1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 1: Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to the 2 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much for 3 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,560 Speaker 1: tuning in. We're so glad that you're here. If you're 4 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 1: hearing this the day it comes out, Welcome to November twelfth, 5 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. We're midway on the way to Thanksgiving 6 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 1: and we have a travel episode for you. Before we 7 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: do this, let us describe your three favorite companions for 8 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: a crazy, crazy international trip. First off, our super producer, 9 00:00:57,760 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: mister Max Williams. 10 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:02,200 Speaker 2: Woo who We're gonna climb some mountains. 11 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 3: Y'all sure? 12 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: Second, our main man here, known as the bag Man. 13 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:12,920 Speaker 1: In some areas of the world, it's mister Noel Brown. 14 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,679 Speaker 3: Give it up. They call me Bilbo Bagman. It's true. 15 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 3: In speaking of that, you know, when you ask this 16 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 3: question about, you know, traveling campaigns, I immediately my mind 17 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:24,039 Speaker 3: goes to, like, who's my D and D party? What 18 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 3: are each individuals like superpower abilities. 19 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: That will serve us on this quest? We need the specialties? 20 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And it's your boy Ben Bowling our our 21 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: question today. 22 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 3: This is something that's been. 23 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: On our minds pretty often for years now. Noel, Max 24 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: and I have had conversations about a place called. 25 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 3: Bhutan, a magical place far away land land locked in fact, 26 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 3: country on the eastern ridges of the glorious Himalayas that 27 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 3: has been referred to by some as the last Shangri Law. Yes, 28 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 3: I haven't, Bye, we have not yet mounted this sojourn 29 00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:07,960 Speaker 3: yet though, have we been, because it's kind of hard to. 30 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: Get to Yeah, yeah, have you ever visited Bhutan? For 31 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:17,639 Speaker 1: most people the answer is no, and Stade Statistically, if 32 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 1: you asked most of most Americans, we're Americans. If you 33 00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:26,079 Speaker 1: ask most of us to point to Boton on a map. 34 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 3: Couldn't do it. I could do if the name was 35 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 3: on there. Yeah. 36 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's why we make maps that way, history 37 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: of cartography. 38 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 3: It's aitty bitty though, right, And it's nestled amongst a 39 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 3: lot of much larger land masses, so it would now 40 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 3: you know, looking at it zoomed out, it's kind of 41 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 3: a spec You might not even be able to read 42 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:45,839 Speaker 3: the text, Max. 43 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:48,960 Speaker 1: Mm hm, you might just see it be and an h. 44 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:53,280 Speaker 1: We also know to your point, Noel, that Bouton is, 45 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,639 Speaker 1: as you said, high up in the heavens of the Himalayas. 46 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 1: It's nestled between Tibet, which is controlled by China, and 47 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: nestled between any Quebet, which, yeah, which already. 48 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 3: It's nineteen ninety five all over it. 49 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 1: And China and India are two of the biggest up 50 00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 1: and coming countries in the world. They're going places, don't 51 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 1: you think, I you know what I I think it's 52 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 1: part of my different job if I say anything about it. 53 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,280 Speaker 3: But yeah, yeah, sorry, no worries. 54 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: Back in twenty twenty one, we spoke about Baton briefly 55 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: referring to we had an episode on what Weird Courtship Rituals, 56 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 1: and we talked about the Bhutanese practice of night hunting. 57 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 3: Oh, I don't remember night hunting. That sounds a little scary. 58 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 3: This is a courtship practice. Sounds a little hunger gamez 59 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 3: I don't know. 60 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 1: This is a travel episode because Noel Max, we're journeying 61 00:03:55,880 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 1: back to Batan because there is a different, odd, wholesome 62 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:04,119 Speaker 1: aspect of this country as well, which has been described 63 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:08,760 Speaker 1: as ridiculous by certain outsiders. But we're we're kind of 64 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: into it. It's the only Vajiana Buddhist nation in the world, 65 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 1: and for a lot of people it's a dream destination, 66 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 1: but it's pretty tough to get there. 67 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it is. But that dream that is kept 68 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 3: alive in Bhutan is in no small part due to 69 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 3: how they measure the success of their country much much, 70 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 3: much differently than we do here for certain in the 71 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 3: United States. Rather than monetary measures, they're looking a little 72 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 3: more inward. Yeah. 73 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, Bhutan does not graid its success as a country. 74 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 1: And to your point earlier in Bhutan is not a 75 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:52,119 Speaker 1: big country by any means. It has a population about 76 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: eight hundred thousand in twenty twenty four. It decided at 77 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: some point not to create it success in terms of 78 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: gross domestic product, in terms of economic output. Instead, they 79 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 1: hung out and back in the nineteen seventies they said, 80 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: maybe we should define success for our country by how 81 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: happy the people living in it are. 82 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 3: Well, that sounds nice. Let's get into this and how 83 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 3: this works. After a quick cold open bring and we've returned. 84 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:32,720 Speaker 3: All right. 85 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:37,040 Speaker 1: The land we call Bhuton today was inhabited by humans 86 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:41,160 Speaker 1: as early as two thousand BCE. But as we were 87 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:44,239 Speaker 1: talking about off air, we still don't know a lot 88 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 1: about its ancient origins. So, uh, Noel, maybe you and 89 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: I can give people just the high level. That's funny 90 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: because it's a high elevation country. 91 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 3: Success. Oh man, there's apparently this movie this dropped recently 92 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 3: called Elevation. That's a total ripoff of a quiet place. 93 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,240 Speaker 3: But the kind of the inverse where it's these monsters 94 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 3: that cannot exist at high elevation. So Bhutan would be 95 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 3: spared from the apocalypse brought on by the creatures in 96 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 3: this apparently quite hacky creature feature. That's that's out in 97 00:06:13,480 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 3: the theater soon. But yeah, it's true. Ben Buddhism was 98 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 3: first introduced to the people of Bhutan in the seventh 99 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 3: century AD, when Tibetan king's Songsten Gompo reigned from six 100 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:27,080 Speaker 3: twenty seven to six forty nine, converted to Buddhism and 101 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 3: extended the Tibetan Empire into the area that empire he 102 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 3: already controlled. So I mean, is this this is It's 103 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 3: easy to in a footnote of history say extended the 104 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 3: Tibetan Empire, but that would be by way of conquest, right. Yeah. 105 00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, it wasn't a cool zoom meeting. 