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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how

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Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm Katie Lambert and I'm Sarah Dowdy. And for our

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Speaker 1: subject today, Katie and I both started our outlines with

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Speaker 1: some pretty amazing superlatives. I had that our subject, the

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Speaker 1: Taiping Rebellion, was the largest war of the nineteenth century,

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Speaker 1: and I had read that it was the most important

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Speaker 1: event in nineteenth century China. But the crazy thing is

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Speaker 1: that neither of us had ever really heard anything about this,

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Speaker 1: So it really is something we missed in history line.

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Speaker 1: We definitely missed it. We just found out about it

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Speaker 1: a few weeks ago when we did our podcast on

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Speaker 1: the Opium War, and uh, it's those are pretty amazing figures,

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Speaker 1: aren't they. Right? Twenty million dead in the Taiping Rebellion,

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Speaker 1: which we both thought must be a mistake when we

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Speaker 1: first read it too, and we looked, you know, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I gotta get another source for this. Twenty million is

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Speaker 1: way too many people, right, But it's what everybody has.

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Speaker 1: And this rebellion changed the Chang dynasty, which began in

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Speaker 1: sixteen forty four forever, and also the imperial system. So

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Speaker 1: it's a pretty big deal. Yeah. And fortunately for us

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Speaker 1: and for our story, something that ends up so broad

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Speaker 1: and so important starts with one man. And this man's

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Speaker 1: name is Hung shu Chuan. And let me go ahead

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Speaker 1: and say that I have no idea if I said

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Speaker 1: that correctly or not. But as most of you know,

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Speaker 1: I do a wrap up blog at the end of

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Speaker 1: the week every single Friday talking about the podcast that

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Speaker 1: published this week. So if you'd like to learn more

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Speaker 1: about it and see how these things are actually spelled,

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Speaker 1: please check out the blog. Hung was a poor farm

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Speaker 1: boy whose biggest hope was to pass the Civil service

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Speaker 1: examinations and get a good post somewhere in Canton. And

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Speaker 1: these were a huge deal. You first passed the qualifying

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Speaker 1: exams and your section, and then he passed that part, right,

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Speaker 1: he did. And then you went to Canton for the

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Speaker 1: state exam and thousands of people showed up, but only

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Speaker 1: a few would make it. And this, if you passed,

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Speaker 1: it would change your class and your entire future. It

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Speaker 1: basically everything is hanging off of this one exam for

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Speaker 1: poor young Hung, and he he fails it four times, yes,

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Speaker 1: again and again and again. So his dreams are thwarted forevermore.

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Speaker 1: But after one of his failures, he meets a Christian

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Speaker 1: missionary and starts reading religious texts. Yeah, he reads the

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Speaker 1: tract of an early Chinese Christian ling Afa, and when

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Speaker 1: he reads the track, he remembers a dream that he

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Speaker 1: had several years before, and everything sort of comes together

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Speaker 1: for Hung. He had dreamt that he was the son

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Speaker 1: of God, uh not Jesus, actually Jesus's younger brother, and

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Speaker 1: he's been ordered to establish the Kingdom of God on

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Speaker 1: earth right, and he has to get rid of the

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Speaker 1: demon Man choose and reform China. So it's not only

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Speaker 1: a religious goal, it's also somewhat of a political goal.

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Speaker 1: And when Hung discovers um the Christian tracts and Christianity,

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Speaker 1: he starts to feel that the confusion classics, which of

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Speaker 1: course he's been studying for twenty years trying to pass

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Speaker 1: the Civil Service exam, seem vain and uh not, they

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Speaker 1: seem what's wrong to be what's wrong with China, and

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Speaker 1: the Christian tracks seem like they give him something to do,

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Speaker 1: and that evil is around us and it can be

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Speaker 1: slayed and he can be the one to do it.

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Speaker 1: So his friend Fung Yun Sean here's his ideas, and

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Speaker 1: thinks they're pretty good and sets up a religious group

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Speaker 1: called the God Worshiper Society with a bunch of poor

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Speaker 1: peasants in the Guangxi Province. And around eighteen forty seven,

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Speaker 1: Hong Fung and the worshippers all come together and in

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Speaker 1: eighteen fifty Hung becomes the leader of the rebellion, and

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Speaker 1: by January one, eighteen fifty one, they've started a new

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Speaker 1: dynasty called the type Ing Tiango, which is the Heavenly

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Speaker 1: Kingdom of Great Peace, and Hong would be in charge

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Speaker 1: as the tien Wang or the Heavenly King of this

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Speaker 1: new dynasty for China, right, and their shining beginning is

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Speaker 1: when they capture Nanjing in March of eighteen fifty three,

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Speaker 1: which they renamed tian Jing, their heavenly capital. So this

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Speaker 1: is pretty crazy. This rebellion starts off as a bunch

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Speaker 1: of raggedy poor peasants and ends up being more than

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Speaker 1: a million disciplined religious fanatics. And their style is just

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Speaker 1: to pick people up as they go along, and uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, why are why are people so into it? What?

