1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,560 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 3 00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Hot Dog who is that? Our 4 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 1: super producer, mister Max Williams Hot Diggity Dog, Chocolate Starfish, 5 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:43,199 Speaker 1: Chocolate Starfish, then the. 6 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 2: Hot Dogs flavor water. 7 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: That's none other than mister Noel Brown no Diggity wonderful 8 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:55,040 Speaker 1: co host brother and podcast arms, also the research associate 9 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 1: for today's episode. 10 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 2: And and the friend, the front person of olymp Biscuit 11 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 2: cover band. I've been keeping that from you, guys. That's 12 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:08,320 Speaker 2: what I do on the weekends when no one's looking. No, 13 00:01:08,319 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: I'll be rolling. They hate him. Well, no, that's different. 14 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 2: I roll and rolling, rolling, rolling. Uh, and you're been 15 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,040 Speaker 2: bowling bowling, bowling, balling. He already said that, You did 16 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 2: say that. I'm just fitting it into the whole Limp 17 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 2: Biscuit motif. I'm fucking at the top because we are 18 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:29,040 Speaker 2: indeed talking about we're talking sausage. Yes, yes, hot dogs. 19 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 1: Indeed as you may as you maybor call, they're a 20 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:38,840 Speaker 1: pretty big deal in the US culture. But the story 21 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: doesn't really start there, does it. 22 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 2: Does it? Ever? You know maybe maybe sometimes. 23 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 1: Maybe sometimes maybe sometimes, But it's it's funny because I 24 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: was thinking about your research here not too long ago, 25 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:58,400 Speaker 1: when I was in a hurry to make dinner, and 26 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 1: I said, you know what, I'm gonna make a couple 27 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 1: of dogs. 28 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 2: I'm gonna do it right. 29 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: I'm gonna have some some relish, I'm gonna have a 30 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:08,920 Speaker 1: little bit of onion, a little bit of chili, got 31 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:13,080 Speaker 1: nasty with some cheese, and I thought, oh man, this 32 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: is such a great this is such a great food stuff. 33 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:23,520 Speaker 1: But I think maybe we start here. I don't know 34 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 1: about you, man, but I've always been mystified by the cylindrical, 35 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:34,920 Speaker 1: tubular dare we shay phallic shape of the hot dog must. 36 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 2: Happen, We must have been, but we will know it's true. 37 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 2: You can't really look at a hot dog and not 38 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 2: think that, at least for a hot second. And it 39 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 2: all goes. It all comes back to guts, man, It's 40 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:55,639 Speaker 2: all about guts. Hot dogs do to your point, Ben, 41 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 2: And you can't hold a thing like that in your 42 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:00,799 Speaker 2: hand not wonder about the story lineage of such a 43 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:06,520 Speaker 2: delicious and handholdable snack. And most historians do trace their 44 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 2: origins to German sausages. But the idea of the sausage 45 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 2: of making a cylindrical meat product goes further back than that, 46 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:21,239 Speaker 2: goes back, in fact, to sausages before the hot dog. 47 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:25,840 Speaker 2: The hot dog's ancestor is, of course, the humble sausage, 48 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 2: and a lot of records, historical records reference a sausage 49 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:36,280 Speaker 2: like food that first appeared in ancient civilizations, including the 50 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 2: Greeks and the Romans. It was achieved this shape that 51 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 2: you've mentioned, Ben, by stuffing minced meat meats of various 52 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 2: origins into animal intestines. That's the casing the snappy bit 53 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,160 Speaker 2: on the outside. And nobody likes to think of that, No, Adam, 54 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 2: I don't really care. I think we you and I 55 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,119 Speaker 2: all both we'll eat it. We'll eat a gut from 56 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 2: time to time. Mm hm Yeah, I like a little 57 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 2: tripe in my in my fa And you know, this 58 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 2: was a way of creating a longer shelf life for 59 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 2: the meat in question by stuffing it inside this kind 60 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 2: of edible pouch. 61 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, because think about it, folks, you've you've got the 62 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,719 Speaker 1: animal that you've already slaughtered, right, your sheep, your goat, 63 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:27,719 Speaker 1: your pig, your cow, et cetera. And you have the 64 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 1: food that is prized, right, the protein you would eat, 65 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,480 Speaker 1: but then you're thinking, how do I get all this 66 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 1: back in one place? And so it makes sense that 67 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: you would have the intestines and look at them and say, oh, 68 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:47,719 Speaker 1: I can the guiver a perfect package here. 69 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 2: A perfect package. Indeed, Ben, no, you nailed it. And actually, 70 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 2: if you're looking for some other sausage related episodes of 71 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,280 Speaker 2: Ridiculous Sisty, we got two that come to mind. One place, 72 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 2: Richard Blaze, for sure, that was more bacon oriented. Well, no, 73 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:05,359 Speaker 2: it wasn't a bacon versus sausage. That's true in his 74 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,159 Speaker 2: episode of Food Court that you and I did. But 75 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 2: we also did an episode pretty early in the history 76 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 2: of this show about botox, the vacullinium toxin that was 77 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:22,039 Speaker 2: derived from spoiled sausages, and also about sausage intestine type 78 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:27,280 Speaker 2: casings used to create early Zeppelins. And you can find 79 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 2: both of those in the feed. But we are talking 80 00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 2: specifically about that aha moment that usually comes along with 81 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 2: an oopsie of some sort, right, yeah, yeah, the aha oopsie, 82 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 2: and this in this case, it happened at the behest 83 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 2: of the Roman emperor Nero, whose chef goes by the 84 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 2: name of Gaius, may have accidentally stumbled upon the method 85 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 2: of creating a casing out of animal guts. God, this is, 86 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 2: you know, a legendary myth kind of thing. But Guias was, 87 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 2: you know, overseeing his kitchen, was preparing these roasted pigs 88 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 2: for some sort of you know, presumably debauched bacchanalia. 89 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: And they were supposed to be starved for a whole 90 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:14,279 Speaker 1: week before they're killed. 91 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 2: Right. I didn't know this. No, I didn't know that either, Ben, 92 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:20,200 Speaker 2: And that that is I guess a way of I 93 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 2: guess is that sort of like a veal, It makes 94 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:25,719 Speaker 2: the meat more delicate or something. I don't know. 95 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:30,599 Speaker 1: Maybe it's we've all eaten Chiplin's before. Maybe it's a 96 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:31,919 Speaker 1: matter of hygiene. 97 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,479 Speaker 2: Could well be Ben, But as the legend goes, Guyas was, 98 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 2: you know, overseeing his kitchen. And by the way, fabulous 99 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 2: article from history dot com, the Extra Long History of 100 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 2: the hot Dog that I'm pulling some of this information from. 101 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 2: Very clever. We love our writers. Over your history. Stephanie 102 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 2: Butler wrote this one from ancient Roman sausage to Nathan's 103 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:56,479 Speaker 2: Coney Island hot Dog, The history of tubular meat may 104 00:06:56,520 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 2: stretch back millennia, she writes. So god Bias was overseeing 105 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 2: the preparation of these starved animals, and one of them, 106 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 2: it would seem, was roasted without being cleaned. So, in 107 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 2: other words, all of the offal and the stuff that 108 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 2: you know inside the cavity had not been pulled out 109 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 2: as customarily would be the case before roasting them. And 110 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 2: when he popped the thing open, outspilled a cornucopia of 111 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 2: gutty parts. 