106 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:45,599 Speaker 3: Right. He didn't just pop over and said, yeah, come 107 00:06:45,720 --> 00:06:46,479 Speaker 3: join us. 108 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, they didn't say he made some good points. No, 109 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:56,160 Speaker 1: this was the old story of historical conquest, blood and treasure. 110 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:03,360 Speaker 1: We know by the tenth century, Bhuton's adoption of Buddhism 111 00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:08,239 Speaker 1: had a significant impact on its political development. It's always 112 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: been a theocracy from that point. And locally, what's curious 113 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:17,560 Speaker 1: going to our point about how we don't know much 114 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 1: about the providence of Bhutan. Locally, it's been known by 115 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:25,920 Speaker 1: many names. The first Europeans to get over there were 116 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 1: Portuguese and they were Jesuits. 117 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 3: Classic. Oh, and if you really want to see a 118 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 3: cool depiction of some of these types of individuals who 119 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 3: you know were off in the front lines of exploration 120 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:41,000 Speaker 3: and conquest, check out Showgun, the FX series. There's a 121 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 3: whole plot involving like Portuguese Jesuits. 122 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, And the Portuguese Jesuits that reached bhutand this 123 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 1: occurs in sixteen twenty seven. They were Estevao, Casella and 124 00:07:55,920 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 1: dal Cabral and they talk to other people and surrounding areas, 125 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: and whenever they asked about what we call Bhutan today, 126 00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 1: people would say, oh, that's the Canberrasaci, whether Potente or 127 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: the mall. It really depended on who you asked. As 128 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 1: far as what name. 129 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 3: That you got, well, and that makes sense because until 130 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 3: the early seventeenth century they really existed as this kind 131 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 3: of loose connection of fiefdoms that were under the control 132 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 3: of different kind of I don't know, warlords or whatever 133 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:30,680 Speaker 3: you might want to call them, but they did not 134 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 3: get along with each other, so there really wasn't much 135 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 3: unity to speak of. That unity did eventually come when 136 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 3: the Tibetan lama and military leader Nawang Yam y'all, who 137 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 3: had actually fled from religious persecution in Tibet, showed up 138 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 3: and basically unified these warring clans I guess you could 139 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 3: call them, yeah. 140 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 1: And he built this network of impregnable fortresses they're call 141 00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 1: zongs dzo ngs. The most famous kind of example of 142 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:07,840 Speaker 1: this architecture is the Tiger's Nest. So look that up 143 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: with your favorite recreational vice of choice and prepare to 144 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 1: learn really cool stuff. 145 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 3: This guy. 146 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: This guy helmed the building of these fortresses and then 147 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 1: also set forth a code of law that, to your point, 148 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 1: Noel unified these other fiefdoms altogether. And here's a crazy 149 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: conspiracy for you, folks. When Gahweang Namgau died in sixteen 150 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:41,679 Speaker 1: fifty one, the unified government was so important and so 151 00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 1: fragile that his successors decided to just not tell anyone 152 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:50,360 Speaker 1: the leader died for fifty four years. 153 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 3: You know, if they had had camera phones and the 154 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 3: internet back then, they wouldn't have been able to keep 155 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 3: a lit on this, even though they probably didn't wouldn't 156 00:09:57,520 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 3: get good reception up there in them hills. But yeah, 157 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 3: you think about the ability to keep a secret like 158 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 3: that by today's standards, and it's just kind of mind 159 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 3: boggling that they were able to do that. Yeah, Like, 160 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 3: did they just tell him? He'll get back to you. 161 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 3: You know. Anyway, you can't turn on the computer without 162 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:18,440 Speaker 3: finding a spoiler for your favorite TV show, let alone 163 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 3: that the leader of a free nation died, right. 164 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:26,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, And we still don't know a ton of early 165 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: history of Butad because most of the records were sadly 166 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 1: destroyed in a fire that ravaged the ancient capital back 167 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 1: in eighteen twenty seven. 168 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,520 Speaker 3: That's right. Then, in nineteen oh seven, which is kind 169 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 3: of a big year, a red letter year for the country, 170 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:49,160 Speaker 3: when Wang Chuk was chosen unanimously as the hereditary king 171 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 3: of the country by the Lengye Shog of leading Buddhist monks. 172 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 3: I imagine the len Ye Shog is a particular title, 173 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 3: like a high level official within this order of Buddhist monks, right, 174 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 3: which was also in control of the government. Right. 175 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's no discernible separation of church and state in this, 176 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 1: which would make it arguably a theocracy. The person you're mentioning, 177 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: Wang Chuk got the coside of the leader of the 178 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:25,319 Speaker 1: Buddhist monks, very powerful force, the local government officials, the 179 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,840 Speaker 1: heads of every rich family. This is the basis of 180 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 1: modern Bhuton today. And there have been some interesting and 181 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 1: sometimes inspiring plot twist along the way, especially that time 182 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 1: they said, Hey, why is the rest of the world 183 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: so stressed about this money thing? Does money really make 184 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 1: you happy? This is where we enter the wholesome, ridiculous 185 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:57,680 Speaker 1: history part of the episode nol Gross National Happiness. 186 00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 3: I mean, it's when going over this material and digging 187 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:05,959 Speaker 3: a little further into it on my own, you start 188 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 3: to look at this and almost it seems like it 189 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:14,280 Speaker 3: would be immediately mocked by certain capitalist forces, you know, 190 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 3: or just by folks that are running the government like 191 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 3: here in the United States, like the idea that anything 192 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 3: other than constant year over year, monetary growth is the 193 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 3: way to measure success. Would be found to be absurd 194 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 3: by these types of folks and worthy of mockery. Like 195 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 3: I could picture certain individuals, you know, pundits or whatever, 196 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 3: just absolutely dragging something like this or a country like this, 197 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 3: and say, how could you even possibly think like this? 198 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 1: Right here in the West, in the United States in particular, 199 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 1: and in a lot of other industrialized nations, the idea 200 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: of happiness is equated with money. There's a New York 201 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 1: Times article that explores this in a fascinating way, where 202 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: in the journalist notes economists as your consumer confidence on 203 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:05,680 Speaker 1: the assumption that the resulting figure says something about progress 204 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 1: and public welfare. The gross domestic product or GDP is 205 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: routinely used as shorthand for the well being of a nation. 