WEBVTT - CLASSIC: Nosy Boraha: The Pirate's Paradise (And Cemetery) 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:05.600 Fellow ridiculous historians, we are returning to you with a 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:12.039 bit of an epilogue to our continuing fascination with pirates. 0:00:12.520 --> 0:00:15.920 Did you know, friends and neighbors, that there was a 0:00:16.079 --> 0:00:18.680 pirate's paradise once upon a time? 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:22.600 Yeah, and a lot like the wild West wasn't quite 0:00:22.640 --> 0:00:24.640 as wild as people think. Do check out our previous 0:00:24.640 --> 0:00:27.319 episode on that. It turns out that pirates depicted in 0:00:27.360 --> 0:00:30.360 fiction often bear very little resemblance to the real life 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:34.080 historical ones. And in our previous conversations about some of 0:00:34.159 --> 0:00:39.240 history's most ridiculous pirates, we mentioned the quite egalitarian, dare 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:44.520 we say democratic, ways that the pirates organized their society, 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:48.320 and I believe we hinted at something of a pirate paradise. 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:55.280 Absolutely, folks, Let's roll the tape. Ridiculous Histories, a production 0:00:55.400 --> 0:01:16.039 of iHeart Radio. Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeart Radio. 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:27.440 Are with a hard, are a vast and ahoy, fellow 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:34.080 ridiculous historians, Welcome to the show. Today, we're diving into piracy. 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:36.520 I guess diving is an accidental pun. There. Hi, my 0:01:36.600 --> 0:01:37.680 name is Ben, my name is no. 0:01:37.760 --> 0:01:40.080 Do were pirates known for their diving skills? 0:01:40.520 --> 0:01:40.679 Well? 0:01:40.680 --> 0:01:43.840 They were maritime, you know, I would I would think 0:01:43.840 --> 0:01:45.679 they would go to a great length to stay as 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:46.680 dry as possible. 0:01:46.840 --> 0:01:49.880 They were known for their non consensual diving skills when 0:01:49.880 --> 0:01:51.120 they had to walk the plank. 0:01:52.480 --> 0:01:57.760 I'm sorry, Oh I felt bad about that one. No, 0:01:57.800 --> 0:02:00.480 it's very I think we all feel bad about that, 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:03.520 but we feel great about our super producer. Give it 0:02:03.600 --> 0:02:08.080 up for Casey Pegre. Now, none of us here in 0:02:08.160 --> 0:02:11.800 the studio, and hopefully none of you have been involved 0:02:11.960 --> 0:02:16.520 in acts of IRL piracy. Let's be honest. It is 0:02:16.639 --> 0:02:20.000 twenty nineteen, and in these our modern days, many people 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:23.320 are digitally pirating things. I was about to say, I 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:26.320 think we've all probably downloaded a Torrent or two in 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:29.079 our day. We're not advocating that here, but you may 0:02:29.120 --> 0:02:33.360 remember that very pointed trailer where I told you about 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:36.480 how piracy does hurt people. You wouldn't download a car, 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:38.639 which you wouldn't download a car. That's where you wouldn't 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:41.320 steal a car. That's right. So we're not talking about 0:02:41.320 --> 0:02:43.639 that kind of piracy. We're talking about a much much 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:46.040 more brazen form of piracy. And I want to start 0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:48.320 the show off by talking about the fact that in 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:52.960 this age of political correctness, and you know, people getting canceled. 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:56.800 Why aren't people talking more about how pirates probably aren't 0:02:56.800 --> 0:02:59.360 the best role model for little kids. You know, you 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:02.560 still can pirate hats and you know, pirates swords and 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:04.799 little eye patches with the Jolly Roger on. 0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:05.640 His sports team. 0:03:05.840 --> 0:03:09.120 It's a sports team. It's a lego set, you know. 