WEBVTT - Gleeking Insider with Michael Ausiello 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.479 And that's what you really missed with Jenna. 0:00:04.559 --> 0:00:07.160 And Kevin and iHeartRadio podcast. 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:12.640 Welcome to and That's what you Really miss podcast. A 0:00:12.760 --> 0:00:16.319 very very very special episode. Yes, who do we have to? 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:25.560 We have Michael Asiello who is TV journalist Royalty, worked 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:29.000 for TV Guide Entertainment Weekly and then started his own 0:00:29.600 --> 0:00:33.680 company called tv Line and just he gets all the scoops. 0:00:33.800 --> 0:00:37.720 He's such a fan of TV and writes really wonderful 0:00:39.240 --> 0:00:41.920 things about TV because he cares so much. And he 0:00:42.000 --> 0:00:44.839 was such a big part of our show. He was 0:00:45.800 --> 0:00:48.000 breaking all kinds of stories. We'd see him on red 0:00:48.000 --> 0:00:51.680 carpets and he's part of that Glee family to us, 0:00:51.800 --> 0:00:52.800 like Glee Memory. 0:00:52.840 --> 0:00:57.880 Who's a strong part of the twitter verse. Oh yeah, 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:01.400 and he's whipping those fans up a trusted, trusted source, 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:05.440 so he also has some sources of his own, that's right. 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:09.000 See if he feels some you enjoy. 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:10.360 Hello. 0:01:11.040 --> 0:01:17.480 Oh my god, Hello, you both look amazing. 0:01:17.840 --> 0:01:19.360 So do you? I love that haircut? 0:01:19.440 --> 0:01:19.679 Great? 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:22.240 I got it cut just for this. 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:24.120 Oh wow, I had a feeling. 0:01:24.319 --> 0:01:24.640 Thank you. 0:01:24.760 --> 0:01:27.760 We appreciate it for that. We love to look at beauty. 0:01:29.400 --> 0:01:31.880 I know I've listened to your podcast you're obsessed with it. 0:01:32.080 --> 0:01:33.440 Yes, it's all we talk about. 0:01:33.480 --> 0:01:33.760 Really. 0:01:34.240 --> 0:01:36.399 I mean we come, you know, dressed in the nines 0:01:36.440 --> 0:01:37.240 for our podcast. 0:01:37.240 --> 0:01:40.000 Now I can see that. But fashion is off the hook. 0:01:40.200 --> 0:01:42.560 It may not look like it, but Jenna's sweatshirt is 0:01:42.680 --> 0:01:44.400 thousands and thousands of dollars. 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:49.040 Wow. Actually yeah, I can see it. 0:01:49.080 --> 0:01:51.120 Stains on it, so I can see it. 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:53.480 And my T shirt's definitely not twenty years old. 0:01:56.800 --> 0:01:59.000 Michael Jenna, it's good to see you. 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:01.040 It's good to see you. Thanks for having me. 0:02:01.240 --> 0:02:05.280 Welcome to our show, Welcome to the Glee podcast. 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:07.520 Thank you for having me. I was so excited to 0:02:07.520 --> 0:02:08.240 get the invitation. 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:12.960 Wollvery a very important part of the Glee history. 0:02:14.720 --> 0:02:20.880 I maybe you know, it's funny. I did a little 0:02:20.919 --> 0:02:23.480 bit of a deep dog prior to this interview, and 0:02:23.520 --> 0:02:27.320 I was going through my Glee coverage over the years, 0:02:27.360 --> 0:02:31.079 and let me tell you, there's a lot of it. 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:34.800 There's a lot, and you're a part of a lot. 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:40.440 In different mediums as well, because Twitter and Glee sort 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:43.519 of was this beautiful marriage in the very beginning, because 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:46.160 they were sort of blowing up together and then you 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:50.240 were on there interacting with fans daily for lots of shows, 0:02:50.400 --> 0:02:54.119 not even just Glee, and you had all the spoilers, 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:55.280 you knew everything. 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:59.120 Well, I think that's really my If my legacy about 0:02:59.160 --> 0:03:01.560 Glee is going to be anything, I think, I think 0:03:01.639 --> 0:03:05.200 it's the news that I broke during that time, and 0:03:05.240 --> 0:03:10.360 the and the spoilers, and because we lived in a 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:13.480 different time back then when like spoilers were like a 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:20.440 massive major piece of journalism. So now, but back then 0:03:21.160 --> 0:03:24.400 with with broadcasts, when broadcast was huge, and when Glee 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:27.440 was big, it was like people wanted to know what 0:03:27.680 --> 0:03:28.359 was coming up? 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:30.200 Who was your source? 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:37.000 So now that the show is over and now time 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:42.000 on your podcast, I feel comfortable letting you know that 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:44.760 my source was Are you serious? Do you really think 0:03:44.760 --> 0:03:45.960 I'm going, Oh my. 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:50.680 God, you got me, girl, I'm sweating. I really felt like, 0:03:50.760 --> 0:03:52.400 oh my god, we're gonna find out. 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:54.720 You're gonna find who deep deep Throat. 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:57.320 Is the biggest news we'll have on our podcast. 0:03:57.360 --> 0:03:59.840 Ever, I also had a fear that I'm like, was 0:03:59.880 --> 0:04:02.560 it me? My memory? So that I'm like, it could 0:04:02.560 --> 0:04:02.960 have been me. 0:04:04.040 --> 0:04:05.640 You're fired, Kevin, You're fired. 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:07.839 You know what I will say is it was It's 0:04:07.880 --> 0:04:13.120 not one person. Glee was such a huge show and 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:16.480 there were so many people involved in it that, you know, 0:04:16.560 --> 0:04:21.240 information flowed from multiple avenues and. 0:04:21.279 --> 0:04:26.400 Sources, and you are and were a very trusted source 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:30.200 and figure, I think in TV journalism, entertainment journalism. So 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:34.279 doesn't that do you think that incentivizes people to come 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:36.919 to you. Because they come to you, they're not going 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:42.600 to some gossipy, slanderous like you do serious stuff reporting 0:04:42.680 --> 0:04:45.440 about TV, like you love TV, Like there's such care 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:49.920 and your story about shows and things. So I feel 0:04:49.960 --> 0:04:51.719 like people gravitate towards that. 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:54.040 Well, I think it helps it. You know, I worked 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:56.440 for a TV guide and I worked for Entertainment Weekly. 0:04:56.560 --> 0:05:00.480 So even if my coverage was cheapy and playful, I 0:05:00.520 --> 0:05:03.919 mean it usually was. I mean I did harder stuff, 0:05:04.040 --> 0:05:08.000 like I did cover stories and bigger, bigger features, but 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:10.000 but a lot of my stuff was sort of fun 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:13.719 and light and uh, you know, the spoilers were sort 0:05:13.720 --> 0:05:17.200 of wrapped in this sort of snarkiness. Uh. But but 0:05:17.240 --> 0:05:20.400 I was always backed by a you know, a legacy 0:05:20.440 --> 0:05:23.680 brand and a really refutable you know brand, TD Guy 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:26.839 and Team Weekly and then when tv line launched, so 0:05:27.040 --> 0:05:31.840 I think that certainly helped, you know, with my visibility 0:05:32.080 --> 0:05:35.960 and that, and when people brought me scoops, they kind 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:38.840 of knew that it was going they were going to get, 0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:40.119 you know, big play. 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:43.080 Okay, let's talk about the scoops though, because let's just 0:05:43.080 --> 0:05:46.520 start there. Yeah, do you have like, do you have 0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:51.160 any like memories that stick out of Glee spoilers that 0:05:51.279 --> 0:05:55.080 you broke, Like, do you have any that like, well. 0:05:54.920 --> 0:06:00.480 Hyber, I remember breaking Darren Cris's casting was a huge 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:02.640 deal because I knew that role. I knew that role 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:05.200 was coming before it was cast, and that was a 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:08.279 pretty big spoiler. And then and then you know the 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:13.080 fact that uh you know he was coming on as 0:06:13.120 --> 0:06:16.600 a uh you know, is this character so? And then 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:19.680 I remember breaking that the news of who got the role, 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:21.640 even though Darren wasn't a huge name at the time, 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:24.000 there was so much anticipation about who was going to 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:28.360 be getting getting this role. That was a pretty major 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:32.760 one in terms of spoilers, you know, all the romance stuff, 0:06:33.000 --> 0:06:39.680 that's what you know. The although the romance surrounding particularly 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:45.719 Rachel you know, uh Leah, all of her loved dress people. 