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Speaker 1: Hey, this Sanny and Samantha and welcome to Stephane. Never

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Speaker 1: told your production of I Heart Radio. All right, guys,

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Speaker 1: today we are doing something a little different. Um, and

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Speaker 1: I'm very excited about it because I'm not gonna lie.

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Speaker 1: I've missed my dear friend a lot. We may have

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Speaker 1: a moment. We're gonna have a moment in a minute.

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Speaker 1: But one of my friends and good people of my

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Speaker 1: life's who I also had the pleasure of working with

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Speaker 1: at the Department of Juvenal Justice here in Georgia. Um,

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Speaker 1: and we are going to do conversation, easy going conversation. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: so um everyone. I want y'all to meet my friend

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Speaker 1: Courtney Jones. Everyone, my Courtney. My name is Courtney Jones.

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Speaker 1: Like you mentioned before, I do work with the Georgia

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Speaker 1: Department of Juvenile Justice and work with placing kids and

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Speaker 1: throughout the state making sure they receive residential treatment care

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Speaker 1: if they should need it. Oh. Um, and Courdney, if

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Speaker 1: you don't mind, can you give us a little bit

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Speaker 1: of your educational background and how you kind of got

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Speaker 1: into this field. Sure, Um, I started out very actually

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Speaker 1: I was supposed to be a teacher. Um. I tried

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Speaker 1: to do that and it did not go well. I

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Speaker 1: don't know how teachers teach and discipline at the same time.

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Speaker 1: So I quickly changed my major after volunteering one summer

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Speaker 1: and I said new not for me. So I have

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Speaker 1: a bachelor's degree in psychology and human services and after

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Speaker 1: that I got a master's degree in school council. I

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Speaker 1: also have a minor in African American studies, but I

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Speaker 1: don't know if that really counts, as I didn't graduate

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Speaker 1: from that school, it counts, I think, so yeah, so yeah,

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Speaker 1: social work. You couldn't in my school. You couldn't get

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Speaker 1: a minor, and you could get a second day or

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Speaker 1: an emphasis. So I was, I think two three courses

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Speaker 1: away from having another major in religion. Really weird, so

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Speaker 1: I kind of say that's my minor, even though technically

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Speaker 1: I couldn't have a minor. So weird to me. I

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Speaker 1: don't know why, but yes, um and I know, just

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Speaker 1: so for you guys to know. Courtney and I actually

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Speaker 1: met because we both interviewed for a promotional uh position

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Speaker 1: at d j J. There was two spots open, and

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Speaker 1: she and I were the ones that received those spots,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, oh no, who am I going

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Speaker 1: to work with who's coming in with me? And I

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Speaker 1: think it was the second day? Was it the second

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Speaker 1: day you and I actually started the job. We wanted

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Speaker 1: out and about and we feared out. We were pretty

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Speaker 1: much salt mates. Oh no, I knew day one. I

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Speaker 1: told you one that you needed your own reality of

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Speaker 1: the show. This was just like just full alive and

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Speaker 1: so I loved her. Day one. It was more anxiety

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Speaker 1: more than energy. So I couldn't stop talking. I couldn't

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Speaker 1: tell okay, good good. I was like, this girl is

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Speaker 1: gonna hate me by the end of this. This woman

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Speaker 1: is going to be like, get it out through my car,

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Speaker 1: Get out of my car right now. Um. But we

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Speaker 1: did have some good body moments. And just for context, uh,

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Speaker 1: the area that Courtney and I worked out and we're

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Speaker 1: definitely was definitely the major parts like of North Georgia,

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Speaker 1: So she covered all of the small surrounding counties while

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Speaker 1: I covered the major cities. So I was a city girl, yes, um.

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Speaker 1: And one of the things that we often talked about

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Speaker 1: during our many many like release sessions, I guess we

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Speaker 1: can call it um, would be the fact of where

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Speaker 1: we were in our field, how we got into our

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Speaker 1: field and how we could make change. And I think

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Speaker 1: what we bonded most over is that we do We

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Speaker 1: would come out talking about loving our kids, and these

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Speaker 1: kids were hours, whether or not we spent one on

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Speaker 1: one time more than an hour or never at all,

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Speaker 1: Like even if we just read all of their files

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Speaker 1: and understood where they were coming from or trying to

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Speaker 1: understand where they're coming from, we would claim them as

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Speaker 1: our own, our kids. And she and I went through

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Speaker 1: a lot of heartbreak, also a lot of encouraging times, um,

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Speaker 1: and of course a lot of frustration about what it

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Speaker 1: looks like to be in public service. Would you agree

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Speaker 1: with that, Corney? Right? And I think one of the

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Speaker 1: reasons we wanted to talk about this and I wanted

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Speaker 1: to talk about this not only to have her on

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Speaker 1: the show because I miss her dearly and also, you know,

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Speaker 1: I needed my one work wife to meet the other

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Speaker 1: work wife. This is a ploy, um, But the fact

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Speaker 1: that we I have been talking about the justice system

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Speaker 1: looked like today and where have we gone wrong? And

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Speaker 1: how do we fix it? How do we fix it all?

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Speaker 1: And what does it look like to try to fix it?

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Speaker 1: And one of the big components to that is at

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Speaker 1: risk teams and at risk youths and UM for myself,

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Speaker 1: I got into the field after I left the Department

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Speaker 1: of Family and Children's Services investigating child abuse because I

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Speaker 1: wanted to try to do something that would impact for

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Speaker 1: the future, if that makes sense. Coming in after the fact,

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Speaker 1: trying to keep a family together didn't seem like it

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Speaker 1: was working, So for me, I wanted to try a

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Speaker 1: little more differently with youths and trying to prevent and

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Speaker 1: help them have a better start or a better life,

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Speaker 1: or a turnaround or at least the bay at least

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Speaker 1: someone to support them. UM. And I think with that

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Speaker 1: one of the things that go through my mind and Accordney,

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Speaker 1: I want you to tell your side of this as well,

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Speaker 1: is as we're seeing all of the brutality that is happening,

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Speaker 1: the questions about power versus empathy, power versus UH, the escalation,

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Speaker 1: and also what it means to hold people accountable is

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Speaker 1: kind of that question of how do we do that

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Speaker 1: on a bigger scale, but also on the smaller scale.

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Speaker 1: Because if you're in social work, I know you guys

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Speaker 1: know this. We talk about the macro versus micro practices,

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Speaker 1: and I think that's part of the conversations that we're

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Speaker 1: not having when we talk about to fund the police,

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Speaker 1: whether or not abolition of police is even possible, or

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Speaker 1: how it's possible, or talking about what it looks like

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Speaker 1: to break down one power scope or will say, white

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Speaker 1: supremacy in an area that is infiltrated with a lot

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Speaker 1: of biases and prejudices that's in there. But with that, Courtney,

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Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you as a person, who how

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Speaker 1: long have you been with d j J. I know

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Speaker 1: it's been a minute, yeah, Um, yeah, I started in twelve.

