WEBVTT - The Reunion Part 1 0:00:01.960 --> 0:00:10.160 Wind Down with Janet Kramer and I'm Heart Radio Podcast. Hi, Hi, guys, 0:00:10.680 --> 0:00:11.319 it's the week. 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:17.840 Good morning, Jana, Good morning. That would be my current mood. 0:00:17.880 --> 0:00:19.560 Good morning Jana and Catherine. 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:20.200 Guys. 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:23.680 What a blessed day today is? It's book week. It 0:00:23.760 --> 0:00:25.360 is book week, and I'm really proud of you. 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:26.000 Thank you. 0:00:26.600 --> 0:00:28.880 I got teared up. Did you hear it on the Instagram? 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:31.720 I tried to swallow my tears fast, friend, I did. 0:00:31.880 --> 0:00:32.600 Why did you get teared? 0:00:32.680 --> 0:00:33.479 Probably cry right now? 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:36.280 Okay? 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:42.360 Episode of wind Down. Yeah, I'm just really proud of you. 0:00:43.200 --> 0:00:43.480 Same. 0:00:43.880 --> 0:00:45.839 Kat had said something to me we were flying back 0:00:45.840 --> 0:00:50.760 from New York last night, and I sometimes forget because 0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:52.559 I've we've all lived it. 0:00:52.640 --> 0:00:53.520 But I guess. 0:00:53.479 --> 0:00:57.920 I in my mind it might have not been as 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:00.440 heavy and she was ever she was. I'll let you 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:02.200 say what you said to me on the plane about 0:01:02.200 --> 0:01:03.160 how every time you. 0:01:03.280 --> 0:01:06.520 Read it, every time I read anything about it, every 0:01:06.520 --> 0:01:10.440 time you talk about it, it makes me cry. And 0:01:10.480 --> 0:01:12.760 I'm not I mean, I am a crier, but I 0:01:12.800 --> 0:01:16.240 like to avoid my feelings. You know, there is something 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:19.840 about this topic that just gets me every single time. 0:01:20.440 --> 0:01:21.840 I was crying in the car on the way here. 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:25.120 She was and I called her. She called me and 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:26.679 I was like, I was just crying and listening to. 0:01:26.600 --> 0:01:30.680 Worship music too, because I go I mean, anyway, I 0:01:30.680 --> 0:01:32.880 don't want to go straight into I mean, it's book week. 0:01:32.920 --> 0:01:34.960 I'm so excited for you, but yeah, it's a lot, 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:35.720 it's emotional. 0:01:36.360 --> 0:01:39.440 Well you almost I think I forget I didn't go 0:01:39.520 --> 0:01:43.240 through all of this alone, and you guys carried a 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:46.280 lot of this with me. You were in the book 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:48.680 and I can't remember which chapter it was, but we 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:52.120 were under a table together, you and me, KB and 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:55.280 then Catherine obviously, I mean, you are a ginormous part 0:01:55.320 --> 0:01:57.120 of the book. And there's so many things that we'd 0:01:57.520 --> 0:02:00.720 talk about from the very beginning too, and there's so 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:03.440 many things too that you know, are even not in there, 0:02:03.760 --> 0:02:07.920 that we've been through with everything, and so for I 0:02:07.960 --> 0:02:11.920 almost forget how much weight you guys have also carried 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:17.280 through the last seven years of this next chapter. 0:02:17.560 --> 0:02:19.519 Yeah, I think it's about to sixty two hundred and 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:22.080 sixty pounds is what we were carrying. Does that feel accurate? 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:24.200 I'm not sure exact weight class, but. 0:02:24.440 --> 0:02:27.960 I think that, at least speaking for myself, I don't 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:31.120 even think I realize until those moments how much weight 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:33.720 I was carrying in that time. 0:02:33.840 --> 0:02:36.280 You carried double I think, right, it's. 0:02:36.120 --> 0:02:38.920 Just like in the moment, it's just like, what do 0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:41.040 we need to do. Let's take care of things, let's 0:02:41.080 --> 0:02:43.760 you know, da da da. It's not until I hear 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:45.760 y'all talk about it and I go back there, or 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:47.560 I read about it and I think about it and 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:49.880 I'm so emotional. I don't realize how much weight it 0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:52.280 actually was on me as well. 