Speaker 1: You're listening to the I Heart Radio and Coast to Coast,
Speaker 1: a paranormal podcast network where we offer you podcasts of
Speaker 1: the supernatural and the unexplained. Getting ready now for Shades
Speaker 1: of the Afterlife with Sandra Schamplain. Welcome to our podcast.
Speaker 1: Please be aware of the thoughts and opinions expressed by
Speaker 1: the host are their thoughts and opinions only and do
Speaker 1: not reflect those of I Heart Media, I Heart Radio,
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Speaker 1: sponsors and associates. We would like to encourage you to
Speaker 1: do your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself. Hi.
Speaker 1: I'm Sandra Schamplain. For almost twenty five years, I've been
Speaker 1: on a journey to the existence of life after death.
Speaker 1: On each episode, will discuss the reasons we now know
Speaker 1: that our loved ones have survived physical death and so
Speaker 1: will we. Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. You know
Speaker 1: the expression if things seem too good to be true,
Speaker 1: they probably are. Well, Today, I want to talk to
Speaker 1: you about physical mediumship and hear some words from Dr
Speaker 1: Jan vanders Andy, who's a physicist, professor and Wall Street
Speaker 1: analyst for over thirty years. He has described in detail
Speaker 1: evidence for life after death in his own book Life
Speaker 1: After Death. Some of the best evidence he has experienced
Speaker 1: extraordinary phenomena. Now I know in the past I have
Speaker 1: told you about Sir Arthur Conan Doyle who wrote Sherlock
Speaker 1: Holmes and he gave up Sherlock Holmes when he realized
Speaker 1: the reality of physical mediumship. These are people becoming real
Speaker 1: again through a substance called ectoplasm. Now, if you're new
Speaker 1: to this show, you might have the hairs on the
Speaker 1: back of your head standing up, like, what am I
Speaker 1: listening to right now? This seems a little bit crazy.
Speaker 1: And I have to tell you, in my twenty five
Speaker 1: years of investigating, this was the last area and I
Speaker 1: was kind of afraid to explore it because I really
Speaker 1: thought it sounds crazy, absolutely crazy. And it wasn't until
Speaker 1: I had my own experiences, which I haven't told you
Speaker 1: about just yet. But having my experiences has totally transformed
Speaker 1: my whole view of reality and even talking about those
Speaker 1: terms seances and ectoplasm. There's a new Ghostbusters movie coming
Speaker 1: out soon, and you know that green, slimy stuff they
Speaker 1: called ectoplasm. Well, Dan Ackroyd, who wrote the movie Ghostbusters
Speaker 1: and star in It. Comes from a long line of spiritualists,
Speaker 1: and after his great grandfather died, Dan's own dad found
Speaker 1: a chest filled with journals about all the sciences that
Speaker 1: were had, all the doctors and scientists who had attended them,
Speaker 1: and the people that would become real again in the darkness.
Speaker 1: So I think it's a good story to listen to
Speaker 1: and hearing from this physicist, I think it is just
Speaker 1: what we need today. So Jan, welcome. It's a pleasure
Speaker 1: to be your sander, and thank you for inviting me. Oh,
Speaker 1: it's our pleasure. Where are you coming to us today?
Speaker 1: From Jan, I'm based outside of Los Angeles, where I've
Speaker 1: lived for thirty five years now. Very nice, But my
Speaker 1: experience has started back in the nine seventies, back in
Speaker 1: South Africa, and I'll go and talk to you about that,
Speaker 1: Indie Pail. Yeah, I'll have you to just start sharing
Speaker 1: your story because it's a different kind of take on mediumship.
Speaker 1: Let me first quickly give a little definitions for your listeners.
Speaker 1: When we talk about mediums or psychics. There are two
Speaker 1: different types of psychics or two different types of mediums.
Speaker 1: Two simple ones are called mental mediums. These are also
Speaker 1: called channel ers, and these people act as an intermediary
Speaker 1: between the spirit world and a physical world, and they
Speaker 1: will give messages. Nowadays, very few of them going to
Speaker 1: trans Most of them are wide awake and they will
Speaker 1: tell you I hear this, or I hear that, or
Speaker 1: I see this. You can watch TV. You can watch
Speaker 1: see the Long Island medium James from Prague and many
Speaker 1: others who perform on TV. You can see it. These
Speaker 1: are called mental mediums. They are very common. There are
Speaker 1: lots of them, and I've sat with many, many of them,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure as you have to, Sandra, and they
Speaker 1: either go from very poor too very good. None of
Speaker 1: them are a hundred percent, but some of them are
Speaker 1: good and they give very good messages, and I'll mention
Speaker 1: some later. Then there are the types of mediums, and
Speaker 1: these are called physical mediums, and these are very rare.
Speaker 1: These mediums produce what they called physical phenomena. And that
Speaker 1: is what I'm going to be talking to you about today.
Speaker 1: You're gonna say to me, jan we don't believe them.
Speaker 1: But i am going to tell you what I've experienced myself,
Speaker 1: what I've read, and the people I've spoken to when
Speaker 1: I've spoken and met many many mediums, and I was
Speaker 1: actually just focus Sandra about some of the ones that
Speaker 1: she knows are many of the ones that I've met.
Speaker 1: So we're going to talk about these phenomena. I'm going
Speaker 1: to describe, describe them to you and hopefully afterwards you'll say, hey,
Speaker 1: there might be something to it. And Jan just interrupted
Speaker 1: a quick second, if you could just I know, I
Speaker 1: read it in your bio at the beginning, just a
Speaker 1: little background is what your career has been, because it
Speaker 1: just it helps to know that you're a reputable guy
Speaker 1: and a very smart man as well. But what career
Speaker 1: filled were you in. I am a physicist by training.
Speaker 1: I have a PhD in physics, and I started I
Speaker 1: was a graduated from Sophomore College and I graduated from Cornell,
Speaker 1: who I got my master's even and then I went
Speaker 1: to South Africa where I did my PhD on diamonds.
Speaker 1: You know, that's a natural place to go to you
Speaker 1: on the physical properties of diamonds. And that's where I
Speaker 1: met my wife, and I met her and after three
Speaker 1: months we were married and actually, believe it or not,
Speaker 1: we were married for forty five years. And if she
Speaker 1: passed away last year she went to the spirit world.
Speaker 1: When I met her, we were both very interested in
Speaker 1: is there something to life? I mean we were younger
Speaker 1: in early twenties. Is there something more to life? What
Speaker 1: happens when we die? And for five year old you
Speaker 1: know normally you got partying, drinking and doing those things. No,
Speaker 1: we weren't. What we did a little bit of that,
Speaker 1: but we were also interested in what happens to you
Speaker 1: when you die? Is there something there? So what did
Speaker 1: we end up doing. We ended up going to some
Speaker 1: of the spiritualist churches in Jhannisburg. This is in South Africa.
