1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:03,560 Speaker 1: You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:04,440 Speaker 1: Sports Radio. 3 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 2: He is the Monday morning quarterback. Senior NFL reporter Albert 4 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 2: Breer is back. We always want to know who won 5 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,959 Speaker 2: and who lost. Here, Uh, let's start with that. The 6 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 2: immediate reaction to who won the trade deadline? 7 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 3: Oh, I, you know, that's a good question because I 8 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:26,680 Speaker 3: think some man of these teams are in such different positions, 9 00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:29,479 Speaker 3: and so, you know, what the Colts did conceptually is 10 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 3: so different than what the than what the Jets did. 11 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 3: You know, you know, I really actually like where the 12 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:40,480 Speaker 3: Cowboys are at now because I think they come out 13 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:46,959 Speaker 3: of the mosaic right of the Micah Parsons Quinn Williams situation, 14 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,319 Speaker 3: and if you like, really like add the whole thing 15 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 3: up right, they got a year and a half older 16 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:57,959 Speaker 3: with a key defensive player. They have a disruptive defensive 17 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 3: tackle instead of a disruptive edge. Now, they save about 18 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 3: twenty million dollars a year on the contract, and they 19 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:08,760 Speaker 3: move a second round pick into the first round. So 20 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 3: if you look at the totality of it, if they're 21 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:15,399 Speaker 3: able to maximize quinnin Williams, now you've got quote Quentin 22 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 3: Williams and Osa Digiezuwa to be the foundation of your 23 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:23,400 Speaker 3: defense that you're trying to build with Maddie Eberflus. There, 24 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 3: Maddie Eberflus's best defenses in Indianapolis were built around to 25 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 3: a dominant defensive tackle into Forest Buckner and a really 26 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 3: good detackle next to. 27 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 4: Him and Grover Stewart. 28 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:37,319 Speaker 3: And you know then, I mean even you look look 29 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,040 Speaker 3: at the veteran end of it. They trade a guy 30 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 3: in Mazzie Smith who was a game day inactive for 31 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 3: him and get a really good veteran back in Kenny Clark. 32 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 4: So is it going to help the Cowboys like right now? 33 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 3: No, I don't think it makes them a playoff team 34 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 3: in twenty twenty five, But I think it does position 35 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 3: them to build pretty aggressively, maybe keep George Pickens and 36 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 3: you know. 37 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 4: Really take a big swing in twenty twenty six. 38 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 2: What do you think what the Colts did? Speaking of 39 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 2: big swings. 40 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,239 Speaker 3: So what's interesting about the Colts is they pushed the 41 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 3: chips in the middle of the table on the core 42 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 3: that they have now right, so like they're. 43 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:17,640 Speaker 4: Basically at the spot now. 44 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:19,639 Speaker 3: They're coaches in his third year, they're gms in his 45 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:22,840 Speaker 3: sixth year, and so they've got this core of players 46 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 3: that they really believe in. Right, So the offensive line, 47 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 3: it's Nelson, it's Smith, it's Raymond, it's Tyler Warren. At receiver, 48 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 3: it's Downs, it's it's Pierce, it's Pittman obviously, Jonathan Taylor, 49 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 3: and running back veteran. 50 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 4: Players like Buckner and Franklin. 51 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:44,120 Speaker 3: In the front seven, you've got, you know, a really 52 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:47,239 Speaker 3: a really good young player in Latu Lotsu at defensive end. 53 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 4: So you're really pushing your chips into the. 54 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 3: Middle of the table on those guys, But in particular, 55 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:56,280 Speaker 3: you're pushing your chips to the middle of the table 56 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 3: on Daniel Jones. 57 00:02:57,480 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 4: Like because to me, this takes. 58 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 3: Away you're opportunity to go and get a quarterback over 59 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 3: the next. 60 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,920 Speaker 4: Few years, right, because how you probably. 61 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 3: Do that as you spend high draft picks, either to 62 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 3: take them in the draft or to trade for that quarterback, 63 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 3: and without first round picks the next two years, it's 64 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:16,680 Speaker 3: going to become much harder to acquire one. Which tells 65 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,079 Speaker 3: you they're all in on Daniel Jones. Puts pressure on 66 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:21,600 Speaker 3: them to sign Daniel Jones, but it tells you that 67 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:23,880 Speaker 3: they think Daniel Jones is more than just an answer 68 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 3: for twenty twenty five. So that's what's so interesting about 69 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:28,280 Speaker 3: it to me. And I do like what it means 70 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 3: for them in the here and the now, which is 71 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 3: this is a position that they were really looking for 72 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 3: help at over the last couple of weeks and probably 73 00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 3: the weakest spot on the roster in that Pittsburgh game 74 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 3: the other day a few weeks. For now, it's gonna 75 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 3: be the biggest strength, one of the biggest strengths in 76 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 3: the roster with Sauce Gardner on one side and sure 77 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 3: Various Ward coming back from injury. 78 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 4: On the other side. 79 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 3: Both those guys are versatile, They'll be able to match 80 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 3: against different receivers, and they'll allowed. 81 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 4: For lou In a Romo to be more creative with 82 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:57,560 Speaker 4: what he's doing up front. 83 00:03:57,640 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 3: So all the way around, I love it for what 84 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:02,760 Speaker 3: it means for them for twenty twenty five, but it 85 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 3: really does mean they're in on this core and they're 86 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 3: in on Daniel Jones going for beyond just this. 87 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 2: Year, and it feels like if I'm the Colts, I'm 88 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 2: building my team, reinforcing my team to beat the Chiefs, 89 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 2: just like it felt like the Ravens built their roster 90 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 2: with Ausie Newsom to beat the Steelers, and they figured 91 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,640 Speaker 2: if they're beating the competition their own division, they're good 92 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 2: enough to win a Super Bowl? Are the Colts built 93 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 2: to beat the Chiefs? 94 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 4: Right now? That's the way it looks. 95 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think if you're going to have 96 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 3: a chance against the Chiefs, we've seen it over the 97 00:04:36,320 --> 00:04:39,599 Speaker 3: last five years. The way to beat the Chiefs is 98 00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:42,360 Speaker 3: you have to disrupt their passing game and you have 99 00:04:42,400 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 3: to hit Patrick Mahomes. 100 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 4: And that's like, that's the. 101 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,359 Speaker 3: Way it is with all great quarterbacks, right, like the 102 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 3: greatest of all time, Tom Brady. How would you beat 103 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 3: the Patriots back over those twenty years. You would beat 104 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,600 Speaker 3: them by beating their offensive line. 105 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:56,679 Speaker 4: And beating up Tom Brady. 