Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wok F Daily with
Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Pre recording from the Home Bunker, Folks,
Speaker 1: I'm very excited to welcome to the show for the
Speaker 1: very first time Tony Morrison, who is the senior communications
Speaker 1: director over at GLAD. He is a veteran in the
Speaker 1: field of morning news and left Legacy Media so that
Speaker 1: he could center the stories of LGBTQ plus people. In
Speaker 1: this conversation, Tony and I discuss, you know, in a
Speaker 1: lot of ways, the negativity, the negative, toxic headlines that
Speaker 1: we have seen, the five hundred plus anti LGBTQ bills
Speaker 1: that were released across the country, but then juxtaposed that
Speaker 1: with the fact that acceptance for LGBTQ people are rising,
Speaker 1: the fact that more people now know a trans person
Speaker 1: than they did ten years ago. And I lament to
Speaker 1: Tony that I remember, you know, when the number of
Speaker 1: people who knew a trans person was in the teens.
Speaker 1: And we talk about the knowledge gap and how you
Speaker 1: may know somebody who is a member of the LGBTQ community,
Speaker 1: but do you understand and are you educated on their
Speaker 1: lived experiences and what folks are up against on a
Speaker 1: regular basis, So we talk about the role of media,
Speaker 1: the role of GLAD to fill that knowledge gap with
Speaker 1: truth and facts and narrative to dispose of this stereotypes,
Speaker 1: the fear, and the hate that the MAGA supremacists want
Speaker 1: to fill that gap with. It's the reasons why they
Speaker 1: get rid of the books so that you cannot learn
Speaker 1: and educate yourself, so that you are a blank canvas
Speaker 1: for their hate. So Tony and I get into a
Speaker 1: really great conversation about what can be done. You know,
Speaker 1: what are the highs and lows of this movement and
Speaker 1: how do we continue to advance forward given all that
Speaker 1: has been stacked against us. My conversation with Tony Morrison
Speaker 1: from GLAD is coming up next, folks. I am very
Speaker 1: excited to welcome to OKF Daily. I believe for the
Speaker 1: very first time Tony Morrison, who is an Emmy and
Speaker 1: GLAD Award earning journalists serving as Senior Director of Communications
Speaker 1: for GLAD, the world's leading LGBTQ media advocacy organization, that
Speaker 1: I've had the pleasure of working with and by and
Speaker 1: being a part of the GLAD family and community for
Speaker 1: over the years. So Tony start out you know with
Speaker 1: me by painting the picture of kind of where LGBTQ
Speaker 1: people representation in media found itself in twenty twenty three,
Speaker 1: before we start looking ahead.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, here we are at the end of
Speaker 2: the year. We're all looking back, right, and I think
Speaker 2: we all have a tendency to look at Obviously the
Speaker 2: major headlines, the ones that are have caught our eye
Speaker 2: in terms of what has maybe been more catastrophic for
Speaker 2: our communities and how we're going to move forward. But
Speaker 2: I really do want to call on a lot of
Speaker 2: our own research here at GLAD that says that acceptance
Speaker 2: is at an all time high. Ninety six percent of
Speaker 2: Americans say that schools should be accepting and affirming of
Speaker 2: all students, notwithstanding whatever backgrounds they come from. Super majorities
Speaker 2: of Americans are for equality and inclusion, and I think
Speaker 2: a lot of what we're seeing is definitely this loud
Speaker 2: minority that seems like they're getting louder and are being
Speaker 2: platformed in certain ways that might be irresponsible, I would say,
Speaker 2: in the media platforms that we are working in and with.
Speaker 2: But acceptance is at an all time high, and when
Speaker 2: it comes to represent representation and visibility in media, which
Speaker 2: is glad's primary focus, is that the studios and film
Speaker 2: studios and television networks and our journal across the country
Speaker 2: are hungry and wanting to tell queer stories and intersectional
Speaker 2: stories accurately and fairly. The want is there. Obviously, it's
Speaker 2: very nuanced once you get into the corporate allyship conversation,
Speaker 2: the Pride month of it all. But for the most part,
Speaker 2: I do just want to call on first here that
Speaker 2: acceptance is at an all time high. And even just
Speaker 2: to name check Pride real quick, this year we saw
Speaker 2: a huge amount of small town prides pop up for
Speaker 2: the first time.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, everywhere.
