WEBVTT - Bitcoin Will Change El Salvador’s Future! | Michael Peterson 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:04.160 In a world that's seemingly going dark. It's bad everywhere 0:00:04.200 --> 0:00:07.560 you look. Attempted assassinations, coups in the government, the food's 0:00:07.600 --> 0:00:11.120 being poisoned, and there's no problem finding bad in this world. 0:00:11.480 --> 0:00:14.960 There's a glimmering hope, there's a there's a light coming 0:00:15.000 --> 0:00:18.120 from the most unlikely place in the world right now. 0:00:18.120 --> 0:00:19.600 And so rather than focus in all the dark, let's 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:22.320 focus on the light, and let's think about a better future. Now. 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:24.759 Somebody who's been on the ground, boots on the ground, 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:28.040 helping to spark that revolution, if we'll call it, that. 0:00:29.240 --> 0:00:30.040 Is Michael Peterson. 0:00:30.040 --> 0:00:32.919 Michael Peterson started a movement down there using the most 0:00:33.000 --> 0:00:35.680 unlikely tool, which is bitcoin, which is now on the 0:00:35.680 --> 0:00:37.320 global stage. 0:00:38.360 --> 0:00:40.040 So, Michael, thanks for sitting down with me. 0:00:40.159 --> 0:00:42.080 Hey, it's great to be here with you again. 0:00:42.200 --> 0:00:44.080 Yeah. Yeah, it's been a while since we caught up. 0:00:45.600 --> 0:00:50.840 The glimmering shining hope that we have of a little 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:55.520 unlikely country. It's pretty amazing. Hopefully people can't pay attention. 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:58.080 I mean, El Salvador went from the most dangerous country 0:00:58.080 --> 0:00:59.959 in the world to the safest country in the world. 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:01.160 You've been down there a long time. 0:01:01.480 --> 0:01:03.800 How long have you been down there and how dangerous 0:01:03.920 --> 0:01:06.639 was it and how has it become a lot safer. 0:01:06.840 --> 0:01:09.360 Yeah, so we've been down there for twenty years and 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:11.760 it was actually when we first when we first bought 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:14.479 our place down there, it was kind of on it 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:16.640 seemed like it was getting better. But then after the 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:20.119 housing crisis, that's that's when the gang problem really started 0:01:20.160 --> 0:01:21.080 to proliferate. 0:01:21.160 --> 0:01:23.200 And it was for about ten years. 0:01:23.240 --> 0:01:25.200 It would go back and forth between El Salvador and 0:01:25.200 --> 0:01:27.800 Honduras as being the highest murder rate in the world. 0:01:27.959 --> 0:01:29.440 It was literally off the. 0:01:29.520 --> 0:01:31.880 Charts, worse than a lot of countries that were, you know, 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:32.760 officially at war. 0:01:33.120 --> 0:01:35.119 Not a title you want, no. 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:36.200 No, it was, yeah, it was. 0:01:36.240 --> 0:01:38.960 I mean even in our community, Alzante, which is a 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:42.040 beautiful little beach community, I mean you would see bodies, 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:44.520 you know, in the street and it was wow. It 0:01:44.560 --> 0:01:46.319 really felt like you were in a war zone. And 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:48.840 it's crazy how much that has changed now. People who 0:01:48.840 --> 0:01:50.960 come can't even imagine that that's what it was like. 0:01:52.440 --> 0:01:52.640 Now. 0:01:53.000 --> 0:01:55.000 I spent a lot of time in Mexico. We're building 0:01:55.000 --> 0:01:56.520 the house in Mexico right now. So we're down there 0:01:56.560 --> 0:01:58.840 a lot and you hear of a lot about murders 0:01:58.840 --> 0:02:02.400 and death in Mexico as well, but from my experience, 0:02:02.520 --> 0:02:05.240 it's never really like in the towns. It's you know, 0:02:05.320 --> 0:02:08.560 out of town, it's the cartels they're fighting, so you 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:10.320 the numbers are there, but you don't see it. 0:02:10.960 --> 0:02:11.480 I'm curious. 0:02:11.480 --> 0:02:12.880 I mean, you said you saw the body, so that's 0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:15.320 that's obviously a whole different story, was it. But was 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:18.080 it really kind of just the gangs or did it 0:02:18.080 --> 0:02:20.280 really spill over into just like regular people. 