1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:07,080 Speaker 1: Hi everyone, I'm Katy Curic and welcome to Next Question. 2 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: I'm popping back on the podcast to share an important 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: conversation I recently had with Dr Anthony Fauci. Of course 4 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:17,919 Speaker 1: he needs no introduction. There is a lot to discuss, 5 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:23,439 Speaker 1: breakthrough cases, vaccine mandates, booster shots, when and where you 6 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: should be masking up, and the possibility of a variant 7 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 1: worse than delta. I know, lots of scary news, but 8 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:36,720 Speaker 1: we're here to explain it all. Take a listen, spread 9 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:40,240 Speaker 1: the word, and let's end this pandemic already, right, guys. 10 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: I know I am sick of it, and I'm sure 11 00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: you are too. A friend of mine recently described getting 12 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: the vaccine shots as the Fauci alci, So please get 13 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 1: yours if you haven't already. Okay, here's Dr Fauci. Dr Fauci. 14 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:02,720 Speaker 1: This pandemic was supposed to be in our rear view 15 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: mirror at this point, but as you recently said, the 16 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 1: country may be in trouble this fall. How frustrated are you? Well, 17 00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: it is. It is a frustration, Katie, but it's just 18 00:01:14,520 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 1: the reality. The virus that we're dealing with is a 19 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 1: different virus than we were dealing with several months ago, 20 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: and we just have to deal with the reality of 21 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 1: that it's a more formidable virus. It translates much more efficiently, 22 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: and even individuals who have vaccinated, even though they are 23 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:36,760 Speaker 1: largely protected from serious disease, nonetheless can get infected and 24 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 1: even transmitted. Let me ask you about that, because I 25 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: think Dr Fauci there's been a lot of confusion about 26 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 1: this delta variant even if you're vaccinated. The CDC says 27 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 1: you can spread it and compared it in fact to 28 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:52,320 Speaker 1: the chicken pox, but the White House COVID Response Team 29 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:56,480 Speaker 1: pushed back on that assessment. Can you clarify once and 30 00:01:56,520 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 1: for all if vaccinated people can spread the delta variant 31 00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:06,240 Speaker 1: at the same rate as unvaccinated people. Okay, let me 32 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: first say one thing that will be a background that 33 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 1: will clarify the vaccine is doing exactly what we wanted 34 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:17,640 Speaker 1: it to do. It's preventing people from getting seriously ill. 35 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 1: That's the reason why you get vaccinated. However, this virus 36 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: is so transmissible that it can infect even though it's 37 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 1: a small fraction. It can infect vaccinated people almost invariably 38 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:37,680 Speaker 1: in a way that they're either without symptoms or only 39 00:02:37,760 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 1: mildly symptomatic, So it's less that it's going to make 40 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 1: the vaccinated person sick. It's more that it's going to 41 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: allow the vaccinated person to transmit it to someone else 42 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:56,240 Speaker 1: who might get sick, like a vulnerable person in the family, 43 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 1: an elderly individual, a child who's unvacccinated. So the issue 44 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 1: with a person who is vaccinated who gets infected, the 45 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 1: level of virus in the naso pharynx of that person 46 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 1: is relatively equivalent to that of an unvaccinated person, which 47 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 1: means there's a mechanism to say that that person very 48 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: well might be able to transmit it, and in fact, 49 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 1: we have documented cases where a vaccinated infected person did 50 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 1: transmit So it can be transmitted in a vaccinated person 51 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 1: at the same rate as an unvaccinated You know, it 52 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 1: is potentially. I want to clarify for you because I 53 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 1: do want to make sure there's no confusion. The level 54 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: of virus in the naso pharynx of a person who's 55 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: vaccinated and infected is the same level as the level 56 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: of virus in the nasal pharynx of an unvaccinated person, 57 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 1: So you can make a reasonable some shan that they 58 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 1: can be equivalent in how they transmit. However, there's one 59 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:10,120 Speaker 1: thing that works in favor of the vaccinated person. That level, 60 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: though it starts off the same as an unaffected as 61 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:18,839 Speaker 1: an unvaccinated person, it decreases much more quickly because of 62 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: the vaccine exactly exactly. Cases are rising in forty nine states, 63 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: with a handful of states experiencing serious surges. But the 64 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: good news is the vaccination rates in many of these 65 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 1: states is increasing as well. In fact, American adults have 66 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 1: now gotten at least one dose of the vaccine. The 67 