112 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 1: M Yeah, this guyas we could only imagine, encounters something 113 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 1: like when you open a package that's been delivered and 114 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 1: you see all the little puffs of air, right, the 115 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: plastic air puffying or the styrofoam or what have you. 116 00:07:48,480 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 1: He sees all this packaging essentially, and because the intestines 117 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: are empty, as the pig had been starved for a week, 118 00:07:56,800 --> 00:08:00,080 Speaker 1: and because they are puffed up from the heat, they 119 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: clearly look like contators. And he has this light bulb 120 00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:10,880 Speaker 1: moment way before light bulbs are invented, where he apocryphally exclaims, 121 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 1: I have discovered something of great importance. And so he's 122 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: got a bunch of like wheat and spices, right, because 123 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 1: he's top dog chef. 124 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 2: So he. 125 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 1: I'm laughing because he literally stuffs the intestines with this 126 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: minced meat and the spices and this wheat as filler. 127 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 2: Is it twisted or genius or geniusly twisted. 128 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: I think it's both, man. 129 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:39,719 Speaker 2: I think it really is. I mean, it's the kind 130 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 2: of story we always hear when it comes to like 131 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 2: the first person that figured out how to eat the 132 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:47,560 Speaker 2: snotty insides of a crustacean and then found it to 133 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 2: be delectable, or the mushrooms that you know killed you 134 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 2: are made just see crazy stuff until you found the 135 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 2: one that just tasted. 136 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 1: Nice, right right. And we do know thanks to hotdog 137 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,559 Speaker 1: dot org. Hot dash dog dot. 138 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:04,200 Speaker 2: Love that that exists, as we typically do with these 139 00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:07,440 Speaker 2: very specific orgs. I love the Internet, man. 140 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 1: What we learned from our friends over at hot dashdog 141 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:15,840 Speaker 1: dot org is that sausage is indeed one of the 142 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 1: oldest forms of processed food. It's even mentioned in the 143 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:26,640 Speaker 1: Odyssey by Homer not Honda, dating back to ninth century BCE. 144 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:28,959 Speaker 2: Ben, have you heard a lot of this kerfuffle that's 145 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 2: being made about the Christopher Nolan Odyssey coming out? 146 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:36,960 Speaker 1: Dude, I was just reading about some of that, people 147 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 1: seem to be skeptical. I think there was a trailer release, 148 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:44,360 Speaker 1: but I'm a sucker for a good a good piece 149 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:45,199 Speaker 1: of mythology. 150 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I love a sword and sandals kind of thing. 151 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 2: But I think the issue is that Nolan is pretty 152 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:56,160 Speaker 2: you know, infamous for being a stickler for details, for 153 00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 2: like historical details, and he has you know, said as 154 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:02,200 Speaker 2: much about this project in his press runs. But it's 155 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 2: my understanding that there is not anyone of note that 156 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 2: is of Greek lineage that has been cast in the film. 157 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 2: And also there are some questions about like the type 158 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 2: of bronze, whether they could have like bronze that was 159 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 2: made to appear jet black, whether that was a process 160 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:20,559 Speaker 2: that was even popular at the time. So there's some 161 00:10:20,559 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 2: people that are getting a little up in arms about it, 162 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 2: but it is true, and you gotta wonder are sausage 163 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 2: is featured in Christopher Nolan's Odyssey. 164 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, spoiler folks, we suspect that's the main plot, 165 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: because one would hope we've actually read the Odyssey. 166 00:10:38,640 --> 00:10:43,479 Speaker 2: It's actually a sequel to seth Rogen's Sausage Party. Absolutely 167 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 2: yet so. But speaking of spoilers, the whole idea here, 168 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 2: and this idea of it being a processed food is 169 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:53,120 Speaker 2: to again extend the shelf life. But this early version 170 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 2: it was really just kind of creating sort of an 171 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 2: air tight package. Like you said, it wasn't until layed 172 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 2: or that more preservatives would be used, and that it 173 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 2: truly would be a much more processed food as we 174 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 2: know those today nitrates and things like that. 175 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, Max, give us some sweeping civilization esque music 176 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:16,360 Speaker 1: to portray the passing of time? 177 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:23,080 Speaker 2: Do perf? How goes SIEV music? Do you build it? 178 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 2: We're belding so so sim music at least according to 179 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 2: step six. It's actually what it does is it combines 180 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:32,560 Speaker 2: music of all the different civilizations you have met in 181 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:36,080 Speaker 2: the game. Oh oh, and that reminds me Max really quickly. 182 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 2: Just and I know this isn't exactly on topic, but 183 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:41,800 Speaker 2: jumping back to Christopher Nolans the Odyssey, another thing that 184 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 2: he said, and it sort of contradicts a lot of 185 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 2: his other choices, is that they didn't have orchestras back then, 186 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 2: so he wanted the score to be ented they wanted 187 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 2: he wanted the score to be entirely orchestra free. So uh, 188 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:56,320 Speaker 2: Ludwig van Gorenson. I think we both love it for 189 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 2: his production work with Childish Gambino, and also he's just 190 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 2: really become kind of the it composer in Hollywood. He 191 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:08,120 Speaker 2: apparently made the entire score using only gongs, various sizes 192 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 2: of gongs, but then he just kind of slipped in 193 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 2: the fact that he also ran them through modular synthesizers 194 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:16,960 Speaker 2: and which definitely didn't exist either. 195 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:22,960 Speaker 1: And hit the gongs with big old wingers. Yeah, because 196 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: we're adults, we can so Max, thank you again for that. 197 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 2: Sort We squandered that sweeping time change music. 198 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: But yeah, here we are over time. Centuries and centuries happen, 199 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 1: empires rise and full, but food remains a constant right 200 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:43,880 Speaker 1: because it's a universal need of people. Sure, so different 201 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 1: regions of Europe are figuring out what d rose Chef 202 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: apparently called later. We suspect Nolan and I suspect this 203 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,439 Speaker 1: was a lot of parallel thinking. As you always like 204 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:02,559 Speaker 1: to say, Nol, but you gotta face it. We go 205 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: to Germany fairly often. Noel goes more often than I do, 206 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: but Germany's very famous or sausages, like if you walk 207 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 1: into a German butcher shop. I'm confused by how many 208 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: types of sausage exists. 