Speaker 1: Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast on this Good Friday,
Speaker 1: and on Good Friday, we are blessed to have Jeff
Speaker 1: Cans with us. He is a biblical scholar and the
Speaker 1: creator of the Bible in a year plan also the
Speaker 1: host of Daily Reflections with Jeff Cans, one of the
Speaker 1: most popular sessions on the Hollow app. And you've got
Speaker 1: something new coming out that we can download right now
Speaker 1: and kind of follow this Holy Week through the Hollow app.
Speaker 1: Is that correct?
Speaker 2: That's right. It's good to be with you, Tutor, And yeah,
Speaker 2: it's going to be a powerful week. Jonathan Roumi, who
Speaker 2: most people know plays Jesus on The Chosen is going
Speaker 2: to be shooting the crucifixion scenes in the Passion week
Speaker 2: coming up in just a little while from now. With
Speaker 2: that given, he's never been to the Holy Land before,
Speaker 2: and we do the Daily on Hello together and he
Speaker 2: wanted to go to the Holy Land and he wanted
Speaker 2: to have me teach him to go through the actual
Speaker 2: walk with Jesus from Palm Sunday all the way to
Speaker 2: the Resurrection and beyond, and so we did. We went
Speaker 2: over there and it was magnificent and there was nobody
Speaker 2: there there's not many pilgrims there, so we really had
Speaker 2: complete access to places like the Garden Agassemine, the Holy Sepulcher,
Speaker 2: the Tomb of Jesus, the Last Supper, everything. It was
Speaker 2: just really, really amazing, and so we put that together
Speaker 2: with Hallow and we launched it Monday, this the day
Speaker 2: after Palm Sunday, and now we're going every day through
Speaker 2: it and the response has been incredible, and I think
Speaker 2: people are very interested because, I mean, this is the
Speaker 2: guy playing Jesus, the biggest role right now on the
Speaker 2: big screen, and I think they want to see his
Speaker 2: response to being there for the first time as a
Speaker 2: prep for the filming.
Speaker 1: Well, and for a lot of us, you know, I
Speaker 1: haven't been there, and I want to see it. I
Speaker 1: want my children to be a to see that. The
Speaker 1: goal obviously is to get there one day myself. But
Speaker 1: what I was reading about your trip and from your
Speaker 1: own experiences being over there is so much deeper than
Speaker 1: you can even imagine. You know. It's like when you
Speaker 1: go to these places that are so monumental in your
Speaker 1: life or in the history of your nation, you can
Speaker 1: kind of feel it in your bones and I can't
Speaker 1: even imagine what it's like to be in the Holy
Speaker 1: Land to something so consequential for not only your life,
Speaker 1: but your eternal life.
Speaker 2: Exactly right, you know. It's like I guess I would
Speaker 2: equate it to years ago. I liked listening to Phantom
Speaker 2: of the Opera the CD, back when they had CDs,
Speaker 2: and then I listened to it in the car all
Speaker 2: the time. And then I got to go to the
Speaker 2: Broadway production and I was sitting there and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden it happened right in front of me, the
Speaker 2: chandelier and everything. I'm like, oh my gosh, this is
Speaker 2: so much different than just listening to the CD, which
Speaker 2: is fine, a lot of enjoyment out of it. But
Speaker 2: that's the way it is. When you go over there.
Speaker 2: You've heard all your life, perhaps these stories about Jesus.
Speaker 2: There's stories about Paul and Peter, Mary, the rest of
Speaker 2: the prophets, and then suddenly you're walking there. Like in
Speaker 2: one scene with Jonathan, we were right outside of Caiaphas's house,
Speaker 2: the high Priest, where Jesus was he was betrayed by
Speaker 2: Judas in the garden of Cassemone. They brought him back
Speaker 2: up to Caiaphas's house and this was the road that
Speaker 2: was Jesus' last walk from the Last Supper down to
Speaker 2: the garden of Gassemone. And he and I sat down
Speaker 2: and I sprung it on him. I said, you're sitting
Speaker 2: on the stones that he walked on, and it hit
Speaker 2: him like wow. And that's what happens. You know, of course,
Speaker 2: when you go over there, and we do realize that
Speaker 2: a lot of people they can't make it over there.
Speaker 2: One of the reasons right now is because of the war.
Speaker 2: I was finishing a project and actually landed on October
Speaker 2: seventh and that morning and had to turn around three
Speaker 2: days later come back. But a lot of people are
Speaker 2: not going to make it over there. So what we
Speaker 2: wanted to do is try to bring it to you
Speaker 2: in a way that it's not just the pictures, but
Speaker 2: we wanted to create the atmosphere for you to enter
Speaker 2: into that particular story.
