1
00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,920
Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I in Matt.

2
00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:06,280
Speaker 1: Today we are asking the question is capitalism a force

3
00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:29,400
Speaker 1: for good? That's right, and this was intended to be

4
00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:33,440
Speaker 1: a provocative title for this episode. Is capitalism a force

5
00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:35,639
Speaker 1: for good? Didn't we didn't? We recently have a beer

6
00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:38,600
Speaker 1: called a force for good? Yes, we completely missed an

7
00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:43,000
Speaker 1: opportunity and had a good parent here. Um. However, this

8
00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:45,000
Speaker 1: is a topic that we feel is important. We want

9
00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:47,920
Speaker 1: to talk about capitalism in a way that we feel

10
00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,320
Speaker 1: like it's fair, while at the same time, we're you know,

11
00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:52,520
Speaker 1: we're addressing the fact. We know that this isn't gonna

12
00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:54,720
Speaker 1: be one of those episodes where at the very end

13
00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:56,840
Speaker 1: you're going to have like your three things to do.

14
00:00:57,640 --> 00:00:59,280
Speaker 1: We're hoping that this is going to be an episode

15
00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:01,960
Speaker 1: that causes you to think, because ultimately, we believe that

16
00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:04,520
Speaker 1: the attitudes that you have about something as fundamental as

17
00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:08,040
Speaker 1: capitalism will impact how it is that you interact with

18
00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:10,720
Speaker 1: different businesses and with the world around us as well,

19
00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:14,000
Speaker 1: and maybe even that desire or not to start your

20
00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:16,880
Speaker 1: own business someday kind of how you view the system

21
00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:19,480
Speaker 1: that we all kind of live in. To a certain extent,

22
00:01:20,080 --> 00:01:23,760
Speaker 1: matters in in your actions. Actually, it is going to

23
00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:26,560
Speaker 1: be somewhat deterministic in how you move about in the world.

24
00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:29,360
Speaker 1: But Matt, before before we get to that, let's I

25
00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:32,240
Speaker 1: just saw this great article from our friend jd Roth

26
00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:35,160
Speaker 1: who writes it Get Rich Slowly, and it was all

27
00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:38,160
Speaker 1: about speaking up for yourself. And I think this is

28
00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:39,959
Speaker 1: like one of those things that maybe we don't do

29
00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:43,399
Speaker 1: enough as consumers. Basically, he had someone come out to

30
00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:46,480
Speaker 1: his house to repair a leak in the roof, and

31
00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:49,000
Speaker 1: he they had told him, Hey, it's gonna cost us

32
00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:50,240
Speaker 1: this much to come out, and then this is our

33
00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:53,280
Speaker 1: hourly rates. They were out there for at most I

34
00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,160
Speaker 1: think you said, two hours, and then the bill he

35
00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:57,200
Speaker 1: got along at all. He was shocked. It was like

36
00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:01,680
Speaker 1: and so um. He at first was just kind of upset.

37
00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:04,160
Speaker 1: I wasn't sure what to do about it, but he decided,

38
00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,520
Speaker 1: you know what, I'm gonna speak up for myself and

39
00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:08,840
Speaker 1: he ended up calling the company and the bill was

40
00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:11,560
Speaker 1: without you know, him having to really even harangue anyone,

41
00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,320
Speaker 1: cut in half essentially and to to something that made

42
00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:19,000
Speaker 1: made more sense commensurate with the labor that actually was

43
00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:22,320
Speaker 1: involved in fixing his roof. And it just made me think, like,

44
00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:24,359
Speaker 1: there are so many times that that happens, and maybe

45
00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,720
Speaker 1: we bemoan it quietly or we're upset about it, we're

46
00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:30,360
Speaker 1: frustrated on the inside. But so much of the time,

47
00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,679
Speaker 1: the way to go about getting something fixed, uh, when

48
00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:37,359
Speaker 1: when something is wrong, when we have been overcharged or underserved,

49
00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:40,480
Speaker 1: is to reach out to that business and to tell

50
00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:43,000
Speaker 1: them and ask for them to fix it on our behalf.

51
00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,520
Speaker 1: That's right, Yeah, we need to advocate for ourselves. And

52
00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,240
Speaker 1: like you said, he didn't have to like go, you know,

53
00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,000
Speaker 1: stay in front of an appeals court or something like that.

54
00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:53,480
Speaker 1: It was literally a phone call. But I think that's

55
00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:57,160
Speaker 1: honestly the biggest uh disconnect or not disconnect, but that's

56
00:02:57,160 --> 00:02:59,520
Speaker 1: the hurdle that keeps us from moving forward and doing

57
00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:01,760
Speaker 1: something uh that would allow us to cosse some of

58
00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:03,800
Speaker 1: our money back. Is that if there isn't like a

59
00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:06,799
Speaker 1: button to click or an app where you submit a

60
00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:09,400
Speaker 1: complaint or something like that. If those things don't exist,

61
00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:11,360
Speaker 1: it's almost as if there's no path forward. It's like,

62
00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:12,960
Speaker 1: what do I do? It'm I supposed to actually pick

63
00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:14,880
Speaker 1: up the phone and call this company. And a lot

64
00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:16,880
Speaker 1: of times, yes, that's exactly what we need to do.

65
00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,320
Speaker 1: And I loved he He actually started that post talking

66
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,080
Speaker 1: about the fact that he hates confrontation. He does not

67
00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:27,080
Speaker 1: like to confront people to ask questions that we don't

68
00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:29,600
Speaker 1: necessarily need to be asked. But in this case, his

69
00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:31,080
Speaker 1: money was on the line, and I was glad to

70
00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,600
Speaker 1: see him, Yeah, advocate for himself, and that is something

71
00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,520
Speaker 1: that we need to do more of ourselves as well. Yeah,

72
00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:39,360
Speaker 1: and it's it's certainly uncomfortable at times, but when our

73
00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:41,720
Speaker 1: money is on the line, we we have to we

74
00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:43,760
Speaker 1: have to be willing to speak up, to push back,

75
00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:45,960
Speaker 1: to ask the question at least, can you explain this

76
00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:47,400
Speaker 1: bill to me a little bit further? You don't even

77
00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:50,560
Speaker 1: have to get hyper confrontatefrontational, you know, I don't think

78
00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,480
Speaker 1: j D j D did. I think he questioned where

79
00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:55,880
Speaker 1: why the bill was as much as it was, and like, well,

80
00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:57,360
Speaker 1: what was the actual work done? Because they were just

81
00:03:57,400 --> 00:03:59,440
Speaker 1: here for a couple of hours, And so asking those

82
00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:01,960
Speaker 1: gentle questions, even as you're starting to prod in the beginning,

83
00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,720
Speaker 1: can help the company realized, wait, we screwed up, we

84
00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:07,000
Speaker 1: build you the wrong amount, and we will fix it

85
00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:08,840
Speaker 1: without you even having to make a fuss, and so

86
00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:11,240
Speaker 1: sometimes you do have to take it to the level

87
00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:14,320
Speaker 1: of confrontational. You do have to maybe make a post

88
00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:17,680
Speaker 1: on Twitter or or you do even in extreme circumstances,

89
00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,560
Speaker 1: have to like pick it out in front of a

90
00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,680
Speaker 1: company in order to get a problem resolved. But most

91
00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,240
Speaker 1: of the time a simple phone call will clear things

92
00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:27,760
Speaker 1: up pretty easily. That's right, man. Let's go ahead and

93
00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:31,160
Speaker 1: introduce the beer that we're going to share during this episode. Uh,

94
00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,240
Speaker 1: it is a bourbon barrel brick kiln. This is a

95
00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:36,800
Speaker 1: beer by Jackie Os. Looking forward to drinking this one

96
00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:38,720
Speaker 1: and sharing our thoughts on this one at the end

97
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,600
Speaker 1: of the episode. Yeah, especially this one. Jackieo's is one

98
00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:43,680
Speaker 1: of my all time paper brewis at this point, and

99
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,360
Speaker 1: so they are. Yeah, they're awesome. Should be a good one.