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: question is, is hurt im mutity still possible at this point. Yes, 68 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 1: it is, but it won't happen Katie unless we get 69 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: a vast majority of the nine three million people who 70 00:04:54,839 --> 00:05:00,479 Speaker 1: are still unvaccinated who are eligible to be vaccinated. Unless 71 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: we get them vaccinated, they are not going to contribute 72 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 1: to the concept of her immunity. So her immunity, there's 73 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:11,920 Speaker 1: a concept of her community, which means you have enough 74 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:16,040 Speaker 1: vaccinated people plus people who were infected and protected so 75 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: that the virus doesn't have any place to go. There 76 00:05:18,760 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 1: aren't any vulnerable targets. We're not there yet. We don't 77 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: know what the percentage is. Is that going to be 78 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:29,080 Speaker 1: the people who are still unvaccinated or is that going 79 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 1: to be eighty five or eighty We don't know. When 80 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 1: you don't know, you know what you do. You just 81 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:37,680 Speaker 1: get as many people vaccinated as you possibly can. Just 82 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 1: as a delta variant has now become part of our vocabulary, 83 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:45,480 Speaker 1: we're hearing about new variants, this be one six to 84 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:49,599 Speaker 1: one in Florida, the delta plus variant. Which variants, Dr 85 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,520 Speaker 1: Fauci are you most concerned about and are you worried 86 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 1: that the current vaccines will not be effective against them? Well, 87 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:01,039 Speaker 1: I am worried more about a variant that we haven't 88 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 1: even seen yet, because they can. But the current delta 89 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: variant is so efficient in its ability to crowd out 90 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: the other variants that even though there are the variants 91 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:18,279 Speaker 1: you mentioned, which there's no reason to believe that they're 92 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 1: going to be worse than the delta variant, they are 93 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:26,719 Speaker 1: not being over they're not overtaking the delta variants. So 94 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,720 Speaker 1: the one good thing is that the vaccines work quite 95 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 1: well against the delta variant in some respects. It's good 96 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 1: that the delta variant is not being outstripped. By the 97 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:43,839 Speaker 1: others because we know we can deal with the delta 98 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:48,719 Speaker 1: variant really quite well. My concern is that if we 99 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:53,279 Speaker 1: allow there to be smoldering infection into the fall and 100 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: into the winter, because those nine million people are not 101 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 1: getting vaccinated for the most part, my concern would be, 102 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: you may allow a variant that we haven't even recognized 103 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:11,960 Speaker 1: yet to come along and in fact be better at 104 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 1: transmitting and more serious than the delta. We haven't seen 105 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: that yet, So rather than be worrying about these others 106 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 1: that are around, let's make sure we don't let new 107 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 1: ones come in well our unvaccinated people. The reason we're 108 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 1: seeing these new strains and will an increase in vaccinations 109 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 1: mitigate the virus morphine in multiple ways? Well, that's a 110 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: good one because the answer is short, yes, Okay, that's 111 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: all you need to say. So, in other words, please 112 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: get vaccinated more with Dr Anthony Fauci. Right after this, 113 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 1: let's talk about boosters that who just announce more a 114 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 1: toorium on booster shots until more countries can get ahold 115 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: of the vaccine. But companies like fisers saying their efficacy 116 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: decreases after about six months and a number of countries Israel, Germany, 117 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: in the UK, among others, are starting to offer booster shots. 118 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 1: Where do you stand on boosters for the US. I 119 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 1: think we can do both, Katie. I think if we 120 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:34,320 Speaker 1: need an additional boost an initial dose to get the 121 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 1: optimal protection because it essentially attendued for a while. I 122 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 1: believe that we can do that in this country, particularly 123 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: for people who are immunely suppressed, people who are on 124 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:49,959 Speaker 1: cancechemo therapy, people who have transplant, they very well may 125 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:55,480 Speaker 1: need as part of their primary regimen a three shot 126 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:58,559 Speaker 1: boost of an m R and A. We are doing 127 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 1: a lot, and we will be doing more to supply 128 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: doses internationally. I believe that we are capable, not only 129 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:12,360 Speaker 1: our own nation, but also the other wealthy nations in 130 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: the world can do both. You certainly want to pay 131 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:21,040 Speaker 1: very good attention to getting vaccine doses to the developing world, 132 00:09:21,559 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 1: but I believe you can do