1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. 5 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, 6 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 2: my name is Noela. 7 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 3: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our 8 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:34,839 Speaker 3: super producer Alexis codenamed Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly, you 9 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 3: are here and that makes this the stuff they don't 10 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,160 Speaker 3: want you to know. It's the top of the week, 11 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 3: so before we lead into episodes, we like to catch 12 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,879 Speaker 3: up with each other and most importantly you, fellow conspiracy realist, 13 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 3: about news that didn't quite get the attention it deserves, 14 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 3: or news that was sort of below the fold, to 15 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 3: use the old school journalists speak. Going to learn about 16 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 3: a small business owner in Canada who has a little 17 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:09,400 Speaker 3: bit of legal trouble and perhaps a larger scheme. We're 18 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 3: going to learn about some groundbreaking Gadaga level stuff, which 19 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 3: we always told you was on the way sooner than 20 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:20,680 Speaker 3: you think. And before we do any of that, we're 21 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 3: going to travel to my hometown of Nashville, Tennessee, to 22 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 3: a hotel that I guess, not to shame anybody, but 23 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:31,759 Speaker 3: I don't think any of us want to visit there. 24 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:37,399 Speaker 2: Ah, well, Nashville, I'm interested in the hotel. Oh, the hotel. 25 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 4: Okay, I'm literally going to Nashville tomorrow. So what am 26 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 4: I welc here? 27 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 2: Well, No, We've got good news for you and a 28 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:46,679 Speaker 2: little bit of a story that rips right from season 29 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 2: four of Thirteen Days of Halloween, which is coming back 30 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 2: this October, by the way, so get your ears prepared 31 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 2: for that. We're going to travel today to one twenty 32 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 2: one fourth Avenue South in Nashville, Tennessee. It's the perfect 33 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 2: place you, guys, to build and operate a large four 34 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 2: star hotel, a very specific hotel, the Hilton Nashville Downtown. 35 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 2: Across the street to the north, you're going to find 36 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 2: Robert's Western World. I love it. 37 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:16,359 Speaker 4: It's the best place in the whole wide world. It's 38 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 4: my favorite honkue tnk on the strip. 39 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 2: I know you were going to say that, Noel, and 40 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 2: it is one of the greatest places. But it's right 41 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,959 Speaker 2: across the street from this location. To the east, you'll 42 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 2: find the Johnny Cash Museum. To the south, the Country 43 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 2: Music Hall of Fame, and museum and to the west, 44 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,840 Speaker 2: and I think this is really messed up and strange 45 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:38,560 Speaker 2: and funny for this episode the Bridgestone Arena, home of 46 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:43,799 Speaker 2: the NHL's Nashville Predators. You'll see why that is funny 47 00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 2: to me in just a moment. So let's imagine that 48 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 2: all of us, you especially, have an extra two hundred 49 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 2: and fifty to three hundred and fifty dollars to spend 50 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:56,079 Speaker 2: nightly at a four star hotel while you're visiting Nashville, Tennessee. 51 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 2: And for that price, my goodness, you'd expect to feel 52 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 2: quite at home. Even when you head back to your 53 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 2: room at night, you close that door, those hotel doors 54 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 2: that lock up so nicely, and get a little shut eye. Well, 55 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 2: today we're going to travel back to the early hours 56 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:17,080 Speaker 2: of Thursday, March thirtieth, around five am Central time, and 57 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 2: we're gonna put you in a little scenario here. So 58 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 2: imagine you're in this nice, lovely hotel. Imagine that all 59 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,480 Speaker 2: of a sudden, out of nowhere, you're awakened in your bed. 60 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 2: It's dark at first, you're not sure what's going on, 61 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 2: but there's a strange feeling. Can't tell what it is 62 00:03:32,520 --> 00:03:35,279 Speaker 2: quite yet, your foot. 63 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 3: Feel it in my fingers. Oh wait, it's in my toes. 64 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 2: Yees to set you see, your foot feels wet. You 65 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 2: hear movement at the end of your bed and you freeze, 66 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 2: you know that feeling like, oh crap, what is going on? 67 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 2: Then you realize it someone else is in your room 68 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 2: and they're actively sucking on your toes. 69 00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:00,640 Speaker 4: Oh god, Nashville toe sucker. 70 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 2: So you kick your legs violently, throw off the covers, 71 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 2: you spring out of bed, hit the nearest light switch, 72 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 2: and you do realize in that moment there is definitely 73 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:13,240 Speaker 2: a man in your room and he was sucking your toes. 74 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 2: But then you realize that you recognize this dude. He 75 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 2: was in your room yesterday helping to fix your TV 76 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 2: in there. It's David, the hotel's night manager. WHOA. I know, 77 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 2: this sounds like a nightmare scenario, and it is. It 78 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 2: really is. This is what allegedly happened to a man 79 00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:39,239 Speaker 2: named Peter Brennan on that day, March thirtieth. Guys, So anyway, 80 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 2: anything like this ever happened to y'all. 81 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 4: No, but yeah, it sounds like it's like the lyric 82 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:48,479 Speaker 4: of that Tenacious D song where it's like, then you 83 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:50,440 Speaker 4: feel something down by your feet, it's me. 84 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:52,280 Speaker 2: It's kg. I'm sucking up on your. 85 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 3: Toes, you know. 86 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's only. 87 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 3: That's sort of my guess. 88 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 4: Consensual maybe, but this is sexual assault. What you're just 89 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 4: this is horrific, bad, bad times, not the fodder for 90 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 4: comedy songs at all. 91 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 3: To answer your question, Matt, yeah, I have been in 92 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 3: situations where I was staying in a hostel, a hotel, 93 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 3: or private domicile. Uh, and someone did enter with the 94 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 3: idea that they I didn't. Thankfully there was not physical 95 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:27,480 Speaker 3: contact of an assumably sexual nature. But yeah, you have 96 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 3: to be careful. You know. It's not uncommon that someone 97 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 3: might try to enter a place when you're in a 98 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 3: vulnerable position, usually for a robbery or something like that. 99 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 3: But I would ten ten prefer to fend off an 100 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 3: attempted robbery then wake up with a very vulnerable part 101 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 3: of my body in a stranger's mouth. 102 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:57,119 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, the toes nobody no, very vulnerable. Not cool. 103 00:05:57,520 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 2: So let's tell you, at least according to the Metropolitan 104 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,359 Speaker 2: Nashshville Police Department, what happened. They said that according to 105 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:08,599 Speaker 2: David Neil, the night manager there, he created a card 106 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 2: the way you would create a card for any guest 107 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 2: at a hotel, you know, you just put it through 108 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 2: the little machine there it gets coded for a specific door. 109 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 2: He made one of those, then entered the guest room 110 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:24,039 Speaker 2: around five am, and according to him, it's because he 111 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,039 Speaker 2: smelled fire and he needed to go and check the 112 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 2: room and the potential victim of a fire. Okay. He however, 113 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 2: did not report the issue to security, and there were 114 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 2: no other reports from anyone in the hotel about the 115 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:45,160 Speaker 2: smell of smoke. When David Neil was asked where the 116 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 2: key was that he used to enter Peter's room, he 117 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:50,120 Speaker 2: said that he had thrown it away and it was 118 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 2: not recovered by anyone, which is. 119 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 3: Also not standard operating procedure. 