209 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:24,200 Speaker 2: Well, the word wiener, you know, is derived from the 210 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 2: region of Germany called Vienna or Veen, and that is 211 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 2: where the term wiener comes from. Another you know, interchangeable, 212 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:38,599 Speaker 2: at least the way it's come to be today. Frankfurture 213 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 2: comes from another city in Germany called Frankfurt, and they 214 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 2: claim that their sausage tradition dates as far back as 215 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:50,079 Speaker 2: the Middle Ages. There are some local historians that trace 216 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 2: Frankfurt is back to the thirteenth century, but Vienna also 217 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:58,280 Speaker 2: claims to have had a significant hand in the creation 218 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 2: of the sausage made from a mixture of pork and 219 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 2: beef that resembles much more closely than what Gaius was 220 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:09,520 Speaker 2: up to the modern hot dog, and even the term 221 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 2: hot dog, as we'll get to its origin is a 222 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 2: German dog. So Frankfurt, as it's known in Germany, Mine 223 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 2: the mine being a river, is traditionally credited with originating 224 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 2: the Frankfurter, but the claim is disputed by a lot 225 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 2: of folks that do seem to believe that the sausage 226 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 2: known as the dochsundt dot that means the little Dog 227 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 2: sausage was created in the sixteen hundreds by a guy 228 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 2: named Johann Jorg Henner, who was a butcher who lived 229 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 2: in Coburg. Didn't Coburg, No, No, that's Cherniberg. We were 230 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 2: talking about fin France, and I believe that's in Saxony. 231 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 2: We were talking about d Day the other day, So 232 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 2: I'm interchanging these things. Coburg is in Germany, and according 233 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 2: to a report cited by Hotdashdog dot Org, he later 234 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 2: traveled to Frankfurt in order to promote his product that 235 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,120 Speaker 2: he had in fact already created in Cobra. But you 236 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:14,600 Speaker 2: know what, man, a lot of these like origin stories, 237 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 2: it's less about where someone was geographically when they made 238 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 2: the thing and more about where it took off. 239 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:26,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, and where humans began telling the story to each other. Uh, 240 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 1: there's a There are some phenomenal authors who wrestle with 241 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,280 Speaker 1: these same questions. One of my favorites is a guy 242 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 1: named Mark Kurlansky, who wrote a book entirely about salt 243 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 1: and It's Cold. In a burst of creativity, can you 244 00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 1: guess salt? 245 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 2: You nailed it? The book, the ride, the movie. It's 246 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 2: a Paige Sturder. 247 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 1: I can't believe it's a novel thing about salt. 248 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 2: Well, salt is is it's that's that is civilization though, right, like, 249 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: there's so much and you could argue the same thing 250 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:05,479 Speaker 2: about hot dogs. And ben a colleague of ours, Jamie Loftis, 251 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 2: who does incredible podcast stuff and other things like stand 252 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:11,800 Speaker 2: up and she's a playwright and just and an author, 253 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:14,400 Speaker 2: wrote an entire book about hot dogs. 254 00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: She did, yes, and we have read it and it's 255 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 1: pretty awesome, to be honest. We're not blowing rainbows, we're 256 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: not blowing sausage links, but we we this earl that's 257 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 1: a little too evocative, but we can tell you that 258 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: based on the work of folks like Kurlansky and hotdashdog 259 00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: dot Org and Loftus, we understand that the history of food, 260 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:48,960 Speaker 1: especially when you get really far back, usually doesn't have 261 00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: a lot of paperwork. It's not very well documented, like 262 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 1: who's the first person who figured out to put salt 263 00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:58,520 Speaker 1: on something? You know what I mean? Or to your 264 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 1: point about mushrooms as well, we generally will see that 265 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 1: the modern you know, Hebrew national that you might buy 266 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:13,359 Speaker 1: in a grocery store today comes from Central European sausage 267 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:18,640 Speaker 1: traditions that are parallel. Thinking multiple folks figured this out. 268 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: There's not one hot dog messiah. 269 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 2: Ooh, but I love the concept of a hot dog messiah. 270 00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: Right. 271 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 2: It's not the messiah that we wanted, but it's the 272 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:28,679 Speaker 2: one that we deserve. 273 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:32,439 Speaker 1: Could you please change this water into wide No, but 274 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:34,879 Speaker 1: how do you feel about the hot links. 275 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,879 Speaker 2: Hot dog water? Hot dog water. I'll take your water 276 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:41,400 Speaker 2: and I'll some awesome dogs in it, and magically it 277 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 2: transmutes into hot dog water. The idea of sausage links 278 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:55,159 Speaker 2: to is interesting because if you really see traditional the 279 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 2: way sausages are made. I love the concept too, of 280 00:17:57,560 --> 00:18:00,440 Speaker 2: how the sausage is made, the implication being some gross 281 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 2: that you don't want to know about. You take the 282 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:06,080 Speaker 2: casings and you stuff them, and then you twist them, 283 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 2: and that's how you get all these like bangers that 284 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:10,719 Speaker 2: are like joined together, and you can like toss them 285 00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 2: over your shoulder. Great way to make them even more portable. 286 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, I've never bought or I've 287 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 1: never purchased one of those chain links of sausages or 288 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 1: hot dogs when I when you don't see them as 289 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: often that much anymore, not. 290 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:34,119 Speaker 2: In the States, unless you go to a cool ass butcher, like, 291 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:38,160 Speaker 2: we're so lucky to have spotted trotter. In Germany, though, 292 00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 2: you can go to any corner butcher and they will 293 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:44,000 Speaker 2: have like a little glass dome with like sausage linked 294 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 2: up kind of more dry, you know, meant to be 295 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 2: eaten on the go as a snack. And you can 296 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:53,440 Speaker 2: buy like four or five of them linked together for nothing. 297 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:55,880 Speaker 2: And they're so good man, they really do know how 298 00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:58,680 Speaker 2: to do do sausages there in Germany. 299 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:05,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, and thankfully a lot of German nationals immigrated to 300 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:07,920 Speaker 1: the United States. This is part of the story of 301 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:09,440 Speaker 1: the hot dog, right, because. 302 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:12,280 Speaker 2: That's why it's the story of immigration. Is the story 303 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:16,360 Speaker 2: of this country, like so many food products, and the 304 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 2: tracking the lineage of them is in and of itself 305 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 2: a story of the movement of people. Yeah. 306 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:28,879 Speaker 1: Now, as we said earlier, the Frankfurter is commonly thought 307 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:33,160 Speaker 1: to be developed in Frankfurt in fourteen eighty seven. As 308 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:37,040 Speaker 1: you said, Noels, so it way predates the United States. 309 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:40,359 Speaker 1: We had our hilarious conversation. 310 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 2: About the term weener. I am an. 311 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: Adult, I can vote. It looks like the North American 312 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: hot dog, the kind of Hebrew national elite today comes 313 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 1: from this European sausage that was brought here by butchers 314 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:01,480 Speaker 1: and various immigrants from throughout Europe. 