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:11.160 It's a it's a series of lego sets. 0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:14.560 It's a series sets. It's a kid's cartoon. Remember the 0:03:14.600 --> 0:03:16.120 Pirates of Dark Water? Remember that? 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:18.200 Yeah? Oh deep cut. I loved it. 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:19.639 I loved it. I liked it too. They were sort 0:03:19.680 --> 0:03:21.000 of like future pirates. 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:25.720 They were some apocalyptic sci fi pirates, you know. Uh, 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:29.560 it's it's funny, Casey, you were mentioning that off the 0:03:29.560 --> 0:03:33.840 air as well. You specifically said, aren't pirates due to 0:03:33.919 --> 0:03:36.760 get canceled, which I thought was a great point. Man. 0:03:37.000 --> 0:03:39.240 It just seems like they get up to a lot 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:41.320 of stuff that's not so great, you know. 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:48.160 The lowest of hijinks. So nowadays we romanticize pirates. However, 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:52.840 this was not always the case, and we should point 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:57.560 out now that there are active pirates existing around the 0:03:57.600 --> 0:04:01.960 world right some based in Somalia, so based off different coasts, 0:04:02.400 --> 0:04:06.240 and these folks are not romanticized, but we have in 0:04:06.280 --> 0:04:12.000 our collective brains, we have this idealized, romanticized concept of 0:04:12.040 --> 0:04:15.200 a pirate, a swashbuckler, you know what I mean, A 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:21.520 lovable rogue. This romanticization begins in eighteen eighty three. It's 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:24.719 weird because we can pinpoint the exact moment where it began. 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:31.720 It began, arguably with Treasure Island by Robert Lewis Stevenson. 0:04:32.040 --> 0:04:35.920 So Treasure Island comes out, and you guys remember Treasure Island, 0:04:36.040 --> 0:04:36.640 right of. 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:41.680 Course, swashbuckling adventures on the high seas. I believe long 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:44.080 John long John Silver. You know, all of the kind 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:47.640 of like tropes of pirate ness were sort of solidified 0:04:47.680 --> 0:04:49.719 in that one book and then it was taken and 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:52.560 run with and everything from the Pirates of Dark Water 0:04:52.880 --> 0:04:59.200 to the Disney Treasure Island to everything. Who knew that 0:04:59.240 --> 0:04:59.760 would work. 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:03.840 It's a film franchise based on a ride, and I'll 0:05:03.880 --> 0:05:06.520 admit the ride's pretty dope, but it you know, when 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:09.280 you're a kid, but it's it's problematic. It is definitely, 0:05:10.080 --> 0:05:13.520 as you guys said, romanticizing things. But yeah, Treasure Island 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:17.440 has this tremendous influence on how we think of pirates today. 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:20.840 It includes all those things that we consider cliches or 0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:24.320 mandatory parts of a pirate story, Treasure maps that have 0:05:24.360 --> 0:05:28.000 an X on the spot, one legged sailors who have 0:05:28.120 --> 0:05:30.880 a trusty parrot, you know what I mean, all the hits, 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:34.479 all the all that slow cool jazz. But if we 0:05:34.640 --> 0:05:38.640 look at real pirates, we see a lot of dissonance 0:05:38.720 --> 0:05:42.800 between what they actually were and what Hollywood would have 0:05:43.000 --> 0:05:46.520 us believe. When we engage with things like talk like 0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:49.760 a Pirate Day or watching Pirates of the Caribbean nineteen 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:52.000 or whatever, whichever one, they're wrong. How far are they 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.400 into that? How many? How many? 0:05:56.080 --> 0:06:00.400 Well, Johnny Depp got canceled briefly, and I think he okay, 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:02.160 now I can't remember because I think it maybe turned 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:05.640 out that his estranged wife was actually being abusive towards him. 