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Speaker 1: First contact with Lori Siegel is a production of Dot

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Speaker 1: Dot Dot Media and iHeartRadio. There was this certain heart

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Speaker 1: back in two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine,

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Speaker 1: and there were things that got solved that I think

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Speaker 1: were really interesting and really changed things. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if this is just me being nostalgic for it or

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Speaker 1: if this is real, but I can sense that same

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Speaker 1: moment happening now because there's a lot more constraint just

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Speaker 1: in the last couple months.

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Speaker 2: It's forced by constraints, right, It's like we were so

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Speaker 2: constrained by not having outside capital, by not having a

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Speaker 2: team around us, like we just had to figure out

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Speaker 2: how to do everything ourselves. And I think that force

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Speaker 2: is actually some different solutions. I think we'll see more

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Speaker 2: of that, you know now and into the next decade.

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Speaker 1: When I started covering tech in two thousand and nine,

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Speaker 1: we were coming out of the recession and there was

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Speaker 1: this new creative class emerging. Uber and Lyft redefined transportation,

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Speaker 1: AIRBNBA shook up the travel industry, and task grab. It

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Speaker 1: helped pave the way for the gig economy. But everything

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Speaker 1: feels uncertain again. I'll say this a decade later. I

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Speaker 1: sense that same creative spirit in Silicon Valley. It's this

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Speaker 1: feeling of opportunity that emerges from chaos. I believe that

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Speaker 1: once again, there will be companies that grow out of

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Speaker 1: this moment, this moment that's filled with extraordinary pain and uncertainty.

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Speaker 1: My next guest is someone who knows a lot about this.

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Speaker 1: Leah Sullivan. She's the founder of Task Grab It, a

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Speaker 1: company born out of the two thousand and eight recession.

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Speaker 1: I'm excited to have her on because this isn't an

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Speaker 1: afterschool special, so I don't want to sugarcoat it. What

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Speaker 1: she did was extremely difficult. Building a company that changes

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Speaker 1: the world is hard, so it is battling your brain,

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Speaker 1: so it is taking risk. Add all of this to

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Speaker 1: the backdrop of a global pandemic, and now we're talking.

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Speaker 1: It's been over a decade since she launched Task Grab It,

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Speaker 1: and now Leah helps run an early investment fund called

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Speaker 1: Fuel Capital. And she's not afraid to talk about mental health,

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Speaker 1: about stress and anxiety, you name it, all while building

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Speaker 1: a startup. It stems from her own experience doing something

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Speaker 1: big and not shying away from the chaos and uncertainty.

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Speaker 1: But before we get to the interview. I just want

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Speaker 1: to tell you, guys how much I've appreciated your feedback

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Speaker 1: and your ears during this time. We're nearing the close

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Speaker 1: of our first season, so I'm a little sentimental and

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Speaker 1: I'll say this, please stay in touch with me. We're

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Speaker 1: launching a newsletter this summer and it'll be your best

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Speaker 1: source to stay in the loop about any extra episodes,

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Speaker 1: virtual town halls we're hosting, and other future projects that

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Speaker 1: I'm going to be working on. So sign up at

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Speaker 1: media dot com backslash newsletter. I promise I won't spam you. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's jump in. I'm Laurie Siegel and this is first contact.

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Speaker 1: I want to kind of start at the beginning and

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Speaker 1: just give you the simple what I ask everyone as

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Speaker 1: we start this, which is, how are you doing.

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Speaker 2: It's such a funny question these days, isn't it. Usually

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Speaker 2: I'd respond, great, everything's great, Everything's fine, And I feel

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Speaker 2: like I'm hanging in there. It's just a lot right now.

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Speaker 2: And I think also having the perspective about, you know,

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Speaker 2: what's going on in the news, what's going on in

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Speaker 2: the front lines, what's going on in hospitals, I mean,

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Speaker 2: certainly gives you perspective on how grateful I am and

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Speaker 2: fortunate and privileged I feel to be where I am.

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Speaker 2: I'm at home, I'm safe, I'm with my children. Everybody's healthy.

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Speaker 2: But you know, between the homeschooling and working full time

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Speaker 2: and you know, not having the support system that I

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Speaker 2: used to, it is. It has been a complete shift,

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Speaker 2: in a complete transition. So just feel like I'm hanging

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Speaker 2: in there.

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Speaker 1: We start out each of these episodes with this idea

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Speaker 1: of first contact, and this one is near and dear

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Speaker 1: to me because I was thinking about our first contact

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Speaker 1: in ten years. It was a long, long time ago.

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Speaker 1: It was a do you remember it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? I do. Actually, you interviewed me on CNN. I

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Speaker 2: was terrified, and I mean it must have been a

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Speaker 2: decade ago at least.

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Speaker 1: I went back in preparation for this. I went back

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Speaker 1: and I found the interview. It was from twenty eleven,

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Speaker 1: and it was two thousand and eight when you started to.

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Speaker 2: Ask about it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then in twenty eleven I interviewed you, and

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Speaker 1: I remember this idea of the gig economy and all

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Speaker 1: this this didn't you know, you guys made this popular,

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Speaker 1: Like this didn't really exist, and so I was on

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Speaker 1: the startup Beat. It helped create the startup beat up CNN,

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Speaker 1: and I remember we were following a task grab It

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Speaker 1: around named Susie, and we're interviewing you about it and

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Speaker 1: talking about this thing called the gig economy and this

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Speaker 1: idea of having other people help out with your errands.

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Speaker 1: And that's when I met you for the first time.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I remember. I remember standing outside around the fountain,

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Speaker 2: I think, and you were interviewing me outside and New

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Speaker 2: York was bustling and it was a beautiful day. And yeah,

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Speaker 2: that was the first, the first interview we did together.

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Speaker 1: It's almost I look back at that and it almost

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Speaker 1: feels I don't know what the word is, but it's

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Speaker 1: so nostalgic to look back at that moment and tech

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Speaker 1: because and we'll get into this, you found a task

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Speaker 1: grab It out of a pretty chaotic moment in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and eight, But there were so many interesting tech

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Speaker 1: companies that did come out of that moment. But this

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Speaker 1: idea of New York bustling, and you know, people being

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Speaker 1: able to come into our homes and do things and

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Speaker 1: help us out, and almost this idea that you had

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Speaker 1: that gave birth to this whole industry of the gig economy.

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Speaker 1: It was so special. And now fast forward all these

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Speaker 1: years later, over a decade later, and we're sitting here,

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Speaker 1: I'm interviewing you self, isolated in my home, with this

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Speaker 1: idea of when will we allow people in our homes

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Speaker 1: again and what's going to happen. It's just it almost

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Speaker 1: feels very nostalgic sitting here talking to you, especially given

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Speaker 1: that I had the opportunity to interview you at the

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Speaker 1: beginning of that.

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Speaker 2: It does. I mean, it was a different time. I

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Speaker 2: mean three months ago, it was a different time. I

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Speaker 2: think the thing that though gets me excited and gives

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Speaker 2: me comfort about the future is, as you said, when

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Speaker 2: you think about all of these companies that were innovated

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Speaker 2: out of that chaos and out of that crazy time,

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Speaker 2: there were so many I mean it was Lyft, it

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Speaker 2: was Uber, it was Airbnb, it was task grab it

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Speaker 2: there were just tons of great innovations that happened in

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Speaker 2: the gig economy and the peer to peer marketplaces. And

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Speaker 2: so I think now is a time for another step

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Speaker 2: change for consumers, and we're going to see a lot

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Speaker 2: of behaviors change and a lot of new innovations come

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Speaker 2: out of you know, this time and throughout the next

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Speaker 2: decade that we'll be talking about, you know, in the

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Speaker 2: year twenty thirty.

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Speaker 1: I want to go back to two thousand and eight.

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Speaker 1: You were at IBM, and you decide right before the

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Speaker 1: recession to quit your job. You're a rising star at IBM,

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Speaker 1: and I know for a fact, having covered Silicon Valley

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Speaker 1: for many years that it is not easy to be

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Speaker 1: the woman in the room and in many of these places.

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Speaker 1: But you made the decision to kind of quit your job.

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Speaker 1: And I think, and I will say this, I think,

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Speaker 1: especially in media, sometimes we have the luxury of perspective

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Speaker 1: to look back and say, and then she quit her job,

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Speaker 1: and then she created task, grab it, and then it's

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Speaker 1: sold for all this, you know, I think that is

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Speaker 1: way too simple of a story. So just take me

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Speaker 1: back to Leah, before the before we entered this recession,

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Speaker 1: before all this happened at IBM, and thinking, you know,

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Speaker 1: something is broken and I want to fix it. What

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Speaker 1: were you like back then?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it's a great question. I think I

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Speaker 2: always tell the story as this moment of inspiration and

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Speaker 2: it was like poof, I waved a magic wand right,

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Speaker 2: and I was off starting my company. But I think

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Speaker 2: the relevant parts now are so much more detailed, and

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Speaker 2: there's so much more rooted in the economic time and

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Speaker 2: the market that was emerging. And so it was February

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Speaker 2: of two thousand and eight when I was working at IBM.

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Speaker 2: I did have the idea because I was out of

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Speaker 2: dog food one night and I thought, there's got to

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Speaker 2: be a way to get this dog food. The iPhone

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Speaker 2: had just come out, you know, a few months earlier,

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Speaker 2: and so all of a sudden, we all had these

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Speaker 2: little mobile devices in our pockets that we weren't really

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Speaker 2: fully utilizing the technology on yet. And as an engineer myself,

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Speaker 2: I got really excited about those emerging technologies, particularly mobile

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Speaker 2: location based awareness and then social technology. I mean Facebook

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Speaker 2: was really just breaking out of the college scene at

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Speaker 2: that point and becoming more mainstream. So I spent the

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Speaker 2: next few months thinking about the idea, talking to anyone

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Speaker 2: who had listened to me about it. I had gotten

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Speaker 2: connected with Scott Griffith, who was the CEO of Zipcar

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Speaker 2: at the time in Boston, and he really took me

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Speaker 2: under his wing. And I was still at IBM then,

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Speaker 2: but he said you know, I really think you're onto something.

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Speaker 2: The way I think about zipcar and getting people to

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Speaker 2: share resources in a neighborhood is very similar to how

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Speaker 2: you're thinking about. At the time, the company was called

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Speaker 2: runmi errand dot com. It wasn't even called tats rabbit yet,

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Speaker 2: and he really encouraged me to make the leap. Now,

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Speaker 2: I had no idea that this recession was coming. I

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Speaker 2: had no idea that the stock market was going to

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Speaker 2: crash or that all these people would be laid off.

