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Speaker 1: This constant fear of like what other people think. There's

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Speaker 1: no audience, Like who do you think is watching?

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Speaker 2: If you really want to oversimplified, it's like we're not

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Speaker 2: hearing that long for real. Therese like just let's roll

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Speaker 2: even when it gets hard and bad. I agree with you,

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Speaker 2: and it's like, hey, listen, this is hard and bad.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, that's okay too, Like that's part.

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Speaker 1: One hundred percent and it's going to pass like everything else,

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Speaker 1: like including our lives.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, hello, I'm mini driver.

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Speaker 1: I've always loved Proust's questionnaire. It was originally in nineteenth

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Speaker 1: century parlor game where players would ask each other thirty

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Speaker 1: five questions aimed at revealing the other player's true nature.

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Speaker 1: In asking different people the same set of questions, you

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Speaker 1: can make observations about which truths appear to be universal.

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Speaker 3: And it made me wonder, what if these questions were

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Speaker 3: just a jumping off point, what greater depths would be

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Speaker 3: revealed if I asked these questions as conversation starters. So

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Speaker 3: I adapted Pru's questionnai and I wrote my own seven

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Speaker 3: questions that I personally think are pertinent to a person's story.

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Speaker 3: They are when and where were you happiest? What is

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Speaker 3: the quality you like least about yourself? What relationship, real

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Speaker 3: or fictionalized, defines love for you? What question would you

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Speaker 3: most like answered, What person, place, or experience has shaped

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Speaker 3: you the most? What would be your last meal? And

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Speaker 3: can you tell me something in your life that's grown

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Speaker 3: out of a personal disaster?

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Speaker 1: And I've gathered a group of really remarkable people, ones

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Speaker 1: that I am honored and humbled to have had the

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Speaker 1: chance to engage with.

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Speaker 3: You may not hear their answers to all seven of

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Speaker 3: these questions. We've whittled it down to which questions felt

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Speaker 3: closest to their experience, or the most surprising, or created

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Speaker 3: the most fertile ground to connect. My guest today is

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Speaker 3: the athlete, podcaster, and wellness oracle Gabrielle Reese. Gabby is

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Speaker 3: an Olympian, which tells you right away a lot of

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Speaker 3: what she is made of. We live in the same

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Speaker 3: small beach community in California where she has these legendary

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Speaker 3: workout sessions that leave people stronger, fitter, having physically achieved

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Speaker 3: things they never.

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Speaker 1: Thought they could. I've never run into her and been

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Speaker 1: met with anything less than her wonderfully direct gaze, her

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Speaker 1: warmth and her presence. There aren't many people who I

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Speaker 1: really believe one hundred percent about health, wellness and fitness,

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Speaker 1: because there always seems to be some kind of Hollywood

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Speaker 1: snake oil attached to it. But Gabby Reese and her

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Speaker 1: husband Led Hamilton are the real deal. Gabby's been living

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Speaker 1: what she talks about on her podcast, The Gabby Reese

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Speaker 1: Show since she was a kid training for the Olympics.

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Speaker 1: This was such a great conversation where someone I'm deeply

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Speaker 1: inspired by and admire so greatly. So my first question

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Speaker 1: is where and when were you happiest?

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Speaker 2: Where and when was I happiest? I think for me,

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Speaker 2: you know, I always joke about in a way there's

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Speaker 2: a part of me, a lot of me that's very

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Speaker 2: very simple, and this has happened multiple times when I'm

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Speaker 2: in bed and sort of the immediate circle everybody's okay.

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Speaker 2: I know that feeling right before I go to bed

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Speaker 2: of sort of feeling really good. You know, no girls

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Speaker 2: in an urgency, they're healthy, I sort of, they're tucked in.

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Speaker 2: Larry and I were in a dance like we're not

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Speaker 2: stepping on each other's toes. So I think for me,

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Speaker 2: that feeling of happiness that you talk about has really

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Speaker 2: shown up for me in that moment right before I

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Speaker 2: go to bed. And I would say, I'm a person

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Speaker 2: who doesn't really look at the past too much, so

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Speaker 2: I don't think it occurs to me. Oh, I was

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Speaker 2: really happy when I was playing volleyball, or of course

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Speaker 2: I enjoyed when my kids were babies. But I think

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Speaker 2: it's this idea of I also kind of look forward often.

