1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,920 Speaker 1: Hey everybody. Max Chafkin here just wanted to let you 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: know you're gonna hear another episode of Everybody's Business, our 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:10,520 Speaker 1: new podcast from Bloomberg Business Week. Now, Everybody's Business has 4 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: been appearing in the elon inkfeed but exciting times. Today's 5 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: the day it gets its own feed. So go on 6 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 1: your podcast app, type in Everybody's Business and subscribe, and 7 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: we'd really appreciate that. You'll hear a couple more episodes 8 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: of Everybody's Business over the next couple of weeks. But 9 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: you're gonna need to go over there if you want 10 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 1: to keep hearing this show. For now here it. 11 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 2: Is Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. 12 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 1: It's Everybody's Business from Bloomberg BusinessWeek. 13 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:48,800 Speaker 3: I'm Max Chaffin and I'm Stacy Vanicksmith. 14 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: Hey Stacy, Hey Max. 15 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 3: This is a special day. It's our first shows show. 16 00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: It's a holy day, is Stacy the first official episode 17 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: of a new podcast from Bloomberg Business Week, where we 18 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:04,840 Speaker 1: break down the news of the week. We bring in 19 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:07,960 Speaker 1: some of the smartest journalists we know from the extended 20 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: Bloomberg universe. The writers and reporters and editors from Bloomberg BusinessWeek, 21 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:14,959 Speaker 1: and sort of chew over what happened, what matters, and 22 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: what's coming next. 23 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:19,199 Speaker 3: In today's show, our first show is all about beginnings, 24 00:01:19,640 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 3: our brave new world or brave new economy, actually things 25 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 3: like tariffs. Those are still pretty new and changing by 26 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 3: the hour, but have not been showing up in prices. 27 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: Not yet showing up in prizes. And we have Amanda 28 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: mal BusinessWeek columnists consumer spending expert to talk that over. 29 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 1: To mull that over if you will, Stacy, you and Amanda, 30 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 1: you went on a field trip without me? We did okay? 31 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,680 Speaker 1: And then the NBA playoffs are heating up, and there 32 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 1: is a new sports owner in town, an owner that 33 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:55,919 Speaker 1: I think most fans are going to be really excited about. 34 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: I'm talking, of course, about the private equity bro They 35 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: are buying up teams, valuations are going up. And we 36 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 1: have Randall Williams, BusinessWeek columnist and sports reporter coming in 37 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 1: to talk to us all about that. 38 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 3: Who does not love private equity. And finally we have 39 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 3: our underrated story of the week, in this case a 40 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 3: new kind of sporting equipment that might be breaking some 41 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 3: pretty important rules. Max, I'm going to tell you this 42 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:21,240 Speaker 3: one gets personal for you. 43 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 1: I can't wait. Okay, But of course this show is 44 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: called Everybody's Business, and we take the everybody very serious. 45 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 3: We do take it seriously and we want to make 46 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,040 Speaker 3: sure that there is something in the show for everybody. 47 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 3: But Max, you and I have both been covering the 48 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:40,519 Speaker 3: world of business and economics for a very long time, 49 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 3: and it can be a little bit of a bubble, 50 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 3: can be hard to know, like what normal people find interesting. 51 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 1: Are saying that we're not normal ever. 52 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,359 Speaker 3: So slightly siloed is all I'm saying. So we wanted 53 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 3: to see what other people who don't spend all their 54 00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 3: time looking at this stuff want to know about. 55 00:02:58,080 --> 00:02:59,920 Speaker 1: Well, this is my favorite part of the show because 56 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,920 Speaker 1: we're in New York. Obviously, people from all over the 57 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: world are here, and you, Stacy Vanicksmith, are like very 58 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:08,800 Speaker 1: good at going out and talking to those people in 59 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 1: the world. 60 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 3: Yes, I am getting very good at going up to 61 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,400 Speaker 3: people and saying, have you heard the good news? You 62 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:18,359 Speaker 3: can be on a podcast. So to get the voice 63 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 3: of the people, I went to the beating heart of 64 00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 3: New York City, of New York City Times Square to 65 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 3: ask people, what are the business and economic stories that 66 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 3: you want to hear? 67 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 4: About I mean, AI, for sure, everybody wants to know 68 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 4: more about that. We all just graduated college, so it's 69 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 4: like keeping up with the different economic policies that will 70 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 4: affect us as like young investors. 71 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: Obviously, the price of eggs. 72 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 3: Really, you're a big egg watcher? 73 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:48,240 Speaker 1: Yes, I work at a boutique grocery store where, like 74 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: I'm not joking, a box of a dozen eggs is 75 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: like ten twelve dollars. Everyone's talking about Terris. 76 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:58,240 Speaker 2: I work at a small consulting firm, and I worry 77 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 2: about how that's going to affect like my job, you 78 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 2: know what I mean. I'm just glued to the gossip 79 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:04,960 Speaker 2: of the markets. 80 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 3: Are you a markets watcher. 81 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 2: In times of crisis? Yes? 82 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 3: Would you guys listen to a new business podcast? 83 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: I would? 84 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, what about you guys. 85 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:15,839 Speaker 4: I'm not a big podcast person, but if I were 86 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 4: to listen to a podcast, thank you? 87 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 1: Sure? Am I going to be on the podcast? 88 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 4: Yes? 89 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:21,839 Speaker 3: Is that okay? Did you get good sound bites on 90 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 3: my good Yeah? I got great sound bites. 91 00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:25,160 Speaker 2: I wish say you that I would have sounded better. 92 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 1: Wow, people have spoken. So we're worried about eggs. We're 93 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: worried about consulting rates. 