both. You can boost 133 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: and get doses to them. If you get a J 134 00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: and J or a Maderna vaccine. Can you get a 135 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: fisor boostere you have to stick with one brand. Well, 136 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 1: we're doing studies right now. They're referred to as mix 137 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 1: and match studies to see if there's any issue with 138 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: giving one vaccine as the prime followed by the other 139 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 1: is the boost, or giving two of the same and 140 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:52,200 Speaker 1: then let the third one be different. As as a scientist, 141 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 1: I don't think there's going to be an issue with that, 142 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 1: but you want to formally prove it, and that's the 143 00:09:57,000 --> 00:09:59,559 Speaker 1: studies that are being done to do that. A lot 144 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: of duct ers in hospitals nationwider saying the population of 145 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: patients they're seeing this go around is very different than 146 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 1: the initial surges. They're younger, they're in their twenties and thirties, Younger, sicker, quicker. 147 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:14,960 Speaker 1: Do we know why it is that, in your view, 148 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 1: convincing younger people to get vaccinated. Well, in answer to 149 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:22,800 Speaker 1: your second question, I hope the realization that you're not 150 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 1: exempt from getting either seriously ill with COVID nineteen or 151 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: even getting long COVID after you recover, which is something 152 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:35,479 Speaker 1: that people should take seriously, namely the persistence of symptoms. 153 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 1: One of the likely reasons that may be more than 154 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: one one. One of the reasons you might be seeing, 155 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 1: relatively speaking, more young people being hospitalized is that first 156 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:51,679 Speaker 1: you're dealing with a very transmissible virus, so everybody who's 157 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 1: unvaccinated is getting infected. The seeing more young versus older 158 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: because we all we know that the elderly population is 159 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:08,320 Speaker 1: already vaccinated, so there's a skewing that among the unvaccinated, 160 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: relatively speaking, more of them are young. So it is 161 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: not surprising that when you look at hospitalizations you're seeing 162 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 1: relative to the elderly, it looks like they're are more 163 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:25,040 Speaker 1: young than are being hospitalized. That's very true because the 164 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:28,239 Speaker 1: elderly are more protected because more of them are vaccinated. 165 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 1: Let's talk about breakthrough cases. My understanding is they're being 166 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 1: trapped only if they require hospitalization or death. Shouldn't we 167 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: be tracking breakthrough cases among the general population. I imagine 168 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: that would be pretty difficult to do, but especially if 169 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: you're some asymptomatic. But isn't that something we should be 170 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:52,320 Speaker 1: focused on so we can get real numbers about the 171 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 1: you know, who is getting COVID after vaccination? Well, yeah, 172 00:11:57,440 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: but you really want to do it what the Israelis 173 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 1: have done and what the Brits have done, But most 174 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 1: of the Israelis is rather than do it generally the 175 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:10,199 Speaker 1: population that when you get someone who's infected and they're asymptomatic. 176 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 1: You test all of their context, not just the context 177 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 1: of the sick people. And the CDC is going to 178 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 1: be starting to do that, in fact, they already are. 179 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 1: Was that a mistake to not do it right away, 180 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 1: because I don't know it just hospitalizations or deaths seem 181 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:32,840 Speaker 1: to be uh, you know, not the not the whole picture. Yeah, no, Kattie, 182 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 1: I'm not going to answer that directly. When I say 183 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: something of a mistake or not, it's an automatic sound bite. 184 00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:44,199 Speaker 1: It's not productive, So I'll refrain size the CDC's protocol. 185 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 1: I think the c DHC tries their very best. They 186 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 1: don't always get it right, but they definitely try their best, 187 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: and they're very competent. Last weekend, almost four hundred thousand 188 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 1: people went to Lollapalooza. Attendees this was a big music 189 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: festival in Chicago. Attend needed to provide their vaccine card 190 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:07,080 Speaker 1: or negative COVID task in order to go. But looking 191 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: at those photos and Millennial Park that they freaked you out. 192 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: I was a bit taken aback by the by the 193 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 1: film clips that I saw. There were a lot of 194 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:21,720 Speaker 1: people crowded around together, you know, and given the fact 195 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:27,600 Speaker 1: that we know that vaccinated people can spread infection, and 196 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: even though we know that outdoors is always safer than indoors, 197 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:35,320 Speaker 1: there was a really lot of crowded that we saw 198 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 1: in those films. So I got a little bit concerned 199 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: about that myself. Would you avoid those kinds of crowds 200 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:44,440 Speaker 1: if it were you, or if it were me or 201 00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 1: my daughters. I'm pretty risk averse, Katie, so I would 202 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 1: even though I'm vaccinated, I don't think I would go 203 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 1: to a really massively crowded where you essentially face to 204 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 1: face with somebody. I would be concerned about that. They've 205 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 1: been suggestions, most notably by former HHS Secretary Alex A. 206 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 1: S Our. President Trump could do more to convince the unvaccinated. 