Speaker 1: It's o very British there and in like I'm written,
Speaker 1: they have lots of spiritualist churches. For a Sunday there's
Speaker 1: a medium does mental mediumship and he gives messages. So
Speaker 1: we went to some of those, most of a terrible,
Speaker 1: terrible messages, nothing really true. But we met some other
Speaker 1: younger people and we decided to form a developmental circle.
Speaker 1: So my wife and I and about five other people
Speaker 1: in their twenties who were also interested in the subject,
Speaker 1: we sat. We met once a week in a developmental circle.
Speaker 1: Will we sit and we hope that one of these
Speaker 1: sitters will develop into a medium. And one of them
Speaker 1: sort of did trance where trans medium is where he
Speaker 1: sort of goes into sleep and then somebody speaks through him.
Speaker 1: So one of the sitters became a trans medium, and
Speaker 1: this was after several months of sitting. But he was
Speaker 1: so so and some of the messages were, Okay, you're
Speaker 1: talking about a sitting in a circle, could you just
Speaker 1: tell us a little bit what you do in that circle.
Speaker 1: That's a good question because people that you want to
Speaker 1: start it, you sit around maybe five or six seven
Speaker 1: of you. Ideally you sit there, you open with a prayer.
Speaker 1: You normally do it in the dark because it's easier
Speaker 1: for the spirit entities to take over, and then you
Speaker 1: sit there for an hour and you meditate and what
Speaker 1: happens eventually somebody will how to get impressions or hopefully
Speaker 1: was that would be fantastic if somebody goes into trance
Speaker 1: and they and they go into a sort of a
Speaker 1: sleep and they start talking. Like Leslie Flint, the very
Speaker 1: famous medium. The first time he went to a developmental circle,
Speaker 1: he fell asleep and he started talking already, So that
Speaker 1: that's extremely rare, but it happens so that's what you
Speaker 1: do in a circle. You meditate for an hour every week.
Speaker 1: At the same time, it can take frustratingly long before
Speaker 1: you get results, but if you do get him there
Speaker 1: unexpected and phenomenal. Anyway, So my wife and I sat
Speaker 1: with these group of people at that time. We just
Speaker 1: moved from one apartment to another apartment after we're married,
Speaker 1: and we needed some pine furniture and not Its an
Speaker 1: interesting story. This is how got involved. Now, across from
Speaker 1: the university in South Africa where I was doing my PhD,
Speaker 1: there was a little pine furniture store. And not having
Speaker 1: a lot of money, being a student and my wife,
Speaker 1: you had a simple job. We went there and we
Speaker 1: looked for some pine furniture, pine tables, some pine chairs,
Speaker 1: and there was two elderly people owned the shop and
Speaker 1: they helped us. So I sat down at one of
Speaker 1: these years. I said, boy, these are hard. This will
Speaker 1: really keep us awake when we sit in our little seance.
Speaker 1: And the store owner said to me, oh, you sit
Speaker 1: in seances. I said yeah. I thought it was a
Speaker 1: big shot. I said, yeah, we sit in the developmental
Speaker 1: circle and we're developing a medium. She said, oh, that's interesting.
Speaker 1: She said would you like to come to a seance?
Speaker 1: My wife and I said, looked at her, said of
Speaker 1: course we would. Her name was Sarah and her husband's Mickey.
Speaker 1: They were both in their sixties and they owned the shop.
Speaker 1: So two weeks later we come to their house and
Speaker 1: two people there, one of the two of the people
Speaker 1: they are One of them was professor Allen, he was
Speaker 1: the professor of anatomy at the university, and his wife
Speaker 1: and two other people. So there were six of us
Speaker 1: and Mickey and Sarah. So we walk into this room
Speaker 1: where they take us totally blackened out, the windows totally
Speaker 1: covered with black sheets. In the corner where two chairs
Speaker 1: with and you can pull a curtain in front of them.
Speaker 1: So they sit in the corner and a little bit
Speaker 1: in front of them is a curtain that pulls in
Speaker 1: front of them, and the door was also sealed. When
Speaker 1: everybody sat down, there was a red light above us,
Speaker 1: and then one of the sitters turned the red light.
Speaker 1: Also we're sitting there in total darkness, and in front
Speaker 1: of this curtain which was closed with it. That was
Speaker 1: in front of Mickey and Sarah. On the floor is
Speaker 1: something we call a trumpet. It's not the kind of trumpet.
Speaker 1: It's more like a megaphone. You know, you're seeing these
Speaker 1: things at football games with these cheer leaders shout through
Speaker 1: these megaphones. But this is a small version of a megaphone.
Speaker 1: It's about a foot and a half high and about
Speaker 1: a diameter of about four inches at the bottom. But
Speaker 1: it was luminous paint on it, so you could clearly
Speaker 1: see it's sitting there like it's turned out. And we
Speaker 1: sit there and after about say, about two minutes, and
Speaker 1: entity starts speaking from sort of behind the curtain, to
Speaker 1: the side of the curtain, and it's a your voice
Speaker 1: of a young man starts talking to us, and he
Speaker 1: in trainee, welcomes us for being there. Had an American accent,
Speaker 1: which makes you said, obviously, weren't there a South African
Speaker 1: with a retypical South African accent. He starts speaking to us,
Speaker 1: welcoming us and hopes we enjoyed the sitting, and he
Speaker 1: talks to the other people who he knows, and he
Speaker 1: laughs a bit with them and make some jokes. And
Speaker 1: his name was Brian and he turned out to be
Speaker 1: He was a young American who died early nine hundreds
Speaker 1: and he was buried somewhere up state New York, which
Speaker 1: Professor Allen when he was in the US once confirmed.
Speaker 1: Then Brian said, okay, let things happen and start. So
Speaker 1: he said, okay, we were wondering what would happen, and
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, this trumpet, this megaphone starts flying
Speaker 1: around the room like he does, flying all around up
Speaker 1: to the corners and came right in front of us
Speaker 1: with tap us on the head, with tap us on
Speaker 1: the knee, and we'll do that to everybody, and we'll
Speaker 1: just fly around for several minutes. Didn't hit anything, and
Speaker 1: this isn't pitch darkness, And all of a sudden stops
Speaker 1: right in the middle, right in front of that black curtain.
