WEBVTT - PRETTY VULNERABLE: Karamo on Vulnerability and Betting on Yourself. 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:02.640 The following podcast is a dear media production. 0:00:06.160 --> 0:00:10.240 Big things happen when you're pretty, pretty bold, pretty clever, 0:00:10.920 --> 0:00:14.480 pretty strong. I'm Danielle Robe and each week my guests 0:00:14.480 --> 0:00:17.760 and I have conversations that put a new spin on pretty. 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:26.560 This is pretty smart. Vulnerability What a loaded word nowadays? 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:28.080 What is it? Really? 0:00:29.080 --> 0:00:35.400 Simply uncertainty, risk, and emotional exposure to show up and 0:00:35.479 --> 0:00:39.559 be seen even when there are no guarantees. It's a 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:43.360 first date after a breakup or divorce. It's starting a business, 0:00:43.920 --> 0:00:47.199 taking responsibility of something we did wrong at work. It's 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:50.080 being next to a loved one that's sick. It's our 0:00:50.120 --> 0:00:53.640 greatest measure of courage. And that's not a philosophy I 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:57.560 made up. Researcher Brene Brown collected thirteen thousand pieces of 0:00:57.640 --> 0:01:01.000 data over twelve years and could not find a single 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:06.120 incident or story of courage that wasn't completely underpinned by vulnerability. 0:01:07.160 --> 0:01:11.600 And that brings me to our guest today, Caroamo Brown Karamo. 0:01:12.240 --> 0:01:14.720 He's known as a TV host, one of Queer Eyes 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:19.240 Fab five, an author and activist. To me, he's the 0:01:19.240 --> 0:01:23.000 most comfortably vulnerable person I've ever known. I met Karamo 0:01:23.160 --> 0:01:26.400 years ago and thought he had always been an old soul, 0:01:27.040 --> 0:01:29.480 but then I read his book and I was shocked. 0:01:30.080 --> 0:01:34.319 He's been through really heartbreaking moments, harrowing struggles with drugs, 0:01:34.319 --> 0:01:38.320 domestic violence, lack of self love, and he constantly talks 0:01:38.360 --> 0:01:42.240 about them all now openly with grace and even positivity. 0:01:43.160 --> 0:01:47.920 That kind of rawness seems both terrifying and liberating. So 0:01:47.960 --> 0:01:50.400 I'm dying to know how did he get to this 0:01:50.520 --> 0:01:55.800 place where he can so easily be pretty vulnerable. So, Karamo, 0:01:55.880 --> 0:01:58.360 there's this quote of yours that I love so much. 0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:00.680 You say, when people hear my story, my hope is 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:02.920 always that they start to believe that the life they 0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:05.680 want is possible for them, because I'm living the life 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:09.200 I've always dreamed. In our country, being from immigrant parents, 0:02:09.240 --> 0:02:11.840 growing up black in the South, coming out at sixteen 0:02:11.919 --> 0:02:14.480 years old, being a teen parent, you would assume that 0:02:14.520 --> 0:02:17.400 my life would amount to nothing, And here I stand today. 0:02:17.840 --> 0:02:21.200 So if I can do it, you can too. Gives 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:23.000 me chills every time I read it, and I've read 0:02:23.000 --> 0:02:23.839 it I wrote it. 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:28.680 I appreciate that, but it's real, though. You know, we 0:02:28.720 --> 0:02:32.160 can get these narratives in our head that the circumstances 0:02:32.200 --> 0:02:34.840 that have happened to us, are going to block us 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:37.080 and stop us from having the life we deserve. And 0:02:37.160 --> 0:02:40.200 I literally realized maybe about twenty three that I had 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:43.040 to throw all those narratives out, throw all of those 0:02:43.040 --> 0:02:45.440 statistics that you see on the news when they talk 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:48.840 about teen parents, about immigrants, about gay people. I had 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:50.400 to throw all of that out and say, what. 0:02:50.320 --> 0:02:51.080 Do I believe? 0:02:51.400 --> 0:02:53.160 What do I believe I'm going to get? What do 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:56.120 I believe that I deserve? And then that's where you 0:02:56.160 --> 0:02:59.160 start to take small steps every day you start to 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:01.880 ask for help, you just keep going. And that's why 0:03:01.919 --> 0:03:04.359 I constantly tell people, if I can make it through 0:03:04.400 --> 0:03:07.000 all those things you just said, trust me, you have 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:09.120 the ability to get to where you deserve. 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:12.799 So I've never known someone so comfortable with vulnerability. I'm 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:15.440 kind of obsessed with how you've gone about healing and 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:18.040 finding so much love for yourself. But I feel like 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:20.760 I can't fully understand the growth without going back a 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:23.080 little bit. Can we go all the way back to Florida? 0:03:23.160 --> 0:03:26.280 You grew up with Jamaican and Cuban parents. What was 0:03:26.320 --> 0:03:27.360 little Karamo like? 0:03:29.000 --> 0:03:31.560 He was? He was a bit shy, to be honest. 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:34.880 He felt like he had to be an overachiever, and 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:39.560 so that overachiever sort of countered the shyness because I 0:03:39.760 --> 0:03:42.160 was always like, okay, well I have to put myself 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:45.280 out in this way because you know, having parents who 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:48.000 are from another country who struggled to get here. It 0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:49.960 was like no, no, no, we got here, so you. 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:51.280 Have to get a's, you have to be involved. 0:03:51.280 --> 0:03:54.000 It's all, you know, all that stuff. But it was 0:03:54.040 --> 0:03:57.440 like forcing against me being shy, and so I wish 0:03:57.440 --> 0:03:59.640 I was like the fun kid, but I was probably 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:02.880 like the scared kid if I think back on it, truly, 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:06.080 that was more of an introvert. Now I think back 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:07.880 about it, I'm glad. You know, I love myself as 0:04:07.880 --> 0:04:10.160 a younger me. But I'm like, I wasn't that person 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:11.880 who went out to a lot of parties or did it, 0:04:12.080 --> 0:04:14.640 like got invited to stuff. I had one best friend 0:04:14.640 --> 0:04:16.960 and that's who I spent the night over. You know, 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:18.920 I wasn't like the uber cool kid. 0:04:19.200 --> 0:04:22.159 It's funny you say that, because anytime I've ever been 0:04:22.200 --> 0:04:23.760 with you, you are the life of the party. 0:04:23.760 --> 0:04:26.680 I cannot even imagine that. When did that shift for you? 0:04:28.480 --> 0:04:31.240 I think it shifted around high school, to be very 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:33.680 honest with you because my parents got divorced when I 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:37.280 was fifteen, and I moved to Florida from Texas to 0:04:37.320 --> 0:04:40.200 live with my father. And this school I went to 0:04:40.240 --> 0:04:42.120 is Marjorie Stowe in Douglas, which we all know from 0:04:42.160 --> 0:04:46.159 February fourteen, twenty seventeen, the school that was shot in Parkland, Florida. 0:04:46.240 --> 0:04:48.760 That was my school, and once I got there, it's 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:51.880 predominantly white school. I walked in and I was six 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:54.359 two and a half six street my same height, same 0:04:54.360 --> 0:04:57.359 bodybuild I have. Now I had a gold tee and 0:04:57.400 --> 0:04:59.600 so I walked into school and everybody was like, Oh 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:03.839 my god, who's this, Like, you know, college guy walking ahead, 0:05:03.839 --> 0:05:05.320 you know what I mean. So all of a sudden, 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:09.000 I felt like. I felt attractive. I felt cool because 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:11.760 I had had a growth spurt bigger than everyone. I 0:05:11.800 --> 0:05:14.360 looked like a man, and so all the guys wanted 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:16.400 to be friends, and all the girls thought I was cute, 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:18.640 and I just, you know, I felt like and I 0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:21.000 think back when it shifted, I realized there was a 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:24.560 power in me owning my self esteem growing. And I 0:05:24.600 --> 0:05:27.159 say that in that way because some people own it 0:05:27.279 --> 0:05:30.320 and it turns into an ego I owned it as Okay, 0:05:30.360 --> 0:05:32.919 this is something that I have that doesn't define me, 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:35.440 but it's allowing me to break out of my shell 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:37.760 and connect with other people. So I think it's shifted 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:38.240 about them. 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:41.320 I love that you talk about that, because my next 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:45.000 question for you was how did your good looks play 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:47.800 into your desire to be in the spotlight, because I 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:51.560 feel like you've always sort of gone after this big life. 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:53.640 I appreciate that. I know you thought I was fine. 0:05:53.680 --> 0:05:54.440 I appreciate that. 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:56.479 Have I never told you that. 0:05:57.839 --> 0:05:58.479 I appreciate it. 0:05:58.480 --> 0:06:01.680 You gorgeous too, making me read you're the side. 0:06:04.240 --> 0:06:06.360 I mean, you know, one of the things that I 0:06:06.400 --> 0:06:10.560 do think is unfair about our industry is that we 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:13.559 I think it's unfair about the world. We give certain 0:06:13.600 --> 0:06:18.040 benefits to people who other people construe us attractive. And 0:06:18.400 --> 0:06:20.839 it's sad because I felt it on both sides to 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:24.080 some degree. Where when I got into Hollywood, and I'm 0:06:24.120 --> 0:06:26.640 going to fast forward just a little bit, I remember 0:06:26.680 --> 0:06:29.320 them telling me immediately like, my nose is too big. 0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:31.040 I remember I went to a mallling agency and they 0:06:31.040 --> 0:06:33.080 were like, your nose is too big. You need to 0:06:33.160 --> 0:06:36.640 lighten up your skin. I had, Oh my gosh, Oh 0:06:36.680 --> 0:06:38.320 my gosh, I know you've heard this stuff too, Like 0:06:38.320 --> 0:06:39.839 we've been friends for a long time, and you know, 0:06:39.880 --> 0:06:41.720 I'm sure people have said like little slight shit to 0:06:41.760 --> 0:06:44.520 you about like your body or anything, and you you're 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:47.440 a beautiful woman, but everyone has an opinion of what 0:06:47.560 --> 0:06:51.120 you should look like. And so because of that, I 0:06:51.320 --> 0:06:54.720 never had the opportunity to really fall into that space 0:06:54.760 --> 0:06:56.920 where I thought that I was the most attractive or 0:06:56.920 --> 0:06:59.520 beautiful person on any cast I've ever been on. I 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:02.719 have never been considered the attractive one. And that's just 0:07:02.760 --> 0:07:06.520 the real of it, the real world never I'm talking about, 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:08.200 And it's not me saying this is about like the 0:07:08.279 --> 0:07:10.600 press and what people and the fans say, Like even 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:11.160 on Queer Eye. 