100
00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:48,719
Speaker 1: All right, Well, let's let's get onto the provocative question

101
00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,160
Speaker 1: that they do. It is capitalism a force for good?

102
00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:53,880
Speaker 1: And this question made me think for some reason about

103
00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:57,360
Speaker 1: the movie and the book Moneyball, And um, yeah, if

104
00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,240
Speaker 1: you've read that book, if you watch the movie, Brad

105
00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,440
Speaker 1: Pitt Brad Pit was in it. Yes, that's right, Jonah Hill,

106
00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:03,640
Speaker 1: I think and I read the actual book because I'm

107
00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:05,839
Speaker 1: kind of a baseball nerd, and I found it fascinating

108
00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:08,120
Speaker 1: and and Michael Lewis is just such a great writer.

109
00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:10,119
Speaker 1: But if you've read the book or watch the movie,

110
00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:14,000
Speaker 1: you have probably acquired maybe a new understanding of the

111
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:18,839
Speaker 1: word underrated, because that book basically details the true story

112
00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:22,520
Speaker 1: of baseball general manager Billy Bean how how he changed

113
00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:25,240
Speaker 1: the face of the game of baseball by starting to

114
00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:29,279
Speaker 1: amass players who had certain characteristics that were kind of

115
00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:32,960
Speaker 1: boring but ultimately led to more team victories. That's right. Basically,

116
00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,240
Speaker 1: he was drafting and training for players who took a

117
00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:36,960
Speaker 1: lot of walks, like that's one way of saying, instead

118
00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:39,760
Speaker 1: of the the sexy or features of baseball like home

119
00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:42,479
Speaker 1: runs and stolen basis, he realized that those don't actually

120
00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,440
Speaker 1: pay off when it comes to victories as much as

121
00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 1: guys who can take walks. And so he got these

122
00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,560
Speaker 1: really undervalued players who had actually add a lot of

123
00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:54,320
Speaker 1: value to the team, even though most of baseball said, yeah,

124
00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:56,640
Speaker 1: we'll basically give these players to you because they don't

125
00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:59,280
Speaker 1: fit the mold of a traditional baseball player that were

126
00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:01,640
Speaker 1: used to see. And so that that group of underrated

127
00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:04,440
Speaker 1: players actually ended up taking the Oakland. A's basically from

128
00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:08,880
Speaker 1: from worst to first. And Matt, I think similarly, capitalism

129
00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:11,240
Speaker 1: is it's it's kind of like the baseball players that

130
00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,360
Speaker 1: Billy Bean was finding. It's this system that has at

131
00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,800
Speaker 1: least in recent year, has been a little more denigrated.

132
00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:19,840
Speaker 1: It's been undervalue maybe, And so yeah, you and I

133
00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:21,920
Speaker 1: we think that it is a force for good and

134
00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:23,320
Speaker 1: we're going to kind of make the case for that

135
00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:25,760
Speaker 1: in today's episode. Yeah, quite another quick example that I

136
00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:28,960
Speaker 1: can think of that's not sports related. It's basically like

137
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,040
Speaker 1: taking care of your teeth, right, Like you can get

138
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,400
Speaker 1: the fancy toothpaste, you can even get a nicer toothbrush,

139
00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:36,400
Speaker 1: like one of those fancy ultra sonic toothbrushes. You can

140
00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,000
Speaker 1: even get like some of those super fancy water jets.

141
00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:40,800
Speaker 1: I don't even know how much those things cost, but

142
00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:42,960
Speaker 1: all that being said, you can do all of those things,

143
00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,279
Speaker 1: or you can get somedental floss, which is like the

144
00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:48,920
Speaker 1: most basic thing, and flash your stupid teeth. It's gonna

145
00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,080
Speaker 1: win every single time. It is not pretty, but it

146
00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,839
Speaker 1: gets the job done. I feel that way again similarly

147
00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,160
Speaker 1: as the you know, Billy Bean, floss is just this

148
00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,640
Speaker 1: underrated thing. But it does get the job done every

149
00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:01,960
Speaker 1: single and it makes a big impact. And so yeah,

150
00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:03,839
Speaker 1: that's this is a big reason why we're talking about

151
00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,040
Speaker 1: capitalism during this episode, because I mean one of the

152
00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:07,640
Speaker 1: other things too, is we feel that it's become in

153
00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:11,840
Speaker 1: vogue recently to hate on capitalism. We're seeing socialist tendencies

154
00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:14,760
Speaker 1: actually growing in our society. Uh. And you know, we're

155
00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:17,360
Speaker 1: gonna do our best here to present a nuanced take here,

156
00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:20,480
Speaker 1: because it's not like we're saying that unfettered capitalism is

157
00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,800
Speaker 1: going to be like this glorious pinnacle of humanity or

158
00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:25,880
Speaker 1: anything like that. But the stats show that only half

159
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:30,160
Speaker 1: of younger Americans actually view capitalism fondly. However, as recently

160
00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,960
Speaker 1: as two thirds of people felt that way. Uh. And

161
00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:37,400
Speaker 1: some of that pivot is understandable. It seems that young adults,

162
00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,760
Speaker 1: they might be tending towards the socialist viewpoint for reasons

163
00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:42,680
Speaker 1: of security. You know that that might make sense. The

164
00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:46,360
Speaker 1: job market has evolved quickly. We'll all likely work a

165
00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,960
Speaker 1: bunch of different jobs in a variety of different sectors

166
00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:52,680
Speaker 1: over our working lifetimes. Uh. And that might be anxiety

167
00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:55,800
Speaker 1: inducing our parents, their parents, our grandparents, you know, they

168
00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:58,800
Speaker 1: didn't have that same experience. But just because that reaction

169
00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:02,040
Speaker 1: might be a understandable it doesn't mean that we think

170
00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:05,400
Speaker 1: gravitating away from capitalism is best. Okay, So I think

171
00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:07,640
Speaker 1: we should define our terms then, Matt, while we're starting

172
00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:11,160
Speaker 1: out here, we should maybe say what capitalism is and

173
00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:15,600
Speaker 1: what matter. And capitalism was essentially founded by Scottish economist

174
00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:18,120
Speaker 1: Adam Smith. He wrote the book The Wealth of Nations,

175
00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,000
Speaker 1: which most of us learned about as we were studying

176
00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:25,120
Speaker 1: history in school. And the literal definition of capitalism is,

177
00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,640
Speaker 1: and I quote, an economic system in which private individuals

178
00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:32,439
Speaker 1: or businesses own capital goods. It's the production of goods

179
00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:35,520
Speaker 1: and services based on supply and demand in the general market.

180
00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:39,520
Speaker 1: But there's also the reality that even before the terms

181
00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:43,240
Speaker 1: free market and capitalism came into our vernacular, before we

182
00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,400
Speaker 1: we knew what capitalism was, that free trade has been

183
00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:51,160
Speaker 1: this basic human instincts, right even before physical currencies were created,

184
00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,400
Speaker 1: before we can trade things back and forth with metal

185
00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:58,760
Speaker 1: coins or you know, paper currency, right exactly like what

186
00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,199
Speaker 1: we learned about when we talked with Jacob Goldstein, people

187
00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:05,800
Speaker 1: were trading agricultural goods back and forth, like grain or cattle.

188
00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:09,160
Speaker 1: And when it comes down to it, capitalism is kind

189
00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:12,080
Speaker 1: of more like the lack of a system than a

190
00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:17,040
Speaker 1: complex structured one, and so really it functions around individual

191
00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:21,040
Speaker 1: needs and then the subsequent ingenuity that comes along attempting

192
00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:22,800
Speaker 1: to meet those needs. That's right, And you know when

193
00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:25,559
Speaker 1: you see ingenuity, Basically what you're talking about here is competition.

194
00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:28,200
Speaker 1: And we feel that that is core to the capitalist system.