0:06:45.800 --> 0:06:48.040 There was just a readers that were kind of obsessed 0:06:48.120 --> 0:06:52.839 with with with that and I and I kind of, 0:06:53.360 --> 0:06:56.920 you know, it's it's tricky because you know, one time 0:06:56.960 --> 0:06:59.159 you don't you don't want to ever outright spoil something, 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:03.080 you know, so I you don't want to ruin someone's experience, 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:07.839 so you want to I try to always couch it 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:10.720 or frame it in more of a tease to get 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:13.559 people excited to watch the show. And also I didn't 0:07:13.600 --> 0:07:16.960 really want to make enemies of Ryan Murphy and everybody else, 0:07:17.000 --> 0:07:19.400 you know. So it's like I tried to be a 0:07:19.440 --> 0:07:24.080 team player and uh and not not be an enemy. 0:07:24.680 --> 0:07:26.760 Mm hmmmmm, No, that's fair. 0:07:36.000 --> 0:07:39.560 I feel like tv Guide when you were there, was 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:43.720 like one of the earliest supporters of the show, Like 0:07:43.800 --> 0:07:47.640 we had covers of TV Guide and we were at 0:07:47.720 --> 0:07:50.920 the events, all the events, and that was sort of 0:07:50.960 --> 0:07:55.080 like our introduction to the craziness that you know, would 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:59.040 get even crazier as the years went on. But I 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:04.040 feel like when that happens, is that your decision, We 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:06.560 were like I want to support this show, I love 0:08:06.600 --> 0:08:07.960 the show, we need to do this thing. Or is 0:08:07.960 --> 0:08:11.880 that sort of like a brand strategy of like, oh, 0:08:11.920 --> 0:08:15.200 the show seems is seemingly doing quite well and is 0:08:15.240 --> 0:08:17.360 going to get bigger let' support it early. How does 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:19.000 that work? 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:23.880 It's a decision above my pay grade. Back then, for sure, 0:08:23.960 --> 0:08:27.200 a brand decision. You know, I was off doing my 0:08:27.400 --> 0:08:31.360 own thing at TV Guide and Entertainment Weekly in many ways, 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:33.439 like I had my own blog, I had my sort 0:08:33.480 --> 0:08:36.440 of you know, my own scoop factory, you know, and 0:08:36.480 --> 0:08:39.960 then and then the brand existed sort of outside of that. 0:08:40.200 --> 0:08:43.959 But in terms of like covers and particularly covers, those 0:08:44.040 --> 0:08:47.360 decisions always went high up. But you know, Glee was 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:52.240 an out of the box smash, so I don't think 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:55.480 people had to you know, the higher ups had to 0:08:55.559 --> 0:08:58.040 think too long and hard about whether to quick Glee 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:00.600 on the cover or to get the hid in this show, 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:03.679 because it was a phenomenon, you know, from right out 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:05.720 of the gate, from season one. And you know, back 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:10.160 then TV Guide was a much bigger deal than it 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:12.880 is now in terms of like the zeitgeist. Like if 0:09:12.880 --> 0:09:15.280 you were on the cover of TV Guide, that meant 0:09:15.400 --> 0:09:19.440 you your show or you as a performer have arrived. 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:23.760 Same thing with Entertainment Weekly, you know, for sure, you 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:25.920 know the peak of Entertainment Weekly. Getting an e W 0:09:26.200 --> 0:09:30.600 cover was like, okay, we we are phenomenon. 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:34.520 Yeah, it was a big, big deal. Yeah, I remember 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:35.319 those things. 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:38.240 You know, And then and then obviously you know, you know, 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:40.280 Comic Con, you come around and I did all the 0:09:40.360 --> 0:09:43.240 video and your Comic Con and also on the red 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:45.280 carpet at the Emmys, and that gave me an opportunity 0:09:45.320 --> 0:09:48.080 to actually meet you, which is really was some of 0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:51.000 the most fun is getting out from behind my computer 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:55.240 breaking the news and actually to interact with cast members, 0:09:55.360 --> 0:09:58.680 especially fun cast members like the two of you. It's 0:09:58.720 --> 0:10:01.440 like it was always it was always just a joy 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:03.720 and a pleasure to interview when you guys were always 0:10:03.760 --> 0:10:06.600 game about like throwing a scoop here and there, and 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:08.400 you know, we give each other a ship about you know, 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:13.120 about school. It was just a really fun back and forth. 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:16.679 And those in terms of like my memories of covering 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:21.040 the show you particularly the Comic On interviews, were really fun. 0:10:21.360 --> 0:10:24.200 This morning, you sent me a Comic Con interview that 0:10:24.240 --> 0:10:26.440 you're looking and I said it to Jenna and we're like, oh, 0:10:26.760 --> 0:10:29.120 I had the same sort of reaction of like, it's 0:10:29.200 --> 0:10:35.640 so strange to see it now. It's Darren, Leah, Corey, Nya, 0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:36.720 myself and Jenna. 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:38.880 Told me the six of you, yes, and it's like 0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:41.920 and Corey and Naya were sitting right next to each other, 0:10:42.480 --> 0:10:47.720 and I knew that video existed. And then after Naya passed, 0:10:47.760 --> 0:10:50.920 I was just like, I watched it interview again and 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:53.559 I said, I can't believe I can't believe it. They're 0:10:53.600 --> 0:10:57.240 both gone. And then you know, I watched it again 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:00.920 in preparation for this interview, and it's just, you know, 0:11:02.120 --> 0:11:05.079 it's just so it's so sad. But you know, I 0:11:05.080 --> 0:11:07.480 guess bettersweet is it? Bittersweet is the way to say it, 0:11:07.520 --> 0:11:09.800 because it is such a fun interview, and you know, 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:11.559 and it was fun to see you guys sitting next 0:11:11.600 --> 0:11:15.560 to each other and having your sort of camaraderie. Uh 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:20.880 and but it's like like ten years ago. It's just crazy. 0:11:21.040 --> 0:11:23.880 Yeah, yeah, no, it was really crazy to watch. Comic 0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:29.560 Con was one of my my personal favorite year two 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:31.439 at ten, so I was at all the gleek comic 0:11:31.480 --> 0:11:34.040 cons and doing the panel in the ballroom. I was 0:11:34.200 --> 0:11:38.599 gladly raising my hand to go and promote the show. 0:11:39.720 --> 0:11:44.520 But yeah, that was particularly a memorable one to watch 0:11:44.679 --> 0:11:47.840 back because we're talking about the future of the show, 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:51.200 we're talking about what's to come, we're talking you know 0:11:51.440 --> 0:11:54.520 there to hear their voices even you know, it's just 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:58.760 you get a little you know, chill down your spine. 0:11:59.640 --> 0:12:02.120 But am Coma was special because we also there was 0:12:02.160 --> 0:12:06.080 a lot of information also revealed there, Like we learned 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:08.400 the first year at comic Con that Kevin and I 0:12:08.440 --> 0:12:12.160 were going to be We're only juniors. We all thought 0:12:12.200 --> 0:12:15.000 we were graduating, and we're like, what's happening to our jobs? 0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:19.360 Where's this going? Where's this headed? And so we learned 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:21.240 a lot of information because it was the first time 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:23.360 you get like Brady and and Ryan in a room, 0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:27.200 you know, all together other than you know, writing these 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:31.240 crazy scripts. So but it was really fun to see 0:12:31.280 --> 0:12:36.440 you and and kind of experience like the fans also 0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:42.400 in that way firsthand, because they you know, comic Con 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:46.120 is all about the fans, and it's it's a very 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:48.920 concentrated place to experience it and to. 