Speaker 1: When I went back to my hooch, all hell broke loose.
Speaker 1: Now we're getting incoming. The hospital is under attack. The
Speaker 1: noise is unbelievable. That ran to my surgical unit where
Speaker 1: I was head nurse, and were just the patients just
Speaker 1: got onto the floor and the ones who couldn't get
Speaker 1: on the floor were the ones hooked up to ventilators
Speaker 1: and or had chest tubes, And were you all kinds
Speaker 1: of intravenous and bloodlines? And we couldn't move them, So
Speaker 1: we took the mattresses. We threw mattresses on those that
Speaker 1: we could. That was Diane Carlson Evans, recalling her time
Speaker 1: as an army combat nurse in Vietnam in ninet Her
Speaker 1: experiences there led her to another battle, a ten year
Speaker 1: effort to get recognition for the two sixty five thousand
Speaker 1: women who served in the U. S Military during the
Speaker 1: Vietnam War. I'm Milan Ververin. This is Seneca's one hundred
Speaker 1: Women to Hear. We are bringing you one hundred of
Speaker 1: the world's most inspiring and history making women you need
Speaker 1: to hear. If you haven't seen the Vietnam Women's Memorial,
Speaker 1: be sure to visit on your next trip to Washington,
Speaker 1: d C. Designed by sculpture Glenna Goodacre and located on
Speaker 1: the National Mall, the statute depicts three Vietnam era women,
Speaker 1: one of whom is caring for a wounded male soldier,
Speaker 1: and this inspiring tribute is there because of Diane Carlson Evans.
Speaker 1: In addition to leading the campaign for the statue, Diane
Speaker 1: also founded the Vietnam Women's Memorial Foundation. The foundation educates
Speaker 1: the public about the role of women during the Vietnam
Speaker 1: War and supports research into their physiological, psychological, and sociological needs.
Speaker 1: Listen and learn why Diane Carlson Evans is one of
Speaker 1: Seneca's on women to hear. We are so pleased today
Speaker 1: on this veteran's day to have with us Diane Carlson Evans. Welcome, Diane, Well,
Speaker 1: thank you. It's my honor to to be with you today.
Speaker 1: You are a former Army nurse, a voice for women veterans.
Speaker 1: You've had the perseverance to spend more than ten years
Speaker 1: making the Vietnam Women's Memorial a reality. And I wonder
Speaker 1: what special meaning does this day hold for you given
Speaker 1: all of that, in particular, well for me personally, it
Speaker 1: is a deeply personal and special day. And you know,
Speaker 1: I think back, I just ever forget that eleventh hour
Speaker 1: of the eleventh day of the eleventh month still rings
Speaker 1: in my my mind about night and of course the
Speaker 1: end of World War One, the end of hostilities between
Speaker 1: the World War One allies in Germany, and and I
Speaker 1: think about all those soldiers, men, women, and of course
Speaker 1: the airmen, the Marines. And when we say soldiers, because
Speaker 1: I was in the Army, we refer to soldiers, but
Speaker 1: of course veterans, uh include our coast Guard, our Navy,
Speaker 1: our Army, the Air Force and all of the above
Speaker 1: and the sacrifices that these men and women have made
Speaker 1: truly since the birth of our nation and the Revolutionary War.
Speaker 1: And you know, Memorial Day really is the day that
Speaker 1: we remember those who died, and the focus and the
Speaker 1: honor and the remembrances and are really for those who died.
Speaker 1: Veterans Day for me is a little more, is a
Speaker 1: little different. The bonding and the camaraderie that I share
Speaker 1: with my fellow veterans is something we, you know, just
Speaker 1: wrap our arms around. And when I am in Washington,
Speaker 1: d C. On Veterans Days and have been in the
Speaker 1: past for decades. It's really our time, it's our day. Two.
Speaker 1: Just remember each other and deepen that, deepen that bond,
Speaker 1: and of course Vietnam um with the wall and when
Speaker 1: we join each other there, it's just a very sacred place.
Speaker 1: And so it's yes, it's a very special day for
Speaker 1: me and my family. Well, you said that just so beautifully.
Speaker 1: And and speaking of the Vietnam War, I gather that
Speaker 1: your experience there extended from nine to sixty nine. And
Speaker 1: if I remember where, that was an intense period of
Speaker 1: the war. What was your day to day life like
Speaker 1: as an army combat nurse, and maybe you could share
Speaker 1: with us a little bit of how that experience affected you. Yes,
Speaker 1: and it's it's hard to put it, milan into um
Speaker 1: words that you know within five minutes or less or
Speaker 1: you know, I it's it's something that it's it's just
Speaker 1: such an epic experience for any young person. And so
Speaker 1: many of us were so young when we went to Vietnam,
Speaker 1: the year olds, the draftees and those of us in
Speaker 1: our twenties. I was twenty one when I went to Vietnam.