207 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:12,719 Speaker 1: Nearly of Republicans say they're not planning to be vaccinated, 208 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: and the Democrats could be giving President Trump work credit 209 00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 1: for Operation Work Speed. Do you agree and are there 210 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: other ways to depute the simple act of getting vaccinated? Well, 211 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:31,320 Speaker 1: I think there needs to be deep politicizing always when 212 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 1: you're in a public health issue. I've been saying that 213 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: for a year and a half. Sometimes it has gotten 214 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 1: me to be the brunt of people's criticism because there 215 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:46,640 Speaker 1: is politicization, usually by people who are trying to exam 216 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: for example, say we shouldn't be doing the things that 217 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:54,880 Speaker 1: are public health measures, and I think that that's really unfortunately. 218 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: What I'm what I'm hardened by is that we are 219 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 1: seeing Republican leaders who are saying get vaccinated. I mean, 220 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 1: Governor asked Asa Hutchinson is beating the bushes in Arkansas 221 00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: doing that. Steve Scalise has has really been promoting vaccines. 222 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 1: Even even Governor de Santis in Florida has been saying 223 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 1: that despite the fact that he is saying that he 224 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 1: doesn't want there to be masked mandates, he is encouraging vaccination, 225 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 1: which is good. New York City will be become the 226 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 1: first US city to will require proof of at least 227 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 1: one vaccination shot in order to interplaces like bars, restaurants, 228 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: and gems. Do you think the strategy should be adopted nationwide? 229 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: It seems to be a pretty good way to motivate 230 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 1: people to get vaccinated. I do think that as a 231 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 1: public health person, we should be putting more pressure on 232 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: people to get vaccinated. And I believe when the f 233 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 1: DA comes through, hopefully within the next few weeks, to 234 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 1: make this in officially approved vaccines plural as opposed to 235 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 1: just an eu A. I hope that we will then 236 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:11,840 Speaker 1: have people feel much more empowered to do some kind 237 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:16,520 Speaker 1: of mandating, For example, universities and colleges saying you're not 238 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 1: going to be able to come in person unless you 239 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 1: get vaccinated. I think that would chuck a lot of 240 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 1: young people who are who are resistant to get vaccinated. 241 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: I think large corporations will be doing the same thing. 242 00:16:29,880 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 1: I was gonna ask you that Google, Microsoft, Tyson's Foods 243 00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: requiring employees to be fully vaccinated. Do you think that 244 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 1: more will be empowered after I'm Katie, I'm convinced to that. 245 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: I think that if you talk to people you know 246 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,480 Speaker 1: off the record that don't want to be talking about 247 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: it publicly, they're saying that once they get the backup 248 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:55,160 Speaker 1: of a fully approved vaccine, they will be much more 249 00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:59,600 Speaker 1: enthusiastic about mandating for their enterprise that you need to 250 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 1: be eaccinated. After this break, Dr Fauci answers your most 251 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: pressing questions. We're gonna do a quick round robin of 252 00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:21,119 Speaker 1: practical advice from questions we got from social media. Dr Fauci, 253 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:25,879 Speaker 1: should people be wearing masks regardless of their vaccination status 254 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:29,960 Speaker 1: indoors I think is probably more specific. Yes, that's a 255 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: CDC recommendation and I totally agree with it. How do 256 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 1: the COVID variants affect children under five? I'm concerned about 257 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:40,639 Speaker 1: them getting sick from the virus with a new variants 258 00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 1: and no protection. Well, you should be concerned, because everyone 259 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,680 Speaker 1: is susceptible, whether you're a child, an adult, or an elderly. 260 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:53,400 Speaker 1: If you're unvaccinated, you are susceptible. It is true that 261 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:58,600 Speaker 1: young children generally do not get as seriously involved with 262 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 1: a severe full of COVID nineteen when they're very, very young. 