120 00:06:55,480 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 2: No, none of that really is. Nope. So anyway, this 121 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:03,480 Speaker 2: guy ended up being hauled away to jail and his 122 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 2: bail was set at twenty seven thousand dollars. You can 123 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 2: find a picture of Neil Ben You shared with us 124 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 2: a picture of Neil that you found on Twitter. 125 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, a picture of the accused made the rounds on 126 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 3: social media and took the story viral. But I think Matt, 127 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:27,119 Speaker 3: you have a lot of details that were missing from 128 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 3: the discourse on Twitter. 129 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:32,040 Speaker 2: Well, sure, we can go to reporting from WSMV, a 130 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 2: local NBC affiliate out there in Nashville, in Wilson County 131 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 2: where this occurred, and they have information on this person, 132 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 2: David Neil, apparently not that long ago. In actually, I 133 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:48,920 Speaker 2: guess it is a while ago. Nineteen ninety seven, David 134 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:56,000 Speaker 2: Neil was found guilty of voluntary manslaughter for killing his roommate, 135 00:07:56,720 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 2: and you can and through this reporting, you know, you 136 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 2: can read about it. He killed his roommate allegedly after 137 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:06,520 Speaker 2: some kind of altercation, a long night of fighting basically 138 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 2: that turned into a dangerous situation, and according to David Neil, 139 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 2: he was forced to go into his bedroom, take out 140 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 2: a gun and shoot his roommate multiple times, killing him. 141 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 2: And you can find through casetext dot com State versus Neil, 142 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 2: and you can find this. It was posted January eighteenth, 143 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 2: two thousand, or at least that's when this was created, 144 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:35,439 Speaker 2: and you can read the I guess, the statement from 145 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 2: David Neil about what had happened, the entire thing there, 146 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 2: which just feels a little strange. It makes me feel 147 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:46,080 Speaker 2: like it's even more suspect now knowing these actions that 148 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 2: he took after he got out of prison and you know, 149 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:52,440 Speaker 2: got a job as a night manager there at that 150 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 2: very nice Hilton hotel. It's just very strange to me. 151 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 2: I guess that you could deal with something like that, right, 152 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 2: killing someone in your home who happens to be your 153 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 2: roommate with a gun, get charged with voluntary manslaughter after 154 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 2: you admit to killing this person, go to prison for 155 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 2: a while, get out, and then I guess be in 156 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:16,280 Speaker 2: charge of a large hotel like that. That's a bit 157 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 2: strange to me, but I don't know. It was also 158 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 2: strange to Peter, the man whose toes got sucked, because 159 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 2: now he is suing. He is suing I believe the 160 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 2: Hilton itself for hiring this person as a night manager. 161 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 3: Yeah. I saw somewhere that his legal representatives are saying 162 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 3: he suffered from quote severe and permanent emotional distress, embarrassment, 163 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 3: past and future medical expenses, plus a loss of earning capacity, 164 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:53,440 Speaker 3: which I mean it sounds maybe hyperbolic to some people, 165 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 3: but consider all the health risk involved, you know, consider 166 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:01,840 Speaker 3: consider whether or not this guy is going to be 167 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 3: able to sleep comfortably in any hotel for a while. 168 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:09,320 Speaker 3: You know what I mean, and it makes sense that 169 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,840 Speaker 3: he would. I mean, again, we're not lawyers, but it 170 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:15,080 Speaker 3: makes sense that he would take legal action against Hilton 171 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 3: as well, because they're the ones who hired him and 172 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 3: put him in that position of responsibility. 173 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 4: Right. 174 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:26,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, According to that same WSMV reporting, I'm going to 175 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 2: read from an article titled Nashville hotel employee he's snuck 176 00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 2: into hotel's room previously convicted of manslaughter. Lawyers say they've 177 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 2: got information from Peter Brennan's lawyers. I'm going to read 178 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:40,320 Speaker 2: verbatim a bit from this. Brennan's lawyers were told that 179 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,480 Speaker 2: the hotel employee was fired from the hotel because he 180 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 2: refused to give a statement regarding this alleged occurrence of 181 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:52,600 Speaker 2: assault and breaking into somebody's room. They are currently, at 182 00:10:52,679 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 2: least when this was written on the fourth of May 183 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 2: this year, they were waiting on surveillance footage from the 184 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 2: hotel to confirm the whereabouts of Brennan and his movements 185 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 2: that evening. And just add a little bit more, here's 186 00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 2: a quote from Brennan quote. I just feel like Hilton 187 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:11,679 Speaker 2: has not been helpful or forthcoming whatsoever. And I don't 188 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 2: know why, but it's very disconcerting. And he went on 189 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 2: to say that the hotels management alleged this lack of 190 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 2: cooperation that Peter Brennan is alleging makes him concerned for 191 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:25,600 Speaker 2: all future guests of the establishment. 192 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:28,800 Speaker 3: I mean that all sounds spot on to me. Those 193 00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 3: are very reasonable things. Additionally, we know one of the articles, well, 194 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 3: it's gone out through a couple of different articles. I 195 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:42,760 Speaker 3: know CBS News did hear back from a representative of 196 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:48,199 Speaker 3: the Hilton, right, and they're already cauterizing the wound. They 197 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 3: said that quote, Hilton Nashville Downtown is independently owned and 198 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,600 Speaker 3: operated by a third party. No Hilton entity employee staff 199 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 3: at this property. AKA, this is not our burden. 200 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:06,959 Speaker 2: So weird, so weird the way that works. Sometimes you 201 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:09,840 Speaker 2: got to just borrow that name, slap it on a hotel. 