Speaker 1: It stops there, and an entity starts speaking through a
Speaker 1: lady called maybe I remember very well, with a German accent,
Speaker 1: heavy German accent, started speaking to us, and she talked
Speaker 1: the sort of philosophy about the purpose of life and
Speaker 1: what we're doing in life and things like that. That
Speaker 1: was quite quite fascinating, and uh, I mean we were dumbfounded.
Speaker 1: I mean we we've never experienced this. Of course, my
Speaker 1: first reaction is it's fraud, But then you think about it.
Speaker 1: How the hell does this thing fly up to the ceiling,
Speaker 1: to the corners of the room in the pitch darkness
Speaker 1: without hitting anybody? You know, I thought it might have
Speaker 1: been Nicky doing holding it, But how does he do that? See?
Speaker 1: And we have to take a quick break, and I'm
Speaker 1: very excited to hear what you're about to say. Next.
Speaker 1: You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio and Coast Coast, a m paranormal podcast network.
Speaker 1: Don't go anywhere, there's more Shades of the Afterlife coming
Speaker 1: right up. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm
Speaker 1: Sandra Champlain and we are here with physicist Jan Vander
Speaker 1: Sandy talking about his first experience with physical mediumship. Jan,
Speaker 1: you're talking about the seance in South Africa where different
Speaker 1: entities spoke and a trumpet flew around the room. What
Speaker 1: else happened? So a few other entities came and spoke
Speaker 1: to us, and that was the first sitting we had
Speaker 1: with them. Professor Allenden said to me, Janny said this
Speaker 1: is real. He'd been sitting with them for years and
Speaker 1: he said, Jan, this is totally genuine. It's not them
Speaker 1: doing this. You can hear all the different voices that
Speaker 1: came and spoke to us, and then this trumpet flying
Speaker 1: around the room. I said, but how does this trumpet
Speaker 1: fly around the room? He says, Oh, all that has
Speaker 1: to do with ectoplasm. And now we get into the
Speaker 1: real physical phenomena. Real physical phenomena are involved when we're
Speaker 1: dealing with ectoplasm. It's an interesting substance. It was actually
Speaker 1: called actoplasm by in nineteen o five by a professor
Speaker 1: Riche who was a professor in France of professor of physics.
Speaker 1: They actually won the Nobel Prize and it was actually
Speaker 1: analyzed ectoplasm by several famous scientists and professors in nineteen
Speaker 1: six And ectoplasm basically consists of what the body consists
Speaker 1: of cells nine oxygen. It consists of those kind of things.
Speaker 1: What it is is is a white substance. And I'll
Speaker 1: describe how to you how I saw it the first time,
Speaker 1: because we became very good friends with Mickey and Sarah,
Speaker 1: and we ended up by the way, sitting with them
Speaker 1: for eight years. Every time we sat with them, and
Speaker 1: in the beginning was quite often. Afterwards, when they were
Speaker 1: getting older, it became became less and less frequent, but
Speaker 1: every time we sat with them, by the way, this
Speaker 1: trumpet would fly around the room. Sarah would always go
Speaker 1: into trance, and his anthony Brian would always talk to us.
Speaker 1: But one of the sittings, they said, Jen and my
Speaker 1: wife Marlene said, we're gonna have a surprise for you.
Speaker 1: They invited one of their friends called Kitty Gordon. Kitty
Speaker 1: and Max were friends of theirs. They were they were
Speaker 1: where she was already in her late sixties early seventies.
Speaker 1: She used to be a materialization medium and she had
Speaker 1: stopped because she was getting old. And they've been doing
Speaker 1: it for three forty years, so they said, you know,
Speaker 1: she really stopped, but she agreed is one time to
Speaker 1: come and sit with us. So Mickey and Sarah would
Speaker 1: sit behind the curtain in the room and this lady
Speaker 1: Kitty was sitting next to them, and this time they
Speaker 1: turned the red light on and then Kitty went into trance,
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, this ectoplasm started pouring out
Speaker 1: of her nose and it went down over her body
Speaker 1: onto the floor, and it was still attached to her nose,
Speaker 1: and he just kept on pouring out of her nose
Speaker 1: and then just on the floor. It looks like silky
Speaker 1: cheese cloth. It is a fluid because it was flowing,
Speaker 1: and when it was on the floor, Sarah wasn't trance.
Speaker 1: Brian came out and said to one of the sitters,
Speaker 1: told him to pick it up, because you can only
Speaker 1: touch it when they tell you to. He told the
Speaker 1: one of the sitters to pick it up at the corner,
Speaker 1: to hold it up and to walk across the room.
Speaker 1: There it was stretched about five ft high all across
Speaker 1: the room, the sheet of white. It's ectoplasm. And you
Speaker 1: could see if we're still stretched and was still attached
Speaker 1: to her nose, and you could see all this oh
Speaker 1: right in front of us, a few feet of her.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I know. And it was, you know,
Speaker 1: four or five ft high. All the way to the
Speaker 1: ground was a big sheet. And then Brian said to
Speaker 1: that person, just let a drop. He dropped it and
Speaker 1: dropped to the floor and then started coming all the
Speaker 1: way back into the nose of Kitty disiter of the medium.
Speaker 1: So that was our first experience with ectoplasm. People might
Speaker 1: listen to me and say you're nuts. No, I'm nut nuts.
Speaker 1: I have degrees in physics, degrees in mathematics. I was
Speaker 1: a professor at Cornell. I was a professor at the
Speaker 1: university in South Africa. And by the way, when I
Speaker 1: mentioned this the fellow professors, they thought I was a nutcase.
Speaker 1: But some of the people who have Nobel Prizes were
Speaker 1: physicists back in the early people whose professors of physics
Speaker 1: with Nobel prizes believed in this because they've been to seances.
Speaker 1: They'd varience this. It is real, and the beauty is
Speaker 1: it has been photographed, and it's the reggie that The
Speaker 1: first time it was photographed was back in about eighty
Speaker 1: He was photographed by Sir William Crooks, you know, a
Speaker 1: famous physics professor. He took a lot of photographs of ectoplasm.
Speaker 1: Photography was just new in those days. It was also
Speaker 1: photographed in the early nineteen hundreds by this baron Fonshanka, German,
Speaker 1: who were photographed two photographs of all different shapes and
Speaker 1: forms of ectoplasm. Most critics who see those photographs nonsense,
Speaker 1: is all fraud, far cheese cloth. It's everything. I saw
Speaker 1: it come out of someone's nose, get stretched for six
Speaker 1: ft across the room four ft high, and then when
Speaker 1: dropped on the ground by itself. It went back into
Speaker 1: her nose. You tell me how trees cloth does that,
Speaker 1: and believe me resort. My wife saught everybody there saw it.
Speaker 1: It is real. Now coming back to my own experiences.