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:51.960 Meet over hand. And what stands out for me by 0:12:52.000 --> 0:12:54.760 the interview is you guys knew nothing about what was 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:57.600 coming up in season four, like because you took place 0:12:57.600 --> 0:13:00.199 between season three and season four, which I think you 0:13:00.240 --> 0:13:02.240 know pretty much at the peak of the show or 0:13:02.559 --> 0:13:04.719 right around the peak of the show. But it was 0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:07.280 the first summer where you guys didn't have the tour, 0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:09.560 like you had a summer off and we talk about 0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:13.480 you had you actually had a hiatus. But of course 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:16.320 I'm grilling you about what's coming up in season four, 0:13:16.360 --> 0:13:21.120 and you guys knew absolutely nothing. You you were no 0:13:21.200 --> 0:13:23.640 help to me. You're no help to me at all. 0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:26.600 I'm not sure that they knew the writer. 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:30.280 I loved how like sort of clunky are dynamic with 0:13:30.320 --> 0:13:33.440 each other. Was in like a charming way because we 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:35.640 clearly were like out of sync. You know when you 0:13:35.720 --> 0:13:37.480 do a bunch of press and you have your answers 0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:38.960 and this question is going to go to this person, 0:13:39.520 --> 0:13:42.360 and we were all just sort of like vibing. It 0:13:42.400 --> 0:13:45.160 was a little messy, but obviously like we knew and 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:47.360 loved you and felt comfortable with you, so we were 0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:51.320 just like goofing around and also being honest about like, 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:54.040 I don't know, I had no idea what was going 0:13:54.080 --> 0:13:54.440 to happen. 0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:58.800 Well, also, I was watching it, it was just sort of 0:13:58.880 --> 0:14:02.960 struck by. There's there was just a nice energy amongst 0:14:02.960 --> 0:14:05.200 the six of you. You know, I think Glee sometimes 0:14:05.440 --> 0:14:09.240 you get there's this bad wrap of all feuds and 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:12.520 this and that, and you know, if you watch that interview, 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:17.520 you don't get any sense like everybody's interacting, everybody's making 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:20.520 eye contact with each other, joking around, like and this 0:14:20.600 --> 0:14:24.000 is three seasons. Well, this isn't going into your fourth season, 0:14:24.080 --> 0:14:26.680 so this is this is when you know there might 0:14:26.720 --> 0:14:30.440 have been or already were tensions or whatever, but you 0:14:30.480 --> 0:14:33.440 guys were all sort of really professional and it's just 0:14:33.840 --> 0:14:35.280 a fun energy to be around. 0:14:35.920 --> 0:14:37.880 That's nice. That's a good point, though. 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:41.560 It is because I do think like post Glee, that's 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:44.480 what's talked about, probably more than anything, is sort of 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:49.240 the negative, dramatic stuff like that, where that didn't really 0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:54.120 exist at all, and until it did towards the end, 0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:56.680 and that was after Corey passed away, and I think 0:14:56.720 --> 0:15:00.640 that was probably the impetus of things just got weird, 0:15:01.200 --> 0:15:06.000 and so then dynamics shift people's mindset shift. Being in 0:15:06.040 --> 0:15:07.840 the place where we spent the most time with him 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:10.320 every day, you know, it's like a it's a really 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:12.800 hard thing to wrap your head around. And I think 0:15:13.360 --> 0:15:15.840 a lot of those quote unquote, I don't know, feuds 0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:20.680 or whatever, we're probably heightened or exaggerated because of brought 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:24.760 on because of the external emotional things that were happening. 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:27.840 Yeah, but that interview is like that was the dynamic 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:29.800 most days in the choir room. 0:15:29.720 --> 0:15:31.480 With everyone, and not just six of us, there were 0:15:31.560 --> 0:15:33.880 you know, eighty of us on that show, and we were. 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:35.960 People were sleeping or closing their eyes, and you know, 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:39.960 then there's other banter, but that was generally us all 0:15:40.000 --> 0:15:43.680 the time. So that was like a little kind of 0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.920 like view in a peek inside to what it was like. 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:49.400 Yeah, those interviews with you at comic Con every year 0:15:49.400 --> 0:15:51.320 were also like one of the things to look forward 0:15:51.320 --> 0:15:55.240 to because we did necessarily do a lot of sit 0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:58.040 down interviews at comic Con. You have your panel, you 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:01.360 have a bunch of like photo shoots and things, but 0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:04.520 like yours, to me, was like the stop that we 0:16:04.600 --> 0:16:07.560 always had to do, Like that was the interview we 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:08.160 were going to do. 0:16:08.600 --> 0:16:10.000 You know what. 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:11.600 That's so nice of you to say, And I really 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:14.440 appreciate that. It's something I hear of and not to 0:16:14.440 --> 0:16:16.520 be bostful or whatever, but I do hear a lot 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:18.600 of that from the actors, especially a comic I'm like, 0:16:18.680 --> 0:16:20.960 oh my god, this is this is our favorite interview. 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:23.120 Blah blah blah, and can I just tell you behind 0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:27.160 the scenes that I'm on the edge of my seat 0:16:27.240 --> 0:16:29.920 wondering if you guys are even going to show up, 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:32.840 because especially when I was at tv Line, when I 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:35.800 launched tv Line, it's like I started over in many ways, 0:16:35.880 --> 0:16:38.040 you know, I left the EW and like all these 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:42.000 legacy brands existed, and then tv Line, you know, was 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:45.600 writing on me in many many ways in my name 0:16:45.640 --> 0:16:49.560 and was not known. So I always we were sort 0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:51.520 of like the ones that were going to get cut 0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:53.840 if you guys were running late, and of course these 0:16:53.880 --> 0:16:57.240 big casts, you know, being carted around San Diego with 0:16:57.480 --> 0:17:02.920 under strict time, somebody's going to get cut. And I 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:05.640 can't tell you how many times we were the ones 0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:07.600 who would get find out, oh they're not going to 0:17:07.640 --> 0:17:09.080 be able to make it. We would be the ones. 0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:11.200 So it's like the fact that you guys were there 0:17:12.160 --> 0:17:15.080 was just such a relief to me. Like it was 0:17:15.240 --> 0:17:17.040 it always felt like a little bit of a battle 0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:21.240 to get all those big, high profile pasts in our studio. 0:17:21.440 --> 0:17:24.359 I'm sure sure. I mean also, but you built up 0:17:24.400 --> 0:17:28.200 such a I imagine too that you had your name 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:31.280 and personally because you had interviewed so many people and 0:17:31.440 --> 0:17:34.639 written about so many people that like, your name was 0:17:34.680 --> 0:17:38.440 also a big draw where yes, obviously it was attached 0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:41.680 to the legacy brands, but outside of that, your name 0:17:41.720 --> 0:17:45.439 was also recognizable and associated with, like, you know, the 0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:47.560 fun and the care that you put into your interviews. 0:17:47.920 --> 0:17:50.600 The flip side to that is, though, if you're if 0:17:50.840 --> 0:17:53.399 it's your name, that is that is sort of driving 0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:56.480 at least in the beginning of the brand, and they 0:17:56.560 --> 0:18:00.359 reject the brand, they're rejecting you. Oh yeah, or it 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:02.640 felt like you know someone who's sort of an insecure, 0:18:03.000 --> 0:18:05.840 sensitive person. It's I think that's really my maybe why 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:09.320 it would accept me when someone would pull the plug 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:11.400 on an interview at Comic conict the last minute, because 0:18:11.440 --> 0:18:14.640 it just felt like it was a rejection, a personal 0:18:15.040 --> 0:18:18.280 rejection of you. We don't give a shit about you, 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:21.000 not just the TV line. We don't care about you, 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:24.240 even though it's really never quite about that and I 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:26.480 shouldn't take it personally, but anyway. 