1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Phil Hi. This is Jace Olmute. Welcome to the Philly Show. 2 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:13,560 Speaker 2: Hey, Ruben Tomorrow Junior, Jim Salisbury Todd's a lucky happy holidays. 3 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:22,159 Speaker 2: It's Monday, December twenty second, twenty twenty five, and the 4 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:25,959 Speaker 2: holidays are almost here. Dave Nebrowski's been busy shopping, Jim 5 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,760 Speaker 2: and Ruben, He's been. He's been a busy man doing 6 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 2: all of his last minute holiday shopping, Christmas shopping. Let's 7 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 2: do a real we're a real quick recap of what 8 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 2: went on this week. A Doulas Garcia signed to a 9 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 2: one year, ten million dollar contract. On Tuesday, some front 10 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 2: office moves, Phillies assistant GM Annie Colombie was named the 11 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 2: Nationals GM. On Wednesday. Thursday, the Phillies announced that they 12 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 2: signed right hander Brad Keller to a two year, twenty 13 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 2: two million dollar contract. And then Friday, ooh got really crazy. 14 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 2: Friday morning, the Phillies traded Matt Stron to the Royals 15 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:06,679 Speaker 2: for Jonathan Bolan, and then maybe I don't know, a 16 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 2: couple hours later, they traded minor league outfielder avery A 17 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 2: Woe sue A Siadu to the Diamondbacks for Kyle Bacchus 18 00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 2: and so now you got bullpen locks, John Deron, Keller, Bolan, Kirkring, 19 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:27,679 Speaker 2: Alvarado and banks that six guys and eight man bullpen 20 00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 2: Uh Bachus Uh will compete for bullpen job along with 21 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:34,760 Speaker 2: Rule five draft pick Zach mccambley, who he had on 22 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 2: the show last week. Uh, Yelle, Corret Nolan, Hoffman, Set Johnson, 23 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 2: Max Lazzar and others. But you know, we we we 24 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:46,399 Speaker 2: already had a show on on Garcia. We already had 25 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 2: a show kind of talking about Keller. What do we 26 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 2: think about the Matt Strom deal? Guys, that's that was 27 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 2: That's big news. 28 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, it is big news. 29 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 3: He's been a really good contributor for three years here 30 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:05,000 Speaker 3: in Philadelphi. You always took the ball, was healthy, was 31 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 3: very effective on show. 32 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: Hey o Tani. 33 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 3: But I just think there's a lot of things in play, 34 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 3: you know, one of them being they signed. 35 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 1: Keller, and I love that move. That move's given me 36 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: a lot of flow. 37 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:21,799 Speaker 3: I'm really liking the back end on Duran Alvarado from 38 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:23,239 Speaker 3: the left and Keller from the right. 39 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: I liked that back three a lot. 40 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 3: I think they freed up a little salary there to 41 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 3: maybe help make Keller a little more palatable eleven per 42 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,080 Speaker 3: year over two years, and it just sounded like Strom's 43 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 3: relationship with you with some corners of the organization had 44 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 3: run its course and it was time for a change 45 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:42,799 Speaker 3: of scenery. 46 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 1: You know. 47 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,840 Speaker 3: They said they felt comfortable depth wise with Alvarado and 48 00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 3: Banks from the left side. But oh, by the way, 49 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,920 Speaker 3: they just moments after that made a trade for Bacchus, 50 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 3: So maybe they weren't. 51 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 1: All that comfortable. 52 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 3: So it just seems like it was time for a 53 00:02:58,720 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 3: move on that front. 54 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, combination of things I thought actually made this team 55 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 4: just a little deeper, a little bit better. You know, 56 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 4: it was really important when you think back. Everybody talks about, 57 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 4: you know, the offense. It was the offense that that's 58 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 4: the reason why they didn't win. Well, there's a couple 59 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:21,040 Speaker 4: of different pitches in certain situations that were created by 60 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 4: the bullpen and some of the foibles that they had 61 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 4: in their bullpen that sort of created some losses for 62 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,200 Speaker 4: them over the last several years in you know, in 63 00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:32,519 Speaker 4: these playoff situations. Yes they didn't score a ton of runs, 64 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 4: but you also have to stop runs and if you 65 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 4: can get the guys to you know, to get make 66 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:40,000 Speaker 4: the pitch they have to make to get the outs. 67 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 5: Those are big. 68 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 4: That's why I agree with you, Jim, that combination of 69 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 4: Alvarado Duran obviously as a closer keller, you got Ryan 70 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 4: Kirkering now from the right side. Tanner Banks has actually 71 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 4: done a nice job in his role from the left side. 72 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 4: And actually Bowlin is an interesting guy. He's a big, 73 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 4: strong guy. He doesn't punch out a ton of guys. 74 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 4: But talking to some scouts about this guy, even though 75 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 4: I don't think he has any options left, he's sort 76 00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 4: of a lock now. He's one of those guys that 77 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 4: can sort of hand the baseball in the sixth inning. 