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Speaker 2: I ended up leaving my job in June of two

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Speaker 2: thousand and eight.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember the day you left your job.

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Speaker 2: I do. It was June twenty fifth. I remember going

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Speaker 2: in and giving notice to my manager and and you know,

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Speaker 2: as sort of that frantic they tried to keep me

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Speaker 2: and they're like, no, no, you got to meet with

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Speaker 2: my manager. And then that manager's like, no, no, you

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Speaker 2: got to meet with my manager. And I was like,

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Speaker 2: you know, three or four managers up the chain by

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Speaker 2: the end of the day, right, But I had made

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Speaker 2: the decision that I wanted to do something more. I

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Speaker 2: love engineering, I love programming, I love creating, but I

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Speaker 2: had all these other skills that I wasn't using at IBM,

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Speaker 2: and I just was really passionate about the idea, and

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Speaker 2: that's sort of what gave me the confidence to walk

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Speaker 2: in that day, quit my job and make the leap.

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Speaker 1: I guess I go back to this idea of like,

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Speaker 1: were you afraid? I mean it's like you look back

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Speaker 1: at all you were able to do, and of course

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Speaker 1: you were able to do it, right, you have the

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Speaker 1: luxury of perspective right now, But in that moment, where

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Speaker 1: did that confidence come from? And maybe this is kind

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Speaker 1: of one of those like how do you how do

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Speaker 1: you talk to yourself when you know you can do

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Speaker 1: all these things, but when you're actually going in to

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Speaker 1: do it, it's much more complicated, you know, and it

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Speaker 1: does take a certain and maybe what I'm getting at

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Speaker 1: is it takes a certain kind of person to follow

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Speaker 1: through with that feeling that they can actually go do

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Speaker 1: it and then and then go do it. So how

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Speaker 1: did you prepare yourself mentally for it? I mean? And now,

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Speaker 1: having the luxury of perspective, you know, what, do you

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Speaker 1: wish you could go back and tell that girl?

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Speaker 2: Well? I mean it's funny because I was hesitant, I

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Speaker 2: was afraid, but I also sort of had hit my

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Speaker 2: max of what I felt like I could do at

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Speaker 2: IBM as far as what would make me happy. There's

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Speaker 2: plenty more I could do there, but I knew it

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Speaker 2: wasn't going to make me happy. And so I remember

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Speaker 2: having this conversation with myself, and sounds kind of funny,

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Speaker 2: but I remember this clearly, and I was saying, you know,

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Speaker 2: how are you going to launch a company? How are

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Speaker 2: you going to build a product? Like all you've done

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Speaker 2: is program You've sat in a queue by yourself, and

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Speaker 2: you've programmed software. You've never interacted with customers, you've never

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Speaker 2: raised money from investors, you've never high you've never fired, Like,

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Speaker 2: you don't know how to do operations. But I think

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Speaker 2: I realized that. And this sounds kind of silly, but

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Speaker 2: I told myself, you know what, Leah, it is not

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Speaker 2: rocket science. You're going to figure it out. And I

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Speaker 2: literally made the decision that I was going to stop

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Speaker 2: worrying about all the things I didn't know how to do,

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Speaker 2: and I was just gonna go figure it out. And

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Speaker 2: I am a constant learner. I like to learn all

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Speaker 2: the time, and so that part of it I decided

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Speaker 2: to look at is very exciting instead of very terrifying.

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Speaker 2: But it was like this active mental shift I had

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Speaker 2: to make before I could get comfortable making the leap

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Speaker 2: to do it.

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Speaker 1: You actually launched task grab It. And I think this

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Speaker 1: is it's so important to talk about, Like so much

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Speaker 1: was happening in two thousand and eight. You know, there

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Speaker 1: was so much chaos everyone was talking about you know,

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Speaker 1: Wall Street was under fire, and I think this, this

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Speaker 1: moment for me, is really fascinating for technology because you

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Speaker 1: you know, you hold up your iPhone and you talk

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Speaker 1: about the iPhone come out, the app store had launched.

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Speaker 1: There was just this canvas for creativity for the smart

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Speaker 1: people who were paying attention, and out of that came

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Speaker 1: task grab It. So tell me about actually launching task

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Speaker 1: grab It in this environment. What did you learn?

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, I spent sort of those June summer

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Speaker 2: months coding the first version of the site, and I

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Speaker 2: was talking to potential customers, and I mean I was

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Speaker 2: literally sitting at the local coffee shop actually coding, and

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Speaker 2: then as customers would come in and be like, hey,

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Speaker 2: what do you think of this? Would you use a

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Speaker 2: service like this? What would you need to outsource? And

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Speaker 2: how much would you be willing to pay, and so

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Speaker 2: I wasn't actually even sure if the market was there yet.

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Speaker 2: And then September two thousand and eight year old around

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Speaker 2: and the stock market crashed and everyone was being laid

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Speaker 2: off and the world changed overnight, and very much like

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Speaker 2: the world has dramatically shifted overnight in the last couple months.

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Speaker 2: And that was a hard time because because I was thinking,

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Speaker 2: oh my god, what did you just do? You left

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Speaker 2: this cushy job at IBM, and you've decided to focus

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Speaker 2: on this company that you don't even know how to build, Like,

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Speaker 2: how are you going to do this now? Because the

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Speaker 2: company was focused on putting people to work. It actually,

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Speaker 2: very serendipitously turned out to be the perfect time to

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Speaker 2: build a company like task Grab It. And I wish

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Speaker 2: I could say I had seen that coming and I

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Speaker 2: had the foresight from you know, February and June like

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Speaker 2: to know that that's what was going to happen. But

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Speaker 2: I didn't. I honestly didn't. And part of it was

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Speaker 2: luck in some ways that the timing hit for this

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Speaker 2: need and what I was building was filling a gap,

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Speaker 2: and sometimes those things just cannot be predicted.

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Speaker 1: When I look at having covered entrepreneurs and the ones

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Speaker 1: who succeed throughout the years, I think there's some qualities

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Speaker 1: that a lot of them have right that I could

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Speaker 1: just see, And I think the first is probably resilience.

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Speaker 1: Another one is being scrappy. So I'd be curious to

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Speaker 1: know how back in the day that played out. How

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Speaker 1: were you very scrappy and building out task grab it?

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Speaker 2: Yes, a lot of scrappiness, and that's just kind of

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Speaker 2: in my DNA anyway, That's kind of how I'm built.

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Speaker 2: So that was a good thing because when the recession

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Speaker 2: hit in September, yes, I had to question everything, but

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Speaker 2: what I didn't have to question was whether or not

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Speaker 2: I could figure it out, whether or not I could

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Speaker 2: actually pull it off, whether or not I could do it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it was just a matter of like finding

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Speaker 2: new ways and coming up with new things and creative

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Speaker 2: outlets to explore. And so you know, when I left

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Speaker 2: IBM in June, I thought I probably had about six

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Speaker 2: months of runway where I cashed out twenty eight thousand

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Speaker 2: dollars from my IBM pension and I thought, okay, twenty

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Speaker 2: eight thousand dollars, I can make that last six months.

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Speaker 2: I can you know, invest a little in the company

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Speaker 2: and I can live off of this. And when, of

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Speaker 2: course September hit, it was an awful time to be

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Speaker 2: raising money. There was no way I was going to

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Speaker 2: be able to raise any money before the end of

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Speaker 2: the year, and so bootstrapping became sort of a necessity

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Speaker 2: and the mode that I stayed in for the next

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Speaker 2: eighteen months. It really wasn't until the following year, near

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Speaker 2: the end of two thousand and nine, that I was

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Speaker 2: able to raise seed round of funding from investors out

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Speaker 2: here in the Bay Area and Marico at Floodgate Fund

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Speaker 2: led a million dollar round of seed funding. But prior

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Speaker 2: to that, it was maxing out credit cards. It was bootstrapping.

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Speaker 2: It was just running super super lean. It was just me.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't hire anyone. So I was the first task

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Speaker 2: Grabbit ever and I did a ton of ariage.

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Speaker 1: You were the first task Gravit.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I did a ton of errands, Oliver.

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Speaker 1: Ow So we tell me, so you were actually going

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Speaker 1: if I went on the earliest iteration of task Gravit,

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Speaker 1: it would have been you, the founder of task Grabbit.

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Speaker 2: Doing my errands all the time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's incredible.

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Speaker 2: What was awesome about that. So I had this little

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Speaker 2: Honda Metropolitan scooter that I would just ride around the

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Speaker 2: city and I'd pick up people's dry cleaning, and I'd

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Speaker 2: deliver groceries. I do all kinds of things. What was

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Speaker 2: great about that time, as I look back, is that

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Speaker 2: it really really taught me what the customer needs were,

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Speaker 2: not just from the standpoint of clients who needed tasks done,

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Speaker 2: but what the actual taskers needed to be successful. And

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Speaker 2: so I became sort of obsessed with the supply side

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Speaker 2: platform and the supply side marketplace and really focused in

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Speaker 2: on what are the tools I need to build to

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Speaker 2: make sure that they can be successful and build out

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Speaker 2: their own businesses like entrepreneurs on this platform. That is

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Speaker 2: an insight I wouldn't have gotten unless I had been

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Speaker 2: actually a task grab at doing the jobs myself as well.

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Speaker 2: So I think in times of scrappiness, in times where

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Speaker 2: you're really forced to bootstrap and be I think it

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Speaker 2: can actually be very beneficial because you get really really

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Speaker 2: close to the customer, and I think you think and

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Speaker 2: you build differently.

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Speaker 1: God, I remember when even like Dennis the founder of

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Speaker 1: Force Square, I remember back in the day going to

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Speaker 1: south By Southwest in like twenty eleven and calling up

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Speaker 1: FORCEM trying to call their PR person, be like, who's

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Speaker 1: going to be the big company? Just Dennis answers the

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Speaker 1: phone because he's the PR people. I don't think people understand,

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Speaker 1: especially as people get bigger and as we we glorify

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Speaker 1: companies as they become companies and put in the press

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Speaker 1: like how involved the best founders are in a very

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Speaker 1: scrappy way, to the point where you are probably going

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Speaker 1: and getting the groceries on your scooter to try to

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Speaker 1: understand the product. I don't know if people fully understand

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Speaker 1: that that is how some of the best businesses are built.