106 00:04:56,839 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 3: And so I think by going and getting Sauce Gardner 107 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,599 Speaker 3: and ge and getting Ward back from injury, you know, 108 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 3: now you've got an opportunity to create chaos up front, right, 109 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,280 Speaker 3: and so they're gonna be able to do so much 110 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 3: more with their with their defensive front. 111 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:13,600 Speaker 4: And you know, the. 112 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 3: Hope is then the doubt that allows you to get 113 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 3: in Patrick Mahomes's face, disrupt the timing of their offense 114 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 3: and maybe get them playing from behind a little bit 115 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:22,920 Speaker 3: more than. 116 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:23,479 Speaker 4: They would like to. 117 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 3: So, yeah, I can certainly see that, Dan, if that's 118 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:30,720 Speaker 3: your takeaway where this would be very you know, very 119 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 3: chief centric move by the Colts. 120 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:35,039 Speaker 2: Give me the team that surprised you that they didn't 121 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 2: make a move. 122 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:42,279 Speaker 3: Seattle makes some move, you know, the Rams, I would say, 123 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 3: the Rams. I I thought, like, you know, coming into this, like, 124 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 3: look at their biggest need over the first half of 125 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:51,479 Speaker 3: the year has been corner, and they did make a 126 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 3: move there. They they traded for Roger McCrary, brought him 127 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 3: over from from from Tennessee. 128 00:05:58,320 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 4: I thought the. 129 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,520 Speaker 2: Buffalo Buffalo I thought was going to make a move 130 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 2: or needed to. 131 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,679 Speaker 4: Yeah, so those two, like the Rams. Like the reason 132 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:10,039 Speaker 4: I say the Rams right is the Rams because because 133 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 4: they had. 134 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,359 Speaker 3: Really kept their powder dry, you know, like over the 135 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 3: last few years they had kind of reset and the 136 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 3: whole FM picks thing, Like now all of a sudden, 137 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 3: they they're getting you know, big production guys in the 138 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 3: first round. They're using first round picks his capital in 139 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:28,440 Speaker 3: a different way. And so like, you know, I remember 140 00:06:28,480 --> 00:06:30,799 Speaker 3: talking to guys there where it was like we still 141 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 3: had this in US. It's just going to take the 142 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 3: right opportunity coming along. So them not being as aggressive, 143 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 3: I think that surprised me just a little bit, although 144 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 3: I still I have them in the super Bowl, so 145 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 3: I'm not gonna be too critical of them. And then 146 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 3: the Bills are my other team in the super Bowl, 147 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,400 Speaker 3: and I think the one thing I did expect to 148 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 3: happen yesterday, I was expecting the Bills to make a 149 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:55,880 Speaker 3: move for a defensive tackle because that Oliver is out 150 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:58,480 Speaker 3: until at least the playoffs, and it's no short thing 151 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:00,120 Speaker 3: that they're going to get him back in the playoff 152 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,440 Speaker 3: depending on that biceps injury. So yes, they were snipping 153 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 3: around a receiver, and I thought Shaheed would have really 154 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:09,040 Speaker 3: worked for them. The price was relatively high for Shahed, 155 00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:12,120 Speaker 3: but defensive tackle was one spot where I really thought 156 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 3: they would at least add someone, and so the fact 157 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 3: that they didn't do that did get my attention a 158 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 3: little bit. 159 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 2: Albert Breer, Monday Morning Quarterback, their senior NFL reporter, Why 160 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 2: didn't the Raiders trade Max Crosby. 161 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:27,320 Speaker 3: Because he's still he's twenty eight, I think twenty seven 162 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 3: to twenty eight, so they still view him as a 163 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:32,640 Speaker 3: piece of their like long term future. 164 00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 4: He's not just a short term guy for them. This 165 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:37,280 Speaker 4: isn't you know. 166 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 3: Miles Garrett, for example, turns thirty at the end of 167 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 3: this year, so I think you can question whether or 168 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 3: not he be, you know, a part of the Browns 169 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 3: or at least still what he is whenever they get 170 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 3: good again, right, you know, Trey Hendrickson with the Bengals, like, 171 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 3: if you don't believe they're gonna win this year, well, 172 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:56,000 Speaker 3: he's you know, thirty one years old and in a 173 00:07:56,040 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 3: contract year. The scenario with Max a little different, where 174 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 3: he's still young enough where you could see getting good 175 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 3: enough fast enough, to getting good enough fast enough where 176 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 3: he's still got a chunk of his prime left, and 177 00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 3: you're contending. I think the other element here too is 178 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 3: I think that front office didn't want to screw the 179 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 3: coaching staff. And I think that's really an element that's 180 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 3: been in play with them, you know, across their roster, 181 00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 3: where they wanted to be careful because they knew that 182 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 3: roster is really deficient in a lot of different places, 183 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 3: and they didn't want to put themselves. They want to 184 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 3: put their coaches in a position where it was difficult 185 00:08:38,360 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 3: to establish the program over the continue to establish the 186 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 3: program over the next couple of months and have a 187 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:46,679 Speaker 3: chance to hit the ground running into twenty twenty six. 188 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 3: Because they just don't have enough players to make it work. 189 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:52,440 Speaker 3: So they weren't going to give away Jacoby Myers. They 190 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 3: wind up trading him, but that leaves them really Razor 191 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 3: Thinn at receiver. And you know, Eric Stokes is another 192 00:08:58,559 --> 00:08:59,839 Speaker 3: guy that they were reluctant to move. 193 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 4: Got a lot of calls on him as a corner. 194 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 3: But like it was just at the point where it's like, 195 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 3: if we deal them off, like we're really gonna have 196 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 3: to get good value because we're putting our coaches in 197 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 3: a tough spot. 198 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 4: At that position if if we let them go. 199 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 3: And we're talking again about Eric Stokes and Jacoby Myers, 200 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 3: what kind of spot are you putting your coaches in 201 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 3: if you if you trade away Max Crosby. 202 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 4: I think that was an element in all this too. 203 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 2: How would you feel for your jets ban today? 204 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 3: I would feel like, I hope my owner is patient, 205 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:31,640 Speaker 3: you know what I mean? Like, because I think that's 206 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 3: that's the catch twenty two about this whole of this 207 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 3: whole thing is like what Darren Mousey and Aaron Glenn 208 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:42,080 Speaker 3: did I think is going to demand patients and that 209 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 3: ownership does not have a great history of being patient, 210 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 3: and so like will they be patient if it looks 211 00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 3: this way again next year? Because the Jets have really 212 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 3: kind of gone all in on young players. 