Speaker 2: So communities are coming together. So when you talk about grassroots,
Speaker 2: grassroot action and advocacy, that's really something that starts at home,
Speaker 2: and that's something that we are seeing, and especially going
Speaker 2: into this election cycle, it is something encouraging that we're seeing.
Speaker 2: But we have to encourage our communities and our allies
Speaker 2: to be able to be equipped to carry these conversations
Speaker 2: in a correct and viable means.
Speaker 1: I'm really glad that you started out with the positive
Speaker 1: right because I think that it is really, you know,
Speaker 1: easy for us to get marred and bogged down by
Speaker 1: all of the negative news and headlines. When we see
Speaker 1: books being banned because they showcase gay penguins, when we
Speaker 1: see you know, GSA stickers being ripped off of classrooms,
Speaker 1: when we hear about people being fired for using a
Speaker 1: child's you know, preferred pronouns. And so when you say
Speaker 1: that acceptance is up, when you talk about the fact
Speaker 1: that there were a lot of small town prides and
Speaker 1: not just big ones, you know, and that acceptance in
Speaker 1: Hollywood is also up, you know, how do we how
Speaker 1: do you break through? I guess with the good right
Speaker 1: in order to make it very clear case that this
Speaker 1: is a lie squeaky minority, but that they don't represent
Speaker 1: the majority of us.
Speaker 2: I mean, for me, I just think you have to
Speaker 2: go back to how just even ten years ago. Let's
Speaker 2: just go back ten years even in our own lives,
Speaker 2: our level of understanding of whatever community is that we
Speaker 2: are saying we ourselves are allies of now obviously I'm
Speaker 2: here to to create more representation and shift culture for
Speaker 2: LGBTQ people. Very interesting space because the LGBTQ community is
Speaker 2: an intersexual, intersectional one of all communities, right, But you know,
Speaker 2: just ten years ago, like only eight percent of Americans
Speaker 2: knew of a transgender person in their lives. Ye, and
Speaker 2: while today we're finding that that number is up to
Speaker 2: thirty percent, in that ten year span, more Americans still
Speaker 2: to feel like they've seen a ghost upwards of forty percent,
Speaker 2: then feel that they have met a transgender person thirty percent.
Speaker 2: So while the progress and you just mentioned this a
Speaker 2: bit ago, the progress is not perfect. Progress works in
Speaker 2: this way, especially in the culture shifting space right in
Speaker 2: the heart and mind changing space that we work in.
Speaker 2: But I just have to call out too. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's having these one on one conversations within our own
Speaker 2: community and being able to be part of the solution
Speaker 2: rather than looking for solutions. And while acceptance is high,
Speaker 2: the knowledge gap is low. So we have a huge
Speaker 2: amount of people who want to do good and do
Speaker 2: right by their communities, their neighbors, their family members. But
Speaker 2: the underlying issue, I feel, the undercurrent here is a
Speaker 2: lot of individuals don't feel equipped to have these conversations.
Speaker 2: We have our homework in the advocacy space. I just
Speaker 2: saw some numbers quite recently about fifty percent of Americans
Speaker 2: feel but half Americans feel that they're knowledgeable about trans
Speaker 2: and non binary people. My question is where are the
Speaker 2: other half of Americans learning about these communities from. Yep,
Speaker 2: it's through the media obviously, yeah, and the content we consume.
Speaker 2: But who's flooding the airwaves right now. It's it's polarizing politicians,
Speaker 2: it's misinformation. So that's where we come in to be
Speaker 2: able to equip our partners and our journalists and people
Speaker 2: who want to do that good in society to do
Speaker 2: it right and accurately and tell our stories fairly. You know.
