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Speaker 1: Got a question about that odd noise your car is making.

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Speaker 1: Not sure how to understand the fine prints in that

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Speaker 1: car lease you're about to sign. Then this is where

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Speaker 1: to turn for help. Welcome to the car doctors driving on.

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Speaker 1: That man's went on. We raw Anadian is here to

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Speaker 1: answer your questions about cars. Give him a call.

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Speaker 2: One hundred and six miles to Chicago.

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Speaker 3: We got a full tack of gas, half a pack

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Speaker 3: of cigarettes. It's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.

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Speaker 4: Get it.

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Speaker 1: Now, here's the car doctor, raw Anadian.

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Speaker 5: Talking about the cost of auto repair. No, beyond what

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Speaker 5: it says on the wall of the shop. You know

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Speaker 5: how when you walk into a repair shop and it

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Speaker 5: says eighty ninety one hundred dollars an hour, one hundred

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Speaker 5: and ten dollars an hour.

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Speaker 3: No, I'm talking beyond that.

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Speaker 5: I'm talking about the things that are reflected in that

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Speaker 5: shop's labor rate. Or more precisely and maybe more accurately,

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Speaker 5: why the cost.

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Speaker 3: Of auto repair keeps going up?

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Speaker 5: Now, it's I guess easy to say that, well, everything

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Speaker 5: goes up, But you know why why does auto repair

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Speaker 5: specifically go up? Is it tied to gasoline? Is it

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Speaker 5: tied to the price of oil. Is it tied to

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Speaker 5: the technology and the tools and the equipment and the

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Speaker 5: cost of paying employees, And well, yes, but there are

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Speaker 5: some specific things that actually do have a direct effect,

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Speaker 5: for example, certain tool costs and how they actually influence

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Speaker 5: actual repair AC service for example, that's going to be

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Speaker 5: a big one coming up in the summer months. And

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Speaker 5: there was a recent ruling last year that has now

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Speaker 5: made a sea service a very expensive service and its

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Speaker 5: price is expected to go up over the course of

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Speaker 5: the next twelve to eighteen months. The EPA and the

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Speaker 5: Society for Mobile Air Conditioning and a bunch of other

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Speaker 5: industry groups got together and there's a new mandate out

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Speaker 5: that requires AC machines to recover ninety five percent of

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Speaker 5: the refrigerant in one pass, meaning that, for example, you

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Speaker 5: hook a car up to an AC system to service it,

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Speaker 5: you hook a car up to a machine. That machine,

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Speaker 5: if it's going to meet the new standard, has to

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Speaker 5: recover ninety five percent of the refrigerant in one pass.

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Speaker 5: It can't make repeated passes, it can't leave any refrigerant

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Speaker 5: in the system.

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Speaker 3: That's great, and that's.

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Speaker 5: Wonderful for the clean air and the ozone and all that,

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Speaker 5: but it's anywhere from five to fifty five hundred dollars

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Speaker 5: to purchase this particular machine. Now order repair shops that

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Speaker 5: are currently using an older machine, which have only been

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Speaker 5: out about five maybe six years, and that machine was

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Speaker 5: a couple of three four one thousand dollars depending on

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Speaker 5: who you purchased, are going to be grandfathered until the

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Speaker 5: end of next year, but beginning two thousand and nine,

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Speaker 5: the way it looks, the mandate's going to be you're

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Speaker 5: going to have to have one of these machines or

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Speaker 5: replace your existing machine when it breaks down and reaches

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Speaker 5: the point that it can't be fixed in order to

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Speaker 5: continue to do AC work. So that's another fifty five

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Speaker 5: hundred dollars. It has to be carved out of a

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Speaker 5: shop's operating budget. It doesn't matter whether you're a dealership

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Speaker 5: or an independent or a chain store, whoever you might be.

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Speaker 5: That has to be reflected somewhere. So what will that

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Speaker 5: do to the cost of repair, Well, it's going to

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Speaker 5: drive it up.

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Speaker 3: That cost has to.

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Speaker 5: Go somewhere, and unfortunately it's it's burdened upon the consumer

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Speaker 5: to substantiate those costs. So when you look at the

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Speaker 5: cost of repair. G it's expensive to get my car fixed?

