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Speaker 1: That's one of the reasons why people, Yeah, watch Dateline because,

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Speaker 1: like so much in the world, doesn't work the way

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Speaker 1: it's supposed to. But yeah, you know, Fridays at nine,

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Speaker 1: that scoundrel gets what's coming to them most of the time.

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Speaker 2: This is off the cup. I'm se Cup. And as

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Speaker 2: a journalist and someone who covers quote unquote the news,

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Speaker 2: we're usually curious about everything. It's a quality that I

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Speaker 2: find a lot of us have in common. We just

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Speaker 2: want to know stuff. And so the true crime category

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Speaker 2: of news has always been interesting to most journalists I know,

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Speaker 2: even if they don't report on crime. And it was

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Speaker 2: definitely true of me. I was a true crime fanatic.

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Speaker 2: And later I'll get into why I'm less of a

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Speaker 2: true crime fanatic these days, but solving crimes was always

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Speaker 2: interesting to me. And one of the earliest memories I

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Speaker 2: have of watching non cartoons was when I was about

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Speaker 2: seven or eight and my parents let me stay up

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Speaker 2: late to watch Murder She wrote every week, and it

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Speaker 2: terrified me, but I also loved it, and I imagined

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Speaker 2: being a writer one day, living in a small town

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Speaker 2: like habit Cove when I was older, and solving all

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Speaker 2: the crimes which seemed to happen way too often for

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Speaker 2: such a small town, but that was obviously fiction. But

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Speaker 2: I also loved unsolved mysteries and cops and America's Most Wanted.

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Speaker 2: Then in nineteen ninety two, Dateline comes along with Stone

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Speaker 2: Phillips and Jane Polly, and I was into the news

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Speaker 2: at a very young age as well.

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Speaker 3: But I was hooked on the show.

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Speaker 2: And it was a news magazine show that covered all

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Speaker 2: kinds of stories.

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Speaker 3: I loved it.

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Speaker 2: And then of course there was this huge true crime

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Speaker 2: boom and now you know Dateline sort of synonymous with

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Speaker 2: like murders. One of the hosts, I'll tell you my

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Speaker 2: favorite Dateline host is Josh Mankowitz and his hips don't lie.

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Speaker 2: If you follow him on social media as I do,

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Speaker 2: I am thrilled to have him on off the Cup.

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Speaker 3: Welcome Josh, thank you great to be here. And yeah,

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Speaker 3: my hips, you're right. Why don't they lie? Though? That's

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Speaker 3: the question? Well, look, I.

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Speaker 1: Mean this is journalism. I mean, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's the thing about you know, you can't

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Speaker 1: lie when you're a reporter. So that's an easy claim

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Speaker 1: to make, you know, true Detective magazine, you can chart

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Speaker 1: that as the beginning of sort of journalism about true crime.

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Speaker 1: I mean, obviously there's earlier examples Sherlock Holmes and things

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Speaker 1: like that, but I mean there's a true detective magazine

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Speaker 1: in the United States talking about horrible crimes and the

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Speaker 1: dogged policeman who solved them.

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Speaker 3: Right. Yeah, that was first published in nineteen twenty four. Wow,

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Speaker 3: So that would be one hundred years of people reading

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Speaker 3: about true crime journalism. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you know, people will to say me, oh, how

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Speaker 1: long you think it's going to last. I'm thinking, like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: a while, because it's been going on for a long time.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this has always been a topic that people

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Speaker 1: read about and were interested in, whether it was that,

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Speaker 1: whether it was in cold blood right right, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I mean all those wonderful true crime books of the sixties, seventies, eighties, nineties,

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Speaker 1: or the sort of current craze of true crime on TV, podcasts, streaming,

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Speaker 1: any other way you want to get your content.

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Speaker 2: And this is correct me. If I'm wrong, Dayline's thirty

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Speaker 2: second year on NBC, I.

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Speaker 3: Think yes, I think that's right.

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Speaker 1: It depends a little bit about how you count the seasons,

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Speaker 1: because I think we started in the middle of the season.

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Speaker 1: I think they started in January instead of in September.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I think this is thirty two years for Dayline.

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Speaker 1: I've only been here thirty I mean February thirty years.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so only and we're going to get into that.

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Speaker 2: But a lot of people are watching them in syndication.

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Speaker 2: But you're you're still I mean you're still airing new

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Speaker 2: episodes of course.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, I mean we've been you know, we were

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Speaker 1: off for the Olympics and we used that time to

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Speaker 1: do a lot of new stories, all of which you're

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Speaker 1: going to be airing this fall Fridays at nine o'clock Eastern.

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Speaker 3: Don't watch alone.

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Speaker 2: There you go. So how I mean, everyone I know

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Speaker 2: in this industry wants a job that is basically forever.

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Speaker 3: How did you pull this off?

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Speaker 1: Okay, So when I took this job in February of

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Speaker 1: ninety five, I didn't have the slightest thought like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: this is the thing you're going to retire from. You didn't,

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Speaker 1: you know, like what lasts thirty years in television? Nothing?

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Speaker 1: Monday Night Football, Meet the Press. I mean, there just

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Speaker 1: aren't a lot of things. So I thought, well, okay,

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Speaker 1: I'll do this for a while and then, you know,

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Speaker 1: do something else. And I'd been a political reporter before.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I covered.

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Speaker 1: Politics in New York City and in LA and I

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Speaker 1: had I'd been an correspondent for ABC, and I'd covered

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Speaker 1: the Congress. And when I came to Dayline, we were

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Speaker 1: not doing exclusively crime. We were doing, as you remember,

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Speaker 1: because you remember the original Dayline with the Paphone and Jane.

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Speaker 1: We were doing all kinds of stories.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, corruption, scandals, yeah.

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Speaker 3: All sorts of things, funny stories.

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Speaker 1: During the nineties stock market boom, we did a thing

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Speaker 1: where we pitted a stockbroker who was picking stocks against

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Speaker 1: the chimp, and we would we'd put the portfolios into

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Speaker 1: the chimp's cage, and whichever one the chip picked up,

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Speaker 1: we'd assumed that that was their choice of which stock

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Speaker 1: to buy. So the you know, the stockbroker was buying

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Speaker 1: like Microsoft, right, and the chimp was like, no, I'm

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Speaker 1: going with Netscape.

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Speaker 3: So and of course, and of course after it, yeah,

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Speaker 3: and of.

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Speaker 1: Course, after a period of time, the chip was actually

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Speaker 1: a hat, which was great.

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Speaker 3: I don't remember how it came out. So we did go.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we did all kinds of stuff. And after I'd

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Speaker 1: been here about ten years. About two thousand and five,

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Speaker 1: we started making the turn to doing in two ways.