Speaker 1: I think that that is so important that when we
Speaker 1: talk about the knowledge gap, right, and that people may
Speaker 1: know someone, but they may not understand their lives right
Speaker 1: and their lived experience or the challenges right that they
Speaker 1: are facing. And I think that that is incredibly important.
Speaker 1: I'm so happy to hear that the number has risen
Speaker 1: over the last ten years of people who know a
Speaker 1: trans or non binary person, because I remember when that
Speaker 1: number was in the teens, right, And you know, most recently,
Speaker 1: I can attest with my own personal story that I
Speaker 1: had a conversation, you know, with my parents recently, with
Speaker 1: them saying, you know, I don't know the right things
Speaker 1: to say, but I'm trying to understand the trans community,
Speaker 1: like what is right? What can I ask? You know?
Speaker 1: But they wanted to have the conversation, but they also
Speaker 1: wanted to they wanted to have it in a safe
Speaker 1: space where they could make mistakes. And so what does
Speaker 1: it look like for those people that want to engage
Speaker 1: but are fearful so they say nothing?
Speaker 2: Do you know what I'm saying?
Speaker 1: So what what advice can we provide for those people
Speaker 1: that can create this safe space for them to say,
Speaker 1: you know what, I am struggling, right, because all people
Speaker 1: struggle with change, but like I want to be better.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this might be a controversial answer coming from
Speaker 2: me and my seat it glad, I'm going to call
Speaker 2: it a bit of a nontroversial answer. But this work
Speaker 2: is really not that hard. It's really just unpinning exactly
Speaker 2: that question and turning it on yourself and just having
Speaker 2: the conversation, overcoming that fear and that shame and maybe
Speaker 2: that rejection or fear of rejection, or fear from getting
Speaker 2: things wrong, or fear of cancel culture. It's the fear
Speaker 2: of not having the fear of having the question is
Speaker 2: what is setting us back? Or the fear of not
Speaker 2: asking the question is what's setting us back, because that
Speaker 2: withholds the conversation and the answers and the solutions for
Speaker 2: a lot of this. If we are just able to
Speaker 2: overcome this fear within ourselves and just ask the questions
Speaker 2: that we are afraid to ask, I think we will
Speaker 2: find a lot of peace. I'm going to use the
Speaker 2: word piece there, because a lot of what we have
Speaker 2: is this unrest whatever however that resonates with people that
Speaker 2: unrest within themselves, it's unrest with understanding an experience unlike
Speaker 2: their own. It's okay to ask questions. We have to
Speaker 2: ask the questions, and we have to be able to
Speaker 2: say and to really say in a full scale i
Speaker 2: am not asking this correctly, but will you allow me
Speaker 2: to ask it and help me through the right way
Speaker 2: to ask it.
Speaker 1: That is what drew me from politics and policy work
Speaker 1: to media was this idea of how do we use
Speaker 1: store storries to be able to present models on how
Speaker 1: we have conversations? Yeah, because what I've come to understand, Tony,
Speaker 1: and you tell me your experience, but what I've noticed
Speaker 1: over in my last decade plus doing this work is
Speaker 1: that what the right, what the opposition wants is a
Speaker 1: lack of conversation so that they can instill fear in
Speaker 1: that place, that knowledge gap that you're talking about. In
Speaker 1: that gap goes sphere right in that gap go yes,
Speaker 1: and they feed off of that gap. And so when
Speaker 1: I look at the importance in the role of media,
Speaker 1: it is to fill in in the place where there
Speaker 1: are holes. But when you have a media that is
Speaker 1: now so interested and invested in creating the gap, right,
Speaker 1: making the work even harder. What do places like GLAD do, right?
Speaker 1: Because the media is very much as responsible for where
Speaker 1: we are currently in this country as the politicians that
Speaker 1: put us there.