263 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 1: But we are starting to see in real time that 264 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 1: there are now young people who you would have expect 265 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 1: were less likely who are getting seriously ill. There have 266 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 1: been close to four hundred, about three hundred and fifty 267 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:20,920 Speaker 1: plus children who have died thus far from COVID nineteen. 268 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,400 Speaker 1: That's more than influenza in any given year. That's more 269 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:28,360 Speaker 1: than a respiratory since the ChIL virus in any given year. 270 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: That's still a mystery. Well, why some people get sick 271 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:37,440 Speaker 1: and some people don't? Soul Sorry, One Florida grandmother who's 272 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,160 Speaker 1: fully vaccinated, wanted me to ask you if she should 273 00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:43,120 Speaker 1: wear a mask when visiting her babysitting her fourign six 274 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 1: year old grandsons, especially since they're not required to wear 275 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:52,680 Speaker 1: a mask in school. If Grandma is unvaccinated, she doescinated, 276 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 1: then she doesn't need to wear a mask. But does 277 00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 1: she doesn't need to worry about the delta variant being 278 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 1: transfer from the children to her. No, when you are 279 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:07,239 Speaker 1: in the home setting, if you have vaccinated and you 280 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 1: have children in the home setting, you do not need 281 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:14,639 Speaker 1: to wear a mask. Speaking of schools, there is still 282 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,399 Speaker 1: no real consensus on how to keep kids uh safe 283 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 1: in school as well as teachers, and that's creating a 284 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 1: ton of anxiety. As you know, people are kind of 285 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:27,080 Speaker 1: pulling out their hair thinking, oh my god, do I 286 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 1: have to deal with this again this school year? Um, 287 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 1: what do you say to parents and school officials facing 288 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:37,840 Speaker 1: another uncertain year? Well, there are a couple of ways 289 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 1: to safeguard children and get them back to school in person. 290 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:47,719 Speaker 1: It is a very important primary goal in the full 291 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 1: to get the children in class and not virtual because 292 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:56,840 Speaker 1: we are well aware of the delaterious effects on children, 293 00:19:57,359 --> 00:20:02,560 Speaker 1: their development, their mental health, there, educational development, to get 294 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,640 Speaker 1: them in school. Therefore, we've got to make sure they're 295 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: safe in school. There are a couple of ways to 296 00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: do that. Get the people who are eligible to be 297 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 1: vaccinated around the children, get them vaccinated, teachers, school staff, 298 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 1: and anybody else. For those who are not able to 299 00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:26,760 Speaker 1: be vaccinated, the only way you can protect them, and 300 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:33,440 Speaker 1: the CDC recommendations are clear. In school, everyone should be masked, 301 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:38,920 Speaker 1: whether you're vaccinated or not. That's a very clear recommendation 302 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:42,399 Speaker 1: by the c d C. When will the vaccine be 303 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 1: available for children under twelve, We don't know the answer 304 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:49,600 Speaker 1: to that, Katie. We are doing studies to getting information 305 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:54,160 Speaker 1: that would be able to validate a decision to do that. 306 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 1: We're collecting those data, will get more and more of 307 00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 1: it as we've approached the full but ultimately that will 308 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:05,959 Speaker 1: be a regulatory decision by the FDA, together with an 309 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:11,959 Speaker 1: advisory a condition from the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices 310 00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:16,640 Speaker 1: that advises the CDC. So this may take quite a while. Well, 311 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 1: I hope it doesn't take quite a while. I hope 312 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 1: we do within the next several months, but I hope 313 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,280 Speaker 1: before the end of the year. But we don't know 314 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:28,640 Speaker 1: that that's the sea. That's an FDA decision. Someone on 315 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: our team is asking, if vaccinated people can spread the virus, 316 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: why aren't they required to be quarantined if they've been 317 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: exposed to someone who has tested positive. No, you just 318 00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:41,400 Speaker 1: need to test if you've been exposed, you don't need 319 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 1: to quarantine. Someone says, I'm being treated for Lukenian to 320 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: not make antibodies from the vaccine. What can I do 321 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: to protect myself? Well, that's an individual first of all, 322 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 1: to wear a mask, that's the first thing. But I 323 00:21:55,040 --> 00:22:00,280 Speaker 1: hope that we will provide protection for that individual and 324 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: people in her same situation by relatively quickly making the 325 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:11,560 Speaker 1: decision to get an additional dose. To immune suppressed people, 326 00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:16,840 Speaker 1: they are a different category than a healthy