0:18:26.320 --> 0:18:28.120 But I mean, you were starting a new brand, so 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:30.240 how do you not because you and the brand are 0:18:30.280 --> 0:18:32.800 synonymous at that point, right like you are the brand, 0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:36.240 the brand is you, and so yeah, and. 0:18:36.720 --> 0:18:40.520 Also I'm a hustler and That's the one thing that 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:42.440 I will say that I did enjoy about that. I 0:18:43.000 --> 0:18:46.120 like being an underdog. I like I always operate well, 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:51.040 feeling like I am fighting an uphill battle. Not that 0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:55.240 I enjoy, you know, showdowns or or arguments with the people, 0:18:55.240 --> 0:18:58.359 but I like I like the feeling that of working hard. 0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:01.200 I like the feeling that I have to work just 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:05.320 a little bit harder to get Maybe with some other 0:19:05.359 --> 0:19:09.639 people don't, you know, get served on a silver platter 0:19:09.760 --> 0:19:11.840 or you know, for for who they are, who they 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:13.440 work for, they get it a little bit easier. 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:16.080 I mean, maybe that's why you resonated with Glee so much. 0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:32.280 I'm curious about the first time. Well, I'm curious. I 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:34.879 have two questions for you. What was the first show 0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:41.760 phenomenon that you covered? And then what was your experience 0:19:41.840 --> 0:19:45.040 with the first time you got the Glee screener? When 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:46.720 did you watch it? Did you watch it with the 0:19:46.760 --> 0:19:48.720 world like when you know? Tell me about that. 0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:53.040 So, my first experience covering up phenomenon not as big 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:57.840 as Glee would be Felicity. That was the show that 0:19:58.000 --> 0:20:01.679 right before I started, right before I started a TV guide, 0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:04.399 I was working for a soap opera magazine called Soaps 0:20:04.440 --> 0:20:08.520 in Depth, but I became as when I was at 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:11.399 the Soaps in Depth, Felicity had debuted and I was 0:20:11.480 --> 0:20:14.160 so obsessed with this, like I want to cover this show. 0:20:14.200 --> 0:20:17.800 But we were a soap opera magazine. So I knew 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:20.879 someone who worked at tv Guide then called tv guide Online, 0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:23.240 which the internet was new, so that's what it was, 0:20:23.280 --> 0:20:27.600 called tv Guide Online. And so I had a friend 0:20:27.640 --> 0:20:31.360 who was who worked for the digital side of tv Guide, 0:20:31.680 --> 0:20:34.680 and I asked them, if you need coverage of Felicity, 0:20:34.720 --> 0:20:38.359 I would be more than happy to help out there. 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:43.200 And luckily, Jonathan Reiner is his name, he was all 0:20:43.240 --> 0:20:46.800 for it. So you know, I'm very in the infancy 0:20:46.840 --> 0:20:49.960 of my journalism career writing for a soap opera magazine, 0:20:50.080 --> 0:20:52.680 but also getting on the phone with Kerrie Russell, getting 0:20:52.720 --> 0:20:54.560 on the phone with JJ Abrams, getting on the phone 0:20:54.560 --> 0:20:56.400 with all these people from the show. Because I had 0:20:56.800 --> 0:20:59.280 TV Guide attacked. Even though it was tv guide Online 0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:01.919 and there was so much unknown about what that was, 0:21:02.359 --> 0:21:05.880 it was still tv Guide. So I got access, incredible access, 0:21:05.960 --> 0:21:09.240 so uh and it was incredible. I was so exciting 0:21:09.240 --> 0:21:11.240 and it's really what led me to getting the job 0:21:11.280 --> 0:21:14.320 at full time job at TV Guide was my Felicity 0:21:14.560 --> 0:21:17.399 coverage because I went I went all in on that 0:21:17.480 --> 0:21:20.360 and I love I loved the show so much. And 0:21:20.400 --> 0:21:22.280 you know, it arrived at the time of my life. 0:21:22.320 --> 0:21:26.240 I had already graduated college. Show. Uh it came after 0:21:26.280 --> 0:21:29.639 that for me. But the character of Felicity I felt 0:21:30.040 --> 0:21:35.440 a connection to, like h and and a kinship with 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:38.919 and uh the show itself I just thought was so 0:21:39.480 --> 0:21:44.160 well written. So that was that was the first phenomenon Glee. Uh, 0:21:44.200 --> 0:21:46.159 you know, and I was thinking about this. I remember 0:21:46.200 --> 0:21:48.920 seeing the pilot, watching the pilot beforecause we get screen 0:21:48.960 --> 0:21:53.040 it was before the episodes came out. In one of 0:21:53.080 --> 0:21:55.560 the advantages of being a TV journalist. I did not 0:21:55.720 --> 0:21:58.960 love the pilot. I remember mistately, I did not love 0:21:59.040 --> 0:22:01.760 the I was one of those take yeah, I take 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:05.600 and here's here's why I felt like tonally, it was 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:08.199 all over the place, like I was like, is this 0:22:08.280 --> 0:22:10.840 a is this one of the Like it's just like 0:22:10.880 --> 0:22:13.840 the shifting tones, like you to Sylvester in one scene 0:22:13.840 --> 0:22:16.879 of being like this horrible person and you have a 0:22:16.920 --> 0:22:19.600 sweet scene. It just to me, it felt and then 0:22:19.640 --> 0:22:22.879 the shaky cam. You know, suddenly there's scenes with shaky cam, 0:22:22.920 --> 0:22:25.240 It's like, what is going on? Like, I felt like 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:29.080 it was trying to be too too many things that 0:22:29.119 --> 0:22:33.320 I didn't quite get it. But it grew on me. 0:22:33.520 --> 0:22:35.480 And then I also think that the show grew into 0:22:35.520 --> 0:22:38.320 itself and became more confident of what it was and 0:22:38.359 --> 0:22:41.359 got better as it went along. But I do distinctly 0:22:41.400 --> 0:22:44.560 remember that I was not I was not amongst the 0:22:44.960 --> 0:22:47.920 many people who were just like, oh my god, this 0:22:48.000 --> 0:22:51.159 is the best show I've ever seen, you know, and 0:22:51.200 --> 0:22:53.640 it was different. I'll say that it was absolutely different, 0:22:54.000 --> 0:22:55.159 and I had, you know, I had a lot to 0:22:55.200 --> 0:22:59.280 offer in a lot of potential, but I didn't. I 0:22:59.320 --> 0:23:01.920 didn't love it as much as a lot of other 0:23:01.960 --> 0:23:05.840 people out of the gate. But then that as the 0:23:05.840 --> 0:23:07.920 seasons went on, I felt that, you know, it felt 0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:09.080 like it really came into its own. 0:23:09.920 --> 0:23:12.680 So you're a TV guide online though at that point, 0:23:12.880 --> 0:23:15.040 and you're like, oh, crap, I have to cover the 0:23:15.119 --> 0:23:19.760 show that I think is like Matt like, you had 0:23:19.800 --> 0:23:22.280 to watch it to cover it, And that's why I 0:23:22.359 --> 0:23:26.119 grew on you. Otherwise you may not have jumped on 0:23:26.160 --> 0:23:28.000 the bandwagon of Glee. 0:23:28.600 --> 0:23:31.719 Absolutely if I was just a regular TV watcher and 0:23:31.760 --> 0:23:36.760 you know, working in some other industry, I I probably 0:23:36.800 --> 0:23:40.720 would not have given it, although I will say once 0:23:40.760 --> 0:23:43.880 it became such a phenomenon, I can't I would imagine 0:23:43.840 --> 0:23:47.800 an let me chuck back in. Yeah, all my friends 0:23:47.800 --> 0:23:51.360 are talking about this. Let me see what I'm missing. Yeah, 0:23:52.080 --> 0:23:54.280 but I don't know that I would have immediately jumped 0:23:54.320 --> 0:23:56.159 back in. But obviously it was an out of the 0:23:56.160 --> 0:23:59.879 box hit, so there and it did well, that's no 0:24:00.119 --> 0:24:03.679 thing I'll say. It is like Glee stuff performed so 0:24:04.119 --> 0:24:08.840 well traffic wise that it was it would have been 0:24:09.040 --> 0:24:13.159 bad business for me to drop the ball. And uh 0:24:13.400 --> 0:24:15.200 so some you know, and sometimes I have to think 0:24:15.240 --> 0:24:17.680 with that brain too. It's like what is good for 0:24:17.800 --> 0:24:20.399 the business whether I love the show or not. And 0:24:20.440 --> 0:24:22.760 again I did love the show. I just didn't love 0:24:22.960 --> 0:24:26.399 the pilot. And then in later seasons I had issues 0:24:26.480 --> 0:24:31.440 just like a lot of other people. But generally speaking, uh, 0:24:31.680 --> 0:24:35.840 you know, the main motivator was It's like the audience 0:24:36.280 --> 0:24:40.000 was locking to TV Guide, Interesting Weekly and tv Line 0:24:40.080 --> 0:24:43.840 for Glee coverage and that was a demand. Who were 0:24:44.080 --> 0:24:45.200 more than happy. 0:24:45.000 --> 0:24:50.080 To film sure. Sure, And then we kept our set pretty. 0:24:50.520 --> 0:24:53.200 They kept it to a minimum with press on set 0:24:53.200 --> 0:24:54.959 do you feel like that, Kevin, Like, there wasn't a 0:24:54.960 --> 0:24:58.360 ton of media that was there was it was very controlled. 