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Speaker 1: One is we started doing hour long episodes, which we

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Speaker 1: had none before. We'd done like four or five six

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Speaker 1: stories within an hour. Sometimes you'd do a two part thing,

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Speaker 1: but usually it was you know, the choices were a

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Speaker 1: story that was about two to three minutes long, five

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Speaker 1: to seven minutes long, and then up to about fifteen

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Speaker 1: minutes long.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 1: And then we started doing hours. And we also started

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Speaker 1: covering crime and mostly murders. And when that happened, I

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Speaker 1: was not super interested in doing that.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: I did not really rebel in the sixties. I had

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Speaker 1: no six in the seventies, I made no money in

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Speaker 1: the eighties. So when true crime came along, I missed

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Speaker 1: that trend too. So it's not surprising.

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Speaker 2: I like, a couple of minutes in here, and I

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Speaker 2: already know so much about you, right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I was.

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Speaker 1: I was behind all of those curves. So yeah, I

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Speaker 1: did not see true crime coming. But I thought, okay,

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Speaker 1: I mean I could tell they really wanted to start

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Speaker 1: doing this, yes, and so I thought, all right, I'll

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Speaker 1: do one. So I did one, and after it was over,

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Speaker 1: I thought, well, that wasn't so bad. That was kind

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Speaker 1: of fun, it's kind of interesting. I'm still in touch

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Speaker 1: with the mom from that story.

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Speaker 3: Wow.

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Speaker 1: And then we were just off and running and then

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Speaker 1: it the audience responded. You know, we found ways to

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Speaker 1: tell these stories that sort of wasn't being done anywhere else.

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Speaker 1: Because most crimes I'm not talking about, you know, John

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Speaker 1: Bnay Ramsey or something that everybody knows the details of it.

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Speaker 1: Most of the stories we cover the stories that you've

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Speaker 1: never heard of before. And there are stories where we're

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Speaker 1: able to say to the family involved, you're not going

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Speaker 1: to get two hours of coverage anywhere else. Most of

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Speaker 1: these are stories that got eight to ten inches in

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Speaker 1: the newspaper and maybe a minute or two on local

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Speaker 1: TV news, and then maybe they covered it again when.

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Speaker 3: There was a trial, but that was pretty much it.

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Speaker 1: But at two hours, we can tell a much longer,

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Speaker 1: a much more in depth story, with a lot more texture,

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Speaker 1: a lot more context, a lot more backstory. You'll get

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Speaker 1: a sense of not just the crime and the killer,

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Speaker 1: but who the victim was, who the family was, what

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Speaker 1: that relationship was.

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Speaker 3: Like, what that loss is like.

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Speaker 1: And sometimes in addition to these terrible stories, you also

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Speaker 1: hear stories of you know, strength and redemption, which is

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Speaker 1: kind of you know resilience, which is one of the

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Speaker 1: things that I think makes people keep coming back to Dayline,

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Speaker 1: because look, most people are never going to be touched

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Speaker 1: by violent crime in their lifetimes. Most people are not

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Speaker 1: going to be the victim of a violent crime. But

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Speaker 1: everybody has been in a relationship that did not end

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Speaker 1: the way they wanted it to, and Daylines about those

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Speaker 1: choices too.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that's such a good point, and I want to

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Speaker 2: talk a lot about Dayline, but first I want to

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Speaker 2: talk about you. You were born in Berkeley. Did you

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Speaker 2: grow up there?

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Speaker 3: Now, my dad was going to law school at Berkeley

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Speaker 3: at the time. That's why I was born there.

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Speaker 1: And then I lived in Los Angeles till I was

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Speaker 1: about six. Then we went to South America because my

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Speaker 1: dad went to the Peace Corps. Then then he was

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Speaker 1: still with the Peace Corps when he went to DC

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Speaker 1: after that. So then by the time I was about

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Speaker 1: nine until I was twenty six twenty seven, I lived

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Speaker 1: in DC.

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Speaker 2: Well, and I most people don't know the history, the

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Speaker 2: long and impressive history of your very famous family.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to run through it for listeners.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I want you to know I'm about to blow

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Speaker 2: a lot of people's minds. So your dad, Frank Mankowitz,

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Speaker 2: was Robert F. Kennedy's press secretary. Yes, we're gonna talk

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Speaker 2: about that, Okay. Your grandfather, Herman, along with Orson Wells,

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Speaker 2: wrote the screenplay for a little movie called Citizen Kane.

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Speaker 3: Fyi. Orson Wells had nothing to do with writing that movie.

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Speaker 3: Go ahead, amazing, amazing? Oh good.

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Speaker 2: Your great uncle Joseph was a director and screenwriter of,

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Speaker 2: among other projects, All About Eve. Your brother Ben is

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Speaker 2: a host at Turner Classic Movies. We watch you guys

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Speaker 2: fight on Twitter sometimes. And you've got a couple cousins

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Speaker 2: who are also very successful in the movie business. I mean,

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Speaker 2: I know, right, what was it like growing up with

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Speaker 2: famous relatives?

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Speaker 3: Well, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you didn't really think about it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it was just you know, I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, George K. Koor was at the dinner table sometimes,

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Speaker 1: you know, at my grandmother's house.

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Speaker 3: But I didn't, like, you know, I wasn't watching his movies.

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Speaker 3: I just knew him as George.

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Speaker 1: You know, when my dad was with RFK you know,

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Speaker 1: Dolores Werda was at our kitchen table sort of plotting

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Speaker 1: strategy for the farm workers. But like that was, you know,

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Speaker 1: just a friend of my dad's who came over.

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Speaker 3: So yeah. When I met Robert Kennedy a couple of.

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Speaker 1: Times when I was, you know, twelve eleven, twelve years old,

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Speaker 1: I did get the feeling like, Okay, this is this

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Speaker 1: is this is different. Not everybody has this experience.

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Speaker 2: What do you remember about RFK senior?

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Speaker 1: Magnetic, charismatic, very soft spoken, like you had to strain

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Speaker 1: to hear him. He didn't talk, he didn't speak loudly,

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Speaker 1: and I think usually maybe more comfortable around kids than

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Speaker 1: the alt love to talk about what you were up

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Speaker 1: to as a kid, Maybe because he had so many kids.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, and I don't. I mean, we don't get

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Speaker 2: political here, but I just got to know, what do

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Speaker 2: you make of his son's presidential campaign.

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Speaker 3: I barely knew him back then.

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Speaker 1: I think I met him a few times, but not

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Speaker 1: accurate to say that we were even friends back then

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Speaker 1: as kids.

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Speaker 3: I think he's a year older than I am.

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Speaker 1: I ran into him again when he was practicing environmental

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Speaker 1: law in New York City and I was a political

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Speaker 1: reporter for Channel two, and I've covered some event that

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Speaker 1: he was at and then out flours, I went up

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Speaker 1: and said hi to him, and he said, wow, it's weird.

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Speaker 1: We don't know each other a lot better. And I said, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is weird, and then we've never spoken again, So

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Speaker 1: that was left there. Yeah, that was the extent of

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Speaker 1: my relationship with Rfkjune.

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Speaker 2: You did not remedy the weirdness.

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Speaker 3: Right, I mean, my dad would be appalled today.

