Speaker 1: Of the law and order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies.
Speaker 3: These episodes are based on. These are our stories.
Speaker 4: Done done, Hello and welcome to That's Messed Up an
Speaker 4: SVU podcast.
Speaker 2: I'm one of your hosts, Kara Klink, and I'm Liza Traeger.
Speaker 2: My voice sounds perfect. We talked SVU True Crime. We
Speaker 2: have celeb guests. We really have a ball over here,
Speaker 2: and I'm on the West coast. We're on the same
Speaker 2: coast again, so.
Speaker 3: Yes, we're back, back back again. You've been sunny bright lights.
Speaker 2: I feel like Winnifred Sanderson, you know from Hocus Focus.
Speaker 3: I'm just like it makes me sick, That's what I know.
Speaker 2: But I woke up with my laptop like on the bed,
Speaker 2: like I really, I don't know what happened.
Speaker 3: Well, you've been doing not show.
Speaker 2: Finding parking on trash day in this neighborhood took everything
Speaker 2: out of me.
Speaker 3: And then finally.
Speaker 2: This this house next to where I'm staying. They're kind
Speaker 2: of psycho Once if you walk by or anywhere near
Speaker 2: the house, it goes warning you are being recorded. Its
Speaker 2: full lights and it's full recording and I'm always flicking
Speaker 2: it up like you're psychotic and so nuts. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: they there's two spot parking spots in front of their house,
Speaker 2: like in theory, that's enough space, and then it's red
Speaker 2: the rest of the way.
Speaker 3: Because La loves to paint a curb.
Speaker 2: Bread can we make the decisions of when we can
Speaker 2: stop at the curb?
Speaker 3: It's so fucked up, it's so fucked up this city.
Speaker 2: But they put their trash can on the one good
Speaker 2: parking spot when half the curb is red. So I
Speaker 2: finally got out of the car and moved all their
Speaker 2: parking bins to the red. But I am on camera,
Speaker 2: so we'll see it happens.
Speaker 3: But I'm just.
Speaker 2: Call call cops. I know, I'm just gonna say you're
Speaker 2: a bad person on garbage. Like, yeah, there's there's already
Speaker 2: less parking. Girl, it's three in the morning. I gotta
Speaker 2: get in.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I put mine like out so somebody can
Speaker 1: park behind them. I mean it's always me parking behind them,
Speaker 1: but you know, anyway.
Speaker 2: But yeah, this is a carriveting content here in for
Speaker 2: the riveting content of Bin movil Well.
Speaker 3: Speaking of cops.
Speaker 1: Jared had like a fucking like traumatic run in with
Speaker 1: the cops. Like he was trying to take my kids
Speaker 1: last weekend because I had the afternoon off to go
Speaker 1: to a party where I line danced, and he was
Speaker 1: taking our kids to this children's museum, but there was
Speaker 1: like a festival happening in the parking lot. It's like
Speaker 1: at the Rose Bowl, and the cops were there directing
Speaker 1: traffic and stuff, and so two cars turned this one way,
Speaker 1: and Jared just found like followed them so that he
Speaker 1: could get to a parking spot closer to this kid's museum.
Speaker 1: He's got our two kids in the car, and this
Speaker 1: cop stops him and he's like, no, no turn around
Speaker 1: and is screaming at him, and he's just going, okay, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna turn around, and the guy just keeps fucking
Speaker 1: screaming at him. Our kids were like traumatized. They were
Speaker 1: like when she put Rosie to bed that night, she
Speaker 1: was like, I'm scared.
Speaker 3: I thought you were gonna get.
Speaker 1: Arrested like these like over literally trying to go to
Speaker 1: a parking spot. He wasn't like driving up on a curb.
Speaker 1: He wasn't endangering anyone I just like fucking infuriates me
Speaker 1: how these like cops get on power trips like this
Speaker 1: and scream at people. And it's like, now you probably
Speaker 1: have like informed my daughter's reaction to cops like for
Speaker 1: the rest of her life, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they act like it's some sort of messaging that
Speaker 2: turns us against them, but it's like, oh no, I
Speaker 2: think as kids, we teach kids to go to cops,
Speaker 2: and you fucking didn't.
Speaker 1: Yeah you didn't, Yeah exactly. It's like she fucking loves
Speaker 1: Paw Patrol, she loves Chase. She thinks cops are good.
Speaker 1: But we've tried to tell her there are some good
Speaker 1: cops and there are some bad cops. And I think
Speaker 1: Jared was just like that was not a good cop,
Speaker 1: like he was, And I was like, you know, you
Speaker 1: never know what's going on with someone. Maybe that guy's
Speaker 1: wife just left him, but like, honestly, you need to
Speaker 1: not scream at a man with two kids in the
Speaker 1: car for a turning down the wrong street in a
Speaker 1: parking lot that you didn't like, that you didn't want,
Speaker 1: it was wild. Anyway, we can move on to more
Speaker 1: fun things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I mean La has been a blur, and I brought
Speaker 2: the New York to LA.
Speaker 3: I am so busy.
Speaker 2: I'm running around like a man woman, and I am ragged.
Speaker 3: But we'll see.
Speaker 2: But I signed up for more Soul Cycle than I
Speaker 2: brought workout clothes, so I do have to stop at
Speaker 2: Tjmax as well.
Speaker 3: Oh add that to the docket. You should have brought
Speaker 3: laundry to my house the other day when you came.
Speaker 2: I definitely should have, but you know, here like all day.
Speaker 2: But I would have to get fragrance free detergent.
Speaker 3: That's what I have. Oh yeah, yeah, that was a
Speaker 3: big mistake.
Speaker 1: I've been using that shit since I had kids. I
Speaker 1: don't know, I just like thought I grew up in
Speaker 1: a blue tide family. Now I'm a clear tide girl.
Speaker 2: Okay, yea yeah yeah, but they should make a tide
Speaker 2: pod candy.
Speaker 3: It does look good, like to confuse kids even more.
Speaker 2: No for us, for us, That's what I'm want for us. Okay.
Speaker 2: So the Netflix is a joke. Festival is raging through
Speaker 2: LA ten days.
Speaker 3: It seems never ending. It's never ending.
Speaker 2: But I did a random show last night, best fish
Speaker 2: Taco or something. Oh yeah, that's outside packed as fuck,
Speaker 2: and he mentioned the festival and not one person knew
Speaker 2: about it. But so it's like we're so in it
Speaker 2: and it does seem so huge though, but a whole
Speaker 2: audience and people were like, we don't know what you're
Speaker 2: talking about.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, cause like that show Best Fish Taco is
Speaker 1: a great show.
Speaker 3: It's very hipster. It's east Side.
Speaker 1: It's like, these aren't the people that are spending two
Speaker 1: hundred dollars to go see like Brett Goldstein at the
Speaker 1: Forum or whatever at like the Palladia, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. Like, it's kind of it's a different groups,
Speaker 1: I guess. But I love Best Fish Taco. I've had great,
Speaker 1: great sets there. It's such a fun.
Speaker 3: Joe, it was a really fun show. I had a
Speaker 3: great time.
Speaker 2: Wait you just said something that made oh you know
Speaker 2: the Assistance versus Agents Instagram?
Speaker 3: No wait, you don't follow this.
Speaker 1: That's like crazy because I used to be an assistant
Speaker 1: to an executive and I think I have a very.
Speaker 2: Dude Assistance versus Agents. Everyone has to follow it or
Speaker 2: this is a mario. I think maybe huge.
Speaker 3: I love this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, wait, they might not be the one who posted this.
Speaker 2: There's a photo of Steve Corral and Ryan Gosling on
Speaker 2: the set of Crazy Stupid Love and over Ryan Gosling,
Speaker 2: it says people that go to Coachella, and then over
Speaker 2: Steve Corell, it says people who go to Netflix. As
Speaker 2: a joke Fitt and he has like a bad pollo.
Speaker 2: It was the wrong It's not on this instagram. I
Speaker 2: confused it. But this instagram is so good. You're gonna
Speaker 2: have so much.
Speaker 3: I love this. I'm already perusing and loving it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely so. I did do an hour show. We
Speaker 2: did see some people are my number one fan. I
Speaker 2: would say. Arsley did leave her husband at the Hollywood
Speaker 2: Bowl show Skip Seinfeld to come to my show, which
Speaker 2: I was like, girl, you don't have to do this.
Speaker 2: I'm quite accessible, like you'll see me another time. I'm
Speaker 2: out and about and for a really good price. But
Speaker 2: at that show there was a woman there who we
Speaker 2: ended up finding out does beverage creation for Starbucks.
Speaker 3: And I said, well, what beverage did you create?
Speaker 2: And she said, next Tuesday, that's my drink and it's
Speaker 2: trying out and we just check Google and her drink
Speaker 2: did drop. It is the Summer Berry Starbucks refresher. This
Speaker 2: is not a advertisement. I don't know this woman. I
Speaker 2: was just so impressed by she made this. This was her,
Speaker 2: she was on the plane.
Speaker 1: She's in beverage innovation, and this is her drink. And
Speaker 1: it's a twitt what People magazine calls a twist on boba.
Speaker 3: And it's got raspberry pearls in it.
Speaker 1: It's like a blue drink that has like raspberry flavored,
Speaker 1: like you know, pearls at the bottom.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think finally they're like Boba's hit a really like
Speaker 2: it's really now. I guess I would say they have
Speaker 2: really come into Yeah. Yeah, I don't like any I
Speaker 2: don't like those things. There's a oh I love boba
Speaker 2: so much.
Speaker 3: I can't suck up a little ball of something it
Speaker 3: makes me. I can't.
Speaker 2: Well, my sister likes the popping ones. That's not for me.
Speaker 2: I like the regular boba, but I fucking love it.
Speaker 3: I fuck I love a melon honeydew.
Speaker 2: A honeydew flavored boba is something I like.
Speaker 3: But nice. This reminds me. So.
Speaker 2: There's a Simpsons episode, the Twisted World of March I
Speaker 2: think it's called. But she is in this like women's
Speaker 2: group with all the other women in the Simpsons to
Speaker 2: be entrepreneurs, but she's like too chicken with money, so
Speaker 2: they kick her out and then they get a truck
Speaker 2: called Fleeta Pita, but it's not full awful. It's crunchy patties.
Speaker 2: It's not peta. It's like flatbread and they kind of
Speaker 2: white it all out and it's really funny. And then
Speaker 2: she goes into business with making pretzels and ye, you know,
Speaker 2: comedy ensues. But that's what this raspberry pearls reminds me of.
Speaker 2: It is just like you are crunchy peating the full
Speaker 2: afful But I'm gonna try it because we obviously met
Speaker 2: her and I wouldn't. Oh, it says popping, new popping,
Speaker 2: raspberry flavored.
Speaker 1: Pearl What do you mean? Like it? It pops?
Speaker 2: Yeah, they like pop. It's different. They're like a different consistency.
Speaker 2: The boba is tapioca. It's like thick, yeah, kind of hardy,
Speaker 2: a hardy ball, and the popping boba is like there's
Speaker 2: just a juice in it and it just releases. Yeah
Speaker 2: fast light. It's light and releasing. Maybe I would like
Speaker 2: that better. I think it's the tapioca I don't like. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you should try a popping like a pop, and there's
Speaker 2: more flavors of the pop, so like there's a green
Speaker 2: apple start, so you can you could also choose the
Speaker 2: flavor of the popping.
Speaker 3: Boba and yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 2: So you can mix it with the drink, so it's
Speaker 2: like you have, you know, a watermelon.
Speaker 3: Wait.
Speaker 1: Also, another person I met at your at your Netflix
Speaker 1: is a Joke show was a listener named Christy and
Speaker 1: she had come all the way from Australia to go
Speaker 1: to Lovers and Friends, which was a festival I was
Speaker 1: dying to go see in Vegas, but the tickets were
Speaker 1: too expensive and my friend just kept being.
Speaker 3: Like, I don't think that this is good.
Speaker 1: Like she kept being like, there's no way all these
Speaker 1: artists are going to show up. It was a one
Speaker 1: day festival with literally everybody from like two thousands R
Speaker 1: and B that you would want to see, like a
Speaker 1: show one night, which was crazy, and te pain was
Speaker 1: on a different stage than the main stage.
Speaker 3: Whatever.
Speaker 2: I looked at the schedule, I was jealous, but in
Speaker 2: my head, I'm like, I thought it was like a scam.
Speaker 2: I was like, how did they get everyone in one day?
Speaker 2: I'm like, this seems too good.
Speaker 3: To be it.
Speaker 1: It seemed crazy, and it seemed like my friend kept saying,
Speaker 1: she was like, I don't think they're all going to
Speaker 1: show up. This like can't be true. And then literally
Speaker 1: they canceled the festival they like the day of or
Speaker 1: the day before because of the wind, because of.
Speaker 2: The high winds. So then I went, I was right.
Speaker 2: I bet those artists aren't even in town. This was something.
Speaker 2: And then there was footage. I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: real or not, but I guess someone from their balcony
Speaker 2: in Vegas saw Usher was watching Usher rehearse, and then
Speaker 2: someone whispered something in his ear and he dropped to
Speaker 2: his knees and sadness, and so that's but that seems
Speaker 2: like you saw that from your balcony. This must be
Speaker 2: a lie. You saw Usher get the toll the news.
Speaker 3: You watched him at the exact moment. That's so funny.