or even 327 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:21,160 Speaker 1: an elderly healthy person, because a person who is either 328 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:26,679 Speaker 1: immune is suppressed from transplant, from chemotherapy, or from immune 329 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 1: suppression likely never made an adequate immune response to begin with. 330 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:36,480 Speaker 1: Someone asked Dr Fauci if emmy suppressing drugs reduced the 331 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: efficacy of the COVID vaccine. Absolutely absolutely, it does. It 332 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:46,160 Speaker 1: does so, so it's not if you're go ahead. If 333 00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:49,240 Speaker 1: you are immune is suppressed because of the drugs that 334 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:55,399 Speaker 1: you are taking for transplant, for cancer, chemotherapy, or for 335 00:22:55,480 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: an autoimmune disease. The drugs that you receive suppress your 336 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: disease also suppress your ability to respond to the vaccine. 337 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: So you should talk to your doctor about getting getting 338 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 1: a booster shot. And you know when this whole thing started, 339 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:20,919 Speaker 1: I remember summer was the time when it wasn't going 340 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,199 Speaker 1: to be very contagious and wasn't going to be a 341 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:26,760 Speaker 1: problem because people were going to be spending more time outside. 342 00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 1: So that hasn't been the case. What do you foresee 343 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,000 Speaker 1: for the fall and winter, more lockdowns? What do you 344 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:38,120 Speaker 1: think is going to happen? I don't see lockdowns because 345 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 1: there is substantial enough proportion of the population that it's 346 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 1: fully vaccinated. Six there are seventy of the adults have 347 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 1: at least a single dose that it was accomplished a 348 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 1: couple of days ago, and we have more than eight 349 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:02,600 Speaker 1: of the elderly population that are vaccinated. Under those circumstances, 350 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 1: you're still going to have a lot of spread if 351 00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 1: we don't get that ninety three million people who are 352 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 1: eligible to be vaccinated vaccinated, but you won't have such 353 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:17,679 Speaker 1: a situation that would trigger a lockdown. I would be 354 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:22,919 Speaker 1: very surprised if that happens. What you will have is 355 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 1: spread of infection predominantly among the unvaccinated, and you will 356 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:34,879 Speaker 1: see hospitalizations predominantly among the unvaccinated as we go through 357 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 1: the fall and into the winter if we don't very 358 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:44,119 Speaker 1: aggressively get people vaccinated. We got so many comments about 359 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,800 Speaker 1: you and from people who deeply admire you, Dr Fauci 360 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,720 Speaker 1: and the job you've done. What's the best advice you've 361 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: give been given about how to get through these tumultuous times. Well, 362 00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I think what you need to do if 363 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,159 Speaker 1: you're in a position like I am, as a public 364 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,920 Speaker 1: health person and a scientist and person who develops vaccines, 365 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: is to just focus on your job. We're in a 366 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,960 Speaker 1: very difficult position. We have things going against us. A, 367 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 1: we have a very formidable virus and be we have 368 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: a very divisive society where you just can't run away 369 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 1: from the fact that there's a lot of bad news 370 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 1: politics going on here. We've got to focus on our job. 371 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: And if you're not a medical person and you're trying 372 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:35,000 Speaker 1: to get just through this a get vaccinated and be 373 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,919 Speaker 1: obey or listen to as it were I wouldn't say 374 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 1: obey because that's not an order. They're not ordering you 375 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:45,919 Speaker 1: do it, but listen to the recommendations of the c 376 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:49,680 Speaker 1: D c Dr Fauci. Always great to see you. Thank 377 00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 1: you so much for talking with me. You've got to 378 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,359 Speaker 1: reach people. However you can write yes, thank you for 379 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 1: having me, Katie. It's always a pleasure to be with you. 380 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 1: Next Question with Katie Couric is a production of I 381 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 1: Heart Media and Katie Couric Media. The executive producers Army, 382 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 1: Katie Couric, and Courtney Litz. The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. 383 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:20,919 Speaker 1: Associate producers Derek Clements, Adrianna Fasio, and Emily Pinto. The 384 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,520 Speaker 1: show is edited and mixed by Derrek Clements. For more 385 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:27,359 Speaker 1: information about today's episode, or to sign up for my 386 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:31,040 Speaker 1: morning newsletter, wake Up Call, go to Katie currect dot com. 387 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: You can also find me at Katie Curic on Instagram 388 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:37,360 Speaker 1: and all my social media channels. For more podcasts from 389 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,359 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, 390 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.