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Speaker 1: It's a function of also being like, quite literally and figuratively,

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Speaker 1: you guys lead an action packed life, and then there

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Speaker 1: is a huge amount of movement, both kind of where

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Speaker 1: you are geographically and like the things that make up

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Speaker 1: yours and lad's life, and I'm assuming you're girls too, Like,

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Speaker 1: do you think that that the notion of action is

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Speaker 1: kind of the stasis and then that piece calm, everybody's quiet,

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Speaker 1: everybody's tucked in, that the space for that is where

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Speaker 1: you can really sort of rest and feel centered.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that really supports that mentality. I think,

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Speaker 2: you know, Lared heard a quote many years ago, never

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Speaker 2: let your accomplishments be greater than your dreams. And I

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Speaker 2: think both of us are sort of hardwired to go like, hey,

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Speaker 2: what's around the corner and listen. It's it's great. You

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Speaker 2: know this from your own experience to have had some

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Speaker 2: semblance of hey, good job, well done. I could figure

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Speaker 2: it out. I don't know how to I'm, you know,

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Speaker 2: approaching something I don't know how to do. I have

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Speaker 2: a body of evidence that I could probably try to

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Speaker 2: figure something out. Those things are nice that give you

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Speaker 2: that kind of confidence, but the hardwiring of that's not

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Speaker 2: in my control. I can't spend a lot of time there,

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Speaker 2: So why not create new experiences or fun or challenges

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Speaker 2: or things that will bring me satisfaction and purpose. I

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Speaker 2: feel like that's something that is hardwired in lair Night individually.

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Speaker 2: And then the fact that we're in this coupleton makes

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Speaker 2: it maybe a little easier.

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Speaker 1: How long have you guys been together?

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Speaker 2: We have been together for almost twenty nine years. We've

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Speaker 2: been married for almost twenty seven years. Wow, I know

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Speaker 2: I am way too young, way.

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Speaker 1: Too young to have been lit.

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Speaker 2: I just kid, you know, listen, And having said that,

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Speaker 2: that sounds like a grand number. I always joke laired

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Speaker 2: and I really almost got divorced to different times. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's been a really good last fifteen years layered you know,

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Speaker 2: stop drinking alcohol sixteen years ago. That really was really

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Speaker 2: good for the relationships. So I never want to sell

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Speaker 2: a bill of goods and like, yeah, it's just easy street.

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Speaker 2: But I also think in some ways we are we

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Speaker 2: have some things that make it easier to be together.

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Speaker 1: So interesting. I think when your happiness is wrapped up

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Speaker 1: with another human of how the parameters of that change

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Speaker 1: and the stuff that becomes non negotiable about Yes, we

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Speaker 1: always go I have to look to myself to kind

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Speaker 1: of change to evolve in a relationship, but there are

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Speaker 1: certain hard and fast things that you go, this is

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Speaker 1: no longer working, and it's kind of like evolve or die.

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Speaker 1: And I think it's amazing to be able to stay

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Speaker 1: in that version of happiness with someone that accommodates sort

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Speaker 1: of radical evolution and radical self knowledge to support kind

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Speaker 1: of the organism of a family. Like it's it's a

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Speaker 1: proper commitment.

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Speaker 2: It is. And maybe one thing I do buy into

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Speaker 2: coming from sports is there is good hard and I

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Speaker 2: don't believe in making myself my life unnecessarily hard. I

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Speaker 2: don't like to do that. I like to actually make

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Speaker 2: things easy, but I do seek out good, hard, hard

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Speaker 2: that I know goes to another level and not shying

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Speaker 2: away from it. But at the end end of the day,

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Speaker 2: it is still on each of us as individuals, like

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Speaker 2: there's just no way around it. Like I could have

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Speaker 2: the greatest partner who pushes me, you know, maybe I

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Speaker 2: get some courage from laired to be kind of certain

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Speaker 2: parts of my personality that I wouldn't, you know, even

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Speaker 2: for my children. It's like it's on me to figure

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Speaker 2: out what's going to make me feel good. And Byron

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Speaker 2: Katie said to me once something one time years ago.

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Speaker 2: She said, you know, if you want to change your environment,

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Speaker 2: change yourself, And I thought, yeah, it's such a such

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Speaker 2: a constant truth. And it's so hard because.