Speaker 2: So but that made me be like, Okay, Lisa, you're
Speaker 2: becoming too conspiratorial, like relax. But it just seemed too
Speaker 2: good to be true, and I feel really bad for people.
Speaker 3: But thank god it's canceled. In Vegas.
Speaker 2: It's not like Bonnerou where you're in the middle of
Speaker 2: Tennessee and that's what I was to arre In fucking Vegas,
Speaker 2: I saw people going to Magic Mike instead, I saw
Speaker 2: people going to drag shows. Yeah, following me on Instagram
Speaker 2: you can go yeah yeah, And.
Speaker 1: She got to see you And it was nice to
Speaker 1: meet all the listeners that I saw when I went
Speaker 1: to Lisa's show.
Speaker 2: You guys are the best, the best. I ate all
Speaker 2: the Australian snacks. That's been my my little snack when
Speaker 2: I've been getting home, and honestly, for La, I've really
Speaker 2: been pushing it till two three in the morning, which
Speaker 2: is pretty cool.
Speaker 1: Which is really cool because in LA's a sleepy little fuck.
Speaker 3: La likes to go to bed, go to bed.
Speaker 2: People are out and and I do have to tell
Speaker 2: everyone I was at the Tom Brady Roast. It was
Speaker 2: just as a viewer, one of the best nights of
Speaker 2: my life. Like I had so much fun. The jokes
Speaker 2: were so many and fun. There was pyrotechnics, and now
Speaker 2: that I know about football, I got certain like I
Speaker 2: got it. I knew what was happening, but I always
Speaker 2: forget if it's Roger or Robert Kraft.
Speaker 3: It's like this fucked up thing while I will, I
Speaker 3: think it's Robert.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, Robert Kraft. I have to remember, so we
Speaker 2: did cover his crime. But I did shake his hand,
Speaker 2: so I do have to tell the listeners. I did
Speaker 2: shake his hand at the after party. He was really
Speaker 2: loose with that hand. I wasn't even trying to shake it,
Speaker 2: but he came at me with the hand and I
Speaker 2: shook it. And you know, he is responsible for women
Speaker 2: being deported and house arrested.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you for coming clean, Thank you for coming clean.
Speaker 1: I feel like a hand being thrust at you.
Speaker 3: You shook it.
Speaker 1: It's not like you talk to him and like hung
Speaker 1: out with him all night, you know, No, and a.
Speaker 2: Limp limp haanshake. And I think he's elderly at this point.
Speaker 2: He was born in forty one. My dad has a
Speaker 2: better handshake than that, I'll tell you that much. But anyways,
Speaker 2: so it was weird and I just kept telling people
Speaker 2: like I covered his crime. I know about all about it,
Speaker 2: and it's actually a bigger story than you think. But
Speaker 2: you know, it's like it.
Speaker 1: Is a bigger case what you were saying about Robert Kraft,
Speaker 1: like he did do a not good thing. And then
Speaker 1: it's like of all the jokes, that was one of
Speaker 1: the jokes that Tom Brady was like, don't write like
Speaker 1: was not one of the jokes, like of any jokes
Speaker 1: about him. Tom Brady was like stop, like and why
Speaker 1: it's it's public record for sure.
Speaker 2: I think maybe I'm trying to think about Tom Brady
Speaker 2: and maybe he like maybe it's like, oh, that's my
Speaker 2: grandpa and he got a handy, you gotta leave him alone.
Speaker 3: And it's not about the handy.
Speaker 2: It's about, you know, to me that he hired one
Speaker 2: of the like you know, like bad guy lawyer. He
Speaker 2: hired one of those he had like this insane legal team.
Speaker 2: He like fought it to the end even though it
Speaker 2: wasn't even a real charge, like move on with it,
Speaker 2: and those women really suffered. And it's to the cops
Speaker 2: and all these investigators in the name of saving human
Speaker 2: trafficking victims, but it wasn't. And they fucked up these
Speaker 2: women's lives and deported that and shit.
Speaker 3: And so.
Speaker 2: It's like the principle of all of it. I don't
Speaker 2: think getting a handy in a massage parlor is bad, now,
Speaker 2: that's what I mean. It's like bigger than this one guy,
Speaker 2: but it's like he fought it so hard for so
Speaker 2: for nothing and like got to just take a private
Speaker 2: jet to a game and live on And Tom Brady's like,
Speaker 2: don't fucking talk about that. Ye yeah, and you know
Speaker 2: who knows what these women are up to now after
Speaker 2: these criminal records their jobs were taken away like yeah.
Speaker 3: But also so what we found out is, you know,
Speaker 3: it was like.
Speaker 2: Are they human traffickers or are they just poor? And
Speaker 2: that's what poor people have to do, and that that
Speaker 2: like us as a collective were more unwilling to accept
Speaker 2: that this was by in quotes choice or were they
Speaker 2: scared of the upper up bosses like in the episode? Right, yeah, right,
Speaker 2: If you want to listen to this, this is an
Speaker 2: older episode we've done.
Speaker 3: The guests was Margaret Cho.
Speaker 1: So yeah, this is the counselor. It's Chinatown episode that
Speaker 1: we covered a long time ago.
Speaker 2: Besides you know, shaking this old dirty man's hand. I
Speaker 2: did meet Julian Edelman, who's you know, a new sports podcast.
Speaker 2: And wait, casey, you don't know this. Oh my god,
Speaker 2: I gotta show you my photo. I've been showing everyone.
Speaker 2: I cannot stop and listen. I've met some stars. He
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's just like I feel like a
Speaker 2: young girl again and this is my Nick Carter.
Speaker 3: It's like so thrilling. But I did meet Julian Edelman.
Speaker 2: Athletes are different than our our famous art type people
Speaker 2: because athletes are trained.
Speaker 3: They posed with kids out, they pose with us.
Speaker 2: Like I saw Julian Edelman walking into the arena. I
Speaker 2: was at the VIP entrance. No big deal. I did
Speaker 2: do the carpet. The photos could look better and I
Speaker 2: should have gotten my makeup professionally done, but I tried
Speaker 2: to be like too cool.
Speaker 3: I was like, this is an event, but I'm not
Speaker 3: gonna go all out.
Speaker 2: And I was like, should have gone all out, absolutely
Speaker 2: biggest event of the year. But he walked by and
Speaker 2: people just hop out, like can I take a selfie?
Speaker 3: No questions asked.
Speaker 2: They just athletes fucking pose you can take photos of them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's different.
Speaker 1: Please tell everybody my message that you were distributing on
Speaker 1: the red carpet when people interviewed you about my thoughts
Speaker 1: about Tom Brady.
Speaker 2: Yes, so any questions that I got asked, I was
Speaker 2: just like, listen. Eighty for Brady is based on four
Speaker 2: real women and he refuses to meet them, and I
Speaker 2: think that's bad and he must meet them.
Speaker 3: Yes, justice for the eighty for Brady women. But Nikki, oh,
Speaker 3: so I didn't realize this.
Speaker 2: I was talking to my friend who had, you know,
Speaker 2: worse seats than me, so she saw more of the
Speaker 2: arena and she told me that it was interesting. As
Speaker 2: the men announced, they all got standing ovations and stuff,
Speaker 2: but Nikki did not.
Speaker 3: Nikki like, they just sat for Nicki.
Speaker 2: But the only standing ovation after a performance was fucking
Speaker 2: Nicki Glazer and the whole arena stood up.
Speaker 3: It was electric.
Speaker 2: My sister texted me that she could hear me screaming
Speaker 2: in the They watched.
Speaker 3: It, but like you, oh my god, I gotta watch it.
Speaker 2: The camera was really behind us, and you know, I
Speaker 2: pee so often, and it was kind of a nightmare
Speaker 2: having to like figure out how and when to pe.
Speaker 2: But it was just I love roasts. I miss it.
Speaker 2: I miss watching them. I love me and quick jokes.
Speaker 2: I love people laughing on a dais And it really
Speaker 2: felt cool being there. And even and I hate some
Speaker 2: of the people performing, two of the people I really
Speaker 2: dislike and don't respect the most were up there. Didn't
Speaker 2: affect my good time, Like that is how much fun was?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so great, that's so great. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: everybody's like it's it's a hit. Everybody's truly talking about it.
Speaker 1: But wait, we are getting the twenty minute flag from Casey,
Speaker 1: so let's get the episode started. But really quickly, I
Speaker 1: wanted to just say, oh, please.
Speaker 2: Buy ticket, reserve seats. Come to my Netflix special taping.
Speaker 2: It's June foesth eight and ten o'clock in New York
Speaker 2: at the Comedy Cellar at the Village Underground. Yeah do
Speaker 2: that please? So come, Yeah, go to that. That's gonna
Speaker 2: be so you're gonna be a part of history. You're
Speaker 2: gonna be on Netflix. Baby if you go watch that, well,
Speaker 2: I mean they probably won't show you, but you know
Speaker 2: you'll your laughs will be immortalized forever on a streaming platform.
Speaker 2: Oh but you know what, listen, I had my high eyes,
Speaker 2: I had an hour. I had fun shows that've been
Speaker 2: running around, did the pladium outside. But I did want
Speaker 2: to everyone should know I did bomb on Fluffy's show
Speaker 2: at the Palladium and yeah, it was a disaster. I
Speaker 2: My face was hot, like boiling hot for about forty
Speaker 2: five minutes. I could not get my face too cool.
Speaker 2: I was so I can't imagine you bombing. I've never
Speaker 2: seen anything close to it. So it's fine. I mean,
Speaker 2: I handled this. This is the thing and the joke
Speaker 2: of it all. I've done work, I've been booed by more.
Speaker 2: I've been you know what I mean. So I was silent,
Speaker 2: and a couple people were yelling out that I should
Speaker 2: leave and sit down. But other than that, like I've
Speaker 2: been booed, I've been through worse, and so that's what
Speaker 2: they don't understand.
Speaker 1: And yeah, some comics have a specific audience and they
Speaker 1: just want their person.
Speaker 3: I don't know. That's crazy though.
Speaker 2: I mean, they wouldn't even clap when I walked out.
Speaker 2: They saw me and stop clapping, and I'm like, listen,
Speaker 2: I know the guy before me is famous and rich,
Speaker 2: but no one respects him. And so that's why I
Speaker 2: was feeling good too. I was like, Oh, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: follow this guy. This is gonna be great. I'm gonna
Speaker 2: do some immigrant material. We're gonna vibe. And then they
Speaker 2: were just like, we hate like it. And then but
Speaker 2: what's worse than people hating you and silence is then
Speaker 2: the other people that are like, you got keep going, girl,
Speaker 2: and I'm like this, no, nice everything. And then I
Speaker 2: was just looking at the time er being like I
Speaker 2: want to leave, two guys, this is not how I
Speaker 2: envisioned this. I'm like, I saw Lizzo here on Molly.
Speaker 2: I saw Gail Simmons with a light on her like
Speaker 2: from heaven here like, this is not what I plan neither.
Speaker 3: I wanted to do my return to the Palladium. Oh
Speaker 3: my god, that was.
Speaker 2: A twenty eighteen. The stage manager is so good at
Speaker 2: her job. I go, I saw Lizzo here she goes
Speaker 2: that was twenty eighteen, and I.
Speaker 3: Go, she sure was? I guess it was. No, it
Speaker 3: wasn't she's wrong day.
Speaker 1: I saw Lozzo in twenty nineteen because I had had Rosie,
Speaker 1: and remember I was like, I was like, can I
Speaker 1: take Mollie?
Speaker 2: But I was breastfeeding, so I didn't. Well, I guess,
Speaker 2: you know, fuck her drag. Couldn't call her out.
Speaker 1: Sorry, I just know because I wanted to take Molly
Speaker 1: at Lizzo and I was like, fuck, I'm breastfeeding, and
Speaker 1: I was googling, like can you take whatever?
Speaker 5: You know?
Speaker 3: I figured out I decided not to take the risk,
Speaker 3: but last little announcements.
Speaker 1: Go to That's messed Up live dot com and you'll
Speaker 1: see our merch little button where you can get guys.
Speaker 1: The T shirt and the mug are sold out. The
Speaker 1: toe bag is still available of the do you have
Speaker 1: children Detective, we are going to get more T shirts.
Speaker 1: There's other stuff up there that's like on sale, and
Speaker 1: you know some of our tour merch if you didn't
Speaker 1: get a chance to grab it when you saw us
Speaker 1: on tours up there. And then there's also a link
Speaker 1: to all of our promo codes if you're listening to
Speaker 1: us while you're driving and you don't have time to
Speaker 1: write down like an Aura frame promo code. We now
Speaker 1: have one place where they all live, and they're also
Speaker 1: on our Instagram page in a promo codes highlight. So
Speaker 1: are thats messed up hot Instagram page. You can also
Speaker 1: if you want to get your shopping.
Speaker 3: On, go there. And now I believe we can just
Speaker 3: start this big bad boy.
Speaker 2: Right dude, Yeah, but now I'm on Robert Kraft's Wikipedia
Speaker 2: and he's a self made man.
Speaker 3: Okay, let's start the episode.
Speaker 2: I what kind of shocks most billionaires aren't? Most billionaires are,
Speaker 2: but he sold newspapers.
Speaker 3: I don't know. I'm wow. I just that's really rare.
Speaker 3: I don't really think that one.