Speaker 1: To encapsulate or too, um, give you um a picture
Speaker 1: that I might paint of what was it like for
Speaker 1: an army nurse in Vietnam. Maybe I could take you
Speaker 1: back to one night, and this was just one night
Speaker 1: in Vietnam, but it's like my whole year there. Mass
Speaker 1: casualties were coming in. I'm at the seventy first Evacuation Hospital.
Speaker 1: I mean play who play who Vietnam, which is in
Speaker 1: the central Highlands. It's in the jungle. We're close to
Speaker 1: the hot Chemn Trail, We're close to the Cambodian border.
Speaker 1: All hell has broken loose. We're kind of the epicenter
Speaker 1: of um action happening at the time. And the mass
Speaker 1: casualties are coming in by helicopter mostly, And one night
Speaker 1: I hear a chopper come in and another helicopter, and
Speaker 1: then I hear a helicopter that is so loud that
Speaker 1: it is shaking my hooch. And it's in the middle
Speaker 1: of the night. And of course we don't sleep well
Speaker 1: in Vietnam because of the noise and being hyper vigilant,
Speaker 1: hyper alert to the noises. Is it incoming, is it outgoing?
Speaker 1: And this chopper was different. It was a Chinook, and
Speaker 1: a Chinook, as you know, is large helicopter and that
Speaker 1: meant mass casualties. I didn't need to hear the phone ring.
Speaker 1: I just grabbed my helmet, I got my fatigues on,
Speaker 1: my combat boots and my flak jacket, and I ran
Speaker 1: to the hospital because I knew we'd be getting called.
Speaker 1: And I was told to go to the empty, empty ward.
Speaker 1: We kept a spare ward just for mass casualties. I
Speaker 1: was told to go there. The word master had set up,
Speaker 1: you know, like thirty I think it was forty beds.
Speaker 1: He'd set up thirty forty i v s ready to go,
Speaker 1: just in case. I had one medic. And the casualties
Speaker 1: started coming in, and I had one medic, so um that.
Speaker 1: And we were using flashlights because at night, you know, Charlie, Victor, Charlie,
Speaker 1: the Vietcong. The night belonged to them, we used to say,
Speaker 1: And so lights were out. It had to be dark.
Speaker 1: The patients started coming in one by one, and the
Speaker 1: beds were filling up, and I said to them, the
Speaker 1: ward master had hung the i v s. And I
Speaker 1: said to my medic, I said, mcabe, we have to
Speaker 1: let's just get these i vs in, every single one
Speaker 1: of them, and then we can deal with the aftermath.
Speaker 1: Of that. So and then I realized. I said to
Speaker 1: my medic, I said, look, these guys don't have any poles,
Speaker 1: there's no wounds, and but they were deadly ill. Their
Speaker 1: their blood pressure, that they were in shock, they had
Speaker 1: low blood pressure, low respirations, and they weren't talking to us,
Speaker 1: and I said, oh my god, we just have to
Speaker 1: get these I vs in. The doctor came and told
Speaker 1: us what to hang. We did as he said. By
Speaker 1: the end, in the dark um and the veins were collapsed,
Speaker 1: so it was very difficult to find the vein to
Speaker 1: start the IVY. But by now, remember I'm twenty two
Speaker 1: by now. But nurses became very skilled, very quickly in
Speaker 1: Vietnam because of the sheer numbers of people we took
Speaker 1: care took care of. And by the end, Mike Corman,
Speaker 1: my medic, said to me, well, Lieutenant, we're done. And
Speaker 1: I just looked at him and he said, twenty eight
Speaker 1: he counted them. We had just started a visa. And
Speaker 1: now my shift, the board is calmed, the doctor comes in.
Speaker 1: They're going to be okay because they've got you know,
Speaker 1: life saving UM intervene exfusions. And I had to go
Speaker 1: back to my hooch to try to get four hours
Speaker 1: asleep from my next shift. When I went back to
Speaker 1: my hooch, all hell broke loose. Now we're getting incoming.
Speaker 1: The hospital is under attack. Rockets and mortars are you know?
Speaker 1: The thud? You just never forget those sounds. The thud
Speaker 1: and then the shrapnel and the noise is unbelievable. And
Speaker 1: so now I'm in my unit, ran to my surgical
Speaker 1: unit where I was head nurse, and we just the
Speaker 1: patients just got on onto the floor. And the ones
Speaker 1: who couldn't get on the floor were the ones hooked
Speaker 1: up to ventilators and or had chest tubes and were
Speaker 1: you know, all kinds of um, the intravenous and bloodlines,
Speaker 1: and they couldn't We couldn't move them. So we took
Speaker 1: the mattresses from the beds with it. Wounded had gone
Speaker 1: under their bed. We threw mattresses on those that we could.