Speaker 2: No, totally, And I love that you mentioned your your
Speaker 2: own culture shift, your career shift, right because you know,
Speaker 2: I was a morning news producer for ten years before GLAD,
Speaker 2: and as I was doing more advocacy journalism, that alone
Speaker 2: has a ceiling in network and legacy media, right, Like,
Speaker 2: of course I can tell our stories, but you can't
Speaker 2: do that full time. So a lot of what I
Speaker 2: was doing in the network, in the network news space
Speaker 2: was a creating a space for career journalists to be
Speaker 2: of resource to one of one another and to create community.
Speaker 2: And what we found was in this kind of legacy
Speaker 2: journal Then this legacy journalist space was a really i
Speaker 2: will say antiquated and you'll at this it's like, you know,
Speaker 2: journalists can't have opinions, tell both sides right down the middle,
Speaker 2: all of these all of these things which does make sense, right,
Speaker 2: But in the world we are living in, we're not.
Speaker 2: The question is no longer do we hold people accountable?
Speaker 2: It's how do we hold people accountable? And that threads
Speaker 2: out to outdated laws, outdated legislation, outdated ideas. And then
Speaker 2: the closest journalist space And what I'm kind of getting
Speaker 2: to here is for me, when I met my ceiling
Speaker 2: in terms of I wanted to tell these stories, our
Speaker 2: stories full time and go over to come over to glad.
Speaker 2: Part of that in my former space was encouraging network
Speaker 2: leadership to allow journalists and reporters to infuse their experiences
Speaker 2: in the storytelling. And that's not biased, that's not opinion,
Speaker 2: that my own lived experience can tell the story in
Speaker 2: a way that connect with an audience, connects with people,
Speaker 2: connects with the stories that we need answers to in
Speaker 2: an explosively expanded way than just telling a script, rereading
Speaker 2: a script, write quote, unquote down the middle. So a
Speaker 2: lot of the work we're doing at GLAD is not
Speaker 2: you know, grading inclusivity the quality of inclusivity of content
Speaker 2: per se, but we're we're really after the visceral experience
Speaker 2: of the content. Can this content shift culture by affecting policy?
Speaker 2: Can this story or piece do that? And of course
Speaker 2: including does it emote emotion and is it thought provoking?
Speaker 2: So GLAD deals with all of that space also, but
Speaker 2: especially the training and advocacy piece from activists across the
Speaker 2: country and being able to take those people in want
Speaker 2: who are hungry to do more, who are already set
Speaker 2: advocates and activists in their own communities, and being able
Speaker 2: to do everything for media, train them, to counsel them,
Speaker 2: to connect them with medium, the right and the right
Speaker 2: folks in their communities to tell their stories and apply
Speaker 2: their lived experiences to quote unquote issues because at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, LGBTQ people are not issues, they
Speaker 2: are people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And the idea of neutrality is a fallacy, right,
Speaker 1: like it is it is looking at the world through
Speaker 1: the prism of white cis hetero men, right, And that
Speaker 1: is a long you know, long ago time, far off
Speaker 1: time when we had four channels that we were all watching,
Speaker 1: and you know, the two news men that we were
Speaker 1: all following, and they were dictating to us how the
Speaker 1: world should look and be right through a white supremacist
Speaker 1: patriot regulars you know. So yeah, so it's it's just
Speaker 1: like for me, you know, I get this. I get
Speaker 1: this question a lot when I when I do storytelling trainings,
Speaker 1: when I work with different folks and they're just like, well,
Speaker 1: you know, isn't it the job? Or when I speak
Speaker 1: to journalism students, isn't it the job of us to
Speaker 1: be neutral? And I said, your job is to tell
Speaker 1: the truth And I don't know how you tell the
Speaker 1: truth with excluding your own lived experience from what it
Speaker 1: is that you're covering, right, Like, that isn't an opinion
Speaker 1: to your point, It is providing color and context, right.
Speaker 1: And what I what I feel like we miss out
Speaker 1: too by doing that is treating the audience as adults,
Speaker 1: right that can handle nuance. And so I when you
Speaker 1: talk about you know, LGBTQ people being people and not
Speaker 1: just numbers or statistics or problems to be solved, I
Speaker 1: think what is missing to in media is that nuance.
