Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. Welcome to the Bloomberg
Speaker 1: This Weekend Podcast with David Gura, Christina Raffini, and Lisa Matteo.
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us for today's selection of conversations from
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Speaker 2: Joining us now is Democratic Senator Jean Shehenes. She's the
Speaker 2: ranking Democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and co
Speaker 2: chair of the bipartisan NATO Observer Group. Senator, thank you
Speaker 2: so much for being with us. I first want to
Speaker 2: ask you what your take is on on me with
Speaker 2: you the events.
Speaker 5: Thank you, sir. We have a bit of a delay.
Speaker 2: I apologize I should have known that overnight and the
Speaker 2: impact on the US force position in the Middle East,
Speaker 2: both our military and diplomatic installations.
Speaker 6: Well, I think, like all Americans, I offer my deepest
Speaker 6: condolences to the families of those service members who have
Speaker 6: been lost. Our men and women in the Middle East
Speaker 6: have performed in an outstanding way and they will continue
Speaker 6: to do that. But what we need to do is
Speaker 6: to bring this war to a close and get the
Speaker 6: president to get Iran back to the negotiating table. He
Speaker 6: has not accomplished any of the goals that he set
Speaker 6: out for the war in the beginning, whether it's getting
Speaker 6: rid of the Iran's nuclear program or changing the regime.
Speaker 6: We have a more hardline regime in place. We haven't
Speaker 6: dealt with the enriched uranium that's on site, we haven't
Speaker 6: destroyed the ballistic missile capability. And furthermore, Iran is controlling
Speaker 6: the straight of hor moves and that was never an
Speaker 6: issue before with respect to their nuclear program. They continue
Speaker 6: to support proxies across the Middle East. So now's the
Speaker 6: time to get them back to the table to address
Speaker 6: these issues, because it seems clear that while we are
Speaker 6: going to degrade their capability to finally address all of
Speaker 6: these issues is not going to be possible just by
Speaker 6: a bombing campaign.
Speaker 3: You sit on the Foreign Relations Committee, the Armed Services Committee,
Speaker 3: and I hear you on your call to get her
Speaker 3: on back to the table. But I wonder what route
Speaker 3: you see for doing that. You mentioned the president's goals
Speaker 3: here what they were at the onset of this conflict.
Speaker 7: They have changed.
Speaker 3: There's been the plasticity to them over the.
Speaker 7: Course of this war so far.
Speaker 3: I wonder if it's clear to you what their objectives are,
Speaker 3: and again, how you would get the mary When.
Speaker 6: You say plasticity, I assume you mean they've gone back
Speaker 6: and forth. Yes, when you say plasticity. What we've seen
Speaker 6: is that the President announces different goals from day to day.
Speaker 6: The problem is there hasn't been a strategy for this war.
Speaker 6: We need a strategy. We need to figure out how
Speaker 6: we're going to get a Ran back to the table
Speaker 6: so that we can actually negotiate. Unfortunately, the president is
Speaker 6: the one page two page memorandum that he announced that
Speaker 6: was signed by Iran in the United States was open
Speaker 6: to vast interpretation and it basically provided Iran everything they wanted,
Speaker 6: and yet they're still not satisfied. So we've got to
Speaker 6: have come up with a different strategy, and so far
Speaker 6: the President hasn't shared that with Congress or the American public.
Speaker 6: How he's going to do that.
Speaker 2: I wonder how concerned you are that Iran seems to
Speaker 2: be employing a different strategy now with its tactics with
Speaker 2: attacking these bases. They have different munitions. They're barraging them
Speaker 2: with cheaper munitions before firing the ones that they can
Speaker 2: target better. And there's also reporting in the Wall Street
Speaker 2: Journal that perhaps they are getting targeting information and help
Speaker 2: from either China or Russia. I wonder if you have
Speaker 2: any insight into that intelligence and what you think about
Speaker 2: these tactics if you're concerned about an escalation.
Speaker 6: I don't have any insights beyond what's been publicly reported,
Speaker 6: but it does go to the point that we need
Speaker 6: to get Russia back. We need to address their warren Ukraine.
Speaker 6: We need to continue to degrade their capability, and that's
Speaker 6: what the Ukrainians are doing. We need to put pressure
Speaker 6: on Vladimir Putin. Now is the time there is momentum
Speaker 6: on Ukraine side, and if Ukraine can defeat Russia there,
Speaker 6: then that puts real pressure on them. In the Middle East.
Speaker 6: We need to look at China. One of the things
Speaker 6: that we have just introduced reintroduced this week is the
Speaker 6: Grand Blumenthal Sanctions Bill that would target the top users
Speaker 6: of Russian oil and gas and China is the number
Speaker 6: one user, and if we can shut down their ability
Speaker 6: to access that cheap Russian oil and gas, that has
Speaker 6: a real impact on them, and it restricts their ability
Speaker 6: these in the Middle East.
Speaker 3: Senator, let me ask you about that bill. So there's
Speaker 3: the debate in the Congress about it and what it
Speaker 3: should do. But the President has a lot of latitude here.
Speaker 3: Were it to be passed, he would choose to implement
Speaker 3: those tariffs. Those secondary tariffs are not and I'm very curious,
Speaker 3: service you've been a party to these conversations with the
Speaker 3: White House, with the US Trade representative. Your sense of
Speaker 3: the eagerness or willingness of this administration, the President in
Speaker 3: particular to impose those tariffs if in fact this has
Speaker 3: made law.
Speaker 7: We've seen the.
Speaker 3: Way that he has operated with regard to Russia in
Speaker 3: the past, the unwillingness to impose sanctions and tariffs like
Speaker 3: this previously. Do you think that he's at a point
Speaker 3: at which he would likely put those tariffs of one
Speaker 3: hundred percent in place where he given the ability to
Speaker 3: do so.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 6: The momentum, as I said, is on the side of Ukraine.