Speaker 1: And at a time when there has been kind of
Speaker 1: this resurgence of faith and you see it, you see
Speaker 1: it in these articles. All suddenly we're seeing that the
Speaker 1: amount of people that are dropping off is not happening anymore.
Speaker 1: It's kind of steady, and it seems like there's a
Speaker 1: push toward growing people in the faith in Christianity. And
Speaker 1: as I was preparing for this, I was thinking, you know,
Speaker 1: all these years I've reflected on this weekend and what
Speaker 1: this means, and I don't think I think every year
Speaker 1: it changes for me. It's kind of especially as a
Speaker 1: parent now, because I was thinking about this this morning,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, do I talk about this as like,
Speaker 1: you know, hey, happy Good Friday? Or are you sad
Speaker 1: on Good Friday? But I was thinking about it, and
Speaker 1: I said to myself, you know, what a hero what
Speaker 1: a hero's day? Because he knew. He didn't question it,
Speaker 1: he didn't say, you know, there's a way of getting
Speaker 1: out of this. He knew he had to do this,
Speaker 1: and he knew it was going to be extremely painful.
Speaker 1: He knew it would be humiliating all of the things
Speaker 1: that we avoid in life, right, everything to a degree
Speaker 1: that we could never possibly handle. And yet he walked
Speaker 1: into it in a glad way because he's our parent,
Speaker 1: you know. And I thought, as a parent, I see
Speaker 1: it differently because I'm like, so many years I've said
Speaker 1: to myself, what was it like for him to see
Speaker 1: his mother, to know that he was leaving her, to
Speaker 1: know that he would be separated. And it's just like
Speaker 1: us when we are losing someone to death, we go,
Speaker 1: we're separated for a time, and for him it was
Speaker 1: a separation for a time, but there was no hesitation
Speaker 1: because he would do anything for us. It's just so
Speaker 1: incredible for me as a parent to think I would
Speaker 1: do this for my kids, but how much more he
Speaker 1: will do for me?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I like what you said. You would do
Speaker 2: it for your kids, But the question is would you
Speaker 2: do it for the rest of the kids out there?
Speaker 2: The answer is probably hmm, I don't know about that.
Speaker 2: Or would you offer your kid for the sins of
Speaker 2: the world. Now you really get into that position of
Speaker 2: Mary having to walk through that. And you know when
Speaker 2: Jonathan and I were sitting on those steps and we
Speaker 2: were looking out at the ancient temple mount and the
Speaker 2: garden of Goitsemone and the path that we were going
Speaker 2: to walk down, which after we spoke, he said, I
Speaker 2: got to take my shoes off. I have to walk this.
Speaker 2: And he took his shoes off in his socks, and
Speaker 2: he walked all the way down, came and came back
Speaker 2: and I said to him, and this is on the
Speaker 2: heels of what you said, and that is he left
Speaker 2: the Last Supper. He went by Kai house on this
Speaker 2: ancient Roman road, and he was going to go down
Speaker 2: to the garden of Casemite. He knew very well that
Speaker 2: one of the twelve was betraying, yet he kept walking.
Speaker 2: He knew very well that he'd be arrested and brought
Speaker 2: back to Caiaphas's house and put into that dungeon, and
Speaker 2: he kept walking. And the big challenge for us on
Speaker 2: this particular series was will we keep walking? Because you
Speaker 2: probably are going to be betrayed at some point in
Speaker 2: your life, and you're probably going to be denied at
Speaker 2: some point in your life, or you know, disrespected in
Speaker 2: some way. Would you still walk? Would you still take
Speaker 2: those steps of faith? And so the only way that
Speaker 2: you can really do it is if you have Him
Speaker 2: in you, if you are walking in Christ and Christ
Speaker 2: is in you and empowered by the love of the
Speaker 2: Holy Spirit. And that's really what Easter is about. It's
Speaker 2: the victory over death, hell and the grave, and it's
Speaker 2: allowing us to experience that same spirit that raised Christ
Speaker 2: from the dead, and that same spirit that raised Christ
Speaker 2: from the dead now fuels us in our daily jobs.
Speaker 2: And our family and our extended family and politics. You know,
Speaker 2: every single area there's something different about you and there's
Speaker 2: something different about me. And that differences is the love
Speaker 2: of Christ in our life, and this week celebrates it
Speaker 2: in spades.
Speaker 1: It's funny because from the perspective of politics, because politics
Speaker 1: has sort of gotten like seeped into every aspect of
Speaker 1: our lives and even our children's lives in ways that
Speaker 1: I had never seen when I was a kid. I
Speaker 1: think of that this story in terms of what were
Speaker 1: the disciples thinking, because I think they were still still
Speaker 1: in a political mindset, even though their faith was very strong.
