1 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties, 2 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big 3 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:16,840 Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they 4 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: Welcome back to the podcast. New listeners, old listeners. Wherever 6 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: you are in the world, it is so great to 7 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:35,640 Speaker 1: have you here. Back for another episode as we, of 8 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: course break down the psychology of our twenties. Today, we're 9 00:00:40,120 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 1: going to dive into something that can be quite unsettling. 10 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 1: We're going to discuss the psychology of dissociation. Now you 11 00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: may have heard of this, you may have experienced this. 12 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: It is this disconnect we have at times between our 13 00:00:56,720 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: reality and ourselves. It's this feeling where like a weird, 14 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 1: blurry screen almost goes up between you and the world. 15 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: And let's be just completely honest straight off the bat, 16 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: it is super scary. It's honestly, really terrifying, and it's 17 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 1: also deeply misunderstood and something that because it feels so terrifying, 18 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:21,840 Speaker 1: we don't talk about because we think it's going to 19 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: validate the thoughts that we have about the experience, and 20 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 1: that actually means that the panic that we feel or 21 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 1: the stress becomes a lot stronger. When I say dissociation, 22 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 1: I want you to think of a very old, very 23 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,679 Speaker 1: dramatic survival strategy that our brain has. It is this 24 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: ability that we all have to disconnect from our thoughts, 25 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:50,559 Speaker 1: our feelings, our surroundings when things get really overwhelming. Now, 26 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,000 Speaker 1: because it's automatic, that's why we have a lot of 27 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: confusion and fear towards the sensations that it brings up, 28 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 1: even though it's not our actually a sign always of 29 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 1: anything actually going wrong within our brains and within our psychology. 30 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,120 Speaker 1: This is something that I think is really helpful to 31 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 1: understand if you have been experiencing dissociation recently, sometimes dip 32 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 1: into this state of mind. It doesn't necessarily mean that 33 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: you are going so called crazy, that you are losing 34 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: your mind, that you are losing touch with reality. There 35 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: are a lot of other explanations that I think are 36 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:34,079 Speaker 1: really helpful just to know about. So that's what we're 37 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:35,799 Speaker 1: going to talk about today. We're going to talk about 38 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:39,519 Speaker 1: why it happens, what it is most importantly as well, 39 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: what you can actually do when your brain kind of 40 00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 1: seems to stop being sure of whether you're here or not, 41 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:49,880 Speaker 1: because you most certainly are. I can promise you that 42 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: you are here, You are alive, The world is real. 43 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 1: You just need to find ways to get back in 44 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:57,679 Speaker 1: touch with the parts of your brain that will help 45 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 1: you believe that. We have quite a science packed episode 46 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: today for you guys, which I know a lot of 47 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,800 Speaker 1: you love. And sometimes I think with something as irrational 48 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:11,640 Speaker 1: as dissociation, like the only real like counterweight is just 49 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:13,800 Speaker 1: to hit it with like a fist full of reason 50 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 1: and rationality, and that's hopefully what we're going to do. 51 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 1: I also want to talk about my own experience with this. 52 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 1: I literally had a moment like this last night, and 53 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 1: there are a couple of strategies that I always use 54 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 1: that I find pretty full proof that I want to 55 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 1: also kind of let you guys in on as well, 56 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: to hopefully help you in these like scary moments. So 57 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 1: you're going to get the personal insights, you're also going 58 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 1: to get the scientific background, the perfect combination, if you 59 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: ask me, without further ado, let's get into the psychology 60 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 1: of dissociation. Let's start super simple. Dissociation is one of 61 00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: those words that floats around a lot in mental health conversations, 62 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 1: but it is of course often misunderstood honestly at this stage, 63 00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: like what term isn't misunderstood? But I always feel the 64 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: need to just give like a bare minimum definition at 65 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: the beginning, even if you've heard of the thing we're 66 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:14,160 Speaker 1: talking about before. 67 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: So. In psychology, dissociation refers to basically a disruption in 68 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 2: the normal integration of consciousness, memory, identity, emotion, and perception. 69 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 2: In other words, it's what happens when parts of our 70 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: mental experience, our thoughts, our awareness, our connection to our 71 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 2: body or the world around us, it just kind of 72 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 2: stops lining up in the ways that it usually would. 73 00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 2: And it's often because we are avoiding some kind of 74 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:49,279 Speaker 2: emotional information or emotional pain to protect our fragile psyche, 75 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 2: our sense of continuity. This thing that you know, joins ourselves, 76 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,039 Speaker 2: that joins time, our actions, the world around us into 77 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 2: one singular thing and singular exca experience that becomes fractured. 78 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 2: And we feel that fracturing as intense discomfort, anxiety, but 79 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 2: also like there is a fuzziness to our experiences that 80 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,119 Speaker 2: you know, maybe we're not really here or the world 81 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: around us isn't here either. Now, both of these things 82 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 2: being here and the world existing are pretty fundamental to 83 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 2: our sense of psychological stability. That is probably the understatement 84 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 2: of a lifetime. And that's why this creates so much terror. 85 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 2: It's not because those things are true. It's because the 86 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 2: possibility of them being true makes us feel like we 87 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 2: don't really know anything. Pierre Janet he was a French 88 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 2: psychologist writing in the late nineteenth century. He was actually 89 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 2: one of the first to start to describe dissociation, and 90 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:50,720 Speaker 2: he described it as a breakdown in the mind's integrative capacity. 