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Speaker 1: This was after me trying to get I was successibly

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Speaker 1: getting a job with the school system because becoming a

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Speaker 1: school counselor, you know, that's position where someone either retires

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Speaker 1: or dies. There is no in between, just that dream job.

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Speaker 1: What else can I do with this that can really

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Speaker 1: affect the same population. D j J was a perfect

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Speaker 1: fit basically working with the same clientele. Um, the kids

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Speaker 1: that would come in UM in the school councilor's office

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Speaker 1: are the same kids that you will be dealing with

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Speaker 1: with DJJ. So I was there since started as a

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Speaker 1: probation officer and then moved into my current position. When

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Speaker 1: you were talking about how you got into this to

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Speaker 1: work with that population. UM. I was the same way.

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Speaker 1: So one of the things I did want to ask

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Speaker 1: you is did you get pulled in during the initiative

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Speaker 1: when they were trying to bring in count serge and

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Speaker 1: social workers as well as because that's how I got involved.

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Speaker 1: They were trying to go away from punitive Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay.

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Speaker 1: So at that time, I was working as a probation

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Speaker 1: officer at the Calf County. This is before I obtained

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Speaker 1: my master's degree. So that was part of the whole

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Speaker 1: restorative justice UM model in which they were trying to

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Speaker 1: get back to UM community policing, bringing more social workers

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Speaker 1: in and really getting the kids not to see us

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Speaker 1: as police officers, but more UM kind of the same

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Speaker 1: vein as UH defects as case worker, so not your

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Speaker 1: probation officers, but your case worker. And the focus of

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Speaker 1: that was for us to be just basically just that,

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Speaker 1: a case worker, the liaison of putting all of those

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Speaker 1: services together. So we were counseling, we were getting them

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Speaker 1: to UM to their actor school group sessions, making sure

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Speaker 1: that they are participating in school, make ensured of getting

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Speaker 1: the family counseling. All of those things combined in the one.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, I was definitely there for that. There was

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Speaker 1: plenty of UM in house trainings conferences and it was

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Speaker 1: awesome in that they were focused on that, but it

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Speaker 1: failed in that they did not tie everything together like

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Speaker 1: we have the every year the UM Systems of Care Conference,

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Speaker 1: which is a great conference, be gives us a lot

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Speaker 1: of ideas, but we don't have the community resources to

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Speaker 1: do what we're talking about UM or we have the

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Speaker 1: community resources, but they're not in the places where we

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Speaker 1: need them. There's so much out there, but there are

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Speaker 1: a lot of people will not or cannot travel to

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Speaker 1: the places that we needed the most, like those countries,

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Speaker 1: and those are our North Georgia kids and you know

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Speaker 1: Middle Georgia kids. They suffer because there really aren't any

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Speaker 1: alternative counseling or programs that can assist through their crisis.

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Speaker 1: And that's kind of where we are. And I know

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Speaker 1: they kind of they had brought me in and I

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Speaker 1: was what they called the Probation Parole Specialists and I

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Speaker 1: know that's what your title as well. And the at

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Speaker 1: this time, it was during the initiative to bring in

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Speaker 1: more case workers and more counseling level of people to

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Speaker 1: do this type of management. And I actually when I

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Speaker 1: started my job, I loved it. I loved interacting with

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Speaker 1: the kids. I felt so passionate about sitting with them.

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Speaker 1: And of course, because I had a background in the

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Speaker 1: Department of Family Children's Services, I had a lot of

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Speaker 1: those dual cases where they may be a part of

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Speaker 1: both defacts. In DJJ also had the mental health caseload essentially,

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Speaker 1: so any child that might have some type of mental

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Speaker 1: health diagnosis, I typically would have them on my plate.

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Speaker 1: I also had parents who are who had mental health

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Speaker 1: diagnosis on my caseload too, because that was a whole

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Speaker 1: different scenario. But I was one of the things that

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Speaker 1: I've always been fascinated by in my field, in our

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Speaker 1: fields essentially, and especially with d j J. And I'm

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Speaker 1: not really sure what the breakdown is because I couldn't

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Speaker 1: find any actual statistics um and that I do know

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Speaker 1: that in social work, uh, women make up eighty one

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Speaker 1: percent of the workers of social workers in the nation,

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Speaker 1: and then counselors is sixty nine nine of women in counseling.

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Speaker 1: And then if you look at the others, like human

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Speaker 1: services field, their social services field that might not have

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Speaker 1: a social work degree or counseling degree. That's a d.

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Speaker 1: Two percent of them are women as well, which I

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Speaker 1: found fascinating, um and not so surprising because if we

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Speaker 1: if you've been in the field long enough, yes see it,

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Speaker 1: that's who you work with typically um and not again,

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Speaker 1: I'm not so surprising, uh, for those who climb their

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Speaker 1: way up to the ladder is typically men and whether

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Speaker 1: they were there to begin with or not. Um. In

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Speaker 1: nonprofits alone, even though in the nonprofit world, old, let

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Speaker 1: me find my statistics, Uh, of the employees are women,

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Speaker 1: but only of the women become CEOs of these nonprofits.

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Speaker 1: And if an organization has a budget of at least

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Speaker 1: twenty one million, only twenty one are run by female CEOs,

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Speaker 1: which there's a lot to me you no, no, but

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Speaker 1: that says much to y'all. Um. And then it's also

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Speaker 1: one to note that on the organizational boards for nonprofits,

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Speaker 1: only four percent of the women women of color on

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Speaker 1: the awards, which I find really disheartening and sad because obviously,

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Speaker 1: if you look at the statistics, the people who know

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Speaker 1: what's going on are women, and most likely women of color. Now,

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Speaker 1: I did find a different statistics saying that social workers

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Speaker 1: because you know I'm all about my social workers do

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Speaker 1: make up of mainly white women, which I'm baffled by, honestly,

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Speaker 1: because the majority of people that I've worked with are

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Speaker 1: typically women of color, and for the metro area, for Georgia,

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Speaker 1: it's typically black women. Mm hmm. And Party, I wanted

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Speaker 1: to have a dialogue because you and I have talked

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Speaker 1: a lot about why someone gets into this field any

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Speaker 1: we've made. We've had an episode previously about why anyone

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Speaker 1: gets into this field, and typically it's because of personal trauma,

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Speaker 1: personal experiences, and a desire through because of empathy, because

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Speaker 1: of that level of personal experience that builds that empathy

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Speaker 1: to want to make change. And um, would that be

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Speaker 1: why you would say you were a part of this Yes, Um,

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Speaker 1: I've always known that was gonna work with kids. Even

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Speaker 1: as a kid, children have naturally just flocked to me.