Speaker 1: They were still like, Okay, this guy's going to be
Speaker 1: the leader. You know, this is the king. He's going
Speaker 1: to take over all of these lands, and we're with him.
Speaker 1: We're with the king, not fully understanding what being with
Speaker 1: the king was, right. So I think so from their
Speaker 1: perspective on this weekend watching him be betrayed, what the
Speaker 1: emotions were. And I'm sure you walk through this in
Speaker 1: this journey. What are the emotions of being at your
Speaker 1: highest high? You know, you're having this dinner with the
Speaker 1: king of kings, and the feeling had to have been
Speaker 1: different than any other feeling. I can't even imagine it.
Speaker 1: Sitting with Jesus himself, you know, and learning from him
Speaker 1: and knowing that there is something so special, and then
Speaker 1: he gets betrayed. And Peter obviously is shocked because he's like, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I don't know the guy, you know, but you can
Speaker 1: see all this from today's perspective and say, my goodness, yes,
Speaker 1: you would be so afraid because the law of the land,
Speaker 1: you know, thinking Okay, he's going to be the next king,
Speaker 1: he's going to take over, and then you're kind of like,
Speaker 1: whoa in the on in the natural we got burned,
Speaker 1: you know, and the earthly sense this didn't go the
Speaker 1: way we thought it was the way Jesus was expecting,
Speaker 1: but they were kind of figuring it out as they went.
Speaker 1: The joy of Sunday had to have been incredible, but
Speaker 1: still there had to have been unease.
Speaker 2: Yeah, boy, you put it perfectly. We should have brought you.
Speaker 2: You could have given commentary here, because what you are saying, Tutor,
Speaker 2: is exactly what we followed, and that we went down
Speaker 2: into the Garden of Gasemone, we experienced the betrayal, we
Speaker 2: were brought back up to Caiaphas's house and the place
Speaker 2: where Jesus was downstairs there in that dungeon. You can
Speaker 2: hear outside right there. And if Peter says, man, I
Speaker 2: tell you I don't know the man, well, Jesus heard
Speaker 2: this and chills, Yeah, you said so well, And that
Speaker 2: is that Peter was on a high. They all were,
Speaker 2: And yet there was confusion. What's going on? And we've
Speaker 2: come in for the passover. Things are looking a little uncertain.
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, Judas leaves the last up or early.
Speaker 2: They go down to the garden. The Romans come in
Speaker 2: and Judas kisses him and betrays him. At that point,
Speaker 2: it's like, okay, what's going on? They're taking them away.
Speaker 2: Certainly there's got to be a way out of this.
Speaker 2: I mean, he's going to do some kind of miracle
Speaker 2: like we haven't ever seen before. And all their plans
Speaker 2: come crashing down as they take him, and of course
Speaker 2: they whip him, they beat him and they crucify him,
Speaker 2: and they put him in the tomb. And this attitude
Speaker 2: that people had, who was reflected in Luke twenty four
Speaker 2: and the Amais Road afterwards, these two individuals are doing
Speaker 2: what they're walking away from Jerusalem. Their heads are low,
Speaker 2: they're disappointed, their dreams are crushed. And as one preacher
Speaker 2: once said one time, you know, it's Friday, but Sunday's coming.
Speaker 2: You know, in your life it's Friday. Things don't look good.
Speaker 2: It's gloomy, cloudy. You're not sure about the future anymore.
Speaker 2: But Sunday's coming. And after the resurrection, you see what
Speaker 2: you were talking about. You still see this, this remnant
Speaker 2: of the disappointment. Because Peter was the leader, he had
Speaker 2: the keys to the kingdom, and he denied the lord
Speaker 2: three times. And afterwards there must have been that sheepish
Speaker 2: look of man, I wish I would have stuck in there.
Speaker 2: I'm so sorry, you know. And we see his heart
Speaker 2: reflected in that he says, I'm going to go back fishing.
Speaker 2: He goes back up north to Galilee to fish. Now,
Speaker 2: if you understand how you become a disciple. The rabbis
Speaker 2: would invite someone to become a disciple by saying in Hebrew,
Speaker 2: lech ACHRAI come follow me, And that's what he said
Speaker 2: to Peter. But now Peter's like saying, you know, I'm
Speaker 2: not the right guy. I think there's probably better choice.
Speaker 2: He goes back up to Galilee, and so Jonathan and
Speaker 2: I went back up to Galilee on the Sea of Galilee,
Speaker 2: and we went right to that place where Jesus shows up.
Speaker 2: And Peter is with some of the other disciples fishing
Speaker 2: because they're kind of going back, you know, and Jesus
Speaker 2: all of a sudden appears and it's around a charcoal fire,
Speaker 2: just like at Caiaphas's house, denied him around a charcoal fire.