91 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 2: And what he essentially concluded when he was looking at 92 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 2: patients he was looking at people with extreme trauma, was 93 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 2: that when stress or trauma overwhelms us, the brain breaks 94 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 2: up how it experiences that in order to protect deeper 95 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 2: parts of ourselves. It is our brain, as he says, 96 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:14,039 Speaker 2: trying to survive hard things so that our soul suffers less. 97 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 2: That's one explanation. It is not, as some movies would suggest, 98 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 2: someone flipping into a completely different person without warning like 99 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 2: it does not make you dangerous. It is also not 100 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 2: the same thing as psychosis. Dissociation can feel strange, and 101 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:35,680 Speaker 2: it can feel scary and floaty. It doesn't mean that 102 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 2: you're losing touch with reality in a psychotic sense. It 103 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 2: doesn't also mean that you may be having delusions or 104 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 2: hallucinations that could or maybe would indicate a more serious diagnosis, 105 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 2: like schizophrenia, for example. A lot of other things have 106 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 2: to be present and happening for that to be considered. 107 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 2: Dissociation cannot be your only symptom, you know, psychosis, you 108 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:03,680 Speaker 2: have to be delusional, You have to really not be 109 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 2: able to question the fact that maybe what you're thinking 110 00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: is wrong. Dissociation, though, there is like a part of 111 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:12,560 Speaker 2: you that knows that this probably isn't real and that 112 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 2: can recognize that this is some kind of split, and 113 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 2: it's a defense mechanism. They definitely overlap at times. But 114 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 2: I just feel the need to address this because it's 115 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:27,000 Speaker 2: a common fear that I've had and that I know 116 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 2: other people have had that they're dissociating, They're feelings super weird, 117 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 2: super unreal, and they think that maybe this is a 118 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 2: sign of something a lot more serious to do with 119 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:39,880 Speaker 2: their mental stability, that they are developing schizophrenia, that they 120 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 2: are going into a psychotic episode. The majority of the time, 121 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 2: I can promise you that is not the case. Now. 122 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 2: Dissociation also exists on a spectrum, and the other thing 123 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 2: that's important to note is that pretty much everyone will 124 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 2: experience some level of this in their life. Maybe that's 125 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 2: comforting to you, you know. At one end of the spectrum, 126 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 2: the most extreme end, we have dissociative identity disorder also 127 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 2: known as multiple personality disorder. That is like the most 128 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 2: extreme version of this, But for most people, the everyday 129 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 2: experience of dissociation is just you know, blanking out during 130 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 2: a stressful conversation, losing a few minutes, feeling disconnected during 131 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 2: exam season, after a breakup during a really hard day. 132 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 2: Now you've probably heard of depersonalization as well, and derealization. 133 00:08:33,200 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 2: These are basically forms of dissociation that people may experience differently. 134 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 2: So we have dissociation as like the blanket idea of 135 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 2: feeling disconnected, feeling that there's a lack of continuity. Then 136 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 2: we have underneath that depersonalization. And this is when this 137 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: feeling of being disconnected is feeling disconnected from your own 138 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 2: body or your own thoughts, like you're kind of watching 139 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 2: yourself from the outside. In this form, you don't feel real, 140 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 2: the world feels real, You're seeing things happen to you 141 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 2: and to your life or your environment. You just don't 142 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 2: feel it. Then there's demrealization, and that's when the world 143 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:18,480 Speaker 2: seems fake but you feel real. The world feels colorless, flat, 144 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 2: dream like. You know you exist, but there's all these 145 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 2: questions of like, how can I be sure that what 146 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 2: I'm seeing and observing isn't just a figment of my imagination. 147 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:31,360 Speaker 2: Obviously that's quite existential, and it can really make you 148 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 2: feel detached from the world around you. It's not always 149 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:37,560 Speaker 2: cause for concern. Some other forms of this that you 150 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 2: may see or hear discussed are dissociative amnesia. This is 151 00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 2: a lot less common. It's when you can't recall personal information, 152 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 2: especially around like traumatic or highly stressful events in your life. 153 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 2: Clinicians will also talk about peri traumatic dissociation, which is 154 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 2: kind of similar. It's like the kind of association that 155 00:09:57,080 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 2: happens right after a traumatic event, and also chronic dissociation, 156 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:06,320 Speaker 2: which is when this detached state exists long after the 157 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 2: triggering event has occurred and then just a circle all 158 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 2: the way back because I feel like I didn't give 159 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 2: it enough attention. We have dissociative identity disorder. This is 160 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:21,480 Speaker 2: the idea that when someone goes through something really terrible, 161 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 2: their personality can literally split so that they are they 162 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:30,719 Speaker 2: completely dissociate from who they are and all of their 163 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:35,199 Speaker 2: thoughts and feelings become contained by another personality. This is 164 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 2: extremely rare, and it's even worth noting that its existence 165 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 2: is even disputed by some. I definitely think that it exists, 166 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 2: Like there's definitely there are so many cases of this happening. 167 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 2: But we're going to talk more about that later and 168 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:53,839 Speaker 2: how and when that develops within somebody. Most of the time, 169 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 2: what you will be experiencing is just everyday dissociation. This 170 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:00,559 Speaker 2: is what happens when you know you're driving home from 171 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 2: work and you don't remember the last ten minutes, or 172 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:07,120 Speaker 2: you're zoning out during a conversation, or like you blink 173 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 2: in an hour's past. It's like you go into some 174 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,800 Speaker 2: kind of trance. Sometimes it's called highway hypnosis or white 175 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:16,679 Speaker 2: lined fever. Especially like when you're driving. You can just 176 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 2: see that there are very different levels of this feeling, 177 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:25,440 Speaker 2: and I think that's really crucial to understand so that 178 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:28,920 Speaker 2: we don't experience association and suddenly think that we're going 179 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 2: to split into a completely different person. Sometimes it's just 180 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:37,320 Speaker 2: because you're tired, or you're stressed, or you know, from 181 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 2: a myriad of other factors you're experiencing this. You have 182 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:44,439 Speaker 2: to understand that this is actually your brain doing exactly 183 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 2: what it has evolved to do, which is protect you, 184 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 2: no matter how scary or shocking it is. At its core, 185 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 2: this is just a coping mechanism. Even if it's made 186 00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 2: like life feel very non linear or blurry or odd, 187 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:02,320 Speaker 2: you and we will come back. Your brain is just 188 00:12:02,520 --> 00:12:04,960 Speaker 2: going a little bit too far. And I know that 189 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 2: my brain does this for everything right. My brain loves 190 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 2: to do things at one hundred and fifty percent, whether 191 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:14,439 Speaker 2: it comes to love, whether it comes to ambition, perfectionism, anxiety, 192 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,439 Speaker 2: and it also does that with dissociation. It just takes 193 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:21,160 Speaker 2: it too far. This is really often in response to 194 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,560 Speaker 2: some kind of threat that we have either been able 195 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:28,199 Speaker 2: to consciously detect or not so. According to what we 196 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 2: know as polyvagal theory, our nervous system when it sees 197 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 2: or encounters a threat follows a bit of a hierarchy. 