0:02:20.520 --> 0:02:22.800 No, it really spilled over into the regular people because 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:26.920 the you know, unlike Mexico where it's it's mostly revolves 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:30.880 around drug trade. There in Alsalvadore, it was about extortion, 0:02:31.160 --> 0:02:33.320 and so it was these the little mom and pop 0:02:33.440 --> 0:02:36.720 vendors that were being extorted and so when they wouldn't pay, 0:02:37.200 --> 0:02:39.800 they would just execute them. And so you would actually 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.360 see it, you know, in the street as you're you know, 0:02:42.400 --> 0:02:44.840 coming down the street, you'd see the body there and 0:02:44.880 --> 0:02:47.320 the police out there, and so it really was something 0:02:47.800 --> 0:02:52.200 that you couldn't get away from. And it for foreigners, 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:54.600 I mean, we never really felt in danger. It was 0:02:54.639 --> 0:02:56.359 one of those things that you were kind of off 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:59.840 limits as a foreigner because the repercussions would be much 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:02.080 longer if they were to kill a foreigner and so, 0:03:02.200 --> 0:03:05.360 and foreigners were just seeing as kind of more troublesome. 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:07.560 They're more likely to fight back, they're more likely to 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:10.240 report if they're trying to be extorted. And so it 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:13.120 didn't affect them directly, but you know, you saw it 0:03:13.120 --> 0:03:15.239 all around you and then you know you're friends with 0:03:15.360 --> 0:03:17.240 the local people in the community, so you saw how 0:03:17.240 --> 0:03:18.000 it affected them. 0:03:18.200 --> 0:03:21.239 Yeah, how did it affect them? I mean it holds 0:03:21.240 --> 0:03:22.800 them back to they able to plan long term. 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:23.960 I mean, what were the kind of. 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:27.400 The mean they so for one thing, most of them, 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:29.320 their their goal was to get out of the country. 0:03:29.400 --> 0:03:31.640 That was the primary goal was to you know, usually 0:03:31.720 --> 0:03:35.400 to come to the US illegally was the main thought. 0:03:35.720 --> 0:03:38.040 The other thing you'd see you often see people start 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:39.920 up a business and then they would shut it down 0:03:40.000 --> 0:03:42.200 right away because they would come to them and say, hey, 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:43.800 you have to pay this much. And a lot of 0:03:43.840 --> 0:03:46.280 times they would make a rational decision, you know it 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:48.680 can they stay in business and pay this They looked 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:50.640 at it kind of as a tax, and so they 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:53.400 would make that decision. But a lot of times what 0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:55.680 the gangs wanted to pay. It just wasn't sustainable, and 0:03:55.760 --> 0:03:58.200 so you would see these businesses come and go and 0:03:58.240 --> 0:03:59.240 shut down real quickly. 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:00.520 You also had these weird things. 0:04:00.600 --> 0:04:04.040 Businesses would set up and you know, closed neighborhoods, there 0:04:04.040 --> 0:04:07.240 were behind gates and they wouldn't put up any signage. 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:09.760 They wouldn't it was hard to even know. You had 0:04:09.760 --> 0:04:11.680 to have like an inside track to even know where 0:04:11.720 --> 0:04:13.920 the business was because they were always trying to stay 0:04:14.160 --> 0:04:17.039 one step ahead of the gangs, which obviously makes it 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:19.039 very hard to run a profitable business if you can't 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:19.600 even put a. 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:20.080 Sock out front. 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:23.480 Yeah, So then everything just kind of continues to spiral downhill. 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:26.320 I mean there's less businesses being started, there's less money 0:04:26.360 --> 0:04:28.440 to go around, there's less jobs. People don't have as 0:04:28.520 --> 0:04:30.440 much money to spend with other businesses, and so it 0:04:30.520 --> 0:04:32.000 was like this is spiral that it started. 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:34.080 Oh, it was a cycle of destruction because then you 0:04:34.120 --> 0:04:35.200 have the parents leaving. 0:04:35.240 --> 0:04:36.080 They'd go to the US. 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:38.680 So you have the kids growing up without their parents around, 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:42.200 which then become prey to the gangs because they don't 0:04:42.200 --> 0:04:45.200 have any family there and so the gang provided family 0:04:45.200 --> 0:04:45.680 for them. 0:04:46.000 --> 0:04:48.600 So as that as the gangs grew. That made it. 