213 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 4: Now. 214 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 3: That said, I think that there's good logic to what 215 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 3: they did, you know, because I think there's like a recognition. 216 00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:05,559 Speaker 4: We don't have the quarterback right now, and we weren't 217 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 4: winning with this group. 218 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:08,280 Speaker 3: And yes, we had a top five defense the last 219 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:10,200 Speaker 3: three years in a row, but the defense wasn't very 220 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 3: good this year, and you know, like we are going 221 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 3: to need capital to find our quarterback over the next 222 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 3: couple of years. And if you look at it too, 223 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 3: I mean they didn't strip it bear. That's the thing 224 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,839 Speaker 3: is like this was a fire sale because they give 225 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:27,679 Speaker 3: away two like franchise level players, but then start to 226 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 3: go down the list of players they still have there 227 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,440 Speaker 3: that Garrett Wilson receiver. We'll see if Briess Hall's back 228 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 3: at running back. They've got two young tackles that were 229 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,199 Speaker 3: drafted in the top half of the first round in 230 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 3: old Fashanu and armand Membu they have two young defensive 231 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 3: ends that were drafted in the first round and Jermaine 232 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 3: Johnson and Will McDonald. They've got a linebacker they just 233 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 3: resigned in Jimine Sherwood. 234 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 4: There is some building blocks there. 235 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:52,840 Speaker 3: And now like as those guys get a little bit older, 236 00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:54,559 Speaker 3: and as those guys, some of those guys come off 237 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 3: of rookie contracts, they're gonna have an ability to build 238 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 3: behind those guys with premium young talent. So I look 239 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 3: at that and I see they're set up with two 240 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:05,680 Speaker 3: first round picks and two second round picks in the 241 00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:06,559 Speaker 3: twenty sixth drafts. 242 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:08,480 Speaker 4: So that'll give them a chance to get better next year. 243 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 4: And then they have three first round picks. 244 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 3: And this is really the key in the twenty twenty 245 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 3: seven draft. And just talking to people, you know in 246 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 3: NFL circles, they aren't wild about next year's draft class. 247 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:19,319 Speaker 4: But the one after that. 248 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 3: Jeremiah Smith, Ryan Williams, Colin Simmons, Dylan Stewart, Leonard Moore 249 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 3: and then young quarterbacks. Arch Manning could be in that class. 250 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 3: Dylan Rayola could be in that class. 251 00:11:31,600 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 4: You know. 252 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 5: CJ. 253 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 3: Carr at Notre Dame could be in that class. Julian 254 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 3: sayan could be in that class, Like, you've really set 255 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 3: yourself up now where if you're patient, you have a 256 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,720 Speaker 3: chance to build a good roster over the next year 257 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:44,679 Speaker 3: and a half, maybe add your quarterback in twenty seven 258 00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 3: and have a young quarterback coming. I knew a roster 259 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:51,440 Speaker 3: that that's already pretty good. That'd be the optimistic Jets 260 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 3: fan view of it. If your owner has enough patience 261 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 3: to see out that. 262 00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 2: Plan, Well, all right, it actually sounds plausible you should 263 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 2: work or the Jets you should work in pr there 264 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 2: putting that. 265 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:06,439 Speaker 3: Out and say that Dan, I don't know, I don't 266 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:08,439 Speaker 3: think what he would agree with you on that, I'll 267 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 3: put it that way. 268 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:14,120 Speaker 2: But if you're gonna predict Kyler Murray's future, what would 269 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:14,320 Speaker 2: it be? 270 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 6: Ye? 271 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 3: So he's got guaranteed money next year, which is sort 272 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:20,280 Speaker 3: of the problem, right, Like, so is he going to 273 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 3: be the Cardinals quarterback in twenty twenty seven? 274 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 7: No? 275 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:25,959 Speaker 4: Like, how do they handle this? 276 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 3: Is? Can he be someone's reclamation project next year? Will 277 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:32,800 Speaker 3: somebody be willing to take on the money? That'd be 278 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 3: the big question, because I think when you when you 279 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 3: start to look at like, all right, like if someone's 280 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 3: looking for their version of Daniel Jones or Baker Mayfield 281 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 3: or Sam Darnold next year like in the spring, and 282 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 3: say you don't like the quarterback class, who are you 283 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:48,560 Speaker 3: looking at? And Kyler Murray would be one of the 284 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 3: people that one of the players that I think will 285 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 3: be in that category, maybe two will be in that category. 286 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 4: With whoever's in charge of the Dolphins, you. 287 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:58,199 Speaker 3: Know, making a decision on that, you know, and and 288 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 3: and the winner in the spring. 289 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 2: Who would you rather have? Kyler Murray or Tua Tua? 290 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 4: Probably I don't know, Well who would you rather have? 291 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 2: Is there another option? Yeah? 292 00:13:12,679 --> 00:13:15,440 Speaker 3: I mean, like I think, like the problem with Kyler's 293 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:19,559 Speaker 3: in spectacular talent, Like my problem with Kyler would be, 294 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 3: like I think all the criticism of Kyler for a 295 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 3: spectacular some of the stuff that he does is. 296 00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,319 Speaker 4: You know, I mentioned this on another show the other day, 297 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 4: where like he has this. 298 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 3: Tendency to bail out of the pocket and play out 299 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:35,320 Speaker 3: of structure a lot, and it looks great, you know 300 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 3: at times, but it kind of like it it was 301 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 3: the same criticism you had on Shador when he was 302 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:43,560 Speaker 3: coming out, which is like it kind of like the 303 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:45,400 Speaker 3: way he plays can kind of put some of the 304 00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 3: other players on offense in a tough spot, and I 305 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:50,800 Speaker 3: think that's reflected by the way Jacoby Brissett has come 306 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:53,720 Speaker 3: in and just played the position, you know, like Marvin 307 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:56,280 Speaker 3: Harrison all of a sudden looks pretty good, right, Trey 308 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 3: McBride has looked great, Like the offensive line doesn't look 309 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:02,440 Speaker 3: so bad, Like different elements of their offense have really 310 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 3: started to come together with Jacoby in there, which I 311 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 3: think informs you if they're the Cardinals, right, it tells 312 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:10,319 Speaker 3: you like, if we can just get average quarterback play, 313 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,680 Speaker 3: we might be all right. So I'd say with both 314 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:17,080 Speaker 3: those guys, with Tua and Kyler, you know, I think 315 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 3: that either they're back as bridge quarterbacks where they are 316 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 3: now next year, or there's someone else's bridge quarterback in 317 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 3: twenty twenty six because the guaranteed money really complicates things, 318 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:29,760 Speaker 3: and things in both cases. 