198 00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 2: First we feel the urge to fight, then flight, so 199 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 2: then run away, and if neither of those is possible, 200 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 2: if the danger feels inescapable, the body will shift into 201 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 2: a free state or a shutdown state. Dissociation is what 202 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 2: is linked to that last pathway. It's also sometimes called 203 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 2: the dorsal vaguel state vaguel meaning agual nerve. This is 204 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:05,880 Speaker 2: the body's longest nerve. It's the main pathway for regulating 205 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 2: almost every system in our body, specifically our power sympathetic 206 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 2: nervous system, which slows things down, shuts things off. So 207 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:17,000 Speaker 2: when we experienced dissociation, that state is triggered, and that 208 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 2: is what's creating this narrowing of awareness, this kind of detachment, 209 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 2: lack of focus. It's what causes our heart rate to drop. 210 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 2: It's your nervous system basically saying, if I can't escape this, 211 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:35,400 Speaker 2: if I can't fight back against this, I'll just disconnect 212 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 2: and maybe I'll survive with a few less emotional scars, 213 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 2: or at least with some energy for later. When we 214 00:13:42,520 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 2: look at the brain, neuroimaging studies will show that something 215 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:51,440 Speaker 2: fascinating happens during this process. When people with trauma related 216 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:56,599 Speaker 2: or stress related association are reminded of distressing experiences or 217 00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 2: put into a stressed state, the amygdala, our brain's alarm system, 218 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 2: often actually shows reduced activity compared to the intense activation 219 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:10,959 Speaker 2: that you would expect if someone was in a hyper 220 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 2: aroused state. So this gets kind of complicated here. But 221 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,559 Speaker 2: how people respond to trauma is different. Some of them 222 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:22,040 Speaker 2: have hyper arousal, some of them have hypo arousal. So 223 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 2: either you stay in this quarters or fight or flight 224 00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 2: state and you are constantly hypervigionant or alert, or some 225 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 2: people go this way and they stay in this dissociative 226 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 2: or hypo arousal state where they kind of just tune 227 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 2: out and they feel completely disconnected. In those cases, the 228 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,800 Speaker 2: part of our brain that would usually be like everything's 229 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 2: on fire, like run, run, run. For people who are 230 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 2: experiencing dissociation, perhaps more than others, it seems that that 231 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 2: part of their brain something is kind of not working. 232 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 2: There's not as much communication going on. Meanwhile, there's another 233 00:14:57,160 --> 00:15:00,160 Speaker 2: part of our brain that is important for integrating emotion 234 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 2: and for regulating emotions, and during this state it also 235 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 2: goes quiet. This is important because this is the prefrontal 236 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 2: cortex that's responsible for these things. When that goes offline, 237 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 2: we lose a lot of our sense of processing, rational processing, 238 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 2: and a sense of like I'm here and this is 239 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 2: happening now we can lose our sense of being present, 240 00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:27,000 Speaker 2: which is probably what's creating that weird feeling. There's one 241 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 2: final area of the brain that's involved, and that is 242 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 2: the insular cortex. This is basically your ability to introspect, 243 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 2: your ability to feel your body, your body's signals to 244 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 2: understand that you are here. And it also shows dampened 245 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 2: activation during dissociation. So all of these things are kind 246 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:56,520 Speaker 2: of combining. And when you dissociate, your brain is basically 247 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 2: trying to reroot around a bunch of systems that have 248 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 2: all walked out on you. It's trying to get to 249 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 2: the place. The thought patterns, the things in your thoughts 250 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 2: in your brain are trying to get to the same place, 251 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:10,800 Speaker 2: and there's a whole lot of roads that are not working, 252 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 2: so it takes longer to get there, and maybe those 253 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 2: messages never get there. Our awareness of our bodies, of 254 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 2: our emotions, of our sense of continuity, of our memories, 255 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 2: they've all been switched off, flooded, overwhelmed. And again it's 256 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 2: this protective reflex that we have evolved as humans so 257 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 2: that we can survive hard things. Research shows that healthy 258 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 2: adults can experience dissociation. Yes, because of trauma, but also 259 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 2: because of really every day I don't want to say 260 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 2: simple but common things, intense anxiety, stress from conflict, from exams, 261 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 2: from work, even when they're just exhausted. For example, a 262 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 2: twenty fourteen study published in the Journal of Behavior Therapy 263 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 2: and Experts Mental Psychiatry looked at a sample of five 264 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:07,440 Speaker 2: hundred and sixty healthy participants who didn't have any serious 265 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 2: mental health conditions, and they basically split them into two groups. 266 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,120 Speaker 2: Half of the participants were placed in the experimental condition. 