WEBVTT - As Pandemic Raged, More People Have Left Big Cities 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.920 It's Tuesday, mate. I'm oscar mirrors from the Daily Dive 0:00:04.000 --> 0:00:08.119 podcast in Los Angeles, and this is reopening America. New 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:10.639 census figures are showing that big cities have been in 0:00:10.680 --> 0:00:13.400 a decline. The largest cities lost a greaterst share of 0:00:13.400 --> 0:00:16.759 people than small and midsized ones. New York, San Jose, 0:00:16.840 --> 0:00:19.639 and Chicago saw the greatest numbers of people leaving, while 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:22.799 Texas and Arizona had seven of the ten fastest growing cities. 0:00:23.320 --> 0:00:26.000 All of these migrations were accelerated by the pandemic and 0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:29.840 work from home capabilities. Paul Overburg Report at The Wall 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:32.600 Street Journal joins us for why people are leaving. Thanks 0:00:32.640 --> 0:00:36.520 for joining us, Paul, thanks for having me. Well, let's 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:39.560 talk about some of the demographic changes that we saw 0:00:39.880 --> 0:00:42.880 in big cities throughout the pandemic. You know, at the 0:00:42.960 --> 0:00:45.680 very beginning of the pandemic, we started seeing this migration 0:00:46.159 --> 0:00:49.919 out of big cities, especially once worked from home and 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:54.240 the remote work thing really started getting into into action. 0:00:54.680 --> 0:00:57.040 But that trend ended up continuing. We saw a lot 0:00:57.080 --> 0:00:59.960 of big cities, especially on the coast, to people moving 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:03.400 inland to cheaper, bigger homes, things like that. But it 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:06.080 seemed to have been a trend that continued throughout the pandemic. 0:01:06.160 --> 0:01:08.680 So Paul, tell us what we're seeing there. Well, the 0:01:08.760 --> 0:01:12.800 Census Bureau has just released new population estimates for cities 0:01:12.959 --> 0:01:16.200 for the year that ended last July one, so effectively 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:20.160 the first year of the pandemic, and these estimates show 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:22.640 that that s and D that trend has continued. The 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:27.520 biggest cities have had major losses of to three percent 0:01:28.120 --> 0:01:33.520 of their populations from the mid and even smaller mid 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:36.800 midsize cities half a million to a million. A lot 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:39.039 of those, even ones that have been growing in the 0:01:39.120 --> 0:01:43.240 years before that, so are small losses or basically flat growth. 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:46.640 And so where did we see the biggest losses? Any 0:01:46.680 --> 0:01:50.800 cities in particular that saw the biggest migrations out New 0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:53.800 York and San Francisco sort of stood out. New York 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:55.840 plus three and a half percent of its residents in 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:58.000 a year, what's about a third of a million people. 0:01:58.160 --> 0:02:01.480 San Francisco lost more than ex percent, which is not 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:04.480 as many people against San Francisco smaller. But you can 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:07.960 see smaller losses all around the Bay Area, in the 0:02:08.080 --> 0:02:11.360 cities around that area, including areas that have been growing. 0:02:11.560 --> 0:02:14.480 So it's not just the core cities themselves. You can 0:02:14.480 --> 0:02:18.200 see the same sort of pattern in cities like Los 0:02:18.200 --> 0:02:21.960 Angeles and Chicago, and even on down the line if 0:02:22.000 --> 0:02:26.399 you go to places like Nashville or Seattle and Atlanta 0:02:26.440 --> 0:02:29.720 and Denver, places that were growing up until the last 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:32.799 couple of years. And it's not just the pandemic. There 0:02:32.800 --> 0:02:36.680 were some signs of this starting even in before the pandemic, 0:02:36.760 --> 0:02:40.480 a combination of other demographic factors. Part of it is 0:02:40.639 --> 0:02:43.760 peak numbers of baby boomers are now reaching retirement age, 0:02:43.800 --> 0:02:47.600 and uh they find that they can sort of tash 0:02:47.680 --> 0:02:50.919 out of owning a home for ten or twenty years 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:54.680 and moved to a less congested, slower paced place with 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:59.880 a lot less expense. At the same time, millennials. Millennials 0:02:59.880 --> 0:03:02.840 are exactly right in getting time for the families and 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:05.440 looking for that bigger space for those growing parts of it. 0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:09.160 They were also a big part of people moving out right. Millennials, 