202 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:14,120 Speaker 3: Right. One day off air, I'll tell you guys about 203 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 3: how I ended up in a place that was definitely 204 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 3: not a days In but called itself days In and 205 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:24,880 Speaker 3: had apparently gotten in so much trouble. They had a 206 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 3: little placard that said they were legally required to notify 207 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:32,199 Speaker 3: me they were not affiliated with days In. They were 208 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 3: like a days In, but not the days in. 209 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 2: You get it. 210 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:39,640 Speaker 4: Well, yeah, so is that pretty standard? Like, you know, 211 00:12:39,679 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 4: when there's a franchise of any large corporation, like they 212 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:48,760 Speaker 4: are indemnified, Like it's entirely the burden is on the 213 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 4: franchise holder and the actual corporation is no longer in 214 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 4: any way, you know, in the line of fire. 215 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 2: Legally speaking, I guess it would be the people who 216 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 2: actually operate the hotel, you know, And in this case, 217 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 2: this is one of the higher level people at the 218 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 2: hotel at that time. 219 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 3: Right, someone in the position to clone a key to 220 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 3: give refunds, you know, to comp rooms, which I guess 221 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,800 Speaker 3: many you know, this makes me think, Matt, it might 222 00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:24,320 Speaker 3: be interesting for us to do an episode on stuff 223 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 3: hotels don't want you to know. 224 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:30,199 Speaker 2: Hey, that's a good episode. Let's do that for sure. Definitely, 225 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 2: all right, well, there's not much else to add here, guys, 226 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:39,319 Speaker 2: just horrifying in my mind. At least nobody got hurt 227 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:45,080 Speaker 2: except psychologically mentally physically PTSD. Oh no, some Peter got 228 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,480 Speaker 2: hurt for sure. And now I'm never going to fall 229 00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:51,000 Speaker 2: asleep in hotel room unless it's like triple locked. Okay, 230 00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 2: we're gonna hear a word from our sponsor. Will be 231 00:13:53,480 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 2: right back with more strange news. 232 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 4: And we're back with another piece of strange news. And 233 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,440 Speaker 4: this is one that on the surface might just seem 234 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 4: like a real kooki fella trying to skirt the law 235 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 4: and do something to make some headlines. Okay, So in Vancouver, Canada, 236 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 4: we've reported on this in the past. They have some 237 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 4: pretty progressive drug laws. You may have seen it reported 238 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 4: as Vancouver, Canada. British Columbia legalizes all hard drugs, and 239 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 4: well that's not entirely the case. They have decriminalized possession 240 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 4: of up to two point five grams of opioids, crack cocaine, 241 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 4: powder cocaine, methamphetamine, and MDMA. Heroin is not included on 242 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 4: the list that I have here in front of me, 243 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 4: but I do believe that that, yeah, opioids, so that 244 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 4: would be include in opioids. This is a decriminalization policy 245 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 4: that kicked in in January over there in British Columbia. 246 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 4: What was not part of this was the sale and 247 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 4: distribution of said narcotics. But there is a man in 248 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 4: Vancouver who is trying to not necessarily change well yeah, 249 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 4: big picture changed that. Jerry Martin, a fifty one year 250 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 4: old man, recently opened a shop called the Drugs Store, 251 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 4: operating out of a mobile like kind of you know, 252 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 4: food truck type situation, and the Drugs Store offered or 253 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 4: the idea was that you could buy up to two 254 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 4: point five grams of all of the aforementioned substances. 255 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 2: The key here being. 256 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 4: That they were all all of the stuff that that 257 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:02,280 Speaker 4: Jerry was pedaling there had been tested for purity that 258 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 4: he was you know, giving a guarantee of purity and 259 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 4: more and most importantly, lack of adulterance. And when we're 260 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,080 Speaker 4: talking about adulterance, we're not only talking about things that 261 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 4: are used to increase the weight of a product while 262 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 4: decreasing the actual you know, narcotics contained therein. But we're 263 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 4: talking about horrible things, things like fentanyl, things that are 264 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 4: killing people, specifically in British Columbia. And you know, especially 265 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:36,880 Speaker 4: since this decriminalization stuff kicked in a lot of overdose deaths, 266 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:40,880 Speaker 4: because just because the drugs are decriminalized, that does not 267 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:44,680 Speaker 4: mean that people are getting them from more reputable, for 268 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 4: lack of a better word, sources. They're still getting them 269 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 4: from the same networks of black market drug dealers who 270 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 4: are getting them from who knows where and whose purity 271 00:16:55,400 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 4: levels and adulterant levels are completely to There actually is 272 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 4: a place that has been open in British Columbia for 273 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 4: some time where you can test your drugs. It is 274 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 4: literally called I think it's just literally called test your 275 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 4: drugs here or something to that. Yeah, get your drugs 276 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 4: tested is the name. It is a free I guess, 277 00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:23,719 Speaker 4: not really a clinic, but it is a lab. It's 278 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 4: a very small kind of sore front next to what 279 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,439 Speaker 4: appears to be a coffee shop on a main drag 280 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:33,240 Speaker 4: there in Vancouver, where you can take your drugs that 281 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:35,800 Speaker 4: you've purchased on the street and get them tested for free. 282 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 4: And a guy named Dana Larson, who is a cannabis 283 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,679 Speaker 4: and drug policy reform activist, started this place and the 284 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:47,200 Speaker 4: idea being that you know, it would reduce overdose deaths 285 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:50,440 Speaker 4: and frankly just death from people that are being poisoned 286 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 4: by stuff that's in their drugs because a lot of 287 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 4: what's considered overdose deaths it's kind of semantic, I guess, 288 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 4: but you know, they're not necessarily overdosing on the drug 289 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,400 Speaker 4: they think they're buying. They're overdosing on something that's put 290 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:06,159 Speaker 4: into the drug, or they're just outright being poisoned. So 291 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 4: back to Martin, he I actually heard an interview with 292 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 4: him with the CBC, the Canadian broadcasting company, where he 293 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:17,920 Speaker 4: was asked by a journalist why was he doing this, Why, 294 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:20,320 Speaker 4: you know, put himself in the line of fire, because, 295 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:23,400 Speaker 4: as we said, not legal to sell this stuff out 296 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:27,000 Speaker 4: out of a storefront. And when asked why he was 297 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 4: doing this, Martin said, well, he had lost two brothers 298 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 4: to drug related activities, one of whom died because of 299 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:40,400 Speaker 4: violence associated with drug deals a drug deal, and one 300 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 4: who overdosed recently or died recently. 301 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 2: Due to an accidental overdose. 