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:06.960 I saw that pop up in the press and then 0:06:06.960 --> 0:06:08.800 it kind of went away. So that's yet to be determined. 0:06:08.839 --> 0:06:10.960 I know he's not in the next one, but they're 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:12.640 doing it without him. They're doing it without him. 0:06:12.760 --> 0:06:14.960 Are they just gonna get Keith Stewart to do it? 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:16.520 I'm not you mean Keith Richards. 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:18.960 That's the one. Yeah, one of the Keith, one of 0:06:18.960 --> 0:06:21.280 the Keith. I'm not discriminatory when it comes to Keith. 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:23.080 I just good a guy named Keith in there. Give 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:24.520 him some dreadlocks, put him in the film. 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:26.400 Yeah, just kind of prop him up with a bottle 0:06:26.440 --> 0:06:26.800 of rum. 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:29.599 Is Keith Stewart a famous for series though? That's just 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:31.479 I think that's a guy who went to my high school. 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:33.560 It's possible we had kind of a Keith Richard's vibe. 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:36.240 I don't know any famous Stuart's except for John Stewart, 0:06:36.800 --> 0:06:41.080 Rod Stewart. We're okay, well you got me there. He 0:06:41.160 --> 0:06:42.479 did not go to oscool. 0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:45.760 But but yeah, yeah, it's amazing this kind of this 0:06:45.839 --> 0:06:50.080 kind of vision, this pop culture phenomenon exists. But we 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:53.280 can we can set the stage for today's show by 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:57.479 looking at pirate fact versus pirate fiction. First things first, 0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:02.400 the life of a pirate was grip. They were ruthless. 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:06.440 This was a time of homicide. This was a time 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:11.520 of murder. If you think a captain Jack Sparrow realized 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.120 in real life he could have never become the captain 0:07:14.280 --> 0:07:17.840 of a pirate ship. He would have been killed by 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:18.400 his crew. 0:07:18.720 --> 0:07:19.840 Was it for wearing eyeshadow? 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:23.840 I think it was less less the the coal liner 0:07:24.200 --> 0:07:27.160 and more the profound commitment to running away. 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:30.440 Oh that's right, because pirates didn't run away. If anything, 0:07:30.480 --> 0:07:33.520 they ran towards things, right, That's what they That's what 0:07:33.560 --> 0:07:35.480 they had to do. You know, they had to they 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:39.440 had to capture these ships. We know that the most 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:43.040 famous pirates were probably not the most successful as well. 0:07:43.400 --> 0:07:46.480 We also see this whole Bury treasure thing. You know, 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:51.400 it probably happened several times, but it was not common. 0:07:51.440 --> 0:07:56.559 It was not normal. These guys. Pirates didn't live super long. 0:07:57.040 --> 0:08:00.000 They weren't like long term thinking, you know what I mean. 0:08:00.320 --> 0:08:02.080 It's like one of the guys selling drugs and the 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:04.520 wire is not wondering about what he's going to do 0:08:04.560 --> 0:08:06.640 when he's eighty because he doesn't think he'll make it there. 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:10.520 Only here's the thing, Ben, Some pirates did kind of 0:08:10.680 --> 0:08:15.320 live the equivalent of a Twilight Years retiring to Florida 0:08:15.400 --> 0:08:17.080 kind of situation, didn't they They did. 