Speaker 6: And the fact is this is a very different bill
Speaker 6: than the bill that was originally introduced by Senators Graham
Speaker 6: and Blumenthal. It is much more narrowly crafted. It's aimed
Speaker 6: at the top five users of Russian oil and gas.
Speaker 6: It's aimed at the Shadow Fleet. We've already sanctioned the
Speaker 6: Shadow Fleet from Iran and that's had a real impact
Speaker 6: on their ability to sell oil. So this would have
Speaker 6: a real impact on Russia. And what we know right
Speaker 6: now is that they're losing over thirty thousand casualties a month.
Speaker 6: Their economy has taken a big hit. If we can
Speaker 6: really put pressure on Vladimir Putin, it's going to have
Speaker 6: an impact. That's what this bill is designed to do,
Speaker 6: and what we've seen from it would be a fitting
Speaker 6: tribute to Senator Graham to be able to pass this.
Speaker 6: When we were in Ankara at the NATO summit last week,
Speaker 6: we heard from the White House that they were supportive
Speaker 6: of the legislation. The Treasury and the Trade Representative are
Speaker 6: both supportive. So this is the opportune time to get
Speaker 6: this bill passed. We have sixty two sponsors in the
Speaker 6: Senate now and we're still working on more. So let's
Speaker 6: get this done and let's put pressure on Vladimir Putin
Speaker 6: and shut down his war machine.
Speaker 2: Senator, a little less than an hour ago, the President
Speaker 2: posted on truth Social that Republicans should add Iran to
Speaker 2: that sanctions bill. He says, that's what Lindsay wanted to
Speaker 2: do and was going to happen important. I'm wondering if
Speaker 2: you had any inkling that the late Senator Graham wanted
Speaker 2: to expand that bill to include Iran, and if you
Speaker 2: think the inclusion of sanctions on Iran would either delay
Speaker 2: or compromise all that support you just mentioned.
Speaker 6: Well, Senator Graham never raised the concern about it putting
Speaker 6: Iranian sanctions on the bill. The fact is we have
Speaker 6: significant sanctions on Iran. When the war started, we put
Speaker 6: additional sanctions on Iran. I think if the President wants
Speaker 6: to do that, let's do it in a separate bill.
Speaker 6: But this bill is moving. It's as I said, it's
Speaker 6: targeted in a way that is important, and is comes
Speaker 6: on the heels of the G seven conference where everyone
Speaker 6: including President Trump signed on to communicate that said we
Speaker 6: need to support Ukraine and put more pressure on Putin.
Speaker 6: That was echoed at the NATO summit. We know that
Speaker 6: that's what it's going to take to get Vladimir Putin
Speaker 6: to the table. So far we have not been successful
Speaker 6: at getting him to the negotiating table, and let's put
Speaker 6: more pressure on him to do that.
Speaker 7: Senator, we're talking to you in London.
Speaker 3: As you mentioned, you were an uncer for the NATO
Speaker 3: summit a few days ago, and I'm very curious to
Speaker 3: get your perspective on how Europeans are regarding the United States.
Speaker 3: I think everyone would say this was at least a
Speaker 3: relatively successful summit in the context of past NATO summits.
Speaker 3: The present's been a participant in, but we have seen
Speaker 3: Europeans kind of react or comport themselves differently as the
Speaker 3: US has begun to kind of disengage with some traditional
Speaker 3: aspects of their relationship with Europe. How do you see
Speaker 3: that relationship today? Are you worried about it? What's the
Speaker 3: path forward as you see it?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 6: As you pointed out, the NATO summit was very successful.
Speaker 6: Not only did we highlight the additional spending on defense.
Speaker 6: All thirty two NATO countries are now at two percent
Speaker 6: of GDP, which had been an earlier goal. They're working
Speaker 6: their way up to five percent of GDP. We have
Speaker 6: a number of countries that I think seven now that
Speaker 6: are over three percent, and so it was an opportunity
Speaker 6: both to highlight that and also to highlight the opportunities
Speaker 6: in our defense industrial base. We know that we're addressing
Speaker 6: threats from China and the Indo Pacific, from Russia in Europe,
Speaker 6: from Iran of course in North Korea. We know we've
Speaker 6: got to work together with our allies and partners, and
Speaker 6: we've got to improve our defense industrial base in a
Speaker 6: way that allows us to work more collaborative together to
Speaker 6: do co production. And we focused on that at the
Speaker 6: NATO summit in a way that I think was really important.
Speaker 6: We didn't hear from our European partners that they were
Speaker 6: concerned about the United States. What we heard was the
Speaker 6: importance of all of us working together cooperating. I'm here
Speaker 6: in England with a bipartisan delegation from the Congress to
Speaker 6: for the Farnborough Air Show. It's one of the biggest
Speaker 6: air shows in the world, and the American presence here
Speaker 6: is bigger than it's ever been in the past, and
Speaker 6: everyone's talking about how do we work together, how do
Speaker 6: we continue to innovate to keep America ahead of the
Speaker 6: competition when it comes to aerospace, which is so important
Speaker 6: to our future.
Speaker 2: Senator, I'm assuming you didn't get that gift from Aeroon
Speaker 2: at the NATO summit that some of the other delegates got.
Speaker 2: I think aus we're calling it the Aeroon Special. But
Speaker 2: assuming you didn't go home with any new weapons, I
Speaker 2: do know that you met with Ukraine's President Selensky while
Speaker 2: you were there.
Speaker 5: It seems like this is a very pivotal.
Speaker 2: Time in that conflict, and there's also some time happening
Speaker 2: in Kiev right now inside his government. What was your
Speaker 2: com verciation with Zelensky like and what is your take
Speaker 2: on what's going on with the leadership of the defense
Speaker 2: department in Ukraine right now.
Speaker 6: Well, we talked at the NATO summit about what Ukraine's
Speaker 6: success is about their drone production, their innovation when it
Speaker 6: comes to drones, and how critical that's been to the
Speaker 6: conduct of this war. One of the people who has
Speaker 6: been very important in helping to change that direction when
Speaker 6: it comes to drone production in the new way of
Speaker 6: waging war has been their Defense Minister Federoff, who was
Speaker 6: dismissed by President Zelensky. Now there are demonstrations. I think
Speaker 6: President Zelenski has said he's going to listen to what
Speaker 6: people have to say, and I hope he's going to
Speaker 6: be responsive to that.