Speaker 1: I think, if true, it's usually it's usually even when
Speaker 1: they say they're self made, it's like their grant, their
Speaker 1: dad gave them a million dollars.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, which could have happened here, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean. But it's got scholarship to college. Oh okay,
Speaker 2: so okay, it is what it is. Listen. The merch
Speaker 2: is good, life is good. I hope everyone's doing great.
Speaker 2: This episode one of our favorites. So really have a
Speaker 2: good time, guys, because we should did here.
Speaker 1: We go, all right, we're doing Resilient, one of the
Speaker 1: most I will say, fucked up episodes.
Speaker 2: I thought you were gonna say most requested because I
Speaker 2: feel like I've been waiting to do this one.
Speaker 3: Young Ti Ti me.
Speaker 1: This pops up in my head as Lisa really loves
Speaker 1: this one, wants to do this one.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So season four, episode ten, this Baby's coming out two
Speaker 1: thousand and two, and we start on a subway platform,
Speaker 1: which I love. Whenever they can get on the subway,
Speaker 1: I love that.
Speaker 3: Even though one of my most.
Speaker 1: Haunting episodes takes place on a subway. So one guy
Speaker 1: is telling another guy on the subday platform about his
Speaker 1: nephew and his wife trying to use an intercom baby
Speaker 1: monitor to talk to the kids, which I do use
Speaker 1: to talk to my own children, and you know, I
Speaker 1: terrorize them. And the guy being told the story is
Speaker 1: sort of like he feels uninterested in it, but also
Speaker 1: he clocks a teen girl looking very bummed and maybe
Speaker 1: is in like a Catholic school uniform. And the train
Speaker 1: starts to come, and it is the end train. I
Speaker 1: was reading on the wiki like that this is like
Speaker 1: all inconsistent because I think it said it was the
Speaker 1: West fourth stop, but then the wall of the back
Speaker 1: says Church Street and it is the end train. So
Speaker 1: this is a lot of like things that don't make sense.
Speaker 1: But the train starts to come, and the guy comments, oh,
Speaker 1: it's the Express, which means for anybody that doesn't really
Speaker 1: know the New York subway, it's not going to stop there,
Speaker 1: it's just going to zoom by the station. And they
Speaker 1: do zoom by extremely fast. So he sees this girl
Speaker 1: looking despondent in she'ing closer to the edge of the
Speaker 1: platform while his friend keeps yammering around about this inane story,
Speaker 1: and just when it looks like she's about to hurl
Speaker 1: her body in front of the oncoming train, this guy
Speaker 1: yells no and grabs her and saves her, and sadly
Speaker 1: we never get a punchline to the baby monitor story.
Speaker 3: I really don't know where it was going.
Speaker 1: Okay, So we cut to Benson Stabler walking with Finn,
Speaker 1: who's giving them all the info that this girl tried
Speaker 1: to quote donate her body to the Downtown Express. She's
Speaker 1: not wearing underwear, her shirt is torn, she's got bruises
Speaker 1: on her thighs, no id, she's not talking, so they
Speaker 1: find her on a stretcher and she won't respond to
Speaker 1: Olivia's questions, and then Stabler's like, I got a daughter
Speaker 1: your age, and I would really want to know what
Speaker 1: happened to her so I could be there for her.
Speaker 1: So this girl's like, okay, daddy, and she finally tells
Speaker 1: us her name is Jackie Landrix and she lives on
Speaker 1: sixteenth in Chelsea. She is very freaked out at the
Speaker 1: idea of them telling her parents what happens. Says, they'll
Speaker 1: kill me and it's SVU, so you know, that's not
Speaker 1: just an expression, and Elliott's like, no, they're just going
Speaker 1: to be so glad you're safe foreshadowing and the credits. Okay,
Speaker 1: So now top of ec won the whole gang. Benson, Stabler, Munch,
Speaker 1: and Finn are watching the security footage of the subway.
Speaker 1: While Munch is dropping this like obscure knowledge, He's like,
Speaker 1: you know, in London, in the underground. In London, there's
Speaker 1: a system for identifying potential suicides and it's called Chromatica.
Speaker 1: And apparently the average person contemplating jumping in front of
Speaker 1: the train will wait about ten minutes on the platform
Speaker 1: and CHROMATICA will spot that and set an alarm.
Speaker 3: I googled this and you.
Speaker 1: Can't really find a reference to this past like nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety nine. So I don't know if Chromatica is still
Speaker 1: popping off in London, but if it is, let us know.
Speaker 1: So now they're focusing on the video of Jackie coming
Speaker 1: down the stairs. They spot a guy behind her who
Speaker 1: seems to be following a bit too close, and then
Speaker 1: as soon as the girl gets saved from jumping in
Speaker 1: front of the train, this guy takes off, so sketchy
Speaker 1: behavior all around. They blow up the logo on his
Speaker 1: show and it's in one second. They're like, can you
Speaker 1: blow it up?
Speaker 2: He goes right away, dah, and it's printed like it
Speaker 2: was the quickest of the blow ups I've ever seene.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it says Mercury Bike Messenger Services. And the
Speaker 1: kid is ideaed as Carl Sirett. He got fired last
Speaker 1: month for spending too much time with his girlfriend. Plus
Speaker 1: he has two arrests for assault. So now at the hospital,
Speaker 1: the doctor is telling Benson Distabler about all of Jackie's
Speaker 1: like sexual assault injuries, and he hands them polaroids of
Speaker 1: Jackie with restraint marks on her body, so she was
Speaker 1: tied down, and he says Jackie was attacked multiple times
Speaker 1: and told him that she had not had sexual relations
Speaker 1: before the attack. And so now her parents are in
Speaker 1: with her and Sabler flashes his badge through the window
Speaker 1: and the dad comes out and the dad, you got
Speaker 1: it is fucking Bosh, baby, I've been waiting for this moment.
Speaker 1: It is Titus Welliver and you might not recognize him
Speaker 1: as Bosh because he's got a full head of thick
Speaker 1: black hair, not exactly what he looks like.
Speaker 3: And if you're not into Bosh.
Speaker 1: You might remember that this guy, this actor Titus Welliver,
Speaker 1: actually comes back as evil bearded lawyer Rob Miller in
Speaker 1: the episodes Blackout, Assumptions and Endgame in season twenty, so
Speaker 1: he does come back into the SBU universe. He thanks
Speaker 1: Benson and Stabler for finding Jackie.
Speaker 3: They were worried.
Speaker 1: He says, Jackie doesn't have a boyfriend, and Stabler's like, okay, well,
Speaker 1: we got to get DNA from all the male family
Speaker 1: members and it's just procedure, and they even want it
Speaker 1: from her twelve year old brother Gary, and he's like,
Speaker 1: whatever you need, so he's cooperating. Jackie says she was
Speaker 1: walking home from school when a guy grabbed her. She
Speaker 1: had taken a shortcut through a parking lot. She heard
Speaker 1: a car pull up behind her, and a guy pushed
Speaker 1: her in. She didn't even get a look at him.
Speaker 1: He said if she screamed, he'd kill her.
Speaker 3: They drove for a bit.
Speaker 1: He pulled her out. They walked down some steps. She
Speaker 1: heard a door open. Then he tied her to the bed,
Speaker 1: took off her clothes, and then he quote unquote did it.
Speaker 1: She says she escaped after he was done, and after
Speaker 1: he had left, and they show her a photo array
Speaker 1: and she immediately points out the guy that was following
Speaker 1: her at the subway station, but she doesn't know if
Speaker 1: he's the one who did it. She was blindfolded, so
Speaker 1: they ask if she remembers anything else about this man,
Speaker 1: and guess what. She does remember that dick was pierced
Speaker 1: with a ring and she says, they're like, how did
Speaker 1: you know that?
Speaker 3: She's like, he made me feel it.
Speaker 1: So now we've got the bike delivery dude in the
Speaker 1: dark bars interrogation room and he does not give a fuck.
Speaker 3: This guy.
Speaker 1: And the actor's name is Billy Lush and he is
Speaker 1: still working. He's on he's been on Black Donnelly's Low
Speaker 1: wintersn and Bosh. So why did you run when this
Speaker 1: girl almost jumped in front of a train?
Speaker 3: He said. He's like, you guys had it under control.
Speaker 1: Like he's just got like douche voice, you know, And
Speaker 1: he says, I never saw a jockie before, and then
Speaker 1: munch reads allowed from his prior file like, oh never
Speaker 1: saw this girl, never met the bitch. They're like, sounds
Speaker 1: like a pattern, bro, and he's like, well, you better
Speaker 1: learned to read because the charges were dropped, and it's like,
Speaker 1: do you think that this man with transitions lenses does
Speaker 1: not read? Munch reads and Carl also declines to give
Speaker 1: a DNA sample. He's like, no, so that none of
Speaker 1: this looks good for old Carl. Craigan and Benson and
Speaker 1: Stabler are watching through the fish bowl and there is
Speaker 1: not a match on the restraint pattern, but the Emmy
Speaker 1: does remember a body being.
Speaker 3: Pulled out of the river two years ago.
Speaker 1: No head, no fingers, but Mark's consistent with Jackie's.
Speaker 3: So they're like, cal.
Speaker 1: Warner, see if she can dig up the body. Okay, guys,
Speaker 1: Finn and Munch pass them and go. Carl has to
Speaker 1: go to the bathroom. They've got Carl with him. In
Speaker 1: the bathroom, we see Munch kind of peeking down at
Speaker 1: Carl's junk and while he's peeing, and Carl goes jealous
Speaker 1: and munches. I believe the technical term is a prince Albert,
Speaker 1: which I did google really quickly and read it is
Speaker 1: one of the most common male genital piercings. And he says,
Speaker 1: ladies love the Prince. So then Finn cuffs him at
Speaker 1: the urinal right away, and it's like, first of all,
Speaker 1: let's let him wash his hands first. And second of all,
Speaker 1: if he wasn't under arrest, why did the cops have
Speaker 1: to walk him to the bathroom. Like they touch on
Speaker 1: this later, I could see why they would take him
Speaker 1: to the bathroom and like wait outside, but like, so
Speaker 1: be there pissing right.
Speaker 3: Next to him. He's not under arrest.
Speaker 1: If I went in to just talk to the cops
Speaker 1: and it was like, hey, I have to pee and
Speaker 1: they were like, cool, we have to come with you
Speaker 1: and watch you do it, that would be weird, but
Speaker 1: something that stuck out to me anyway. In the next scene,
Speaker 1: we see our old pal, Gina Bernardo aka Ileana Douglas,
Speaker 1: who we just talked about recently because she was the
Speaker 1: attorney for Jeremy Brice in Juvenile And also I'd like
Speaker 1: to point out that a friend of ours went on
Speaker 1: a date with Jeremy Bryce right after we covered this episode.
Speaker 1: She comes up to me and goes, I just want
Speaker 1: on a date with this guy who used to be
Speaker 1: on Nickelodeon but now does restaurants. I go, I know
Speaker 1: exactly who you're talking about, and I I md beat
Speaker 1: him and that was who it was. She said it
Speaker 1: was a great guy Ileana Douglas. Gina Bernardo says, you
Speaker 1: pulled my client out of bed, you made him, you
Speaker 1: held me here for more than five hours.
Speaker 3: Uncuff him and let him go.
Speaker 1: And Finn's like, he's under arrest, and Munch says, subway
Speaker 1: cameras show the victim trying to take her own life
Speaker 1: to get away from this guy, and Gina's like, that's
Speaker 1: hardly proof of rape. Munch brings up that Jackie mentioned
Speaker 1: the piercing, and Gina says, so he's the only man
Speaker 1: in New York City with us, Pierce Schlong, and you
Speaker 1: know we can put that in the coffee table book.
Speaker 3: Of spu lines.
Speaker 1: And she's like, you guys just happened to see his
Speaker 1: privates when you took him to the bathroom after you
Speaker 1: poured soda down his throat for five hours.
Speaker 3: Then she takes all.
Speaker 1: The soda cans and it's like, you think you're gonna
Speaker 1: get a free DNA sample and she's like, I want
Speaker 1: to talk to the ADA. So if you're a fucking
Speaker 1: douchebag nineteen year old, you want this woman to be
Speaker 1: your lawyer. You know she has got your back. So
Speaker 1: now Gina is on a very brisk walk and talk
Speaker 1: with Craigan in cabot. They feel like they are jogging,
Speaker 1: and Daddy Craigs says that it is procedure to escort
Speaker 1: suspects to the restroom, but I just feel like maybe
Speaker 1: not pissing right next to them.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: She wants to know if inspecting their genitals is also procedure,
Speaker 1: and she's like, you guys bamboozled this boy into thinking
Speaker 1: he was in custody when you knew you didn't even
Speaker 1: have probable cause to keep him in custody, which means
Speaker 1: everything you obtained, including a glance at his junk, is inadmissible.
Speaker 1: Craigan tries, uh, why Watters, didn't you just give us
Speaker 1: the DNA and Gina's like fuck no. Seu in chambers
Speaker 1: cabin is nervous because she's like, Gina's got a point.
Speaker 1: I hope you've got something else, and Craigan's like, how
Speaker 1: about a dead body?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 1: We cut too, and we talk about this a lot lately,
Speaker 1: but these early episodes they really just show you whatever.
