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Speaker 1: Worrying. This podcast contains spoilers for the finale of House

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Speaker 1: of the Dragon Plush. We're going to be talking about

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Speaker 1: the books on which that show is based with our

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Speaker 1: good friends from History of Westros and that will include

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Speaker 1: major spoilers for stuff that's going to probably appear in

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Speaker 1: season two and maybe even season three, in season four,

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Speaker 1: and however many seasons that show goes, so watch out

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Speaker 1: and beware. Hello. My name is Jason Concepcion. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: x ray Vision, the Crooked Podcast, where we dive deep

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Speaker 1: into your favorite shows, movies, comics and pop culture. Joining me,

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Speaker 1: of course today is the great Powerful super Encyclopedia of

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Speaker 1: Comics History, Ultrager, Godzilla Wright or Rosie Dight. Rosie, how

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Speaker 1: are you good?

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Speaker 2: I'm happy to be here. I'm ready to ready to

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Speaker 2: talk some sad game of Thorn's business.

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Speaker 1: First, on the previously on, we will be getting into

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Speaker 1: lots of MCU news, ant Man and the Wspontomania trailer,

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Speaker 1: Guardians of the Galaxya holiday special trailer, the various DC

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Speaker 1: shake up news, including the hiring of James Gunn as

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Speaker 1: the co Kevin Feigey of the DC universe. In the

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Speaker 1: Airlock of course, we're going to talk about the season

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Speaker 1: finale of House of the Dragon. After that, we're gonna

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Speaker 1: give you the last round of Ask the Master for

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Speaker 1: season one of House of the Dragon. This is it,

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Speaker 1: Folks in the hive mind. Our good friends as He's

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Speaker 1: and Ashia from the History of West Rospot are going

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Speaker 1: to join us to talk about House of the Dragon

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Speaker 1: in a book centric, spoiler filled conversation. So this is

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Speaker 1: for book readers. If you don't want to be spoiled

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Speaker 1: on a bunch of stuff that's probably gonna happen in

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Speaker 1: seasons two, three, four of House of the Dragon, then

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Speaker 1: maybe skip this one. And of course, if you want

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Speaker 1: to jump around, check out the show notes for the

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Speaker 1: time stamps Furst up previously on. Okay, let's start with

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Speaker 1: a newly released trailer for ant Man in the Wasp Quantumnia.

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Speaker 1: Your thoughts, Rosie.

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Speaker 2: Wow, I was not expecting it to be like this.

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Speaker 2: I was expecting a trailer. It's been a long time,

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Speaker 2: but it is so different from anything they've done with

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Speaker 2: that Man in I will say the beginning of the

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Speaker 2: trailer is in my lovely town of sam Pedro, where

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Speaker 2: I live. That's what we saw them filming. Scott is

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Speaker 2: looking happy, He's loving life is an avenger. People are

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Speaker 2: saying hi to him like they think he's Spider Man,

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Speaker 2: but still, and then it's just like that is very

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Speaker 2: emptyish as we know it, but it just throws us

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Speaker 2: into the quantum realm. After Cassie creates a quantum satellite, which,

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Speaker 2: to be honest, very silly idea, but yeah, you know,

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Speaker 2: Scott's daughter Cassie does that. They go in and then

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Speaker 2: it's just like this unreal Star Wars spi kid, super

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Speaker 2: hard sci fi spy kids. It kind of blew my mind.

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Speaker 2: I did not expect them to go in this direction,

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Speaker 2: or for so much of the movie to actually be

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Speaker 2: set in this really expanded version of the quantum realm.

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Speaker 1: I was left wondering. It feels as if obviously Kang

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Speaker 1: Jonathan Major's Kang the Conquer is in this looking great great.

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Speaker 1: I came away from the trailer feeling like, Okay, he's here,

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Speaker 1: but he might not be the big band. I wonder

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Speaker 1: what it is that Scott, Cassie and Janet are gonna

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Speaker 1: be fighting against, because it does not seem like it's

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Speaker 1: gonna be Kang. It seems actually that their kind of

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Speaker 1: interests are aligned, and whatever it is that Scott helps

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Speaker 1: Kang with is gonna be the thing that gets the

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Speaker 1: ball rolling towards you know, the next you know, the

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Speaker 1: ultimate like showdown in the eventual Avengers movie when it

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Speaker 1: does happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I totally agree from the beginning what I've really

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Speaker 2: wanted because we knew from Loki that Jonathan would basically

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Speaker 2: be playing multiple different versions of Kang, which makes sense

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Speaker 2: as the nature of his character is that there are

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Speaker 2: many different versions of Kang living through all different times

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Speaker 2: and realities. I've always wanted it to be that he

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Speaker 2: would meet a version of Kang who was an ally.

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Speaker 2: I thought maybe it would be more like a version

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Speaker 2: who is just in the normal world, who's a scientist,

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Speaker 2: who's a very early version. But I like this idea

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Speaker 2: that there's this established version of Kang who is going

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Speaker 2: to try and ally himself with ant Man. You know,

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Speaker 2: we see him call him ant Man. He recognizes who

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Speaker 2: he is, what his powers are. He doesn't mistake him

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Speaker 2: for a different Avenger. The big question, like you say,

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Speaker 2: who is the threat? We know that basically, the version

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Speaker 2: of the quantum realm that we have in the MCU

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Speaker 2: is a mixture of the quantum realm and then this

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Speaker 2: thing called the microverse, which came from this weird old

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Speaker 2: seventies toy comics, the Micronats. So they can't say that,

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Speaker 2: but I wonder whether what we see here is some

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Speaker 2: version of Chronopolis, which is this kind of space where

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Speaker 2: Kang lives in some of the comics, where he can

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Speaker 2: open portals to all different dimensions that he's conquering up once.

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Speaker 2: I wonder if there's something where one of those portals

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Speaker 2: and you know, it's always going to go back there.

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Speaker 2: I'm not going to say X men, so be surprised, but.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna says, we're going but it's Kang, So I'm

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Speaker 3: going to say some kind of negative zone threat, some

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Speaker 3: kind of Doctor Doom threat, some kind of more direct

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Speaker 3: fantastic for threat.

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Speaker 2: I also think there has been rumors going around, and

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Speaker 2: this is very rumors, So no confirmation here that one

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Speaker 2: of the next Marvel Special presentations will be about Silver Surfer.

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Speaker 2: So I also wonder if we could see like a

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Speaker 2: galact and if they do that, I would assume it

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Speaker 2: would be about him before he became the Herald of Galactus.

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Speaker 2: So but if that's the case. Then in that case,

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Speaker 2: you know, this would be about Nora and rad. I

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Speaker 2: wonder if they're going to introduce the Silver Surfer. That

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Speaker 2: means maybe the bigger threat is someone like Galactus, you know,

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Speaker 2: I would I would love to see something like that,

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Speaker 2: you know. And I like the idea of Kang being

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Speaker 2: an ally first and a villain later because Jonathan Mage

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Speaker 2: just brings so much complexity to that performance in Loki.

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Speaker 2: He was just so brilliant. That's my favorite episode of

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Speaker 2: Loki is the finale episode with him, and I'm very

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Speaker 2: excited to see where they go with this, especially because

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Speaker 2: something I find very interesting about this setup is the

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Speaker 2: idea that Janet van Deen, you know, Michelle Fire for

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Speaker 2: Icon Original found like one of the founders leaders of

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Speaker 2: the Avengers. I I love the idea that she knew

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Speaker 2: that Kang was there, and she knew that this wider

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Speaker 2: version of the quantum realm existay, she didn't tell them that.

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Speaker 2: To me, kind that is very interesting. What does she know?

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Speaker 2: How Why did she think it was safer for them

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Speaker 2: to not be there. There's a lot of really interesting

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Speaker 2: character work they can do here, and the fact that

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Speaker 2: they're doing it in this kind of Bonker's super sci

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Speaker 2: fi world where they're sort of traveling as nomads through

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Speaker 2: the quantum realm. It's just so unexpected to me, Like,

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Speaker 2: I'm really excited for it.

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Speaker 1: The suit, the Kang suit looks amazing. I had a

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Speaker 1: crackpots I love this.

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Speaker 2: You better say it.

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Speaker 1: I listen, this is not gonna be right, but I

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Speaker 1: a crackpot thought just because of the way his face

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Speaker 1: looks and the way the mask looks. I do wonder

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Speaker 1: you mentioned the multiple versions of Kang and which one

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Speaker 1: is Scott going to be interacting with, which one is

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Speaker 1: gonna be in this movie. I wonder if the suit

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Speaker 1: is like some kind of quantum entanglement suit where different

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Speaker 1: versions of Kang can inhabit the suit at different times

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Speaker 1: depending on need. And I wonder if that's not a

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Speaker 1: way they could do it. He could he could be

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Speaker 1: version in this one suit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's a brilliant idea. Also, it makes

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Speaker 2: a lot of sense that if he had the technology

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Speaker 2: to create something like that with Chronopolis, then he would

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Speaker 2: have the technology to create a version of that in

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Speaker 2: the suit where the suit is essentially a portal in itself. Also,

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Speaker 2: I will say, like the obvious, big bad. For a

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Speaker 2: movie like this where we have the ally, Kang would

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Speaker 2: be like an immortous Kang. You know, Kang is the villain,

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Speaker 2: but Kang is an ally because there are many versions

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Speaker 2: of Kang, so that would also be very interesting to

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Speaker 2: see how they will play that. But I also didn't

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Speaker 2: realize this was coming out in February, maybe because time

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Speaker 2: is moving so fast, so we don't even have to

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Speaker 2: wait that long.

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Speaker 1: I'm ready, I don't have to wait that long. Up

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Speaker 1: next to the Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special trailer,

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Speaker 1: my immediate reaction is great, more Cosmo, more Cosmo.

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Speaker 2: That's the one baby. That's the most thing.

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Speaker 1: I like.

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Speaker 2: The most baby from God into the Galaxy was the

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Speaker 2: collector's collection, you know, seeing Cosmo, seeing Howard the Duck obviously,

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Speaker 2: who I hope is gonna make his way into the

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Speaker 2: main EMCU once again now he's married to Darcy. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know what, this is exactly what a Guardians of

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Speaker 2: the Galaxy Christmas special should be. Mandison drags. They're going

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Speaker 2: to cheer up star Lord, who honestly is a whiny baby,

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Speaker 2: so I don't know why they're bothered, but anyway, they're

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Speaker 2: gonna do it because they're good friends and they love him,

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Speaker 2: and how they're gonna do it. They're gonna kidnap Kevin Bacon.

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Speaker 1: Yes, my senses like a like a one shot in contacts,

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Speaker 1: like the like the like the Star Wars Holiday special before.

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Speaker 1: This is gonna be a very fun thing that will

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Speaker 1: not impact the canon.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, especially now the next news that we're gonna talk about.

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Speaker 2: We can assume that this is gonna be very out

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Speaker 2: of cannon. And I love this idea that it's kind

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Speaker 2: of like it's like Marvels, what if Drax was Santa

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Speaker 2: Claus or something like that. You know, it's like he

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Speaker 2: would be kidnap people and causing Nightmare before Christmas level troubles.

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Speaker 1: So up next. DC Films has announced that they have

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Speaker 1: found there Kevin Feige and is in fact two people.

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Speaker 1: It is writer director James Gunn show the Various Gardens

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Speaker 1: of the Galaxy movie but also Peacemaker and also Suicide

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Speaker 1: Squad over at Warner Brothers DC, and producer Peter Saffran.

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Speaker 1: They will lead the film, TV and Animation division as

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Speaker 1: co chairs and co CEOs of DC Studios, with gun

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Speaker 1: focusing on the creative side and Saffran more of the

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Speaker 1: business and production side. So you know, you would imagine

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Speaker 1: that's why considering that, you know, putting a director, not

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Speaker 1: just a director, but like an active working director who is.

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Speaker 2: Like currently doing work on her.

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Speaker 1: In in control of an entire studio. This is we've

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Speaker 1: never really seen this before. This is this is crazy.

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Speaker 1: You know, I've seen numerous like posts online that are

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Speaker 1: something like Kevin Feige has created his own super villain

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Speaker 1: with James Gunn. You know, obviously a lot of work

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Speaker 1: to do, a lot remains to be seen. It'll be

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Speaker 1: fascinating to see what they're you know, what their slate

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Speaker 1: of films is. I would imagine it's gonna be some.

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Speaker 1: It's gonna be like two years before James's like influence

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Speaker 1: has even felt on the screens. I would imagine your thoughts.

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Speaker 2: So I think that it's probably gonna seem sooner because

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Speaker 2: DC wants to feel like there's a shape. So we'll

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Speaker 2: probably get some classic DC slash Marvel style announcement where

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Speaker 2: you get the slate of movies and you're just like,

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Speaker 2: half of these definitely aren't gonna come out. But I

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Speaker 2: think you're right. Two years seems realistic. It's a four

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Speaker 2: year deal from what I understand, so I'm like, two

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Speaker 2: years feels like they're really gonna it's hopefully gonna go well,

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Speaker 2: so they can extend the deal and kind of do

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Speaker 2: more with it. I really like this choice. Peter Saffran

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Speaker 2: and James Gunn have worked together for a long time.

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Speaker 2: You know. It fits in with zaz Labs style of

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Speaker 2: the kind of people that he wants to put in

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Speaker 2: charge of things, aka you know, white men but for

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Speaker 2: the price of one. But like, the truth is that

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Speaker 2: Safrans worked with gun for a long time. He was

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Speaker 2: like his manager, and he actually produced the DC movies

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Speaker 2: that I liked the most. Like I everyone knows I

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Speaker 2: love Aquaman. I can't wait for the next Aquaman movie.

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Speaker 2: I loved Shazam. I think it's an absolute underrated gem.

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Speaker 2: It's just like pure superhero magic. He did Suicide Squad,

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Speaker 2: which I adored, Peacemaker, which was a huge smash. Also

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Speaker 2: worked on The Conjuring, which is the biggest horror franchise

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Speaker 2: of all time. So he has the producing chops and

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Speaker 2: he has them at Warner Brothers. And the good thing

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Speaker 2: about gun like the Suicide Squad really showed me in

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Speaker 2: a way that I hadn't really seen before. And I'm

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Speaker 2: such a huge fan of that movie. I think it's

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Speaker 2: really radical and just great. But like I knew that

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Speaker 2: he loves comics. He loves comics, and that's something like

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Speaker 2: that FIGI has that a lot of these execs have

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Speaker 2: not had. Right. He loves comics, and not just that,

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Speaker 2: he knows how to look into a catalogue that spans

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Speaker 2: eighty years and find unexpected characters to explore and unexpected

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Speaker 2: stories to tell. That is what the MCU was built on.

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Speaker 2: I know it doesn't feel like it. I know Captain

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Speaker 2: America and Iron Man feel like they were the biggest

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Speaker 2: superheroes in the world. They were not at the time.

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Speaker 2: These and Gun goes even deeper than that, you know.

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Speaker 2: So he made a movie with Suicide Squad that's like

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Speaker 2: one of the best superhero movies ever made, and it

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Speaker 2: has Poker dot Man in it. It has a legacy

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Speaker 2: version of rat Catcher, and the Rat Catcher storyline is unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: It has so many unexpected characters. It has Starro you know,

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Speaker 2: it has these cosmic, strange characters brought into this really

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Speaker 2: grounded world. I'm excited to see what this looks like

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Speaker 2: in the long term and if this is their tenure plan,

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Speaker 2: they got someone who's going to do something that's very

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Speaker 2: different than Marvel and that's what they need.

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Speaker 1: I agree, And I think having Saffron there, to your point, yes,

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Speaker 1: is wise. You know, you know, on the creative side,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of work to do in kind of

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Speaker 1: producing a cohesive shape and tone out of a lot

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Speaker 1: of disparate kind of projects, and that is going to

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Speaker 1: be a lot and so you would imagine having Saffron

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Speaker 1: there to kind of be the guardrails. It just seems

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Speaker 1: it'll be interesting to see what happened.

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Speaker 2: The thing that I think is actually really key, which

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Speaker 2: is something I've kind of been talking about, is like,

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Speaker 2: you know what else James Gunn has.

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Speaker 4: He has like.

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Speaker 2: An unreal rollerdex of talent who loves to work with him.

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Speaker 2: Like if you look at the people he works with

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Speaker 2: and how they love to continue to work with him

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Speaker 2: on different kinds of projects, he is bringing with him

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Speaker 2: an immense amount of star power who would likely be

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Speaker 2: very happy to do more things with him and whatever

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Speaker 2: guys wherever he ends up. And we're talking about a

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Speaker 2: studio whose main focus is on you know, making a

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Speaker 2: Superman movie. I have my version of what that should

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Speaker 2: be at DC, which is basically, they should just do

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Speaker 2: a Channing Tatum as Superman movie and make it as

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Speaker 2: bright and sparkling as Rob's you know, Batman movie was dark,

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Speaker 2: and then you have the two of them meet. But

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Speaker 2: I am not in charge. I'm not James Gunn spoiler alert, guys,

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Speaker 2: but I'm very interested to see they have the man

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Speaker 2: who who made a Superman What if Superman was a

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Speaker 2: horror killer, you know, with Brightburn. That's the man who's

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Speaker 2: now in charge of DC Studios along with Peter Saffran.

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Speaker 2: I find that very interesting.

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Speaker 1: Well, up next here it is, folks, the finale of House.

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Speaker 2: And the Drea. Did you know Dragons are coming?

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Speaker 1: Election Day is coming up fast? And you know what

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Speaker 1: that means just t shirts, No, it means voting. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: get yourself and everyone around you pump to go vote

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Speaker 1: with merch from the Cricket Store. We've got merch to

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Speaker 1: shout out voting as well as the most important issues,

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Speaker 1: from abortion rights to filibus to reform. Treat yourself to

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Speaker 1: something that represents what you stand for, like an eye

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Speaker 1: voted sticker. You can put it in the washing machine.

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Speaker 1: What get some gear and gear up for Election Day.

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Speaker 1: At Crooked dot com slash store, we're stepping out of

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Speaker 1: the airlock and onto the beautiful beaches of Dragonstone to

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Speaker 1: discuss the season finale of HBO's House of the Dragon

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Speaker 1: The Black Queen, written by Ryan Condall, directed by Greg iTANs.

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Speaker 1: What a this What a great episode. And also it

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Speaker 1: just made me sad. It may be sad for various reasons,

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Speaker 1: many you know, chief among them how hard Rania has

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Speaker 1: tried to avert the very thing that is now happening.

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Speaker 2: This is the ultimate proof of what we said this

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Speaker 2: hall season, which is at every point she's been giving

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Speaker 2: everyone incredibly generous offers, thoughtful ideas, trying to bring peace.

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Speaker 2: She's been living up to what her dad would have wanted,

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Speaker 2: and we see that just torn apart in the most

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Speaker 2: brutal way. Today, I am wearing all black morning clothes.

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Speaker 2: And also because I am now officially in the Black Faction,

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Speaker 2: I always thought Raniera is right, but I was an

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Speaker 2: Allison apologist hash tagged as I I'm.

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Speaker 1: An apologist for her, me too.

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Speaker 2: Like the episode, she still adds into that, like it's

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Speaker 2: so I love I know, I know it's controversial, and

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Speaker 2: I know we'll talk about this, but I love the

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Speaker 2: way that they subtly changed that big moment in this

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Speaker 2: episode to add a little bit more to that that sad,

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Speaker 2: kind of tragic.

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Speaker 1: Kind of we're going to talk about that, and let's

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Speaker 1: get into it. So we open on Dragonstone this wonderful

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Speaker 1: moment between mother and son. Raniera is pregnant with her

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Speaker 1: sixth child. Uh if it's a girl, she shall be

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Speaker 1: named Visenya, and she finds her son, Lucas Luke, looking

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Speaker 1: over egguns painted table. He is worried that, you know,

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Speaker 1: Lord Corlis is obviously still ailing, healing from his wounds

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Speaker 1: on the stepstones, he might die. Drift Mark might then

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Speaker 1: pass to Luke, and Luke is like, I don't think

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Speaker 1: I'm ready. I think I'm ready for this, and Nia

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Speaker 1: really quite affectingly talks about how, you know, she didn't

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Speaker 1: think she was ready also when her father named her

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Speaker 1: heir at fourteen years old, and now he is at

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Speaker 1: about that same age and dealing with all those those issues,

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Speaker 1: and she says, in time, I came to understand that

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Speaker 1: I had to earn my inheritance. There's this really heartbreaking

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Speaker 1: moment where he's like, how did you becomes so perfect?

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Speaker 1: And she's like, oh, if you only need.

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Speaker 2: Me like all of you.

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Speaker 1: Oh.

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Speaker 2: It's so such good stuff here and just absolutely heartbreaking

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Speaker 2: in the context of what's to come. There's so many

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Speaker 2: great Ranera Luke moments this episode.

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Speaker 1: And then Sir Lawrence Marbrand, one of the King's guard,

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Speaker 1: comes and bring the news that Princess Rainie says and

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Speaker 1: she really really really needs a meeting of right now.

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Speaker 2: I wonder what she wants to talk about.

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Speaker 1: I wonder what it is, And of course it is

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Speaker 1: the tidings of the death of King Vissaras and the

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Speaker 1: crowning in the dragon pit of King egg On the

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Speaker 1: second and it this news hits Rania like a physical blow.

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Speaker 1: She goes into labor. She knows because again she's been

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Speaker 1: through this, you know, five times by now that this

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Speaker 1: is one. It's way too early, the masters are saying so,

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Speaker 1: and then she can feel that this is not going

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Speaker 1: to turn out well damon. Meanwhile, he's processing all of this.

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Speaker 1: There's a great moment where he like spins dark Sister

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Speaker 1: kind of you know, he's got it in his hand

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Speaker 1: point that you know in the scabbard point down like

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Speaker 1: on the ground like a cane almost like spins it

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Speaker 1: in his hand and then leans it up against the

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Speaker 1: table and he's like the Sarah's has been slain. He's

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Speaker 1: obviously furious. They ask Nice why so yeah, like obviously

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Speaker 1: they were like, well, Rainie's they made you swear to

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Speaker 1: egg On. She's like, they wanted me to, but I refuse,

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Speaker 1: and they ask her how she escaped. She tells them

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Speaker 1: and then Damon is naturally for all of us, really

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Speaker 1: didn't Yeah, Rainie's that didn't just take care of it

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Speaker 1: right then? Why didn't you just take care of it

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Speaker 1: right then? I think she gives an excellent answer that

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Speaker 1: war was not mine to begin Huh.

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Speaker 2: It's so good and it totally leans into like the

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Speaker 2: great points that you were making. But I have to say, like, Nice,

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Speaker 2: this episode just absolutely delivers on every point. And you

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Speaker 2: kind of you see that even if it was not

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Speaker 2: a direct influence or a maternal relationship, a lot of

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Speaker 2: what Raniera learned was from the way that she saw

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Speaker 2: Renie behave. And this comes through in this way where

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Speaker 2: this week and this episode, Renie becomes the ally to

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Speaker 2: Raniera that we always wanted her to be, and there

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Speaker 2: is this understanding there between them that is so brilliant.

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Speaker 2: And when she says that that war is not mine

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Speaker 2: to begin, there's just no questioning her. Damon can say

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Speaker 2: what he wanted me is mad want?

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Speaker 1: But she's right and it also does something important I think,

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Speaker 1: which it gets underlined again and again and again throughout

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Speaker 1: this episode, which is Raniera, you're the queen. Now that's

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Speaker 1: your decision. Look at the way everybody is treating you

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Speaker 1: over the course of this episode as they're looking to

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Speaker 1: see is there any weakness here like their father, like

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Speaker 1: Damon is challenging her. Who will she stand up to this?

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Speaker 1: She laid that decision at Raniera's feet, and you can

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Speaker 1: hate it. You can disagree with it, you can be

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Speaker 1: frustrated with it. I certainly am, but I but the

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Speaker 1: I you really do understand the logic. And I gotta say,

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Speaker 1: like Rene, at this point, I think maybe my favorite

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Speaker 1: character in the show. I'm just like fascinated by her wisdom,

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Speaker 1: the way she is. She you know, she's got that

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Speaker 1: like world weariness of someone who has been right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: for decades, and it is just now that people are like,

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Speaker 1: you know what you are right about that, and it's like, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've been saying this noo years.