Speaker 3: I want to ask you about this period that we're
Speaker 3: in when you look at the Ukraine conflict, this forty
Speaker 3: day period that the President Zelensky's really emphasizing additional strikes
Speaker 3: on Russia. We've seen him strike ships in the Strait
Speaker 3: of Asar as well. How do you view the kind
Speaker 3: of pivotal nature of this moment in that conflict? And
Speaker 3: the images that we saw yesterday from the President's Twitter
Speaker 3: account were really extraordinary, the strikes that Ukraine made on Russia.
Speaker 3: What does it tell you about the trajectory of the
Speaker 3: conflict and indeed what Ukraine needs at this point in
Speaker 3: terms of support.
Speaker 6: Well, again, there's no doubt the momentum is on Ukraine's
Speaker 6: side right now, and that's why we need to be
Speaker 6: thinking about every avenue we can to support Ukraine. We
Speaker 6: saw tremendous support for Ukraine after the NATO summit, pledging
Speaker 6: billions of dollars in support. Looking at President Trump said
Speaker 6: to President Zelenski, we agree you should be able to
Speaker 6: produce the patriot missile and interceptors in Ukraine.
Speaker 5: That was a big step forward.
Speaker 6: And thinking about how we put pressure on Russia now
Speaker 6: and Vladimir Putin is really critical. And that's why this
Speaker 6: Russia sanctions bill that we have that would sanction their
Speaker 6: final antial entities, their oligarchs. Also look at those countries
Speaker 6: that are benefiting from that cheap Russian oil and gas
Speaker 6: and shut that down, because that shuts down the support
Speaker 6: for Russia's war machine. And that's what we need to do.
Speaker 6: Their economy is on the brink, it's teetering. The casualties
Speaker 6: that they're losing are just unbelievable from an America's prospect
Speaker 6: when you think about in less than three months, Russia's
Speaker 6: losing as many people on the battlefield as we lost
Speaker 6: throughout all of Vietnam. So now is the time for
Speaker 6: us to take action. I'm hoping Congress will do this.
Speaker 6: We'll get this bill passed, and think about all the
Speaker 6: other ways that we can try and bring Vladimir Putin
Speaker 6: to the table to end this war centa.
Speaker 2: It does seem that this is at least moving towards
Speaker 2: a level of pressure that Putin really hasn't felt prior
Speaker 2: to this, but there is some concern with that, and
Speaker 2: that is, if you corner someone, they're going to react.
Speaker 2: Are you concerned that a desperate Putin could do something
Speaker 2: really imhorrant, like the use of tactical nukes and what
Speaker 2: can the US or its allies do to try to
Speaker 2: prevent that.
Speaker 6: Well, I think what Vladimir Putin is doing right now
Speaker 6: is already imhorrent. And the concern is that if he's
Speaker 6: successful in Ukraine or even if not, the one place
Speaker 6: where he could escalate is against a NATO country. And
Speaker 6: that's why doing everything we can to bring him to
Speaker 6: the table is critical. Look, he's lost his foothold in
Speaker 6: South America with Venezuela, he's in danger of losing Cuba,
Speaker 6: He's lost his foothold in the Middle East in Syria.
Speaker 6: Now is the time to add to that pressure to
Speaker 6: get him to the table.
Speaker 3: Let me just ask you to look ahead, if you could,
Speaker 3: at the way in which you're going to get more
Speaker 3: answers to questions that you have about the administration strategy
Speaker 3: going forward. Here, I'm curious what's front of mine for you,
Speaker 3: what you'd like to learn more about, and if indeed
Speaker 3: there has been any improvement in the ability of the
Speaker 3: committees on which you sit again, Armed Services and Foreign Relations,
Speaker 3: in getting information about strategy from this administration.
Speaker 6: Well, not that I'm aware of. We have a hearing
Speaker 6: before Appropriations on Tuesday afternoon where Secretary heg Seth and
Speaker 6: Secretary Rollins will come in for their supplemental budget request.
Speaker 6: We have very few details about what they're planning and
Speaker 6: what that would mean going forward for the war in Iran.
Speaker 6: We need to see that transparency. The fact is, in
Speaker 6: order to be successful, Congress and the administration should be
Speaker 6: working together, and the President and the Secretary of heg
Speaker 6: Seth have not provided any of those details.
Speaker 7: Senator, thank you very much. That Senator Gen.
Speaker 3: Shaheen of New Hampshire, where sits on the Foreign Relations,
Speaker 3: Armed Services and Appropriations committees, joining us today from London
Speaker 3: ahead of the Farmborough Airshow.
Speaker 7: Appreciate your time. Thank you very much.
Speaker 5: Thank you, ma'am.
Speaker 2: All right, we're going to go now to the latest
Speaker 2: headlines with Lisa Mittaio.
Speaker 4: You gotta guys let us recalls tied to a cyclost
Speaker 4: sporasis outbreak. It continues to spread and now select Walmart
Speaker 4: locations they have removed four bag lettuce salad products manufactured
Speaker 4: by Taylor Farms. The retailer said they pull the items
Speaker 4: which are sold under its market Side Store brand as
Speaker 4: a precaution. Now there have been no confirmed illnesses tied
Speaker 4: to those products. Ontario Premier Doug Ford is fiery back
Speaker 4: at the President Trump's criticism of Canada's wildfire response. The
Speaker 4: President took this truth social on Friday, threatening higher tariffs
Speaker 4: to deal with the costs of quote filthy polluted air now.