Speaker 1: And when we're talking beyond because you were in you know,
Speaker 1: in the news business. You know we're talking about clips, right,
Speaker 1: like we need the clip, we need the two minute clip.
Speaker 1: But when we're going beyond that and you actually have
Speaker 1: the ability to tell stories in documentaries, in series, in
Speaker 1: you know, in in film, what do you think is missing?
Speaker 1: You know, Tony, that need that we need to expand on, that,
Speaker 1: we need to work on that. It isn't just about
Speaker 1: the numbers of LGBTQ people that are present in front
Speaker 1: or behind the camera, because I think both are important,
Speaker 1: But what else do you think is missing? To really
Speaker 1: expand on the nuance?
Speaker 2: I really out the gate as a storyteller myself, who
Speaker 2: has had threats for stories in the past, not going
Speaker 2: to name names or networks like threatened some stories to
Speaker 2: go away because I pushed a little too hard, uh
Speaker 2: first for that truth, right. I think what's really missing
Speaker 2: across the board, as a broad stroke is having the
Speaker 2: courage to tell things the way they are and call
Speaker 2: things out for the way they are, to say this
Speaker 2: person or idea is transphobic, XYZ is racist. We have
Speaker 2: to get to a place all of our storytellers out there,
Speaker 2: content creators, we have to have the courage to call
Speaker 2: things as they are, period, and that is actually journalism.
Speaker 2: Being neutral is not journalism. That's irresponsible journalism to me,
Speaker 2: but being able to call things out for what and
Speaker 2: who they are and what those things stand for and
Speaker 2: the realities for what is at stake. I am not
Speaker 2: you know, I'm not a I'm not a policy gay
Speaker 2: by any means. And I know i've again, I just
Speaker 2: I call on, I've been name checking legacy, legacy, legacy,
Speaker 2: but at these legacy networks, I say, I still say.
Speaker 2: We also we love our polls, and I'm like, I'm sorry,
Speaker 2: but I've never answered any of these phone calls ever
Speaker 2: in my life. I don't even know anybody who has ever.
Speaker 2: So I'm like, who are these people? Number one? And
Speaker 2: who really does this poll represent? And they're so calculated,
Speaker 2: in formulaic and careful, you know, and how they portray
Speaker 2: certain numbers on the air. I get that, but I
Speaker 2: think we rely a lot on polling numbers, and I
Speaker 2: have to just call this out as we go into
Speaker 2: an election year, we rely so much, not on just
Speaker 2: the direction of a campaign, but we let polling dictate
Speaker 2: our storytelling now yes, versus going out and talking to
Speaker 2: the people or leaning on lived experience to actually dictate
Speaker 2: the facts and what is actually at stake versus really
Speaker 2: a narrative made up by numbers, you know.
Speaker 1: And I'm glad that you made the pivot to the
Speaker 1: election because you know, that is obviously top of mind
Speaker 1: for me and top of mind for the listeners as
Speaker 1: we you know, head you know, headfirst into twenty twenty
Speaker 1: four and so what you know, how what is Glad's role,
Speaker 1: you know, as we head into what is you know?
Speaker 1: And I know I say it ad nauseum, the most
Speaker 1: consequential election of our time, the one that is going
Speaker 1: to decide whether America remains a project of democracy or
Speaker 1: you know, a tool of fascism. So what what is
Speaker 1: Glad's role and what are you all preparing for as
Speaker 1: we head into an election cycle?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean for us, it's really humanizing the queer experience.
Speaker 2: It's going out there and telling real people's stories. It's
Speaker 2: getting out of the coastal cities and really meeting people
Speaker 2: for who and what they are and what they're going through.