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:13.000 You know, I don't I don't care what I have on. 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:15.440 I'm not the attractive one. On the past, people will 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:16.840 say to me, you're the sweet one I want to 0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:18.520 get to know, You're the one I want to talk to. 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:21.200 And I don't mind it because I'm not. I'm not 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:25.960 someone who needs that type of validation. But I realize, yes. 0:07:26.320 --> 0:07:29.840 I am shot you're the hot one on Oh thank you. 0:07:29.920 --> 0:07:32.320 I appreciate it. I think I think I appreciate that, 0:07:32.360 --> 0:07:34.880 and I'll receive it. But I think that our hot 0:07:34.920 --> 0:07:36.840 one is hot, you know, And I think that when 0:07:36.840 --> 0:07:38.760 you and I think about it, we all have such 0:07:38.840 --> 0:07:41.760 beauty and I just wish that we could all, you know, 0:07:41.840 --> 0:07:43.560 see the beauty. But like you know, we have these 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:46.120 lists People's most beautiful man, you know what I mean. 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:48.600 It took years for someone you know, of color to 0:07:48.600 --> 0:07:50.440 get on it. It took years for I don't think we 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:53.480 still had an Asian People's most Beautiful person yet, you 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:55.240 know what I mean. These type of things are crazy 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:57.480 to me because those standards can make you think that 0:07:57.520 --> 0:08:00.760 you're not attractive. And so I do try to understand 0:08:00.840 --> 0:08:03.800 the privilege that I have with being tall, with looking 0:08:03.800 --> 0:08:06.080 a certain way, but I don't let it get to 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:08.960 me because I know it's so subjective and that tomorrow 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:10.400 someone's going to look at me and be like, h 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:12.320 he's not that, because I've had. 0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:13.040 That before, you know. 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:15.720 Yeah, And you really do play so much importance in 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:18.120 your soul. It like emanates when you walk. 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:21.440 You don't lead with those beautiful eyes or those muscles, 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:22.320 you lead with your soul. 0:08:22.360 --> 0:08:23.360 It's special. 0:08:23.600 --> 0:08:26.280 Oh, thank you, love. I appreciate that. I try. I try. 0:08:26.440 --> 0:08:29.360 I ain't perfect girl, No one is. 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:32.560 Did you have a desire for fame in high school? 0:08:33.480 --> 0:08:35.600 I did, If I can be honest with you, I 0:08:35.600 --> 0:08:37.640 had a desire of fame because when you grow up 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:40.199 that lonely kid, when you grow up in a broken household, 0:08:40.720 --> 0:08:42.960 you think that fame is going to heal you. You 0:08:43.000 --> 0:08:44.760 think that fame is going to make the world see 0:08:44.800 --> 0:08:48.440 you and give you some sort of validation. And after 0:08:48.600 --> 0:08:50.960 being on MTV's Real World in two thousand and four, 0:08:51.200 --> 0:08:54.480 I quickly realized that fame doesn't heal those parts of you. 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:57.120 That it's your job to heal the parts of you 0:08:57.240 --> 0:09:00.240 that you think are unworthy. It's your job to look 0:09:00.280 --> 0:09:02.920 at yourself in the mirror and know that the experiences 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:04.800 that you went through are only going to make you 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:07.360 stronger or lessons you needed, because fame. 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:08.320 Won't do that for you, you know. 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:10.840 Like I tell people now, I'm so blessed and thankful 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:13.360 the career that I have. I work hard for it. 0:09:13.800 --> 0:09:16.040 But I'm not interested in fame. I'm interested in money. 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:19.040 I don't say that like I'm interested in money and 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.920 like how like some people are like money rules everything, 0:09:22.080 --> 0:09:24.440 not like that. I'm more so in it, like, Okay, 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:25.760 this is a job. I want to get paid, and 0:09:25.760 --> 0:09:27.800 I want to be able to create generational wealth for 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:30.240 my family, for my kids. I want to take us 0:09:30.240 --> 0:09:32.360 out of the cycle we've been in. You know, But 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.520 I don't look for fame, because the minute you start 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:39.880 putting yourself esteem on fame, baby, oh you know this, like, 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:41.960 people will go on social media and tear you down. 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:44.920 You know, people will tear you down immediately. And fame 0:09:45.160 --> 0:09:47.280 has a beautiful side and ugly side, and I don't 0:09:47.280 --> 0:09:49.440 want either of those sides. I just want to continue 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:51.840 to work and keep doing what I can do that 0:09:51.920 --> 0:09:53.600 makes me happy and makes other people happy. 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.320 To get to that point requires so much growth. 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:59.600 Have you kind of figured out the piece of you 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:01.320 that was hurting in high school? 0:10:01.360 --> 0:10:03.000 Have you been able to pinpoint. 0:10:02.520 --> 0:10:06.120 That, Oh my gosh, yes for me. And this is 0:10:06.200 --> 0:10:08.520 an exercise that I tell people to do all the time, 0:10:09.040 --> 0:10:11.800 is to really go back and use your notes, to 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:15.160 use a journal and think about the moments in your 0:10:15.400 --> 0:10:19.679 childhood that made you sad, made you feel confused, that 0:10:19.720 --> 0:10:22.680 made you feel unsure about your place in the world. 0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:24.560 And we can all have we all have the power 0:10:24.600 --> 0:10:27.480 to reflect and when you reflect, you get so much clarity, 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:30.680 and for me, I realized there was something very critical, 0:10:30.960 --> 0:10:34.440 which was I'm my father's only son, I have four sisters, 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:37.120 I'm the baby. And my father used to tell me 0:10:37.120 --> 0:10:39.720 every single day, I was a champion. I was his world. 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:42.280 He loved me. I was the most extraordinary person he 0:10:42.280 --> 0:10:43.840 had ever met. These are the things that my father 0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:46.640 would tell me every day. And then when I said, 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:48.640 when I let him into my life and told him 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:51.760 that I identify as gay, he stopped talking to me. 0:10:52.400 --> 0:10:56.679 And I realized, after work of reflection, you know, speaking 0:10:56.679 --> 0:11:00.480 to people being vulnerable, that that moment was so critical 0:11:00.480 --> 0:11:03.120 of my life that it caused me to not trust love. 0:11:03.280 --> 0:11:06.080 It caused me not to trust what people say about me. 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:09.240 And so that desire to be famous that I had 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:13.600 early on came from a need to fill that void 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:16.880 of like, Okay, if I can become famous, then people 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:19.360 will love me, and I can trust their love. And 0:11:19.520 --> 0:11:22.400 I realized immediately that what I was seeking was the 0:11:22.440 --> 0:11:26.120 same vapid validation that I've gotten from my father. I 0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:28.680 was seeking, you know, something that was flighty, that could 0:11:28.760 --> 0:11:30.920 just go away. And I had to realize that in 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:33.120 that moment, that what I needed when I was that 0:11:33.240 --> 0:11:35.200 small kid and he stopped talking to me, What I 0:11:35.240 --> 0:11:36.960 needed in that moment was to look at myself and 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:39.000 tell myself I still love me, and I didn't have 0:11:39.000 --> 0:11:40.679 the language to do that. I had. You know, we're 0:11:40.720 --> 0:11:42.640 in a space now where we talk about mental health 0:11:42.679 --> 0:11:45.360 and you know, self esteem and new way, But when 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:47.600 I was in high school, we weren't talking like that. 0:11:47.720 --> 0:11:50.640 And so instead of turning into myself and saying I 0:11:50.679 --> 0:11:53.200 love me, I love me and practicing that every day, 0:11:53.600 --> 0:11:56.600 I practiced the opposite of saying you're not worthy of love, 0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:58.600 You're not going to get it, you can't trust people's love. 0:11:59.120 --> 0:12:01.400 And it affected every relationship I had. It affected how 0:12:01.400 --> 0:12:03.800 I moved through this world. And once I started to 0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:07.080 let that go and realize that him not loving me 0:12:07.120 --> 0:12:10.000 anymore didn't mean that I couldn't love myself more than 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:12.040 things started to change. And so that was the critical 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:12.600 moment for me. 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:16.800 I wish I could hug little you. It was like, really. 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:18.880 Sad, I wanted me to go back and hug little loss. 0:12:19.040 --> 0:12:20.839 I guess you're right, I wish I could hug little 0:12:20.840 --> 0:12:24.000 me too. Yeah, that's a good point. When I read 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.200 your book. I was so shocked by some of the 0:12:26.280 --> 0:12:29.040 things that I didn't know about you. After knowing you 0:12:29.120 --> 0:12:31.840 for all these years, I didn't know that you were 0:12:31.880 --> 0:12:33.360 in an abusive relationship. 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:36.120 Yeah, I was, and I was the abuser. 