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Speaker 2: I love that. And also it kind of is one

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Speaker 2: of those funny moments where you feel like she did

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Speaker 2: this a lot. We talked about it, where they kind

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Speaker 2: of know what you're thinking and they preempt you. They

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Speaker 2: knew that we were all going to be like, well,

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Speaker 2: Circe would have burnt them, Circe would have done this.

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Speaker 2: But Renie isn't Circe. And that's actually what makes her

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Speaker 2: a great leader, that's what makes her a great person.

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Speaker 2: She's not gonna make that decision that's gonna end up

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Speaker 2: costing the lives of everyone, and by doing that, she,

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Speaker 2: at least for a small modicum of time, inspires Rania

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Speaker 2: to consider the idea of peace in the realm and

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Speaker 2: what that would take.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Nia goes to deliver. She's refusing the help of

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Speaker 1: her midwives and her master gerardis she is just like

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Speaker 1: in this fury. It's it. The feeling is that let's

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Speaker 1: just move past this delivery so I can begin the

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Speaker 1: hard work of trying to avert this war. Of course,

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Speaker 1: the baby is still born and dies. It is and

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Speaker 1: yet another hard to watch delivery scene. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: a conversation I think worth having, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: why make this decision to show it? I think you

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Speaker 1: can come down on either side of it. The thing

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Speaker 1: that I think about it is besides the very trite like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's in the books, like you have to put it in. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: of course it's in the books. But I find myself

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Speaker 1: like interrogating why it is so easy for me to

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Speaker 1: watch like any number of like deaths appear on screen,

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Speaker 1: and it's hard to watch someone deliver a child. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't have an answer for that, but

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Speaker 1: I just really like that.

432
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,840
Speaker 2: I think that's a good thing to think about because

433
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,360
Speaker 2: we've talked, you know, a lot about representation and these

434
00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 2: shows in the way The House of the Dragon has

435
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:50,879
Speaker 2: done a really great job at changing the way that

436
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 2: we see certain kinds of sexual violence. Though that the

437
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 2: way that they show birth is definitely very visceral. But

438
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,119
Speaker 2: something that you know, was a big conversation around the

439
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:02,119
Speaker 2: original Game of the Three is like, why can you

440
00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:05,399
Speaker 2: not see an erect penis on TV but you can

441
00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:07,479
Speaker 2: see someone get their head chopped off? What does that

442
00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:11,119
Speaker 2: tell you about that part of somebody's body and what

443
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 2: does it tell you that to watch a birth is

444
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:20,000
Speaker 2: so much more unsettling for us than to see somebody

445
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,520
Speaker 2: being tortured or have their tongue cut out. It's I

446
00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:25,560
Speaker 2: really like that. That's like a conversation that the question

447
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:27,440
Speaker 2: it's making you think of, because I think it's one

448
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,080
Speaker 2: of the biggest things about TV. You can turn on

449
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 2: broadcast TV and see somebody gunning down a bunch of people,

450
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,840
Speaker 2: but you can't see, you know, a nipple on some

451
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,440
Speaker 2: broadcast TV and you can't see you can never see,

452
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,439
Speaker 2: you know, a penis or other things. It's really really

453
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,159
Speaker 2: interesting the ideas of what is explicit and what is not.

454
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 1: While Raanira is going through this, Damon swings into action.

455
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: You can tell this is the moment that he has

456
00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:56,000
Speaker 1: been waiting for for years. He's ready to plan. He's ready.

457
00:24:56,080 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 1: He's like, man, the watchtowers, sight the skies, everybody's like,

458
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,880
Speaker 1: you know, man, your battle stations, all that nice. Goes

459
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:07,560
Speaker 1: out to the beach, calls Prince Jason Luke to their

460
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: mother's side. They find her in the midst of giving birth.

461
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: She tells them the news King your grandfather's dead. The

462
00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 1: throne is being usurped here's what's going on. Jace takes

463
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: it there. Whatever they've been doing to prepare him for

464
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,679
Speaker 1: this moment in these years, it worked. He takes it

465
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 1: really well. There was a really small moment on the

466
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 1: beach right before this where you know, he and Luke

467
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 1: are sparring and Luke falls down and it's that generational

468
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:43,800
Speaker 1: trauma game passed down again where he Jase is standing

469
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,400
Speaker 1: over lukewan what was that like? And to the point

470
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:48,640
Speaker 1: where one of the king's guard is being like, hey,

471
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 1: let's maybe take it easy on him, like allow him

472
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 1: to learn. But here again is this trauma and violence

473
00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 1: being passed down. Jace asks what do we do? And

474
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 1: Raniera is like, listen, nothing happens unless I order it

475
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:05,840
Speaker 1: right now. Okay, I just need to get past this,

476
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,159
Speaker 1: she's basically saying, and just everybody stand down until I

477
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:13,240
Speaker 1: am ready to rule. And then she's like, where's Damon.

478
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 1: Jase's like, I will, I'll go find him, okay. Rania

479
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: wants jas also to realize, Hey, you're the heir now, Okay,

480
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 1: so many hopes are pinned on you, so just be

481
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 1: aware of that Damon is with you know this this

482
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 1: kind of like burgeoning black council that is like coming

483
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,440
Speaker 1: together that will soon coalesce around Raniera. But like he's

484
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 1: really at the wheel right now and he's sending. He's

485
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 1: getting ready to send Ravens. Word reaches Dragonstone that Lord

486
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 1: Corlis is up and he is sailing there. He'll be

487
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:53,640
Speaker 1: there shortly, Rania. You can hear her cries echoing through

488
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 1: the castle. She's calling for Damon, and people are all

489
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,640
Speaker 1: around the table, Sir mar Brand, Keltigar, They're looking at him,

490
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,199
Speaker 1: and Sir Marbrand speaks up and is like, hey, uh,

491
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 1: are you gonna do you want us to do? You

492
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 1: want to speak to the masters and just see what's

493
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 1: going on right there, And Damon gives him the iciest stare, like,

494
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:19,119
Speaker 1: don't question me.

495
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 5: Right.

496
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 2: If Damon didn't need every night of the thirty that

497
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 2: he had, you probably would have had your head chopped

498
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,360
Speaker 2: off just then for like making it seem like he

499
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 2: needed to care about it. But he he needs every man.

500
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 1: Uh, Damon plans to fly to the riverlands talk to

501
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: Grover Tully. Jace comes up and he's like, well, the

502
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,639
Speaker 1: queen says, don't do anything. So she's back on her

503
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 1: feet and Damon and now there's a really interesting push

504
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:51,680
Speaker 1: and pull here where Damon is like, send the ravens,

505
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:54,440
Speaker 1: and Jason's like, but the Queen said not to send them,

506
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 1: and then of course the ravens do get sent because Damon,

507
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:00,400
Speaker 1: you know you're not You're really It's gonna be really

508
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 1: hard to not follow Damon's orders right now. And Damon

509
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:06,959
Speaker 1: is also telling Jace, hey, listen, you better get your

510
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: head in the game because you're going to need to

511
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:11,159
Speaker 1: be on a dragon patrolling the sky soon. Jace follows

512
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 1: Damon to a meeting with Sir Lawrence Marbrand and Sir

513
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: Stephan Darkland, members of the King's Guard who are assigned

514
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,879
Speaker 1: to the Queen and her family. Damon gives them the

515
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 1: opportunity to declare whether they are for the queen or

516
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: whether they are traders essentially, And listen, if you declare

517
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:33,160
Speaker 1: for the queen and then you flip later, it's gonna

518
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,680
Speaker 1: be very, very painful. Damon makes that very clear. If

519
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 1: you declare for the Greens right now, okay, that's fine,

520
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 1: but I'll make it quick. I'll make it quick if

521
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 1: you do it right now. Meanwhile, again, while this is happening,

522
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:54,520
Speaker 1: Raniera finally gives birth the child is stillborn, and the

523
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: queen prepares the child herself on her own for the

524
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:04,520
Speaker 1: traditional targeri and funeral. Right Sir Eric arrives, shocking the funeral.

525
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 1: He has brought a crown. This is the crown of

526
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 1: King Jaharis and then later her father, King Visaras, which

527
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: he smuggled out of King's landing, and he swears fealty

528
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: before everybody to the queen. Damon places the crown on

529
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,080
Speaker 1: Renier his head and everybody bows before Yah.

530
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 2: And talking of Push and Paul, there's that great moment.

531
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 2: Damon is looking at that crown and he is looking

532
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:33,240
Speaker 2: longingly for too long, but he knows in that moment

533
00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:36,000
Speaker 2: that the best move is to put it on Rania's head.

534
00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 2: But that is the moment where he thinks about it

535
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:39,960
Speaker 2: and he.

536
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,280
Speaker 1: Wants it no matter what, And I think, and you

537
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,600
Speaker 1: see it over the course of this episode where Raniera,

538
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:53,640
Speaker 1: taking her responsibilities extremely seriously, feels that, listen, a lot

539
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: of people are gonna die. It is my duty to

540
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 1: try as hard as I can to avert war if

541
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: it's at all possible, whereas Damon is just like, no,

542
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: we're fighting now, we go now, why don't we go

543
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,600
Speaker 1: right now, and now the planning begins in Earnest. The

544
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: Hall of the Painted Tables turned into a Council of War.

545
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: We've got the Black Council now here. Officially, we discover

546
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 1: that Agon's painted table lights up.

547
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 2: Shocking fast time, shocking stuff, shocking.

548
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 1: I used the time we get to stan Us in

549
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 1: Game of Thrones, they had lost, like the lighting they lost,

550
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 1: like the piece.

551
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 2: Can't put some candles to attach to it.

552
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 1: I didn't know, you know. It's like finding like an

553
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,160
Speaker 1: eight track like today a track player and being like,

554
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,320
Speaker 1: how do I even know I even do with this thing?

555
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: Damon announces the Queen with all her full titles. There

556
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: is a very interesting moment where everybody bows their head,

557
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:53,400
Speaker 1: but Raynie kind of doesn't.

558
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:58,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean they they Everyone else kneels when Damon

559
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 2: puts the crown on, and Renie stays standing but gives

560
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 2: that like a smile. She's like, now.

561
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 1: Here is my take. She and Corlis have been such

562
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: a team, even though Corliss has really thought like I'm

563
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:18,440
Speaker 1: running this for a lot of them, right. My take

564
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: is We're going to make this decision Corlis and I

565
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,920
Speaker 1: as a family, and I'm going to see what he

566
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:26,719
Speaker 1: wants to do, and we will talk to each other,

567
00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 1: which we see later before I officially, and then we

568
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 1: will declare together. But I'm not going to declare right no.

569
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 2: I love that also, I think as well. It's like

570
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 2: a sign of Raniera's respect for Raynice and this kind

571
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,480
Speaker 2: of growing respect they have Raannera doesn't make her bow,

572
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 2: Damon doesn't go to her with a sword. Raynie is

573
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,360
Speaker 2: watching over and she's saying, I did this. If I

574
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 2: didn't come to you and tell you what happened, this

575
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 2: would not be happening for you.

576
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: That's a great point. There's that moment at that first

577
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,840
Speaker 1: meeting where she first arrives and tells them the news Raine,

578
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 1: where you know, Damon is like very very hot again

579
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:10,440
Speaker 1: that rainis didn't burn everybody, while Raniera is like, hey,

580
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 1: uh well we you know, as we have been doing

581
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: every night. We will pray for Lord Corlis's return to health.

582
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 1: We have been you know, and come on, like, Damon

583
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 1: has not been praying every night for anything for anyone.

584
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:29,240
Speaker 1: But it shows you the diplop, like how Raniera has

585
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: really grown into a leader and she understands the weight

586
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 1: of it. It is very notable in this first meeting

587
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:40,040
Speaker 1: of the Black Council that Queen Raniera immediately includes bailen

588
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 1: Ws and the council immediately has them right around the table.

589
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 1: That is a huge nod to their importance and also

590
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 1: an example to you know, her virgeon and government about

591
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: what kind of ruler she is going to be. And

592
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 1: then Damon gives this the state of war, which is

593
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: things on Dragonstone are okay, but all in all not

594
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 1: really great. They have House Celtigar, they have the Stauntons,

595
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 1: they have House Massy darklnd bar him On, they are

596
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 1: with the Queen. Raniera's like, I think we can count

597
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 1: on the veil. That's my mother's people. Master Gerardis thinks

598
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: that the Riverlands are probably keen as well. Ravens are

599
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 1: going to Lord Grover Tully we discover, and Rniera's like,

600
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 1: wait a second, I said nothing was supposed to happen.

601
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 1: So there's a little bit of a look between those two,

602
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: and then Damon says, listen, I'm going to go to

603
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 1: river On personally, and like, of course, it was my

604
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:48,120
Speaker 1: idea to send the ravens against your express wishes. And

605
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: then they're some discussion of okay, where do storms end

606
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:55,960
Speaker 1: and winterfell fall. In this Winterfell, it is believed the

607
00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 1: Starks will never go again. Anything they've pledged it, they'll

608
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 1: never break an It doesn't matter how many years it's been,

609
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter who did it. They will stay true

610
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 1: to what they said. And the Queen also thinks that

611
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: Lord Boroughs, son of the late now Lord Borrmond Barrathian,

612
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 1: may need some reminding, and that is an understatement. The

613
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:20,480
Speaker 1: news from Driftmark is that Corliss is coming. And then,

614
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:24,439
Speaker 1: of course the Lanisters are never going to turn never

615
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 1: going to turn black. They're going to stay green, which

616
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: is why Damon believes again that the riverlands are so important.

617
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:36,759
Speaker 1: His plan is we seize heronhall right house of the

618
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 1: you know, the seat of Lord Laris Strong. So in

619
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 1: a stroke we weaken one of the Queen's most important

620
00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:50,280
Speaker 1: supporters and we cut the realm in half. They're discussing

621
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,399
Speaker 1: all of this again, and Lord Bartamus Celtigar of claw Isle,

622
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 1: who by the way, is also the Celtic Gar, is

623
00:34:56,040 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 1: also descended from the blood of Old Valeria, though no

624
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:04,000
Speaker 1: one remembers this, and I imagine that they would be like, hey,

625
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 1: remember us, we're Valerian, dude, don't forget us, is like, hey,

626
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: before we get into all of this planning, we have

627
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 1: the dragons, do we not like we we have the

628
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,720
Speaker 1: advantage here, Damon, give us a quick count. The Greens

629
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:23,320
Speaker 1: have three adult dragons, Vagar, Sunfire and Dreamfire ridden by Aimond,

630
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 1: egg On the Elder, the King, and Helena, plus Darren

631
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 1: the Daring who is off screen in Old towns to Serion,

632
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,200
Speaker 1: but that's a juvenile dragon. Meanwhile, the Blacks have Sea

633
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 1: Raxkaraxies and Melise plus Vermax Arax and Tyraxes also Moondancer

634
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:50,400
Speaker 1: Sea Smoke, who's unclaimed right now formerly len Or Valarian's dragon,

635
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,600
Speaker 1: plus the amounts of old King Jaharis and Queen Alisain

636
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: Verma Thor and Silverwing who are on Dragonstone in the

637
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:02,239
Speaker 1: dragon Isle right now, plus three wild dragons. So that

638
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 1: is thirteen according to Damon against four dragons, only three

639
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:10,439
Speaker 1: of which are adults. Plus Damon is like, I got

640
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:16,239
Speaker 1: a lot of eggs incubating. So Damon is like, yeah,

641
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 1: let's attack. The time now is to attack. We can

642
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 1: have the Greens heads on spikes in two weeks or

643
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: something like that before they can really debate this too

644
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 1: much it's clear also that Rania doesn't. She's like, listen,

645
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 1: we're not just like plunging into war right now, before

646
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 1: this debate can really take shape, Sir Eric brings word

647
00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 1: that there is a galley on the way flying the

648
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:45,040
Speaker 1: banner of King Eggon. Auto high towers here, Damon, the

649
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 1: Queen's Guard, other men at arms go to meet Auto,

650
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 1: who is backed by several members of the King's Guard

651
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 1: and other knights. Auto brings terms from Queen Allison. He's

652
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,720
Speaker 1: been directed by Alison to the Liver, terms only to Ranier.

653
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:02,920
Speaker 1: And so Rania appears on dragon back landing behind Otto,

654
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:06,320
Speaker 1: just as she did twenty years previously in the Crisis

655
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 1: of the egg And it is a really incredible mirror

656
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,440
Speaker 1: image moment. There's some jousting about about who is innocent

657
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: a trader. Rinera is like, I'm the Queen.

658
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 2: No matter how many times she stopped him. I mean,

659
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:24,440
Speaker 2: you would think I would have learned his lesson at

660
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:27,400
Speaker 2: this point about Dragonstone and Rinera, but he has not.

661
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 2: So you know, let that the.

662
00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:32,480
Speaker 1: Chips for where they may, and you have to say,

663
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:39,799
Speaker 1: certainly with you would imagine Allison's influence. Egg On has

664
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:41,600
Speaker 1: offered some really generous terms.

665
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, these are just Allisons times. Let's be real like that.

666
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,400
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I think these are Allison's terms obviously,

667
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 1: but obviously they come in in kan Agon's name. If

668
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 1: Rania bens, the knee Rania will be confirmed in Dragonstone

669
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:01,319
Speaker 1: in perpetuity. Okay, that's safe, which that will pass to her,

670
00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:07,920
Speaker 1: and they call her sons with Lenor aka Carwin Strong.

671
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:15,839
Speaker 1: Her true born sons Jaharis will get Driftmark, and all

672
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: the holdings of House Valarion, Visas and Eggon will be

673
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 1: given places of high honor at court Cupbear Squire to

674
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 1: the King, royal pardons for all the Black supporters, and

675
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 1: you know, honestly, it is a good deal. The question

676
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:36,520
Speaker 1: then becomes, do you trust the Greens to honor their

677
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:40,360
Speaker 1: side of it? Certainly Damon doesn't. He's like, never gonna happen.

678
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 1: What about this? We kill you all Otto points out

679
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 1: that all the symbols of legitimacy belong to Agon.

680
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:50,879
Speaker 5: Right.

681
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 1: Otto overreaches a little bit by saying, hey, and also

682
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:59,359
Speaker 1: how stark Tullian Barathian they you know, I think they're

683
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 1: leanings that they haven't. He amakes it clear that they

684
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 1: haven't really decided, but he's basically counting it against them.

685
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 1: This infuriates the Queen Raniera. She rips the pin from

686
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 1: the health rosen into the ocean and then Otto signals

687
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:22,440
Speaker 1: Grandmaster or while who delivers a note to Raniera and

688
00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:25,920
Speaker 1: is the page from the book that she and Alison

689
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,200
Speaker 1: were studying all those years ago in the Gods Wood

690
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 1: It is, you know, the history of Nimia, and tears

691
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:36,279
Speaker 1: well up into Rhanniera's eyes. And I have to say,

692
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:38,920
Speaker 1: I've seen a reading of this online where people are like,

693
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: Alison isn't trying to connect with Raniera. She's saying, you know,

694
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:45,960
Speaker 1: because like the history of Nimia is that she took

695
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:49,239
Speaker 1: the ships and they fled from Essos, made this kind

696
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:53,719
Speaker 1: of circuritous, circuitous journey, eventually landing in Dorn. She's not

697
00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 1: saying take the deal. She's saying run. She's saying flee.

698
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:00,759
Speaker 1: I actually don't look at it that way, because like

699
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:05,399
Speaker 1: the end of the Nimeiria story is Nimia finds a home,

700
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 1: she's not running anymore. She burns the ships on the

701
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: beach so that they're as a symbol to her people

702
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 1: like we're not going anywhere where this is it. I

703
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:17,720
Speaker 1: think she was just trying to connect with her friend

704
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: in it, like saying, hey, your friend is still here.

705
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,920
Speaker 1: These are my terms to your point, like you have

706
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 1: a you have a supporter and a friend on this side,

707
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 1: it is me. I will be the guaranteur of your

708
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 1: safety and your family safety in this deal.

709
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's from that moment. You know, those those

710
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:40,040
Speaker 2: were the moments when they were the people who were

711
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:42,360
Speaker 2: closest to each other in their lives. You know, this

712
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 2: is from the scene where they're laying on each other.

713
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 2: They are their only companion within the walls. I like,

714
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:52,359
Speaker 2: I think your reading is the reading that I saw

715
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 2: when I when I first watched it and then on

716
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 2: concurrent rewatches, I just think, yeah, I just think you

717
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 2: can see Reese does a great job. He's kind of

718
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:03,800
Speaker 2: pissed that he had to bring in.

719
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,200
Speaker 1: He doesn't want to hand it over here, but he.

720
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 2: Doesn't want to reconnect them because he already had that

721
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 2: moment of fear at the dinner table when he saw

722
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:18,440
Speaker 2: them holding hands and reconnecting. So yeah, I love that moment,

723
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 2: and it just makes everything that's gonna come so much

724
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:22,280
Speaker 2: more tragic.

725
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:26,720
Speaker 1: Blades come out now, because Damon is like, fuck this shit,

726
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:31,239
Speaker 1: what about what about this? Uh? Sir Eric, go over there,

727
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: grab otto, bring it to me, and then I'm gonna

728
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: fucking chop his head.

729
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:37,360
Speaker 2: He's like, I want the pleasure, baby.

730
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:41,280
Speaker 1: I want to do it. I've been waiting twenty years

731
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 1: to do it. Renier shuts it all down. She says,

732
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 1: King's landing will have my answer on the moraw. We're

733
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:52,960
Speaker 1: back at the Black Council Hall. Damon again is pointing

734
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 1: out that we have the horses, we have the dragons.

735
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 1: We can end this tonight if we wanted to. Raniera

736
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 1: is like, you know, my father told me the histories

737
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 1: and I'm well aware of them. When dragons flew to war,

738
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 1: everything burned. I do not wish to rule over a

739
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 1: kingdom of ash and bone, and dim Damon is fucking irate.

740
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 1: He's like, listen, you're trying to overt war. They declared war.

741
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:21,160
Speaker 1: They have already declared war, so what are you gonna do.

742
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,560
Speaker 1: Raniera is like, okay, we can't have this conversation in

743
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 1: front of everybody because we can't have fractures at the top.

744
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:33,800
Speaker 1: Clear the room. She is like, gonna pull rank. She's

745
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:39,280
Speaker 1: here is the moment where she's she is in her mind,

746
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:42,400
Speaker 1: she's sharing Eggon's prophecy with somebody who knows me.

747
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:46,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, she said, damn, you know, we have a big omission,

748
00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 2: like you know, she says, you know, little does she

749
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:50,600
Speaker 2: know he does not know.

750
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 1: She is right in her mind. This is this is

751
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,719
Speaker 1: to remind him, Hey, remember what we're doing here, like

752
00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:01,799
Speaker 1: remember our greater, greater mission that we we have to

753
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: keep to. And Damon reacts violently and terribly. He grabs

754
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:10,759
Speaker 1: her around the throat. And it's very very clear that

755
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: he did not know about this and and whatever is

756
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:19,040
Speaker 1: going through his mind. And in that moment, I don't

757
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 1: want to make any excuses for him, because this is

758
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 1: fucking horrendous and I don't even honestly, if Raniera wanted

759
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,560
Speaker 1: to and if and if it wouldn't weaken her, if.

760
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:30,439
Speaker 2: That he probably would have chosen.

761
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 1: Then it's like it's one hundred and the issue is

762
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:39,919
Speaker 1: she fucking needs Damon right now. She needs him. He's

763
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 1: a dragon writer, he is he's been to war.

764
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:47,440
Speaker 2: You know, she needs we know as well, like Allison

765
00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 2: has her insane psychopathic ally in Lara's strong and in

766
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:55,359
Speaker 2: Kristin Cole and these men will just murder people for her.

767
00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:58,200
Speaker 2: So we know in a dramatic irony sense that Raniera

768
00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 2: also needs her like violent wild car.

769
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:01,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, she just needs.

770
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:05,439
Speaker 2: It to not be directed towards her. But I love

771
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 2: that moment, Like Emma Darcy sells it so well, when

772
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:12,360
Speaker 2: Rania like clocks that Damon didn't know, and she just

773
00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 2: laughs in his face. She's like, you didn't know, and

774
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:19,600
Speaker 2: I'm just like, well, I love you. This is so good.