Speaker 2: It's walking you through the stories of thousands, I want
Speaker 2: to say, millions of Americans and families who are leaving
Speaker 2: states over you know, laws on immigration, bodily autonomy, athletes
Speaker 2: and bathrooms, you name it. It's just like, are are
Speaker 2: we so bored? Like that? Those are the issues at stake,
Speaker 2: Like like what people are trying to put food on
Speaker 2: the table and we are stuck on a less than
Speaker 2: one percent of a community that needs to be legislated again,
Speaker 2: so like so that's my aside personally, but humanizing the
Speaker 2: queer experience is number one for us. And I think
Speaker 2: all of the queer organizations are really having a coming
Speaker 2: together and I feel like at times there's there's a
Speaker 2: little bit of a I'm gonna say turf wars, and
Speaker 2: I know many will hear this, but there's the idea
Speaker 2: that all the orgs have their own lane and we
Speaker 2: do our own thing. We don't talk to each other.
Speaker 2: But what's going to really come to a head here
Speaker 2: is having unified message and being able to come together
Speaker 2: and bring all our resources together. You know you have
Speaker 2: Human Rights Campaign who you know they do policy prevor
Speaker 2: Project is mental health. GLAD creates content, representation and experiences
Speaker 2: around policy and mental health and all those things. Right,
Speaker 2: so when we come together, we are an unstoppable force.
Speaker 2: But as you mentioned before, there are people who are
Speaker 2: pouring millions of dollars into that knowledge gap. That's their
Speaker 2: mo You have your groups like Moms for Liberty, your
Speaker 2: Alliance Defending Freedom, who are getting these insane cases into
Speaker 2: the Supreme Court. So there's millions of dollars coming up
Speaker 2: to bat against us. But I think also what you're
Speaker 2: seeing is you know we're going after Moms for Liberty
Speaker 2: like you will be exposed. We know who you are
Speaker 2: and we're coming for you. And it's so unfair to
Speaker 2: see how much a lot of these groups have been platformed.
Speaker 2: But I'm really encouraged by gen Z and Jen Alpha,
Speaker 2: just to name two generations. We just had a couple
Speaker 2: of weeks ago here Xander Morricks in South Florida, who
Speaker 2: is a GLAD twenty under twenty alumnus, just said some powerful,
Speaker 2: powerful stuff to one of the Moms for Liberty. Uh yeh, scandals.
Speaker 2: I mean, these are things. I'm like, I could not
Speaker 2: come up with this stuff, but these are these are
Speaker 2: people who are empowered to make change in a way
Speaker 2: that I haven't seen in my lifetime. And we all
Speaker 2: get into this space and advocacy for our own reasons
Speaker 2: and experiences, but to see the kind of drive and
Speaker 2: the kind of ways they are utilizing media as a
Speaker 2: vehicle for change by using their experience, their voice, their
Speaker 2: story is really something that blows me away. And within
Speaker 2: Glad's plan of action is really being able to support
Speaker 2: those people and those voices and instead of doing it
Speaker 2: on our own. I think a lot of times, you know,
Speaker 2: I always say acceptances on all of us, and acceptance
Speaker 2: is really not that hard. I tell my team here
Speaker 2: all the time. We can do everything, but we can
Speaker 2: empower people and guide them to do and be their
Speaker 2: best and to equip them to go out into the
Speaker 2: world and be the change they want to see. I
Speaker 2: think for us, it's going to be humanizing the queer
Speaker 2: experience and equipping our community to really go the distance
Speaker 2: and connect with people in ways that people might be afraid,
Speaker 2: might have been afraid to in the past.
Speaker 1: Amazing, Well Tony WELLKF Daily is here for you and
Speaker 1: here for Glad in all the ways that we can
Speaker 1: partner and work together to my voices UH and much
Speaker 1: needed messages and fill in the knowledge gap in a
Speaker 1: way that increases our progress. So appreciate you making the
Speaker 1: time for.
Speaker 2: I appreciate you're filling gap here every day. Girl. You
Speaker 2: just spent fire everywhere I see you on on social media,
Speaker 2: and I so appreciate you. And it's a privileged to
Speaker 2: join you for this convote today, So thank you.
Speaker 1: All right, we'll come back again soon. That is it
Speaker 1: for me today. Dear friends on wok f as always,
Speaker 1: power to the people and to all the people. Power,
Speaker 1: get woke and stay woke as fuck.