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Speaker 1: I don't know why that is. I command the grocery

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Speaker 1: stove right now, and the little kid will walk up

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Speaker 1: to me and do like this, pick me up. It's

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Speaker 1: like motion. I don't know this kid. It's kind concerning,

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Speaker 1: it's very weird, but it happens. But um, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: always knew I was gonna work with kids. Um, So

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Speaker 1: when the teaching thing didn't work out because of my

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Speaker 1: lack of patience with the discipline part, Um, this was

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Speaker 1: perfect because I'm all about discipline and being able to

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Speaker 1: do it in a helpful vein. I don't believe in

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Speaker 1: person yelling to get my point across that kids and

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Speaker 1: think it enough of that at home. So, um, this

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Speaker 1: fit very well with what I wanted to do. The

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Speaker 1: problem is always gonna be money. Um. What you were

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Speaker 1: those statistics that you were talking about, the men are

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Speaker 1: the CEO is because of the whole money situation. Men

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Speaker 1: are still promoted based the fond the fact that they

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Speaker 1: are the bread winners of their family. Um, and and

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Speaker 1: women aren't that we just aren't. And However, a lot

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Speaker 1: of people, I think go into social work because it

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Speaker 1: is such a It is a feeling which you can

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Speaker 1: build your family, Like if you were very family oriented,

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Speaker 1: you can take your time off and then come back.

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Speaker 1: That is one of the good things about being a

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Speaker 1: governmental employee. Your time is your time. So if you've

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Speaker 1: earned the time, you use the time and you can

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Speaker 1: come back. So I think there's pros and concept why

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Speaker 1: people choose to be in this particular field, whether it

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Speaker 1: is they want to build their family. They don't necessarily

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Speaker 1: care about the money because their partner makes more than enough,

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Speaker 1: and they truly have a desire to help people and

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Speaker 1: this is the best way that you can do that

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Speaker 1: at multiple levels. It started for me UM being a

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Speaker 1: kid working living in a low income area. We received

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Speaker 1: a lot of programs people coming in, whether that be

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Speaker 1: hands On Atlanta or UM. There were other volunteer groups

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Speaker 1: that would come in and work with us. I also

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Speaker 1: was a part of Upward Bound program, which is a

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Speaker 1: federally run program which UM took at a riscue and

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Speaker 1: encouraged them to go to college, which was a treat

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Speaker 1: for me because that meant met every Saturday, I got

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Speaker 1: to be on the Moorhouse campus and be surrounded by

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Speaker 1: all these wonderful, laurious, gorgeous young men and if you know,

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Speaker 1: UM the summer program was so awesome also because they

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Speaker 1: took us on a college tour. We got to see

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Speaker 1: campuses and go have the dorm experience and it was

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Speaker 1: all free. So when I started thinking about, you know, man,

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Speaker 1: that's something I really would like to do. I would

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Speaker 1: like to do this for someone else who may not

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Speaker 1: have the opportunity because I wasn't a troubled kid. I

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Speaker 1: was not in the principal's office, I was not seeing

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Speaker 1: the school council all the time. But I needed help,

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Speaker 1: and I was one of the very few that actually

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Speaker 1: got it, that didn't just slip through. I can think

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Speaker 1: of many other my classmates that were kind of in

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Speaker 1: the same boat as me, but they never received those things.

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Speaker 1: But once I saw free and then you're gonna give

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Speaker 1: me a Marty card to be there. Oh I'm there.

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Speaker 1: You like your free I know you were the first

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Speaker 1: person I've met. You're like, it's my birthday week. I

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Speaker 1: got download all my free things. There you go. It's

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Speaker 1: all about me, which my birthday and every birthday should

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Speaker 1: be a national holiday. In my mind, I celebrated like

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Speaker 1: that half Christmas is going to kick off. It is

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, her birthdays. How She's like, my birthday is

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Speaker 1: in between halfway to Christmas. And I was like, oh, okay,

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Speaker 1: six months before Christmas and six months after you can't

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Speaker 1: be there. So we're gonna do an happy birthday day.

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Speaker 1: Everybody's gonna say you happy birthdays. Remember that, listeners, we

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Speaker 1: have some more of our conversation with Courtney. But first

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Speaker 1: we have a quick break for a word from our

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Speaker 1: sponsor and back, thank you sponsor. Let's get back into it. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: I think that was one of the big questions as

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Speaker 1: we've seen. I know we were talking about just ability

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Speaker 1: and care and that's kind of one of the things

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Speaker 1: that they talked about as to why men aren't being

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Speaker 1: social workers are going into that field. Um And by

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Speaker 1: the way, in the nineteen eighties, over thirty something percent

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Speaker 1: of social workers were men. As of this last few

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Speaker 1: years it went down to ten percent. And the big

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Speaker 1: question about why, and again we talked about money. And

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Speaker 1: by the way, I had to have three jobs at

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Speaker 1: one point in order to live by myself in Atlanta,

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Speaker 1: UM and I know many people from like New York

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Speaker 1: and California A scoff and DC like, oh, you don't

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Speaker 1: have to pay you know, your cost of living is

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Speaker 1: not that much. I was like, yeah, well, in comparison

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Speaker 1: to what we're being paid, it is um And it

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Speaker 1: took me to that and I'm still paying pretty low

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Speaker 1: now for my apartment um at with forty and trying

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Speaker 1: to figure out how to do this and I finally

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Speaker 1: have landed a job and it had to be away

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Speaker 1: from social work, like that's the only way I could

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Speaker 1: do it, and or any kind of social services in general.

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Speaker 1: But that was one of the things like Okay, maybe

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Speaker 1: it's money and that could be it. But one of

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Speaker 1: the bigger conversations is that men are less likely to

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Speaker 1: seek help like therapy, like assistance in that way, so

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Speaker 1: that toxic maxculinity holds them bags. So therefore, why would

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Speaker 1: you want men to help other women? Maybe, you know,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of that level of like, okay, who

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Speaker 1: helps whom? Well, of course it's that's a female. A

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Speaker 1: female should help them. Maybe that's that conversation. On top

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Speaker 1: of that, there's also that conversation that social services and

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Speaker 1: social care is more like caretaking, as you said, um,

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Speaker 1: giving and providing, which is very maternal and seen as feminine.

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Speaker 1: So therefore men don't want to be a part of

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Speaker 1: that culture. I gotta be a man. So that's kind

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Speaker 1: of one of those levels of Okay, we get you,

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Speaker 1: but that's really really toxic and really unhealthy. It is.