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.760 They did nail on the head. This is something that 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:26.360 the three of us recently found out about. Because we're 0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:29.840 all right, we understand that Hollywood doesn't depict a lot 0:08:29.880 --> 0:08:32.640 of the truths about pirates, like the whole walking the 0:08:32.679 --> 0:08:36.200 plank thing are and I made. Those are kind of 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:41.720 Hollywood creations, but some pirates did make it. Some pirates did. 0:08:41.800 --> 0:08:45.760 As you say, Nol have a retirement plan. There is 0:08:46.280 --> 0:08:51.080 a small island off the coast of Madagascar that we 0:08:51.160 --> 0:08:56.360 call Nosey Burraja today weird, it's weird, it's a weird one. 0:08:57.000 --> 0:09:00.520 In the past it was known as the is Sainte Marie. Casey, 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:02.080 could you help us out with that. 0:09:02.440 --> 0:09:04.959 Yeah, you'll stall Mari. That sounds about right, Casey, and 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:10.480 Ben on the case whoa and noul I thank you. 0:09:10.640 --> 0:09:12.240 I appreciate that, Ben, but you nailed it in the 0:09:12.240 --> 0:09:14.040 first place. We just got a little bit of confirmation 0:09:14.240 --> 0:09:17.320 from our resident, what do you call him, a Francophone. Yeah, 0:09:17.840 --> 0:09:20.199 Casey Pegram, Casey Pegrim, the. 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:27.640 Man, the myth, the legend. And speaking of men, myths 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:32.520 and legends, there was in the Indian Ocean again, just 0:09:32.520 --> 0:09:37.480 off the coast of Madagascar, a real life pirate paradise. Yeah. 0:09:37.559 --> 0:09:40.760 When about in the neighborhood of one thousand pirates weren't 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:44.319 out pirrating, they can't. This was kind of their summer home. 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:47.920 You know they're off season paradise. There was a map 0:09:47.960 --> 0:09:52.000 from seventeen thirty three that was discovered of this area 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:55.640 and it was simply headed with the Island of Pirates. 0:09:56.240 --> 0:10:00.000 It is near the East Indies trade route, very very 0:10:00.240 --> 0:10:03.280 centrally located to where these folks would have been pillaging 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:06.720 and pirrating and looting and raping their way across the 0:10:06.800 --> 0:10:10.040 high seas. It was very convenient and it was the 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:13.320 perfect place to it. It was like a real life 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:16.000 treasure island in theory anyway, right, because it was perfect 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:19.240 tucked away location where they could hide all of their 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:24.000 ill gotten booty. I like saying booty, right right. Yeah. 0:10:24.520 --> 0:10:29.679 Since a pirate named Adam Baldridge started making that his 0:10:29.840 --> 0:10:33.640 base in sixteen ninety one, this became a home away 0:10:33.679 --> 0:10:36.240 from home or in some cases a legit first home 0:10:36.280 --> 0:10:39.000 for a lot of pirates and it went on until 0:10:39.480 --> 0:10:43.880 seventeen nineteen with a pirate named John pro There were 0:10:43.920 --> 0:10:48.520 multiple reasons for this tiny island to be attractive to pirates. 0:10:49.080 --> 0:10:54.680 They first off enjoyed proximity to multiple trading routes. You 0:10:54.720 --> 0:10:57.480 know what I mean. This ships would be returning from 0:10:57.520 --> 0:11:04.840 the East Indies with fresh goods, fine fine clothing, spices 0:11:04.880 --> 0:11:07.960 and so on. And then it had a bunch of 0:11:08.040 --> 0:11:13.920 bays and inlets that were protected geographically from storms. It 0:11:14.040 --> 0:11:18.560 was situated in quiet, easy water. It had tons of fruit. 0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:21.400 You could just live off the land if you had to. 0:11:21.800 --> 0:11:23.640 And so a bunch of or make their own rum 0:11:24.000 --> 0:11:27.280 or make their own rum. Oh that's probably more important 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:28.960 than the fruit. That was a big That was a biggie, 0:11:29.000 --> 0:11:30.320 I think yeah, I think you're right. 