Speaker 1: It was their only protection from the shrapnel. And we
Speaker 1: there was one other female nurse, army nurse with me,
Speaker 1: and we had for medics and so we are all
Speaker 1: doing everything we can to protect these soldiers. Now, the bloodlines,
Speaker 1: we had extensions on our bloodlines and our I VS
Speaker 1: for this very reason, so that if they had to
Speaker 1: go to the floor and get under their bed, they
Speaker 1: wouldn't yank out their life saving lines. And so now
Speaker 1: I'm putting those back together. And finally I look around
Speaker 1: the unit and there's nothing else we can do except
Speaker 1: this little aunt and yard girl who we had had
Speaker 1: in our unit, who had been injured by napalm. She
Speaker 1: had a circumferential wound burn. We she was not going
Speaker 1: to survive, but she was so terrified from the noise
Speaker 1: because that's what happened to her when she was in
Speaker 1: her village and she lost her parents. And I went
Speaker 1: over to her and I just held her hand and
Speaker 1: I crawled under her crib and then just the noise
Speaker 1: and that. So what I've just described to you is
Speaker 1: one night in Vietnam and the year in Vietnam. So
Speaker 1: much of it was like a nightmare. It was like
Speaker 1: an hallucination. It was surreal. It's hard to it's hard
Speaker 1: to describe what it was like to be in a
Speaker 1: field hospital when you're not only just caring for the wounded,
Speaker 1: but you're also being attacked at the same time. But
Speaker 1: what I want to really wanted to bring across here
Speaker 1: is the bravery of the nurses and the docks and
Speaker 1: the medics. We truly forgot about our else. This wasn't
Speaker 1: about us. It was about saving lives and our mission.
Speaker 1: Our mission was very clear, it was conserved the fighting strength.
Speaker 1: So we knew what our mission was. And um at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, we were exhausted and tired,
Speaker 1: and we got as much sleep as we could, and
Speaker 1: we got up the next morning and we repeated, you know,
Speaker 1: day in and day out, because like you said, sixty
Speaker 1: sixty nine was the year that we lost the most
Speaker 1: casualties in Vietnam. So we worked long hours and we
Speaker 1: worked extra hard, but we survived. We were young, we
Speaker 1: had the energy, we had the commitment, and we had
Speaker 1: the passion to do all we could to save these
Speaker 1: these these young men's lives. Well, you described that so vividly, Diane,
Speaker 1: it's almost as though we were they're experiencing it with
Speaker 1: you again. Just stunning and harrowing and intense. I can't
Speaker 1: imagine really what it was like. What must your readjustment
Speaker 1: been like when you returned to the United States. That
Speaker 1: was the hard part, you know, we went from one
Speaker 1: war to another. You don't leave the war on the battlefield.
Speaker 1: We came home and the country was at war, the protests,
Speaker 1: the hostilities. I was happy that people were protesting the war.
Speaker 1: I hated the war too. I wanted the war to end.
Speaker 1: This was sixty and we still had several years to go.
Speaker 1: But unfortunately, for some reason, what was happening at the time,
Speaker 1: a lot of the hostility and the anti war sentiment
Speaker 1: became anti soldier, anti veteran sentiment, and they took it
Speaker 1: out on us, and we were set up for humiliation.
Speaker 1: If we wore our uniform, we had things either thrown
Speaker 1: at us or hurtful words that were said about us,
Speaker 1: that we were just a bunch of rug Gray's glassy
Speaker 1: eyed baby killers, and and I was what, what where
Speaker 1: is this coming from? It was so painful to hear
Speaker 1: these awful things being said, particularly about my brother veterans,
Speaker 1: because at the time people were really um. They didn't
Speaker 1: even know women we were. We were there, and it
Speaker 1: seemed like the trajectory or the target for the anti
Speaker 1: war sentiment was on the very men who I had
Speaker 1: just seen suffer and die. And we're just as brave,
Speaker 1: you know. I I defend my generation of you know,
Speaker 1: there's greatness in every generation, and there's certainly undeniable greatness
Speaker 1: in ours. And I saw that greatness in Vietnam with
Speaker 1: how are a soldiers you know, were as brave and
Speaker 1: and their patients who cared more about the guy in
Speaker 1: the next bed than themselves, and um, and and I wondered, America,
Speaker 1: people here just don't understand. They don't they don't know
Speaker 1: what we've been through, what we've done, what we've accomplished,
Speaker 1: and that we've only done with what our fathers and
Speaker 1: mothers had done, and that was serving uniform um when
Speaker 1: we were asked. So I went underground like many of us.
Speaker 1: I just stopped talking about it, and I wouldn't admit
Speaker 1: I was a veteran, and I refused to talk about it.
Speaker 1: And my husband, I told him he was not to
Speaker 1: ever let anybody know I was there because I just
Speaker 1: couldn't talk about it. A different kind of anguish, to
Speaker 1: be sure, but certainly very painful. Senecas one hundred women
Speaker 1: to hear. Will be back after the short break. So
Speaker 1: let's go back a bit to your earliest days. You
Speaker 1: grew up on a dairy farm in Minnesota. What influenced
Speaker 1: you that made you who you are today. I think
Speaker 1: the influence was largely that dairy farm I grew up on,
Speaker 1: and my mother and the work ethic on the farm.