Speaker 2: And then Jesus pulls Peter out and says, do you
Speaker 2: love me more than these? He says, Lord, yeah, I
Speaker 2: love you. Feed my sheep again, you love me? Feed
Speaker 2: my sheep a third time? You love me? He gets upset, Lord,
Speaker 2: you know everything about me. You know I love you.
Speaker 2: Then feed my sheep, tend my lambs, and then he
Speaker 2: ends that conversation with Peter. I can just in the series.
Speaker 2: I put my hand on Jonathan's shoulder and tell him this.
Speaker 2: As I looked at me, I said, ah, come fall,
Speaker 2: Yeah you fell, but the calling is still on your life.
Speaker 2: And I think that's good news for how many people
Speaker 2: who have failed in marriage, they failed in raising their children.
Speaker 2: At least they feel that way. They feel like I'm
Speaker 2: left over and in Jesus eyes, No, it's always a
Speaker 2: new beginning, and that's what Easter is. It's a new beginning.
Speaker 2: It's a new start in your marriage, in your relationship
Speaker 2: with people, in your hope for the future. So it's yeah,
Speaker 2: when you go there, it kind of comes alive. And
Speaker 2: when I brought Jonathan up there on the shores of
Speaker 2: the Sea of Gali, you could see in his eyes it.
Speaker 1: Was like, We've got more coming up with Jeff Cavens,
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Speaker 1: We've got more coming up after this. I think about
Speaker 1: all of those things that you just said, when you
Speaker 1: talk about how Peter felt and how he shied away
Speaker 1: from this, and how much that's like us. You know what,
Speaker 1: when we read the Bible, it's it is stories of
Speaker 1: earthly people who are people of faith. But we can
Speaker 1: continually fail, right, We continually fall back on what we
Speaker 1: know here because it's hard and I think that the
Speaker 1: message and maybe I'm wrong, but it feels like the messages. Look,
Speaker 1: this is a journey, and it's a hard journey, and
Speaker 1: you only you can keep bringing pulling yourself back. But
Speaker 1: Jesus is there. You've got to keep seeking him. He's
Speaker 1: never going to stop seeking you. He will never stop
Speaker 1: seeking you. But it is it's hard because I think
Speaker 1: about all of the different factors, all of the different
Speaker 1: outside worldly pressures. Because they followed this man when people
Speaker 1: were going, oh my goodness, he's not talking about the law.
Speaker 1: He's going against what we learned. He's not following the
Speaker 1: Old Testament, he's not following what Moses said. You know,
Speaker 1: this is all of this stuff is different, and we can't.
Speaker 1: We've got to get away from this guy. And then
Speaker 1: the disciples were like, no, there's something here. We're going
Speaker 1: to follow him. And then you go through the crucifixion
Speaker 1: and you've got to be like all of the worldly
Speaker 1: pressures that the people on the outside going told you, yep,
Speaker 1: told you it wasn't the Messiah, and then you it
Speaker 1: now falls on you alone when Jesus comes back and says,
Speaker 1: keep feeding my people, Well, that's on you. You have to
Speaker 1: tell the story. Now it is worldly people going out
Speaker 1: with faith and with the Holy Spirit and changing hearts
Speaker 1: and minds, and that to me is so powerful because
Speaker 1: that's you and me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right. You know. There's a text
Speaker 2: in the Bible says hope deferred makes the heart sick
Speaker 2: and in our lives. You know, you think back at
Speaker 2: all the times we had great hope about something and
Speaker 2: then something happened and hope was deferred. It didn't happen,
Speaker 2: and you feel sick about it, you know. And I
Speaker 2: think that the disciples probably felt that way when Jesus
Speaker 2: was put into the grave and what was that walk
Speaker 2: home like? What was that like? That day of oh
Speaker 2: my gosh, what is the last three years meant? You know,
Speaker 2: I'm going to get that backed And they must have
Speaker 2: felt that way. But the resurrection from the dead overcomes
Speaker 2: all of this. And if people are living with this
Speaker 2: idea of a sickness in their heart and their soul
Speaker 2: because hope has been deferred, whether in a relationship or
Speaker 2: their children or work or whatever it might be, I
Speaker 2: think that the resurrection renews all of this hope, because
Speaker 2: you know, our hope is not in man, you know,
Speaker 2: and our hope is not as Asalma says, not in chariots,
Speaker 2: and it's not in gold and silver or bitcoin or
Speaker 2: anything else. Our hope is in God. And I love
Speaker 2: this because you know, the Hebrew word, which is also
Speaker 2: the anthem for Israel, the national anthem, hot teak va
Speaker 2: tik va is hope, the hope. How tikva is that
Speaker 2: the hope that we have, we've been given in our heart.