302 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:50,120 Speaker 4: He blames this on the fact that, you know, despite 303 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:56,159 Speaker 4: drugs being decriminalized, folks can't really depend on what they're getting, 304 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 4: and they are if they're not taking it upon themselves 305 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 4: or if they're not educated properly to you know, get 306 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:05,480 Speaker 4: the drugs tested or to you know, make sure they're 307 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 4: being incredibly safe in terms of their use. 308 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:09,400 Speaker 2: I mean, no drug use is. 309 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 4: Safe, but we know that, you know, there are things 310 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 4: that you can keep on hand, like the drug can 311 00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:19,159 Speaker 4: revive you, nar can exactly that can revive someone in 312 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,840 Speaker 4: the event of an accidental overdose. And so when you're 313 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 4: talking to CBC, he cites these reasons that he is 314 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:29,680 Speaker 4: doing this, that he was just recently as the time 315 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 4: this recording, I think it was just a couple of 316 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:35,439 Speaker 4: days ago he was arrested, not I think just a 317 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:39,960 Speaker 4: couple of days after his shop opened for a business 318 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 4: And when he spoke to the CBC, he essentially implied 319 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:48,920 Speaker 4: that this was part of the plan that by getting arrested, 320 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:52,919 Speaker 4: by putting himself out there, he could become sort of 321 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 4: the beginning of a new conversation. Okay, so obviously the 322 00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 4: drug policies there in British Columbia are incredibly liberal, let's 323 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 4: just say, or progressive. But he's saying that that policy 324 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,679 Speaker 4: doesn't really go far enough, Like it's one thing to 325 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:12,400 Speaker 4: not uh, you know, to not persecute drug users and 326 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 4: get them into the prison system, but it's another thing 327 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 4: to actually employ policies that help save their lives. And 328 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:23,119 Speaker 4: he hopes and uh, and the the activists that I 329 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:27,680 Speaker 4: mentioned earlier who had to test your drugs facility, they 330 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,480 Speaker 4: believe that this is this is accurate, This could potentially 331 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:34,199 Speaker 4: open that conversation up and with given the government's position 332 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:39,400 Speaker 4: already possibly lead to some further, uh, further examination of 333 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:41,920 Speaker 4: you know, all of this and and guys, I want 334 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 4: to hear y'all's. 335 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 2: Take on this. 336 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,679 Speaker 4: But it reminds me of things that you hear about, 337 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,200 Speaker 4: like in places where certain drugs are a real problem, 338 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,600 Speaker 4: where there will be things like needle exchanges where you know, 339 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 4: rather than using sharing needles potentially getting blood borne illnesses, 340 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:00,880 Speaker 4: you know, and diseases that can kill you, you can 341 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,640 Speaker 4: actually exchange your dirty needles for clean ones. And there 342 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:07,360 Speaker 4: are some on certain sides of the debate that think 343 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 4: that's too much, that's like, we shouldn't be helping quote 344 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 4: unquote these people, you know who, I would argue, you 345 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 4: have a legitimate condition. You know, drug addiction is something 346 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:20,880 Speaker 4: that it can be treated and should be treated as 347 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 4: a disease in and of itself. So, I don't know, 348 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,199 Speaker 4: this is interesting stuff to me, and I think in 349 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,480 Speaker 4: a lot of ways, very brave move for this fellow 350 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:32,639 Speaker 4: to put himself out there like that in the in 351 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:35,840 Speaker 4: the name of trying to move the you know, policy forward. 352 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is really interesting to me. The statements put 353 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 2: up by the government there in British Columbia about decriminalization 354 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:48,320 Speaker 2: is not the same as legalizing, right, because you're you're 355 00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 2: talking about the possession of drugs when you're talking about 356 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:56,920 Speaker 2: decriminalization versus the trafficking of drugs, which is why it's 357 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:01,560 Speaker 2: still Yeah, that's why it's still legal. When it comes 358 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 2: to harm reduction and things. Remember when we had a 359 00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 2: host of psychoactive on and he was talking a lot 360 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 2: about some of the things that can be done to 361 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 2: reduce harm. 362 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,800 Speaker 3: Right, I'm really glad to use the term harm reduction 363 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:15,359 Speaker 3: as well. 364 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, yeah, I mean that's what he preaches, right. 365 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:22,360 Speaker 2: Ethan Nadleman has spent decades looking at that very thing, 366 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:24,960 Speaker 2: harm reduction, And you know, there are a lot of 367 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:27,560 Speaker 2: very intelligent people out there trying to figure out how 368 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 2: to actually enact this these kinds of practices in cities 369 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,680 Speaker 2: across the world. How do you actually effectively do that 370 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:39,840 Speaker 2: allow people to safely take drugs but also attempt to 371 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:44,680 Speaker 2: help people get out of addictive behaviors and get off 372 00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:48,920 Speaker 2: of addictive substances. It's it's a it's not an easy thing. 373 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,359 Speaker 2: That's why we haven't solved it yet, right, But I 374 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 2: do like this person's I don't know what you call it, 375 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:56,960 Speaker 2: gusto moxie, Yeah, whatever it is. 376 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:01,360 Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I'm with you on that. That because when 377 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 3: I was originally reading about this story, one of my questions, 378 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 3: and this occurs to some of our more cynical audience 379 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:14,360 Speaker 3: members as well, is was this his intention going in right? 380 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 3: Or was this? I mean, I feel like it must 381 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 3: have been, because you would know obviously that this would 382 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 3: eventually lead to legal problems. Hopefully will spark a larger conversation, 383 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 3: because one thing that I find somewhat problematic about the 384 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 3: personal responsibility argument that is foisted so often, or hoisted rather, 385 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:46,240 Speaker 3: is the idea that someone in the grips of addiction 386 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 3: right needing a substance will stop long enough, will delay 387 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 3: the ingestion long enough to say, hey, let me go 388 00:23:56,160 --> 00:24:00,119 Speaker 3: across town to get a safety check, or hey let 389 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 3: me vet this provider of this thing. So if we're 390 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,640 Speaker 3: not treating if we're treating addiction as an illness, which 391 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 3: it is, rather than a crime, then the most efficient 392 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,399 Speaker 3: and the most efficacious way to address that is to 393 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:21,879 Speaker 3: make it easier to be safe. And unfortunately it doesn't 394 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 3: get the votes. I would imagine what we're looking at 395 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:29,840 Speaker 3: is the quarreling of multiple addictions. The politicians making these 396 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 3: laws are addicted to power. They're addicted to easy votes 397 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,719 Speaker 3: just as much as someone may be addicted to a drug, 398 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 3: and so of course they're not going to be incentivized 399 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 3: in many cases to actually help the people. Now, would 400 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:49,080 Speaker 3: that change if there was a large voting block of 401 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:52,880 Speaker 3: people who thought of addiction this way, or if there 402 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 3: was a large voting block of people who were addicted 403 00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:00,400 Speaker 3: in some substance or in recovery, I would say yes. 404 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,320 Speaker 3: But to your question, at your excellent question, why isn't 405 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:08,200 Speaker 3: this getting fixed? I think it's because the system as 406 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 3: it exists now is incentivized to continue the punitive approach 407 00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:16,360 Speaker 3: rather than the rehabilitative approach. 408 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, certainly that's the case in the United States. 409 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,119 Speaker 4: I one hundred percent agree, and I think probably to 410 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,200 Speaker 4: a lesser degree the case in Canada as well. The 411 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 4: thing that's interesting here too is Martin's lawyer, Paul Lewin, 412 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 4: said that this was his intent from the start, and 413 00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 4: that he has a whole constitutional argument ready to go 414 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:41,760 Speaker 4: if and now when he gets criminally jo he hasn't 415 00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:44,640 Speaker 4: been criminally charged yet, He just has he's been he's 416 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:48,200 Speaker 4: been detained, you know, and his business has been shut down, 417 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 4: which of course was not operating with a certainly not 418 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,439 Speaker 4: operating with with a legal business license. But this is 419 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 4: what his lawyer, Paul Lewin, had to say. If mister 420 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,479 Speaker 4: Martin is charged with selling controlled substances, it is his 421 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 4: intention to challenge the constitutionality of those laws. And the 422 00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:07,359 Speaker 4: laws we're talking about are section seven of the Charter 423 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:12,760 Speaker 4: of Rights and Freedoms, which is what decriminalized possession of narcotics. 