267 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 2: They were deprived of sleep for thirty six hours. The 268 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 2: other half had a super normal night sleep. They then 269 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 2: asked the participants to rate their levels of sleepiness, their 270 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 2: mood symptoms, their dissociative symptoms, and what they found was 271 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:35,920 Speaker 2: that sleep deprivation alone can push people into a dissociative 272 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 2: moment or state of mind. It can make them depersonalize 273 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 2: or make them derealize. So again, you're not going and 274 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:47,000 Speaker 2: I'm going to use air quotes here you can't see 275 00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:50,840 Speaker 2: me use them, But you are not going crazy. Sometimes 276 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 2: it's just that you are tired, you are overwhelmed, you 277 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:57,440 Speaker 2: are at a low your brain doesn't have the same cognitive, psychological, 278 00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 2: and mental resources that it usually would just shuts things down. 279 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:08,640 Speaker 2: It will pass these everyday stresses. They feel big, they 280 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 2: feel scary. They're also typically short lived. It's just that 281 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 2: your nervous system doesn't discriminate. It's just trying to do 282 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,880 Speaker 2: what it's meant to do. It has like its manual 283 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:21,959 Speaker 2: in front of it. It's reading from the manual, and 284 00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:24,960 Speaker 2: it's not very flexible. It's just this is what I've 285 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,119 Speaker 2: been told to do. This is the systems that I 286 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 2: have available to me. They're feeling stressed. Okay, my manual 287 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 2: tells me press this button. That's what's happening to your 288 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 2: brain right now. Okay, we're going to take a short 289 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:40,159 Speaker 2: break here, but when we return, I want to talk 290 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:44,360 Speaker 2: about the unique relationship between ADHD and dissociation as well 291 00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 2: as trauma and dissociation. Stay with us. We will be 292 00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:56,119 Speaker 2: right back. So something that you may not know, or 293 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 2: maybe you do. I don't know what you do and 294 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:01,880 Speaker 2: don't know, but I certainly wasn't entirely over this idea 295 00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:06,879 Speaker 2: is that dissociation and ADHD are actually deeply linked. People 296 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,400 Speaker 2: with ADHD, for example, may find that everyday stresses are 297 00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:14,760 Speaker 2: even more extreme, meaning their brain has to rely on 298 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:20,960 Speaker 2: association more. There's the sensory overload, there's the cognitive load 299 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:25,639 Speaker 2: of having to juggle multiple tasks of shifting attention, remembering deadlines, 300 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:31,679 Speaker 2: managing impulses, plus the emotional dysregulation that people with ADHD 301 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:36,120 Speaker 2: can experience where small things trigger really big reactions. All 302 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:39,480 Speaker 2: of this adds up. The nervous system for someone with 303 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 2: ADHD is constantly taxed, and when that combination of sensory, cognitive, 304 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:49,399 Speaker 2: and emotional demands reaches a tipping point, the brain again 305 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 2: presses the button, activates the same protective mechanisms that we 306 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 2: sometimes see as a trauma response, even if no trauma 307 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 2: is actually present. Dissociation in the sense is not caused 308 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,879 Speaker 2: by ADHD itself, but it often is something that a 309 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,720 Speaker 2: lot of people find themselves slipping into in these moments 310 00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 2: because it's just the only way to survive the overload. 311 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: It's also worth noting that dissociation and ADHD in particular 312 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,359 Speaker 2: can be very very subtle, so a lot of people 313 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 2: don't always put this label on it. It might show 314 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,040 Speaker 2: up as zoning out a lot more, which people can 315 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,800 Speaker 2: get frustrated at. You for even though you know you're 316 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:35,359 Speaker 2: not deliberately trying to do it, losing track of time 317 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:39,440 Speaker 2: whilst you're hyper focusing on a task. Some people have 318 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 2: labeled that as a form of dissociation or just feeling 319 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:48,479 Speaker 2: really really numb during moments of high stress, like someone is, 320 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:53,720 Speaker 2: you know, bringing something to you, or someone is putting 321 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 2: something on your plate that needs to be done immediately, 322 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 2: and you just operate. You can just do it. This 323 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 2: is like a weird skill that I have a couple 324 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 2: friends with ADHD that they just seem to be able 325 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 2: to do where it's like everyone else is freaking out 326 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 2: and normally I would assume that they would be having 327 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,160 Speaker 2: the same, if not a more emotional reaction, and they 328 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 2: just become like hyper focused and they can just deal 329 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:21,400 Speaker 2: with it. This may be again because of this high 330 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 2: reliance on association, the brain can use it to its 331 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 2: advantage during these moments. There is also, of course a 332 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 2: link between dissociation and anxiety and depression and other mood disorders. 333 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 2: But the biggest risk factor here, like the one that 334 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:42,680 Speaker 2: everyone is going to talk to you about if you 335 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 2: mentioned association in an academic room or in a room 336 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 2: full of psychologists, is trauma. Trauma is the biggest thing 337 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 2: that researchers will cite for you when it comes to association. 338 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,560 Speaker 2: There was a recent report that suggests that the rates 339 00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:04,320 Speaker 2: of dissociation are almost sixty to seventy percent higher in 340 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 2: people have experienced trauma than the average individual. That is 341 00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 2: one of the most replicated findings you will find from 342 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:18,920 Speaker 2: the last fifty years in psychology. Trauma and dissociation are 343 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 2: like two p's in a pod. I feel like we've 344 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 2: been talking about trauma a lot on the podcast recently, 345 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:28,440 Speaker 2: and just the hard parts of being human and how 346 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 2: our brain and our bodies respond to that. It's been 347 00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:34,000 Speaker 2: like a common theme for us in the last couple 348 00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,240 Speaker 2: of months. I don't know if you've noticed, but I 349 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 2: think it's because the deeper you get into the literature 350 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:42,760 Speaker 2: on these topics, the more you kind of realize how 351 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:49,480 Speaker 2: deeply shaped we are by the negative experiences that we 352 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 2: may have, and how the body instinctively holds onto these 353 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,199 Speaker 2: experiences for better or for worse, in ways that do 354 00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 2: end up shaping our personality, and how we respond to 355 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 2: things without even knowing. Emotional abuse, neglect, inconsistent caregiving, but 356 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:11,280 Speaker 2: also childhood bullying, surviving a natural disaster, surviving your parents 357 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:15,719 Speaker 2: divorce that can create a blueprint for dissociation later on 358 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 2: in life. So there is this theory called the structural 359 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 2: dissociation theory that explains why, according to this model, when 360 00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:32,400 Speaker 2: a child experiences repeated overwhelming stress, you know, hearing their 361 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:37,000 Speaker 2: parents constantly fighting, being threatened by a caregiver, being at 362 00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,480 Speaker 2: school seven to eight hours a day, and feeling like 363 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 2: they need to hide or you know, have to look 364 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 2: over their shoulder, or are just constantly feeling out of place, 365 00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:50,400 Speaker 2: their personality can actually split into what we call apparently 366 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 2: normal parts or ANPs, which is what they use to 367 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:59,199 Speaker 2: handle daily life, and then emotional parts epis, which are 368 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:02,800 Speaker 2: the parts of them that's store the unprocessed trauma. The 369 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:06,880 Speaker 2: system learns to switch between these parts as a survival 370 