Speaker 4: Ford called the President's rhetoric unacceptable and suggested dropping lumber
Speaker 4: teriffs would help clear forest for it. Said Ontario has
Speaker 4: one hundred ninety one active wildfires. Poor air quality not
Speaker 4: affecting today's World Cup finals when Argentina defends its title
Speaker 4: against Spain in New Jersey this afternoon. Now, Argentina looking
Speaker 4: for its fourth title and battling, and they're battling Spain,
Speaker 4: who is going for their set. And the match today
Speaker 4: is going to be attended by eighty thousand spectators, including
Speaker 4: President Donald Trump, and fifty thousand fans will attend a
Speaker 4: free watch party on Central Park's Great Lawn. A Host
Speaker 4: Committee study shows the World Cup has produced one point
Speaker 4: two billion dollars in direct economic impact during the group
Speaker 4: stage period and FIFA yes also introducing a star studied
Speaker 4: closing ceremony alongside a first of its kind halftime show
Speaker 4: for the final. It'll feature Madonna, Shakira, Justin Bieber and
Speaker 4: b T S. David and Christina.
Speaker 7: I'm excited for Shakira. That's akira sperennial presence.
Speaker 5: I follow the guy who makes her skirts online.
Speaker 8: They're very very friend g A.
Speaker 7: Right, that's an interesting tidbit.
Speaker 2: All right, this is gonna be a hard pivot, right
Speaker 2: and as a less fun topic nowe all right, as
Speaker 2: we just talked about with Senator Shaheen, Russia hit Ukraine
Speaker 2: for the largest ballistic missile barrages so far in the
Speaker 2: four year old war. Ukrainian President Lensky says it involved
Speaker 2: more than fifty missiles and one hundred and twenty attack drones,
Speaker 2: and now he's asking for more interceptors and more sanctions
Speaker 2: on Russia.
Speaker 7: After Ukraine struck in Russia.
Speaker 3: Yesterday, I spoke to President Trump's former Deputy Secretary of
Speaker 3: State at the Aspen Security Forum. Steve Began told me
Speaker 3: President Trump truly wants piece, but Vladimir Putin does not
Speaker 3: share that goal.
Speaker 9: He sees war is a wasteful exercise. He also also
Speaker 9: sees it as a failure of diplomacy, a failure of negotiation,
Speaker 9: very much in the context of how president President Trump
Speaker 9: likes to approach global tensions like this. But he's got
Speaker 9: a bit of the conceit of the negotiator too, which
Speaker 9: is I think he believes everything is negotiable. In this case,
Speaker 9: It's just not the case. Putin doesn't want a negotiation.
Speaker 9: Putin wants Ukraine, and he wants all of it. American
Speaker 9: presidents are President Trump and even to a greater extent,
Speaker 9: President Biden before him, wake up every morning and think
Speaker 9: how do I avoid a direct war with Russia? But
Speaker 9: Vladimir Putin wakes up every morning and thinks, how do
Speaker 9: I win a war against America? And I think that
Speaker 9: mismatch is very much on display. No matter how much
Speaker 9: President Trump wants a peaceful end of this war, Vladimir
Speaker 9: put It was not going to give it to him,
Speaker 9: because peace is not his objective.
Speaker 5: It's a really interesting point.
Speaker 2: I think America for decades has failed to understand some
Speaker 2: of its foes rationale in the ways of thinking, and
Speaker 2: Russia especially, we just don't seem to frame ideas and
Speaker 2: concepts and diplomacy the same way a lot of times.
Speaker 3: And I think it's interesting, as you were talking just
Speaker 3: about what a cornered Putin might do Secretary of Big
Speaker 3: and expressing very similar concerns here about the irrationality of
Speaker 3: somebody back into a corner in the way in which
Speaker 3: it seems like President Putin is at least in small forms.
Speaker 2: Percent but doesn't be like, here's the options. But that's
Speaker 2: always dangerous. It's also dangerous, you know, power of pores,
Speaker 2: a vacuum. If he goes, if he ever goes, what
Speaker 2: replaces him?
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I should say he echoing what the Senator
Speaker 3: said just a moment ago, that he really feels like
Speaker 3: this war has changed its trajectory here in recent weeks
Speaker 3: that Ukraine does have the upper hand going forward.
Speaker 9: Here.
Speaker 7: Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend.
Speaker 2: Right after this, after a long, complicated, mostly joyful journey,
Speaker 2: the twenty twenty six feet in World Cup is finally here.
Speaker 2: Spain is going to be taking on Argentina as that
Speaker 2: team tries to be the first to win back to
Speaker 2: back World Cups, a feet not achieved since Brazil in
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty eight and nineteen sixty two. So to bring
Speaker 2: this all to a nice clothes we let go go
Speaker 2: get a coffee and we invited Bloomberg Business of Sports
Speaker 2: reporter hosts Randall Williams on the Sofia here with me
Speaker 2: to help interview our next guests. We have Real Madrid
Speaker 2: and German national team center back Antonio Rudigert. Thank you
Speaker 2: so much for coming in.
Speaker 5: We really appreciate this. Thank you for coming in.
Speaker 10: Absolutely, I'm excited.
Speaker 5: All right, boys, Who's going to win this game?
Speaker 2: Who?
Speaker 7: Asked a professional first?
Speaker 11: I think that's a tough question. And who? Obviously, because
Speaker 11: I play in Spain, I'm going for Spain. But it's
Speaker 11: a tough match because Argentina is really really a strong opponent.
Speaker 11: And yeah, but still I root for Spain fair enough.
Speaker 10: So everyone who is analyzing this game, so that Spain
Speaker 10: keeps the ball away, they don't allow you to have it,
Speaker 10: and that's how you know ultimately they could beat Argentina's
Speaker 10: if they score first and then play keep away. From
Speaker 10: your perspective, what makes Spain a difficult opponent?
Speaker 11: If you see the way hew Spain played the whole tournament,
Speaker 11: they were always dominant. They played as a team, and
Speaker 11: they have also great individual quality with La Migna mal
Speaker 11: and I think that's great. They have a great mix,
Speaker 11: great mix of team. But then you see Argentina is
Speaker 11: they have Leonard and Messi and then they have the
Speaker 11: soldiers and that makes them very dangerous.