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Speaker 3: Why A lot.

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Speaker 5: Of it goes to tooling and information and diagnosis and equipment,

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Speaker 5: and we're going to talk about that this hour. We're

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Speaker 5: going to talk about some individual jobs that may be

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Speaker 5: deemed by you the public is being inexpensive, but actuality

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Speaker 5: are expensive. And we're going to talk about the reasons

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Speaker 5: why those simple g whiz years ago we didn't do

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Speaker 5: it that way kind of a repair has all of

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Speaker 5: a sudden gotten to be very, very expensive, and well,

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Speaker 5: we're going to talk about that right here this hour.

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Speaker 5: Let's kick open those garage doors and welcome Bob's Bob

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Speaker 5: Ronin Amy and the car doctor.

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Speaker 3: How can I help you, sir?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, say good morning. Last time I talked to you

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Speaker 6: about this car, I was getting ready to replace the

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Speaker 6: engine with a you know, with the cylinder boards. We're

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Speaker 6: all pounded out. Okay, when I first started driving this cars,

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Speaker 6: is this the car you found in the barn?

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Speaker 4: Bob?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, okay, this is the other one?

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Speaker 1: All right?

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Speaker 3: Oh okay, I can't keep track. You know, you have

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Speaker 3: your own fleet.

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Speaker 5: You know, if the next Volkswagen dealer goes out of business,

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Speaker 5: you could just hang a sign over the front door.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I know you probably have enough. Okay, what this

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Speaker 6: car does is basically, at a prescribed time about twenty

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Speaker 6: miles an hour, it acts like it's running out of gas.

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Speaker 6: I have done all kinds of testing. I rode around

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Speaker 6: two weeks with a fuel pressure gauge and everything else,

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Speaker 6: and you can hold it as steady throttle, and it

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Speaker 6: just it just acts like it runs out of gas.

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Speaker 6: The attack doesn't take a nose dive or anything. And

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Speaker 6: he just hold it there and it kind of sputters

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Speaker 6: and carries on and takes off. It won't stall.

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Speaker 3: Is this cis bob?

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Speaker 6: This is this digitifunt thing?

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Speaker 3: So this is an air box?

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Speaker 6: Yeah? Right, Well anyway, you know, I mean the obvious things.

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Speaker 6: You know. A friend of mine's got a repair shop,

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Speaker 6: gave me a whole bunch of box aparts and try

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Speaker 6: this and try that with no good parts and everything.

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Speaker 6: The only thing that I did find was was the

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Speaker 6: power was once in a while with deteriorate and then

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Speaker 6: nock sensor literally fell apart. So I replaced that and

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Speaker 6: it's happy. And what I did what was is underneath

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Speaker 6: the right rear of the car with all this stuff,

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Speaker 6: I did replace the fuel filter. That didn't make any difference.

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Speaker 6: But they have this I call it the mystery fuel filter.

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Speaker 6: They call it a a fuel filter with a reservoir.

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Speaker 6: And what they're doing is is the pump that's in

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Speaker 6: the tank, it goes directly to this filter and then

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Speaker 6: on the suction side of the name filters picked up

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Speaker 6: through this reservoir filter.

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Speaker 5: Does is this the accumulator set up on the under

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Speaker 5: the right rear where it's that plastic housing next to

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Speaker 5: the underneath the fuel tank.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, okay, yeah. They call it a fuel filter reservoir.

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Speaker 6: And the only way that I was able to find

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Speaker 6: it was is I didn't know what it was, and

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Speaker 6: I looked it up in the Volkswagen Parts program and

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Speaker 6: I found it. It was hard to find, but it's

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Speaker 6: not mentioned in the Bentley book. Right, really really kind

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Speaker 6: of ticks me off. But it's got four outlets on this.

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Speaker 3: It's mounted in rubber, it's in cased and rubber.

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Speaker 6: No, it's you could actually say it it's hard to see,

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Speaker 6: but it's it's you know, it's really difficult to see

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Speaker 6: this thing. Okay, it's about two inches square and it's

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Speaker 6: about four inches long. And what's really strange about this

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Speaker 6: is they also are running the return to this thing too,

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Speaker 6: So obviously it's original, it's seventeen years old. I ordered

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Speaker 6: it and hopefully that that could be the problem. But

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Speaker 6: they call it a fuel filter with a reservoir.