775
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,800
Speaker 1: And then Damon says something that is worth thinking about.

776
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:26,920
Speaker 1: Certainly dreams didn't make us King's dragons didn't He leaves.

777
00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 1: Corlis wakes up to find his wife at his bedside.

778
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 1: She is just pissed at him for abandoning the family

779
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:37,360
Speaker 1: to the Stepstones time and time again when when she

780
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 1: needed him, when the family needed him. Now their children

781
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 1: are dead. She gives him the latest news from the capitol,

782
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:51,320
Speaker 1: the Saras, the death of Visaras, the usurpation of Eggon. Oh, also,

783
00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:57,160
Speaker 1: your brother is dead. What Corlis is shocked and amazed

784
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 1: at this, but also recognizes in his brother's action is

785
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:03,800
Speaker 1: the fact that he openly called Raniera's children bastards and

786
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:07,359
Speaker 1: the presence of the king. He recognizes the same kind

787
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 1: of ambition that has driven him, and he's chastened. Now

788
00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:13,960
Speaker 1: He's like, listen, that's it. We're done. Okay, we're done.

789
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:17,319
Speaker 1: We've lost both of our children. We've got our grandkids.

790
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,359
Speaker 1: Let's retire to Driftmark and just sit this one out,

791
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 1: enjoy our grandkids. But of course Renie's like, you know,

792
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 1: lets him know that's it's really not an option, okay,

793
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: because your grandchildren are going to be in harm's way.

794
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:38,440
Speaker 1: If Eggon is king, they will never be safe Bayla, Rena,

795
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 1: Jay Sluke, Joffrey. They are going to be constant danger.

796
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:46,279
Speaker 1: Corlis joins the Black Council and he's looking shaky on

797
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:53,439
Speaker 1: that king Damon conspicuously absent. You know, the Queen makes

798
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:57,000
Speaker 1: some excuses for him. Corlis looks over the situation map

799
00:45:57,040 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 1: on the table and he says, you know, this doesn't

800
00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:02,759
Speaker 1: look great. This doesn't look like a lot of forces. Really,

801
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 1: it's a seize Westrus and you know, Nia is like, well,

802
00:46:08,239 --> 00:46:12,240
Speaker 1: we're hoping also for the riverlands and for the Barrathians

803
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:16,600
Speaker 1: and you know, the Errands, and Corlis says, hope is

804
00:46:16,640 --> 00:46:19,839
Speaker 1: the fool's ally, and then plays very very coy, but

805
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:25,160
Speaker 1: then eventually promises the strength of his house and his

806
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:28,600
Speaker 1: fleets to the Queen's cause. And it is a huge, huge,

807
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 1: huge fucking win because at this point, with more dragons

808
00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:35,000
Speaker 1: and the bigger fleet, they have the skies and the sea,

809
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:37,800
Speaker 1: It's going to take some time to get an army together,

810
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:41,080
Speaker 1: but this is this is huge, yeah, and it gives

811
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:45,840
Speaker 1: them some leverage if, as she surely does, Reniera wants

812
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:48,279
Speaker 1: to try and negotiate a piece to this yeah.

813
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:50,120
Speaker 2: And I think something that I really love about this

814
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 2: moment is like, really, again, it shows Rene's power. We

815
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:55,879
Speaker 2: know that really, Corlis is probably going to say yes.

816
00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:00,600
Speaker 2: But the thing that makes him make the final he

817
00:47:00,680 --> 00:47:03,400
Speaker 2: sees bay Line, he sees Rainer, and he sees them

818
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 2: standing with Luke and Jas and he kind of realizes, like, well,

819
00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 2: if I want my family to be okay, this is

820
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:11,239
Speaker 2: my family. My family is at the Black Council, my

821
00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 2: family as he are. So it's that again, that character

822
00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:18,960
Speaker 2: driven emotional storytelling that has made this season so powerful,

823
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,800
Speaker 2: and that's the thing that tips him over the edge.

824
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 1: And Corlis gives some good news too, which is the

825
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: status of the Stepstones. Are they are fully under his control,

826
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:33,839
Speaker 1: meaning that from that strong point, the Black Faction can

827
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:37,840
Speaker 1: strangle the Gullet and the Narrow Sea that put it

828
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: under blockade, stop all shipping and supplies into the capitol

829
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:44,880
Speaker 1: if they so wish. The Queen. Of course, it still

830
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:47,600
Speaker 1: needs the great Houses to get in line. They've decided

831
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:50,719
Speaker 1: the Lanisters are off the table, but Winterfell, the Veil,

832
00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:54,319
Speaker 1: storms End need to be contacted and they need to

833
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,600
Speaker 1: see where their allegiances lie. Jay steps up and says, hey,

834
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:02,279
Speaker 1: don't send Ravens, send us. What stronger message could there

835
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:09,080
Speaker 1: be than princes on dragonback? Good idea, bad idea? Well,

836
00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 1: well we'll find that. You decide. Jace will head to

837
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 1: the Eerie and then off to Winterfell. Luke will go

838
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 1: to storms End. Makes sense, it's the it's the closest, right,

839
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:25,200
Speaker 1: It's like very short flight over there, and maybe Dragon

840
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:28,720
Speaker 1: got a baby dragon. It's a quick kind of jaunt

841
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:33,319
Speaker 1: and then jaunt back. Raniera makes them promise you're going

842
00:48:33,320 --> 00:48:35,920
Speaker 1: in peace. You're not going as warriors, You're going as

843
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:44,440
Speaker 1: messengers only, and honestly, all things being equal, usually that

844
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:46,840
Speaker 1: would have been enough to protect them, And I think

845
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:49,440
Speaker 1: in any other kind of situation like if you take

846
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:52,560
Speaker 1: dragons out of it, as we'll see, I think that

847
00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:57,840
Speaker 1: might have protected them. Of course it doesn't quite go

848
00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:00,719
Speaker 1: that way. Raniera can see that Luke's scared to go,

849
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 1: and she reminds him that, hey, listen, the Brassians are

850
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,400
Speaker 1: blood They they first. You know. We'll get into this

851
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:08,319
Speaker 1: more and ask the master, But the Brassians. The only

852
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:11,960
Speaker 1: reason the Brassians are high lords of any place is

853
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 1: because the Targarians put them there. That wuris Barrathian back

854
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,000
Speaker 1: in the day. That was egg On, the conqueror's like

855
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:20,960
Speaker 1: best friend. Maybe more than that, you know, but like

856
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:25,800
Speaker 1: the history say, they were very very very close, and

857
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 1: and Eggon put him, you know, on the seat at

858
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,160
Speaker 1: Storm's end. So hey, listen, don't worry about it. Their

859
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:36,759
Speaker 1: blood were you know, Boris's ego will be stroked by

860
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,160
Speaker 1: the fact that a prince has arrived. Surely the other

861
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:42,920
Speaker 1: side will not have thought of something like that, Like

862
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 1: we're the only ones who would think of sending a

863
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:47,800
Speaker 1: prince on dragonbacks. Don't worry about It'd be great for

864
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:52,560
Speaker 1: max Araks and Moondancer flyoff. Damon goes to the dragon mount.

865
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 1: He is singing a Valerian lullaby, and he goes and

866
00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:00,160
Speaker 1: I don't think you could say claims, but but.

867
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:05,000
Speaker 2: It seems like he's trying to Woo Woo makes contact.

868
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 1: With Vermo Thor, who is you know again that the

869
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:14,680
Speaker 1: former dragon of old King Jaharis and certainly the second largest,

870
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 1: second oldest dragon currently alive, second only to Vagar, which

871
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:23,000
Speaker 1: is huge, but still Verma Thor and silver wearing huge

872
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:26,760
Speaker 1: dragons and big gets for the Black Faction. Luke arrives

873
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:30,839
Speaker 1: at Storm's end. It is, of course storming and bad news.

874
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: Vgar is there. You'd think at that point.

875
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,480
Speaker 2: You I would have just left. I would have just left.

876
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 1: I'm out, I think.

877
00:50:37,160 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 2: I also, like you know, it's hard like in this show, right,

878
00:50:40,160 --> 00:50:42,400
Speaker 2: we've seen the dragons a certain extent, but this is

879
00:50:42,440 --> 00:50:45,800
Speaker 2: the first time you realize how big Vagar is. Vega

880
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:49,920
Speaker 2: looks as big as storms end. Vegas is huge, Vega

881
00:50:50,080 --> 00:50:54,600
Speaker 2: is looming out of the clouds. It is just leave, babe.

882
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:57,560
Speaker 2: Your mom will be more happy that you go home.

883
00:50:57,880 --> 00:50:59,160
Speaker 2: You don't need them that much.

884
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:04,439
Speaker 1: Considering how nervous Luke has been since we've known him,

885
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: and certainly over the course of this episode, is anxiety

886
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 1: about inheriting driftmark about this mission, in particular about his

887
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:16,720
Speaker 1: own place in the world. It is stirring to watch

888
00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:21,040
Speaker 1: the courageousness with which he goes forth. He figures, Okay,

889
00:51:21,040 --> 00:51:23,759
Speaker 1: well I'm going to do it. He goes in delivers

890
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:27,680
Speaker 1: the message to Lord Boros, who, by the way, can't read.

891
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:31,920
Speaker 1: Lord Boros cannot read. Cannot read is described in the

892
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:41,800
Speaker 1: in the books as quote never a man of words. So, uh,

893
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:46,040
Speaker 1: Lord Boros has to have his master read the deal

894
00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:53,160
Speaker 1: that is offered to him, which is, yeah, fair play

895
00:51:53,200 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 1: to for fair play to Lord Barathion, not apparently as

896
00:51:57,640 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 1: rich as the one that King egg On is offered,

897
00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 1: which is a betrothal, yeah, one of marriage of his daughters.

898
00:52:06,040 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 2: It was like, yeah, you you you you've made an oath,

899
00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:12,560
Speaker 2: come to it and Aim and you know has gone

900
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:15,879
Speaker 2: to deliver this message of a marriage proposal, Luke.

901
00:52:16,239 --> 00:52:18,960
Speaker 1: And so you've come with no marriage and Luke is marriage.

902
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:22,200
Speaker 2: I'm not free to marry you know again, this is

903
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:23,879
Speaker 2: the problem when you send like a twelve year old

904
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:25,919
Speaker 2: could have just lied, could have been like, yeah, sure

905
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:28,080
Speaker 2: marry me, like the side with us, and then you

906
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:30,000
Speaker 2: just give him a different lord when you get back.

907
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: And also, you know, I think it was unwise to

908
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:38,440
Speaker 1: send Luke, but I understand, like you know, blue Sky thinking,

909
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:41,480
Speaker 1: I understand the thought behind it. That makes sense. I

910
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:44,720
Speaker 1: do think it was unwise considering the context. I also

911
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:51,000
Speaker 1: think we needed to prepare Luke for things that might

912
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:53,840
Speaker 1: have happened. You know what would have got there first.

913
00:52:54,080 --> 00:52:56,200
Speaker 2: Demon would have been like a great person to send

914
00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:58,520
Speaker 2: for this specific situation.

915
00:52:58,600 --> 00:52:59,720
Speaker 1: Why not send Daemon?

916
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:01,759
Speaker 2: That's the biggest I get it.

917
00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:04,759
Speaker 1: I guess. I guess you're thinking, if they attack, we

918
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:08,440
Speaker 1: need somebody here who's ready for war. Okay, I get that.

919
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:11,440
Speaker 1: It's the same time, it's not far, it's not far.

920
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:15,200
Speaker 1: At the same time, it's like it does not take.

921
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:19,279
Speaker 1: It shouldn't be like genius level planning to go. Okay, well,

922
00:53:19,320 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 1: what if the Greens made contact first, like what they

923
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:22,640
Speaker 1: had enough.

924
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,279
Speaker 2: To make a new They made new flags for the

925
00:53:26,400 --> 00:53:29,440
Speaker 2: ships with a green Targarian dragon. They have been planning

926
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 2: for a long time. You can't do.

927
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:33,080
Speaker 4: That, even night like it is.

928
00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:37,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, this was a terrible plan. I hate to see it.

929
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:38,000
Speaker 2: I understand this.

930
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:38,839
Speaker 1: Is they hate to see it.

931
00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:42,319
Speaker 2: This is a good idea is a bad execution. This

932
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 2: is the thing I think that's really key to this

933
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:48,520
Speaker 2: is that Vanera overestimates her children, because.

934
00:53:48,360 --> 00:53:50,360
Speaker 1: Let's be real, Yeah, I think that's right.

935
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:53,000
Speaker 2: Ten and four Vanera was a badass who went and

936
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:56,200
Speaker 2: ended the you know, the Crisis of the Egg. Ranera

937
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 2: is a fourteen year old flying around on dragon back,

938
00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:03,000
Speaker 2: stopping wars from happening. And she when Jay steps up and.

939
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:05,359
Speaker 1: Says, great point, she sees.

940
00:54:05,120 --> 00:54:07,319
Speaker 2: That in them and like what she wants for them,

941
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:10,400
Speaker 2: this kind of logical strength where you can go and

942
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:12,120
Speaker 2: you know the right thing to say and you but

943
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:14,920
Speaker 2: they don't. That's not the way that they've been raised.

944
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:17,960
Speaker 2: That's not the They never had that full belief of

945
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:21,600
Speaker 2: their family behind them because of the controversy around like

946
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:24,839
Speaker 2: their parentage, and that's just not who Luke is. Luke

947
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:26,759
Speaker 2: is just a sweet baby.

948
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:30,600
Speaker 1: Very very sweet boy. That is such a great point.

949
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:33,279
Speaker 1: Of course, Rania is gonna think, yeah, I did shit

950
00:54:33,400 --> 00:54:36,399
Speaker 1: like this when I was thirteen fifteen. Yeah, you can

951
00:54:36,440 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 1: handle this. I did it. Unfortunately, no Amond is mocking

952
00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 1: Luke the whole time. He's like, I want, hey, you're

953
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 1: gonna have to cut your eye out, by the way

954
00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:50,000
Speaker 1: to get out of here. He shows the sapphire that

955
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,400
Speaker 1: he keeps in the eye sode of his throws a

956
00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:56,800
Speaker 1: knife across the hall. Lord Borrows won't let anything happen

957
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:59,120
Speaker 1: in the hall, but of course, like he doesn't control

958
00:54:59,160 --> 00:55:00,720
Speaker 1: the skies and what happen outside.

959
00:55:01,520 --> 00:55:03,240
Speaker 2: Uh Luke, he's gonna come to regret.

960
00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:05,880
Speaker 1: Gets He gets on Arax and is like, and you

961
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:08,240
Speaker 1: could tell both the rider and the dragon are nervous,

962
00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:09,919
Speaker 1: and he's trying to calm the dragon down, like listen,

963
00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:14,320
Speaker 1: let's just get out of here. A chase ensues. Uh

964
00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:19,000
Speaker 1: Luke gets away. Luke gets away on Arax like the

965
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:21,320
Speaker 1: dragon is much smaller. They fly down into a canyon.

966
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:26,080
Speaker 1: Vegar can't fit down there. They get away unwisely, and

967
00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 1: it's unclear.

968
00:55:27,080 --> 00:55:29,719
Speaker 2: I think this is the I.

969
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:33,480
Speaker 1: Think this is a decision. Arax makes the very very

970
00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,200
Speaker 1: unwise decision to you know, belch a little bit of flame.

971
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:40,319
Speaker 2: I think the way I read it, it's kind of

972
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:42,920
Speaker 2: like he's just that it's like a body instinct, like

973
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:45,000
Speaker 2: a muscle memory, because he's so.

974
00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 1: I think I think that I think that the dragons

975
00:55:51,560 --> 00:55:54,879
Speaker 1: want war much like Damon does. And I think that

976
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 1: the dragons are just ready to fight. Yeah, And I

977
00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:04,120
Speaker 1: think everybody, just as there's been so much underestimating going on,

978
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:07,640
Speaker 1: as you said, like Rania overestimating her her son's I

979
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:13,719
Speaker 1: think there's been some underestimating of dragons as creatures with

980
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:14,960
Speaker 1: their own decision.

981
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,160
Speaker 2: I think this is what I love about this episode.

982
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:20,840
Speaker 2: Like as much as it was so hard to watch,

983
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:23,719
Speaker 2: I love how well we can now go back and

984
00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 2: I was going back and watching earlier episodes and see

985
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:28,520
Speaker 2: the times when Visaras was like, we never should have

986
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 2: created dragons. Dragons are mistake terrifying. I think Patty did

987
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:36,080
Speaker 2: an interview where he basically said to Visaras, it felt

988
00:56:36,080 --> 00:56:38,279
Speaker 2: like he was riding a nuclear bomb. He knew that

989
00:56:38,320 --> 00:56:41,560
Speaker 2: it was this weapon of mass destruction and it terrified him,

990
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:45,279
Speaker 2: and he was the only one who didn't underestimate the dragons.

991
00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:49,600
Speaker 2: And that comes just to a head in the most

992
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:51,440
Speaker 2: horrific way in this scene.

993
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:54,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, Visara says earlier in the season, it's

994
00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:57,520
Speaker 1: an illusion that we control them, and here you see

995
00:56:57,520 --> 00:57:02,839
Speaker 1: it so ers as this attack Aimond is he can

996
00:57:02,920 --> 00:57:07,040
Speaker 1: feel Vagar going to respond and is trying to call

997
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:08,680
Speaker 1: Vegar off, like don't don't.

998
00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:10,360
Speaker 4: Don't, no, no, no, no.

999
00:57:10,640 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: Don't serve me don't do this, but of course Vogar

1000
00:57:14,600 --> 00:57:21,000
Speaker 1: doesn't listen, and in one mighty chomp kills Arax, kills Luke.

1001
00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:24,640
Speaker 1: Poor babies, they are dead. They pieces of dragon and

1002
00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 1: young boy are falling into the sea. Uh. We go

1003
00:57:28,680 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 1: back to Dragonstone where Raniera is still at the table

1004
00:57:32,920 --> 00:57:34,840
Speaker 1: and Damon comes up to deliver the news and we

1005
00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:37,919
Speaker 1: see her turn around and you could see on her face.

1006
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:39,240
Speaker 2: That it's done.

1007
00:57:39,320 --> 00:57:44,440
Speaker 1: Whatever, whatever whatever off ramps there were, we are past

1008
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 1: that now. Now it is time to fully go to war.

1009
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:53,760
Speaker 1: She is absolutely furious. It's a chilling moment.

1010
00:57:53,960 --> 00:57:58,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, we get the two face the two facial performances

1011
00:57:58,360 --> 00:58:02,000
Speaker 2: from Emma Dassi has ran and the kid who plays

1012
00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:08,160
Speaker 2: Amend when he realizes what has happened, and that look

1013
00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:13,720
Speaker 2: where he's basically like, what do I admit I'm a kinslayer?

1014
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 2: Or do I admit that I can't control my dragon?

1015
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:19,200
Speaker 2: And oh shit, I just started a war. There's like

1016
00:58:19,480 --> 00:58:22,800
Speaker 2: so much that goes over his face and he's just

1017
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:25,640
Speaker 2: so horrified. And I found that to be a very

1018
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 2: powerful choice because the truth is, well, these kids have

1019
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:32,080
Speaker 2: not ever been taught the realities of war. Like to them,

1020
00:58:32,120 --> 00:58:36,880
Speaker 2: it's this horrible trolling, bullshit game. But that's not that's

1021
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:39,280
Speaker 2: not what it is, Like did people die? If you

1022
00:58:39,320 --> 00:58:41,200
Speaker 2: threaten to kill someone, they can die, you know. An

1023
00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:44,280
Speaker 2: amend is just having that realization just then that he

1024
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:47,800
Speaker 2: killed his cousin, his companion, someone he grew up with,

1025
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:49,840
Speaker 2: his nephew.

1026
00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:55,520
Speaker 1: He will absolutely, he will absolutely wear the moniker of

1027
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:58,800
Speaker 1: a kinslayer. That will he knows that that will happen now.

1028
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 1: And I mean, to your point, we had just gotten

1029
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:08,000
Speaker 1: talking done talking about how rainee. So it was obviously

1030
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 1: a frustrating decision for a lot of people. Declined to

1031
00:59:12,120 --> 00:59:15,320
Speaker 1: start a war that was not first to start aim

1032
00:59:15,400 --> 00:59:18,320
Speaker 1: and just keeps start war that was not his to start.

1033
00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:21,040
Speaker 1: That was not his place to do that, to to

1034
00:59:21,200 --> 00:59:25,400
Speaker 1: go out and immediately fire the first shot in the

1035
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:28,800
Speaker 1: most what is going to be some faust stating in

1036
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:32,600
Speaker 1: a devastating civil war and kill a messenger too, like

1037
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 1: who was not it's like.

1038
00:59:34,040 --> 00:59:37,000
Speaker 2: Not he says that he was as he was not

1039
00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 2: there as a warrior. That is it's very well done,

1040
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:43,200
Speaker 2: because Boris even says it, like you can't do that.

1041
00:59:43,240 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 2: He came as in a mystery. Yeah, there is a

1042
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 2: certain amount of rules and etiquet that Aimen has broken

1043
00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:52,520
Speaker 2: here that go even beyond you know, usurping. This is

1044
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:55,080
Speaker 2: about the next step when you're trying to navigate power.

1045
00:59:55,480 --> 01:00:00,480
Speaker 2: And he just absolutely decimated any chance of any kind

1046
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:04,960
Speaker 2: of peaceful ending. And we see them, oh he knows it,

1047
01:00:05,000 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 2: and then we see it in Ranares face. It's done,

1048
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:10,600
Speaker 2: like it's over the other.

1049
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:13,240
Speaker 1: The other thing that really strikes me is as we

1050
01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:18,840
Speaker 1: watched Raniera struggle so mightily to avert this war. Is

1051
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:21,600
Speaker 1: that and Alison too, you know, in the previous episode

1052
01:00:22,080 --> 01:00:25,120
Speaker 1: in her own way, and I think very sincerely trying

1053
01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:29,280
Speaker 1: to slow down this machinery that is like sprung into motion.

1054
01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:32,960
Speaker 1: Is that at this point it's kind of out of

1055
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:37,840
Speaker 1: their hands. Like all of these warriors around, Alison and

1056
01:00:37,960 --> 01:00:42,840
Speaker 1: Rania want to fight, They want to do it. Damon

1057
01:00:43,040 --> 01:00:48,080
Speaker 1: wants to fight this whole life. Otto has been waiting

1058
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:53,200
Speaker 1: to kill Rania and her entire family. Whatever these two

1059
01:00:53,280 --> 01:00:56,920
Speaker 1: want to do. The moment when they could have stopped

1060
01:00:56,960 --> 01:01:00,480
Speaker 1: it is gone because it's just out of their hands.

1061
01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:02,040
Speaker 1: It's out of their hands. And not only that, I

1062
01:01:02,120 --> 01:01:05,040
Speaker 1: think Alison, you know we we said last week, Alison

1063
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:09,800
Speaker 1: will regret I think placing a crown on Eggon's head

1064
01:01:09,840 --> 01:01:15,320
Speaker 1: and the loss of agency and influence she has I

1065
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:19,400
Speaker 1: think after I think the last moment she had to

1066
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:25,560
Speaker 1: have any influence over Eggon over the Green Council ended

1067
01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:29,040
Speaker 1: with those very very generous terms. I agree, you know

1068
01:01:29,040 --> 01:01:32,920
Speaker 1: from her perspective that were offered that ended with the

1069
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:37,600
Speaker 1: death of Lucera's Valarian. I think that is she will

1070
01:01:37,640 --> 01:01:40,640
Speaker 1: realize now that she doesn't have much say in anything.