Speaker 1: There were six kids, there was six of us. My
Speaker 1: mom was a registered nurse, she worked at the local hospital,
Speaker 1: and my dad was a dairy farmer. Our our farm
Speaker 1: back then was self sustaining. You know. We we had
Speaker 1: our jobs to do and we didn't complain because we
Speaker 1: took care of the farm and the farm took care
Speaker 1: of us. You know, you have to feed and water
Speaker 1: and milk those cows or they, uh, they will die
Speaker 1: and you won't have milk to go to the creamery
Speaker 1: and you won't have that milk check that provides what
Speaker 1: what a family needs. And we had to take care
Speaker 1: of the horses and those little baby calves, and my
Speaker 1: chores were to lift those buckets and go feed the
Speaker 1: little baby calves. And it was that work ethic where
Speaker 1: we had to pitch in and get the job done.
Speaker 1: And we couldn't be slackers, because if we were slackers,
Speaker 1: then something we were deprived of. Something like we had
Speaker 1: to take care of the garden because we needed that
Speaker 1: to can and breeze for the winter, and and then
Speaker 1: with my mother watching her as a nurse, and thought
Speaker 1: I went to started working at the hospital with her
Speaker 1: when I was fifteen, and my mom was the most experienced, wonderful,
Speaker 1: compassionate nurse. She never missed a beat, and she took
Speaker 1: me to the emergency room, she took me to watch
Speaker 1: babies be delivered. She spared me nothing. And then so
Speaker 1: of course I had decided to go to college to
Speaker 1: study nursing, and I had some good experience before I
Speaker 1: even started, and that was with my mother for three
Speaker 1: years at that hospital. So that work ethic and the
Speaker 1: admiration I had for nurses and feeling that nurses, including
Speaker 1: my mother, we're not getting the recognize shan and the
Speaker 1: gratitude that that they deserved so um, and then finishing
Speaker 1: a job. Once you start a job, you don't you
Speaker 1: finish it. You don't do it halfway, you finish it.
Speaker 1: And when I decided after the troubling years of my
Speaker 1: homecoming and the aftermath of the war, and then my
Speaker 1: visit to the wall in and the the knowledge that
Speaker 1: I was now feeling about that the healing is finally
Speaker 1: taking place for my brother veterans, but not for my
Speaker 1: sister veterans, and that if we were going to have
Speaker 1: a statue physically, you know, visibly portraying men as men
Speaker 1: looked in Vietnam with their uniforms and and their youth,
Speaker 1: and but not to see the women was very troubling
Speaker 1: to me that if we're going to now have of
Speaker 1: a statue honoring men, we need to complete the memorial
Speaker 1: with the statue visibly portraying what women look like in
Speaker 1: Vietnam and in a special place for them as well
Speaker 1: on those grounds. So that's how you came up with
Speaker 1: really becoming so intensely involved in the creation of the
Speaker 1: Vietnam Women's Memorial. Were there others involved with you? Was
Speaker 1: there a campaign to make that happen? What was the
Speaker 1: environment like? Oh? Yes, no one does anything alone when
Speaker 1: you want to accomplish a mission. And my my experience
Speaker 1: as a nurse and being taught team nursing where a
Speaker 1: team we pulled together. Of course in the military, you're
Speaker 1: a team and everybody is important, from the truck driver
Speaker 1: to the cook to the surgeons. Everybody is important. You
Speaker 1: pulled together and you accomplish your mission. I had had
Speaker 1: that experience, and I also had the energy thankfully. I
Speaker 1: was a high energy person, and when I founded the
Speaker 1: Vietnam Women's Memorial in three I had four children under
Speaker 1: the age of ten. Started it at a more difficult
Speaker 1: time with the responsibilities I had at home, but it
Speaker 1: was it was the timing dedication of the wall. I
Speaker 1: was there, I found names. I came home, I would
Speaker 1: no longer hide the fact that I was a veteran.
Speaker 1: I was depressed. I was crying. Um, my patients were
Speaker 1: coming back to me in the night, and I couldn't
Speaker 1: put them aside anymore. I started thinking about each and
Speaker 1: every one of them. And I had never had a funeral.
Speaker 1: I had never had a wake for those young casualties.
Speaker 1: And now they're all coming back to me, and now
Speaker 1: something else is happening inside of me. It's it's I
Speaker 1: need to find my voice, um, to to talk about
Speaker 1: this and talk about the women who I was so
Speaker 1: proud to have served with, and how they too deserved
Speaker 1: recognition and honor and remembrance, and they too needed to heal.