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Speaker 1: What do they have to offer? What are they all about? Well,

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Speaker 1: Their beliefs were a mix of Christianity and the and

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Speaker 1: the classical Chinese religion, and the Taipings were more of

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Speaker 1: the Old Testament type, the wrathful God, right, beware thy

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Speaker 1: wrathful God, and you know, someone who required obedience and

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Speaker 1: in general had a bit of a temper. If you're

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Speaker 1: up on your Old Testaments, they were. They were pretty puritanical. Actually, yeah.

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Speaker 1: They were anti prostitution, footbinding, slavery, opium, smoking, adultery, gambling, tobacco,

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Speaker 1: arranged marriage, idle worship, and alcohol. So they really weren't

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Speaker 1: getting around. But on the more progressive front, they deemed

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Speaker 1: men and women equal, and they wanted to simplify the

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Speaker 1: Chinese language, and they believed that all property would be

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Speaker 1: held in common, which that's a little foreboding for um,

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Speaker 1: what's to come later in China. It's an interesting predecessor here,

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Speaker 1: and that they believed in the equal distribution of land, right,

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Speaker 1: a primitive, primitive sort of communism. And they also, again

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Speaker 1: we're anti Manchu, wanted to get rid of the entire

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Speaker 1: imperial system and wanted a restoration to the old ways

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Speaker 1: in some respects. So we should probably talk a little

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Speaker 1: bit about the Man Choose. Yeah, the Man Choose. The

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Speaker 1: Manchu emperors had been in power for century uh with

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Speaker 1: the Qing dynasty, and the Chings had overturned the Mings,

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Speaker 1: who were sort of regarded as the classic Chinese dynasty. Um,

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Speaker 1: but the Man Choose lasted so long because they maintained

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Speaker 1: control over all aspects of the bureaucracy. They put Man

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Speaker 1: Choose in all the key positions. And we should say

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Speaker 1: to the Man Choose are minority in China, so a

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Speaker 1: lot of a lot of the Chinese are seeing them

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Speaker 1: as foreign emperors almost. Um. But I think the bureaucratic

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Speaker 1: aspect is interesting here, considering that Hung couldn't become a bureaucrat,

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Speaker 1: he couldn't pass his examination, and he ends up this

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Speaker 1: enemy of the Man Choose. But um, by the eighteen fifties,

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Speaker 1: the formally impressive military of the Man Choose and strong

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Speaker 1: emperors have weakened, and um they've lost the Opium War,

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Speaker 1: which um, you know, they're are held responsible for caving

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Speaker 1: into the West. But as we've learned in our earlier podcast,

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Speaker 1: there wasn't much that could be done about them. But

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Speaker 1: the Chinese were again very unhappy that the treaty of

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Speaker 1: Ninjing had been signed and felt that the Ching dynasty

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Speaker 1: had given in. So there's plenty of opportunity for secret

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Speaker 1: societies in the eighteen fifties, not just these guys when

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Speaker 1: the rebellion had swept some of them up with the

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Speaker 1: Tai Pings if they were even remotely anti Ching. The

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Speaker 1: Nian Rebellion was also going on from around eighteen fifty

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Speaker 1: one or eighteen fifty three to eighteen sixty eight, so

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Speaker 1: the Ching dynasty is fighting more than one rebellion at

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Speaker 1: the same time, and there are also famines, droughts, and

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Speaker 1: floods going on. The people are suffering and not very happy.

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Speaker 1: There's thought that perhaps the Ching dynasty wasn't doing as

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Speaker 1: much as they could to help the people. So of

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Speaker 1: course there's going to be some sort of reaction to

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Speaker 1: what's going on, and if things are bad, it must

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Speaker 1: be the fault of the current rulers, the barbarian foreigner

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Speaker 1: man choose. So now that we've got some con x

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Speaker 1: let's go back to the actual rebellion. The Taipangs tried

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Speaker 1: to capture Beijing but failed. They had lots of victories

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Speaker 1: in the Yangsee River valley, but that capture of Nanjang

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Speaker 1: was the only big city they ever managed to get,

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Speaker 1: and this is why some people think they ended up

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Speaker 1: not lasting. So there are some internal cracks as well.

