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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly

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Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small

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Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions

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Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, doctor Joy Harden Bradford, a

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Speaker 1: licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or to

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Speaker 1: find a therapist in your area, visit our website at

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Speaker 1: Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you love

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Speaker 1: listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not

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Speaker 1: meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a

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Speaker 1: licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for

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Speaker 1: joining me for a special bonus episode of the Therapy

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Speaker 1: for Black Girls Podcast. We'll get right into our conversation

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Speaker 1: after a worry from our sponsors. Earlier this week, we

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Speaker 1: shed some light on the experience of dating as a

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Speaker 1: transgender woman, and today we want to delve a little

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Speaker 1: deeper into that conversation, this time from the lens of

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Speaker 1: certified sex therapist Tia Evans. Tia has a private practice

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Speaker 1: in which she holds space for people from all cultures

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Speaker 1: and backgrounds. She holds a Master of Social Work from

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Speaker 1: Fayeteville State University, a Master of education in Human Sexuality

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Speaker 1: from Widner University and is a licensed clinical social worker

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Speaker 1: in the state of North Carolina. During our conversation, we

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Speaker 1: explored ways for a transgender person to identify signs of

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Speaker 1: safety and a potential friend or partner, how to establish

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Speaker 1: boundaries around intimacy with a new partner, and how cisgender

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Speaker 1: individuals can best support their transgender place partners. If something

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Speaker 1: resonates with you while enjoying our conversation, please share with

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Speaker 1: us on social media using the hashtag TVG in session

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Speaker 1: or join us over in the sister Circle to talk

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Speaker 1: more about the episode. You can join us at Community

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Speaker 1: dot Therapy from blackgirls dot com. Here's our conversation. Thank

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Speaker 1: you so much for joining us today, Tire, of course,

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Speaker 1: thank you for having me. Absolutely absolutely so. You are

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Speaker 1: a licensed clinical social worker and a kink friendly sex therapist.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk to us a little bit about what

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Speaker 1: you do in the communities you serve?

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Speaker 2: So my role is people come to me when they

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Speaker 2: have issues in the relationships and their sex lives, questions

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Speaker 2: about a gender, sexuality, all that fun.

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Speaker 1: Stuff, got it? Got it? And what does it mean

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Speaker 1: to be kink friendly?

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Speaker 2: That means that I'm pretty well versed in things in

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Speaker 2: the kink community. So like BDSM, anything that's unconventional I

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Speaker 2: have a pretty good knowledge base of. And so I

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Speaker 2: come into a place of the non judgmental. You can

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Speaker 2: come ask your questions, you can ask your opinions, and

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Speaker 2: we can run just hash things out that they may

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Speaker 2: not feel comfortable doing in regular therapy.

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Speaker 1: And so in a large part of your caseload and

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Speaker 1: a lot of the work you do is also as

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Speaker 1: a part of the trans community.

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Speaker 2: Correct, Yes, a huge base.

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Speaker 1: Yes, So I think it's important for us when we

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Speaker 1: are having these kinds of conversations to make sure we

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Speaker 1: have good definitions and that people are kind of operating

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Speaker 1: from the same place. So I want to ask you

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Speaker 1: a couple of words to see if you can give

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Speaker 1: us a definition so that you know people have a

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Speaker 1: better understanding. So what are we talking about when we

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Speaker 1: say cis gender?

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Speaker 2: So a cist gender person is a person that identifies

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Speaker 2: with the gender that they were assigned at birth.

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Speaker 1: Okay, and what about trans feminine?

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Speaker 2: For somebody who identifies as transfeminine, that means that they

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Speaker 2: have been assigned one particular gender that may have been

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Speaker 2: assigned male as their gender. But they identify as female

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Speaker 2: or they identify as being more or into feminine based things.

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Speaker 1: And what about trans masculine.

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Speaker 2: So then that's going to be the opposite of that.

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Speaker 2: So that's a person who's tender, maybe a signed female

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Speaker 2: at birth, but they identify as male or they are

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Speaker 2: into masculine things or identify with things that are traditionally

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Speaker 2: labelled as a masculine.

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Speaker 1: So, Tia, you know, I know so much of like

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Speaker 1: how we know about ourselves and how we are interested

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Speaker 1: in dating and our dating habits are shaped by like

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Speaker 1: our upbringing, right, And I know that for people in

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Speaker 1: the trans community, they're often being raised by CIS people.

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Speaker 1: So can you talk a little bit about how like

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Speaker 1: that lack of representation impacts identity and dating choices.

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Speaker 2: So when people aren't used to seeing how they would

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Speaker 2: love to date or they are in clinent today being

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Speaker 2: represented let's stay in the media or even in their

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Speaker 2: own community, it makes them feel isolated or it makes

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Speaker 2: them feel like what they're doing is and people tend

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Speaker 2: to and if they're put into that box, they tend

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Speaker 2: to kind of shut down and maybe go into themselves

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Speaker 2: and they withdraw. You might see somebody end up being

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Speaker 2: very anxious or depressed, or just seemingly not connected to

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Speaker 2: society as a whole, maybe like even checked out.