Speaker 2: Hope is not a hope, so you know, and it's
Speaker 2: not a projection of the future based on my limited power,
Speaker 2: my limited perspective, my limited insight and wisdom. But it's
Speaker 2: a look at the future based on His unlimited power
Speaker 2: and his unlimited vision in wisdom given to me because
Speaker 2: I'm in Christ. And so when I look at a
Speaker 2: problem in my life and I and I think, oh man,
Speaker 2: I'm just such a loser, you know, And is this
Speaker 2: happening again? And you can change that attitude, and you
Speaker 2: can say, Lord, I'm going to hope in you. My
Speaker 2: hope is in you. My hope isn't in the market,
Speaker 2: you know. My hope, my hope certainly is not in
Speaker 2: politics necessarily, you know. And I think that's where a
Speaker 2: lot of people in our country are at right now,
Speaker 2: is that we have lived for a long time with
Speaker 2: hope in people and the the the the market, in
Speaker 2: our life, whether it be politics or Hollywood, or whether
Speaker 2: it be you know, the news, these things. People really
Speaker 2: relied on it. In the last five to ten years,
Speaker 2: everything has been scrambled a bit and people are like, wow,
Speaker 2: what do you know? What do we do? You know?
Speaker 2: I'll give you an example of that, Tutor. What was
Speaker 2: a few years ago, Father Mike Schmidts and I put
Speaker 2: together the Bible in a Year podcast And we did that.
Speaker 2: We did that. See, it was in twenty twenty and
Speaker 2: we were done by around October January first of twenty one.
Speaker 2: We got a call from our producer and said, are
Speaker 2: you sitting down, and yeah, it's your number one So
Speaker 2: number one?
Speaker 1: What?
Speaker 2: Number one?
Speaker 1: What?
Speaker 2: And they said it's number one podcast in America. What.
Speaker 2: We went on there to app and looked at it
Speaker 2: and we had to determine real quickly why why And
Speaker 2: we came to the conclusion it's not us. Had we
Speaker 2: been given that task of trying to do that, we
Speaker 2: wouldn't have done that. We would have tried to be
Speaker 2: funny or something, you know. But here's what the deal is.
Speaker 2: We believe the Holy Spirit did this. Why because everyone
Speaker 2: during the beginning of COVID, they were lonely, they were
Speaker 2: without work. Many of them they couldn't get out there.
Speaker 2: It was an awful time for a lot of people.
Speaker 2: And in the midst of it, it was like the
Speaker 2: Lord was saying, Okay, I'm going to come to you
Speaker 2: and I'm going to renew your life and I'm going
Speaker 2: to give you a plan for living. And that's the only, uh,
Speaker 2: that's the only conclusion we can really come to. And
Speaker 2: I think we're still in that to a degree. And
Speaker 2: so we have this, you know, we put out something
Speaker 2: like we did with Jonathan there, and my word, the
Speaker 2: response was incredible, just really incredible.
Speaker 1: An access in a way that young people understand better
Speaker 1: than sitting down and doing the job on your own
Speaker 1: of reading the Bible. You know, it's like there's there's
Speaker 1: a new new way of reaching people and that that
Speaker 1: was given to you, like this is how you're meant
Speaker 1: to do it. And I just I think about what
Speaker 1: you said about hope and the need for hope, and
Speaker 1: I think that's what we've seen in this country for years,
Speaker 1: and that's why that the environ the political environment, has
Speaker 1: become so toxic because there's a blame of who, you know,
Speaker 1: whose fault is it? And where do we put place
Speaker 1: our hope? And there has been a decline in the
Speaker 1: past ten years of people in the church. We now,
Speaker 1: like I said, we're seeing that steady off and that
Speaker 1: maybe even increasing a bit. And I believe that's because
Speaker 1: you know, they went around and they talked to young
Speaker 1: people in this new generation and they said, you know,
Speaker 1: what do you need? And years ago I was in
Speaker 1: a group where this woman said, we find that our
Speaker 1: students who are joining these different groups keep telling us
Speaker 1: that they're I want to be a part of something bigger.
Speaker 1: So I become an activist and I go out then
Speaker 1: I fight for a cause. And it's not a cause
Speaker 1: they believe in necessarily, it's something that they feel like
Speaker 1: they're a part of something bigger than themselves. And they said,
Speaker 1: you know, we're pushing them back to the church. There
Speaker 1: is a way to be a part of something bigger
Speaker 1: than yourself. They push them back to the church. And
Speaker 1: these young people have come in back to the church
Speaker 1: and even sometimes sought out Latin masses because they've said,
Speaker 1: you know, I want to really, really feel that closeness
Speaker 1: to God and that feeling of the Scripture and feeling
Speaker 1: of God's word on me and how that changes my life.