195
00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:30,960
Speaker 1: Because here's the thing, like we're not saying that, like

196
00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:33,400
Speaker 1: we're not we're not anarchists, right, we believe that there

197
00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,320
Speaker 1: is a certain amounts of law, like the rule of

198
00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,120
Speaker 1: law needs to exist in order for there to be

199
00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:42,720
Speaker 1: healthy competition, and that actually helps foster robust capitalists. Yeah, exactly,

200
00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:44,920
Speaker 1: because if you don't have any laws, then competition just

201
00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,720
Speaker 1: leads to death as people are literally clabboring each other

202
00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:51,720
Speaker 1: for the scarce goods. And so I wanted to quickly

203
00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:55,640
Speaker 1: provide a foil to capitalism. Let's mention the Scandinavian countries.

204
00:09:56,200 --> 00:09:59,160
Speaker 1: Everybody likes talking about those, uh your motherland. Yeah, I

205
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:01,520
Speaker 1: feel like there's been a lot of discussion in recent

206
00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:05,840
Speaker 1: years about Sweden, Denmark, about Norway, uh, the favorite of

207
00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:08,880
Speaker 1: those your country, and how these like quote unquote socialist

208
00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:12,680
Speaker 1: countries are basically like the gold standard. Many have said

209
00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:15,320
Speaker 1: that the U S should actually aim to be more

210
00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:19,640
Speaker 1: like these countries, and interestingly enough, we don't completely disagree here,

211
00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:22,920
Speaker 1: and that's because these countries aren't actually all that socialist.

212
00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:25,600
Speaker 1: Sure like, they definitely have higher tax rates, they've got

213
00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:28,760
Speaker 1: a stronger social safety nets. But when we're talking about

214
00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:31,640
Speaker 1: economic freedom, most of these countries have ranked higher than

215
00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:33,640
Speaker 1: the U S in recent years. Here's the thing. The

216
00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:36,800
Speaker 1: governments in these countries, they don't own the means of production,

217
00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:40,280
Speaker 1: which is what socialism actually is. Uh. And so if

218
00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:42,200
Speaker 1: you're looking for that type of economic system, you're gonna

219
00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:44,600
Speaker 1: have to look back in history to the USSR, or

220
00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:48,080
Speaker 1: more recently to Venezuela and Cuba. Those aren't countries where

221
00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:51,080
Speaker 1: most of us want to live. Uh. But interestingly enough,

222
00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:54,880
Speaker 1: these Scandinavian countries, they seem to prioritize free markets better

223
00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:57,199
Speaker 1: than we do here in the US these days. But

224
00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,480
Speaker 1: that's just an interesting note because it seems that these

225
00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,680
Speaker 1: SCAN and Navy in countries have prioritized free markets recently

226
00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:04,920
Speaker 1: better than the USS. Yeah. I think it's an important

227
00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:09,200
Speaker 1: part of the conversation because those countries have admirable qualities,

228
00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:12,120
Speaker 1: and there is a lot to admire about some of

229
00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,080
Speaker 1: those Scandinadian countries, what they've been able to produce, and

230
00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:18,240
Speaker 1: the happy people that they've been able to produce overall.

231
00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,320
Speaker 1: And it's interesting to see that actually capitalism has been

232
00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,960
Speaker 1: a robust part of that, and and more so lately

233
00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:26,800
Speaker 1: over the past couple of decades actly, there have been

234
00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:28,520
Speaker 1: a lot and we can link to an article too

235
00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:33,079
Speaker 1: from recent magazine where John Stossel details how skinn how

236
00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,000
Speaker 1: Sweden in particular, has changed over the years to looking

237
00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,000
Speaker 1: more like the United States than the traditional Sweden of

238
00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,520
Speaker 1: the six season seventies. And uh, yeah, this isn't to

239
00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:47,600
Speaker 1: say that there's more overall economic freedom in Scandinavian countries

240
00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:49,720
Speaker 1: than there is in the US. There are still lots

241
00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:53,320
Speaker 1: of government run services, but they also have the taxes

242
00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:55,320
Speaker 1: to fund them. And so while the US has a

243
00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,920
Speaker 1: tax to GDP ratio of somewhere in the range of

244
00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:02,319
Speaker 1: it's closer to forty five percent over in the Nordic countries.

245
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:04,720
Speaker 1: So more of your paycheck, a good bit more of

246
00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:07,959
Speaker 1: your paycheck is going to fund those social services. And

247
00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,359
Speaker 1: that's not to say that those countries are worse off.

248
00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:13,080
Speaker 1: It's okay to have different countries doing different things. We

249
00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,400
Speaker 1: think it provides a nice balance to the world. You know,

250
00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:18,240
Speaker 1: folks who want to take it easier can move to Norway,

251
00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:21,480
Speaker 1: although I think the immigration policies there are are pretty tight. Uh.

252
00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:23,199
Speaker 1: And if you want to, I might be able to

253
00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:25,960
Speaker 1: get in just because of my ancestry, but it's because

254
00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,160
Speaker 1: of your name and if you want to duke it

255
00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:31,079
Speaker 1: out then you know. That's what the US does really well.

256
00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:34,560
Speaker 1: And companies like Apple, Google, forward Visor, and Delta, they

257
00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:37,920
Speaker 1: have all flourished under the capitalist system. That these are

258
00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:41,120
Speaker 1: all US companies that haven't only just made our lives better,

259
00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:42,800
Speaker 1: but like I mean, they literally have made the entire

260
00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:44,600
Speaker 1: world better exactly. Yeah, when you look at some of

261
00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:47,600
Speaker 1: these companies, um, many of them make more money overall

262
00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:50,040
Speaker 1: outside of the United States than they make inside of

263
00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:52,360
Speaker 1: the US these days. And Matt, you and I were

264
00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:55,880
Speaker 1: obviously not not all knowing beings, but I'm guessing that

265
00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:59,040
Speaker 1: these companies might not even exist if it weren't for

266
00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:03,640
Speaker 1: the capitalistic work that exists in the US that lead

267
00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:06,560
Speaker 1: them to flourishing. We probably wouldn't have Netflix or eBay either. Yeah,

268
00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,079
Speaker 1: these are companies again, like, can you think of one

269
00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:12,080
Speaker 1: company from like a Scandinavian or Nordic country, Like you

270
00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:16,120
Speaker 1: probably can't think like Nestley in Switzerland there maybe I don't.

271
00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:18,160
Speaker 1: I don't even know, though it sounds kind of like

272
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,360
Speaker 1: an American company, like like Nordic track that doesn't count either,

273
00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,240
Speaker 1: But it is interesting to see the privatization that has

274
00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:28,520
Speaker 1: happened over time in some of these countries. Spotify, I believe,

275
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:30,760
Speaker 1: where of a British company or they maybe they might

276
00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:33,360
Speaker 1: even be a Swedish company. Actually, yeah, yeah, And so again,

277
00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,040
Speaker 1: why are we talking about this because we normally stick

278
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:37,199
Speaker 1: to personal finance and now we're gonna be getting more

279
00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,320
Speaker 1: into the broader field of economics with this discussion. But

280
00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:42,640
Speaker 1: because we live in a free market economy, we feel

281
00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:45,160
Speaker 1: that it's important to know how it functions so that

282
00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:47,560
Speaker 1: we can thrive inside of it. And maybe this episode

283
00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,560
Speaker 1: will help you to understand just the societal waters that

284
00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,200
Speaker 1: we are all swimming in. And another reason we feel

285
00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:55,760
Speaker 1: compelled to talk about capitalism today is because of just

286
00:13:55,800 --> 00:14:00,360
Speaker 1: the changing perceptions by many that free markets aren't actually good.

287
00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:02,400
Speaker 1: We think that they are, uh, And so we're going

288
00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:14,679
Speaker 1: to discuss that and more right after this break. All right,

289
00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,240
Speaker 1: we're back, Matt. Let's keep annoying our listeners talking about

290
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,760
Speaker 1: capitalism here for a second, and kind of it's not annoying.