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Speaker 1: And you mentioned the media for a lot of people

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Speaker 1: who are in morginalized communities, if you don't see yourself

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Speaker 1: represented in your home or in your community, and you

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Speaker 1: will turn to media, right, So, TV, film, books, those

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Speaker 1: kinds of things. Can you talk a little bit about

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Speaker 1: the impact that you have seen on the trans community

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Speaker 1: from looking at depictions of trans life in the media.

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Speaker 2: I think that when we see things that are in

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Speaker 2: a positive light, then you see more of a whilely

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Speaker 2: seeing my patients, more of happy, upbeat. But then when

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Speaker 2: you see things in the media that might show trends

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Speaker 2: people in a negative light, then I see them coming

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Speaker 2: with more of being down themselves or maybe even questioning

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Speaker 2: where they fit in society or in their own lives

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Speaker 2: and their own community. So I think it definitely ebbs

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Speaker 2: and flows with what you see on TV or on

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Speaker 2: the radio, with how people who are a part of

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Speaker 2: the community tend to reflect in the day to day.

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Speaker 1: And to your earlier points. So, I recently had a

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Speaker 1: chance to watch the Disclosure documentary on Netflix. Have you

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Speaker 1: seen that I haven't seen it, Okay. So there was

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Speaker 1: a lot in the documentary just about not having trans

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Speaker 1: representation in the media, or if it was then it

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Speaker 1: was always this thing that was like looked upon negatively

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Speaker 1: or it was like a joke, right, Like a joke

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Speaker 1: was made out of trans people's lives, and that the

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Speaker 1: people in the documentary were talking about how that impacted

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Speaker 1: their identity and like their self concept until they grew

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Speaker 1: up and maybe met trans people in later life.

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Speaker 2: I don't have to check that out. It sounds really good.

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Speaker 1: Mm hmmmmm, Yeah, it definitely would be one. I think

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Speaker 1: you'd appreciate. The other thing that they talked about as

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Speaker 1: a part of the documentary was like having to unlearn

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Speaker 1: so much of like the negative stereotypes that they saw

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Speaker 1: about trans people in the media. Can you talk a

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Speaker 1: little bit about maybe what that has looked like with

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Speaker 1: your clients, Like what kinds of things have they had

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Speaker 1: to unlearned.

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Speaker 2: Believe it or not, some people who identify as trans

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Speaker 2: are in the community may have a bit of transphobia

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Speaker 2: themselves just because of what they've seen or what's been

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Speaker 2: spilled back into them. So part of what I do

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Speaker 2: is kind of unpack what they've learned, and we decipher

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Speaker 2: what is good to keep and what is not so

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Speaker 2: good to keep, and I really get in there and

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Speaker 2: discover what do they want to be, how do they

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Speaker 2: want to represent themselves? So what does it mean to

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Speaker 2: be authentic? And that's what comes across my desk a

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Speaker 2: lot is how do I live authentically when the world

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Speaker 2: doesn't want me to be present? And so part of

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Speaker 2: that is really just sitting into that and maybe just

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Speaker 2: defining what does it mean to be authentic? And how

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Speaker 2: do we persevere and look past the negativity? How do

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Speaker 2: we look past the stereotypes, and how do we get

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Speaker 2: people to be seen and heard as it deserved to

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Speaker 2: be seen and heard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I was gonna say, I would imagine that

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Speaker 1: your job has become that much harder in recent years,

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Speaker 1: right with all the additional like anti trans legislation that's

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Speaker 1: being passed. Can you talk a little bit about how

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Speaker 1: all of that has impacted your work and your clients.

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Speaker 2: So I am in North Carolina and where's a lot

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Speaker 2: of negative trans bills floating around right now, and some

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Speaker 2: of the bigger ones are being targeted towards my little

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Speaker 2: trans people. So my under eighteen people. And so that's

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Speaker 2: where we see a lot of not just the patience,

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Speaker 2: but the parents too try and decide or what we're

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Speaker 2: gonna do because a lot of people are option to move.

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Speaker 2: That's the biggest impact that's happening right now. Within this day,

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Speaker 2: there's people making exit plans to leave the state, to

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Speaker 2: seek refuge and places that are safer or places that

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Speaker 2: are more welcoming. It's devastating.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So when you talk about like sitting with people

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Speaker 1: and helping them to kind of appreciate authentically who they are,

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Speaker 1: what does that look like? What kinds of conversations are

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Speaker 1: you having or exercises that might help with some of that.

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Speaker 2: So I asked them to define who they are. If

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Speaker 2: they have to describe themselves to anybody, how will they

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Speaker 2: describe themselves? And then we'll go into well how does

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Speaker 2: that look? How do you represent that adjective with the physical?

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Speaker 2: How do you want to present? How do you want

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Speaker 2: to look? What do you want to give to the world.

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Speaker 2: That's pretty much how we start, and then I send

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Speaker 2: them home, Well, this is what you need to work on.

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Speaker 2: Here is how you can present and the way you

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Speaker 2: want to present. And let's see what feels good for you,

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Speaker 2: and let's see what doesn't feel good for you, and

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Speaker 2: let's reshape it if it doesn't.

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Speaker 1: Tea earlier, you mentioned that even people in the trans

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Speaker 1: community themselves will sometimes experience transphobia, and that feels similar

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Speaker 1: to you. Even black people experiencing anti blackness right and

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Speaker 1: are having anti black kinds of thoughts. So what kinds

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Speaker 1: of things do you do to help them unpack like

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Speaker 1: some of their internalized transphobia.