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:13,040 Speaker 2: strategy at school, you know, with a parent, the apparently 371 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 2: normal parts, the A and P s will be on display, 372 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 2: but then there are these emotional parts that are hid 373 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 2: in a way that they only briefly kind of dip 374 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 2: into that they don't really want to touch. Their brain 375 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 2: doesn't really want to touch, but is still there. In practice, 376 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:31,160 Speaker 2: this means that even as adults, people with this kind 377 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 2: of history. Can experience dissociation when a trigger comes into 378 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:39,679 Speaker 2: their life that echoes the original trauma. A loud voice, 379 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:43,679 Speaker 2: a threatening tone, a situation where they feel powerless, even 380 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 2: like relationship difficulties or conflict can cause people to be like, 381 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 2: I know how to deal with this. I'll just slip 382 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:58,240 Speaker 2: this mask on. I'll just fade out of this, and here, 383 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 2: in this state, I can be saved, even if I 384 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 2: feel completely weird. It's not that the present is objectively dangerous. 385 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 2: It's just that the nervous system again recognizes an environmental 386 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 2: queue that resembles past trauma, and these patterns from early 387 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 2: life switch us into protective mode, because what else is 388 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 2: your body going to do? Just ignore when it thinks 389 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 2: something dangerous is about to happen, that's not its programming. 390 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 2: This is where dissociation can become really maladaptive, when it's 391 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,239 Speaker 2: responding to threats that aren't there anymore, or when it 392 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 2: becomes the only strategy that our brain keeps going back 393 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:42,320 Speaker 2: to when things are scary and when better options are 394 00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:46,639 Speaker 2: available for it. If your brain again learns that the 395 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:50,359 Speaker 2: early world is dangerous and the only way to keep 396 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 2: going through this is to put large parts of that 397 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 2: experience offline, or to kind of float above the world 398 00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 2: or float above yourself, dissociative patterns can become stabilized. I 399 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,119 Speaker 2: was actually reading up on a bunch of cases about 400 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 2: this in a couple of psychiatric journals, just to see 401 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,880 Speaker 2: how this presents, and there was one case, actually, there's 402 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 2: a couple cases I'll reach you that were super interesting. 403 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,200 Speaker 2: The first was of a young twenty one year old guy, 404 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 2: and he experienced a really bad dissociative episode when he 405 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 2: got back in touch with his estranged father and he's 406 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 2: associated for I think it was like three or four days. 407 00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 2: He couldn't remember being admitted into a psychiatric hospital. He 408 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 2: couldn't remember anything that had happened to him in the 409 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,440 Speaker 2: last three to four days of his life, despite being really, 410 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:44,520 Speaker 2: really healthy and otherwise completely fine. And afterwards he told 411 00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 2: physicians that the last time this had happened to him 412 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 2: was surprise, surprise, when he was a young kid and 413 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,399 Speaker 2: he'd last seen his father. You know, it'd been years. 414 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 2: I think for him, maybe he had even been over 415 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 2: a decade since he'd seen his father, and yet he 416 00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 2: was right back there. And this ancient part of our 417 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 2: brain is like, okay, I know what to do here. 418 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,879 Speaker 2: Another case I read was someone in their fifties who 419 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 2: reported that at twenty four, it was like her life 420 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:22,760 Speaker 2: suddenly changed color and she felt like everything became dampant 421 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,200 Speaker 2: after a serious traumatic event, and since then she'd only 422 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,440 Speaker 2: had a few moments every year when she had felt normal. 423 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 2: But she actually was telling physicians that like she liked 424 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 2: how she felt. She was like, I don't I know 425 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 2: it's a problem. My family tells me it's a problem, 426 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 2: but I like this feeling of sometimes not feeling real 427 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,160 Speaker 2: or not feeling like the world is real, or detaching 428 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:52,359 Speaker 2: myself from what's going on around me. It just feels 429 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 2: more peaceful. Again, a maladaptive coping strategy. It's probably about 430 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 2: time we bring up dissociated any disorder, and what we 431 00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:07,199 Speaker 2: previously knew is multiple personality disorder, because when trauma is 432 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:11,920 Speaker 2: really extreme, there is this thing that can happen, this 433 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 2: phenomena where someone's personality splits so deeply that they feel 434 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 2: like they are different people at different times. Now, this 435 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 2: is not everyday dissociation. This is not feeling unreal and 436 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:32,000 Speaker 2: panicked by that feeling. This is when children, especially go 437 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,480 Speaker 2: through such a terrible thing in their life that the 438 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 2: only way they endure it is to say, is to 439 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 2: almost create an alter or a persona that it's happening 440 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 2: to that is not them, as a way to protect 441 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 2: their ego and those people. Once they are created in 442 00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 2: their mind, it's very hard to kill them. Some people 443 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,920 Speaker 2: even have amnesia about this. There's an incredible YouTube video 444 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 2: that I think you should watch titled oh Okay, I 445 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 2: need to remember. I think it's titled Living with Twelve 446 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 2: Alternative Personalities for sixty years, and it interviews a woman 447 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 2: called Amanda who has twelve altars, twelve different personalities that 448 00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 2: have emerged from and through traumatic periods in her life. 449 00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 2: Some of them are children, some of them are teenagers, 450 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 2: some of them are men, some of them are women, 451 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,840 Speaker 2: some of them are older, and she switches between them, 452 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 2: sometimes on a daily, sometimes monthly. They feel like she's 453 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 2: like I when I am in this person, I am 454 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 2: this person. I don't have amnesia about it. Like the 455 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 2: way she tries to explain it is like someone trying 456 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 2: to explain colors that don't exist, Like you just probably 457 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,960 Speaker 2: can't see it or understand it unless you are her. 458 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 2: And she describes the first time she experienced this as 459 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,240 Speaker 2: a child, when something horrible happened to her, and she 460 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 2: again was like, this is not happening to me, This 461 00:29:58,240 --> 00:29:59,200 Speaker 2: is happening to Jenny. 462 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: Jenny. 