78 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,479 Speaker 4: He can get ground ball, soft contact, big strong guy 79 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:24,120 Speaker 4: with a I think he's a power sinker slider guy 80 00:04:24,200 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 4: that I think that they really like. And having that 81 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 4: type of guy is important, like especially if if you 82 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 4: run into a situation where the starter only gives you 83 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 4: five innings and you gotta lock it down for four 84 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,240 Speaker 4: more innings, It's important to have a guy like that. 85 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 4: Interesting also turn of events, as far as I'm concerned 86 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 4: on Annie who was the assistant GM amazing that these 87 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 4: types of people in this industry can put themselves in 88 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 4: these positions to be GMS. 89 00:04:58,240 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 5: He's talking to a good friend of mine the other 90 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 5: about the game of baseball. 91 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 4: Imagine that this guy on he has the same title 92 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 4: as Pat Gillick. 93 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:09,160 Speaker 5: Kind of strange. 94 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 4: I mean, good for him that he gets this opportunity. 95 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 4: But it is interesting that the industry, you thought that 96 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 4: might the pendulum might start swinging the other way. As 97 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:22,919 Speaker 4: far as the impact that analytics has had in the game, 98 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 4: in some ways very positive, in other ways not so positive. 99 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 4: But they're still valuing it very, very highly in certain organizations. 100 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 4: And that experiment that's going on, I think it's an 101 00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 4: experiment in Washington is insane. Thirty one year old manager, 102 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,200 Speaker 4: younger and younger and less experienced people in the front office. 103 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 4: Very interesting way to go about it. It will be 104 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 4: I'm super curious to see what happens in Washington over 105 00:05:52,839 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 4: the next several years, whether they get any better or 106 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 4: they get worse, because it's been a wild for them 107 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 4: to not be very good. 108 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 6: Well, it's gonna be interesting to see. 109 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 2: How Dave Debrowski said the other day, they plan on 110 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:06,440 Speaker 2: filling that position, they're not sure if they're going to 111 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:08,360 Speaker 2: do it. Internally, they're not sure if they're going to 112 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 2: do it with one guy, multiple guys gals to fill 113 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 2: that position. But you know, to me, that says that 114 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 2: the Nationals weren't really too deep in on analytics and 115 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 2: so they wanted to shore up that side of the 116 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:24,360 Speaker 2: side of their baseball operations department. On it obviously comes 117 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 2: from Tampa Bay where they have just a ton of 118 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 2: success doing that type of thing. 119 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:31,719 Speaker 6: But interesting, interesting for sure. 120 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 2: And then going back to so going back to Strom, 121 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:38,479 Speaker 2: Dobrowski said a couple of things. He said, Hey, you know, 122 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 2: the question was asked, Strom's making seven and a half 123 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 2: million dollars last year. Bowlin's going to make he has 124 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:47,280 Speaker 2: less than a year of service time even though he's 125 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:49,000 Speaker 2: out of options, and he's so he's going to make 126 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:50,880 Speaker 2: a little bit more than the league minimum, which is 127 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: like seven hundred and fifty grand. Ish said, heah, you know, 128 00:06:55,600 --> 00:06:58,640 Speaker 2: it really had nothing to do with payroll. You know, 129 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 2: it didn't really have any you know, you'd have to 130 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 2: ask other people. But you know, my relationship with Strom 131 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 2: was fine, you know, despite what he clearly perturbed in 132 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 2: his post season wrap up news conference in October, said 133 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 2: it had more to do with balance of the of 134 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 2: the bullpen. But I personally believe that, if you know, 135 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 2: this is a more of a payroll slash personality move 136 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,840 Speaker 2: than anything, because we hear everybody forever say you can 137 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:31,240 Speaker 2: never have too much quality pitching, and he just traded 138 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 2: a guy that's been pretty pretty quality, especially left handed. Yeah, exactly, 139 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 2: it's great you have Alvarado and Banks. Banks hasn't really 140 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 2: pitched too many high leverage situations over the years. He's 141 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:44,720 Speaker 2: been kind of more of a you know, the bridge too, 142 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 2: Strom in Alvarado. So uh, I think it has a 143 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 2: lot to do with payroll clearing, as they they're right 144 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 2: under that fourth luxury tax number right now, and it 145 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 2: has a lot to do with strong kind of butting 146 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:00,160 Speaker 2: heads with with people in the clubhouse. And you know, 147 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:03,240 Speaker 2: I got along great with Strom. I love talking to Strom. 148 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 2: Super opinionated on a lot of different things. He made 149 00:08:08,200 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 2: the comment to separately to mac album myself after Game 150 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 2: four of the NLDS saying, you know, talking about the PFPS. 151 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 6: Clearly that irritated Dave Dombrowski. 