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Speaker 2: I think that some of that is forced as well.

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Speaker 2: It's forced by constraints, right. It's like Dennis started around

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Speaker 2: the same time that I did. He was two thousand

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Speaker 2: and seven, two thousand and eight as well, And we've

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Speaker 2: talked about this before. For Dennis and I, it's like

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Speaker 2: we were so constrained by not having outside capital, by

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Speaker 2: not having a team around us, like we just had

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Speaker 2: to figure out how to do everything ourselves. And I

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Speaker 2: think that Force is actually some different solutions, some different

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Speaker 2: product solutions. I think we'll see more of that you know.

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Speaker 2: Now into the next decade, I think as the market

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Speaker 2: improved and more capital, you know, came into the market,

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Speaker 2: people founders didn't need to be the ones on the

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Speaker 2: ground anymore. They could hire out for that, right, and

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Speaker 2: they could learn from secondhand from those people. But things

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Speaker 2: get lost in translation. So I think it's actually kind

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Speaker 2: of interesting to be super scrappy and super bootstrapped in

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Speaker 2: the beginning and really understand the market.

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Speaker 1: There's something really interesting about this moment. Having covered your

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Speaker 1: story back in the day, Dennis's story, and having gotten

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Speaker 1: my early start in my career watching entrepreneurs make something

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Speaker 1: out of the recession and make something out of this

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Speaker 1: moment of constraint. I think part of why I'm excited

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Speaker 1: to be here with you is because I sense that

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Speaker 1: this is another moment of constraint. And I think Silicon

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Speaker 1: Valley and you you're an investor now, and we'll get

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Speaker 1: to that, like got very noisy, right, and a lot

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Speaker 1: of people outsourced, outsourced, outsourced, and there was this certain

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Speaker 1: heart back in two thousand and eight, two thousand and

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Speaker 1: nine which made way for companies like Airbnb and Uber,

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Speaker 1: and you know, there were things that got solved that

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Speaker 1: I think were really interesting and really changed things. And

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Speaker 1: I think, I don't know if this is just me

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Speaker 1: being nostalgic for it, or if this is real, but

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Speaker 1: I can sense that same moment happening now because there's

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Speaker 1: a lot more constraint just in the last couple of months,

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Speaker 1: you know, I hear Silicon Valley chatter again. I'm beginning

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Speaker 1: to see the same entrepreneurs who have been kind of

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Speaker 1: distant for a while beginning to kind of come back

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Speaker 1: and solve some real problems. And I'm assuming you as

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Speaker 1: an investor, i'd be curious to know, like what are

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Speaker 1: you sensing, Like what's the feel you invest in early

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Speaker 1: stage companies, What is the feel now sitting in Silicon

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Speaker 1: Valley as at another moment of constraint.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think it is real. This is

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Speaker 2: a real moment of inflection, I think for technology companies

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Speaker 2: for consumers. So as an investor, I'm incredibly excited. I'm

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Speaker 2: really excited. I can't wait to see what is born

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Speaker 2: out of this moment. And I just hope I'm part

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Speaker 2: of it. I hope I'm the one funding it, right,

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Speaker 2: Like that's the job, it is the dream job. This

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Speaker 2: actually as an investor could be seen as a dream moment,

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Speaker 2: and so I think the opportunity is there to really

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Speaker 2: drive innovation, to find founders that are resilient, that are scrappy,

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Speaker 2: that are innovating, you know, in a different way, on

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Speaker 2: a new level, and to really support them and be

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Speaker 2: a part of it.

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Speaker 1: Okay, we've got to take a quick break to hear

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Speaker 1: from our sponsors more with my guest after the break.

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Speaker 1: You know, we saw what kind of came out of

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Speaker 1: two thousand and eight two thousand and nine, Like we

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Speaker 1: saw Airbnb, uber Lyft, task grabbit. You know, we saw

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Speaker 1: the sharing economy. This is very near and dear to

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Speaker 1: me because this is where I got my start covering technology.

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Speaker 1: What kind of industries do you think are now we're

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Speaker 1: kind of seeing are like ripe for some disruption right now.

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Speaker 2: Well, back in two thousand and eight, it was really

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Speaker 2: driven by technology around location, around mobile, around social right

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Speaker 2: and like, so people were thinking about different ways to

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Speaker 2: mash up those technologies Airbnb, Uberlyft, task grabbit. Now there's

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Speaker 2: this whole step function change in how we're working. We're

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Speaker 2: all working remotely from home. Work will never be the

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Speaker 2: same again. It's been now almost two months of sheltering

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Speaker 2: in place, we're from home. I mean, there's no better

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Speaker 2: way to shift consumer behavior than to actually put constraints

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Speaker 2: around it. And I think at first people were like, oh,

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Speaker 2: this is going to be so hard, I'm working from home.

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Speaker 2: And then you know, Zoom just completely took off and

435
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:20,920
Speaker 2: blew up. It's like Zoom is the next Facebook. Now

436
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 2: Zoom is the next platform. Like what does that mean

437
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 2: for for remote work and for collaboration? And then I think,

438
00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:32,359
Speaker 2: you know, people are going to figure out new ways

439
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:37,119
Speaker 2: of balancing working from home working in person. Do I

440
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,399
Speaker 2: think that we'll, you know, as soon as this shelter

441
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:41,159
Speaker 2: in place is over, do you think we'll all go

442
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,680
Speaker 2: back to the normal in office, face to face nine

443
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 2: to five. I don't think so. I don't think, you know,

444
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 2: unless you really have to be there in person. People

445
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:55,120
Speaker 2: now have been sort of trained to utilize these remote tools,

446
00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:58,640
Speaker 2: and they're okay. I mean, I think at best they're

447
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:02,399
Speaker 2: kind of mediocre because they haven't been stress tests the

448
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 2: way that we have stress tests them over the last

449
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 2: two months. And so it's in times of stress, right

450
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 2: that entrepreneurs and innovators are going to say, like, Okay,

451
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 2: this worked to a certain extent, but like, here's the

452
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,800
Speaker 2: next level of it, here's the next iteration, here's the

453
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,560
Speaker 2: next phase. So remote work is definitely an area I'm

454
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,240
Speaker 2: really excited about. You know, in two thousand and eight,

455
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:25,359
Speaker 2: it was all about how the future of work was

456
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:29,000
Speaker 2: changing and how jobs were becoming more flexible and the

457
00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 2: gig economy was emerging. And now it's like, Okay, we've

458
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,880
Speaker 2: seen what the future of work is like, how does

459
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 2: that now evolve into the next phase, into the next decade.

460
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 2: I think another area that's super exciting is around digital health,

461
00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 2: I mean telemedicine. Just the necessity of it has just

462
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 2: blown up. But again, like the tools have not been

463
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 2: stress tests the way that they have in the last

464
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 2: two months, and so there'll be new innovations and digital

465
00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 2: health and wellness in telemedicine. And then the third area

466
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:05,000
Speaker 2: I'm really excited about and watching closely is just education.

467
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:08,919
Speaker 2: I mean online learning. It's like, again with all the

468
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:13,639
Speaker 2: schools closed, my kindergartener is on Zoom and she's on Duo,

469
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 2: and she's you know, she can barely spell, but she's

470
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 2: like on I Message texting with her teacher and her friends,

471
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:24,520
Speaker 2: and it's like a whole new world of learning, and

472
00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 2: there haven't really been great tools or platforms that have

473
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 2: emerged as the leaders in that space, particularly for elementary education,

474
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 2: and so I think that's a huge opportunity that we'll

475
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 2: see innovations around as well.

476
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it certainly feels like, all of a

477
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: sudden overnight, the only means towards humans connection we have

478
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 1: is through this screen, right I'm zooming with you right

479
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,639
Speaker 1: now in order to do this interview. But it seems

480
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 1: like a lot is lost in context. If we wanted

481
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 1: to have a moment to kind of go off on

482
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: our own or come back, it's like you've got to

483
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 1: be all in or you're all at it. There's something

484
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 1: that feels a little bit like it doesn't one hundred

485
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 1: percent mirror the human experience. And this is me putting

486
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 1: on my tech in humanity hat, and I think you're right.

487
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: I can sense that there's got to be something else, right,

488
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 1: Like zoom is okay, but all of us are getting

489
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,560
Speaker 1: exhausted I think by this one way experience that leaves

490
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:19,760
Speaker 1: no room to have kind of the serendipity of the

491
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 1: human experience and the lightness that comes along with just

492
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 1: being around a room and having that casual element. So

493
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 1: I'd be curious to let me know what you end

494
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 1: up investing in. Do it quick, please, Lea be very interesting.

495
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: I want to go back to the early task Gravit days.

496
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,160
Speaker 1: Sorry to take you on that tangent. I just think

497
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,879
Speaker 1: it's so fascinating and you're such an interesting person for

498
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 1: me to pick your brain on this, because you were

499
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 1: at the beginning of this, and I think you very

500
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 1: much represent you know, innovation out of constraint, and so

501
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: I go back. I didn't realize that you were the

502
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 1: initial the og task Rabbit, which I think is just fascinating.

503
00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:00,560
Speaker 1: But then I saw that you actually went on Craigslist

504
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:02,919
Speaker 1: to try to find task Grabit people. This is before

505
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,439
Speaker 1: you guys have extensive background checks and all this kind

506
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 1: of stuff. And that was even when I interviewed you

507
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 1: in twenty eleven. I remember asking you about that. But

508
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 1: back before that, you went on Craigslist for your earliest

509
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 1: task people of a task Grabbit, and the way you

510
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:24,000
Speaker 1: decided if you would hire people was if they were

511
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 1: people that you would trust to go into your grandmother's home,

512
00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 1: was that it can you just take us to that

513
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 1: What was the thinking behind the next iteration of we

514
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: go beyond Leah as task grab at number one and

515
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 1: into Craigslist phase two.

516
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 2: Right. Yeah, Well, I realized that I couldn't actually do

517
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,399
Speaker 2: it all if this company was going to scale and

518
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 2: be successful, and so I put the ad on Craigslist,

519
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:51,679
Speaker 2: and I wanted to see just who would respond. I mean,

520
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,480
Speaker 2: I was actually very curious, you know, what types of

521
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 2: people would respond to the ad. I met thirty task

522
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:02,640
Speaker 2: rabbits in person over coffee at the local coffee shop

523
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 2: where I was spending my days coding away, and I

524
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 2: met with him for about thirty minutes at a time,

525
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 2: and I just sort of assessed, like, is this someone

526
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:14,640
Speaker 2: I would feel comfortable sending over to my grandmother's house.