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Speaker 1: I think if we approached a different way, this is

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Speaker 1: not about if we take away the social work part

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Speaker 1: of them, put more mentor coaching those are terms that

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Speaker 1: they can get with, right, that's those are the things

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Speaker 1: that they like. This is how we pander and so

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Speaker 1: and then I know a big part of that which

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Speaker 1: again kind of enables this toxic masculinity, this misogynistic idea

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Speaker 1: is saying being a man. So a lot of our

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Speaker 1: mentoring program talk about men being men. Yes, but in

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Speaker 1: order to get more men in it, we have to

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Speaker 1: rebrand this thing, is what I'm saying. If you want

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Speaker 1: men to be more caring and more open and to

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Speaker 1: really be there for this younger generation and get them

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Speaker 1: out of that toxicity, we have to uh do a

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Speaker 1: new campaign so far as to lure them in, and

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Speaker 1: the money has to change, and it has to be

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Speaker 1: a way for us to let them know that, hey,

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Speaker 1: this is not just about wiping noses and patting people

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Speaker 1: on the back. We're really talking about the future of

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Speaker 1: our country. We have to change how we talk to

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Speaker 1: one another, how we communicate one another. And if we

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Speaker 1: can't do that right now with our young people we're having,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna have another generation that's lost because the way

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Speaker 1: in which people talk and interact with each other is

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Speaker 1: so based on non reality. It's scary. The way kids

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Speaker 1: think things are supposed to be based on what they

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Speaker 1: see on TV, what they see on scripted reality TV

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Speaker 1: shows and trying to get them to understand, no, that's

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Speaker 1: not real. It's like it's very hard to jerking out

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Speaker 1: of that because they're bombarded by it, whether it be

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Speaker 1: the TV, internet, phone, they have it coming at them

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Speaker 1: at all different angles. So we really do need that

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Speaker 1: male perspective. We need strong male voices to be able

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Speaker 1: to lead and show our kids that this is what

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Speaker 1: you need to be. This is what truly makes you

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Speaker 1: not just a man, but to be a successful adult

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Speaker 1: contributing to society. And I think that's the conversation is

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Speaker 1: it's not so much that we're it's unfortunate that we

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Speaker 1: have to rebrand. Shouldn't we to be able to break

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Speaker 1: down the system in general and say being kind and

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Speaker 1: being compassionate is not a gender thing. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: to be a strong man doesn't mean you have to

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Speaker 1: be physically or emotionally strong. It just means that you

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Speaker 1: are reliable in there, you know. And that's kind of

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Speaker 1: that conversation that needs to be broken down, is we

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be catering to the toxic masculinity. We should be

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Speaker 1: breaking it down and redoing the mindset not only on

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Speaker 1: men and young boys, but the whole system in itself,

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Speaker 1: which is because exactly what you're saying. When we were

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Speaker 1: in social work, when I was in the course, I remember,

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Speaker 1: and I've talked about this before, I remember a professor

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Speaker 1: saying specifically to the men in our class, which I

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Speaker 1: think was a in full maybe three or four, saying,

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Speaker 1: you guys are gonna get jobs faster than any other

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Speaker 1: person here. You guys are gonna get money than any

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Speaker 1: other person here, so you need to stick with it.

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Speaker 1: That was kind of the painter. And I was like

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Speaker 1: looking around, going and and she wasn't saying it as

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Speaker 1: a good job, guys. She was just saying it as

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Speaker 1: a fact. It is what it is. And I think

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Speaker 1: you and I have seen that many times. Men who

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Speaker 1: play the game, and what I mean by that, play

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Speaker 1: the white supremacist game and being you know, in the

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Speaker 1: middle line and sucking up and not make too many

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Speaker 1: headways get promoted very very quickly and fast. Would you

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Speaker 1: agree with that? I don't know about the white supremacy

404
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Speaker 1: par It's just really about the boys quote. It really

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Speaker 1: is just being able to play your position until a

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Speaker 1: job opens up. Not just men, anyone just promoting their friends.

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Speaker 1: Like we have a lot of turnover, yes, a lot

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Speaker 1: of turnover and d JJ and when we have someone new,

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Speaker 1: we know they're gonna bring in such as such and

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Speaker 1: such a disposition in that position, in that position, which

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Speaker 1: is fine to have your own team. But the nepotism,

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Speaker 1: that's the word I was looking for. There's a lot

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Speaker 1: of nepotism and that, and it really prevents people who

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Speaker 1: have been there, who really know what the needs are

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Speaker 1: for the organization to move forward, to move up and

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Speaker 1: truly move the organization where it needs to be, whether

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Speaker 1: it be male or female. But that happens a lot,

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Speaker 1: right and I think what I'm saying about white supremacies

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Speaker 1: literally playing the game. Whether in the state of Georgia,

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Speaker 1: we know who our bosses and that's the governor. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to talk about that. A lot of

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Speaker 1: the idea is you don't say too much, you don't

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Speaker 1: say too loudly. We've definitely had coworkers say like, this

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Speaker 1: is somewhat racist, you're treating this child like this whatever whatnot,

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Speaker 1: and they get shut down very quickly and being like,

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Speaker 1: you can't say that. So as long as you play

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Speaker 1: the middle of the get like playing the middle of

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00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:05,120
Speaker 1: the road game and where you have to, you can't

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Speaker 1: acknowledge too many wrongs because if you acknowledge too many wrongs,

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Speaker 1: and you're showing spotlights. And and I know for me,

431
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 1: when I worked within the Metro area, one of our

432
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 1: county judges um stated that, yes, black young black boys

433
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 1: are actually targeted in our area. And ninety somewhere between

434
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 1: of the arrests and the cases were actually black boys.

435
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,120
Speaker 1: Like it was that significant. And we had they had

436
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:38,080
Speaker 1: the highest arrest record and detention record in the state.

437
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,399
Speaker 1: So that conversation in itself was part of the whole. Okay,

438
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 1: don't say it too wildly. We don't want to say

439
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,120
Speaker 1: that too wildly, like who is being targeted? And therefore

440
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,919
Speaker 1: when you see and you know, you know who I'm

441
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,000
Speaker 1: talking about, our our buddy who gets a little too

442
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:56,840
Speaker 1: loud sometimes and it's real quick to call people out.

443
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: He doesn't get promoted very well. But people who play

444
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 1: the middle line play that mental game, and oftentimes it

445
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:07,679
Speaker 1: is to ignore those underlying issues. And and I know

446
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,600
Speaker 1: the last year and a half that I worked there.