152 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 2: You know, Rob Thompson made a point to say they 153 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 2: did work on PFPS, that wasn't the They didn't trade 154 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 2: him because of that comment, but I think it was 155 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:30,680 Speaker 2: a cumulative thing. Again, matt Strom very opinionated on a 156 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 2: lot of different things, but he took the ball. He 157 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 2: was not afraid. I never went I never went out 158 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 2: there and watched matt Strom pitch. He said, he's looking 159 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 2: kind of shaky out there. I think he's kind of 160 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 2: scared in this moment, you know. So you know, a 161 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 2: loss there in a sense, but something that they felt 162 00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 2: they needed to do. 163 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 3: They're showing a lot of faith in Alvarado and Banks. 164 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 3: And I like Alvarado. I like the strikeout stuff. But 165 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:00,160 Speaker 3: you know, we're going to see a little bit. We're 166 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 3: going to get a read on him first couple of 167 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 3: months because you know, after that ped suspension, all his 168 00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 3: stuff trended upward last year. 169 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 1: It makes you scratch your head. 170 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 3: But I still think he can He can be quality, 171 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:13,120 Speaker 3: and they need him to be quality. 172 00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:15,000 Speaker 1: And Banks. 173 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 3: I look at Banks as more of a middle guy 174 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 3: that can really get you a big out in the middle, 175 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:24,199 Speaker 3: not necessarily a high leverage guy. So I also I 176 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:26,440 Speaker 3: think they could have their eyes open on left handers, 177 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 3: you know, depending on things go throughout the summer. But 178 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 3: you hope they don't have to because I do believe 179 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:34,880 Speaker 3: in the track record of Alvarado, I do believe in 180 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 3: what I saw on Keller last year, and do run 181 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 3: as well. So that leads me to say, on you know, 182 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 3: December twenty second, I really like that back three. 183 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 4: So there's a couple of layers that are that are 184 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 4: associated with this strong deal that I think it's important 185 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 4: to point out, and you hit on them, Todd, and 186 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 4: I don't have a problem saying these words. I mean, 187 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 4: it's pretty clear that the Billies are trying to change 188 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 4: things around in that clubhouse a little bit. And it's 189 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:04,600 Speaker 4: also pretty clear that with guys like the Casianos Is 190 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 4: in the Stroms of the world, that there weren't so 191 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 4: pleased with some of you know, what they were getting 192 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 4: out of that that those two pieces of the pie 193 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:17,319 Speaker 4: they've had at times pretty productive. 194 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 5: You know, careers, there's no question about it. 195 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 4: And you know, when you end up jettising a player 196 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:28,680 Speaker 4: like Strom in particular, you know you start thinking about 197 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 4: what the reasons are. 198 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 5: Well, I think it's a combination. It's a layering thing. 199 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 4: It's about the money and freeing up the opportunity to 200 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:39,560 Speaker 4: sign that, you know, to sign Keller, and I think 201 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 4: it's also about maybe freeing up a little money to 202 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 4: try to bring JT back, And that's part of it 203 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 4: as well. 204 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 5: I mean, it's not a limited payroll. 205 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 4: And I think that there's also some issues with with 206 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:52,959 Speaker 4: the makeup there and and the fact that he has 207 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:54,559 Speaker 4: some you know, some decline. 208 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:57,440 Speaker 5: You know, left handed pitchers. We've gone through this a lot. 209 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 4: I mean, he was lights out, almost lights out in 210 00:11:02,679 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 4: twenty twenty four, was an All Star, was phenomenal. I 211 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 4: mean there was maybe not a better, more effective left hander. 212 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 4: Not as effective last year, had a little short, late 213 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 4: start because of his health. 214 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 5: At some point you start to decline a little bit. 215 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 4: Wasn't nearly as sharp, I didn't think in the playoffs 216 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 4: as he was in the past. 217 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 5: So I think it's a combination of some of the. 218 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 4: Stuff going downhill a little bit, maybe a little makeup 219 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 4: issue in the clubhouse, perhaps a little you know, perhaps 220 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 4: the ability to free up a little bit money to 221 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 4: do some other things. And you know, sometimes you make 222 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 4: decisions not just based on one thing, but based on 223 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,080 Speaker 4: a variety of things, and that seems to be what's 224 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 4: happened with Strom. 225 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, so real quick, if you're watching us on YouTube, 226 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 2: don't forget to hit the subscribe button. We appreciate the 227 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:58,640 Speaker 2: support it helps grow and support the show. And of 228 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 2: course go to the Philly Show Shop to pick up 229 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 2: your Phillies Show merch. 