Speaker 1: Is because in my book, then I recommend if anybody
Speaker 1: is interested in the subject and you want to see
Speaker 1: photographs of actoplasm, that I will vouch for one because
Speaker 1: I know who took them. During my book, like Sandra said,
Speaker 1: Life after Death, some of the best evidence combined an
Speaker 1: Amazon Kindle, Amazon the photographer is worth the book alone.
Speaker 1: So I have vouched for these photographs. Is because four
Speaker 1: of them, and especially the one on the front cover,
Speaker 1: were taken by Professor Allen This professor of anatomy at
Speaker 1: the university. He took those four photographs of not with
Speaker 1: Mickey and Sarah. They did not produce actoplasm in red light,
Speaker 1: and I must explain this to the listeners. Hectoplasm is
Speaker 1: very sensitive to light. White light has got more energy
Speaker 1: than red light. Red light has got a lower frequencies
Speaker 1: or less energy. So some media can produce ectoplasm that
Speaker 1: kids Kitty did when we saw it in red light.
Speaker 1: Some mediums cannot do that, and they'll talk about some later.
Speaker 1: And now it gets even stranger but more fascinating. And
Speaker 1: if you've ever seen this or experience that it will
Speaker 1: change your life is when this medium then goes into trance.
Speaker 1: And this was with Professor Allen. He sat with a
Speaker 1: medium in Johannesburg who Jack would not tell me his name,
Speaker 1: and the reason was he was a top executive in
Speaker 1: the insurance world in Johannesburg and he didn't want people
Speaker 1: to know that he was sitting in seances and producing
Speaker 1: materializations because a lot of people thought you were in
Speaker 1: nut case. Then he sat with this particular medium in
Speaker 1: Johannesburg six times, a young man in his thirties. The
Speaker 1: ectoplasm would come out of his nose and it would
Speaker 1: fore first of all, form on his shoulder what they
Speaker 1: call a voice box, so you can see it. One
Speaker 1: of the photographs in the book shows a voice book,
Speaker 1: and I also show a photograph there of Jack Webber,
Speaker 1: very famous materialis Asian medium never proven to be frauddant
Speaker 1: or anything. And Jack also Finice photographs similar of a
Speaker 1: voice box on the shoulder of the medium. The voice
Speaker 1: box is used in what's called direct voice. This is
Speaker 1: what the spirit entities you sometimes to talk through. Either
Speaker 1: the medium isn't trance and they will use the vocal
Speaker 1: chords of the medium, or they will speak through what's
Speaker 1: called this voice box, where they will use that voice
Speaker 1: box and put it over their spirit mouth so they
Speaker 1: can talk through it. Leslie Flynt, who was a very
Speaker 1: famous direct voice medium, wouldn't even go into trance. He
Speaker 1: would be awake, but the voice box would form next
Speaker 1: to his body and entities would speak and he would
Speaker 1: even speak to the people speaking through the voice box. Incredible.
Speaker 1: It was an incredible medium. And this voice box then
Speaker 1: is used by spirit like Brian with Sarah who then
Speaker 1: you could hear the voice not from in the behind
Speaker 1: the curtain, but next to occurred and he was using
Speaker 1: the voice box by the ectoplasm she produced. So this ectoplasm,
Speaker 1: that's the one purpose of it, to produce what's called
Speaker 1: the voice box for spirit entities can use it to
Speaker 1: talk to us. Then I show a photograph there of
Speaker 1: this ectoplasm totally draping the medium, and that's exactly what
Speaker 1: I saw with Kitty, my wife, and I saw with
Speaker 1: Kitty this ectoplasm draped over the medium. But what happens
Speaker 1: next is where it gets unbelievable. This actoplasm and forms
Speaker 1: rolls out to the ground and then starts rising into
Speaker 1: a solid form like into a rod, and goes higher
Speaker 1: and higher, and eventually it forms a full human body.
Speaker 1: It forms a full body in white with draperies on
Speaker 1: it with it in my book shows that beautifully how
Speaker 1: it is draped in this white actoplasm. It is a
Speaker 1: spirit entity that is materiality call a materialization that they
Speaker 1: have materialized in ectoplasm. And the incredible thing is this
Speaker 1: entity then who walk around the room, talk to the
Speaker 1: sitters and touched them if they were If they're allowed,
Speaker 1: he will touch the sitters and he will allow them
Speaker 1: to touch them. And these entities that were photographed by
Speaker 1: Professor Allen, he photographed to full materializations. During my book.
Speaker 1: He had a professional photographer with him. They use youth
Speaker 1: ultra violet film and they turned this in red light.
Speaker 1: And when you look at that photograph of my front cover,
Speaker 1: you can see on the ground there in the background.
Speaker 1: I don't if you notice the sandra whole pile of
Speaker 1: ectoplasm lying there an incredible amount. So you get this
Speaker 1: whole entity, which by the way, is totally solid speaking
Speaker 1: to you, and you get this actoplasm, these draperies folds,
Speaker 1: you know, draping down from the entity. It is just
Speaker 1: unbelievable and they talk to you. Now. The most impressive
Speaker 1: example of a materialization medium, and I want to talk
Speaker 1: about him because there is no one else who's ever
Speaker 1: produced what he did is called Alec Harris. I think
Speaker 1: you know about it. I've read the book that was
Speaker 1: written by his wife, wife Louis Harris. Now you won't
Speaker 1: believe it, but my friend Mickey and Sarah, the ones
Speaker 1: we sat with, sat with Alec Harris and his wife.
Speaker 1: They had sittings with them, so I got firsthand accounts
Speaker 1: of what happened at those seances. So what you read
Speaker 1: in the book there because Alec Harris was born in
Speaker 1: Wales and he was giving demonstration in Wales. He in
Speaker 1: the beginning never believed it, but he was untold to
Speaker 1: go and sit in developmental circle or ship with his
Speaker 1: wife and he would then go into trance and produce
Speaker 1: these materializations. And the incredible thing about Alec Harris was
Speaker 1: he would produce from ten to thirty different materializations in
Speaker 1: one evening and they would come and out at the
Speaker 1: same time, but one at a time. You would sit
Speaker 1: behind the curtain, the black curtain, the materialization would form
Speaker 1: walk out all in red lights. Everybody could see it.