206 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 3: But Noel, we've. 207 00:13:15,880 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 1: Talked about this off air. I've talked about this with Max, 208 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 1: and economy can be doing gangbusters and the people in 209 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:26,560 Speaker 1: the place where the economy is doing well can be 210 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 1: having horrible lives. 211 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 3: It's just a misnomer. I mean, I'm sorry, We're not 212 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,440 Speaker 3: here to soapbox about any of this kind of stuff. 213 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 3: And you know, to quote Biggie, more money, more problems. 214 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 3: I mean, that's absolutely true. And the older you get 215 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 3: and the more you start to maybe come into a 216 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 3: career or whatever, the expectations is to continue to rise. 217 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 3: And given our position kind of in this system that 218 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:50,960 Speaker 3: we're talking about here in the US, you start to 219 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 3: kind of judge yourself against that GDP and judge yourself 220 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 3: against these expectations of wealth. And if you're not careful, 221 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:02,040 Speaker 3: you spend your entire life, you know, and the more 222 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:03,600 Speaker 3: money you have, the more you want to have more, 223 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:05,080 Speaker 3: the more you want to be like the next guy. 224 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 3: And that isn't happiness. I'm sorry, it's just not what 225 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:09,720 Speaker 3: happiness is. In fact, it's misery. 226 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:13,559 Speaker 1: Gotta watch Apocalypto. They have a thing about this anyway. 227 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 1: So yes, I think we're raising good points. The Kingdom 228 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 1: of Bhutad is not trying to be a huge expansionist empire. Instead, 229 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: gross national happiness, which is sometimes called gross domestic happiness. 230 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:33,040 Speaker 1: It's a philosophy that currently guides the government. What it 231 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:37,920 Speaker 1: means essentially is this, the country has decided to eschew 232 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 1: or throw away the traditional economic metrics, and they said, 233 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 1: you know what, we're going to figure out our country's 234 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: vibe based on how much everybody wins, how we develop 235 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:59,680 Speaker 1: socioeconomic equitable situation, how do we conserve the environment, how 236 00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:03,160 Speaker 1: do we preserve and promote our culture, how do we 237 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 1: make sure our government is not corrupt. That's a checklist 238 00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: of cool stuff. 239 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:09,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, win for one is a win for all. And 240 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 3: I know what a lot of folks might be thinking, like, 241 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 3: is this vaguely communist or vaguely socialists And it's not 242 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:20,280 Speaker 3: exactly real own thing, right, Like really, yeah, it's super interesting. 243 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 3: So I mean to the government of Bhutan, it's simple. 244 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:27,840 Speaker 3: In two thousand and nine, the leader his eminence the 245 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,200 Speaker 3: rin Pouchet, which is a big deal. This is this 246 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 3: like spiritual kind of the idea of a reincarnated spiritual 247 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 3: like the king of the monks, right, his eminence Ked 248 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 3: Drupchen ren Puschet, the fifth ree incarnate and head the 249 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:45,920 Speaker 3: sang Chen again Suklach Monastery. Again, very much a theocracy. 250 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 3: And you were doing a great job with these prefaciations, 251 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 3: doing my best. That's in Troungsta, Bhutan. He actually became 252 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:57,400 Speaker 3: the youngest ever ren puschet or spiritual leader spiritual master 253 00:15:57,680 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 3: in the history of Bhutan at only nineteen years old. 254 00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 3: So that was a big deal in and of itself. And 255 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 3: it would seem that he put his money where his 256 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 3: mouth is, or vice my mouth where his money would go, 257 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 3: and we're going to get rid of money. I don't know, 258 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 3: it's a bad metaphor, but he really wanted to practice 259 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 3: what he preached on a large scale in terms of, like, 260 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 3: how can we separate ourselves from some of the more 261 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 3: you know, secular trappings and things that are ultimately can 262 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 3: be negative for people's mental well being and focus a 263 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 3: little bit more on kind of a holistic approach to 264 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 3: mental and spiritual health. 265 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: I uyeah, yeah, one hundred percent nailed it. He was 266 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:42,320 Speaker 1: a or is a liaison to the larger world outside 267 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:45,560 Speaker 1: of Baton, and to these guys, this is a very 268 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:49,880 Speaker 1: simple thing. It's just quote a set of collective conditions 269 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: that is generally needed to live a good life. And look, 270 00:16:55,160 --> 00:17:00,280 Speaker 1: everybody outside of Baton, we live in a world that 271 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: is just chock full of complicated governmental economic policies. To 272 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 1: put things so simply sounds refreshing. But how did they 273 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: get there? How does this idea of quantifying happiness works? 274 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: To answer that? To like, answer even where it comes from. 275 00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 1: We have to go back to nineteen seventy two, which 276 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 1: technically means this is within our purview. 277 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, it's more beautiful. Well, the story and the 278 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 3: origin of Bhutan as well within our perduc okay, but yeah, 279 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 3: as a nation. But you're right, it's crazy how modern 280 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 3: this this concept is. So let's travel back to nineteen 281 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 3: seventy two together Bhutan's newly crowned leader, King Yigme. See, 282 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 3: I'm getting all the pronunciations today. King Jigme Singye wang 283 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:54,120 Speaker 3: Chuk was very much pondering this conundrum, you know, of 284 00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:57,439 Speaker 3: how when you focus on economic growth exclusively as a 285 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,119 Speaker 3: measure of the success of your nation, you're kind of 286 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:06,359 Speaker 3: ignoring your citizens actual well being and your citizen's actual happiness. 287 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:09,760 Speaker 3: Because he kind of clocked what we've both been screaming 288 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 3: this whole time that I just think that GDP to 289 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 3: happiness quot shent is absolutely out of whack. 290 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:23,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry, economists, and his excellency studied abroad. He went 291 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: to different parts of the world, and he felt like 292 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 1: he was seeing the same thing over and over again. 