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:51.039 Less and less profitable to run a business there, which 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:52.760 made more people flee. So it was kind of like 0:04:53.160 --> 0:04:54.720 that's so most people just felt like there was no 0:04:54.720 --> 0:04:55.680 future in El Salvador. 0:04:55.920 --> 0:04:57.839 And I heard that they even preyed on the kids 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:00.760 because of like the age difference and like kids couldn't 0:05:00.760 --> 0:05:02.800 really be prosecuted for crime. So then really those kids 0:05:02.800 --> 0:05:03.599 became a big target. 0:05:03.800 --> 0:05:06.680 Oh yeah, it was usually the twelve thirteen year olds 0:05:06.680 --> 0:05:09.159 that were the triggerman. And for one thing, they couldn't 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:11.640 be prosecuted as doults. It's another thing, you know, for them, 0:05:11.720 --> 0:05:13.480 it was kind of like a video game. They don't 0:05:13.560 --> 0:05:15.960 understand the repercussions of what they're doing. Yeah, and so 0:05:16.000 --> 0:05:18.520 they could get these kids to go in and you know, 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:21.359 just blast people away without really thinking about it. You know, 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:24.120 as people get old er, even hardened criminals, they start 0:05:24.160 --> 0:05:26.240 to you know, think more about the repercussions of what 0:05:26.279 --> 0:05:26.720 they're doing. 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:28.640 But as a kid, it just seemed the game to them. 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:29.080 Yeah. 0:05:29.680 --> 0:05:33.159 Now, obviously, you know with Bitcoin beach, you know, that's 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:35.880 where the kind of the world a lot of the 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:38.960 worlds are paying attention. But where did the shift, Where 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:41.640 do you see now looking backwards, where do you think 0:05:41.720 --> 0:05:45.000 that shift in momentum started to go from this downward 0:05:45.040 --> 0:05:47.040 spiral the most dangerous country in the world, Like, what 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:47.799 was the spark? 0:05:47.839 --> 0:05:48.280 Do you think? 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:51.520 I think it was was two things. 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:53.880 I mean, I think, and I think they happened in 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:56.800 a synergistic way. So I definitely give credit to the 0:05:56.839 --> 0:05:59.520 President bu Kelly. He came in and really was willing 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:03.120 to shake things up. The previous politicians it had all 0:06:03.360 --> 0:06:06.039 been about getting in power so you could drain as 0:06:06.120 --> 0:06:09.000 much money from the state as possible, and he really 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:12.080 shifted that where he wanted to see real change come. 0:06:12.839 --> 0:06:15.479 Even people within his own party that were corrupt, he 0:06:15.560 --> 0:06:18.240 went after them, and he really made people feel like 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:20.680 for the first time that there was potentially going to 0:06:20.680 --> 0:06:23.680 be a future in El Salvador. It happened to be 0:06:23.760 --> 0:06:26.360 that we had started the bitcoin project at that same time, 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:29.920 and so they were seeing just the impact that bitcoin has. 0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:31.480 You know, it's like a mind virus. 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:35.560 It shifts people's perspective, gives them a lower time preference, 0:06:35.640 --> 0:06:38.800 makes them think longer term, and makes them hopeful about 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:42.560 the future. And so we were seeing this project that 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:45.799 started as this very small thing and al Xante grow 0:06:45.920 --> 0:06:49.120 and start, you know, affecting the communities around us. We 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:52.720 started like a lifeguard program. There was the number of 0:06:52.839 --> 0:06:56.160 kids attending high school like triple people were going to college. 0:06:56.200 --> 0:06:59.320 It was all these different not just saving in bitcoin, 0:06:59.360 --> 0:07:02.760 but all these secondary and tertiary impacts of bitcoin. And 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:06.080 so while the government was making these big changes on 0:07:06.080 --> 0:07:09.080 the national level, these things happening in Alzonte, and then 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:11.520 they embraced saw what was happening there and said, hey, 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:14.520 let's combine these forces. And so I think it was 0:07:14.760 --> 0:07:16.920 you know, all of these things coming together in kind 0:07:16.960 --> 0:07:17.880 of a magical way. 