315 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:05,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, the North American as we know it, the indigenous 316 00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:12,840 Speaker 2: North American hot dog, comes from this European sausage that 317 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,720 Speaker 2: we've been talking about, brought here by those folks that 318 00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 2: you mentioned. However, the big question remains, we know where 319 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:23,919 Speaker 2: the sausage came from, but where did the bun come from? 320 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,719 Speaker 2: And then who came up with the idea of sticking 321 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:29,800 Speaker 2: them together. As you can imagine, we do have some 322 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 2: alternate theories as to how that went down. 323 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, think about it this way, folks. She got German immigrants, butchers, salespeople. 324 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:43,440 Speaker 1: They're going to urban centers like New York City, Chicago, 325 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 1: Saint Louis, Cincinnati, and they're selling street food basically. 326 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:48,840 Speaker 2: Right. 327 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,960 Speaker 1: And before we get to the bun, we've got to 328 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:56,119 Speaker 1: mention the Colombian Exposition of eighteen ninety three. This is 329 00:20:56,160 --> 00:21:00,639 Speaker 1: where a bunch of people get together and Chicago. 330 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 2: It's a big to do. 331 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: If you ever get the chance to go to a 332 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 1: World's Fair or an exposition, please do visit. There are 333 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:13,639 Speaker 1: thousands of folks who are discovering new kinds of food, 334 00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:18,320 Speaker 1: and they're seeing all these hot dogs, these sausages. This 335 00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 1: is where you do a lovely bit in the research 336 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: stool and you point out there is a hot dog 337 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:30,440 Speaker 1: historian named Bruce Craig, a PhD historian in hot dogs 338 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:36,359 Speaker 1: at Roosevelt University, and he says, look, the German manner 339 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 1: was to always eat these docks and or little dog 340 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:41,920 Speaker 1: sausages with bread. 341 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, as is the case today. I mean, if you 342 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,600 Speaker 2: go to Germany, you're not gonna typically see a you know, 343 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:53,640 Speaker 2: a traditional hot diligible, but no, it's gonna be bavos, 344 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:57,919 Speaker 2: midwot or buchin, which are like these little breads and 345 00:21:57,960 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 2: that you could cut it and then stick the dog 346 00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:02,640 Speaker 2: in side or literally just put the dog on top 347 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:04,719 Speaker 2: and you put the mustard on the dog. But it's 348 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:09,439 Speaker 2: not really a bun. And Germans are they love their bread. 349 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 2: They're very particular, very particular about their bread, as of 350 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 2: course the French are as well. So the question then 351 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 2: becomes like, you know, sure the Germans were probably eating 352 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 2: their you know, sausages with bread since time immemorial, or 353 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,919 Speaker 2: since the sausages kind of were around. But that's not 354 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 2: necessarily the same thing as the like elongated split traditional 355 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:35,639 Speaker 2: americanized hot dog, buton that we see at baseball games. 356 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, for that we have to go to an historical debate. 357 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:46,640 Speaker 1: So a lot of hot dog boffins are going to say, hey, 358 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:51,120 Speaker 1: there's a story that isn't true. This is the story 359 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:55,639 Speaker 1: that historians hate. The story goes, or the legend we 360 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: could call it, is that in nineteen oh four there 361 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: was a Bavarian street vendor we could call them, named 362 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 1: Anton Futswangler, and he was at the Saint Louis, Louisiana 363 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 1: Purchase Exposition. So apparently, again according to the legend, he 364 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: he is selling these very hot, fresh baked sausages and 365 00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:27,280 Speaker 1: he gives his customers these cheap white gloves so that 366 00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 1: they don't burn their hands while they're fing Yeah, they 367 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:35,879 Speaker 1: don't burn their fingies. And he realizes, hey, I can't 368 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,879 Speaker 1: trust all these strangers. I'm giving these people these gloves 369 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 1: as alone, but they're not giving them back. 370 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:46,840 Speaker 2: They're just away. You don't give away a thing expecting 371 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,439 Speaker 2: to get it back unless you take a deposit. I mean, 372 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 2: I'm sorry. This thing screams of apocryphal. 373 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: One hundred percent and So he goes to his brother 374 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: in law, a guy who is a baker, and he says, hey, man, 375 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,520 Speaker 1: can you you bake gloves? 376 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 2: Helps me out? I'm out of white. 377 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 1: Gloves, right, And so the baker looks at the sausage, 378 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 1: looks at his brother in law, loves the guy and 379 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 1: doesn't want him to fail, and we can only imagine 380 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:21,359 Speaker 1: he had some leftover materials. That's where, according to this 381 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,840 Speaker 1: kind of malarkey story, we find the long soft rolls 382 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 1: that seem custom tailored to fit the hot dog. 383 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 2: Yeah. Sadly, though, there is still that discrepancy of hot 384 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:38,400 Speaker 2: dogs coming in a certain number and buns coming in Yeah. Yeah. 385 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 2: I'll never forget that scene from Father of the Bride 386 00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 2: with Steve Martin where he freaks out and rips the 387 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 2: package open and takes only the number of buns that 388 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 2: he wants and the guy's like, you can't do that. 389 00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 2: He's like, I'm making a stand. I can relate, man, 390 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,160 Speaker 2: but you gotta you know, these people don't get paid 391 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 2: enough to deal with your craziness in the in the 392 00:24:58,440 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 2: grocery store. 393 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,400 Speaker 1: Steve Martin exactly, Steve who is by the way, did 394 00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:05,920 Speaker 1: you know Steve Martin is one of the best banjo 395 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: players on the planet. 396 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:08,800 Speaker 2: He knows how to pluck at a banjo. 397 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:10,960 Speaker 1: I was surprised. 398 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 2: I've been playing for a very long time. He incorporated 399 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,879 Speaker 2: into a lot of his early stand up and he 400 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:18,719 Speaker 2: really truly is. I think it's They're called like the 401 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 2: Steep Canyon Rangers, I believe is the name of this group, 402 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,000 Speaker 2: and it's not a comedy group. It is just an 403 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:26,720 Speaker 2: absolute top notch bluegrass outfit. Yeah. 404 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:30,880 Speaker 1: You go into Steve Martin experience and you think I'm 405 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: gonna see some amazing stand up, and then part way 406 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 1: through you go, oh, this guy is just actually amazing 407 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:37,680 Speaker 1: at the banjo. 408 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:40,360 Speaker 2: This guy can shred, this guy shreads. 409 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: What we do know here is that sausages were phenomenal 410 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: in the American sphere, Like there was a great appetite 411 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,880 Speaker 1: for it. So by the late eighteen hundreds, you can 412 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 1: already see a sausage something that doesn't quite look like 413 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 1: your hot dog today in a long rowle, and it's 414 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:07,159 Speaker 1: being served and sold in multiple US cities, especially on 415 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: the East Coast, which I think gives us a clue 416 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: about immigration and innovation. 