Speaker 1: And you're talking about this pilgrimage being life changing, and
Speaker 1: I just think it's so neat to watch how one
Speaker 1: app has brought so many people. Even if you were
Speaker 1: a church person, it's brought unchurched, it's brought church to people.
Speaker 1: But bringing you to that closer relationship with God is
Speaker 1: just so critical to getting through all these things. And
Speaker 1: then I think, honestly, we wouldn't have this fear of oh,
Speaker 1: my candidate's not here, my politicians not the one and
Speaker 1: what's going to happen. God's got this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you nailed it. I think you really
Speaker 2: nailed it. And when you talk about where young people
Speaker 2: are at today, because my wife and I we've watched
Speaker 2: the evening news, we see these protests for whatever reason.
Speaker 2: I mean, there's people that are sincere, and there always is,
Speaker 2: but we looked at it over and over and over
Speaker 2: and I said to my wife, I said, they don't
Speaker 2: believe in this, they're not even aware of really what
Speaker 2: the subject is, but they want to become a part
Speaker 2: of something that rises up and there's change, and there's
Speaker 2: purpose and so forth. And I get that. And what
Speaker 2: I would say to them is there is a purpose,
Speaker 2: and there is change, and there is someone to follow
Speaker 2: and to fight for, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ,
Speaker 2: who is some people say, a revolution, you know, and
Speaker 2: he's the one that stood up against the norm, and
Speaker 2: he's the one that said to love your enemies, and
Speaker 2: and so the I think that the more difficult you
Speaker 2: make Christianity in some ways, young people are like, that's
Speaker 2: for me. I'm going to do that, you know, And
Speaker 2: and they want to follow this radical guy, and I'm
Speaker 2: going to lay down my life even if i have
Speaker 2: to die. I'll die for you, kind of like Peter,
Speaker 2: you know, Lord, I'll die for you. And Jesus, hmmm, No,
Speaker 2: you're gonna You're gonna deny me before the cock crows
Speaker 2: three times, you know, deny me three times. So I
Speaker 2: think I think that, uh, you're You're exactly right when
Speaker 2: you look at the young people out there, and you
Speaker 2: can see I think I know you. That's what you
Speaker 2: and I are saying, kind of, you know, tutor, looking
Speaker 2: at them, I think I know you. I think I
Speaker 2: know what you're searching for Come here, I've got something
Speaker 2: for you. It's gonna blow your mind.
Speaker 1: It's been kind of neat to see celebrities get involved
Speaker 1: in this because I think that that is another group
Speaker 1: that young people tend to go. I'll put my hope
Speaker 1: in you all follow you. I think that something you're
Speaker 1: doing is impressive. And to see them kind of step
Speaker 1: out and be like, it's not about me. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: that's gotten some pushback too. I think it was Gwen
Speaker 1: Stefani who came out over Christmas and was talking about
Speaker 1: the Hollow app and she got a lot of pushback
Speaker 1: on us, like whoa what is this? And I think,
Speaker 1: you know, when you're in that position, all the pushback
Speaker 1: is fine if you save one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know the purpose of the app is
Speaker 2: not to gather together a bunch of speakers and singers
Speaker 2: who have their life completely one hundred percent totally put together.
Speaker 2: That is not the purpose. The purpose is to glorify Jesus,
Speaker 2: to proclaim the Gospel in a way that people can understand.
Speaker 2: And we do realize that along the way, there are
Speaker 2: a lot of people who are at different places on
Speaker 2: this journey, and there is nothing wrong with me walking
Speaker 2: with one or two and saying how are you doing,
Speaker 2: you know, and how are you relating to God in
Speaker 2: your life, all the while keeping what we call that orthodoxy,
Speaker 2: you know, their center stage. And so yeah, there are
Speaker 2: people who join us, you know, Lauren Daggel and Chris
Speaker 2: Pratt and Mark Wahlberg, and these are people who are
Speaker 2: actively you know, growing and trying to pursue their relationship
Speaker 2: with the Lord. You know, Tutor, the one thing we
Speaker 2: don't want to do is we don't want to project
Speaker 2: this idea that if you're going to hang with me
Speaker 2: or us, you got to have it together, you know.
Speaker 2: And we're not putting people on there like they're doctors
Speaker 2: of the Church, your great saints from the old These
Speaker 2: are people like you and me, you know. And the
Speaker 2: truth is that if people knew all about any of us,
Speaker 2: we probably would not be invited to the party.