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.320 And I talk about it openly, in candidly because when 0:12:40.360 --> 0:12:42.440 people see me and they you know, they see me 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:45.320 on television, people who know me, they think like, I'm 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:48.880 you know, like all you know, like spiritual and always 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:50.560 like whatever. And there was a time in my life 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:52.720 that I wasn't. I was filled with so much anger 0:12:53.160 --> 0:12:55.760 in my in my household, my father beat my mother. 0:12:55.960 --> 0:12:57.520 You know, that was the reason they got divorced, because 0:12:57.520 --> 0:12:59.360 he was a cheat and he would hit her. And 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:01.360 you know, one of the things my father used to 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:03.920 say to me was don't ever hit a woman. But 0:13:04.160 --> 0:13:06.559 he was speaking to a young man, which first of 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:09.240 all was contradictory because I'm watching his behavior. But he 0:13:09.280 --> 0:13:11.400 was also speaking to a young man who was dating men. 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:14.079 So he's giving me this advice of like, don't hit women, 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:17.560 But what about when there's two men in a relationship. 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:21.000 How do I process that? And in my mind, not 0:13:21.040 --> 0:13:23.360 knowing any better, I processed it the same way most 0:13:23.520 --> 0:13:26.839 young men who subscribed to toxic Behaviors processed it. It 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:29.600 was like, Okay, I can't hit a woman, but two 0:13:29.640 --> 0:13:32.520 men we can fight. And so anytime I had anger 0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:35.040 in a relationship where we weren't coming to some resolution, 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:37.960 I got physical very quickly, because that's what we were 0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:39.559 taught on the playground, That's what I was taught on 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:41.960 the football field. That's what I was always taught, which 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:44.360 was to fight back. That makes me more of a 0:13:44.400 --> 0:13:47.199 man if you can stand up. And I got really abusive, 0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:50.960 and I remember the stopping point for me of wanting 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:54.120 not wanting to be abusive anymore was I had just 0:13:54.360 --> 0:13:57.720 finished into a fight with my boyfriend. At that time, 0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.160 he was bleeding and I made him clean up the 0:14:00.200 --> 0:14:03.600 blood off the ground. And I say this not because 0:14:03.640 --> 0:14:05.280 I'm proud of this moment. It's because there was a 0:14:05.320 --> 0:14:07.320 Poe moment that I need to reflect on and hopefully 0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:11.000 the other people can learn from. Is he called the police, 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:13.400 and I arrogantly waited at the door for the police 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:15.880 because I knew the police hadn't been trained on how 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:18.400 to deal with same sex couples, which is still true today. 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:21.720 Most first responders don't know how to intervene in same 0:14:21.720 --> 0:14:23.480 sex couples. So if he was a woman, they would 0:14:23.520 --> 0:14:25.440 have taken me to jail. But because I was a man, 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:28.800 these two police officers, both men, laughed it off and said, 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:30.680 you two figure it out. And I remember I went 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:33.080 back in the house and I looked at him and 0:14:33.120 --> 0:14:36.160 I saw my mom. I literally saw my mother's face, 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:39.640 and not her face physically obviously, but like the way 0:14:39.680 --> 0:14:41.520 that she looked at my dad after he did this, 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:44.120 like sort of like with sorrow and with sort of 0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:46.400 like pain and like and I just saw it and 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:49.000 I ran to the room and I was like, you're him. 0:14:49.200 --> 0:14:53.640 You're becoming him. You're not knowing how to manage your feelings, 0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:56.760 You're becoming this man. And it was very hard for me. 0:14:57.200 --> 0:14:59.840 I got really depressed after that, and then I had 0:14:59.840 --> 0:15:02.360 to say to myself, I need to leave, because you know, 0:15:02.400 --> 0:15:04.640 sometimes when people in abusive relationships, we always put this 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:07.760 onus on the person who's being abused of asking them 0:15:07.760 --> 0:15:08.720 why didn't you leave? 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:09.240 You know? 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:12.120 And I had to. I realized that I had put 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.200 sort of manipulated my boyfriend into feeling like this was 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:18.160 okay behavior, that I had done so much damage to 0:15:18.200 --> 0:15:20.760 his self esteem that of course he wasn't going to leave. 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:23.440 You know, I had made him feel inferior in so 0:15:23.440 --> 0:15:26.520 many ways, and I realized that I had to leave. 0:15:26.640 --> 0:15:28.800 I had to stop this behavior. I realized it was 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:32.760 up to me to release him, to release myself of 0:15:32.840 --> 0:15:37.280 this behavior, to do the work. And that's that's when 0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:40.280 life got better. And luckily that stopped at twenty six 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:42.840 for me, right before I became a father, because I 0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:44.960 couldn't imagine if I still had those anger issues when 0:15:44.960 --> 0:15:47.120 I became a dad, because I would have probably hit 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:49.200 my children, and so it was a dark time. But 0:15:49.280 --> 0:15:51.640 also I talk about it now because I don't think 0:15:51.680 --> 0:15:55.040 we talk about domestic violence enough. We don't talk about 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:57.680 enough with same sex couples. I think it needs to 0:15:57.680 --> 0:15:59.480 be discussed for I agree. 0:15:59.160 --> 0:16:01.400 And I hope you feel okay that I brought it up. 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:03.640 I only brought it up honestly because. 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:05.520 Oh oh no, I feel okay. I love that you 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:06.040 brought it up. 0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:10.160 Bring it up with you you are, But I brought 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:13.280 it up because of exactly what you said. I'm sort 0:16:13.280 --> 0:16:16.920 of in awe, especially after reading your book, as to 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:21.040 how that person became this person. Yeah, it takes so 0:16:21.200 --> 0:16:24.800 much internal strength and self awareness and work. And I 0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:30.240 think anybody who's in real pain oftentimes feels like there 0:16:30.320 --> 0:16:32.640 is no out, there is no getting to the other 0:16:32.720 --> 0:16:34.360 side to it. So to hear you talk about it 0:16:34.400 --> 0:16:36.280 so candidly, I think is really inspiring. 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:37.880 Thank you. I appreciate that. 0:16:38.200 --> 0:16:40.480 But you know, it's what you said before and what 0:16:40.520 --> 0:16:42.200 I love about you as well, because every time we 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:45.480 have our little catchups, we're both vulnerable each other. And 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:48.560 for me, what got me here was the first thing 0:16:48.560 --> 0:16:50.840 I had to realize is that I was in pain. 0:16:51.480 --> 0:16:54.200 I was in pain. I was hurting, and everything I 0:16:54.240 --> 0:16:57.240 did and every way I reacted was because I was hurting. 0:16:57.800 --> 0:17:00.280 Then I took an inventory of the people I love 0:17:00.320 --> 0:17:02.720 in my life and asked them to tell me candidly 0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:05.720 how they see me. And that's something that we don't 0:17:05.760 --> 0:17:08.800 do often because we don't want to hear people's opinions 0:17:08.800 --> 0:17:10.639 of us, you know, we especially if we think it's. 0:17:10.480 --> 0:17:11.040 Going to be bad. 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.480 And so I literally went around to people and said, so, 0:17:14.480 --> 0:17:16.640 what do you see me as And people would be like, oh, 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:18.760 you're you know, you're sweet, we love hanging around you, 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:20.480 but you're you're a bit of an asshole. You're a 0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:24.359 bit of this. Really they want honest because I believe 0:17:24.400 --> 0:17:26.440 we all have our tribe that you can really take 0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:28.800 inventory from. That's going to be real with you, you 0:17:28.840 --> 0:17:30.520 know what I mean? Who will tell you what they see? 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:32.560 You know. I wasn't asking people who I knew were 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:35.200 fly by friends, you know. I was asking like my 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:38.800 best friends of you know, fifteen years, sixteen years, eighteen years. 0:17:38.960 --> 0:17:41.520 I was asking my sister, I was asking. I asked, 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:43.800 and I asked two of my ex boyfriends during that time. 0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:45.879 I was like, what was I like as a boyfriend, 0:17:46.040 --> 0:17:47.639 and you know, they just let me know. And I 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:50.720 was like, oh my gosh, I'm writing down what they said, 0:17:50.720 --> 0:17:52.800 and I'm seeing consistence on the negative side and not 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:55.199 enough on the positive side. And I realized that the 0:17:55.200 --> 0:17:57.040 negative was happening because I was in pain and I 0:17:57.080 --> 0:17:59.520 was trying to make people feel what I was feeling 0:17:59.520 --> 0:18:01.920 because I didn't how a process. And that took day 0:18:01.960 --> 0:18:04.440 after day of journey, you know. And I tell people 0:18:04.440 --> 0:18:06.480 all the time, the same way you can knock your 0:18:06.480 --> 0:18:10.280 self esteem down, because if you practice saying bad things 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:11.719 to yourself every day, it's the same way you can 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:14.400 change your life and just build your self esteem back up. 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:17.280 You know, I had to say, Okay, I don't want 0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:19.919 to be this way. I reflect in the moment. It 0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:23.120 took a lot of daily work, but I was patient 0:18:23.160 --> 0:18:25.160 with myself and that was the key thing. 