291
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:21,880
Speaker 1: This is this is an important converence. Yes, I agree,

292
00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:23,280
Speaker 1: I think it is. And and you know you and

293
00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,280
Speaker 1: I again, this is not necessarily the normal route we take,

294
00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:30,160
Speaker 1: but we feel compelled to discuss this because when knowing

295
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:32,200
Speaker 1: the water that you're swimming in and knowing kind of

296
00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:35,160
Speaker 1: how a capitalist system operates and what's good and what's

297
00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:37,520
Speaker 1: bad about it, We're gonna cover both of the sides

298
00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:39,800
Speaker 1: of the coin here on today's think about it and

299
00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:41,640
Speaker 1: talk about it in a way that's just fair and

300
00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:43,840
Speaker 1: well rounded. Yeah, because it's trying to do here because

301
00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:45,880
Speaker 1: like you you mentioned before the break, like perceptions have

302
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:49,280
Speaker 1: changed around capitalism, um and quickly really and even just

303
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,200
Speaker 1: the last ten to fifteen years. And perception tends to

304
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:56,320
Speaker 1: define our reality, Like how we view things influences um

305
00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:58,520
Speaker 1: the way that we interact with the world around us,

306
00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:01,240
Speaker 1: and and and it seems that we as a society

307
00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:04,800
Speaker 1: have developed developed like um what I would define as

308
00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:08,760
Speaker 1: a bipolar approach towards capitalism and then generally, and then

309
00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:13,080
Speaker 1: towards big businesses specifically, because when Americans are are surveyed,

310
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,880
Speaker 1: the stats show that we don't trust businesses very much,

311
00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:19,200
Speaker 1: at least that's how we respond to folks that do

312
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,040
Speaker 1: the polling. Roughly eighteen percent of folks who were asked

313
00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:25,200
Speaker 1: whether they trust big businesses said yes. So that's um

314
00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:28,160
Speaker 1: a paltry some of people. Most of them are like

315
00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:30,520
Speaker 1: pretty low approval ready, Yeah, no, I don't trust business

316
00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:32,480
Speaker 1: at all. But at the same time, some of the

317
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,920
Speaker 1: biggest businesses out there are actively adored, Like folks love

318
00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:40,040
Speaker 1: their iPhone and they use Google products or or search

319
00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:43,960
Speaker 1: on a daily if not in hourly basis that we're

320
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,440
Speaker 1: fascinated by Tesla cars were amazed at the fact that

321
00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,360
Speaker 1: Costco can sell a fully cooked rotist or chicken. For

322
00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:52,920
Speaker 1: There's this disconnect between the way we think about big

323
00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:55,840
Speaker 1: businesses broadly and then the way we interact with them

324
00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:59,120
Speaker 1: in our our daily lives totally man and unfortunately, I

325
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,520
Speaker 1: feel like it's like at the core, like what's at

326
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:04,280
Speaker 1: the root of this is selfishness, right, because we think, oh, well,

327
00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:05,800
Speaker 1: I want to enjoy the things that I want to

328
00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:07,960
Speaker 1: that I like to purchase or the services that I

329
00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:10,360
Speaker 1: like to participate in, but generally speaking, when it comes

330
00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:12,600
Speaker 1: to these large businesses, I don't trust them. Like it

331
00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,480
Speaker 1: makes me think of uh, Like, if you've identified that

332
00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:18,680
Speaker 1: housing affordability as a problem, basically, like what it comes

333
00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:20,680
Speaker 1: down to is that there is not enough housing here

334
00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:22,440
Speaker 1: in the United States, especially as there are more and

335
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:24,240
Speaker 1: more folks who are looking to buy homes. And so

336
00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:27,040
Speaker 1: one of the most obvious solutions is housing density. Right,

337
00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:29,880
Speaker 1: we're talking about condos, we're talking about apartments. But that

338
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:32,080
Speaker 1: same person who might be like, oh, yeah, that's what

339
00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 1: we need, they might be the same person that goes

340
00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:36,520
Speaker 1: to a community meaning where they're proposing some apartments on

341
00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,480
Speaker 1: the corner and they're in their neighborhood exactly. Yes. And

342
00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:43,120
Speaker 1: so there's this cognitive dissonance here, and that is the

343
00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:45,120
Speaker 1: biggest thing that we're trying to address head on here

344
00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:46,560
Speaker 1: during this episode. And I think it's a good way

345
00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:48,440
Speaker 1: to put it, because I think there there's like one

346
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:52,000
Speaker 1: thing that we do with our wallets, with our habits,

347
00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:54,120
Speaker 1: with our actions, and there's another thing that we're saying

348
00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:56,040
Speaker 1: with our mouths or thinking with our brains yea, And

349
00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:58,480
Speaker 1: we would argue that what we're doing with our wallets

350
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,320
Speaker 1: really reveals where our part is when it comes to

351
00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:04,119
Speaker 1: these matters. Um and another sort of I guess argument

352
00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,520
Speaker 1: here for capitalism is that, like country, to a popular opinion,

353
00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,600
Speaker 1: the purpose of a business it's not necessarily to make money.

354
00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:12,440
Speaker 1: That might be mind blowing to some people and they're like,

355
00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:14,000
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? Of course that's the reason

356
00:17:14,040 --> 00:17:16,840
Speaker 1: businesses exist, like money, Well, profits are necessary of course

357
00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,120
Speaker 1: in order to run a business, but the primary reason

358
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:22,240
Speaker 1: businesses exist is basically to provide value, right And so

359
00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,360
Speaker 1: for instance, if this podcast doesn't provide enough value for you,

360
00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:27,639
Speaker 1: like you're gonna find another money podcast to listen to.

361
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,400
Speaker 1: Maybe you'll listen to like true crime, Like I just said,

362
00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,520
Speaker 1: I hate Joel so much. I'm done with money podcasts altogether.

363
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:35,480
Speaker 1: Like the same is true with like a grocery store

364
00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:37,639
Speaker 1: right around the corner, you know, I love Aldi. Is

365
00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:40,000
Speaker 1: Aldi taking an advantage of their customers or are they

366
00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,200
Speaker 1: providing a valuable service because I might not personally shop

367
00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 1: at fresh Market myself as an individual, but they certainly

368
00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:48,879
Speaker 1: aren't taking advantage of anyone as long as folks have

369
00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,680
Speaker 1: the option, and there are lots of options because of

370
00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,280
Speaker 1: the competition you talked about earlier, Matt, And there's just

371
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:57,879
Speaker 1: so many examples we could come up with here, like

372
00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,840
Speaker 1: as to companies that are per binding value, that are

373
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:03,120
Speaker 1: that are changing things in a way that are making

374
00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:05,800
Speaker 1: things better for us as individuals, Like why have so

375
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,800
Speaker 1: many how do money listeners switch to Mintmobile? Well, part

376
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,480
Speaker 1: probably because we have they're good competition. But but it's

377
00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:14,280
Speaker 1: this fairly new company really on the scene that's offering

378
00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:16,959
Speaker 1: better service and lower prices than the old school cell

379
00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:19,880
Speaker 1: phone companies. People are starting to realize specifically lower prices. Yeah,

380
00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:22,679
Speaker 1: it's like it's like the same service, uh, for the

381
00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:24,679
Speaker 1: best price exactly. So instead of paying fifty bucks a month,

382
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,719
Speaker 1: I'm paying fifteen and I'm getting really the same exact product.

383
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:30,880
Speaker 1: And so, yeah, that is capitalism at work. Or why

384
00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,920
Speaker 1: are folks leaving big banks for online banks with better features?

385
00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:36,840
Speaker 1: Also capitalism and competition and all the things that we

386
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:38,560
Speaker 1: love to talk about that we're trying to convince people

387
00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:41,000
Speaker 1: to switch over to exactly, And and this is just

388
00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:44,119
Speaker 1: all voluntary really, like nobody's forcing you to do this.