424 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:17,120 Speaker 4: He goes on, he would allege that laws that prevent 425 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 4: a safe supply and result in death by poisoning contravene 426 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:25,080 Speaker 4: Section seven of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and 427 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,280 Speaker 4: must be struck down because and this is from reporting 428 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:32,600 Speaker 4: in Vice. That's reporting on quite a few other sources, 429 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,920 Speaker 4: including statements from Martin, and his lawyer has this to say. 430 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,959 Speaker 4: Section seven of the Charter states that all Canadians have 431 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 4: quote the right to life, liberty and security of the person, 432 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,520 Speaker 4: and the right not to be deprived thereof except in 433 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 4: accordance with principles of fundamental justice. Now forgive me this 434 00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:52,560 Speaker 4: Section seven is obviously just more of a constitutional thing. 435 00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 4: This is not specifically, this is not sipeificly language from 436 00:26:55,960 --> 00:27:01,879 Speaker 4: the Act that legalized, or rather decriminalized possession of certain 437 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 4: controlled substances. So he is arguing that by decriminalizing the 438 00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:12,440 Speaker 4: controlled substances, they are essentially not They're talking about two 439 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 4: sides of their mouths. They're saying, yeah, it's okay it 440 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,360 Speaker 4: possessed this, but we're also not going to do anything 441 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 4: to make sure that you are able, you know, given 442 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:24,720 Speaker 4: the new law, to be guaranteed that life, liberty, and 443 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,720 Speaker 4: security of the person. Yeah, and it says not to 444 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 4: be deprived there of accept in accordance with the principles 445 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:36,120 Speaker 4: of fundamental justice. So interesting. I think it's an interesting, 446 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:38,000 Speaker 4: an interesting maneuver. 447 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:40,879 Speaker 2: And I figured it out, guys, I figured out the problem. 448 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 2: I know how to fix it. Here we go. You're ready. 449 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 2: We're heading towards some form of universal income because none 450 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:50,679 Speaker 2: of us are going to have jobs anymore, because the 451 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,240 Speaker 2: machines are going to run everything. Right, this is inevitable. 452 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:53,919 Speaker 2: We all know this. 453 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:59,240 Speaker 3: Eventually. I want to positive not to interrupt with interject 454 00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 3: mat because I think, I think I my spider sense 455 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:02,960 Speaker 3: tells me where you're going. 456 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 4: Uh. 457 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 3: The post work economy will eventually exist, but it's going 458 00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,440 Speaker 3: to be a post worker economy first, and ubi the 459 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:17,159 Speaker 3: current models of it, they're not ready. 460 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, but anyway, none of this is ready, None of 461 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,919 Speaker 2: this is even real. I'm joking to a large extent, 462 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 2: just putting this out there. What if there were incentives 463 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 2: to not do drugs in uh, you get more money 464 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,320 Speaker 2: if when you get drug tested or whatever, you have 465 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,159 Speaker 2: no cocaine in your system, you have no heroin or 466 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,200 Speaker 2: opioids in your system, you have no marijuana system, and 467 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 2: you get it's a tiered system where you get more 468 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 2: and more money on that universal income thing, the fewer 469 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 2: and fewer vices that you have. Whoa dude, we can 470 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 2: do this. 471 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:54,360 Speaker 3: What about the lower your likelihood of certain genetic diseases 472 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 3: that's the into. 473 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a good that is a good point. Yeah, 474 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 4: you're the right place there. You're thinking, No, there's something 475 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 4: to that. I would argue if but but again then 476 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 4: that starts to other people who are, you know, perhaps 477 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 4: more predisposed to have these kinds of uh, you know, 478 00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,800 Speaker 4: proclivities towards substance abuse. So I know we're not try 479 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 4: I'm not not I know you're not I'm just saying 480 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:22,960 Speaker 4: like it is a slippery slope. But if if you're 481 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 4: if you're if you're giving someone a benefit because they're 482 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,560 Speaker 4: not afflicted with something that you know, you could argue 483 00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 4: is either genetic or learned, then it's it just doesn't 484 00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 4: really have looked like an even playing field. But I 485 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 4: do think there's something to that in a way as well, 486 00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:39,239 Speaker 4: and I think you're asking the right questions in terms of, 487 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 4: you know, incentivizing and how do you I think that 488 00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 4: the most important part about that, the very least is 489 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 4: education and giving people the resources they need if they 490 00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:50,160 Speaker 4: really want to get clean, you know, to help them 491 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:53,160 Speaker 4: do that, whether that be through counseling or mean obviously, 492 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:57,840 Speaker 4: we know things like rehab are prohibitively expensive and it's 493 00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 4: just nearly out of reach for a lot of people, 494 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 4: and then you hear about people of means who do 495 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 4: it like a bunch of times and still can't kick 496 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 4: the habit. 497 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:09,400 Speaker 3: I just want to take a second to note shadow 498 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 3: Berneze here. My take, my unsolicited take, is that the 499 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:19,000 Speaker 3: way to address these things is through not just financial pressure, 500 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:22,840 Speaker 3: which you're onto something there, Matt, even as a thought experiment, 501 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 3: it's social dynamic pressure. The reason cigarettes worked is because 502 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,200 Speaker 3: they were made to look cool, So you just make 503 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 3: something else look cool. Bernez was right. Propaganda and crystallizing 504 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,440 Speaker 3: public opinion are free to read online right now. 505 00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 4: I yield my time. And also, by the way, Ben, 506 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 4: your takes are always solicited. That is the whole nature 507 00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:48,880 Speaker 4: of the show, and I think that is a very 508 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:50,959 Speaker 4: very good one. And the last thing I'll add though, 509 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,560 Speaker 4: is when it comes to the responsibility of the government, 510 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 4: you know too at citizens, whether it be in Canada 511 00:30:56,120 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 4: or the United States, is you know, in Canada and elsewhere, 512 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 4: you know, we're hearing about things like heroin being tainted 513 00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 4: with fentanyls. We know it takes a very very small 514 00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 4: amount to be fatal, but not only is the heroin 515 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,720 Speaker 4: being tainted with fentanyl, the fentanyls being tainted with benzo diazepines, 516 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 4: which are things like xanax, and you know, at a 517 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 4: van maybe I think I forgive it. There's certain ones 518 00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 4: that are anti anxiety medications and they they're very they're 519 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,479 Speaker 4: not opioids, they are benzodiazepin. They're more like tranquilizers kind of, 520 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:35,959 Speaker 4: and it's created a whole new drug that's being referred 521 00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 4: to as benzo dope, And so when people are taking 522 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 4: heroin that's laced with fentanyl, that's laced with benzodiazepins, they're 523 00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:49,680 Speaker 4: much more likely to black out, to open themselves up 524 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:54,920 Speaker 4: to being sexually assaulted or robbed or you know, injured 525 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,560 Speaker 4: in ways that would be much worse than if they 526 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 4: were just high on the rug they thought they were getting. So, 527 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 4: you know, I just think this is the right direction 528 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 4: given all of this, all of these different conditions that 529 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 4: are at play, you know, all all around the world. 