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Speaker 5: You know, Bob, I know I don't have to lecture

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Speaker 5: you about the necessity of cleanliness on the fuel on

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Speaker 5: these systems. Yeah, and you know, all your fuel pressure

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Speaker 5: tests are good. You've done a volume test, right, sure.

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Speaker 5: This problem only happens intermittently, or you can duplicate it.

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Speaker 3: It happens all the time.

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Speaker 6: The car has to sit for a period.

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Speaker 3: Of time, so it's got to go through a hot soak.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, a car has to sit for a period of time,

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Speaker 6: maybe about four or five hours, and it'll do it

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Speaker 6: exactly at the same spot.

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Speaker 5: It's really you know, I can believe it's fuel. But

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Speaker 5: just one comment and you know, obviously after you put

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Speaker 5: the part of the piece on, you.

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Speaker 3: Change that housing. Yeah, no more.

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Speaker 5: But you know, one comment, you've done a back pressure

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Speaker 5: test that this couldn't be a melted cat or restricted

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Speaker 5: exhaust anywhere.

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Speaker 6: Oh okay, all right, you know, just you know, just.

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Speaker 5: To get the focus off fuel for a second. That

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Speaker 5: was common too. The cats would melt internally, and I've

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Speaker 5: had cases on those as well as a lot of

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Speaker 5: the other cars where the cats would partially melt. And actually,

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Speaker 5: if you bang on it, and I'm sure you have already,

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Speaker 5: but again, I just want to be as clear as

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Speaker 5: I can. You know that the cat spins itself around

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Speaker 5: and creates a you know, it'll make you nuts. It'll

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Speaker 5: spin itself around, It'll it'll block the outlet out of

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Speaker 5: the exhaust, and then all of a sudden it unclogs

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Speaker 5: itself in the car runs normal.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so don't rule that out.

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Speaker 5: While you're doing your fuel pressure test, to hook up

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Speaker 5: a manifold vacuum gage just to see what manifold vacuum is, right,

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Speaker 5: and you know, to go from there, g does it

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Speaker 5: do it? Doesn't it do it? And sort of take

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Speaker 5: off from that point.

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Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, okay, all right, you let me know.

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Speaker 5: You try your fuel filter, do my vacuum back pressure test,

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Speaker 5: call me back, let me know what the results are.

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Speaker 6: One other quick question. Yeah, okay, you're talking about these

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Speaker 6: reclaimers because I'm into what they call commercial refrigeration, okay,

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Speaker 6: and the reclaimers that I'm using because I'm pumping out

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Speaker 6: a system that holds like sixteen pounds of free on, right,

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Speaker 6: and these things here will actually you could actually pull

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Speaker 6: a vacuum in the system.

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Speaker 3: Right, Well, that's what these will do. Also, Yeah, that's

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Speaker 3: what Diesel do. Also.

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Speaker 5: Now let me ask you this. Have you had to

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Speaker 5: upgrade your equipment in the last couple of years.

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Speaker 6: I haven't been notified.

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Speaker 5: Well, it might be different because you're doing what R

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Speaker 5: twenty two.

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Speaker 6: No, I'm using I'm using our four or four A.

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Speaker 5: Okay, it may have a different lens and stuff, right,

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Speaker 5: it may have a different specification and a different requirement.

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Speaker 5: This stuff that I was just talking about was specifically

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Speaker 5: applied to R one thirty four, the current refrigeration or

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Speaker 5: refrigerant used in.

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Speaker 3: Most of the vehicles. Yeah, okay, hey, something always changes.

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Speaker 3: It's an automobile.

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Speaker 6: No, this is true.

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Speaker 5: So all right, all right.

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Speaker 6: I'll let you know.

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Speaker 3: Let me know, Bob, thank you. Hey. Scan tools, Well,

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Speaker 3: everybody's got a scan tool.

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Speaker 5: And I suppose a scan tool is as common today

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Speaker 5: as a screwdriver and a hammer was and a wrench

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Speaker 5: twenty five thirty years ago.