1071
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:42,520
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, I think so too, And I think

1072
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:44,640
Speaker 2: it's not just going to be Eggon that she's lost

1073
01:01:44,640 --> 01:01:47,680
Speaker 2: control of, but also Aimen, because for Aimen to survive this,

1074
01:01:48,440 --> 01:01:51,920
Speaker 2: he is going to have to I think that and

1075
01:01:52,000 --> 01:01:53,720
Speaker 2: as we know from like the history, but I think

1076
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:55,800
Speaker 2: he's essentially going to have to act like it was

1077
01:01:55,960 --> 01:01:59,720
Speaker 2: something he did out of choice, and that's gonna pit

1078
01:01:59,800 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 2: him against Allison and put him against Reniera in an

1079
01:02:02,680 --> 01:02:04,640
Speaker 2: incredibly brute a way. Where the truth is we know

1080
01:02:04,680 --> 01:02:07,840
Speaker 2: it was just like a very sad mistake of an

1081
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 2: idiotic teenager.

1082
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:13,040
Speaker 1: It was very man It was very very sad. But

1083
01:02:13,080 --> 01:02:17,160
Speaker 1: I can't can't wait for season two. Up next more

1084
01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:25,680
Speaker 1: House of the Dragon and Ask the Master. To celebrate

1085
01:02:25,720 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 1: the last round of Ask the Master, we have emerged

1086
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 1: from the citadel to answer your questions.

1087
01:02:35,200 --> 01:02:38,560
Speaker 2: Jamie asks. Early in Game of Thrones, Jora tells Danny

1088
01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:40,919
Speaker 2: that the people of West Ross don't really care who

1089
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:45,000
Speaker 2: sits the throne. Do common people care about Eggon versus RNERA.

1090
01:02:46,040 --> 01:02:50,600
Speaker 1: I think that that is a good perspective, and honestly, no,

1091
01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:55,880
Speaker 1: you know, like if we use you know, medieval culture,

1092
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:59,520
Speaker 1: European medieval culture, like as a kind of guide here,

1093
01:03:00,120 --> 01:03:04,360
Speaker 1: national identity was not really a thing. And moreover, you know,

1094
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:09,960
Speaker 1: the small folk are worried about tilling their crops, working

1095
01:03:10,000 --> 01:03:13,640
Speaker 1: as crafts people. Whether this person is their lord, or

1096
01:03:13,680 --> 01:03:16,000
Speaker 1: that person is their lord, or this person is their

1097
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:19,840
Speaker 1: king or queen, their lives stay the same. The income

1098
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:24,720
Speaker 1: inequality is like unimaginable gulf. There is no upward mobility.

1099
01:03:25,120 --> 01:03:27,200
Speaker 1: Their position will never change no matter.

1100
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:28,960
Speaker 2: Who is always on the mash.

1101
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:34,000
Speaker 1: The boot is there and it is very strongly on

1102
01:03:34,040 --> 01:03:37,600
Speaker 1: their neck. And what they care about is who is

1103
01:03:38,680 --> 01:03:40,200
Speaker 1: which one of these people is going to make my

1104
01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:45,480
Speaker 1: life actively worse. And in that sense, that's really the

1105
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:51,040
Speaker 1: only way they care. They truly are fearful of the

1106
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:54,360
Speaker 1: people who rule over them and just looking to live

1107
01:03:54,440 --> 01:03:56,880
Speaker 1: life as quietly and safely as possible.

1108
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,320
Speaker 2: Taran asks what was Damon singing.

1109
01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:06,600
Speaker 1: Damon was singing a Valerian lullaby titled and I'm not

1110
01:04:06,640 --> 01:04:10,040
Speaker 1: going to be able to pronounce this correctly, but Haro spartosi,

1111
01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 1: which translates in English with three heads words by ty

1112
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:19,680
Speaker 1: Michel and David J. Peterson, who is the linguist who

1113
01:04:19,720 --> 01:04:21,760
Speaker 1: has designed all the languages in Game of Thrones and

1114
01:04:21,800 --> 01:04:27,320
Speaker 1: House of the Dragon, and the lyrics translated in English

1115
01:04:27,600 --> 01:04:31,360
Speaker 1: are fire breather, winged leader, but two heads to a third,

1116
01:04:31,480 --> 01:04:34,280
Speaker 1: sing from my voice the fires I've spoken, and the

1117
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 1: price has been paid with blood magic, with words of flame,

1118
01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:40,400
Speaker 1: with clear eyes to bind the three to you. I

1119
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:43,520
Speaker 1: sing as when we gather, and with three heads we

1120
01:04:43,560 --> 01:04:45,960
Speaker 1: shall fly as we were destined, beautifully free.

1121
01:04:46,120 --> 01:04:49,080
Speaker 2: Okay, so I need to say something then after that, Yeah,

1122
01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:51,040
Speaker 2: I didn't know those were the lyrics. I got a

1123
01:04:51,080 --> 01:04:54,320
Speaker 2: message from one of our listeners, Whitney Jane, who told

1124
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:56,160
Speaker 2: me a theory that just blew my mind, which was

1125
01:04:56,200 --> 01:04:59,400
Speaker 2: the idea that the death of Visnya could have been

1126
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:02,960
Speaker 2: a blood sat crifice to allow Damon to have two dragons.

1127
01:05:03,480 --> 01:05:05,560
Speaker 2: And with the lyrics to this song, and the idea

1128
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,720
Speaker 2: of the three headed dragon is do you think there's

1129
01:05:08,720 --> 01:05:11,520
Speaker 2: a possibility that that is the case, because I had

1130
01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:14,120
Speaker 2: no idea that that's what the lyrics meant. But I yeah,

1131
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:15,960
Speaker 2: I thought that was just so wild.

1132
01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:21,160
Speaker 1: That is very interesting and I will need to process it.

1133
01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:25,720
Speaker 1: But you know, blood magic was part of old Valaria

1134
01:05:26,240 --> 01:05:29,160
Speaker 1: certainly was part of the kind of the magical, the

1135
01:05:29,240 --> 01:05:32,800
Speaker 1: culture of magic. As you know, Viscera's mentioned himself. There

1136
01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:37,640
Speaker 1: are rumors that, like in other parts of SOS, like

1137
01:05:37,720 --> 01:05:40,880
Speaker 1: cohoric As, they were trying to create their own version

1138
01:05:40,880 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 1: of Vlarian steel. A lot of the experiments that they

1139
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:46,120
Speaker 1: were doing were with blood sacrifices to create this like

1140
01:05:46,160 --> 01:05:49,120
Speaker 1: magic metal similar to Vlarian steel. So I would not

1141
01:05:51,120 --> 01:05:54,960
Speaker 1: I would. I think that's a very interesting theory, that's all. Else.

1142
01:05:55,160 --> 01:05:56,800
Speaker 1: I think that's a lot to think about. That's a

1143
01:05:56,840 --> 01:05:59,000
Speaker 1: really interesting one.

1144
01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:00,640
Speaker 2: Okay, let's do it.

1145
01:06:00,680 --> 01:06:03,040
Speaker 1: Wow that is yeah.

1146
01:06:03,080 --> 01:06:06,480
Speaker 2: Okay, So we got some Valarian steel questions. How strong

1147
01:06:06,520 --> 01:06:10,240
Speaker 2: is Valarian steel? How does it compare to bestcar adamantium vibrands?

1148
01:06:10,560 --> 01:06:13,800
Speaker 2: Funny other man to ask? And and then that was

1149
01:06:13,840 --> 01:06:16,640
Speaker 2: Ben and then James asks where did everyone get their

1150
01:06:16,760 --> 01:06:17,960
Speaker 2: Valerian steel swords.

1151
01:06:19,240 --> 01:06:24,280
Speaker 1: Valarius steel is it's very comparable to best scar and adamantium.

1152
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:27,320
Speaker 1: I'll get to that in a second. It is, you know,

1153
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:32,400
Speaker 1: lighter than regular crucible steel and is much much much stronger,

1154
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:37,560
Speaker 1: basically indestructible. Once it's forged and hammered and folded into shape.

1155
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:40,919
Speaker 1: The blades are said to never lose their edge. These

1156
01:06:40,920 --> 01:06:44,560
Speaker 1: are the weapons that are around right now, are hundred's,

1157
01:06:45,080 --> 01:06:47,400
Speaker 1: you know, three hundred years old something like that, some

1158
01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:50,440
Speaker 1: four hundred ish years old, and the fact that they

1159
01:06:50,480 --> 01:06:55,200
Speaker 1: never need to be sharpened tells you that they're essentially indestructible, right,

1160
01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:59,240
Speaker 1: Very similar to adamantium in that way. Adamantium also once

1161
01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:04,520
Speaker 1: the molten metal cools, indestructible. Now, the technology for creating

1162
01:07:04,600 --> 01:07:07,920
Speaker 1: Valarian steel has of course been lost, but there are

1163
01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:12,880
Speaker 1: very highly skilled artisans in Coohoric who, I guess no

1164
01:07:13,960 --> 01:07:17,400
Speaker 1: certain spells that allow them to rework the metal. And

1165
01:07:17,720 --> 01:07:19,880
Speaker 1: you know, we saw that in Game of Thrones when

1166
01:07:20,400 --> 01:07:24,880
Speaker 1: Taiwan Lanister hired Tobomot from Soo So I don't think

1167
01:07:24,920 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 1: they say his name. They may say his name in

1168
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:30,720
Speaker 1: the episode to melt down the Stark family, sword ice

1169
01:07:30,760 --> 01:07:35,080
Speaker 1: into two swords. That was made possible because again those

1170
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:40,120
Speaker 1: Tobomot knows certain spells and knows how to do that.

1171
01:07:40,200 --> 01:07:45,240
Speaker 1: Now that also those secrets in Cohoric, the secrets of

1172
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 1: reworking valarium steel are tightly, tightly, tightly guarded. A Maser

1173
01:07:49,120 --> 01:07:50,800
Speaker 1: went over there to kind of study them, and he

1174
01:07:50,880 --> 01:07:54,040
Speaker 1: was like publicly whipped several times because he was like

1175
01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:58,480
Speaker 1: getting too close to the secret. Vibranium is significantly different

1176
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:03,240
Speaker 1: in that it has that unique property of absorbing and

1177
01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:08,200
Speaker 1: storing energy, kinetic energy in particular, and that it is

1178
01:08:08,240 --> 01:08:11,080
Speaker 1: then able to like release it. Also in the movie version,

1179
01:08:11,200 --> 01:08:13,840
Speaker 1: you see that, you know, it's just in everything. It's

1180
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:16,559
Speaker 1: in the in Wakanda in particular, it's in the plants,

1181
01:08:16,560 --> 01:08:20,719
Speaker 1: it's in the organic matter. And that this is also

1182
01:08:20,800 --> 01:08:24,080
Speaker 1: forms the basis for their very advanced technology. Or I

1183
01:08:24,080 --> 01:08:29,559
Speaker 1: would imagine that vibranium is in Wakandon you know, computer chips,

1184
01:08:30,040 --> 01:08:32,400
Speaker 1: et cetera, and that has some sort of special properties.

1185
01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:37,160
Speaker 1: Of course, you know, valarian seel doesn't work that way. Also,

1186
01:08:37,760 --> 01:08:41,240
Speaker 1: vibranium and adamantium different than valariums steel in that there

1187
01:08:41,240 --> 01:08:45,160
Speaker 1: are several versions of both of those metals, right there's

1188
01:08:45,200 --> 01:08:49,000
Speaker 1: the Wakandan vibranium, there's the Savage Land vibranium, and there's

1189
01:08:49,120 --> 01:08:53,280
Speaker 1: different versions Adamantium. There's several versions, not to mention the

1190
01:08:53,400 --> 01:08:57,559
Speaker 1: multiversal versions of those, so it's different. How did they

1191
01:08:57,560 --> 01:09:02,720
Speaker 1: get into Westros. There had been contact and trade relationships

1192
01:09:02,800 --> 01:09:05,800
Speaker 1: between the kingdoms of West Ross and Old Valeria before

1193
01:09:05,840 --> 01:09:09,320
Speaker 1: the Doom. Dragon Stone was the entry point for this,

1194
01:09:09,439 --> 01:09:15,240
Speaker 1: the westernmost outpost of the Valerian Freehold. We don't exactly

1195
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:18,080
Speaker 1: know when the Blades started coming in, but based on

1196
01:09:18,120 --> 01:09:22,519
Speaker 1: clues from the books, you can date it to like

1197
01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:26,640
Speaker 1: a couple one hundred years before the Doom, which was

1198
01:09:26,720 --> 01:09:31,360
Speaker 1: one hundred and fourteen years before Eggon's conquest. The clues

1199
01:09:31,439 --> 01:09:34,799
Speaker 1: are that like just for example, in Game of Thrones,

1200
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:40,639
Speaker 1: heart Spain, which is the Tarley family sword, is mentioned

1201
01:09:40,680 --> 01:09:44,160
Speaker 1: as being quote nearly five hundred years old. And then

1202
01:09:44,200 --> 01:09:47,720
Speaker 1: in Kat's chapter of Game of Throne, she's watching you

1203
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,559
Speaker 1: know ned in the gods would clean off Ice after

1204
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:55,759
Speaker 1: having decapitated the guy who fled from the Night's Watch,

1205
01:09:56,880 --> 01:10:00,320
Speaker 1: and she says that Ice is quote said to be

1206
01:10:00,400 --> 01:10:03,840
Speaker 1: four hundred years old, So using that as a window

1207
01:10:03,880 --> 01:10:08,040
Speaker 1: and then counting back you can say, you know, approximately

1208
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:13,200
Speaker 1: three hundred and fourteen BC, something like that Bright Roar,

1209
01:10:13,240 --> 01:10:17,839
Speaker 1: which was the Lanister family sword that got lost because

1210
01:10:18,120 --> 01:10:22,719
Speaker 1: some looney Lanister decided to sail off into the Sunset

1211
01:10:22,760 --> 01:10:26,000
Speaker 1: Sea with it, came into their possession like one hundred

1212
01:10:26,080 --> 01:10:28,680
Speaker 1: years before the doom. So let's call it about two

1213
01:10:28,760 --> 01:10:30,880
Speaker 1: hundred years before the doom that that stuff started to

1214
01:10:30,880 --> 01:10:31,200
Speaker 1: come in.

1215
01:10:31,360 --> 01:10:35,080
Speaker 2: Okay, we asks a good, good fun questionnaire. How common

1216
01:10:35,240 --> 01:10:36,919
Speaker 2: was incestin Old Valeria.

1217
01:10:38,040 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 1: We don't know, but Old Valeria was an oligarchy, meaning

1218
01:10:44,040 --> 01:10:49,960
Speaker 1: that like thirty or so dragon writing families basically ruled

1219
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:52,040
Speaker 1: the city. So you can think about it as the

1220
01:10:52,120 --> 01:10:55,799
Speaker 1: Roman Republic, you know, with senators and consuls and stuff

1221
01:10:55,840 --> 01:11:00,320
Speaker 1: like that. No actual like figurehead, leader, leader, and all

1222
01:11:00,320 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 1: these people kind of like jostling for position. My guess

1223
01:11:03,080 --> 01:11:06,040
Speaker 1: would be incest would happen, of course, because again that

1224
01:11:06,120 --> 01:11:08,600
Speaker 1: dragon riting blood, you want to keep it safe, but

1225
01:11:08,760 --> 01:11:13,599
Speaker 1: that there would also be significant intermarriage between those families

1226
01:11:13,600 --> 01:11:17,000
Speaker 1: to the point that I'm sure they were all cousins

1227
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:19,400
Speaker 1: that you know, by the point that doom happened, like

1228
01:11:19,439 --> 01:11:22,040
Speaker 1: they were all related somehow. So I guess you could

1229
01:11:22,040 --> 01:11:26,599
Speaker 1: say probably a lot of incest depending on how how

1230
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:29,559
Speaker 1: you think of cousins in terms of francest.

1231
01:11:30,280 --> 01:11:34,000
Speaker 2: Okay, may and asks please connect the family tree dots

1232
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:35,920
Speaker 2: from Visaras to Denares.

1233
01:11:36,360 --> 01:11:40,719
Speaker 1: So this is there are some really great family trees

1234
01:11:40,760 --> 01:11:43,599
Speaker 1: online and this is really interesting. So if we start

1235
01:11:43,680 --> 01:11:53,920
Speaker 1: with Visarasu Viceus's daughter is Raniera. Uh, then now spoilers

1236
01:11:54,040 --> 01:11:59,360
Speaker 1: semi spoilers here. Okay, Raniera's there. We've got egg On

1237
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:02,880
Speaker 1: right as king right now concurrent with Raniera, and there's

1238
01:12:02,880 --> 01:12:08,040
Speaker 1: some controversy over who's gonna rule. But later on spoiler

1239
01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:10,800
Speaker 1: spoiler spoiler, don't listen to this if you don't want

1240
01:12:10,840 --> 01:12:14,800
Speaker 1: to know. Uh. Egg On the Third aka Eggon the

1241
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:19,160
Speaker 1: Younger goes and becomes king. You can start listening now,

1242
01:12:19,320 --> 01:12:22,280
Speaker 1: I don't if if you didn't listen, then you can

1243
01:12:22,320 --> 01:12:28,040
Speaker 1: start listening now. He then has a son named Baylor

1244
01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:36,600
Speaker 1: and Darren. Darren then becomes king. He dies during the

1245
01:12:36,640 --> 01:12:42,120
Speaker 1: conquest of Dorn. He's uh, followed by Baylor UH, and

1246
01:12:42,200 --> 01:12:46,559
Speaker 1: then Aggon the Fourth succeeds after Baylor. So those are

1247
01:12:46,640 --> 01:12:51,920
Speaker 1: all the grandsons of Queen Nia, the great grandchildren of Sarahs.

1248
01:12:53,200 --> 01:12:56,559
Speaker 1: Egon the fourth then has a son named Darren the

1249
01:12:56,640 --> 01:13:03,960
Speaker 1: second Uh. Darren the second then has a uh son

1250
01:13:04,080 --> 01:13:10,839
Speaker 1: named Maycar who becomes King Maycar. Uh then has several

1251
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:16,400
Speaker 1: very very interesting sons, including Amon aka measter Amen Targerian,

1252
01:13:16,439 --> 01:13:20,640
Speaker 1: and then the eventual king Egon aka Eggon the fifth.

1253
01:13:21,160 --> 01:13:23,799
Speaker 1: Egg On the fifth then has a son named Jaharis,

1254
01:13:23,800 --> 01:13:27,720
Speaker 1: who's Jaeharis the second. Jaharis the second then has a

1255
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:30,640
Speaker 1: son named Aris, who becomes Aries the second aka the

1256
01:13:30,680 --> 01:13:34,440
Speaker 1: mad King. Aries then has a bunch of children, including

1257
01:13:34,520 --> 01:13:41,120
Speaker 1: Denaris Targarian. So if we go from Visas, that is

1258
01:13:41,240 --> 01:13:47,759
Speaker 1: like the eighth great grandchild. Denaris is the great great

1259
01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:55,120
Speaker 1: great great great great great great granddaughter of King Visaras.

1260
01:13:55,600 --> 01:13:58,200
Speaker 2: So there you have it, okay, Mary Amosques. I've been

1261
01:13:58,240 --> 01:14:00,639
Speaker 2: thinking about the saying, every time at Tagaan is born,

1262
01:14:00,680 --> 01:14:02,760
Speaker 2: the God's toss a coin, does this come up in

1263
01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:03,720
Speaker 2: fire and bloot it tool?

1264
01:14:06,160 --> 01:14:11,760
Speaker 1: It doesn't. That was a quote attributed by barrist and

1265
01:14:11,880 --> 01:14:15,360
Speaker 1: sell me to King Jaharis the Second, the father of

1266
01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:18,160
Speaker 1: the Mad King King Harris. This is when Barriston is

1267
01:14:18,439 --> 01:14:23,240
Speaker 1: explaining to Denaris, you know how her father was actually

1268
01:14:23,320 --> 01:14:28,000
Speaker 1: kind of insane, and the coin flip metaphor is is

1269
01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:32,799
Speaker 1: pretty unfair. There's no doubt that, because of rampant incest,

1270
01:14:32,880 --> 01:14:36,440
Speaker 1: and of course the way immense wealth and power warps

1271
01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:39,720
Speaker 1: a person's moral compass, that the Targerias were really eccentric.

1272
01:14:40,680 --> 01:14:44,400
Speaker 1: But I think only a handful of them were people

1273
01:14:44,479 --> 01:14:49,720
Speaker 1: that you could truly say were mad. Okay. Usually they

1274
01:14:49,760 --> 01:14:52,320
Speaker 1: include King bay Laura K. Baylor the Blessed, who was

1275
01:14:52,439 --> 01:14:56,000
Speaker 1: just an extreme and fervent follower of the faith of

1276
01:14:56,040 --> 01:14:59,840
Speaker 1: the seventy burned books. He like fucking crawled dorn on

1277
01:14:59,840 --> 01:15:04,640
Speaker 1: his hands and knees. He was he was now. I

1278
01:15:04,680 --> 01:15:06,720
Speaker 1: think other people would say maybe he was just very

1279
01:15:06,840 --> 01:15:10,559
Speaker 1: very devout, but certainly that's so. Again, there is one that,

1280
01:15:11,040 --> 01:15:13,200
Speaker 1: depending on how you read it, is either just like

1281
01:15:13,240 --> 01:15:16,880
Speaker 1: a very very extremely devout guy or actually insane. Prince Ragal,

1282
01:15:17,240 --> 01:15:23,040
Speaker 1: son of Darren the second was known to be Madon

1283
01:15:23,439 --> 01:15:27,080
Speaker 1: aka Arion bright Flame, the son of Maycar, brother of

1284
01:15:27,400 --> 01:15:30,400
Speaker 1: a Master Aim and Targarian, brother of Agon the fifth,

1285
01:15:31,080 --> 01:15:35,200
Speaker 1: thought he was a dragon made flesh and wanted to

1286
01:15:35,240 --> 01:15:38,800
Speaker 1: turn himself into a dragon, and decided he would drink

1287
01:15:39,160 --> 01:15:41,400
Speaker 1: wildfire and that would turn him into a dragon, and

1288
01:15:41,479 --> 01:15:44,200
Speaker 1: of course he died. I think you can say canonically

1289
01:15:44,240 --> 01:15:47,479
Speaker 1: that guy was nuts and then of course Aris Targari

1290
01:15:47,560 --> 01:15:53,000
Speaker 1: and the Mad King. So that's like four out of

1291
01:15:53,080 --> 01:15:58,200
Speaker 1: like multiple like you know, out of dozens of Targarians.

1292
01:15:59,040 --> 01:16:02,640
Speaker 1: And I wouldn't throw Helene in there, for instance. So

1293
01:16:03,040 --> 01:16:05,880
Speaker 1: I think that it's a little bit of it's an

1294
01:16:06,000 --> 01:16:11,559
Speaker 1: unfair saying, but not one that was really around during

1295
01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:13,519
Speaker 1: the events that we're watching in House of the Dragon.

1296
01:16:13,560 --> 01:16:14,720
Speaker 1: This would come much much later.

1297
01:16:15,080 --> 01:16:19,040
Speaker 2: Hanna asks, good question, how did Damon and Raniera find

1298
01:16:19,040 --> 01:16:20,759
Speaker 2: out about Luke's death so fast?

1299
01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:24,720
Speaker 1: It's a good question. I don't know. Again, Storm's End

1300
01:16:24,960 --> 01:16:30,519
Speaker 1: is quite close to Dragonstone, like it's it's right there,

1301
01:16:30,560 --> 01:16:35,400
Speaker 1: And I would assume since many, many many people witnessed

1302
01:16:35,439 --> 01:16:40,920
Speaker 1: this the the argument in storms End between aim And

1303
01:16:40,920 --> 01:16:45,800
Speaker 1: and Luke, and you know, it would not take aim

1304
01:16:45,880 --> 01:16:49,360
Speaker 1: And that long to fly back to King's landing and

1305
01:16:49,439 --> 01:16:55,200
Speaker 1: give the news. And also assuming that Damon, as he said,

1306
01:16:55,280 --> 01:17:00,719
Speaker 1: has numerous contacts in the city, that there's a bunch

1307
01:17:00,720 --> 01:17:03,400
Speaker 1: of ways that word could have come. Either through Damon's

1308
01:17:03,400 --> 01:17:06,960
Speaker 1: contacts in the city, watch his various spies, someone that

1309
01:17:07,200 --> 01:17:10,320
Speaker 1: is friendly to them in storms End could have leaked

1310
01:17:10,360 --> 01:17:12,480
Speaker 1: the news. There were just like a lot of witnesses

1311
01:17:12,520 --> 01:17:17,200
Speaker 1: to that. It's unclear, but it's certainly not It's not

1312
01:17:17,800 --> 01:17:20,759
Speaker 1: unthinkable that they would have got that news that quickly.