94 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 3: I think jobs, I think people are worried about their jobs. 95 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 1: Well, that's fair. We're going to do this every week, 96 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:41,840 Speaker 1: not always questions about what should be on the podcast, 97 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: but we do want to hear from you listeners about 98 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,000 Speaker 1: what you want us to talk about and what you're 99 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:50,040 Speaker 1: seeing in the economy. You should send us an email. 100 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:53,359 Speaker 1: Everybody's at Bloomberg dot net. That's everybody's with an s 101 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:55,640 Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot net. We're going to repeat that email 102 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 1: address over and over again many times until you actually 103 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: send us some email. So aready all right, Stacy. The 104 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: big kind of business news earlier this week, it was 105 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 1: good news. It was that inflation, which everybody had been 106 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: really worried about, with you know, Trump's high tariffs and 107 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: the erratic nature of the tariffs. It actually wasn't that bad. 108 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: It was two point three percent. I think that was 109 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,480 Speaker 1: the lowest level that we've seen since twenty twenty one. 110 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: You know, that was before we had the post pandemic spike. 111 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: Trump also backed down on his China tariffs, announcing a 112 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: ninety day pause. It's going down to thirty percent from 113 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: one hundred and forty five percent, So this is good right. 114 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 1: I mean basically those eggs that we heard about in 115 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,720 Speaker 1: the UH eggs they're gonna cost less now, I think, 116 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 1: and consultants will be able to flourish, and those those 117 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 1: graduates will all get to Everything is great. 118 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,599 Speaker 3: I mean I have to say, I really expected to 119 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 3: see the consumer price index, that's the inflation index go 120 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 3: up a lot, because Trump's tariffs have been in effect 121 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 3: for a couple months now, so we should be starting 122 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 3: to see them. But you're the numbers just didn't show that, 123 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 3: and the markets have been on this happy tear. 124 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: And we should just say for anyone who hasn't followed 125 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,200 Speaker 1: this as closely as us, the reason we expected, yeah, 126 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: which is everyone. The reason we expected prices to go 127 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,839 Speaker 1: up is because a tariff is essentially a tax on 128 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:18,880 Speaker 1: a consumer good. You know, it costs more money to 129 00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 1: bring some item, you know, an article of clothing, a toy, whatever, 130 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:26,919 Speaker 1: into the United States, and somebody has to pay for 131 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: that cost, whether it's a company, and ultimately consumers are 132 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 1: going to pay. And that's why we wanted to talk 133 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,919 Speaker 1: to Amanda Mull because this is what she does. She 134 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:40,159 Speaker 1: writes about consumer behavior and retail businesses and kind of 135 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: all the ways that affects culture. Amanda's here now, how 136 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: you doing. 137 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:45,719 Speaker 4: I'm doing great, Thanks for having me. 138 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 3: We're very excited to have you on our first episode. 139 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,200 Speaker 3: And you just wrote this article called Trump's tariffs are 140 00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:54,360 Speaker 3: going to ruin Christmas, and it is all about tariffs 141 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 3: and prices. So, just to start out very simply, looking 142 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 3: at the data this week, inflation numbers looking really good. 143 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 3: What's going on? Why are the tariffs not showing up? 144 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,320 Speaker 4: The most important thing to remember in trying to understand 145 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:12,560 Speaker 4: all of this is that, like our experience of the 146 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 4: economy as sort of like end consumers, is a lagging 147 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 4: indicator of what is going on in the economy. 148 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:21,240 Speaker 3: Lagging mean like it doesn't show up until after it's 149 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 3: already happened. 150 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:26,239 Speaker 4: Our experience will change after months of many other things 151 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 4: going into effect that will eventually affect us. The process 152 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 4: of getting goods onto the shelves is like a months 153 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:34,280 Speaker 4: long and sometimes years long process, depending on what the 154 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 4: product is. So a lot of the stuff that's on 155 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:40,280 Speaker 4: shelves right now was imported in warehouse before any tariffs 156 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 4: went into effect, So we still have like a lot 157 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 4: of goods in the system that would have been tariff 158 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 4: affected if they had been imported a little bit later, 159 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 4: but they weren't. And then you also get this behavior 160 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 4: from retailers in brands that are like looking at projections 161 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 4: for what happens once some level of tariff goes into effect, 162 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,120 Speaker 4: and they're saying, Okay, we need cash on hand, and 163 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 4: we need to move inventory now. We need to front 164 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 4: load a lot of this consumer spending because consumers are worried, 165 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 4: and a lot of them have their wallets open right 166 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 4: now for purchases that they might have otherwise made in 167 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 4: six months or in a year or at the end 168 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 4: of the summer. So you've got retailers going, hey, we 169 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 4: know you're worried about tariffs. We have brought in a 170 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 4: lot of extra inventory, and we know that you want 171 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:22,280 Speaker 4: to buy right now. So here's fifteen percent off, or 172 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 4: here's buy one, get one fifty percent off. So you 173 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 4: have all of these behaviors that are happening right now 174 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 4: with this pre tariff merchandise. That is keeping prices stable 175 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 4: and that is encouraging people to buy at a pretty 176 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 4: pretty steady rate. But what like Goldman Analysts said in 177 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 4: a note to clients about this CPI reading is that 178 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,679 Speaker 4: we're not done with this, like probably next month and 179 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 4: maybe in the months to come after. That is where 180 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:48,320 Speaker 4: we're going to see a lot of these pricing variations 181 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:50,599 Speaker 4: start to bubble up, because that's when you're going to 182 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 4: get goods in the system that are more tariff affected. 