447
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:14,880
Speaker 1: They had just started to talk about diversity and transgender

448
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,120
Speaker 1: kids and how to work with them, and the pushback

449
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 1: that was there was really really disheartening. I know, you

450
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:23,439
Speaker 1: had to keep me in line so I wouldn't yell

451
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 1: at people a few times. But that's kind of that

452
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: mentality of like, how do we break this down in

453
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 1: this system? And we kind of went away from the

454
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: original point of women in this industry. But it's kind

455
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: of the whole breakdown is there is a built up

456
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:44,400
Speaker 1: system that it's hard to let go of and obviously

457
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:47,959
Speaker 1: hard to let go of if we're diverting to another

458
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 1: tactic instead of reinvesting into what is working right. You

459
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:59,439
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, I had you um that just

460
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 1: so far as with women being in this field and

461
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 1: and with the whole racial aspect of it, you do

462
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 1: kind of have to play your position. You do have

463
00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: to be aware of what your leadership line looks like,

464
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:20,119
Speaker 1: um before you make any suggestions on what to do

465
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 1: and how to move forward. Because the fact of the

466
00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: matter is, nothing that we're saying right now hasn't already

467
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: been said before. They know what the needs are, they

468
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 1: know what we're going through, they know what the data

469
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:34,880
Speaker 1: is because we submit it to them every month. The

470
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,520
Speaker 1: fact of the matter is, how are we going to

471
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:41,439
Speaker 1: tweet the budget to meet those needs? How do we

472
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 1: justify moving the money from here to here? And do

473
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 1: we have enough people to make that happen. That's where

474
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:54,359
Speaker 1: I see it the most. I'm not fearful of saying

475
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,400
Speaker 1: anything so far as what I believe that I need

476
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,960
Speaker 1: for my kids. It's just tiring saying the same thing

477
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 1: over and over and over and over again, and you

478
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: get burned out. So everyone knows what my my investment

479
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 1: date is because I tell them all the time. I

480
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 1: don't know what I'm gonna be doing come January twenty two,

481
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,960
Speaker 1: but I won't be here because I'm done. I'm done.

482
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 1: I am done. I'm done. I'm just burned out. And

483
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: and I try to and even when with saying that,

484
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:27,240
Speaker 1: I do try to recruit people into the organization that

485
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 1: I think that would do well there. I said, Hey,

486
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,680
Speaker 1: if you're looking to further your education, if you're looking

487
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:36,080
Speaker 1: to do this, this, and this, this is the perfect

488
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 1: position for you because not only are you getting the

489
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 1: experience that you need, it stayable money. It might not

490
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: be a lot of money, but it is stable money.

491
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,840
Speaker 1: You can work on your retirement. You can work on

492
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: these things here and you still have time to work

493
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: on your master's da da da da, have your kids whatever.

494
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 1: It's flexible in that. But do not come into this

495
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: if you don't have a love for people and children.

496
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 1: If you don't have that at the core, you're going

497
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:08,200
Speaker 1: to mess up. You're going to mess up bad. You're

498
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: gonna curse out the wrong somebody, and it's going to

499
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 1: all fall on you. So those are you know, just

500
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: kind of where we are with it so far as

501
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 1: being aware of who you are, where you work, and

502
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 1: what the leadership line looks like. So you just have to,

503
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:30,720
Speaker 1: you know, pick your battles. And that's that's definitely the conversation.

504
00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:33,280
Speaker 1: And um and before we go, I did want to

505
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: because you you were talking about it, and I want

506
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:37,920
Speaker 1: to talk a little more about it, about funding and

507
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:41,080
Speaker 1: about what budgeting looks like. Um. And we you know

508
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: it on a smaller scale, we know it on a

509
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,480
Speaker 1: state scale. And I will say we got to see

510
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 1: a little more than most people in there because we

511
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: did handle the budget a lot more than others have.

512
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: But the one of the things that I have we

513
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 1: have been thinking and as we talk about all of

514
00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 1: the things that are happening in the country and things

515
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 1: that are trying to be rea apter, people are trying

516
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 1: to find accountability within the government, within the systems all

517
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: over the country, and one of them, again, we talked

518
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 1: about defunding the police and what does that look like?

519
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 1: And it sounds so harsh at the beginning, and I

520
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 1: know everybody's like, what what we need police? We need

521
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: law enforcement. Not everybody, but a lot of people are

522
00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: on that level. And I'm assuming especially in Georgia, UM,

523
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: if you go outside of the metro area, people will

524
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 1: be like what you know what UM? Because But one

525
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 1: of the things that we wanted to talk about is

526
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 1: when we had part Cannon, who was the representative UM

527
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: for Georgia, she did talk about the fact that there

528
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 1: was going to be over a billion dollars of a

529
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,000
Speaker 1: budget cut in the state and knowing that what that

530
00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: looked like and where that would go, and the immediate

531
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: places that it would go would be for mental health treatment, uh,

532
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 1: things like DJ for Department of Old Health, for defacts.

533
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 1: They're cutting workers, are cutting teachers, budgets, all of these

534
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 1: things that you're like, wait, these are the places that

535
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 1: need the most, that needs it the most. And the

536
00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:00,040
Speaker 1: first thing that when we were looking at it and

537
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 1: they're talking about giving incentive pay police departments, and the

538
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: question comes into but why. I get that they're risking

539
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 1: their lives, but essentially so are defects workers. They go

540
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: out without help to a dangerous situation. So our DJJ

541
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: workers because we as probation officers had to go out

542
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: to homes and sit with people and be threatened. I

543
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 1: had two kids with me, like several times. I remember

544
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 1: another coworker who the kid came back. It was like,

545
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 1: I know where I went to your house, I saw

546
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 1: your car, you know, making threats. Um. And it was

547
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 1: a power play for sure. But the fact of the

548
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,400
Speaker 1: matter is, yes, I understand we came in knowing that

549
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:45,239
Speaker 1: this could be dangerous and things like this happened. But

550
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: we don't see the same support. I don't know. You

551
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: tell me as the government seems to be supporting the

552
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:55,560
Speaker 1: police department in budgetary levels. Um. So the question is

553
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 1: why are we not seeing that same level of support

554
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: and why is it so hard for people to believe

555
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: that it should happen that way? Because people don't understand

556
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: defund the police and they're too lazy to google it. UM.

557
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: I think it's just it's a lot of information, and

558
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 1: you know that will for ignorant. People are comfortable in

559
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: what they know and anything that they can find to

560
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 1: reinforce what they already know. They're cool with. So far

561
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 1: as learning anything new and taking on anyone else's pain history, culture,

562
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: that's too much. I don't have time for that. I

563
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: need to be reinforced and what I already know and

564
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 1: feel so I can sleep good tonight. Simple. So with

565
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: defunding the police will, Like I said before, I know

566
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 1: you hate this, but we got to rebrand this thing.

567
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 1: We have to just get people to understand what it

568
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 1: is and what it means and what that truly looks like. UM.

569
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 1: I can remember being a kid in the late eighties

570
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 1: early nineties. I can go to the Recreation Center UM

571
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 1: down the street from my house during the summer and

572
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 1: be entertained every day for free. You know, they had

573
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 1: little art classes, they had basketball, they had brisbee league, volleyball,

574
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,959
Speaker 1: anything that you can think of. They had people there

575
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 1: teaching us with us for free snacks included. We need

576
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff back because our kids are board. UM.