Speaker 1: We cut to Melinda's house where there is simply a
Speaker 1: headless body on her table and they're calling her Chelsea Doe,
Speaker 1: and I was wondering why they're calling her that instead
Speaker 1: of Jane Doe, Like I remember the episode with Gloria
Speaker 1: Rubin where they call the little girl Precious Dough, and
Speaker 1: that kind of made me feel like, oh, because they
Speaker 1: want it to be known that it's a child, but
Speaker 1: this is Chelsea Doe, a woman.
Speaker 3: I just don't know why it's Chelsea do.
Speaker 1: They don't really explain it, and I tried to google
Speaker 1: it and I didn't really find anything.
Speaker 3: So if anyone knows.
Speaker 1: Melinda says, this one pissed her off because the perp
Speaker 1: went to such lengths to make sure that this that
Speaker 1: the victim couldn't be ideed. She compares the marktings and
Speaker 1: she says, yeah, these are similar, but not the same.
Speaker 1: Chelsea does are from rope burns, whereas jackies look like
Speaker 1: they were done from like furniture straps, like straps that
Speaker 1: you would use to like, you know, in a moving
Speaker 1: you'd see in a moving truck or whatever.
Speaker 3: Very specific.
Speaker 1: Melinda doesn't know if Chelsea was sexually assaulted because she'd
Speaker 1: been in the water for two weeks, so that would
Speaker 1: have washed away any evidence. She was in her late
Speaker 1: twenties fingers and head were cut off with some kind
Speaker 1: of cleaver, but she was strangled first. She also has
Speaker 1: news on the Jackie front. She's like, it turns out
Speaker 1: there were two rapists because she got two DNA samples
Speaker 1: and one of them has traces of mava statin in it,
Speaker 1: which is a medication for high cholesterol.
Speaker 3: And it's probably in my future because I have high cholesterol.
Speaker 1: So maybe Carl had an older partner, they think, because like,
Speaker 1: you didn't match the dad, the semen didn't match the dad.
Speaker 3: So they go back to talk to Jackie.
Speaker 1: At the Landrix's house, we meet Jackie's mom, Angie, who
Speaker 1: was played by Cynthia Edinger, and you might also remember
Speaker 1: her as the mom who in the episode we did
Speaker 1: called Shaken shook her baby because she wanted to just
Speaker 1: have a nice date with a mediocre man and her
Speaker 1: daughter would stop crying. So she's the mom from that.
Speaker 1: She had brown hair. Here she has blonde. The mom
Speaker 1: is Angie runs a daycare in her home and when
Speaker 1: the cops get there, they are baking cookies and she's like,
Speaker 1: these are Sally and Jason, two of my kids.
Speaker 3: You know, I kept them home today.
Speaker 1: She's talking to the cops when Jackie shows up in
Speaker 1: the doorway, they obviously want to talk to Jackie alone,
Speaker 1: so in that Jackie's room lives, like, hey, so it
Speaker 1: looks like there were two men. Did you hear two voices?
Speaker 1: And Jackie's kind of like, no, I didn't like whatever.
Speaker 1: All I heard was don't like, don't scream. Then their
Speaker 1: conversation kind of trails off as Stabler catches a quick
Speaker 1: movement in the hallway and he stoops away while Jackie
Speaker 1: continues to chat with Olivia and he finds little Sally
Speaker 1: and he introduces himself, and this girl immediately snuggles up
Speaker 1: to Stabler like she's on his lap really quickly and
Speaker 1: is like.
Speaker 3: Has Jackie been bad? Can I have your pen?
Speaker 1: Like she's, you know, a little precocious Stabler reads the
Speaker 1: name on two pill bobbles.
Speaker 2: I really love a chatty, precocious kid who's gonna give
Speaker 2: them evidence. Yes, Like they're gonna hug Stabler's leg and
Speaker 2: give them something and be like my sister said this, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I just love these little ghost kids that help the investigation.
Speaker 3: Truly, so many ghost kids on this series and get
Speaker 3: scared of the authorities.
Speaker 2: Nothing just ready ready, to help and psychologically traumatized. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so little Sally is like, oh, so while Stabler's, you know,
Speaker 2: chatting away with Sally, he happens to pick up two
Speaker 2: pill bottles that are just sitting willy nilly, and Stabler
Speaker 2: asks Sally who's James Randall and she goes, he lives
Speaker 2: with us, and Stabler's like, is he old like me?
Speaker 1: And Sally goes worse and then takes off. And I
Speaker 1: love a burn too. These kids do know how to give,
Speaker 1: like a very honest burn. So when Stabler goes back
Speaker 1: into Jackie's room, he asks about James Randall and she's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's lived down the hall for a couple of months,
Speaker 1: but he's never bothered me. And Jackie's like getting annoyed.
Speaker 1: She's like, why are you asking me all these questions?
Speaker 1: And then she storms off. So Stabler tosses the pill
Speaker 1: bottle to Benson and goes, guess who takes Miva Staton
Speaker 1: for high cholesterol? This guy James Randall? Right, so I
Speaker 1: guess they were in his room. Why is his room
Speaker 1: not locked?
Speaker 3: I don't know? Anyway.
Speaker 1: Top of AAC two, we've got this Randal guy in
Speaker 1: interrogation and he goes, just because I have high cholesterol
Speaker 1: doesn't mean I raped anybody. And it's like, I don't
Speaker 1: think anybody's suggesting.
Speaker 3: That, sir.
Speaker 2: I think we should put that on a T shirt.
Speaker 1: As a person with a genetically high cholesterol, I would
Speaker 1: wear it.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 1: Finn and Munch are questioning him, and he says, he
Speaker 1: does say Jackie's kind of hot, but schoolgirls aren't my thing.
Speaker 1: All right, bro, you could have just said nothing. Say
Speaker 1: less is what we're saying here, like you don't need
Speaker 1: to comment on that the hotness of a fifteen year
Speaker 1: old child. Munch wants to know why a hot shot
Speaker 1: at exec is slumming at living with a family in
Speaker 1: a house that is also a daycare, and honestly, same question.
Speaker 1: And he's like, I had some bad breaks, So what
Speaker 1: I need the specifics? What are the bad breaks? You're divorced,
Speaker 1: you lost all your money gambling? What are the bad breaks?
Speaker 1: They show in the picture of Chelsea Doe's body, and
Speaker 1: that freaks him right out. It is like a horrible photo,
Speaker 1: like it's you know, its body's been dead for two
Speaker 1: and a half years, and it's like it was in
Speaker 1: the water. It's not a great photo and that freaks
Speaker 1: him out and he's like, I will into a cup yesterday,
Speaker 1: like give it to me now, like show me up.
Speaker 1: He's like, just show me a pretty woman or something
Speaker 1: like that. So now we're all at the corkboard and
Speaker 1: Finn is like, yeah, guilty. Guys don't usually offer up
Speaker 1: their DNA, so this guy's either dumb or innocent.
Speaker 3: Olivia announces to.
Speaker 1: The group that Jackie has cervical dysplasia, and then she goes, so,
Speaker 1: our girl with no boyfriends has had a lot of them,
Speaker 1: And I just want to say, I googled cervical displasia
Speaker 1: and it's caused by HPV, which is sexually transmitted. But
Speaker 1: you can just have sex a couple times with the
Speaker 1: same person and get it. So it's like Olivia jumped
Speaker 1: right to classic slutshaming, which is.
Speaker 2: Very Also what's crazy is you know there's no test
Speaker 2: for men to see if they have HPV, and it's
Speaker 2: because it doesn't really affect them and they could just
Speaker 2: give it to women and causes them cancer, but they
Speaker 2: won't create a test for the guys.
Speaker 3: I know, I don't know why we can't test for it.
Speaker 2: Well, it's because there's probably they just don't care enough.
Speaker 2: Because it's also like, why isn't male birth control a
Speaker 2: thing because there's just too many side effects and men don't.
Speaker 1: Do Yeah, yeah, yeah, oh yeah, I got a joke
Speaker 1: about it. It's wild, but I had I think I
Speaker 1: had cervical displaysia and I had one boyfriend like at
Speaker 1: the time, you know, like I've had that, So it's like,
Speaker 1: that's not it just was a weird thing to be like,
Speaker 1: turns out she's a slut. But I get it's a
Speaker 1: TV show.
Speaker 3: We need to move on.
Speaker 2: Well, especially for Benson. We could have had someone else
Speaker 2: say it right exactly.
Speaker 1: But what we're getting out of this is Jackie's been
Speaker 1: lying about her sexual history. She was not a virgin
Speaker 1: before this attack, and she you know, you know, there's
Speaker 1: something else going on here. Stabler's like, I bet she
Speaker 1: didn't want her dad to find out. And it turns
Speaker 1: out also the judge denied the order for Carl's DNA
Speaker 1: based on police misconduct.
Speaker 3: Which, like, we can't say what we will about this show.
Speaker 1: It is copaganda in a lot of ways, but they
Speaker 1: do point out stuff like this, like they don't get
Speaker 1: what they want because they mishandled the situation, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like, and this is season four, like
Speaker 1: so they're not completely like the cops can do no wrong,
Speaker 1: Like Finn and Munch fucked this up, and now they
Speaker 1: don't have this guy's DNA because they apparently coerced him
Speaker 1: into self incrimination by bringing him into the bathroom cab.
Speaker 3: It's like, this is your guy's fault.
Speaker 1: And Craigan tells Finn and Munch to try to connect
Speaker 1: Carl the Penis piercer and Randall the broke executive, and
Speaker 1: then he sends Benson is able to figure out whose
Speaker 1: Jackie's boyfriends are, you know, the several several boyfriends at
Speaker 1: the school. They're talking to miss Bowen, and she is
Speaker 1: a teacher that you want, right She does not want
Speaker 1: to give up her student's personal business to the cops.
Speaker 1: But Olivia's like, hey, come on, girl, we're on the
Speaker 1: same side here, and she says, well, Jackie is really bright.
Speaker 1: She's a gifted writer. She's got a lot of potential.
Speaker 1: But other students told me that she was sleeping around,
Speaker 1: so okay, maybe she was. And she asked her and
Speaker 1: Jackie said she was dating a senior, but that she'd stop.
Speaker 1: And it started last year when she was a freshman.
Speaker 1: She was fourteen and the dude was eighteen, which, obviously,
Speaker 1: the detective point out is statutory, and this I always
Speaker 1: say it like caatchatory, like chicken statutory, But they point
Speaker 1: out that it's statutory, and the teacher is like, this
Speaker 1: shit is happening constantly, like I can't.
Speaker 3: I mean, it is hard at high school.
Speaker 1: So I knew freshmen that dated juniors and seniors, you know,
Speaker 1: like or sophomores that dated seniors after they graduated and
Speaker 1: stuff too, like, so like she's like, it was consensual.
Speaker 1: I stopped when I when uh, and it stopped when
Speaker 1: I found out. So she's like, I didn't want to
Speaker 1: take it to the cops over this, but she suggested
Speaker 1: they talked to the parents, but Jackie begged her not
Speaker 1: to tell them, said they'd kill her. Second time hearing
Speaker 1: that flag it for follow up and the teacher said,
Speaker 1: I told the guy to knock it off or I'd
Speaker 1: cut his balls off. So I love this teacher. I
Speaker 1: feel like she's writing for her girls students and good
Speaker 1: for her. And then she tells them the guy's name
Speaker 1: dot dot dot, Carl Surrett it is the penis piercing guy.
Speaker 1: So I'm really confused because I'm like, why would you
Speaker 1: point out your ex boyfriend on this lineup? But now
Speaker 1: we're talking to Jackie and her dad, who are sitting
Speaker 1: uncomfortably close to one another on the couch. They confront
Speaker 1: Jackie about knowing this guy, dating him, having sex with him,
Speaker 1: and she's like, it stopped a month ago. I broke
Speaker 1: up with him after my teacher talked to me. And
Speaker 1: they're like, book girl, you picked him out of a
Speaker 1: photo array and she's like, yeah, I just wanted someone
Speaker 1: to blame. And then it's like, well, why was he
Speaker 1: following you? He was following her because he saw her
Speaker 1: outside the station and he hangs out outside the deli there.
Speaker 1: This is all very coincidental. When you find out what
Speaker 1: happens later, you're like, why why was any of this happening?
Speaker 3: It's a television show anyway.
Speaker 1: They're like, Jackie, you gotta tell us everything, and she's like,
Speaker 1: I am.
Speaker 3: You just won't believe me.
Speaker 1: Can I go now? And she like asked her dad
Speaker 1: if she can leave. So now they're just talking to
Speaker 1: Bosh and he's like, so, Carl's in the clear. What
Speaker 1: about Randal and lives like, well, we questioned him, but
Speaker 1: without Jackie's ID, we really can't hold him. Also, he
Speaker 1: did offer up his DNA, so you know, it's like
Speaker 1: they're not doing anything with him. And Stabler's like, I
Speaker 1: got a big question. Why would you rent a room
Speaker 1: to a forty year old man right next to your
Speaker 1: teen daughter? And he's like, because I need my head examined.
Speaker 1: Like he's obviously knows how dumb that is. He's like,
Speaker 1: I needed the money, and usually I only rent to
Speaker 1: women and students. But Randal seemed okay. What about him
Speaker 1: seems okay? He immediately said your daughter was hot. Now, Angie.
Speaker 1: The mom comes home with a child and suddenly the
Speaker 1: combo is over. The dad takes off with the kid
Speaker 1: to another room, and the mom wants to know what's up.
Speaker 1: Sally is back and pulls Stabler into the hallway. She's like,
Speaker 1: I got you a present. She is very ghosty here,
Speaker 1: she's a very ghost child.