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Speaker 1: You think I can visit them, I know, because it's

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Speaker 1: so much that I need to see somebody else's shit

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Speaker 1: than it is to see you or to offer up

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Speaker 1: advice on how for them to fix it. The exo

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Speaker 1: stuff is so much easier than the internal journey. And

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Speaker 1: yet that's why we've got to do it. What is

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Speaker 1: the quality you like least about yourself?

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Speaker 2: Jeez, I think I'm not looking for fun and that

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Speaker 2: sort of that's not great. I know, Lair looks at

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Speaker 2: me on the side of his head so many days

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Speaker 2: because he really is looking for fun, like the real fun.

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Speaker 2: They'll like out in nature, you know, be in the moment,

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Speaker 2: have the wind blowing, just like the good fun. And

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Speaker 2: I'm sort of like, yeah, I'm looking for work and order,

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Speaker 2: and maybe that's my version of trying to have some

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Speaker 2: kind of control. I get a deep sense of fulfillment

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Speaker 2: from Oh, okay, goal task completion. I love all that. Like,

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Speaker 2: if you want to visit with me and talk, I

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Speaker 2: can be funny and fun, but I'm not personally looking

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Speaker 2: for like big fun, and I think that's a really

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Speaker 2: important part of being human being.

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Speaker 1: I really like that observation. No one's ever answered that,

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Speaker 1: but it's sort of I think it makes for quite

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Speaker 1: a good compliment with someone like Lad who is essentially

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Speaker 1: Puck in the Shakespearean sense of just the mischief maker,

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Speaker 1: the seeker of the fun and the naughtiness and the

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Speaker 1: loves to get in trouble just to see how he

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Speaker 1: can get out of it, Like Puck kind of needs

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Speaker 1: to be with Eel. Yeah, someone who's taking it a

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Speaker 1: little bit more seriously.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's funny because obviously at my age, I

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Speaker 2: have really learned like it's hard to get me to react.

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Speaker 2: I don't get aggravated. But as far as like, you know,

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Speaker 2: do you want to go get you know, in trouble,

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Speaker 2: I'm sort of like, yeah, I'll be ready at like seven,

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Speaker 2: you guys when to get back. And maybe I intuitively

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Speaker 2: chose Lair because I enjoy it through him. I know

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Speaker 2: it's important, so I have a splash of it in

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Speaker 2: my life, even if it's not all coming through me.

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Speaker 2: I'll give you an example. I went to this gentleman

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Speaker 2: named Peter Evans, and he said, you know you don't

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Speaker 2: have wonder, and you know you have to get back

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Speaker 2: to your bliss right, And I thought, I don't even

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Speaker 2: know what the hell you're talking about. Like when he

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Speaker 2: said that word bliss, when I see people that are

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Speaker 2: like freely floating and like in my bliss, I thought,

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Speaker 2: I don't know that I've ever experienced that. And I

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Speaker 2: am very open minded. But when you talked about wonder,

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Speaker 2: when you see a small child and everything is in wonder,

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Speaker 2: I'm assessing, who's that, what's this? What does that mean?

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Speaker 2: Versus wonder? And so that would be another kind of

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Speaker 2: bolt on adjunct to this fun component that I really

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Speaker 2: think I could do better.

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Speaker 1: Have you ever actively gone and created your version of

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Speaker 1: wonder and fun and what does that look like?

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Speaker 2: No, because I don't think it's something you can fake, right,

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Speaker 2: It's the way that the world hits you. So my

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Speaker 2: version of that is I'm just gonna see, I'm gonna look,

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Speaker 2: I'm not going to think, I know, I'm just gonna

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Speaker 2: take it in. And so that has been the practice

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Speaker 2: for me that has come out of that.

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Speaker 1: That sounds incredibly fun to be actively present. What question

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Speaker 1: would you most like answered?

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Speaker 2: I guess it's not unique. You know, you go through

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Speaker 2: this life, and especially during this time when it's really

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Speaker 2: wild and contentious, it's like when you see the lopsidedness

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Speaker 2: of all the beauty and the injustice, I guess I

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Speaker 2: would like to understand why that has to coexist. And

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Speaker 2: I know bright light dark shadow, and you can't have

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Speaker 2: light without dark, but I guess sometimes when you see

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Speaker 2: such extreme I would love to understand is that the

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Speaker 2: only way is that the only way that the one

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Speaker 2: beauty and the magic can exist is with the sort

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Speaker 2: of other side. I always look at that and think, man,

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Speaker 2: that's a lot of suffering for some of this other stuff.