389
00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:46,240
Speaker 1: Nobody's holding a gun to your head saying like you

390
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:49,199
Speaker 1: must switch to Mintmobile. We're suggesting it, and you you know,

391
00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:51,520
Speaker 1: many of you have taken advantage, but you don't have

392
00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:54,040
Speaker 1: to if you're like listen, I love paying a hundred

393
00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:57,000
Speaker 1: and twelve dollars a month to Verizon. More power to

394
00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,000
Speaker 1: you keep doing it, like you don't have to make

395
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,520
Speaker 1: the switch. You don't have to buy stuff on Amazon

396
00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:03,879
Speaker 1: if you don't want to. Either you do it or

397
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:06,280
Speaker 1: lots of people do it, because that business has created

398
00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,159
Speaker 1: an immense amount of value, and I think that value

399
00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:12,320
Speaker 1: was made even more apparent during the pandemic. During the

400
00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:14,560
Speaker 1: last two years. You can find almost anything you want,

401
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:17,520
Speaker 1: it's priced reasonably, and that shipped your home in this

402
00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:20,640
Speaker 1: ridiculously short period of time. I mean, I think that's

403
00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:23,639
Speaker 1: a big part of it is that capitalism is not coercive,

404
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:25,800
Speaker 1: and really it's up to us to decide how we

405
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,159
Speaker 1: want to interact with these with these companies that are

406
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,160
Speaker 1: vying for our dollars. That's right. At the same time, though,

407
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,800
Speaker 1: let's make sure that we are approaching capitalism from you know,

408
00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:37,240
Speaker 1: with a balanced perspective, because it's important to realize that

409
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:41,439
Speaker 1: free markets they can't fix everything. Um capitalism has broken

410
00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:43,840
Speaker 1: a lot of things on the road to progress. Uh.

411
00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:45,960
Speaker 1: And this is a specifically, this is a force known

412
00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:49,760
Speaker 1: as creative destruction. UH. So for example, as PCs and

413
00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:52,880
Speaker 1: as computers were invented and then adopted by the masses,

414
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,879
Speaker 1: typewriters they went away almost overnight. Smith Corona is an

415
00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:59,560
Speaker 1: old typewriter company, and they began to lose millions of

416
00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:03,359
Speaker 1: dollars a year, uh, completely upending a legitimate business that

417
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:07,240
Speaker 1: employed a lot of people. But that destruction, it unleashed

418
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:11,480
Speaker 1: just a torrent of creativity which gave rise ultimately to

419
00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,719
Speaker 1: tens of millions of new jobs. Uh. The same thing

420
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:18,120
Speaker 1: is true with Kodak and the advent of digital cameras.

421
00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:20,200
Speaker 1: They even invented, I think one of the first digital

422
00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:23,280
Speaker 1: cameras ever, I think the first digital camera created it.

423
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:25,400
Speaker 1: But but they assumed that it was going to cannabalize

424
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,760
Speaker 1: their film business, which is what Kodak was. I mean,

425
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,880
Speaker 1: it was obviously the bulk of their profits. And so

426
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:32,960
Speaker 1: what they do They didn't release it. They stuck it

427
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:34,639
Speaker 1: on the shelf, and of course we all know how

428
00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,719
Speaker 1: that worked out for Kodak specifically. UH. And so creative

429
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,560
Speaker 1: destruction it causes targeted harm in the short term, but

430
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:44,800
Speaker 1: it also creates way more opportunity for everyone in the

431
00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,280
Speaker 1: long run. That's right. Yeah, we're all happy that we

432
00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,600
Speaker 1: have digital cameras now, even though at the time Kodak

433
00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:51,040
Speaker 1: was like, ah, this is like the worst thing that's

434
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:52,600
Speaker 1: ever happened to us. At the time, it's a threat,

435
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,680
Speaker 1: but over the long haul, it's something that they could

436
00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,239
Speaker 1: have gotten behind, and you know, they could have been

437
00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:59,879
Speaker 1: the leader and in digital camera. And some businesses do

438
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,359
Speaker 1: in this process of bringing better ideas and your better

439
00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:07,320
Speaker 1: services and goods to the world. Right, and um, let's

440
00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,399
Speaker 1: talk about to Matt, just the creative destruction thing is

441
00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:12,680
Speaker 1: important to mention. It's important to say that there are

442
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:17,719
Speaker 1: certain specific pockets, uh certain industries and certain locations that

443
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 1: are negatively impacted as creative destruction takes place. I mean,

444
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:23,679
Speaker 1: you can look at Detroit as a prime example. But

445
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,159
Speaker 1: here's the thing. You can find things wrong with with

446
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 1: any system. You know, has capitalism exploited different groups of

447
00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,560
Speaker 1: people over the years. The answer to that question is yes.

448
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,960
Speaker 1: And is there such a thing as chrony capitalism? Um, yes,

449
00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 1: that's that exists. To some businesses have benefited from the

450
00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 1: political relationships that they've formed, meaning they get preferential treatment

451
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,320
Speaker 1: thanks to cozy relationships with elected officials, and we would

452
00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:49,719
Speaker 1: say that is a form of capitalism that is not

453
00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 1: pure and not good um and it negatively affects other companies,

454
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:57,359
Speaker 1: like some some companies are trying to protect themselves, protect

455
00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,879
Speaker 1: their company through political means. And you can also, at

456
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,000
Speaker 1: the same time, you can point to a bunch of

457
00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:07,159
Speaker 1: different businesses that aren't great representations of the free market,

458
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,520
Speaker 1: or or even businesses that have actively caused harm to

459
00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,720
Speaker 1: lots of people. I'm thinking of Enron or Farinos like

460
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:15,960
Speaker 1: those are companies that you don't want to mimic, You

461
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,200
Speaker 1: don't want to go by their playbook, because they lied, cheated,

462
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:21,960
Speaker 1: they were deceptive, and you know that. But you can also,

463
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,160
Speaker 1: at the same time easily point to other economic models,

464
00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:28,080
Speaker 1: and I would say flaws that exist in those are

465
00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:30,639
Speaker 1: even more severe than the ones that exist in the

466
00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 1: capitalist framework, and so those examples they don't negate. We

467
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:37,280
Speaker 1: would say the overwhelming human progress that's been achieved thanks

468
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,639
Speaker 1: to free markets, and I think we could at this

469
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,600
Speaker 1: point share some stats, Maddie even about just how far

470
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 1: we've come in the last two and or fifty years,

471
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,399
Speaker 1: largely thanks to the free market system flourishing across the world,

472
00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:52,199
Speaker 1: just longer lifespans, greater wealth achieved, and and really like

473
00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,239
Speaker 1: people just having more choice in their lives totally. And

474
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,120
Speaker 1: what we're getting at here is the fact that I mean, oftentimes,

475
00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,800
Speaker 1: when there are bad players in a system like capitalism,

476
00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 1: it's not because necessarily of the system. It's because of individuals.

477
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:06,960
Speaker 1: And what we're arguing here is that with any system,

478
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,320
Speaker 1: they're gonna be folks who screw things up for everybody

479
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,960
Speaker 1: else the benefit though, you know, and we're gonna get

480
00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 1: to this, I think maybe here in a little bit

481
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit more about just the self

482
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 1: cleansing aspects of that capitalism provides. Uh, the companies that

483
00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,800
Speaker 1: you mentioned and Ron there knows those are both companies

484
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:26,119
Speaker 1: that don't exist anymore because of the way the market works.

485
00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:28,560
Speaker 1: In that way, it's self corrects. But like you said,

486
00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,360
Speaker 1: there are certain sectors where the free market can run

487
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,000
Speaker 1: a muck, where it can cause a lot of damage.

488
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:36,440
Speaker 1: I'm specifically thinking about the the Volkswagen emission scandal. I

489
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 1: think that was a few years ago. But you know,

490
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,239
Speaker 1: public companies, they sometimes they lie or they cover up

491
00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:44,479
Speaker 1: their misdeeds in the pursuit of profits. That's not okay,

492
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 1: And those examples give capitalism a bad reputation. And of

493
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 1: course we do need public goods and services. Like Amazon

494
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 1: as a private company, they can't fix the nation's infrastructure problems, right, Uh.