319 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 2: Is Indiana currently the best football state in the country 320 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 2: if I include college and pro, you know. 321 00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,040 Speaker 3: So, I think it was Fritzy that that that asked 322 00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 3: me that when I was coming on, and I would 323 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 3: really have to think about it, because the one thing 324 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 3: that popped into my head was California with if you 325 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 3: if you look at where the Niners are, where the 326 00:14:55,680 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 3: Rams are, where the Chargers are. USC is pretty good, right, 327 00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 3: So UCLA is terrible, and I think Stanford and Cal 328 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 3: are pretty irrelevant to the conversation. But is USC close 329 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 3: enough or are we greater this on a scale where 330 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:13,880 Speaker 3: like just because Indiana's two teams? 331 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 4: Because are you including for doing that? No? I mean, 332 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 4: so then eliminated Stanford and Cal. 333 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,040 Speaker 2: I'm not making the rules here. I was just saying, 334 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 2: if I go, oh, I got Indiana at two, I 335 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:35,400 Speaker 2: got Notre Dame, and I got so I got the Colts. 336 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 2: Do you have three that would compete with those three? 337 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 2: If I said you had to have two college or 338 00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:43,359 Speaker 2: one pro. 339 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,080 Speaker 4: RAM or two college and one pro. 340 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, so you took I took the Niners of the 341 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:49,240 Speaker 3: Chargers private. 342 00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 4: That's close, right. 343 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 2: But you're going to take the rams overall rams have. 344 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 4: And then either the Niners of the Chargers and USC. 345 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:02,880 Speaker 2: Okay, that's pretty good, right. Well, I got Notre Dame 346 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 2: and I got Indiana, and then I got the Colts. 347 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:09,920 Speaker 4: Right, so you probably still win there. You probably still 348 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 4: win there. 349 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 3: I can't say Ohio because you came Ohio State's way 350 00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:15,280 Speaker 3: up here. 351 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 2: Then yeah, how did a guy from Massachusetts end at 352 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 2: end up in Ohio State Because. 353 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 3: My dad went to Michigan and my grandfather went to 354 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:27,240 Speaker 3: Michigan and my great grandfather went to Michigan and on 355 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 3: the black sheet. 356 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 2: Wait, you went to Ohio State to spite them? 357 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 4: No, I didn't get into miche so f them. 358 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 3: Wow wow yeah, because I was. I have like my 359 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:43,280 Speaker 3: dad's from Detroit. All my family I always saw like 360 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:48,440 Speaker 3: so like for me growing up and like like having 361 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 3: that kind of like everybody in my dad's side of 362 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:52,760 Speaker 3: the family went to either Michigan or Michigan State, So 363 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 3: I grew up around that, like even though I didn't 364 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:58,840 Speaker 3: grow up there, like that was like kids around here, 365 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 3: like kids who grow up here, like their idea of 366 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 3: college is like some you know, liberal arts school in 367 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 3: the mountains, you know what I mean. Like my idea 368 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 3: college was like probably what your idea was of college 369 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 3: growing up in Dayton, right, Like it's these big, hulking, 370 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:11,920 Speaker 3: big ten campuses. 371 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 4: So I always wanted to go to one. 372 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 3: And you know, a really good friend of mine, a 373 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 3: high school teammate of mine, went to Ohio Stays a 374 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 3: year older than me, and he was a priority walk. 375 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 4: On in the football team there. 376 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 3: His name was Eddie Brown, still lives in Columbus. His 377 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 3: daughter played soccer at Oklahoma and Creighton, and so Eddie 378 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 3: brought me out my senior year in high school's freshman 379 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:40,200 Speaker 3: year at Ohio State. I honestly, like it was very 380 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 3: easy to you've been to Columbus, very easy to fall 381 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:46,359 Speaker 3: in love with that place. I had high boards and 382 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 3: low grades in high school, and let's just say, Ohio 383 00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 3: State wasn't as hard. 384 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 4: To get into then as it is now. 385 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 3: And I thought, because I was a legacy, I'd get 386 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:55,880 Speaker 3: into Michigan. 387 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:58,359 Speaker 4: And it didn't work out for me. 388 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,040 Speaker 3: So that's the that's the short version of the story. 389 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:02,400 Speaker 3: But it all worked out for the best. 390 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 2: I'd say, did you cry when Michigan said no? 391 00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:07,040 Speaker 4: No, I sort of. 392 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:09,240 Speaker 3: I mean I knew I did that to myself, you know, 393 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 3: like I knew, I knew. I thought I'd get in, 394 00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 3: but like I thought, like maybe, because again, like you're 395 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 3: your a legacy like that, like I maybe they would 396 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,960 Speaker 3: let me in. But I also knew, like I screwed 397 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:27,760 Speaker 3: around enough in high school to mess that up, which 398 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 3: you know, which is fine. Like again, like it worked 399 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 3: out for the best. I'm I'm more than happy where 400 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:33,479 Speaker 3: I went to school. 401 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:36,880 Speaker 4: That's uh. That's one of those things where maybe when 402 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 4: you expect it the least things work out for the best. 403 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:42,199 Speaker 2: Great to talk to you again, Thank you, Albert, all right, 404 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:44,440 Speaker 2: Thanks Dan, Albert Breer Monday Morning Quarterback. 405 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,200 Speaker 1: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan 406 00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:50,880 Speaker 1: Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific 407 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:54,160 Speaker 1: on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app. 408 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 7: Hey, it's Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington from The Odd 409 00:18:58,080 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 7: Couple on Fox Sports Radio. 410 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,600 Speaker 8: In an addition to hearing us live weeknights from seven 411 00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 8: to ten pm Eastern on Fox Sports Radio, we are 412 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:09,119 Speaker 8: excited to announce brand new YouTube channel. 413 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:09,400 Speaker 6: For the show. 414 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,000 Speaker 3: That's right, you can now watch The Odd Couple live 415 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 3: on YouTube every day. 416 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 8: All you gotta do search Odd Couple FSR on YouTube 417 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:22,239 Speaker 8: again YouTube, Just search Odd Couple FSR. Check us out 418 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:24,280 Speaker 8: on YouTube and subscribed. 419 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 2: Well look who's back. Dodger manager Dave Roberts another World 420 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:34,480 Speaker 2: Series title. Didn't need to make a proclamation in spring training, 421 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 2: didn't have to do any of that stuff. Just an 422 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,679 Speaker 2: easy seven games and there you are winning again. I 423 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 2: guess can you compare the back to back, the different 424 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 2: feelings that you had. 425 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 7: Well, I'm glad your ho hum about it. It was 426 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:55,640 Speaker 7: very difficult. Winning a championship is very difficult. Winning two 427 00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 7: is even tougher. No, I mean, there's nothing like games Evan, 428 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 7: and a lot of things had happened. 