0:18:25.480 --> 0:18:29.080 So in that journey of self forgiveness, what was going 0:18:29.119 --> 0:18:31.280 on is like, what did you have to actually forgive? 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:35.360 Because this manifested not just abusive relationships, but you dealt 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:38.679 with a cocaine addiction. I it was really sad to 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:40.320 read in two thousand and six you tried to take 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:44.600 your own life. I mean like this got pretty dark. Yeah, 0:18:44.640 --> 0:18:46.000 what did you have to forgive? 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:50.720 I first had to forgive myself for the things that 0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:53.120 I did wrong because I knew I did a lot 0:18:53.119 --> 0:18:56.359 of wrong and I had to forgive myself and that's 0:18:56.359 --> 0:18:59.600 hard for people to do. It's easier said than done. Yeah, 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:02.080 as you end up still, you know, I call them 0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:04.159 cringe moments now where I'm in the in bed at 0:19:04.280 --> 0:19:06.080 nighttime in a memory will pop up my head and 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:06.920 I'll cringe and be. 0:19:06.960 --> 0:19:09.080 Likeugh, did I really do that? Oh? 0:19:09.320 --> 0:19:12.359 You know, like and that still happens when those moments happened, 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:14.560 where I cringe on something that I did in my past. 0:19:15.119 --> 0:19:16.760 I have to forgive myself and say, you know what 0:19:16.840 --> 0:19:18.679 you did it, you did you did it with the 0:19:18.680 --> 0:19:24.399 best knowledge that you had at that time. Oh my gosh, 0:19:24.440 --> 0:19:25.920 I love that. You know. It's like one of those 0:19:25.920 --> 0:19:27.720 things where it's just like I had to forgive myself 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:30.600 in a moment. And then once I forgave myself, I 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:34.719 had to then go and seek out help. And that 0:19:34.840 --> 0:19:37.639 at first was just reading online, you know, because I 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:40.720 couldn't afford a therapist, right, you know, therapists are expensive 0:19:40.720 --> 0:19:41.120 as hell. 0:19:41.040 --> 0:19:43.359 And people forget that. You know, we throw around very. 0:19:43.240 --> 0:19:45.840 Easily like go see a therapist, but therapists costs money. 0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:48.240 And if you're basically struggling to get by or I've 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:49.840 never had access to a therapist, you don't know how 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:52.159 to get a therapist. And you know, I had to 0:19:52.200 --> 0:19:55.160 realize that, Okay, there was you know, counseling services, group 0:19:55.240 --> 0:19:58.040 services that were free or cheap that I could go to, 0:19:58.280 --> 0:20:00.320 and so I did that and the REA and that 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:02.679 was the second step. Is because mostly time people on 0:20:02.680 --> 0:20:04.800 their journey of back and forgiveness and growth, they forget 0:20:04.800 --> 0:20:06.760 to forgive themselves or they go right to the people 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.040 they hurt and try to get forgiveness there, and I 0:20:09.119 --> 0:20:11.800 realized early on that's wrong because if I come to 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:13.919 you and say I wanted you to forgive me please 0:20:14.000 --> 0:20:15.840 for the bad I did, but I don't have the 0:20:15.920 --> 0:20:18.200 tools to show you what I've learned, and I don't 0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:19.560 have the tools to show you what I'm going to 0:20:19.640 --> 0:20:22.040 do to make up for this moment, then it's sort 0:20:22.040 --> 0:20:24.960 of it's very it's vapid. It's like okay, you know, 0:20:25.080 --> 0:20:27.800 like there's there's no depth in it. So I went 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:29.880 and did the work first, and then once I had 0:20:29.880 --> 0:20:31.960 the skills and the tools, I then went to all 0:20:31.960 --> 0:20:34.960 these people and said, hey, I'm sorry. And I said 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:38.160 I'm sorry without needing to rebuttal anything they said, which 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:40.560 is also hard because a lot of times when you 0:20:40.560 --> 0:20:43.040 say sorry, people will say something and it's not what 0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:45.159 you experience, so you'll try to be like, well, that's 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:47.840 not really how it was, instead of just saying I'm sorry, 0:20:48.119 --> 0:20:50.600 no buds. That journey as a start to heal me 0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:54.560 very quickly, forgiving myself, doing the work, and then asking 0:20:54.600 --> 0:20:57.399 others for forgiveness. And it wasn't until I got to 0:20:57.400 --> 0:20:59.520 that place of wanting to take my own life, and 0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:03.280 luckily I didn't succeed at it, because you know, when 0:21:03.320 --> 0:21:05.360 you're in those dark moments, you think there's nothing will 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:08.720 get better. But I was so happy that I didn't succeed, 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:11.719 so that way things could get better, that I could forgive. 0:21:11.960 --> 0:21:13.960 And I just hope if there's anyone listening right now 0:21:14.000 --> 0:21:18.119 who might be having any feelings about suicide or feeling 0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:21.600 like they can't forgive themselves, to know that there's resources. 0:21:21.760 --> 0:21:23.560 You know, I can drop you a couple of numbers 0:21:23.760 --> 0:21:25.360 that you can put in the link in the bio 0:21:25.480 --> 0:21:28.520 and just you know, people just know they're not alone 0:21:28.520 --> 0:21:29.400 and they'll get through it. 0:21:29.840 --> 0:21:32.720 Yeah, And look how much light you've spread since then. 0:21:33.119 --> 0:21:35.320 I try, girl, I do travel, you do. 0:21:36.119 --> 0:21:39.320 So when we spoke about doing this interview, originally I 0:21:39.400 --> 0:21:43.560 was thinking pretty purposeful, pretty forgiveness, because I name them 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:48.080 pretty something each episode, and after reading your book, I 0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:50.919 really would I wanted to name it pretty vulnerable because 0:21:51.320 --> 0:21:53.920 I saw this interview you did. I think it was 0:21:53.960 --> 0:21:57.280 an NPR host on stage. It was live, and you 0:21:57.359 --> 0:22:01.800 were so honest, and you said it with grace and positivity, 0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:04.800 and you were so honest that it made it like 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:07.280 I had to confront myself, like it made me a 0:22:07.280 --> 0:22:08.280 little uncomfortable. 0:22:08.800 --> 0:22:10.200 Wow, I want to know what I've said. 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.520 Then it was honestly, a lot of it was in 0:22:13.560 --> 0:22:16.720 your book, but you were able to just communicate and 0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:20.320 articulate your true feelings in a way that I think 0:22:20.320 --> 0:22:23.520 sometimes I only say, like in bed at night to myself, 0:22:23.640 --> 0:22:27.080 you know. And then I started reading more about vulnerability, 0:22:27.119 --> 0:22:31.400 and I realized that it feels like courage. 0:22:31.080 --> 0:22:34.680 In you but weakness in me. It's the first thing 0:22:34.720 --> 0:22:36.680 we want from other people and the last thing we're 0:22:36.680 --> 0:22:39.520 willing to give. And so when I hear you. 0:22:39.560 --> 0:22:45.360 Beautiful out of me, that's like, wow, that is gorgeous. 0:22:46.080 --> 0:22:46.640 We'll put the. 0:22:48.640 --> 0:22:49.800 Yeah. 0:22:49.840 --> 0:22:52.440 But it was like I had to overcome this initial 0:22:52.520 --> 0:22:54.080 panic to get to your magic. 0:22:54.240 --> 0:22:55.399 Have you ever had that feeling? 0:22:55.640 --> 0:22:58.919 Oh my gosh, yes, consistently, you know what I mean. 0:22:58.920 --> 0:23:02.160 I still had that feeling of sometimes when I'm about 0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:04.280 to go out, because this is the part about vulnerability 0:23:04.320 --> 0:23:08.639 is that it's frightening because our truth scares other people, 0:23:08.720 --> 0:23:11.439 and people judge our truth, and you want people just 0:23:11.480 --> 0:23:13.760 to be like no, no, no, listen, I get it. 0:23:13.800 --> 0:23:16.600 I see how vulnerable you are, but like to be 0:23:16.720 --> 0:23:19.440 rejected when you've been vulnerable is the worst feeling ever. 0:23:19.560 --> 0:23:22.280 It's like I let my guard down, I let you in, 0:23:22.320 --> 0:23:24.399 and you still rejected me, and then it's like I 0:23:24.400 --> 0:23:27.520 don't want to be vulnerable again. So yes, I've experienced that, 0:23:27.800 --> 0:23:29.960 you know, I've experienced that so many times. But what 0:23:30.040 --> 0:23:32.720 I try to help people understand when it comes to vulnerability, 0:23:33.200 --> 0:23:35.280 this is a saying that I heard a long time ago, 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:38.000 and I just love it. Is that broken crayon still 0:23:38.000 --> 0:23:42.160 color And it's my way of saying. And what I've 0:23:42.200 --> 0:23:44.480 taken away from that saying is, you know, no matter 0:23:44.520 --> 0:23:47.000 how much I've been broken, how many things I've done 0:23:47.040 --> 0:23:49.960 that are bad, I still have the ability to color 0:23:50.000 --> 0:23:55.160 this world with bright, beautiful light. Vulnerability, you know, understanding 0:23:55.520 --> 0:23:58.840 because my brokenness or the things that broke me or 0:23:58.880 --> 0:24:01.159 I thought that were going to break me didn't stop me. 0:24:01.720 --> 0:24:04.159 It didn't stop me. And so it propels me to 0:24:04.200 --> 0:24:06.680 know that I still have the power and ability, until 0:24:06.720 --> 0:24:09.600 there's no breath in my body to continue to color 0:24:09.640 --> 0:24:11.760 this world in the way that I see fit that's 0:24:11.760 --> 0:24:13.399 going to make it more beautiful. But I do have 0:24:13.440 --> 0:24:14.440 those moments. 0:24:14.400 --> 0:24:16.240 Yeah, And I think it allows you to connect with 0:24:16.280 --> 0:24:18.080 people on a whole different level. 0:24:18.440 --> 0:24:20.879 Than amen. 0:24:21.359 --> 0:24:24.240 As I was reading more about vulnerability, Brene Brown obviously 0:24:24.280 --> 0:24:27.360 came up and she says that it's rooted in courage. 0:24:27.720 --> 0:24:28.040 M hm. 0:24:28.480 --> 0:24:32.040 So what is the most courageous know or the hardest 0:24:32.080 --> 0:24:34.080 boundary that you've had to put up? 0:24:34.560 --> 0:24:37.280 Ooh, first of all, shout out to Brene Brown. Love 0:24:37.320 --> 0:24:39.200 her to death. It's so funny. I still have never 0:24:39.200 --> 0:24:41.560 met Brene Brown and never worked with her, and I'm 0:24:41.880 --> 0:24:43.560 I keep trying to put that in the universe. I'm like, 0:24:43.600 --> 0:24:45.000 how is it that we are sitting in the same 0:24:45.040 --> 0:24:47.120 space and I've never met this lady who I admire 0:24:47.200 --> 0:24:47.560 so much? 0:24:47.680 --> 0:24:49.320 Oh my god? And how much would you love each 0:24:49.359 --> 0:24:50.320 I mean, she would love you. 0:24:51.000 --> 0:24:51.680 I love her to that. 0:24:51.920 --> 0:24:53.879 So I'm going to put that out for you. 0:24:54.400 --> 0:24:57.720 Maest, please please, please, let's manifest that together. I say, 0:24:57.800 --> 0:24:59.560 all three of us do like a brunch and lunch 0:24:59.800 --> 0:25:01.240 or brunch and talk or something. 