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Speaker 1: I don't think that's going to come as any shock,

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Speaker 1: and my dad would be absolutely crestfallen.

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Speaker 2: About his campaign.

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Speaker 1: You mean, yeah, just about sort of the nuttiness associated

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Speaker 1: with that and the damage he's doing to his own name.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, might dad be appalled with a

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Speaker 1: lot of things happening in America today, so that that

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Speaker 1: probably wouldn't even make the top ten.

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Speaker 2: So did you always want to be in the news?

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Speaker 1: You know, I grew up watching Vietnam Civil rights movement,

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Speaker 1: Watergate on the evening news every night. Yeah, so I

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Speaker 1: did definitely think about that. You know, we watched the

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Speaker 1: CBS Evening News with water Kronkite.

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Speaker 3: Good Evening from CBS News headquarters in New York.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to say five days a week for you know,

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Speaker 1: probably fifteen years. I mean until I went away to college.

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Speaker 1: And then I remember being in my dorm room at

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Speaker 1: college and thinking like, oh, it's it's seven o'clock. I

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Speaker 1: got to watch the news, and I would get out

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Speaker 1: my little, tiny black on white TV and while everybody

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Speaker 1: else was doing something else, I would be I'd watch

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Speaker 1: the news, you know, and then it was the Patty

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Speaker 1: Hirst story, you know, when I would tell seventy three, there's.

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Speaker 3: Been a big kidnapping on the West Coast.

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Speaker 1: The victim is Patricia Hurst, the daughter of newspaper executive

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Speaker 1: Randolph Hurst and a granddaughter of the legendary William Randolph Hearst.

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Speaker 1: Because I said, right, I did not have any sex

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Speaker 1: in the seventies, I was watching the news, so uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I missed every trend.

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Speaker 3: I'm not sure what this decade is going to be

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Speaker 3: famous for, but I know that I will not.

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Speaker 1: Do it, okay, So yeah, I mean I always thought

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Speaker 1: about that, and I remember saying to my dad talking

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Speaker 1: about the correspondence on the evening news. I remember saying

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Speaker 1: that guy's got an interesting job, because the other day

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Speaker 1: he was in Texas covering that flood, and today here

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Speaker 1: he is in Alabama and he's covering this protest march

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Speaker 1: or whatever. He had to travel during that time, and

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Speaker 1: he had to get up to speed on this other story,

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Speaker 1: and I thought that sounded like a lot of fun.

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Speaker 3: And my dad had been a journalist. No one remembers

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Speaker 3: this about him.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he's primarily thought of as being in politics

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Speaker 1: and being in PR but he was also president of

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Speaker 1: National Public Radio for a while, and at an earlier

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Speaker 1: stage in his life, he was a local anchorman in Washington,

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Speaker 1: d C. Which no one remembers, in like about nineteen seventy,

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Speaker 1: at which he was spectacularly unsuccessful. So he had a

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Speaker 1: brief foray into TV news also, which sort of exposed

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Speaker 1: me to some of the people who worked there, and

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Speaker 1: that also got me interested. So by the time I

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Speaker 1: was in college, yeah, I was already thinking about this

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Speaker 1: as some kind of career. And I started working at

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Speaker 1: ABC News on the assignment desk in the middle of

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Speaker 1: the night in the summer when everybody else was on vacation,

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Speaker 1: in the summer of seventy five. So it's coming up

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Speaker 1: on fifty years.

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Speaker 2: Wow, what did you study in college? She went to Haverford, Right,

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Speaker 2: I went to Haverford.

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Speaker 1: I studied sociology, which maybe not the smartest choice back then.

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Speaker 2: I can beat you. I studied art history, super super useful.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so yeah, it comes in. Yeah, yeah, I talk

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Speaker 1: a lot about the Protestant ethic and the spirit of capitalism. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: comes up, comes up all the time. I also thought

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Speaker 1: there was going to be more quadratic equations as we went.

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Speaker 3: Through life, and there have not been, indeed not been

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Speaker 3: nearly as much of that as I expected.

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Speaker 2: No total, total waste. All right, let's get to Dateline.

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Speaker 2: It's nineteen ninety five, and your agent says, what to you?

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Speaker 3: Why are you calling me all the time?

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Speaker 1: Leave?

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Speaker 3: Leave me alone. I have actual clients. Yeah, it was

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Speaker 3: welcome to be.

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Speaker 1: It was not my agent, it was I was in

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Speaker 1: local news in Los Angeles covering politics. Dick Reardon had

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Speaker 1: just been elected mayor. Tom Bradley had left. He was

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Speaker 1: getting sworn in. But I didn't actually cover Reard. I

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Speaker 1: covered the campaign, and that was right at the end

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Speaker 1: of that and there was a big boom of news

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Speaker 1: magazines on all the networks, and Dateline had been around

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Speaker 1: for a couple of years, and it had. They went

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Speaker 1: through that thing with the GM truck where a bunch

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Speaker 1: of people got fired, and the new management team that

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Speaker 1: came in involved a guy named Neil Shapiro who went

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Speaker 1: on to be president of NBC News. But he's the

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Speaker 1: guy that took Dateline from just about at death's door

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Speaker 1: and made it the juggernaut than it is today, first

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Speaker 1: putting us on five nights a week at one time,

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Speaker 1: the multiple editions, and he's the guy that sort of

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Speaker 1: took Dateline from failure to household name and so Neil

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Speaker 1: and I knew Neil from having worked at ABC News

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Speaker 1: with him, But instead of going to Dayline, which I

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Speaker 1: probably could have done, then I went to a news

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Speaker 1: magazine that Fox was doing. There was no Fox News

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Speaker 1: channel then. This was the Fox network right where the

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Speaker 1: NFL now airs called front Page, which was murdoch attempt

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Speaker 1: to do a news magazine, and it's we were on

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Speaker 1: for like less than a year. I think we were

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Speaker 1: on about ten months. Maybe not even Ron Reagan was

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Speaker 1: on that that might jog people's memory. And there were

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Speaker 1: a couple of other correspondents and I was one of them,

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Speaker 1: and that sort of taught me how to do magazine story.

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Speaker 1: It ultimately didn't succeed. We were, you know, I think

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Speaker 1: we were one week. I have this, I tore this

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Speaker 1: out of the newspaper. They don't do this anymore because

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Speaker 1: it's all on the internet.

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Speaker 3: But there was a.

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Speaker 1: There was a time when the papers used to publish

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Speaker 1: the list of TV programs, you know, like the Nielsen raids. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: number one was you know, sixty minutes or something like that, right,

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Speaker 1: or you know, Dallas, right, And then it would go

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Speaker 1: down and one week there were one hundred and three

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Speaker 1: programs and front Page was number one hundred and three.

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Speaker 3: So that we were.