495
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 1: They they need public roads and bridges to even have

496
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:00,840
Speaker 1: a business. And so we believe that a certain amount

497
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 1: of government services and regulations, public utilities, uh, these things

498
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 1: are all definitely necessary to prevent abuses of capitalism. But

499
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 1: that being said, these laws, these regulations, they should not

500
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,679
Speaker 1: keep us from prioritizing free markets in most of the

501
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 1: areas in our lives. Yeah. Man, I think another argument

502
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,679
Speaker 1: maybe is is that there's less individual security in a

503
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 1: society that's more steep it in capitalism, like like we

504
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 1: are here in the United States. There's some truth to

505
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:29,159
Speaker 1: that argument, um, but I think it's important for us

506
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:32,920
Speaker 1: to mention what happens if the government doesn't step in

507
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 1: in in some of these occasions. Well, it turns out

508
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 1: that we have an incredible array of nonprofits in this

509
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:42,399
Speaker 1: country too, and Americans are very very generous people. In fact,

510
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,360
Speaker 1: when you look at the rankings, we ranked number one

511
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,239
Speaker 1: in worldwide generosity over the past decades. So yeah, when

512
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: Americans prosper under the capitalist system, they tend to share

513
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:54,880
Speaker 1: the wealth that they accrue with others in need. And

514
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,160
Speaker 1: you know, while the US doesn't necessarily have as strong

515
00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 1: of a safety net as some other development stations, there's

516
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:03,120
Speaker 1: still a lot of government aid for folks who are

517
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: in real need. And so yeah, I guess the question

518
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,119
Speaker 1: could be asked, do we need more of that? Do

519
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:11,760
Speaker 1: we need more government programs? Do we need more money

520
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,640
Speaker 1: going into the hands of the most needy in our society?

521
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,680
Speaker 1: That is a worthwhile debate. That's something that I think

522
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: we would probably admit in some instances there is more

523
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,719
Speaker 1: money needed flowing into the hands of individuals who need

524
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:25,920
Speaker 1: help in our country. But we I think we can

525
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: have that debate while still appreciating the free market system

526
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:31,440
Speaker 1: that we've got and how much it has done for

527
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 1: really all of us. It's that rising tide that's lifted

528
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,280
Speaker 1: all the boats totally. Yeah. And actually, you know, while

529
00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:39,199
Speaker 1: we're talking about the social safety net, job security, like

530
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 1: that's something else that comes to mind, because you know,

531
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,400
Speaker 1: we were just talking about creative destruction, how job security,

532
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,160
Speaker 1: how it's not guaranteed in a capitalist economy. That might

533
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 1: definitely be seen as a major downside to capitalism. But

534
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:52,440
Speaker 1: do we really want a government to prop up companies,

535
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 1: let alone you know, entire industries that aren't succeeding. I'm

536
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,200
Speaker 1: sure a lot of folks would say no, like, that's

537
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,239
Speaker 1: not what we need, And unfortunately that means individuals are

538
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,640
Speaker 1: going to lose jobs in the moment. But I think

539
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 1: that the responsibility lies with us as individuals plus our generation.

540
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:08,640
Speaker 1: You know, like we've also learned that the best way

541
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:11,760
Speaker 1: to actually earn more is by switching companies, getting a

542
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 1: new job. And so do you really want the you know,

543
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:17,119
Speaker 1: like the soul crushing monotony of working for the same company,

544
00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: doing the same thing for thirty years in an industry

545
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,040
Speaker 1: that's you know, kind of fading away. I'd be like

546
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: us continue to podcast when nobody listens to podcast any

547
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 1: more years from ti, Like, what's what's the point? Uh? Like,

548
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 1: some folks might want to you know, like, some folks

549
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: might like that consistency, and that's totally fine. Folks might

550
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 1: not want to change, but there's also a room for

551
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,479
Speaker 1: more individual advancement because of capitalism and the options that

552
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 1: people actually have. Yeah, man, I feel like that's really true.

553
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:44,320
Speaker 1: And I feel like, yeah, we've tried to give some

554
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 1: cons and talk about the downside of capitalism, but we

555
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,359
Speaker 1: have destruction that capitalism is causing. It's actually good like

556
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 1: the long run. So it's it's I mean, it's it's

557
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 1: almost like a picture of bush or a tree getting pruned.

558
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, it hurts in the moment, like it's

559
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 1: not a good thing. It's not something that the tree

560
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 1: likes or the plan enjoys. But in the end, if

561
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 1: that means this tree is going to be healthier, if

562
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:05,679
Speaker 1: it means that this vegetable plant is going to have

563
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 1: bear more fruit because of you know, in a way

564
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 1: we can kind of call it discipline, that's being you know,

565
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 1: provided to this organism. That's how we see creative distruction exactly.

566
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: And so yeah, and our attempts to denigrate capitalism, I

567
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,679
Speaker 1: think still I said good things about it, but we

568
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,359
Speaker 1: have some more reasons that we actually think capitalism is

569
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:27,440
Speaker 1: a great thing. And um, we will unapologetically tell you

570
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 1: what those reasons are and we'll get to them right

571
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:41,160
Speaker 1: after this break, dude. So it totally feels like we're

572
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,159
Speaker 1: just making out with capitalism, like Matt and Joel, they

573
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,439
Speaker 1: just love capitalism, and again we want to reinforce that

574
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,359
Speaker 1: we don't think it's perfect. There are there are some

575
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 1: shortcomings that it has. I can see it's releasing some

576
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: shirts that are like I love capitalism or something like that. Um,

577
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 1: I don't know if I'll go that far. I don't

578
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: know if I would even wear that, Like, I don't

579
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,639
Speaker 1: because it's just I don't know, Like there's a difference

580
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 1: between em bray seen something and saying that this is

581
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 1: the best thing ever, as opposed to giving it like

582
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,239
Speaker 1: the tip of the cap, like it's something that we

583
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,440
Speaker 1: are grateful for and it's something that we're most everybody

584
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:13,399
Speaker 1: listening to this is benefited and is currently partaking in

585
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 1: the capitalist system. But obviously there are some unintended consequences. Uh.

586
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: And those I mean because of that, I think we

587
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 1: try to avoid talking about capitalism in our you know,

588
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 1: within our culture. But that being said, let's go ahead

589
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: and dig into it. Maybe a few more reasons that

590
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 1: we feel that capitalism has been so successful. Uh. And

591
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: I wanted to mention how the economist Tyler Cowen he

592
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 1: he calls the U S a nation of weirdos. Uh.

593
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 1: And I mentioned that because, like many other countries, have

594
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:45,360
Speaker 1: more of a reticence towards innovation. Specifically why that is

595
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: that's tough to answer. But the way in which our

596
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 1: country was founded alongside you know, the melting pot of

597
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 1: talented humans, it's just created such a diversity of thought

598
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 1: and talent and that has all led to extraordinary innovation

599
00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: here in the US. Uh. You know, like we prize

600
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 1: this unique individuality. Uh. And it's you know, it's great

601
00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: for the most part, but you know that sometimes gets

602
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: out of hand. I'm thinking about how oftentimes celebrities they

603
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: get idolized, um, and the wealthy they get way more

604
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:13,760
Speaker 1: attention than they probably should be getting. But one of

605
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: the consequences, you know, is that this lionization also leads

606
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 1: to more risk taking, which ultimately does benefit us all

607
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: But bottom line, the US, it's always been known as

608
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 1: the land of opportunity, and it's no wonder that nearly

609
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 1: fifty million immigrants actually live here. Yes, I agree, So

610
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 1: I think I think that how welcome you we are

611
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 1: to immigrants and how they have people from all over

612
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 1: the world have been able to prosper because just under

613
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: this system has been is something worth holding up as

614
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,200
Speaker 1: like one of the reasons that capitalism is so great.

615
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 1: Another reason, Matt, you mentioned this earlier. You hinted at this,

616
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: the self cleansing nature of capitalism, and I think it's

617
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 1: like the best part of capitalism. Yeah, it's great, it

618
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,440
Speaker 1: really is. And it's one of those things that in

619
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 1: the moment, like you said, can be painful for certain

620
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 1: companies or for certain people who work in a specific sector.