577
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,480
Speaker 1: We still have a lot of single family homes, but

578
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 1: we don't have any outlets for them. So that's where

579
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 1: we need to readjust how we're looking at how to

580
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 1: help these kids. Instead of punitive, we need to be

581
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: more prevention. And it can't be lame stuff. They're not

582
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: going to participate in that. They have too many things

583
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 1: coming at them. Um So far as with the TikTok

584
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 1: and you know all the things on you know, on

585
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 1: the internet that keeps them entertained, we have to compete.

586
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 1: I like that you sound as old as me when

587
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 1: you say the TikTok and the internets. You know what

588
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 1: I'm talking about? Like, did I say it that way too?

589
00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 1: I do charged to like that too, because I hate

590
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 1: it so much. I hate it so much when Snapchat

591
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 1: came out, like what the hell is this? And why

592
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: stop it? Stop it? But it's all entertaining to them

593
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:15,839
Speaker 1: and they all know what it is, and so we

594
00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: need a common form like that, and it has to

595
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: be constantly changing it updated. We can't be lazy about

596
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 1: this because we're talking about our future. Um So, when

597
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 1: we talk about defunding the police, we have to really

598
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 1: explain what that means and how it UM can benefit

599
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 1: other programs UM so far as with mental health and

600
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,879
Speaker 1: with our kids and the residential treatment programs and keeping

601
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 1: these kids out of your house. Our kids get bored,

602
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: you know, they have an older person, tell them, Hey,

603
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 1: if you go in this house and you still such

604
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 1: and such and such such, you're not just gonna get

605
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,040
Speaker 1: as much time as me. And they're using our kids

606
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 1: because they don't have anything else to do. So we

607
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:55,319
Speaker 1: have to get people to understand that, UM understand it.

608
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 1: One care about it is two different things. I can't

609
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:00,040
Speaker 1: make anybody care, but at least if I can of

610
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: the information out there, they won't be as negative towards

611
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 1: the whole. Defunding the police, maybe we can call it

612
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: something else, reappropriate. I don't know that. That's probably worse. Ye,

613
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 1: Can we borrow some money from you? You know, don't

614
00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:19,920
Speaker 1: say borrow, We're gonna pay it back. That is exactly

615
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 1: what it is. And and the biggest part of this

616
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:24,240
Speaker 1: is even though we haven't we've kind of talked about

617
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 1: women's issues in this, this is a women's issues, This

618
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:30,759
Speaker 1: is a family issue. This is an issue that we

619
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,560
Speaker 1: need to talk about as the whole because we do

620
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 1: see cases and I've seen people talk about why they

621
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,399
Speaker 1: don't like social workers because they all the people they've

622
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:40,320
Speaker 1: interacted with social workers, all they care about is removing

623
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 1: children and breaking up families. And the conversations into that

624
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:46,759
Speaker 1: is this is the lesser evil. This is the conversation

625
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: why we have to talk about why this is not

626
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 1: a good option. We can't and unfortunately we're talking about

627
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: it with our presidential election. The lesser evil? What is

628
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 1: the better choice or what it's not the worst choice, essentially,

629
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,880
Speaker 1: And that's the problem. We shouldn't have to do that.

630
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: We shouldn't have to have this conversation. When I worked

631
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 1: with families, when I did the fact cases and I

632
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:10,319
Speaker 1: did investigations, I worked my ass off trying to keep

633
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 1: them together because for me, seeing kids and knowing these

634
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,799
Speaker 1: kids were removed from a home was more traumatic oftentimes

635
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 1: than the abuse or the neglect that was happening in

636
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: the home. The only times I would ever remove them

637
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 1: is because I could not find the family and because

638
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 1: maybe the child have gotten lost or whatever whatnot, or

639
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 1: because it was a life and death situation. But the

640
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,440
Speaker 1: problem with all of this is there is no better option.

641
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:36,799
Speaker 1: We have no funding. With the funding that used to

642
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 1: go to families to help place other kids in other

643
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 1: like with family members kind of disappeared, and we need

644
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,279
Speaker 1: to talk about that. Why don't we talk about how

645
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,480
Speaker 1: family should be helping other like family members. UM, A

646
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,799
Speaker 1: lot of people can't afford it. I would have so

647
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 1: many grandparents and so many aunts and uncle's day I

648
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 1: would love to help. I cannot have another child in

649
00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:00,120
Speaker 1: my home because I cannot afford it. And because the

650
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,399
Speaker 1: system has no money. The only way we could give

651
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:05,959
Speaker 1: money is by taking custody. And that's a whole other

652
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 1: issue about why this is an ugly, ugly thing and

653
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 1: why we need to break down this money and why

654
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,520
Speaker 1: is it being allotted in billions and billions of dollars

655
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,640
Speaker 1: to one place that doesn't seem to be improving anything.

656
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:21,560
Speaker 1: If you look at the numbers of homicide, if you

657
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 1: look at the numbers of stuff, if you look at

658
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 1: the numbers of crime, it hasn't really gone down. You're

659
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: you're one correct, But that just lets us know that

660
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,800
Speaker 1: the system of repression is working perfectly, is working beautifully,

661
00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:35,920
Speaker 1: is working exactly the way they set it up to.

662
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: And I don't think until we um change the the

663
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,959
Speaker 1: guards of the money that's not gonna change. Um, that's

664
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: why we have to It's kind of like a balancing act.

665
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: We've got to keep our eyes on our kids, but

666
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 1: we also have to encourage the adults. Hey, okay, I

667
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 1: need you to vote. Man, I need you not only

668
00:37:56,840 --> 00:37:58,840
Speaker 1: to vote, but I need you to be a thought

669
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:00,560
Speaker 1: or voter. I need you to go to to the

670
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 1: Secretary of State website and actually look up who's running. Look,

671
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 1: we see what's on the ballot before you get there.

672
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 1: These are things that it's not information that's hidden from you,

673
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,839
Speaker 1: but it's not advertised. And we have to do a

674
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: better job of educating. Um, those who are maybe want

675
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: to just don't know how to start. Especially our young

676
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 1: people that are just now starting to vote in this

677
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:30,160
Speaker 1: new election. We've got to guide them. Got oh god,

678
00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:34,200
Speaker 1: that's that's just a nightmare on top of a nightmare.

679
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 1: And you know, I'm all about bottom line. So the

680
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 1: moment he said that slavery was a choice was that

681
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 1: it was a rap for me. I was drunking. I

682
00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: was done after that rap. So there's nothing else good

683
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:50,680
Speaker 1: for you that can come from that vein at all.