Speaker 3: Here.
Speaker 1: She's like, I got you a president and it hams
Speaker 1: him this bracelet and she goes, don't tell. So this
Speaker 1: is a little bit a little little creepy. What's this
Speaker 1: bracelet all about? So now, Huang and Sabler are walking
Speaker 1: and talking. He wants to know what's up with Sally.
Speaker 1: She's unusually friendly. She asks strangers for presents, she gives
Speaker 1: them presents. She's just a little bit too affectionate. And
Speaker 1: Huang is like, yeah, sometimes that's a sign of abuse.
Speaker 1: And Stabler's like, yeah, but I've seen abusive families, and
Speaker 1: these parents really seem to love the kids, and the
Speaker 1: kids seem happy. And it's like you are nsvu didtech
Speaker 1: dev Like what about things are not always what they
Speaker 1: seem on the surface, do you not get Munch and
Speaker 1: Vinn interrupt and they're like, the emmy got a match
Speaker 1: on one of the DNA samples from Jackie. It's a
Speaker 1: guy named Charles Eno who did time for robbery and assault,
Speaker 1: and he lives a block from the Landris Plus. Two
Speaker 1: years ago, he was a butcher in the Meatpacking District
Speaker 1: ret row. In interrogation, Charles Eno is telling Munch and
Speaker 1: Finn that he was home in till eleven thirty and
Speaker 1: then he went to the club where he works security.
Speaker 1: He says he didn't rape anyone, and that Munch says, well,
Speaker 1: your sperm tells a different story. He's like, I didn't
Speaker 1: tell anyone up. And then they throw the picture of
Speaker 1: Chelsea Doe in front of him too, and he does
Speaker 1: not like that.
Speaker 3: He's like, that's sick. Who do you guys think I am?
Speaker 1: Then he admits I had sex with Angie Landrix, but
Speaker 1: I never touched the girl huge dundune that we did
Speaker 1: not see coming. He says, why would I mess with
Speaker 1: jail bait when I can get it from her?
Speaker 3: Mom's a great question.
Speaker 1: Cragan is on the other side of the glass with Stabler.
Speaker 1: If we already have his DNA in the girl and
Speaker 1: he puts himself in the apartment, why would he be
Speaker 1: holding out and telling this wild story?
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: Stabler thinks maybe he's doing both of them and he
Speaker 1: doesn't want to cop to the statutory and then knock knock,
Speaker 1: Benson comes in. The other DNA sample result came back
Speaker 1: and it's not Carl Surrett. It is James Randall, the
Speaker 1: ad executive border, So what.
Speaker 3: Is going on?
Speaker 1: Stabler goes like the jackass who gave up his DNA, Like,
Speaker 1: what's going on? Why would this guy give his DNA
Speaker 1: if he did this? Now we've got said jackass back
Speaker 1: in interrogation and he still swears he did nothing to Jackie.
Speaker 1: They show him a picture of Charles Eno and he goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I know that guy from the club I go to,
Speaker 1: and they want to know if this is some kind
Speaker 1: of joint project between him and Charles, but he's like
Speaker 1: totally clueless. He's like, what are you talking about? He
Speaker 1: has no idea how his sperm got into this child.
Speaker 1: And then they're like, let me guess you just had
Speaker 1: sex with the mom and he goes, yeah, that's right,
Speaker 1: and it's like, what the.
Speaker 3: Fucking mom is fucking this guy too? What is happening?
Speaker 1: And lives like that's ballsy to do it under the
Speaker 1: husband's nose, and Randall goes, well, he paid me to
Speaker 1: do it.
Speaker 3: Done done.
Speaker 1: What's going on here? Apparently mister Landrix likes to watch.
Speaker 1: So now the gang at the top of AC three
Speaker 1: is gathered around the bulletin board and they are all confused.
Speaker 1: Huang swoops in and says, I think the dad is
Speaker 1: a sexually obsessive narcissist, and Craigan goes, you're telling me
Speaker 1: this guy gets his kicks from prostituting his wife and
Speaker 1: daughters and it is straight out of the Milaney special
Speaker 1: where he's like, you tell me, this guy gets off
Speaker 1: a little girls with pigtails, so I love that moment.
Speaker 1: Huang explains that for this guy, his family is his
Speaker 1: own little cult. The women are just trying to make
Speaker 1: him happy, which is not different from the story the
Speaker 1: real true crime story we talked about in last week's
Speaker 1: episode Honor, Like this is like a little cult family
Speaker 1: and Sally may not be actually abused, but Huang wouldn't
Speaker 1: be surprised if she's aware of it, Like she knows
Speaker 1: what's going on. She knows like daddy's the boss. We
Speaker 1: all do whatever we have to do to make Daddy happy.
Speaker 3: So that way, when.
Speaker 1: Somebody like Stabler comes into the house, it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: let's do that with this man too, And he explains
Speaker 1: like yeah, the kids don't say anything because he's their
Speaker 1: dad and they love him. Huang says it's called child's
Speaker 1: sexual abuse accommodation syndrome, and I did look this up,
Speaker 1: and the accommodation syndrome has five stages. One is secrecy,
Speaker 1: the nexus helplessness, The next is entrapman and accommodation. The
Speaker 1: next is delayed and unconvincing. Disclosure of the abuse, and finally,
Speaker 1: a reaction of the complaint in the face of the
Speaker 1: usual adult disbelief and blame of the victim. So that's
Speaker 1: from the Office of Justice Programs where I found those
Speaker 1: five stages. And I feel as though we've seen this
Speaker 1: in a lot of other episodes, and this is the
Speaker 1: first time i've you know, we've I think, zeroed in
Speaker 1: on this actual diagnosis. So basically, Jackie knows that if
Speaker 1: she talks, she breaks up the family. And they're like,
Speaker 1: but why is he doing this? And Huong's like, my
Speaker 1: guess is he's impotent, possibly infertile, and this family structure
Speaker 1: is the only place where he has power. Benson is like,
Speaker 1: and then Angie's running a daycare there. We got to
Speaker 1: get those kids out of there. And Craigan also thinks, maybe, like,
Speaker 1: let's bring Angie in. If she sees her whole world
Speaker 1: falling apart, maybe she'll spill the tea. So now they're
Speaker 1: at the Landricks home removing the kids. Child Services is there.
Speaker 1: Angie's screaming like, no, I have to call their parents.
Speaker 1: Where's my husband?
Speaker 3: And then she goes to Jackie, what have you done?
Speaker 1: And Jackie softly says, I'm sorry and like it's it's
Speaker 1: so fucked. And then two little boys get brought out
Speaker 1: and there's no record of their parents in the home.
Speaker 1: So what does the mom say? Nothing I can repeat,
Speaker 1: the social worker says. So Stabler taps his a little pal,
Speaker 1: Sally our ghost child, to identify the boys, and she's like,
Speaker 1: that's Philip and that's Antoine. And he's like, who's their mom?
Speaker 1: And Sally goes, mom is and Stabler's like, no, who's
Speaker 1: their real mom? And she said, my mom is stupid.
Speaker 1: They're my brothers. And Benson's face is shocked and ominous
Speaker 1: keyboard music is playing. So we're in interrogation, but we're
Speaker 1: not in cement room bars. I don't know if we're
Speaker 1: in wood room blinds, but it's like nicer. There's framed
Speaker 1: pictures on the walls, and we're with Angie and they're
Speaker 1: telling her that they check the birth records and Philip
Speaker 1: and Antoine are her kids, and she says, I never
Speaker 1: said they weren't.
Speaker 3: Who are their dads? They asked? She goes, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Stabler's like, how does the big family man feel about
Speaker 1: all this? And she says he wanted me to have
Speaker 1: these kids. Sally was his last biological child. He can't
Speaker 1: have anymore, so he just pulls men off the streets
Speaker 1: and lets them play in seminators. Stabler asks. She says,
Speaker 1: Tom wanted more kids and I wanted to keep him happy.
Speaker 1: And Benson's like, how long are you going to keep
Speaker 1: this up? And She's like, I can't give him any
Speaker 1: more kids. Phillip's birth went wrong and I had to
Speaker 1: have a hysterectomy, and I'm like, girl, you had five kids.
Speaker 1: I'd say Phillip's birth went just right. You can be
Speaker 1: done now. So they ask her, so what Jackie's the
Speaker 1: next best thing, and she tries to pin it on
Speaker 1: Randall and eno She's like, no, they that was those
Speaker 1: two guys, and Stablor goes, either you let them rape
Speaker 1: your daughter or your husband took their semen out of
Speaker 1: you and did it himself.
Speaker 3: And she goes, it's wild.
Speaker 1: He screams in she goes, that's disgusting, and Stabler goes,
Speaker 1: you're disgusting. You are It's a top ten Maloney moment,
Speaker 1: and she's like, I want to talk to Tom.
Speaker 3: We would never hurt our children, you know.
Speaker 1: She's basically just like breaking down. She cannot really operate
Speaker 1: outside the existence of her husband. Benson and Stabler are
Speaker 1: on their way to talk to Jackie when Craigan fills
Speaker 1: them in that Jackie's been moved to a treatment center
Speaker 1: after some kind of you know, mental breakdowns. So in
Speaker 1: walks Bosh aka Tom Landrix, demanding to know where.
Speaker 3: His kids are.
Speaker 1: He calls Stabler bastard and is like, I trusted you,
Speaker 1: and Stabler go was then your kids trusted you and
Speaker 1: they have this like harmless little.
Speaker 3: Slap fight before they get pulled apart by other people.
Speaker 1: So now we're at the treatment center and Huang and
Speaker 1: Benson are watching Jackie play with dolls in one of
Speaker 1: these like kid playrooms through an observation window, and Huang goes,
Speaker 1: it's regression in service of the ego. When the president
Speaker 1: gets too frightening, people try to escape to a safer time.
Speaker 1: So he says, children are very fragile and resilient, which is,
Speaker 1: you know the episode's name, So you can drink unless
Speaker 1: you're in the car right now or at work, or
Speaker 1: you know somewhere where you can't drink. She could go
Speaker 1: either way, he says, like she could either break or
Speaker 1: bounce back from this. Stabler goes, she's playing with dolls.
Speaker 1: How do we know she's not faking it? And he goes,
Speaker 1: we don't until you talk to her. Stabler's like me,
Speaker 1: no way, you're the shrink. But Huang's like, no, you're
Speaker 1: the father figure. That's what she's looking for. Who's to
Speaker 1: say Huang doesn't have kids, but whatever, we know Stabler
Speaker 1: has the daddy vibe. So Stabler goes in. Jackie introduces
Speaker 1: him to her doll, Cindy. Then she introduces Cindy's boyfriend Bear,
Speaker 1: and he likes Cindy because Cindy knows what Bear wants,
Speaker 1: and the combo gets creepy, being sexual extremely quickly. Jackie's like,
Speaker 1: I know what to do. I've watched and then Stabler
Speaker 1: asks who have you watched? And Jackie goes, my mom
Speaker 1: and then gets upset and like walks away from Stabler,
Speaker 1: and then Stabler, the antithesis of a child psychologist, immediately
Speaker 1: goads Jackie into a meltdown where he yells at her
Speaker 1: about how her dad doesn't love her and is using her,
Speaker 1: and that he tells her you're safe, like, I want
Speaker 1: to hear what you have to talk to me, and
Speaker 1: she falls into his arms and starts telling all.
Speaker 3: She says, her dad.
Speaker 1: Told her that her mom couldn't have a baby and
Speaker 1: that made him sad. He asked her to help him,
Speaker 1: and he wanted her to have a baby. She didn't
Speaker 1: want to, but she said, but he said she was
Speaker 1: old enough and that she had to do it for
Speaker 1: the family. He took her to the bedroom, took off
Speaker 1: her clothes, told her to lie down on the bed.
Speaker 1: Then I saw he had a syringe.
Speaker 3: She said.
Speaker 1: I tried to get away, but he caught me, tied
Speaker 1: me down. Then I saw my mom. I begged her
Speaker 1: to stop him, but she wouldn't. He put I mean
Speaker 1: a second episode in a row where a mom is
Speaker 1: just like letting the dad like do something that you
Speaker 1: know she's not but she could be helping to stop.
Speaker 1: He pushes the syringe into her and says, good girl,
Speaker 1: and then Stabler gives Jackie a hug, and we've got
Speaker 1: the whole story now.
Speaker 3: So top of act.
Speaker 1: Four, we've got friend of the Pod Jill Marie Lawrence
Speaker 1: aka Cleo Conrad in a prison cell with her client
Speaker 1: Tom Landrix, and she said, look, he's ready to plead guilty.
Speaker 1: To promoting prostitution, and Cabot's like, lady a misdemeanor. He
Speaker 1: tied down his own daughter and tried to inseminate her.
Speaker 1: And then it turns out that Angie denies that happen,
Speaker 1: forensics prove that Tom's not the one that raped her,
Speaker 1: and the apartment search turned up nothing. This is all
Speaker 1: a figment of a disturbed child's imagination.
Speaker 3: Cleo says.
Speaker 1: Cabot's like, the forensics will actually confirm Jackie's story, and
Speaker 1: then Cleo goes low and says, no one will buy
Speaker 1: Jackie's crazy story now that she's been transferred to a
Speaker 1: psych facility, and Cabot's like, oh, bitch, you want to
Speaker 1: go low. Once the jury hears he pays strangers to
Speaker 1: fuck his wife, I think they'll get on board with.