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Speaker 1: Yung Sho Ching, the Taiping minister of State, has been

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Speaker 1: trying to take over some of Hung's power. It doesn't

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Speaker 1: go over well. And Young and his followers several thousand

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Speaker 1: are all killed by Hung, and he's not the only

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Speaker 1: one killed. Even the person who killed Yang is killed

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Speaker 1: by Hung. So we're already to make a struggle right well.

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Speaker 1: And Hung is becoming more imperial as his rain goes on,

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Speaker 1: less about his early ideals and more about being in charge,

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Speaker 1: you know, obviously if he's having all these people killed.

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Speaker 1: But he started up a huge bureaucracy of his own.

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Speaker 1: He has two thousand women serving as ministers, bureaucrats, maids,

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Speaker 1: and attendants. Um, he's his puritanical side has gotten even stronger.

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Speaker 1: And he's decreed that men and women, even those who

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Speaker 1: are married, couldn't have sexual relations until the heavenly Kingdom triumphed.

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Speaker 1: And if you know anything about human nature, so yeah,

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Speaker 1: it happens, and sometimes violators are beheaded. But at the

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Speaker 1: same time he's very hypocritical about this, and he even

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Speaker 1: keeps his own harem, so you can see how there

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Speaker 1: would be a lot of internal disputes and anger and

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Speaker 1: feuds and um. Things are starting to fall apart, and

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Speaker 1: he's starting to alienate people. One of his top general,

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Speaker 1: Shida Kai, gets nervous about all the killing and defects

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Speaker 1: and takes a lot of people with heads out of there. Right.

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Speaker 1: So the Chain dynasty is fighting back this entire time

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Speaker 1: against the Taipings, but their res verses are stretched then

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Speaker 1: because again they're fighting the Nean rebellion, and they're also

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Speaker 1: some Muslim rebellions going on in other parts of China,

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Speaker 1: so they've got a lot on their plate. And at

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Speaker 1: some point around this time, some accounts have hung stepping

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Speaker 1: back from leadership altogether. So here in the Harem time, right,

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Speaker 1: he's not doing the administrative stuff anymore. So you've lost that.

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Speaker 1: You know, that one prismatic leader right to your focus

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Speaker 1: actually had the vision from God which is inspiring everyone.

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Speaker 1: So he's just you know, gone and taking a seat.

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Speaker 1: Go step back a little bit. And in eighteen sixty

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Speaker 1: the Taipang's try to take Shanghai, but again that doesn't work.

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Speaker 1: This big city takeovers are just not happening of them. Interestingly,

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Speaker 1: they're thwarted by an American, Frederick Townsend Ward in his

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Speaker 1: army of foreign mercenaries, and the West is not pleased

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Speaker 1: that Award is getting involved in this. They want to

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Speaker 1: be neutral and just maintain their trading interests because that's

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Speaker 1: what the West is interested in, selling opium and keeping

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Speaker 1: these Chinese ports open um. So they're trying to stay neutral,

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Speaker 1: and the British actually arrest Ward for getting mixed up

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Speaker 1: in local politics, but he gets away and he ends

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Speaker 1: up setting up the Ever Victorious Army, which was Chinese

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Speaker 1: troops but Western officers and arms, so they were Western

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Speaker 1: trained but using Chinese people. And when he died, Charles George,

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Speaker 1: known as Chinese Gordon, took over. And a side note,

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Speaker 1: Gordon is really interesting. I might want to do it

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Speaker 1: totally separate podcast on him. He ends up being killed

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Speaker 1: in cartoon by modest governor of Sudan. It's all over

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Speaker 1: the world here, so if the Qing dynasty collapsed, foreign

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Speaker 1: trade might go with it. The British have just fought

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Speaker 1: the opium War and have secured those ports and everything,

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Speaker 1: and they don't want a regime change, so the West

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Speaker 1: becomes anti Taiping right because they're so anti foreign again

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Speaker 1: the man choes, they think, well, they'll probably be even

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Speaker 1: more anti foreigner with Americans and the British and the

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Speaker 1: Tayping are adamantly anti opium too, so it's really not

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Speaker 1: going to work out with that whole selling opium thing.