527
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:16,919
Speaker 2: I didn't have kids at the time, or else I

528
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 2: would have, you know, thought about putting them in my house.

529
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 2: But the point was is like, can I trust this

530
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 2: person with my loved ones, with someone that I care

531
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 2: for and really love and that you know is vulnerable,

532
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,480
Speaker 2: you know, is going to be maybe a little more

533
00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,760
Speaker 2: vulnerable than the rest. And so those early days I

534
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 2: had to sort of make that gut check and say like, oh, okay, yes,

535
00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 2: I definitely trust this person to, you know, drop groceries

536
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 2: over at my grandmother's house. I knew though, that I

537
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 2: needed to build in some background checking and some automation

538
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:52,920
Speaker 2: and the application process and some protections. I mean, remember,

539
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 2: this is a time where jumping into a stranger's car

540
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 2: was unheard of, like you would not do it.

541
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: That The thing is, like, I don't think people realize that.

542
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: I just want to like set everyone back like eight

543
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 1: ten years. Like maybe it's because I remember going on

544
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 1: camera and doing kind of a bit of a cheesy

545
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 1: stand up and being like, imagine going into a stranger's home.

546
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,160
Speaker 1: Can you imagine going into a stranger's carvia and app

547
00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 1: or like would you ever hire a stranger to do

548
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: a chore for you? Because I remember those were my

549
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 1: lead INSes because at the time it was just unimaginable,

550
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: and then everything changed so quickly, and I think people

551
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 1: forget that you could have been looked at is a

552
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: little insane, and I think that's important for people to understand.

553
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 1: I'm sure when you started out people kind of said

554
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: no or kind of looked at you a little bit

555
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: like this girl's just kind of crazy, she's you know,

556
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 1: just too ambitious. Whatever, I think that's really important for

557
00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: people to understand that all of this seemed insane until

558
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,000
Speaker 1: you came along, and until it wasn't.

559
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 2: Until it wasn't, and that that's kind of the point.

560
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 2: Like I actually think that because of the economic crisis

561
00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 2: that we went into in two thousand and eight, and

562
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 2: because of the stress put on the market and the

563
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 2: stress put on the labor market, I mean that really

564
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 2: helped shift consumer behavior into making that step function change,

565
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 2: into being okay with you know, inviting a stranger into

566
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 2: your home to do a chore or eventually jumping into

567
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 2: a stranger's car, which didn't come that much later, you know,

568
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,480
Speaker 2: it was twenty ten, twenty eleven, and liftin uber took off.

569
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 2: So it is in times like these that the consumer

570
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 2: is actually open to change. And it's really hard to

571
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:45,320
Speaker 2: force that change when everything is sort of normal and

572
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 2: going well, and that's the hardest time to make a change.

573
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 2: But behavioral changes come when there's stress on the system.

574
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 1: Do you remember out of curiosity, just like go back

575
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 1: with me in time, do you remember the biggest know

576
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 1: you got or the most like the most frustrating no,

577
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,040
Speaker 1: or because you went to I'm sure a lot of investors,

578
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 1: or you left a job that was cushy, Like, you know,

579
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: do you remember any specific interaction that sticks with you

580
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 1: of someone who just did not believe in you or

581
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 1: this idea?

582
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 2: Absolutely, like just more than one, honestly. I mean I

583
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:26,680
Speaker 2: talked to every investor I could get introduced to in

584
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,239
Speaker 2: the Boston area between I don't know, September of two

585
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 2: thousand and eight and maybe the summer of two thousand

586
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 2: and nine. I mean, it's a long time where I

587
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 2: would just meet with investors, angel investors, vcs. Now. At

588
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 2: that time, it was also not a time where there

589
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:46,040
Speaker 2: are a ton of seed investors set up quite yet,

590
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 2: particularly on the East Coast, particularly in the Boston area,

591
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:53,360
Speaker 2: so Founder Collective hadn't even started yet. I actually met

592
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 2: those guys, you know, right when they were raising their

593
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 2: first fund. So it's a different time for a venture

594
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:03,479
Speaker 2: as well. But you know, I remember talking to, you know,

595
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 2: potential advisors that I wanted to bring on, or potential

596
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,760
Speaker 2: angel investors and telling them about the idea and they

597
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 2: were so skeptical, so skeptical, like what what did they say? Well,

598
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 2: one thing in two thousand and eight that wasn't quite

599
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:22,920
Speaker 2: apparent at least on the East Coast. Honestly at the time,

600
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 2: was that social networking was going to be a thing.

601
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:30,360
Speaker 2: I remember Facebook was started in Boston and Mark went

602
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,720
Speaker 2: to the West Coast to get funding, you know, Boston

603
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,920
Speaker 2: in that the East Coast area didn't feel like they

604
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 2: had missed or lost that yet, right, because it wasn't

605
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 2: big enough yet to be a miss or a loss,

606
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 2: and so everyone was still very skeptical that, oh, this

607
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 2: other entrepreneur Mark, you know, he's out on the West

608
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 2: Coast now and he raised all this money and like,

609
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 2: but we don't really believe in it still. So there's

610
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 2: a little bit of that. I literally had a pitch

611
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 2: deck that I would show investors for East Coast investors

612
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 2: and then a different pitch deck for West Coast investors,

613
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: because the conversations were so different, specifically around social and

614
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 2: whether that was going to be a long standing trend

615
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 2: or if it was just a fad.

616
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: Wow, that's interesting. I saw something you wrote that I

617
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: thought it was great when you talk about having a

618
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: founding story, and you gave a commencement speech and I

619
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:26,600
Speaker 1: think you spoke about this. You talk about having a

620
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 1: founding story has three parts, a personal backdrop and moment

621
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: of inspiration and an innovated path forward. And I think

622
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,160
Speaker 1: we talked a little bit about your personal backdrop of

623
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 1: you know, the problem that led you to do task

624
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: grab it, And oftentimes we oversimplify these stories, but I

625
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: do think it's really important to have these, you know,

626
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 1: because they are rooted in something, and even as founders,

627
00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 1: like there's a reason why you become obsessed with something

628
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 1: and why you drive towards something, and you had your

629
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: moment of inspiration and then there's something else you wrote.

630
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: You said, a big lesson you have is to have big,

631
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: harry audacious goals, but take baby steps. And you even

632
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 1: went on to compare it, which I absolutely love to

633
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 1: where the wild things are. What was your big audacious

634
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,400
Speaker 1: goal and then what were the baby steps that you

635
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,040
Speaker 1: had to take to achieve them.

636
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 2: Well, it became a parent in September of two thousand

637
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 2: and eight that the world was changing, and then I

638
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 2: had started this company as an Aaron's business, but that

639
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:33,279
Speaker 2: what I was building actually fit into the market in

640
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 2: a much bigger way. And so the vision very early

641
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 2: on became We're going to change the future of work.

642
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:41,960
Speaker 2: We're going to change the labor markets. We're going to

643
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 2: change the way people work and we're going to make

644
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:48,239
Speaker 2: them successful working in a new and flexible way. That

645
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 2: was the big, hairy, audacious goal. And it's funny because

646
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 2: you know, investors, customers would look at task grab it

647
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 2: and they be like, oh, that's a service where I

648
00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 2: can you know, get my dry cleaning picked up or

649
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 2: get my groceries to li And yes, that was the

650
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 2: easiest way to explain it to someone who needed to

651
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 2: understand it quickly. But my vision was way, way, way

652
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 2: bigger than that, and it was very ambitious, right, And

653
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 2: so if you shared that very ambitious vision with an

654
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 2: investor in the beginning, chances are you would be laughed

655
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:24,680
Speaker 2: out of the room. And that's the type of big

656
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,560
Speaker 2: harry audacious goal I think is the most interesting. Come

657
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,279
Speaker 2: up with something where you will be laughed out of

658
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 2: the room because it's so big and so ambitious and

659
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 2: everyone's just kind of like, I don't even understand where

660
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 2: you're going with this. And so that was the goal

661
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 2: at the time. I think what I realized is I

662
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 2: had to break it down into these little pieces. I

663
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 2: had to tell customers and investors that yes, you can

664
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 2: get your groceries delivered. Yes, you can find someone to

665
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 2: help you pick up your dry cleaning because you know,

666
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 2: feeding them. That whole big vision was too much at

667
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 2: once to take baby steps to get there and tie

668
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:06,240
Speaker 2: all the dots together. It was like, you know, putting

669
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 2: all these points on the board along the way that

670
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,440
Speaker 2: would lead us to the overarching goal, which in the end,

671
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,799
Speaker 2: as I look back, you know, a decade later, I

672
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 2: can say like, yeah, we did a lot to change

673
00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:20,960
Speaker 2: the way the labor market worked over the last decade,

674
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:23,960
Speaker 2: and yes, this is a new phase of work, and

675
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 2: yes the gig economy stayed and it's here and it's

676
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 2: you know, continues to evolve today. But that wasn't apparent

677
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:34,400
Speaker 2: in two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine, in

678
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,480
Speaker 2: twenty ten. So it was about kind of having that

679
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,879
Speaker 2: overarching vision, but making sure that what you were doing

680
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 2: on a daily basis actually was going to push the

681
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 2: business forward and closer to that vision in some way.

682
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,359
Speaker 1: When you look back and you talk about having these

683
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,320
Speaker 1: big goals and you can have the luxury of perspective

684
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 1: and you kind of look at what you were able

685
00:36:55,200 --> 00:36:58,640
Speaker 1: to do. You know, no one I know who's ever

686
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 1: been able to do anything big, hasn't had big failure

687
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 1: or hasn't had to just just get it knocked out

688
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:07,720
Speaker 1: of them. Because if you were the kind of person

689
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:10,080
Speaker 1: who has the ability to have these big, lofty, as

690
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:12,399
Speaker 1: you call them, like hairy goals right like from where

691
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 1: the wild things are, then I think that probably comes

692
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: with the ability to fail pretty spectacularly. So was there

693
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: a moment that you could go to in this journey

694
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:26,839
Speaker 1: of task grab it that you just felt like that

695
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:29,840
Speaker 1: this was just like a very very dark dark space

696
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 1: for you that you felt like a failure in some capacity.

697
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 2: I mean, I honestly had a lot of those moments.