Speaker 5: How has this World Cup been overall?
Speaker 2: I mean, I know, obviously Germany didn't go as far
Speaker 2: as I'm sure you would have liked. But you've been here,
Speaker 2: you've been playing and even watching it. It was very
Speaker 2: controversial to start the venue, but it feels like, I mean,
Speaker 2: people have called it a worldwide sleep over. The fans,
Speaker 2: the Americans, we've gotten along pretty well. And from a
Speaker 2: player's perspective, just how was it?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 11: I find it very very, very positive because you see
Speaker 11: a lot of different nations meet together and the main
Speaker 11: focus is the World Cup and the joy in the
Speaker 11: people and all the emotions and the cultures are meeting
Speaker 11: together and everyone supports and this is just great.
Speaker 7: How is your.
Speaker 10: Experience just being around the US city is one of
Speaker 10: the things that was unique was that you were traveling
Speaker 10: all throughout, you know, back and forth to the base
Speaker 10: camp and then out to the matches themselves. What was
Speaker 10: your experience like as you were traveling and experiencing the
Speaker 10: different cultures in those cities.
Speaker 11: For me personally, it was, first of all, we were
Speaker 11: there for a job. Like the traveling, that's part of it.
Speaker 5: It's a workshop.
Speaker 7: Yeah, America.
Speaker 11: America is a huge country, so that's why we knew
Speaker 11: that before. But just meeting the people around because me,
Speaker 11: I like to have walks outside and just connect with
Speaker 11: the people and the people being great. They're being great
Speaker 11: because normally when you come to the US, you think
Speaker 11: like people will not recognize you or something like this,
Speaker 11: so you think you have more.
Speaker 5: Peace not in America recognized on the street.
Speaker 11: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 7: But the approach. I like that.
Speaker 11: I like the approach. It's very respectful. This is really something,
Speaker 11: very very nice.
Speaker 5: Any favorite moments, favorite interactions.
Speaker 11: Favorite interactions? Yeah, like not favorite because they all been
Speaker 11: the same. Like, it's more about the approach, the way
Speaker 11: people speak to you, like very friendly, always please and
Speaker 11: thank you, like very well educated.
Speaker 5: Oh that makes it. Thanks, thanks follow Americans. We appreciate that.
Speaker 2: Ona you mentioned h MESSI you've played I think four
Speaker 2: times in your career. What makes him stand out as
Speaker 2: a player. Is he is he worth the hype? Is
Speaker 2: he really as good as as his reputation?
Speaker 11: Well, I think we are all seeing it and he's
Speaker 11: now don't don't want to say anything wrong, but I
Speaker 11: think he's now thirty nine years old. That's yeah, yeah,
Speaker 11: thirty nine, So then you know that, and he's still
Speaker 11: delivering on the world stage. So I think we don't
Speaker 11: need to speak more fair enough.
Speaker 10: I want to go back a couple of weeks when
Speaker 10: Flow Balagin, the US striker, was he was given a
Speaker 10: red card. Some say that red cards shouldn't have been
Speaker 10: given out, but based on the rules, it should have
Speaker 10: and we see President Trump get involved, he asked FIFA
Speaker 10: to review it. As you were watching all of that unfold,
Speaker 10: what was your perspective, Well, yeah, it's difficult. It's a
Speaker 10: difficult topic, especially for the player for the US team.
Speaker 10: I think I wouldn't say that is the fault why
Speaker 10: they got eliminated, but I think that also plays.
Speaker 3: A part that just came out of fire, especially for
Speaker 3: a hard head game too.
Speaker 11: Definitely, so yeah, but I think my personal opinion, he
Speaker 11: should have stayed out of that.
Speaker 5: If you were the coach, would you have played him
Speaker 5: or would you have kept him out?
Speaker 11: I will if I would be the coach of USA.
Speaker 11: It's the talisman, it's the most one of the most
Speaker 11: important players in the squad.
Speaker 5: No, I would play, all right, all right, all right,
Speaker 5: you mentioned the age. Messi's age.
Speaker 2: This World Cup, Bloomberg did an analysis has more players
Speaker 2: in their mid and late thirties than any other World
Speaker 2: Cup in twenty twenty six six percent of the forty
Speaker 2: eight national team squads where players on or around forty
Speaker 2: eight of the twenty oldest ever players to play in
Speaker 2: the World Cup match took the field in twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2: He's still a young guy. But career longevity in sports
Speaker 2: is hard. Is this encouraging? How are people achieving that?
Speaker 5: And there are things?
Speaker 2: Is that something you think about on a day to
Speaker 2: day basis when you're playing, is how long you can
Speaker 2: do this?
Speaker 11: Absolutely, I'm thinking about it. But first of all, like
Speaker 11: we all always hoping and praying that we stay healthy. Yeah,
Speaker 11: but with the amount of games we have, it's not
Speaker 11: always easy. So that's why I'm now in my thirties.
Speaker 11: So I'm thirty three. So I'm also looking at always
Speaker 11: sleeping well, doing the right things. Yeah, to be at
Speaker 11: this highest level because the young guns they're coming out.
Speaker 11: There's always new talents, so the competition is huge. So
Speaker 11: that's why we have to look out for But as
Speaker 11: the statistics say, we old men doing a good job.
Speaker 5: We only have a couple of minutes left. And I
Speaker 5: know you want to get to your foundation.
Speaker 2: Because as you look at maybe not after soccer, but
Speaker 2: in concurrent with and just life outside of football, what
Speaker 2: is your foundation and what does it do?
Speaker 5: And I know you guys have a big event coming up.
Speaker 11: Yes, yeah, as you mentioned my foundation, I think this
Speaker 11: is my biggest drive, my biggest drive, and there's when
Speaker 11: I want to leave my legacy, my personal legacy, and
Speaker 11: my foundation is about young kids since early on, and
Speaker 11: it's about health, education and sports development and this is
Speaker 11: a that's why I also I have my foundation gala
Speaker 11: in Washington, d C. On the twenty first of July.