417 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, and we also it also gives us a clue 418 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,440 Speaker 2: about that historical game of telephone, you know that you're 419 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 2: always talking about Ben. There's another hot dog apocryphal hot 420 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:29,479 Speaker 2: dog story, origin story that historians kind of you know, 421 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:32,960 Speaker 2: turn their noses up at. Some believe that the term 422 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 2: was coined in nineteen oh one at an event that 423 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 2: took place on the New York Polo Grounds on a 424 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 2: frigid April day, where vendors were selling the dogs that were, 425 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 2: you know, being kept warm in hot water tanks and 426 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 2: shouting out their slogans something along the lines of get 427 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 2: them while they're hot, you know, get your docsun sausages, Well, 428 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,240 Speaker 2: they're red hot, and red hots is another name for 429 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,560 Speaker 2: a type of sausage. And apparently, as the story goes, 430 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:05,160 Speaker 2: a cartoonist named Ted Dorgan from the New York Journal 431 00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 2: saw the you know, the kerfuffle, the delicious kerfuffle, and 432 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 2: decided he to draw a little cartoon to commemorate this 433 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:18,240 Speaker 2: historical moment, wherein he kind of anthropomorphized the hot dogs 434 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 2: and made them into little barking docs and sausages hanging 435 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,399 Speaker 2: out in these little buns. He didn't know how to 436 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,240 Speaker 2: spell the word, as the story goes, so he wrote 437 00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:32,119 Speaker 2: hot dog instead of Docson and apparently, you know again, 438 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 2: as the tale goes, that the cartoon was a big 439 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,320 Speaker 2: hit and the term hot dog took off from there. 440 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,119 Speaker 2: But this particular cartoon seems to be lost to history, 441 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:45,200 Speaker 2: if it ever existed in the first place. So yeah, 442 00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:49,440 Speaker 2: there's definitely a huge body of work by this particular cartoonist, 443 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:53,000 Speaker 2: but this does not seem to be among it. So yeah, 444 00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:55,360 Speaker 2: the historians seem to believe that that one's another one 445 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 2: that's kind of been you know, largely exaggerated, if not 446 00:27:57,960 --> 00:27:58,840 Speaker 2: entirely trumped up. 447 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: I love it though, especially because we skipped a bit 448 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,359 Speaker 1: of lunch today to record, so I'm super into hot 449 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: dog history. We're gonna make some hot dogs here in 450 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:14,119 Speaker 1: the home studio after this. We also one thing I 451 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:19,880 Speaker 1: love that you found here is that the easiest way 452 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,879 Speaker 1: to figure out when something becomes a thing is to 453 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:28,879 Speaker 1: look back into printed material. This is why Craig and 454 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:34,720 Speaker 1: other culinary historians hot dog boffins. This is why they 455 00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 1: spend so much time digging through history for the first 456 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: printed instance of the phrase hot dog. They see it 457 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:49,200 Speaker 1: again in the late nineteenth century. In the eighteen nineties, 458 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:55,400 Speaker 1: it was used at Yale in eighteen ninety four, specifically 459 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: referring to something called dog wagons, which speak. 460 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 2: Of like a pro food truck or like an ice 461 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,880 Speaker 2: cream you know what do you call it? Like a 462 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 2: little pushcart. But instead of selling you know, cold treat, 463 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:10,840 Speaker 2: you're selling hot dogs. And this is something that would 464 00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 2: go around to the different dormitories, and the name kind 465 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 2: of became a bit of a regional in joke, not 466 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,240 Speaker 2: a compliment, not a compliment again, how the sausage was 467 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 2: made there, it did become a question as to whether 468 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:28,280 Speaker 2: or not, you know, these kind of mystery meats contained 469 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 2: some things that maybe would not be particularly culturally appropriate 470 00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:35,400 Speaker 2: to eat. 471 00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, and do check out our earlier episode on the 472 00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: amazing growth of Chinese restaurants in the United States and 473 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:49,800 Speaker 1: the racism those folks had to had to overcome. So 474 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: we know, a hot dog was definitely derived from some 475 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,120 Speaker 1: perspective about German immigration. 476 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 2: It was also definitely a compliment all the time. 477 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 1: But there is one reason beside convenience that made the 478 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 1: hot dog an American staple. Dare we say, an icon 479 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 1: up there with apple pie this one and cracker jacks 480 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:20,600 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah yeah. And seventh, any stretches This one 481 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 1: is for our own Max Williams. The hot dog owes 482 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:27,560 Speaker 1: its success to baseball. 483 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, as baseball became America's pastime, the hot dog became 484 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 2: inextricably linked with the sport. The spectacle. There you go of, 485 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:48,760 Speaker 2: you know, attending the old, the old ballgame. So Smithsonian 486 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 2: mag has a delightful piece by Donald Dale Jackson called 487 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 2: hot Dogs are Us. It's no stretch to say they're 488 00:30:56,560 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 2: more American then, as you said, Ben apple Pie, because 489 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 2: they lay us together. Everyone's going to be making that joke. 490 00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,320 Speaker 2: It's simple. Oh yeah, I didn't even do it on purpose. 491 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 2: It just this hat and he had this to say. 492 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,520 Speaker 2: They were Americanized through their association with public events. According 493 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 2: to a person who spoke to the author for this 494 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 2: piece named Bruce Craig, people ate them at baseball games, 495 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:23,880 Speaker 2: horse races, fairs, and circuses. Today America is hot dog 496 00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:30,480 Speaker 2: HQ with rival styles regional specificities in terms of what 497 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 2: what does the hot dog make from places like New 498 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 2: York and Chicago. There's even a Seattle dog we'll get 499 00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 2: to in a little bit, and it is a bit 500 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 2: of a source of some good natured beef. Haha. Gosh, 501 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 2: you just walk right into all of them. New Yorkers 502 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 2: would say that Chicago dogs are you know, way overkill 503 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 2: unga patchka, as my buddy Wigs would say on the 504 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,720 Speaker 2: dough Boys podcast putting a hat on a hat In Chicago, 505 00:31:57,880 --> 00:31:59,960 Speaker 2: they would say they put an entire salad over the 506 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,560 Speaker 2: dog because they're embarrassed at the way it tastes. I 507 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 2: love a Chicago dog. You know who else loves the 508 00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 2: Chicago dog. 509 00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:10,400 Speaker 1: People from Chicago, People from Chicago. 510 00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:13,680 Speaker 2: But Anthony Anthony Bourdain. Oh yeah, it is a real 511 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:16,120 Speaker 2: evangelist for the Chicago dog. And I will die on 512 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,200 Speaker 2: that hill. I think it is the superior dog. It 513 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,680 Speaker 2: is true, it is true. Don't necessarily like the full 514 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:26,320 Speaker 2: pickle spear on it, but everything else is good on me. 515 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 2: And we'll get to some of these different. 516 00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,480 Speaker 1: Weird rules about condiments, I hope, uh huh oh definitely yeah, 517 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: no catchup allowed on a Chicago dog, let's see. 518 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 2: But A guide to Chicago fast food bad mouths the 519 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:44,080 Speaker 2: New York Dogs from Smithsonian, again referring to as this 520 00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 2: is tough, guys, but I'm gonna get through it. A 521 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 2: little limp Wiener drowning in gloppy stewed onions and sour crowd. 522 00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,880 Speaker 2: What a fair I don't know, man, some of those 523 00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,240 Speaker 2: street hot dogs in New York are not great. Well 524 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 2: what do you expect. 