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Speaker 3: But you know what sort of scan tool.

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Speaker 5: Upgrades what sort of costs are associated with Hey, I've

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Speaker 5: got to upgrade my scan tool.

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Speaker 3: And which scan tool is the shop talking about?

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Speaker 5: Hey, how does it affect the cost of auto repair?

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Speaker 5: Find out when the car doctor returns. I'm ronin Aian.

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Speaker 3: We'll be back right after this.

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Speaker 1: Tell me.

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Speaker 2: Then I said, hey, hey, hey, welcome back ronin Any

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Speaker 2: and the card doctor here.

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Speaker 5: We're talking about scan tools. Well, we're talking about, you know,

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Speaker 5: cost of repair. Why does it cost so much to

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Speaker 5: get the gosh darn car fixed? You know which you

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Speaker 5: go through every time you walk into the repair shop

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Speaker 5: and you see that number on the wall and you say, hey, why, Well,

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Speaker 5: here's one reason why scan tools. Every repair shop today

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Speaker 5: that's fixing cars properly has at least one scan tool.

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Speaker 5: I can't imagine a shop that doesn't. That's working on

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Speaker 5: something with a computer. That means any automobile made since

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Speaker 5: nineteen eighty one, which goes back a pretty far piece.

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Speaker 3: I can't imagine somebody.

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Speaker 5: Working on a two thousand and three Chevy anything without

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Speaker 5: a scan.

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Speaker 3: Tool just just not going to work all right.

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Speaker 5: As far as doing any kind of diagnosis and general

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Speaker 5: maintenance and repair, and a lot of applications. So you've

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Speaker 5: got to look at and say, well, well, how many

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Speaker 5: scan tools is it necessary for a shop to have today? Well,

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Speaker 5: how many car lines are out there? Because you can

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Speaker 5: find scan tools that are specific GM, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Asuzu, Nissan, Mazda, Jaguar, Mercedes,

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Speaker 5: and so on. So for every vehicle line out there,

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Speaker 5: there's a specific factory scan tool which a repair shop

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Speaker 5: may have depending upon the amount of cars that they

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Speaker 5: work on that volume of that particular brand or make

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Speaker 5: on a regular basis. Now, if they do have let's say,

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Speaker 5: multiple factory scan tools, those scan tools, those test tools

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Speaker 5: can be anywhere from two to four thousand dollars a

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Speaker 5: year to upgrade software. One of the things that a

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Speaker 5: lot of shops are doing is they're buying generic scan tools,

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Speaker 5: or they're buying a scan tool sort of a one

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Speaker 5: scan tool does them all, but may not do it

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Speaker 5: in the depth and coverage and quality that a factory

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Speaker 5: scan tool does. And OTC Genesis, for example, is a

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Speaker 5: scan tool that covers a great deal in a large

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Speaker 5: variety of automobiles, but the software updates for that are

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Speaker 5: not inexpensive either. About twenty five hundred dollars a year

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Speaker 5: depending upon how you're going to do your updates and

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Speaker 5: to what level. So the bottom line here becomes that

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Speaker 5: a repair shop can spend upwards of at least, you know,

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Speaker 5: beginning fifteen hundred and two grand, and the sky's the limit.

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Speaker 5: And then how many scan tools. The average repair shop today,

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Speaker 5: it's been reported, has approximately four and a half scan tools,

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Speaker 5: which I can't figure out how they have half a

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Speaker 5: scan tool, but neither here nor there. Whatever they're upgrading,

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Speaker 5: it still costs something and it still takes money out

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Speaker 5: of their pocket. That unfortunately, again this isn't defending them,

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Speaker 5: but it's got to get passed along. This is the

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Speaker 5: creature we've created, this thing we call automobile that has

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Speaker 5: all these computers on it, that needs all of this

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Speaker 5: equipment in order to accurately diagnose and repair.

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Speaker 3: So scan tool costs.

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Speaker 5: Are going to affect the consumer in terms of what

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Speaker 5: that number on the wall is reflected at that hourly

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Speaker 5: labor rate. Let's get back to the phone. I'm ronning

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Speaker 5: any in the card doctor. Let's go over and talk

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Speaker 5: to Ed New London, New Hampshire. Hey, Ed, welcome aboard.