0:25:04.520 --> 0:25:04.720 Fun. 0:25:04.920 --> 0:25:06.600 But the thing that I had to be most courageous 0:25:06.600 --> 0:25:09.720 throughout instead of boundary, when we have the five of 0:25:09.800 --> 0:25:13.120 us have group events. I can tell you they like Netflix. 0:25:13.119 --> 0:25:15.480 They does these events all the time, especially during amy seasons, 0:25:15.520 --> 0:25:17.560 or we do things and they'll line us up in 0:25:17.560 --> 0:25:21.320 our own little boots. And you know, Johnthan's line will 0:25:21.320 --> 0:25:22.960 always have people coming out with me and like, oh 0:25:22.960 --> 0:25:25.640 my gosh, touch my hair. You know, let's twirl, let's 0:25:25.640 --> 0:25:28.359 have fun. You know, Tanse line always has people saying 0:25:28.359 --> 0:25:30.040 like took out my fashion? Do you think my boyfriend 0:25:30.040 --> 0:25:32.400 looks good? And I will literally had the longest line 0:25:32.440 --> 0:25:34.240 no joke of people coming up to me and say, 0:25:34.440 --> 0:25:36.960 my grandfather just died. I don't know how to process it. 0:25:37.119 --> 0:25:39.240 I'm in abuseul relationship. I don't know what to do, 0:25:39.600 --> 0:25:42.160 like a long line of people crying and taking their 0:25:42.480 --> 0:25:46.240 stuff out. And for me, I learned how to understand 0:25:46.240 --> 0:25:48.720 my capacity of being able to give, and I'm not 0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:50.760 afraid of telling people that I'm not able to give today. 0:25:50.960 --> 0:25:52.840 So that was a boundary I learned a long time ago. 0:25:53.080 --> 0:25:55.960 Is saying that it's okay that to say I don't 0:25:55.960 --> 0:25:59.040 have the capacity it is and helping people to understand 0:25:59.040 --> 0:26:00.560 that that doesn't mean that I don't love you and 0:26:00.640 --> 0:26:02.400 I don't care for you. It means that I don't 0:26:02.400 --> 0:26:04.520 have the capacity to day. You know, I heard someone 0:26:04.560 --> 0:26:06.440 once say that, like, if you think of your brain 0:26:06.560 --> 0:26:09.560 as computer tabs that are open, you know, Internet tabs, 0:26:09.560 --> 0:26:12.240 that are open. You know, once you have forty tabs open, 0:26:12.480 --> 0:26:14.640 your Internet starts going slower. You don't have the ability 0:26:14.640 --> 0:26:16.320 that sometimes you just got to be like, nope, got 0:26:16.320 --> 0:26:19.159 too many tabs open. I can't today. And that is 0:26:19.200 --> 0:26:21.480 something I'm very comfortable with, and I want more people 0:26:21.520 --> 0:26:23.280 to be comfortable with, because we look at no as 0:26:23.280 --> 0:26:25.680 a dirty word, and no should never be a dirty word. 0:26:25.960 --> 0:26:28.560 No could be used to protect yourself and protect others, 0:26:28.600 --> 0:26:30.479 because if I try to give advice when I'm not 0:26:30.600 --> 0:26:32.440 in a healthy place, and all I'm doing is doing 0:26:32.440 --> 0:26:34.960 at the service to somebody who actually was seeking my 0:26:35.560 --> 0:26:38.680 advice and my expertise. But I think the most courageous 0:26:38.720 --> 0:26:40.200 boundary I've had to say to be honest with you 0:26:40.240 --> 0:26:41.200 would be with my father. 0:26:41.600 --> 0:26:41.800 Wow. 0:26:42.080 --> 0:26:44.040 And I say that because as I became a father, 0:26:44.400 --> 0:26:47.440 I had to struggle with my father meeting my son, 0:26:47.720 --> 0:26:50.639 and I always was like, I don't want my father 0:26:50.720 --> 0:26:55.360 to ever put his negativity or anything onto my children 0:26:55.400 --> 0:26:56.920 to make my children feel like they had to choose 0:26:56.920 --> 0:27:00.440 between their father and their grandfather. And I I found 0:27:00.480 --> 0:27:02.840 the courage, you know, years ago to say to him, Hey, 0:27:03.040 --> 0:27:04.760 I will allow my children to be in your life. 0:27:04.960 --> 0:27:07.800 But if you ever say anything negative about me or 0:27:07.800 --> 0:27:11.119 the LGBT community, then I'm going to not allow you 0:27:11.160 --> 0:27:13.119 to see my children. This is my one thing. You 0:27:13.160 --> 0:27:15.119 can see them as long as you never try to 0:27:15.160 --> 0:27:18.440 disparage me or my community. And that was a hard 0:27:18.480 --> 0:27:21.040 thing because you know, it was like me setting a 0:27:21.160 --> 0:27:24.119 clear boundary with somebody who I'm, to be honest, a 0:27:24.119 --> 0:27:26.800 bit intimidated by, even though like as I get older, 0:27:26.960 --> 0:27:28.959 I'm still intimidated by him because I still feel like 0:27:28.960 --> 0:27:31.520 like that small child that can't speak back, that feels 0:27:31.520 --> 0:27:33.560 like he deserves his abuse. 0:27:33.800 --> 0:27:36.440 He's still your dad that never goes over exactly. 0:27:36.480 --> 0:27:38.720 And it's so weird because as I get I'm forty now, 0:27:38.960 --> 0:27:40.879 just fur forty last November, and I'm like, why am 0:27:40.920 --> 0:27:43.159 I still feeling this way about him? And you're right, 0:27:43.280 --> 0:27:45.280 this is your father. But when I told him that, 0:27:45.400 --> 0:27:48.199 because I was so confident and was so clear and 0:27:48.320 --> 0:27:50.560 what I expected and what I wanted. He has a 0:27:50.600 --> 0:27:53.520 relationship with my sons all these years, and not once 0:27:53.760 --> 0:27:56.800 has he ever disparaged me or said anything about the 0:27:56.880 --> 0:27:59.959 LGBT community in front of my kids. And because of them, 0:28:00.080 --> 0:28:02.480 they've been able to have a relationship. So they talked 0:28:02.480 --> 0:28:04.520 to Grandpa all the time, or that he calls them 0:28:04.560 --> 0:28:06.639 G Paul if they talked to g Pau all the time. 0:28:07.000 --> 0:28:09.399 And it feels good to know that my children have 0:28:09.480 --> 0:28:12.639 a relationship with him. That's healthier because I set a 0:28:12.680 --> 0:28:15.000 boundary with him to say this is not okay and 0:28:15.040 --> 0:28:16.439 you can't do that. And I think that was one 0:28:16.440 --> 0:28:19.159 of the most courageous moments of my life, because otherwise, 0:28:19.320 --> 0:28:21.040 if I didn't find that courage, I wouldn't have been 0:28:21.040 --> 0:28:23.840 able to do that and would have probably destroyed three 0:28:23.920 --> 0:28:25.960 generations of relationships versus just two. 0:28:27.080 --> 0:28:28.960 You set the framework for that. That's amazing. 0:28:29.440 --> 0:28:30.080 Yeah, thank you. 0:28:30.480 --> 0:28:35.000 In Kabbala, they believe that children choose their parents to 0:28:35.320 --> 0:28:37.720 teach them the lessons that they needed in this lifetime. 0:28:38.000 --> 0:28:41.080 And as I was reading your book, I kept thinking, Wow, 0:28:41.240 --> 0:28:44.240 Karama was chosen to be his father's son and it 0:28:44.320 --> 0:28:45.880 caused you so much pain. 0:28:46.440 --> 0:28:47.800 But I kind of believe that. 0:28:48.280 --> 0:28:50.520 Oh it's Kabala that believes that. I want to read 0:28:50.600 --> 0:28:51.120 up more on that. 0:28:51.240 --> 0:28:53.520 Yeah, I'll I'll send you a book because. 0:28:53.280 --> 0:28:55.400 How come I couldn't pick Barack Obama because I would 0:28:55.400 --> 0:28:58.840 have loved hid to you, my daddy, Like I don't 0:28:58.880 --> 0:29:01.000 know Baroxie like he'd have been dope as dad to have. 0:29:01.120 --> 0:29:02.680 I'm just saying, I mean, no one's perfect. 0:29:03.440 --> 0:29:08.440 It's true you could have gotten any internship, seriously, any. 0:29:08.400 --> 0:29:12.000 Like damn like. But yeah, I'm with that. I'm with that. 0:29:12.040 --> 0:29:13.560 I do believe the people that come in our lives, 0:29:13.560 --> 0:29:15.440 you know, are supposed to give us a lesson. You know, 0:29:15.480 --> 0:29:18.480 there is something special magical about children and parents that 0:29:18.520 --> 0:29:20.400 we don't fully understand, you know what I mean, Like 0:29:20.760 --> 0:29:23.360 this young person comes to you and grows in this 0:29:23.400 --> 0:29:27.040 woman's body and then is delivered to us, and we're's 0:29:27.160 --> 0:29:29.320 meant to guide it and we're meant to learn, and 0:29:29.360 --> 0:29:31.400 so I do believe there's something of that. So that's 0:29:31.400 --> 0:29:33.160 pretty awesome. I can't wait to research that more. 0:29:33.600 --> 0:29:36.920 You mentioned Queer Eye, and I was wondering what you 0:29:37.200 --> 0:29:42.680 felt was potentially misunderstood about your life publicly because there's 0:29:42.680 --> 0:29:44.280 so much out there, right, there's so much on the 0:29:44.320 --> 0:29:48.520 Internet and Instagram. Do you feel like your inner life 0:29:48.760 --> 0:29:51.959 fully matches the outer life online or is there a 0:29:52.000 --> 0:29:53.440 piece that is misunderstood? 0:29:53.640 --> 0:29:55.560 Oh yeah, hell yeah girl, you know. I mean we're friends. 0:29:55.560 --> 0:29:56.720 I like to party and get down. 0:29:56.840 --> 0:29:58.880 I'm glad to tell we see. 0:29:58.680 --> 0:30:00.920 That with your Instagram. Yeah, videos, you let us in. 0:30:01.160 --> 0:30:03.000 I try to a little bit, but you know, I 0:30:03.080 --> 0:30:06.040 really people think all the time that I'm like, like, 0:30:06.120 --> 0:30:09.720 I'm always talking about like deep soul stuff and I do. 0:30:10.120 --> 0:30:12.720 And I love conversations about vulnerability. You know. We've had 0:30:12.720 --> 0:30:14.680 moments where we've just gotten deep and just like and 0:30:14.720 --> 0:30:16.840 I think that's so beautiful, like when friends can like 0:30:17.120 --> 0:30:19.280 really just go there. But then I also love when 0:30:19.320 --> 0:30:21.719 friends can just be like, girl, we just gonna cheers 0:30:21.760 --> 0:30:23.400 and have a lot of drinks and you know what 0:30:23.440 --> 0:30:26.000 I mean. And so I think that people. 0:30:25.960 --> 0:30:28.000 Don't get enough of that side, which is all right. 0:30:27.960 --> 0:30:29.760 You know, But I hope they just know that you 0:30:29.800 --> 0:30:32.240 can be balanced, you can do both. You can have fun, 0:30:32.280 --> 0:30:34.160 you can be spiritual as long as you're not hurting 0:30:34.200 --> 0:30:35.400 yourself or hurting other people. 0:30:35.520 --> 0:30:36.479 You really do turn up. 0:30:37.280 --> 0:30:39.760 I turn up, girl. I love the turn up. You 0:30:39.840 --> 0:30:41.560 turn up is the best thing ever for me. 0:30:41.760 --> 0:30:43.680 And you know how to set the scene of a party. 0:30:43.840 --> 0:30:46.320 You get catered, you do like you have it by 0:30:46.320 --> 0:30:46.680 the pool. 0:30:46.760 --> 0:30:47.440 It's all good. 0:30:47.680 --> 0:30:48.720 I try to. I try to. 0:30:48.800 --> 0:30:50.720 I try to always make sure there's enough food, drink. 0:30:50.880 --> 0:30:52.440 That's my that's the Caribbean. 0:30:52.040 --> 0:30:53.040 Side of me, my mother and me. 0:30:53.160 --> 0:30:55.200 That's like every there always has to be enough. Food 0:30:55.240 --> 0:30:57.480 has to be enough, drinks has to be enough. Everything. Yeah, 0:30:57.480 --> 0:31:00.680 I'm ready for I just got my first vaccine shot. 0:31:00.760 --> 0:31:04.040 I have my second one coming up in two weeks, 0:31:04.080 --> 0:31:06.920 and I'm thank you and I'm just I say that 0:31:06.960 --> 0:31:10.120 particularly because, first of all, there's so much distrust with 0:31:10.160 --> 0:31:13.520 African Americans and Latinos when it comes to vaccines. Rightfully so, 0:31:13.680 --> 0:31:16.280 because we've had issues in our country where we were 0:31:16.320 --> 0:31:19.600 experimented on. But in this particular time, I've done the research, 0:31:19.640 --> 0:31:22.120 and I'm just employing anyone who's African American or Latino 0:31:22.520 --> 0:31:25.920 or young who has apprehension to know I've done the research. 0:31:26.320 --> 0:31:27.240 Do your own research. 0:31:27.440 --> 0:31:28.120 It is safe. 0:31:28.320 --> 0:31:30.479 I'm not trying to, you know, turn this conversation into this, 0:31:31.000 --> 0:31:34.560 but I just want people to know to get vaccinated. 0:31:34.680 --> 0:31:36.440 I did it because I'm ready to get back out 0:31:36.440 --> 0:31:38.479 there and have a good time. And I said this 0:31:38.520 --> 0:31:41.360 all to say, the minute that everyone gets vaccinated in 0:31:41.400 --> 0:31:44.160 my circle, we are about to turn up, like you 0:31:44.200 --> 0:31:47.480 can imagine it. Okay, I'm just said you know that 0:31:47.600 --> 0:31:50.840 the day that that happens, I'm like everybody comes to 0:31:50.880 --> 0:31:52.440 the house. We are in the pool. We were gonna 0:31:52.480 --> 0:31:55.200 have a good time. Because I'm so dumb with COVID. 