Speaker 1: If I was having these problems, maybe they were. And
Speaker 1: I didn't even know about post traumatic stress disorder at
Speaker 1: the time. I didn't know what a flashback was, and
Speaker 1: but what I was feeling that it was something inside
Speaker 1: of me that was percolating. I had this um something
Speaker 1: burning inside of me that that women who served in
Speaker 1: the military um for since the birth of our nation
Speaker 1: have really not been properly recognized or given the credit
Speaker 1: for their contribution and place value on on their their contribution.
Speaker 1: And I was feeling this and when I told my husband,
Speaker 1: I said, well, if they're going to have a statue
Speaker 1: honoring the men, there has to be one to women.
Speaker 1: And he he said to me, well, who's going to
Speaker 1: do that? I think about that now. When he said that,
Speaker 1: and I said, well, I don't know how to do it,
Speaker 1: but I'm going to do something. And so one thing
Speaker 1: led to another, and I made a lot of phone calls.
Speaker 1: I met an artist in Minneapolis, Minnesota who said he
Speaker 1: would work with me to develop a prototype, a model, uh.
Speaker 1: And we did in five months. And then I, I,
Speaker 1: you know, with others, with some Vietnam veterans who were attorneys,
Speaker 1: men and women. We got together and we started a
Speaker 1: five oh one C three so we could raise money.
Speaker 1: We identified a board of directors. We've got our I
Speaker 1: R S Status for charities, you know, to receive money,
Speaker 1: and we got an account in a c p A
Speaker 1: who could do the books, and then we sent out
Speaker 1: press releases with this idea, this vision that I had,
Speaker 1: and that vision was a statue and I had no idea.
Speaker 1: I was naive. And it's a good thing I was naive,
Speaker 1: because if I had known what I was going to
Speaker 1: have to go through those ten years, I would never
Speaker 1: ever have started it because I would not have had
Speaker 1: the confidence to do it. Well, I can't do that.
Speaker 1: That's too complicated. I don't have the skills to do that.
Speaker 1: I'll be a failure or you know, all the things
Speaker 1: that it took to accomplish this mission. I didn't know
Speaker 1: that I could accomplish it. But now I'm I am
Speaker 1: developing supporters who also agree with the mission and their volunteers.
Speaker 1: We were all volunteers, all of us, and um, you know,
Speaker 1: persistence overcomes resistance, and I, yes, I led the effort
Speaker 1: and I was persistent and resilient and had the energy
Speaker 1: to keep it moving forward. But I needed all these
Speaker 1: other people to all so believe in the mission and
Speaker 1: for us to pull together as a team. And then
Speaker 1: when we started getting pushback, and um, a lot of pushback,
Speaker 1: and a lot of negative articles were written in newspapers
Speaker 1: all over the United States. Basically, who did these women
Speaker 1: think they were? They don't deserve there were so few
Speaker 1: of them in Vietnam. Almost three million men were there,
Speaker 1: but only ten thou women. Why do they deserve a memorial?
Speaker 1: And um all kinds of um, really mean spirited things
Speaker 1: were said about us and what happened with that? I
Speaker 1: could have just said I'm done, I'm going home. This
Speaker 1: is too hard, and I felt that way at times,
Speaker 1: but it's I truly believe they don't know who we are,
Speaker 1: they don't know what we did, and they're going to
Speaker 1: find out and once they hear the stories about what
Speaker 1: women did all around the world. Two women joined the
Speaker 1: military during the Vietnam War and they didn't have to.
Speaker 1: We were all volunteers. Women were not drafted, were not conscripted,
Speaker 1: never have been. And um, yet they signed up during
Speaker 1: a very unpopular war. And I really wanted the country
Speaker 1: to know about these women. And um, then there were
Speaker 1: those of us who actually went in country to to Vietnam.
Speaker 1: What was the biggest challenge, would you say? I mean, clearly,
Speaker 1: this kind of negative reaction, Who do they think they
Speaker 1: are you often here that, particularly with respect to a
Speaker 1: women's effort? But what was the biggest challenge for you personally?
Speaker 1: For me personally, it was I knew I couldn't give up,
Speaker 1: no matter how hard it was. And yet I had
Speaker 1: four children at home, my mother, who had just retired
Speaker 1: as a registered nurse after forty five years of nursing.
Speaker 1: When she retired, it was perfect timing. It was nine
Speaker 1: eight three. She said, Diane, you do what you need
Speaker 1: to do when you need to be gone. I will
Speaker 1: take care of the children. She came to our home.
Speaker 1: And I had a husband who was a very busy.
Speaker 1: He was a surgeon. He was the only surgeon in
Speaker 1: the county. He was gone all the time, night and day.
Speaker 1: I couldn't rely on him, but Mom came. So with
Speaker 1: mother home and the kids in good hands, and I
Speaker 1: didn't have to worry about them. I could travel and
Speaker 1: make the trips to Washington, d C. And all over
Speaker 1: the United States that I needed to make to garner support,
Speaker 1: whether to be a resolution at the American Legion or
Speaker 1: the VFW or Vietnam Veterans of America d a V,
Speaker 1: all of our veteran service organizations. I got on their
Speaker 1: docket to speak at conventions, state conventions and national conventions.