684
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 1: But that's all, um. I would have to stay on

685
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 1: that we got to do better with this balancing where

686
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:00,879
Speaker 1: we are. Don't forget our kids, is try to move

687
00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:03,359
Speaker 1: it forward to the future. We've got to vote these

688
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: people out and start a new and pay attention. And

689
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 1: and then one of the things that you as you

690
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: were saying, looking at the ballot, go to the Secretary

691
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 1: of state, state site, look at your local elections. And

692
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:16,840
Speaker 1: we've said this many of times, which is why we

693
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: brought on part Cannon, who was a local representative I

694
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: really and I loved her anyway, but all of those things,

695
00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 1: it was because these are the people that are controlling

696
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: a lot more than you know. The city council. That

697
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 1: Atlantis council right now is in control o over seventy

698
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,200
Speaker 1: three million dollars of our budget and they're talking about

699
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 1: allotting that to the police, are allowing that and not

700
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,319
Speaker 1: even having a conversation about why we're doing so. This

701
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 1: is kind of that level of like you have to

702
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 1: pay attention and you have to read those ballots. You

703
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,600
Speaker 1: need to pay attention to who's representing you and why,

704
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:52,560
Speaker 1: and if you think you can do it a better job,

705
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: please run. I agree, Oh my god, please run. I

706
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:03,160
Speaker 1: will give you money if you I'm just playing. I'm

707
00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 1: not playing. But all of those things I love. I

708
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:09,920
Speaker 1: think it's such an important thing, and I would Corney,

709
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:11,879
Speaker 1: this is why I talked to you. And of course

710
00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:13,799
Speaker 1: you're doing any But like Courtney and I have been

711
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 1: on this track for the past seven years. You know

712
00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 1: each other that. Yeah, we've created our own two person therapy,

713
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 1: trauma therapy UM. So this is where I get my

714
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 1: trauma out. This is where we talk. This is I

715
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 1: think you and I have had the most frank and

716
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 1: honest conversations about not only obviously this, but about race,

717
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: about about UM culture, shock, and I being the one

718
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,400
Speaker 1: of two Asian people, one of three Asian people in

719
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 1: our agency minority within the minority. But she held it well.

720
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 1: Though she's a strong lady, I'm too sassy. You can't

721
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 1: mess with me. No, you are a word assassin. So

722
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,760
Speaker 1: people aren't messing with you too often because they already

723
00:40:55,800 --> 00:41:00,480
Speaker 1: know that you are locked and loaded. We do have

724
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:02,799
Speaker 1: a little bit more for you listeners, but first we

725
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:04,880
Speaker 1: have one more cup break for work from our sponsors,

726
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 1: and we're back. Thank you sponsor. Okay, Andie, I'm so sorry,

727
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: do you have anything that you want to add as

728
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 1: we have completely overtaken this is what happens that I

729
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 1: love it. It's great. I've I've learned so much. UM.

730
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:34,279
Speaker 1: I did when I touch on UM because we have

731
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:36,759
Speaker 1: done an episode on nonprofits before, and I know that's

732
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 1: not exactly the same as government work, but there are

733
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:41,680
Speaker 1: a lot of similarities. And one of the very uh

734
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:45,399
Speaker 1: disheartening statistics about that is women. There is this really

735
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 1: high rate of burnout. UM. Is that something that you've seen? Yes, UM,

736
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 1: I also worked at a group on before I started

737
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,760
Speaker 1: any of business. I was getting my bachelor's. I worked

738
00:41:57,800 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 1: at a group home and the multiple roles that you

739
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:07,000
Speaker 1: have to play, UM in that is astounding. I was

740
00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:10,359
Speaker 1: the weekend living counselor, and that's exactly what I did.

741
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:12,880
Speaker 1: I lived there on the weekend. I was the twenty

742
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:15,720
Speaker 1: four seven type position. I was there with the girls

743
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:19,320
Speaker 1: all day and I was responsible for meals on the weekend.

744
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 1: And if they had a weekend job, I had to

745
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:23,879
Speaker 1: drive them there. If they wanted to go to the

746
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 1: amusement park, I drove them there. I had to issue med's,

747
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 1: make sure that no one was fighting. I had to

748
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 1: make sure no one was in a corner somewhere because

749
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 1: you know there's a lot of gay or to stay

750
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 1: even in the group homes on cabineing. You have to

751
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,840
Speaker 1: keep your eyes on so much. And that is the

752
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,880
Speaker 1: issue with any type of social service job. You're wearing

753
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:46,920
Speaker 1: more than one hat because there isn't any backup because

754
00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: the staffing is limited, because most of the funding is

755
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:53,319
Speaker 1: going to keeping that whole thing running, making sure the

756
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:59,359
Speaker 1: girls can have clothes, food, um, getting to UM appointments

757
00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 1: and like, yeah, you do receive like your payment from

758
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 1: your dj J and your defects, but you still are

759
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:13,239
Speaker 1: dependent upon donations. And being that this was the Methodist

760
00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:18,919
Speaker 1: uh background, we were depended upon donations from the church

761
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 1: and trying to make sure that our girls were presentable

762
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:24,399
Speaker 1: for the ones who chose to go to church and

763
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 1: you know, interacted well with the people in the church.

764
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:28,799
Speaker 1: There's just so much that can go wrong if we

765
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: don't meet that donation marker. So and I wasn't really

766
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:36,680
Speaker 1: a part of the you know, with the money and

767
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:39,240
Speaker 1: things like that, but I could see how it affected

768
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 1: us if we didn't get it. So far as um,

769
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:46,399
Speaker 1: what trips we were planning versus what we went last year,

770
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: versus where we went the next year, things of that nature,

771
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 1: whether we got the new van or not, or did

772
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: we have to stick with the old van and wake

773
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 1: sure that it was fixed. So you know, it's it's

774
00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 1: a lot of ah you have. You really do burn

775
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:03,919
Speaker 1: yourself out trying to make sure that you're giving them

776
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 1: everything that you mean, everything that they need and making

777
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:08,879
Speaker 1: sure that you put in your case notes and things

778
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 1: like that. There's a lot of work. And I would

779
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: put in that we exhaustion, like the literal exhaustion from

780
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 1: taxing yourself emotionally, whether you're investing in kids and heartbroken

781
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:29,040
Speaker 1: because of death, of failure somehow of um, something going

782
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:33,800
Speaker 1: wrong UM. For us, oftentimes, if a kid became incarcerated

783
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 1: after leaving DJJ, that was like a death almost to us.

784
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:40,239
Speaker 1: We felt that was our failure somehow, and that in

785
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 1: itself was an emotional uh trauma for us. And on

786
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:47,360
Speaker 1: top of that the actual trauma of being attacked, perhaps

787
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:53,840
Speaker 1: are being uh verbally abused, which happened often often UM

788
00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:56,040
Speaker 1: or whether or not that you're trying you're doing the

789
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,279
Speaker 1: making the best decision, because again this is one of

790
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:01,600
Speaker 1: those things that you never know the best decision. And

791
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:05,239
Speaker 1: for me, as the ending came, I was like, I

792
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 1: am not giving everything I have for this job, and

793
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:12,920
Speaker 1: though you shouldn't have to, because it's still just a

794
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:19,360
Speaker 1: job that in itself causes anxiety and emotional trauma and

795
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,239
Speaker 1: physical trauma. To be fair, but when I was working

796
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:25,319
Speaker 1: in Defects, I was had so many panic attacks, I

797
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,440
Speaker 1: had so many sleepless nights. I was not it was nightmare.