698
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 2: There were three major ones. I like, just hit me

699
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 2: when I'm hearing you ask the question, and I think

700
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,440
Speaker 2: you know the one that I'll tell you about. Well,

701
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 2: I'll tell you the three quickly, and then I'll dive

702
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 2: into one. I mean, it was when I had to

703
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 2: lay off thirty percent of the team, huge failure near

704
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 2: the end of the company, when we were getting acquired,

705
00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:00,439
Speaker 2: I was three million dollars short of profitability. That three

706
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,440
Speaker 2: million dollar raise literally almost killed me, put me in

707
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 2: the hospital, you know. And then it was like early on,

708
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 2: just like the product was not performing, and we had

709
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,440
Speaker 2: to make this huge product shift into a more mobile

710
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 2: centric product and away from the web. So it's like

711
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:23,720
Speaker 2: fundraising failures, it's people failures, it's product failures that were really,

712
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:26,560
Speaker 2: really difficult. And I think every day was sort of

713
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:29,920
Speaker 2: this roller coaster ride of ups and downs. And there

714
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 2: were some really exciting things like being on CNN with you,

715
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 2: or you know, we were on Good Morning America one

716
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:38,880
Speaker 2: morning and we had so much traffic that the servers

717
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:42,040
Speaker 2: went down, or you know, really exciting things happened too

718
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 2: our big fundraises that we did and announced. And I

719
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:50,720
Speaker 2: think what I realized as a founder is that the

720
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 2: highs versus the lows were so dramatic that I couldn't

721
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 2: let myself ride that roller coaster fully. I couldn't let

722
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,560
Speaker 2: my thought feel great about the highest highs when I

723
00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:06,960
Speaker 2: knew that around the corner there was gonna be a

724
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 2: failure or a lowest low, because it was just it

725
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,760
Speaker 2: was too jolting. It was like just too emotionally draining,

726
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:16,560
Speaker 2: and so I kind of learned how to stay level

727
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 2: throughout the whole thing.

728
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,879
Speaker 1: But yeah, you hear a lot of founders talk about

729
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 1: that roller coaster where the highs are high and the

730
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 1: lows are low? How do you find that middle ground? Like,

731
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:30,400
Speaker 1: what did you what did you do specifically that that

732
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 1: helped you balance a little bit of the extremes.

733
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,239
Speaker 2: You know, in the beginning, it was hard because I

734
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,320
Speaker 2: just didn't have the experience, and so I'd get really

735
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:43,640
Speaker 2: really excited or really really depressed. And I think after

736
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 2: you go through that a few times, you're just your

737
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 2: body just physically and emotionally can't handle it. And then

738
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:50,719
Speaker 2: I think the next time you hit it high, you're

739
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 2: kind of like all right, but like remember last week

740
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 2: when you had that big low, And I think over

741
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:58,839
Speaker 2: time you just kind of learned to manage it. I

742
00:39:58,880 --> 00:40:03,320
Speaker 2: think keeping things in perspective experience helps with that over time,

743
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 2: keeping your team sort of on that same wavelength, because

744
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 2: you don't want them riding the highs and lows when

745
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 2: you know you're the one staying level. It's like, you know,

746
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:17,399
Speaker 2: sharing that experience in perspective with the team, And yes,

747
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,839
Speaker 2: you want the team to celebrate when great things happen,

748
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 2: but you also want to keep it in perspective and

749
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,600
Speaker 2: kind of keep a reality check on things, particularly when

750
00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:29,279
Speaker 2: you're building a company out of a recession and sort

751
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 2: of you've had that like scrappy DNA where it was

752
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,320
Speaker 2: really really hard to raise capital, Like everything was really

753
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 2: hard in the beginning. And I think because we started

754
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,400
Speaker 2: at a time where everything was super super difficult, it

755
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 2: kind of gave us the perspective that, like, even when

756
00:40:45,239 --> 00:40:48,920
Speaker 2: things are going great, the reality is is that it

757
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,799
Speaker 2: may not always go great, right, and so it's kind

758
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 2: of like just learning how to stay somewhere in the middle.

759
00:40:57,520 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: Okay, we've got to take a quick break to hear

760
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 1: from our sponsors more with my guest. After the break,

761
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 1: I want to go back to you talking about having

762
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 1: to lay off folks. This isn't something you prepare for

763
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:26,600
Speaker 1: as like a first time founder. Can you tell us

764
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:30,880
Speaker 1: the day that you realized you had to lay off folks,

765
00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 1: the hardest part of it, and what you would go

766
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: back and kind of tell yourself now about it.

767
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that was the lowest low of the

768
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 2: entire company. Out of everything I experienced, was doing that layoff.

769
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:49,400
Speaker 1: What was the hardest part of it.

770
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 2: It's just failing those people. It just it felt like

771
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:58,360
Speaker 2: a true failure of my team. And you know, the

772
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:02,840
Speaker 2: reasons behind it were, Okay, the product wasn't performing. We

773
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 2: need to reorganize the team and hire more engineers, and

774
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:09,480
Speaker 2: we needed to cut from marketing and operations in business development.

775
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:13,480
Speaker 2: But it's like, whose fault was it that we over

776
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 2: hired in some areas and we underhired in others? It

777
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:20,920
Speaker 2: was mine, right, And so it was it was awful

778
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 2: to have to really admit to myself that I had

779
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:29,040
Speaker 2: failed in managing the way that the company was scaling.

780
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 2: And so you know, going in, you know, that morning

781
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:36,719
Speaker 2: and talking to the team that I couldn't keep there anymore,

782
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:41,160
Speaker 2: it was it was my worst nightmare come true. And

783
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:43,839
Speaker 2: as bad as it was for me, I knew it

784
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 2: was a hundred times worse for them, which is like,

785
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 2: you know, it's so so hard for everyone. I think

786
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 2: anything that had to do with people or failing the

787
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 2: team or managing the team, it was hard for me.

788
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,320
Speaker 2: You know, I felt a lot of empathy with people

789
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,040
Speaker 2: that I'd brought on board who really believed in the

790
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 2: company and the mission and believed in me, and then

791
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 2: I felt like I was failing them personally, and so

792
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:14,759
Speaker 2: that was hard. But you know, with perspective and with

793
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 2: looking back, I realized that it is what saved the business.

794
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 2: It's really what made the business thrive in that next

795
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 2: phase and afterwards. And as hard as it was, it

796
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 2: had to be done if I wanted the company to

797
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:33,920
Speaker 2: be successful. And so, you know, I talked to entrepreneurs

798
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:37,359
Speaker 2: today that are looking at their runways and their cash

799
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:40,600
Speaker 2: flows and they're looking at the market and they're having

800
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 2: to make these tough decisions and it's like PTSD all

801
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:47,600
Speaker 2: over again. But I tell them, listen, you're gonna do this,

802
00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:49,640
Speaker 2: and it's gonna be hard, but you're going to look

803
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 2: back three years from now when the market improves, and

804
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 2: you're going to realize this is the decision you made

805
00:43:55,640 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 2: to save your company. And so it's it's not easy

806
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 2: and it's very emotional.

807
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:03,360
Speaker 1: Do you remember what you said that morning?

808
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it wasn't a huge surprise in that

809
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 2: one of the things we really valued at Task grab

810
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 2: it was transparency. And so people had seen the projections.

811
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:19,719
Speaker 2: People saw that our revenue, you know, was not tracking

812
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:23,400
Speaker 2: to where our monthly cash burn was. And I remember

813
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 2: saying three months before the layoffs, like, guys, listen, we've

814
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 2: got to like we've got to increase revenue. We've got

815
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 2: to increase demand, like otherwise our cash burn it doesn't

816
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 2: match up. It's not going to be sustainable. And guess

817
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:38,759
Speaker 2: what in most companies, like eighty percent of cash burn

818
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,319
Speaker 2: is headcount is people, right, So if you have to

819
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 2: decrease burn, it's like you've got to decrease people. And

820
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 2: so that was ninety days out. Then it was like

821
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:49,319
Speaker 2: sixty days out. Then it was thirty days out, and

822
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,759
Speaker 2: I remember thirty days out being like, you guys, seriously,

823
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:55,160
Speaker 2: like we've got to do something big this month, and

824
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:57,200
Speaker 2: if we don't do something big this month, like I'm

825
00:44:57,239 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 2: not sure what's going to happen. So then that next

826
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:04,120
Speaker 2: month came and you know, we went in as a

827
00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:07,720
Speaker 2: team and I just said, listen, we've been talking about

828
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 2: this now for a quarter and we're just not running

829
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 2: in a sustainable way. And you know, today's the day

830
00:45:16,200 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 2: that we have to reorganize and we have to rethink

831
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 2: about how the company is going to move forward, and

832
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,640
Speaker 2: not everybody can stay. And so we then kind of

833
00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 2: broke off with team members and their managers to talk

834
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:32,840
Speaker 2: in more detail. And you know, I think one of

835
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 2: the things that I did that was hard but I

836
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:39,120
Speaker 2: think was good to do was that after I talked

837
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 2: to the team about what was happening and that not

838
00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 2: everyone was going to be able to stay. I also

839
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:47,600
Speaker 2: gave the option to the remaining team if they wanted

840
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 2: to walk, If they wanted to leave that day, no

841
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 2: questions asked, they could take the same package that everyone

842
00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:57,760
Speaker 2: else got, because I felt like, you know, I had

843
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:02,120
Speaker 2: chosen where I needed to where the company needed to cut,

844
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:05,120
Speaker 2: but that doesn't mean that those people staying had chosen

845
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:07,880
Speaker 2: me or had chosen the company. And I kind of

846
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 2: wanted this like mutual agreement moving forward that it's like,

847
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:17,880
Speaker 2: if not everyone can stay, that is terrible, but the

848
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 2: people that are here, they actually also want to be

849
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 2: here too, And I think that actually helped with that

850
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:28,240
Speaker 2: transition because it made this kind of mutual agreement between

851
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:30,839
Speaker 2: the company and the people that stayed that they were

852
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:33,040
Speaker 2: going to be in it. And it may not have

853
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:36,720
Speaker 2: been easy, but they still really believed in the business

854
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 2: and they believed that they wanted to be a part

855
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:41,560
Speaker 2: of our mission, and I think that helped moving forward.

856
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:43,319
Speaker 1: How do you know how to lead like that?

857
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:43,719
Speaker 2: Right?

858
00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:46,880
Speaker 1: Like it's like what an interesting decision, like that little

859
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:50,520
Speaker 1: decision to say like you know, okay, we've got to

860
00:46:50,600 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 1: let people go, but I also want people to choose me.