530 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 4: So I yield my time as well. So let's take 531 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,400 Speaker 4: a quick break and we'll hear a word from our sponsor. 532 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:19,640 Speaker 4: Then'll be back with another piece of strange news. 533 00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 3: And we have returned, Fellow conspiracy realists. This one threw 534 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,440 Speaker 3: me for a bit of a loop, and it's kind 535 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 3: of why I was foreshadowing Gatika just a little bit. Here. 536 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,520 Speaker 3: We are living in an exciting time. Good science fiction, 537 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 3: as we always say, is only fiction for a certain 538 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 3: interval before it becomes factual. Right now, as we're recording, 539 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:55,800 Speaker 3: we want to wish a very happy, very belated birthday 540 00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:00,520 Speaker 3: to the first child in the United Kingdom born with 541 00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:06,280 Speaker 3: three parents Wow, yep, genetically a free Yeah, he's got 542 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 3: the mom, he's got the dad, a five month old 543 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:14,720 Speaker 3: biological male and has another mom. And this might sound 544 00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 3: like the kid is a kmara, you know, in the 545 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 3: human species. Kimara describes where a single individual might have 546 00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:27,080 Speaker 3: different DNA in different parts of their body. It's winning 547 00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 3: a very weird lottery. It's quite rare, but those people 548 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 3: can live full lives. Here's what happened. This kid might 549 00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:43,480 Speaker 3: have had was under kind of a dark cloud as 550 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 3: they were developing in their mother's womb. Doctors realize the 551 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 3: kid might suffer from a mitochondrial disease. This can spell 552 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:58,400 Speaker 3: doom for children. Doctors took an unprecedented step and said, hey, 553 00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 3: what if we can do something to remove that bad 554 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:11,759 Speaker 3: mitochondrial DNA and slot in something else. This DNA is 555 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:14,680 Speaker 3: not evenly split. It's not a you know, like thirty 556 00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:19,320 Speaker 3: three point three percent each parent kind of thing. Instead, 557 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 3: the majority of the DNA comes from the two parents 558 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:27,280 Speaker 3: and abou zero point one percent comes from a third person, 559 00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 3: a donor, a woman. And the idea is that mitochondrial 560 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 3: DNA can be replaced via this donor using IVF in 561 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 3: vitro fertilization, and you can read some great articles on 562 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 3: this in the BBC. The news just broke as we're 563 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:51,000 Speaker 3: recording today, May tenth, twenty twenty three. Shout out to 564 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:54,680 Speaker 3: James Gallagher and shout out to all the other journalists 565 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:59,680 Speaker 3: who have been reporting this. First off, first question, would 566 00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 3: you all consider doing this, not just not just us 567 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:05,560 Speaker 3: on the show today, but us listening along at home. 568 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,000 Speaker 3: Would you all consider inviting a third person to donate 569 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,320 Speaker 3: DNA to your child if it prevented a disease? 570 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:20,319 Speaker 2: Yeah? I think this is an amazing breakthrough, Absolutely great. Same. 571 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm glad, glad it's not controversial. 572 00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:26,960 Speaker 2: Well, because it's it's going to be, like you said, Ben, 573 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,759 Speaker 2: the tiniest amount of that person is going to be 574 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:33,279 Speaker 2: in your child. So I think that would be the 575 00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:36,960 Speaker 2: biggest thing, you know, for me personally, Like having a 576 00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:41,239 Speaker 2: having a child where it's like either the mother's egg 577 00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,720 Speaker 2: or the father's sperm is one of them's not viable 578 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:46,919 Speaker 2: and then you still want to have a baby. That's 579 00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:50,319 Speaker 2: tougher for me just personally, But in this case, it's 580 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 2: a no brainer. If you can, if you could prevent 581 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 2: like diseases that you know are potentially present, right, And. 582 00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 3: It's not alter important point there, Matt. It's not all 583 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 3: during the appearance of the child of the issue you 584 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:09,759 Speaker 3: would call it if it's nobility. But the question still 585 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:13,239 Speaker 3: brings up a lot of weird stuff and one of 586 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:16,560 Speaker 3: the things that we haven't talked about at length on 587 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 3: the show in over the years. It's unbelievable. It's just 588 00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:26,600 Speaker 3: how weird mitochondria is. Mitochondria, back in the day was 589 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 3: a bacteria. So mitochondria is a stranger in a strange 590 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:35,400 Speaker 3: land to quote Highland. Once upon a time it was 591 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:38,680 Speaker 3: completely separate from the human body. And of course if 592 00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 3: you grow up in the West, the number one thing 593 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:43,719 Speaker 3: you know about mitochondria is it's quote, the powerhouse of 594 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:45,759 Speaker 3: the cell. Right. Did you guys hear that through a 595 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,040 Speaker 3: biology Yeah? 596 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:50,520 Speaker 4: Well yeah, I mean I'm obviously not a geneticist or 597 00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:54,200 Speaker 4: a biologist of any stripe, but it always consistently blows 598 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:57,360 Speaker 4: my mind to think about these little bugs inside of. 599 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 2: Us that are so dang smart. There are thousands of 600 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:04,600 Speaker 2: them per cell. Hey, oh yeah, you're right, Ben, They're 601 00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:07,200 Speaker 2: like tiny little batteries. They're just hanging out making sure 602 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:09,879 Speaker 2: your cells got what they need. So yeah. 603 00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:14,359 Speaker 3: So shout out to Thomas Cavalier Smith, who in two 604 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:18,840 Speaker 3: thousand and six wrote a paper with the title you ready, 605 00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:25,920 Speaker 3: origin of mitochondria by intercellular enslavement of a photosynthetic purple bacteria. 