0:31:55.240 --> 0:31:57.600 I'm so dumb with quarantining. I say the. 0:31:57.480 --> 0:31:59.520 Same way it hit me a few weeks ago. I 0:31:59.560 --> 0:32:00.800 have done done. 0:32:01.240 --> 0:32:04.240 I am done. Like I was jealous of Texas for 0:32:04.280 --> 0:32:06.880 a second the other day, my sister's Texas, and when 0:32:06.880 --> 0:32:09.120 they said everything opened back up for like a good 0:32:09.120 --> 0:32:11.480 ten minutes, I was like, I'm so jealous. But you know, 0:32:11.560 --> 0:32:13.440 it was like that feeling of like, y'all get to 0:32:13.440 --> 0:32:15.320 go bowling again. I want to bowl, you know, like 0:32:15.400 --> 0:32:15.920 little pig. 0:32:16.280 --> 0:32:18.280 Even the stuff I didn't like to do, I want 0:32:18.280 --> 0:32:20.520 to do now because I just can't exactly. 0:32:20.760 --> 0:32:24.560 I have the same feeling. So so please everyone can 0:32:24.680 --> 0:32:27.080 take care of yourselves, and if you're able to get 0:32:27.120 --> 0:32:28.560 a vaccination, please go. 0:32:29.040 --> 0:32:31.880 So you know, I've never asked you this, but I 0:32:31.920 --> 0:32:32.760 looked up the dates. 0:32:32.800 --> 0:32:36.360 So February sixth, twenty eighteen, you wake up as Caramo, 0:32:36.440 --> 0:32:38.520 you make breakfast with your kids, you're in your house. 0:32:38.880 --> 0:32:42.680 February seventh, twenty eighteen, the day after you wake up, 0:32:42.760 --> 0:32:47.000 your Instagram shoots to a million followers and it's May. 0:32:46.600 --> 0:32:49.600 It was literal mayhem. I remember checking your Instagram and 0:32:49.640 --> 0:32:50.840 being like, holy. 0:32:50.680 --> 0:32:55.200 Shit, overnight, overnight, what the hell? Yeah, it was it 0:32:55.280 --> 0:32:55.880 was crazy. 0:32:56.000 --> 0:32:58.160 It was what and I saw it happen in real time. 0:32:58.160 --> 0:33:00.680 It was like two hundred thousand, three hundred thousand, one million. 0:33:00.880 --> 0:33:03.840 So what was it like to wake up twenty four 0:33:03.880 --> 0:33:07.840 hours later and have your life just be total mayhem? 0:33:08.240 --> 0:33:12.000 It was amazing because, as you and I know, I 0:33:12.040 --> 0:33:15.400 had been hustling a hosting career for years, just like you. 0:33:15.480 --> 0:33:18.840 We had been on every carpet, with every outlet we 0:33:18.880 --> 0:33:21.600 could do. We have been telling each other about job. 0:33:21.920 --> 0:33:24.840 We had been like talking about agents, and so it 0:33:25.000 --> 0:33:28.920 felt like, thank god, I never gave up, and here's 0:33:28.960 --> 0:33:32.240 this moment that is showing me you got to keep 0:33:32.280 --> 0:33:34.479 pushing because it can get even bigger than this. And 0:33:34.480 --> 0:33:37.040 so I loved it. It was it was amazing. I 0:33:37.080 --> 0:33:39.080 can't I wish that I you know that I could say, 0:33:39.120 --> 0:33:41.000 oh my gosh, I was scared or whatever. I was 0:33:41.080 --> 0:33:43.840 just like thankful because I've been in the trenches. And 0:33:43.880 --> 0:33:45.479 that's why I love speaking to you, is because we 0:33:45.480 --> 0:33:49.560 were in these trenches together, like constantly hustling, you know 0:33:49.560 --> 0:33:52.520 what I mean, And we're still hustling. I'm still hustling 0:33:52.560 --> 0:33:54.560 because people think that the minute you get on it's like, 0:33:54.640 --> 0:33:57.000 oh everything comes to you. You still have to hustle, 0:33:57.280 --> 0:33:59.640 you still have to keep finding opportunities. There is some 0:33:59.800 --> 0:34:01.560 thats that come along with it, but a lot of 0:34:01.560 --> 0:34:02.959 the stuff I still have to be like, hey, can 0:34:03.000 --> 0:34:04.640 I have a general meeting with this person? And I 0:34:04.680 --> 0:34:05.640 talked to this person, so. 0:34:06.280 --> 0:34:08.919 Yeah, I mean you started companies like you're a self 0:34:08.960 --> 0:34:12.280 starter that doesn't just come from same Yeah. 0:34:12.320 --> 0:34:14.719 Completely, And that's something that people need to understand, is 0:34:14.719 --> 0:34:16.560 that you know, you have to be a self starter 0:34:16.600 --> 0:34:18.279 and you have to believe in yourself and try for 0:34:18.360 --> 0:34:20.319 yourself more because no one's going to work as hard 0:34:20.320 --> 0:34:22.160 for you as you. And that's just the real of it. 0:34:22.200 --> 0:34:24.160 And I thought for a second when I became when 0:34:24.239 --> 0:34:26.120 queer Ie blew up, that everything was going to start 0:34:26.160 --> 0:34:28.239 coming through me. I really did. I thought like, oh 0:34:28.280 --> 0:34:30.120 my gosh, all these things are going to start happening. 0:34:30.120 --> 0:34:32.760 And I realized they weren't. And I had to continue 0:34:32.760 --> 0:34:36.400 to like reintroduce myself to people, and I had to 0:34:36.480 --> 0:34:39.239 let go of my ego of saying, well, I'm too 0:34:39.280 --> 0:34:41.800 big to reintroduce myself to people. I was like, nope, 0:34:41.840 --> 0:34:43.920 I'm in another level now. And this is the way 0:34:43.920 --> 0:34:46.080 I saw it in my mind. It was like I 0:34:46.160 --> 0:34:48.840 was in one office building and the next door was 0:34:48.840 --> 0:34:51.040 a medium sized off the building, and I got promoted 0:34:51.040 --> 0:34:53.760 to that building. And now this building has thirty floors 0:34:53.760 --> 0:34:55.680 and I got to go through every thirty floors to 0:34:55.719 --> 0:34:58.080 make sure all these people know me because they didn't 0:34:58.080 --> 0:34:59.680 know what was going on in this small building. And 0:35:00.000 --> 0:35:02.279 I feel like I'm at floor twenty eight of the 0:35:02.320 --> 0:35:04.160 medium building and I'm like, Okay, I'm ready to go 0:35:04.200 --> 0:35:06.000 to the next building, but I know that once I 0:35:06.040 --> 0:35:07.880 get over there, I'm gonna have to reintroduce myself to 0:35:07.920 --> 0:35:10.560 every single person again, you know. And I don't have 0:35:10.600 --> 0:35:12.960 an ego about it. It makes me feel like this 0:35:13.080 --> 0:35:15.640 is what I'm doing because I love my job. I 0:35:15.680 --> 0:35:19.040 feel blessed. I'm so thankful. I'm humbled by it. So 0:35:19.520 --> 0:35:21.840 I walk in there with humility and like, let me 0:35:21.920 --> 0:35:24.040 keep doing the work and keep working hard and trying 0:35:24.080 --> 0:35:24.839 to strategize. 0:35:24.880 --> 0:35:27.839 And so is there something that you wish somebody would 0:35:27.840 --> 0:35:29.640 have told you before it all popped off? 0:35:29.880 --> 0:35:33.840 Ooh so much? Oh my gosh, Luckily, I already had 0:35:33.880 --> 0:35:36.520 the finances on check because you know, I already knew 0:35:36.560 --> 0:35:39.000 just being in Hollywood, like when you get your big checks, 0:35:39.080 --> 0:35:41.680 don't go buy you a car anything stupid, like hold 0:35:41.719 --> 0:35:44.279 onto your money. And luckily, because of that, like I've 0:35:44.320 --> 0:35:46.480 now set up financially for me and my kids. Is 0:35:46.520 --> 0:35:48.680 I'm very happy about. So that was one thing no 0:35:48.719 --> 0:35:50.239 one had to tell me. But I'm going to just 0:35:50.280 --> 0:35:52.839 tell other people. If you get something big, don't think 0:35:52.880 --> 0:35:55.640 that's your moment to start splurging. You can do something 0:35:55.719 --> 0:35:59.279 nice for yourself, but save I think the thing that 0:35:59.400 --> 0:36:01.440 I would tell someone to tell me is like, you know, 0:36:01.560 --> 0:36:04.800 your good intentions can be canceled, and you can be canceled. 0:36:04.840 --> 0:36:06.200 And you know, one of the things I hate is 0:36:06.239 --> 0:36:08.000 cancel culture. You and I have talked about this for 0:36:08.200 --> 0:36:09.720 I hate hate cancel culture. 0:36:10.480 --> 0:36:12.760 So you subscribe to call in which I love. 0:36:12.800 --> 0:36:16.760 Yes completely, Like let's let's have somebody come in. Let's 0:36:16.800 --> 0:36:19.320 talk about it, because what I know about cancel culture 0:36:19.360 --> 0:36:21.680 is that people who you cancel, they they're not taking 0:36:21.680 --> 0:36:23.400 away their money and they're just I see it all 0:36:23.440 --> 0:36:25.319 the time in Hollywood. They just go to another job 0:36:25.480 --> 0:36:26.919 and now they're not in the public eye, but they're 0:36:26.920 --> 0:36:29.400 still making money. You haven't really done any real damage. 0:36:29.640 --> 0:36:33.440 But I realized that my positive intentions can be construed 0:36:33.680 --> 0:36:37.520 as negative and me being hurtful. And that was the 0:36:37.560 --> 0:36:40.160 thing that that really affected me because for a while, 0:36:40.719 --> 0:36:42.960 you know, last year, I was like, I don't want 0:36:42.960 --> 0:36:45.400 to do anything positive anymore. I like literally got to 0:36:45.440 --> 0:36:46.440 this place where I was like, I don't want to 0:36:46.480 --> 0:36:49.359 do anything good anymore. Because if I'm going to get 0:36:49.360 --> 0:36:51.520 people to hit me up on my social media saying 0:36:51.880 --> 0:36:55.440 you're wrong, you're this, then what am I going to do? 0:36:55.560 --> 0:36:57.040 Why do I want to do this? I don't want to. 0:36:57.080 --> 0:36:58.400 I don't have to do this, So why do I 0:36:58.440 --> 0:37:01.239 want to? I'll give you an example because we're out 0:37:01.239 --> 0:37:04.400 of the thick of it. But while Trump was in office, 0:37:04.520 --> 0:37:07.680 I was very adamant as a Democrat that the only 0:37:07.719 --> 0:37:09.160 way we're going to see eye to eyes if we 0:37:09.239 --> 0:37:11.239 sort of reach out to people who have different views 0:37:11.280 --> 0:37:12.839 in US. And so I made it my mission of 0:37:12.880 --> 0:37:16.759 reaching out to different Republicans to say, hey, this is 0:37:16.800 --> 0:37:18.919 who I am, this is how I feel. I met 0:37:18.960 --> 0:37:22.320 with Karen Pence's chief of staff. You know, I said, 0:37:22.360 --> 0:37:24.759 Sean Spicer was a nice guy on Dancing with the 0:37:24.760 --> 0:37:27.279 Stars and try to talk to him. I met with 0:37:27.360 --> 0:37:29.680 so many Republicans, and every time I did it, people 0:37:29.680 --> 0:37:31.799 would just be like, You're an awful person, I hate you. 0:37:31.880 --> 0:37:34.680 How dare you? They threaten my kids? It was like 0:37:35.360 --> 0:37:37.279 and I was like, I was like, do you really 0:37:37.280 --> 0:37:39.840 think my black gay as with immigrant parents is trying 0:37:39.880 --> 0:37:43.239 to like hurt our community? Like do you really think 0:37:43.280 --> 0:37:45.479 I have some secret agenda of like wanting to hurt? 0:37:45.520 --> 0:37:47.840 But I'm like, I'm trying to go into these spaces 0:37:47.880 --> 0:37:50.880 where we normally don't get we don't get into, to 0:37:51.000 --> 0:37:52.840 try to change these minds and hearts. 0:37:53.080 --> 0:37:53.600 Will it work? 0:37:53.640 --> 0:37:56.520 Who knows? But every time a new headline came out 0:37:56.600 --> 0:37:58.880 that I was a trading size and I was a 0:37:58.920 --> 0:38:01.360 horrible person, it just made me be like, why do 0:38:01.400 --> 0:38:02.200 I want to do good? 0:38:02.600 --> 0:38:02.839 Yeah? 0:38:02.880 --> 0:38:05.080 You know, And I have a couple more of those 0:38:05.120 --> 0:38:07.480 situations that have happened where I'm just like, I'm trying 0:38:07.480 --> 0:38:09.600 to do the work the best I know how and 0:38:09.680 --> 0:38:11.480 maybe in ten years I'll be like, oh, there was 0:38:11.480 --> 0:38:12.480 a different approach. 0:38:12.160 --> 0:38:12.920 That I could have taken. 0:38:13.080 --> 0:38:16.080 But it feels bad when you put yourself out there 0:38:16.160 --> 0:38:18.680 because you have a spotlight. People attack you or hurt 0:38:18.760 --> 0:38:21.439 you for it, and I'm open to criticism. I'm open 0:38:21.480 --> 0:38:23.440 to hearing what people have to say, but it does 0:38:23.520 --> 0:38:26.560 hurt my heart sometimes when I'm like, I know my intentions, 0:38:26.840 --> 0:38:29.360 but if my intentions are good and the impact for 0:38:29.480 --> 0:38:31.840 someone else is negative, I understand where there. You know 0:38:31.840 --> 0:38:33.680 where they're coming from, But I don't ever see the 0:38:33.719 --> 0:38:36.440 impact being so negative that you'd want to threaten my kids. 0:38:36.600 --> 0:38:38.080 And so that's one of the things I would have 0:38:38.080 --> 0:38:40.239 told myself before, like watch out for that. 0:38:40.760 --> 0:38:42.920 Yeah, and it feels so evil you can't even imagine 0:38:42.960 --> 0:38:43.360 it coming. 