525 00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:03,240 Speaker 1: It's like, it's how much good a padana costs? 526 00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,840 Speaker 2: Michael. That's a very good question, Ben. But I will 527 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 2: say there are other forms of street meat that are superior, like, 528 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 2: you know, absolutely a little bit of chicken and rice. 529 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 2: You know, I love a hala bowl. 530 00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:16,360 Speaker 1: You know. 531 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 2: It just seems like some of the hot dog vendors 532 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 2: are phoning in it. Yeah, I hear you, I hear you. 533 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: In some cases, I'll say it, they're clearly laundering money. 534 00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,520 Speaker 2: But but I was like, it's like the pizza places. 535 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,600 Speaker 2: It's like the pizza places. Uh, and Ben, you'll be 536 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:37,040 Speaker 2: thrilled to know, and Max as well, that Pizza Hut 537 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 2: is bringing back the classic Pizza Hut experience. It's our 538 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:44,120 Speaker 2: youth and one of them is going to be in 539 00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,560 Speaker 2: Blue Ridge, which is not too far. We have to 540 00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,080 Speaker 2: be we are I want to go. 541 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 1: We have to go together. 542 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 2: I really want to go. And it's it's such a 543 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,800 Speaker 2: good excuse to go for a lovely little, you know 544 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 2: day in the mountains and in a classic pizza hut, 545 00:33:56,280 --> 00:34:00,400 Speaker 2: pizza parts, those red cups, those red plastic cus in 546 00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 2: the stained glass little table overhang. 547 00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:08,840 Speaker 1: We could play a pickup game of basketball with kids, 548 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:13,120 Speaker 1: or demolish a little league team. They go back to celebrate. 549 00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:17,799 Speaker 1: That's awesome, that's great news, and that's quinte essentially American. 550 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: We should do a history of pizza hut one day. 551 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:25,600 Speaker 1: But we know that the hot dog now is if 552 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,920 Speaker 1: you're not from the States, you are familiar with the 553 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:32,560 Speaker 1: American modern version of the hot dog because you see 554 00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:37,960 Speaker 1: it in countless TV shows and countless gosh, even reality 555 00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: TV or films. They're associated with picnics and cookouts and 556 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 1: definitely baseball games. We know that they've even become a 557 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:54,239 Speaker 1: tool of diplomacy because back when we had FDR as 558 00:34:54,280 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: a president in nineteen thirty nine, he made international headline 559 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:04,920 Speaker 1: because George the sixth, the guy from Britain from earlier 560 00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: the King, visited the US and the White House chef 561 00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 1: was like, hey, President Roosevelt, what should we serve this 562 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:19,960 Speaker 1: visiting royalty, And without missing a beat, all FDR said, 563 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:21,280 Speaker 1: give him hot dogs. 564 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 2: Give him hot dogs. Yeah, that's true. It's like Trump 565 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:30,319 Speaker 2: would probably make it big Max. You know, at this 566 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:32,919 Speaker 2: point he was kind of trying to spread the word 567 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,760 Speaker 2: sort of the way that remember in the Potato episode, 568 00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:40,000 Speaker 2: they were serving potatoes to foreign dignitaries and using potatoes 569 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:43,759 Speaker 2: as you know, the main ingredient in a lot of 570 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,920 Speaker 2: like state dinners, and it was a way of spreading 571 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,279 Speaker 2: the word of the potato. Yeah. 572 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 1: And some of the more high faluting, like the Boston 573 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,760 Speaker 1: Brahmins or the blue blood New Yorkers in the crowd, 574 00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:02,719 Speaker 1: some of them said that Velt was screwing up because 575 00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: he was serving street food to the literal king of 576 00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:12,240 Speaker 1: the United Kingdom. But word on the street changed once 577 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 1: the public learned King George had a hot dog politely 578 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: and then he had a second hot dog. He was 579 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 1: housing these dogs. 580 00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,880 Speaker 2: He was housing those dogs, man, just shoveling them down. Uh. 581 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:32,399 Speaker 2: And you know it's just it's kind of the everyman food. Yeah. 582 00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:35,880 Speaker 1: Walking while you're eating it. You can hold it with 583 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,920 Speaker 1: one hand, you know, you got your other hand for 584 00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: your soda or whatever. 585 00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:42,919 Speaker 2: I don't suck it out of your sleeve because it'll 586 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:44,520 Speaker 2: get lies in your throat and then you need a 587 00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:47,000 Speaker 2: special vacuum cleaner to suck it out. 588 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:51,600 Speaker 1: Skip lunch I'm getting so hungry thinking about this. We 589 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:54,560 Speaker 1: do have to mention, of course, uh nol, as you 590 00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:59,879 Speaker 1: point out here, we do have to mention a titular milestone, 591 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 1: watershed moment in the history of the hot dog, that 592 00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:06,840 Speaker 1: is Nathan's famous and Cody Island. 593 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:13,760 Speaker 2: Right in nineteen sixteen, Nathan Handworker opened what you just mentioned, 594 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 2: his first hot dog stand. He sold hot dogs at 595 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,800 Speaker 2: a bargain price that he, you know, was able to 596 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,640 Speaker 2: undercut all his competitors, helping further establish them as a 597 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,799 Speaker 2: kind of you know, universal food of the people. His 598 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:32,680 Speaker 2: stand began to amass acclaim far and wide and really 599 00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:36,120 Speaker 2: helped popularize the hot dog outside of just the boroughs 600 00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:41,880 Speaker 2: of New York. Not to mention, of course, Nathan's famous 601 00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:44,879 Speaker 2: hot dog eating contest that later turned the hot dog 602 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:50,160 Speaker 2: into a symbol of this bizarre to me anyway, sports 603 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 2: as well as American popular culture, and the hot dog 604 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,000 Speaker 2: eating contest that happens at Coney Island every year is 605 00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:57,880 Speaker 2: still you know, hugely popular. 606 00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:03,200 Speaker 1: Absolutely, and I went down a huge rabbit hole about 607 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:08,480 Speaker 1: this for several years before we even started Ridiculous History. 608 00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:09,920 Speaker 2: It's it's such. 609 00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:14,600 Speaker 1: A bizarre and thoroughly American pastime. I'm not sure if 610 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,879 Speaker 1: we could call it a sport, but competitive eating does 611 00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:21,320 Speaker 1: have all the ingredients of a sport. 612 00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:23,880 Speaker 2: And also these people that are the best at it 613 00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:30,359 Speaker 2: aren't like big, you know, gluttonous talking. I'm talking yep, 614 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:35,960 Speaker 2: for sure. It really did. The hot dog eating sports 615 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 2: took on a bit more kind of cachet or gravitas 616 00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:45,480 Speaker 2: when Takuru Kobayashi won the Nathan's Contest in two thousand 617 00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:48,840 Speaker 2: and one, eating fifty hot dogs in only twelve minutes, 618 00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 2: roughly doubling the previous winning totals. And you might have 619 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 2: heard of some of these techniques. This is not again 620 00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:59,800 Speaker 2: just glutton the stuff. There's there's strategy here. Some of 621 00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:02,320 Speaker 2: his techniques that he more or less invented, I guess, 622 00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:06,080 Speaker 2: separating the dogs and the buns and soaking it's not appetizing, 623 00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 2: by the way, soaking the buns in water. It really 624 00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:14,520 Speaker 2: did give this event much more of a sense of 625 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 2: you know, competitive edge and you know skill, rather than 626 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 2: being a little bit more like, you know, who was 627 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:25,000 Speaker 2: the fattest fat boy on the block? Right right, who's 628 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 2: the biggest piggy. 