230 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:04,320 Speaker 6: There's still time. 231 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 2: You're not gonna get it before Christmas if you're looking 232 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:08,440 Speaker 2: for it, but you can still use the promo code 233 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 2: Holiday to get ten percent off, so make sure you 234 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 2: check that out. So let's I want to we talked 235 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 2: about payroll, So this is interesting Ron Blum Bloom, What 236 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 2: did I say by Rod Blum? Yeah, from the second 237 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 2: guess myself from the AP reported last week that the 238 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 2: Phillies will pay just over fifty six million dollars in 239 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 2: luxury tax penalties from their twenty twenty five payroll. Only 240 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 2: the Dodgers and one hundred and sixty nine point three, 241 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 2: the Mets at ninety one point six and the Yankees 242 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 2: at sixty one point seven paid more. So as we 243 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 2: talk about clearing payroll for Brad Keller and Strom and 244 00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:55,679 Speaker 2: you know JT and what he might get. Cott's contracts 245 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,400 Speaker 2: is a pretty great website if you want to take 246 00:12:58,400 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 2: a look at where the Phillies payroll is. So I 247 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 2: just checked them today They're projected forty minion payroll for 248 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:10,760 Speaker 2: luxury tax purposes. Right now, Monday December twenty second without JT, 249 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 2: Real Muto is at three hundred and one point. 250 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:14,720 Speaker 6: Six million dollars. 251 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 2: That's that's two point six million, right, if you guys 252 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:21,839 Speaker 2: can keep following me here, that's just under the fourth 253 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 2: luxury tax threshold at three hundred and four million dollars. 254 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:30,720 Speaker 2: So as of today, they're already paying thirty nine million 255 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 2: dollars in penalties for next season. So let's say JT 256 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 2: signs at an AAV of fifteen. I think the Phillies 257 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:43,199 Speaker 2: would like that. I think JT wouldn't. I think JT's 258 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 2: would more than that. But say that happens, the Phillies 259 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:50,720 Speaker 2: would then go past the fourth luxury tax threshold, and 260 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 2: then JT's contract would basically they basically bang a little 261 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 2: over thirty one million dollars for JT, fifteen million dollars 262 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 2: in salary, a little over sixteen million dollars in luxury 263 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 2: tax penalties. So I just wanted to kind of mention 264 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:09,720 Speaker 2: where they are, so bands kind of wondering, like, you know, 265 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 2: can they go out and get a Bobaschet and a JT. 266 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 6: You know, I've been told that. 267 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:14,599 Speaker 5: No. 268 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 2: You know, if they get JT, they're out on all 269 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 2: those guys. But maybe if JT find somebody else, maybe 270 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 2: they jump in on a boba sheet, maybe they find 271 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 2: a little bit extra scratch at that point. 272 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:29,600 Speaker 6: You know, I don't know if that's possible. 273 00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 2: I still think it's unlikely. I still think JT is 274 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 2: going to come back, But I just wanted to. I 275 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 2: wanted to throw those numbers out there for people just 276 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 2: so they can kind of get a sense of what's 277 00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 2: kind of going on with their payroll. 278 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 1: This this tax thing is real. 279 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 3: Fifty six million in taxes on the twenty twenty five payroll. 280 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:50,160 Speaker 3: Just to put that in a little bit of perspective, 281 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 3: that's basically what they're going to pay Harper and Schwarzer 282 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 3: in twenty six is about fifty seven millions. So in 283 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 3: that Wow, it's putitive. 284 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 1: Man. 285 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 5: So here's a deal. Uh. 286 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,360 Speaker 4: And I'll say this, I've got it from very very 287 00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 4: good sources. The Phillies lose money as far as year 288 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 4: to year. They're losing hundreds of millions of dollars over 289 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 4: the last several years, and. 290 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,840 Speaker 5: Fans are like, how could that possibly be? 291 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 4: Happening right now with all the revenues and the packed houses, 292 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 4: and well, there's only so many revenue streams you can 293 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 4: get from from outside, from TV, from what have you, 294 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 4: all your marketing stuff, uh, patches on their you know, 295 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,120 Speaker 4: on their uniform now and all that stuff. There's only 296 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 4: so much you can generate in this marketplace. 297 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 5: Yes, it's a big market, but they're not. 298 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 4: Generating enough money to withstand the the these penalties and 299 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 4: the amount of money that they're spending on their payroll 300 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 4: and the amount of money that they're spending on their 301 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 4: entire organization to operate at the highest level, which is 302 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:55,880 Speaker 4: exactly what John Middleton wants to do. 303 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:58,640 Speaker 5: That's why you've seen new owners. 304 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 4: Come into the program to infuse more cash into it. 305 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:04,600 Speaker 5: And so you know, I've been there, I've seen it. 306 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 5: It's one of the reasons why they don't do deferrals. 307 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 4: It's one of the reasons why they try to keep 308 00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 4: you know, they you know, fiscally sound. But they're losing 309 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 4: money now. Their franchise values going up, there's no question. 310 00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 4: So I mean, you can offset that obviously for a 311 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 4: variety of reasons. When it comes to cash, they are 312 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 4: still losing some money and a significant amount of money. 