Speaker 1: You know. Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue
Speaker 1: next on the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I saw a post
Speaker 1: on social media today and I don't know if it
Speaker 1: was true, but it was a good a good example
Speaker 1: of what we tend to do. It was this story
Speaker 1: of a bishop who had a woman and her young
Speaker 1: child come into the church, and she wasn't dressed the
Speaker 1: way the people expected her to be dressed. So people
Speaker 1: that worked at the church ushered her out, and the
Speaker 1: bishop said to them, you'll pray for her every day
Speaker 1: for the rest of your life, because there's a chance
Speaker 1: that she will never walk into a church again. And
Speaker 1: I want to make sure that we don't chase people off,
Speaker 1: that everybody is welcome. Yes, And I just think so
Speaker 1: often that is the case. It's like, oh, you don't
Speaker 1: really fit here, You're not really right, and we have
Speaker 1: to remember we don't really fit here. Yeah, yeah, we're
Speaker 1: never good enough. And yet he always welcomes us.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he's always saying, you know, come with me.
Speaker 2: I don't see Jesus at any point saying you you
Speaker 2: and you please stay.
Speaker 1: Back a little bit right right right.
Speaker 2: I've got reputation, i have a social media platform, I've
Speaker 2: got a book deal. It's about to be please please.
Speaker 2: He'd say, bring the children to me. Bring them and
Speaker 2: what do the what do disciples do? They tried to
Speaker 2: push them back, who wha, whoa? Give the superstars some
Speaker 2: rome here. No, he said, bring them to me, bring
Speaker 2: them to me. And I think that that's that's I
Speaker 2: believe the heart of Jesus, and that's the way I
Speaker 2: want to be, you know, And anybody that I can
Speaker 2: bring to the walk with the Lord, I'm going to
Speaker 2: do it because I know that here's the here's the
Speaker 2: interesting thing. I'll share this with you. You get you'll
Speaker 2: get a kick out of this. I think when uhhen
Speaker 2: Zachias down in Jericho, he's he's chief tax collector. That
Speaker 2: means he's he's hated by all the Jews. He's got
Speaker 2: he's the chief. He has underlings that are tax collectors.
Speaker 2: He has a fine home and everything. He has ripped
Speaker 2: people off. He has cheated people, you know. And when
Speaker 2: they see him coming to Jericho to do what he
Speaker 2: wants to see Jesus, he's you know, he gets up
Speaker 2: in the sycamore tree and he looks down he sees Jesus,
Speaker 2: and and Jesus looks up at him and says, you
Speaker 2: come on now, I'm going to have dinner at your house.
Speaker 1: They go crazy nuts.
Speaker 2: If he knew who that was, yeah, he wouldn't have
Speaker 2: them over for dinner. Does you know what that says?
Speaker 2: Something about his discernment. You know, he is so if
Speaker 2: he knew who that was. He'd never he would invite us,
Speaker 2: the Pharisees, you know, the scribes, we would be going
Speaker 2: to dinner. But here's the deal. They got ripped off
Speaker 2: of a lot of money. The only way that they're
Speaker 2: ever going to get back that money. And they're probably saying,
Speaker 2: you know you owe me, you ripped me off, you
Speaker 2: owe me. I wish I could take you to court,
Speaker 2: you know. But the only way they're going to get
Speaker 2: that money back is if Zechias has dinner with Jesus.
Speaker 2: And when Zechiez gets together with Jesus, his whole heart
Speaker 2: melts and he says, I'm going to give I'm going
Speaker 2: to give everything back to them in fourfold. And that's
Speaker 2: what happens when we invite the tax collectors and the
Speaker 2: chief priests to come into this intimate dinner with Jesus,
Speaker 2: and Jesus changes their heart and then that that that
Speaker 2: high priest turns around says, you know all of you
Speaker 2: that I know, I know I've done you wrong, and
Speaker 2: I know you've hated me all this time. I know it.
Speaker 2: I'm giving four fold back this guy, Jesus, that you
Speaker 2: allowed me to come into the city and view he's
Speaker 2: changed my life. Yeah, earlier about the lady with the dressing,
Speaker 2: you know, addressing what would happen if they had taken
Speaker 2: Jesus and just thrown them out of the city Zechias.
Speaker 1: And it's such so interesting at a time when we
Speaker 1: see people like looking at at somebody in their political
Speaker 1: party and saying, you talked to this person. You can't
Speaker 1: be a part of this group anymore. You can't, you
Speaker 1: can't be here. We've got to push you out. You're
Speaker 1: not acceptable. You crossed the line. This is an exclusive group.
Speaker 1: And yet Jesus didn't have an exclusive group. It wasn't
Speaker 1: an exclusive club with Jesus. It was open to all.