293 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:34,000 Speaker 1: People would say, Oh, the GDP is great, Oh the 294 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 1: economy is increasing, but when he walked the streets right 295 00:18:40,359 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 1: when he saw the people on the ground, he saw 296 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 1: countless cases of environmental degradation, he saw startling inequality, and yes, 297 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:52,400 Speaker 1: if you're wondering, he did that part of his education 298 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: in India, and he saw war and he saw crime proliferating, 299 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 1: and he said, you know what we need, Bhutad. We 300 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 1: need to ensure that any prosperity our country encounters is 301 00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: shared across society. That's the only sustainable way to do it. 302 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: We need to preserve the cultural traditions, the things that 303 00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:17,159 Speaker 1: make us Bhutanese. We got to protect our environment. And 304 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:20,800 Speaker 1: if people say to the government that there is a problem, 305 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 1: we need a government to respond without corruption. And from 306 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:27,720 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy two, he's still in school when he cooks 307 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:30,400 Speaker 1: up this idea. He's the guy who coins the term 308 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 1: gross national happiness. From nineteen seventy two all the way 309 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 1: to another plot twist. He spends the next decades trying 310 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 1: to just do that. 311 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, and it kind of catches on beyond his country. 312 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 3: You know, there's a really great New York Times piece 313 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 3: that came out in two thousand and five by Andrew C. Revkin. 314 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 3: And Revkin had this to say about it. Around the world, 315 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:01,119 Speaker 3: a growing number of economists, social scienceists, corporate leaders, and 316 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 3: bureaucrats are trying to develop a measurement that takes into 317 00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 3: account not just the flow of money, but also access 318 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:11,400 Speaker 3: to healthcare, free time with family, conservation of natural resources, 319 00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 3: and other non economic factors. Been does this sound familiar? Oh? 320 00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 1: Think our buddy may have been ahead of his time. 321 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:19,560 Speaker 3: Huh. 322 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 1: So what we're showing you here is even economists that 323 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 1: are largely disconnected from the inner world of Bhutan or 324 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:32,200 Speaker 1: the wider spiritual world of Buddhism, they heard this philosophy 325 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:35,880 Speaker 1: and they said, yeah, maybe there's something missing, so much 326 00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:40,040 Speaker 1: so that in two thousand and five, four hundred people 327 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 1: from a dozen plus countries got together in Nova Scotia 328 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,680 Speaker 1: for a conference where they said, let's try to reimagine 329 00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: the dismal science of economics. And also that is the 330 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:57,159 Speaker 1: street name for the study of economies. It's called the 331 00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:58,120 Speaker 1: dismal science. 332 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:01,560 Speaker 3: Are you serious? I am so serious. That's incredible. That's 333 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 3: why I didn't pursue it. I had no idea is 334 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:08,680 Speaker 3: that that? Yeah? Wow, okay, that so much makes sense now. 335 00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 3: But this included in that four hundred three dozen representatives 336 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:19,440 Speaker 3: from Ding Ding Ding, Bhutan, including monks, government officials, teachers, 337 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 3: and others you know involved in this kind of you know, 338 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:28,719 Speaker 3: philosophy of measuring a country's success by the happiness of 339 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 3: its citizens. Imagine that the idea of building a content 340 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:36,440 Speaker 3: fulfilled and happy and equitable society. 341 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, oh, and don't get it twisted. We have to 342 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 1: put this part in. The people of Bhutan are by 343 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 1: a large not rich at all. While household incomes in 344 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: Bhutan are still amid the world's lowest, especially if you 345 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 1: look at GDP bup bup bup, bup up up. We 346 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:04,720 Speaker 1: know that the policies enacted under the idea prioritizing happiness 347 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 1: have resulted in higher quality of life, in higher life expectancy. 348 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 1: From nineteen eighty four to nineteen ninety eight, just a 349 00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 1: little more than a decade, life expectancy increased by nineteen years. 350 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 3: And you might be thinking, well, as history progresses, life 351 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,800 Speaker 3: expectancy does tend to go up. But this, I think 352 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 3: we could all argue, is even outside of the norm 353 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,920 Speaker 3: of you know, maybe what would just happen organically by 354 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:36,640 Speaker 3: the availability of medicine and medical technology and things like that. 355 00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's stunning, It is astonishing, and the country is 356 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:50,040 Speaker 1: still extremely strict about development. At least sixty to seventy two. 357 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 1: I think seventy two percent of its country remains forested. 358 00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:59,400 Speaker 1: It does welcome a limited supply of wealthy tourists. We'll 359 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,399 Speaker 1: talk about it at the end because I'm going to 360 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:03,320 Speaker 1: try to pitch you with Max and going with me. 361 00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 1: And it makes money by exporting hydro power to India 362 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: because it's up in the mountains, you know, it's got 363 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:11,560 Speaker 1: that glacial connect. 364 00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, but you know, I think the focus here, or 365 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 3: the takeaway is that the incredible prioritization of their natural 366 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:22,480 Speaker 3: resources and their history and the you know, beauty of 367 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,320 Speaker 3: their country. Ben you mentioned I think it was called 368 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:27,480 Speaker 3: the Tiger's Nest at the top, which is one of 369 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 3: those fortified situations, you know, that one of the early 370 00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:34,160 Speaker 3: rulers of the country, you know, focused on. They're literally 371 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:37,360 Speaker 3: these gorgeous kind of I don't know I'm saying Pagoda 372 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,400 Speaker 3: esque type structures because that's just what I liken them too. 373 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 3: But they're mounted like on the sides of these incredible 374 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:49,560 Speaker 3: steep cliff sides, and it's an absolute marvel of engineering 375 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 3: in and of itself, and that's the kind of stuff 376 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,480 Speaker 3: that they're not gonna let people mess with, you know. 377 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,439 Speaker 3: And you can't hike that trail, you know, up the mountain. 378 00:23:57,480 --> 00:24:01,080 Speaker 3: It's called the Tigers Nests and it's like very difficult 379 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 3: pass to hike. But you see all this beautiful stuff 380 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:05,840 Speaker 3: that is an example of the way they preserve their 381 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:09,120 Speaker 3: history and their their natural you know features. 382 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:13,959 Speaker 1: And despite what longtime listeners may know about me as 383 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: an entity, I love monasteries. Have you gone to the 384 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 1: monastery in Conyers. 385 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 3: We've talked about it that I've got to, we got 386 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,200 Speaker 3: we got to, and I really want to. Next. 387 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:26,000 Speaker 1: Do you want to go with us to a monastery? 388 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 1: I promise there will be no hot air balloons. 