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Speaker 2: So I normalize people being able to present the way

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Speaker 2: they want to present. So sometimes you see some trans

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Speaker 2: people talking about how I want to make sure that

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Speaker 2: I pass or what does it mean to be passable?

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Speaker 2: And what does it mean to be able to blend in?

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Speaker 2: And then there are some people in the community that

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Speaker 2: just are free to look and feel how they want

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Speaker 2: to feel, and that may not be mainstream, that may

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Speaker 2: not be the norm, so to speak. And so I

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Speaker 2: work with patients to normalize. You look how you want

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Speaker 2: to look, You represent how you want to represent, and

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Speaker 2: that doesn't make you any more or less of how

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Speaker 2: you want to be seen or viewed. And how you

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Speaker 2: look doesn't affect how the next person looks, and so

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Speaker 2: less normalize your own style, your own authenticity, your own esthetic.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk to you about any additional kinds of

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Speaker 1: struggles that you see with maybe some of your black

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Speaker 1: trans clients. Are there additional kinds of conversations, additional things

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Speaker 1: to kind of work through as being a part of

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Speaker 1: the black community.

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Speaker 2: Oh? Absolutely. The biggest thing I see is issues with

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Speaker 2: the church and their spirituality and religion that intersects heavy.

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Speaker 2: Especially a lot of the people who are in the

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Speaker 2: trans community that come from a very heavily spiritual Christian

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Speaker 2: base will often be conflicted on well, this is what

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Speaker 2: my religion says, but this is how I feel. Or

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Speaker 2: I can't go home because my grandmother, who is a

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Speaker 2: deepness in church, or my father who's a pastor in

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Speaker 2: the church, doesn't want me around because of how I

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Speaker 2: look to them, and how the church might see my

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Speaker 2: parents not even meet, but how I see my parents.

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Speaker 2: So what it trickles down, that's what I see the

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Speaker 2: most within the black and brown communities is how their

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Speaker 2: religion crosses over into the identity.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing that tea, You know it makes

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Speaker 1: me think about there's obviously then some grief to I

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Speaker 1: would imagine process when maybe you have to let go

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Speaker 1: of some of those relationships, either as parents or with

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Speaker 1: a church. Can you talk a little bit about how

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Speaker 1: you might help somebody process.

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Speaker 2: That so that might even look like maybe a mini funeral,

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Speaker 2: or what do you want to say to your family

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Speaker 2: that you may not be able to say? If you

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Speaker 2: want to write a letter, even if you send it

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Speaker 2: or not, what do you want that letter to say

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Speaker 2: as your goodbyes to whoever you have to let go,

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Speaker 2: If it's the or if it's religion as a whole,

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Speaker 2: what can you do to find peace with that within yourself?

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Speaker 2: And what does that mean for you to maybe get

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Speaker 2: your spiritual cut field in a different way. So we

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Speaker 2: look up ways to process letting go, but looking forward

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Speaker 2: to being able to be free. Is that sacrifice worth

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Speaker 2: the freedom? And if it is, then we move forward.

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Speaker 2: If it's not, well, what does that mean? How can

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Speaker 2: you find those little pieces of peace in the struggle.

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Speaker 1: Can you say more about the ceremony. I think that's

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Speaker 1: often a very powerful kind of imagery for people to do,

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Speaker 1: like these kind of funerals, or it kind of reminds

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Speaker 1: me of like an empty chair technique. Can you say

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Speaker 1: a little bit more about the ceremony, like would you

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Speaker 1: encourage them to invite other people to be a witness

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Speaker 1: to that? What does that look like?

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Speaker 2: Only if they feel safe doing so. But usually it's

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Speaker 2: something that we might even do in session where the

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Speaker 2: person is maybe standing up and reading what their goodbyes

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Speaker 2: could look like to the couch, which is again the

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Speaker 2: empty chair method, or even just saying hey, this is

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Speaker 2: who I used to be. I am memorialized and who

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Speaker 2: I used to be, and I'm letting go of that

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Speaker 2: so that the new week can be birthed. So it

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Speaker 2: really is one of those they write out what they

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Speaker 2: want to say. If they want to bring in our

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Speaker 2: article of clothing or something that they want to leave behind,

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Speaker 2: they're welcome to do that. Just something that memorializes who

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Speaker 2: they were and maybe something to look forward to moving forward,

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Speaker 2: even if it's like a new tube of lipstick or

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Speaker 2: a new tie, just something to kind of complete the ceremony,

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Speaker 2: if you will.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for that more from our conversation after the break. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think even within the LGBTQIE community there

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Speaker 1: has often been even further marginalization for trans people as

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Speaker 1: a part of that community and kind of being made

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Speaker 1: to feel invisible. Can you talk a little bit about

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Speaker 1: some of that backlash and supporting clients to find community

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Speaker 1: even within the community that they may be feeling pushed

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Speaker 1: out of.

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Speaker 2: And I think the biggest part about that too is

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Speaker 2: some people in the community see the tea in the

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Speaker 2: acronym is more gender based versus sexuality based, and that's

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Speaker 2: where a lot of intersection looks or a lot of

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Speaker 2: them being ostracized looks like, oh, this is a tack

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Speaker 2: on our sexuality, but they're folks on their gender, so

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Speaker 2: they should stay over there, when really there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of people who are trans that are very much steal

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Speaker 2: lesbian or gay or participate in the acronym as well.