183 00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 4: I've seen a lot of anecdotal evidence that a lot 184 00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 4: of customs processors and a lot of shippers don't know 185 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:03,319 Speaker 4: what they's supposed to be charging interiors. Yeah, people are 186 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:04,040 Speaker 4: very confused. 187 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 1: So what you're saying basically is boats move slowly, Like, yes, 188 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:10,599 Speaker 1: you know, a lot of this stuff comes on a 189 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: giant container and those container ships take weeks to get here. 190 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 1: And not just that, but a lot of the goods 191 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:19,960 Speaker 1: that are being brought on those container ships contain other 192 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: items that also arrive on container ships. This just takes 193 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: a long time. And a lot of companies like Apple, right, 194 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: they just like frantically imported as much of their stuff 195 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 1: as they. 196 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:34,720 Speaker 3: Could because like six hundred tons or something and iPhone. 197 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 1: Trump made this very easy for them, and maybe even deliberately, 198 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: right he put the date on the calendar Liberation Day, 199 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 1: so we all know got to get as much, you know, 200 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 1: stuff ahead of Liberation Day. It seems like that kind 201 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 1: of happened, right absolutely. 202 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 4: I talked to a consumer industry expert from EY who 203 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:53,480 Speaker 4: said that of the businesses that he has sort of 204 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:55,680 Speaker 4: been observing and the ones you know that are in 205 00:09:55,720 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 4: their client base, he saw retailers and brands bringing in 206 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 4: on average about ninety days of excess inventory, and to 207 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:04,960 Speaker 4: the point where you could look around the freight industry 208 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:07,200 Speaker 4: and the logistics industry in the US and see like 209 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 4: warehouses filling up, and like warehouse space being sort of 210 00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 4: at a premium, especially near ports. Companies that had the 211 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 4: cash on hand to bring in extra stuff really did 212 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 4: just frontload as much as they could. 213 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 3: So tariffs haven't really shown up yet, but they're definitely 214 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:22,839 Speaker 3: going to show up. And so Max, I don't know 215 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 3: if you know this, but Amanda and I live pretty 216 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,959 Speaker 3: close to each other in Brooklyn, and we live pretty 217 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:31,079 Speaker 3: close to a Target, which is basically Amanda's church as 218 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 3: a consumer reporter, so she agreed to meet me there 219 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:38,839 Speaker 3: and take me on a little Target tariff tour. 220 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,199 Speaker 4: We're looking at a rather large TV. It's a sixty 221 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:44,440 Speaker 4: five inch Broku TV two fifty. When I worked in 222 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 4: Best Buy from like two thousand and four to two 223 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 4: thousand and eight, flat panel TVs were still several thousand dollars. 224 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:53,559 Speaker 4: We would put one on sale for like one thousand bucks, 225 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:55,160 Speaker 4: and you know, people would line up for that stuff. 226 00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 4: But they've come down in price a ton in the past, 227 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 4: like fifteen years. The ultra inexpensive two hundred and fifty 228 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 4: dollars sixty five inch TV that you can take home 229 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 4: today from Target is a product, ultimately of what a 230 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:12,840 Speaker 4: globalized manufacturing chain produces for wealthy consumers. 231 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 3: And what happens to our flat screen TVs in a. 232 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:21,840 Speaker 4: Tariffed world, Like everything, they get a lot more expensive. 233 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 4: This is the type of manufacturing that is really hard 234 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:28,920 Speaker 4: to reproduce in new places because it is a very 235 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 4: delicate process. It requires a lot of specialized machinery and 236 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 4: you need like a ton of workers that you can 237 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:38,200 Speaker 4: pay not that much money in order to pull this 238 00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 4: off at these prices. 239 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,319 Speaker 3: All right, shall we go to produce? 240 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's good. 241 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:45,320 Speaker 3: And why have you brought us here? 242 00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 2: We're looking at pineapples. 243 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:51,439 Speaker 4: Let me see, it's a del Monte pineapple. They are 244 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 4: three bucks for big and heavy. Pineapple is getting this 245 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 4: from Costa Rica, and you can buy it like fresh 246 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:00,839 Speaker 4: off the shelf. Three Bucks is like. 247 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 3: In Target a miracle. So what is going to happen 248 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:06,280 Speaker 3: to this section of the store with tariffs? 249 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:10,920 Speaker 4: Fresh produce supply chains rely on a cold storage and 250 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 4: cold chain and a lot of elements of global shipping 251 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:17,959 Speaker 4: that are set to become more expensive. We get a 252 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:20,839 Speaker 4: lot of our fruit from Central and South America. If 253 00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:23,800 Speaker 4: you want pineapple, if you want mangoes, then tariffs are 254 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 4: going to make a lot of those things, if a 255 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 4: lot more expensive, especially out of season. Like, I don't 256 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 4: know if they're going to be like affordable to somebody 257 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 4: that's like trying to figure out their grocery budget. 258 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 3: You like, these might not be in Target next year. 259 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 4: No, the apples probably will be, but like, I don't 260 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 4: know if we're gonna have mangoes. 261 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 1: I have joked to my wife many times that when 262 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,720 Speaker 1: we're all gone and the alien archaeologists find our civilization, 263 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:50,680 Speaker 1: the thing that they are going to be most impressed 264 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: by is this the produce that you can get from 265 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 1: Like the fact that you can like walk into a 266 00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:59,840 Speaker 1: Whole Foods or a Target and buy an exotic fruit 267 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:04,079 Speaker 1: or a freaking ostrich egg or whatever for almost no money. 