Speaker 1: And I just had to get out there and spread
Speaker 1: the word and then not give up because I'm really
Speaker 1: believed that what I was doing was the right thing,
Speaker 1: that honoring my sister veterans was the honorable thing to do,
Speaker 1: that that it all boiled down to this Milan. It
Speaker 1: boiled down to the Vietnam Veterans Memorial with the wall
Speaker 1: and more than fifty eight thousand names and the eight
Speaker 1: nurses whose female nurses who are names on the wall,
Speaker 1: and there are male nurses on the wall as well,
Speaker 1: But this was for women. Honoring women was that if
Speaker 1: they belong, if the men belong there, we women belong there.
Speaker 1: Because in Vietnam, if the men belonged in Vietnam, and
Speaker 1: we women were belonging in Vietnam to help bring them
Speaker 1: home to survive the war, we belonged with the men.
Speaker 1: And this was my message to to to counter this
Speaker 1: um illogical, irrational thinking that women didn't deserve to be
Speaker 1: recognized the same way we recognize men at the Vietnam
Speaker 1: Veterans Memorial. If they along there, we belong there. This
Speaker 1: is our place. And I stuck to that believe and
Speaker 1: so would not be deterred by the mean spirited um
Speaker 1: and you you did ask who where was the biggest
Speaker 1: pushback coming from the federal agencies in Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: The Commission of Fine Arts with Jay Carter Brown, a
Speaker 1: very prestigious commission in d C. That's the gatekeeper to
Speaker 1: anything that goes on the National Mall, as they should be.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have to be very I have a
Speaker 1: lot of um, you know, protocols in place and a
Speaker 1: policy in place that you know for what goes what's
Speaker 1: worthy to go on the National Mall, and of course
Speaker 1: I believe women veterans were worthy and so. But they
Speaker 1: said no, and they didn't like the statue that we proposed.
Speaker 1: They didn't They said we couldn't have the site. Well,
Speaker 1: two things, I understand that public art is very controversial
Speaker 1: and that we we might have to compromise that we
Speaker 1: could not use that statue, but they could not take
Speaker 1: the side away from us. It was for Vietnam veterans.
Speaker 1: But but long story short, in a lot of meetings
Speaker 1: and a lot of discussion, we determined to get the site.
Speaker 1: We'd go to Congress and get a bill passed. Well,
Speaker 1: it took two years and a lot of lobbying and
Speaker 1: a lot of um petitions and a lot of letters
Speaker 1: coming now from a lot of wounded veterans who are
Speaker 1: now getting behind us by the thousands, who are saying,
Speaker 1: if it wasn't for these women in Vietnam, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: be here to write this letter. They deserved this memorial.
Speaker 1: So now we're getting a lot of support, and thanks
Speaker 1: to a piece on sixty Minutes by Morley Safer who
Speaker 1: asked me to come on to sixty minutes and tell
Speaker 1: the millions of viewers why J. Carter Brown said we
Speaker 1: didn't deserve a memorial. He said, if if they allow
Speaker 1: the women to have a memorial, they'll have to allow
Speaker 1: the Canine Core because the Canine Core had also submitted
Speaker 1: a proposal when we had that they wanted to put
Speaker 1: a statue honoring the Canine Core at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. Well,
Speaker 1: you know, putting us in that same sentence or as
Speaker 1: a real it's like, what did he just say? So
Speaker 1: again we did. We got Congress behind us to give
Speaker 1: us the site. Next step, next phase now defying all
Speaker 1: the naysayers and pushing back on the them and um that. UM,
Speaker 1: we had to have a design competition, so that took
Speaker 1: another year, and Glenna Goodacre of Santa Fe, New Mexico
Speaker 1: created the Vietnam Women's Memorial as you see today in Washington,
Speaker 1: d C. On the National Mall. And it was a
Speaker 1: brutal process. We crossed every tea, we dotted every eye
Speaker 1: to do everything right and UM with the design competition
Speaker 1: and all the things that go into that, and UM
Speaker 1: we won. On Veterans Day, we dedicated the Vietnam Women's Memorial.
Speaker 1: Despite those who actually had built the wall, they're being
Speaker 1: UM controversial and adversarial towards us as well, and we
Speaker 1: worked around them, and we worked with the National Park
Speaker 1: Service and those Veteran service organizations got behind us women
Speaker 1: and we succeeded. And we succeeded largely because we got
Speaker 1: those women out of the woodwork and encourage them to
Speaker 1: tell their stories and use their voices and UM talk
Speaker 1: about what they did in Vietnam or any other place
Speaker 1: around the world, because that memorial honors all the women
Speaker 1: who served, not just those in country. Those women in country. UM.