429 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 6: Guys stepped up, and I'm just prout of the guys 430 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:07,359 Speaker 6: it was. 431 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:10,639 Speaker 7: There's a lot of pressure points in that series, in 432 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:14,959 Speaker 7: the postseason and certainly in the World Series. But it 433 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,600 Speaker 7: certainly wasn't easy. And yeah, we've done something that hadn't 434 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 7: been done in twenty five years. 435 00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:23,879 Speaker 2: But you look at pressure and we we could see pressure. 436 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 2: It was tangible when you're watching Game seven. But the 437 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:30,920 Speaker 2: pressure too, you're supposed to win, expected to win by 438 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 2: you know, the media, of the you know, fans. It 439 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:36,639 Speaker 2: feels like that the difference in being an underdog in 440 00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 2: winning like when you won with the Red Sox as 441 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 2: a player, to winning when you're the favorite. The different 442 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 2: kind of pressures are feeling that. 443 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:51,600 Speaker 7: You have with that, Yeah, you know, I guess, you know, 444 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 7: I don't know. I guess The thing about sports is, yeah, 445 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:56,400 Speaker 7: everyone's got opinions. 446 00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,439 Speaker 6: But you know, the David and Goliath narrative. 447 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,719 Speaker 7: Fans, media put things together that just aren't true, and 448 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:03,960 Speaker 7: to be quite honest, people that have never been in 449 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:08,800 Speaker 7: the ring. And the Blue Jays were a very good team. 450 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 7: They won the al least they won more baseball games 451 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:16,159 Speaker 7: than we did. But we're Goliath, and so it was 452 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:20,000 Speaker 7: a great series and we were trying to win the series. 453 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,360 Speaker 7: They were trying to win a World Series. I don't 454 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:24,880 Speaker 7: think he was pressure. I think that what happens is 455 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 7: as athletes, as teams, you have expectations and goals for yourself, 456 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 7: and you know, you don't want more for yourself than 457 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 7: I think than fans do. You want to win, You 458 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:41,120 Speaker 7: expect to win. So I don't think that our pressure 459 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,960 Speaker 7: or pressure from the fans or media had any bearing 460 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:45,400 Speaker 7: on the game. We were trying to win for each 461 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 7: other in the city of Los Angeles. 462 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 2: Give me the move that maybe you were going to 463 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 2: second guess yourself in Game seven and you didn't. 464 00:21:55,280 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 7: Probably, Well, the easiest one is hitting for got Ross. 465 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:04,480 Speaker 7: He's a defensive guy. I inserted him in Game six 466 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,359 Speaker 7: to add some infusion and energy into our club. 467 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,040 Speaker 6: And yeah, that's that's probably the one. 468 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:13,840 Speaker 7: But you know, looking at the bench, it's tough to 469 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 7: pinch hit, and anyone can say and you were probably 470 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:19,119 Speaker 7: second guessing me saying you should hit for him, and 471 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:22,400 Speaker 7: because the numbers say that, there's other guys that can 472 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,040 Speaker 7: hit home runs in this but it's hard to come 473 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,239 Speaker 7: off the bench. And I trusted my players, and you know, 474 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 7: he made me look good and he deserved that moment. 475 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:34,439 Speaker 7: And in the postseason, what I have learned Dan is 476 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 7: you know, it's not about the numbers. You gotta trust 477 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,440 Speaker 7: your players. And my job is to know the players. 478 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 7: That's my job. Ultimately, that's my job. It's not to 479 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 7: know statistics. It's about to know the heartbeat of the player. 480 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 7: And I do believe that, you know, to win eleven 481 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:52,080 Speaker 7: or this year thirteen games in October, you've got to 482 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,080 Speaker 7: trust your players, to know your players, and that's what 483 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:54,480 Speaker 7: we did. 484 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,919 Speaker 2: But so you're saying gut feeling still has a place 485 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 2: in the game. It feels like we're so attached to analytics. 486 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 2: How much of what you did in Game seven was 487 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 2: gut as opposed to analytics. 488 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,880 Speaker 7: It's it's all got I think that if you look 489 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 7: back at twenty twenty four in the postseason, it's the 490 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:12,120 Speaker 7: eye test. 491 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 6: It's gut. 492 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 7: But people, if you look at twenty twenty, it's eye test, 493 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,639 Speaker 7: it's got People can't get off the analytics for some reason. 494 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 7: So these are people that are just stuck in their 495 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 7: ways and you're never going to change them. But if 496 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,359 Speaker 7: people that really want to, that really watched the game 497 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:32,359 Speaker 7: and know the game, then they can see that analytics 498 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 7: had nothing. It's about, you know, coaches trusting their players 499 00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 7: and players stepping up in big moments. 500 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:41,119 Speaker 2: When you saw the collision in left center with pyos In, 501 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,120 Speaker 2: Key k what I. 502 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,840 Speaker 7: Was a prayer's r answer, and I was unbelievable. You know, 503 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 7: they both went after it. Kik was trying to make 504 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:54,639 Speaker 7: his Willie Mays play. Pahes was just inserted and just 505 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 7: made a next level, big moment play. And it's funny 506 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 7: because Key Kate laid down there for dead and Pats 507 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 7: asked me if he was okay, and he says, forget that. 508 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 6: Do you have the ball? 509 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,080 Speaker 7: And he said, yes, I do have the ball and 510 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,640 Speaker 7: he goes he got up and ran into the dugout. 511 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 7: So it was but again, and it's like Miguel Ross 512 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 7: coming out of Game seven, because he just expended all energy. 513 00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,120 Speaker 7: It's like that's just what fans lived for. And that's 514 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,120 Speaker 7: what our players gave both teams. 515 00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:31,120 Speaker 2: The play at the plate. How close that was? Are 516 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 2: you ready then to ask for replay? 517 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:33,920 Speaker 6: Oh? 518 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:36,200 Speaker 7: That was like I was asking for replay right from 519 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:38,399 Speaker 7: the get go, or if they would have called it, 520 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,120 Speaker 7: say for sure? And I was with Will Smith last 521 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,959 Speaker 7: night and he goes, I honestly did not realize that 522 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:48,159 Speaker 7: I took my foot off the plate to then have 523 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:50,120 Speaker 7: the wherewithal to put it down. And that's the thing, 524 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 7: is that, but even the play for me to take it, 525 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:55,399 Speaker 7: to lose momentum and then to regain to make a 526 00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:57,640 Speaker 7: good throw for Will to field it, get his. 527 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 6: Foot back down. I mean, god, it's a heartache series. 