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Speaker 1: I often wonder if it is I mean, I use

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Speaker 1: the word God just some other force. Is that God made,

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Speaker 1: force made? Or is that man made? Like I think

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Speaker 1: about that often, Like you sort of see it in nature.

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Speaker 1: You see the ostensible rawness, but there doesn't seem to

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Speaker 1: be a rage behind it. You see that it's balanced

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Speaker 1: the light and dark in nature, which is what makes

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Speaker 1: me feel that we have a hand and just test savage.

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Speaker 2: But is that our lesson? Right? Is that we have

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Speaker 2: to go through that to tame the beast within ourselves?

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Speaker 2: I don't It's so complex, right, you go, man, what

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Speaker 2: is the real lesson? What is the real purpose of that? Because,

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Speaker 2: like you said, in nature, it feels very straightforward. It

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Speaker 2: doesn't feel personal, and it's freaking brutal at the same time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe that's it. It doesn't feel personal. It feels

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Speaker 1: like it's part of a rhythm that has always existed,

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Speaker 1: whereas ours feels a lot more manufactured. And you're right,

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Speaker 1: it's like, could we ever evolve from that? I wonder, like,

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Speaker 1: is it possible for us to evolve beyond the savagery?

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Speaker 1: I suppose of the way in which we whether it's

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Speaker 1: treat each other or treat ourselves. I don't know. That's

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Speaker 1: a good one. That's actually a really good one. I

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Speaker 1: think about AI as well, and going is that part

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Speaker 1: of the lure of that is this idea that you

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Speaker 1: could fashion and create a program that doesn't have the

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Speaker 1: kind of awfulness that is part of being human.

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Speaker 2: I asked this gentleman who runs the Harvard study once

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Speaker 2: it's a happiness study, right, and it's gone on for

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Speaker 2: I think seventy five years, And I said, you know, listen,

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Speaker 2: we've written books about it, and there's poems and movies

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Speaker 2: and songs, like we know the answers. What is it

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Speaker 2: about us that we just can't figure it out? And

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Speaker 2: he looked at me and he was like, oh, Gabby,

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Speaker 2: that's how we gained wisdom. And I thought, fair enough.

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Speaker 2: And so the AI think will be interesting because some

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Speaker 2: of the lessons that's what's so great about experience. You

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Speaker 2: can't hack it, you can't shortcut it. Right, It is

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Speaker 2: yours to possess, to own.

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Speaker 1: It's certainly going to speed stuff up.

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Speaker 2: Oh hell yes, it is.

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Speaker 1: Thinking about what the gentleman at Harvard said of the

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Speaker 1: idea of getting wiser Is it just that we can't

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Speaker 1: see our evolution because for us, it's it's generational, Like

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Speaker 1: if you could look at it in a thousand years,

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Speaker 1: would you be able to see this bell curve that

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Speaker 1: we don't know that we're part of because we can't

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Speaker 1: see it yet.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And the transitions are really really uncomfortable, and we

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Speaker 2: obviously clearly in a wild transition because you know, is

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Speaker 2: it a transition away from a biological into a hybrid.

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Speaker 2: It's so funny, I said the laird. Today. I vacillate

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Speaker 2: between I want to check out and just go live,

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Speaker 2: you know. But we're of the age that we're supposed

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Speaker 2: to be here and we're supposed to help, and we're

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Speaker 2: supposed to usher in the next group. We're supposed to

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Speaker 2: act like the adults. But then it's like, is the

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Speaker 2: information or wisdom we have almost useless because is it

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Speaker 2: moving away from biology towards a mashup with technology? So

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Speaker 2: that is sort of an interesting question. I still think,

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Speaker 2: because we're in our biology at this moment, that it's

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Speaker 2: really nice to consider it because I feel like when

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Speaker 2: we have a relationship with it, you feel better.

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Speaker 1: I agree. I do think a lot about our carbon

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Speaker 1: based NICs becoming potentially obsolete, or as you said, a hybrids.

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Speaker 1: It just goes back to be what you said about

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Speaker 1: just be present. It's forward moving. It is always forward moving,

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Speaker 1: so we might as well be that way as well. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what person, place, or experience most altered your life.