Speaker 1: It is a sculpture in the round and the nurse
Speaker 1: is tending to a Wounded Soldier um. The other two
Speaker 1: women are non nurses. This memorial honors all women, regardless
Speaker 1: of what core we served in or where we served,
Speaker 1: or rank. There is no rank on that memorial, and
Speaker 1: it is not the nurses Memorial. It is the Women's Memorial,
Speaker 1: but of course it includes the nurses. Well, thank goodness
Speaker 1: for your determination and perseverance and deep commitment to this project,
Speaker 1: because it's breathtaking to be able to stand before that
Speaker 1: memorial and understand what it represents in the service that
Speaker 1: it represents as well. You know, the U. S Military
Speaker 1: has changed a lot. Women are now serving in combat roles, uh,
Speaker 1: and just about every other role for that matter. What
Speaker 1: do you think about the progress that's been made for women.
Speaker 1: Are we in a different place today? Absolutely, and thank
Speaker 1: goodness we are in And that is because when we
Speaker 1: bring women into the room and at the table, let's
Speaker 1: let's just use that as an example, and now women
Speaker 1: generals at that table, okay. And during my time, a
Speaker 1: woman could not be a general. We couldn't be pregnant.
Speaker 1: And now women who have families are also being deployed,
Speaker 1: and so we have a larger um population of women
Speaker 1: who are able to serve our nation if they choose,
Speaker 1: because still we are not conscripted or drafted. But look
Speaker 1: at the thousands of women who step up to serve
Speaker 1: our country in some way. Uh, there were no helicopter
Speaker 1: female pilots in Vietnam. And look today, you think, you
Speaker 1: think of of the women who have lost arms and
Speaker 1: legs and have prosthetics, have been injured, have died. Um
Speaker 1: the numbers, the sheer numbers because women are in very
Speaker 1: dangerous areas. And the way they try to explain it
Speaker 1: is we women in Vietnam, we were also in combat.
Speaker 1: We The difference is back then we could not carry
Speaker 1: weapons and we couldn't shoot back. We weren't trained in weapons.
Speaker 1: We weren't even supposed to have them. But I know
Speaker 1: a few that carry their own. Forty fives were in
Speaker 1: such dangerous areas. The women today are in combat and
Speaker 1: hearing weapons, and they're trained in weaponry and artillery and
Speaker 1: all of the above. And you know, when I see
Speaker 1: women today flying jet jet fighter planes and helicopters, it's
Speaker 1: just extraordinary. How women what we have achieved as women.
Speaker 1: But every decade we stand on the shoulders. You know,
Speaker 1: us Vietnam nurses, we stood on those World War One.
Speaker 1: It was World War One where women were allowed finally
Speaker 1: into the military, and they were is the founding of
Speaker 1: the Army nurse score nine one. And then gradually, um
Speaker 1: they were ranked, they could be officers. We were officers.
Speaker 1: We are officers if we're nurses. And and then just
Speaker 1: the doors that have opened, why did those doors open
Speaker 1: because we proved ourselves. We proved that we were not
Speaker 1: shrinking violets, and and that we were just going to
Speaker 1: run away when you know, times got hard. It was
Speaker 1: the opposite. We were right in the thick of the
Speaker 1: danger and we were protecting the men. They men were
Speaker 1: not protecting us nurses in those units. I told you
Speaker 1: the story about one night in Vietnam. We female nurses,
Speaker 1: we were protecting the men. We did not go for
Speaker 1: cover or safety and tell those men had been taken
Speaker 1: care of. We were there for them. So every generation
Speaker 1: of women has proven that we are smart, that we
Speaker 1: are brave, that we measure up, and that we have
Speaker 1: the abilities and the skill with training to do what
Speaker 1: the men are doing. And you know, it's uh, it's
Speaker 1: been extraordinary to see when I see pictures. Of course,
Speaker 1: the last twenty years Iraq, Afghanistan, and and you know
Speaker 1: the trauma, the tragedy, you know, losing men and women
Speaker 1: in that war. And I'll just share one quick little
Speaker 1: question that when the war in Iraq broke out, I
Speaker 1: got a phone call from a reporter and he'd heard
Speaker 1: that I was a nurse in Vietnam. And he said
Speaker 1: to me, and he was he was kind of a
Speaker 1: little sarcastic, and he said to me, well, are you
Speaker 1: ready for women to come home in body bags? And
Speaker 1: I said to him, look, I said, women have come
Speaker 1: home in body bags, and no, I'm not ready, and
Speaker 1: I'm not ready for men to come home in body bags.
Speaker 1: I have three sons and I have a daughter. I
Speaker 1: don't want either one of them to come home in
Speaker 1: a body bag. But it's men and women who are
Speaker 1: either drafted or conscripted or join as volunteers. Like our
Speaker 1: last twenty year war, there were no there was no draft.