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:54.400 What do you think as a friend was the hardest 0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:58.960 piece for you going through that journey with me those 0:02:59.000 --> 0:02:59.760 many years. 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:05.240 The hardest part was just seeing you hurt. I mean, 0:03:05.280 --> 0:03:07.880 it's nobody wants to see anybody hurt, but then to 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.120 have the person that's so closest to you hurt over 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:15.679 and over and over again. But also in part not 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:18.840 doing it to yourself, but allowing it, and that's I 0:03:18.840 --> 0:03:21.079 think was the hardest piece, because it's like you, I 0:03:21.160 --> 0:03:22.919 understand that you can't see it when you're in the 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:25.600 middle of it. I totally understand that, but that's what's 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:27.799 so frustrating on this point, this part, you know, it 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:30.560 is like you can't see it, but you're so hurt, 0:03:30.560 --> 0:03:32.920 and you keep getting hurt, and you're allowing yourself to 0:03:32.919 --> 0:03:35.960 get hurt. But it's like a it's a it's a 0:03:35.960 --> 0:03:38.400 frustrating and hard feeling because you know, I mean, as 0:03:38.440 --> 0:03:40.560 Amy's told me before, like they have to see it 0:03:40.600 --> 0:03:43.520 for themselves, and you know that. I know that in 0:03:43.560 --> 0:03:45.760 that moment, but I'm like just praying, like what at 0:03:45.760 --> 0:03:47.600 what point? At what point is she going to see 0:03:47.600 --> 0:03:50.960 it for herself? At what point is the hurt not 0:03:51.040 --> 0:03:53.840 going to be worth it? It was interesting to me. 0:03:55.280 --> 0:03:58.400 I felt like I always was fighting, as long as 0:03:58.440 --> 0:04:02.960 you were fighting, and then there was the time, like 0:04:03.000 --> 0:04:05.560 the straw that broke the camel's back for me was 0:04:05.600 --> 0:04:07.840 not as catastrophic and big as I thought it would be. 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:11.400 I thought it would be like a big. 0:04:11.320 --> 0:04:15.000 Like some giant relationship or some huge, you know, something 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:18.240 outside of marriage. And I was like, that's it. And 0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:20.280 I remember exactly where I was when you sent it. 0:04:21.080 --> 0:04:23.440 I remember exactly how I typed it in, just sent 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:27.359 it from my soul, and I I think it's just 0:04:27.440 --> 0:04:33.520 difficult because we were friends with him too, and so 0:04:33.720 --> 0:04:37.799 it was like, stop messing with this, like stop messing 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:40.400 with all of us, stop hurting our friend, but then 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:42.839 also like we have fun game nights and we're all 0:04:42.880 --> 0:04:45.280 we all have inside jokes, like Kat and I have 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:47.279 both been on the road with you at separate times, 0:04:47.320 --> 0:04:49.479 like I did all of Texas with you and Mike, 0:04:49.640 --> 0:04:51.960 you know, like I'm like, but this is too tall, Mike, 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:58.200 Like get it together, dude, you have such a good life. Yeah. 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:03.240 And I always well, especially layered for you, Cat, because 0:05:03.279 --> 0:05:06.440 you have the business side to carry too, Like you 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:08.599 defend her as a friend, but then you also defend 0:05:08.600 --> 0:05:10.479 her as a client. And so that's why to me 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:14.040 it always is perceived as double heavy. Not that you 0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:15.760 have ever framed it that way, but in my brain, 0:05:15.760 --> 0:05:19.600 I'd always literally had said like, oh, I wouldn't want 0:05:19.600 --> 0:05:20.039 to be Cat. 0:05:20.480 --> 0:05:23.760 Well, it's just a hard wanting to be a friend, 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:26.680 but also thinking like but how do we protect her? 0:05:27.360 --> 0:05:27.560 You know? 0:05:27.800 --> 0:05:30.280 I mean, yeah, you got to think about that. How 0:05:30.279 --> 0:05:32.800 do we protect finances? How do we protect you know? 0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:34.800 You have to go into like a business mode and 0:05:35.000 --> 0:05:38.520 a and it's hard and I can remember very specifically 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:40.599 in