Speaker 3: The other stuff.
Speaker 1: So it's a really great little tit for tat there.
Speaker 1: And then Cleo goes, if you put Jackie on the stand,
Speaker 1: I'll be forced to bring up her muscuity, her false
Speaker 1: rape accusations, and her lies. And she tells Alex take
Speaker 1: the deal, and then Tom Landrix goes, I love my daughter.
Speaker 1: I would never heard her, and Cabbot goes shut up.
Speaker 1: I'll see you in court. So we cut to court
Speaker 1: where Cabot is questioning Jackie about the bruises on her
Speaker 1: body the night she was attacked and ended up in
Speaker 1: the hospital. She says straps cause them when asked where
Speaker 1: she was tied up.
Speaker 3: She makes eye.
Speaker 1: Contact with her dad and then Cabot tries to get
Speaker 1: in between them, but it kind of feels like it's
Speaker 1: too late. She's already fallen under her dad's spell. She's like, Jackie,
Speaker 1: who did this? And she's like, I don't know, and
Speaker 1: she pretty much freezes up at all of Cabot's questions.
Speaker 1: Cabot rolls out the record of her grand jury testimony
Speaker 1: where Jackie told the whole story about her dad, and
Speaker 1: Cabot starts reading her quotes, but Jackie says, I said
Speaker 1: what you wanted me to say. So she's fully renagging
Speaker 1: on her whole story. She's back to the eye was blindfold.
Speaker 2: On the story me too, because so stressful and perjury.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because our ada's really can't be prepared for something
Speaker 1: like that, Like they've already gone over testimony with someone
Speaker 1: and then they fully won eighty on them.
Speaker 3: So she's like, I saw nothing. I was blindfolded.
Speaker 1: I told you I was scared, and that policeman talking
Speaker 1: about Stabler told me to say my dad did bad
Speaker 1: things to me. But my dad wouldn't do that. I
Speaker 1: just know he wouldn't. And so who did them? She says,
Speaker 1: I don't know. And Cleo gets to cross examine and
Speaker 1: she's like, one question, did your mom and dad ever
Speaker 1: hurt you?
Speaker 3: Jackie says never. Ugh, it's tough. It's tough.
Speaker 1: The layers of trauma here are tough to peel back.
Speaker 1: So back at the precinct, there's a lot of info
Speaker 1: flying around. Oh I heard Tom Landrix is getting his
Speaker 1: family back. Plus Jackie's pregnant. She wants to keep the baby.
Speaker 1: Craigan's like, what happened in the morning after pill isn't
Speaker 1: that standard. By the time they got to the hospital,
Speaker 1: the parents were already there, so they must have talked
Speaker 1: her out of taking it.
Speaker 3: Of course, because this is their big plan. I guess.
Speaker 3: I don't get.
Speaker 1: Which they never get to is after this happened, they
Speaker 1: just let her, kind of traumatized, walk out of the
Speaker 1: house to the subway.
Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 1: So they're joking about how these little kids Philip and
Speaker 1: Antoine are about to be uncles when they're only two
Speaker 1: and four, and that kind of gives Finn a little
Speaker 1: like light bulb moment where he's like, huh, if Angie
Speaker 1: got her hysterectomy two years ago, why doe he waits
Speaker 1: so long to turn Jackie into the baby farm? And
Speaker 1: it's like, I don't know, maybe because he thought fifteen
Speaker 1: was better than thirteen, but whatever, and they're like, maybe
Speaker 1: he's tried this before. Maybe he tried this with Chelsea Doe.
Speaker 1: The restraint patterns are similar. If we can't get him
Speaker 1: for rape, let's get him for murder. Olivia remembers that
Speaker 1: before they let Randall rent a room, Landrix said he
Speaker 1: usually rented rooms to the room to women. What if
Speaker 1: Chelsea Doe was one of these renters. Craigan sends the
Speaker 1: gang out to do some digging, and he wants to
Speaker 1: introduce Huang to Chelsea Doe. So back at Melinda's house,
Speaker 1: Huang's getting the low down. Strangulation, he says, implies a
Speaker 1: crime of rage. The fingers being cut off is strange
Speaker 1: because a hand is much easier to just take off
Speaker 1: at the wrist. Oh, I'm throwing up. He kept the
Speaker 1: fingers for souvenirs, he says, and he references Fred West
Speaker 1: who collected bones, and it increases the risk of discovery,
Speaker 1: but it also increases the risk the feeling of power.
Speaker 1: I mean, we've seen a million serial killer documentaries where
Speaker 1: they take souvenirs, and we've seen a million episodes of
Speaker 1: SVU where they take souvenirs because like it makes them
Speaker 1: feel like they still have a piece of the victim
Speaker 1: with them and that they're more powerful. So could Tom
Speaker 1: have killed her?
Speaker 3: He says.
Speaker 1: He enjoys violating the rights of other people, which is
Speaker 1: the mark of an anti social personality, but he also
Speaker 1: has schizotypal features which provoke him to act out his fantasies.
Speaker 1: He points out that the restraints show that he keeps
Speaker 1: their arms and legs free so that the victim will fight,
Speaker 1: which makes his dominance more satisfying. So Huang's like, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think this guy could kill and I think he could.
Speaker 3: Grow to enjoy it.
Speaker 1: Yikes, this is getting more twisted by the second. So
Speaker 1: at the precinct, Olivia has pretty easily discovered that two
Speaker 1: and a half years ago, a twenty eight year old
Speaker 1: named Karen Stenslin gave the landrix to address at the DMV,
Speaker 1: and there's been no movement on her Social Security number
Speaker 1: since Chelsea Doe's body was found. Only living relative this
Speaker 1: one has is a grandma living in Teaneck, New Jersey.
Speaker 1: So now we're talking to a classic guess for you.
Speaker 1: Grandma Gullible doesn't know what's going on. She's like, I
Speaker 1: haven't spoken to.
Speaker 3: Karen in a long time. She moved to Europe.
Speaker 1: I know phones are expensive, but I wish she'd call.
Speaker 1: And she talks about this postcard that she got is
Speaker 1: the last time she heard from her, and the postcards
Speaker 1: sitting right there. Sabler notices that it's postmark Manhattan, so
Speaker 1: it hardly came from Europe. And the Grandma's like, no,
Speaker 1: I found out. She's like, I found out about the
Speaker 1: Europe thing from the nice man that Karen nannied for.
Speaker 1: And Sabler picks up a photo of Karen and goes,
Speaker 1: is this Karen? And what's this bracelet that she's wearing?
Speaker 1: And she goes it was her mother's she died when
Speaker 1: Karen was very young. She always wears it. So ghost
Speaker 1: Baby did bring us the bracelet evidence, and we are
Speaker 1: starting to get a picture of what's going on here.
Speaker 1: Cut to Stabler at the playground asking Sally about the bracelet.
Speaker 1: Jackie's just chilling on a bench behind her, and it's like,
Speaker 1: who was watching these emotionally disturbed children. They're just like, Jackie,
Speaker 1: take your other emotionally disturbed siblings to the playground.
Speaker 4: End.
Speaker 1: If the cops show up, I guess let them talk
Speaker 1: to them. They're like, Sally, what remember that bracelet. She's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I want it back, and they're like, well, who gave
Speaker 1: it to you? And she says, nobody. I took it
Speaker 1: from Jackie's drawer. So then Jackie walks up and she's
Speaker 1: very down to talk to the cops, who she did
Speaker 1: not trust at the trial, and she tells them, no,
Speaker 1: it's not mine, it's Karen's. But she went away, and
Speaker 1: then she says, I found the bracelet in Karen's room
Speaker 1: under the bed, which is Randall's bedroom. So now we're
Speaker 1: at their house and there's a guy, there's a whole
Speaker 1: crew there digging up one of the rooms of the house,
Speaker 1: and the guy goes, I had to use ground probing
Speaker 1: radar to locate the void and.
Speaker 3: Dig through two feet of solid concrete.
Speaker 1: But after they get started, they just let detectives dig
Speaker 1: through it themselves.
Speaker 3: Stablers on his hands and knees with his big.
Speaker 1: Ass in the air, just removing chunks of debris from
Speaker 1: this place. It's like, I feel like there's a team
Speaker 1: that has to do this, more like in an archaeological
Speaker 1: dig style. But whatever, we had to get Sablers butt
Speaker 1: and hands into the situation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very stucky vibes, honestly, just getting in there,
Speaker 2: no rhyme or reason.
Speaker 1: Right, So Sabler finds a skull wrapped in a flannel
Speaker 1: shirt very nineties, and Olivia finds the missing fingers, like
Speaker 1: just loosely strewn about as well, So now we feel
Speaker 1: like we've kind of closed this. In interrogation with Tom
Speaker 1: and Cleo again, they give him the four one one
Speaker 1: about finding Karen's head and fingers and he's like, no way,
Speaker 1: Karen's in London, and he says I would never hurt
Speaker 1: Karen and then accuses Stabler of setting him up and
Speaker 1: planting this stuff. And Stabler goes under two feet of
Speaker 1: concrete and admittedly Tom Landrix looks like he's got got
Speaker 1: He's like, uh.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's I guess that would be a lot for
Speaker 3: you to do.
Speaker 1: Olivia is like, we know it's Karen. We checked her
Speaker 1: mitochondrial DNA against her grandmother, So bitch, you thought you
Speaker 1: could just chop off her head and chop off her
Speaker 1: fucking hands. They figure out other ways to identify people.
Speaker 1: Stabler's like, I've had it.
Speaker 3: With this guy. Next time I see you're gonna have
Speaker 3: a needle in arm.
Speaker 1: Keep denying it, and he walks out, and Olivia's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: what happened Tom? Because you know, maybe Tom will talk
Speaker 1: to like a woman more because he's this narcissistic, crazy person,
Speaker 1: and maybe Stabler threat threatens him. So he's like, she
Speaker 1: tried to destroy us. She said she'd have a baby,
Speaker 1: and then she backed out, said she'd tell have our
Speaker 1: kids taken away. And his lawyer's like, shut the fuck up,
Speaker 1: but he just can't. He's like, I had to protect
Speaker 1: my family. If there are no children, the family dies.
Speaker 1: But there are five children, sir, like there are already
Speaker 1: a lot of children.
Speaker 2: It's like the John Stamos episode, Yeah, productive abuse, but worse, yes, way.
Speaker 1: Worse, because that's a guy that's just like, as spread
Speaker 1: my kids around Manhattan. This guy's like, make my children
Speaker 1: have them, Like, oh, he is not good, and he says,
Speaker 1: they're like, what about Jackie. She tried to run away.
Speaker 1: Were you gonna kill her too? He says, I'd never
Speaker 1: hurt Jackie. Well you kind of did, bro, She's got
Speaker 1: a baby inside of her that you put there, And
Speaker 1: he looks like a little bit happy to hear that.
Speaker 1: He says, Jackie loves me, she knows I her, She'll
Speaker 1: do what's best for the family. So final scene, we're
Speaker 1: at the playground again. Jackie's watching her siblings again when
Speaker 1: Stabler shows up and he's like, how you doing, and
Speaker 1: she says, okay, I've been following my dad's trial. She's like,
Speaker 1: it's weird. It's like watching someone I don't know and
Speaker 1: it's my dad. And she's like, and he did all
Speaker 1: these horrible things, but it's my dad. And she tells
Speaker 1: Stabler I'm not going to keep the baby, and even
Speaker 1: his Catholic ass is like, thank God, Like even he's like,
Speaker 1: you've never seen Stabler like relieved about an abortion before, really,
Speaker 1: but he is here, and she says the baby is
Speaker 1: what my dad would have wanted.
Speaker 3: And I'm done with that shit.
Speaker 1: So she walks off and that's dick wolf baby twist turns.
Speaker 3: It's like such a classic.
Speaker 1: Kind of it's just weird that like, at the same
Speaker 1: moment as that happened, she passed the deli where her
Speaker 1: ex boyfriend with a penis piercing happened to be hanging
Speaker 1: out and he followed her down there. That's just like
Speaker 1: the only part of it that's a little bit like TV.
Speaker 1: But I guess we had to have like a Red Herring.
Speaker 1: We had to have a person that was like we
Speaker 1: thought was the bad guy.
Speaker 3: Right absolutely, and yeah, get ready for the crimes. I'm excited.
Speaker 3: I hate to say it.
Speaker 2: Okay, So there is a case that Kara is very
Speaker 2: excited to hear, and they're known as Britain's worst serial killers,
Speaker 2: and we will get to that, but I do want
Speaker 2: to cover the semen of it all. And that is
Speaker 2: a different case, and that's the case of Shenna Grimm.
Speaker 2: And so John Goff is an Ohio man and he
Speaker 2: forced his stepdaughter Shenna to be inseminated with his sperm
Speaker 2: when she was sixteen because the mother could.
Speaker 3: No longer conceive.
Speaker 2: So yeah, straight up, like you know, we we know
Speaker 2: Neil Bear read this and.
Speaker 3: Some local paper and he got his hands on it,
Speaker 3: like get me my laptop.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So Goff and his wife in December nineteen ninety
Speaker 2: eight asked Grim to be injected with his seamen and
Speaker 2: so Narda. The mom she met Golf when Shana was
Speaker 2: four years old. And you know he has all the
Speaker 2: like trappings of no good for us, for us, you know,
Speaker 2: ex marine volunteer, auxiliary cop. He had seven guns and
Speaker 2: a street evangelis evangelist evangelist evangelist, street evangelist.