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:18.520 Yeah. 0:07:18.560 --> 0:07:21.200 So, where there's no hope, the people perish kind of 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:23.520 a thing. Right, So when the president came in and 0:07:23.560 --> 0:07:25.560 showed that there was going to be change happening, and 0:07:25.560 --> 0:07:28.200 then people were hopeful for that. And then as well 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:30.800 as the bitcoin thing allowed people to think more long term, 0:07:30.840 --> 0:07:32.440 and that created more hope. 0:07:32.320 --> 0:07:34.640 And also brings in business and opportunity. 0:07:34.680 --> 0:07:37.320 And they saw tourists, you know, people cared about El 0:07:37.360 --> 0:07:39.080 Salvador all of a sudden, I mean really put El 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:41.680 Salvador on the world map when he made that decision 0:07:41.680 --> 0:07:42.920 to make it legal tender people. 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:45.880 Yeah, but that was that was. I mean, that kind 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:47.280 of came about. I want to get to that, but 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.520 I'm just curious. So you were in the United States 0:07:49.600 --> 0:07:51.360 and you spent like half your year in El Salvador 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:53.280 and half your year in the United States kind of thing. 0:07:53.560 --> 0:07:55.760 We were there like nine months in El Salvador. In 0:07:55.800 --> 0:07:57.640 three months we'd come back for the summers of the US. 0:07:57.760 --> 0:07:59.200 Yeah, so you were kind of one in, one out. 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:01.320 And I guess the question that I'm thinking about or 0:08:01.320 --> 0:08:04.600 asking is it seems like it's sort of back to 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:07.000 the hope in the air of the directionality, if you will, 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:10.280 because I try to think about, like the United States 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:13.400 is going in a horrible direction and things look very bleak. 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:15.440 But at the same time, if I want to shift 0:08:15.440 --> 0:08:17.600 my perspective, it's also still probably the greatest place in 0:08:17.640 --> 0:08:22.200 the world to live, but the hope is kind. 0:08:22.000 --> 0:08:23.800 Of gone because we see where it's going. 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:25.600 So even though it's still probably the best place in 0:08:25.640 --> 0:08:28.680 the world to live, it's heavy because of where we're going. 0:08:28.720 --> 0:08:31.080 Where's El Salvador is still one of the poorest countries 0:08:31.120 --> 0:08:33.560 in the world. It is like the services are poor, right, 0:08:33.600 --> 0:08:35.760 et cetera, The roads are bad, et cetera. But the 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:38.120 hope is different, the energy of the direction is different. 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:39.600 And so really even though the. 0:08:39.960 --> 0:08:43.440 Current conditions couldn't be more opposite, the directions they're going 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:45.680 are different, and that creates a different energy. 0:08:46.240 --> 0:08:47.600 Is that right, No, one hundred percent. 0:08:47.720 --> 0:08:51.800 I think that's one thing people miss and or underestimate, 0:08:51.920 --> 0:08:56.040 is just the impact of the animal spirits in a population. 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:57.760 Like if the population. 0:08:57.360 --> 0:09:00.640 Thinks that tomorrow is going to be better, more likely 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:03.160 to save, they're more likely to invest in education, they're 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:09.160 more likely to defer current purchases just for gratification, more 0:09:09.200 --> 0:09:12.240 for investment, and to think longer term, where if you 0:09:12.240 --> 0:09:13.880 think things are going to be worse in the future, 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:16.240 you're just gonna live for the day. And so I 0:09:16.280 --> 0:09:21.239 think that is really what makes the difference between economies 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:23.760 and countries that are on the upswing and those are 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:26.959 on the downswing. It's just that perspective and that that hope. 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:27.760 That's exactly right. 0:09:27.800 --> 0:09:30.240 And so then you're around people who also have that, 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:32.880 and so to your point, living for today versus living 0:09:32.880 --> 0:09:34.920 long term, and so then it's just the whole culture 0:09:34.960 --> 0:09:35.679 gets dragged down. 0:09:35.720 --> 0:09:37.520 So so you. 0:09:37.240 --> 0:09:39.120 You were there, you've been there for a while, and 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:41.920 then one little sliver of hope in that. 0:09:41.880 --> 0:09:43.000 Country that you said kind of start. 