463 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 2: And then Jenny was this part of her personality that 464 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:08,800 Speaker 2: dissociated and broke off, and she just kept relying on 465 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 2: this strategy and kept splitting until she is the person 466 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,560 Speaker 2: she is today. What's so interesting and what I found 467 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 2: so interesting about this video was she was like, they 468 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 2: all have different opinions, They kind of have different voices, 469 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 2: they have different even political beliefs, different food preferences. And 470 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 2: she even in this interview like switches between her and 471 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,240 Speaker 2: I think the guy like one of her personalities called 472 00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:36,720 Speaker 2: Bradley like on camera. And the reason I bring this 473 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 2: this extreme case up is because firstly, I think it's 474 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 2: important to see the level, like the maximum level at 475 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 2: which this can develop to. It's almost comforting to know 476 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 2: that like even if that was where I ended up 477 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,240 Speaker 2: or you ended up, like you would still be okay. 478 00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 2: This woman seems actually very happy and very loved. But 479 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 2: also because in those unique cases you really can see 480 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 2: the anatomy of this mechanism. You can see exactly more clearly, 481 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 2: I guess what is happening to you. You are obviously 482 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:15,560 Speaker 2: not splitting into a different personality, but it's the same premise. 483 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,880 Speaker 2: Your brain just needs a break, it just needs to 484 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 2: clock out for a little bit. I will say it's 485 00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:27,200 Speaker 2: very unlikely that this will happen to you, especially if 486 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 2: you are over the age of twelve. You have to 487 00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:33,680 Speaker 2: have experienced intense trauma in your childhood to be diagnosed 488 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 2: with this associative identity disorder. Obviously, some people get diagnosed 489 00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:41,720 Speaker 2: later in life, but I think it's important to realize 490 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 2: that these really intense cases are super rare. So if 491 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:51,000 Speaker 2: you're experiencing everyday dissociation, yes it's really scary, but you're 492 00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 2: probably not going to end up in this extreme state, 493 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,080 Speaker 2: and even if you do, you will survive. You may 494 00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 2: have relied on dissociation for a long time without realizing it. 495 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:07,080 Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that you're always going to feel this 496 00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,760 Speaker 2: way or be in this state. The good news is 497 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 2: that your nervous system is completely plastic. It is changeable. 498 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: There is a way to switch off chronic associative responses 499 00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 2: and to really feel more in touch with reality and 500 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,400 Speaker 2: the feeling of being real and the feeling of being alive, 501 00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 2: even if maybe that is in itself equally equally like confronting, 502 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:34,959 Speaker 2: it's good to know the possibility is there and that 503 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 2: you can remove this filter over your experiences. And that's 504 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:42,960 Speaker 2: what we're going to talk about next. When dissociation feels scary, 505 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:48,040 Speaker 2: when personalization derealization takes over, how do you bring your 506 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:52,200 Speaker 2: self back successfully stick around. We're going to talk about 507 00:32:52,200 --> 00:33:00,120 Speaker 2: all of that and more after this short break in 508 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 2: True Psychology of your twenties fashion, I want to give 509 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 2: you some strategies that might help if you have noticed 510 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:10,400 Speaker 2: in yourself that you have a tendency to not feel real, 511 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 2: to not feel like the world is real, or to dissociate. 512 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 2: Like I said, this is something that I experience quite 513 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 2: a bit, especially when I'm sleep deprived, especially when I'm stressed, 514 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 2: especially when I have a lot on my plate. I 515 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 2: often find that I will have these like really scary 516 00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:34,040 Speaker 2: moments right before I go to bed, where automatically my 517 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,840 Speaker 2: brain is like, oh, well, did you know that you're 518 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,120 Speaker 2: not actually real and that you're not actually here? And 519 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,640 Speaker 2: I'm like, can we can we cut with can we 520 00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 2: not with that? Like I'm sick of feeling this way, 521 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,120 Speaker 2: like let's let's cut the cameras on that one. But 522 00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,840 Speaker 2: I have actually discovered some really helpful strategies that like 523 00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,640 Speaker 2: make me the boss of that feeling and immediately kind 524 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:57,360 Speaker 2: of shut it up to be like the most polite 525 00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 2: about it. You know a lot of people talk about ground, 526 00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 2: you know, naming five things that you can see here, feel, 527 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 2: maybe even taste, placing your feet on the grass, in 528 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 2: the dirt, in the sand, and really connecting with the earth. 529 00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 2: Those are all great strategies, probably the ones that we know, 530 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:18,560 Speaker 2: and sometimes it just doesn't cut it. So here are 531 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,839 Speaker 2: some things that might take this to the next level 532 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:22,719 Speaker 2: for you and might actually be able to pull you 533 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:26,839 Speaker 2: back into the world when association hits. The first being 534 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:32,120 Speaker 2: safety scaffolding. If dissociation happens, it really helps to have 535 00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:36,920 Speaker 2: a predictable, low effort ritual that signals safety to your 536 00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,839 Speaker 2: nervous system. That could be a short recorded audio that 537 00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,600 Speaker 2: you've made of your own voice saying a really calming 538 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,720 Speaker 2: mantra or just saying, hey, I know you're not feeling 539 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 2: real right now, I can promise you definitely are. It 540 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,520 Speaker 2: could also be the voice of someone else, like a 541 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:57,640 Speaker 2: meditation that you always come back to the familiarity of 542 00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:59,560 Speaker 2: the voice, whether it's your own or a voice that 543 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 2: you listen to a lot, reduces the initial alarm state 544 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,600 Speaker 2: that you might be feeling because it signals, Okay, something 545 00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:10,360 Speaker 2: I know well and something I know to be true 546 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:16,040 Speaker 2: is here. I must be present because this is something 547 00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,359 Speaker 2: that I keep coming back to. This is something that 548 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:23,359 Speaker 2: has been continuous, this mantra from myself, this meditation has 549 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:27,680 Speaker 2: always been here through these moments. It's just like having 550 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:31,759 Speaker 2: an anchor to hold onto. Another kind of scaffolding is 551 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:37,440 Speaker 2: anything sensory, A Rubik's cube, a mint lozenge, chewing gum, 552 00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,400 Speaker 2: something like that. I've also given this tip before. Warheads 553 00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 2: sour candies have been a lifesaver for me in these 554 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:50,120 Speaker 2: moments because the extreme sensory experience of this candy, it 555 00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:53,160 Speaker 2: like genuinely shocks me and brings me back into the 556 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:56,719 Speaker 2: present because it's something that I cannot ignore. It is 557 00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 2: this like real thing that is like, of course you're alive, 558 00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 2: because how could I be alive and be experiencing or 559 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,960 Speaker 2: not be alive and be experiencing this like so intensely. 