Speaker 3: So those are not the four you want to hear.
Speaker 3: Those are great preachers. Street preachers are like always killers.
Speaker 2: I feel like I wish I said preacher instead of
Speaker 2: trying to say evangelist. But the auxiliary cop of it
Speaker 2: all is probably my biggest in the seven gon whatever.
Speaker 2: So she did agree to do this, but it's because
Speaker 2: he threatened her with a gun. He put a gun
Speaker 2: to her fucking head and said he would hurt her
Speaker 2: mother if she did not comply.
Speaker 3: So that's not agreeing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it was a rape to fulfill his desire
Speaker 2: to procreate. According to Grim, the mom started charting her
Speaker 2: fertility cycle when she was ovulating, John would ejaculate into
Speaker 2: a cup then put it into one of Narda's syringes.
Speaker 2: Because she had MS, so she would inject medication into herself.
Speaker 2: And so then Shenna became pregnant at sixteen years old.
Speaker 2: She gave birth to a boy in nineteen ninety nine,
Speaker 2: and eventually she did place them into foster care in
Speaker 2: two thousand and one. She said she could not care
Speaker 2: for him. It was too hard. She had a lot
Speaker 2: of PTSD and a lot of trauma and like.
Speaker 1: But was the point of it not for the parents?
Speaker 1: Did the guy who did this not want to have
Speaker 1: the baby or he just wanted to like spread his
Speaker 1: seed more?
Speaker 2: Well, she had a fiance. I'll get into that. I'll
Speaker 2: get into that. Your brain is going to the right
Speaker 2: place for an amateur detective. We are, you're doing good.
Speaker 2: So and then at first nobody believed her. They all
Speaker 2: thought it was too creepy and sadistic to fathom. And
Speaker 2: it's like, have you been living under a rock for
Speaker 2: all of humanity? Like, okay, even her boyfriend. So then
Speaker 2: he became a fiance. I don't know what happened to
Speaker 2: her post like this case, And I honestly didn't dig
Speaker 2: that hard because she just deserves her life. Like I
Speaker 2: kind of was like, girl, I hope you married this
Speaker 2: guy and he treats you well and you're you know,
Speaker 2: doing well and have all the support you need. But
Speaker 2: so this boyfriend at the time, she you know, he
Speaker 2: didn't know what was going on, and then he when
Speaker 2: she told him, he was like, this story is crazy,
Speaker 2: like I can't I don't get this. But then he
Speaker 2: went over to their house for dinner and the dad
Speaker 2: admitted it like it was super normal, like he talked
Speaker 2: about it at dinner. So then months of like investigation happened,
Speaker 2: and finally a paternity test made people listen to her.
Speaker 2: But then the entire family and extended family turned their
Speaker 2: backs on her. They were like, you're ruining our lives.
Speaker 2: They tried to poke holes in her story. They're like,
Speaker 2: you lying bitch, like normal stuff, not surprising. But in
Speaker 2: January two thousand and one, she finally went to the
Speaker 2: cops and they blew her off, So thank you so
Speaker 2: much to the Stow police. So then the Summit County
Speaker 2: Children's Services Board also blew her off.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, it's nuts.
Speaker 2: And then this you're gonna love this this is such
Speaker 2: a twist. This is like an SVU thing. I can't
Speaker 2: even believe it. So in the nineties, Goff and the
Speaker 2: wife Narda campaigned for tougher state rape laws. They were activists.
Speaker 2: So their activism was sparked because a man got acquitted
Speaker 2: for molesting Grim and at the time, the law required
Speaker 2: intercourse for a rape charge. And because of that law
Speaker 2: that they changed, he was tried under a tougher state
Speaker 2: rape law.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So basically, in July nineteen ninety three, the family attended
Speaker 2: a neighborhood party and then two weeks later she told
Speaker 2: her mom. During the party, a neighbor, a thirty five
Speaker 2: year old named John Eggert, raped her and threatened to
Speaker 2: kill her family if she told anybody. The case was
Speaker 2: very straightforward, but until Grim hit the stand and she
Speaker 2: could not definitively say or no if he used his
Speaker 2: penis or fingers, and up until the nineties, if it
Speaker 2: wasn't a dick, it wasn't rape.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, Like that's why she was a kid,
Speaker 3: she was little. Oh my god.
Speaker 2: It's just crazy, Like when people are not clear about
Speaker 2: the importance of feminism and like all of this like
Speaker 2: into the nineties in the state of Ohio, if you
Speaker 2: used an object or another thing, or force someone to
Speaker 2: do oral or anything not rape.
Speaker 3: It had to be a dick in penetration. Oh my god.
Speaker 2: Like if you put a finger in a child against her,
Speaker 2: what are you talking about? Ah, how is that not rape?
Speaker 2: He got fucking acquitted. Oh my god, but GoF legit.
Speaker 2: The dad was like, what's the difference what he raped
Speaker 2: her with? Rape is rape? So a bill was drafted
Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety six, and after spending two years waiting
Speaker 2: through the Ohio legal systemading one hundred and twenty two
Speaker 2: letters to legislators, it finally became law, and so June
Speaker 2: two thousand and one, the Goths were finally indicted. Goff
Speaker 2: ended up being convicted in two thousand and two and
Speaker 2: sentenced to twenty years in prison, but then in an
Speaker 2: appeals court overturned the convictions because of the detective's testimony
Speaker 2: about statements that Goff's wife made and it shouldn't have
Speaker 2: been allowed. So something about like hearsay or something happened
Speaker 2: where he was quoting the wife and he shouldn't have
Speaker 2: or maybe because wives can't testify against husbands, like I'm
Speaker 2: not sure, but because of the testimony was thrown out.
Speaker 2: The defense attorney said there was no crime because the stepdaughter.
Speaker 3: Agreed to carry the child. So that's the defense. They're like,
Speaker 3: she agreed to have the baby, so how is it
Speaker 3: a cray?
Speaker 2: And so then Goff and her own mother, Narda, testified
Speaker 2: that this was the daughter's idea.
Speaker 3: But during the trial he had a boyfriend me while
Speaker 3: she had a boyfriend.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she really wanted to carry her stepdad's baby, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: got it?
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: And then during the trial, you know, this motherfucker was
Speaker 2: quoting Bible verses. He said he forgives everyone, including the judge, police, prosecutors,
Speaker 2: and his stepdaughter. But then finally April two thousand and six,
Speaker 2: they got to do a retrial and the jury convicted
Speaker 2: his ass of rape, sexual battery, and child and dangering.
Speaker 2: He got twenty years and then five more year for
Speaker 2: the rape and then five more for the abuse that
Speaker 2: was to be served concurrently, also, Judge Judith Hunter also
Speaker 2: ordered him to register as a sex offender when he
Speaker 2: does get released from prison.
Speaker 3: I mean, I bet he's gonna get released soon.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Narada Goff was convicted March two thousand and two of
Speaker 2: helping her husband impregnate her daughter. She was sentenced to
Speaker 2: three years, but she was released from prison in two
Speaker 2: thousand and three after only serving eight months. I think
Speaker 2: three years is too little. The fact that it was
Speaker 2: only eight months is like sickening to me. Grim At
Speaker 2: twenty had been diagnosed with PTS depression and she did
Speaker 2: have attempts to take her own life. Graham did file
Speaker 2: some civil suits, and in March eleventh, two thousand and five,
Speaker 2: that a Summit that the Summit County Jury ruled that
Speaker 2: Goff is liable for more than three point three million
Speaker 2: dollars in compensateor compensatory compensatory. Liable for three point three
Speaker 2: million dollars in compensateory. I can't it sounds like because
Speaker 2: repository to me, and I cannot say it compens say it.
Speaker 3: You can just say damages, compensatory.
Speaker 2: Compensaitory damages, and then seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars
Speaker 2: in punitive damages. The jury also ordered Akron City Hospital
Speaker 2: to pay two hundred and twenty four thousand dollars in
Speaker 2: damages since when they asked her who put who to
Speaker 2: put down? As the dad on the birth certificate. She
Speaker 2: did say her stepfather's name. They didn't do anything about it.
Speaker 2: Hospital records also show, Oh, it gets worse. Hospital records
Speaker 2: also showed that he made inappropriate comments during the delivery.
Speaker 2: I'm actually not going to repeat them here. They are
Speaker 2: vile versus heard it. The nurses also noticed a blank
Speaker 2: look on her face, flat affect in her voice. She
Speaker 2: was shaky and pale. They did nothing. She also sued,
Speaker 2: so I'm glad they owed her money. She also sued
Speaker 2: Summit County Children's Services Board for negligence, and according to
Speaker 2: court documents, the judge said he ruled CSB had no
Speaker 2: liability because the Ohio Revised Code gives immunity to government
Speaker 2: entities and we've covered that like child service agencies like
Speaker 2: can't be sued.
Speaker 3: And she's like that, it's pretty fucked up.
Speaker 2: Her lawyer, William Whittaker, who spoke on behalf of his clients,
Speaker 2: said that she feels vindicated and very happy with that
Speaker 2: jury's decision. I just hope her fiance and her are good,
Speaker 2: or she found something else in life, like I just
Speaker 2: wish the best for chef.
Speaker 3: She's happy. What a fucking nightmare, I mean like.
Speaker 1: I know everybody has, like you know, traumas and stuff
Speaker 1: like that, but it's like when people like get married
Speaker 1: and let like a man treat their child in a
Speaker 1: bad way kind of like no, what what, like it
Speaker 1: doesn't even you need a boyfriend that bad. I don't
Speaker 1: get it. I don't get it. I know we just
Speaker 1: are but he was probably.
Speaker 3: Abusing her too, and like, you know, there's a lot
Speaker 3: of yeah.
Speaker 2: We're also like liberal free women, and like a lot
Speaker 2: of times if you grow up in a really indoctrinated situation,
Speaker 2: like having a man is the number on the thing,
Speaker 2: and the man, if you're religious, is the head of
Speaker 2: the household. And when he says, goes like and to
Speaker 2: be able to procreate is your duty as a woman.
Speaker 2: And you know, so like there's just so much trauma
Speaker 2: and bullshit instilled in women that like, yeah, of course
Speaker 2: I can see them ending up serving and massage.
Speaker 3: I know I shouldn't blame I shouldn't blame the mom
Speaker 3: and no, it's a.
Speaker 2: Natural instinct to be like you should protect your fucking child.
Speaker 3: I feel I agree with you. I agree with you.
Speaker 3: I that's why.
Speaker 2: But you know, weren't we talking about it for like
Speaker 2: the Nardilique. Not not really, I'm forgetting her name. One of
Speaker 2: the child cases in New York where the mom got
Speaker 2: way more than the dad.
Speaker 4: Oh.
Speaker 3: Yes, because we're.
Speaker 2: Meaner to moms, because we do have an expectation of
Speaker 2: mothers that you care about your kid. We don't have
Speaker 2: expectations for dads. We know they're bad. They should be
Speaker 2: at work, they should be absent. I never changed a diaper,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like, but I understand the
Speaker 2: instinct to be like, how dare you not protect your
Speaker 2: child too?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: But also a girl don't. Also, girl, don't go to
Speaker 1: jail for a man. It was only eight months, but
Speaker 1: you still went to jail for a fucking man.
Speaker 2: But so I understand the instinct to be mad at
Speaker 2: the moms. But then I understand the fucked up way.
Speaker 2: So many women are brought up totally to honor men.
Speaker 1: So it's totally difficult case.
Speaker 2: I guess somewhere. So this is the case of Fred
Speaker 2: and Rosemary West.
Speaker 3: The Wests.
Speaker 2: They are sick, like I said, they're known as Britain's
Speaker 2: worst serial killers. This couple would prey on vulnerable young
Speaker 2: girls and women to play out sexual fantasies. Over a
Speaker 2: period of twenty years, they would rape, torture and murder
Speaker 2: in their house of Horror in Glouceschester, England.
Speaker 3: I think that's Gloucester, Glocester. It's just Gloucester, Gloucester, England.
Speaker 2: And there was abduction, satomasochistic torture, binding, and then after
Speaker 2: the murders, these women were dismembered and their bodies buried,
Speaker 2: very sexually sadistic, very fucked up.
Speaker 3: And of course both of.
Speaker 2: Them have very classic like killer vibes with roots going
Speaker 2: back to their childhood. So both of them were subjected
Speaker 2: to incest, both were abused, and so when they met
Speaker 2: it was the worst possible combination of all time. And yeah,
Speaker 2: and then when the authorities finally arrived and did all
Speaker 2: the work, they found the bodies of nine girls in
Speaker 2: the hall under the home, and then three other bodies
Speaker 2: were found later elsewhere where.
Speaker 3: I was just gonna say, do you watch Black Mirror?
Speaker 2: I am, I'm not a religious watcher. I've seen maybe
Speaker 2: thirty percent of it, if not less. Obviously I watched
Speaker 2: the Miley one, okay, and the Jared Goldstein.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because in the Jared Goldstein season, there is one
Speaker 1: where this couple goes to this house to.
Speaker 3: Make a documentary. If you've seen it, you've seen it.
Speaker 1: And I just really quickly googled it and it seems
Speaker 1: like there might be a connection between that episode and
Speaker 1: Fred and Rosemary West. So it immediately made me think
Speaker 1: of it. Just go on, No, that's yeah.