268 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 3: It is amazing, like from halfway around the world, and. 269 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 1: It would still be amazing to buy that del Monte 270 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:13,480 Speaker 1: pineapple for four fifty even like still a pineapple that 271 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,320 Speaker 1: made it like you know, a huge distance. But you 272 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 1: do wonder like at what point does that price become 273 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: too much and does the whole system that we've kind 274 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: of created around these cheap goods, like when does it 275 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:29,120 Speaker 1: start to break down? Like how much could people of 276 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: the world really be willing to spend? 277 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,319 Speaker 4: And fresh produce is really tough when you look at 278 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:39,079 Speaker 4: like how little small changes in price could affect availability 279 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,680 Speaker 4: because the margins at every step of the fresh produce 280 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 4: chain are like really really thin, even in grocery, like 281 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:48,439 Speaker 4: grocery as far as retail goes in America is known 282 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 4: to have just like the most razor thin margins. The 283 00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 4: items themselves may not be like super heavily tariffed. A 284 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 4: lot of it comes from Central and South America, which 285 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:01,439 Speaker 4: is less affected by the liber day tariff table then 286 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:03,960 Speaker 4: China would be. But you still end up in a 287 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 4: situation where you need a lot of logistics resources that 288 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 4: are built out to work at scale in moving around 289 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 4: all of these different types of goods from different places. 290 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:15,080 Speaker 4: So if you have like a big drop in imports 291 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,680 Speaker 4: from some places, logistics companies and freight companies and truck 292 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 4: drivers sort of like drop out of the system. They 293 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 4: go elsewhere, they find other types of jobs, warehouses, close trucks, 294 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 4: you know, leave the road. So this is one of 295 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:29,000 Speaker 4: those second third, fourth order effects where it's like, if 296 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 4: you change your logistics system in the country significantly, how 297 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 4: does that affect the moving around like really fragile, really 298 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 4: perishable goods like fresh fruit that comes in from Costa 299 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 4: Rico or from Mexico or from Columbia or wherever. You 300 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 4: start tinkering with little things and then the effects just 301 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 4: reverberate out in ways that are not necessarily like super 302 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:50,960 Speaker 4: easily predictable from where we are today. 303 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 3: So we have some flat screen TVs that are going 304 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 3: to get a lot more expensive pineapples that might not 305 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,880 Speaker 3: be there. But we went to another part of the store. 306 00:14:58,240 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 3: Here we go. 307 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 4: We're in the one of the makeup aisles right now. 308 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:03,080 Speaker 4: You know, if you look at makeup, there's lots of 309 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:05,480 Speaker 4: like fiddly little plastic parts. There's lots of packaging. 310 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:07,600 Speaker 3: Yes, the packaging is like the best part. 311 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 4: Yes, packaging is super important to selling makeup. Packaging is 312 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 4: one of the most overseas concentrated parts of the supply 313 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 4: chain period. Most of it is in China and other 314 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 4: parts of Asia, with some types of packaging, mascaro, whatever else. 315 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 4: Like sometimes the tube will be made in one place, 316 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 4: in the cap to the tube will be made in 317 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 4: another in the brush bristles will be made in another, 318 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 4: and that sort of all comes together to be manufactured 319 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 4: into a saleable product. For instance, this elf mascaren has 320 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:33,400 Speaker 4: a box around it so that it can hang on 321 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 4: a shelf, and then like the group that goes inside 322 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 4: might come from someplace else entirely, and they're all shipped 323 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:40,640 Speaker 4: to these manufacturing facilities that then put the product together. 324 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 3: It's funny because I feel like what you're talking about 325 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 3: is something I always think of when we talk about 326 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 3: like iPhones. It's like, oh, they've components made in forty 327 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 3: four countries, But it actually seems like maybe mascara is 328 00:15:50,560 --> 00:15:51,240 Speaker 3: not different. 329 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 4: Yes, the things we think of as simple are rarely 330 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,360 Speaker 4: simple because we've basically set up the entire global economy 331 00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 4: to ensure that like they're efficient by a certain definition 332 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 4: and cheap, right, so you find, you know, quote unquote 333 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 4: efficiencies that enable you to do all of this across 334 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 4: like a massive geographic space in order to make something 335 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:13,680 Speaker 4: that is ultimately like extremely complex, but much cheaper than 336 00:16:13,680 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 4: it would be if done beginning to end in one place. 337 00:16:17,920 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 3: Okay, so I feel like we should probably pick one 338 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 3: of these up. 339 00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:23,560 Speaker 4: For Max, we brought you a Mascarra oh alf Flash 340 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 4: Extender Mascarra Wow for you. 341 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 1: I just have to ask why this product. 342 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 3: Just a good thing to keep in mind. There's no message. Really, 343 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 3: we're not implying anything. Not really, I'll. 344 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:35,880 Speaker 1: Take it out. 345 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 3: Bet our lash has never hurt anybody. 346 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: No. It is a great time to be a sports 347 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: fan right now. The NBA playoffs are heating up, Baseball 348 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:52,320 Speaker 1: season is in full swing. The WNBA is about to start, 349 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: you know today as this episode drops. On Friday, we're 350 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,760 Speaker 1: gonna have a Knicks playoff game and Mets against Yankees 351 00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 1: going on the same time. I am so excited about it. 352 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: But there's just one thing that could make our sporting 353 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,440 Speaker 1: experience a little bit better, and that would be owners 354 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: who knew how to squeeze efficiencies out of their franchises. 355 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:16,240 Speaker 1: I was just thinking the values a little higher. 