0:11:30.480 --> 0:11:32.480 And they lived in these little huts, right, They were 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:35.600 like little wooden huts, and each one was marked with 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:38.120 an emblem or one of you know, the pirate the 0:11:38.200 --> 0:11:41.839 ubiquitous pirate flags, which presumably would have been different designs 0:11:41.920 --> 0:11:45.880 for the different crews that were under serving under these 0:11:45.920 --> 0:11:49.200 different captains. And also, wouldn't you think, man, that some 0:11:49.240 --> 0:11:52.680 of these factions wouldn't necessarily be like vying for the 0:11:52.720 --> 0:11:56.760 same stuff, Like there wasn't necessarily like an overall brotherhood 0:11:56.760 --> 0:11:58.840 of pirates. To my understanding, it was sort of like 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:02.400 every man, every crew for themselves kind of situation. And 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:07.400 yet they managed to coexist on this island, That's true. 0:12:07.559 --> 0:12:10.200 Quite a few of them managed to coexist, So maybe 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:13.360 they had kind of a truce situation. But we're talking 0:12:13.559 --> 0:12:18.640 legendary real pirates, William Kidd, Robert Culliford, Henry Avery, Abraham, 0:12:18.679 --> 0:12:24.199 Samuel Thomas, two and so on. The island had a 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:28.960 main town called Embodi Futatra, which is a mouthful. And 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:32.600 they also had family here, you know. They they met 0:12:32.640 --> 0:12:36.400 women who were native to the area, and they had children, 0:12:36.960 --> 0:12:42.960 and they evolved this sort of non criminal lifestyle, but 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:47.520 they took a bunch of stuff with them. So the 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:53.880 island today remains allegedly home to massive amounts of missing 0:12:53.960 --> 0:12:57.839 loot or as you prefernal booty, booty, booty hard d. 0:12:58.760 --> 0:13:03.360 So we're talking gold, we're talking coins, works of art, 0:13:03.559 --> 0:13:09.360 religious artifacts, precious stones, and legend has it that the 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:14.280 treasure of William Kidd is still buried somewhere in this 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:18.400 pirate island, in the bay near the main town, and 0:13:18.720 --> 0:13:23.800 people have been hunting around this area for buried treasure 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:27.680 for decades and decades and decades and decades. But one 0:13:27.720 --> 0:13:32.000 thing that really fascinated us was the culture that sprang 0:13:32.120 --> 0:13:36.720 up on this island, particularly that there is an actual 0:13:36.960 --> 0:13:41.360 pirate cemetery that's nuts, there's actually there, you know, like 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:42.920 the whole nine. They are tombstones. 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:46.800 They're weird messages and codes and skulls and there's actually 0:13:46.880 --> 0:13:49.520 there's skulls inscribed on the tombstones. 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:52.880 Totally, and that whole Jolly Roger imagery. Yes, so it's 0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:55.480 not a huge one. It's on a hill shaded by 0:13:55.559 --> 0:14:00.720 palm trees and it overlooks the ocean and pretty small. 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:05.840 Only about thirty real life irl pirates are buried there, 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:08.760 and they were buried there because they were residents of 0:14:08.760 --> 0:14:12.040 this island. This was their home away from their home 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.160 on the high Seas, I guess. And you can still 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:16.680 go visit this site today. 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:20.080 Yeah, yeah, you can go tour it the same way 0:14:20.200 --> 0:14:24.360 that you could see another local attraction. It's only about 0:14:25.480 --> 0:14:29.880 three or four dollars to go us. There's a small 0:14:30.000 --> 0:14:35.160 pathway behind this long way wall which is south of 0:14:35.200 --> 0:14:38.760 the capital, and signs from there will lead you to 0:14:38.920 --> 0:14:41.440 the cemetery. There's a small hut where you can pay 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:44.040 your entrance fee and you can learn more about the 0:14:44.080 --> 0:14:48.200 pirates that are buried in the in the area, and 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:54.320 