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Speaker 2: So letting them know that they still belong, normalizing that

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Speaker 2: your place is here. If you want to identify within

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Speaker 2: this culture, then you have every right to do so,

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Speaker 2: and nobody can take they're from you. I love to say,

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Speaker 2: who gonna check you in my sessions? Because really and truly,

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Speaker 2: who has the right to do that?

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Speaker 1: Right right? I love that? And can you talk a

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Speaker 1: little bit about helping people in the trans community find

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Speaker 1: community for themselves, because I think if you can't be

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Speaker 1: a part of some of these larger communities. Sometimes that

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Speaker 1: means you have to create it for yourself. So can

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Speaker 1: you talk about supporting clients through that or with that?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely? So what I do is I talk about, well,

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Speaker 2: what does your support system look like now, and how

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Speaker 2: many people aren't in supports who are also trans, and

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Speaker 2: what does that look like? Would you like more trans friends?

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Speaker 2: And we talk about ways to maybe find trans friends,

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Speaker 2: ways to if their city has an organization that's dedicated

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Speaker 2: to the trans community, I might direct them there, if

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Speaker 2: there's resources onlines or even Facebook groups that seem safe.

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Speaker 2: Just trying to encourage them to find their tribe and

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Speaker 2: what speaks to them. Because and then because everybody's not

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Speaker 2: going to accept everybody, and that's the unfortunate reality of

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Speaker 2: the world. So my job is to get back to

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Speaker 2: them and say, you find your people. Who do you

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Speaker 2: want your people to be? Let's find your people. Let

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Speaker 2: me help you find your people.

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Speaker 1: We definitely talk about, you know, finding community and friendship

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Speaker 1: here at TVG a lot. Can you talk a little

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Speaker 1: bit about how people can assess whether somebody is actually

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Speaker 1: a safe person to be in their circle.

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Speaker 2: It looks like asking specific questions, maybe not necessarily outing

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Speaker 2: themselves if they don't need to, but asking questions about

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Speaker 2: how they feel about even just the lgbt QIA community

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Speaker 2: as a whole. How do you feel about what's happening

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Speaker 2: in politics? Maybe, oh, have you seen this show? What's

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Speaker 2: your take on this show? Those little feeling questions to

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Speaker 2: put those feelers out without out themselves they don't have to,

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Speaker 2: that's where you start, and.

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Speaker 1: I would imagine that's why, you know, finding like the

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Speaker 1: Facebook groups and different kinds of communities where like you

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Speaker 1: already know that there is some acceptance and hopefully affirmation,

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Speaker 1: maybe feel like a better place to start then, you know,

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Speaker 1: like random strangers. Oh correct, absolutely, yeah, yeah, but.

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Speaker 2: More so you want us to do the filling out

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Speaker 2: in social media or insights that may be more public

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Speaker 2: and less provas. We want to be selective regardless, it's

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Speaker 2: easy to infiltrate these spaces sometimes. Yeah, that's a big

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Speaker 2: part of being safe too, is really knowing where you're

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Speaker 2: putting yourself out there and really being on your p's

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Speaker 2: and q's.

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Speaker 1: You're saying that makes me think, you know, we talked

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Speaker 1: a little bit about like some of the additional challenges

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Speaker 1: that black people in the trans community have and we

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Speaker 1: know that some of the highest levels of violence happened

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Speaker 1: to black trans women. Is there any safety planning that

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Speaker 1: you do with clients or like bringing in additional agencies

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Speaker 1: or resources to help support clients in that area.

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Speaker 2: I like to ask them what are they doing to

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Speaker 2: stay safe? Just straight up, Especially if I have people

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Speaker 2: who are trying to day or are new today, they

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Speaker 2: are wanting today, and I say, well, what's your exit plan?

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Speaker 2: What's happened if you meet this stranger and it comes

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Speaker 2: out in that moment and it gets a little heck

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Speaker 2: that what are you going to do? Talk about maybe

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Speaker 2: making sure that you're closer to the door versus the

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Speaker 2: other person. Just I don't want to say basic safety

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Speaker 2: book because really some things would just take for granted,

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Speaker 2: like watching your surroundings, looking around, checking license plates of Nebee,

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Speaker 2: just those little things.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know. And as you're talking about this, Tia,

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering how that impacts like intimacy, because you're already

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Speaker 1: going into these situations thinking like, Okay, what is my

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Speaker 1: safety plan going to be?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 1: And I think most of us have to. I mean,

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Speaker 1: we should be thinking about that because you just never

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Speaker 1: know what it does feel like there's a particular kind

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Speaker 1: of burden for folks in the trans community. So can

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Speaker 1: you talk a little bit about how that might impact

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Speaker 1: intimacy or the ability to even settle into relationships when

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Speaker 1: you're kind of always thinking about safety planning.