that time, and I hope you heard it this way. 0:05:40.720 --> 0:05:44.120 I tried really hard. You know, Okay, this is friend 0:05:44.360 --> 0:05:47.359 Kat talking, this is business Cat talking now because it 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:49.920 seems so callous. I mean, it just seems so and 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:53.360 I understand I am a tough love type person anyways, 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:56.520 So then that layered with that having to go okay, 0:05:56.520 --> 0:05:59.240 but we have to think about this too. It seemed 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:01.440 hard and it was hard for me, and it was hard. 0:06:01.440 --> 0:06:04.279 It made me feel, you know, like I was just 0:06:04.320 --> 0:06:06.960 too tough sometimes. And you know, at the end of 0:06:07.000 --> 0:06:10.239 the day, I was probably the one person that from 0:06:10.279 --> 0:06:14.559 the beginning said leave. I understand that I'll never forget 0:06:14.560 --> 0:06:17.520 when you called and say okay, k Beef actually said 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:20.760 it's time, you know, because I had just was the 0:06:20.760 --> 0:06:23.640 only one that kind of from the beginning whether I 0:06:23.640 --> 0:06:25.680 should have or I shouldn't have. You know, I go 0:06:25.760 --> 0:06:28.080 back and forth on whether I should have even stated that, 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:30.080 but I kind of was the one, you know that 0:06:30.240 --> 0:06:32.200 just from the beginning was like enough is enough? 0:06:32.320 --> 0:06:37.279 Is that where you think he, y'alls, why you think 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:40.839 he throughout the years didn't like you? Probably that you 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:42.280 guys had that tension. 0:06:42.279 --> 0:06:46.120 Yeah, you know, And it's it's so hard because hearing 0:06:46.160 --> 0:06:51.279 that has really it's really it's really been hard, you know, 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:54.480 hearing you say the other day you're not sure if 0:06:54.480 --> 0:06:57.440 he liked me the whole time. That was hard to 0:06:57.520 --> 0:06:59.440 hear because, like you said, like I considered him a 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:01.720 friend and I'm going to cry because I did. I 0:07:01.760 --> 0:07:04.720 loved him too, and her husbands loved him. Yeah, and 0:07:04.760 --> 0:07:08.600 he hates us now, you know, And that's not easy 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:11.640 and somewhat not fair. You know, I don't feel like 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:12.400 that's fair. 0:07:13.840 --> 0:07:18.360 Because we also defended him on the backside so many. 0:07:18.560 --> 0:07:23.280 Yeah, every time you said I'm not leaving, I'm forgiving him, 0:07:23.920 --> 0:07:27.400 I chose to. I don't know if I forgave him, 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:29.640 but I chose to move on. Sure, I chose to 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:31.640 get along with him. I chose for him to still 0:07:31.680 --> 0:07:35.960 be my friend. Did I believe everything he was saying? No, 0:07:36.480 --> 0:07:39.480 I didn't. But I made a conscious choice to if 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:41.480 you're going to stay in this, I'm going to be 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:43.840 in this. And I think that's just it is. 0:07:44.120 --> 0:07:44.280 Man. 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:47.280 It's just hard to really hear that. I guess he 0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:49.120 didn't feel the same way. Well, I don't know. 0:07:49.200 --> 0:07:53.040 I was just right, and you're probably right. There was 0:07:53.080 --> 0:07:56.040 always that when there was a fight, it would be like, well, 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:59.120 Catherine's just your yes person or this or whatever, and. 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:03.480 Well, and what's interesting to that to me is. I 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:05.680 was thinking about this the other night. I feel like 0:08:05.720 --> 0:08:08.520 if I was your yes person, I would have said, oh, yeah, 0:08:08.520 --> 0:08:12.120 you're right, you can make this work. I was the opposite, 0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:14.040 and so in that moment, I truly and I wasn't 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.280 necessarily the opposite, you know. I wasn't always just like, 0:08:16.320 --> 0:08:18.360 oh my god, you know him or you know or whatever, 0:08:18.880 --> 0:08:23.080 but it was a y'all can't keep doing this to yourselves. 