then you can walk over to Saint Pierre. The problem 0:14:54.400 --> 0:14:58.640 is that over the years, surprise, surprise, not a lot 0:14:58.640 --> 0:15:03.560 of people have put time into taking care of the 0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:07.720 gravestones on the grave site. So a lot of a 0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:11.800 lot of graves and crips were damaged because because of 0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:15.280 a very understandable crime. I have to say, guys, if 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:17.640 I grew up in this area, or if I were 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:22.560 interested in being around pirates and finding their treasure, I 0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:25.280 would totally mess with their graves because I would figure 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:27.920 they would be buried with their stuff. Because again I 0:15:27.960 --> 0:15:31.600 have like a goonies level understanding of real pirates. 0:15:31.760 --> 0:15:34.200 Yeah, yeah, you know, to be fair, that's probably one 0:15:34.200 --> 0:15:37.600 of the more historically accurate pirate films that's out there, 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:41.520 right right right. Mine was Pippy long Stocking or Pippy 0:15:41.560 --> 0:15:43.960 long Stocking. I do she was? She was she a pirate. 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:46.960 She wasn't a she was on a pirate ship. There 0:15:47.040 --> 0:15:49.320 was a pirate, I believe. I believe she served under 0:15:49.600 --> 0:15:52.160 some sort of pirate and she had a monkey, right 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:53.000 I think? 0:15:53.080 --> 0:15:57.600 So, you know, I mainly remember her hair. But it's 0:15:57.800 --> 0:16:00.640 it's true, though, this is one of the misc inceptions 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:05.080 that's leading to pretty serious damage to this real life 0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:10.080 pirate cemetery. Pirates didn't again, they didn't really bury treasure. 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:13.520 It could happen, but it was not commonplace instead. Just 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:18.119 imagine if you listening and Casey and Noel and I 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:21.600 are all together and we're pirates. We're sailing the high seas, 0:16:21.680 --> 0:16:24.680 and we rob a ship and we get our booty 0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:27.440 with the hard tea. Then we're going to keep it 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:30.600 on this ship, and then later we'll divide it up 0:16:30.720 --> 0:16:35.040 amongst ourselves. Again, this idea of buried treasure comes from 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:39.240 Treasure Island, and the X marks the spot. The whole 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:42.880 nine largely fictive. The only person we know for sure 0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:47.680 to bury anything was Captain Kidd, and the entire reason 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:51.000 he buried his treasure was to keep it away from 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:53.560 the Governor of New York. He buried it outside of 0:16:53.600 --> 0:16:57.680 New York, I don't know, like Yonkers or something. I'm kidding. 0:16:57.720 --> 0:16:58.880 He didn't do it in Yonkers. 0:17:04.119 --> 0:17:06.520 So one of the I don't know, slightly more well known, 0:17:06.560 --> 0:17:08.280 certainly not as well of them as Billy. The kid 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:11.560 pirates that was laid to rest in this graveyard and 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:15.840 spent a lot of time on this island was a 0:17:15.920 --> 0:17:21.920 French Corsair by the name of Olivier Lavasier or a 0:17:22.040 --> 0:17:25.240 ka LaBouche, LaBouche LaBouche. 