798
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:32,759
Speaker 1: It was a constant nightmare where I would drive or

799
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:34,680
Speaker 1: have dreams about my kids. And I still actually have

800
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:37,719
Speaker 1: dreams about some of those kids. Um, because you you're

801
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:40,800
Speaker 1: just scared of making the wrong decision, and because lives

802
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 1: are on the line. It's not like we could come

803
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: and that even though this is our job, we can

804
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,479
Speaker 1: walk away from it. Walking away from it. Maybe that

805
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: we've not we've neglected kids somehow in between, that we

806
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:54,400
Speaker 1: left them slip because we had to go to you know,

807
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: practice here, or we're trying to live our lives so

808
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:58,360
Speaker 1: we're gonna put our our phone down, and then you

809
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: missed that phone call because of ever. And I know

810
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:04,239
Speaker 1: that we didn't as much support as we may have

811
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 1: gotten from our immediate bosses. We weren't supported on the

812
00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:12,080
Speaker 1: bigger picture and that's also exhausting in itself. And as

813
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:14,560
Speaker 1: we talk about police being respected in this level and

814
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: they're qualified immunity, that's a whole other conversation. I actually

815
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:20,879
Speaker 1: had to take out insurance as a social worker at

816
00:46:20,920 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: Defects just in case I got sued. That was it

817
00:46:25,239 --> 00:46:28,160
Speaker 1: so that I could pay the liability. It came out

818
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:31,319
Speaker 1: of my money. So that to me was like, why

819
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: wouldn't that be a thing, especially if I'm not the

820
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:36,280
Speaker 1: one that caused it. It's half the times of decisions

821
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:39,239
Speaker 1: are from the higher ups, whether it's our supervisors, whether

822
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:42,319
Speaker 1: it's judges, whether it's court systems, or whether it's you know,

823
00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:46,399
Speaker 1: state mandate. There's all of these things. And a part

824
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:48,799
Speaker 1: of that is because we do have to have we

825
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:51,800
Speaker 1: do have cases with mental health issues, and we don't

826
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 1: have any type of resources except for one organization that

827
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,040
Speaker 1: can only handle so much. And the severity has to

828
00:46:58,120 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: be so high that they won't type unless it's there.

829
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:03,720
Speaker 1: But it has to get to the already bad point

830
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:06,160
Speaker 1: in order for it to be resolved. And all of

831
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 1: those days caused a lot of burnout. And I think

832
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 1: for women in's self, when you talk about women who

833
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: accord you are a caretaker. I'm not necessarily a caretaker

834
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:18,279
Speaker 1: because I got a doggy, but he just can do

835
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:21,920
Speaker 1: like he's thought. She's fine. But being a caretaker on

836
00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:25,880
Speaker 1: top of that, that's another reason why burnout happens, because

837
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: you're being pulled in so many directions that you're not

838
00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 1: able to do your job. And that if you are

839
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:34,680
Speaker 1: someone who is sympathetic and had or an impact that

840
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: destroys you, that can literally destroy you physically, emotionally, all

841
00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 1: of those ways. Yeah, you know, I'll go all forever.

842
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:48,239
Speaker 1: You gotta have questions, but yeah, and I think, and

843
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 1: that can be any job when you're not satisfied. Unfortunately,

844
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:55,080
Speaker 1: for those in human services and all of those and

845
00:47:55,160 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 1: counseling you, being disappointed or sad FID often means something

846
00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:04,120
Speaker 1: is wrong in the system and other people are in

847
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:10,920
Speaker 1: harm's way. Are being women in this field, we always

848
00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:14,399
Speaker 1: do what we have to do anyways, and so we

849
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:19,040
Speaker 1: are teachers, we are mothers, We are the backbones this

850
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 1: whole thing. But we meet help. So any help we

851
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 1: can get, we take good help. That is sometimes the

852
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:30,880
Speaker 1: kind of okay help. We have to settle for the

853
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:36,880
Speaker 1: okay help that brings us to the end. Of this interview.

854
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:40,360
Speaker 1: It was such a delight. I'm so glad that I

855
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:44,160
Speaker 1: got to virtually meet Courtney. I know it made me

856
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:47,040
Speaker 1: happy too. I'm sorry when we get to talking, I

857
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 1: understand it's hard to slow down, especially when we get

858
00:48:50,040 --> 00:48:51,799
Speaker 1: really into the issues. And even though like we may

859
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 1: not always agree on like terminology and the back stories,

860
00:48:56,680 --> 00:48:59,959
Speaker 1: but we do have a really good open conversation about

861
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 1: what does this look like? How does this look like

862
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:03,880
Speaker 1: when we break it down, even though we may not

863
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 1: be able to implement it, Yeah, we at least have

864
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:10,479
Speaker 1: that conversation and being able to refresh in knowing that

865
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 1: we are in a good headspace. You know, I do

866
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:16,799
Speaker 1: love that she's my girl. I love her so much.

867
00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:19,200
Speaker 1: She's fantastic. Love the people I've been working with, just

868
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:21,480
Speaker 1: so you know, everybody, everybody, I just have so much love.

869
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:24,919
Speaker 1: But I also feel very fortunate for the people I

870
00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:30,520
Speaker 1: work with. UM and I it was very um enlightening

871
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 1: and important conversation have and I'm glad we had it,

872
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:37,120
Speaker 1: so thank you for arranging it, Samantha. Yeah, if if

873
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:40,600
Speaker 1: any of you listeners have any stories you want to share,

874
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,799
Speaker 1: if you're also working in this field or a similar field,

875
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 1: or you know well, we love hearing from you no

876
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:47,400
Speaker 1: matter what. Right tell us what's going on, what your

877
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:49,960
Speaker 1: thoughts are, how you think things could be changing, like,

878
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 1: there's so many ideas that's not being spoken yet. Let

879
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 1: us know what your thoughts are. Yes, yes, please let

880
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: us know. You can email us at SEFT Media, mom

881
00:49:58,120 --> 00:50:00,480
Speaker 1: Stuff and I hurt Mia dot com. You can find

882
00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 1: us on Instagram at stuff I Never Told You or

883
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:05,160
Speaker 1: on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks. It's always to

884
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,880
Speaker 1: our super producer Andrew Howard. Thanks Andrew, and thanks to

885
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:11,320
Speaker 1: you for listening Stuff I Never Told You this production

886
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:13,239
Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart

887
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:15,840
Speaker 1: Radio is heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

888
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows,