1
00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,240
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, A production

2
00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,400
Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. Am Holly Frye and

3
00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:18,040
Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson. We talked about emil KOA and

4
00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:21,639
Speaker 1: auto suggestion this week. Yeah, I had a lot of feelings.

5
00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,600
Speaker 1: I knew you would. I also just thought there were

6
00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:29,840
Speaker 1: a couple of fun quotes that I came across while

7
00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,200
Speaker 1: researching Okay. One was written by that biographer of Koua

8
00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,560
Speaker 1: that we mentioned, and it is the French point of

9
00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:45,040
Speaker 1: view criticizing the way Americans wrote about hypnosis. Okay, and

10
00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,239
Speaker 1: he says, meanwhile, the ideas of the Nazi school had

11
00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:52,440
Speaker 1: spread in America. They were being exploited and popularized with

12
00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:56,320
Speaker 1: all the claptrap and noise that Accompani's bluff. And I

13
00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,160
Speaker 1: just love that. I was like, yeah, that's true, because

14
00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:01,840
Speaker 1: people were like hip itism, it's magical, and they were like,

15
00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,040
Speaker 1: we are trying to do science. You're messing it up,

16
00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:08,280
Speaker 1: You're making it harder. Yeah, kind of fascinating. On the

17
00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:11,200
Speaker 1: flip side of that, there was in that criticism of

18
00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:16,600
Speaker 1: Kua in the US, particularly from the medical community. The

19
00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:21,920
Speaker 1: New York Neurological Institute described Kua as astoundingly ignorant of

20
00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:26,120
Speaker 1: all scientific research and knowledge. So yeah, point of view

21
00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:32,480
Speaker 1: changes everything. Yeah, start in with your many thoughts. Well, So,

22
00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:35,760
Speaker 1: when I was in high school, my mom took me

23
00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:39,160
Speaker 1: to a workshop. I'm not going to say the specific

24
00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:43,520
Speaker 1: name because I don't want to prompt like discourse, right,

25
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:47,560
Speaker 1: but it a lot of it had a lot of

26
00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 1: stuff in common with what Kua was writing about. Yeah,

27
00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,360
Speaker 1: a significant part of it did not, and was way

28
00:01:54,400 --> 00:01:57,840
Speaker 1: more woo woo magic, Yeah, which would have made him

29
00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:01,520
Speaker 1: absolutely irate, I think. Yeah, And so that part, like

30
00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:04,520
Speaker 1: the whole wooo magic part, I've pretty much jettisoned out

31
00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:08,200
Speaker 1: of my mind. But the parts that were more about,

32
00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:14,119
Speaker 1: like the more self affirmation, positive thinking like that kind

33
00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:16,440
Speaker 1: of stuff, and some other aspects that had to do

34
00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:21,040
Speaker 1: with basically basically meditation and mindfulness. All of that I

35
00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,480
Speaker 1: have found very useful to me for my whole life

36
00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:30,280
Speaker 1: in the decades since then. When my mom first went

37
00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:35,000
Speaker 1: to this workshop, she we've talked about on the show before,

38
00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:42,560
Speaker 1: has an incurable, essentially untreatable, progressive neurological disease, and this

39
00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:45,680
Speaker 1: was happening when I was in high school. She had

40
00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,720
Speaker 1: not progressed nearly as far as she has today, and

41
00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,680
Speaker 1: the stuff that we learned in this class did absolutely

42
00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:57,640
Speaker 1: zero to slow the progression of her disease. But in

43
00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:01,800
Speaker 1: terms of making her feel more in control in a

44
00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:06,400
Speaker 1: situation that she had no control over, and improving her

45
00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:11,320
Speaker 1: outlook in her mood, and just having a better mental

46
00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,600
Speaker 1: state in the middle of all that, it was incredibly useful.

47
00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:17,840
Speaker 1: And I think all of that is like important, and

48
00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:20,960
Speaker 1: some of the stuff that dismisses this kind of thing

49
00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:29,320
Speaker 1: as not effective, I think sometimes kind of underestimates how

50
00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:33,320
Speaker 1: important a person's mental state is just too existing. Yeah,

51
00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:37,040
Speaker 1: Like you could do a bunch of research about does

52
00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:43,040
Speaker 1: a person's mental state affect how quickly they recover? Maybe

53
00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:47,880
Speaker 1: that's maybe yes, maybe no, whatever, But like you also

54
00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:52,800
Speaker 1: have the part where your improved mental state while that's happening,

55
00:03:53,240 --> 00:03:57,400
Speaker 1: means your life feels a little better exactly how it's happening,

56
00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:03,560
Speaker 1: and that's also important, Like I don't so yeah, yeah, yeah,

57
00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:08,000
Speaker 1: I think. I mean, the concept of positive self talk

58
00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:13,040
Speaker 1: is pretty bolstered by science at this point, right, Like

59
00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:18,479
Speaker 1: psychiatrists psychologists will encourage you to use positive self talk

60
00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:21,440
Speaker 1: as a way, whether or not it improves anything like

61
00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:24,240
Speaker 1: health wise, it can improve the way you deal with

62
00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:27,599
Speaker 1: the world, which is likely to have an overall improvement

63
00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,440
Speaker 1: on a lot of other parts of your life, just

64
00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,919
Speaker 1: because you're kind of operating at a better starting point

65
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,400
Speaker 1: than if you were kind of down in the dumps

66
00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,680
Speaker 1: and saying a lot of negative stuff to yourself. There

67
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,920
Speaker 1: are I didn't dig into them because they get really

68
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,400
Speaker 1: heady and really fast, and it's a little bit hard

69
00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:46,840
Speaker 1: to draw direct conclusions. But there are a lot of

70
00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:51,719
Speaker 1: studies about not necessarily curing anything or fixing any malady,

71
00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:56,200
Speaker 1: but like your immune system getting a boost from the

72
00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,680
Speaker 1: positive attitude and positive self talk. So and it is

73
00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,719
Speaker 1: trick because it is stuff we don't always understand how

74
00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:06,599
Speaker 1: it's exactly functioning, right, Rich does make it very open

75
00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:11,040
Speaker 1: for people to be like, yeah, a little hokey about

76
00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,920
Speaker 1: the whole thing, and it kind of robs the legitimate

77
00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:17,839
Speaker 1: part of it of its of its you know, esteem,

78
00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:20,680
Speaker 1: because it has now gotten lumped in with a lot

79
00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,520
Speaker 1: of other things. Sympnotism kind of is the same, right.

80
00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:28,800
Speaker 1: There are definitely studies of like smoking cessation, oh sure,

81
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,520
Speaker 1: and people you know, having a better, more effective outcome

82
00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:34,799
Speaker 1: and being able to stop smoking if they are getting

83
00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:40,719
Speaker 1: hypnosis for that versus not again, though that does all

84
00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:43,280
Speaker 1: there are other factors like who you are, what your

85
00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:47,920
Speaker 1: brain is open to. Yeah, it's tricky, Yeah, but I

86
00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:49,960
Speaker 1: do love that Emil Kuai does not appear to have

87
00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:54,880
Speaker 1: been a jerk. Yeah, And I mean it seems like

88
00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:58,159
Speaker 1: he didn't want people really making a ton of money

89
00:05:58,160 --> 00:05:59,880
Speaker 1: off of what he was doing. Like he would have

90
00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:04,240
Speaker 1: opposed to the world of wellness grift that we live

91
00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:07,560
Speaker 1: in very much so he did not believe in any

92
00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:10,919
Speaker 1: of that. No grift for him. He reminds me in

93
00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:13,560
Speaker 1: some ways of many, many many years ago when I

94
00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:17,520
Speaker 1: was in massage school. There were people in the class

95
00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,800
Speaker 1: that would say stuff that was just not founded in

96
00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:24,440
Speaker 1: reality at all. It was kind of frustrating. And we

97
00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:28,280
Speaker 1: had an anatomy and physiology teacher who was a nurse

98
00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:30,840
Speaker 1: and was very practical about things and was like, look,

99
00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:35,240
Speaker 1: you don't need to be telling your clients that their

100
00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:39,039
Speaker 1: massage is going to like cure anything that they have

101
00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:45,480
Speaker 1: going on, because just getting the massage feels good. I

102
00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:48,559
Speaker 1: know you are not a fan of massage, Holly, I

103
00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:51,640
Speaker 1: love a massage, And he was like, get a massage,

104
00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:55,320
Speaker 1: you will you'll feel better, and like that is reason enough.

105
00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:59,560
Speaker 1: That's enough, that's enough. You don't need to be saying

106
00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:01,480
Speaker 1: that you know your massage will help all of these

107
00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:05,440
Speaker 1: other things, that there is evidence for some stuff, but

108
00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:10,080
Speaker 1: like the fact that you will feel better by itself

109
00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:16,920
Speaker 1: is important. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, the massage feels good to me. Yeah.

110
00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:22,440
Speaker 1: The problem is that my brain gets real panicky that

111
00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:24,840
Speaker 1: I am too relaxed and something that will happen and

112
00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:28,320
Speaker 1: I can't handle it. I don't know why I feel

113
00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:31,200
Speaker 1: responsible for everything that goes on around me in the world,

114
00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,640
Speaker 1: but I apparently do all the time. There's no reason

115
00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,520
Speaker 1: for this. I'm not an oldest child. I have you

116
00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:45,840
Speaker 1: tried some auto suggestion. I am not responsible for everything

117
00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:48,080
Speaker 1: in the world. I'm not responsible for all of it.

118
00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:51,920
Speaker 1: Here's the other thing that I would like to discuss,

119
00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:56,040
Speaker 1: and it's very important, okay, and I especially like it

120
00:07:56,120 --> 00:08:01,640
Speaker 1: because Emil Kua appears to have been delightful. I think

121
00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:06,920
Speaker 1: he could potentially unseat Pierre de Kub as best mustache

122
00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,440
Speaker 1: on the episode, and then it will be someone who

123
00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:14,880
Speaker 1: I don't think was a misogynist jerk. Oh yeah, great,

124
00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:18,480
Speaker 1: let's celebrate it. When you see pictures of him. Nice, nice,

125
00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:22,640
Speaker 1: he looks so he looks happy all the time, not

126
00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:24,320
Speaker 1: that everybody has to be, but like he has just

127
00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:29,240
Speaker 1: that sweet countenance. His smile is adorable. He looks charming

128
00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:33,640
Speaker 1: as heck. Oh sure, it's kind of like Santa and

129
00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:37,560
Speaker 1: Colonel Sanders had a very smiley baby. He's so cute.

130
00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:42,920
Speaker 1: He's so cute, Okay, and I love this. I will

131
00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,600
Speaker 1: see if I can find some pictures of him that

132
00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:47,720
Speaker 1: we are allowed to use, then will put it on

133
00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:51,640
Speaker 1: our Netflix. Yeah. I think probably there are there are

134
00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:55,880
Speaker 1: some some usable pictures. He is very, very very sweet face,

135
00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,959
Speaker 1: like the kind of person that I believe that there

136
00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:02,160
Speaker 1: are probably people who just by being in the room

137
00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:06,600
Speaker 1: with him, felt better. Yeah, therefore you cannot measure the

138
00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,360
Speaker 1: efficacy of his method because it's like, well you were

139
00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:12,880
Speaker 1: with Emil Kua, of course you felt better. Yeah. He

140
00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:17,000
Speaker 1: looks very reassuring, brightening up the room. Just a charming

141
00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,760
Speaker 1: little sweetheart. Everyone every description of him, even people that

142
00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:25,480
Speaker 1: wanted to debunk him, talked about how charming and kind

143
00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:27,800
Speaker 1: he was, which is kind of a good measure of

144
00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:29,400
Speaker 1: a man. Even if you don't agree with them, you

145
00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:32,360
Speaker 1: still think they're a good guy. Yeah, that's not bad

146
00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:37,640
Speaker 1: at all. So hopefully if anyone out there is dealing

147
00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:40,240
Speaker 1: with anything that perhaps could be helped by auto suggestion,

148
00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:43,040
Speaker 1: like I said at the end of that episode, couldn't hurt,

149
00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,800
Speaker 1: may or may not help, but it's probably not going

150
00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:48,560
Speaker 1: to do any harm if you just want to try

151
00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:50,679
Speaker 1: it and see if it works for you. You know,

152
00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:53,679
Speaker 1: I'm a believer in positive self talk. It's a thing

153
00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,040
Speaker 1: I've had to learn in recent years. It does seem

154
00:09:57,040 --> 00:09:59,600
Speaker 1: to help me. I don't know that to cure anything,

155
00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:01,760
Speaker 1: but it's helps me feel a little better about myself

156
00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:04,160
Speaker 1: in the world, and that's good enough for me. Doesn't

157
00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:16,720
Speaker 1: have to be more than that. We talked about the

158
00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:20,720
Speaker 1: Pompy Stone for an April Fool's Day episode with just

159
00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:26,200
Speaker 1: a very low stakes historical hoax or prank, very little pain,

160
00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:31,360
Speaker 1: kind of a whoops, but not anything evil. Yeah. I

161
00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:34,480
Speaker 1: found it very silly, and it became more silly the

162
00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:38,960
Speaker 1: longer it went on, Like every new person who wrote

163
00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:44,160
Speaker 1: a book just assuming that it was a historical relic

164
00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,560
Speaker 1: that dated back to fifteen twenty got a little funnier

165
00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:51,559
Speaker 1: to me. And then the fact that the last major

166
00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:57,240
Speaker 1: publication on it was so detailed and so full of speculation.

167
00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:03,560
Speaker 1: It was like thirteen pages of speculating about stuff. I

168
00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:06,840
Speaker 1: wrote a note and called it the homes fanfic because

169
00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:09,880
Speaker 1: it was kind of a weird thing about making up

170
00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:14,400
Speaker 1: a person that this was about with a shocking amount

171
00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:19,360
Speaker 1: of like believed details about that person's life. I was like,

172
00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:24,600
Speaker 1: right where you just feeling creative, sir, It's true that

173
00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:27,240
Speaker 1: those are a lot of things that all happened. There

174
00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,640
Speaker 1: really were a lot of expeditions that came to North America.

175
00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,520
Speaker 1: There really were a lot of people from Spain on them.

176
00:11:34,760 --> 00:11:37,679
Speaker 1: There really were a lot of people who, for whatever

177
00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:41,760
Speaker 1: means or reason, went to live with an indigenous community.

178
00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:45,880
Speaker 1: None of that meant that the stone was connected to

179
00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:50,480
Speaker 1: any of it. I think the fact that while this

180
00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:55,360
Speaker 1: stone was kind of a public curiosity and people were

181
00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,200
Speaker 1: taking like a nail or a file to like clean

182
00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:04,160
Speaker 1: the inscription out, that became an explanation for why it

183
00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:07,720
Speaker 1: didn't look that old. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, because it

184
00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:11,240
Speaker 1: it doesn't really look that old, and so people were like, well,

185
00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:13,760
Speaker 1: of course, like in the process of cleaning it up,

186
00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:16,640
Speaker 1: this whole inscription has been freshened up, Like that must

187
00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,959
Speaker 1: be why, But that it was not. Why it really

188
00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:25,120
Speaker 1: speaks to the human desire to want to believe things. Yeah,

189
00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,600
Speaker 1: something that I think Schoolcraft is the person who said this,

190
00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:36,080
Speaker 1: Craft whose writing style was incredibly circular. Everything that he

191
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,880
Speaker 1: said took twice as long as it really needed to,

192
00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:43,360
Speaker 1: was very round about. But he was sort of saying that,

193
00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,920
Speaker 1: like one of the characteristics of the age that he

194
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,880
Speaker 1: was living in was turning any local artifact into a

195
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:55,439
Speaker 1: wonder and that this had been done with the Pompy Stone.

196
00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:59,440
Speaker 1: Like people sort of treated it as this wondrous thing,

197
00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:05,719
Speaker 1: which led to a lot of people being overly credulous

198
00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:09,520
Speaker 1: about it. I guess. I mean there's also just the

199
00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:12,160
Speaker 1: like it's exciting to consider something like that, like can

200
00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:17,360
Speaker 1: you believe, yeah, that farmer just accidentally found this amazing thing.

201
00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:22,800
Speaker 1: And I understand the impulse to jump on the bandwagon

202
00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:27,920
Speaker 1: and about it. But when when I was a kid,

203
00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:33,320
Speaker 1: we had like the house that we lived in had

204
00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:35,760
Speaker 1: a small amount of land. It was like one in

205
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,200
Speaker 1: a third acres or something like that, And so there

206
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,000
Speaker 1: was the house and then there was a hilly wooded

207
00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:44,400
Speaker 1: area and then at the bottom was where we had

208
00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:46,920
Speaker 1: a garden that for most of my childhood, We like

209
00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:50,120
Speaker 1: we grew all of the vegetables that we ate, And

210
00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:52,840
Speaker 1: if I'm remembering correctly, it was somewhere in that stretch

211
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:57,040
Speaker 1: of land or nearby my brother or I one of us.

212
00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:01,560
Speaker 1: The details are very fuzzy. Someone found us, as you do.

213
00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:06,280
Speaker 1: And boy did I want that skull to be a dinosaur.

214
00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:10,280
Speaker 1: It was definitely not a dinosaur. I think it was

215
00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:13,240
Speaker 1: a you know, a horse or a cow or maybe

216
00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:17,880
Speaker 1: a deer. Not remotely a dinosaur at all. But I

217
00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,960
Speaker 1: remember in my very small childhood being like, but what

218
00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:24,520
Speaker 1: if it's a dinosaur? Should we get someone to check

219
00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:30,960
Speaker 1: if it's a dinosaur? It was definitely not a dinosaur. Yes,

220
00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:35,400
Speaker 1: but you were a child, Yes, I was a child.

221
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,000
Speaker 1: I mean we also lived in an area where people

222
00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:42,280
Speaker 1: would sometimes find like arrowheads or other projectile points or

223
00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:48,800
Speaker 1: dinosaur maybe dinosaurs somewhere. Definitely not that skull. I think

224
00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:51,160
Speaker 1: my dad has started listening to the podcast. He may

225
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:53,760
Speaker 1: now fill in the gaps of my memory about the skull.

226
00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:59,240
Speaker 1: I could be completely misremembering it from my very small childhood.

227
00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:06,640
Speaker 1: Patrick grew up in New York, but much much farther

228
00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:10,320
Speaker 1: west in New York than where this happened, and so

229
00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,440
Speaker 1: I asked him if he had ever heard of it when,

230
00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:16,760
Speaker 1: because I didn't quite really, I hadn't yet visualized the

231
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:18,920
Speaker 1: map where these places were on the map, and so

232
00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,760
Speaker 1: I just the names were reminiscent enough of some of

233
00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:25,760
Speaker 1: the places that he did live very close to that

234
00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,320
Speaker 1: I thought it might have been in his area. And

235
00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:30,680
Speaker 1: I was like, did you ever hear He said, absolutely not.

236
00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:36,640
Speaker 1: I have no idea what you're talking about. So even

237
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:40,080
Speaker 1: if it did make kind of a splash at the time,

238
00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:45,040
Speaker 1: it's maybe outside of that immediate area of New York,

239
00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:47,360
Speaker 1: maybe not as known based on the sample of one

240
00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:50,400
Speaker 1: person that I asked, right, And also, I mean to

241
00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:53,680
Speaker 1: be fair, it was kind of like a, well, this

242
00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,000
Speaker 1: is so cool, this is so cool. It's not as

243
00:15:56,040 --> 00:16:00,680
Speaker 1: cool as we thought, you guys. Let's just I like that.

244
00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:03,560
Speaker 1: It did seem like he did not get a sudden

245
00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:08,320
Speaker 1: wave of hate mail after debunking the Pompy Stone. Yeah.