621
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 1: But yeah, did you know one at one point that

622
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 1: my Space was considered to monopoly. I think that tells

623
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 1: you all you need to know about like how capitalism works,

624
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 1: because I bet a lot of our listeners like, huh,

625
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 1: what's my space? If you don't remember Tom from my Space,

626
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 1: Like you're not doing it right, okay, like Matt and

627
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,000
Speaker 1: I we had or you're just you're younger than this

628
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: because we're geriatric millennium. We journaled on zanga dot com

629
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 1: back in the day. I bet most of our listeners

630
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 1: don't remember that site either spell it with an X

631
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: and so yeah, these are these are companies that for

632
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,520
Speaker 1: a while they had their moment in the sun, and

633
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 1: today they either don't exist or nobody knows that they exist.

634
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: Apple was the fifty six largest company today there number one,

635
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: and so yeah, are they gonna be there for forever?

636
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: I wouldn't bet on it, Like just like I wouldn't

637
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 1: have bet on my Space being number one for forever.

638
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: At the time, Amazon was the largest business in today

639
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:55,360
Speaker 1: their number four, and yeah, I wouldn't bet on them

640
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: being the top dog for decades to come either, although

641
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 1: right now in the current moment, it feels like they

642
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 1: will be. But yeah, a free market where we as

643
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 1: consumers have the option to vote with our time and

644
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 1: our money, it dictates the businesses that make the cut,

645
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 1: and and those businesses that make the cut, it's just

646
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 1: ever evolving and changing list. It's not always the same

647
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,880
Speaker 1: companies that continue to thrive year after year. Let's right, Yeah, capitalism,

648
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 1: it's that refiner's fireman and so on the other side

649
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 1: of the coin, Toys r US they spent twenty four

650
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: years on the fortunate uh, and then they filed for

651
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 1: bankruptcy a few years ago. Why well, largely because of

652
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 1: Amazon and the changing landscape for buying toys. The most

653
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 1: powerful companies are not guaranteed their place on top, and

654
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 1: they rarely stay there for that long. They must continue

655
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: to innovate otherwise they die, and that makes room for

656
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 1: just these smaller, more nimble companies with better ideas, who

657
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 1: can implement those ideas in ways that we feel are

658
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: going to make the market even better. Economist Thomas sol

659
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 1: said that capitalism, actually it might be more actually be

660
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: described as consumerism and not consumerism in the way that

661
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: we traditionally talked about it here on the show, and

662
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: that's because it's consumers who call the tune and capitalists

663
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 1: are the one who have to learn to dance to it.

664
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: When you think about it that way, I feel like

665
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 1: that we've got way more power within the system than

666
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 1: we normally assume that we do. That's a good point.

667
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 1: I think sometimes we feel like it's our capitalist overlord

668
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: to determine everything that's going to happen in this society,

669
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 1: when really it's up to us as individuals too we

670
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,560
Speaker 1: determine whether those businesses fail or succeed. We have way

671
00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 1: more free will and options than we realize. Yeah, and

672
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 1: that brings us to another great aspect of capitalism is

673
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 1: that it decentralizes power. So when we view it through

674
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 1: the lens that you were just talking about, Matt, it

675
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 1: really does appear that capitalism is truly the most democratic

676
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 1: economic system that exists. It's not one dictator or government

677
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: officials a small group of elites in Washington, d C.

678
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 1: Calling the shots. And it's not even the companies who

679
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 1: are deciding what's best for us and we just have

680
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 1: to take it. It's us as individuals who are making

681
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: decisions for what is best for us for our families.

682
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,520
Speaker 1: The market really knows better than the smartest folks out there,

683
00:32:56,600 --> 00:33:00,040
Speaker 1: even the conglomeration of those folks. And yeah, when I

684
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 1: think of products or institutions that I'm the most frustrated with,

685
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: oftentimes it can be when the government is involved. So

686
00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 1: true DMV getting a built building permit, it took me

687
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: three months to get permits for my and I had

688
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: to go through an almost six month long process just

689
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: to get plans approved. And I'm not saying that those

690
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 1: aspects of government aren't needed at all, although I will

691
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: say it was over the top and there was no

692
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,640
Speaker 1: need for the extended time frame that it took me

693
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: to have a really small change to my home approved,

694
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 1: especially when I was following the existing line of the

695
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: house the way it was built and constructed. But but

696
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 1: it is interesting how we are often served better by

697
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 1: the companies we choose to do business with rather than

698
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 1: the government who we are sometimes forced to do business

699
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:44,959
Speaker 1: with by no choice of our own. Yeah, you're not

700
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: thinking about the great customer experience that you had with

701
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: the I R S when it comes to tax season,

702
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: that's right. I mean, how many millions and millions of

703
00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 1: tax tax returns to tax? Yes, have they still yet

704
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: to you know, there's still refunds due to millions of

705
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 1: people that that have not received them. And you know,

706
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: obviously pandemic. We're gonna give them a little bit of

707
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 1: grace and short staff. But at the same time, like

708
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 1: it's just it's it's worth pointing out those inconsistencies. Absolutely,

709
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:12,439
Speaker 1: it seems that these are all areas where some privatization

710
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:14,840
Speaker 1: could definitely help. And yeah, in the end, we we

711
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: feel that markets are the best system for defining value. Uh.

712
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 1: You you know, you can't make a profit, you can't

713
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:22,759
Speaker 1: increase your profits without adding to the value that you're

714
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 1: injecting out into the world. And another thing to capitalism,

715
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:27,920
Speaker 1: it's not the zero sum game. The more people who

716
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 1: find purpose in creating value, the more that we are

717
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: all going to benefit. There are entire industries that are

718
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:36,319
Speaker 1: going to exist in ten years that we're not even

719
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 1: aware of now, and those wallby industries in areas and

720
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 1: companies who we are giving our money to, or think

721
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 1: about the guy we want to give our money to,

722
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 1: right and think about the guy who created wordle on

723
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:47,399
Speaker 1: a whim and he sold it to the New York

724
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 1: Times for more than a million dollars. Yeah, that's all well, yeah,

725
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 1: that's what we know. That's all seven figures. But just

726
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 1: think that, like, he created something in his spare time

727
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,239
Speaker 1: and somehow it's worth that much money. And that was

728
00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:58,880
Speaker 1: something that the New York Times didn't know that they

729
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 1: needed to add to their arsenal a word games, and

730
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,600
Speaker 1: that was something that the world didn't know that they wanted.

731
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 1: But that's the beauty of kind of ingenuity and capitalism,

732
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,319
Speaker 1: how that can be brought to the masses through just

733
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:13,040
Speaker 1: the general act of creating something and trying to add

734
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: value to the world. And I think, really you just

735
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: kind of can't argue with the results that capitalism has created. Like, um,

736
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:23,320
Speaker 1: it's raised the standard of living for hundreds of millions

737
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,839
Speaker 1: of people, for billions of people around the world, and

738
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:28,439
Speaker 1: countries that are more recent converts. Let's say, we've seen

739
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,440
Speaker 1: substantial changes in very little time to the standard of

740
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 1: living of everyday folks. Makes me think of, like Matt,

741
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 1: when I went to Thailand, uh like five or six

742
00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 1: years ago. It was astounding to see like how well

743
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 1: their economy was doing, how well ordinary individuals were worth

744
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 1: thriving inside of that economy as they're like kind of

745
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 1: really beginning a ramp up into a more free, free

746
00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: market economy. And what I had heard before I went

747
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 1: there from people that had gone decades before, was that

748
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,200
Speaker 1: there was so much poverty. And it's not that there

749
00:35:57,239 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 1: wasn't any, but I saw not nearly as much as

750
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: I expect did, And I feel like so much of

751
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 1: the progress has to be attributed to what's happened with

752
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 1: just their economic system and be more open to capitalism

753
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:10,319
Speaker 1: in general. That's right, dude. You know, I kind of

754
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 1: mentioned this earlier because this episode it doesn't have a

755
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 1: clear takeaway. You know, this isn't seven Ways to Save

756
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,040
Speaker 1: Money this week. It's not that kind of episode. But

757
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:19,680
Speaker 1: even still, we hope that we've been able to just

758
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 1: put capitalism in a different light. You know, we think

759
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:25,080
Speaker 1: it's important to consider all the different angles to this

760
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: economic system that we're a part of. We hope that

761
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:28,919
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel like we've just been kind of hitting

762
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,879
Speaker 1: you over the head with with the textbook of capitalism,

763
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:35,319
Speaker 1: but we do. We we we did want to talk

764
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,520
Speaker 1: about the benefits that we have all received from capitalism.