861
00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 1: Well that's a leadership moment too, you know, and that's you,

862
00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: as a leader doing something extra that's a little bit different.

863
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,160
Speaker 1: Where do you think that comes from?

864
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,720
Speaker 2: I got it from an advisor, honestly, I remember sitting.

865
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:11,399
Speaker 2: I was having brunch with Gina Bianchini, who runs Mighty Bell.

866
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:16,720
Speaker 2: She's the founder of ning very successful exit and she's

867
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 2: been an advisor to me and task grab it for years.

868
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 2: And I was meeting with advisors leading up to this.

869
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:23,239
Speaker 2: I was like, oh my god, like, how do I

870
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:25,160
Speaker 2: do this? How do I do this in the best way?

871
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:28,080
Speaker 2: Like there's no perfect way, Like how do I do

872
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:29,880
Speaker 2: this in the best way? And I was just getting

873
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:32,440
Speaker 2: feedback from as many people as I could, and it

874
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:36,319
Speaker 2: was Gina who said, you know what, and then do this.

875
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:39,920
Speaker 2: And when she said it, I was like, really like,

876
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:44,000
Speaker 2: what if people leave? What if everybody leaves? You know?

877
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,840
Speaker 2: And she's like, you got to know who's there and

878
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:52,280
Speaker 2: who really wants to be there. And it was hard

879
00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 2: actually to say that and to share that with the

880
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:58,640
Speaker 2: team and to give people that option to say, like

881
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:00,840
Speaker 2: you can walk to you and get this same package

882
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 2: and we had two or three people walk.

883
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,319
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, did anyone walk? Yeah? They did.

884
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:08,080
Speaker 2: Wow, we had two or three people walk.

885
00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:10,160
Speaker 1: And how did that feel it?

886
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 2: Well, I mean none of it felt good. I mean

887
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:16,960
Speaker 2: it was just but you know, it was actually a

888
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:20,520
Speaker 2: relief in the end, because I felt relieved that I

889
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:23,920
Speaker 2: knew that the team that did stay actually really wanted

890
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,880
Speaker 2: to be there. And if I hadn't done that, and

891
00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:29,720
Speaker 2: if I hadn't kind of gone through that really hard

892
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:34,000
Speaker 2: extra piece, it would have always been a question. So

893
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 2: I think it was relief in the end.

894
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:38,879
Speaker 1: That's such an interesting story. You know, this is such

895
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 1: a This is such a moment to kind of slow

896
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 1: down a little bit. And one of the things you

897
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:45,319
Speaker 1: said when you're talking, we're taking through like the hard

898
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 1: moments of the company. As you mentioned, you ended up

899
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:50,239
Speaker 1: in the hospital at one point during fundraising. So I

900
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,200
Speaker 1: just feel like the human in me cannot just brush

901
00:48:53,239 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 1: over that. So what happened? You know what? When you

902
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:02,040
Speaker 1: talk about ending up in the hostelpitle during a fundraising round, like,

903
00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 1: I just also feel like it is really important for

904
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 1: people to hear what actually happens behind the scenes with

905
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:10,920
Speaker 1: successful companies, And I appreciate the fact that you'll go

906
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:13,720
Speaker 1: there and talk about it, and I think that's important

907
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:17,319
Speaker 1: for building successful companies in the future. So you ended

908
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:21,400
Speaker 1: up in the hospital during a fundraising round. What what happened?

909
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:24,680
Speaker 2: At the time, I didn't tell anyone. My board didn't know,

910
00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:28,440
Speaker 2: my current investors didn't know. The only person that really

911
00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:32,879
Speaker 2: knew was Stacy, my COO, and a couple of other

912
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,799
Speaker 2: execs on the team what was going on. But it

913
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 2: was a three million dollar raise. Now, we had raised

914
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:43,120
Speaker 2: like forty five million dollars to date, we were close

915
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,480
Speaker 2: to profitability, the business was doing well, and we were

916
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 2: short this three million to get to profitability. And so

917
00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: I was like, this is going to be easy. We'll

918
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:55,239
Speaker 2: go out, we'll talk to some investors, we'll get three

919
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 2: million dollars, and then we'll be self sustainable. And it

920
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:02,360
Speaker 2: was the hardest rays. I mean, way harder than what

921
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:05,120
Speaker 2: I did even in two thousand and eight. And there's

922
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,640
Speaker 2: a lot of different reasons for that and different dynamics

923
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 2: for that. Some of them I understand more now as

924
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 2: an investor, but at the time it was just so

925
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:19,680
Speaker 2: stressful and stressful to the point where I was out

926
00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 2: with another entrepreneur one Monday afternoon and I was taking

927
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 2: a walk and at the time, he was the CEO

928
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:29,880
Speaker 2: of stumble Upon, and we were walking and you know,

929
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:32,040
Speaker 2: we're like, oh, this is so stressful. And he was

930
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:33,840
Speaker 2: going through a raise and I was going through this

931
00:50:33,960 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 2: raise and we were swapping notes. And after the walk,

932
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:40,279
Speaker 2: I drove home and he later tells me that I

933
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:42,799
Speaker 2: looked a little green during the walk, but he didn't

934
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:46,720
Speaker 2: say anything. And so I drive home and my stomach

935
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,040
Speaker 2: starts to hurt. And I get to the house and

936
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:52,520
Speaker 2: at this point, I have one child. I have an

937
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:55,719
Speaker 2: eighteen month old daughter. So I put her to bed.

938
00:50:55,840 --> 00:50:58,160
Speaker 2: It's like seven o'clock. I put her to bed. I

939
00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:00,040
Speaker 2: sit on the couch and it's just getting worse and

940
00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:01,799
Speaker 2: worse and worse, to the point where I can't get

941
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:06,239
Speaker 2: off the couch. And so I call an uber to

942
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:09,960
Speaker 2: take me to the emergency room. And I get to

943
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 2: the er. You know, you go through triage. I wait

944
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:17,040
Speaker 2: like five or six hours. Sort of long story short.

945
00:51:17,560 --> 00:51:21,080
Speaker 2: By that point, it was my colon that had gotten

946
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:25,359
Speaker 2: infected and it was the stressed induced colitis, and the

947
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:28,400
Speaker 2: surgeon came in. I was admitted to the hospital. I

948
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:31,279
Speaker 2: was put on antibiotics. The surgeon came in the next

949
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:33,440
Speaker 2: day and was like, have you been under a lot

950
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:37,040
Speaker 2: of stress lately? And I was like, you have no idea,

951
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:39,480
Speaker 2: and he was like, yeah, this goes stress ahead.

952
00:51:39,520 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 1: When you're sitting there and you have like a stress

953
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:44,439
Speaker 1: in like you're in a hospital bed, and they say,

954
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:46,319
Speaker 1: have you been under a lot of stress? Like what

955
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 1: do you even think to yourself?

956
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:50,560
Speaker 2: This is what I'm thinking. I say out loud, my

957
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:53,280
Speaker 2: company is going to fail because my body has failed.

958
00:51:53,680 --> 00:51:56,480
Speaker 2: And that is exactly what I was thinking. And I

959
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:57,919
Speaker 2: was like, I'm not even going to get this three

960
00:51:57,960 --> 00:52:00,279
Speaker 2: million dollar raised done. I was very close with some

961
00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:01,960
Speaker 2: investors and I'm like, because I'm now, I'm in the

962
00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:05,040
Speaker 2: hospital and I'm gonna have to have this surgery. And

963
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:08,000
Speaker 2: luckily I avoided the surgery. I actually stayed in the

964
00:52:08,040 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 2: hospital for five days. They pumped me full of antibiotics.

965
00:52:11,719 --> 00:52:14,480
Speaker 2: I was on the phone with investors in London at

966
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:17,879
Speaker 2: the time, closing this three million dollar deal and got

967
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:21,839
Speaker 2: it done, but literally was that was a Monday. I

968
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:25,440
Speaker 2: left the hospital on Friday afternoon and went straight to

969
00:52:25,520 --> 00:52:27,880
Speaker 2: a pitch meeting. I could barely walk.

970
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 1: Oh my you still let it greenish.

971
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:34,840
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know. I remember my poor stomach

972
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:38,720
Speaker 2: was like so distended. It was awful. It was awful,

973
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:41,799
Speaker 2: but it was like what are you gonna do? I

974
00:52:41,840 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 2: was like, I have to get this money closed. And

975
00:52:44,520 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 2: it's like I meet with founders today and they're like

976
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:50,920
Speaker 2: trying to get like a little bit of a bridge

977
00:52:51,000 --> 00:52:53,440
Speaker 2: raised right now, right in his COVID time, it is

978
00:52:53,520 --> 00:52:55,759
Speaker 2: like the same thing. I'm like, oh my god, I

979
00:52:55,840 --> 00:52:59,160
Speaker 2: feel their pain. Like it's so stressful because you just

980
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 2: feel like everything is going to fall apart if this

981
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:06,080
Speaker 2: doesn't happen, and your body can only take so much.

982
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:09,759
Speaker 2: And so that's why, now having gone through all of that,

983
00:53:10,040 --> 00:53:14,000
Speaker 2: I am such a proponent of, you know, as a founder,

984
00:53:14,200 --> 00:53:18,320
Speaker 2: just really taking care of your physical, mental, and emotional

985
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:21,440
Speaker 2: health as well, because I've been at points where I've

986
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:25,520
Speaker 2: hit the wall, where it hasn't been sustainable. It's just

987
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:27,480
Speaker 2: not a good place for anyone to be.

988
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:31,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, was there a moment that you felt because I

989
00:53:31,719 --> 00:53:33,240
Speaker 1: just kind of put you through the ringer and talking

990
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:35,719
Speaker 1: about all the bad moments, and there were lots of

991
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 1: good moments, and I like that you included our CNN

992
00:53:37,600 --> 00:53:38,400
Speaker 1: interview in one of them.

993
00:53:38,440 --> 00:53:38,960
Speaker 2: I'll take that.

994
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 1: But was there a moment that you felt in all

995
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,440
Speaker 1: of this that you had made it.