Speaker 1: Look at the men and women who stepped up to serve,
Speaker 1: knowing they were putting themselves in grave danger and and
Speaker 1: willing to do that, and then the sacrifices that they
Speaker 1: have made. And then his second question really struck a nerve.
Speaker 1: He said, well, won't the men just if women are
Speaker 1: in combat over there, won't the men just be running around?
Speaker 1: They can't do their jobs because they'll be protecting the women. Well, oh,
Speaker 1: you've heard all the arguments. I can hear that, my goodness. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you know what I told him with that question. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: this has been just extraordinary, this conversation with you, and
Speaker 1: we are just about at a time and I wanted
Speaker 1: to ask you one last question. Here we are on
Speaker 1: Veteran's Day, We've just gone through the searing experience of
Speaker 1: seeing the Taliban takeover in Afghanistan in uh We don't
Speaker 1: know what will come in the days and weeks and
Speaker 1: years ahead, but what gives you hope, My hope is
Speaker 1: what has always been and and that is um confidence
Speaker 1: in the men and women in America who will step
Speaker 1: up to serve our nation. And despite the right or wrong.
Speaker 1: You know, it's hard for us when we're young to
Speaker 1: know enough. Like me, I didn't know much about I
Speaker 1: knew nothing about Vietnam. All I knew it was across
Speaker 1: the Pacific Ocean. And the hope is that for women,
Speaker 1: women have always stepped up to serve because they care
Speaker 1: and they always will and they can bring more to
Speaker 1: the table now because they will help make decisions because
Speaker 1: their generals, their their their offices, their flag officers that
Speaker 1: they are they have graduates of West Point, the Naval Academy,
Speaker 1: the Air Force Academy. Those opportunities were not available to
Speaker 1: me because we could never be what leaders women men
Speaker 1: thought women couldn't shouldn't be leaders. But now I have
Speaker 1: hope in these women who are at the discussion table
Speaker 1: about um, about war, about military readiness and preparedness, and
Speaker 1: that that our troops are better trained than we were. Uh.
Speaker 1: But I also have deep concern about homecoming, that we're
Speaker 1: not doing a good enough job to help our veterans
Speaker 1: readjust back into their communities. The suicide rate is off
Speaker 1: the charts. The suicide rate is alarming. The rate of
Speaker 1: sexual assault in the military does not seem to be disappearing.
Speaker 1: It's not even going down all that much. And these
Speaker 1: are grave concerns that I have about our our military.
Speaker 1: But I have hope. There are good people, good good
Speaker 1: people who um and I could start naming them. You
Speaker 1: know that these chairmen of the Joint Chiefs, who I
Speaker 1: had great admiration for, and um, we have good leadership,
Speaker 1: and I have hoped that we will continue to have
Speaker 1: that good leadership. Well, thank you so much, and and
Speaker 1: thank you for raising these challenges also because there's much
Speaker 1: more all of us can do to be respectful of
Speaker 1: and supportive of our veterans, and I hope we will
Speaker 1: think about that on this Veteran's Day. So thank you
Speaker 1: so much, Diane Carlson Evans for what you have done.
Speaker 1: That memorial will always remind us of the service of
Speaker 1: so many uh, and we're grateful to you. Thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you for the opportunity to share this story. It's
Speaker 1: it's such an important message to our country on Veteran
Speaker 1: State or to remember the men and women who have
Speaker 1: served and are still serving. So thank you well. And
Speaker 1: it's a powerful story. It's the story of our country
Speaker 1: in many ways. So much courage, compassion, and perseverance. What
Speaker 1: an honor to talk to Diane Carlson Evans. Here are
Speaker 1: three things I took from the conversation. First, it's all
Speaker 1: too easy to overlook the sacrifices made by those who
Speaker 1: serve our country. When Diane Carlson Evans returned to the
Speaker 1: United States from her time in Vietnam, she realized there
Speaker 1: was a huge gulf between what she'd experienced and the
Speaker 1: public's perception. They don't know what we've done. She thought,
Speaker 1: we've only done what our fathers and mothers had done,
Speaker 1: and that was to serve in uniform when we were
Speaker 1: asked second, women's contributions and women's voices need to be recognized.
Speaker 1: That belief spurred Diane's long back for a women's statue
Speaker 1: won them all. When confronted with naysayers, she would remind herself,
Speaker 1: this is our place. Finally, when you're fighting for an
Speaker 1: important cause, you can find a way to make it happen.
Speaker 1: When Diane began her campaign, she had no idea how
Speaker 1: to accomplish it, but her faith in her goal drew
Speaker 1: supporters and allies who helped make the memorial a reality.
Speaker 1: Tune in next week and hear about our next featured
Speaker 1: woman and discover why she's one of Seneca's on Women
Speaker 1: to Hear. Seneca's one hundred Women to Hear is a
Speaker 1: collaboration between the Seneca Women Podcast Network and I Heart Radio,
Speaker 1: with support from founding partner PNG. Have a Great Day