0:08:23.240 --> 0:08:27.600 You can't keep living this way. So yeah, I mean 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:29.680 I know that he thought that about me, that I 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:31.920 was your yes person. To me, I just felt like that, 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:35.720 you know, for the longest time, truly, you just wanted 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:37.520 to make it work. You really wanted people to tell 0:08:37.559 --> 0:08:39.760 you to make it work. In my mind, I think 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:41.480 you did well. 0:08:41.480 --> 0:08:44.520 I also think you thought it could like you have 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:47.240 two kids with someone. This isn't like a totally. 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:50.320 Breakup, right, And when you believe so that when someone 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:53.280 says I'll know, it's like you want to believe. Of 0:08:53.280 --> 0:08:55.640 course you do also the father of your children, right, 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:59.280 And so I think that that kept me staying there 0:08:59.360 --> 0:09:01.920 because it's it's like, well, what if he did what 0:09:01.960 --> 0:09:05.439 if he did change? Then then what you know? And 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:08.720 I think what I kind of realized through the book 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:11.960 and when you guys read it too, is even if 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:13.920 and I even said in there, like even if there 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:18.680 wasn't some monumental thing, there were so many we were 0:09:18.720 --> 0:09:21.600 not each other's person and it wasn't just because of 0:09:21.600 --> 0:09:24.320 the infidelity. And that's something that I realized, Like he 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:29.120 didn't meet the needs that I really truly love now 0:09:29.200 --> 0:09:32.600 and received from Alan and everything else. 0:09:32.679 --> 0:09:36.000 So it's he didn't give you a chance to get 0:09:36.000 --> 0:09:38.560 to know yourself well either. But that's not just on 0:09:38.640 --> 0:09:40.640 him though, No, I know, you know, but like that 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:43.679 relationship never gave you the chance. Well, no, And that's 0:09:43.800 --> 0:09:46.320 where it always felt very unfair. It's like I didn't 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:48.560 get to be the wife that I would have loved 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:51.640 to have been. Having said that, I think it's also 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:56.079 where I go to We just maybe weren't as compatible 0:09:56.080 --> 0:09:58.559 and we moved quick obviously, And. 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:00.400 I don't know anything about that life. 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:04.120 It was just toxic kind of from the beginning. Yeah, 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:07.960 well can who can be their best selves if they're 0:10:08.000 --> 0:10:10.880 in a toxic relationship? Well, I remember saying that to you. 0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:12.440 Do you remember the day that I told you I 0:10:12.480 --> 0:10:13.800 was like, I really think you all are going to 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:16.640 end up being really good friends, Like I would watch 0:10:16.679 --> 0:10:20.720 you interact so well as friends. But there was the 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:24.360 things that really I felt like mattered on the marriage front, 0:10:24.520 --> 0:10:27.200 Like the non negotiables were just never there. It was 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:30.120 like every time you could gain a little bit of 0:10:30.520 --> 0:10:34.440 trust back, like a little bit of like the roadback, 0:10:34.920 --> 0:10:37.200 it just got scooped out again. And it was like, 0:10:37.280 --> 0:10:42.080 there's just at some point it's not sustainable, or it 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:45.280 becomes sustainable, but both people have to become completely unhealthy 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:48.160 to work inside of it. And I was watching you go, 0:10:48.559 --> 0:10:52.440 I don't want to become unhealthy. I was watching him 0:10:52.559 --> 0:10:57.920 continue to repeat, and then I felt, and this is interesting, 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:00.760 This is the compassion side I have for him, is 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:03.560 I felt like he was doing everything he could do 0:11:03.640 --> 0:11:05.640 to play the character he needed to play, but he 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:09.240 wasn't taking the time to actually learn himself. Oh yeah, 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:11.600 So then it was like he was giving the right answers, 0:11:11.679 --> 0:11:13.240 or he was saying the right things, or he was 0:11:13.280 --> 0:11:16.040 doing