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Speaker 2: I've had a few. I lived with a couple from

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Speaker 2: the age of two to seven. They recently, I actually

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Speaker 2: both passed away. They were a couple from Long Island,

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Speaker 2: New York, and they took care of me. And my

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Speaker 2: mother was a young mother in her early twenties. She

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Speaker 2: had sort of a far out. She was training dolphins

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Speaker 2: at a circus in Mexico and she met my father,

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Speaker 2: who's from Trinidad. I did not live with my parents,

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Speaker 2: so they were really pivotal, and I grew up in

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Speaker 2: the Caribbean. After that, I had some families that would

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Speaker 2: take me in even though I was living with my

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Speaker 2: mother at the time. I had a coach in college

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Speaker 2: that was really really instrumental and sort of talking about

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Speaker 2: personal accountability and help me. So I'd say I sort

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Speaker 2: of had these outside people, And what I learned from

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Speaker 2: all that was we think our parents, like, oh my

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Speaker 2: mom did or didn't do this, my dad did or

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Speaker 2: didn't do that. But sometimes we have people that didn't

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Speaker 2: have to step in and they do, and so we

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Speaker 2: got bonus even though we felt like we got chinched

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Speaker 2: on this one side. And so I think when I

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Speaker 2: got a little older, I was like, man, I had

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Speaker 2: some pretty stellar people who stepped in and really helped

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Speaker 2: me navigate and create a really wonderful life.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that by being able to acknowledge that

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Speaker 1: these people were incredibly generous and wonderful to step into

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Speaker 1: your life when perhaps they didn't necessarily have to in

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Speaker 1: the way that we think parents should, did that help

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Speaker 1: you let go of the hard things? So it became

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Speaker 1: a bonus. It became something that was actually light filled

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Speaker 1: as opposed to something that was dark and sad. And

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Speaker 1: the idea of living with someone other than your parents

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Speaker 1: at two to seven might like when you say that

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Speaker 1: to me, it sounds sad. But did you just manage

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Speaker 1: to reframe that later because there was a lot of

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Speaker 1: light in it.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, and it's also maybe surrendering to maybe it was

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Speaker 2: better for me. Maybe my life has turned out better

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Speaker 2: even though there was a great deal of unknown and

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Speaker 2: my hypervigilance comes from not living with my parents. My

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Speaker 2: lack of fun, my lack of wonder comes from really

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Speaker 2: being bounced from the nest very early. But what I

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Speaker 2: came to a relationship with is Listen, I was out

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Speaker 2: of my house at seventeen and totally independent at eighteen.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to adult a lot longer than I was

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Speaker 2: a kid. So let's take a few hard, shitty years

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Speaker 2: for the opportunity to go like, oh wait, I have

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Speaker 2: tools that I can build a life. I don't like stuff,

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Speaker 2: I know how to change it. I have discipline, I

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Speaker 2: can plan, I can navigate, and that came from that childhood.

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Speaker 2: So it certainly took time. And I would also say

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Speaker 2: today I have the best relationship with my mother. I

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Speaker 2: completely accept and love and have no problem with her.

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Speaker 2: But I only seek out the relationship with her that

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Speaker 2: works for me. So I also have a brutality with

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Speaker 2: that being able to reframe. So I can reframe it

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Speaker 2: and I honor myself, and sometimes that's brutal.

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Speaker 1: Well, you have extraordinary clarity around the tenets of your story,

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Speaker 1: which perhaps is part of like again, what makes us

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Speaker 1: the most human is our ability to really examine what

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Speaker 1: our narratives are and to not ignore them or just

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Speaker 1: seek out the bits that we like and ignore the other,

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Speaker 1: but rather see the whole and then holistically move forward.

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Speaker 1: It's really hard to do. I think it requires a

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Speaker 1: kind of brutality, not brutal in the way that what

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Speaker 1: I see in the world right now, but I mean

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Speaker 1: clarified rather than brutal.

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Speaker 2: Well, because with that you can't blame anyone. You're not

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Speaker 2: a victim of your own story. And really, the more

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Speaker 2: people you meet, everybody's had a thing like I am

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Speaker 2: not a victim. But having said that, but I also

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Speaker 2: know how to ask for and put myself in situations

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Speaker 2: that work and make me feel good, and so those

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Speaker 2: can go part and parcel well.