1313
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:22,759
Speaker 1: That news will spread very very fast.

1314
01:17:23,200 --> 01:17:25,679
Speaker 2: Derek says, I was a little surprised that the Greens

1315
01:17:25,720 --> 01:17:28,680
Speaker 2: offered Aimand as a match for the Barrathian daughter. Was

1316
01:17:28,720 --> 01:17:31,240
Speaker 2: I wrong to perceive that the Barrathians were not really

1317
01:17:31,320 --> 01:17:34,840
Speaker 2: heavy hitters in terms of influence in West Ros. Oh?

1318
01:17:34,920 --> 01:17:36,720
Speaker 1: No, They're big time heavy hitters. They're one of the

1319
01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:42,760
Speaker 1: great houses and meaning the most powerful influential houses in

1320
01:17:42,800 --> 01:17:47,360
Speaker 1: the realm, to which multiple lords you know, swear their

1321
01:17:47,400 --> 01:17:50,720
Speaker 1: allegiance to these great houses. So that's like the Brathians,

1322
01:17:50,840 --> 01:17:55,280
Speaker 1: the Starks, the Aarons, the Lanisters, etc. Like they're a big,

1323
01:17:55,320 --> 01:17:59,080
Speaker 1: big deal and more than that. As we mentioned previously

1324
01:17:59,160 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 1: during our recap, Oris Barathian, who is the founder of

1325
01:18:03,320 --> 01:18:09,040
Speaker 1: House Sparathian, was placed at Storm's End because of Eggon,

1326
01:18:09,120 --> 01:18:11,639
Speaker 1: the conqueror's large s. They were very very very close

1327
01:18:11,680 --> 01:18:16,960
Speaker 1: friends and companions, and Storm's End was formally and for

1328
01:18:17,200 --> 01:18:20,360
Speaker 1: centuries the seat of the Durand and Storm kings, and

1329
01:18:20,400 --> 01:18:24,599
Speaker 1: that line ended during Egon's conquest and Eggon because he's

1330
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:29,240
Speaker 1: a was a good chill. Bro was like, Oris, you're

1331
01:18:29,320 --> 01:18:33,160
Speaker 1: my guy. It's, by the way, rumored that Orris is

1332
01:18:33,360 --> 01:18:36,040
Speaker 1: like a bastard brother to Eggon. Also so may have

1333
01:18:36,080 --> 01:18:40,599
Speaker 1: some Targaran lineage. And so you know, the Barrathians owe

1334
01:18:40,720 --> 01:18:44,040
Speaker 1: a lot to the Targarians, and it's honestly crazy that

1335
01:18:44,200 --> 01:18:48,120
Speaker 1: Boros like repays them like this. But also they're legitimately

1336
01:18:48,160 --> 01:18:50,200
Speaker 1: a big deal. Like they're a very very big deal.

1337
01:18:50,400 --> 01:18:53,640
Speaker 1: End they are a powerful you know, they are the

1338
01:18:53,720 --> 01:18:56,640
Speaker 1: great House that is closest to King's landing, so you

1339
01:18:56,720 --> 01:18:59,120
Speaker 1: definitely want to secure their support if you're at Kingsland.

1340
01:19:00,160 --> 01:19:02,519
Speaker 2: And finally, the Lost ask the Mace. The question of

1341
01:19:02,560 --> 01:19:06,000
Speaker 2: this season comes from Michael, and he says, we know

1342
01:19:06,080 --> 01:19:09,000
Speaker 2: that Danny's baby with cal Drogo was scaled like a dragon.

1343
01:19:09,280 --> 01:19:13,160
Speaker 2: Is there some connection between Targarians and dragons?

1344
01:19:13,920 --> 01:19:19,960
Speaker 1: That's a great question. So Valerian legends said that the

1345
01:19:20,080 --> 01:19:23,040
Speaker 1: dragon lords were quote this is from a world of

1346
01:19:23,080 --> 01:19:26,760
Speaker 1: ice and fire quote descended from dragons and kin to

1347
01:19:26,920 --> 01:19:30,360
Speaker 1: those they now controlled. So that's what the Valerians said

1348
01:19:30,400 --> 01:19:36,360
Speaker 1: about themselves, were that they were somehow like the evolution

1349
01:19:36,560 --> 01:19:39,559
Speaker 1: of dragons. The human evolution of dragons and that they

1350
01:19:39,600 --> 01:19:46,120
Speaker 1: were all somewhat the same. Now you mentioned Danny's stillborn

1351
01:19:46,160 --> 01:19:51,160
Speaker 1: baby from cal Drogo and how it was born. I

1352
01:19:51,200 --> 01:19:53,839
Speaker 1: don't want to say deform, but in this really unique,

1353
01:19:54,080 --> 01:19:56,280
Speaker 1: strange way that certainly makes you think about a dragon

1354
01:19:56,840 --> 01:20:01,200
Speaker 1: Meg or the Cruel Throughout his numerous attempts to have

1355
01:20:01,640 --> 01:20:07,760
Speaker 1: kids and produce an air produced several produced children that

1356
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:10,680
Speaker 1: were deformed in a very similar way. One was described

1357
01:20:10,720 --> 01:20:15,880
Speaker 1: as being eyeless with small wings. So maybe there's something

1358
01:20:15,920 --> 01:20:18,560
Speaker 1: to the legend. Maybe there's something to it, you know that.

1359
01:20:20,360 --> 01:20:23,040
Speaker 1: Certainly we understand that the Targarian blood, and we would

1360
01:20:23,080 --> 01:20:26,360
Speaker 1: imagine the dragon lord blood of old Valaria, was important

1361
01:20:26,600 --> 01:20:31,240
Speaker 1: to why dragons listened to humans. So maybe there is

1362
01:20:31,280 --> 01:20:35,439
Speaker 1: some kind of shared lineage, magical shared lineage that has

1363
01:20:35,520 --> 01:20:41,080
Speaker 1: yet to be revealed. But certainly these very interesting births

1364
01:20:41,520 --> 01:20:45,840
Speaker 1: do suggest that that's it for the last ask the

1365
01:20:45,880 --> 01:20:49,799
Speaker 1: Master of this season. Thank you all for submitted questions.

1366
01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:52,680
Speaker 1: If you're waiting on answers or you didn't get your

1367
01:20:52,760 --> 01:20:54,920
Speaker 1: questions answered, I'm going to be emailing people back over

1368
01:20:54,920 --> 01:20:56,519
Speaker 1: the course of the next few days and weeks, so

1369
01:20:57,240 --> 01:21:01,000
Speaker 1: look for that up next. Hive mind, and we will

1370
01:21:01,040 --> 01:21:04,200
Speaker 1: discuss lore from House to the Dragon when a book centric,

1371
01:21:04,240 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 1: spoiler filled conversation with our good friends from History of

1372
01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:19,280
Speaker 1: west Ross this week, x ray Vision is absolutely delighted

1373
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:24,200
Speaker 1: over the moon to welcome back Aziz and a Shia

1374
01:21:24,320 --> 01:21:26,880
Speaker 1: of History of Westro's pod to discuss the lore of

1375
01:21:27,160 --> 01:21:32,080
Speaker 1: House of the Dragon with a particular focus on stuff

1376
01:21:32,400 --> 01:21:36,080
Speaker 1: that book readers would maybe be interested. This is going

1377
01:21:36,120 --> 01:21:39,040
Speaker 1: to be a book centric conversation. If you don't want

1378
01:21:39,080 --> 01:21:42,559
Speaker 1: to be spoiled on certain things, please feel free to

1379
01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:45,880
Speaker 1: pass this by. But this is going to be bookstuff,

1380
01:21:45,920 --> 01:21:49,120
Speaker 1: book stuff, book stuff, y'all. It's great to see you.

1381
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:51,000
Speaker 1: It's so wonderful to have you here.

1382
01:21:52,120 --> 01:21:54,840
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm so excited, to be honest, My first time

1383
01:21:54,880 --> 01:21:57,840
Speaker 5: as these was on last time, and we've been talking

1384
01:21:57,840 --> 01:22:00,280
Speaker 5: a lot of non spoilery topics on his three of

1385
01:22:00,280 --> 01:22:04,760
Speaker 5: Westros lately, so I'm pretty excited to just all out spoilers.

1386
01:22:04,240 --> 01:22:07,280
Speaker 2: Today anytime we've all been waiting.

1387
01:22:07,960 --> 01:22:10,800
Speaker 1: Before we before we do that. Like your overall impressions,

1388
01:22:10,880 --> 01:22:15,240
Speaker 1: both of you of of the show of what we watched, did,

1389
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:17,000
Speaker 1: what did you think? How's the Dragon? Season one? In

1390
01:22:17,040 --> 01:22:17,439
Speaker 1: the books?

1391
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:21,120
Speaker 6: I didn't I couldn't have dared expected to be as

1392
01:22:21,160 --> 01:22:23,799
Speaker 6: good as it actually turned out to be. I couldn't

1393
01:22:23,800 --> 01:22:25,360
Speaker 6: have gotten my hopes up that high I would have.

1394
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:28,960
Speaker 6: That's just asking to be disappointed, I think so. And

1395
01:22:29,240 --> 01:22:32,479
Speaker 6: when it does deliver above expectations, hey, then you.

1396
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:34,439
Speaker 7: Feel even better about it. And that's that's.

1397
01:22:34,200 --> 01:22:38,599
Speaker 6: Pretty much what happens that low expectations. They came in way, way, way,

1398
01:22:38,640 --> 01:22:42,160
Speaker 6: way above that. So I'm super happy they stuck to

1399
01:22:42,200 --> 01:22:46,679
Speaker 6: the lore pretty well. The changes they made were overwhelmingly good. Yeah,

1400
01:22:46,720 --> 01:22:49,439
Speaker 6: and that gives me faith about what's next.

1401
01:22:49,960 --> 01:22:50,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1402
01:22:50,200 --> 01:22:53,599
Speaker 5: I would say my expansions were pretty low, you know,

1403
01:22:53,680 --> 01:22:55,400
Speaker 5: just because they have to be like as he said,

1404
01:22:56,040 --> 01:22:58,599
Speaker 5: But it just blew me away, how much like character

1405
01:22:58,760 --> 01:23:02,120
Speaker 5: depth that they managed to mine from what is sometimes

1406
01:23:02,400 --> 01:23:05,439
Speaker 5: thinly written characters in Fire and Blood. I love Fire

1407
01:23:05,479 --> 01:23:08,120
Speaker 5: and Blood, but still I feel like they found so

1408
01:23:08,200 --> 01:23:10,559
Speaker 5: much depth there. And I'll say that I do a

1409
01:23:10,680 --> 01:23:14,599
Speaker 5: top sixty shows of each year, right, like the top

1410
01:23:14,640 --> 01:23:16,000
Speaker 5: sixty shows I'm watching this year.

1411
01:23:16,360 --> 01:23:20,519
Speaker 4: This one made the number seven, so game even my top.

1412
01:23:20,320 --> 01:23:26,800
Speaker 1: Ten legio the Faith of the Seven Lucky. So here's

1413
01:23:26,800 --> 01:23:29,519
Speaker 1: a question for all of us. You mentioned the changes,

1414
01:23:29,800 --> 01:23:32,599
Speaker 1: the different things that they did. Obviously, Fire and Blood

1415
01:23:32,640 --> 01:23:35,519
Speaker 1: is written in a very very specific way, different again

1416
01:23:35,680 --> 01:23:40,840
Speaker 1: from the two novellas which also inform this show. You know,

1417
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:46,599
Speaker 1: very dry written as fictional history. What did you make

1418
01:23:47,000 --> 01:23:51,759
Speaker 1: of the changes? And how do you delineate between something

1419
01:23:52,000 --> 01:23:57,040
Speaker 1: like lane or escaping to Essos, which is clearly meant

1420
01:23:57,040 --> 01:23:59,439
Speaker 1: to flesh out what we know in Fire and Blood,

1421
01:23:59,720 --> 01:24:05,880
Speaker 1: and something like uh, you know, Millie erupting through the

1422
01:24:05,880 --> 01:24:08,479
Speaker 1: floor of the Dragon, which is not in the books,

1423
01:24:08,760 --> 01:24:12,240
Speaker 1: but which you would have imagined if it did happen, hundreds,

1424
01:24:12,240 --> 01:24:14,559
Speaker 1: if not thousands, of people would have witnessed it, would

1425
01:24:14,560 --> 01:24:16,559
Speaker 1: have talked about it, et cetera. It's be hard for

1426
01:24:16,600 --> 01:24:19,000
Speaker 1: anyone to miss that one. How do you so, how

1427
01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:24,640
Speaker 1: do you how do you differentiate between an addition and

1428
01:24:24,720 --> 01:24:27,080
Speaker 1: a true change in the things that we saw over

1429
01:24:27,120 --> 01:24:28,240
Speaker 1: the course of the seeing anybody?

1430
01:24:29,479 --> 01:24:31,360
Speaker 6: That's a good That's a great question. For the most part,

1431
01:24:31,360 --> 01:24:36,320
Speaker 6: I try to whenever they overlap well enough, I merge

1432
01:24:36,360 --> 01:24:38,639
Speaker 6: them into one. Right, But as you said, there are

1433
01:24:38,640 --> 01:24:40,720
Speaker 6: someone some you just can't do that with, like the

1434
01:24:40,720 --> 01:24:45,080
Speaker 6: floor exploding. Yeah, that just you're right, there's almost no

1435
01:24:45,160 --> 01:24:47,080
Speaker 6: you can't really conceive it of that not being in

1436
01:24:47,160 --> 01:24:49,760
Speaker 6: the history if it really if it's supposedly happened. So

1437
01:24:49,840 --> 01:24:52,880
Speaker 6: that's that that goes back to something George said and

1438
01:24:53,160 --> 01:24:54,400
Speaker 6: has said, I guess a couple of times he said

1439
01:24:54,439 --> 01:24:57,599
Speaker 6: in an interview with us that there's different cannons, there's

1440
01:24:57,640 --> 01:25:00,880
Speaker 6: just different versions. And that's the case for so many

1441
01:25:00,880 --> 01:25:03,040
Speaker 6: other fandoms. I mean, how many there's lots of cannons

1442
01:25:03,040 --> 01:25:07,280
Speaker 6: for Star Wars Marble right, Like how many Batman movies

1443
01:25:07,280 --> 01:25:08,960
Speaker 6: have there been, So there's more. I mean, even though

1444
01:25:08,960 --> 01:25:12,800
Speaker 6: those are similar, they don't drastically change from one to

1445
01:25:12,800 --> 01:25:15,360
Speaker 6: each other, from one to another like this ultimately isn't

1446
01:25:15,360 --> 01:25:17,400
Speaker 6: a huge change, even though it's like you said, it's

1447
01:25:17,439 --> 01:25:20,640
Speaker 6: hard to imagine how it didn't make the histories. It

1448
01:25:20,680 --> 01:25:22,840
Speaker 6: also just it's taking us to the same place. It's

1449
01:25:22,880 --> 01:25:25,920
Speaker 6: not it's not a big diversion, it's not a branch off.

1450
01:25:26,200 --> 01:25:30,439
Speaker 6: It's just a different bump along the road. So Noah

1451
01:25:30,760 --> 01:25:32,400
Speaker 6: and I like how it sets things up that that

1452
01:25:32,520 --> 01:25:34,839
Speaker 6: particular thing. You know, we've got hatred from the peasants

1453
01:25:34,920 --> 01:25:37,040
Speaker 6: coming and hatred towards the dragons, and.

1454
01:25:36,880 --> 01:25:38,240
Speaker 7: That's all that's all gonna work out.

1455
01:25:38,240 --> 01:25:43,840
Speaker 1: Really well, Oh, that's going to work out tremendously. Yeah. Well, which,

1456
01:25:43,840 --> 01:25:45,960
Speaker 1: by the way, we don't have to be quiet about it.

1457
01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:48,120
Speaker 1: We can actually say what's going to happen is the

1458
01:25:48,160 --> 01:25:53,240
Speaker 1: people are gonna be so furious at dragons that they

1459
01:25:53,240 --> 01:25:56,839
Speaker 1: are going to attempt successfully in many cases, to massacre

1460
01:25:56,960 --> 01:25:59,080
Speaker 1: them in the in the very dragon pit where this

1461
01:25:59,120 --> 01:25:59,760
Speaker 1: event took place.

1462
01:25:59,800 --> 01:26:01,679
Speaker 2: So, like you said, it all leads to the same place.

1463
01:26:01,720 --> 01:26:03,599
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that's been really well set up there.

1464
01:26:03,680 --> 01:26:03,880
Speaker 8: Yeah.

1465
01:26:04,160 --> 01:26:07,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, And you know, Jason mentioned like the contextual additions.

1466
01:26:07,760 --> 01:26:10,320
Speaker 2: Something that I just adored in this show that I

1467
01:26:10,360 --> 01:26:14,559
Speaker 2: was not expecting was like the way that they built

1468
01:26:14,560 --> 01:26:17,720
Speaker 2: out Allison's character arc and kind of changed her from

1469
01:26:17,720 --> 01:26:21,080
Speaker 2: this conniving person to this much more there's a much

1470
01:26:21,120 --> 01:26:25,639
Speaker 2: more like amount of empathy and storytelling there. To tell us,

1471
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:29,519
Speaker 2: what were some of your favorite kind of additions and

1472
01:26:29,560 --> 01:26:32,679
Speaker 2: added context that you weren't kind of expecting to affect

1473
01:26:32,720 --> 01:26:33,679
Speaker 2: you as much as they did.

1474
01:26:34,920 --> 01:26:37,040
Speaker 5: I think you named a great one right there with Allison,

1475
01:26:37,240 --> 01:26:40,160
Speaker 5: for sure, because I think as a book reader going

1476
01:26:40,200 --> 01:26:44,559
Speaker 5: into it, I was primed to be anti Allison going

1477
01:26:44,600 --> 01:26:46,840
Speaker 5: into the show, but I tried, I tried to have

1478
01:26:46,880 --> 01:26:48,240
Speaker 5: an open mind, and she.

1479
01:26:48,200 --> 01:26:53,000
Speaker 7: Was wearing a shirt.

1480
01:26:51,800 --> 01:26:59,599
Speaker 5: I was primed to hate Allison, but regularly Alison did

1481
01:26:59,640 --> 01:27:00,479
Speaker 5: prove me wrong.

1482
01:27:00,520 --> 01:27:03,719
Speaker 4: And I think that was one that really the show

1483
01:27:03,840 --> 01:27:06,240
Speaker 4: added a whole lot. And I'm speaking of Aimen.

1484
01:27:06,360 --> 01:27:08,439
Speaker 5: I am wearing an aim And shirt right now. And

1485
01:27:08,520 --> 01:27:10,200
Speaker 5: I'll say, going into the show, I was not an

1486
01:27:10,200 --> 01:27:10,920
Speaker 5: aim And fan.

1487
01:27:11,680 --> 01:27:13,680
Speaker 4: I wasn't. I didn't read Fire and Blood and go

1488
01:27:13,760 --> 01:27:15,559
Speaker 4: oh yeah, this guy, this is the guy for me.

1489
01:27:16,600 --> 01:27:18,600
Speaker 5: But then I see the show when you see like

1490
01:27:19,160 --> 01:27:21,879
Speaker 5: these levels to the character where like he was bullied

1491
01:27:21,880 --> 01:27:25,120
Speaker 5: as a kid, and I don't know, they there's a

1492
01:27:25,160 --> 01:27:27,400
Speaker 5: lot of context, Like you said that they add to

1493
01:27:27,400 --> 01:27:29,880
Speaker 5: these characters that even when we see like their actions

1494
01:27:29,920 --> 01:27:32,240
Speaker 5: and Fire and Blood, and even if those actions remain

1495
01:27:32,360 --> 01:27:34,440
Speaker 5: the same, knowing.

1496
01:27:34,160 --> 01:27:37,160
Speaker 4: Everything that went on behind the scenes changes it so much.

1497
01:27:37,400 --> 01:27:37,679
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1498
01:27:37,760 --> 01:27:40,800
Speaker 6: Yeah, So it was a really wide open sandbox. They

1499
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:43,640
Speaker 6: had to imagine these characters, and you got to give

1500
01:27:43,680 --> 01:27:47,800
Speaker 6: them a lot of credit for choosing what they did,

1501
01:27:48,120 --> 01:27:50,280
Speaker 6: which worked out so well. Like you said, Ash has

1502
01:27:50,280 --> 01:27:52,040
Speaker 6: said that the characters were so well done. There were

1503
01:27:52,080 --> 01:27:53,679
Speaker 6: so many characters we did not expect to care about.

1504
01:27:53,760 --> 01:27:56,160
Speaker 6: I mean, damon reading Fire and Blood, you may not

1505
01:27:56,240 --> 01:27:57,680
Speaker 6: have loved him or hate him.

1506
01:27:57,680 --> 01:27:58,280
Speaker 7: You knew he was.

1507
01:27:58,200 --> 01:28:00,960
Speaker 6: Going to drive the action be interesting, right that that

1508
01:28:01,080 --> 01:28:04,240
Speaker 6: we could see that coming Visara's you couldn't see him

1509
01:28:04,240 --> 01:28:05,720
Speaker 6: being so interesting necessarily.

1510
01:28:05,920 --> 01:28:11,240
Speaker 5: George did see that coming, like you've pulled one up

1511
01:28:11,360 --> 01:28:12,000
Speaker 5: by the master.

1512
01:28:12,080 --> 01:28:12,280
Speaker 7: There.

1513
01:28:12,320 --> 01:28:13,960
Speaker 6: They really got that one. That's a real feather in

1514
01:28:14,000 --> 01:28:15,920
Speaker 6: their cap. And then yeah, Allison couldn't see that coming

1515
01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:17,400
Speaker 6: as well, aiming like who.

1516
01:28:17,240 --> 01:28:19,200
Speaker 7: Who could predict that? You know, you just can't see

1517
01:28:19,200 --> 01:28:19,519
Speaker 7: that coming.

1518
01:28:19,560 --> 01:28:22,240
Speaker 6: So that's the kind of stuff that was legitimately surprises

1519
01:28:22,280 --> 01:28:24,160
Speaker 6: for us book readers. It was how well they did

1520
01:28:24,160 --> 01:28:27,280
Speaker 6: the characters. Yeah, we're not surprised by vagar chomping air acts.

1521
01:28:27,280 --> 01:28:27,880
Speaker 7: We're not surprised.

1522
01:28:27,920 --> 01:28:30,439
Speaker 6: We're not gonna be surprised when Jace goes down on

1523
01:28:30,479 --> 01:28:32,400
Speaker 6: his dragon in the Battle of the Gullet. You know,

1524
01:28:32,840 --> 01:28:34,639
Speaker 6: we weren't surprised by the Red wedding, you know, at

1525
01:28:34,640 --> 01:28:36,880
Speaker 6: ten years ago whenever that was so. But we were

1526
01:28:37,000 --> 01:28:40,160
Speaker 6: surprised by the things like this, these characters, and that's

1527
01:28:40,280 --> 01:28:41,320
Speaker 6: that's the core of the story.

1528
01:28:41,360 --> 01:28:42,719
Speaker 7: We wanted to be about the characters.

1529
01:28:42,760 --> 01:28:47,200
Speaker 6: The Vaguarre killing a Ax isn't like this incredible historical milestone.

1530
01:28:47,600 --> 01:28:49,760
Speaker 6: It's we care about, like how both sides are going

1531
01:28:49,800 --> 01:28:51,479
Speaker 6: to react to it. I mean, it is an incredible

1532
01:28:51,520 --> 01:28:54,679
Speaker 6: historical milestone, but that's not as important as what Allison

1533
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:57,000
Speaker 6: and Otto and Agon are going to do and what

1534
01:28:57,160 --> 01:29:00,240
Speaker 6: Rainier and Damon and and Jason they're gonna.