Speaker 1: Very often one of these materializations was a relative of
Speaker 1: one of the sitters in the circle. We were invited
Speaker 1: to come and sit. Do you imagine one of your
Speaker 1: relatives appearing there in front of you. It hasn't happened
Speaker 1: to me, but I know parents that have had their
Speaker 1: children talk to them from beyond the veil. Let's take
Speaker 1: our next break and when we come back, we'll find
Speaker 1: out more. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on
Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio and Coast to Coast AM paranormal
Speaker 1: podcast network. We are happy to announce that our Coast
Speaker 1: to Coast AM official YouTube channel has now reached over
Speaker 1: three hundred thousand subscribers. You can listen to the first
Speaker 1: hour of recent and past two shows for free, so
Speaker 1: head on over to the Coast to Coast a m
Speaker 1: dot com website and hit the YouTube icon at the
Speaker 1: top of the page. This is free show audio, so
Speaker 1: don't wait. Coast to Coast a m dot com is
Speaker 1: where you want to be. Welcome back to Shades of
Speaker 1: the Afterlife. I'm Sanders Champlain and we are here with
Speaker 1: Professor Jan vanders Andy talking about physical mediumship. Jan, you're
Speaker 1: talking about Alec Harris. People would come from all over,
Speaker 1: wouldn't they to sit with him. People would travel from
Speaker 1: all over England just try to get in and experience this.
Speaker 1: And these were just these are men, women, children. The
Speaker 1: one guy materialized missing a leg and his relatives said, yes,
Speaker 1: that's my brother. He lost his leg in the war
Speaker 1: in Singapore, Second World War in Singapore. And you know,
Speaker 1: they materialized like that. I believe even animals did the animals, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he one of David Thompson's sittings. But the little dog
Speaker 1: appeared and ran up and jumped up and sat in
Speaker 1: someone's lap. So Alec Harris. What happened is their son
Speaker 1: moved to South Africa back into the nineteen fifties and
Speaker 1: he got a job there and they moved to Jannisburg.
Speaker 1: And that's where they met Mickey and Sarah. Because Mickey
Speaker 1: and Sarah were sitting with Kitty and Max, so they
Speaker 1: were all mediums. So they all sat with each other regularly,
Speaker 1: cried often. So Mickey told me these stories about Alec,
Speaker 1: just like you're reading the book about all the sties
Speaker 1: have materialized. And one of the ones that Mickey told
Speaker 1: me the story his native American Indian materialized but very
Speaker 1: tall guy must Mickey said, he must have been six
Speaker 1: and a half tall, really big guy. And he stood
Speaker 1: there in front of everybody in red light and he
Speaker 1: said to Mickey Mickey, I am your guide, and I
Speaker 1: forgot the name. I am your guide. Please come up
Speaker 1: in front of me. So Mickey walked up and there
Speaker 1: is this entity in actoplasm in white talking to him
Speaker 1: with a head dress and Indian dressing, American Indian dress,
Speaker 1: and he said to Mickey, hit me on the chest.
Speaker 1: So Mickey said what he said, Yeah, hit me on
Speaker 1: the chest. So Mickey gently taps him on his chest
Speaker 1: and the guy says, I said, hit me on the chest.
Speaker 1: So Mickey hit him a little bit harder. The guide
Speaker 1: again said hit me hard. Somebody said okay. He took
Speaker 1: his head and hit him as hard as he could.
Speaker 1: Nothing happened, not a thing. The guy just took it totally.
Speaker 1: He said thank you, And Mickey was just dumbfound there
Speaker 1: he had his materialization, which comes from this ectoplasma pours
Speaker 1: out of someone's nose solidifies into an entity that walks
Speaker 1: around the room, but it is always still attached to
Speaker 1: the medium, so it is entered. Even though it walks,
Speaker 1: it is still attached with ectoplasm on the ground that
Speaker 1: is attached to the materialization is still attached out to
Speaker 1: the nose and the medium or the mouth. Sometimes it
Speaker 1: comes out of the years or the solar plexus, so
Speaker 1: they are still attached to the medium. Interesting, and that's
Speaker 1: why that photograph of my front cover of my book,
Speaker 1: you see all that ectoplasm next to the entity there
Speaker 1: that's then attached to the medium. So Mickey told me
Speaker 1: these stories. One of their stories they also told me
Speaker 1: was that the spirit entity sometimes they walk back into
Speaker 1: the cabinet, which as they call it, or behind the
Speaker 1: black curtain. But other times they would sink into the
Speaker 1: floor and disappear. Now you say to yourself, I don't
Speaker 1: believe that, but that he says, jan I saw it
Speaker 1: through my own eyes, and I think you read about
Speaker 1: it if you read Alex's book. He sinks into the ground,
Speaker 1: one of these entities and still talking, and he talks
Speaker 1: and talks and talks until his head is just sticking
Speaker 1: above the floor. You know, the only thing above the
Speaker 1: floor is head, and he's still talking and then his
Speaker 1: head disappears. Now your listeners are gonna say this is nonsense.
Speaker 1: It isn't. The reason I talked so convincingly about it
Speaker 1: because I've witnessed it myself, and I have talked to
Speaker 1: people who have seen these things, like Professor Allen, who
Speaker 1: sort of the medium, and Johannisburg who Mikia and Sarah
Speaker 1: who saught with Alec Harris. I saw the ectoplasm myself
Speaker 1: with Kitty and another experience which I just have to
Speaker 1: talk about these Christmas, the Christmas sittings. These are sittings
Speaker 1: of Mickey and Sarah advocause. Remember they were getting older.
Speaker 1: They were not producing full materializations. It's a bit sad
Speaker 1: of entities like Alec Harris would They weren't producing those
Speaker 1: kind of materializations. They were having the trumpet effect. We
Speaker 1: had people talk to us, lots of different guides, but
Speaker 1: they did produce materializations when we had Christmas sittings. They
Speaker 1: could just produce enough actoplasm. What happened at these Christmas
Speaker 1: sitting was ten sitters were invited. My wife and I
Speaker 1: were invited. Two or three years in a row and
Speaker 1: we had everybody was told to bring a wrapped gift,
Speaker 1: so we had a rapped gift. And my wife had
Speaker 1: bought a black doll because the gifts afterwards were given
Speaker 1: to African charities, so we bought this black doll. She
Speaker 1: bought wrapped it never told Sarah or anybody what was
Speaker 1: in it. And we had to put the gifts in
Speaker 1: the middle of the circle. So Sarah and Mickey were
Speaker 1: sitting behind the black curtain. The trumpet, you know, this
Speaker 1: little megaphone was standing up front, and in front of
Speaker 1: that we had lots of little toys that we had
Speaker 1: sitting in front of them, a little toy, drum, toy, whistle,
Speaker 1: a troy trumpet, a toy, some of these little toys
Speaker 1: that you would rub around and have sparks. And I
Speaker 1: forgot what they call those friction toys. There were some
Speaker 1: friction toys. They were all lying there and all the presents,
Speaker 1: who are about ten presents in the front there. So
Speaker 1: the lights are turned out and then firstly Brian comes out.