Speaker 2: We think our tickets got lost in the mail, but
Speaker 2: we hope it's going to be a good party.
Speaker 11: It's going to be it's going to definitely be a
Speaker 11: good fundraising gala and then a good part.
Speaker 5: Okay, perfect, perfect expansion good or bad?
Speaker 7: Bad?
Speaker 5: Okay, thank you so much. For coming in.
Speaker 2: I encourage everyone to go on the website to take
Speaker 2: a look at the website of the foundation and what
Speaker 2: you guys are trying to do, and I know you're
Speaker 2: going to do more of that coming up. Stay with
Speaker 2: us for more on Bloomberg this weekend. Right after this, Welcome.
Speaker 7: Back to Bloomber this weekend.
Speaker 3: I'm David Gerr with Christina Raffini and Dinosaur skeletons have
Speaker 3: recently become a hot new asset class coveted by the
Speaker 3: ultra rich. They're seen as an alternative to traditionally owning
Speaker 3: a piece of art or a sports franchise.
Speaker 2: But with the market that's not yet stable or regulated,
Speaker 2: problems send to a curb. Bloomberg Wealth reporter Devin Pendleton
Speaker 2: for The Big Take, investigated the recent failed auction of
Speaker 2: the dinosaur.
Speaker 12: Sen Schen was a t Rex that the auction house
Speaker 12: Christie's announced in twenty twenty two, and it was going
Speaker 12: to be the first t Rex ever to go on
Speaker 12: sale in Asia. This was poised to be a major sale.
Speaker 12: Sheen's auction never went forward. About ten days before the
Speaker 12: scheduled auction date, Christie's pulled the sale. There are fewer
Speaker 12: than fifty known t Rex specimens in the world. So
Speaker 12: the sudden appearance of Shen out of the blue seeming
Speaker 12: was a little fishy to a lot of people in
Speaker 12: the paleontology community, which is small. People know each other,
Speaker 12: they know the specimens, they know what's coming to market,
Speaker 12: So this raised some eyebrows. Peter Larson is a commercial
Speaker 12: paleontologist and he's sort of a famous figure in the
Speaker 12: paleontology world. He is a t rex expert and he
Speaker 12: actually led the team that excavated Stan. Larson is a
Speaker 12: controversial figure. In the nineteen nineties, he served eighteen months
Speaker 12: in federal prison for customs violations related to a fossil discovery. Now,
Speaker 12: when he saw the announcement, he just instantly felt this
Speaker 12: jolt of recognition. He knew Shen, or at least he
Speaker 12: knew Shen's skull when he discovered Stan. He made cast
Speaker 12: copies of all of Stan's bones, and that's a big
Speaker 12: part of his business is selling these cast copies. Can
Speaker 12: sell them to museums, can sell them to private collectors. Basically,
Speaker 12: he sells these bones so that somebody can have a
Speaker 12: copy of Stan that's a bone by bone reconstruction without
Speaker 12: actually having the real bones of stan. Ultimately, Christy's did
Speaker 12: pull Shen from auction. In a statement, Christy said that
Speaker 12: when questions are raised about a lot that it cannot
Speaker 12: answer in a timely fashion, the auction house withdraws the
Speaker 12: lot for further research.
Speaker 2: Seven penal tends here with us Bloomberg News Wealth Reporter
Speaker 2: is there's so much unpack here, literally and rhetorically. It's
Speaker 2: shocking to me how big of a market this has
Speaker 2: become so quickly. I remember I first read about this
Speaker 2: maybe less than a year ago, and it seems like
Speaker 2: it's only gone up. I was reading in your article
Speaker 2: financier Ken Griffin spent forty four point six million dollars
Speaker 2: on a stegosaurus. Leonardo DiCaprio, Nick Cage other celebrities have
Speaker 2: also gotten into these. But when when one is purchasing
Speaker 2: a giant dinosaur skeleton, how do you know if it's
Speaker 2: authentic or not?
Speaker 5: What are you looking for? Because it sounds like there
Speaker 5: are a lot of copies out there.
Speaker 12: Potentially there could be potential copies out there. You want
Speaker 12: to make sure, of course, what you're buying, what you're
Speaker 12: spending millions of dollars on is authentic, and so there's
Speaker 12: a lot of paperwork that behind that that you're going
Speaker 12: to really need to ask for. And by paperwork, you
Speaker 12: want to know exactly where the dinosaurs found. You want
Speaker 12: to know the coordinates, and really importantly, you want to
Speaker 12: see video and photo documentation from the minute a spade
Speaker 12: was put in the dirt to kind of take this
Speaker 12: thing out, because there's funny business that can happen between
Speaker 12: when the bones come out of the ground and between
Speaker 12: when they're reconstructed as a specimen that you buy, and
Speaker 12: you need to be able to track all of it.
Speaker 5: That's so funny.
Speaker 2: It's like provenance for works in the art world, but
Speaker 2: this time it's you want to see the whole process
Speaker 2: of this thing being excavated.
Speaker 13: Exactly, and provenance is the very word that they use.
Speaker 2: Really all right, well, lay that I knew a thing.
Speaker 2: I do want to ask you where did this market
Speaker 2: come from? How big is it at this point? And
Speaker 2: do you expect it to grow?
Speaker 13: So the market's really old.
Speaker 12: I mean this goes back, of course, since dinosaurs were
Speaker 12: discovered in the Gilded Age. There's great colorful stories about
Speaker 12: Gilded Age barons kind of fighting over finding dinosaurs and
Speaker 12: laying claim to finding great dinosaurs and funding digs. So
Speaker 12: it's not new, but certainly it's taken on new velocity
Speaker 12: in recent years.
Speaker 13: You could definitely say, I mean.