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Speaker 2: I think that it takes a little longer for some

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Speaker 2: just because the respector right and really making sure that

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Speaker 2: they feel safe to even divulge their gender identity. I

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Speaker 2: think that's a huge part of a huge part of

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Speaker 2: it is actually when do I have this conversation with

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Speaker 2: my partner or what does that conversation look like? And

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Speaker 2: so those are the kind of things that we work

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Speaker 2: through in session, where how do you want to disclose,

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Speaker 2: how do you want to operate if that person maybe

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Speaker 2: gets angry or that person might need more time to

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Speaker 2: think about what they want to do, and normalize and

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Speaker 2: give them space, to give their partner space because that

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Speaker 2: could be apprehensive too that weight and gain wait and

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Speaker 2: to see what the response is going to be and

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Speaker 2: kind of normalize them. Well, these are your options, and

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Speaker 2: what do these options look like if it falls to

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Speaker 2: A to B or the C category.

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Speaker 1: So what kinds of guidelines are conversations? Do you typically

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Speaker 1: talk about with your clients around like when do you

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Speaker 1: disclose this information or when is it necessary?

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Speaker 2: Well, that's a big question, just asking them when they

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Speaker 2: feel when it's necessary, because I can't be the judge

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Speaker 2: of that. But it goes case by case scenario. It's

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Speaker 2: usually around comfort level. How have you experienced this before?

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Speaker 2: Have you had an opportunity to disclose a gender before?

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Speaker 2: And what does that feel like? What are you gonna

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Speaker 2: do differently this time or if you've never done it before,

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Speaker 2: give me a sign that makes you feel safe, Tell

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Speaker 2: me something that's gonna make you feel safe enough to

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Speaker 2: disclose that or are you the type that you want

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Speaker 2: to disclose off the top And if you do, are

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Speaker 2: you willing to accept what happens or do you know

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Speaker 2: what could happen if you disclose off the top your

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Speaker 2: gender identity. So a lot of it is just planning

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Speaker 2: and overplanning and going through scenarios and role playing and

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Speaker 2: really hashing out the benefits and consequences of these particular

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Speaker 2: actions and then coming behind with the safety plan on

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Speaker 2: top of it. It's a lot of preparation in the

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Speaker 2: front end.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, And I'm wondering to ya if this

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Speaker 1: feels like a pie in the sky kind of questioning,

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Speaker 1: But it feels like we are asking people from this

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Speaker 1: marginalized group to do like all of this thinking, like

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Speaker 1: what kinds of conversations and things could we be having

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Speaker 1: as people who are not members of the trans community

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Speaker 1: so that this burden is not so heavy for people

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Speaker 1: in the trans community.

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Speaker 2: I think it starts about just having conversations in general

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Speaker 2: and correcting people or correcting friends or peers if the

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Speaker 2: wrong pronouns are being used or this negative talk comes along.

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Speaker 2: Somebody has to be the change agent and say, hey,

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Speaker 2: it's not okay to talk about this community or talk

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Speaker 2: about this person in this way. Because we're all humans,

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Speaker 2: we have the right to live. And how is one

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Speaker 2: person's decision directly affecting you if that's not somebody that

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Speaker 2: you have in your traditional space and your space in general.

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Speaker 2: So just breaking down the stereotypes and checking people out

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Speaker 2: the door and being prepared to maybe lose some friends

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Speaker 2: or lose some loved ones behind it to be that

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Speaker 2: change agent.

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Speaker 1: So you gave us some great information around trying to

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Speaker 1: assess whether somebody is trustworthy as a friend. Are there

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Speaker 1: additional kinds of questions or things that people should be

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Speaker 1: looking out for in terms of like being a potential

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Speaker 1: partner or somebody to date, in terms of whether they

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Speaker 1: are trustworthy.

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Speaker 2: I think that kind of parallels. I think once you

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Speaker 2: get past the safetiness and a friend, it kind of

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Speaker 2: transpires into the next section. And especially at that point,

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Speaker 2: if they feel safe enough to disclose, maybe asking somebody

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Speaker 2: if they dated a trans person before and what that

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Speaker 2: looked like for them and how they felt about it,

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Speaker 2: and really seeing what somebody's current knowledge is within dating

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Speaker 2: in the community.

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Speaker 1: So for trans people who maybe are feeling like some

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Speaker 1: societal pressure to disclose, right because you already said that's

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Speaker 1: up to the person's kind of individual comfort. So let's

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Speaker 1: say people are listening to our conversation now and they

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Speaker 1: are feeling like this pressure to disclose. What kinds of

441
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 1: things might you tell them, or what kinds of questions

442
00:22:57,880 --> 00:22:59,280
Speaker 1: might they want to ask themselves?

443
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,639
Speaker 2: Are you ready? Are you really ready to disclose or

444
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,000
Speaker 2: you just feel like you need to just because? And

445
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 2: if it's just because, what's stopping you from waiting another

446
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:12,359
Speaker 2: day or waiting the nextra week. For those who feel

447
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:15,160
Speaker 2: that they are ready, that they do want to disclose, well,

448
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 2: what does it feel like? What are you feeling currently?

449
00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:21,879
Speaker 2: What's your reason for wanting to disclose? How do you

450
00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:24,719
Speaker 2: think you're going to feel after you do disclose? And

451
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 2: if you feel like disclosing, try it with a very

452
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:33,440
Speaker 2: trusted friend first and go from there. If you already

453
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 2: have your tribe and you've already disclosed the people in

454
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:38,800
Speaker 2: your tribe, do you need somebody there with you to

455
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,040
Speaker 2: support you as you disclose? And if you do, that's

456
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,280
Speaker 2: okay too. It's nothing wrong with having a support person

457
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 2: present with you when you need to have these difficult

458
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: conversations or conversations where you don't quite know how the

459
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 2: ending is going to be. And then also ask yourself, well,

460
00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:56,600
Speaker 2: once the cat's out the bag, I can't put the

461
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,120
Speaker 2: cat back in the bag. So what is life going

462
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:00,080
Speaker 2: to look like from me?