1535
01:29:00,240 --> 01:29:04,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, I think the depiction of Visseris

1536
01:29:04,240 --> 01:29:08,880
Speaker 1: and chats to Patty Considine for just an imperial performance.

1537
01:29:09,439 --> 01:29:11,360
Speaker 7: Imperial you know, is.

1538
01:29:12,680 --> 01:29:14,960
Speaker 1: The kind of magic of that character? Is that? I mean,

1539
01:29:14,960 --> 01:29:17,679
Speaker 1: you're absolutely right, Like in the books, it's just he's

1540
01:29:17,680 --> 01:29:19,920
Speaker 1: a weak king period point like that's it. It's very

1541
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:22,679
Speaker 1: cut and dryed. He just was not a strong leader,

1542
01:29:23,120 --> 01:29:26,440
Speaker 1: did not really care to do it, wasn't that interested,

1543
01:29:26,760 --> 01:29:30,679
Speaker 1: and was pretty unplugged from things. Obviously, the show adds

1544
01:29:30,720 --> 01:29:34,240
Speaker 1: a lot of super interesting flesh and blood. He's still

1545
01:29:34,360 --> 01:29:37,000
Speaker 1: kind of disconnected at times, but you understand emotionally where

1546
01:29:37,000 --> 01:29:40,000
Speaker 1: that comes from. And he was essentially maybe the rarest

1547
01:29:40,040 --> 01:29:43,160
Speaker 1: thing in this in Westros, which is like a good

1548
01:29:43,360 --> 01:29:48,960
Speaker 1: honest person. And I was talking to on the official

1549
01:29:49,000 --> 01:29:53,920
Speaker 1: pod we were interviewing Ryan Condall, Greta Johnson and I

1550
01:29:54,040 --> 01:29:57,400
Speaker 1: and Ryan said something interesting which I had never really

1551
01:29:57,439 --> 01:29:59,000
Speaker 1: thought about. I mean, you think about Fire and Blood

1552
01:29:59,000 --> 01:30:02,760
Speaker 1: as being written by the these unreliable fictional historians. But

1553
01:30:02,840 --> 01:30:04,719
Speaker 1: he added this bit of context to which he said,

1554
01:30:05,600 --> 01:30:09,720
Speaker 1: you know, it was written by these unreliable fictional historians

1555
01:30:09,920 --> 01:30:14,400
Speaker 1: who were heavily biased toward the greens. These were green people,

1556
01:30:14,920 --> 01:30:17,479
Speaker 1: And I had never really thought about it that way,

1557
01:30:17,520 --> 01:30:22,400
Speaker 1: And I wonder, thinking about that, does that does that

1558
01:30:22,479 --> 01:30:27,040
Speaker 1: recontextualize anything from this show and from the books now

1559
01:30:27,080 --> 01:30:29,880
Speaker 1: that you kind of think, wow, Like, were these like

1560
01:30:30,040 --> 01:30:33,240
Speaker 1: actually green zelots that were like, of course they would

1561
01:30:33,280 --> 01:30:38,880
Speaker 1: paint Visas as this absolutely meek character and Rania as

1562
01:30:38,920 --> 01:30:42,280
Speaker 1: this like iron handed despot who couldn't wait to like

1563
01:30:42,479 --> 01:30:46,080
Speaker 1: crack down on kings Landing, et cetera. Does that change

1564
01:30:46,080 --> 01:30:47,960
Speaker 1: anything for you? Because I was kind I was like,

1565
01:30:48,160 --> 01:30:52,160
Speaker 1: very very lightly mind blown by that when he said that. Oh.

1566
01:30:52,280 --> 01:30:55,400
Speaker 5: I think in the fandom there's always been this kind

1567
01:30:55,439 --> 01:31:00,639
Speaker 5: of uh perception that that Fire and Blood is anti

1568
01:31:00,800 --> 01:31:04,720
Speaker 5: rain Era is anti that there is that it is

1569
01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:08,639
Speaker 5: colored by that, And but I think more often people

1570
01:31:08,760 --> 01:31:12,160
Speaker 5: are focusing on the anti black part versus the pro

1571
01:31:12,200 --> 01:31:15,120
Speaker 5: green part. Speak to what you're saying, whereas like the

1572
01:31:15,200 --> 01:31:18,080
Speaker 5: fact that because they are pro green, that does mean

1573
01:31:18,200 --> 01:31:24,160
Speaker 5: that Viseris is colored differently, So yeah, I would agree

1574
01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:27,760
Speaker 5: with that with that take for sure. But I also

1575
01:31:27,920 --> 01:31:32,840
Speaker 5: think that they're also anti They say some anti Green

1576
01:31:33,000 --> 01:31:35,400
Speaker 5: things as well in it, because I think it as

1577
01:31:35,479 --> 01:31:37,880
Speaker 5: much as they're pro Green or anti Black, they're also

1578
01:31:38,000 --> 01:31:41,880
Speaker 5: kind of just biased masters against. Yes, they're kind of

1579
01:31:42,400 --> 01:31:45,479
Speaker 5: biased against women in general, Like even though Island is

1580
01:31:45,520 --> 01:31:48,719
Speaker 5: like the Queen, they're still biased against Alison as a Green.

1581
01:31:48,720 --> 01:31:51,519
Speaker 6: And I guess is my point, I would agree with

1582
01:31:51,520 --> 01:31:53,559
Speaker 6: that it's it is, it has a different set of biases.

1583
01:31:53,560 --> 01:31:56,559
Speaker 6: It's it's maybe more biased against the Blacks, and it

1584
01:31:56,600 --> 01:32:00,559
Speaker 6: is pro the Greens, you know, because the the Green

1585
01:32:00,640 --> 01:32:02,920
Speaker 6: faction did cause a lot of trouble even back at

1586
01:32:03,400 --> 01:32:06,320
Speaker 6: back at High Tower Land where the Citadel is next door,

1587
01:32:06,400 --> 01:32:08,960
Speaker 6: which explains a lot of the influence right away. There

1588
01:32:09,600 --> 01:32:11,920
Speaker 6: is you know, there's there's I'm sure there's some bad

1589
01:32:11,960 --> 01:32:14,240
Speaker 6: feeling around there because a lot of their own vassals

1590
01:32:14,240 --> 01:32:17,040
Speaker 6: turned against them. So it can't just be straight up propaganda,

1591
01:32:17,080 --> 01:32:19,720
Speaker 6: because it might have been and other circumstances, it might

1592
01:32:19,720 --> 01:32:22,519
Speaker 6: have been straight up like rewriting history entirely if they

1593
01:32:22,520 --> 01:32:26,240
Speaker 6: had had an overwhelming victory, you know they had taken

1594
01:32:26,280 --> 01:32:28,200
Speaker 6: the crown and want easily they could have, they would

1595
01:32:28,240 --> 01:32:30,880
Speaker 6: have directed the historical narrative even more. But I think

1596
01:32:30,920 --> 01:32:32,720
Speaker 6: they didn't have that kind of leeway here. And that's

1597
01:32:32,760 --> 01:32:35,280
Speaker 6: great writing because it fits with the level of victory,

1598
01:32:35,320 --> 01:32:37,320
Speaker 6: Like if it had been propaganda, that would be like, well,

1599
01:32:37,360 --> 01:32:39,479
Speaker 6: how did they get away with this when? But you

1600
01:32:39,520 --> 01:32:42,360
Speaker 6: do see minor things like not counting Raynira as having

1601
01:32:42,400 --> 01:32:44,719
Speaker 6: been queen, Like that's a pretty good example, a pretty

1602
01:32:44,720 --> 01:32:48,240
Speaker 6: strong example right there that well they didn't make everybody

1603
01:32:48,280 --> 01:32:50,960
Speaker 6: good guys, but they you know, these important big things

1604
01:32:50,960 --> 01:32:52,520
Speaker 6: were omitted permanently.

1605
01:32:53,080 --> 01:32:55,400
Speaker 2: Yeah. One of the things that I'm really interested in

1606
01:32:55,600 --> 01:32:57,920
Speaker 2: specifically from the finale, and I'd love to kind of

1607
01:32:58,120 --> 01:33:00,519
Speaker 2: get your thoughts on it. You mentioned like Aiman's journey

1608
01:33:00,520 --> 01:33:02,280
Speaker 2: and the way that it fleshes him out in the

1609
01:33:02,280 --> 01:33:04,200
Speaker 2: cider of him being like a bullying victim who has

1610
01:33:04,240 --> 01:33:07,360
Speaker 2: then gone on to found his power. They do this

1611
01:33:07,520 --> 01:33:11,880
Speaker 2: really heartbreaking thing in the finale where they have this

1612
01:33:12,040 --> 01:33:15,760
Speaker 2: change where it's not this intentional killing to start a war,

1613
01:33:15,880 --> 01:33:21,519
Speaker 2: it is an accident of an egotistical kind of child

1614
01:33:21,560 --> 01:33:24,080
Speaker 2: trying to get his revenge. How do you feel like

1615
01:33:24,640 --> 01:33:26,599
Speaker 2: knowing what you know, his book readers and stuff that's

1616
01:33:26,640 --> 01:33:31,800
Speaker 2: gonna shape his journey as we move forward, that specific change,

1617
01:33:31,840 --> 01:33:33,000
Speaker 2: And did you like the change?

1618
01:33:33,800 --> 01:33:33,880
Speaker 1: What?

1619
01:33:34,120 --> 01:33:35,840
Speaker 5: I really like the change because I feel like it's

1620
01:33:35,840 --> 01:33:39,400
Speaker 5: a change that gives nuance to Aimen's character without absolving him, right,

1621
01:33:39,520 --> 01:33:42,960
Speaker 5: Like he's not it's not just a misunderstanding. Right, He's

1622
01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:47,120
Speaker 5: still he's still committed manslaughter, Like he still killed this kid,

1623
01:33:47,400 --> 01:33:48,519
Speaker 5: like he's still culpable for it.

1624
01:33:48,600 --> 01:33:48,920
Speaker 1: Whatever.

1625
01:33:49,280 --> 01:33:53,040
Speaker 5: But addressing your other part of your question for me,

1626
01:33:53,200 --> 01:33:55,880
Speaker 5: knowing that, like the history books have it down as

1627
01:33:55,960 --> 01:33:58,559
Speaker 5: aim And killed him and he was going into it

1628
01:33:58,600 --> 01:34:00,519
Speaker 5: and all that. So to me, that points to the

1629
01:34:00,520 --> 01:34:02,759
Speaker 5: idea that Amon is going to own this, that Amon

1630
01:34:02,880 --> 01:34:05,040
Speaker 5: is gonna as Asese put it to me, he said,

1631
01:34:05,080 --> 01:34:09,240
Speaker 5: it's better to be evil than incompetent. The general idea

1632
01:34:09,360 --> 01:34:11,720
Speaker 5: is that Amon's gonna be like, well, I didn't mean

1633
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:13,760
Speaker 5: to do this. I didn't mean to be a kinselayer,

1634
01:34:13,880 --> 01:34:16,320
Speaker 5: but I no one's gonna believe me anyways. I think

1635
01:34:16,320 --> 01:34:18,720
Speaker 5: he has to own it. So my big question is

1636
01:34:19,320 --> 01:34:22,240
Speaker 5: who Aimond would tell the truth to, Like will he

1637
01:34:22,360 --> 01:34:25,639
Speaker 5: tell Allison? Will he tell his mother or Auto or Egon?

1638
01:34:25,880 --> 01:34:29,280
Speaker 7: Like Alice Rivers or Alice exactly.

1639
01:34:29,360 --> 01:34:31,120
Speaker 1: All I was going to say is it's going to

1640
01:34:31,200 --> 01:34:33,080
Speaker 1: be Alice Rivers, right.

1641
01:34:33,400 --> 01:34:35,599
Speaker 5: I feel like we'll right, We'll see him open up

1642
01:34:35,640 --> 01:34:38,280
Speaker 5: to That's what I would like to see, is Amond

1643
01:34:38,640 --> 01:34:39,759
Speaker 5: confess this to someone.

1644
01:34:39,800 --> 01:34:43,240
Speaker 1: I suppose, well, they kind of have planted the seed

1645
01:34:43,560 --> 01:34:48,960
Speaker 1: of you know Amens, Yeah, you know, the kind of

1646
01:34:49,640 --> 01:34:53,840
Speaker 1: physical side of him in terms of like relationships, sexual relationships,

1647
01:34:53,840 --> 01:34:56,760
Speaker 1: and you know, earlier in this in the season, and

1648
01:34:56,840 --> 01:34:58,519
Speaker 1: this is the penunciate episode when he goes to the

1649
01:34:58,560 --> 01:35:01,920
Speaker 1: brothel and they recognize their remember him, and there's clearly

1650
01:35:02,000 --> 01:35:06,200
Speaker 1: something that's setting off in his mind about that. I

1651
01:35:06,240 --> 01:35:11,960
Speaker 1: could really see him telling Alice what what actually happened

1652
01:35:12,320 --> 01:35:17,360
Speaker 1: and on that I were you. First of all, the

1653
01:35:17,720 --> 01:35:21,720
Speaker 1: entire situation reminded me a little bit of the kind

1654
01:35:21,720 --> 01:35:25,639
Speaker 1: of tragedy of Jamie Lanister in that like, here's this

1655
01:35:26,120 --> 01:35:29,760
Speaker 1: thing that nobody, nobody really understands the truth of it,

1656
01:35:29,840 --> 01:35:31,960
Speaker 1: and now he's going to be painted with this name,

1657
01:35:32,320 --> 01:35:36,000
Speaker 1: which he does deserve, but not in the He's not

1658
01:35:36,160 --> 01:35:39,720
Speaker 1: a kinslayer in the way everybody thinks he. I wouldn't say,

1659
01:35:39,720 --> 01:35:44,560
Speaker 1: absolve him purely like he he's he incited that situation,

1660
01:35:44,920 --> 01:35:46,600
Speaker 1: He made it happen. He didn't have to get on

1661
01:35:46,640 --> 01:35:48,880
Speaker 1: his fucking dragon and chase him. He did, but he.

1662
01:35:48,960 --> 01:35:50,759
Speaker 2: Did try and stop him. That's the big.

1663
01:35:52,360 --> 01:35:56,519
Speaker 1: Which which brings me to this, which is how does

1664
01:35:57,320 --> 01:36:03,959
Speaker 1: I had not thought about dragons as being active decision

1665
01:36:04,040 --> 01:36:08,000
Speaker 1: makers in this story as they clearly are in that scene,

1666
01:36:08,040 --> 01:36:11,240
Speaker 1: Like it changes the way I look at it a little,

1667
01:36:11,479 --> 01:36:13,160
Speaker 1: and even the way I look at the you know,

1668
01:36:13,200 --> 01:36:16,439
Speaker 1: that confrontation on Dragonstone earlier in the finale, when it

1669
01:36:16,520 --> 01:36:20,840
Speaker 1: was like oh yeah, like Syrix kind of wanted to go,

1670
01:36:21,120 --> 01:36:23,559
Speaker 1: like si Rex was like roaring back there and was

1671
01:36:23,640 --> 01:36:28,879
Speaker 1: kind of ready for it, and you know, Aras clearly

1672
01:36:29,000 --> 01:36:33,200
Speaker 1: against Luke's wishes, went and fired that little blast of

1673
01:36:33,240 --> 01:36:36,599
Speaker 1: flame at Vagar and Aiman and then Aimon you know,

1674
01:36:36,840 --> 01:36:39,280
Speaker 1: tried to get Vagar to stand down and couldn't get

1675
01:36:39,320 --> 01:36:41,120
Speaker 1: them to do it, couldn't get her to do it.

1676
01:36:42,280 --> 01:36:45,720
Speaker 1: What do you think about this idea now where the

1677
01:36:45,840 --> 01:36:49,320
Speaker 1: dragons are these you know, our active participants in a

1678
01:36:49,360 --> 01:36:51,839
Speaker 1: way that we did not expect in this story.

1679
01:36:52,800 --> 01:36:54,760
Speaker 5: You know what it makes me think of first is

1680
01:36:55,120 --> 01:36:57,479
Speaker 5: we're going to see the dragon seeds right and right

1681
01:36:57,600 --> 01:37:00,559
Speaker 5: those dragon seeds are going to be writers of Vermathor

1682
01:37:00,640 --> 01:37:03,520
Speaker 5: and silver Wing, who you would imagine as the dragons

1683
01:37:03,520 --> 01:37:07,160
Speaker 5: of Jaharis and Alisan. Those two dragons have to be

1684
01:37:07,680 --> 01:37:12,679
Speaker 5: pretty close, pretty bonded, I would assume, And so that's

1685
01:37:12,720 --> 01:37:16,280
Speaker 5: where my mind goes first, is the idea of these

1686
01:37:16,400 --> 01:37:18,720
Speaker 5: the dragons who are close to one another, and the

1687
01:37:18,720 --> 01:37:21,559
Speaker 5: idea of them ever having to fight near one another.

1688
01:37:21,600 --> 01:37:22,000
Speaker 4: I guess what.

1689
01:37:22,040 --> 01:37:26,040
Speaker 6: About Yeah, I think I definitely agree with that, And there,

1690
01:37:26,080 --> 01:37:30,240
Speaker 6: when the concept was thrust more in our faces in

1691
01:37:30,320 --> 01:37:33,120
Speaker 6: the show, we realize that there are some pretty solid

1692
01:37:33,160 --> 01:37:36,480
Speaker 6: examples from the books as well, like the most overwhelming

1693
01:37:36,600 --> 01:37:40,240
Speaker 6: being Araea and Valerian right in the time of Septin,

1694
01:37:40,280 --> 01:37:44,360
Speaker 6: Barth and j Harris and alisand but also Cyrax when

1695
01:37:44,400 --> 01:37:48,000
Speaker 6: Geoffrey tries to mount her in fire Blood and Perhaps

1696
01:37:48,240 --> 01:37:51,320
Speaker 6: and Denaris just drogon going where he wants.

1697
01:37:51,320 --> 01:37:54,040
Speaker 7: She doesn't have control. She gradually lures to control him.

1698
01:37:54,320 --> 01:37:57,000
Speaker 6: First, he's doing what he wants, and that kind of

1699
01:37:57,000 --> 01:37:59,639
Speaker 6: implies that there may be another time where he goes

1700
01:37:59,680 --> 01:38:02,240
Speaker 6: does what once any dog owner, for.

1701
01:38:02,200 --> 01:38:05,240
Speaker 7: The most like a squirrel runs.

1702
01:38:05,040 --> 01:38:08,080
Speaker 6: Past and the dog just jerks you like they want

1703
01:38:08,080 --> 01:38:10,800
Speaker 6: to run after that squirrel. Like, it's the same basic thing,

1704
01:38:10,920 --> 01:38:13,200
Speaker 6: except this is a gigantic monster.

1705
01:38:13,600 --> 01:38:16,680
Speaker 7: Like, by the way, it's hilarious that the way a

1706
01:38:16,720 --> 01:38:16,960
Speaker 7: lot of.

1707
01:38:16,920 --> 01:38:24,439
Speaker 6: People are personifying Vagar, they're like, Okay, giant, uncontrollable, murderous lizard, Grandma,

1708
01:38:24,720 --> 01:38:32,000
Speaker 6: that's what grandma. Like what it's like, actually, okay, angry Grandma. Right,

1709
01:38:32,040 --> 01:38:34,960
Speaker 6: I guess I could kind of see that. I love,

1710
01:38:35,160 --> 01:38:37,000
Speaker 6: But I love the idea. I love the plot in general,

1711
01:38:37,040 --> 01:38:38,760
Speaker 6: the idea that they're not in control. It was set

1712
01:38:38,840 --> 01:38:41,479
Speaker 6: up really well with Visara saying we control the dragons

1713
01:38:41,560 --> 01:38:43,880
Speaker 6: is an illusion. All throughout the season, they've had like

1714
01:38:44,200 --> 01:38:47,640
Speaker 6: little hints of Dragon and Rider having a bond, like

1715
01:38:47,640 --> 01:38:50,200
Speaker 6: when Damon is hit by the fire arrow, when Rainier

1716
01:38:50,280 --> 01:38:55,040
Speaker 6: is giving birth, uh, and other ones. There's other examples

1717
01:38:55,040 --> 01:38:56,280
Speaker 6: that I'm not thinking of, but y'all know what I'm

1718
01:38:56,280 --> 01:38:57,920
Speaker 6: talking about. There's plenty of little ones, and then they

1719
01:38:57,920 --> 01:38:59,760
Speaker 6: get bigger and bigger. In this last episode they were

1720
01:38:59,800 --> 01:39:01,960
Speaker 6: like five of them. So they're really just like hitting

1721
01:39:02,040 --> 01:39:04,560
Speaker 6: us with that, presumably because there's a lot more of

1722
01:39:04,640 --> 01:39:06,720
Speaker 6: it coming in the future seasons.

1723
01:39:07,000 --> 01:39:09,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, okay, so this I kind of touched on this.

1724
01:39:09,800 --> 01:39:11,800
Speaker 2: This was a I'd love to know if you think

1725
01:39:11,840 --> 01:39:14,320
Speaker 2: if you can think of any examples of this. So,

1726
01:39:14,640 --> 01:39:17,439
Speaker 2: one of our listeners, Whitney who I who I shouted out,

1727
01:39:17,640 --> 01:39:22,639
Speaker 2: had messaged me after seeing Damon singing to Vermathor and

1728
01:39:22,680 --> 01:39:26,000
Speaker 2: the lyrics of the song being about this three headed dragon,

1729
01:39:26,080 --> 01:39:30,479
Speaker 2: and is there any examples of somebody bonding with two

1730
01:39:30,560 --> 01:39:33,600
Speaker 2: dragons and using blood magic to do it, because I

1731
01:39:33,640 --> 01:39:36,280
Speaker 2: feel like that that was Whitney's idea of what Damon

1732
01:39:36,360 --> 01:39:38,680
Speaker 2: may have been doing after the death of Visenya.

1733
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:43,160
Speaker 6: Well, there's no there's no examples of one person bonded

1734
01:39:43,200 --> 01:39:45,880
Speaker 6: to two dragons, though there is a reference in Fire

1735
01:39:45,920 --> 01:39:49,920
Speaker 6: and Blood of a time when Lena took ship and

1736
01:39:50,040 --> 01:39:55,519
Speaker 6: Damon brought both his dragon and Vagar somehow was commanded

1737
01:39:55,520 --> 01:39:57,679
Speaker 6: to follow him, so there was some way they got

1738
01:39:57,680 --> 01:40:01,040
Speaker 6: that to work. But that is a a bond, that's

1739
01:40:01,120 --> 01:40:03,960
Speaker 6: just a command. So but ashe had a really good

1740
01:40:04,000 --> 01:40:06,920
Speaker 6: idea of what this scene was setting up in terms

1741
01:40:06,920 --> 01:40:10,920
Speaker 6: of the dragon seeds and what's coming, Yeah, I kind.

1742
01:40:10,720 --> 01:40:12,920
Speaker 4: Of feel like Damon is trying to.

1743
01:40:14,479 --> 01:40:17,880
Speaker 5: Trying to get Vermothor and the other dragons more used

1744
01:40:17,920 --> 01:40:20,479
Speaker 5: to people, to kind of get them.

1745
01:40:20,360 --> 01:40:22,000
Speaker 4: Ready to be written to be tamed.

1746
01:40:22,080 --> 01:40:23,840
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's been like it might have been like twenty

1747
01:40:23,880 --> 01:40:27,679
Speaker 5: thirty years since anyone rode Vermothor. He might think, hey,

1748
01:40:28,680 --> 01:40:31,280
Speaker 5: people will have a better shot at taming this dragon

1749
01:40:31,360 --> 01:40:34,880
Speaker 5: if I've been coming and singing to Vermothor. And again,

1750
01:40:35,000 --> 01:40:38,160
Speaker 5: maybe he's thinking of his daughter Rayna specifically or whatever,

1751
01:40:38,280 --> 01:40:42,080
Speaker 5: but he's maybe trying to ease the path there, So

1752
01:40:42,160 --> 01:40:46,320
Speaker 5: like he is cultivating a human and dragon bond, but

1753
01:40:46,479 --> 01:40:49,439
Speaker 5: in the pursuit of someone else actually bonding the dragon.