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Speaker 1: But even then, I mean even then, because there was

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Speaker 1: no streaming and almost no cable programs except you know,

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Speaker 1: reruns and things like that, but there's very little original

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Speaker 1: content on cable. Like even then, that rating today would

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Speaker 1: be like a that show would be a big success, right,

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Speaker 1: just you know, because of the raw numbers. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: back then it definitely wasn't a success. And while it

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Speaker 1: was off the air and kind of getting retooled and

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Speaker 1: they couldn't decide what to do with it or what

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Speaker 1: to call it or when to put it back on,

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Speaker 1: I left and went to Dayline and that was in February.

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Speaker 3: Of ninety five. Wow.

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Speaker 2: And it's always except for the time you're talking about

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Speaker 2: where I was at Death Store, it's always been a

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Speaker 2: successful franchise. But it feels like it's reached kind of

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Speaker 2: a cult status now where it's even cooler than it

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Speaker 2: was like ten or twenty years ago, and younger generations

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Speaker 2: are discovering it and there's memes about you guys, And

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Speaker 2: what's that been like to have this like resurgence.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, for a long time when a young

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Speaker 1: person would come up to me in an airport and say,

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Speaker 1: you're Josh, make it some dayline, Like, uh huh, the

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Speaker 1: next line was always my mom.

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Speaker 3: Loves you and I take a picture. Right now they

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Speaker 3: know us, they're not asking for them for their mom.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, there was a point where Neil Shapiro, who

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Speaker 1: you know, made Dateline this big success.

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Speaker 3: He moved up to be president of NBC.

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Speaker 1: News, and David Corvo, who actually had produced the Fox

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Speaker 1: show that I worked on, Front Page, he came to

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Speaker 1: be executive producer of Dayline and he's the guy that

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Speaker 1: took us into true crime. And that's kind of what

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Speaker 1: made Dateline the thing that it is today. That's what

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Speaker 1: sort of got us that that that new audience. And also, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it made us cool in a way I sort of

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Speaker 1: didn't see coming. But we're all over popular culture now.

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Speaker 1: I mean when when Taylor Swift is talking about how

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Speaker 1: Dateline helped her create a song, I'm thinking, like, what

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Speaker 1: really mean?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very cool, and you know it's funny. I

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Speaker 2: develop shows as well, And when I am in a

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Speaker 2: pitch meeting with a network, this is what they'll say.

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Speaker 2: I've heard this from several different network heads. They'll say,

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Speaker 2: we want something we can make a hundred of like Dateline.

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Speaker 2: People want to invest over and if they're liking something,

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Speaker 2: they want it over and over. Give it to me again,

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Speaker 2: give it to me again. And that's what's so great

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Speaker 2: about Dateline because they're endless, unfortunately, endless stories to tell.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there are endless stories to tell, that is true. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and also people see them again and again and again.

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Speaker 2: Yes, they know how it ends, and they still want

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Speaker 2: to watch it.

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Speaker 1: And they watch it anyway. And I mean we are

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Speaker 1: all I mean not only are we all over the

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Speaker 1: podcast universe. Yes, there's about five ways to get that

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Speaker 1: Dateline twenty four to seven streaming channel. I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: on Peacock, but it's also I think on Samsung TVs.

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Speaker 3: It's on YouTube. I mean, and so I mean you

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Speaker 3: can go back. You can't go back thirty two seasons because.

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Speaker 1: At one point we switched from standard definition to high

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Speaker 1: definition and the standard def episodes are not streaming because

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Speaker 1: they look weird on your on your TV.

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Speaker 3: But you can go back. You can go back a

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Speaker 3: very long way.

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Speaker 1: You can watch a lot of those episodes, and people

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Speaker 1: do and and they see them again and again and

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Speaker 1: again and then I mean, I know people when people

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Speaker 1: now talk to me about Dayline, I always ask them

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Speaker 1: how they consume it, because some people like, don't watch

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Speaker 1: the TV show, they're listening to the podcast, right.

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Speaker 3: Some people are unaware.

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Speaker 1: That there are podcasts out there of them, you know,

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Speaker 1: and you know on the podcast, I mean, it is

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Speaker 1: the audio of Dayline.

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Speaker 3: We don't change that at all.

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Speaker 1: We do some original podcasts every year and those those

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Speaker 1: are done specifically to be podcasts, and they take a

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Speaker 1: lot longer. But people eat up those podcasts because they're

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Speaker 1: consumable in ways that television is not. Like in your

437
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 1: car or you know, when you're commuting or when you're

438
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,360
Speaker 1: you know, doing work around the house.

439
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,720
Speaker 2: Right to Jim, Yeah, do you and the other hosts

440
00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:00,760
Speaker 2: ever fight over stories, like tell me the process, how

441
00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 2: a story comes to you or you get assigned a story.

442
00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:08,680
Speaker 1: I would say no, we don't, although within the way

443
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 1: Keith disag well. Within the last couple of weeks, just

444
00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:15,639
Speaker 1: for the first time since I've since I've been a

445
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,680
Speaker 1: correspondent at Dayline, there was a story that I was

446
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:21,880
Speaker 1: going to do in Canada, a cold case story.

447
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:24,120
Speaker 3: And I did a story in Canada several months ago,

448
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 3: and those cops put us onto this case.

449
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:28,000
Speaker 1: So the producer and I were going to do this

450
00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: one too, but it turns out that it's it's happening

451
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 1: in a The story occurred in a place that Keith

452
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:41,000
Speaker 1: thinks of as his hometown, and when he saw that

453
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,159
Speaker 1: story was beingid, he said to me, I want to

454
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 1: do that. I'm like, I thought, wait aboute my name's

455
00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:47,399
Speaker 1: already on that.

456
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,720
Speaker 3: And then I was like, it's in everyone's interest at Dayline.

457
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 1: For Keith Morrison to be as happy as possible, So

458
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:57,920
Speaker 1: so I was like, you know what, go to Canada,

459
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,040
Speaker 1: have a great time. But yeah, normally no, we do

460
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,520
Speaker 1: not fight over any stories and that doesn't even qualify

461
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,000
Speaker 1: as a fight. But you know, we hear about these

462
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 1: stories all kinds of different ways. I mean, we were

463
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:10,800
Speaker 1: reading the papers all over the country every day, and

464
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:14,280
Speaker 1: we're online all the time. And because we've been around

465
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:19,159
Speaker 1: so long, police departments, prosecutors, local stations, even defense attorneys

466
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 1: are calling us and saying, I don't know how this

467
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:27,000
Speaker 1: is going to come out, but this woman is missing.

468
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 1: Her husband is not joining in the searches, he's retained

469
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 1: a lawyer, he's acting very strangely. And we start making calls.

470
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 2: So I mean a lot of wait, are they doing

471
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,880
Speaker 2: that because they want like this crime solved and exposed?

472
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,360
Speaker 3: Why are they doing that just because they're being helpful?

473
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:46,639
Speaker 3: You know? I mean why are they calling us in

474
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 3: the local station.