356 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, I feel like when when sports fans watch games, 357 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:23,760 Speaker 3: what we're always looking for. 358 00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: More private equity, which is why absolutely we have Randall Williams, 359 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: Bloomberg BusinessWeek sports columnist, friend of the podcast here with 360 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 1: us in the studio. Randall just wrote a column about 361 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,880 Speaker 1: the skyrocketing valuations for sports teams. Randall, how you doing? 362 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 2: I'm doing all right? Thank you all for having me. 363 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 2: I'm excited. 364 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 1: You know this, but many people probably don't. The Boston 365 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:48,640 Speaker 1: Celtics were recently sold for six point one billion dollars. 366 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 1: That's a team that was worth four hundred million, I 367 00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:54,960 Speaker 1: believe according to Forbes in twenty eleven. Who and yeah, 368 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 1: and it goes on and on. The Eagles has. 369 00:17:56,680 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 3: Been to them? That's a big Boston glow up. 370 00:17:58,720 --> 00:17:59,640 Speaker 2: What happened to them? 371 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:02,639 Speaker 1: I mean? And it's not just the Celtics, right, The 372 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:05,120 Speaker 1: Eagles went from being worth one point two billion back 373 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: then to eight point three the Dodgers eight hundred million 374 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,800 Speaker 1: now six point nine billion. Yep, Randall, what's happening here? 375 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: What is causing this? 376 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 2: The media deals are getting bigger for each of these leagues, 377 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:19,160 Speaker 2: and the sports are growing in popularity. The stars are 378 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 2: getting bigger. You just named three different teams where we 379 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:24,920 Speaker 2: could all name a superstar on them. For the Dodgers, 380 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:26,000 Speaker 2: it's show hal time. 381 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,920 Speaker 3: Might be a stretch, you could do it, Jalen Hurt 382 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 3: say yeah yeah. 383 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:34,400 Speaker 2: And with the Celtics Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown of course, 384 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,200 Speaker 2: and overtime that was Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett and 385 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 2: Ray Allen. So the media deals are driving these valuations up, 386 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,200 Speaker 2: and ultimately the cost to run these teams is also 387 00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:44,960 Speaker 2: going up as well. 388 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:47,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, what goes into a team valuation? Like, what does 389 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:49,679 Speaker 3: it mean if a team is worth eight billion dollars? 390 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:51,919 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, it's a market real estate. So 391 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:54,800 Speaker 2: like the stadium, Yes, for sure the stadium. If you 392 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 2: own your own stadium, then that gives you the ability 393 00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 2: to make a lot of revenue from things outside of 394 00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:02,119 Speaker 2: you sports team. So let's use the Boston Celtics as 395 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:04,920 Speaker 2: an example. They get forty one home games a year, 396 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:06,680 Speaker 2: but you know, forty one dates out of three hundred 397 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 2: and sixty five, that's not a lot of opportunity to 398 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,240 Speaker 2: make money. Now, granted, I think it's the Boston Bruins 399 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:13,920 Speaker 2: are also in that stadium, but the Celtics don't own 400 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:16,680 Speaker 2: their own stadium, so as part of the six point 401 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 2: one billion dollar deal, one of the things that NBA owners, 402 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,440 Speaker 2: NBA executives, and business people alike were watching to see 403 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 2: is how much this team would go for because the 404 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 2: NBA is looking to expand now for the expansion people, 405 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:29,880 Speaker 2: they're watching this because like, okay, the Celtics don't own 406 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 2: their stadium, can't go for that much. And then it 407 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 2: goes for six point one billion dollars, which is more 408 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:35,720 Speaker 2: than the Commanders who. 409 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,679 Speaker 1: Bought the Celtics. I mean, it's this guy Bill Chisholm, 410 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 1: co founder of STG Partners. That's a PE firm. But 411 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:43,480 Speaker 1: then there's PE money inside of. 412 00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:45,960 Speaker 3: That, like private equity sorry not physical education. 413 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:48,439 Speaker 2: Yeah. Bill Chisholm is the leading investor. He has a 414 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,200 Speaker 2: billion dollars in six Street money. He has Rob Hale, 415 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 2: he has Bruce A. Beal junior, so his ownership group 416 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 2: is very diverse. He's added some more money since then, 417 00:19:57,160 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 2: but it's a lot of money. 418 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 3: Sixth Street is the private equity firm, correct, okay, and 419 00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:03,960 Speaker 3: the private equity firm bought it, not the guy who 420 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:05,960 Speaker 3: runs it, but the actual private equity firm. 421 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:09,040 Speaker 2: No, No, bil Chisholm is the organizer. Now. The thing with 422 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,359 Speaker 2: private equity firms and sports is that they cannot be 423 00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 2: controlling owners. They are passive investors. Eventually they'll exit and 424 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 2: the exits of these deals is still to be determined. 425 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: What is it in the NBA? Is it ten percent 426 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:22,080 Speaker 1: or twenty percent? Is the limit for private equity? 427 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:24,680 Speaker 2: A single private equity firm can own up to twenty 428 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 2: percent of an NBA franchise. Private equity and totality can 429 00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 2: own thirty percent. So you so ideally you could have 430 00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:34,000 Speaker 2: twenty percent of one firm and then ten percent to 431 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:34,879 Speaker 2: another to get to thirty. 432 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,760 Speaker 1: This strikes me, and forgive my saying this, but this 433 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:41,720 Speaker 1: strikes me as because you have a private equity guy 434 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:45,679 Speaker 1: who is leading the deal. Like these are basically private 435 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 1: equity groups. They're just it's just private equity group made 436 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:51,440 Speaker 1: up of a bunch of little private equity. 437 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 2: Groups in some ways. In some ways, however, the biggest 438 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:56,960 Speaker 2: difference is that you can have your money come from 439 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,760 Speaker 2: private equity, but your firm cannot run the team. That's 440 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 2: the difference. So you could name any private equity person 441 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:05,639 Speaker 2: in the world right now, and that individual could buy it, 442 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:07,120 Speaker 2: but the firm could not, because. 