528 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:08,240 Speaker 2: Talking to Dave Roberts, Dodger manager, Yamamoto reminded me of Pedro. 529 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 2: Remind me of Pedro Martinez. I are they similar build, 530 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 2: similar size and. 531 00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:21,080 Speaker 7: Very similar build, very similar size, you know obviously Pedro, 532 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,640 Speaker 7: you know, sort of a similar mix. If you say 533 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:31,199 Speaker 7: the split is Pedro's changeup and just same mindset. You 534 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,760 Speaker 7: know Pedro on game days, I've never seen. He's an 535 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 7: assassin and Yamamoto is an assassin. What he did is 536 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:43,880 Speaker 7: stuff like Pedro asked, Sandy Kofasque asked, obviously what. 537 00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 6: Mad bummed in? I did? 538 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 7: And I don't know if it was twenty twelve or 539 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 7: twenty fourteen, one of those Giants years, but yeah, I mean, 540 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,480 Speaker 7: this is the guy that, yeah, not physical, but his mind, 541 00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 7: Dan is just pretty spectacular. 542 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 2: But if you would have said, hey, beginning of the series, 543 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 2: a Japanese born player is gonna win MVP. 544 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:05,920 Speaker 6: Joe Hey all day? 545 00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:11,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, all day. But what did you learn about him 546 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 2: in this World Series or in the playoffs that maybe 547 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 2: you didn't know? 548 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,160 Speaker 7: Yeah, okay, okay, yeah, not the World Series, the playoffs. 549 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,159 Speaker 7: So I actually I knew that he's a killer. I 550 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 7: knew it this guy, and he showed that, you know, 551 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 7: this year, having just a tremendous years being a stop perforce, 552 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:32,959 Speaker 7: pitching huge and big games, going complete game. Doing what 553 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 7: he did in Milwaukee was incredible, complete games. One run, 554 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,160 Speaker 7: I think the first Yeah, gives up a solo homer, 555 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,560 Speaker 7: a leadoff homer, then goes nine innings shut after that, 556 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:50,680 Speaker 7: then the next game, complete game, and then in game three, 557 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 7: eighteen innings, I think he was like thirteenth inning, He's like, 558 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:57,680 Speaker 7: I'm ready to go down there. I'm not going to 559 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 7: let a position player pitch in the game in a 560 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,680 Speaker 7: World Series game, and this is a one day off 561 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:05,480 Speaker 7: and so that showed me a lot. 562 00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 6: Freddy walks it off. 563 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:10,040 Speaker 7: And then so yesterday or Game seven obviously was no surprise, 564 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:11,879 Speaker 7: but to go three innings was incredible. 565 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,040 Speaker 2: But o Tani and your you say him throughout the season, 566 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:19,520 Speaker 2: ramping him up. Uh, was he coming in in game 567 00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:22,320 Speaker 2: seven or we started getting Yeah? 568 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 7: No, no, because he started Game seven okay. And then 569 00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:28,240 Speaker 7: so once he was done, he gave us three innings 570 00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 7: and then I was like, you know what, I think 571 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,640 Speaker 7: he just wasn't a sharp Get him off the pitching, 572 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 7: lock in on the hitting, and then we had some 573 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 7: marms behind him. 574 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 4: Yeah. 575 00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 2: I thought the way you ramped him up the entire 576 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,880 Speaker 2: season was interesting. You know, when you have that kind 577 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,560 Speaker 2: of talent, but you know he's got two innings or 578 00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:47,959 Speaker 2: he's got three, Like you, you got to be careful 579 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 2: that you don't get greedy in a situation. I guess 580 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:51,680 Speaker 2: like that you do, and. 581 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:53,919 Speaker 6: It was it's hard not to be greedy. 582 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:56,879 Speaker 7: But we went one inning, we remain steadfast one and 583 00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 7: he won in two innings, two innings, three innings, and 584 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,200 Speaker 7: then you know at the end that was the first 585 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,960 Speaker 7: time because all year he had seven, eight, nine, ten 586 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 7: days of rest. So game seven was the first time 587 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 7: he ever went on three days rest. So that's why 588 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,720 Speaker 7: you know, this guy's coming off to Tommy John's he is, 589 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:18,720 Speaker 7: he's our team MVP, and so he's two players and 590 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,760 Speaker 7: one so we couldn't get greed with him. So three days. 591 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:25,240 Speaker 7: It wasn't terribly sharp. He gave us three nings. That 592 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:26,159 Speaker 7: was that was plenty. 593 00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 2: Clayton Kershaw is joining us tomorrow. 594 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:32,000 Speaker 6: Nice, What should. 595 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 2: I bring up to him? 596 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:40,040 Speaker 7: Oh my gosh, you know, I think was in game 597 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:43,239 Speaker 7: seven he was it was either going to be the 598 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:47,720 Speaker 7: next hitter or certainly if they tied it up, if 599 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:50,000 Speaker 7: Kirk tied it up right there, Kirk Clayton was going 600 00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 7: to take. 601 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 6: The next sitting. 602 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 2: How nervous were you when he was on the mound. 603 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 6: That I was nervous in that game? Game three? 604 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:03,000 Speaker 7: Game three, I bring in a basis loaded situation, and 605 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,640 Speaker 7: it goes back to again, it goes back to trust 606 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 7: your players. Clayton and I have been through so much 607 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 7: in my ten years with him, eighteen years obviously in 608 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 7: his career and We've had some loads, certainly together and 609 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 7: we had some highs. But again, I'm gonna if it's 610 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 7: gonna go down, I'm gonna I'm gonna bet on playing 611 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,360 Speaker 7: Kershaw and I've proved that time. 612 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 6: And time again. 613 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 2: How was the celebration? 614 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,280 Speaker 6: Oh, so last year was insane. 615 00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:32,320 Speaker 7: We didn't get it in twenty twenty, so it sort 616 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,120 Speaker 7: of kind of butted up together in twenty four. But 617 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:40,200 Speaker 7: last yesterday's parade or two days Agos parade was it 618 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 7: was the best. The bet they did, they one up themselves, 619 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 7: more people, a longer parade route. Players were just over Jordan. 620 00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 7: It was fantastic. 621 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:52,680 Speaker 2: Damn you getting used to this? 622 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 7: I would say it's it's I enjoy it. I wouldn't 623 00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:00,960 Speaker 7: say get used to it. We already talked about the 624 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 7: players already talked about a three p I talked about 625 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:06,880 Speaker 7: a three peat. So I'm not making any guarantees, but 626 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:09,760 Speaker 7: I already cleared it with pat Riley on the three 627 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:10,480 Speaker 7: pet term. 628 00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,960 Speaker 6: So we're excited. I just think with us, you got 629 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:15,600 Speaker 6: to find some carrot. You know. 630 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 7: It's like we started out in South Korean twenty four, 631 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 7: finished in the Bronx, started out in Tokyo. Finish in Canada. 