475
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 1: Because you know, because we'll probably end up, you know,

476
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 1: maybe interviewing their reporter or using their coverage, or they'll

477
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:58,800
Speaker 1: will be on their air talking about this story. I mean,

478
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 1: when I go, you know, some small town and we

479
00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:05,159
Speaker 1: do a story about that, we probably will do some

480
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 1: little mini version of the story for them, you know,

481
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 1: if they want me to come on their newscast and

482
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 1: talk about it, I will. But in many cases they've

483
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,959
Speaker 1: already done a huge amount of the sort of digging

484
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 1: on this story. They've probably covered the trial. They probably

485
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,240
Speaker 1: were there early on when that search warrant was being served.

486
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 1: We weren't, but they were. We might be using those

487
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,719
Speaker 1: pictures that they shot. So local stations call us, but

488
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 1: so do so do investigators that we've worked with in

489
00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 1: the past, because you know, most people who have appeared

490
00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,640
Speaker 1: on Dateline. I'm not necessarily talking about the murderers here,

491
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:43,360
Speaker 1: but most people who have appeared on dateline think like, yeah,

492
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:44,639
Speaker 1: that worked out, I'm glad I did that.

493
00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I want to say. I said I was

494
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 2: a devotee of true crime, and I don't know if

495
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 2: you've got this a lot, But then I had a kid,

496
00:24:56,800 --> 00:25:01,679
Speaker 2: and every victim, every awful story of unsolved crime was

497
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 2: about my kid, and I couldn't separate it. And add

498
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 2: that to the stories I cover for a living, the

499
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 2: terrible things that happen to innocent people, from war to genocide.

500
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 3: You know, I had to take a break from it.

501
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 2: And I'm better now, but I have to be in

502
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 2: a very good mental health space to watch a doc

503
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 2: or a dock series about real like violent crime. Sure,

504
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,879
Speaker 2: do you ever take it home with you.

505
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 1: These stories I don't I do understand because I tend

506
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 1: to focus on sort of the other things you learn

507
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,440
Speaker 1: from those stories, not just the awful things that people

508
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 1: do to each other, which still shocks me all these

509
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 1: years later. You know, the things that people do to

510
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,880
Speaker 1: somebody that they you know, once maybe love, Yeah, somebody

511
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: that might very well be the parent of their children,

512
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 1: and people think like, oh, yeah, it'll be fine, my

513
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,920
Speaker 1: kids can lose their other parent in some violent way.

514
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 3: I'll be okay, right, I mean, and that lose me

515
00:25:58,359 --> 00:25:59,360
Speaker 3: because I'm in jail now.

516
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,119
Speaker 1: I don't understand any of that kind of thing. But

517
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 1: you also see tremendous stories of faith, of strength, of resiliency,

518
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,080
Speaker 1: of recovery, and so I was kind of like focus

519
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 1: on that stuff. And sometimes it's like, it's really nice

520
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:14,639
Speaker 1: to see justice done. I mean, that's one of the

521
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 1: reasons why people watch Dateline because like, so much in

522
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 1: the world doesn't work the way it's supposed to. But

523
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:25,120
Speaker 1: you know, Fridays at nine that scoundrel gets what's coming

524
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 1: to them most.

525
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 3: Of the time, and that's sort of satisfying.

526
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,880
Speaker 1: But look, you know, we don't we could choose bloodier

527
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:33,640
Speaker 1: stories We could do stories about serial killers. Certainly, there's

528
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,920
Speaker 1: a lot of programs out there doing that. We could

529
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: do sex crimes, we could do crimes, you know, involving children,

530
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 1: and we could do much bloodier things than we do.

531
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: But we don't because like the audience could change the channel.

532
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want them to have the same

533
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 1: reaction you did, which is like I can't watch this.

534
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 1: Yeah right, yeah, we're not. You know, Dennis Murphy's famous

535
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,840
Speaker 1: line about Dateline is, it's not about the murder, It's

536
00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:57,959
Speaker 1: about the marriage.

537
00:26:58,640 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 3: You know, it's so good.

538
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 1: This is about the relationships. This is not about the

539
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,520
Speaker 1: mechanics of the crime. It's about the mechanics sometimes of

540
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 1: solving the crime, and sometimes it's about the trail that

541
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 1: got police and prosecutors to the door of a murderer.

542
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:17,199
Speaker 1: But it's usually not about exactly what happened in that

543
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 1: room and how many times somebody got shot or stabbed.

544
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,880
Speaker 1: And now we can't even show most of those pictures

545
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 1: on television, I mean the number of you know, we

546
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: always wait till the end because we wanted to be adjudicated,

547
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,199
Speaker 1: and also that's when you can get any exhibit that

548
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,119
Speaker 1: was shown in court crime scene photos and stuff, But

549
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,239
Speaker 1: I mean, what percentage of the crime scene photos can

550
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 1: we show? Like maybe five percent? Most of them we can't.

551
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: So I mean this is not about shocking people because

552
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:47,159
Speaker 1: so much of it. We could cover much more horrifying things,

553
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 1: But like, I don't want to drive people away.

554
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:50,159
Speaker 3: I want people paying attention.

555
00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:53,440
Speaker 2: Up next, I talked to Josh about a story he

556
00:27:53,560 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 2: never expected to cover. Can you talk to me about

557
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 2: doctor Steve pitt Ugh?

558
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, I met him because we interviewed him on

559
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: a story about the twenty year anniversary of the John

560
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: Benet story. Now I didn't cover the John Benet story

561
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:27,880
Speaker 1: when it happened. Somebody else did, but they had left

562
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,240
Speaker 1: Dateline by the time it was time to do a

563
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:32,639
Speaker 1: twenty year story, so I kind of inherited that.

564
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 3: So I met him.

565
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 1: Because he had worked with the Boulder Police on that,

566
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: and so he was an interview on that, and he

567
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 1: was a good friend of a producer that worked for

568
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,640
Speaker 1: Dateline at the time who lived in Phoenix, which is

569
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 1: also where Steve lived, so they've gotten to know each other.

570
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,479
Speaker 1: So through all of that I met him and we

571
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 1: became friends, and he came out here to La a

572
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 1: lot where I live, and he and his fiance and

573
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,800
Speaker 1: and I went out. And I don't want to make

574
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:04,880
Speaker 1: this sound like he was my best friend on the

575
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 1: face of the earth, but it was clear he was

576
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,240
Speaker 1: going to become a better friend as the weeks and

577
00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 1: months went on. And he called me and said, Hey,

578
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,000
Speaker 1: I'm going to be in town. I'm at this art

579
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: fair and once you drop by. So I did drop by,

580
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: and he was there, and he was in a great mood,

581
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: and we sat around and had a couple of laughs,

582
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,000
Speaker 1: and that was that. We were going to meet again

583
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 1: a few weeks later and a couple of weeks after that.

584
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 1: He was a psychiatrist, by the way, for people who

585
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: don't know, he was a forensic psychiatrist, and he did

586
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 1: a lot of work for law enforcement over the years,

587
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 1: helped police with profiles of different criminals and also did

588
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: some court ordered evaluations of different people. Had done that

589
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:45,080
Speaker 1: over the years, in addition to having his own practice.