389 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 3: We'll even provide a mantra for you. 390 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm totally doing a monastor. Actually a few 391 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 2: months back, when I was in New York, I was 392 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 2: sitting Noel texts photos. 393 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:38,479 Speaker 3: I was in Uh. 394 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,119 Speaker 2: My friends really wanted to go to the Lego store, 395 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 2: which I was like, okay, and I was like, I 396 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:45,680 Speaker 2: don't want a Lego store. In right across street was 397 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:49,040 Speaker 2: a giant cathedral. The Giant Cathedral, which was the most 398 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:52,280 Speaker 2: capitalistic place I went in all of New York, the 399 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 2: Lego store, the cathedral, so much more capitalistic. It was like, yeah, 400 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:04,400 Speaker 2: one can years ago everything with all. 401 00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:06,879 Speaker 1: That money goes directly to God, though, and I forgive 402 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:08,400 Speaker 1: you for not texting me as well. 403 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 3: That is the spirit of Buddhism. 404 00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,359 Speaker 1: But the Catholic Monastery Our Lady of the Holy Spirit 405 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 1: out in Conyers is great. 406 00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:19,159 Speaker 3: Get to go visit if you have a chance. 407 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,840 Speaker 1: They're not going to try to proselytize with you. They've 408 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,000 Speaker 1: got also an awesome Bondzeye Museum. The Tiger's Nest in 409 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:32,000 Speaker 1: the local language is Pero Taksong. So this becomes the 410 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: official goal. Gross national happiness becomes the official goal of 411 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 1: the government of Bhutan in the enshrine it in the 412 00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 1: Constitution which has enacted on July eighteenth, two thousand and eight. 413 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 1: So from nineteen seventy two to two thousand and eight, 414 00:25:54,960 --> 00:26:00,840 Speaker 1: the king who had this epiphany has been working ardently 415 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:06,120 Speaker 1: toward this goal. And look for the more cynical amid us. 416 00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 1: This may sound like a performative political thing. 417 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 3: But. 418 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,960 Speaker 1: This is where we get to another I think very 419 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 1: wholesome piece of ridiculous history, it's neat. 420 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:19,280 Speaker 3: It's kind of weird. 421 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: So the leaders of Bhutad and the king this is 422 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 1: still pretty much an absolute monarchy until two thousand and eight. 423 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:31,919 Speaker 1: They evaluate happiness through multiple lenses and they get to 424 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: the idea of what government makes people or gives them 425 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,840 Speaker 1: the best chance for happiness, and they say, let's try democracy, 426 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 1: and no, I think this stood out to both of us. 427 00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 3: The people did not love the idea now, and that's 428 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,040 Speaker 3: why it's a really complicated thing. Immediately you're like, Okay, 429 00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:54,119 Speaker 3: that's unusual, but it is sort of there's multiple ways 430 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 3: to look at it where it's like, on the one hand, 431 00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 3: you could argue that maybe they were just so you 432 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:04,879 Speaker 3: to existing under a under that form of government that 433 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:07,400 Speaker 3: they were kind of spooked. But then you can also 434 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,400 Speaker 3: look at it as like it was just working for 435 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:13,439 Speaker 3: them and they believed in the benevolence of their leader, 436 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 3: because like, dictatorships are only I think truly bad when 437 00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:21,960 Speaker 3: the leader is corrupt, you know, and there's no real 438 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:24,120 Speaker 3: focus on the people. But it would seem that their 439 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:27,400 Speaker 3: king really did care about the people and made choices 440 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 3: that directly benefited the people. Yeah. 441 00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:34,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, the people of Bhutah. The Bhutanese were super on 442 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: board with this. They loved the king, as this is 443 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:42,119 Speaker 1: a religious figure. The king is the one who came 444 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:44,200 Speaker 1: to the folks and said, all right, we're going to 445 00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 1: try out democracy in some form technically constitutional monarchy, and 446 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 1: this tested his otherwise absolute rule. If you look at 447 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,600 Speaker 1: news reports of the time, you'll see that people in Bhutah, 448 00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 1: like you said, Dol, we're apprehensive, they were reluctant to 449 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 1: embrace this. And I love that you're pointing out context 450 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,679 Speaker 1: here because if we go to an interview with the 451 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:14,399 Speaker 1: country's first democratically elected prime minister, who's got a really 452 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,960 Speaker 1: interesting name, it feels part Bhutanese and for some reason 453 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,040 Speaker 1: part Victorian England. 454 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 3: A little bit. Yeah me, why Thinley? Why Thinley? I 455 00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 3: don't know if that's very unusual. 456 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 1: We've got a response from him in a long form 457 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,119 Speaker 1: interview he had with the Council on Foreign Relations where 458 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:37,200 Speaker 1: he was put in a weird situation where as one 459 00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 1: of the first democratically elected officials, he had to explain 460 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 1: why the country was maybe not super on board with 461 00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,000 Speaker 1: democracy and the visa Keen. 462 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 3: It's also like, I mean not to be too I 463 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,400 Speaker 3: already kind of get it. I mean, look at how 464 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 3: democracy works in other parts of the country and also 465 00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:59,640 Speaker 3: in that region. So many failed democracies I could totally 466 00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 3: get on with thinking that maybe it was not the 467 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 3: best experiment to try, right and you know, and he 468 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 3: put it this way, we'll break it up. Like you said, 469 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 3: the people were not keen on bringing the kind of 470 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,880 Speaker 3: change that, in their eyes and in their mind could 471 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 3: not be very different from what they saw in the 472 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 3: world at large, and in particular in our neighboring countries 473 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 3: in South Asia. 474 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 1: In many of the countries than they continues, democracy had 475 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,120 Speaker 1: failed or was in the process of failing, and leading 476 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: to tremendous upheavals strife among the people. 477 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 3: In some cases, they have seen so much violence that 478 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 3: people felt that under the benevolent rule of a king 479 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 3: who was so very popular, who was revered, loved and 480 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 3: adore by the people, they had the. 481 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,760 Speaker 1: Best and they were not about to give up the 482 00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 1: best that they had for somebody that, as I said, 483 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,800 Speaker 1: could perhaps not be different from what they saw. 484 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:55,040 Speaker 3: Elsewhere one percent. And he goes on. So they were anxious, 485 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,280 Speaker 3: but the king prevailed over them, saying that even though 486 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:01,160 Speaker 3: the final choice must be theirs. They must realize that 487 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 3: the king becomes the leader only by the accident of 488 00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:07,320 Speaker 3: birth boom boom boom, the accident of birth bens and 489 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,160 Speaker 3: not by merit or virtue. He's literally pointing out, like 490 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 3: to the people under a monarchy, the problems with a 491 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 3: monarchy of which he himself is the beneficiary, right, the 492 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:22,640 Speaker 3: leader goes on, and that to place the future of 493 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 3: a country in the hands of such a person is 494 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 3: not in the long term interest of the country. 