313 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 4: And when you start paying these kind of penalties, man, 314 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 4: it's not unlimited. 315 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 5: The piece of the pie is not unlimited. 316 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 4: They cannot afford I don't think to just continue to 317 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:42,520 Speaker 4: like go past these thresholds and have a viable organization 318 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 4: that's gonna be sustainable. 319 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:46,880 Speaker 5: So, yeah, it's not our money. 320 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 4: We'd love for them to pay for everybody, and I 321 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 4: would like to see it maybe a little bit of change. 322 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 4: And you did make a great point Todd for me 323 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:59,760 Speaker 4: that if in fact they do not sign JT, that 324 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 4: may create something else that they can do. Why not 325 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 4: trade Boom and then free up that money also and 326 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:10,879 Speaker 4: then maybe sign a Bishett or a Bregman. It looks 327 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:13,920 Speaker 4: like Markami's going to another team right now, So that's 328 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 4: a guy that comes off the board, and so that 329 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,400 Speaker 4: you're gonna start seeing the third basement start to roll 330 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 4: off the board a look bit. So it'll be interesting 331 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:26,680 Speaker 4: to see what happens. I don't think Dave Dombrowski's done necessarily. 332 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 4: I don't think he wants to have people anticipate that 333 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 4: that that big things are coming. But you never know 334 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:36,120 Speaker 4: what might happened over the next couple of months. 335 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,199 Speaker 2: Yeah, so JT again, like there's the Phillies have an 336 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 2: offer on the table. They've been talking, they continue to talk. 337 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 2: I don't know what they're what their offer or offers are, 338 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,920 Speaker 2: how much they've changed, But you know, obviously JT is 339 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 2: looking for more and. 340 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 6: More than that. 341 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 2: I don't want to say they're at a stalemate, but 342 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 2: you know, I've been watching the stalemate. 343 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:57,719 Speaker 5: I guess you could say it's stalemated. 344 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: It's been described to me as a game chicken. 345 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 6: So there you go, there, you can pick. 346 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 1: You pick your word. 347 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 3: They are staring each other down, and they might be 348 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 3: short on the year's end the money because I think 349 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 3: we've heard, you know, probably two years and like they're 350 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 3: staring each other down. I still in my heart feel 351 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,719 Speaker 3: like he's coming back. But to me this, you know, 352 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 3: what do they do if he doesn't come back? Is 353 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 3: it Victor Caratini? Is it Rafael Marchan? Do you give 354 00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:32,679 Speaker 3: him a look? I mean, just just you know. I 355 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 3: know they traded the young catching prospect to the Twins, 356 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 3: but this organization needs to build a stock of catching prospects. 357 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 3: If in spring training they need to look at every 358 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 3: infielder and outfield that they don't think is going to 359 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 3: make it to the big leagues, or maybe just gonna 360 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:53,719 Speaker 3: make it to the big leagues and be an extra. 361 00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 3: Every kid is a teenager and fits that mold and 362 00:18:57,840 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 3: and say, do you want to stick around a little 363 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:01,679 Speaker 3: bit to put the gear on. Let's see what if 364 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 3: we can make you a catcher, Because when you think 365 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,600 Speaker 3: about it, like four of the greatest catchers in this 366 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:11,800 Speaker 3: franchise history were all converted. Ruiz converted in fielder, j 367 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 3: t converted in fielder, Bob Boone converted third baseman, right 368 00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:20,560 Speaker 3: Rubin's correct, and Mike Leeberthal was an infielder right up 369 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 3: until high school. 370 00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 1: His dad was a scout to the Tigers. 371 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 3: Dad was a very smart baseball man and said, well, 372 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:27,400 Speaker 3: I want him to go to the big leagues. 373 00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:28,399 Speaker 1: We're gonna make him the catcher. 374 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:31,919 Speaker 5: It is amazing. 375 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 4: It is amazing that for me, the most important, the 376 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:42,920 Speaker 4: most important position player on the field is the catching position. 377 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 4: Most managers are catchers. Is a reason why they sort 378 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 4: of run the game. They are involved in every single 379 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:53,399 Speaker 4: play of the game. And yet there is a dearth 380 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 4: of catching that is disgraceful in the major leagues. 381 00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:58,360 Speaker 5: It's kind of disgraceful. 382 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,719 Speaker 4: Even guys like Adlie Dutchmen who are supposed to be phenomenal, 383 00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 4: really hasn't. 384 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 5: He's sort of stalled out a little bit. I mean, 385 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 5: I like him. I like the player. 386 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 4: He's a switch hitting catcher who's got defensive talent, but. 387 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 1: It doesn't catch all the time. 388 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 5: Though it doesn't catch all the time. 389 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 4: And now they have a super prospect from the left 390 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 4: side who can really swing the back. But now they're 391 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 4: gonna make him a d H or a first basement. 