally, So that's that's a big attraction for them. Also,

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Speaker 1: and then of course the key part is they're hedging

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Speaker 1: the ability to hedge your returns because you're getting paid

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Speaker 1: in dollars. And if you're getting paid in dollars and

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Speaker 1: you're funding in Naira, they're funding the movies in nira

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Speaker 1: but getting paid in dollars, so there's an upside on

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Speaker 1: that contraint. And the currency has been weakening for the

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Speaker 1: last one year, so one two, two years, so that

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Speaker 1: for them, those are the key things that they're looking

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Speaker 1: at and makes knowledge were quite attractive for them to

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Speaker 1: put money in.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's sort of at net positive and even the

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Speaker 2: model that you're outlining there, it seems like that is

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Speaker 2: probably what a lot of the Hollywood studios we're thinking

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Speaker 2: forty fifty years ago when they were creating these films

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Speaker 2: that are still getting some of the returns as you

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Speaker 2: were mentioning there, because they're caught like favorites or something

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Speaker 2: like that. So the opportunity clearly is there, Anthony. It's

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Speaker 2: really fascinating. We started off talking today on the podcast

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Speaker 2: about My Father's Story, which is premiering at the can

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Speaker 2: Film Festival. This is very notable for people who have

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Speaker 2: been following the Nollywood industry more broadly, when we look

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Speaker 2: at a few years down the road, though, if we

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Speaker 2: do continue to see maybe a bit more discernment about

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Speaker 2: what's made and what's not, should we expect more presence

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Speaker 2: from Nollywood films in European and American cinemas. And I

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Speaker 2: say that because you know, we also talk to Moabudu

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Speaker 2: who has aspirations for that. Is that where we're headed?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's where we are headed.

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Speaker 1: I think we'll increasingly see Nollywood getting into the international

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Speaker 1: main movie scene because of the increasing quality of the

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Speaker 1: movies that I'm produce in with Netflix and Amazon Prime,

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Speaker 1: they are increasingly being seen by non Nigerians.

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Speaker 3: If you check the go online and check the.

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Speaker 1: Statistics of who is watching Nollywood, you're increasingly seeing them

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Speaker 1: appearing in countries that are not known to have a

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Speaker 1: dominant Nigerian population or excizable Nigerian population. So increasingly it's

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Speaker 1: gaining mainstream attraction. So yeah, and then they are beginning

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Speaker 1: to because of the quality of movies, they are beginning

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Speaker 1: to be seen in the right places, so we're likely

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Speaker 1: to see them increasingly compete with the global players. And

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Speaker 1: then because they also want to gain international attention. They're

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Speaker 1: beginning to go into collaborations and then that's where they

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Speaker 1: asset managers come into because the asset managers want the

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Speaker 1: movies to be globally competitive. They're also encouraging producers to

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Speaker 1: go into partnerships with established stars in other parts of

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Speaker 1: the world, so they're looking at bringing. They're increasingly trying

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Speaker 1: to get Nollywood African Nollywood stars into Nollywood movies even

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Speaker 1: ahead of where they are trying to partner with Bollywood

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Speaker 1: stars also in a bit to widen the appeal of

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Speaker 1: Nollywood movies. So we're gregal going to see these collaborations

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Speaker 1: and these movements where you'll see that Nollywood increasingly goes

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Speaker 1: into mainstream globally and people start seeing Nollywood that's just

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Speaker 1: the way they purpublic see Hollywood Bollywood. But it's going

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Speaker 1: to take some time, but I don't think that's too far.

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Speaker 3: Away that we're likely to see that happening very soon.

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Speaker 2: Yah, Anthony, can you give me a Nollywood film that

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Speaker 2: I should watch?

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Speaker 3: The Black Book? Go watch it.

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Speaker 1: The Black Book is quite interesting. The Gangs of Legos

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Speaker 1: that's on Amazon Prime, I think it's also very interesting.

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Speaker 3: I think those are good move and Nollywood movies.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to go for it. I love a good film,

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Speaker 2: so it's nice to see this industry sort of taking off. Anthony,

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Speaker 2: thank you so much for your reporting. It was really

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Speaker 2: great to speak with you. We'll make sure to share

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Speaker 2: your story in the show notes. Thanks Anthony. This program

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Speaker 2: was produced by A. Bradley and tiwa Adebayo. Don't forget

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Speaker 2: to follow and review this show wherever you usually get

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Speaker 2: your podcasts. I'm Jennifer's Abasaga. Thanks as always for listening.