495 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: Now, can you give me some raucous applaws? 496 00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 3: I love that quote. Now, guys, if you want to 497 00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 3: pick me, you know, as your leader. I mean, I'm 498 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,640 Speaker 3: not saying this from an opportunistic standpoint. I'm more than 499 00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:42,960 Speaker 3: willing to serve, just not as your king. You know. 500 00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:45,440 Speaker 3: That's what he said. Yeah, that's so cool. 501 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,280 Speaker 1: And as a guy who, as you know, based on 502 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,960 Speaker 1: my past centuries, I am very anti monarchy, I just 503 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 1: want to take a moment and appreciate how wholesomely ridiculous 504 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 1: this is. The people are saying they don't want democracy, 505 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:05,320 Speaker 1: the king who could make them do that instead does 506 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,040 Speaker 1: way of open hand, and it's like, hey, just to 507 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:12,000 Speaker 1: be honest, I was just born in this position, you 508 00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 1: know what I mean, technically anybody could have been king. 509 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:18,920 Speaker 3: He is a benevolence dictator in a way. 510 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, He's like, we've got to all be part of 511 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,360 Speaker 1: this experiment for it to work in the long term. 512 00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:29,000 Speaker 1: It's a topsy turvy situation because historically most kings commit 513 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 1: great acts of violence upon their subjects just to maintain 514 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:36,280 Speaker 1: their power. And this guy is saying, hey, we're all cool, 515 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 1: let's try let's try to make this a long term thing. 516 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:45,040 Speaker 1: I mean, Bhutan is certainly not a perfect place by 517 00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: any means. There are great concerns about the treatment of 518 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:55,600 Speaker 1: the Nepalese population. But the courage that exhibits in questioning 519 00:31:55,680 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 1: a fundamental assumption of the modern world that money means happiness. 520 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: We know science proves money does not equate to happiness 521 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,480 Speaker 1: after a certain threshold of income, but it gains the 522 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: rest of the world something to think about. And all 523 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: the conversation is continuing today at the World Economic Forum, 524 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,080 Speaker 1: at the CFR, at all the you know, the big 525 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,560 Speaker 1: the big movers and shakers. Internationally, it's it's happening at 526 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 1: the United Nations, and we have to wonder, could this 527 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 1: only work in a very small, isolated place high in 528 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 1: the Himalaya, the so called Kingdom of Heaven, or just 529 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: maybe could something like gross domestic happiness also make life 530 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 1: a little better for all of us schmucks down here 531 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 1: off the mountain. 532 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 3: You know, Ben, we just had a big election here 533 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:45,480 Speaker 3: in this country, and I'm really hoping that they go 534 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 3: the gross domestic happiness route. Wouldn't that be cool? I'm 535 00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,480 Speaker 3: I'm choosing to be optimistic about. 536 00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,240 Speaker 1: This, all right, We got a ven diagram. I'm a 537 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:56,520 Speaker 1: nihilistic optimist. 538 00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:00,479 Speaker 3: Okay, cool, you mean in the middle somewhere there we go. 539 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:04,880 Speaker 1: So this is a story that we found uplifting. There's 540 00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:07,959 Speaker 1: much more to the story. We'd like to end it 541 00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:12,600 Speaker 1: with just some quick tangents in trivia about a country 542 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 1: will hopefully get to travel to one day. 543 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:20,560 Speaker 3: That's right. In addition to the what is it the 544 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:24,160 Speaker 3: Last Changri law, it also has a really cool nickname, 545 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 3: the Land of the thunder Dragon boom boom boom boom. Yeah, 546 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 3: he say, isn't exactly as menacing as it seems. That 547 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:35,880 Speaker 3: it's not a Kaiju size, you know, Godzilla esque creature, 548 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 3: and it's. 549 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:42,719 Speaker 1: It's like going to a town where they have a 550 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:48,000 Speaker 1: mascot that's everywhere. The thunder dragon is in architecture, It's 551 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:51,600 Speaker 1: depicted in art. You see it on the nation's flag. 552 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 3: Drook is what it's known as colloquially, that's the official name. 553 00:33:56,280 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 3: I believe it's it's actually part of their mythology, not 554 00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 3: an actual living creature at all. No, it's more like, 555 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, it's based on science. Maybe they 556 00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,400 Speaker 3: exist within the lore and the context of their belief system. 557 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, they're home to a ton of endangered animals too, 558 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,279 Speaker 1: so this would be a cool place to try to 559 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 1: catch a cryptid if you're on board. There are no 560 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 1: traffic lights in Bhutad at all. If you go to 561 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,840 Speaker 1: the current capital, Timpo, then you'll see there is a 562 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:36,000 Speaker 1: there's like a decorated stand where traffic police manually direct traffic, 563 00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:37,520 Speaker 1: similar to North Korea. 564 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:41,759 Speaker 3: Like the lollipop men, you know, and in the UK. Yeah, 565 00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 3: I was about to say, is it just like the 566 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,319 Speaker 3: honor system ben like as far as zoo goes when 567 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,080 Speaker 3: and is this a product of maybe they don't have 568 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,920 Speaker 3: the kind of modern, you know, traffic build up that 569 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:54,439 Speaker 3: we see in other parts of the world. It seems yeah, 570 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:58,320 Speaker 3: way dangerous, way fewer cars that would makes sense. Yeah. 571 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,760 Speaker 1: Also the national sport following up on our earlier sports 572 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,239 Speaker 1: phase is archery. It's not the kind of archery you're 573 00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 1: thinking about. It's a big deal. If you have the 574 00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 1: privilege to visit Bhutan. Pretty much any family you meet 575 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:15,879 Speaker 1: is going to have a bow and arrow set and 576 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,680 Speaker 1: they will properly drop everything if you want to go 577 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:20,720 Speaker 1: learn archery. 578 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 3: How is it different than maybe the Olympic kind of 579 00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,160 Speaker 3: versions of archery that we might be aware of. I 580 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:29,440 Speaker 3: know archery is also real big in like Korea. Yeah, yeah, 581 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 3: it's in Bhutan. 