560 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 2: And it's just like the shock that just like catapults 561 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:13,799 Speaker 2: me right back to where my feet are planted. I 562 00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 2: think it's also like a distraction technique, like when you're 563 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:20,680 Speaker 2: chewing or licking or whatever, consuming something that's that sour, 564 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 2: sometimes you just like can't really think about anything else, 565 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,720 Speaker 2: and it lets you just for a moment stop thinking 566 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 2: about thinking about not being real or the world not 567 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,440 Speaker 2: being real, if you know what I mean. I know 568 00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,000 Speaker 2: as well that when I'm flying overseas, I will or 569 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,280 Speaker 2: flying anywhere like I will feel a sense of derealization 570 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:45,879 Speaker 2: a lot. More so, I also always bring something from home, 571 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 2: like a little figuring from my house on every trip 572 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,839 Speaker 2: that I just like sat in my hotel room or 573 00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 2: like bring with me in my bag, and it has 574 00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 2: this weird therapeutic effect on me. I don't know what 575 00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,280 Speaker 2: it is, but again, like I think, especially being away 576 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:05,800 Speaker 2: from my environment that I love and then I cherish 577 00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:09,360 Speaker 2: and like from my dog and like from my life, 578 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:13,160 Speaker 2: I can feel quite unstable, and having this like really 579 00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 2: otherwise quite silly stupid thing that would otherwise just be 580 00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,120 Speaker 2: like this ornamental thing in my house with me on 581 00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,400 Speaker 2: this trip pulls me back to that environment where I 582 00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:25,560 Speaker 2: feel my safest. I've also heard of someone a friend 583 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 2: of mine, who brings a sheet of stickers with her 584 00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:33,200 Speaker 2: everywhere she goes, and anytime she feels strange or she 585 00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:36,399 Speaker 2: feels odd, she will pull out a sticker and it's 586 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:39,839 Speaker 2: like one of those three D stickers, like those squishy ones, 587 00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 2: and she will like stick one onto the wall or 588 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,160 Speaker 2: her computer, or a mirror or like the back of 589 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 2: the bus seat, and just like focus on it, and 590 00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:50,879 Speaker 2: she's like, oh, well, I'm bringing like at least this 591 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:52,719 Speaker 2: thing is real. At least I have these stickers that 592 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:55,480 Speaker 2: I'm bringing with me and to every single different situation. 593 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 2: And I know it sounds silly, but sometimes for something 594 00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:02,000 Speaker 2: is like extreme and scary as derealization, you just have 595 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 2: to either beat it with complete reason or beat it 596 00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:07,799 Speaker 2: with silliness and being a little bit goofy with it 597 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:11,120 Speaker 2: and like playing with the feeling. These are all kind 598 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:16,560 Speaker 2: of sensory or physical anchors. We can also use kinesthetic anchors, 599 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,680 Speaker 2: which is basically just a fancy word for moving your 600 00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 2: body like and really moving it. Don't just like look 601 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,839 Speaker 2: at your hands and feet as they like wriggle that 602 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:29,279 Speaker 2: can still feel kind of disorientating. I want you to 603 00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:37,040 Speaker 2: like fully rapidly violently shake your whole body, dance, stretch, 604 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:41,280 Speaker 2: move run, just like spasm in the air. Do something 605 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:44,040 Speaker 2: that you feel reconnects you with your limbs and your 606 00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 2: fingers and your toenails. A twenty fourteen study that I 607 00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:53,320 Speaker 2: particularly love explored how dance therapy specifically helps people exit 608 00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:59,279 Speaker 2: association when other things aren't working because it creates kinesthetic awareness. 609 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:02,480 Speaker 2: And this is our body's natural ability to detect and 610 00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:07,160 Speaker 2: locate and recognize our body, our form in space and time, 611 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:12,440 Speaker 2: and our surroundings. And that kinesthetic awareness really activates something 612 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:16,000 Speaker 2: mentally within us as well that obviously recognizes that we 613 00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:18,799 Speaker 2: must be present to be having this feeling, and so 614 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:23,160 Speaker 2: it brings us back to our sense of realness. Even 615 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,920 Speaker 2: like repetitive rhythmic movements like bouncing your knee or rolling 616 00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 2: your shoulders or flowing moving your body have been shown 617 00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:37,919 Speaker 2: to provide that same grounding experience. It positions you back 618 00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:40,800 Speaker 2: in the room. It shows you that you are in control, 619 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,520 Speaker 2: that you can feel time and space and movement around you. 620 00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:48,000 Speaker 2: It also helps you obviously release tension. We know that 621 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:51,560 Speaker 2: stress is like a big trigger for dissociation. Sometimes that 622 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:58,480 Speaker 2: may also be why this mechanism works. I will also say, 623 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:01,880 Speaker 2: sometimes you don't want to think even more about the feeling, 624 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:08,200 Speaker 2: but it's kind of liberating to argue with it, to 625 00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:10,800 Speaker 2: argue with that I'm not real, I'm not here thought. 626 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,960 Speaker 2: If your mind is saying that I'm not real, this 627 00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:18,840 Speaker 2: isn't real whatever it is. This may sound counterintuitive, but 628 00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:24,480 Speaker 2: I think about how liberating that maybe would be if 629 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:27,440 Speaker 2: that was true. Like, I know that this thought is 630 00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:30,319 Speaker 2: scary to me, but I argue with the thought, and 631 00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:33,439 Speaker 2: I think, but what if that was a good thing. 