996
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:50,880
Speaker 2: Here's the moments that I look back on the most

997
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 2: and think that made it all worth it. And we

998
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:58,000
Speaker 2: were lucky because at task grab It, we had these

999
00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:02,200
Speaker 2: little interactions in these little story every single day of

1000
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 2: amazing things that would happen on the platform, just matches

1001
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:08,800
Speaker 2: that were made or you know, interesting stories that happened,

1002
00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:11,960
Speaker 2: and those were the moments that we really held on

1003
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 2: to as a team and said, like, this makes it

1004
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:17,120
Speaker 2: all worth it. I'll tell my favorite story real quick,

1005
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 2: which was we were only open in two markets. We're

1006
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:23,760
Speaker 2: open in Boston and San Francisco. And at the time,

1007
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 2: there was this woman in San Francisco who posted on

1008
00:54:27,160 --> 00:54:29,919
Speaker 2: task grabbit and that she had a twenty year old

1009
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 2: son living in Boston. She couldn't fly out there to

1010
00:54:32,760 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 2: be with him, and unfortunately he was going through chemotherapy

1011
00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:40,399
Speaker 2: treatment at mass General Hospital. He's twenty years old, and

1012
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:43,520
Speaker 2: so she posted on task grabbit to find someone to

1013
00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:47,479
Speaker 2: go to the hospital to bring them a healthy meal

1014
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:51,120
Speaker 2: from Whole Foods and a cozy blanket from her and

1015
00:54:51,239 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 2: sit with him every day for a week during his

1016
00:54:53,640 --> 00:54:57,760
Speaker 2: treatments and then call her afterwards to tell her how

1017
00:54:57,800 --> 00:55:00,920
Speaker 2: her son was doing. E scare that picked up the

1018
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,239
Speaker 2: job in Boston was actually another mom, and so the

1019
00:55:04,280 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 2: bomb that these two moms formed across the country was

1020
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:10,360
Speaker 2: just incredible. And I think, you know, just two markets

1021
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:13,360
Speaker 2: open very early days. It was like twenty ten. I

1022
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:18,520
Speaker 2: realized what we were building was successful. Like it didn't

1023
00:55:18,560 --> 00:55:21,439
Speaker 2: matter the amount of revenue I drove or what sort

1024
00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 2: of acquisition offer I got in the end, but just

1025
00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:28,439
Speaker 2: the opportunity to change and improve people's lives like that

1026
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 2: is what kept us going through the whole thing. And

1027
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:34,280
Speaker 2: we had tons of stories like that on an ongoing basis.

1028
00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:38,839
Speaker 1: And you guys eventually sold to Ikea. Did you feel

1029
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:41,200
Speaker 1: like you could breathe because you talk about that rollercoaster?

1030
00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:43,840
Speaker 1: What was the feeling after the papers were signed?

1031
00:55:45,239 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, it was such a weird day. I

1032
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:50,719
Speaker 2: remember being on the board call where we voted to

1033
00:55:50,840 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 2: approve the acquisition and it was so exciting, but at

1034
00:55:55,719 --> 00:56:01,239
Speaker 2: the same time, it was this dramatic moment of my baby,

1035
00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:03,920
Speaker 2: My baby is gone. You know, this thing that I've

1036
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 2: worked on and raised for the last eight nine, ten

1037
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:10,520
Speaker 2: years it's going to be gone. And so I was

1038
00:56:10,560 --> 00:56:12,279
Speaker 2: the last one to vote. We were a bored of

1039
00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:14,520
Speaker 2: I think seven at the time. I was the last

1040
00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 2: one to vote. We all went around very dramatically. We

1041
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:20,360
Speaker 2: were like, yes, I approve, Yes, I approve, and everyone

1042
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:22,520
Speaker 2: said yes, and it got to me and I was

1043
00:56:22,560 --> 00:56:25,040
Speaker 2: so choked up in that moment, and of course I

1044
00:56:25,080 --> 00:56:27,600
Speaker 2: approved the deal. I was very exciting, but it was

1045
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:30,239
Speaker 2: just such a huge transition. I knew it was going

1046
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:32,880
Speaker 2: to be a life transition and a huge transition for

1047
00:56:32,960 --> 00:56:36,239
Speaker 2: the company, for the business, and for me. At the

1048
00:56:36,239 --> 00:56:40,640
Speaker 2: same time, I was pregnant with my second child, and

1049
00:56:40,719 --> 00:56:46,400
Speaker 2: so I think actually for me personally, that helped shift

1050
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:48,560
Speaker 2: me out of the day to day and shift me

1051
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:51,360
Speaker 2: out of the business because I had now this newborn

1052
00:56:51,360 --> 00:56:53,640
Speaker 2: at home, and so it was like a lot of

1053
00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:57,480
Speaker 2: personal life changes as well that sort of were good

1054
00:56:57,480 --> 00:57:00,239
Speaker 2: for me and helped me move forward maybe in a

1055
00:57:00,239 --> 00:57:03,319
Speaker 2: way that was really healthy. Whereas if I didn't have

1056
00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:07,160
Speaker 2: those sort of distractions and new joys and things in

1057
00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 2: my life, it probably would have been a lot harder.

1058
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:11,480
Speaker 1: Would you do the day you voted? What was like

1059
00:57:11,520 --> 00:57:14,759
Speaker 1: the first thing you did after you you gave your

1060
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 1: approval and you kind of set your kid off to

1061
00:57:18,040 --> 00:57:20,000
Speaker 1: college in a metaphorical sense.

1062
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,200
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, well I was at home. I was at

1063
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:25,880
Speaker 2: my house, and I think I just remember just going

1064
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:29,280
Speaker 2: downstairs and just playing with my own children, my very normal,

1065
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 2: very normal day. Yeah, but I definitely remember that moment

1066
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 2: in feeling like whoo. I felt like I was standing

1067
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:39,520
Speaker 2: like on the edge of a cliff and it was like,

1068
00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:42,400
Speaker 2: I've got a jump. This is it.

1069
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:47,480
Speaker 1: And you're now investing. You're a general partner and an

1070
00:57:47,560 --> 00:57:51,440
Speaker 1: investment fund, You're looking at companies early on. Why did

1071
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: you decide to become an investor?

1072
00:57:55,360 --> 00:57:58,240
Speaker 2: So you know, for me, I've told the story that

1073
00:57:58,640 --> 00:58:01,400
Speaker 2: I found a task Grabit because I was really excited

1074
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:05,360
Speaker 2: about these three emerging technologies, social, location, and mobile and

1075
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:08,360
Speaker 2: I'm an engineer, that is my background, and so I

1076
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:12,800
Speaker 2: love technology. And then I founded the company. I kind

1077
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:15,160
Speaker 2: of put my head down in this one space and

1078
00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 2: this one technology, in this one business for almost a decade,

1079
00:58:18,080 --> 00:58:20,480
Speaker 2: and when I sold task grab It, I kind of

1080
00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:22,920
Speaker 2: picked my head up and I thought, Wow, there's a

1081
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:25,560
Speaker 2: lot of new emerging technologies that have happened that I

1082
00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 2: haven't been a part of. There's been bitcoin and blockchain

1083
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:33,120
Speaker 2: and ar and all kinds of really interesting technologies that

1084
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:36,280
Speaker 2: I haven't had a chance to dig into. So I

1085
00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 2: knew that whatever I did next, I didn't want to

1086
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:41,840
Speaker 2: put my head down in one business and one technology

1087
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:44,320
Speaker 2: again for a long time. That I wanted to find

1088
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:47,000
Speaker 2: a role that I could really dig into a lot

1089
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 2: of different areas at once. And so because I had

1090
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:54,000
Speaker 2: great relationships with investors over the years, you know, a

1091
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:56,360
Speaker 2: lot of people reached out and kind of introduced me

1092
00:58:56,440 --> 00:58:59,720
Speaker 2: to the idea of investing full time. And I spent

1093
00:58:59,760 --> 00:59:02,960
Speaker 2: a year thinking about it and getting to know different

1094
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 2: investors before I decided to finally join Fuel. And it's

1095
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:09,600
Speaker 2: been a great fit. I get to work with entrepreneurs

1096
00:59:09,640 --> 00:59:12,080
Speaker 2: every day on their businesses. I get to learn new

1097
00:59:12,120 --> 00:59:15,880
Speaker 2: technologies every day, and my partner, Chris Howard, who's the

1098
00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:18,080
Speaker 2: founder of the firm, is just fantastic and it's just

1099
00:59:18,160 --> 00:59:20,560
Speaker 2: the two of us. So it's been a really really

1100
00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:21,440
Speaker 2: great move for me.

1101
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:25,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I read something that you know, you've kind

1102
00:59:25,360 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 1: of said that founders who care for themselves can better

1103
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:31,600
Speaker 1: care for their businesses. So and even in this interview,

1104
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 1: some of the things you've said about the conversations you've

1105
00:59:34,040 --> 00:59:35,920
Speaker 1: had with founders who are trying to make sure to

1106
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,479
Speaker 1: get a bridge during this time and all this, you've

1107
00:59:38,520 --> 00:59:41,840
Speaker 1: spoken a lot about how they are doing emotionally. I

1108
00:59:41,880 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 1: can see that that's very much in the DNA of

1109
00:59:44,320 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 1: how you're of your investment strategy. So what do you

1110
00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:54,640
Speaker 1: tell founders who are in this moment, who are looking

1111
00:59:54,640 --> 00:59:58,920
Speaker 1: at the landscape, who are dealing with the normal stress

1112
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:02,320
Speaker 1: and anxiety of being a founder, which you know better

1113
01:00:02,360 --> 01:00:07,440
Speaker 1: than most is very stressful, and now have the backdrop

1114
01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:11,920
Speaker 1: of a global pandemic. What advice do you give them?

1115
01:00:12,400 --> 01:00:17,360
Speaker 2: Well, you know, my advice is one you know, think

1116
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:21,440
Speaker 2: about what your business needs to survive over the next

1117
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:25,520
Speaker 2: eighteen twenty four plus months, and that usually means what

1118
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:28,000
Speaker 2: is your cash runway? So we're advising all of our

1119
01:00:28,040 --> 01:00:30,000
Speaker 2: founders to just make sure they have enough cash in

1120
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:32,280
Speaker 2: the bank to kind of ride this out. You know,

1121
01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:34,600
Speaker 2: when I started in two thousand and eight, it really

1122
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:37,480
Speaker 2: wasn't until eighteen months later that I was able to

1123
01:00:37,520 --> 01:00:40,720
Speaker 2: get a seed round together. And it may take eighteen

1124
01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 2: months or longer for really the markets to improve and

1125
01:00:43,600 --> 01:00:47,000
Speaker 2: for investors to really re engage and put capital back

1126
01:00:47,040 --> 01:00:49,440
Speaker 2: into the markets in the same way they were, And

1127
01:00:49,480 --> 01:00:52,040
Speaker 2: so that's one thing. I think the second thing is like,

1128
01:00:52,160 --> 01:00:55,800
Speaker 2: once you've got that figured out, make sure that you

1129
01:00:55,840 --> 01:00:59,800
Speaker 2: were carving out time and space for yourself as far

1130
01:00:59,840 --> 01:01:05,120
Speaker 2: as as sort of a mental emotional health and wellness standpoint.