463
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:00,159
Speaker 1: Me?

464
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,160
Speaker 2: Or how do I want my life to look once

465
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 2: I have disclosed? It's a lot of soul searching.

466
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would imagine too, like what kinds of support

467
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,520
Speaker 1: is going to be there after I disclosed? Right? Like

468
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 1: what kinds of communities might I want to be able

469
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:18,240
Speaker 1: to be a part of? More from our conversation after

470
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:30,719
Speaker 1: the break, so it sounds like people are using therapy

471
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 1: for lots of different reasons. Especially you know in the

472
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,080
Speaker 1: work that you're doing, what are some of the conversations

473
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,439
Speaker 1: or situations that maybe have come up for people like

474
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,520
Speaker 1: when they started dating, that they didn't even think about that.

475
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,320
Speaker 1: Maybe you have tried to or helped a client work

476
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: through labels.

477
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:50,160
Speaker 2: I think labels are a big thing, especially if somebody

478
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: is navigating dating a person in the community that may

479
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 2: not have even been in the community when they first

480
00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,720
Speaker 2: started dating. As a common topic that I work with

481
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 2: see is well what does that mean for you? Now?

482
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:05,239
Speaker 2: Am I now gay and my now a lesbian? What

483
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 2: does this mean for me? And I try to take

484
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 2: a step back and say, well, you don't have to

485
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 2: jump the gun so fast. You don't have to put

486
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,920
Speaker 2: any label on yourself that you don't want to identify with.

487
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 2: What do you see as a partner, who do you

488
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 2: want as a partner? And what does dating for you

489
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:24,879
Speaker 2: mean or look like? And as far as intimacy goes,

490
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,639
Speaker 2: there's levels to it, right, So who says that you

491
00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 2: have to do everything that you feel like should be done.

492
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 2: Just do what feels natural for you and let your

493
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,320
Speaker 2: instincts take you there. I find a lot of people

494
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:43,920
Speaker 2: in the community, they don't necessarily change their sexual identity, right,

495
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:47,880
Speaker 2: So it looks like, well, how do you want to date?

496
00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:50,119
Speaker 2: Do you want to be a pursuer? Now? Do you

497
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 2: want to be pursued? What's your style or what do

498
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 2: you think your style is going to look like? If

499
00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:01,199
Speaker 2: you're trying to navigate the dating field as a new person,

500
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 2: how do you want to present yourself? How do you

501
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 2: want to be treated? What do you have to give

502
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 2: the world, and what do you want the world to

503
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 2: give you? As you're navigating dating, just really looking at

504
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,600
Speaker 2: the who do you see as a potential partner? Who

505
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:20,159
Speaker 2: do you want as a partner, and how can we

506
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 2: get that for you? How can we obtain that for you?

507
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 2: I think those are the biggest things that come across.

508
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 2: And then also well, how do I date? How am

509
00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:32,520
Speaker 2: I supposed to dress for this first day? Or am

510
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 2: I supposed to be the one to open the door now?

511
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 2: Or do I wait to have the door open for me?

512
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 2: Just these little nuances that we work through.

513
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:41,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, and something else that has come up for us

514
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 1: I think in the community recently is like there's a

515
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 1: lot of anxiety about like the first time you're going

516
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:49,679
Speaker 1: to be physical with somebody, and I would imagine that

517
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 1: is the case here too. Can you talk a little

518
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:54,920
Speaker 1: bit about how do you prepare for your first time?

519
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 1: Like what kinds of conversations should you be having, what

520
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:00,000
Speaker 1: kinds of things can be helpful to kind of manage

521
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 1: anxiety around your first time?

522
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 2: The biggest thing is boundaries. What are your boundaries? What

523
00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:07,000
Speaker 2: are you willing to do, what are you not willing

524
00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:09,239
Speaker 2: to do? How are you willing to be touched? And

525
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 2: how do you want to touch others? What does consent

526
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 2: look like? How do you withdraw consent if need be?

527
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 2: Just again, I hate to say the word basic, but

528
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 2: these things that we don't think about now as adults

529
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 2: because maybe if we've navigated these as young adults, but

530
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,159
Speaker 2: it's kind of like, well, how do you want your

531
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 2: body to be perceived or how do you want to

532
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 2: use your body in a sexual manner or at an

533
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 2: intimate level with your partner, And how do you want

534
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 2: to have these conversations about body parts or how do

535
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:44,640
Speaker 2: you want to have this conversation about what your body

536
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 2: may have looked like or how bodies may have changed

537
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,159
Speaker 2: over time, and how does that affect you when you

538
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 2: look in the mirror, what do you see? Do you

539
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:52,680
Speaker 2: feel sexy?

540
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:52,920
Speaker 1: No?

541
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 2: How can we get you to feel sexy? What do

542
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 2: you need to feel better about yourself or better about

543
00:27:57,800 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 2: what you see when you look in the mirror, because

544
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:00,360
Speaker 2: that's where it really istess arts.