606 00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:31,719 Speaker 3: So yeah, yeah, doctor CS is not pulling punches here. 607 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:36,200 Speaker 3: First line of the abstract is mitochondria originated by permanent 608 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:40,719 Speaker 3: enslavement of purple non sulfur bacteria. I don't think that's 609 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,800 Speaker 3: the thing a lot of people want to consider, you know, 610 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,840 Speaker 3: when you think about your own body. But we've already 611 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:49,480 Speaker 3: talked about how the body is a universe or a 612 00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:53,000 Speaker 3: city of its own, and their human cells are vastly 613 00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 3: outnumbered by all the bacterial cells. I am one hundred 614 00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 3: percent on board with this treatment, and I'm glad that 615 00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:01,920 Speaker 3: it's like all of us on the show here are 616 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:06,600 Speaker 3: as well. Because there's a plot twist. This is the 617 00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:12,279 Speaker 3: first child born in the UK with three parents. The 618 00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:17,320 Speaker 3: actual first child born by this technique dates back to 619 00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:22,320 Speaker 3: twenty sixteen, when a Jordanian family had the same treatment 620 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:26,239 Speaker 3: in the United States, also to save their child. So 621 00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:30,520 Speaker 3: it's still cost prohibitive, but it's real. The science fiction 622 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:35,400 Speaker 3: of designer babies is no longer science fiction, and it 623 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:39,080 Speaker 3: got me thinking of a world in which you can 624 00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:43,520 Speaker 3: kind of choose how many parents or what traits you 625 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:46,680 Speaker 3: want to have for a kid. There's a great documentary 626 00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:51,280 Speaker 3: about this on Netflix, a series, I should say, episode 627 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,879 Speaker 3: four of Unnatural Selection for anyone who wants to learn more. 628 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:56,600 Speaker 2: It has this scene. 629 00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:58,960 Speaker 3: I think it starts with this scene where there's a 630 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:04,520 Speaker 3: doctor in Ukraine who was doing the IVF procedure to 631 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 3: help stave off mitochondrial disease from this kid and replace 632 00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:12,800 Speaker 3: that tiny bit of mitochondrial DNA, and it opens with 633 00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:16,239 Speaker 3: him saying something like, Okay, now this is my favorite part. 634 00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:20,279 Speaker 3: I'm using the laser. Obviously this is everybody's favorite part, 635 00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:24,520 Speaker 3: and props to the makers of that show. But it's 636 00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:27,759 Speaker 3: a great place to learn about this. And the way 637 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:32,120 Speaker 3: they like to phrase it is not necessarily three parents, 638 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:34,879 Speaker 3: that's more news headline. They like to phrase it as 639 00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:41,240 Speaker 3: babies with donated mitochondria. And there are some researchers, leading 640 00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:44,480 Speaker 3: edge experts who are talking about this stuff, and in 641 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:49,200 Speaker 3: their conversations, both in the studies they published and in 642 00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:53,799 Speaker 3: their interviews that are more for the general public, they've 643 00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,359 Speaker 3: said things like, if we were talking about this one 644 00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:02,239 Speaker 3: hundred years from now, you would find offensive for me 645 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:07,440 Speaker 3: to say we shouldn't have designer children or designer babies. 646 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:09,719 Speaker 3: And I just keep going back to it. 647 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:13,440 Speaker 4: It's it's something to subject them to the cruelty of 648 00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:16,000 Speaker 4: nature if we're going to do something to prevent it. 649 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:18,960 Speaker 3: Right, Look, how hey, how about this. This is a 650 00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:24,920 Speaker 3: very base comparison, But look how popular character customization is 651 00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:29,759 Speaker 3: in your favorite video games. People already pay extra to 652 00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:33,759 Speaker 3: alter the appearance of the things they create, and I 653 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:38,799 Speaker 3: don't see how human species would examples of the human 654 00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:41,760 Speaker 3: species would be any different. You know, there's a world 655 00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 3: in which it becomes kind of like the options when 656 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:49,600 Speaker 3: you buy a car. Certain things start as options and 657 00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:53,320 Speaker 3: then they become factory standard, like seat belts. You know what, 658 00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 3: if I mean obviously anybody, most people, I would say, 659 00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:02,800 Speaker 3: who are going to have child? If given the opportunity 660 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:07,240 Speaker 3: to genetically alter that child in a way that maybe 661 00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:13,359 Speaker 3: reduces likelihood of cancers, reduces likelihood of dementia, or addresses 662 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:16,719 Speaker 3: some kind of genetic condition. If they're given that ability, 663 00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:21,320 Speaker 3: most people will say yes, unless they're spiritually or ideologically 664 00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:24,640 Speaker 3: opposed to the concept in general. But at this point, 665 00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:27,800 Speaker 3: we have to ask, hopefully without sounding like a broken record, 666 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:31,799 Speaker 3: do you guys think this is part of an inevitable 667 00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 3: trend or do you think it'll stay here just mitochondrial donation. 668 00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:38,759 Speaker 4: I think it's going to go as far as it's 669 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:43,080 Speaker 4: possible for it to go. You know, I don't think 670 00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:46,400 Speaker 4: progress is ever going to be intentionally stimy, and if 671 00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:49,600 Speaker 4: someone's going to be out there working under the radar 672 00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:51,600 Speaker 4: figuring out how to push it further. Have you all 673 00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 4: heard of this new Amazon series Dead Ringers. It's based 674 00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:00,640 Speaker 4: on the David Cronenberg film from I think the late 675 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:04,960 Speaker 4: eighties early nineties starring Jeremy Irons as like twin gynecologists, 676 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:08,320 Speaker 4: and it's, you know, it's a dark, twisted kind of 677 00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 4: horror sci fi thing about you know, genetic manipulation and 678 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:18,920 Speaker 4: about implanting infertile women with children and all of the 679 00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:22,799 Speaker 4: god complex that can go into that. So it's sort 680 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,160 Speaker 4: of like a really nihilistic gatica in some ways. But 681 00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:27,360 Speaker 4: the series I only see the first two episodes, and 682 00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:31,440 Speaker 4: it tackles this stuff head on the dark side of it, 683 00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 4: but also the like positive side of it, and like, 684 00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:38,160 Speaker 4: you know, what the the I guess benevolent version of 685 00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:40,359 Speaker 4: what this is. But inevitably you're going to have these 686 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:42,320 Speaker 4: bad actors who just want to figure out how to 687 00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:43,960 Speaker 4: make a bunch of money on it and have it 688 00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:45,520 Speaker 4: be only for the super elite. 689 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:47,719 Speaker 2: So I'm going forward seeing where the series goes. But 690 00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:49,640 Speaker 2: it made me think of that immediately. 691 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:54,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's creating a new cast system potentially right, such 692 00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:58,680 Speaker 3: that there is the potential for a world in which 693 00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:07,080 Speaker 3: the top couple percent inch points of humanity are faster, smarter, stronger, 694 00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:10,600 Speaker 3: longer lived, less prone to disease, to the point where 695 00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:14,959 Speaker 3: you could make an argument that speciation begins. Speciation being 696 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:21,160 Speaker 3: when an origin species starts to diverge due to environmental 697 00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:26,000 Speaker 3: pressures into two separate kind of organisms. And this goes 698 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:28,279 Speaker 3: pretty far. I mean, it's part of evolution, but it 699 00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:32,280 Speaker 3: gets to the point where those two formerly related things 700 00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:36,200 Speaker 3: can no longer even interbreed. Also, we should say the 701 00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:37,920 Speaker 3: fancy name for this, if you want to put a 702 00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:42,879 Speaker 3: tie on it, is pro nuclear transfer. And it's controversial 703 00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:47,320 Speaker 3: because wrapped up in the process you have to destroy 704 00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,760 Speaker 3: some embryos, so you have to break a few eggs 705 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:54,400 Speaker 3: to make it up quite literally. Just so yeah, so 706 00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:58,880 Speaker 3: people are against it for that reason. If you want to, 707 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:01,600 Speaker 3: if you want to read some of the work of 708 00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,160 Speaker 3: the experts, you're going to look at people like Professor 709 00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:09,879 Speaker 3: Doug Turnbull, who heads the center in Newcastle that pioneered 710 00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:14,080 Speaker 3: a lot of this research. And you guys know, I've 711 00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:20,080 Speaker 3: been going through a kick of obscure research from days 712 00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:23,280 Speaker 3: of your the stuff that just got kind of proven 713 00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:26,719 Speaker 3: in concept and then never really followed through due to 714 00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:31,200 Speaker 3: one concern or another. I'm thinking specifically about brain surgery 715 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,960 Speaker 3: on the octopus. Still, someone do it. Someone smarter than 716 00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:38,400 Speaker 3: us do it. We need a fifty eight year old octopus. 