632 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 7: And so we've had the longest season, the shortest offseason 633 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,000 Speaker 7: of anyone, travel the most mile. So you've got to 634 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 7: have some carrot to keep our guys focused and motivated. 635 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,320 Speaker 6: So the three pet is it for us? 636 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean you shouldn't. You want to win, you 637 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 2: expect to win. 638 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 6: That's right, that's absolutely right. 639 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,840 Speaker 7: Congrats, Thank you, Dan, I appreciate you man. 640 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 2: All right, enjoy your offseason. 641 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 6: All right, take care and tell Clayton I said hello tomorrow. 642 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,800 Speaker 2: All righty, that's Dave Roberts did it again. 643 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in 644 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 1: the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio 645 00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to 646 00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: listen live. 647 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 2: Sam Smith Phil Jackson co authors of Masters of the Game, 648 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 2: a conversational history of the NBA, and it's seventy five 649 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:19,480 Speaker 2: legendary players. Sam of course covers the Bulls, He's done 650 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 2: so since nineteen eighty seven. He gave us the Jordan rules, 651 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 2: and of course Phil Jackson eleven time NBA champ and 652 00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 2: they join us. Now, Phil, you know you have all 653 00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,280 Speaker 2: of these different players, all these different chapters where you 654 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 2: and Sam are just talking back and forth about them, 655 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:40,960 Speaker 2: giving your thoughts in a conversational tone. Give me the 656 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,080 Speaker 2: player that you had the most fun talking about in 657 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:44,640 Speaker 2: this book. 658 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 5: Well, I think we could have gone on forever about 659 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 5: Dennis Rodman, but I would say some of the guys 660 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:58,800 Speaker 5: that I didn't coach, So the guys that you know 661 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 5: have a check and players that you know competed against 662 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 5: and had admiration for. 663 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,480 Speaker 2: Sam give me the player in the book that more 664 00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,360 Speaker 2: people should know about. 665 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 9: You know, I think one who gets overlooked so much 666 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 9: is Rick Barry. You know, people know Rick Barry. I 667 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:22,200 Speaker 9: don't think they appreciate how great Rick Rick Barry, you know, 668 00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 9: in my view, could have been. You know, Steph Curry 669 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,719 Speaker 9: with his shooting ability. He was such an all around 670 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 9: versatile player who for various reasons, was so universally disliked. 671 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 9: But you know, one of the interesting things, Phil went 672 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,920 Speaker 9: on a lot of State Department tours back then, and 673 00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:42,840 Speaker 9: he was on one with Rick, and I remember one 674 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 9: Phil was telling we were talking about one with Pete 675 00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:49,360 Speaker 9: Maravich where and I know the history books don't reflect 676 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 9: this actually, but Pete basically opened China before Richard Nixon. 677 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:56,280 Speaker 9: Because I think on some of the State Department tours. 678 00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 9: You know, Pete stribbling and passing and playing, you know, 679 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:04,120 Speaker 9: so excited some of the communities in China and phil 680 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,040 Speaker 9: what we were talking about. And that was another I 681 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:09,600 Speaker 9: know they know Pete Maravich, but you know, they don't 682 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,800 Speaker 9: know in this era. And to me, that was part 683 00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 9: That was really what the book's about, that these guys 684 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:22,239 Speaker 9: sort of lost to history as much gets But I 685 00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:24,719 Speaker 9: believe and I think when you see Jokic now and 686 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:27,400 Speaker 9: you see Don Kitch, these guys could have played in 687 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 9: any era, including this era, and I don't think that 688 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:32,840 Speaker 9: is appreciated. And that was that was a big part 689 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:34,800 Speaker 9: of my interest in the book. 690 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 2: It feels like the NBA started when Magic and Larry 691 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,760 Speaker 2: showed up. So you had players in the sixties, certainly 692 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 2: in the seventies. They missed out on the TV era, 693 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,880 Speaker 2: and I think Kareem the better years of his career 694 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,000 Speaker 2: he missed out, or at least we missed out. But 695 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,160 Speaker 2: what do you remember about Kareem. 696 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 5: Yeah, this is a guy who had, you know, a 697 00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:00,480 Speaker 5: body that could survive playing in this game for twenty 698 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:05,360 Speaker 5: some years. Not too many guys can even shoot the 699 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:09,360 Speaker 5: step hook as a jump hook or two foot takeoff, 700 00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:18,560 Speaker 5: and Kareem was able to perfect this shot. He was 701 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:23,480 Speaker 5: able to play with a certain amount of grace. His 702 00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:29,000 Speaker 5: defense was always criticized and his rebounding perhaps as a shortcoming, 703 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:32,680 Speaker 5: but his scoring was never He was a great scorer, 704 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:36,400 Speaker 5: and he was the guy that held himself together quite 705 00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 5: well off the court as well as on. 706 00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,200 Speaker 2: We're talking to Sam Smith and Phil Jackson. The book 707 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,759 Speaker 2: is Masters of the Game, a conversational history of the 708 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:50,719 Speaker 2: NBA the seventy five legendary players. So was there somebody 709 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:52,720 Speaker 2: that you wanted to include that you didn't. 710 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:59,120 Speaker 9: We used the NBA's top seventy five and you know, 711 00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:02,360 Speaker 9: no offense, but I thought there were too many, But 712 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,120 Speaker 9: it was seventy five years. They had to go in 713 00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:09,040 Speaker 9: seventy five, you know. Sort of the controversial if it 714 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 9: would be named, was Dwight Howard. But he's a Hall 715 00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:15,880 Speaker 9: of Famer. You know, people look at it as a 716 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 9: negative when you say, well, he wasn't deserving it being 717 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,400 Speaker 9: the Hall of Famer. You know, a top seventy five, 718 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 9: and I thought some of the seventy five, you know, 719 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:26,440 Speaker 9: Damian Lillard, no offense. I didn't think he was the 720 00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:29,680 Speaker 9: top seventy five player. I think there was some recent, 721 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,719 Speaker 9: you know, recency bias in the list, but they had 722 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:37,280 Speaker 9: to get the seventy five. I think it was overall 723 00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:39,439 Speaker 9: a pretty good list. You know, I ended up being 724 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,720 Speaker 9: on the panel. I know Phil doesn't like to select 725 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:45,880 Speaker 9: ranked people, and we didn't rank people in this and 726 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:47,799 Speaker 9: I think that's another thing that's different. You know, it's 727 00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:52,319 Speaker 9: not the debate who's number one, who's number two. You know, 728 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,799 Speaker 9: it's a look at the history of it. So I 729 00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 9: think it's a fairly good list overall. 