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:45.000 At the same time was then this project in Alesonte 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:47.080 which has now been dubb Bitcoin Beach. 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:50.040 Give us the origin of that, like what was the 0:09:50.080 --> 0:09:50.679 spark for that. 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:54.439 Yeah, so we had you know that Alsante where a starter. 0:09:54.559 --> 0:09:55.559 That's where that's where I live. 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:59.760 You know, my wife and I were working with missionaries 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:01.959 and in the country. We moved to El Salvador to 0:10:02.360 --> 0:10:04.760 work with like a broad base of different missionaries there, 0:10:05.200 --> 0:10:07.400 and we were based on the beach, mostly because I 0:10:07.440 --> 0:10:09.240 like to surf and so I wanted to be on 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:12.880 the beach. And you know, even in Alzonte, though there 0:10:12.920 --> 0:10:16.600 was this kind of quaint tourist town, the gangs ran everything, 0:10:16.760 --> 0:10:19.840 and so we had an opportunity to start some youth 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:23.360 programs with some local leaders and really start to try 0:10:23.360 --> 0:10:26.720 to change the mindset of the youth there. And originally 0:10:26.760 --> 0:10:30.000 we were it wasn't involved with bitcoin. I was a bitcoinner, 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:34.160 but I wasn't really thinking that. So this was probably 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:38.120 twenty sixteen did that happen that we started the youth 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:41.439 programs there and then but you know, and I was 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:43.240 in the bitcoin but I didn't really you know, you 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:45.400 think of that as like a separate world. And there 0:10:45.440 --> 0:10:47.040 were a lot of times where I was thinking, you know, 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:49.680 as we were trying to bring money down to you know, 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.760 buy vehicles for the project or things like that, and 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:56.360 it was a headache using the wire system. I was like, man, 0:10:56.360 --> 0:10:58.960 if we just use bitcoin, but I never envisioned that 0:10:58.960 --> 0:11:04.079 that would actually be. And so in twenty nineteen it 0:11:04.200 --> 0:11:08.760 was introduced to somebody that was in early in the 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:13.840 bitcoin space that wanted to see bitcoin circular economies rise up, 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:15.880 and they heard about the work we were doing in 0:11:15.920 --> 0:11:18.559 El Salvador and they said, hey, maybe maybe there's a 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:21.520 connection there. They were supporting some other ministries that we 0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:24.880 were familiar with, and so I thought, hey, I doubt 0:11:24.920 --> 0:11:27.520 it's gonna you know, it would work, but let's take 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:28.320 a chance and meet. 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:30.280 And so had this crazy meeting. 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:33.080 It wasn't even the donor, it was his representative because 0:11:33.080 --> 0:11:36.920 he wanted to remain anonymous, but heard the story of Hey, 0:11:36.960 --> 0:11:41.079 there's somebody there that really sees the bitcoin that they 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:44.720 have from early days as not just the value in 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:49.800 the monetary value, but the way using bitcoin as currency 0:11:49.840 --> 0:11:53.599 as it was meant to be used, will actually impact society. 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:55.679 And so they kind of challenged us to think of 0:11:55.720 --> 0:11:59.600 a way to start a system that could begin to 0:11:59.600 --> 0:12:01.160 pull away from the fiat system. 0:12:01.920 --> 0:12:03.400 Still there's still a lot of people that want to 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:04.800 do good in this world. That's amazing. 0:12:05.240 --> 0:12:07.839 So they gave you a bitcoin, you broke it down 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:11.240 into the hundred million satoshi's that are available, and then 0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:13.920 what I mean, you start giving it to people to say, hey, 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:15.120 I'm gonna give it to you, but you need to 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:17.880 spend it, or you talk to businesses about buying and 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:19.679 selling it, or how did that then get going? 