632 00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:38,319 Speaker 2: Let me explain, Like, if I wasn't real, it meant 633 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,160 Speaker 2: that something would have to be controlling this experience, and 634 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:45,200 Speaker 2: that makes me feel assured in the idea that something 635 00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,359 Speaker 2: is out there that is bigger than us. And that's 636 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:51,120 Speaker 2: actually deeply comforting. And it's like you were trying to 637 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:53,600 Speaker 2: scare me with this feeling. Actually a part of it 638 00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:59,080 Speaker 2: might be deeply like existentially validating, or you know another 639 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:02,200 Speaker 2: thought that we have, like I'm not actually here. Well, 640 00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,400 Speaker 2: then that's fucking great. That eliminates a lot of my 641 00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 2: social anxiety, doesn't it. Why am I so worried about 642 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,760 Speaker 2: being perceived? If I'm not even real? If the perception 643 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:15,560 Speaker 2: of me isn't even happening. Sometimes that's just like helpful 644 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 2: to turn off the anxiousness tap before I come back 645 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,640 Speaker 2: down and realize like firstly that this feeling is quite silly, 646 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,359 Speaker 2: and to challenge it, but also to say that, like, 647 00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:29,640 Speaker 2: even if this was the case, is that even a 648 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:33,239 Speaker 2: bad thing? Because my anxiety and my panic that is 649 00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:37,200 Speaker 2: rising in response to my depersonalization or my derealization is 650 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,760 Speaker 2: only rising because it is perceiving. It is a terrible, 651 00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:45,480 Speaker 2: terrifying thing. What if it wasn't? These are actually they 652 00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,399 Speaker 2: have a name, they call cognitive scripts. They have been 653 00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:52,560 Speaker 2: proven to help with this feeling. Another really famous one 654 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,560 Speaker 2: that you've probably heard comes from the philosopher Renee de 655 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:58,719 Speaker 2: cart which says, I think therefore I am also a 656 00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:03,799 Speaker 2: Billie Eilish song. Basically, this phrase, this mantra, I think 657 00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:07,040 Speaker 2: therefore I am, tells us that the very act of 658 00:42:07,160 --> 00:42:12,240 Speaker 2: doubting your own existence actually proves that you exist. How 659 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:16,840 Speaker 2: because to doubt, you have to be thinking, and thinking 660 00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:21,000 Speaker 2: is something that only a conscious mind can do. The 661 00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:23,960 Speaker 2: very act of questioning, am I real? Is this real? 662 00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:27,359 Speaker 2: Is proof that you are? And I know if this 663 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:32,399 Speaker 2: feels a little bit better. But that's the reassuring part. 664 00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:35,640 Speaker 2: The fact that you are noticing that you are dissociating, 665 00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:40,000 Speaker 2: that you are questioning reality. That is all proof that 666 00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:45,160 Speaker 2: you must be existing in order to have those thoughts, 667 00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:48,960 Speaker 2: even when it feels like the world is fuzzy or 668 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,960 Speaker 2: your awareness isn't in itself a solid anchor. This in 669 00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,200 Speaker 2: itself is like something we can always come back to. 670 00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:59,640 Speaker 2: It's this subtle cognitive reminder that you may feel disconnected. 671 00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:04,160 Speaker 2: That's just your individual experience. It doesn't mean that reality 672 00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:09,000 Speaker 2: itself or the world around you has disappeared. It's just 673 00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:13,000 Speaker 2: a natural response to stress. It's a natural response to 674 00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:16,520 Speaker 2: perhaps trauma in your past. But even just not getting 675 00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:20,799 Speaker 2: enough sleep, even just having a really hard day. I 676 00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:25,000 Speaker 2: want to again remind you, this whole process of feeling 677 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,239 Speaker 2: like everything is kind of blurring out or fuzzy or 678 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:32,480 Speaker 2: not real, is your brain trying to just give you 679 00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:34,800 Speaker 2: a bit of a break and cut you some slack. 680 00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:40,400 Speaker 2: It definitely doesn't feel nice. It doesn't mean that it's wrong, 681 00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:44,000 Speaker 2: and it doesn't mean that something is wrong with you 682 00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:48,280 Speaker 2: or that something is this is an indicator of something 683 00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:51,279 Speaker 2: dangerous that's going to happen to you. I think this 684 00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:56,000 Speaker 2: is a gentle reminder that this is a human process. 685 00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:01,680 Speaker 2: This is just noise. Your brain isn't betraying you. It's 686 00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:05,560 Speaker 2: not trying to tell you something. It's just trying to 687 00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:10,960 Speaker 2: help you survive. You are real, you are here. I 688 00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:14,319 Speaker 2: promise you that you are listening to my voice in 689 00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:20,200 Speaker 2: your ears right now, that it's confirmation, and you're gonna 690 00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:22,640 Speaker 2: survive this. You're gonna survive this overwhelm. I know it 691 00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:26,640 Speaker 2: can feel super unpleasant, but everyone who has been through this, 692 00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:29,960 Speaker 2: which is if the estimates say nearly every person on 693 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:33,319 Speaker 2: this planet has come through on the other side, and 694 00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:35,520 Speaker 2: if the worst case is that you are not real 695 00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:39,920 Speaker 2: or the world isn't real, actually that's not even a 696 00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:44,359 Speaker 2: bad thing. Necessarily, you will still be okay. You can 697 00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,399 Speaker 2: still trust yourself to get through that. It's not even 698 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:49,680 Speaker 2: like that is the case, like when you start to 699 00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:52,680 Speaker 2: really question it, like you see how ridiculous it is. 700 00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:56,319 Speaker 2: But even in the most ridiculous fears aren't really that 701 00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,120 Speaker 2: scary if they were to actually come true, and they 702 00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:03,560 Speaker 2: weren't even so, so you're good on both fronts. Okay. 703 00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:05,600 Speaker 2: I think that's all we have time for today. I 704 00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:08,480 Speaker 2: hope you enjoyed this episode. I hope you learned something. 705 00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:10,880 Speaker 2: I hope it felt validating. I hope that it's something 706 00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,879 Speaker 2: you can come back to when you are feeling that same, 707 00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:18,680 Speaker 2: like very scary, panicked feeling of not being here. We've 708 00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:20,560 Speaker 2: all been there, well, at least I can say I 709 00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:23,239 Speaker 2: most certainly have, and I have made it through, so 710 00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:26,600 Speaker 2: I hope my strategies are helpful as well. I want 711 00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:30,480 Speaker 2: to thank our research assistant, Libby Comvert, for her excellent 712 00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:34,560 Speaker 2: help in providing some research assistance for this episode. She 713 00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:37,360 Speaker 2: does an amazing job every single week, time after time, 714 00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:41,480 Speaker 2: so thank you, Libby. We also a couple of updates. 715 00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:44,239 Speaker 2: Now we have a substack. If you've ever wanted a 716 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:47,200 Speaker 2: script for an episode or a transcript, we have one 717 00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:51,400 Speaker 2: of those available on our substack. You can go and subscribe, 718 00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 2: And we have a YouTube channel. Every second episode every 719 00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:57,520 Speaker 2: episode on Friday is a video episode that you can 720 00:45:57,520 --> 00:45:59,719 Speaker 2: go on access there. I don't really talk about it enough, 721 00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:03,640 Speaker 2: but I probably should. So if watching podcasts is more 722 00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,920 Speaker 2: your thing, that's now an opportunity, that's now an option 723 00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:08,800 Speaker 2: for you. Make sure as well that you are following 724 00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:12,080 Speaker 2: us on Instagram at that Psychology Podcast You can send 725 00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,120 Speaker 2: me a dam with further questions or like queries or 726 00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:18,840 Speaker 2: episodes suggestions over there. But until next time, stay safe, 727 00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:22,200 Speaker 2: be kind, be gentle to yourself. Remember, I promise you 728 00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:24,399 Speaker 2: are real. I promise you are present. I promise this 729 00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,560 Speaker 2: is real. We will talk very very soon.