1131
01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:06,720
Speaker 2: And it is so so hard. I mean, we're all

1132
01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:09,840
Speaker 2: juggling so much. We've got kids running around, we're homeschooling,

1133
01:01:10,400 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 2: you know, we're taking care of all kinds of things

1134
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:16,960
Speaker 2: beyond just our businesses. And now work in life is

1135
01:01:16,960 --> 01:01:20,000
Speaker 2: so integrated because we're all working from home. So it's

1136
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:23,320
Speaker 2: sometimes really hard and sometimes impossible to find the time

1137
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,480
Speaker 2: and space that you need mentally. But one of the

1138
01:01:26,520 --> 01:01:30,800
Speaker 2: things we're doing as part of Fuels Portfolio is we're

1139
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:36,080
Speaker 2: holding weekly meditation sessions for our founders over zoom. You know,

1140
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:40,520
Speaker 2: we're trying to connect founders with resources around healthy eating

1141
01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:44,200
Speaker 2: and healthy sleeping that can help them through this time.

1142
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:47,440
Speaker 2: I think sometimes it's just you're in such a frantic

1143
01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:50,360
Speaker 2: panic mode. It's so easy to stay in that mode.

1144
01:01:50,720 --> 01:01:53,160
Speaker 2: But you can break that cycle, even if it's just

1145
01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:56,960
Speaker 2: like ten minutes a day to just like sit quietly

1146
01:01:57,200 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 2: and make your mind stop, you know, wish that I

1147
01:02:00,760 --> 01:02:03,160
Speaker 2: had done more of that when I was running Task

1148
01:02:03,200 --> 01:02:05,760
Speaker 2: Grab It. And certainly, you know at the end when

1149
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:07,800
Speaker 2: I tell the story about going into the hospital, like

1150
01:02:08,600 --> 01:02:11,400
Speaker 2: I pushed my body to a place where it couldn't

1151
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:14,240
Speaker 2: operate anymore, and that wasn't good for the business either.

1152
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:19,280
Speaker 2: If I had just taken some measures to act more sustainably,

1153
01:02:20,040 --> 01:02:22,320
Speaker 2: then I think it would have been a lot easier

1154
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:25,240
Speaker 2: for me, and you know, the business in the end

1155
01:02:25,680 --> 01:02:28,800
Speaker 2: would have reached the same success in the same story.

1156
01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:31,600
Speaker 2: So I think it's just having that perspective that it's

1157
01:02:31,640 --> 01:02:36,200
Speaker 2: okay to just take a pause for yourself from a

1158
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:37,320
Speaker 2: mental health standpoint.

1159
01:02:37,680 --> 01:02:41,160
Speaker 1: And if you could go back and you know, tell

1160
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight Leah building out Task Grab It

1161
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:47,640
Speaker 1: Anything as you now having kind of just gone through

1162
01:02:47,640 --> 01:02:50,720
Speaker 1: this huge journey and being on the other side of it,

1163
01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:54,920
Speaker 1: and even now at this crazy moment, what would you

1164
01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:56,240
Speaker 1: tell her.

1165
01:02:57,680 --> 01:03:02,280
Speaker 2: I've been just recognizing it's gonna be hard. It's hard

1166
01:03:02,320 --> 01:03:05,960
Speaker 2: for everyone. But I think actually that was the best

1167
01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:08,520
Speaker 2: time for me to start a business. Now is the

1168
01:03:08,560 --> 01:03:11,240
Speaker 2: best time for a lot of entrepreneurs to be starting

1169
01:03:11,240 --> 01:03:13,880
Speaker 2: their businesses. It's going to be so so hard in

1170
01:03:13,920 --> 01:03:19,640
Speaker 2: the beginning. But because you're you're innovating something out of

1171
01:03:19,680 --> 01:03:23,360
Speaker 2: a time that's really chaotic and really hard, it's going

1172
01:03:23,440 --> 01:03:25,680
Speaker 2: to make you operate differently. It's going to make you

1173
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:30,320
Speaker 2: build in a more sustainable way. And I think the

1174
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:34,560
Speaker 2: opportunity to achieve a bigger vision, sort of this game

1175
01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:38,880
Speaker 2: changing vision where customers will change their behavior along with

1176
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:42,280
Speaker 2: you is you know, it's like no other time, and

1177
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:45,640
Speaker 2: so I'm glad I went for it, even though it

1178
01:03:45,640 --> 01:03:48,520
Speaker 2: was just a crazy, crazy journey, and so I encourage,

1179
01:03:48,640 --> 01:03:50,080
Speaker 2: you know, other people to go for it.

1180
01:03:50,040 --> 01:04:01,800
Speaker 1: To Okay, guys, that's it for this week's show. Quick

1181
01:04:01,880 --> 01:04:04,880
Speaker 1: update for you. This is one of the last episodes

1182
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:08,240
Speaker 1: of the season. It's been so much fun bringing you, guys,

1183
01:04:08,360 --> 01:04:11,920
Speaker 1: stories of founder journeys, the highs and the lows, some

1184
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:15,120
Speaker 1: weird stories like that time I had a relationship with

1185
01:04:15,160 --> 01:04:19,160
Speaker 1: a bot, my quarantine diaries, the one time we talked

1186
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:22,200
Speaker 1: about hacking your brain. Thank you, guys for playing ball

1187
01:04:22,240 --> 01:04:25,520
Speaker 1: with me. This season has been a blast. We hope

1188
01:04:25,520 --> 01:04:28,160
Speaker 1: to bring you more for us contact later this summer. Now,

1189
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:31,520
Speaker 1: there's never been a more important time to explore technology

1190
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:35,520
Speaker 1: and its impact on us human beings. My favorite part

1191
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 1: of doing this show is hearing from you, so don't

1192
01:04:38,400 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 1: be a stranger. Let's stay in touch. The best way

1193
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:42,480
Speaker 1: to do that is to sign up for our newsletter

1194
01:04:42,520 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 1: at dot dot dot media dot com Backslash Newsletter. We're

1195
01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:48,600
Speaker 1: launching it this summer and it's going to be your

1196
01:04:48,640 --> 01:04:50,880
Speaker 1: best source to stay in the loop on any upcoming

1197
01:04:50,920 --> 01:04:53,840
Speaker 1: episodes that we happen to drop. And we're also doing

1198
01:04:53,880 --> 01:04:56,640
Speaker 1: these virtual town halls, so we'll let you know about those,

1199
01:04:56,720 --> 01:04:59,160
Speaker 1: and we're working on a ton of projects that will

1200
01:04:59,200 --> 01:05:01,520
Speaker 1: keep you in the loop on. So sign up at

1201
01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:05,120
Speaker 1: dot dot dot media dot com Backslash Newsletter. I promise

1202
01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:07,680
Speaker 1: not to spam you, and reach out to me. Tell

1203
01:05:07,680 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 1: me what you're up to and what stories you're interested in.

1204
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:13,600
Speaker 1: My number is nine one seven five four zero three

1205
01:05:13,720 --> 01:05:17,600
Speaker 1: four one zero. Also, a lot of you been texting

1206
01:05:17,640 --> 01:05:20,160
Speaker 1: me about new initiatives during this crisis, and I know

1207
01:05:20,280 --> 01:05:23,200
Speaker 1: a lot of folks in Silicon Valley working on quite

1208
01:05:23,240 --> 01:05:25,040
Speaker 1: a few of them, So I want to give a

1209
01:05:25,040 --> 01:05:28,200
Speaker 1: couple shout outs. The first is Frontline Foods. It's five

1210
01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:31,520
Speaker 1: hundred volunteers and since they've started, they've delivered more than

1211
01:05:31,600 --> 01:05:35,480
Speaker 1: fifty thousand meals to hospitals and forty cities. The next

1212
01:05:35,520 --> 01:05:38,000
Speaker 1: is Code Academy. They're working on more than ten thousand

1213
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:41,720
Speaker 1: scholarships to Code Academy pro for students and teachers affected

1214
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:46,000
Speaker 1: by COVID nineteen school closures. And lastly, an app called

1215
01:05:46,120 --> 01:05:49,440
Speaker 1: COVID Coach. It's an app designed to help folks stay sane,

1216
01:05:49,520 --> 01:05:54,120
Speaker 1: stay connected, cope with stress, manage anxiety, and navigate parenting

1217
01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:57,680
Speaker 1: and caretaking during this pandemic. If you want to learn

1218
01:05:57,720 --> 01:05:59,840
Speaker 1: more or get involved with any of these organizations, go

1219
01:05:59,840 --> 01:06:02,760
Speaker 1: to our show notes. Follow along on our social media.

1220
01:06:02,920 --> 01:06:05,880
Speaker 1: I'm at Lori Siegel on Twitter and Instagram, and the

1221
01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:09,280
Speaker 1: show is at First Contact Podcast on Instagram, on Twitter,

1222
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:12,840
Speaker 1: We're at First Contact Pod. First Contact is a production

1223
01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:15,680
Speaker 1: of Dot Dot Dot Media executive produced by Lori Siegel

1224
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:19,040
Speaker 1: and Derek Dodge. This episode was produced and edited by

1225
01:06:19,120 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 1: Sabine Jansen and Jack Reagan. The original theme music is

1226
01:06:22,520 --> 01:06:26,000
Speaker 1: by Xander Singh. And as always, I'm sending my thoughts

1227
01:06:26,040 --> 01:06:28,000
Speaker 1: to each and every one of you guys, and so

1228
01:06:28,240 --> 01:06:31,600
Speaker 1: is our whole First Contact crew. During this time, I

1229
01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:36,400
Speaker 1: hope that everybody is staying home, staying healthy, and staying human.

1230
01:06:36,720 --> 01:06:48,440
Speaker 1: I'm Lori Siegel and this is first contact. First contact

1231
01:06:48,440 --> 01:06:50,440
Speaker 1: with Lori Siegel is a production of Dot dot Dot

1232
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:52,000
Speaker 1: Media and iHeartRadio