0:12:19.760 --> 0:12:23.040 Yeah, So initially we just used it in the projects 0:12:23.080 --> 0:12:24.920 we already doing. So we were, you know, we'd been 0:12:24.960 --> 0:12:27.199 paying the youth to clean the river and the beach, 0:12:27.280 --> 0:12:29.840 just you know, mostly just try to keep them occupied. 0:12:29.880 --> 0:12:32.720 It also gave us a chance to walk alongside them 0:12:32.760 --> 0:12:35.079 and mentor them. And when I say this, I mean 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:37.760 more like the local team members there that were doing that. 0:12:37.800 --> 0:12:40.240 I tried to remain behind the scenes as much as possible. 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:41.920 I just I'm very much a. 0:12:41.840 --> 0:12:44.280 Proponent that things need to come from the local level 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.840 and from people that are in the community. And so 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:51.280 we started using bitcoin, you know, to compensate them. And 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:53.600 it was Originally, we just thought it would be like, 0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:55.600 you know, paying them and it wouldn't make a difference 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:57.240 so if we were paying them in dollars or bitcoin, 0:12:57.280 --> 0:12:59.360 but we saw when we just started paying them in bitcoin, 0:12:59.440 --> 0:13:02.120 it really changed the way they started thinking about things 0:13:02.160 --> 0:13:04.840 because they became curious about money, like what is money? 0:13:05.000 --> 0:13:07.720 They thought about that for the first time, they started 0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:10.920 considering the cost of spending something now versus holding it 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:14.400 for later, because they understood that this was most likely 0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:17.439 appreciating value over time, and so they for the first 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:19.359 time understood deferred gratification. 0:13:19.559 --> 0:13:22.000 And so we saw these things happened. 0:13:22.080 --> 0:13:24.320 This was on a very very small level when this 0:13:24.600 --> 0:13:28.199 was happening, and then we had a podcast. Peter McCormick 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:30.959 came in and spent some time with us, and then 0:13:31.280 --> 0:13:34.360 when he did some things, it kind of started to 0:13:34.360 --> 0:13:36.880 blow up. We started getting number of bitcoin tourists that 0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:40.840 started coming in and we were able to expand the programs. 0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:44.600 And then COVID hit and that really gave us the 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:48.679 opportunity to expand it to the whole community. Anybody who's 0:13:48.720 --> 0:13:52.120 worked in in any type of development work understands that, 0:13:52.600 --> 0:13:54.520 you know a lot of whelming people come in with 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:56.880 projects and wind up doing a lot more harm than good, 0:13:57.000 --> 0:13:58.880 because you if you just throw a bunch of money 0:13:58.880 --> 0:14:01.880 at people a lot of time, you disincentivize them to work. 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:06.439 You can distort the local economy and actually put local 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:10.480 businesses out of business if you start providing free services. 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:13.040 So it's it's always a balance, and so we wanted 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:14.920 to be very aware of that. But when COVID hit, 0:14:15.400 --> 0:14:17.840 everything was locked down, people were not allowed to work, 0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:21.000 people were going hungry, and the businesses were going on 0:14:21.080 --> 0:14:24.320 business because nobody had any money. So it gave us 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:28.080 kind of the freedom to do like a community wide 0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:32.080 disbursement of bitcoin, and we started sending bitcoin. 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:34.120 To the stimulus. 