392 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:25,320 Speaker 4: I mean, there's so many great athletes in the game, 393 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:30,199 Speaker 4: there's not very many good catchers and uh, and you know, 394 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 4: it's hard, it's hard to find, and yet it's. 395 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 5: Such an important position. 396 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 4: It will be interesting to see how this thing all 397 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,800 Speaker 4: play plays out because JT's been a star Wars for him, 398 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,320 Speaker 4: he's been great. And uh, and listen, if they got 399 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 4: to go with Marshawan and they have to sign up 400 00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:48,320 Speaker 4: Quarantini or I have to go with Marshaw and Stubbs 401 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,160 Speaker 4: not ideal, but maybe they can do something else. 402 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:53,960 Speaker 5: And hey, listen, Uh. 403 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:56,880 Speaker 4: Carlos Rees, not a lot of people believed in him 404 00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 4: for a while, and then he became an everyday catcher, 405 00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 4: one of the best catchers they've had in this franchise. 406 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:04,880 Speaker 4: Could that happen to Marshawan? Could he get better? Could 407 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 4: he be durable enough? You don't know until you see him, 408 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:11,399 Speaker 4: and so, uh, if JT doesn't come back, don't be 409 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 4: surprised by Marshawn catching maybe one hundred games next year. 410 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 6: I mean that that would be a way to go. 411 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 2: It would be definitely risky because you have Crawford now 412 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,119 Speaker 2: being the every day center fielder basically, so you'd be 413 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:21,680 Speaker 2: having your. 414 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 6: Eight to nine hole hitters. 415 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 2: I mean, who knows what kind of production you're gonna 416 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,919 Speaker 2: get from from either of those two guys. Uh. But 417 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:30,400 Speaker 2: also again I always I've told this story to you before. 418 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:32,879 Speaker 2: I still see you guys before, and to others. I 419 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 2: still remember in two thousand whatever, Carlos Reis's first year 420 00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 2: was as mostly an everyday guy. And you know, this 421 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 2: is when you guys had Reuben Mlou Marson was in 422 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,880 Speaker 2: Triple A and he was one hundred prospect and everybody 423 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:50,199 Speaker 2: was just killing Charlie on playing Carli killing you and 424 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:54,120 Speaker 2: Pat Gillick for playing lout what Choot stinks and all 425 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,359 Speaker 2: this stuff and Charlie finally blew up at us one 426 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,439 Speaker 2: day in the dugout and said, God, damn, you know, 427 00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 2: we're under eight old hitter to carry us. 428 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:03,639 Speaker 6: You know, we're in deep trouble, like you know. 429 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:08,040 Speaker 2: So, yeah, I thought that the top seven guys in 430 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 2: the lineup do what they're supposed to do. Maybe you 431 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 2: can get by with with with a mar Shaan and 432 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,679 Speaker 2: uh and the Crawford maybe as he kind of feels 433 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 2: his way around during his rookie season. Because the trade 434 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 2: options out there, the free agent options are terrible. You 435 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 2: mentioned Jim Jim, You mentioned Kartini, right, who's kind of 436 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 2: been a number two ish type of guy most of 437 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:32,440 Speaker 2: his career. The trade options aren't great either. Yeah, Rushman 438 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:36,159 Speaker 2: would be great. What's he going to cost Hunter Goodman 439 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:38,280 Speaker 2: from the Rockies? Oh my gosh, he'd be amazing. What's 440 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:40,440 Speaker 2: he gonna cost Ryan Jeffers from the Twins. He would 441 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 2: be great. But they've you know, Christian Vasquez is a 442 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,640 Speaker 2: free agent. They've kind of said earlier earlier this month 443 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 2: that he's you know, Jeffers. They want him to be 444 00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 2: the everyday catcher finally, So I don't know if he's 445 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:52,000 Speaker 2: going to be available he's the Twins, so you can't 446 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:54,119 Speaker 2: rule it out. And then you look at guys like, 447 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 2: you know, Sean Murphy from the Braves. That's a salary dump. 448 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:02,080 Speaker 2: He's had some hit problem. His offensive production's gone way down. 449 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:04,360 Speaker 2: So you know, there's not a lot of great options 450 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 2: out there trade wise that you know you're not gonna 451 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 2: like sacrifice a ton of prospect capital get. 452 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 1: If you played marsh On. 453 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 3: Let's just you know, think of that, if you played him, 454 00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 3: you'd keep some payroll drive for the some power to 455 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:22,480 Speaker 3: drive for the trade deadline. 456 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 5: Yea yeah. 457 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,399 Speaker 4: In addition, so the other part of that is that, listen, 458 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,440 Speaker 4: I like Marshaan more than other people do. Maybe maybe 459 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 4: it's because you know, a lot of people haven't seen 460 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,120 Speaker 4: him a lot. He's got pretty good back to ball skills. 461 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:40,000 Speaker 4: As a switch hitting catcher, he got a little bit better. Listen, 462 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,840 Speaker 4: the guy didn't play very much. It's hard to evaluate 463 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 4: a guy who doesn't only plays what sixty games. 