590
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 1: He was very successful. I worked in the Phoenix area,

591
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 1: and a couple of weeks after I had seen him

592
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 1: here in Los Angeles, I was driving up the coast

593
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 1: to a wedding north of la in the Wine Country

594
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 1: and the offic started calling me, and I thought, oh, no, no, no, no,

595
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 1: I am off. I am going to this wedding. My

596
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 1: wife was sitting next to me. No, no, I am not.

597
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: I don't know what you're calling me for, but I

598
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 1: am not available. And so I didn't answer the phone,

599
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: and they called a couple of times.

600
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 3: I'm like, mm mmmm, maybe you're not did not read

601
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 3: the memo.

602
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,840
Speaker 1: Where I am taking three days off, and then they

603
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: texted me the link to the Arizona Republic. Steve Pitt

604
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 1: had been murdered outside of his office the night before,

605
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 1: and I just drove off the road. So a couple

606
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 1: of days later I was in Phoenix for Steve Pitt's funeral,

607
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 1: and I don't know, two weeks after that, which I

608
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 1: wasn't expecting, we were doing a dateline episode about his murder.

609
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 1: And it turned out somebody that he had done a

610
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 1: court ordered evaluation of like eight or nine years earlier.

611
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 1: Had something happened, We don't know what. That sort of

612
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 1: hpped him over and made him want to start avenging

613
00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 1: what he saw as everybody having had done to him.

614
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:10,880
Speaker 1: He was almost certainly looking for the woman who had

615
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 1: been his wife, but she was very afraid of him,

616
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: and she also had the financial wherewithal to be able

617
00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 1: to hide herself and their son, so the guy could

618
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: not find them, although god, I think they would be dead. Yeah,

619
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: I'm sure at least she would be dead. But he

620
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 1: couldn't find her. But he could find Steve, who was

621
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: still listed, and he went to Steve's office and murdered

622
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: him as Steve was leaving. Then he went to the

623
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 1: attorney who had represented the wife in the divorce. The

624
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: attorney wasn't actually in the office, but a couple of

625
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 1: paralegals were, and this guy killed them. Then he went

626
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: to the psychologist's office, who he saw as having turned

627
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:57,760
Speaker 1: his son against him. That psychologist wasn't there, but he

628
00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 1: rented office space to some other person, and so he

629
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 1: killed that guy. And then it turned out he'd killed

630
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: another couple in their home, maybe before any of this happened,

631
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: because he had their gun. And I'm not sure what

632
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:17,680
Speaker 1: that They weren't connected to the divorce or his issues

633
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 1: with his family, but he might have wanted money from them,

634
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: or it's not quite clear when he wanted, but he

635
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 1: had killed them too.

636
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,000
Speaker 3: And then by the time police in Phoenix and.

637
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 1: Scottsdale figured out like they sort of connected the dots,

638
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 1: they realized what this hall was. They found where he was,

639
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 1: they surrounded him, but the guy killed himself before before

640
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 1: he could be brought in. So yeah, that was the

641
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 1: first time I covered the story of a murder of

642
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: somebody that I had known. And the weird thing was,

643
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: when Steve and I had been hanging out in Los

644
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 1: Angeles about ten days earlier, he was already in that

645
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 1: guy's sites. The police found that he'd been sort of

646
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 1: stalking Steve for a while, I probably learning, you know,

647
00:32:57,920 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: when he went to work, and when he went home,

648
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 1: they saw his car. They went back on security video

649
00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: and so his car park nearby. So Insteve was already

650
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 1: a marked man at the time that we met, which

651
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 1: was very sobering and what a loss. I mean, not

652
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 1: only was it this huge resource for law enforcement and

653
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 1: did a lot of good, but he was also just

654
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 1: the most wonderful guy.

655
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:24,320
Speaker 2: So when I hear a story like that, my broken

656
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 2: brain does a thing where it tells me the odds

657
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 2: of something awful happening to me or my family are

658
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: way better than they really are, simply because I've covered

659
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 2: so many awful things, and now there's something awful happening

660
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 2: in your own circle?

661
00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 3: Why am I special? Why will I be spared?

662
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:47,000
Speaker 2: Does this ever happen to you? Do you internalize stories

663
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 2: that way? Like the volume of stories? Does that impact you?

664
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,960
Speaker 3: You know? I mean? Am I more careful?

665
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,920
Speaker 1: I don't know? Maybe? I mean I don't. I don't

666
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 1: walk around thinking that something terrible.

667
00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 3: Is going to happen. You know.

668
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 1: I know that cops who've seen like a lot of

669
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: terrible things, you know, when they're you know that that

670
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 1: there can be very strict parents, you know, and when

671
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 1: their kid says to them, you know, I'm going to

672
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: we're all going to the mall.

673
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,040
Speaker 3: No, you're not right, right, they're not Your friends can go,

674
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:18,000
Speaker 3: You're not going. Well, we're all going out to this

675
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 3: all night party. No, you aren't right, which you know

676
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 3: can have the opposite effect.

677
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,440
Speaker 1: I mean, it can make your kid chafe and end

678
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,960
Speaker 1: up doing things that are dangerous. Yeah, you know, you know,

679
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,279
Speaker 1: I mean, there's no way to know. Obviously. No, the

680
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:36,319
Speaker 1: answer is you're wrong. You actually have a tiny, tiny chance.

681
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 2: There's something wrong with you. It's there's something wrong with me,

682
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 2: and it's my anxiety and it's why I'm in I'm

683
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:45,280
Speaker 2: in treatment and therapy and on medication.

684
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 3: Right.

685
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,879
Speaker 1: But I mean, but you're not alone. I mean sure

686
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: a lot of people think that.

687
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just hard to it's hard to dissociate sometimes

688
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:54,359
Speaker 2: and it's hard to separate it, and it's hard not

689
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 2: to think there is trouble around every corner. And it's

690
00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:01,799
Speaker 2: so wonderful that you don't have that problem considering what

691
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 2: you do.

692
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:04,320
Speaker 3: I don't.

693
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 1: I don't sort of look around every corner and think

694
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: like something terrible is about to happen or is going

695
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 1: to happen.

696
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 3: I'm glad. It's awful, it's exhausting.

697
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 1: But I will say I am careful. I mean, I

698
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:18,839
Speaker 1: you know, I don't walk to my car looking at

699
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: my phone and.

700
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 3: Not looking around. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know.

701
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 1: Whether that comes from Dayline or not, because that's probably

702
00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 1: just good advice no matter who you are.

703
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:31,640
Speaker 2: Right, you wrote somewhere that we live in a world

704
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:33,880
Speaker 2: in which there's too much violence and not enough mental

705
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:34,439
Speaker 2: health care.

706
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,800
Speaker 3: And that's for sure a fact.