Speaker 12: Even in recent months, even it's who knows where it
Speaker 12: could go. I mean, this really is sort of worth
Speaker 12: kind of at the very beginning of this market is
Speaker 12: sort of a mature, like real sort of investible part
Speaker 12: of the market space where you see auctions houses really
Speaker 12: getting into it and putting money behind it, and muscle
Speaker 12: and entire shows and auctions dedicated to this space. Like
Speaker 12: there's a lot of potential. It has a lot of
Speaker 12: you know, buyers and sellers, traders, dealers pretty excited.
Speaker 2: Is there any kind of regulation? I mean, you talk
Speaker 2: about commercial fossil brokers in your piece. I didn't know
Speaker 2: that was a thing. Who was keeping track of where
Speaker 2: these are coming from? How many of them are And
Speaker 2: as you mentioned the piece, like sometimes you can recognize
Speaker 2: that that's a skull that you've excavated or that you own,
Speaker 2: because you were telling me they have very unique qualities
Speaker 2: and scars or marks and they can be identified.
Speaker 12: Certainly, especially if you're talking about the skulls. I mean
Speaker 12: those are the t rex, right. Yeah, they're very they're
Speaker 12: very big, and they've had incredibly violent lifestyles. So you're
Speaker 12: going to see marks from disease. You'll see holes that
Speaker 12: are signs of healed wounds. You might even see gashes,
Speaker 12: things that look like bite marks. I mean, you're going
Speaker 12: to see a lot more trauma there than you would
Speaker 12: like on a human skeleton. And it's not just knowing
Speaker 12: that you recognize that skull, but there's just not that
Speaker 12: many of them, because there's so f you that are
Speaker 12: really in so that you could put together to be
Speaker 12: back in one piece that they're just singular.
Speaker 13: And they've given them names.
Speaker 12: Too, which really like also just you know, clicks it
Speaker 12: into your head, like, oh that's stand.
Speaker 13: I know that skull.
Speaker 5: We got about thirty seconds left it. But why is
Speaker 5: this a market?
Speaker 2: What is so compelling about these these remnants from the past,
Speaker 2: and especially the t rex. What is it about these
Speaker 2: creatures that people are just so drawn to.
Speaker 12: I mean it's such a just part of consciousness, like
Speaker 12: since we were little, they're just they fascinate everybody. There's
Speaker 12: really nobody who have come across in the years working
Speaker 12: on this story. That's not like dang, that's cool. You know,
Speaker 12: it's just something very primal in us that finds this fascinating.
Speaker 12: And the t rex is amazing. If someone put it
Speaker 12: to me, it can just eat you in one bite.
Speaker 12: There's not a lot of things out there that can
Speaker 12: do that, and they're just cool.
Speaker 2: I have to say, if I had gobs of disposable income,
Speaker 2: and this is my bi dinosaur, if I had.
Speaker 5: A giant foyer and needed something to put in it.
Speaker 3: Like this, I mean to be a giant foyer foyer
Speaker 3: to those who are uh watching here in the States.
Speaker 2: But either way, whatever you're gonna call it, I want
Speaker 2: to stake a sourus in it.
Speaker 3: A sure, I mean, I was found. She's talking about
Speaker 3: the magnetism of these. If you go to like the
Speaker 3: Natural History Museum here, it is crazy to see.
Speaker 2: That they're just incredible, but it's also shocking that they
Speaker 2: can replicate them so well.
Speaker 5: Now you can only tell with a ct scantic.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend.
Speaker 8: Right after this, are you do the intro.
Speaker 3: Staging your chips, It's time for Pointed, a special Sunday
Speaker 3: edition of Pointed Lisa Matteo off yesterday back here. It
Speaker 3: is nice to see, yes, and we would not you know,
Speaker 3: it would take a lot of training for somebody besides
Speaker 3: Lisa to this and efficiently as Lisa runs the game, pointed,
Speaker 3: of course our weekly news quiz, Lisa walk us through.
Speaker 13: You were just hoping.
Speaker 2: Not Now it's now that he's been winning, you're running
Speaker 2: it fairly.
Speaker 5: When I was winning, there was controversy.
Speaker 3: So characterized in the trade press. Is an overwhelming victory
Speaker 3: for me last week?
Speaker 2: What's really trade press text with your mom, you know
Speaker 2: it's uh, my family watches this very closely, and my
Speaker 2: father did congratulate you on your victory, you.
Speaker 7: Mister, I appreciate that. Loyal all right, loyalty and classes
Speaker 7: I love.
Speaker 4: Okay, So for those of you who are not loyal
Speaker 4: and have not heard about.
Speaker 7: Them, welcome to the show.
Speaker 5: Here's how it goes.
Speaker 4: Here's how the game plays out.
Speaker 7: Okay.
Speaker 4: So they each have thirty chips in front of them, Okay,
Speaker 4: into three different categories. They will place their bets depending
Speaker 4: on how confident you feel about each category. Okay, so
Speaker 4: you're going to place your bets. They have whiteboards here.
Speaker 4: They're going to write their answers and reveal them. Are
Speaker 4: three categories are are you ready for?
Speaker 7: I'm ready?
Speaker 4: Okay.
Speaker 7: First is food food okay.
Speaker 4: Second is smart homes h third is critic credit cards. Okay,
Speaker 4: So think about it. How do you want to place.
Speaker 7: You don't know much about smart homes?
Speaker 4: You don't thought that was my instinct as well.
Speaker 3: I'm going to double up on credit cards, and I'm
Speaker 3: going to go nothing on smart.
Speaker 4: Nothing on smart homes.
Speaker 5: I'm gonna regret this, but I'm going to do the
Speaker 5: Raffini split. We're gonna we're.
Speaker 4: Gonna do that'll collapse, but I.
Speaker 5: Mean it has before.
Speaker 4: All right, you're going for food? Ready?
Speaker 7: Yes?
Speaker 8: The food?
Speaker 4: He does Chipotle rolling It's burritos into what Country, opening
Speaker 4: its first location there on Thursday.
Speaker 5: I did see this because I thought.
Speaker 7: Excited, she's excited. I actually have no ideas.
Speaker 6: You don't have.