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Speaker 1: I mean also because you've clearly became an advocate for yourself,

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Speaker 1: really yeah, or maybe we're encouraged you as well by

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Speaker 1: your coach, like nobody can advocate for you better than you.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I think a lot of people want

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Speaker 1: to be told what to do, and I mean that

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Speaker 1: in the nicest way. Like I set up an art

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Speaker 1: thing with a boyfriend when I was like nineteen, and

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Speaker 1: the art piece was just the folding table in Portobello

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Speaker 1: Market in London, and we just had a tent card

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Speaker 1: that said advice. We just put up a chair and

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Speaker 1: then we sat on two chairs and I was like,

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Speaker 1: I'm nineteen. I barely know how to tie my shoelaces.

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Speaker 1: I was like, how am I going to answer any questions?

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Speaker 1: And he was like, you just do the best you can,

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Speaker 1: because really most people want you to listen and offer

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Speaker 1: a little bit of advice. And that's exactly what happened.

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Speaker 1: Like we answer questions on infidelity and the people's mortgage rates,

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Speaker 1: whether or not they should move in with someone. It

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Speaker 1: was crazy. People really want someone else to tell them

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Speaker 1: what to do. So I think those moments of being

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Speaker 1: able to believe that you are your own advocate and

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Speaker 1: that you actually can give yourself good advice, I think

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Speaker 1: it's pretty rare, gabby to be able to do that,

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Speaker 1: and kind of amazing to have cultivated that.

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Speaker 2: But you have to question yourself also at every moment. Again,

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Speaker 2: there lies another duality, which is if you're going to

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Speaker 2: be a good steward of your story, you better pay

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Speaker 2: attention and not think you're right. So it's this weird

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Speaker 2: fine line of leaning into this is the way to

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Speaker 2: go and keep paying attention keep questioning yourself, where is

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Speaker 2: this decision coming from? So I think it's also staying

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Speaker 2: awake the whole time. So you are steering the ship

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Speaker 2: at least hopefully more times than not, towards the light

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Speaker 2: or the right direction.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, to be aware of what it is to be

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Speaker 1: the captain of your ship. Yeah, what relationship, real or fictionalized,

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Speaker 1: defines love for you?

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Speaker 2: That's an interesting question. I know this is probably not great.

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Speaker 2: I like to be surprised, but I don't want to

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Speaker 2: be surprised, so like I'm great with oh I didn't

399
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Speaker 2: see that coming, but I always sort of feel like

400
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Speaker 2: with love for me, and I really hope to be

401
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Speaker 2: this for somebody. Is I'm not really gonna surprise you.

402
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Speaker 2: It's not going to be like oh I thought she

403
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Speaker 2: was this, but.

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Speaker 1: Wow, she's that un steadiness yes, but not fixed right

405
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Speaker 1: and with allowance and movements.

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Speaker 2: So it's sort of like this big bubble that kind

407
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Speaker 2: of bounces around and it won't break, but it can

408
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Speaker 2: kind of motion bend, But the inside of it is

409
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Speaker 2: there's something sort of like there's sort of a volume

410
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Speaker 2: that you understand and know. It's not a lot more

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Speaker 2: or less. So I try to be that and really

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Speaker 2: I don't need for it to be great or perfect

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Speaker 2: and I'm not looking for someone to save me. And

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Speaker 2: you're not gonna tell me anything where I'm gonna be

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Speaker 2: like ooh, that's bad. Just be congruent and I'm cool

416
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Speaker 2: with it. And I really want to be that and no, no,

417
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Speaker 2: tit for tat and one for one. If I do it,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to do it because I want you and

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Speaker 2: you owe me nothing. And if you do that for

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Speaker 2: me too, I would hope that that's the same.

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Speaker 1: Wow, it's very stoic. I really like that. It speaks

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Speaker 1: to like proper ancient stoicism, that notion of I will

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Speaker 1: do what I say. I will say what I do,

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Speaker 1: and that's what you can expect from me, and that

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Speaker 1: is what I would most appreciate from you. Would you

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Speaker 1: say that's probably having very clear boundaries around what it

427
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Speaker 1: is that you your expectation of a person or the

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Speaker 1: expectation of yourself.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I think I'm much harder on myself than I

430
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Speaker 2: am on others. I think that I have learned, especially

431
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Speaker 2: through parenting and being in a long relationship. I can

432
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Speaker 2: barely control myself. But that's going to be the person