246
00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:11,920
Speaker 1: It had. Instead, somebody immediately corroborreate, like, yeah, you're right,

247
00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:17,560
Speaker 1: it's that's a fake. It is tricky too, like even

248
00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:24,520
Speaker 1: the people that invoked this as evidence of something they

249
00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:28,680
Speaker 1: wanted to be true after it had been debunked. I mean,

250
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,000
Speaker 1: I'm willing to give them grace because they didn't have

251
00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:33,680
Speaker 1: things where they could just look it up and check

252
00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:37,440
Speaker 1: if there were a traditional pieces of information. But it

253
00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:42,040
Speaker 1: is quite funny how long that went on. Yeah, yeah, well,

254
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,560
Speaker 1: and I think at least two of the three people

255
00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:52,120
Speaker 1: that we mentioned including it in stuff we're specifically writing about,

256
00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:55,960
Speaker 1: like Catholic history. And so it would make sense to

257
00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,080
Speaker 1: if you had previously heard this thing about how there

258
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:02,360
Speaker 1: was you know, a Spanish Catholic in New York in

259
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:06,679
Speaker 1: fifteen twenty, then especially if you just latched onto that

260
00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:11,560
Speaker 1: might not go verify whether it has been debunked and

261
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:14,400
Speaker 1: the however, many years since you heard about it, I've

262
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,359
Speaker 1: honestly done that on this show. Relied on something that

263
00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:22,800
Speaker 1: I learned in childhood. It is no longer accurate. I mean,

264
00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:27,040
Speaker 1: I think most of us have things that we learned

265
00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:30,000
Speaker 1: at an early age or at some point not even

266
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:33,440
Speaker 1: necessarily an early age, in college, in high school, as

267
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:35,840
Speaker 1: an adult that it turns out that people now know

268
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:39,800
Speaker 1: are not true. But yeah, that information doesn't automatically filter

269
00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:42,840
Speaker 1: to everybody if you're not out there going, oh, hey,

270
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:46,560
Speaker 1: was that debunked you? Yeah? Never know, well, and there's

271
00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:48,320
Speaker 1: also the stuff that you learn as like a much

272
00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,080
Speaker 1: more simplistic way. Yeah. That then, like the thing that

273
00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:55,200
Speaker 1: always I remember is like when I was a child,

274
00:17:55,480 --> 00:18:00,600
Speaker 1: I learned that your cells have a membrane around them, right.

275
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:03,760
Speaker 1: And then when I got I was an adult and

276
00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:07,000
Speaker 1: I was in massage school, and our massage school anatomy

277
00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:10,280
Speaker 1: textbook was one that was used in nursing schools a lot,

278
00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:13,720
Speaker 1: and I learned that this membrane that I had learned

279
00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:18,800
Speaker 1: about was something called a lipid bilayer, not remotely what

280
00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:23,919
Speaker 1: I had imagined by the word membrane, not a sack. Well,

281
00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:27,159
Speaker 1: when you're in when you're a school kid, right, like

282
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,720
Speaker 1: we all remember the exercise draw the cell and its

283
00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:33,960
Speaker 1: component parts and you started with like an oblong sipper

284
00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,199
Speaker 1: usually and then put the pieces inside of it. So

285
00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:40,520
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, makes that makes sense? Yeah, totally appropriate

286
00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:44,440
Speaker 1: to teach the simplest, the simpler explanation of something to

287
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:48,600
Speaker 1: younger kids and then to build on that later or not.

288
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:50,520
Speaker 1: If you don't go to massage school, you may never know.

289
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:54,800
Speaker 1: If you never take a more advanced anatomy class. You

290
00:18:54,880 --> 00:19:00,520
Speaker 1: could just think of it as a membrane. It's fine.

291
00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:06,800
Speaker 1: If you love April fools Day pranks, I hope there

292
00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:10,040
Speaker 1: were good pranks for you this past April Fool's Day.

293
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,360
Speaker 1: And if you hate that, I hope nobody messed with you.

294
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,520
Speaker 1: And I hope that no one fell for fake April

295
00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:21,000
Speaker 1: Fool's Day articles on the internet and then felt bad

296
00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:24,400
Speaker 1: about it. Whatever is coming up for you this weekend,

297
00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:28,160
Speaker 1: I hope that is also great. We will be back

298
00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:31,320
Speaker 1: on Monday with a brand new episode I think on

299
00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:35,840
Speaker 1: Nothing prank related, and we will be back with a

300
00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:43,800
Speaker 1: Saturday Classic tomorrow. Stuff you Missed in History Class is

301
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:48,160
Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit

302
00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:51,639
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

303
00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:55,360
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.