629 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:30,080 Speaker 1: It's it's not that it's uh, there is something. 630 00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:33,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, r yeah, yeah, it's crazy. 631 00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:36,400 Speaker 1: I have to mention this as a student of the game. 632 00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:41,560 Speaker 1: During Kolbiyashi's halsey odd years, during the height of his fame, 633 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:48,080 Speaker 1: he was studied by doctors who found this is you know, 634 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:49,720 Speaker 1: the scuttle butt. 635 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 2: They found that he had a. 636 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:58,000 Speaker 1: Mutation of sorts. His stomach was not constrained by his 637 00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:04,719 Speaker 1: rib cage, so and under it, providing more area of absorption. 638 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,920 Speaker 1: At least that's the legend. There are a bunch of 639 00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:13,800 Speaker 1: legends about competitive eating. Shout out to Sonya the Black Widow, Thomas, 640 00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:18,440 Speaker 1: shout out to, of course Joey Chestnut, which already sounds 641 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:19,520 Speaker 1: like a made up name. 642 00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 2: It it really does. These folks must have had like 643 00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:25,600 Speaker 2: the metabolisms of hummingbirds. In two thousand and seven, Joey 644 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:31,600 Speaker 2: Chestnut dethroned Kobayashi and began, you know, absolutely dominating in 645 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:34,640 Speaker 2: It's referred to in some of the sources I'm reading 646 00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 2: as the most dominant runs in sports periods. He won 647 00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:42,080 Speaker 2: Jordan of it. He really is. He won the contest 648 00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,520 Speaker 2: numerous times and set a record of seventy six hot 649 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:47,319 Speaker 2: dogs and buns in ten minutes in twenty twenty one, 650 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:51,560 Speaker 2: not too terribly long ago. His rivalry with Kobyashi is 651 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:57,439 Speaker 2: really a big you know again sports beef that gave 652 00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:00,520 Speaker 2: competitive eating much more of a mainstream quality. 653 00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,680 Speaker 1: And you can watch it with us live very soon 654 00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,000 Speaker 1: next month, less than a month away. I'm getting too 655 00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:08,799 Speaker 1: excited about it. 656 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:13,040 Speaker 2: It's fine. We have the hot dog contest. I've never 657 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:16,080 Speaker 2: watched it. I'm really glad that you mentioned that, Ben. 658 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:20,040 Speaker 2: I'm sure it is, but I'm at least morbidly curious. Yeah. 659 00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:25,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, well you will scratch that itch, Noel, because it's 660 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:28,719 Speaker 1: when they go to town. They certainly go to town. I 661 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:31,960 Speaker 1: want to go back to one of those stats you mentioned. 662 00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 1: I cannot imagine eating seventy six hot dogs in a series, 663 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:41,800 Speaker 1: no matter how much time I have. 664 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:46,440 Speaker 2: No ten minutes. Four is too much. Four is too many. 665 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:48,960 Speaker 2: Four is too many. I will say though, hot dogs 666 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,040 Speaker 2: two is they should come in. I do like if 667 00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:53,920 Speaker 2: I'm eating them at home, I'll always make two, Always 668 00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:56,560 Speaker 2: make two. Yeah. Remember that scene in Weapons where they 669 00:41:56,560 --> 00:42:00,680 Speaker 2: have like ten like it was the time I started 670 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:02,719 Speaker 2: reading about. When that movie came out, people were talking about, like, 671 00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:04,960 Speaker 2: what's up with the hot dog scene? And apparently it's 672 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 2: a reference to the Whitest Kids you know sketch which 673 00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:12,600 Speaker 2: Zach Craigor was a member of that crew. We have 674 00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:18,440 Speaker 2: teased multiple times some of the distinctive regional spins on 675 00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,880 Speaker 2: the hot dog, so I think we wrap with a 676 00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:23,920 Speaker 2: few of those for you to try. I mentioned I've 677 00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:25,960 Speaker 2: already come down on the side of the way they 678 00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:30,520 Speaker 2: do it in Chicago with mustard relish, and it's kind 679 00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:36,240 Speaker 2: of a weird green like, you know, almost ungodly neon 680 00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:40,360 Speaker 2: green colored relish, onion, tomato, pickle spear could take it 681 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,279 Speaker 2: or leave it, sports Peppers, That's what does it for me. 682 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:47,080 Speaker 2: And Celery salt. I really love that, And traditionally on 683 00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,680 Speaker 2: the Chicago Dog, Ketchup is a no no. You'll even 684 00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:54,080 Speaker 2: hear Obama talking about that. He absolutely abhorrors ketchup, and 685 00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:55,759 Speaker 2: that is a very Chicago perspective. 686 00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know what ketchup did to Chicago, but 687 00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:03,000 Speaker 1: there's still very pissed about it. Also, the tomato. 688 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,839 Speaker 2: Take it or leave it? I agree to me, the 689 00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:10,160 Speaker 2: real winner are the sports peppers and the Celery sauce 690 00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:12,800 Speaker 2: and the onions and the mustard and the relish. 691 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,239 Speaker 1: I'm not opposed to the mustard. We also have to know, 692 00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:19,680 Speaker 1: going back to the Chicago New York City rivalry, we 693 00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:22,520 Speaker 1: also have to know that the New York style dog 694 00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:26,360 Speaker 1: is going to be a bit simpler in formation. 695 00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,280 Speaker 2: For sure it is. It is a much more cut 696 00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:34,520 Speaker 2: and dry, straightforward dog, typically served with brown mustard, sauer kraut, 697 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:38,239 Speaker 2: and a kind of an onion sauce. Yeah, it's sort 698 00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:42,000 Speaker 2: of sauteed caramelized onions. Sometimes almost has a little bit 699 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,560 Speaker 2: of a barbecue quality too, maybe yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 700 00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:48,480 Speaker 2: it's certainly different spins on it. On the onion sauce, 701 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:49,160 Speaker 2: you can do that a lot. 702 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:52,000 Speaker 1: Some of it will be fresh chopped and others will 703 00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:55,920 Speaker 1: be clearly just sort of out of a container. 704 00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,840 Speaker 2: Which is funny though, because they're New York. Kind of 705 00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:03,080 Speaker 2: two styles of dog, the other being, of course, the 706 00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,520 Speaker 2: coney dog, referring to Coney Island, and this one usually 707 00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:10,560 Speaker 2: has chili with mustard on top and onions. And though 708 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:15,480 Speaker 2: it is kind of associated with Coney Islands, even if 709 00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:18,120 Speaker 2: you get it at Sonic, I think they call it 710 00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:21,759 Speaker 2: a coney it did in fact originate in the Midwest. 711 00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:26,439 Speaker 1: And then we have we have multiple variations of this 712 00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:29,440 Speaker 1: and you know, a lot of it, folks, is going 713 00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:33,279 Speaker 1: to be people in the US fighting about toppings. We 714 00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:37,600 Speaker 1: got to talk about the Dodger dog. It's branded advertising. 715 00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:42,239 Speaker 1: It's for the La Dodgers baseball team. They sold in 716 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:46,040 Speaker 1: twenty eleven and nope, I think we can assume Max 717 00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:51,800 Speaker 1: already knows this. In two thousand, twenty eleven, the Dodgers 718 00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:59,520 Speaker 1: Stadium sold two million hot dogs, and the question immediately 719 00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:05,240 Speaker 1: became for everybody involved, what makes this Dodger dog so unique? 