464 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 5: Or whatever the hell he played behind a guy like JT. 465 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,360 Speaker 4: This guy's not a bad player, and he's not as 466 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 4: bad a hitter as people. He's not a one to 467 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 4: eighty hitter. I think he's probably gonna end up being 468 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 4: like a two thirty hitter or two forty hitter at 469 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 4: some point if he gets a chance to play every 470 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:05,480 Speaker 4: day and he actually is a good catch and throw 471 00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:08,520 Speaker 4: guy has studied and learned and learned from JT. 472 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:10,160 Speaker 5: He runs a good game. 473 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,679 Speaker 4: There's a lot of good things about Marshawn that you 474 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 4: can sort of hope that he can handle. 475 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:19,679 Speaker 5: My issue with him is his durability. Can he play 476 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 5: one hundred games. 477 00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 4: For a championship caliber club? You never know until you 478 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 4: give him the opportunity. I happen to like him a 479 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 4: little bit more than some other guys, who knows what 480 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 4: he can be with he plays a little bit more 481 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:31,440 Speaker 4: every day. 482 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:34,239 Speaker 3: Here's a question who is in on JT other than 483 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,199 Speaker 3: the Phillies. You know, I think a lot of the 484 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:40,679 Speaker 3: teams that need catching. I mean Tampa Bay, Houston. Houston 485 00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:43,280 Speaker 3: might play the daz kid more, but a lot of 486 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:45,720 Speaker 3: those teams are right up against it. Peroll Wise don't 487 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:49,440 Speaker 3: have the money that you know. The Giants have been mentioned. 488 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 3: I'm just not sure that's going to happen. They have Bailey. 489 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,800 Speaker 3: I keep thinking that, boy, would you know, well, the 490 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,000 Speaker 3: Mets get involved, But I haven't heard anything. 491 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 5: I don't imagine why he would go to the Mets. 492 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:05,440 Speaker 4: He's got his best friend in shorebur right there down 493 00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:05,840 Speaker 4: the road. 494 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:07,200 Speaker 1: I'm not saying you would go there. 495 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,880 Speaker 3: I'm just surprised to make Maybe they haven't gotten involved 496 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:14,200 Speaker 3: given their catching situation. But you know, I haven't heard 497 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 3: a lot of teams on him, have you. 498 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,600 Speaker 4: I have not, and I'm just surprised. I think he's 499 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:21,880 Speaker 4: just holding out for that last year, that third year. 500 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 4: I think that's more important to him than anything else. 501 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 4: And I think the Phillies are rightly only offering too. 502 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,879 Speaker 4: That's what I think is happening. I don't know that 503 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 4: for fact, but that's the feel I get, and that's 504 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 4: why they're at a stalemate. 505 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 2: Maybe it will be interesting to see how long it goes. 506 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:39,360 Speaker 6: I mean. 507 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,480 Speaker 2: Later today, later on Monday, you know, there could be 508 00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:47,960 Speaker 2: an agreement announced. But remember five years ago when he signed, 509 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 2: it was like January twenty sixth, January twenty ninth, and 510 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 2: that was when there was It was basically again, Jim, 511 00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 2: what do you say, a game of chicken? It was 512 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 2: kind of a game of chicken back then too. Remember 513 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 2: the Mets sign Brian McCann. Was it Brian mccannon or 514 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 2: no James McCann. James mccannon mess, Yeah, mcann. That didn't 515 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 2: work out too well for them. That didn't work out 516 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,960 Speaker 2: too well for him. But there was really nobody else 517 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 2: in on JT. So JT was looking for a big number. 518 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 2: The Phillies off made their offer, and then JT finally 519 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,919 Speaker 2: they finally came around in late January. 520 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:25,280 Speaker 6: I know, maybe that maybe drags on that long. 521 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 1: All right, give me your predictions on the end game 522 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:28,960 Speaker 1: here with j T. Give me the predictions. 523 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,880 Speaker 2: I think JT ends up re signing with the Phillies 524 00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 2: on a two year deal with an aa VU more 525 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 2: than the Phillies are comfortable paying. But to get it done, 526 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,440 Speaker 2: they they they go over their their comfort. 527 00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 5: Level real two years under thirty million. 528 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 6: So you think it's. 529 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:50,160 Speaker 4: I think that they're going to hold right there and 530 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 4: if and I don't think the Phillies are gonna wait 531 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 4: around all that long, because as these other guys get 532 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 4: off the board and they decided that you know, they 533 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 4: might they made very well just say, you know what, 534 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 4: let's do a Marshawn, Let's maybe go to a Victor Kartini, 535 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:06,720 Speaker 4: or let's go with Marshawn and Stubbs and just wing 536 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:09,280 Speaker 4: it and hold powder. Like Jimmy said, I mean, if 537 00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 4: I was sitting there and I was Dave Dombrowski right now, Yes, 538 00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:14,119 Speaker 4: I would absolutely love to have JT back and have 539 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,920 Speaker 4: it get done. But I'm going to get a little 540 00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 4: impatient as we get closer and closer to January. First, 541 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:22,720 Speaker 4: it's time for us to make some moves because these 542 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:25,200 Speaker 4: third basement or other opportunities that they may be able 543 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 4: to create by waiting. 