1754
01:40:49,520 --> 01:40:49,840
Speaker 4: I guess it.

1755
01:40:52,040 --> 01:40:55,200
Speaker 1: It's really cool, and we've already you know, we're already

1756
01:40:56,280 --> 01:41:00,479
Speaker 1: it's already been foreshadowed for us to think about these

1757
01:41:01,360 --> 01:41:03,240
Speaker 1: Targary and bastards. You know, where they go to the

1758
01:41:04,200 --> 01:41:06,920
Speaker 1: Children's fight club in Flea Bottom and the scene out

1759
01:41:06,960 --> 01:41:11,960
Speaker 1: of Eggon's bastards down there horrifying. So certainly, you know,

1760
01:41:12,720 --> 01:41:16,280
Speaker 1: we should presume that there's any number of Targary and

1761
01:41:16,800 --> 01:41:22,200
Speaker 1: Bastards running around both kings Landing and you know, Driftmark

1762
01:41:22,200 --> 01:41:26,280
Speaker 1: and Dragonstone. I was thinking about like season two and

1763
01:41:26,320 --> 01:41:28,960
Speaker 1: what events from the books we might see in season two,

1764
01:41:29,000 --> 01:41:34,320
Speaker 1: and when you know, Jase is heading off to the

1765
01:41:34,360 --> 01:41:38,080
Speaker 1: north eventually to go treat with craigin Stark. That's gonna

1766
01:41:38,080 --> 01:41:43,200
Speaker 1: be fun, but you know it, George says he wants

1767
01:41:43,200 --> 01:41:48,920
Speaker 1: four seasons. Certainly, the appearance of the Northmen doesn't really

1768
01:41:49,000 --> 01:41:52,559
Speaker 1: occur until the war is basically like winding down at

1769
01:41:52,560 --> 01:41:57,000
Speaker 1: that point. So do you think there's any way where

1770
01:41:57,200 --> 01:41:59,200
Speaker 1: where they speed that up. I guess we're gonna meet

1771
01:41:59,240 --> 01:42:02,960
Speaker 1: Craig and Stark. Would imagine next season that's absolutely gonna happen.

1772
01:42:03,439 --> 01:42:06,280
Speaker 1: But in terms of like the Starks and the North

1773
01:42:06,320 --> 01:42:09,320
Speaker 1: in general joining the Fray, do you think we see

1774
01:42:09,320 --> 01:42:10,080
Speaker 1: that next season?

1775
01:42:11,400 --> 01:42:15,800
Speaker 6: Well, we have the advanced army of Roddy the Ruin,

1776
01:42:15,880 --> 01:42:19,200
Speaker 6: which that they might tweak and make a Stark or

1777
01:42:19,200 --> 01:42:22,120
Speaker 6: something in charge of that, maybe Uncle, maybe, rather than

1778
01:42:22,160 --> 01:42:23,880
Speaker 6: using Roddy. I think they'll probably just still stick with

1779
01:42:23,920 --> 01:42:27,040
Speaker 6: Roddy the Ruin, but they might use a different leader,

1780
01:42:27,400 --> 01:42:29,360
Speaker 6: maybe someone who to me to bring the Starks or

1781
01:42:29,400 --> 01:42:32,800
Speaker 6: some more familiar house in. It will be wild to

1782
01:42:32,840 --> 01:42:34,519
Speaker 6: have it be like a car Stark or a Bolton

1783
01:42:34,600 --> 01:42:38,840
Speaker 6: or a Mandolin rather than a Dustin, because the Dustins

1784
01:42:38,880 --> 01:42:40,760
Speaker 6: aren't very well known, they are just as prominent. Like

1785
01:42:40,760 --> 01:42:42,080
Speaker 6: the dozen terms of the history of the North of

1786
01:42:42,080 --> 01:42:43,640
Speaker 6: the dozens are just as prominent as their names, but

1787
01:42:43,680 --> 01:42:45,840
Speaker 6: they're definitely not as familiar to TV viewers, so they

1788
01:42:45,920 --> 01:42:47,160
Speaker 6: might make a small tweak there.

1789
01:42:48,360 --> 01:42:49,360
Speaker 7: But I know it's.

1790
01:42:49,240 --> 01:42:51,360
Speaker 6: Gonna be exciting to bring the North back into Fans

1791
01:42:51,400 --> 01:42:54,960
Speaker 6: are going to be so excited to sell. People are

1792
01:42:55,000 --> 01:42:58,880
Speaker 6: gonna love Kriggin. They're gonna love it, And Sarah Snow

1793
01:42:59,000 --> 01:43:00,360
Speaker 6: is going to be really interesting too. That's the when

1794
01:43:00,400 --> 01:43:02,839
Speaker 6: they have a lot more room to develop a story

1795
01:43:02,880 --> 01:43:04,040
Speaker 6: that that it's hard to.

1796
01:43:04,000 --> 01:43:04,720
Speaker 7: Imagine for us.

1797
01:43:04,720 --> 01:43:06,840
Speaker 6: It's like, well, there's some certain elements we can pick

1798
01:43:06,880 --> 01:43:08,720
Speaker 6: at and kind of feel like they're going.

1799
01:43:08,720 --> 01:43:09,200
Speaker 7: To use that.

1800
01:43:09,320 --> 01:43:11,400
Speaker 5: But yeah, but they I think they set up Yeah,

1801
01:43:11,439 --> 01:43:15,920
Speaker 5: the Jace is sojourn with the the Starks really well.

1802
01:43:16,000 --> 01:43:20,680
Speaker 5: With how much they've shown Jace is aware of his bastardy, right,

1803
01:43:21,360 --> 01:43:24,200
Speaker 5: he is aware it weighs on him, So I can't.

1804
01:43:24,200 --> 01:43:26,040
Speaker 5: I just feel like there's so much room for them

1805
01:43:26,080 --> 01:43:29,000
Speaker 5: to show Jace in winter Fell and he meets this

1806
01:43:29,120 --> 01:43:32,280
Speaker 5: bastard girl and he has a bond with her and

1807
01:43:32,280 --> 01:43:34,720
Speaker 5: doesn't judge her as much because he knows he is.

1808
01:43:34,880 --> 01:43:37,680
Speaker 5: Like if I had been wondering whether I thought they

1809
01:43:37,680 --> 01:43:42,320
Speaker 5: would do Sarah snow or not, I those any reservations

1810
01:43:42,360 --> 01:43:46,719
Speaker 5: disappeared once they like really seem to emphasize Jace caring

1811
01:43:46,760 --> 01:43:47,360
Speaker 5: about this.

1812
01:43:47,320 --> 01:43:56,559
Speaker 1: I mean double date Alice and Jason Sarah and just

1813
01:43:56,600 --> 01:43:58,080
Speaker 1: like iron this out.

1814
01:43:59,760 --> 01:44:03,440
Speaker 6: They find a partner that matches part of their pathos,

1815
01:44:03,479 --> 01:44:06,880
Speaker 6: like Yeah, finds an older woman, Jays finds another bastard,

1816
01:44:08,160 --> 01:44:11,320
Speaker 6: and then and they both get to bond over like

1817
01:44:11,800 --> 01:44:17,000
Speaker 6: they're family members dying all around them, trauma bonding.

1818
01:44:17,800 --> 01:44:24,439
Speaker 2: Yes, how romantic with kind of like the context of

1819
01:44:24,680 --> 01:44:29,679
Speaker 2: this season having happened, You've had those expectations kind of raised. Obviously,

1820
01:44:29,800 --> 01:44:32,479
Speaker 2: always good to keep them low, even especially after something

1821
01:44:32,520 --> 01:44:35,599
Speaker 2: good like this. But is there a kind of quiet

1822
01:44:35,640 --> 01:44:39,120
Speaker 2: moment or a character that you wouldn't necessarily have expected

1823
01:44:39,160 --> 01:44:41,320
Speaker 2: to see in season two that you now feel like

1824
01:44:41,520 --> 01:44:44,680
Speaker 2: they might pick up or do justice too, or kind

1825
01:44:44,720 --> 01:44:47,200
Speaker 2: of build out in that way, And obviously Jason to

1826
01:44:47,240 --> 01:44:47,599
Speaker 2: you too.

1827
01:44:47,720 --> 01:44:51,639
Speaker 5: Yeah, Okay, So for me, I still have to keep

1828
01:44:51,680 --> 01:44:54,599
Speaker 5: my hopes slow because I've been through this before, I know.

1829
01:44:55,920 --> 01:45:00,120
Speaker 5: But I really really love the characters of sc and

1830
01:45:00,160 --> 01:45:03,840
Speaker 5: Sylvana sand who were the mothers of Game and Pale Hair,

1831
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:06,839
Speaker 5: and they've set up Game and Pale Hair with referring

1832
01:45:06,880 --> 01:45:11,040
Speaker 5: to how Aigen has multiple bastards, So I feel like

1833
01:45:11,040 --> 01:45:13,920
Speaker 5: they're setting it up. I feel like with Mazaria talking

1834
01:45:13,920 --> 01:45:16,960
Speaker 5: about the power of the people, they're also setting it up.

1835
01:45:17,560 --> 01:45:21,519
Speaker 5: But I won't believe I get my progressive lesbian mothers

1836
01:45:21,600 --> 01:45:24,080
Speaker 5: until I actually see them on screen. I guess like

1837
01:45:24,240 --> 01:45:26,479
Speaker 5: I won't believe until I see it. But those are

1838
01:45:26,479 --> 01:45:29,440
Speaker 5: the ones that I There were a couple character beats

1839
01:45:29,160 --> 01:45:31,400
Speaker 5: in season one that made me like, well.

1840
01:45:31,560 --> 01:45:34,320
Speaker 4: Maybe it's gonna happen. Maybe we will get them.

1841
01:45:34,479 --> 01:45:36,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, this is a great question. If I had more

1842
01:45:36,920 --> 01:45:38,519
Speaker 6: time to think about it, I might give another answer,

1843
01:45:38,560 --> 01:45:40,800
Speaker 6: but a good one popped into head, so I'm gonna

1844
01:45:40,840 --> 01:45:43,320
Speaker 6: roll with it. In it's Mouse, which is the mother

1845
01:45:43,520 --> 01:45:49,000
Speaker 6: of Adam Valarian and Alan Valarian. Adam of course ends

1846
01:45:49,040 --> 01:45:52,360
Speaker 6: up being the writer of Sea Smoke, and Alan Valarian

1847
01:45:52,400 --> 01:45:54,599
Speaker 6: of course ends up being oken Fish, so he's pretty famous,

1848
01:45:54,600 --> 01:45:56,599
Speaker 6: although I don't know that they'll develop him a whole

1849
01:45:56,600 --> 01:45:59,920
Speaker 6: lot in this show because his role is pretty minor,

1850
01:46:00,479 --> 01:46:03,960
Speaker 6: but his brother not role is huge. So that's having

1851
01:46:04,040 --> 01:46:08,879
Speaker 6: her involvement in this being the mother of those children

1852
01:46:08,960 --> 01:46:11,720
Speaker 6: whose father they may have to lie about because if

1853
01:46:11,720 --> 01:46:14,160
Speaker 6: they're gonna say it's lean Or, but it's probably actually

1854
01:46:14,240 --> 01:46:18,840
Speaker 6: core Leice, and well that presents its own sort of

1855
01:46:19,840 --> 01:46:24,200
Speaker 6: second level of fake airs kind of situation that falls

1856
01:46:24,280 --> 01:46:26,519
Speaker 6: back a lot of the same stuff from Rainierra and

1857
01:46:26,600 --> 01:46:29,360
Speaker 6: Vymond and all this other stuff. And so she's gonna

1858
01:46:29,360 --> 01:46:30,479
Speaker 6: be caught in the middle of that. She's got to

1859
01:46:30,520 --> 01:46:33,400
Speaker 6: like agreed to this lie so her children can advance.

1860
01:46:33,479 --> 01:46:35,800
Speaker 6: It's this very similar kind of scenario, I guess. But

1861
01:46:35,920 --> 01:46:37,280
Speaker 6: there's a lot of ways they could play it. They

1862
01:46:37,280 --> 01:46:39,760
Speaker 6: could kind of not do it. They could just not

1863
01:46:39,800 --> 01:46:43,280
Speaker 6: even include her at all potentially, So it's a real

1864
01:46:43,320 --> 01:46:44,920
Speaker 6: wide range of possibilities there.

1865
01:46:47,200 --> 01:46:51,040
Speaker 1: Thinking about season two again, I wonder if there are

1866
01:46:51,080 --> 01:46:55,200
Speaker 1: any events that you think for sure we will see this,

1867
01:46:55,479 --> 01:46:59,280
Speaker 1: Like I feel like Blood and Cheese it's going to

1868
01:46:59,360 --> 01:47:02,800
Speaker 1: happen right like they've been foreshadowing it. I mean, I

1869
01:47:03,000 --> 01:47:09,599
Speaker 1: I read the prominent shots of rats running throughout the

1870
01:47:09,640 --> 01:47:14,000
Speaker 1: castle as foreshadowing of the appearance of Blood and Cheese

1871
01:47:14,000 --> 01:47:15,639
Speaker 1: and the fact that these rats are out of control,

1872
01:47:15,640 --> 01:47:18,680
Speaker 1: they're running through the passageways. Who's controlling them is this

1873
01:47:18,840 --> 01:47:22,439
Speaker 1: rat catcher who just guess what, knows how to move

1874
01:47:22,479 --> 01:47:24,639
Speaker 1: around these passageways, So I feel like we're gonna see

1875
01:47:24,680 --> 01:47:28,160
Speaker 1: that battle is a gullet you feel like we have

1876
01:47:28,240 --> 01:47:30,640
Speaker 1: to see. Are there anyones that that you feel like

1877
01:47:31,640 --> 01:47:33,760
Speaker 1: that has to be in season two? Just you know,

1878
01:47:33,800 --> 01:47:35,800
Speaker 1: based on the kind of cadence that we have right now.

1879
01:47:37,280 --> 01:47:38,920
Speaker 5: I mean you said the biggest ones I think for me,

1880
01:47:38,960 --> 01:47:40,720
Speaker 5: But I guess the other one is we've touched on

1881
01:47:40,880 --> 01:47:44,759
Speaker 5: is the Dragon Seats, which isn't like a big battle,

1882
01:47:44,840 --> 01:47:46,680
Speaker 5: but I think it's a big sequence to me and

1883
01:47:46,720 --> 01:47:49,000
Speaker 5: one that I'm particularly excited for. I just have this

1884
01:47:49,080 --> 01:47:53,120
Speaker 5: great vision of like this Bonker's montage of people coming.

1885
01:47:53,160 --> 01:47:58,240
Speaker 7: I know, right it's gonna be like, yeah, the next

1886
01:47:58,320 --> 01:48:00,040
Speaker 7: day a wild.

1887
01:48:00,120 --> 01:48:02,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's what comes to mind for me.

1888
01:48:03,520 --> 01:48:06,160
Speaker 5: But yeah, Rook's rest, I suppose is the other like

1889
01:48:07,000 --> 01:48:09,280
Speaker 5: big big moment that I think of.

1890
01:48:10,160 --> 01:48:12,280
Speaker 6: Yeah, Rook's rest was kind of what I was thinking

1891
01:48:12,360 --> 01:48:15,320
Speaker 6: thinking of too, because it's got Vagar and Aimon, and

1892
01:48:15,360 --> 01:48:20,320
Speaker 6: it's got the death of Rainyes and Males and then

1893
01:48:20,439 --> 01:48:24,760
Speaker 6: Agon's horrible wounding and the maiming of Sunfire that there's

1894
01:48:24,760 --> 01:48:26,360
Speaker 6: no way they can skip that. I agree, especially right

1895
01:48:27,040 --> 01:48:29,920
Speaker 6: involved in the whole there's ground troops battling as well.

1896
01:48:29,960 --> 01:48:31,920
Speaker 6: It's gonna be really epic and it's it's it's amazing

1897
01:48:31,920 --> 01:48:33,040
Speaker 6: to think about it.

1898
01:48:33,040 --> 01:48:34,200
Speaker 7: It's a good thing season one.

1899
01:48:34,080 --> 01:48:38,200
Speaker 6: Did so well because the budgetary requirements for season two

1900
01:48:38,280 --> 01:48:42,800
Speaker 6: are substantially greater. I think that you mentioned the Battle

1901
01:48:42,800 --> 01:48:44,640
Speaker 6: of the Gulf. I think that has a chance to

1902
01:48:44,680 --> 01:48:48,200
Speaker 6: be the most expensive battle they've ever done, because just

1903
01:48:48,200 --> 01:48:50,479
Speaker 6: thinking about all the pieces that, all the dragons, all

1904
01:48:50,479 --> 01:48:54,160
Speaker 6: the ships, everythingle aspect of that is expensive as hell.

1905
01:48:54,800 --> 01:48:57,519
Speaker 1: This is why you know there's gonna be Season two

1906
01:48:57,560 --> 01:48:59,679
Speaker 1: kind of has to be action patches based on the books,

1907
01:49:00,200 --> 01:49:02,280
Speaker 1: which makes me wonder is kind of a follow up?

1908
01:49:03,120 --> 01:49:07,400
Speaker 1: Do you think we open with either Damon Seeson, Heron

1909
01:49:07,479 --> 01:49:10,160
Speaker 1: Hall or the Battle of the Gullet, Like it feels

1910
01:49:10,200 --> 01:49:12,160
Speaker 1: like there is a chance that we open on a

1911
01:49:12,200 --> 01:49:13,479
Speaker 1: big battle right away.

1912
01:49:14,800 --> 01:49:16,800
Speaker 6: Well, we have to have the dragon seeds before the

1913
01:49:16,840 --> 01:49:19,320
Speaker 6: Battle of the gall is, right, Yeah, so we probably

1914
01:49:19,320 --> 01:49:21,439
Speaker 6: can't go straight to it. But it could be like

1915
01:49:22,000 --> 01:49:26,400
Speaker 6: episode three, I think, really pushing it, it could be episode two,

1916
01:49:26,400 --> 01:49:28,519
Speaker 6: but I think maybe more like I think Rook's rest

1917
01:49:28,560 --> 01:49:29,840
Speaker 6: will be first.

1918
01:49:30,040 --> 01:49:31,840
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think battle of these little times, I think

1919
01:49:31,840 --> 01:49:33,320
Speaker 5: I want them to take a little more time with

1920
01:49:33,439 --> 01:49:36,960
Speaker 5: Jace's journey nor Yeah, I suppose, like we're like, there's

1921
01:49:37,000 --> 01:49:40,200
Speaker 5: a chance that we start street with Jace in the North,

1922
01:49:40,200 --> 01:49:41,880
Speaker 5: but I would like to see him stop in the

1923
01:49:42,000 --> 01:49:45,120
Speaker 5: Veil and see Jane Aaron. I would like to see

1924
01:49:45,120 --> 01:49:47,240
Speaker 5: the journey, but I don't know how I think that'll

1925
01:49:47,240 --> 01:49:49,080
Speaker 5: go if I think they'll kind of skip over that

1926
01:49:49,320 --> 01:49:50,639
Speaker 5: or just have him take his time.

1927
01:49:51,000 --> 01:49:53,439
Speaker 4: And I'm also curious where Jace is when.

1928
01:49:53,280 --> 01:49:55,800
Speaker 5: He learns about Luke's yes, because that's something that we

1929
01:49:55,840 --> 01:49:57,400
Speaker 5: don't know, like where is he going to be in

1930
01:49:57,400 --> 01:49:59,200
Speaker 5: the Veil? Is he going to be in winter Fell?

1931
01:49:59,520 --> 01:50:02,160
Speaker 5: Like who's gonna comfort Jason If.

1932
01:50:02,000 --> 01:50:05,320
Speaker 6: He's in Winterfel, you get Rob Stark, Jane Westerling vibes

1933
01:50:05,360 --> 01:50:06,000
Speaker 6: all over again.

1934
01:50:06,080 --> 01:50:08,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, gosh, yeah, that's part of.

1935
01:50:07,960 --> 01:50:10,080
Speaker 7: What they'll bond over. So that, yeah, that's really big.

1936
01:50:10,280 --> 01:50:13,040
Speaker 6: One battle that Bears mentioned that I can't say fitfalls

1937
01:50:13,080 --> 01:50:15,080
Speaker 6: in the category of they'll definitely do it, but they're

1938
01:50:15,080 --> 01:50:16,599
Speaker 6: gonna be really tempted to do it if they can

1939
01:50:16,720 --> 01:50:19,000
Speaker 6: afford to is the Battle of Burning Mill, just because

1940
01:50:19,000 --> 01:50:22,840
Speaker 6: it's it sounds amazing to have a big, huge windmill

1941
01:50:22,960 --> 01:50:28,719
Speaker 6: on fire spinning with Karaxis and Damon involved, like that's

1942
01:50:28,840 --> 01:50:30,960
Speaker 6: and that's where you have like black Alley black Wood

1943
01:50:30,960 --> 01:50:34,080
Speaker 6: putting an arrow through the dude's eye and all this

1944
01:50:34,120 --> 01:50:37,040
Speaker 6: other stuff. So like they might have to cut that

1945
01:50:37,080 --> 01:50:40,160
Speaker 6: and just talk about it, but they're they're like we

1946
01:50:40,160 --> 01:50:42,439
Speaker 6: we they're gonna I imagine they're trying everything they can

1947
01:50:42,520 --> 01:50:44,600
Speaker 6: to fit that one in, So I hope they do.

1948
01:50:45,520 --> 01:50:45,840
Speaker 8: M h.

1949
01:50:47,320 --> 01:50:51,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. I wonder if the the character driven nature of

1950
01:50:51,920 --> 01:50:56,760
Speaker 2: this first season was to allow for the many battles

1951
01:50:57,080 --> 01:50:58,320
Speaker 2: of seasons two. Do you know what I mean?

1952
01:50:58,840 --> 01:51:00,040
Speaker 1: This is like the un.

1953
01:51:00,040 --> 01:51:03,360
Speaker 2: Believable dragon action, Like there's great stuff, but it's so

1954
01:51:03,680 --> 01:51:05,920
Speaker 2: character driven. In the first few episodes are really like

1955
01:51:05,960 --> 01:51:09,559
Speaker 2: a chamber drama of just like one family. So I

1956
01:51:09,600 --> 01:51:14,000
Speaker 2: do wonder if how they would balance what people have

1957
01:51:14,040 --> 01:51:16,760
Speaker 2: loved so much about this season with the mix of

1958
01:51:16,840 --> 01:51:20,960
Speaker 2: the kind of unbelievable action and speed that they're gonna

1959
01:51:20,960 --> 01:51:23,360
Speaker 2: have to go through for season two.

1960
01:51:24,600 --> 01:51:26,760
Speaker 4: That's a good point that I was thinking about, which is.

1961
01:51:27,800 --> 01:51:32,200
Speaker 5: What slow scenes are we gonna see, what council scenes

1962
01:51:32,200 --> 01:51:34,960
Speaker 5: are we gonna see what will give us the time to.

1963
01:51:34,920 --> 01:51:37,439
Speaker 4: Breathe with the characters. And one thought that I had

1964
01:51:37,560 --> 01:51:38,400
Speaker 4: was I kept thinking.

1965
01:51:38,439 --> 01:51:41,800
Speaker 5: I kept coming back to Reina Targarian, Damon's daughter and

1966
01:51:41,840 --> 01:51:43,559
Speaker 5: how she goes to the Veil and kind of just

1967
01:51:43,640 --> 01:51:48,000
Speaker 5: has this little court league season where she's like being

1968
01:51:48,640 --> 01:51:52,240
Speaker 5: entertained by suitors, and I feel like that is crucial

1969
01:51:52,320 --> 01:51:54,840
Speaker 5: here is for them to not just have battle, battle, battle,

1970
01:51:54,840 --> 01:51:57,800
Speaker 5: but for us to see, like, here's what else is

1971
01:51:57,840 --> 01:51:58,719
Speaker 5: going on in the realm.

1972
01:51:58,960 --> 01:52:00,360
Speaker 7: M h yeah, I agree with that.