0:24:58.960 --> 0:25:00.400 But you visited a bit? 0:25:01.240 --> 0:25:05.520 Nope, I did not. I believe I visited once. No, 0:25:06.240 --> 0:25:08.560 I'm pretty sure I visited. 0:25:08.920 --> 0:25:10.280 Memory you were there a lot. 0:25:10.760 --> 0:25:11.800 Oh that's so nice. 0:25:12.200 --> 0:25:14.720 I mean, make a handful of familiar faces that we 0:25:14.880 --> 0:25:17.240 had on set that were allowed on set that we 0:25:17.359 --> 0:25:21.600 actually like, welcomed to see. Right, But that's so interesting. 0:25:21.960 --> 0:25:24.399 Well, so one of the reasons why So Tim Stack 0:25:24.520 --> 0:25:26.800 did most of the Glee covers and Entertainment Weekly, so 0:25:26.880 --> 0:25:29.040 I was the one who would be on set doing 0:25:29.080 --> 0:25:32.359 a cover story. I'm the one who's breaking news stories 0:25:32.400 --> 0:25:35.879 and stuff like that. Anything. I would think that producers like, 0:25:35.960 --> 0:25:39.040 we don't want him on set. He's already got enough sources, 0:25:39.320 --> 0:25:43.280 you know, we don't want him, you know, and curing anymore. 0:25:44.000 --> 0:25:45.760 Not to say that God was a reason I wasn't 0:25:45.760 --> 0:25:48.679 in there. Really just wasn't a necessity for me to 0:25:48.680 --> 0:25:50.760 be there because I wasn't doing bigger stories. But I 0:25:50.800 --> 0:25:52.879 do remember, and I don't know if it was like 0:25:52.920 --> 0:25:55.960 a TCA set visit. I don't think it was, because 0:25:56.000 --> 0:25:57.920 I do kind of remember I was I was there 0:25:57.960 --> 0:26:02.120 by myself, but I was any in the choir room, 0:26:02.359 --> 0:26:07.120 maybe season four or five, and I was there all 0:26:07.240 --> 0:26:10.280 day while you guys were shooting choir stuff. I forget 0:26:10.320 --> 0:26:13.720 exactly what was going on, but I do remember distinctly 0:26:14.400 --> 0:26:20.200 how how kind Corey was to me during that day, 0:26:20.560 --> 0:26:23.000 because I was kind of by myself, and you know, 0:26:23.200 --> 0:26:26.119 and you know, as you know, there's a lot of 0:26:26.160 --> 0:26:28.919 time to kill when you're on SAT and Nice. For 0:26:28.960 --> 0:26:30.919 whatever reason, I spent the whole day there, but he 0:26:31.000 --> 0:26:33.160 kept checking in on me, and I remember he came 0:26:33.200 --> 0:26:34.720 over and we were talking. He had just shot a 0:26:34.760 --> 0:26:37.040 movie in Philadelphia that hadn't come out yet that he 0:26:37.080 --> 0:26:39.280 was really excited about, and he was talking to me 0:26:39.359 --> 0:26:45.399 about that, and really that was my biggest memory from 0:26:45.400 --> 0:26:48.199 that day, was just like how lovely keen it was 0:26:48.880 --> 0:26:53.080 and one monsters the two of you were. That's really 0:26:53.160 --> 0:26:55.399 the takeaway track. I've done that. 0:26:57.880 --> 0:26:58.680 We can cut that out. 0:26:58.720 --> 0:27:01.160 It's fine, this is our show. 0:27:04.200 --> 0:27:06.760 Everybody, honestly, everybody was nice. That was another one of 0:27:06.760 --> 0:27:09.520 those days was like I'm not seeing the drama, that's 0:27:10.680 --> 0:27:13.119 the tension. I'm seeing a bunch of professional people who 0:27:13.160 --> 0:27:16.120 are showing up. They know their lines are doing their 0:27:16.160 --> 0:27:20.880 work and like there was I didn't see any any 0:27:20.880 --> 0:27:23.160 of that. So I think that was the one time 0:27:23.240 --> 0:27:27.040 I maybe stop by to set one or other one 0:27:27.280 --> 0:27:30.040 one one more times for like a TCA event or whatever. 0:27:30.160 --> 0:27:32.399 But that was the like one meaty day that I 0:27:32.440 --> 0:27:32.880 spent them. 0:27:33.119 --> 0:27:34.480 Sure that makes sense. 0:27:34.560 --> 0:27:39.359 Corey was always like, come on in. 0:27:39.720 --> 0:27:42.600 He's just so inclusive the amount of. 0:27:42.600 --> 0:27:45.480 Times we were late to press things because he was 0:27:46.320 --> 0:27:48.440 genuinely so nice and talking to everyone. 0:27:49.960 --> 0:27:51.080 We're late, we have to. 0:27:51.200 --> 0:27:53.240 We have to get out of here, we have to go. 0:27:53.880 --> 0:27:56.400 And you know, I'll say it just about Corey too. 0:27:56.520 --> 0:28:01.040 Is I remember when I found out that he had died, 0:28:01.640 --> 0:28:05.680 and it was late at night on the East Coast, 0:28:06.000 --> 0:28:10.840 I believe hit my late husband, Uh and I were 0:28:10.880 --> 0:28:13.520 about to go to sleep, or I had already fallen asleep. 0:28:13.600 --> 0:28:16.399 Kit was still awake and he woke me up and 0:28:16.440 --> 0:28:18.800 he was like Michael because he knew, you know, he 0:28:19.480 --> 0:28:21.760 came to the concert with me. He you know, he 0:28:21.880 --> 0:28:25.280 was part of the Glee phenomenon too. He's like, you're 0:28:25.320 --> 0:28:26.639 not going to believe this. And I think it was 0:28:26.680 --> 0:28:28.639 TMZ that broke it. And I was like, it's liked 0:28:29.200 --> 0:28:33.760 midnight or one am, and I'm like in disbelieve, I 0:28:33.800 --> 0:28:37.280 can't believe what I'm reading. I'm shocked, I'm sad, I'm 0:28:37.320 --> 0:28:40.920 all these things. But then I have to switch gears immediately. 0:28:41.080 --> 0:28:44.440 I have to actually write a fucking story about him dying. 0:28:44.520 --> 0:28:48.680 So it's like the brain has to immediately shift from 0:28:48.760 --> 0:28:52.920 being like stunned, shocked, sad, all these things too. Oh, 0:28:53.120 --> 0:28:55.400 I have to actually write about this now. It's my 0:28:55.520 --> 0:28:59.400 job to write a story about this person that I 0:29:00.640 --> 0:29:05.720 know that I've covered, that I've interviewed. And the same 0:29:05.720 --> 0:29:07.800 thing with Naya to a degree. You know, it's like 0:29:07.920 --> 0:29:10.440 obviously that she died after the show had ended, but 0:29:10.480 --> 0:29:13.920 it's still is a story we covered, that we had 0:29:13.960 --> 0:29:17.040 to cover, and it's just that's one of the tricky things, 0:29:17.320 --> 0:29:22.560 is just the brain switch of Okay, turn off the 0:29:23.760 --> 0:29:28.240 personal and get into the professional mode because you have to. 0:29:28.480 --> 0:29:31.880 You have to write the story now, And there are 0:29:31.880 --> 0:29:33.040 two different sides of the brain. 0:29:33.680 --> 0:29:37.640 Yeah, that's really interesting. It resonates to maybe Kevin, you 0:29:37.680 --> 0:29:41.440 can ogree your disagree, but like for us, we lost 0:29:41.480 --> 0:29:43.960 a friend and we lost a cast mat or and 0:29:44.040 --> 0:29:47.320 a character on our show, and so there was a 0:29:47.440 --> 0:29:50.800 very very thin line between what you were seeing on 0:29:50.880 --> 0:29:54.880 camera in the quarterback and what you were seeing in 0:29:54.920 --> 0:29:59.640 real life, right behind the scenes. And I hate that episode, 0:30:00.040 --> 0:30:03.600 hate shooting it, hate everything about it obviously because what 0:30:03.720 --> 0:30:07.200 you're watching is us grieving a friend. You have a 0:30:07.280 --> 0:30:08.120 camera in your face. 0:30:08.600 --> 0:30:10.840 And it wasn't that long after, right, It was like 0:30:10.880 --> 0:30:12.320 a couple of months when you shut up. 0:30:12.560 --> 0:30:15.560 It was like three months or two it was. 0:30:15.880 --> 0:30:21.480 It was very maybe two months, very fresh, and it's 0:30:21.840 --> 0:30:24.160 I also don't know, like to your point about having 0:30:24.160 --> 0:30:26.320 to switch gears and like write about it how you 0:30:26.360 --> 0:30:30.440 Then it was obviously the first time for us, for 0:30:30.480 --> 0:30:32.200 a lot of us to one lose somebody close to 0:30:32.280 --> 0:30:35.000 us and to your sort of a public figure or 0:30:35.000 --> 0:30:39.280 the show is this public entity, and so then you're 0:30:39.320 --> 0:30:42.440 having to deal with that whole side of it. 0:30:42.520 --> 0:30:45.800 Then there are reporters, journalists writing about it. Then there 0:30:45.800 --> 0:30:50.920 are people on social media tweeting you or whatever. And 0:30:51.960 --> 0:30:55.920 the balance of how do we figure out one how 0:30:55.960 --> 0:30:59.720 to like grieve a friend and then also represent this 0:31:00.800 --> 0:31:04.320 publicly in a way that is like honoring him and 0:31:04.400 --> 0:31:07.520 respectful but also not encroaching on any of us what 0:31:07.520 --> 0:31:12.440 we feel comfortable doing. Very weird for you. 0:31:11.560 --> 0:31:14.040 Like trying to be respectful but while having to do 0:31:14.240 --> 0:31:17.040 a job right to report on it and to write it. 0:31:17.040 --> 0:31:20.600 It feels I'm sure it felt very right. 0:31:20.640 --> 0:31:23.120 It's like, when is it When is it okay for 0:31:23.200 --> 0:31:26.520 you to start asking the producers how you're going to 0:31:26.520 --> 0:31:30.560 incorporate this into the show? You know, it's like and 0:31:30.680 --> 0:31:32.480 because that also is a big part of the story. 0:31:32.520 --> 0:31:38.040 And as I remember, Corey died right before Comic Con. 0:31:38.400 --> 0:31:40.600 Once it was over the summer, it was starting a hiatus, 0:31:40.640 --> 0:31:43.600 and it was before Comic Con, and I remember getting 0:31:43.640 --> 0:31:46.880 pulled out of an interview in our interview Street because 0:31:46.920 --> 0:31:49.840 Ryan Murphy wanted to speak to me. He was speaking 0:31:49.880 --> 0:31:52.760 to a couple of journalists I believe about how he 0:31:52.920 --> 0:31:56.600 was going to handle Corey's death on the show. And 0:31:56.760 --> 0:31:59.600 that was the first time we knew how it was 0:31:59.640 --> 0:32:01.000 going to be handle on how it was going to 0:32:01.000 --> 0:32:03.920 be dealt with. And you know, I have to say it. 0:32:03.960 --> 0:32:10.320 I thought it was beautifully done and was a beautiful tribute, 0:32:10.320 --> 0:32:14.360 But it's an impossible situation. I can't imagine what you 0:32:14.400 --> 0:32:15.480 guys went through. 0:32:16.520 --> 0:32:18.880 Yeah, I don't know how any show, you know, there's 0:32:18.920 --> 0:32:22.240 a handful of shows that's happened, and like I watched 0:32:22.240 --> 0:32:25.040 The West Wing after that had happened, and I was like, oh, 0:32:25.080 --> 0:32:27.680 how do they deal with this? And it's this weird. 