443 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 3: I feel like normally when private equity buys something like 444 00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 3: for a while, private equity owned KFC and stuff, I 445 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:16,679 Speaker 3: feel like they kind of tend to strip things for parts. 446 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 1: Exactly why not be great? 447 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 2: That's why sports leagues don't want private equity firms to 448 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:21,800 Speaker 2: run teams. And there's a lot of fan fear if 449 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 2: you jump in Reddit threads, Fans hate the idea of 450 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 2: this because they think that private equity firms are going 451 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:28,920 Speaker 2: to strip the teams down and be like, you know what, 452 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 2: we're not paying Jalen Hurts, We're not paying Saquon Barkley. 453 00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:34,480 Speaker 2: We're just going to invest in the stadium. In stead, foam. 454 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 3: Fingers are going to get smaller. 455 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:39,880 Speaker 1: They they're definitely making fingers. It does kind of cut 456 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: against what I think most people understand as fandom, right. 457 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:48,560 Speaker 1: You understand teams as being kind of community groups almost, 458 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 1: and then you have these these groups of owners and 459 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: they're buying not just one franchise, they're buying another franchise. 460 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 1: And you might think, oh, it's like the guy who 461 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,320 Speaker 1: owns the baseball team in town is buying the hockey 462 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 1: team in town, or what But no, the group that 463 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,439 Speaker 1: owns the Celtics also owns I think ten percent of 464 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,760 Speaker 1: the Giants, and like that doesn't fit with like how 465 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,960 Speaker 1: a normal fan I think understands the point of a 466 00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 1: sports team or even the point of sports. But I'm wondering, Randall, 467 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 1: are we seeing changes in how these ownership groups manage 468 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 1: their teams? Are they doing the private equity playbook? Are 469 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:22,439 Speaker 1: they making the foam hand smaller? 470 00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 2: It depends on who you are. Yeah, Like I think 471 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,399 Speaker 2: if you look at Josh Harris and the Washington Commanders, 472 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:29,359 Speaker 2: when he bought that team was a total train wreck. 473 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:33,160 Speaker 2: Now since then he's struck a four billion dollars stadium deal. 474 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 2: He has put more money into a quite frankly, a 475 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 2: horrible stadium. And so you have Josh Harris, who comes 476 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 2: from private equity investing all of this money. Now he 477 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:44,520 Speaker 2: has the money to do this, There aren't going to 478 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,160 Speaker 2: be a lot of people who have the same money. 479 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,360 Speaker 2: But if you look at the Celtics deal, for example, 480 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 2: Bill Chisholm has not said anything about a new stadium, 481 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 2: even though he's not making any money from let's say concerts. 482 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 2: If Taylor Swift comes in town or another. 483 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 3: Oh, that's how you can kind of leverage. 484 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:03,360 Speaker 2: Your stadium any money from those things, and so it's 485 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 2: really dependent on how much money you have. Private equity 486 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 2: can come in and help these stadium costs, other real 487 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,639 Speaker 2: estate things, other projects, liquidity things like that. 488 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 1: Randall, let's dig into a little bit around like what 489 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,439 Speaker 1: is driving these valuations. We kind of hit on the 490 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: media deals, so just talk a little bit about what's 491 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:23,359 Speaker 1: behind that. I mean my understanding sports viewership is up 492 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,760 Speaker 1: a little bit historically, but it's relatively flat. Like if 493 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: you look at like super Bowl viewership numbers over the 494 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:31,440 Speaker 1: last like fifty years, like it's gone up, but it's 495 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: sort of gone up in the way that you would 496 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 1: expect given population growth, but everything else has fallen a lot. 497 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,639 Speaker 1: So basically sports has sort of maintained high viewership while 498 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: like sitcoms, reality shows, all that stuff has fallen out. 499 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 1: These games, those are live, Those are unique events that 500 00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:49,880 Speaker 1: if you care about it, and a lot of people 501 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 1: care about sports, there is no way of getting around it. 502 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:55,719 Speaker 1: And that is like gold for advertisers, for media. 503 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, it is the only thing people watch live. 504 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 2: The reality is the NFL is a behemoth. I mean 505 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 2: I was shocked that the Super Bowl had one hundred 506 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,239 Speaker 2: and twenty seven million people watch it when at one 507 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:07,440 Speaker 2: point the game was forty to six at halftime, I 508 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 2: believe it was like twenty four to nothing or something 509 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 2: like one hundred and twenty seven million people when the 510 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 2: previous two games were incredible games. 511 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 3: But it was an underdog win, which was thrilling. 512 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 1: Eh. 513 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:21,840 Speaker 2: The Eagles were pretty good all three season. They had 514 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 2: the three peak going, they had the three peak going. 515 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 2: But if you I mean, if you were paying attention 516 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 2: to both teams, the Eagles were the dominant team. The 517 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 2: Chiefs were surviving week by week. Now, the NBA has 518 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,840 Speaker 2: seen some fluctuation. Of course, NBA Finals ratings were down. 519 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 2: Now the current playoff viewership is at an all time high. However, 520 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:40,639 Speaker 2: what happens on Lebron exits, Steph Curry exits, and I mean, 521 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 2: if the Knicks don't pull this series out, you could 522 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:45,119 Speaker 2: see a dramatic fall of not just because they're a 523 00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:47,040 Speaker 2: popular team, but you look at the markets that are 524 00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 2: out there, Oklahoma City, the Indiana Pacers, the Minnesota Timberwolves, 525 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,600 Speaker 2: and the Denver Nuggets. It's not the same thing as 526 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,200 Speaker 2: the New York Knicks. Even the brand recognition isn't the same. 527 00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 2: But at the same time, NBA has a seventy six 528 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 2: billion dollar media deal that isn't up until twenty. 