0:17:25.400 --> 0:17:37.520 Casey, can we get a sound effect for that. 0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:35.480 Of course, that means the mouth. I don't know if 0:17:35.520 --> 0:17:38.000 he has some sort of weird snaggletooth kind of situation 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:42.679 going on, or if he just talked too much. But 0:17:42.760 --> 0:17:45.520 apparently dead men tell no tales. But here's the thing, 0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:50.720 LaBouche did tell tales after his passing, in the form 0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:53.199 of a cipher. I know you're a fan of a 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:55.840 good cipher, and we're not talking about a freestyle rap, ben, 0:17:55.920 --> 0:17:56.960 are we no? 0:17:57.200 --> 0:18:01.840 But fun fact, I am actually very scarily to freestyling. Yeah, 0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:05.040 we're talking about a cipher is in a code. So 0:18:05.400 --> 0:18:09.840 he's executed in seventeen thirty for as many, many, many 0:18:09.960 --> 0:18:13.400 many crimes as a scaly wag, a buccaneer and so on. 0:18:14.359 --> 0:18:20.760 But apparently, moments before his execution he yelled, find my treasure, 0:18:20.880 --> 0:18:25.200 the one who may understand, and hurled a necklace into 0:18:25.240 --> 0:18:28.359 the crowd. And this necklace had sort of a note, 0:18:28.720 --> 0:18:32.200 but it was actually a cipher is a seventeen line 0:18:32.560 --> 0:18:37.160 coded message. And you can see you can see photographs 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:41.560 of this cipher on a great article by Magellan Times. 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:46.480 The cipher itself remained It's unsolved today, right, No one's 0:18:46.480 --> 0:18:46.879 cracked it. 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:49.520 I believe that's true, and not that it wasn't attempted, 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:52.480 because maybe it's just maybe no one's figured it out yet. 0:18:52.520 --> 0:18:54.520 I mean, on the same article there is like a 0:18:54.600 --> 0:18:57.040 key with some of the little symbols and what letter 0:18:57.080 --> 0:19:00.240 they're present, But obviously it didn't do the trick. 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:04.359 And not for nothing people have been trying to find 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:07.359 this for such a long time. There's a guy named 0:19:07.400 --> 0:19:11.040 Barry Clifford who is a real life treasure hunter and 0:19:11.200 --> 0:19:14.520 somewhat successful too. That that's nuts to me. Do you 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:18.560 guys think about that. We're here in our podcast studio 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:23.080 and we're we're having a lovely time making shows and 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:27.320 exploring these stories, but this guy is actually out hunting treasure. 0:19:27.400 --> 0:19:29.959 I gotta say, if I had to pick another job, 0:19:30.440 --> 0:19:32.240 no offense to you guys, but I would totally be 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:34.320 a treasure hunter. Would you guys be in like if 0:19:34.320 --> 0:19:36.360 we had a chance of finding treasure. 0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:39.879 Like Steve Zisu's style, Yes, well he was more like 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:44.240 a naturalist, like a figure, but yeah, I'd be down, 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:47.680 especially if you knew a good area to look. Where 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:48.240 might that be? 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:48.840 Right? 0:19:48.960 --> 0:19:50.760 It's almost as though we've been talking about what might 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:53.520 have been a hotbed of pirate activity. It boggles the 0:19:53.800 --> 0:19:56.600 boggles the mind, and it boggles Barry Clifford's mind to 0:19:56.680 --> 0:19:59.840 the point where he decided, surely there are remnants of 0:20:00.040 --> 0:20:04.119 sunk in pirate galleys and all of the accompanying booty 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:09.040 littered throughout Sant Marie. He told The Daily Mail in 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:11.440 twenty fifteen that pirates had more money than they could 0:20:11.440 --> 0:20:15.080 spend in ten lifetimes. So surely there's stuff squirreled away 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:18.080 in these little lagoons or you know, in caves or 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:20.240 what have you. Right, yeah, yeah, so surely he must 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:22.960 have had complete success, and he is now a very 0:20:23.000 --> 0:20:23.760 wealthy man. 