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:37.080 Very much like a stimulus it was, and probably ninety 0:14:37.120 --> 0:14:41.560 percent of the families were receiving you know, I can't 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:43.600 remember how many SATs it was at the time that 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:45.320 we were sending out, but you know, it was enough 0:14:45.360 --> 0:14:48.840 to buy maybe half their basic food items for the month, 0:14:48.920 --> 0:14:52.360 and so but it wasn't distortive in any way because 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:54.520 they weren't allowed to work anyways, and so it really 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:58.920 kept these families fed and it also kept the businesses alive, 0:14:58.960 --> 0:15:01.040 and it made it very easy for us to onboard 0:15:01.080 --> 0:15:04.200 businesses because it was the only currency circulating in the community, 0:15:04.280 --> 0:15:06.680 and so they were coming rather than us happened to 0:15:06.720 --> 0:15:08.320 come to them and try to orange pill, and they 0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:10.280 were coming to us like, hey, how do we how 0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:10.560 do we. 0:15:10.480 --> 0:15:11.320 Get involved in this? 0:15:11.480 --> 0:15:14.160 And so it really helped supercharge it and set the 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:18.000 stage for you know, for what later you know, became this. 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:20.880 It became ubiquitous within the community that the majority of 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:22.360 the businesses are accepting bitcoin. 0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:24.840 So was this happening. 0:15:24.920 --> 0:15:27.240 So this you said, like when Hayley came in and 0:15:27.280 --> 0:15:29.440 started changing things was kind of around the same time, 0:15:29.480 --> 0:15:31.680 So around twenty nineteen ish is when you started kind 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:34.240 of the project there and then right so that was 0:15:34.280 --> 0:15:35.200 kind of coming up to the seash. 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:38.480 So we started a little bit before he was elected, 0:15:38.560 --> 0:15:41.000 because I remember he was on the scene. 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:44.320 It was during it was campaign season, and I remember. 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:48.320 Actually when I did a podcast with Peter, I remember 0:15:48.360 --> 0:15:50.240 telling him, I like, there's this new president, and I 0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:52.880 think that there's a possibility that he could be the 0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:55.120 first president to adopt bitcoin as legal tender. 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:58.440 Like he has this sense of wanting to embrace new things. 0:15:58.440 --> 0:16:00.320 Everybody thought it was crazy at the time, and I 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:02.800 was like no, I see this happening. 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:05.640 And so it was funny that it actually came to be. 0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:07.840 We were definitely swinging for the fences there. 0:16:08.200 --> 0:16:10.720 How was it that that became on his map like 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:12.920 all of a sudden, was someone from his team alerted 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:14.360 him he wanted to come take a look at it, 0:16:14.480 --> 0:16:16.560 or like, you know, did it just get so big 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:18.160 and it made so much change in the country that 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:19.720 he couldn't ignore it, or how did that work? 0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:20.960 I think a couple things. 0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:23.800 There was a Forbes article that came out talking about 0:16:23.840 --> 0:16:27.160 the projects, and it was probably one of the first 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:30.200 articles about l Salvador that was positive that wasn't talking 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:32.160 about the gangs and the violence, and it was talking 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.000 about this new innovative project that was happening in El 0:16:35.040 --> 0:16:38.240 Salvador by a major publication. So I think that kind 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:40.880 of put it on their radar. And then we really 0:16:40.880 --> 0:16:44.320 tried to engage the government from early stages because we 0:16:44.320 --> 0:16:47.200 didn't want them to hear rumors like oh, bitcoin. 0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:49.239 Money laundering, drug, you know, all the. 0:16:49.000 --> 0:16:53.920 Negative connotations that came with bitcoin, especially in the earlier days, 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.760 and so we would be very open with them. 0:16:56.800 --> 0:16:57.960 We were working with the. 0:16:57.920 --> 0:17:02.120 Ministry of Tourism to promote tourism through bitcoin. We also 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:06.240 established the country's first lifeguard program. They didn't have any 0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:09.520 lifeguard program in the country, and there would be probably 0:17:09.560 --> 0:17:11.919 about three hundred people that would drown each year, you know, 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:12.919 some of them tourists, but. 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:14.360 Most of them locals. 0:17:14.840 --> 0:17:18.920