765
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,239
Speaker 1: But ultimately it's sort of like when we're talking about

766
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: how there's always like those there's always gonna be some

767
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 1: some bad apples in the basket, right, They're always gonna

768
00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 1: be individuals who make it seem like the system that

769
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 1: we are currently in isn't working out. But ultimately we

770
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:53,000
Speaker 1: feel that it does come down to the individual and

771
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 1: the choices that you make and the things that you

772
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 1: pursue and how it is that you spend your time

773
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 1: your money. Uh. And so while you know this is

774
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 1: one of these episodes we're zooming out, we're looking at

775
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 1: sort of this larger pool of water that we're all

776
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:05,920
Speaker 1: swimming in, or really it's not even a pool. I mean,

777
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:09,120
Speaker 1: it's like an ocean. We're talking about our country's economy.

778
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:11,399
Speaker 1: Even still, we feel that so much of our own

779
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: individual outcomes come down to what we do as individuals. Yeah, man,

780
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: I think we can rail against the system. We can

781
00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 1: rage against the machine, or we can kind of say,

782
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: all right, this is this is the reality we live

783
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:23,879
Speaker 1: in this free market society. How do I, as someone

784
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:26,719
Speaker 1: who has these gifts, participate in this market economy in

785
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 1: a way that provides value? And I think when you

786
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 1: think about it like that, it might actually completely change

787
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 1: the way you view your job or your desire to

788
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 1: start your own business, because you're like, you know what,

789
00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 1: if I can provide value in this way, I can

790
00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: serve a lot of people and at the same time

791
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: make a living for for my family. Um, that is

792
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 1: the beauty of this system is that that there is

793
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,279
Speaker 1: boundless opportunity. You can create the opportunity and there's a

794
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: lot of room to run in the capitalist system for

795
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: anybody who wants to serve their fellow human And the

796
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: great thing is it can make you a living as well. So, um,

797
00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 1: that that's kind of how we view capitalism. And uh,

798
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 1: we hope you stuck around to the end and learned

799
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,279
Speaker 1: a lot during this episode because we're just kind of

800
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,040
Speaker 1: we're just kind of nerdy dudes too, and we we

801
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 1: like thinking about this stuff. So, and that being said,

802
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 1: if you completely disagree with us. We would love to

803
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: hear from you, and maybe you know, on the subsequent

804
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 1: Friday Flight episode here in a couple of days, maybe

805
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,440
Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit more about it. If you

806
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 1: have a different opinion. If that's you, definitely reach out

807
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 1: to us, shoot us an email at how the Money

808
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:25,879
Speaker 1: Pod at gmail dot com. That's right. We always love

809
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 1: hearing from our listeners. All right, let's get back fellow

810
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,640
Speaker 1: the nerds who might happen to have a different perspective.

811
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: That's right and well and all right, so we're gonna

812
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:33,799
Speaker 1: get back to the craft beer that we had on

813
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 1: this episode. But you and I talked before this we

814
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: started recording this episode, and we said, man, isn't it

815
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 1: crazy that the United States has It's not that there

816
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 1: aren't great beers in other parts of the world. There

817
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: certainly are. But we have per capita like more great

818
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,920
Speaker 1: beer than any other nation in the world. And if

819
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 1: the United States were was a communist country, what kind

820
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 1: of beer would we have? Not we definitely would not

821
00:38:57,160 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 1: be drinking this beautiful barrel aged barley. Oh my gosh.

822
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 1: We we definitely wouldn't have the variety that we have here.

823
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:06,160
Speaker 1: And we're certainly lucky to have this beer again. This

824
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:09,279
Speaker 1: is a bourbon barrel brick kiln by Jackie O's What

825
00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:11,440
Speaker 1: were your thoughts on this one? Okay, so this again

826
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: one of my favorite breweries, and this is a top

827
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 1: notch beer and and it might be I would say,

828
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: adventures say it's maybe the best barley wine I've ever had,

829
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:23,080
Speaker 1: at least top three. This is a really really good beer,

830
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: and barley wines are. The problem with that with me

831
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:27,360
Speaker 1: is that I don't drink barley win is enough to

832
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,919
Speaker 1: like even like really remember like what the top barley

833
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:32,800
Speaker 1: Wins I've had are. I remember one of the Goose

834
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: Island annual releases. It was legit that was probably not

835
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 1: the year that they screwed him or something like that.

836
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:40,600
Speaker 1: That was a long time ago. But this one was

837
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,479
Speaker 1: a little sweet. It was slightly boozy. Had had some oak,

838
00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:46,520
Speaker 1: some vanilla and some raisin notes called on dude raisin

839
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,759
Speaker 1: all the way like dried, yeah, just dried fruit like

840
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:53,279
Speaker 1: that with some nice creamy notes tongue at the same time.

841
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,359
Speaker 1: And it was it was delicious. You know. Actually, when

842
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:57,839
Speaker 1: I think, uh, one of our favorite local breweries Monday

843
00:39:57,920 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: Night they back in the day, they had this beer

844
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 1: called uh speaking of the economy and whatnot, that was

845
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 1: called Las Fair And if they still had that beer,

846
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 1: maybe instead of a Force for Good, which we had recently,

847
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: maybe we should have had Las Fair on. But I

848
00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:14,440
Speaker 1: think that's fair that they that they retired. I think

849
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 1: it was if I remember correctly, I think it was

850
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:19,440
Speaker 1: a barley wine that they aged in red wine barrels.

851
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: But anyway, it sounds tasty. I mean, I don't know

852
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,240
Speaker 1: why I'm talking about it. I can't buy it anymore.

853
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:26,520
Speaker 1: It's not a beer that they make. But I completely agree.

854
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 1: As I thought about how to describe this beer, obviously

855
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:32,000
Speaker 1: all the notes that you mentioned, but Fatty stood out

856
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 1: to me as well. It felt like it was just

857
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 1: like this decadent. It was like, I don't know, like

858
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 1: if you even a nice piece of toast and maybe

859
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 1: just like a touch, like like you're just putting the

860
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,279
Speaker 1: butter on thick, you know, and you're eating and just

861
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:45,680
Speaker 1: like this is like luxurious. That's what I was thinking

862
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 1: as I was rinking this. It. I don't know, it

863
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 1: just had like this depth. It had this umm, a

864
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 1: velvety sort of oh my gosh, totally yeah, and not

865
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 1: just completely in the texture, but just in the flavors

866
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,160
Speaker 1: and how it all came together. It actually kind of

867
00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:59,080
Speaker 1: reminded me of a Belgian quad as well, because of

868
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:01,279
Speaker 1: like the you know, like the raising kind of fig

869
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:03,480
Speaker 1: flavors going on, but it didn't have that Belgian funky

870
00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:07,200
Speaker 1: yeast flavors going on. It's almost like an American quad.

871
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:09,720
Speaker 1: If that exists. I don't think it does, but I'm

872
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:12,520
Speaker 1: certainly glad that you and I got to enjoy this beer. Again.

873
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:15,120
Speaker 1: This is by Jackie Ohs. And if you ever come

874
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: across their beers, I don't think you'll be disappointed. Pick

875
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,680
Speaker 1: one up, yes, pick one up, or three or five

876
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,319
Speaker 1: like there, they make really good beers. So all right, mat,

877
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for this episode. For listeners who

878
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:26,120
Speaker 1: want show notes for this episode, go to our website

879
00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:28,239
Speaker 1: at how to money dot com. And again, please do

880
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:30,719
Speaker 1: send us an email if you have a counterpoint, we'd

881
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:32,120
Speaker 1: love to hear it from you. Seriously. How do I

882
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:34,600
Speaker 1: pod at gmail dot com? All right, man, So that

883
00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 1: is going to be it for this episode until next time.

884
00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 1: Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out.