529 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,360 Speaker 3: Thirty pay them to air their games. 530 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 2: Yes, the NBA's new media deals with ESPN, it is 531 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 2: with Amazon and NBC, and the NFL has like six 532 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 2: different media partners. The MLB will be negotiating theres pretty 533 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 2: soon as well. 534 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 3: What does private equity see in sports teams? 535 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:17,439 Speaker 2: Like? 536 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 3: Why are they making this investment? 537 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:21,159 Speaker 2: I mean, I think if you keep looking at the 538 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 2: media deals and they keep doubling, they keep tripling, and 539 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 2: the franchise valuations, if you look at the NBA or 540 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,240 Speaker 2: the NFL or the MLB, these sales keep going for 541 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:32,800 Speaker 2: higher and higher and higher. I mean the Panthers sold 542 00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,679 Speaker 2: for two to two, the Denver Broncos sold for four 543 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:39,399 Speaker 2: to six, The Washington Commanders, yes, billions, and then the 544 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 2: Washington Commanders sold for six billion. You're looking at these 545 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,960 Speaker 2: exits and it's like wow, Like these teams are tripling 546 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 2: over time in a matter of a decade. You don't 547 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,679 Speaker 2: normally see that in business. And so what the NFL 548 00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 2: has done with their rules is if a private equity 549 00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,359 Speaker 2: firm buys into it, you have to hold it for 550 00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,680 Speaker 2: six years. They're not looking for immediate exits, and quite frankly, 551 00:25:57,760 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 2: I'm not sure that Blue Au was looking to exit 552 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,239 Speaker 2: as as they were with the Phoenix Suns. It's just 553 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 2: that Robert Sarver got in trouble and so he was 554 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:06,880 Speaker 2: forced to sell the team, or he elected to sell 555 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 2: the team. 556 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,040 Speaker 1: So, having done some reporting on this and kind of 557 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 1: followed private equity in general, private equity in healthcare for instance, 558 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 1: you know, the business model is basically like, you cut 559 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: a bunch of costs, you raise prices where you can, 560 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:22,240 Speaker 1: and then you sell, often to another private equity firm. 561 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 1: What I'm wondering is who are the buyers? Like, if 562 00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 1: the price of the Celtics has gone up, the math 563 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 1: is going to be hard, But you know, like one 564 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: thousand percent or whatever over the last fifteen years, how 565 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 1: do you get that? Are they expecting another thousand percent? 566 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,199 Speaker 1: And if that happens, who's the buyer? Like? At what 567 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,280 Speaker 1: point does this start to look like a bubble rather 568 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:45,200 Speaker 1: than an asset with a lot of upside? 569 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:47,440 Speaker 2: Well, I think that it really depends on who you ask. 570 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:49,760 Speaker 2: As I'm watching this, I think it's incredible that the 571 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 2: Celtics got to six to one. I've talked to plenty 572 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 2: of NFL owners and they all tell me like they 573 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 2: don't think they're anywhere near the ceiling of this. And 574 00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 2: the Super Bowl is kind of a telltale sign at 575 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 2: that because if you're big, this event is a blowout 576 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 2: and it sets a record in viewership, you're still going 577 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:06,239 Speaker 2: to have media companies that are going to want to 578 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,680 Speaker 2: buy in at a new, bigger price. And this is 579 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:11,720 Speaker 2: a reminder. The NFL's media deal is over one hundred 580 00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 2: billion dollars, and yet they set a record in a 581 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:15,720 Speaker 2: blowout game. And so what's the next one going to be? 582 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 2: One hundred and fifty billion, one hundred and seventy five billion, 583 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 2: We don't know. And so that's going to drive valuations up. 584 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 2: The NBA's media deal begins this upcoming season, and so 585 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 2: that's a seventy six billion dollar media deal that's going 586 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 2: to drive up values for the next ten years as well. Now, 587 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,440 Speaker 2: what's going to be interesting to see is how these 588 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:35,320 Speaker 2: owners offset the cost because stadiums aren't getting any cheaper, 589 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 2: contracts aren't getting any cheaper, and you're right, there are 590 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:40,679 Speaker 2: going to be some billionaires who are priced out of this, 591 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,400 Speaker 2: and you will see the NFL, the NBA, the MLB 592 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,880 Speaker 2: adjust their private equity rules so that you know, these 593 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,159 Speaker 2: private equity firms can come in and provide solutions to 594 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,359 Speaker 2: owners who aren't capital heavy. 595 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 1: Randall, Like, you're a sports business reporter, but I mean, 596 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 1: I assume you can't totally divorce your fandom from your 597 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:00,639 Speaker 1: I know we're all objective journalists, but I'm sure it 598 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,679 Speaker 1: sometimes it slips through the cracks. I mean, how are 599 00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:11,560 Speaker 1: you feeling about this? We are to our final segment, 600 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:13,680 Speaker 1: and Randall, you're gonna need to stick around for this, 601 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:17,679 Speaker 1: all right? All right, this is where either Stacy or 602 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:22,680 Speaker 1: I will go through the depths of the news cycles. 603 00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 1: We'll do deep dives, will do extensive research and find 604 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,240 Speaker 1: the underrated story of the week, the story that people 605 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,000 Speaker 1: should be paying more attention to. And Stacy, what is 606 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:32,600 Speaker 1: it this week? 607 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 3: So I brought this story? Randall, I don't know if 608 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:37,680 Speaker 3: you know this, but both Max and I are runners, 609 00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 3: and over the weekend, Max and I accumulatively ran one 610 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:46,760 Speaker 3: hundred miles. Well, okay, I'll be truthful, which is that 611 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 3: Max ran one hundred miles and I ran no miles. 612 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 3: He runs ultra marathons because sometimes one marathon isn't enough. 