433
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,679
Speaker 2: I'm the hardest on and I'm not going to be

434
00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:21,920
Speaker 2: that hard on you. That's on you, but just show

435
00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:24,199
Speaker 2: me the truth. Tell me the truth. And also I'm

436
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,960
Speaker 2: going to keep moving. So the hope would be if

437
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 2: we're going to be in this relationship, whatever relationship that is,

438
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 2: with the exception of my children, you want to have

439
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,200
Speaker 2: forward motion in your own version, and then we will

440
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:39,280
Speaker 2: know each other. I'm not going to hang back because

441
00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 2: I can't. Right, So, even if you're a movement side

442
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:45,119
Speaker 2: to side or up and down, it's cool. That is

443
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:48,280
Speaker 2: sort of like maybe we'll meet kind of thing. I

444
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:52,360
Speaker 2: always tell my girlfriends it's perfectly healthy to ask yourself,

445
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 2: what do I get from this relationship, even if it's Hey,

446
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,439
Speaker 2: Minnie is really bright and I like the way she

447
00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 2: lives her life and with Laird, obviously, I'm trying to

448
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,679
Speaker 2: to show up in service, but you can bet I

449
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,119
Speaker 2: do some inventory being like, also when am I getting

450
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 2: because otherwise I don't know that that's honest.

451
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:13,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree, I do. I agree in that inventory particularly,

452
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 1: and I think that that does really help to find

453
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,360
Speaker 1: love for me as well, is that everybody is sort

454
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 1: of taking responsibility for their own personal inventory within a relationship.

455
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:24,880
Speaker 2: My kids are the only ones. Like I always say,

456
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,199
Speaker 2: there's only one group that I never go like, what

457
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:30,840
Speaker 2: am I getting out of this? It's like, I'm your mom,

458
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,120
Speaker 2: I'm going to be your mom. I'm going to be here.

459
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:40,959
Speaker 1: In your life. Can you tell me about something that

460
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 1: has grown out of a personal disaster.

461
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, one of my daughters went through something when she

462
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 2: was thirteen. It's like the stuff you hope never occurs,

463
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 2: and you think, I'm going to have a peaceful house,

464
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 2: I'm going to be there, and sometimes you realize your

465
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,320
Speaker 2: kids have a journey. And I really got flipped upside

466
00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 2: down on it. You think, are we going to get

467
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 2: through this? Is she going to get through this? And

468
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 2: what came out of that was a real opportunity not

469
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:06,680
Speaker 2: only for her and I to grow closer together, but

470
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:08,919
Speaker 2: for me to change as a person, which was so

471
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 2: wildly uncomfortable. I mean, I wasn't that young. I was

472
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:16,200
Speaker 2: in my forties. Anything could happen to me, and it

473
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:18,919
Speaker 2: was not great. Even as a young kid. For me,

474
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:21,159
Speaker 2: the hardest would be when something happens to one of

475
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,520
Speaker 2: your kids. And so I could say that that certainly

476
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:27,919
Speaker 2: was not only a wake up call, but I have

477
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:33,400
Speaker 2: the opportunity to be a better or different person from

478
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 2: something that was excrucinatingly painful for her and for me.

479
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,919
Speaker 1: And were you conscious of taking those things that you

480
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 1: learned with you on and did she also do you

481
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 1: feel like take those lessons on with her?

482
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:50,680
Speaker 2: She absolutely did what I have learned as a parent,

483
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 2: and I know you can. Really you're not really telling

484
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 2: them anything, you're modeling. Nobody really tells you. We go

485
00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 2: like this, oh okay, and we do exactly what we think.

486
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 2: That's what we do. And my girls are strong willed, imagine.

487
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 2: So I thought, I'm uncomfortable and I resent the fact

488
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,360
Speaker 2: that I'm having to make a change because the tendency

489
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 2: is to be like, hey, I'm going to drop my

490
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,640
Speaker 2: kid off, fix them, and I'll pick them back up

491
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 2: when they're fixed. And it's like yeah, no, no, no,

492
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 2: the whole group gets to make a change. I think

493
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 2: your kids really appreciate that you go, I don't know,

494
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:27,000
Speaker 2: I'm fumbling through, but I'm going to try. That is

495
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 2: powerful for them. Not that you weren't.