0:32:27.840 --> 0:32:30.200 It is impossible. I think it's a sort of lose 0:32:30.280 --> 0:32:35.320 lose no matter what, where there's no proper way because 0:32:35.320 --> 0:32:38.720 there's no real way, especially on a TV schedule, to 0:32:39.760 --> 0:32:46.240 like separate that real life event from a fictional character 0:32:47.000 --> 0:32:51.600 event because you're grieving in real time and you're shooting 0:32:51.880 --> 0:32:54.920 five days a week, sometimes six days a week, and 0:32:55.000 --> 0:32:58.600 so there is no sort of separation at all of anything. 0:32:59.280 --> 0:33:02.920 So it's a weird, weird thing. But I will say, 0:33:03.200 --> 0:33:08.960 though you're writing about these tough things, which you wrote 0:33:09.000 --> 0:33:15.560 about your relationship with your husband, Kit was the is 0:33:15.800 --> 0:33:18.640 one of the most phenomenal books I've ever read. And 0:33:19.080 --> 0:33:26.320 then that movie that came out, Boy, like you can 0:33:26.440 --> 0:33:32.000 write your damn face off and like share like these 0:33:32.120 --> 0:33:36.120 really hard to talk about things. Reading that I think 0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:42.320 also helped me, you know, go through these hard grief 0:33:42.480 --> 0:33:44.480 stages of grief and things like that and thinking about 0:33:44.480 --> 0:33:47.800 the past. But if anyone has not read your book, 0:33:47.840 --> 0:33:51.959 spoiler the hero dies, it's unbelievable. And see the movie 0:33:52.000 --> 0:33:55.520 just ugly cried through both of them. I made all 0:33:55.600 --> 0:34:00.360 my friends go see the movie. I was like, you 0:34:00.440 --> 0:34:02.600 give me that book, Yeah, thank you sent it to me, like, 0:34:02.680 --> 0:34:05.720 thank you for Like, I'm just it was. 0:34:05.720 --> 0:34:08.880 Here for the support. Let me just say, it's like, 0:34:08.920 --> 0:34:11.799 when that book came out, you were so lovely. I 0:34:11.800 --> 0:34:15.120 think you even moted it before you even read it. 0:34:16.160 --> 0:34:18.440 And then when the movie came out, You're just I 0:34:19.680 --> 0:34:22.759 don't take the support for granted. I really appreciate it. 0:34:22.800 --> 0:34:27.920 You've been always so kind to me with with my 0:34:28.040 --> 0:34:32.640 career and uh, and I'm just extremely grateful. 0:34:32.680 --> 0:34:36.719 So thank you, Kevin, I mean more than welcome. You 0:34:36.719 --> 0:34:38.880 do not need to thank me, because it's also just 0:34:38.960 --> 0:34:40.799 like it's beautiful. It's a beautiful piece of work. The 0:34:40.840 --> 0:34:45.880 movie is also equally as beautiful. And as a genuine 0:34:47.000 --> 0:34:50.440 fan of the book, I was also you know, so 0:34:50.719 --> 0:34:52.440 I was like, what is this movie going to be? 0:34:53.280 --> 0:34:56.160 Am I going to get the same feeling? And did 0:34:56.920 --> 0:35:01.279 and it felt like such a great translation of the 0:35:01.280 --> 0:35:05.319 book onto the screen. And how I mean, what was 0:35:05.360 --> 0:35:10.200 that process like for you going from one deciding to 0:35:10.200 --> 0:35:12.160 write this book, have the book come out, and then 0:35:12.840 --> 0:35:15.520 have a movie with you know, Jim Parsons and Sally Field. 0:35:16.160 --> 0:35:18.640 It was so many things like but as I sit 0:35:18.719 --> 0:35:22.360 here now a year out from the movie having come out, 0:35:22.640 --> 0:35:26.880 it almost doesn't feel real. It doesn't feel did it happen? 0:35:27.120 --> 0:35:31.399 Like did all that? Because you know, this past year 0:35:31.400 --> 0:35:33.759 has been challenged for me. It's been really different, like 0:35:33.760 --> 0:35:37.160 a morning period because after kid died, I started writing 0:35:37.200 --> 0:35:40.360 the book like three months late after he died, or 0:35:40.360 --> 0:35:43.319 maybe four months, because my biggest fear was if I'm 0:35:43.360 --> 0:35:45.600 going to do this, I need to do it quickly 0:35:45.680 --> 0:35:48.319 because I'm not going to remember like the little the 0:35:48.360 --> 0:35:53.160 little things like the conversations, mannerisms like and to me 0:35:53.239 --> 0:35:55.879 it felt like if I were if I was going 0:35:55.920 --> 0:35:59.839 to do Kit justice or come close to doing justice 0:35:59.880 --> 0:36:03.239 to him, I need to remember those details. So I 0:36:03.280 --> 0:36:06.080 had to start right right away. But you know, the 0:36:06.120 --> 0:36:08.799 book led into the movie, and that was over eight 0:36:08.880 --> 0:36:13.759 years of my life. That last January came to an 0:36:13.920 --> 0:36:20.760 end and was essentially over and and it was a loss. 0:36:20.840 --> 0:36:23.319 It was it was a loss of this experience, this 0:36:23.480 --> 0:36:28.200 incredible experience, life changing experience. It was a loss of Kit. 0:36:28.360 --> 0:36:30.160 It was you know, I was able to hang on 0:36:30.239 --> 0:36:33.640 to him for those three eight years professionally, through the book, 0:36:33.680 --> 0:36:36.120 through the movie. He was with me for all that 0:36:36.560 --> 0:36:39.080 and then he's now gone too, Like I had nothing 0:36:39.239 --> 0:36:43.120 to nothing is you know, sort of tethering me to 0:36:43.960 --> 0:36:50.239 him other than memories. But it was this past year 0:36:50.239 --> 0:36:54.560 has been about letting go and moving on in many ways, 0:36:54.680 --> 0:36:58.920 you know, professionally, emotionally, personally. You know, I was going 0:36:59.000 --> 0:37:01.200 to ask you, you guys, not to say it's the 0:37:01.200 --> 0:37:04.239 same thing. But when Glee ended, did you guys have 0:37:04.360 --> 0:37:07.880 a period of where you're like, oh my god, I 0:37:07.960 --> 0:37:11.360 just went I just went through this incredible, once in 0:37:11.400 --> 0:37:14.160 a lifetime experience and now it's over. I'm sure this 0:37:14.239 --> 0:37:17.279 was some relief to that, like, oh we made it. 0:37:17.360 --> 0:37:20.080 I'm alive, I survived. But also did you have a 0:37:20.080 --> 0:37:23.800 period of, like of mourning of the experience? 0:37:24.680 --> 0:37:26.959 For me, I did years later. 0:37:27.400 --> 0:37:27.680 Yes. 0:37:29.840 --> 0:37:33.400 I think a lot of us, I think buried ourselves 0:37:33.400 --> 0:37:37.200 in work immediately, Like Jenna moved back to New York, 0:37:37.440 --> 0:37:40.319 I went to London and we were just sort of 0:37:40.960 --> 0:37:44.480 the show's done. It was really hard on us and 0:37:44.840 --> 0:37:48.879 emotionally physically, let's like geographically get as far away as 0:37:48.920 --> 0:37:52.320 possible to do something else. And then it wasn't until 0:37:52.360 --> 0:37:58.760 those new things faded away that I think we all 0:37:58.880 --> 0:38:02.000 sort of had this realization or maybe it was a 0:38:02.040 --> 0:38:07.759 morning period of like, Wow, we worked really hard for 0:38:07.800 --> 0:38:11.719 a really long time and experienced this crazy thing. And 0:38:11.800 --> 0:38:14.000 I think even still to this day, those things are 0:38:14.000 --> 0:38:17.560 still coming up for me when I'm in different situations 0:38:17.640 --> 0:38:20.200 or meeting new people or different groups of friends, and 0:38:21.680 --> 0:38:24.359 the things I'm interested in are not interested in, are 0:38:24.400 --> 0:38:27.520 wholly affected by that experience. I think where it's like, 0:38:28.160 --> 0:38:31.600 we went through so much in such a pretty like 0:38:31.760 --> 0:38:35.400 short amount of time, life changing events that there's no 0:38:35.520 --> 0:38:40.560 way that those ripples don't continue I think for years, 0:38:40.719 --> 0:38:42.640 decades afterwards, and. 0:38:42.640 --> 0:38:45.520 So time in your life. 0:38:45.640 --> 0:38:48.719 Yeah, so I'm still learning. I think about that, and 0:38:49.200 --> 0:38:51.239 every now, you know, doing this talking to different people 0:38:51.239 --> 0:38:53.719 who had different interactions with the show. I think that 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:56.200 sort of maybe is judging up a lot of that 0:38:56.280 --> 0:38:58.880 as well, and in a good way. I think you 0:38:58.920 --> 0:39:01.719 do sort of have to. It's good to work through 0:39:01.719 --> 0:39:04.160 it and think through it and deeply about it, as 0:39:04.160 --> 0:39:07.920 opposed to maybe what we initially did, which was physically 0:39:08.080 --> 0:39:09.439 literally run away from it. 0:39:09.760 --> 0:39:11.520 Yeah, no, we actually did. I think there was a 0:39:11.840 --> 0:39:16.320 it was a distraction period of like I'm done, I'm good. 0:39:16.520 --> 0:39:18.080 Get me out of here, Like I moved back to 0:39:18.040 --> 0:39:19.799 New York's it get me out of LA because that's 0:39:19.840 --> 0:39:22.799 the only thing that I associated Los Angeles with was 0:39:22.880 --> 0:39:25.560 with Glee. So I called it a gree talks, and 0:39:25.600 --> 0:39:28.640 I went home. I worked on other things. I saw 0:39:28.640 --> 0:39:34.320 my family. And then when the work slowed down and 0:39:34.400 --> 0:39:38.320 nobody wanted anything to do with us, Like no casting 0:39:38.400 --> 0:39:42.840 rooms wanted to see us because we were Tina and Artie, 0:39:42.880 --> 0:39:45.120 like it was a very hard thing for them to separate, 0:39:45.239 --> 0:39:49.800 which makes total sense. And then there was all these 0:39:50.840 --> 0:39:58.080 emotions that I think were unresolved from feeling I don't know, 0:39:58.239 --> 0:40:02.080 I guess not, I guess over worked or underappreciated at 0:40:02.160 --> 0:40:06.279 least for me in some of these moments, and never 0:40:06.320 --> 0:40:10.360 being able to actually vocalize that and just walking away 0:40:10.600 --> 0:40:12.960 as an actor saying, I say, yes, I do my lines, 0:40:13.000 --> 0:40:16.000 I you know, show up on time and I go home. 0:40:18.040 --> 0:40:21.359 And so there was like a reckoning period. I think 0:40:21.640 --> 0:40:25.719 after Nia died, that was a huge reckoning from a 0:40:25.719 --> 0:40:28.680 lot of people, you know, Ryan, for us, for us 0:40:28.719 --> 0:40:32.680 with Ryan, because Ryan really didn't talk about Lee, you know, 0:40:32.920 --> 0:40:33.839 after all of that. 0:40:33.880 --> 0:40:35.960 I know when he did your podcast. I was so 0:40:36.239 --> 0:40:41.000 surprised pleasantly like, yeah, I was like I was so 0:40:41.040 --> 0:40:42.680 happy for the two of you because I knew what 0:40:42.719 --> 0:40:47.279 that that, what that endorsement, and what that that that 0:40:47.400 --> 0:40:50.480 publicity and visibility would do for your podcast. But I 0:40:50.480 --> 0:40:54.279 also was like it just made me feel good that 0:40:54.800 --> 0:40:57.520 he was at a place where he was like I'm 0:40:57.600 --> 0:41:00.160 ready to talk and to the two of you. It 0:41:00.239 --> 0:41:01.440 was just really nice all around. 