613 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 3: How is that embarrassing? It would be the first thing 614 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 3: I said to everybody. 615 00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:58,760 Speaker 2: Wait a minute, the marathon was one hundred. 616 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 3: No he yeah, he ran a tra marathon one hundred. 617 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 2: You not the first person I've met that does this? 618 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I know. It's like a middle aged cliche. 619 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 3: Does that. 620 00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 2: Let's set automobiles and vehicles aside. He doesn't hasn't heard 621 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 2: of horses, mules, anything like that. 622 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 1: There is a mule whet. 623 00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 3: Well, so, my underrated story is that the sport of 624 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 3: ultra marathoning, very long distance running, has been plagued by 625 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 3: scandal in the form of super puffee shoes. So apparently, 626 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 3: when you run one hundred miles and this feels reasonable, 627 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 3: you want super poofy soles on your shoes. And we've 628 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,560 Speaker 3: all seen this has become a trend, right, the Hokah 629 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:44,840 Speaker 3: shoes and stuff like that getting poofy or and poofier, 630 00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 3: And apparently if you run one hundred miles you want 631 00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:51,880 Speaker 3: super lofty shoes. But there are now these careful regulations 632 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:52,760 Speaker 3: around how. 633 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: Shoe sole high, how much poof can you. 634 00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 3: Have yes, and people are getting disqualified from races for 635 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 3: overly poof shoes. 636 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: Wow. 637 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, but the shoemakers keep making them and they don't care. 638 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 3: They are upping the anti. There's a new shoe from 639 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:12,160 Speaker 3: Puma where the sole of the shoe is fifty eight millimeters, 640 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 3: which is the size of a Rubik's cube. 641 00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:16,400 Speaker 1: Okay, can you show me yes? 642 00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 3: Here is the picture. My god, that's this is your people. 643 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 1: That is obscene. 644 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,800 Speaker 3: Well, apparently people love these shoes, and the poofy or 645 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,360 Speaker 3: the sole, the more people will pay. And because shoe 646 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,560 Speaker 3: sales have been declining for the past two years, they're 647 00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:33,280 Speaker 3: down by two percent. Running shoes shoes like shoemakers are 648 00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 3: getting more and more invested in shoes that they can 649 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,000 Speaker 3: charge a premium for and apparently people will just pay 650 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,680 Speaker 3: endless amounts of money. So actual money being made from 651 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,240 Speaker 3: shoes up fourteen percent in spite of the sales drop 652 00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 3: because of poofy soles. 653 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:48,720 Speaker 2: And you're basically heals for men. 654 00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:50,520 Speaker 3: Heals form men. 655 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: First of all, there is no this is not an 656 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:57,719 Speaker 1: ultra running story. There is no fashion. I mean, you. 657 00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 2: Confirm or deny that these are heels for men. 658 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 1: They are, but I'm just saying that this is these 659 00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: are two worlds that are are that could not be 660 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 1: further from one another. No one who is actually running 661 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:12,560 Speaker 1: one hundred miles looks their best, uh, to say the least. 662 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 1: I also think it's funny how in shoes you have 663 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:20,280 Speaker 1: all of this amazing innovation. You know, earlier it was 664 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 1: the carbon fiber soles, and they're always there are always 665 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 1: these like crazy innovations and all this conversation around performance 666 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,560 Speaker 1: and is it is it cheating or whatever. And then 667 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,560 Speaker 1: you have fashion, which is like totally on the opposite 668 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 1: end of innovation, and like those two forces are sometimes 669 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 1: pushing against each other, sometimes pushing with each other. I 670 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: don't know what's what. 671 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:41,640 Speaker 2: We're just pushing you forward. 672 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,520 Speaker 1: When I started running long distances, the big thing was 673 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 1: having no soul, was having like these, yeah, or wearing 674 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: those like shoes with the toes where your toes stick out, 675 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 1: and even today, like you see people with giant souls. 676 00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 1: I saw a guy this this past weekend running in 677 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:01,360 Speaker 1: sort of like what you think of as like a 678 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: Roman thong, like like sandal really like my story. 679 00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:07,600 Speaker 2: I think he's trying to get away from the story. 680 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 3: Well, here's the thing like if you're running one hundred miles, like, 681 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 3: is it cheating if you have like a slightly more 682 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 3: comfortable shoe, like if I ran, I don't even think 683 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 3: using like a moped is cheating if it's one hundred miles. 684 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:24,360 Speaker 2: We got to ask him, if you saw someone who 685 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 2: was speeding past you and they had some bigger, bigger souls, 686 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,280 Speaker 2: are you going to point them out and flag down 687 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 2: an official. 688 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,120 Speaker 1: Them in the race? Director? No, I don't think I 689 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:34,760 Speaker 1: would notice. 690 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 3: People have been turning each other in apparently too, there 691 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:37,920 Speaker 3: was this. 692 00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 2: Guy running around with a ruler. This show is. 693 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,400 Speaker 3: Produced by Stacy Wong. Magnus Hendrickson is our supervising producer, 694 00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 3: Amy Keene is our editor, and Brendan Francis Newnham is 695 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:56,160 Speaker 3: our executive producer. Special thanks to Jeff Muscus and Maria 696 00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,440 Speaker 3: Ling and Sage Bauman heads Boomberg Podcasts. If you have 697 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 3: a minute, please rate and review the show. It helps 698 00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,840 Speaker 3: people find us and it would really mean a lot 699 00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,400 Speaker 3: to us. And if you have a story that should 700 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:10,520 Speaker 3: be our business, email us at Everybody's at Bloomberg dot net. 701 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 3: That is, Everybody's with an us at Bloomberg dot net 702 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 3: and thank you for listening. To see you next week.