545
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: So you mentioned the term that I think a lot

546
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:05,360
Speaker 1: of people may not be familiar with, Tia, withdrawing consent.

547
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:07,680
Speaker 1: So can you talk a little bit more about what

548
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,400
Speaker 1: that means? And like, how would you even withdraw consent?

549
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 2: So with drawing consent just means that you want to

550
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,359
Speaker 2: stop whatever activity is happening. So that looks like saying

551
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:18,879
Speaker 2: stop or no, or I think we should shade this

552
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 2: for a later date, or I thought I was ready

553
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 2: for I don't think I'm ready now. So anytime you

554
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 2: might have said Okay, I do want to do this activity,

555
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 2: but then you change your mind later, its withdrawing consent.

556
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of people don't know that

557
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:34,560
Speaker 1: even if you have done something before, you can still

558
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 1: withdraw consent and say I don't want to do that again.

559
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:37,879
Speaker 2: Absolutely.

560
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, So you mentioned something Tia that I wanted to

561
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: follow up on. You talked about a lot of these

562
00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 1: conversations actually need to happen before anybody gets nikeked. Right,

563
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 1: So all these conversations around boundaries, how would you introduce

564
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 1: this conversation with a potential partner.

565
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 2: I think a lot of it is a natural progression.

566
00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 2: So it may happen with that first kiss, so that

567
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,920
Speaker 2: first makeout session, or when things start to feel like

568
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 2: they're getting hot and heavy, and it starts with somebody's saying,

569
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:11,240
Speaker 2: let's really talk about this. What are our expectations and

570
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 2: what does it look like for me to say I'm ready?

571
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:17,800
Speaker 2: What does it look like for me to say I

572
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,400
Speaker 2: may not have had sex this way before, but I'm

573
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:26,040
Speaker 2: willing to try. And it's something really special about being vulnerable,

574
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 2: And all of this is assessing somebody's vulnerability level and

575
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 2: what are they willing to do, what are they willing

576
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:35,040
Speaker 2: to talk about? And again, if they're not ready, maybe

577
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 2: let's take a step back and do that at a

578
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 2: later date. Let's just focus on building our mental intimacy

579
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 2: or our romantic intimacy and not just straight sexual intimacy.

580
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 1: So so much of dating today, when you've already talked

581
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: about this a little bit, but so much of dating

582
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: today is happening online, right, so we know you've already

583
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:57,560
Speaker 1: mentioned that people can easily infiltrate spaces. So what kinds

584
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 1: of conversations are What kinds of suggestions would you give

585
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 1: to people around kW to navigate online dating to defend

586
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:06,960
Speaker 1: against transphorb me as much as possible. What kinds of

587
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 1: suggestions would you have there.

588
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 2: Trust your instincts, trust your gut, let somebody know if

589
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 2: you're going on a first date, let somebody know your

590
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 2: surroundings of what's happening around you. And as far as

591
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 2: trying to select a partner or you know, read through

592
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 2: who could be a potential is just look for those keywords,

593
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 2: look for how that person is talking about trans people,

594
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 2: or look about how that person is talking about people

595
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 2: in the community as a whole, and just be alert.

596
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:44,440
Speaker 2: Ask questions. There's nothing wrong with too many questions. And

597
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 2: then for somebody who their style they prefer to disclose

598
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 2: off the top, be okay with the backlash, be okay

599
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 2: or normalizing or not taking that personal that person doesn't

600
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 2: want to continue, and know when to take a break.

601
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 2: If are you're seeing on these Dayton profiles is transphobia?

602
00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:07,960
Speaker 2: Of are you've seen is negative outlook on the internet,

603
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 2: or social media. Just cut the computer off for a

604
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 2: little bit, take some time. It's okay to come back

605
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 2: to that later day. You don't have to digest this

606
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 2: all day every day. It's already waiting out there for

607
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,560
Speaker 2: you anyway. So you take your time and you take

608
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 2: a step back from everything from Dayton peruse and social media.

609
00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 2: Stick to your support system and ask for help if

610
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 2: you need help.

611
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: So you know. Another first that I think can bring

612
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 1: up a lot of anxiety for people is meeting a

613
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: partner's family for the first time. Right and again, I

614
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 1: would imagine that this can be, you know, an additional

615
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 1: level of stress for a trans person. Can you talk

616
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: about what kinds of things should the non trans partner

617
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: maybe do to prepare their family, Like, what kinds of

618
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 1: conversations should be happening to make sure this is an

619
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 1: affirming kind of opportunity for the person.

620
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 2: For the non trans person bringing their trans partner into

621
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 2: their family, it starts with again boundaries talking to their famils. Ka, Okay,

622
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 2: we're not gonna talk about this, We're not gonna bring

623
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 2: this particular subject up. We're gonna let that person and

624
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 2: they share pronouns. This is their pronouns. Is the pronouns

625
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:16,239
Speaker 2: that we're using. If somebody uses an incorrect pronoun, I

626
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 2: expect you to either correct yourself or be prepared to

627
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 2: be corrected. And just setting those firm boundaries that this

628
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 2: is not gonna fly. This is the person that I'm

629
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,640
Speaker 2: choosing to be with, and if that can be accepted,

630
00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 2: then maybe we can't have dinner on Sunday. It looks

631
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,320
Speaker 2: like being very firm in their support and then their

632
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 2: affirmation of their partner.