707
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:40,720
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean, one of the things that Steve

708
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: said in his evaluation of that guy was that if

709
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:51,880
Speaker 1: he didn't get some significant medical psychological intervention, that he

710
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: was going to be a big problem, and that guy

711
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: didn't get any and he was a big problem. And

712
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:58,600
Speaker 1: also you know, I think he was ordered by a

713
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: judge not to have any guns. But there's sort of

714
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,280
Speaker 1: no mechanism for making sure that people in that situation,

715
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 1: you know, don't come into possession of a gun or

716
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,880
Speaker 1: you know, there's I mean there's in Arizona where that happened,

717
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 1: that just wasn't anything, and there's hardly anything in a

718
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:12,719
Speaker 1: lot of other places too, So I mean, yeah, I

719
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 1: mean we do. We live in a society where you know,

720
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: there's this trap door out there all the time for everybody,

721
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 1: I mean, too big a stigma against you know, going

722
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: into therapy or getting help.

723
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 3: It's too hard.

724
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 2: That's why I talk about it, because they don't want

725
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 2: there to be a stigma, and it's just so important.

726
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 2: Anxiety is now the most common mental health disorder, and

727
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 2: it's really impacting a lot of kids, and it's it's tough.

728
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:42,359
Speaker 2: We live in an anxious and anxious time and an

729
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 2: anxious world. Okay, my friends, yes, run a thing called

730
00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:54,400
Speaker 2: crime con. They started crime con YEP, which is super

731
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 2: popular convention.

732
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:57,840
Speaker 3: I know you've gone to meet with fans. I love it.

733
00:36:57,880 --> 00:36:58,760
Speaker 3: I get the appeal.

734
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 2: I am super proud of my friends for creating a

735
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:06,160
Speaker 2: space for fans like this. But it's a little weird

736
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 2: that we live in a world where crime gets its

737
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 2: own celebratory convention.

738
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 1: Though. I mean there's a big community out there. Somebody

739
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 1: was certainly going to figure out that, you know, that

740
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:21,440
Speaker 1: there was money to be made by bringing everybody together.

741
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:27,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I like it because it's a chance

742
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 3: to meet.

743
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:29,760
Speaker 1: I mean I went to the first one all along,

744
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 1: which was in Indianapolis, and I think there have been

745
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:33,919
Speaker 1: six of them so far.

746
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,359
Speaker 3: Maybe. I mean, it gets a little bigger every year.

747
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: And I went to the first one in Indianapolis, and

748
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 1: you know, I gave a gave a little address.

749
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 3: Room was packed. Yeah, And I came back and said to.

750
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 1: Liz Cole, who's the executive producer of Dayline, I'm like,

751
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,280
Speaker 1: we got to go next year. Like this is the audience,

752
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:55,440
Speaker 1: Like they're all jammed into one room, Like we gotta go.

753
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 3: Yeah.

754
00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,360
Speaker 1: And you know, there's certain rules about the guys I

755
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,960
Speaker 1: aren't really well publicized, Like people cannot show up dressed

756
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 1: as Jody Arius. You know, I mean, yeah, I mean

757
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:12,560
Speaker 1: this is not the equivalent of you know, comic con, right, Yeah,

758
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 1: I mean I mean the people who go are by

759
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:21,320
Speaker 1: and large, very very serious, and they, in my case,

760
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 1: they ask granular questions about dateline episodes really, and I

761
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,879
Speaker 1: have to yeah, I mean, they really want to know,

762
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 1: you know, not just what was it like to sit

763
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,240
Speaker 1: across from Zoe and so, but you know, why didn't

764
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:38,280
Speaker 1: the cops lose use luminol at the second crime scene?

765
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,440
Speaker 3: I'm thinking, like, yeah, okay, which one was that?

766
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:41,960
Speaker 1: Right?

767
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 3: Yeah?

768
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:46,239
Speaker 1: I mean they refer to the episodes by their titles,

769
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,480
Speaker 1: which is the only part of the episode that I

770
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:51,399
Speaker 1: don't play any role in, rowkay, Like those are put

771
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: in by somebody, you know, Like like, you know, the

772
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 1: story I'm covering right now is called Internally it's called

773
00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:02,399
Speaker 1: Baltimore Missing, but it'll be called something else. Yes, yes,

774
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:04,799
Speaker 1: when it airs, you know, it'll be called you know,

775
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 1: mystery on Eagle Road. Right, And then when someone asks

776
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: me about that in two years, something like which one

777
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: was mistery?

778
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm good, don't worry. I am going to ask

779
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:16,040
Speaker 2: you actually about the titles?

780
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 3: Yeah.

781
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:19,879
Speaker 1: So, but like like people really, I mean, at crime con,

782
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 1: people really know about it, and it's not just me.

783
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 3: I mean they know about all that.

784
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, so when they're talking to Nancy Grace, or when

785
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:29,200
Speaker 1: they're talking to people from Oxygen, for the authors that

786
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 1: go or the podcasters, I mean there's a lot of

787
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: knowledge there. Yes, and for me, it's nice to meet

788
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:36,080
Speaker 1: the people that watch Dayline.

789
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:37,920
Speaker 3: Sure, I get that.

790
00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:42,720
Speaker 2: How do you What do you do to unwind?

791
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 3: I read crime novels. No, no, you don't. That's your

792
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:54,480
Speaker 3: waiting waiting.

793
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,919
Speaker 2: It's like if I said I read the newspaper.

794
00:39:56,600 --> 00:40:02,000
Speaker 1: Waiting anxiously for the next Michael Finally, the next Robert Craze,

795
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 1: the next George Pelicanos. I'm reading. I'm reading Jane Casey

796
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:10,320
Speaker 1: right now. Yeah, the next Meg Gardner.

797
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 2: You.

798
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I watch all the British crime shows.

799
00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:18,080
Speaker 2: That's amazing. That's the last thing I expected you to say.

800
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:20,239
Speaker 1: Right, you're gonna throw I go, okay, well I'll come

801
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: up with something better. I Yeah.

802
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 3: I go fishing.

803
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:27,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, I fish, and I uh, what's the thing where

804
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:28,919
Speaker 1: you carve whalebone?

805
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:33,799
Speaker 3: What's that called? I do that? Yes? Yeah, I made yeah, yeah,

806
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:35,840
Speaker 3: I made a ship in a bottle. Yeah, it's fabulous.

807
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, it's time for the lightning round. So these

808
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:50,440
Speaker 2: are quick and fine. Okay, how many dateline podcasts?

809
00:40:50,480 --> 00:40:52,800
Speaker 3: Can you name? My own?

810
00:40:53,239 --> 00:41:00,200
Speaker 1: Motive for murder? Missing in America? Internal Affairs, the thing

811
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:03,399
Speaker 1: about Pam, the thing about Helen and Olga, the girl

812
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 1: in the Blue Mustang, murder in the Hollywood Hills. Yeah,

813
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 1: something about Room thirteen. That was one of keys can't

814
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:13,920
Speaker 1: roll what that one was called?

815
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:14,799
Speaker 3: That's it.