0:41:01.800 --> 0:41:04.960 No, agreed, Agreed. We're very grateful for that and for 0:41:05.080 --> 0:41:09.600 him and to be in like a just a healing 0:41:09.680 --> 0:41:12.160 place with everybody in the show now. But you know, 0:41:12.200 --> 0:41:14.080 it took how long, like how long has it been 0:41:14.120 --> 0:41:15.920 since we finished twenty fifteen? Was it? 0:41:16.160 --> 0:41:19.640 Yeah? But I think it sort of takes unfortunately, or 0:41:19.680 --> 0:41:24.600 it took a really another horrible event to happen to 0:41:24.800 --> 0:41:31.200 sort of like okay, you guys, like life is too short. Yeah, 0:41:31.239 --> 0:41:33.319 we and as you know, bringing you back to that 0:41:33.360 --> 0:41:36.120 interview that we talked about a comic con where you 0:41:36.160 --> 0:41:38.239 saw the joy and like the love that we all 0:41:38.280 --> 0:41:41.319 had with each other where it's like, I think we 0:41:41.400 --> 0:41:43.880 got caught up in sort of the media scrutiny of 0:41:43.920 --> 0:41:48.080 the show postally, and that altered everyone's opinion of the 0:41:48.120 --> 0:41:51.840 show for us ourselves, which is a weird thing to 0:41:52.080 --> 0:41:55.400 experience because it's like, well, no, let's we had a 0:41:55.440 --> 0:41:59.480 great time. We made connections with people, and just like 0:41:59.520 --> 0:42:02.400 people do it any co working space, you know, where 0:42:03.120 --> 0:42:05.520 you find your people, the people that you're obsessed with, 0:42:05.680 --> 0:42:08.680 they become family. And we were obviously spending fifteen sixteen 0:42:08.680 --> 0:42:12.040 hours a day with each other, and like, let's remember 0:42:12.400 --> 0:42:15.239 those things because we're losing people that we love and like, 0:42:15.320 --> 0:42:20.320 we can't be doing this anymore. And so I think, luckily, 0:42:20.400 --> 0:42:23.920 out of a horrible situation, we found I think one 0:42:23.960 --> 0:42:26.960 of the only positive things that could have come out 0:42:27.000 --> 0:42:30.480 of it. And luckily it was a all hands on 0:42:30.560 --> 0:42:34.840 deck sort of approach, because I mean I talked, We 0:42:35.280 --> 0:42:37.600 all talked to everyone, and I had people who are angry, 0:42:37.680 --> 0:42:41.719 and because it's just sort of brings up all that 0:42:41.800 --> 0:42:46.040 stuff where where it's unrelated in a sense of like 0:42:46.800 --> 0:42:49.439 Nya passing away was like this horrible tragic thing. Why 0:42:49.440 --> 0:42:51.480 are people talking about Glee? Like why are we talking 0:42:51.480 --> 0:42:54.879 about this thing that happened so long ago? Still and 0:42:55.640 --> 0:42:58.879 for whatever reason, we were talking about it, and like, okay, 0:42:59.440 --> 0:43:02.759 let's this out. Let's figure this out now because we 0:43:02.800 --> 0:43:03.359 can't do this. 0:43:09.160 --> 0:43:12.200 That the most uplifting podcast. 0:43:15.120 --> 0:43:16.840 This is welcome to our therapy catch. 0:43:16.960 --> 0:43:18.960 Yeah, well you know what I will. 0:43:19.080 --> 0:43:22.440 I will say that it's something about loss. It's so 0:43:22.920 --> 0:43:25.120 it's so universal, you know, It's like it's one thing 0:43:25.160 --> 0:43:28.080 that I'm reminded of when people reach out to me 0:43:28.120 --> 0:43:30.279 about the book or the movie. It's like mostly it's 0:43:30.280 --> 0:43:33.960 like I went through this and it helped me get 0:43:34.280 --> 0:43:39.839 every No one is immune to loss, and I think 0:43:39.880 --> 0:43:44.400 it's one of the things that binds us together, uh 0:43:44.760 --> 0:43:48.440 and sort of a connected fissue. We are experiencing that 0:43:48.600 --> 0:43:53.160 loss and grief and we all go through it, and 0:43:53.880 --> 0:43:57.680 I don't know, it's actually I enjoy talking to people 0:43:57.800 --> 0:44:03.200 about their own processes journeys with loss, and I inevitably 0:44:03.680 --> 0:44:06.440 learned something about them, but also just about the greeting 0:44:06.480 --> 0:44:07.239 process as well. 0:44:08.080 --> 0:44:10.680 I think that's also why I'm just like so constantly 0:44:10.760 --> 0:44:13.600 in awe of you and the book in the movie, 0:44:13.640 --> 0:44:17.200 because to be able to voice that, to share all 0:44:17.239 --> 0:44:20.239 these like incredible moments of your relationship and the hard 0:44:20.239 --> 0:44:24.799 moments for somebody to do that, to put themselves out there, 0:44:24.800 --> 0:44:27.480 to put that down on paper. So the rest of 0:44:27.600 --> 0:44:31.120 us can not only learn about your story, but then 0:44:31.200 --> 0:44:34.799 learn about ourselves and also how we can deal with 0:44:34.840 --> 0:44:38.719 grief and also like it is the most universal experience 0:44:39.160 --> 0:44:43.400 of life. Yeah, and once you are affected by it 0:44:43.480 --> 0:44:46.720 or impacted by it, you're part of this really shitty club. 0:44:47.080 --> 0:44:51.919 But you know there are everybody at some point will 0:44:51.960 --> 0:44:54.320 be in that club. And it's nice to be able 0:44:54.360 --> 0:44:57.239 to find something for me. I guess it was your 0:44:57.280 --> 0:45:01.359 book really of starting a dialog and feeling comfortable about 0:45:01.520 --> 0:45:04.480 talking about that or working on it with yourself, And 0:45:04.520 --> 0:45:07.040 so I think that's why I'm always drawn to it 0:45:07.040 --> 0:45:08.360 and always bring it up every time I see you, 0:45:08.360 --> 0:45:12.360 because it's just like a really impressive feat and the 0:45:12.400 --> 0:45:15.359 world is better off that you put yourself out there 0:45:15.360 --> 0:45:15.839 in that way. 0:45:17.239 --> 0:45:17.560 Thank you. 0:45:27.080 --> 0:45:28.839 Are there any shows right now that you're obsessed with? 0:45:29.400 --> 0:45:32.000 Because you have some great taste. 0:45:34.520 --> 0:45:36.800 You know. I think that the titles I'm going to 0:45:36.840 --> 0:45:39.840 spout off are not going to be surprising to anyone. 0:45:39.920 --> 0:45:45.600 But The Bear is just the most incredible show. Succession 0:45:45.680 --> 0:45:49.320 and White Lotus. You know, I'm a big HBO geek. 0:45:49.360 --> 0:45:52.760 You know, so much of their programming. I loved Barry. 0:45:55.440 --> 0:45:57.680 You know, HBO just has such an incredible track record 0:45:57.800 --> 0:46:00.080 of God, they just have so many great things, and 0:46:00.080 --> 0:46:01.719 they had such a great run for so many years. 0:46:01.719 --> 0:46:03.680 It's like it feels like all my favorite shows were 0:46:04.840 --> 0:46:10.360 on HBO. Oh. For All Mankinds on Apple TV Plus, 0:46:10.400 --> 0:46:14.040 which is a little show that doesn't get nearly enough attention, 0:46:14.120 --> 0:46:17.799 and their new season, season four is out now, and 0:46:18.000 --> 0:46:26.280 it's just such a beautifully, smartly done show about space, 0:46:26.600 --> 0:46:30.240 outer space and astronauts, things that I'm not particularly usually 0:46:30.280 --> 0:46:34.040 interested in. But you know, at the end of the day, 0:46:34.920 --> 0:46:38.040 it's a soap opera, though, you know, all these Successions, 0:46:38.200 --> 0:46:40.840 it's a soap opera. Yeah, you know. And I'm a 0:46:40.880 --> 0:46:43.760 kid who grew up obsessed with soap opera, and really 0:46:43.760 --> 0:46:48.480 that's just continuing storylines, surrealized storylines. So I'm a I mean, 0:46:48.520 --> 0:46:52.759 I'm a sucker for a good soap opera. And some 0:46:52.800 --> 0:46:55.600 of the soap operas a little more high brow than others, 0:46:55.640 --> 0:46:58.440 you know, you know, Succession is certainly one of those. 0:46:58.480 --> 0:47:01.480 For All Mankind is one of those, but uh, and 0:47:01.480 --> 0:47:05.040 Felicity was certainly, uh, in my opinion, one of those 0:47:05.120 --> 0:47:05.879 with those as well. 0:47:06.280 --> 0:47:09.759 Yeah, I love Felicity, Love Felicity. 0:47:09.880 --> 0:47:13.600 I wanted to be Felicity. I mean I was Felicity 0:47:13.600 --> 0:47:18.840 one year for Halloween. But the short, the long hair scene, 0:47:18.960 --> 0:47:22.719 it's on my Instagram scene, but it was it was terrifying. 0:47:22.920 --> 0:47:28.360 It was terrifying. It was terrified. Everybody was terrifying. But 0:47:28.560 --> 0:47:31.040 that's what Halloween is. That scared people. 0:47:32.320 --> 0:47:35.320 But yeah, you know who can make a good TV 0:47:35.360 --> 0:47:39.720 shows that Carrie Russell. I mean that track record she touches, 0:47:40.200 --> 0:47:42.440 it's goll Diplomat is like my favorite thing. 0:47:42.560 --> 0:47:45.239 Oh so good. 0:47:45.400 --> 0:47:48.640 The Diplomat really all the boxes for me. 0:47:49.120 --> 0:47:52.280 And that surprised me because and I told Perry this myself. 0:47:52.360 --> 0:47:54.640 It was like the trailer. I did that love the 0:47:54.680 --> 0:47:56.920 trailer because again, there was a total thing with the trailer. 