Speaker 1: Of course he talks to us through the voice box
Speaker 1: and he talks to us and he thinks, he says,
Speaker 1: look everybody, and welcomes them there, and he gets to
Speaker 1: my wife, Marlene, and he says, oh, hello, Marlene, thank
Speaker 1: you for the nice present. He says, you're going to
Speaker 1: have one of those next year, but it won't be
Speaker 1: that color. This was This was in December. My wife
Speaker 1: had our daughter in November next year, so she wasn't expecting.
Speaker 1: But he said to her, you're going to have one
Speaker 1: of these next year, but it won't be that color.
Speaker 1: Then your present was wrapped. The doll was actually totally wrapped,
Speaker 1: and of course dark and stark. No one knew what
Speaker 1: Marlene said, had said nothing to anybody. Is that incredible?
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what you call nice evidence. And so
Speaker 1: next November she had our daughter. Then Brian finishes talking
Speaker 1: to everybody. Okay, kids, he says, go ahead, and all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you hear this noise of all these
Speaker 1: presents being unwrapped, to hear all this paper being torn apart.
Speaker 1: We had no there was going on, you can imagine.
Speaker 1: And after a few minutes the boxes were open. These
Speaker 1: kids were playing with the toys. Then the little toys
Speaker 1: we put their little drums, the blistles. They were sort
Speaker 1: of playing all these toys they're playing with the drums,
Speaker 1: blowing the whistles, blowing the trumpets. There was a hell
Speaker 1: of a racket time at the same time, but there
Speaker 1: were there were numerous kids. Then they would walk around
Speaker 1: and pull on your pants. Like my wife had her
Speaker 1: hand laying hand out and they were a little hand
Speaker 1: would touch her hand. And they told us not to
Speaker 1: grab or do anything, but if they came and touched us,
Speaker 1: we we should just allow them. So we allowed them
Speaker 1: to touch us. By me, they were pulling on my pants.
Speaker 1: A few little hands pulling on your pants, and little
Speaker 1: hands will be touching everybody just and then we had
Speaker 1: the friction toys that were rubbing these friction toys for
Speaker 1: little sparks with a little things. You can actually see
Speaker 1: little materialization children there but for a fraction of a
Speaker 1: second while they were using these friction toys. So we
Speaker 1: experienced this, I mean we experienced this two or three
Speaker 1: years in a row. Incredible, an incredible experience. How can
Speaker 1: anybody all this fraud? Yeah? Well, jan One of the
Speaker 1: reasons I feel so like it's now time for me
Speaker 1: to talk about this is I was at one of
Speaker 1: these Christmas seances and that is exactly what happened. And
Speaker 1: it blew my mind. And what's important to know too
Speaker 1: is when I saw the medium was strapped down to
Speaker 1: a chair, everybody was searched before going in, just to
Speaker 1: really show this is not some fraudulent thing doing this.
Speaker 1: I mean, these mediums are very, very tested, and that's
Speaker 1: why it's like, we we've got to talk about this.
Speaker 1: We need to bring this into the world. And you know,
Speaker 1: one of the things, every time you say ectoplasm or seance,
Speaker 1: I cringe. And it's only because I've seen the Oustbusters movies,
Speaker 1: you know, with the green slime. Yeah. Yeah. And then
Speaker 1: you know, we remember in times of you know, in
Speaker 1: the books and the and the movies and things, hearing
Speaker 1: things about Houdini trying to reach his mother and they
Speaker 1: go to these seances, and it all sounds like a
Speaker 1: very creepy world, and it wasn't one that I wanted
Speaker 1: to really talk about because I didn't want people think
Speaker 1: I'm crazy. But it's not creepy. It's filled with love
Speaker 1: and fun and humor. Yeah, exactly. And what is the
Speaker 1: whole purpose. The whole purposes to show people here on
Speaker 1: earth that death is not the end, now that you're
Speaker 1: going to continue living. They're here to show and prove
Speaker 1: something to us. And a lot of times little children,
Speaker 1: you know, come out their parents to show them, hey,
Speaker 1: we're still alive. We're still here. Yeah, we're still here,
Speaker 1: and we're around you all the time. So it is
Speaker 1: a experience filled with love. But the fact that, like
Speaker 1: you experienced it, and you did it in England, I
Speaker 1: think you do what you told me. I experienced it
Speaker 1: in South Africa. Different continents, different times, but notice a
Speaker 1: very similar kind of experiences. These are phenomenal. This is
Speaker 1: not fraud. Anybody who says to me fraud. To give
Speaker 1: you a good example, when I was a professor at Cornell,
Speaker 1: this was back in the early nineteen eighties, they had
Speaker 1: invited Randy the Magician. I don't know if you ever
Speaker 1: heard of him. He's not retired. He used to be
Speaker 1: the big debunker of psychic phenomenon and he would go
Speaker 1: on TV shows and saying it's all nonsense. I can
Speaker 1: do whatever they can do. You know, this is Bologna.
Speaker 1: He was there the professor's department. They divided him. They
Speaker 1: said there was anybody there in the department who wanted
Speaker 1: to speak to him, and I said, yeah, sure, I
Speaker 1: did so I took my photographs with me and showed
Speaker 1: it to him at a private meeting with him. We
Speaker 1: had one look. He says, that's nonsense, that's fraud. I said, oh,
Speaker 1: can you do this? Oh of course I can. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'll tie you to a chair in the dark, and
Speaker 1: I'll tie you with straps and everything, and you produce this.
Speaker 1: Oh well, we'll see, we'll do it. So, you know,
Speaker 1: immediately backtracked as soon as I challenged him that I
Speaker 1: would tie him to a chair, all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, no, But well we'll think about it,
Speaker 1: you know. But he's out there because why he made
Speaker 1: a good living doing that. And then other people when
Speaker 1: they hear about this, anybody who listeners, who are going
Speaker 1: to hear about this, they're gonna say, wait a minute,
Speaker 1: this is not possible. It is. The photographs are there
Speaker 1: to prove it. And also that I have some book
Speaker 1: photographs in my book from Minnie Harrison. I don't know
Speaker 1: if you've heard a minute. Oh, I have the book.
Speaker 1: Tom Harrison's book had it. I know Tom. I've spoken
Speaker 1: to him. He had retired in Spain. He's not in
Speaker 1: the spirit world. Because I asked permission to use some
Speaker 1: of his photographs in my book. So we got to
Speaker 1: be very friendly, and he loved it. He asked me
Speaker 1: to send me my photographs, to send them because he
Speaker 1: he loved this to see others have the same experiences.