Speaker 7: I mentioned I've been in the field always city.
Speaker 2: No, no, I don't hear about anymore.
Speaker 7: Yeah, okay, I'm going to go with Okay, flippit.
Speaker 5: Japan, Japan was Mexico.
Speaker 3: Mexico is correct because you know they're strangers to burritos.
Speaker 7: I feel really need.
Speaker 5: Guys like like.
Speaker 4: Taco Bell tried and it didn't work.
Speaker 5: There was a reason for that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so they're going to try. They're saying they're fresh
Speaker 4: ingredients are going to make a difference, Like.
Speaker 7: Mexico knows a thing or two about.
Speaker 2: Any gas station makes a better taco than I've ever
Speaker 2: had in the US.
Speaker 5: So all right, I.
Speaker 3: Guess I need to think more logically logically because now
Speaker 3: I have what she knows about smart homes, smart smart homes,
Speaker 3: open ai developing a physical manifestation of chat GPT for
Speaker 3: the home.
Speaker 4: What kind of device is it?
Speaker 5: What is the name?
Speaker 4: What is what kind of device are they developing? This
Speaker 4: is open AI. I might know this one too, a
Speaker 4: physical manifestation of chat GPT for the home. What kind
Speaker 4: of device is it? I love our music?
Speaker 7: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I mean it's racing. He's a racing Yeah, but I
Speaker 3: don't know. I was going to ride, like I know.
Speaker 3: Will you helped me raise last time? Which I actually
Speaker 3: helped me.
Speaker 7: I wrote a.
Speaker 3: Pod, you know, like a pod like you talked to it,
Speaker 3: like the home pod like you talked to.
Speaker 4: Well, since he wrote speakers, the smart speaker, you didn't.
Speaker 5: Bet anything on that one, that's true.
Speaker 7: I just want to actually to defend.
Speaker 3: Did you see how I just naturally thought that, even
Speaker 3: though I had no skin in the game, I.
Speaker 5: Was about to defend you.
Speaker 2: Then I realized you had no chips on it, so
Speaker 2: I would have argued you got that right.
Speaker 4: I was rough on you.
Speaker 5: I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, I'm I'm going to continue keeping all
Speaker 2: my chips over here, but you double them back so you.
Speaker 4: Can so he so we have Christina still lead. Okay,
Speaker 4: credit cards, we're moving on to credit cards.
Speaker 3: I don't mean to point out errors in the control room,
Speaker 3: but I did see this question flash across the screen
Speaker 3: a moment ago.
Speaker 2: You did.
Speaker 7: Okay, I didn't read it. I just want to sure
Speaker 7: everyone I didn't read it.
Speaker 5: I didn't see it at all.
Speaker 7: But I wish I had.
Speaker 3: It was there and then gone, and I thought, God,
Speaker 3: what an edge I could have gotten.
Speaker 2: So cool. Sometimes I put it in the wall behind
Speaker 2: us and we're both too dumb to look, and the
Speaker 2: will be like, you.
Speaker 7: Know, the end, it's there, but on display.
Speaker 5: Say that all the time?
Speaker 11: Okay.
Speaker 4: Credit cards? Americans a record number of what last year.
Speaker 4: That's the term for petitioning a bank to reverse a
Speaker 4: credit card transaction. So you call that when when you
Speaker 4: petition a bank for to reverse a credit card transaction,
Speaker 4: what is it called? And there was a record number
Speaker 4: of them, a record number, record number. People want to
Speaker 4: get their money, get that money back, right? What do
Speaker 4: you got?
Speaker 7: Chargebacks?
Speaker 3: I wrote disputes charge Oh, for god's sake, I feel
Speaker 3: like it's a synonym and fewer characters to boot chargeback.
Speaker 2: I don't know my desire to defend you on them
Speaker 2: where you've bet a bout is he's not totally wrong,
Speaker 2: it is, it is a dispute, but.
Speaker 7: That's not what the answer.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. I feel like she's done one between last
Speaker 3: week and this one. First of all, I was too comfortable.
Speaker 2: Randomly all topics I know, and I know about chargebacks
Speaker 2: because really hurting a lot of small makers that I
Speaker 2: follow complain all the time about them.
Speaker 5: They like vinted shops.
Speaker 2: Or people who sow things will send someone to something
Speaker 2: and they will pay like three hundred fifty dollars for
Speaker 2: a handmade jacket, and then the person will say it
Speaker 2: was bad and get the charge back, and the person
Speaker 2: who made it, it's very hard for them.
Speaker 5: To get that money down to get them like the actual.
Speaker 2: Person, because the bank side with the customer and these
Speaker 2: small like makers are getting and they're getting losing a
Speaker 2: lot of money.
Speaker 4: It's not good.
Speaker 5: It's not good.
Speaker 4: I think we need a bonus bonus.
Speaker 7: We have limited time.
Speaker 4: We got a limited time public health. Public health cyclospora
Speaker 4: belongs to what border category of pathogen and it shares
Speaker 4: the name with a twenty nineteen film.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Oh, he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I got this, I
Speaker 4: got this.
Speaker 7: Let's see.
Speaker 5: Okay, bad ones.
Speaker 7: Are how much? You gets.
Speaker 11: Very much?
Speaker 5: Mateo?
Speaker 7: Will they fight this one out? And I relish?
Speaker 5: Where's the they have the world?
Speaker 7: There's no var and pointed.
Speaker 3: You can test your knowledge on all ten questions. Take
Speaker 3: the point of News quiz at Bloomberg dot com slash
Speaker 3: point in of course, it's builab on the Bloomberg Business App.
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us on today's Bloomberg This Weekend podcast.
Speaker 2: Don't forget to tune in live for the show every
Speaker 2: Saturday and Sunday morning, starting at seven am Eastern.
Speaker 3: We're on Bloomberg Television Radio and the Bloomberg Business App,
Speaker 3: bringing you unique takes and in depth interviews on news, politics,
Speaker 3: lifestyle and culture.