0:47:57.160 --> 0:48:01.600 It was like slapsticky, you know, and that's not the show, 0:48:01.800 --> 0:48:05.520 and there is comedy in it, but it's layered comedy 0:48:05.560 --> 0:48:09.120 and it's it comes out through character. The trailer did 0:48:09.160 --> 0:48:11.680 the show no favor. So I had very low expectations 0:48:11.719 --> 0:48:13.680 going in, even with the presence of Perry. So I 0:48:13.719 --> 0:48:16.319 was so pleasantly surprised where I was like, this ship 0:48:16.480 --> 0:48:19.880 is good. It's like your seat, yes, and I'm so 0:48:19.880 --> 0:48:20.439 happy it. 0:48:20.320 --> 0:48:26.280 Was for New It's like if Aaron Sorkin wrote something 0:48:26.320 --> 0:48:31.200 a little lighter, Yeah, right, just a little less dense, 0:48:32.239 --> 0:48:34.920 and yeah, I love it. I love a good political 0:48:35.080 --> 0:48:36.000 And she's so good. 0:48:36.160 --> 0:48:40.680 She's so good, she's the role. And you know, it's 0:48:40.440 --> 0:48:42.520 so funny you say something about the haircut. This is 0:48:42.520 --> 0:48:45.080 something I talk about a lot, is the seasons been 0:48:45.080 --> 0:48:49.279 the season two haircut. When the pandemic happened and we 0:48:49.320 --> 0:48:51.719 were like looking for things to write about because there 0:48:51.760 --> 0:48:55.040 was no television on. I went back and I revisited 0:48:55.040 --> 0:49:00.080 Felicity season two, the famous haircut season, and because I 0:49:00.280 --> 0:49:04.400 wanted to do a defense of not just the haircut, 0:49:04.719 --> 0:49:07.360 but of this season as a whole, which was overshadowed, 0:49:07.880 --> 0:49:14.600 marred by this this incident. And I think there's all 0:49:14.640 --> 0:49:17.440 anyone thinks about, like the sophomore slump. She got a haircut, 0:49:17.440 --> 0:49:19.040 and then the ratings went down, Well, the ratings went 0:49:19.080 --> 0:49:20.920 down because the show moved to a new night, not 0:49:21.040 --> 0:49:24.839 because of the haircut, but that's a better, snazzier last 0:49:24.920 --> 0:49:28.319 your headline to do that the headline killed the show, 0:49:28.360 --> 0:49:31.360 which not happened, but anyway, I rewatched all of season 0:49:31.400 --> 0:49:35.840 two and did this sort of deep dive into why 0:49:36.080 --> 0:49:39.480 season two was even better than season one in my opinion. 0:49:39.760 --> 0:49:42.960 You know, I threw down. I was like, yes, the 0:49:43.000 --> 0:49:46.480 haircut season is actually the superior season of Felicity, and 0:49:46.560 --> 0:49:49.759 here's why. And let me tell you it holds up 0:49:49.800 --> 0:49:53.239 season two. I would if you want, and you want 0:49:53.239 --> 0:49:54.640 to go back and watch any season, go back and 0:49:54.640 --> 0:49:58.400 watch season two. It's phenomenal. And the haircut made sense 0:49:59.239 --> 0:50:03.279 in ca the character's world. It made sense regardless of 0:50:03.520 --> 0:50:06.640 the bullshit about whether it was the smart decision for 0:50:06.680 --> 0:50:08.759 the publicity, for the show or for Kerry. It was 0:50:08.800 --> 0:50:12.960 like a character in college doing impulsive things. It made 0:50:13.000 --> 0:50:15.440 sense for her to do that, especially coming off of 0:50:15.480 --> 0:50:18.840 this romantic drama. Anyway, this isn't a podcast about Felicity. 0:50:18.960 --> 0:50:20.200 It can't be, but it can be. 0:50:20.320 --> 0:50:23.680 But it also felt like the publicity I remember it. 0:50:23.760 --> 0:50:27.480 I didn't watch all Felicity, but like I watched it 0:50:27.520 --> 0:50:31.040 much later in time after it was, you know, airing live, 0:50:31.120 --> 0:50:34.319 and that was the memorable moment for me. It was 0:50:34.400 --> 0:50:37.360 like she cut her hair, like all the process everywhere, 0:50:38.080 --> 0:50:39.799 I don't know what they're talking about. 0:50:39.880 --> 0:50:42.239 I feel like it's akin to like it's such like 0:50:42.280 --> 0:50:45.319 a non thing, like she cut her hair. It's like 0:50:45.320 --> 0:50:48.680 when Obama wore a tan suit'. That's all we have. 0:50:48.920 --> 0:50:51.200 That's the only negativity we have to say about this show. 0:50:51.400 --> 0:50:52.120 It's pretty good. 0:50:52.160 --> 0:50:55.000 Well, I think the fact that the ratings went down 0:50:55.680 --> 0:50:59.480 in tandem with the hair but it gave people a 0:50:59.600 --> 0:51:03.359 store a narrative. It was like, oh, she cut her 0:51:03.400 --> 0:51:06.239 haircut and the ratings went down, But everybody forgets the 0:51:06.239 --> 0:51:08.200 reason the ratings went down was because it moved to 0:51:08.239 --> 0:51:11.120 a new night, and I think it was opposite friends, like, 0:51:11.120 --> 0:51:13.239 I think it was Thursday night that it was, so 0:51:13.280 --> 0:51:15.520 it was I think I think, don't don't quote me 0:51:15.560 --> 0:51:16.960 on that, but I think it moved to a much 0:51:17.040 --> 0:51:20.080 more competitive time. Stuff. But I will say one thing 0:51:20.080 --> 0:51:23.040 I'm super proud of is that haircut reference made it 0:51:23.080 --> 0:51:27.399 into the movie. And I'm so happy. Our first date, 0:51:27.480 --> 0:51:30.360 Michael and Kit's first date. He mentions Felicity is his 0:51:30.400 --> 0:51:32.719 favorite show and all he knows about Felicity about the 0:51:32.719 --> 0:51:35.120 show where the haircut almost got the show canceled, And 0:51:35.120 --> 0:51:37.400 then I sort of give him groth about that. But 0:51:37.520 --> 0:51:40.719 also at the end there is a clique from Felicity 0:51:40.760 --> 0:51:43.960 and a very memorable point, and I'm so proud that 0:51:44.080 --> 0:51:46.759 we got that in there and we were allowed to 0:51:46.880 --> 0:51:50.920 use that because just personally, that show means so much 0:51:50.960 --> 0:51:51.160 to me. 0:51:51.400 --> 0:51:53.960 Yeah, it's beautiful. It's just like a full circle moment 0:51:54.520 --> 0:51:56.520 and hearing you talk about it now, I love it. 0:51:56.600 --> 0:51:59.600 I love this. Thank you for sharing all of that. 0:52:00.120 --> 0:52:02.080 Yes, oh my god, my pleasure. 0:52:02.760 --> 0:52:06.839 Thanks for chatting with us. It's very good to see you. 0:52:07.400 --> 0:52:10.040 It's good to see you too, both of you. This 0:52:10.080 --> 0:52:11.120 feels like full circle. 0:52:11.360 --> 0:52:13.560 This feels like yes, definitely. 0:52:14.640 --> 0:52:17.360 That's the joy of doing this is like getting to 0:52:18.360 --> 0:52:21.560 like reconnect and like talk about these things that we 0:52:21.680 --> 0:52:24.360 all went through sort of together. 0:52:24.120 --> 0:52:26.320 In this like crazy war text. 0:52:26.760 --> 0:52:28.640 And now that we're all older, have lived life a 0:52:28.680 --> 0:52:30.160 little longer, have. 0:52:30.160 --> 0:52:32.120 Some of us some of us older than others. 0:52:35.760 --> 0:52:39.920 Who's counting? Count the lines on my face? 0:52:39.960 --> 0:52:47.600 Okay, not with that botox, Jenna, you know you're cutting 0:52:47.600 --> 0:52:50.920 to a botoxe. 0:52:52.680 --> 0:53:01.879 Oh god, Michael, thank you are being here with us. 0:53:02.080 --> 0:53:09.880 This was wonderful. We are so appreciative of how trusted 0:53:09.920 --> 0:53:12.640 you were in the Grey Circle. You were very trusted 0:53:12.640 --> 0:53:15.799 and that's why we enjoyed being around you, sharing with you, 0:53:16.160 --> 0:53:20.759 seeing you, reading your staff. You know, just you were 0:53:21.040 --> 0:53:23.400 very important part and we are grateful. 0:53:24.000 --> 0:53:26.600 Oh, thank you for being a very small part of 0:53:26.880 --> 0:53:29.359 this incredible experience that you both went through. 0:53:30.239 --> 0:53:32.719 And if you would like to text me who your 0:53:32.760 --> 0:53:33.760 sources were. 0:53:35.000 --> 0:53:36.160 Ill never tell. 0:53:36.480 --> 0:53:42.279 Tell Jenna, is your hundredth podcast? We've done it? 0:53:43.000 --> 0:53:45.360 Oh? When is your two hundredths? 0:53:45.800 --> 0:53:46.319 We got it. 0:53:46.760 --> 0:53:51.560 That's probably maybe for the two hundredths, we'll do a 0:53:51.600 --> 0:53:53.000 big reveal. That's all I'm saying. 0:53:53.120 --> 0:53:54.800 Okay, we have you on the record. 0:53:56.000 --> 0:53:57.960 Have you on the record. We have you on the. 0:53:57.960 --> 0:53:59.960 Records making a false promise. 0:54:04.120 --> 0:54:05.640 Its so good to see. Thank you so so. 0:54:05.719 --> 0:54:08.920 Much, Thank you, take care, Thank you too. 0:54:10.880 --> 0:54:15.040 Seriously though over this like holiday season spoiler alert, the 0:54:15.080 --> 0:54:17.920 movie is also sort of a Christmas movie. Watch it. 0:54:18.320 --> 0:54:19.520 I wanted to watch it tonight. 0:54:19.800 --> 0:54:23.680 Watch it tonight, Jenna. Yeah, it's great. Thank you Michael 0:54:23.719 --> 0:54:27.360 so much for joining us. Yes, truly, and like for 0:54:27.520 --> 0:54:31.680 just it's really I will never get over people coming 0:54:31.719 --> 0:54:33.960 on here and like opening up and being so honest 0:54:34.120 --> 0:54:37.760 and you know, talking about their perspectives in their lives, 0:54:37.880 --> 0:54:39.920 and it means a lot that they trust us and 0:54:40.200 --> 0:54:43.200 share so much with us. Yeah, well, Vin, isn't it 0:54:43.239 --> 0:54:48.040 weird interviewing the interviewer. Yes, very very it's nerve wracking, 0:54:48.200 --> 0:54:49.960 like this person is very good at their job and 0:54:49.960 --> 0:54:51.480 now we're doing their job to them. 0:54:51.719 --> 0:54:54.120 Well, here's the thing, they always end up interviewing us anyway, 0:54:54.239 --> 0:54:59.760 So I'm like, my job is done. I'm just kidding. 0:55:00.239 --> 0:55:02.279 That was a really No, that was really fun to 0:55:02.480 --> 0:55:05.120 that was special feminis and yeah, it's really wonderful. So 0:55:05.160 --> 0:55:08.120 thank you, Michael. Hope you guys enjoyed the episode. Join 0:55:08.239 --> 0:55:11.640 us next week for another recap and guests and that's 0:55:11.680 --> 0:55:12.239 what you're a miss. 0:55:12.960 --> 0:55:17.200 But also before you go, snacks Miss is happening. Oh so, 0:55:17.480 --> 0:55:21.160 go to alexandriahouse dot org slash snacks Miss with two 0:55:21.440 --> 0:55:27.480 x's to donate, Go download Nya Rivera's song Prayer for 0:55:27.520 --> 0:55:35.280 the Broken proceeds. Go to alexandria House and also just enjoy. 0:55:34.680 --> 0:55:38.640 Unreally strong Prayer for the Broken And there are just 0:55:38.680 --> 0:55:48.640 some additional support from some friends of Glee. No really, 0:55:48.680 --> 0:55:50.680 go go donate and learn more about alexurd your house 0:55:50.719 --> 0:55:54.479 and enjoy the song and Mary sms Mary snakes Miss. 0:55:55.160 --> 0:55:58.319 Thanks for listening and follow us on Instagram at and 0:55:58.360 --> 0:56:00.640 that's what you really miss pod. Make sure to write 0:56:00.680 --> 0:56:02.960 us a review and leave us five stars see you 0:56:02.960 --> 0:56:03.359 next time.