the check ins, but like the two versions of 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:18.640 him could never merge and like have a safe place 0:11:18.640 --> 0:11:20.120 to land even in his own body. 0:11:20.760 --> 0:11:23.400 Yeah, I think, but you he'd agree with that piece too, 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:26.160 and same, you know, I'm like, I trust you, I 0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:28.360 didn't trust you. I'm saying I trust you, I don't 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:31.480 trust you. So it's it's same. And I think with 0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:34.560 this book too, I will say what I'm most excited 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:42.600 about is the how it ended up, because again, when 0:11:42.600 --> 0:11:44.880 I started the book, I was very angry, I was 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:47.360 very bitter, and there was a lot of things in 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:52.160 there that through the work with Amy and just you know, 0:11:53.440 --> 0:11:56.079 healing and growing and learning, I took a lot of 0:11:56.080 --> 0:11:58.520 stuff out because I'm like, it doesn't it's not about him, 0:11:58.559 --> 0:12:03.000 And that's my most excited piece of it, but also 0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:06.200 it's my most fearful piece of this week in book released, 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:08.360 because I don't want anyone to make this. 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:10.720 Book about them. 0:12:10.800 --> 0:12:13.760 There could be someone in this book that makes it 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:19.040 about them and we'll say things or and it's like, 0:12:19.120 --> 0:12:21.800 this book has actually nothing to do about you or 0:12:22.080 --> 0:12:25.840 any of my exes. It's all about the stuff that like, 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:29.480 I've looked in the mirror and I'm doing things differently 0:12:29.520 --> 0:12:31.560 and I'm learning and I'm growing and I'm trying, you know, 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:37.400 to do better at this. So that's like my excitement, 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:41.160 but also my like fear too that someone's gonna try 0:12:41.160 --> 0:12:44.600 and take it like I'm talking bad about them. I'm like, 0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:46.800 it has nothing to do about you. Well, these are 0:12:46.880 --> 0:12:50.040 my stories, my experiences, and it has nothing to do 0:12:50.080 --> 0:12:52.600 with it. You might have contributed to my story, but 0:12:52.600 --> 0:12:55.160 this book is not about you. It's about how I 0:12:55.160 --> 0:12:57.080 had to look in the mirror and face the fact 0:12:57.080 --> 0:13:00.160 that I was repeating really toxic patterns over and over 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:04.400 and over again, and that when people live an offense, though, 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:06.960 they're going to be offended no matter how you word it. 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:09.920 If you're a person that lives an offence, you will 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:13.920 take everything personal. And so that is more about them 0:13:13.960 --> 0:13:14.560 than about you. 0:13:14.800 --> 0:13:15.240 For sure. 0:13:15.360 --> 0:13:17.960 Is there anything specific you can think about in this 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:20.920 book that you're just nervous for it to be out there, 0:13:21.040 --> 0:13:24.520 Whether it's a behavior of yours that you're putting out 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:27.840 there or something that has happened that you know you 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:30.160 haven't talked about, or is there just anything that you're 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:31.320 just you're nervous about. 0:13:32.360 --> 0:13:40.920 Yeah, the night that I talked to Miles because it's 0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:46.679 such a touchy subject and I don't and I got 0:13:46.679 --> 0:13:48.599 asked about it in an interview and I forgot to 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:49.959 even I was going to text to me like did 0:13:49.960 --> 0:13:54.080 that come out? Because it's such a I talk about 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:57.360 how I pulled the case, my gun case from my drawer. 0:13:57.440 --> 0:14:00.600 I had no intent of committing suicide. It was just 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:03.080 there and I grabbed it as like it was just 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:06.040 I was in a cry for help. And I don't 0:14:06.040 --> 0:14:09.520 I can't even explain why I grabbed it or but 0:14:09.600 --> 0:14:12.800 it was just I was I was never going to intend. 