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:28.639 Right he changed his name to Jeff Bezos. No, he 0:20:28.680 --> 0:20:31.240 goes on and he says, he's like, yeah, you know, 0:20:31.320 --> 0:20:33.560 back in the day, if you were a pirate, this 0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:35.679 island's where you would go. It's where all the pirates 0:20:35.720 --> 0:20:36.280 hung out. 0:20:36.640 --> 0:20:38.199 Why is this guy so haggard sounding. 0:20:38.320 --> 0:20:40.320 He's lived a hard life, you know what I mean. 0:20:40.640 --> 0:20:45.040 He doesn't wear sunscreen, so that's the secret. It's very apparently, 0:20:45.080 --> 0:20:47.000 it's very bad for your throat not to wear sunscreen. 0:20:47.320 --> 0:20:52.679 But he has been exploring the island for almost well 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:56.919 more than twenty years, and during this time, he's found 0:20:57.320 --> 0:21:02.240 thirteen separate distinct ship and you can see you can 0:21:02.280 --> 0:21:06.560 see photos, you can see some of the stuff that 0:21:06.640 --> 0:21:10.640 he's that he's extracted from these crash sites or these 0:21:10.720 --> 0:21:13.320 uh oh, some of these ships were probably scuttled too, 0:21:13.640 --> 0:21:15.639 if their damage was too great. And I know you 0:21:15.680 --> 0:21:16.480 love that word. 0:21:16.400 --> 0:21:20.560 Scuttle, but scuttle, but would be rumors if I say scuttled, 0:21:20.560 --> 0:21:22.800 but I said scuttled. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:25.239 Some of these ships were scuttled. I know that's one 0:21:25.280 --> 0:21:26.000 of your favorite. 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:27.159 Words, is but it would have been funny if you 0:21:27.200 --> 0:21:29.160 had said, I know some of these ships were scuttled, but. 0:21:29.640 --> 0:21:32.320 It would have been yeah, it's true. The jokes that 0:21:32.359 --> 0:21:35.760 would have been everybody who's seen Hunger Games, go ahead, 0:21:35.840 --> 0:21:39.160 kiss your fingers, do the uh what what was that motion? 0:21:39.600 --> 0:21:41.639 Oh that's I always thought of that as sort of 0:21:41.680 --> 0:21:45.960 like a badass like sign off, like I'm out yeah. 0:21:45.720 --> 0:21:48.080 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think both of us have done 0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:52.479 that in social situations before. But anyway, Yes, he has 0:21:52.560 --> 0:21:57.600 not found treasure. Clifford has not. He has, however, found 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:03.560 religious artifacts. He's found ships, of course, and pieces of ships. 0:22:04.840 --> 0:22:07.560 One of his big one of his big recoveries was 0:22:07.680 --> 0:22:11.199 an early statue of Jesus Christ from the thirteenth or 0:22:11.359 --> 0:22:15.760 fourteenth century. So who knows whether you have a dream 0:22:15.880 --> 0:22:18.080 job or something that's just sort of a means to 0:22:18.119 --> 0:22:22.159 an end right now, maybe a career in treasure hunting 0:22:22.400 --> 0:22:24.879 is for you. It takes some dedication, and it sounds 0:22:24.880 --> 0:22:27.800 like it takes a lot of overhead, but I would 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:32.240 personally love it. I would love it if someone listening 0:22:32.280 --> 0:22:36.160 now actually found buried treasure, you know what I mean, 0:22:36.920 --> 0:22:40.320 because even we know it was super unusual. No, it's 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:43.280 largely a myth, but that doesn't mean it's totally a myth. 0:22:43.640 --> 0:22:47.480 The treasure's out there right Also hashtag no oak. 0:22:47.240 --> 0:22:49.160 Island Remind me about Oak Island again? 0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:53.160 Then the Oak Island money Pit. We did a show 0:22:53.320 --> 0:22:55.959 on this for stuff they don't want you to know, 0:22:56.560 --> 0:23:00.399 and the Oak Island money Pit in Nova Scotia is 0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:05.320 thought to be a site of largely unrecovered buried treasure. 0:23:05.480 --> 0:23:09.920 Now this has also become a reality show phenomenon, so 0:23:10.080 --> 0:23:14.080 the producers got involved and now you will see all 0:23:14.160 --> 0:23:18.359 kinds of here you go scuttle butt at about what's 0:23:18.440 --> 0:23:19.560 actually in the ground there. 0:23:19.600 --> 0:23:21.000 Thanks for doing that for me, Ben. 0:23:20.840 --> 0:23:24.480 Hey Man, I got your back. So some things have 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:30.040 been carbon dated. Some people have claimed that they found something, 0:23:30.080 --> 0:23:33.320 but they haven't found any significant treasure. The thing is, 0:23:33.400 --> 0:23:35.880 there are real buried treasures out there, and I would 0:23:35.920 --> 0:23:37.600