730 00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:57,560 Speaker 1: Phil. 731 00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 2: Over the years, it feels like your relationship with Scottie 732 00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:04,400 Speaker 2: Pippen has been complicated. Can you expound upon that. 733 00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 5: Well, I was assistant coach when Scotty came into the game, 734 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:14,719 Speaker 5: and I played with him and against him one on 735 00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 5: one and tried to help his game out a little bit. 736 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 5: And I was big in promoting Scotty because you know, 737 00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:27,759 Speaker 5: we had Scotty coming off the bench and I had 738 00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,600 Speaker 5: to sub in as a coach for Doug Collins when 739 00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,960 Speaker 5: he got thrown out of a game, and that was 740 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:37,040 Speaker 5: like the immediate thing I did. I put Scotty in 741 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,440 Speaker 5: the game and up the pressure defense because this is 742 00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 5: one of the best defensive players ever to play the game. 743 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,400 Speaker 5: So I had a lot of admiration for him and 744 00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 5: had a lot of contact with him. He was the 745 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,759 Speaker 5: on court guy that I alerted all the time when 746 00:36:53,800 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 5: defensive strategies would come, double teams, traps, et cetera. Whistle, 747 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:06,760 Speaker 5: Hey Scottie, it's time whatever. So yeah, it was shocking 748 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,359 Speaker 5: to hear the comments that he made, but he had 749 00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:15,840 Speaker 5: a situation that was coming off the bench, not being 750 00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:20,200 Speaker 5: able to play the last few seconds of the basketball 751 00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 5: game that was critical and it made a big change 752 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,920 Speaker 5: in his life. Michael called the next day from baseball 753 00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:29,200 Speaker 5: and said, I don't know Scotty'll ever be able to 754 00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,040 Speaker 5: live this sound. And I think it's been a hard 755 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,799 Speaker 5: thing to live down, you know, refusing to go on 756 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,879 Speaker 5: the ballgame because things didn't go your way. 757 00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:41,640 Speaker 9: Michael and I wanted to add something briefly with that. 758 00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:43,120 Speaker 9: I thought it was really poignant. 759 00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:44,080 Speaker 4: You know. 760 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:48,239 Speaker 9: Phil's kept a good relationship with Michael. I've seen him occasionally. 761 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:50,399 Speaker 9: We don't chat as much as he and Phil Mike, 762 00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 9: and when some of those things came out, we talked 763 00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:58,160 Speaker 9: about this in the book that Philip asked Michael about 764 00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,920 Speaker 9: that and Michael really expressed regret. I thought it was 765 00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:06,520 Speaker 9: really poignant that Michael told fell that he feels terrible 766 00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,440 Speaker 9: about losing the relationship with Scottie, you know, a twenty 767 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,480 Speaker 9: twenty five year relationship that was closer than a lot 768 00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 9: of people thought. And so yeah, it struck me as 769 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:20,040 Speaker 9: really poignant that Michael felt a loss about this filled. 770 00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:25,480 Speaker 2: The Dennis Rodman relationship certainly different, but it almost felt 771 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:29,040 Speaker 2: like you had these big personalities and you gave everybody 772 00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:33,479 Speaker 2: almost their own longitude and latitude. Is that fair to say? 773 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:40,240 Speaker 5: We had a team that was without a power forward 774 00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 5: when Michael came back to play after his baseball stint, 775 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 5: and you know, we put on a list of power 776 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:55,240 Speaker 5: forwards that could be or would be capable of filling 777 00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:59,239 Speaker 5: that role, and we came up with Dennis Robin as 778 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,520 Speaker 5: the only one that really fit the bill. We traded 779 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,520 Speaker 5: Will Purdue for him and it wasn't a big money thing. 780 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:12,400 Speaker 5: And after meeting Dennis and knowing who he was, I 781 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:17,440 Speaker 5: addressed the team as we're all adults, there's got to 782 00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 5: be exception for some players. This guy's not going to 783 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:26,120 Speaker 5: come to the games on time. He doesn't shoot, he 784 00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,440 Speaker 5: doesn't go out and shoot around. So he's asked me 785 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,319 Speaker 5: if he can come a half hour late, so he'll 786 00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:35,359 Speaker 5: be fine. We'll find him, like the NBA wants to 787 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:38,040 Speaker 5: find players for not being there an hour and a 788 00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:40,799 Speaker 5: half before the game, and at the end of the year, 789 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:44,040 Speaker 5: he'll pay the fine of whatever it was, two five 790 00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:48,040 Speaker 5: hundred dollars or whatever. But these are exceptions that we're 791 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,279 Speaker 5: going to have to live with with this guy, and 792 00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 5: I think his talent overways. What's going to happen as 793 00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,520 Speaker 5: we go together towards winning a championship? 794 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:01,280 Speaker 2: Phil, give me the player you wish you had coached? 795 00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:06,000 Speaker 5: Wow, I think a lot of There are a lot 796 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,680 Speaker 5: of players that you look at and say, what a 797 00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:12,759 Speaker 5: terrific player this guy is. He's overall, but I think 798 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,320 Speaker 5: Latners is like one of the guys I thought never 799 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:19,759 Speaker 5: really got to play the way he was capable of 800 00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,520 Speaker 5: playing in the NBA. I would have liked to coach 801 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:26,920 Speaker 5: guy like that that has his talent, had some leadership ability, 802 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:29,120 Speaker 5: maybe never blossomed as an. 803 00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:33,319 Speaker 2: NBA player, Sam, who do you think changed the game more? 804 00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:35,840 Speaker 2: Michael Jordan or Steph Curry. 805 00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:41,920 Speaker 9: Michael Jordan, partially because I'm still with the bulls, so 806 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:46,319 Speaker 9: I have to say that that's in my contract. But 807 00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:50,239 Speaker 9: the greatest thing, you know, I sometimes say, you know, 808 00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,480 Speaker 9: this guy shot better than Michael, passed better back, and 809 00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:54,520 Speaker 9: there's every skill they. 810 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:55,160 Speaker 6: Did better Michael. 811 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:56,440 Speaker 9: How could be the greatest player? 812 00:40:57,040 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 3: You know? 813 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,560 Speaker 9: Part of it is not just you know, Michael changed world. 814 00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:04,400 Speaker 9: You know, long shorts men could be bald. You know, 815 00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:09,320 Speaker 9: bald was good. Bald was never good before earrings, the shoes, 816 00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:14,600 Speaker 9: the fashion. Michael's influence about the world way transcended basketball. 817 00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:17,239 Speaker 9: And you know that's part of the equation. So I 818 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,680 Speaker 9: don't think anybody could ever rival Michael with the combination 819 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:21,320 Speaker 9: of his play. 820 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:22,479 Speaker 1: Guys. 821 00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,879 Speaker 2: Good luck with the book. It was an easy read. 822 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:27,120 Speaker 2: It was a fun read, and I learned a few 823 00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,000 Speaker 2: things about some of those players that I didn't get 824 00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:32,160 Speaker 2: a chance to see when I was growing up. Phil, 825 00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:34,359 Speaker 2: I think I saw you at the Cincinnati Gardens when 826 00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 2: the Knicks came to town against the Royals. But thanks 827 00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:41,040 Speaker 2: again Sam, great to see it, Phil, Thank you as well, 828 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:42,160 Speaker 2: and good luck with the book. 829 00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:47,480 Speaker 6: Thanks Ton, Thank to see it thirty years again. 830 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:48,360 Speaker 2: Thank you, Sam.