720 00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:10,440 Speaker 2: What makes it special? Well, they're particularly long. The traditional 721 00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:12,920 Speaker 2: hot dog would be around six inches and the Dodger 722 00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:17,240 Speaker 2: dog's more in line with ten, so they are considered 723 00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,440 Speaker 2: the biggest hot dogs on the market. You can get 724 00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:23,560 Speaker 2: them in a couple different hot dog varietals, the Super 725 00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:27,480 Speaker 2: Dodger Dog, which is one hundred percent beef sausage, while 726 00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:32,760 Speaker 2: the Doyer Dog swaps the traditional toppings for jalapinos, salsa 727 00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:36,480 Speaker 2: and chili. Then they have a veggie and vegan version, 728 00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:40,160 Speaker 2: the Italian Dodger Dog with shredded mozzarella and marin aasa, 729 00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,200 Speaker 2: and the Southwestern Dodger Dog with has a little bit 730 00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:47,600 Speaker 2: of sour cream, avocado slices, pico degayo, and other things. 731 00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:50,880 Speaker 2: And La does have another pretty famous hot dog place 732 00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:54,960 Speaker 2: known called Pinks that people talk about a lot, and 733 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:58,000 Speaker 2: I've never been. The lines are always crazy long. LA 734 00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:00,279 Speaker 2: is typically known as more of a burger town, but 735 00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:02,160 Speaker 2: they also do dogs pretty dang well. 736 00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:06,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, most US cities will will make a good hot 737 00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:11,279 Speaker 1: dog for you, from Atlanta to Seattle and beyond. Now 738 00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,640 Speaker 1: I had a question for you to know about this 739 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:18,200 Speaker 1: Seattle style hot dog. I've never tried this cream. 740 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:24,160 Speaker 2: Cheese, you know, doesn't immediately peak my appetite, but I'd 741 00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:26,440 Speaker 2: try it. You know, if there was a if I 742 00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:28,640 Speaker 2: was in Seattle and there was someone making one the 743 00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:31,320 Speaker 2: authentic Seattle way, I'd give it a go. It wouldn't 744 00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:34,600 Speaker 2: be wouldn't be my go to preparation though. Yeah. Yeah, 745 00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,160 Speaker 2: I love cream cheese, but it just feels like it's 746 00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:39,200 Speaker 2: again kind of putting a hat on a hat. Yeah, 747 00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:40,200 Speaker 2: wish Yeah. 748 00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:44,200 Speaker 1: And we also everybody from New York who's writing the 749 00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:47,880 Speaker 1: email now, don't worry, we got you. We're well aware 750 00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:51,799 Speaker 1: of Gray's Papaya and the Papaya dog. We've all been. 751 00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:56,160 Speaker 1: It's inexpensive. It is considered one of the best hot 752 00:46:56,200 --> 00:47:00,080 Speaker 1: dogs in the city of New York. So if you 753 00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:02,640 Speaker 1: get a chance and you find yourself in the Big Apple, 754 00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:06,600 Speaker 1: if you've got like a loose three dollars and forty 755 00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:09,160 Speaker 1: five cents, get a put by a dog. 756 00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:12,040 Speaker 2: For sure, And I guess we can just wrap with 757 00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:15,720 Speaker 2: kind of hot dogs as they are today. Like many things, 758 00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,520 Speaker 2: the Industrial Revolution changed hot dogs as well, from a 759 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:22,279 Speaker 2: street food to a mass produced product that you could buy, 760 00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:26,160 Speaker 2: you know, in odd numbered packages in the grocery store. 761 00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:31,080 Speaker 2: The advent of Oscar Meyer and their titular Wiener mobile 762 00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:38,720 Speaker 2: really revolutionized refrigeration and supply chain and distribution packaging. Of course, 763 00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:42,560 Speaker 2: I'm creating a network that allowed the hot dogs to 764 00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:47,640 Speaker 2: be sold in supermarkets all over the country. The great, 765 00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,200 Speaker 2: the great democratization of hot dogs, which further made it 766 00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:54,239 Speaker 2: the people's food. By the mid nineteen hundreds, as you've 767 00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:58,480 Speaker 2: already mentioned, ben became a staple of bapguard barbecues, July 768 00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:04,640 Speaker 2: fourth celebrations, school lunches, sporting events of course, and family cookouts. 769 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:09,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, and this becomes a global phenomenon all the way 770 00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:15,399 Speaker 1: from murky undetermined legends to the modern day. As we 771 00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:19,600 Speaker 1: record on Tuesday, June ninth, twenty twenty six, you go 772 00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:23,760 Speaker 1: pretty much anywhere in this wide world, and you're gonna 773 00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:27,920 Speaker 1: run into something like a hot dog. And the beautiful 774 00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:32,160 Speaker 1: thing about it is, you know, similar to pizza, right, 775 00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:37,160 Speaker 1: or similar to a hamburger. All these different cultures and 776 00:48:37,239 --> 00:48:40,839 Speaker 1: countries have adapted the basic idea of the hot dog 777 00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:44,560 Speaker 1: to their local preference. So you'll have breads you've never 778 00:48:44,600 --> 00:48:48,840 Speaker 1: heard of, You'll have sauces you've never tasted. You'll have toppings, 779 00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:51,279 Speaker 1: some of which you will love and some of which 780 00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:53,440 Speaker 1: will thoroughly confuse you. 781 00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:56,400 Speaker 2: Like mustardo mustard. 782 00:48:56,760 --> 00:49:00,720 Speaker 1: I was not expected of a startouff it's today. 783 00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:02,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I guess you could put it on 784 00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:03,960 Speaker 2: a hot dog, right, isn't it like a like a 785 00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:07,120 Speaker 2: it's like a mustard fruit, right, mustard fruit? 786 00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:07,279 Speaker 1: Not? 787 00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:11,440 Speaker 2: Thanks? Yeah, yeah, it's traditionally one of the weirder condiments 788 00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:14,120 Speaker 2: that comes up, and we talk about this kind of stuff. So, 789 00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:17,879 Speaker 2: what began as a European tradition even previous to that, 790 00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,000 Speaker 2: a whoop see, a culinary whoop see that led to 791 00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:25,680 Speaker 2: stuff in animal guts with you know, seasoned meats, evolved 792 00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:29,680 Speaker 2: into one of the most recognizable facets of American cuisine. 793 00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:33,680 Speaker 2: Hot dogs and hamburgers. You know, just a simple combination 794 00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:37,000 Speaker 2: of meat and bread. That really does like to the 795 00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,120 Speaker 2: earlier point of this stuff, tracking the movement of people 796 00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:44,680 Speaker 2: and culture represents a very rich culinary history, immigration and 797 00:49:44,920 --> 00:49:47,080 Speaker 2: entrepreneurship and of course pop culture. 798 00:49:48,000 --> 00:49:53,200 Speaker 1: And people will say the hot dog is as American 799 00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:57,400 Speaker 1: as apple Pie. Not only is that not the case, 800 00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:03,120 Speaker 1: as we've solved here today, but also apples are from Kazakhstan. Everybody, 801 00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:05,680 Speaker 1: please tune in for our upcoming. 802 00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:10,799 Speaker 2: Episode and apple Pie's Dutch. What yes, tune in for our. 803 00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:17,439 Speaker 1: Episode on an unhinged eccentric named Johnny Appleseed. Noel, thank 804 00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:22,080 Speaker 1: you so much for this awesome research brief. I'm a 805 00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:25,360 Speaker 1: little mad at you because it does have me hungry 806 00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:28,880 Speaker 1: and starving. But also big thanks to our super producer, 807 00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:31,120 Speaker 1: mister Max Williams. 808 00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:35,279 Speaker 2: Max the coney Boy Williams. How about long Dog too, 809 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:37,080 Speaker 2: dirty long Dog? 810 00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:40,040 Speaker 1: Silver long Dog, Silver long Dog. 811 00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:45,240 Speaker 2: So only the third time I've gotten that nickname? Oh wow? 812 00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:49,120 Speaker 2: All right? Oh humble brags, Yeah, humble brags. Huge thanks 813 00:50:49,160 --> 00:50:52,880 Speaker 2: to Jonathan Strickland, the Quizler, A J. Bahamas, Jacobs, the Puzzler, 814 00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:55,200 Speaker 2: Chris Frasciotis and Leaves, Jeff Coates. 815 00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:57,759 Speaker 1: Here in spirit and huge thanks to Kobeyashi. 816 00:50:58,200 --> 00:51:07,680 Speaker 2: Mm hmm, what was the next time, folks. For more 817 00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:11,279 Speaker 2: podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 818 00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:13,360 Speaker 2: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.