Speaker 1: It was his mother who produced full materializations in their
Speaker 1: room in their seances. So I asked some of those
Speaker 1: photographs in the book, and one of the times Tom
Speaker 1: told me it's in this book was what it was
Speaker 1: a medical doctor there and he measured the pulse of
Speaker 1: these materializations. They have a pulse. They talked to us
Speaker 1: and believe it or not, to have a pulse. They're warm,
Speaker 1: they have a pulse and it's like nothing I've ever
Speaker 1: experienced before. Jan we have to go into our last
Speaker 1: break and when we come back, we'll hear more. You're
Speaker 1: listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio and Coast Coast AM Paranormal podcast network. Okay, folks,
Speaker 1: we need your music. Hey, it's producer Tom at Coast
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Speaker 1: we play music from emerging artists just like you. If
Speaker 1: you're a musician or a singer and have recorded music,
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Speaker 1: That's Coast to Coast am dot com. Welcome back to
Speaker 1: Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sanders Champlain and we are
Speaker 1: here with physicist Jan vanders Andy talking about physical mediumship. Now,
Speaker 1: physical mediumship was really big back in the turn of
Speaker 1: the century and mid to late eighteen hundreds, very very
Speaker 1: rare today, but it does exist. So, Jan, you had
Speaker 1: mentioned David Thompson. David Thompson's an Australian medium and David
Speaker 1: was doing materializations. But David was not good enough to
Speaker 1: do them in the red light. David did him in
Speaker 1: the black in the park. So immediately people say it's fraud.
Speaker 1: People are so quick to criticize. David then gets strapped
Speaker 1: to a chair. Did you see David or did you
Speaker 1: see Scopa both? You know what? Then you saw David.
Speaker 1: You take David, you strapped into the chair with these
Speaker 1: ti plastic treat ties. They pulled him tightly around him.
Speaker 1: His legs get tied to the legs of the chair,
Speaker 1: his hands get tied to the arm rest of the chair.
Speaker 1: A scarf gets done through his mouth tied to that.
Speaker 1: So there he is totally tied to the chair. And
Speaker 1: we could actually go up and make sure he's strapped in,
Speaker 1: make sure his hands couldn't fit through those straps, make
Speaker 1: sure it wasn't a trick chair. I mean I checked
Speaker 1: it out exactly, and me, I was the one who
Speaker 1: organized the room where it was, so there was no
Speaker 1: nothing could have been hidden there because David came in,
Speaker 1: you know, that was it. He couldn't do anything not
Speaker 1: I mean, the room was totally organized by me. It
Speaker 1: was totally sealed, totally dark. Lights has turned off. And
Speaker 1: then as you know, his guide, William James, comes out.
Speaker 1: Now William, he walks in boots, so we had plywood
Speaker 1: on the ground so you could hear him step hard
Speaker 1: on the on the plywood, the boots he was wearing.
Speaker 1: David was wearing sneakers, and he walks around William touching
Speaker 1: everybody on the head with his big hand. Did happened
Speaker 1: to you, Sandra? It did? And it was a big,
Speaker 1: warm hand that I sell, wasn't it so? And I
Speaker 1: asked William, I said, William, do you have a pulse?
Speaker 1: So he grabbed my hand with his hand, he put
Speaker 1: it up to his neck and I could feel his
Speaker 1: pulse in his neck. Incredible. There he is standing right
Speaker 1: in front of me and we were talking, and he
Speaker 1: thanked me for David inviting, getting David to come out
Speaker 1: and um. And then he walks around talking to everybody
Speaker 1: and he talks about, hey, all we're doing here is
Speaker 1: to show to you that you live after you die.
Speaker 1: You're not gonna die. And yes you're gonna die. Your
Speaker 1: physical body is gonna leave you, but your spiritual body
Speaker 1: is going to go on. And that's where he came out.
Speaker 1: He know what he did, and that David does the
Speaker 1: same thing. He has trumpets, these trumpets flying around the room,
Speaker 1: and one of the sittings, I had two of my
Speaker 1: own trumpets that read my wife and I used. So
Speaker 1: there were three trumpets flying around the room at the
Speaker 1: same time. Now you tell me, and then people tell
Speaker 1: me it's fraud, I say, well, how the hell. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: he gets out of the bindings. He has night vision
Speaker 1: goggles and takes the trumpet and moves it around. And
Speaker 1: I said to that person, you ought to go to
Speaker 1: an insane asylum in case you have to experience it.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think you do, because it as great
Speaker 1: as it sounds that this would be reality. I mean it,
Speaker 1: it's scary for even myself to tell people about it
Speaker 1: because so many times we've been burned by things and
Speaker 1: by people. And I do think back in the day
Speaker 1: when physical mediumship was in his heyday, there were magicians
Speaker 1: that we're trying to pray on people absolutely, and they
Speaker 1: used to take these umpets and time with a string
Speaker 1: and wisdom around the year. But you could hear that
Speaker 1: if you listened closely, you can hear the wisdom. These
Speaker 1: trumpets fly around the room to the corners of this
Speaker 1: high speed and come and tap you on the head,
Speaker 1: on the knee, even if it's in the dark, and
Speaker 1: very gentle, very gentle, and they just have her thing
Speaker 1: since don't have her. But I think that's why this
Speaker 1: is so good that we're having this conversation. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: I mean, you and I have experienced it. But I
Speaker 1: have spoken to the people who sat with the greats
Speaker 1: in this field, you know, I've spoken to people who
Speaker 1: sat with Leslie Flynt with Alec Harris. I know the
Speaker 1: people who took the photographs. I've spoken to them and
Speaker 1: they swore blind. This professor of anatomy, is he gonna
Speaker 1: phony a photograph? I mean, you know, we became friends
Speaker 1: for twenty years. We were great friends. So when you've
Speaker 1: experienced all these things yourself and you know it, and
Speaker 1: you've spoken to the people, you've seen it with your
Speaker 1: own eyes. Like one thing, I gotta tell you about
Speaker 1: one of David's seances here the injury in l A,
Speaker 1: because I brought him back again two years later because
Speaker 1: there was so much demand for people to come and
Speaker 1: sit with them. But one of the seances here in
Speaker 1: the room we had this was in the hotel conference room.
Speaker 1: There were these plastic trees they have in the four corners.
Speaker 1: They're about six eight ft high in the pots that
Speaker 1: the thing must have weighed anyway from five to ten pounds.
Speaker 1: During the sitting, those five plants were taken from the
Speaker 1: corners and put right around me. So there I was
Speaker 1: sitting with those five trees right around me and little Timothy,
Speaker 1: who is a little guide of David's. You've heard Timothy.