0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:18.600 I wasn't suicidal and a nuts and I can't. I mean, 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:22.360 I for people that are, I'm so sorry and I 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:24.560 can't even imagine the pain that you go through. I 0:14:24.600 --> 0:14:26.480 think in that moment, that was just a cry for 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.560 help to myself, like because I just wanted the noise 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:32.440 to stop from the media and the trolls and the 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:35.920 it just but I would never have taken my life, 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:38.240 So that's just like for me, I just want that 0:14:38.440 --> 0:14:41.880 to That's just it was just touchy and I didn't 0:14:41.880 --> 0:14:43.080 know if I wanted to put it in there, but 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:44.960 it was a moment of like I hit. 0:14:44.840 --> 0:14:48.880 My rock bottom and it was. 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:52.400 Just there and I just screamed at it, and I 0:14:52.400 --> 0:14:54.640 think it was that was my way of like get help. 0:14:56.640 --> 0:14:58.000 I mean, that's powerful. 0:14:58.320 --> 0:15:03.760 Is there anything that you wrote that you maybe wish 0:15:03.800 --> 0:15:07.080 you weren't so honest about because your kids will potentially 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:08.240 read this later on in life. 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:08.960 I took it out. 0:15:09.400 --> 0:15:14.680 Good for you, God Creamer, look at you go, because 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:18.480 it wasn't those things weren't important. Yeah, yeah, yeah, because 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:20.240 I always do. It's important to my story and I 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:23.280 keep that in therapy. So there are things that happened 0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:28.360 that they don't ever need to know about. We know 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:31.400 about it. I know about it, My therapist knows about it. 0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:33.720 Y'all know about it. Nothing else has to be said 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:39.240 about it. That's right, well done, Bief. But I'm excited 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:44.360 and I really hope this book helps people, and I just, uh, yeah, 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:48.840 I'm I'm I'm I'm proud of it. I'm excited about it, 0:15:49.040 --> 0:15:52.200 and I'm very much looking forward to the next. 0:15:52.080 --> 0:15:54.360 Chapter because a big chapter. 0:15:54.520 --> 0:15:56.640 It was just a year, but I've learned again so 0:15:56.760 --> 0:16:00.480 much since and we'll continue to and obviously we'll chat 0:16:00.520 --> 0:16:03.600 about it on wind up, but obviously there Uh. I 0:16:03.680 --> 0:16:08.200 thought it was important to have Mike come on because 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:13.240 you know, he we have not spoken publicly about this 0:16:13.440 --> 0:16:16.520 or anything, and I just thought it was only fair 0:16:16.840 --> 0:16:20.600 to let him have a space to be able to 0:16:20.640 --> 0:16:25.040 talk and hopefully we can mend some feelings and emotions. 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:29.600 But let's take a break, y'all, maybe go in the 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:31.880 other room, let Mike come back on the couch, and 0:16:31.960 --> 0:16:34.000 then then we'll have you guys back on in a 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:34.960 little bit to chat. 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:37.120 Sounds good. You guys feel good about that. 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:39.200 We feel present. 0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:43.640 Okay, right, okay, guys's take a break and we'll get 0:16:44.240 --> 0:17:00.960 Mike Cousin on the podcast. Everyone, welcome Mike Cousin back 0:17:01.000 --> 0:17:01.840 on the podcast. 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:04.280 What's up? 0:17:04.800 --> 0:17:08.359 How does it feel to be back in the wind down. 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:13.120 The new and improved studio we got here? It's good. 0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:16.760 It's like riding a bike. I guess. Actually, I will say, yeah. 0:17:16.840 --> 0:17:22.520 I wasn't nervous until like this morning, really yeah, because 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:24.040 I know we had talked about it. This has been 0:17:24.080 --> 0:17:27.760 a couple of months kind of in the making. I 0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:29.240 was like, Nah, I'm good, I'm good. I'm good. In 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:32.760 this morning, I was like, I don't know if it's 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:34.240 the odderall or coffee. 