496
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:34,440
Speaker 1: Perfect, absolutely, not that you weren't perfect exactly, and amazing

497
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,320
Speaker 1: to see that behavior like that will always be with

498
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:40,680
Speaker 1: not only her, but I think probably with everyone else

499
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,800
Speaker 1: in your family of going we went through this thing

500
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 1: and now we are on the other side of that,

501
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:47,880
Speaker 1: and this is how it shaped us. And I think

502
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 1: it's amazing to be able to look back positively on

503
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,400
Speaker 1: things that were extraordinarily hard.

504
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 2: I remember clear as day going up into the bathroom

505
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 2: in my bedroom and I literally stood six inches from

506
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:01,479
Speaker 2: the mirror and looked into one of my eyeballs and

507
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:03,880
Speaker 2: I was like, you're gonna have to keep your shit

508
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,120
Speaker 2: together right now, because the impulse was to go, Oh

509
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 2: my god, like I'm gonna follow apart and it was like, oh, yeah, no.

510
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:11,919
Speaker 2: And I had a friend say to me, and I

511
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,440
Speaker 2: know people can relate to this. We all get our

512
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 2: turn and our time in the chamber, and sometimes we're

513
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 2: gonna have to be there longer than when we want cool.

514
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,879
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh shit, And that's the thing.

515
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:27,399
Speaker 2: Sometimes we can't just fix it and solve it right you.

516
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 2: We're gonna have to go all the way through it

517
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 2: and we think we're out of it and then all

518
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,359
Speaker 2: of a sudden you get pulled back in. So just

519
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,160
Speaker 2: if anyone is going through anything like that, just keep

520
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 2: asking for the answers, and remember this, whatever we're going through,

521
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 2: if everyone's here, like you know, Layedi says, if there's

522
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 2: air going in and out of the nose in the face,

523
00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 2: we can work it all out. Whatever it is, we

524
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 2: can work it out.

525
00:28:55,520 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: And on that brilliant note, I just l's philosophy is

526
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: their going in and out of the pace. It's not over.

527
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 1: It's true.

528
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 2: My oldest daughter, who is almost twenty nine, was like

529
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,320
Speaker 2: going through something at nineteen and he's like, oh my god,

530
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 2: just make it to twenty five. And I thought, oh, yeah,

531
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 2: that's right.

532
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:23,640
Speaker 1: Wow, that's amazing, it's really amazing. Is she ready twenty nine?

533
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 2: I don't think you know that one. You know the

534
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:27,920
Speaker 2: middle who's twenty and.

535
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 1: Okay, I didn't know you had an older daughter.

536
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 2: Laird came with a He came with a four month old.

537
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:35,320
Speaker 1: That's right.

538
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 2: So I became a step parent at twenty five. But see,

539
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 2: my experience with living with my aunt Or and uncle

540
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 2: Joe when I was little reminded me that love is love,

541
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 2: and so I didn't have to be her mom to

542
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: be another source of love, so that I had that

543
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 2: lesson early.

544
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 1: That's exactly how it is for my son and my partner.

545
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 1: His name's Addison, and he we call him Daddison. They

546
00:29:57,200 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 1: have their own separate relationship that is amazing and a

547
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 1: source of great joy. It's funny that the notion of

548
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 1: convention can keep us shackled to things having to look

549
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 1: a certain way. And I think clearly empirically, so in

550
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 1: your own life, things didn't look the way that the

551
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: in quote should have looked. But you grew and you

552
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: got some incredible thing from those people.

553
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you don't get on each other's genetic nerves.

554
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 2: Imagine that. Yeah, my daughter is so much like me.

555
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my god. So there's so many bonuses.

556
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 1: Oh, Gaby, thank you so much with all my heart.

557
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 2: Thanks.

558
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 1: Mini Mini Questions is hosted and written by Me Mini Driver,

559
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: Executive produced by me and Aaron Kaufman, with production support

560
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 1: from Jennifer Bassett, Zoey Denkler, and Ali Perry. That theme

561
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 1: music is also by Me and additional music by Aaron Kaufman.

562
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: Special thanks to Jim Nikolay, Addison, Henry Driver, Lisa Castella,

563
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:07,720
Speaker 1: Anick Oppenheim, a, Nick Muller, and Annette Wolfe, a w kPr,

564
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: Will Pearson, Nikki Ittor Morgan Lavoy and mangesh A ticke

565
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 1: Adore