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Speaker 4: Hi Ron, Thanks about I have a Kia Spectra and

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Speaker 4: O two with fifty three thousand miles, and about a

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Speaker 4: year ago I went to a box store and had

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Speaker 4: a new battery put in, and since then it's had

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Speaker 4: some hard starting issues.

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Speaker 3: When you say hard starting it do you mean hard cranking.

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Speaker 4: Well, I turned the key and it cranks up to

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Speaker 4: a count to one thousand and five sometimes.

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Speaker 3: In other words, it's got a long crank time.

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Speaker 4: A long crank time, okay, and you know the car

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Speaker 4: runs great once it's going, And this is an intimental

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Speaker 4: starting problem.

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Speaker 3: Any check engine light.

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Speaker 4: It did about a week ago, and I took that

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Speaker 4: in and I had a at the same time, I

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Speaker 4: had a with an exhaust pipe week Do.

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Speaker 3: You know what the do you know what the code

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Speaker 3: was with the check engine light was on.

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Speaker 4: For I don't, but it was. The guy told me

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Speaker 4: it was a missions when I brought it into sixth the.

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Speaker 3: Pipe, Well it was it.

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Speaker 5: And don't misunderstand me, but everything with the check engine

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Speaker 5: light is emissions related. I see, you know, it's in

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Speaker 5: simplest terms, the check engine light on any vehicle.

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Speaker 3: And I can say this with.

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Speaker 5: Clear conviction since nineteen ninety at the at the latest,

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Speaker 5: any vehicle with a check engine light that comes on.

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Speaker 5: As that light comes on because by EPA standards, the

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Speaker 5: vehicles exceeding federal test procedures and federal test levels for emissions,

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Speaker 5: so the light comes on. So you know, he's got

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Speaker 5: to be more specific than that. You know, if it

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Speaker 5: was exhaust pipe related or EGR valve related or oh

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Speaker 5: two centsor related.

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Speaker 3: Fine, but you're probably still having the same problem.

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Speaker 4: Yes, I am.

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Speaker 5: So you've got an intermittent every once in a while

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Speaker 5: long crank time, right, and does it eventually start or

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Speaker 5: do you have to turn the key off and then go.

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Speaker 4: To restart it it eventually starts?

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Speaker 3: Okay.

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Speaker 5: Do you ever feel like you're getting to the end

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Speaker 5: of your rope, like, G whiz is it going to start?

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Speaker 5: And you kind of get nervous?

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Speaker 4: No, I just know it's going to start at you know,

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Speaker 4: one thousand and four, one thousand and five. Okay, you

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Speaker 4: know what happens every two weeks.

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Speaker 5: I don't know that you know that a four second

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Speaker 5: crank time would would make me concerned as far as

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Speaker 5: you know, like, G, do I have a problem. I

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Speaker 5: would first start off with asking you the question have

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Speaker 5: you done your regular maintenance, and I don't mean just

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Speaker 5: oil changes. Have you ever had a thirty thousand mile

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Speaker 5: service to this? Have you ever done a carbon cleaning?

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Speaker 5: Have you ever done a throttle body service? Any of

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Speaker 5: those things? Ring any bells?

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Speaker 4: No, I've had the car for like a year and eight.

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Speaker 3: Thousand miles, okay, and it has how many miles on

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Speaker 3: it now?

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Speaker 4: Fifty three?

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Speaker 3: Fifty three?

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Speaker 5: Talk to your mechanic you got You got a regular

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Speaker 5: mechanic you see on a regular basis, said, talk to

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Speaker 5: your mechanic, ask him to do this. Take a look

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Speaker 5: at fuel trim and see where fuel trim is long

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Speaker 5: term and short term. Ask him to do a brief

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Speaker 5: sweep of the mass airflow sensor, make sure it's in range.

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Speaker 5: And consider the possibility of doing a carbon cleaning, and

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Speaker 5: see what that does for you in terms of cleaning

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Speaker 5: up the engine and making it more efficient. And then

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Speaker 5: give me a call back. I'm running ay in the car,

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Speaker 5: doctor A carcare corner's coming up.

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Speaker 3: Next segment. Stick around, we're back. We're right after this