1973
01:52:00,400 --> 01:52:03,320
Speaker 6: There's some other potential, like you said, Jason and Sarah,

1974
01:52:03,320 --> 01:52:05,719
Speaker 6: we mentioned that several times, was a great potential, although

1975
01:52:05,720 --> 01:52:06,719
Speaker 6: maybe that's still really heavy.

1976
01:52:06,760 --> 01:52:08,440
Speaker 7: It's not battle, but.

1977
01:52:09,880 --> 01:52:13,679
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, you might have soft moments, like we said,

1978
01:52:13,680 --> 01:52:16,360
Speaker 6: with some of these, with characters like Adam and Alan

1979
01:52:16,439 --> 01:52:18,800
Speaker 6: Valerian and maybe their mother Mouse like I mentioned, maybe

1980
01:52:18,840 --> 01:52:22,360
Speaker 6: with Nettles as well, someone who actually because like.

1981
01:52:22,360 --> 01:52:25,240
Speaker 7: Olf and Hammer are going to be partying after the battle.

1982
01:52:25,840 --> 01:52:28,679
Speaker 7: Yeah we're dragon riders now, buddy, let's have some drinks.

1983
01:52:28,680 --> 01:52:33,360
Speaker 6: Whereas Nettles and Adam are like war is horrible, so

1984
01:52:33,479 --> 01:52:35,920
Speaker 6: this is more relatable I think for most of us.

1985
01:52:35,960 --> 01:52:38,960
Speaker 6: So like that'll be soft and they'll have to slow

1986
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:41,000
Speaker 6: it down to see them react to that. Because if

1987
01:52:41,000 --> 01:52:43,840
Speaker 6: I remember correctly, Adam goes and talks to Corlice and

1988
01:52:43,880 --> 01:52:46,880
Speaker 6: it's like, how do you process this? And he's they

1989
01:52:46,880 --> 01:52:48,599
Speaker 6: have a convers So that's got a lot of potential

1990
01:52:48,680 --> 01:52:50,759
Speaker 6: right there. And then like there's a lot of deaths,

1991
01:52:51,320 --> 01:52:53,040
Speaker 6: you know, people dying is going to be a chance

1992
01:52:53,240 --> 01:52:54,080
Speaker 6: to slow down.

1993
01:52:53,880 --> 01:52:55,320
Speaker 4: And have funerals.

1994
01:52:55,439 --> 01:52:57,680
Speaker 6: Yeah, sh you mentioned court scenes like Auto is going

1995
01:52:57,760 --> 01:53:01,640
Speaker 6: to get fired, Yen's Kristen's going to get promoted and

1996
01:53:02,160 --> 01:53:04,360
Speaker 6: power could go to his head, just like it's definitely

1997
01:53:04,400 --> 01:53:06,160
Speaker 6: gonna go to Eggon's head. Like we have yet to

1998
01:53:06,160 --> 01:53:10,680
Speaker 6: see what all the drunken debauchery that this king is

1999
01:53:10,720 --> 01:53:12,840
Speaker 6: going to get into. They created a monster and they

2000
01:53:12,880 --> 01:53:13,800
Speaker 6: don't realize it yet.

2001
01:53:13,960 --> 01:53:16,120
Speaker 4: I would to see an epic Eggon party scene.

2002
01:53:17,240 --> 01:53:19,519
Speaker 1: That's actually a great point because I think one of

2003
01:53:19,560 --> 01:53:21,439
Speaker 1: the themes that Rosie and I have been kind of

2004
01:53:21,439 --> 01:53:24,880
Speaker 1: hammering on is that Allison doesn't she thinks she's going

2005
01:53:24,920 --> 01:53:28,040
Speaker 1: to be able to influence her son, right, that's what

2006
01:53:28,200 --> 01:53:30,760
Speaker 1: her plan is, basically to try and steer him towards

2007
01:53:30,800 --> 01:53:35,559
Speaker 1: the light. She doesn't realize how much she gave away

2008
01:53:36,080 --> 01:53:40,680
Speaker 1: when you know, she just said, let's crown him in

2009
01:53:40,720 --> 01:53:45,040
Speaker 1: front of everybody, and let's do it I would expect

2010
01:53:45,320 --> 01:53:48,440
Speaker 1: that we're going to really see a very very sidelined

2011
01:53:48,479 --> 01:53:53,200
Speaker 1: Allison next season, like she's I would imagine that, you know,

2012
01:53:53,240 --> 01:53:55,800
Speaker 1: it's kind of between the lines and the book, but

2013
01:53:55,920 --> 01:53:58,640
Speaker 1: she's I would imagine she's going to be extremely frustrated

2014
01:53:58,640 --> 01:54:02,120
Speaker 1: by the lack of pull that she has going forward

2015
01:54:02,200 --> 01:54:03,000
Speaker 1: into season two.

2016
01:54:03,720 --> 01:54:06,479
Speaker 6: I have a strong prediction here which agrees with what

2017
01:54:06,520 --> 01:54:08,800
Speaker 6: you're saying, and it fits in very well, I think

2018
01:54:08,840 --> 01:54:10,960
Speaker 6: with what Fire and Blood sets up. Okay, so we

2019
01:54:11,000 --> 01:54:12,559
Speaker 6: know Auto is gonna get fired. It's going to because

2020
01:54:12,600 --> 01:54:16,160
Speaker 6: Eggon is impatient ye with writing letters, even though the

2021
01:54:16,200 --> 01:54:18,400
Speaker 6: letter writing is going to end up working out even

2022
01:54:18,439 --> 01:54:23,799
Speaker 6: after the Auto's gone. So Eggon gets impatient, fires Auto

2023
01:54:24,280 --> 01:54:29,000
Speaker 6: and is a strike against his mother, promotes Kristen cold Hand,

2024
01:54:29,040 --> 01:54:30,959
Speaker 6: which takes him away from being.

2025
01:54:30,760 --> 01:54:33,960
Speaker 7: Her like top protector, right hand man.

2026
01:54:34,360 --> 01:54:36,160
Speaker 6: He goes to you know, he's like, well, I can't

2027
01:54:36,160 --> 01:54:37,640
Speaker 6: be your right hand man anymore.

2028
01:54:37,640 --> 01:54:39,240
Speaker 7: I'm the hand of the king. And then he's out

2029
01:54:39,240 --> 01:54:41,920
Speaker 7: of King's landing. He's not he's he's out in the field.

2030
01:54:42,080 --> 01:54:44,680
Speaker 6: So she doesn't have him by her side anymore, which

2031
01:54:44,680 --> 01:54:47,360
Speaker 6: we've seen how much that matters. Kristin Call's presence in

2032
01:54:47,480 --> 01:54:51,040
Speaker 6: the in the council room after the King's death was huge.

2033
01:54:51,080 --> 01:54:53,760
Speaker 6: Without him there, she could not have done what she did.

2034
01:54:53,800 --> 01:54:56,200
Speaker 6: She could not have gotten to egg on first. All

2035
01:54:56,240 --> 01:54:58,880
Speaker 6: that falls apart. She doesn't even have that option. So

2036
01:54:59,280 --> 01:55:01,520
Speaker 6: it's like when Sir he had the Mountain at her side.

2037
01:55:01,640 --> 01:55:04,760
Speaker 6: Her demeanor and what she could do and intimidate, her

2038
01:55:04,840 --> 01:55:08,480
Speaker 6: ability to intimidate politically was massively changed there. I think

2039
01:55:08,480 --> 01:55:10,720
Speaker 6: that's what Allison will lose. So it's exactly what you're

2040
01:55:10,720 --> 01:55:12,720
Speaker 6: saying there, Jayson. Her influence will go away, and this

2041
01:55:12,880 --> 01:55:16,400
Speaker 6: is multiple mechanisms as to it can be stripped away.

2042
01:55:17,440 --> 01:55:19,560
Speaker 6: A just doesn't listen to her b he takes away

2043
01:55:19,600 --> 01:55:20,600
Speaker 6: her supporters.

2044
01:55:20,800 --> 01:55:22,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hate Kristin.

2045
01:55:23,360 --> 01:55:27,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean we're going to be exciting list people

2046
01:55:27,720 --> 01:55:29,760
Speaker 1: are going to learn to hate him even fucking more

2047
01:55:30,800 --> 01:55:37,520
Speaker 1: next season. Any and then finally, just like any predictions

2048
01:55:37,560 --> 01:55:40,920
Speaker 1: for season two, you know, where do you think, where

2049
01:55:40,920 --> 01:55:43,800
Speaker 1: do you think the season ends, and any predictions that

2050
01:55:43,880 --> 01:55:44,560
Speaker 1: you might have.

2051
01:55:46,080 --> 01:55:48,600
Speaker 5: Ends. I've thought a lot about where I think it begins,

2052
01:55:48,600 --> 01:55:49,800
Speaker 5: because I think it begins, like.

2053
01:55:49,760 --> 01:55:51,240
Speaker 4: Starts off with some blood and cheese action.

2054
01:55:51,400 --> 01:55:55,720
Speaker 1: But I hadn't if they give us Blood and Cheese

2055
01:55:56,400 --> 01:56:01,960
Speaker 1: episode one of season two that people are that's just

2056
01:56:01,960 --> 01:56:03,400
Speaker 1: gonna be a lot. I think it's gonna be.

2057
01:56:06,160 --> 01:56:07,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's kind of what I think is they like,

2058
01:56:08,120 --> 01:56:08,840
Speaker 4: wave very near.

2059
01:56:09,040 --> 01:56:11,360
Speaker 5: Her face is so steeled at the end of season one,

2060
01:56:11,400 --> 01:56:13,960
Speaker 5: it just looks like the setup for Okay, Damon, let's

2061
01:56:14,040 --> 01:56:14,520
Speaker 5: go all out.

2062
01:56:14,840 --> 01:56:17,120
Speaker 7: I was I was trying to hold back, but now, yeah.

2063
01:56:17,080 --> 01:56:18,160
Speaker 1: Sun for a sun, let's go.

2064
01:56:18,440 --> 01:56:20,000
Speaker 5: Like what do I think a final what do you

2065
01:56:20,000 --> 01:56:22,040
Speaker 5: think the final moment of season two week?

2066
01:56:22,040 --> 01:56:23,880
Speaker 6: Maybe the fall of the fall of the first fall

2067
01:56:23,920 --> 01:56:26,720
Speaker 6: of King's landing. Maybe, yeah, be a pretty good way

2068
01:56:26,760 --> 01:56:27,160
Speaker 6: to end it.

2069
01:56:27,160 --> 01:56:28,400
Speaker 7: It's not it's not too.

2070
01:56:28,240 --> 01:56:32,200
Speaker 6: Far forward, and it makes sense. I mean, we know

2071
01:56:32,240 --> 01:56:35,959
Speaker 6: aimond And and Cole kind of pull all the defenders

2072
01:56:36,000 --> 01:56:40,560
Speaker 6: away and they're like opportunity and yeah, so it could

2073
01:56:40,600 --> 01:56:42,960
Speaker 6: it leads to the eventually leads to the anarchy. Can

2074
01:56:43,000 --> 01:56:45,280
Speaker 6: look like you know, Rainiers ends the season on a

2075
01:56:45,320 --> 01:56:48,640
Speaker 6: win and which is kind of the opposite of how

2076
01:56:48,680 --> 01:56:49,440
Speaker 6: this season ends.

2077
01:56:49,840 --> 01:56:51,800
Speaker 7: Yeah, kind of eat that way. I guess that works out.

2078
01:56:52,640 --> 01:56:55,600
Speaker 6: But yeah, it'll be something we think about a lot

2079
01:56:56,080 --> 01:56:59,440
Speaker 6: for the next couple of years here. But I think

2080
01:56:59,480 --> 01:57:03,600
Speaker 6: those are pretty strong options for sure. One other thing

2081
01:57:03,640 --> 01:57:05,520
Speaker 6: I'm really looking forward to is since you asked that,

2082
01:57:05,560 --> 01:57:07,960
Speaker 6: prediction wise, I think a surprise. A character that's going

2083
01:57:08,000 --> 01:57:11,800
Speaker 6: to surprise book readers is Hammer. I think a lot

2084
01:57:11,800 --> 01:57:15,960
Speaker 6: of the fans, like more casual fans, will react very

2085
01:57:15,960 --> 01:57:18,280
Speaker 6: strongly to him because I don't think we book readers

2086
01:57:18,280 --> 01:57:21,600
Speaker 6: have realized just how imposing he's going to look on

2087
01:57:21,680 --> 01:57:25,360
Speaker 6: screen after he gets established and is riding that big

2088
01:57:25,400 --> 01:57:28,000
Speaker 6: ass dragon we just saw, we can have that dragon.

2089
01:57:29,160 --> 01:57:32,040
Speaker 6: He's a huge man. He's gonna wear a crown, have

2090
01:57:32,120 --> 01:57:35,120
Speaker 6: a giant hammer, and probably be decked out in pretty

2091
01:57:35,160 --> 01:57:35,800
Speaker 6: boss armor.

2092
01:57:35,840 --> 01:57:37,920
Speaker 4: After a time, fans are going to be so.

2093
01:57:41,120 --> 01:57:43,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, like talk about a villain that's just a villain,

2094
01:57:43,600 --> 01:57:45,040
Speaker 6: like straight up, like a guy whose power goes with

2095
01:57:45,040 --> 01:57:45,240
Speaker 6: his head.

2096
01:57:45,320 --> 01:57:46,200
Speaker 7: Right away, he's probably mean.

2097
01:57:46,200 --> 01:57:47,920
Speaker 4: If they give him funny lines, you'll have a fan.

2098
01:57:50,960 --> 01:57:52,840
Speaker 6: I think there's actually a lot of potential for him

2099
01:57:52,840 --> 01:57:55,320
Speaker 6: to be very entertaining, you know, like a driver of

2100
01:57:55,360 --> 01:57:58,000
Speaker 6: action that I think book readers kind of he's almost.

2101
01:57:57,680 --> 01:57:59,960
Speaker 7: An afterthought, which is weird because he's got a huge role.

2102
01:58:00,200 --> 01:58:02,480
Speaker 6: But people don't like like an art show, people don't

2103
01:58:02,520 --> 01:58:04,600
Speaker 6: like ask us to talk about him. Or like he's

2104
01:58:04,640 --> 01:58:06,440
Speaker 6: not like someone people think it's brought up a lot,

2105
01:58:06,520 --> 01:58:07,520
Speaker 6: you know, so I don't know.

2106
01:58:08,720 --> 01:58:11,040
Speaker 1: I will just say that I think my prediction for

2107
01:58:11,240 --> 01:58:14,760
Speaker 1: either the penultimate or finale episode of season two is

2108
01:58:14,960 --> 01:58:21,200
Speaker 1: Auto's head coming off mirror of Ned Stark season one. Oh,

2109
01:58:22,240 --> 01:58:26,800
Speaker 1: I think Otto Getting Got is going to be either

2110
01:58:28,240 --> 01:58:31,760
Speaker 1: ten of season two of House of the Dragon. Any

2111
01:58:31,880 --> 01:58:34,280
Speaker 1: any final thoughts before we say goodbye? It so been

2112
01:58:34,320 --> 01:58:34,800
Speaker 1: so wonderful.

2113
01:58:34,800 --> 01:58:36,800
Speaker 5: I would love to say how excited I am for

2114
01:58:36,880 --> 01:58:39,040
Speaker 5: the Blackwoods, for black Alley.

2115
01:58:39,120 --> 01:58:41,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, Blackwood just.

2116
01:58:41,040 --> 01:58:42,800
Speaker 4: Like people are like, what characters we have to love him?

2117
01:58:42,840 --> 01:58:46,320
Speaker 4: Like you got these characters. I guarantee you'll love the Blackwoods.

2118
01:58:46,400 --> 01:58:49,200
Speaker 5: I hope they give us the actual really good phrase

2119
01:58:49,280 --> 01:58:53,120
Speaker 5: because we got Sabbatha vibrant Fray who marries in and

2120
01:58:53,160 --> 01:58:56,720
Speaker 5: then we've got Forest Fray, who is not bad. He's like,

2121
01:58:56,800 --> 01:58:59,720
Speaker 5: he's pretty legit actually, So I'm looking forward to the

2122
01:58:59,760 --> 01:59:04,560
Speaker 5: Joe folks about the cool phrase coming.

2123
01:59:04,680 --> 01:59:07,320
Speaker 7: Yeah, how they'll do that.

2124
01:59:09,120 --> 01:59:12,000
Speaker 1: Azi's and Ashaya thank you so much for joining us.

2125
01:59:12,520 --> 01:59:14,480
Speaker 1: You can find them on the History of West Ros

2126
01:59:14,520 --> 01:59:17,600
Speaker 1: pod on YouTube and wherever you get your podcast. Anything

2127
01:59:17,640 --> 01:59:18,760
Speaker 1: else to plug folks.

2128
01:59:19,360 --> 01:59:20,600
Speaker 4: Oh, I have one more thing to plug.

2129
01:59:20,640 --> 01:59:24,760
Speaker 5: I did a really cool mashup of Arrested Development with

2130
01:59:24,960 --> 01:59:27,840
Speaker 5: the Greens, like the team greet the Arrest Development intro

2131
01:59:27,960 --> 01:59:30,000
Speaker 5: credits where I mash up the intro credits.

2132
01:59:30,000 --> 01:59:31,880
Speaker 4: It's like eighteen seconds long, and I'm going to do

2133
01:59:31,920 --> 01:59:33,160
Speaker 4: one for the Blacks as well.

2134
01:59:33,520 --> 01:59:38,400
Speaker 5: I might be doing more intro credit mashups because I

2135
01:59:38,440 --> 01:59:39,720
Speaker 5: realized I really don't like the.

2136
01:59:39,640 --> 01:59:41,720
Speaker 4: Intro credits for House of the Dragon very.

2137
01:59:41,600 --> 01:59:44,560
Speaker 5: Much, so like, why don't I just recreate the intro

2138
01:59:44,600 --> 01:59:45,720
Speaker 5: credits for all the things I like?

2139
01:59:45,800 --> 01:59:47,360
Speaker 4: So I was like, I might do like the Royal

2140
01:59:47,400 --> 01:59:51,040
Speaker 4: Tenenbaum's intro. I'm going with it.

2141
01:59:51,160 --> 01:59:53,760
Speaker 5: So you can find on History of West Rows Arrested

2142
01:59:53,760 --> 01:59:55,360
Speaker 5: Development meets House of the Dragon.

2143
01:59:55,560 --> 01:59:58,120
Speaker 1: Oh that's so great, you guys. Thank you for joining

2144
01:59:58,200 --> 02:00:00,040
Speaker 1: us and.

2145
01:59:59,200 --> 02:00:00,320
Speaker 2: Thank you coming back much.

2146
02:00:00,920 --> 02:00:03,520
Speaker 7: Yeah, yes, thanks for having us come back. An, It's

2147
02:00:03,520 --> 02:00:04,600
Speaker 7: always great to get.

2148
02:00:04,520 --> 02:00:07,920
Speaker 4: To see you. In a month's let's go.

2149
02:00:11,120 --> 02:00:12,840
Speaker 1: A big thanks to his He's in a shia from

2150
02:00:12,880 --> 02:00:15,800
Speaker 1: History West ros Rosie, what do you have to plug?

2151
02:00:16,320 --> 02:00:19,480
Speaker 2: You can find me on Instagram, Rosie Marks. You can

2152
02:00:19,520 --> 02:00:24,280
Speaker 2: find me at letterbox same handle. I'm updating all my

2153
02:00:24,360 --> 02:00:27,320
Speaker 2: films it's very fun to follow along. I have finally

2154
02:00:27,400 --> 02:00:30,320
Speaker 2: managed to watch one horror movie a day for October,

2155
02:00:30,360 --> 02:00:32,880
Speaker 2: which I somehow always always managed to struggle with, So

2156
02:00:32,960 --> 02:00:37,680
Speaker 2: that's been fun. You can find my writing at notict Ign, Polygon,

2157
02:00:38,680 --> 02:00:40,680
Speaker 2: Den of Geek. I'll have some cool stuff coming up

2158
02:00:40,680 --> 02:00:43,880
Speaker 2: in the next Denny Geek magazine, and you can always

2159
02:00:43,880 --> 02:00:45,839
Speaker 2: just find me here talking about all this cool stuff.

2160
02:00:49,040 --> 02:00:51,720
Speaker 1: Catch our next episode November fourth, that's going to be

2161
02:00:51,720 --> 02:00:57,240
Speaker 1: a big Star Wars episode, plus a lot of conversations

2162
02:00:57,240 --> 02:00:59,800
Speaker 1: about our favorite horror movies of twenty twenty two, plus

2163
02:00:59,800 --> 02:01:03,920
Speaker 1: an interview with Run Sweetheart Run director Shanna Fest. Subscribe

2164
02:01:03,960 --> 02:01:06,160
Speaker 1: to the show on YouTube, and of course follow at

2165
02:01:06,360 --> 02:01:08,720
Speaker 1: XRV pod on Twitter and check out our discord. You

2166
02:01:08,840 --> 02:01:11,520
Speaker 1: find discord link in the show notes to meet with

2167
02:01:11,680 --> 02:01:14,560
Speaker 1: lots of other fans of X ray Vision, fans of

2168
02:01:14,600 --> 02:01:17,040
Speaker 1: the projects that we talk about, and plus Rosie and

2169
02:01:17,120 --> 02:01:20,520
Speaker 1: I were there all the time, reading your theories, reading

2170
02:01:20,520 --> 02:01:24,520
Speaker 1: your conversations, and chiming in five star reviews. We love them,

2171
02:01:24,520 --> 02:01:26,440
Speaker 1: we got to have them, we need them, we love

2172
02:01:26,480 --> 02:01:28,400
Speaker 1: to get them, and we get them. We read them out.

2173
02:01:28,640 --> 02:01:32,120
Speaker 1: Here's one from Lehman DC Love Jason and Rosie, thank you,

2174
02:01:32,160 --> 02:01:35,160
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. The feeling is absolutely mutual. Love

2175
02:01:35,200 --> 02:01:37,240
Speaker 1: this podcast. It's so nice to listen to people who

2176
02:01:37,280 --> 02:01:40,280
Speaker 1: are fans talk about something they love. Well, we feel

2177
02:01:40,320 --> 02:01:41,560
Speaker 1: the same way and we love doing it.

2178
02:01:41,600 --> 02:01:44,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, we feel so absolutely delightful to do it. Thank you.

2179
02:01:45,040 --> 02:01:46,880
Speaker 1: X ray Vision is a Crooked Media production. The show

2180
02:01:46,920 --> 02:01:48,680
Speaker 1: is produced by Chris Lord and Soul Rubin. The show

2181
02:01:48,720 --> 02:01:51,680
Speaker 1: is executive produced by myself and Sandy Rhard Are editing

2182
02:01:51,680 --> 02:01:55,680
Speaker 1: and sound designs by Vascillias Patopoulos. Dilon Villanueva and Matt

2183
02:01:55,720 --> 02:01:58,800
Speaker 1: de Group provide video production support. Alex Rella for handles

2184
02:01:58,800 --> 02:02:02,120
Speaker 1: social media. Thank you Ian Vesquez for the music. We

2185
02:02:02,200 --> 02:02:04,360
Speaker 1: will talk to you next week, folks.

2186
02:02:04,400 --> 02:02:21,040
Speaker 8: Goodbye. Hey, Mike, is this awake? Araks araqs are my

2187
02:02:21,120 --> 02:02:22,080
Speaker 8: favorite dragon bake.

2188
02:02:23,080 --> 02:02:23,920
Speaker 4: He's a baby.

2189
02:02:23,960 --> 02:02:28,600
Speaker 8: He's a cute little baby dragon. Why do we said,

2190
02:02:28,680 --> 02:02:33,520
Speaker 8: David said, anybody else? Bike, lady, the baby aracks do it.

2191
02:02:34,280 --> 02:02:37,880
Speaker 8: They have like a dozen adult dragons over there, Mike,

2192
02:02:38,480 --> 02:02:41,400
Speaker 8: like a dozen of They said, the fucking baby to

2193
02:02:41,520 --> 02:02:42,040
Speaker 8: go do it.

2194
02:02:42,160 --> 02:02:45,880
Speaker 1: Adult's work. Take my hands over the here.

2195
02:02:46,040 --> 02:02:46,360
Speaker 2: Thank you