582 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:37,319 Speaker 1: It has a religious significance and social significance. Also, the 583 00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 1: targets are placed differently than they would be in the Olympics. 584 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,719 Speaker 1: I still can't believe the cryptid point. I wasn't even 585 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,000 Speaker 1: thinking about this man until we just started talking about it. 586 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,400 Speaker 1: With over seventy percent of the land covered by forest. 587 00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 3: Forested, yeah, way of the same with India. We just 588 00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:56,279 Speaker 3: did an episode recently and stuff that I want you 589 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:58,719 Speaker 3: to know about the cryptids of India, And a big 590 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:02,560 Speaker 3: reason for that possibility is how how much impassable you 591 00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:05,319 Speaker 3: know forest there is and how much opportunity there might 592 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:08,080 Speaker 3: be for something to exist kind of under the radar, 593 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:09,720 Speaker 3: and it's very similar here in Bhutan. 594 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:14,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's also we've heard of carbon neutral countries. Bhuton 595 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:19,960 Speaker 1: is a carbon negative country. They make, you know, they 596 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 1: make the average amount of CO two that you would expect, 597 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 1: but their forest ground captures all of it, so it's 598 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:34,920 Speaker 1: actually eating carbon from other parts of the environment. Bhuton 599 00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:39,000 Speaker 1: is better for better for the global environment. 600 00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:42,920 Speaker 3: That's because they don't mow down the forests. That's that's 601 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:46,080 Speaker 3: a whole part of their philosophy, and they're governing principles 602 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 3: to not do that kind of thing and not to 603 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:52,360 Speaker 3: prioritize industry over you know, the kinds of things that 604 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:58,200 Speaker 3: will hopefully help preventing global catastrophe. They listen to the Lorex, right, 605 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 3: I always listen to Lorax. 606 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:05,080 Speaker 1: There is one thing I wanted to surprise surprise you 607 00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:08,120 Speaker 1: guys with which might not be familiar to everyone. Just 608 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:10,560 Speaker 1: if you get to chance to travel to Bata and 609 00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:14,960 Speaker 1: first off, send us photos, we love that. Secondly, you're 610 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 1: gonna see a lot of penis artwork. 611 00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:19,879 Speaker 3: Ah. Still, I'm down with that. There, Yeah, I'm down 612 00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:20,200 Speaker 3: with that. 613 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:24,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, Flanking doorways, hanging off rooftops painted on homes in 614 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:25,920 Speaker 1: window displays. 615 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,560 Speaker 3: You had me at penis artwork. Yeah he didn't. You 616 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,080 Speaker 3: needn't say no more, Ben, I was. 617 00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:31,799 Speaker 2: I was on the fence, like all the climbing stuff 618 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 2: and then penis artwork. 619 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,400 Speaker 3: I'm in. You had me a penis BND and you 620 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 3: had me a penis. You had me a pen It's 621 00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:43,960 Speaker 3: I'm in the say no more, say less. It's also 622 00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:49,480 Speaker 3: highly regulated or illegal to smoke, right, isn't that the thing? 623 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: It was the first nation in the world to ban 624 00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:56,759 Speaker 1: tobacco for a while until the pandemic kicked in and 625 00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: a lot of smuggling happened over the border. Uh so 626 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:02,560 Speaker 1: now it's tightly controlled. 627 00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 3: And well, I think that's interesting. I think all of 628 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:08,240 Speaker 3: us here ridiculous history aren't the biggest proponents of outright 629 00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:12,120 Speaker 3: prohibition because we know that it just leads to smuggling. 630 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:15,280 Speaker 3: It just leads to black market stuff, which leads to crime. 631 00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:17,320 Speaker 3: And I just think, so this is to me is 632 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:20,560 Speaker 3: a little short sighted. You know, I guess maybe coming 633 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 3: from a good place, but it's it's tough. You know, 634 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:25,719 Speaker 3: no one we're going to stop their vices just because 635 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,400 Speaker 3: the government tells them. Max has a cigar that would. 636 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:29,480 Speaker 2: Probably the cigar away. 637 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,160 Speaker 3: I will be very you can prime Max's cigar from 638 00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 3: his cold dead hand for one CS a year. Okay, 639 00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:39,759 Speaker 3: wonder you're on record. It's fine, but I have but 640 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:41,240 Speaker 3: I just have three in a drawer. 641 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:46,880 Speaker 1: It's uh, this is where we learn to that point. 642 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:49,680 Speaker 1: Bhuton is definitely a work in progress. 643 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:50,520 Speaker 3: Uh. 644 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,640 Speaker 1: It's been a dream country of mine to visit for 645 00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:57,719 Speaker 1: many years. It hasn't worked out yet. Visiting Bhuton is 646 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:02,520 Speaker 1: quite expensive. Just getting over there is expensive, and if 647 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:05,200 Speaker 1: you are American, you have to pay. 648 00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 3: It used to be two one hundred a day. It 649 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:08,880 Speaker 3: used to be higher. 650 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:11,880 Speaker 1: Now it's about one hundred dollars a night every twenty 651 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,200 Speaker 1: four hours just to be there, just to be there 652 00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:17,160 Speaker 1: as an American, not counting hotel. 653 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:19,799 Speaker 3: But is it also affordable though? Like is are the 654 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:22,000 Speaker 3: hotel fees? I know a lot of times in Asian 655 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:25,239 Speaker 3: countries is expensive to get there, But then the you 656 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:27,759 Speaker 3: know the actual cost of staying for a while or 657 00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:30,279 Speaker 3: not too bad? I hope we find out together. I 658 00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 3: would like to. Yeah, sounds like a real great idea. 659 00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,440 Speaker 1: The visa is only forty bucks a pop. That's great, 660 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:38,880 Speaker 1: that's actually not too crazy, but we will have to 661 00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:41,440 Speaker 1: I know not all of us are fans of flying 662 00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:44,560 Speaker 1: or heights. We will have to be ready to fly 663 00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:47,799 Speaker 1: into one of the world's most difficult airports. 664 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:52,840 Speaker 3: Okay, difficult, how like narrow like perhaps some mountain I mean, 665 00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:55,399 Speaker 3: we know it's mountainous. You probably have to come in 666 00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:58,080 Speaker 3: for a landing between some crazy peaks. 667 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: I gotta link here from CNN from our pale little 668 00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:05,680 Speaker 1: at Marcus where you can see what it looks like. 669 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:10,480 Speaker 1: There's one landing airway or runway. There's one takeoff. They're 670 00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:15,080 Speaker 1: both very short. You called it man, there are this 671 00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 1: is between two eighteen thousand foot peaks. When you're landing 672 00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,239 Speaker 1: at the very last minute, just to make it in, 673 00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,920 Speaker 1: you have to take this crazy, this crazy turn. 674 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 3: Dog leg turn. I'm seeing like I got a gift 675 00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:32,400 Speaker 3: on the CNN travel site that shows you from the 676 00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:36,600 Speaker 3: cockpit perspective, and it is serious manure. It's a make 677 00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:40,239 Speaker 3: your peace with God stuff. It's show jumping here real quick. 