Speaker 1: And you think that you you think so many people
Speaker 1: look at Christianity as an exclusive group, but it's not.
Speaker 1: And that was why we have That's why Jesus came,
Speaker 1: That's why he sent, God, sent his only son. It
Speaker 1: was to say it's not exclusive. It's here for all
Speaker 1: of you. I'm coming to you to show you that
Speaker 1: it's here for all of you. And I just I
Speaker 1: think that's so amazing. And this weekend is always that
Speaker 1: weekend where you feel like he did it for me
Speaker 1: and I didn't deserve it. I don't know why he
Speaker 1: did it for me, and I think there is guilt
Speaker 1: in this weekend, and probably a good guilt, because that's
Speaker 1: that convicting guilt that on Sunday means we all get
Speaker 1: to say, at Sunday came, Sunday is here, he has
Speaker 1: risen and we get to rejoice in that. But before
Speaker 1: I let you go, I know I'm keeping you a
Speaker 1: little long, but let me ask you to just one
Speaker 1: more time. Tell people where they can get this, because
Speaker 1: I know I want my girls to walk that walk,
Speaker 1: and so people understand they actually get to see you
Speaker 1: walk this walk?
Speaker 2: Correct, Yes? With Jonathan? Yeah, I mean Jonathan's really the
Speaker 2: I think the folk of this is his experience because
Speaker 2: he's going to be filming in the weeks ahead now
Speaker 2: those scenes for the Chosen. And you know, people can
Speaker 2: go to you can download the Hello app and you
Speaker 2: can register that way. They do have a seven seven
Speaker 2: days free which is perfect for this, and if you
Speaker 2: want to get I think it's three months to check,
Speaker 2: but I think it's three months. You can go to
Speaker 2: Hello dot com forward slash Jeff Caven's my my name
Speaker 2: and they'll give you three months free on that. But
Speaker 2: you can get it. You can download it and you
Speaker 2: can begin watching right now, and you can pick up
Speaker 2: the whole week. You can go back and watch him
Speaker 2: as well, and it's really a great tool. You mentioned it.
Speaker 2: You're spot on for children because when children say that's
Speaker 2: the Garden of that's the Garden of gossemone and a
Speaker 2: boy that looks like Jesus, well that's Jonathan, but he
Speaker 2: plays Jesus.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's what I always say. I'm a very
Speaker 1: I'm a visual person and I know my kids are
Speaker 1: visual people. And I think we all sit down and
Speaker 1: we read those stories and we read those stories together
Speaker 1: as a family. But to put the visual with it,
Speaker 1: to see that, that's so much more powerful. And that's
Speaker 1: why I think it's so important people go to Hollow
Speaker 1: download the app you just heard. You can get three
Speaker 1: months free, So why would you not do it? Go there?
Speaker 1: And really, I think that you have to understand that
Speaker 1: the reason people like you are out there doing this
Speaker 1: for the folks listening is because we want you to
Speaker 1: have that hope. The hope that you talked about. It's
Speaker 1: just it's having gone through cancer, losing my dad to cancer,
Speaker 1: just all the things that you go through as a parent,
Speaker 1: all the struggles you go through. I don't know how
Speaker 1: I would have done it without Jesus.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you on that tutor. I just October.
Speaker 2: Last October my dad died, and then March first to
Speaker 2: this year, my mom died. And I know what you're
Speaker 2: saying is that is that there's something different about you
Speaker 2: and there's something different about me morning because we have
Speaker 2: this relationship with Jesus, there's even our mourning is different,
Speaker 2: and our hope is even in.
Speaker 1: That because it's we're separated for a time. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just like when I think about him at that dinner,
Speaker 1: looking at all of them and the difference between what
Speaker 1: they were going through at that dinner and the knowledge
Speaker 1: that he had at that dinner. I leave them tomorrow.
Speaker 1: I am separated for a time. That is the same
Speaker 1: feeling I had when I lost my dad. We're separated
Speaker 1: for a time. I'm so blessed that I get to
Speaker 1: see you again. And I think that's the if that
Speaker 1: doesn't sell you, I mean, that's the hope that you
Speaker 1: have in Jesus, is that you get to have eternal
Speaker 1: life in him because he has given his life for us.
Speaker 2: Amanda that I totally agree with you, totally agree.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you, thank you, and happy Easter coming up.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Jeff Cavens, like you said, go
Speaker 1: to the Hallow app for sure. Thanks for being on today.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you all for joining us on the
Speaker 1: Tutor Dixon Podcast. For this podcast and others, go to
Speaker 1: Tutor Dixon podcast dot com, the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts and join us next time.
Speaker 1: Have a blessed day.