633
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I would imagine that there are again some

634
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: conversations that need to happen with the partner even before

635
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: you meet the family, right around what kinds of things

636
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,400
Speaker 1: feel comfortable? What kinds of things don't feel comfortable?

637
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, so then you're definitely gonna have that conversation with

638
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 2: your partner about, well, okay, what are your boundaries with

639
00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 2: my family or what kind of things do I need

640
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 2: to look out for if you're feeling uncomfortable? What kind

641
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 2: of support do you need if you're feeling uncomfortable, and

642
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 2: what's our exep plain and if we need to leave,

643
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 2: we can leave and remind that partner that they don't

644
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:06,080
Speaker 2: have to be in a space that they're uncomfortable being

645
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 2: in and if any kind of discomfort is there, we're

646
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:11,520
Speaker 2: gonna remove ourselves. And those kind of things can be

647
00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:15,920
Speaker 2: happening way before the meeting, in the car on the

648
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 2: way to the meeting, as far as reaffirming that is

649
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 2: going to be okay, I'm here, letting your partner know

650
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,239
Speaker 2: that you are there for them, This is just the

651
00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 2: next station in your relationship and that you're here.

652
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 1: So you talked earlier Tia about the importance of media

653
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 1: and like solid positive depictions of trans people. Can you

654
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,480
Speaker 1: point to any like shows or films or things that

655
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: you've seen recently that you think have done a good

656
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: job of really presenting trans people.

657
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 2: So I really love POSS and I know it's not

658
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 2: on anymore, but I just recently rewrited the series, and

659
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 2: I think a lot of that is very very affirming

660
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 2: to see people in the community even that far, even

661
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:00,160
Speaker 2: it's not that far, but you know, talking about the

662
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 2: eighties and early nineties, the depictions of the trans population

663
00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:07,239
Speaker 2: there is really where I pull from the most. I

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00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 2: see a lot of people on social media as far

665
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:13,520
Speaker 2: as like TikTok is Concerned or even Facebook coming out

666
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 2: more and sharing their stories and sharing their journeys, and

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00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 2: that's usually where I direct a lot of my patients too,

668
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,959
Speaker 2: if they're looking for a more positive light or more

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00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:27,319
Speaker 2: of how do I see myself on the screen, So

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00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,040
Speaker 2: a lot of me is showing them social media.

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00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 1: So you are also working on a workbook, Tia, tell

672
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:34,799
Speaker 1: us more about your work wook and what your plans are,

673
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:36,000
Speaker 1: your hopes are for the work.

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00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 2: So it's a work in progress. It is about intimacy.

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00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:46,680
Speaker 2: How to build intimacy with your partner or partners if

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00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:50,160
Speaker 2: you are in nom monogamous relationships, and what that looks

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00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:54,160
Speaker 2: like from a physical aspect, from a romantic aspect, en

678
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:57,640
Speaker 2: fron mental aspect, and so it's just about those little

679
00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:00,279
Speaker 2: things to get your intimacy back to where there it

680
00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 2: was or better than what it was beforehand. People are

681
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 2: looking to pull that spark back, all right.

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00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 1: So let us know where we can stay posted so

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00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:10,319
Speaker 1: that we know when the workbook drops. What is your

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00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 1: website as well as any social media channels you'd like

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00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 1: to share.

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00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 2: So my website is Beth change hky dot com. You

687
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 2: can find me on Instagram at t the Sex Therapist,

688
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,239
Speaker 2: no Ian sex. Because social media they will pull you.

689
00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:31,480
Speaker 2: Also on Facebook, as Ta Evans sexuality and relationship therapist,

690
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,840
Speaker 2: I believe is what it is currently. And then my

691
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,240
Speaker 2: brick and mortar practice is based out of Hickory, North Carolina,

692
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:41,760
Speaker 2: and it's called The Change within the Counseling Center Perfect.

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00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,440
Speaker 1: We'll be sure to include all of that in the

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00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 1: show notes. Thank you so much for spending some time

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00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 1: with us today, Tya, absolutely, I'm so glad Tia was

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00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,880
Speaker 1: able to join us and share her expertise for this conversation.

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00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:57,919
Speaker 1: To learn more about her and her work, be sure

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00:35:57,920 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 1: to visit the show notes at Therapy from Black Girl

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00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 1: slash trans Dating, and don't forget to textas episode to

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00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 1: two of your girls right now and encourage them to

701
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 1: check it out. If you're looking for a therapist in

702
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,560
Speaker 1: your area, check out our therapist directory at Therapy for

703
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:16,040
Speaker 1: Blackgirls dot com slash directory. And if you want to

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00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: continue digging into this topic or just be in community

705
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,319
Speaker 1: with other sisters, come on over and join us in

706
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,320
Speaker 1: the Sister Circle. It's our cozy corner of the Internet

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00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 1: designed just for black women. You can join us at

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00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 1: community dot Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. This episode was

709
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 1: produced by Frida Lucas Elise Ellis and Zaria Taylor. Editing

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00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 1: was done by Dennison Bradford. Thank y'all so much for

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00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 1: joining me for this bonus episode. We'll be back with

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00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 1: our regular episode next week. Take good care, what's