678 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:42,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, I just want to say, like you know, as 679 00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:43,800 Speaker 2: it's been staying on the show, I'm not the biggest 680 00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:44,319 Speaker 2: fan of flying. 681 00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 3: I've gotten better about it. I'm also not a fan 682 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:47,439 Speaker 3: of heights, but like. 683 00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:51,560 Speaker 2: This is terrifying, but it's also like super cool that 684 00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:52,160 Speaker 2: I would do it. 685 00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:55,640 Speaker 3: And I vote Philip J. Fry. This is a cool 686 00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:59,040 Speaker 3: way to die. Yeah, that's what. 687 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:02,839 Speaker 1: I That's what I say with whomever we're sitting next 688 00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:06,040 Speaker 1: to in the plane. I'm like, hey, good news. Though, 689 00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:08,880 Speaker 1: right before we hit the turn and have to grab 690 00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,280 Speaker 1: our beat me here, have to grab our ocean handles, 691 00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:13,919 Speaker 1: I'd be like, hey, this is a pretty cool way 692 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:14,279 Speaker 1: to die. 693 00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:17,560 Speaker 3: Right. There's a really fun quote the floor the floor. 694 00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:19,960 Speaker 3: There's a really fun quote the very beginning of this 695 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,200 Speaker 3: article on Sean and Travel. It said, there's a Buddha 696 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,160 Speaker 3: in the cockpit. The orange robed icon looks on as 697 00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:28,680 Speaker 3: the pilot speedily executes a dramatic last minute turn to 698 00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 3: land the A three nineteen on the slender runway. A 699 00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:34,399 Speaker 3: dozen passengers, some of whom have spent the last few 700 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:38,320 Speaker 3: minutes white knuckling the seat armor res break out into applause. 701 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's fine to clap on that plane because 702 00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:46,360 Speaker 1: you're also getting flown by a celebrity. In aviation, even 703 00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:49,000 Speaker 1: now in twenty twenty four, there are only about fifty 704 00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:53,320 Speaker 1: pilots on the entire planet who are qualified to land 705 00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,560 Speaker 1: or take off from this place, so I would pause it. 706 00:41:56,840 --> 00:42:01,080 Speaker 1: If you land safely, you have already won ritual approval 707 00:42:01,239 --> 00:42:03,080 Speaker 1: from the Kingdom of the thunder Dragon. 708 00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:05,719 Speaker 3: I love it, man, what a fun episode. Ben, Thanks 709 00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:08,440 Speaker 3: for putting this one together. This is so interesting. I 710 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:10,800 Speaker 3: didn't know any of this stuff, and maybe given the 711 00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 3: slightly uncertain political moment that we're in here in the 712 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:15,719 Speaker 3: United States, whatever your political persuasions are, this is not 713 00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:19,400 Speaker 3: a political show. Stuff like this is comforting. Man. I 714 00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:20,240 Speaker 3: have to say. 715 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:24,799 Speaker 1: Yeah, just to check in, and I am so impressed 716 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:30,480 Speaker 1: by his excellency, you know, the sheer balls to say 717 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:36,720 Speaker 1: I want what's best for us, and it's so few 718 00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,399 Speaker 1: monarchs ever admit the lottery of birth right. 719 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:41,479 Speaker 3: So figure it out. 720 00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,240 Speaker 1: If your friends are happy, if your people are happy. 721 00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:46,480 Speaker 3: That is such a cool thing to do. 722 00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:49,080 Speaker 1: And you know what else is a very cool thing 723 00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,200 Speaker 1: tuning into this show ridiculous historians. Thank you so much. 724 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:56,839 Speaker 3: Yeah, so cool. Yeah, and a huge thanks again, Ben 725 00:42:56,840 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 3: for putting this brief together. This is a super fun 726 00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:03,279 Speaker 3: topic and I feel a little bit better after talking 727 00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:06,120 Speaker 3: about it with you. Oh Man, Bootney's cuisine. We didn't 728 00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:09,200 Speaker 3: have time to get to it. But buddy, all right, 729 00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:11,360 Speaker 3: we'll keep where I said, buddy, all right, it's a 730 00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:13,360 Speaker 3: good way. What are we talking here? Does it have 731 00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:17,480 Speaker 3: any connections to maybe cuisine i'd be aware of or similarities? 732 00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:19,520 Speaker 3: Oh geez, you're gonna love it. You're gonna love it. 733 00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:21,520 Speaker 3: And our pal Matt Frederick will love it too. Do 734 00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:27,520 Speaker 3: they do curries? What are we talking here? Come on, 735 00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:28,680 Speaker 3: we've got all right. 736 00:43:28,800 --> 00:43:33,719 Speaker 1: So Bootney's cuisine is similar in some it's a transit point, 737 00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:37,400 Speaker 1: right because we've got Indian cuisine coming in. We've got 738 00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:42,920 Speaker 1: a certain kind of rice with a specifically unique nutty flavor, 739 00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,080 Speaker 1: and it's the only rice that can grow at that 740 00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:49,719 Speaker 1: elevation in the world. They love red chili's like love love. 741 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:51,840 Speaker 3: And it looks like they actually do you know, a 742 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,640 Speaker 3: little bit different from what Indian cuisine folks might be 743 00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:56,719 Speaker 3: familiar with. They do noodle dishes as well. 744 00:43:56,920 --> 00:44:00,800 Speaker 1: Mm hmm, yeah, they love a noodle dish. There's also 745 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,839 Speaker 1: a lot of cheese, which got me back into the game, 746 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:04,399 Speaker 1: and that. 747 00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:08,360 Speaker 3: Is not something you typically associate with with the Asian cuisine. 748 00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:12,520 Speaker 3: I mean, you do have the delicious panier in Indian cuisine, 749 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:14,920 Speaker 3: which I have become a big fan of in recent years. 750 00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,600 Speaker 3: But yeah, okay, I'm sold. Do we have Are there 751 00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,960 Speaker 3: any Botanese restaurants out on Buford Highway here in Atlanta? 752 00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,640 Speaker 1: We're gonna have to get together and figure that one out. 753 00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:25,319 Speaker 3: On You're out, Ben, You're right. 754 00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,040 Speaker 1: I think you're right too, Noel ed of course, big 755 00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:31,920 Speaker 1: big thanks to our super producer, mister Max Williams. Big 756 00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:36,640 Speaker 1: big thanks to his bio bro Alex Williams, our resident composer. 757 00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:41,880 Speaker 3: Indeed huge thanks to Jonathan Strickland, The Quiz, the aj Bahamas, Jacobs, 758 00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:43,600 Speaker 3: the Puzzler. 759 00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,239 Speaker 1: Big big thanks to Rachel Big Spinach, Lance, big big 760 00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:51,160 Speaker 1: thanks to Eves, Jeff Coates and our pale Christopher hasiotis 761 00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:54,360 Speaker 1: here in spirit. And big big thanks Noel to you 762 00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:58,440 Speaker 1: and Max for agreeing with me to try to get 763 00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:01,440 Speaker 1: to BA Todd. We should we should write to accounting 764 00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:02,799 Speaker 1: now just get a hand of it. 765 00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:05,360 Speaker 3: That'll be fine with it. We'll see you next time, folks. 766 00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:16,080 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 767 00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:18,280 Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.