0:03:09.520 --> 0:03:12.680 the oldest millennials are now reaching their mid thirties, and 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:17.360 they didn't didn't marry and have children at the same 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:20.960 pace at earlier generations did. But now because there's so 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:23.720 many of them, they're having an impact on things like 0:03:23.840 --> 0:03:27.800 the housing market, especially the house a housing market for 0:03:27.919 --> 0:03:30.720 places where you'd raise a family with more space and 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:33.639 good school districts and things like that. So that's a 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:36.640 piece of this movement that was already starting, and the 0:03:36.640 --> 0:03:40.520 pandemic is just sort of accelerated. Now more people are 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:44.120 participating in this move for those reasons, but also because 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:45.960 they weren't enough space to be able to work from 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:48.920 home if that's an option with their employer, and where 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:51.440 are a lot of these people going to. Texas and 0:03:51.480 --> 0:03:54.840 Arizona had seven of the top ten fastest growing cities 0:03:55.200 --> 0:03:59.560 with fifty people or more between one, so Texas and 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:02.440 Zona getting a big chunk of those people. Florida and 0:04:02.440 --> 0:04:06.040 Tennessee also in these top ten cities, right, you can 0:04:06.080 --> 0:04:09.440 see a lot of the cities that are growing fast. Obviously, 0:04:09.520 --> 0:04:12.280 they're at the small end of that range, that fifty thousand. 0:04:12.760 --> 0:04:15.240 The census spirit uses to kind of sort of set 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:17.719 a floor on this places that are out and sort 0:04:17.760 --> 0:04:20.520 of what you might think of his ex urban locations 0:04:20.560 --> 0:04:25.360 around uh say, these major areas. So a fair number 0:04:25.360 --> 0:04:29.360 of spring Hill, Tennessee, which is you know, well outside Nashville, 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:33.840 and Buckeye, Arizona, which is well outside Phoenix and several 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:37.640 other places around Phoenix on the outskirts and the edges 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:40.200 of it, like places that are now are actually fair 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.799 size cities you may not have heard of, like places 0:04:42.880 --> 0:04:46.080 like Goodyear and Buck and Eye. Right, Yeah, and so 0:04:46.080 --> 0:04:48.360 you spoke to a lot of people that made these moves, 0:04:48.400 --> 0:04:51.360 that made these moves to different states and cities completely 0:04:51.839 --> 0:04:54.240 and for the most part, they're very happy with the 0:04:54.320 --> 0:04:57.960 changes there. Their houses are bigger now, their mortgages are 0:04:58.279 --> 0:05:00.480 they feel might be a little more pro read because 0:05:00.480 --> 0:05:02.719 of the interest rates and stuff like that. So a 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:05.440 lot of them very happy with the moves. Right. My 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:08.640 colleague Janet Atomy spoke with a couple of folks, one 0:05:08.720 --> 0:05:12.200 family that moved from Portland, Oregon to a little bit 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:14.920 e town on the upper Peninsula of Michigan and was 0:05:15.080 --> 0:05:19.000 very happy with all the changes in their life because 0:05:19.000 --> 0:05:21.880 they've got more room and they can do She and 0:05:21.880 --> 0:05:25.440 her husband can work remotely. So yeah, there's a lot 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:30.800 of families sort of reaching the transition points in their lives, 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:35.040 and the pandemic sort of nudge some people or pushed 0:05:35.040 --> 0:05:39.279 some people to sort of make decisions and make moves. Yeah, definitely, 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:40.919 I mean the work from home thing has been a 0:05:40.960 --> 0:05:43.120 big game changer for a lot of people, and they've 0:05:43.160 --> 0:05:44.960 taken advantage of it. So, I mean there's a lot 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:47.440 of It's a big common theme we heard throughout the pandemic. 0:05:47.480 --> 0:05:51.800 So we'll keep seeing if these trends do continue. Paul Overberg, 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:54.080 reporter at the Wall Street Journal, thank you very much 0:05:54.080 --> 0:05:59.760 for joining us. Thanks for having me. I'm Oscar Ramiers 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:02.680 and this has been reopening America. Don't forget that. For 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:04.360 today's big news stories, you can check me out on 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:07.400 the Daily Dive podcast every Monday through Friday. So follow 0:06:07.440 --> 0:06:10.120 us on I Heart Radio or wherever you get your podcast.