0:38:43.800 --> 0:38:46.720 Oh my gosh. The first time someone told my child 0:38:47.080 --> 0:38:49.279 in person that they wanted to kill them because I 0:38:49.360 --> 0:38:52.399 was their dad. And this happened in Philadelphia while we're 0:38:52.440 --> 0:38:56.360 shooting Querai in twenty nineteen. Literally, my son came home. 0:38:56.560 --> 0:39:00.759 This is my grown son came home crying because these 0:39:00.760 --> 0:39:03.360 guys had stopped him and said, oh, you're that f 0:39:03.440 --> 0:39:06.480 words son. We want to kill your dad or he 0:39:06.600 --> 0:39:09.040 wants to be a Republican now, will kill him and 0:39:09.080 --> 0:39:11.640 show him and all this stuff. And my son comes 0:39:11.640 --> 0:39:14.720 home crying, and I'm like, there's people really that dishes 0:39:14.800 --> 0:39:16.959 that will find my children. That's why I stop posting 0:39:17.000 --> 0:39:19.160 my kids so much until recently that my son was like, 0:39:19.160 --> 0:39:20.640 can we get on TikTok? And I was like cute. 0:39:20.680 --> 0:39:23.040 But I stopped posting them because. 0:39:22.880 --> 0:39:24.600 I was like, dude, okay, we can if you're fine. 0:39:24.840 --> 0:39:26.759 But I stopped posting because I was like, I don't 0:39:26.800 --> 0:39:28.680 want people to see you and know where you're at, 0:39:28.800 --> 0:39:30.840 and like, yeah, harass you. 0:39:30.880 --> 0:39:34.320 So anyway, Oh, my stomach dropped when you said that. 0:39:34.320 --> 0:39:37.040 That's horrible. Yeah, I'm so sorry that happened. 0:39:37.320 --> 0:39:39.120 Thank you of you know, but it's one of those 0:39:39.120 --> 0:39:41.080 things that I wish someone would have told me before that. 0:39:41.840 --> 0:39:44.200 You know, people can get bile, you know, and for 0:39:44.280 --> 0:39:47.880 every good person out there, there's always somebody who is hurting, 0:39:48.000 --> 0:39:51.360 who wants to you know, conflict plane and so I just, 0:39:51.440 --> 0:39:54.560 you know, just being smarter about watching out for that 0:39:54.680 --> 0:39:56.680 is what I've learned since this thing has taken off. 0:39:56.760 --> 0:39:58.319 It's interesting when you talk about hurt. 0:39:58.360 --> 0:40:02.040 I think about how you are the one that transforms 0:40:02.120 --> 0:40:07.400 people's lives on the show, and yet as a friend 0:40:07.440 --> 0:40:10.120 and a fan of yours, I've seen your life transform, 0:40:10.200 --> 0:40:14.440 and I'm wondering how you feel like Queer Eye transformed you. 0:40:14.960 --> 0:40:16.080 What gift has it given you? 0:40:16.600 --> 0:40:19.920 Queer eye allows me to believe that good, wholesome content 0:40:20.760 --> 0:40:25.440 is just as exciting as you know, like ratchet content. 0:40:25.480 --> 0:40:26.719 And I don't want to call it rapt because it 0:40:26.719 --> 0:40:29.960 sounds like I'm judging because I love ratchet reality shows. 0:40:30.160 --> 0:40:31.080 I love them. 0:40:31.239 --> 0:40:33.839 Give me a Bad Girls Club, give me a love 0:40:33.840 --> 0:40:36.279 and hip hop anytime I'm watching this, but I love them. 0:40:36.480 --> 0:40:39.480 But it really helped me to see, you know what, 0:40:39.680 --> 0:40:41.920 it's possible. Like my dream, the only dream that I 0:40:41.920 --> 0:40:44.839 have left in this business, there's only two, is just 0:40:44.880 --> 0:40:47.800 selling content and you know, having my own production company, 0:40:47.840 --> 0:40:49.640 which I've now done, and I'm going to be announcing 0:40:50.160 --> 0:40:53.120 two shows very soon that I've sold and that are 0:40:53.120 --> 0:40:54.600 going to be coming on air, and so you've got 0:40:54.640 --> 0:40:56.040 to kind of get a little bit exclusive there. 0:40:56.120 --> 0:40:58.840 But oh my god, Mule, that is so exciting. 0:40:59.640 --> 0:41:00.279 Thank you love. 0:41:00.360 --> 0:41:02.279 And then the second thing is I want to be 0:41:02.280 --> 0:41:03.759 a talk show host, and so I want my own 0:41:03.840 --> 0:41:06.120 daytime talk show and. 0:41:05.680 --> 0:41:08.399 Need the world that needs it. Since I have known 0:41:08.440 --> 0:41:10.320 you that like you are the millennial? 0:41:10.400 --> 0:41:12.040 Are you a millennial? 0:41:12.160 --> 0:41:14.560 You are a millennial, Oprah. There's no one else that 0:41:14.680 --> 0:41:17.239 has that gift. It has to it will happen. I 0:41:17.280 --> 0:41:17.759 know it will. 0:41:17.920 --> 0:41:19.680 I appreciate that and I received that. 0:41:20.080 --> 0:41:22.319 But what it's helped me Queer Eye, is that I 0:41:22.400 --> 0:41:24.560 realized in the content that I'm creating that I've sold 0:41:24.600 --> 0:41:26.960 and then hopefully with my talk show one day, is 0:41:27.000 --> 0:41:30.279 that it can be positive. And I love like when 0:41:30.320 --> 0:41:34.000 I talk about daytime TV, I love the Sally just Raphael's, 0:41:34.000 --> 0:41:36.160 I love News, I love these are old schools for 0:41:36.239 --> 0:41:39.040 anybody who's younger that don't know these are eighties. But 0:41:39.040 --> 0:41:41.280 I also love like the Maury's. I love these shows 0:41:41.760 --> 0:41:45.359 because you see real people and I believe that there's 0:41:45.400 --> 0:41:48.400 a way, Like recently, I've had the opportunity to guest 0:41:48.400 --> 0:41:51.359 hosts for Maury like a couple of different times, and 0:41:52.160 --> 0:41:54.439 you know, Maury does such a great job on his show, 0:41:54.800 --> 0:41:56.719 but he's given me a chance to go deeper and 0:41:56.800 --> 0:41:58.799 like to see the humanity in them and to like 0:41:58.880 --> 0:42:01.239 really have them have breakdown. Was of like why are 0:42:01.280 --> 0:42:04.480 you on here? And the first time Maury allowed me 0:42:04.520 --> 0:42:06.359 and this was real, I thought I was gonna get 0:42:06.400 --> 0:42:08.919 in trouble because I went on this man's show and 0:42:09.000 --> 0:42:11.520 I had this it was a paternity test I had 0:42:11.719 --> 0:42:14.600 the man who brought this woman on who he knew 0:42:14.640 --> 0:42:16.640 it was his baby, but he brought her on and 0:42:16.680 --> 0:42:19.839 embarrassed her, was calling her all keepnine. I was like, 0:42:20.040 --> 0:42:22.560 you need to apologize. You need to apologize for bringing 0:42:22.560 --> 0:42:25.080 her on national TV and embarrassing her, and then we 0:42:25.080 --> 0:42:27.080 need to go deeper and find out why you thought 0:42:27.120 --> 0:42:29.440 that was appropriate page Why did you think this was 0:42:29.480 --> 0:42:31.360 okay to do? Why do you think And I'm telling 0:42:31.360 --> 0:42:33.360 this to his guest. This is somebody who called. 0:42:33.120 --> 0:42:33.839 It his shone. 0:42:33.880 --> 0:42:35.600 I was like, oh, these people are not inviting me back. 0:42:36.000 --> 0:42:39.000 But they had this cathartic cry and they were like wow, 0:42:39.000 --> 0:42:41.080 and we got to the heart of what was the reason. 0:42:41.120 --> 0:42:43.320 And I was like, if I could do that every week, 0:42:43.760 --> 0:42:47.080 every day, that'd be amazing. And so, you know, Queer 0:42:47.080 --> 0:42:49.439 Eye gave me that ability to believe that, yes, there's 0:42:49.480 --> 0:42:52.320 always a space for like the truth and the reality 0:42:52.320 --> 0:42:54.080 and the corb and where you don't have to judge, 0:42:54.120 --> 0:42:56.320 but you could really help my to grow and heal, 0:42:56.560 --> 0:42:58.920 you know. And so yeah, Queer I did that for me. 0:42:59.160 --> 0:43:01.239 It's cool to hear you say that, because I think 0:43:01.440 --> 0:43:05.440 shows like Maury had in the last like five years, 0:43:05.480 --> 0:43:10.960 maybe a connotation of exploitation a bit, and to shift 0:43:11.000 --> 0:43:12.880 that and to get to the root of the hurt 0:43:13.480 --> 0:43:15.200 would be amazing for that show. 0:43:15.440 --> 0:43:17.000 Yeah, and that's what I've been doing, and that's why 0:43:17.000 --> 0:43:19.360 they keep bringing me back. I've just been like getting 0:43:19.360 --> 0:43:21.920 to the root of it of like let's really talk, 0:43:22.040 --> 0:43:24.759 you know, like let's really figure out what's going on. 0:43:25.000 --> 0:43:27.719 Because it's funny we see these we see individuals who 0:43:27.719 --> 0:43:30.520 call on these talk shows, and from my perspective, you 0:43:30.560 --> 0:43:32.439 can't always tie everything in a ribbon and a bow, 0:43:32.800 --> 0:43:34.960 but you can set people on the path to get 0:43:35.000 --> 0:43:37.520 real closure and real healing. I realize I know how 0:43:37.560 --> 0:43:40.600 to do that professionally and personally because I've lived it, 0:43:40.640 --> 0:43:42.640 and I've lived through most of the things you know 0:43:42.760 --> 0:43:46.080 that these people have been through. Like I think that's 0:43:46.120 --> 0:43:48.880 one of my greatest gifts, and that's why I'm so vulnerable, 0:43:49.120 --> 0:43:51.440 is because the more people know I've been through what 0:43:51.480 --> 0:43:53.799 they've been through, then the more they're willing to hear 0:43:53.880 --> 0:43:56.080 me and understand that they can make it through. You 0:43:56.160 --> 0:43:57.680 can't look at me and say, well, you don't know 0:43:57.719 --> 0:43:59.440 what it's like to have to be a team parent. 0:43:59.600 --> 0:44:01.560 You don't know what it's like to be a single parent. 0:44:01.719 --> 0:44:03.720 You don't know what it's like to have no money. 0:44:03.880 --> 0:44:05.440 You don't know what it's like to be on drugs. 0:44:05.560 --> 0:44:07.360 You don't know what it's like to be an abusive relationship. 0:44:07.440 --> 0:44:10.000 You don't know what it's still in the blank. I'm like, girl, Yes, 0:44:10.080 --> 0:44:12.640 I do lived it, been there and grown through it, 0:44:12.840 --> 0:44:14.399 and now it's time for you to do the same. 0:44:14.840 --> 0:44:17.160 And that's what I think my greatest gift is to 0:44:17.239 --> 0:44:20.319 this world right now. And it's only because of that vulnerability. 0:44:20.560 --> 0:44:23.799 Wow, that should be the stump speech. Can we make 0:44:23.840 --> 0:44:25.120 a teaser of that? 0:44:25.120 --> 0:44:27.560 That was so But you're right, the people that have 0:44:27.640 --> 0:44:29.520 been through the most have the most to give, and 0:44:29.600 --> 0:44:31.560 it's you're using it as a gift. 0:44:31.880 --> 0:44:33.680 Yeah, trying every single day. 0:44:33.960 --> 0:44:37.399 So I saw a pinch me moment before we went 0:44:37.440 --> 0:44:41.279 into lockdown. You were talking about how you met Oprah. 0:44:41.440 --> 0:44:44.120 Yes, was it everything you were hoping? Or was it? 0:44:44.400 --> 0:44:45.360 Was she a mere mortal? 0:44:46.600 --> 0:44:48.279 She was not a mere mortal, And I wish I 0:44:48.320 --> 0:44:51.839 could say she was. She floated, she floats to the room. 0:44:52.040 --> 0:44:55.120 She's beautiful, she's kind. But what humbled me? And I 0:44:55.200 --> 0:44:57.600 promise you one of my friends was with me when 0:44:57.600 --> 0:44:59.720 I met her the first time. I spent three hours 0:44:59.719 --> 0:45:02.360 crying in a corner because she came up to me 0:45:02.400 --> 0:45:05.040 and she said she knew my name already. She hugged me. 0:45:05.280 --> 0:45:06.759 I put a bit of it on my Instagram, like 0:45:06.800 --> 0:45:08.719 a video. She told me she was like. I had 0:45:08.760 --> 0:45:10.640 a shirt on and said Black Day gifted. She was there. 0:45:10.680 --> 0:45:12.000 She was like, oh my gosh. She was great and 0:45:12.040 --> 0:45:15.360 an actor. The whuha was finished. She turned to me 0:45:15.400 --> 0:45:17.920 and she was like, I've been watching you. What you're 0:45:17.920 --> 0:45:20.799 doing is great. You're next? And I was like, did 0:45:20.840 --> 0:45:22.280 Oprah to say I'm next? 0:45:22.520 --> 0:45:23.920 I don't even don't. I don't even know. 0:45:24.040 --> 0:45:25.719 She could have been talking about next to go eat, 0:45:25.840 --> 0:45:27.680 but in my mind I was like, she's telling me 0:45:27.719 --> 0:45:30.120 I'm next. Well, I know what you're saying. She was 0:45:30.160 --> 0:45:32.480 saying I was next. But I cried for three hours. 0:45:32.560 --> 0:45:34.600 I cried for three hours because it was such a validation. 