Speaker 1: He was laughing like Alice's chan we put you in
Speaker 1: a forest and he's laughing like hell. And I had
Speaker 1: no idea what's going on until eventually after the seance
Speaker 1: lights would turned on and there these four trees, plants
Speaker 1: in these plastic trees were sitting next right around me
Speaker 1: my chair. Incredible, incredible. Plus also, David, as you know,
Speaker 1: in the sitting where you've probably had, they moved him
Speaker 1: tied in his chair to the center of the circle.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you had that they did, and
Speaker 1: how they could move the cabinet out far and his
Speaker 1: clothes was on backwards and his sweater was on backwards.
Speaker 1: But Voss was even more amazing. The circle came from
Speaker 1: the around the cabinet where he was sitting, so they
Speaker 1: didn't move him forward. They actually lifted him and put
Speaker 1: him on the back over the people behind the circle.
Speaker 1: We're dealing with energy here that we just don't know.
Speaker 1: And as physicist, any physicist who says we know all
Speaker 1: the laws of physics doesn't know what he's talking about.
Speaker 1: There are things happening here that we just don't understand. Yet,
Speaker 1: nothing scary happens, There's nothing I feel worse after leaving
Speaker 1: one of these seances. The only feeling I've had is
Speaker 1: when people tell me it's fraud and they, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's got nine vision goggles. I said, where do you have,
Speaker 1: oh Adam and his pants? Oh Jesus. You know, these
Speaker 1: are the kind of comments you get. Yeah, And there
Speaker 1: have been people that have been outed for being you know,
Speaker 1: that have been filmed on the thermal cameras, that have
Speaker 1: walked around the realm and have been holding the trumpet.
Speaker 1: You know. So, Sandra, you are unfortunately back in the
Speaker 1: late eight d early nineteen hundreds, when when spiritualism was
Speaker 1: really at its peak, there were so many frauds because
Speaker 1: there were so many gullible people who are willing to
Speaker 1: pay for it. And of course, when there's money involved,
Speaker 1: there's fraud involved. No matter what you talk about everything
Speaker 1: in life, if there's money involved, there's unfortunately fraud involved.
Speaker 1: And yes, there were a lot of fraudulent mediums. There
Speaker 1: were fraudulent people who took advantage of beriefed people, and
Speaker 1: there's lots of people out there. Yeah, and you are correct,
Speaker 1: and you read the literature, but then you have to know.
Speaker 1: That's why in my book, the evidence I present is
Speaker 1: from the horses I believe accurate and for mediums who
Speaker 1: have never ever been proven to be fraudulent. So as
Speaker 1: a reminder, Jan vanders Andy's book is called Life After
Speaker 1: Death Some of the Best Evidence. Also another book I
Speaker 1: highly highly highly recommend. It's called Alec Harris, the full
Speaker 1: story of his remarkable physical mediumship by his wife and
Speaker 1: her name is Louis Harris. Best book that I have
Speaker 1: read so far, and you can read it on kindle
Speaker 1: if you can't get a hard copy. I haven't brought
Speaker 1: up physical mediumship too much as far as my experiences,
Speaker 1: because the truth is it does sound kind of weird,
Speaker 1: and even to me, I had to make a three
Speaker 1: thousand mile trip just to discover it for myself. I
Speaker 1: took a five day workshop with two seances, tons of information,
Speaker 1: food and beverage included, and hotel room for it was
Speaker 1: less than five dollars, So that is not somebody who's
Speaker 1: trying to trick me. One of the great mediums I
Speaker 1: saw is Scott Milligan. You've heard me talk about him
Speaker 1: in the show. You've also heard some of his trances speaking.
Speaker 1: He is also a physical medium. I used to hate
Speaker 1: Christmas and the holidays because my parents divorced when I
Speaker 1: was fourteen years old. My seance with Scott Milligan was
Speaker 1: much like jam Vanders. Andy talked about a group of
Speaker 1: people sitting in a circle. There was a Christmas tree
Speaker 1: in the center with lots of toys that were wrapped,
Speaker 1: and at one point it was as if the room
Speaker 1: was filled with children. All the presents were unwrapped at
Speaker 1: the very same time and things started flying around the room.
Speaker 1: Everything was being played with at once. But what makes
Speaker 1: Scott Milligan's physical mediumship the most exceptional to me is
Speaker 1: that loved ones come through and speak to their family members.
Speaker 1: I have witnessed many children talk to their parents again,
Speaker 1: Husbands speak to their wives and vice versa, detailed messages
Speaker 1: as if they were alive. Because they are. Somehow they
Speaker 1: are able to step into this ectoplasmic robe and become
Speaker 1: real again. I've even witnessed children's fingers touching my fingers.
Speaker 1: The experience is priceless. It's not anything I would dream
Speaker 1: of trying to convince you of in a radio show.
Speaker 1: But in the future, when the world gets a little
Speaker 1: safer to travel again, we will be holding some more
Speaker 1: We don't die. Conferences around the world and you can
Speaker 1: meet Carrie and phil Son. Youre a Naldi, sit with
Speaker 1: Scott Milligan and have the six variance for yourself. There's
Speaker 1: nothing like it to go from a hope of the afterlife,
Speaker 1: to a faith, to a belief, to absolutely knowing it's real.
Speaker 1: There's nothing quite like it. As we close this show today,
Speaker 1: I want you to just look around you. You may
Speaker 1: feel alone, but in the invisible space around you, you
Speaker 1: have the biggest group of cheerleaders wanting you to have
Speaker 1: the best life possible. They're they're trying to wipe your tears.
Speaker 1: They're they're celebrating the good times. That moment you close
Speaker 1: your eyes for the very last time here on Earth,
Speaker 1: you will open them and be reunited with them. That
Speaker 1: I promise. So I want to remind you our home
Speaker 1: base is we Don't Die dot com. If you join
Speaker 1: our email list at the bottom of the page, you
Speaker 1: get a free copy of my book, We Don't Die.
Speaker 1: If you'd rather hear the audio book, go over to
Speaker 1: the store, find the audio book and use coupon code
Speaker 1: free f R. Also join us for Sunday gathering. We
Speaker 1: have mediumship demonstrations coming up and all kinds of good things.
Speaker 1: I want to thank you from the bottom of my
Speaker 1: heart for listening. My name is Sandra Champlain. I'm your
Speaker 1: host on Shades of the Afterlife right here on the
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 1: And if you like this episode of Shades of the Afterlife,
Speaker 1: wait until you hear the next one. Thank you for
Speaker 1: listening to the Heart Radio and Coast to Coast a
Speaker 1: m paranormal podcast Network.