816
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:17,759
Speaker 1: And they're talking about original podcasts. Those are the ones

817
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:19,719
Speaker 1: I can name. Yeah, I probably missed. I think I

818
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:20,759
Speaker 1: missed one of my own.

819
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:25,719
Speaker 2: But yes, there's there's so many. Do you talk to

820
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 2: Stone Phillips? Oh yeah, sure in these days. You know,

821
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:31,479
Speaker 2: he lived in California for a long time.

822
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: I'd been back and forth between New York and California,

823
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:38,200
Speaker 1: and so I would see him sometimes, and he kind

824
00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,840
Speaker 1: of retired from broadcasting after he left eight Line.

825
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 3: Uh.

826
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 1: He's still pretty young. I mean he's had the same age. Yeah,

827
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 1: he's very happy. His son has grown up. I think

828
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 1: works here in la in the motion picture industries. I

829
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,120
Speaker 1: think come out here sometimes to see him. But he's

830
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: doing fine. He plays a lot of tennis, he plays

831
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:58,759
Speaker 1: a lot of golf. He seems really happy when I

832
00:41:58,760 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 1: see him.

833
00:41:59,200 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 3: That's great.

834
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:04,720
Speaker 1: He's still one of the two or three best looking

835
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 1: people I've ever met in my life. Yeah, no, he's

836
00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,160
Speaker 1: he's he is stunningly handsome. And I met JFK.

837
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:15,280
Speaker 2: Junior, So yeah, that says a lot. He was definitely

838
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:16,680
Speaker 2: my childhood crushed stone.

839
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 1: No a knockout and the sweetest, nicest guy.

840
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:24,680
Speaker 2: That's nice to hear. Yeah, Okay, murder she wrote took

841
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,080
Speaker 2: place in a fictional town of Cabot Cove, Maine. Do

842
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:28,440
Speaker 2: you know where it was actually filmed?

843
00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 3: I do not. I do not, and I didn't watch that.

844
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:36,160
Speaker 3: I wasn't into crime. Then it was filmed in Mendocino.

845
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,879
Speaker 1: Really, wow, that's a long way out of the way

846
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,640
Speaker 1: out right, I mean no, but I mean, like, like

847
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 1: to get all the crew and the gear up to

848
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: Mendocino that had to be expensive. Like, I'm surprised that

849
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 1: it wasn't somebody's closer to a major city, right. Did

850
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 1: she have a cottage up there or something that's like

851
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 1: the kind of thing. Don't you think that's the kind

852
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 1: of thing that Angela would have demanded? Like yeah, okay, yeah,

853
00:42:57,800 --> 00:42:58,880
Speaker 1: i'll do it, I'll do it.

854
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 3: I'll do it, but you got a shoot it down

855
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:02,040
Speaker 3: the road from where I live.

856
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can see her being like that.

857
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 2: Do you know what state featured the most dateline stories?

858
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:12,920
Speaker 1: Well, we've been through this before. It's going to depend

859
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,720
Speaker 1: on how you count dateline stories. The answer is almost

860
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 1: certainly California. It is, but that's because you got to

861
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 1: you add up all the oj stories and all the

862
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson stories and all the Scott stories, which were

863
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:27,920
Speaker 1: you know, all of these, you know, we didn't just

864
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:30,400
Speaker 1: do them once and then all the other stories that

865
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 1: we cover in California, so that yes.

866
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:36,879
Speaker 3: It's California. But yeah, but that's true for.

867
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:38,640
Speaker 1: A lot of things about California, just because there's so

868
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:40,720
Speaker 1: many people in it, you know, I mean.

869
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:41,439
Speaker 3: That makes sense.

870
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 2: I'm gonna name three dateline episodes by their titles good,

871
00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 2: and I want you to tell me which one is fake?

872
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 3: Okay, oh good, okay, good? All right. I like this.

873
00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:51,919
Speaker 3: This is good. This is a very good thing.

874
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 2: Yes, Secrets in Silver Lake, that's real.

875
00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 3: I did that. Okay.

876
00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 2: She wore a yellow ribbon, that's that's a real one.

877
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:02,400
Speaker 2: Even the devil went to church.

878
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:08,880
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, even the devil with the church is

879
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:10,200
Speaker 1: the fake one?

880
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 2: Nope, that's real. She wore a yellow ribbon. Is not

881
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:15,239
Speaker 2: a dateline episode, It's a Turner classic movie. And I'm

882
00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 2: going to tell your brother, Okay, well you didn't know that.

883
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:19,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, good luck, good luck getting him on the phone.

884
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 1: Tell him to call me.

885
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:24,480
Speaker 3: I think you passed. Though.

886
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:27,400
Speaker 2: This is a final question, and it's the question that

887
00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:31,800
Speaker 2: is most important to me. When is iced coffee season?

888
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:37,440
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say it's the same as wearing white, you know,

889
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:40,799
Speaker 1: like interesting Memorial Day through Labor Day.

890
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:43,760
Speaker 2: That's incorrect, it's year round. But that's fine. That's fine.

891
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:44,319
Speaker 3: You can have that.

892
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:48,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean, clearly you can have it before that.

893
00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 1: Clearly it's warm after Labor Day. But yeah, I'm gonna

894
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:53,440
Speaker 1: say generally it's when you wear white.

895
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:54,279
Speaker 3: Yeah.

896
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:56,719
Speaker 2: Great, well, Josh Megawitz.

897
00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 3: This was This was a pleasure so much. Thank you

898
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:01,640
Speaker 3: for having me. Thank you so much.

899
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:05,239
Speaker 2: I'm really geeking out and big fan and so I'm

900
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:09,640
Speaker 2: just so grateful that you came on to me. Thom

901
00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 2: next week, on Off the Cup, I talked to Henry

902
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:16,520
Speaker 2: Winkler the Fonds. I don't know what happened, but I

903
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:21,279
Speaker 2: changed my voice and when I changed my voice, all

904
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:23,919
Speaker 2: of a sudden, this fonds came out.

905
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:26,000
Speaker 3: I had six lines.

906
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 2: Then I looked at.

907
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,839
Speaker 3: The man who was reading the other part with me.

908
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,799
Speaker 2: And I said, hey, don't you look at me like that,

909
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:36,279
Speaker 2: threw the script up in the air, saunted out of

910
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:36,840
Speaker 2: the room.

911
00:45:37,320 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 3: At the end of.

912
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:40,719
Speaker 2: The month, when my money ran out, when I had

913
00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 2: to go back to New York, they called and said,

914
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 2: would you like to do this character on the show.

915
00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as

916
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:53,640
Speaker 2: part of the Recent Choice network. I'm Your HOSTESSI Cupp

917
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:57,240
Speaker 2: editing and sound design by Derrek Clements. Our executive producers

918
00:45:57,280 --> 00:46:00,840
Speaker 2: are Messie Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffmann. If you

919
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,400
Speaker 2: like Off the Cup, please rate and review wherever you

920
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 2: get your podcasts, follow, or subscribe for new episodes every Wednesday.