0:45:34.920 --> 0:45:38.320 It was such validation from somebody I respect so much. 0:45:38.200 --> 0:45:41.360 And talk about that little kid being seen. 0:45:41.560 --> 0:45:45.319 Right, Oh my god, Oh my gosh, yes, I do. 0:45:45.160 --> 0:45:46.600 I think you're next. I believe that. 0:45:46.760 --> 0:45:47.719 Oh thank you. 0:45:47.880 --> 0:45:50.680 So I have some end rapid fires for you. 0:45:51.000 --> 0:45:52.120 I like it. Rapid fires. 0:45:52.160 --> 0:45:54.319 I will be as honest as I can do. 0:45:56.480 --> 0:45:59.239 Of course you're you, of course you will. Okay, this, 0:45:59.320 --> 0:46:00.640 I guess is not as rapid. 0:46:00.680 --> 0:46:03.719 But what is a lesson you learned in therapy that 0:46:03.840 --> 0:46:05.799 you wish everyone could have access to? 0:46:06.280 --> 0:46:08.799 Ooh, I tell people this all time. Comparison is the 0:46:08.800 --> 0:46:12.160 thief of joy. Comparison is the thief of joy. You 0:46:12.239 --> 0:46:14.120 keep looking at what other people have. You're forgetting what 0:46:14.200 --> 0:46:16.920 you already have. Don't compare your journey to other people's journey. 0:46:17.040 --> 0:46:19.040 Don't look at them and say why am I not married? Why? 0:46:19.280 --> 0:46:21.360 Why don't I have this? Why don't I have more money? 0:46:21.440 --> 0:46:23.640 Focus on you and be thankful what you have, and 0:46:23.680 --> 0:46:25.680 then take the steps every day to get to what 0:46:25.719 --> 0:46:26.560 you want and desire. 0:46:26.800 --> 0:46:31.160 Okay, let's go. The best part of being you right now, 0:46:31.280 --> 0:46:32.000 at the age. 0:46:31.760 --> 0:46:35.160 You're at, ooh, is that I have a lot of clarity. 0:46:35.480 --> 0:46:38.440 And I didn't have this clarity in my twenties. But 0:46:38.520 --> 0:46:41.360 I feel clear And that's such a beautiful feeling to 0:46:41.400 --> 0:46:43.920 wake up and feel clear about where I'm going. And 0:46:43.920 --> 0:46:46.200 it doesn't mean that every day I don't have challenges, 0:46:46.239 --> 0:46:48.880 but it means that I'm clear about how to handle 0:46:48.880 --> 0:46:51.040 the challenges. And to not let them get me down. 0:46:51.239 --> 0:46:53.280 How do you have the clarity and the same abs 0:46:53.320 --> 0:46:54.879 that you had when you were twenty It's like, it's 0:46:54.880 --> 0:46:55.880 not supposed to go. 0:46:55.880 --> 0:46:59.839 Like that quarantine. Oh please, I'm trying to get it down. 0:47:00.120 --> 0:47:01.960 Oh that does not exist for you. 0:47:03.040 --> 0:47:05.040 It got down for a little bit, but it came back. 0:47:06.560 --> 0:47:09.480 Okay, a book that shifted your perspective, something you think 0:47:09.600 --> 0:47:10.640 everybody should read. 0:47:11.080 --> 0:47:14.440 Oh, Jay shetties Think like a Monk? Really, Yes, he's 0:47:14.440 --> 0:47:16.520 a friend of mine, but I didn't buy his book 0:47:16.560 --> 0:47:19.439 because of that. I thought I just wanted to learn 0:47:19.480 --> 0:47:22.319 because he's really is someone who takes the time to 0:47:22.400 --> 0:47:25.680 really think about how you can be better in practical ways. 0:47:25.719 --> 0:47:27.960 Because I love people who are like self help, but 0:47:27.960 --> 0:47:29.800 a lot of them go with people's heads and I 0:47:30.520 --> 0:47:33.040 hate information that go with you. I need practical one, two, three, 0:47:33.040 --> 0:47:35.080 What do I do today? How do I start? How 0:47:35.120 --> 0:47:37.239 do I finish? You know all these things and Jay 0:47:37.280 --> 0:47:40.520 Shetty's book Think Like a Monk was extraordinary and giving 0:47:40.600 --> 0:47:43.440 me even new perspectives. So yeah, I would recommend that 0:47:43.600 --> 0:47:44.200 all day long. 0:47:44.239 --> 0:47:46.160 Okay, we're going to add that to the library. Thank you. 0:47:47.000 --> 0:47:49.440 A mentor or person that you've met on your journey 0:47:49.520 --> 0:47:52.640 that you think changed the trajectory of your life or 0:47:52.640 --> 0:47:54.280 made a real tremendous impact. 0:47:54.560 --> 0:47:55.920 Well, there's been a lot of those. 0:47:56.200 --> 0:47:57.440 I call those the angels. 0:47:57.560 --> 0:47:59.040 There's a lot of people, but I would tell you 0:47:59.080 --> 0:48:01.080 the one thing consists about all of them, as if 0:48:01.080 --> 0:48:05.160 they're all women. I think that women are the greater sex. 0:48:05.360 --> 0:48:07.680 Not to be a traitor to my gender, but I 0:48:07.680 --> 0:48:12.160 think they're the best. My strength, my vulnerability has always 0:48:12.160 --> 0:48:14.520 come from women guiding me. You know, I think that 0:48:14.600 --> 0:48:17.960 this world be a better place women were running it fully. 0:48:18.520 --> 0:48:20.160 And I'm not trying to say that all women are 0:48:20.320 --> 0:48:22.480 just perfect or anything, but I'm just like all of 0:48:22.520 --> 0:48:24.600 my mentors who have showed me how to be vulnerable, 0:48:24.640 --> 0:48:26.840 how to be kind but also be smart, be giving, 0:48:27.120 --> 0:48:30.320 have always been women. I'm the product of four sisters 0:48:30.320 --> 0:48:33.720 and my mom. Women have always been the best gift 0:48:33.800 --> 0:48:35.880 in my life and had been the best gift of 0:48:35.920 --> 0:48:38.960 this world. And so I just would say thank you 0:48:39.000 --> 0:48:41.400 to all women out there for you being you and 0:48:41.440 --> 0:48:43.120 for you putting up with the shit that you've dealt 0:48:43.120 --> 0:48:46.560 with and still coming out strong and loving and kind. 0:48:46.840 --> 0:48:50.799 And that's it. So women, all my mentors are women, right? 0:48:50.840 --> 0:48:53.240 So I do a pretty smart question and I picked 0:48:53.280 --> 0:48:55.400 one at random. I'm very excited at the one you 0:48:55.480 --> 0:48:57.320 got because you've been to a lot of great parties. 0:48:57.480 --> 0:48:59.960 What's the best party you've been to set the scene 0:49:00.200 --> 0:49:00.640 for us? 0:49:01.160 --> 0:49:03.920 Oh, the Vanity Fair Oscar Party. I've been now two 0:49:03.960 --> 0:49:06.160 years in a row. This would have been my third year, 0:49:06.480 --> 0:49:10.680 and when I tell you, it is amazing because you're 0:49:10.719 --> 0:49:13.800 literally standing next to some of like Hollywood's biggest stars 0:49:13.800 --> 0:49:16.080 and everyone is so comfortable. So I'm going to give 0:49:16.080 --> 0:49:19.680 you a story from last year. And it's funny because 0:49:19.719 --> 0:49:22.480 if my ex was here, he'd be screaming because he 0:49:22.560 --> 0:49:25.440 was there with me. But basically, I saw these people 0:49:25.480 --> 0:49:27.320 taking a photo. I was behind them and I was 0:49:27.320 --> 0:49:29.239 a little kiss like go I, and so I went 0:49:29.239 --> 0:49:31.680 behind them to sort of like crash the photo and 0:49:31.960 --> 0:49:34.399 I turned around. The person turned around and was like, 0:49:34.719 --> 0:49:37.200 oh my gosh, Karama, I love you. And I was like, 0:49:38.040 --> 0:49:41.400 I took a deep breath and it was Galdado, wonder 0:49:41.440 --> 0:49:44.279 Woman herself, and I was like, I was like, hi Gal. 0:49:44.440 --> 0:49:46.759 She was like, oh, Carmo, I love you. And I'm 0:49:46.800 --> 0:49:48.799 thinking I just was photobomming you. I didn't know who 0:49:48.800 --> 0:49:50.960 you were. I just went behind random people. And her 0:49:51.080 --> 0:49:53.440 husband was like, oh my gosh, she does love you, Caramo. 0:49:54.360 --> 0:49:57.400 She goes to sleep to your voice every night. I 0:49:57.440 --> 0:49:59.840 swear to god, I've never shared the story with anyone. 0:50:00.080 --> 0:50:04.040 And I was like, oh my gosh, thank you, Dal 0:50:04.480 --> 0:50:06.479 Just like the work that you're doing. I just really 0:50:06.480 --> 0:50:09.840 love it. And then next to her was Josh Dad 0:50:10.120 --> 0:50:12.160 and Josh was like, man, dude, I love you as well, 0:50:12.200 --> 0:50:14.080 like really, And I'm sitting here, I'm looking at this 0:50:14.120 --> 0:50:17.000 and I'm like, what the freaking fuck is Josh Dadd 0:50:17.040 --> 0:50:19.640 and Gal Galbado like saying they know me and they 0:50:19.719 --> 0:50:21.640 like me, and I was just like, it was mind blowing. 0:50:21.760 --> 0:50:25.160 But those are two really heartfelt actors. So it's because 0:50:25.160 --> 0:50:27.200 I feel like real recognize real. It was the law 0:50:27.239 --> 0:50:27.800 of attraction. 0:50:28.400 --> 0:50:29.480 It was the law of attraction. 0:50:29.520 --> 0:50:30.880 It was also the law of me being tipsy and 0:50:30.880 --> 0:50:33.000 me and super and nupty like you know whatever, but 0:50:33.520 --> 0:50:33.920 it was. 0:50:34.080 --> 0:50:36.759 It was amazing. And in that party I'm talking about, 0:50:36.760 --> 0:50:39.680 You're just coming across like mel Street, like you know, 0:50:39.840 --> 0:50:42.600 like Michael B. Jordan and we're just all hanging and talking. 0:50:42.880 --> 0:50:45.719 And for me, even when I'm in those situations. I 0:50:45.760 --> 0:50:48.400 still feel like the little gay boy in Texas that 0:50:48.520 --> 0:50:50.920 was shy and I just had to fight through it 0:50:50.920 --> 0:50:53.200 because I'm like, this may never happen again, so enjoy 0:50:53.280 --> 0:50:56.040 this moment. But Vandy Fair Party is the most exciting 0:50:56.040 --> 0:50:58.800 party I've ever been to in my life. The drinks 0:50:58.800 --> 0:51:01.280 are free, the food is free, and the people are 0:51:01.320 --> 0:51:02.440 just kind and beautiful. 0:51:02.719 --> 0:51:04.600 It sounds like it's one of the few that is 0:51:04.640 --> 0:51:07.120 even better irl than on Instagram. 0:51:07.200 --> 0:51:09.399 Oh my gosh, it's so much better in real life. 0:51:09.440 --> 0:51:10.080 Oh my gosh. 0:51:10.200 --> 0:51:13.280 Okay, because on Instagram and look, you see people still, 0:51:13.320 --> 0:51:16.239 but like when you're there, people are just dancing and 0:51:16.280 --> 0:51:18.160 having the best time, and you be in like a 0:51:18.280 --> 0:51:19.880 dance circle, and all of a sudden you'll be like, oh, 0:51:19.920 --> 0:51:22.520 I'm in a dance circle with Melissa McCarthy. I was 0:51:22.560 --> 0:51:26.120 literally in a dance like battle with Melissa McCarthy and 0:51:26.120 --> 0:51:27.840 her husband the year that they wore tracksuits to the 0:51:27.880 --> 0:51:28.560 Bandy Fairpark. 0:51:28.800 --> 0:51:32.160 Oh my god, I would say to see that video me. 0:51:32.200 --> 0:51:34.040 Too, I'm like, I just wish we were dancing and 0:51:34.040 --> 0:51:36.320 it was like crazy that You're like, what in the world. 0:51:36.320 --> 0:51:37.359 But anyway, that's when you. 0:51:37.320 --> 0:51:40.239 Need like a secret personal photographer following you around all night. 0:51:40.600 --> 0:51:41.360 Right, you do? 0:51:42.000 --> 0:51:42.239 You do? 0:51:42.640 --> 0:51:43.279 Okay, This is. 0:51:43.280 --> 0:51:46.880 The last question and you can take it however, like 0:51:46.960 --> 0:51:48.280 for whatever comes up first. 0:51:48.560 --> 0:51:50.800 What's the smartest decision you've ever made? 0:51:51.280 --> 0:51:53.360 Smart decision I ever made was to bet on myself 0:51:53.960 --> 0:51:57.120 because betting on myself for me meant then I trust 0:51:57.160 --> 0:51:59.600 that I had the ability to do what's going to 0:51:59.600 --> 0:52:02.879 be right myself, to never give up, to ask for help, 0:52:03.320 --> 0:52:05.319 to make a plan, you know, to bet on me 0:52:05.719 --> 0:52:07.719 because I think a lot of times we don't bet 0:52:07.719 --> 0:52:10.799 on ourselves, because we've been so broken down by what 0:52:10.840 --> 0:52:12.880 the world has done to us. And when you truly 0:52:12.880 --> 0:52:15.320 bet on yourself and you believe in yourself, the world 0:52:15.360 --> 0:52:17.640 opens up. And I've seen it happen to me, I've 0:52:17.680 --> 0:52:20.680 seen it happen to other people. So yeah, betting all myself. 0:52:21.080 --> 0:52:23.960 I love you so much. You are as beautiful on 0:52:24.000 --> 0:52:25.440 the inside as you are on the outside. 0:52:25.480 --> 0:52:26.160 It's very rare. 0:52:27.080 --> 0:52:29.040 I love you too, and the same goes to you. 0:52:29.120 --> 0:52:31.240 I really do appreciate you having me on your podcast. 0:52:31.400 --> 0:52:52.080 Talk to you soon, babe, I'll talk to you. 0:52:32.840 --> 0:52:55.320 Good day, all right, Today is a good day to 0:52:55.400 --> 0:52:59.080 have a good day. I'll see you next week,