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Speaker 1: And there are some other outside forces that are coming

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Speaker 1: in here, because usually the gentry would get behind a

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Speaker 1: successful rebellion, but since the Taipings were so anti Confucianism,

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Speaker 1: a lot of them felt like they were being threatened

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Speaker 1: as well, that you know, the Chinese gentry classes and

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Speaker 1: the scholars and not the peasants. So they come together

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Speaker 1: under a man named Zungwofan, a Chinese official in the

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Speaker 1: Chang government, and he puts together a Hunan army courtesy

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Speaker 1: of their own local taxes and surrounds Nanjang. And by

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Speaker 1: this time Hung is sick and refuses to leave Nanjing

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Speaker 1: or to escape, and um he kills himself or perhaps

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Speaker 1: does of food poisoning in June of eighteen sixty four.

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Speaker 1: But before he dies he makes his teenage son, the

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Speaker 1: tian Wang or the Heavenly King, which again he has

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Speaker 1: a teenage son, But weren't people not supposed he was

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Speaker 1: supposed to be waiting for the heavenly kingdom there, I

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Speaker 1: don't think so. Nanjing falls from the Taiping in July

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Speaker 1: of eighteen sixty four, and one hundred thousand Taiping preferred

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Speaker 1: death to being captured. Yeah, they were offered amnesty if

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Speaker 1: they repented, but nobody did it. Basically a lot of

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Speaker 1: them would kill themselves by fire or just die at

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Speaker 1: the hands of the Imperial army rather than renounced their beliefs.

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Speaker 1: So in this way, Zong saved the imperial regime from

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Speaker 1: total collapse, although since his success gave more power to

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Speaker 1: the Han Chinese elite the gentry right, it weakened the

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Speaker 1: Ching dynasty after all, even more so the man choose win,

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Speaker 1: but they've given to so much to win that it's

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Speaker 1: sort of an empty victory for them, and the rebellion

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Speaker 1: didn't even really end. Then, skirmishes went on for years

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Speaker 1: and years. The Typing did not want to fall, and

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Speaker 1: the government was trying to squash them for quite a

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Speaker 1: while afterward. So they didn't want to fall, but they

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Speaker 1: basically do. So why does that happen? There's not really

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Speaker 1: much consensus on this, And it might have been because

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Speaker 1: they because of their religious beliefs and because they were

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Speaker 1: against Confucianism UM, and a lot of people considered that

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Speaker 1: religion integral to being Chinese. And then also on the

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Speaker 1: religion side of it, people might have objected to having

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Speaker 1: a theocracy. Some of it could have been because they

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Speaker 1: alienated so many people with those really radical social reforms.

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Speaker 1: And they also didn't really have a stable base. You know,

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Speaker 1: they only had that one big city that they had gotten,

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Speaker 1: but when they got there, they never consolidated power in

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Speaker 1: an effective way. Yeah, the rag tag way that they

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Speaker 1: formed isn't the most long lasting model now. And they

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Speaker 1: also had so much internal feuding. Hung changed so much,

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Speaker 1: there was corruption of his own beliefs. And then also

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Speaker 1: the West came in on the side of the West involvement. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that certainly turns the cards where we put our our

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Speaker 1: money where we needed it. But of course, aspects of

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Speaker 1: the rebellion last for decades after, and a lot of

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Speaker 1: people do see a form of primitive communism in in

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Speaker 1: the whole Typing rebellion. UM. There are even some interesting

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Speaker 1: comparisons between Hung and Mao, both inspired by these UM

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Speaker 1: outside Western ideas Christianity or Um in Male's case, by

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Speaker 1: Marx and Um setting up utopian communities and remote areas

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Speaker 1: and governing very strictly. So it's it's interesting to think

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Speaker 1: about how something that neither of us had heard about

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Speaker 1: before this, and something that was such an important event

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Speaker 1: for the nineteenth century has interesting ramifications in the twentieth

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Speaker 1: century exactly Well. I think that about wraps it up

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Speaker 1: for today. But if you'd like to learn more about

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Speaker 1: how communism works, check out our article and also check

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Speaker 1: out the blog if you get a chance, on our

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Speaker 1: homepage at www dot how stuff works dot com. For

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Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics, visit how

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Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. Let us know what you think,

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Speaker 1: Send an email to podcast at how stuff works dot com,

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Speaker 1: and be sure to check out the stuff you missed

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