717 00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,080 Speaker 3: I think they could make it to sixty nine percent. 718 00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:43,120 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, one one would like to believe. 719 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:43,440 Speaker 4: No. 720 00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 3: I wonder what they would say. I wonder what they 721 00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:51,440 Speaker 3: would say, but this right, they would speak in chrematoform. 722 00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:51,879 Speaker 2: Definitely would Yeah. 723 00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:56,360 Speaker 3: But the point that you're making about the money factor, 724 00:44:56,440 --> 00:45:02,280 Speaker 3: the fees associated those could be a huge, huge chasm 725 00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:05,839 Speaker 3: for humanity to cross, just like you were saying earlier, Matt, 726 00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:12,719 Speaker 3: regarding the replacement of jobs right with algorithms. I don't 727 00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:18,120 Speaker 3: know what the next iteration of human society is going 728 00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:22,080 Speaker 3: to look like. But it does seem that right now 729 00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,839 Speaker 3: we have all the ingredients to make a really good civilization. 730 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:32,239 Speaker 3: Are really cool when or all the ingredients to just 731 00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:36,800 Speaker 3: roll it down a pavement of good intentions all the 732 00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:40,959 Speaker 3: way all the way to extinction. And at this point 733 00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:43,960 Speaker 3: there's I don't know. I guess we'll just keep doing 734 00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:46,160 Speaker 3: our show. We'll do our show, see how it goes. 735 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:52,800 Speaker 3: As long as natural born podcasters meatbags could be around, right. 736 00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:57,600 Speaker 2: Guys, speaking of meatbags, yes, okay, don't does it blow 737 00:45:57,680 --> 00:46:02,279 Speaker 2: your minds that are in this realm wherever it is 738 00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:06,359 Speaker 2: this place is that we exist helmets. You got two 739 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:11,839 Speaker 2: different of these humans. They have different downstairs bits. All 740 00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:14,000 Speaker 2: they have to do is rub those bits together for 741 00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:19,560 Speaker 2: a while until that's over simple, well, until both of 742 00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:25,399 Speaker 2: their internal bits attached to those other bits eject a thing, 743 00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:29,080 Speaker 2: a tiny tiny bit of DNA and those little bits 744 00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,840 Speaker 2: just have to touch in the right way. 745 00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:32,840 Speaker 4: And then all. 746 00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:40,400 Speaker 2: They make a whole entire human. This is it? How's 747 00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:40,799 Speaker 2: that real? 748 00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:44,680 Speaker 3: Well, it's uh, it's it's funny you say that, Matt, 749 00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:48,760 Speaker 3: because for any you know, I've often called the lottery 750 00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:52,360 Speaker 3: attacks on being bad at math, which is what it is. 751 00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:56,680 Speaker 3: But if you think about it. Maybe we end it 752 00:46:56,760 --> 00:47:00,359 Speaker 3: this way. Let's end with two positive things to your point, Matt. First, 753 00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:05,120 Speaker 3: anytime you're feeling down, remember that you are the winner 754 00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:08,839 Speaker 3: of a lottery that is way more difficult than any 755 00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,480 Speaker 3: power ball you could imagine. Right, I think of all 756 00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:14,759 Speaker 3: the decisions that led to you, you know what I mean, 757 00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,440 Speaker 3: it's kind of inspiring. The odds were against you and 758 00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:21,040 Speaker 3: you're here. And then, second, maybe a little out of 759 00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:23,800 Speaker 3: character and a motive for me, if you're ever feeling 760 00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:27,240 Speaker 3: really down you're looking at yourself in the mirror, remember 761 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:32,560 Speaker 3: that your face is inherently made up of all the 762 00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:36,920 Speaker 3: faces of all your ancestors, all the people who liked 763 00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:40,560 Speaker 3: that some version of your face enough to fall in 764 00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:43,520 Speaker 3: love and reproduce or reproduce okay. 765 00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:48,080 Speaker 2: Together, you know I mean, but hey, don't take the 766 00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:48,799 Speaker 2: poetry there. 767 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:50,640 Speaker 3: That's a guy ending like. 768 00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:55,800 Speaker 2: You just rubbed the bits together and it happened. 769 00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:58,440 Speaker 3: Sometimes you got over the hard part. You got over 770 00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:01,480 Speaker 3: the most traumatic event of your life, which is being born. 771 00:48:01,840 --> 00:48:04,839 Speaker 3: We are glad you are here, and we can't wait 772 00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:05,279 Speaker 3: to hear what. 773 00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:07,439 Speaker 2: You think about this. Oh, I can't say say before 774 00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:08,040 Speaker 2: you close it up. 775 00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:10,120 Speaker 4: I just have to add, it reminds me of the 776 00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:14,120 Speaker 4: lyrics to a really wonderful Monty Python song from the 777 00:48:14,200 --> 00:48:17,360 Speaker 4: Meaning of Life. It says, just remember that you're standing 778 00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:19,720 Speaker 4: on a planet that's evolving and revolving at nine hundred 779 00:48:19,760 --> 00:48:21,760 Speaker 4: miles an hour. It's orbiting in nineteen miles a second, 780 00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:23,600 Speaker 4: so it's reckoned that the Sun is the source of 781 00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:26,440 Speaker 4: all our power, et cetera. Goes on, and it goes on, 782 00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:28,880 Speaker 4: talks about the universe, but then it says, so remember, 783 00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:32,160 Speaker 4: when you're feeling very small and insecure, how amazingly unlikely 784 00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,240 Speaker 4: is your birth, And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere 785 00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:37,959 Speaker 4: out in space, because there's bugger all down here on Earth, 786 00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:38,680 Speaker 4: that's all. 787 00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:41,880 Speaker 3: And before we go out, I just want to reiterate 788 00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:46,640 Speaker 3: again if you're feeling down, life is increasingly difficult all around. 789 00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,839 Speaker 3: But if you are feeling down, remember you've already won 790 00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:53,280 Speaker 3: the lottery. You're here. We're glad you're here. We cannot 791 00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:56,040 Speaker 3: wait to hear from you, and we try to be 792 00:48:56,160 --> 00:48:58,080 Speaker 3: easy to find online. 793 00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:01,600 Speaker 4: We do doesn't require any kind of genetic lottery system 794 00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:03,520 Speaker 4: at all. So far you can not well, yeah, you 795 00:49:03,560 --> 00:49:06,080 Speaker 4: can find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff where we 796 00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:10,960 Speaker 4: exist on Facebook, on YouTube and on Twitter, Conspiracy Stuff 797 00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,000 Speaker 4: show on Instagram and TikTok. 798 00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:17,480 Speaker 2: Hey do you like phones, Well, give us a call. 799 00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:22,799 Speaker 2: Our number is one eight three three std WYTK. When 800 00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,640 Speaker 2: you call in, you've got three minutes to leave a voicemail. 801 00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:27,959 Speaker 2: Start the clock as soon as you hear that beat. 802 00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,000 Speaker 2: Let us know what your code name is. Let us 803 00:49:31,080 --> 00:49:33,400 Speaker 2: know if we can use that name and your message 804 00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:36,279 Speaker 2: on the air. If you'd rather not talk on the phone, 805 00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:38,800 Speaker 2: why not instead send us a good old fashioned email. 806 00:49:38,920 --> 00:49:41,960 Speaker 3: We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. 807 00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:02,720 Speaker 2: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production 808 00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:07,359 Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, 809 00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:10,320 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.