544 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 5: Around for JT. 545 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,400 Speaker 4: I'm going to get a little pissed off, and I'm 546 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 4: going to try to you know, I got to. 547 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 5: Do it best for the Philadelphia Phillies. 548 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:38,560 Speaker 3: Right, I'm going to say John Middleton steps in and 549 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:41,679 Speaker 3: visits with JT, looks him in the eye, talks to 550 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,159 Speaker 3: him on the phone, texts him whatever they need to do, 551 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 3: and they get a two year deal done just north 552 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,119 Speaker 3: of thirty. I think he looks in the eye and says, 553 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 3: you're an important Philly I want you back. 554 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 1: How do we get it done? You know he did 555 00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,520 Speaker 1: make what he was averaging. 556 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 3: His average geniue value was twenty two and changed the 557 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:03,919 Speaker 3: last five years twenty three. 558 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,120 Speaker 2: Twenty three ish I think twenty three one, you know, yeah, 559 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:08,720 Speaker 2: five year, one hundred and fifteen point five. 560 00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:10,920 Speaker 3: I can see where the team is coming from on 561 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 3: you know, wanting to bring that that aav down. 562 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:16,640 Speaker 1: I could see where the player is coming from. He's 563 00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 1: got pride. 564 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 3: So I'm wondering if the owner steps in and says, Okay, 565 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 3: enough of this crap, let's get it done, then how 566 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 3: do we get it done? 567 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 7: We'll see, exactly right, very possible because because John knows 568 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,119 Speaker 7: how important that that position is, and it is, but 569 00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:33,720 Speaker 7: at some point, I mean, you got to turn the 570 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,119 Speaker 7: fascet off and see what happens. 571 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 5: And that's what they're doing right now. And I don't 572 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:37,040 Speaker 5: blame him. 573 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 3: And I think John really values guys who are much 574 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:43,800 Speaker 3: like Dave Montgomery did, and guys who we are Phillies. 575 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:44,480 Speaker 1: And when I look at J. 576 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:46,480 Speaker 3: T reil Mudo, I think, I mean, I know he 577 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,200 Speaker 3: was a Marl and I know they got him in trade, 578 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 3: but to me, he is. 579 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:51,080 Speaker 5: A Philly been one for a while. 580 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah. 581 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 3: He embodies a lot of what, yeah, what the people 582 00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:59,640 Speaker 3: who run that team want that team to be. And 583 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 3: I don't think you can discount the fact that the 584 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 3: starting pitchers really want him as well and really value 585 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 3: what he brings to them. So my end game is 586 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 3: he he's back here, but who knows. 587 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I mean yeah, Zach Wheeler of course 588 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:20,800 Speaker 2: loves the guy. My colleague at MLB dot com, Christina 589 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 2: de Nicola, talked with his Zarto Saturday at an event 590 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 2: and down in Miami. It's like, oh, man, JT was 591 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 2: great for me. JT was absolutely grateful me. I really 592 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:32,880 Speaker 2: hope he's back. And that's that is a consensus. I 593 00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,280 Speaker 2: think you could throw any pitcher on the Phillies organization 594 00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 2: that's actually thrown to him. They love the guy. 595 00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 3: They this just this, this whole, this whole dance just 596 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 3: to me firms up the idea that you need more 597 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 3: catching prospects, you need more inventory, and so so one 598 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:53,080 Speaker 3: of them will stick. If you have ten of them, 599 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 3: maybe you can get one of them. I hear about 600 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 3: all these pitching labs and all these hitting labs. Let's 601 00:29:58,400 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 3: have a catching lab. 602 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 6: That's a great idea. Jim has said to me before, 603 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 6: like that. 604 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 5: The most important position on the field. 605 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 4: Now the analytics folks may see may see it as 606 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,040 Speaker 4: less and less important now that they're going to have 607 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:18,000 Speaker 4: the ABS system in place, or they'll be able to 608 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 4: get in their ear and call their own pitches. 609 00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 5: That's something they might be thinking about. 610 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,560 Speaker 4: But I will tell you that it's so important to 611 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,720 Speaker 4: have the trust of your catcher when you're on the mound. 612 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:32,480 Speaker 4: You've got to have that trust and it's an important 613 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 4: element of being you know, of being behind the plate 614 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 4: and having a successful team, No. 615 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,720 Speaker 6: Doubt about it. Guys, that was fun. We will be 616 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 6: back later this week. Maybe we'll be talking about JT. 617 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 2: Who knows what Dave Dombrowski's got up his sleeve. 618 00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,240 Speaker 1: Smell noll you, Jim. 619 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:54,680 Speaker 2: The Philly Show is brought to you by the Foul 620 00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 2: Territory Network. Subscribe to The Philly Show on YouTube and 621 00:30:58,080 --> 00:30:59,680 Speaker 2: wherever you get your podcasts.