0:17:33.840 --> 0:17:34.000 But. 0:17:35.920 --> 0:17:39.440 Or maybe the emotions, or maybe just the fact of 0:17:39.480 --> 0:17:42.040 being behind a microphone or even saying anything for the 0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:44.399 first time in two and a half years. 0:17:46.160 --> 0:17:48.359 Has it been two and a half years since we've podcasted. 0:17:49.480 --> 0:17:53.160 Yeah, let's see what mon month. 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:53.480 Are we in? 0:17:53.960 --> 0:17:56.919 It's October twenty three. 0:17:56.880 --> 0:18:00.200 So we've been divorced for April twenty twenty. 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:06.080 Twenty one, so it's about like ten. 0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:12.600 Emotionally, I think dog ears like it's not. 0:18:12.920 --> 0:18:14.600 People can't see me. But it's not just my beard 0:18:14.640 --> 0:18:16.359 that probably makes me look a little older. It's like 0:18:16.920 --> 0:18:21.120 a few more wrinkles, a few more grays, even less 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:21.800 hair in my head. 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:23.560 Is that possible? 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:26.720 I don't know, we. 0:18:26.920 --> 0:18:28.560 Know what like do what do you think was it? 0:18:28.600 --> 0:18:28.760 Is it? 0:18:28.840 --> 0:18:30.640 Yeah, just kind of like being behind a mic again 0:18:30.800 --> 0:18:33.480 or is that the is that the the the energy 0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:35.919 or the nervousness that maybe came in this morning. 0:18:36.280 --> 0:18:39.760 Yeah, it was more about just being behind the mic 0:18:39.800 --> 0:18:44.280 again over whatever we're going to end up talking about. 0:18:45.520 --> 0:18:48.680 Because you know, like you and I have mentioned before 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:54.080 to ourselves, you know, this was ours for a long 0:18:54.160 --> 0:18:58.159 time and we have a we you know, did a 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:03.040 lot on this show. So yeah, I was like, man, 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:07.240 you know, brings me back a little bit. There's a 0:19:07.240 --> 0:19:09.720 big part of me that misses this aspect. 0:19:11.880 --> 0:19:17.600 Yeah, wind down or being behind a doing because I 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:21.000 will say you were I remember when I started originally 0:19:21.040 --> 0:19:23.080 and then you came on I'm like, we and this 0:19:23.160 --> 0:19:26.320 is something we though it was hard. We enjoyed doing 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:30.760 the lighter episodes together, and you were really good behind 0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:33.760 the microphone and you're a great interviewer and something where 0:19:35.359 --> 0:19:38.720 it was hard when you did leave because I don't 0:19:38.840 --> 0:19:42.480 have that innate ability or quality to be able to 0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:45.560 interview like you've interviewed guests, like you're just really good 0:19:45.560 --> 0:19:46.600 at asking questions. 0:19:46.920 --> 0:19:50.560 I appreciate that. I mean, I think there's, like any 0:19:50.600 --> 0:19:54.159 team doing something, we just complimented each other. Well, you know, 0:19:54.240 --> 0:19:56.600 we just did in a lot of different ways, especially 0:19:56.640 --> 0:20:02.640 when it came to professionally. So yeah, I think, yeah, 0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:05.840 I appreciate that. There is I miss both the wind 0:20:05.880 --> 0:20:10.760 down because even the tough episodes were a lot of growth, 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:14.600 a lot of people that got something from it, as 0:20:14.600 --> 0:20:18.959 difficult as it might have been for us personally or emotionally. 0:20:21.040 --> 0:20:24.080 But even since, you know, twenty eighteen when we started 0:20:24.080 --> 0:20:27.800 doing it together, feels like a lifetime ago because now 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:32.919 everywhere you look, ever, everybody has a podcast. Yeah, right, 0:20:33.640 --> 0:20:38.600 So it's just it's such an oversaturated market where we 0:20:38.720 --> 0:20:45.919 benefited from being towards the forefront of of the timeline 0:20:45.960 --> 0:20:48.440 that is now podcasting especially with TikTok and everything. It's 0:20:48.520 --> 0:20:54.200 just SoundBite after SoundBite after SoundBite. So yeah, I missed. Yeah, 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:58.760 I missed podcasting in general, and I miss us doing 0:20:58.760 --> 0:20:59.200 it together. 0:21:02.280 --> 0:21:04.000 Can I ask a question about our podcast? 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:04.440