Speaker 2: So Anne McFall is to be believed as the first victim,
Speaker 2: and she was the fucking nanny to the kids from
Speaker 2: his first marriage. And this is really difficult. I hated
Speaker 2: this BBC article, but it did focus on the victims,
Speaker 2: which I feel oftentimes we focus so much on the
Speaker 2: killers and we forget like all these victims.
Speaker 3: So I wanted to go through it.
Speaker 2: But a lot of the information came from the biographer
Speaker 2: from Fred West. A lot of people wrote books about,
Speaker 2: you know, both of these killers, and the way they
Speaker 2: talk about the victims really irks me. And so it's
Speaker 2: from Fred West's account to this biographer who's also this man,
Speaker 2: but like, you know, according to him, she flirted with him.
Speaker 3: All the time.
Speaker 2: Oh right, right, you know, So, like this article really
Speaker 2: bothered me throughout. And yeah, they said that the nanny
Speaker 2: was very naive, she was eighteen. She did end up
Speaker 2: having a sexual relationship with Fred. When the wife would
Speaker 2: leave town, he then fathered her child, and then when
Speaker 2: she was pregnant, she disappeared.
Speaker 3: In May of nineteen sixty seven.
Speaker 2: Her body was found in a field near West's home
Speaker 2: village of Much Markel. I don't know, get over at
Speaker 2: England but in her a ford Shire. That's not real.
Speaker 2: Go back to Lord of the Rings. Okay, then the
Speaker 2: second victim, this is to be believed, you know, with
Speaker 2: all the things. So Catherine Cassello was born in Scotland
Speaker 2: and was his first wife and second victim. So when
Speaker 2: she married him in nineteen sixty two, she was already
Speaker 2: pregnant with another man's child, and then she gave birth
Speaker 2: in nineteen sixty three to that child, and then they
Speaker 2: had another child together. And like I said, I hated
Speaker 2: the reporting, but like the BBC also knew Jimmy Sevil
Speaker 2: was molesting kids and did nothing about it.
Speaker 3: This is not a great organization.
Speaker 2: I shouldn't be using them, but you know, they like
Speaker 2: they are, like, yeah, she was known to have a strong personality.
Speaker 2: She was tough and manipulative. And it's like he also
Speaker 2: killed twelve women. So like, I don't know if her
Speaker 2: being manipulative is relevant to murder.
Speaker 1: Like one of Jeffrey Dahmer's victims was like really annoying,
Speaker 1: like he would never pay for drinks, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, Like.
Speaker 3: Like for what? For what?
Speaker 2: These were women that were tortured and murdered and you
Speaker 2: have to say that, like you know they were Actually
Speaker 2: she was manipul so we get why she would be murdered.
Speaker 3: Like itis me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a misogyny. That's so fucking in there, damn right,
Speaker 1: fucking crazy. You have to talk shit about this woman
Speaker 1: even after she's been.
Speaker 2: Murdered by a serial killer, like her worst qualities. Like
Speaker 2: I'm sure she had some good qualities too, you could
Speaker 2: have mentioned. But she left him in nineteen sixty nine
Speaker 2: because there was violence and sexual abuse, and then her
Speaker 2: friends and family lost contact with her in nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 2: So then Fred went on and he met Rosemary West
Speaker 2: who was fifteen, and married her three years later, and
Speaker 2: when she was in nineteen seventy two, together they were
Speaker 2: jointly charged with the murder of the following ten victims.
Speaker 2: And I know you might think, oh, she was abused too,
Speaker 2: she was only fifteen. Nah, she's a dumb bitch too.
Speaker 2: So Charmaine West was one of Fred's daughters and her stepdaughter,
Speaker 2: and Rosemary hated the girl because she was rebellious and
Speaker 2: so basically he left town and she murdered his daughter.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So this isn't a situation where I hope I can
Speaker 2: go off of this. This is not a situation where
Speaker 2: uh oh he met her young like and.
Speaker 3: For her she seems like she was murderous.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so yep, she was eight years old when she
Speaker 2: disappeared in nineteen seventy one. And yeah, basically Rosemary murdered
Speaker 2: her while Fred was in prison for the theft of
Speaker 2: a car and vehicle tax stuff. So if she was
Speaker 2: forced to do anything, he would have been there or
Speaker 2: even a work this he was in prison, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: and she took the opportunity to kill his child, but
Speaker 2: when he was released, he'd inn't mind. He buried the
Speaker 2: body of his daughter beneath the kitchen window in their
Speaker 2: home in Midland Road in Gloucester. So then the next
Speaker 2: Venda victim is Linda Goff, and she lived in Gloucester
Speaker 2: as well with her family, and at nineteen years old
Speaker 2: in April nineteen seventy three, she vanished and her parents
Speaker 2: reported her miss Her remains were found in a former
Speaker 2: car inspection pit in a garage that had been converted
Speaker 2: into a bathroom in the West's next home at twenty
Speaker 2: five Cromwell Street.
Speaker 3: And they had lodgers in there.
Speaker 2: So I think that's how that connects to like that
Speaker 2: guy living yeah in an episode, like they did have.
Speaker 3: Lodgers in that house.
Speaker 2: The next victim was Carol Ann Cooper, and she was
Speaker 2: from Bedfordshire and later lived in Worcester. I think the
Speaker 2: sauce right is that it No, that's Worcestershires.
Speaker 1: Yeah, ok, pronounced I don't know in Massachusetts that's pronounced Worlster.
Speaker 3: But I don't know about in England. I'm sorry, I
Speaker 3: know it to our British listeners.
Speaker 2: I know our poor English people were butchering everything. You
Speaker 2: can send me hateful DMS if you'd like, But so
Speaker 2: then so Carol Anne Cooper. At the time she disappeared
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy three, she was staying at the Pines
Speaker 2: children It's home. She was given permission to spend the
Speaker 2: weekend with her grandmother, and she disappeared after boarding a
Speaker 2: bus back to the children's home following a night out.
Speaker 2: On November tenth, her body was found buried underneath the
Speaker 2: cellar at twenty five Cromwell. Lucy Partington was a clever
Speaker 2: woman and she attended Exeter University and on the twentieth
Speaker 2: of December in nineteen seventy three, she returned home for
Speaker 2: Christmas and then the twenty one year old disappeared two
Speaker 2: days later after leaving a friend's house. It's thought she
Speaker 2: was waiting for a bus and the wests picked her
Speaker 2: up near her home and then her mother did report
Speaker 2: her missing. Big search and her you know, remains here.
Speaker 2: They got away with it for over twenty plus years.
Speaker 1: Like, I mean, there's also this like Ken and Barbie
Speaker 1: killer thing where or like the Sebastian Martin short episode
Speaker 1: where it's like it's a man and a wife.
Speaker 3: What could possibly happen to me?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, so I'm telling you everyone at once, but
Speaker 2: like and when on how they were found and whatnot.
Speaker 2: But they got away with these crimes for twenty plus years.
Speaker 2: They did not So this was all in the seventies
Speaker 2: and there was no justice till the nineties. But her
Speaker 2: remains were found at twenty five Cromwell, beneath the floor
Speaker 2: of the cellar. The next victim is Terse Seagenthaler, and
Speaker 2: she was a Swiss born student. She was twenty one
Speaker 2: years old at London College. She also worked at a
Speaker 2: ballet's shoe shop, and she disappeared on eastern nineteen seventy four,
Speaker 2: having set out hitchhiking to visit a friend in Ireland
Speaker 2: who was a priest.
Speaker 3: She never reached her destination.
Speaker 2: And my thing was like, how were they at all
Speaker 2: these locations and all these places and ready to attack
Speaker 2: all the time, like the planning and all of it,
Speaker 2: and their methods are I don't know.
Speaker 3: It's like it's all over the place.
Speaker 2: So her her remains, like I said, were found many
Speaker 2: years later, also under the floorboards in the cellar at
Speaker 2: twenty five Cromwell. Shirley Hubbard was fifteen and attended high school.
Speaker 2: At the time of her disappearance November fourteenth, nineteen seventy four.
Speaker 2: She left work to go home and was never seen again.
Speaker 2: No trace of her was found she as well under
Speaker 2: the cellar.
Speaker 3: Oh my God.
Speaker 2: Janita Mott born in nineteen fifty seven and then in
Speaker 2: April nineteen seventy five she was eighteen years old and
Speaker 2: she left her Nuwant address and is believed to have
Speaker 2: traveled to Gloucester, but she vanished the day before a
Speaker 2: friend's wedding. It was not reported to police, but the
Speaker 2: family did contact the Missing Persons Bureau and the media,
Speaker 2: and her remains were also found at twenty five Cromwell.
Speaker 2: Shirley Anne Robinson lodged with Fred and Rosemary and became
Speaker 2: Fred West's lover and conceived a child with him, and
Speaker 2: when she was eight months pregnant, was the last time
Speaker 2: she was ever seen.
Speaker 3: In May of nineteen seventy eight, her.
Speaker 2: Body and the body of the unborn child were found
Speaker 2: buried in the garden at the West's home.
Speaker 1: So so far he's killed two pregnant women. So unlike
Speaker 1: the guy from the episode, he does not want these
Speaker 1: kids now they're just popping out from the result of
Speaker 1: being a psychopathy.
Speaker 3: And yeah, it's evil.
Speaker 2: Alison Chambers was born in West Germany, later moved to
Speaker 2: Swansea and then you know she was quote unquote rebellious
Speaker 2: as well, very mouthy and stubborn. It's like, why would
Speaker 2: you write that in like a victim article. It's sickening,
Speaker 2: it's crazy, but she went to go live in a
Speaker 2: children's home in Gloucester and was a known visitor to
Speaker 2: twenty five Cromwell. And she disappeared in August nineteen seventy nine,
Speaker 2: shortly before her seventeenth birthday, and her remains were found
Speaker 2: in the garden at twenty five Cromwell. I mean, I
Speaker 2: don't know how many times like a lot of Cromwell. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Heather West Yes, one of their children. Heather was the
Speaker 2: first child of Fred and Rosemary, born in Gloucester on
Speaker 2: October seventeenth, nineteen seventy and this obviously just shows the
Speaker 2: even more depths of the evil of this couple. She
Speaker 2: was sixteen years old and she was murdered in nineteen
Speaker 2: eighty seven. Her body was the first that was found
Speaker 2: at twenty five Cromwell and is believed to be the
Speaker 2: last victim of their killing spree. She lived with her
Speaker 2: family in Midland wrote until nineteen seventy two, and then
Speaker 2: they all moved to this Cromwell place. Her and her
Speaker 2: sister tried to protect each other from their father and
Speaker 2: this biographer, mister Wanzell, said that he believed she had
Speaker 2: threatened to go to the police about her father's sexual abuse,
Speaker 2: and that's when she went missing. Her parents never reported
Speaker 2: her disappearance because they knew she was buried under the
Speaker 2: garden patio. And the patterns are it's like group home, hitchhiking,
Speaker 2: traveling buses, not close with their families. They did know
Speaker 2: what they were doing. Even though I'm confused about the
Speaker 2: scope and finding stuff, I guess it is more simple
Speaker 2: than I'm making it. And then how do they get
Speaker 2: away with it for so long? And it's most of
Speaker 2: the victims were in the seventies. That stuff didn't get
Speaker 2: uncovered till nineteen ninety two. So how they got uncovered
Speaker 2: was the West's five remaining children were taken into local
Speaker 2: authority care because of child abuse allegations against their parents.
Speaker 2: There was also a family joke that they kept repeating
Speaker 2: that their sister was buried under the patio. And then finally,
Speaker 2: in the summer of nineteen ninety three, the police were
Speaker 2: told about the concerns stemming from the jokes.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So once they were taken in, Fred's story kept changing.
Speaker 2: Rose denied any knowledge about it, but then they found
Speaker 2: two femurs in the yard and Fred Slart slowly started
Speaker 2: confessing to the killings and was taken back to the
Speaker 2: house and pointed all the.
Speaker 3: Spots where all the bodies were.
Speaker 2: These bodies were found dismembered, stuffed into vertical holes in
Speaker 2: the ground and with trophy. Body parts such as kneecaps
Speaker 2: and finger bones were removed and have never been found.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: The property was demolished after the search. The search continued
Speaker 2: to the old property. And obviously this was a massive story.
Speaker 2: Many people have written books about both of the monsters
Speaker 2: and this case really did put a cloud over a Gloucester,
Speaker 2: which was a small town.
Speaker 3: Doonet cared about. And now this is the legacy.
Speaker 2: And he was charged with twelve counts of murder, but
Speaker 2: sadly he did kill himself at fifty three before he
Speaker 2: could stand trial, and he took a ton of secrets
Speaker 2: to the grave with him that have haunted the country
Speaker 2: for decades.
Speaker 3: So we have no information.
Speaker 2: He was found in his Remann cell on January first,
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five, was convicted of ten counts of murder
Speaker 2: in November nineteen ninety five. She had no outward reaction
Speaker 2: when the guilty verdict was delivered.
Speaker 3: She did try to appeal. Lol, it did not work.
Speaker 2: She will remain in prison until she dies at HM Prison,
Speaker 2: new Hall Flocked in West Yorkshire. She still claims she
Speaker 2: is innocent and has not revealed anything about the case
Speaker 2: over the years. Experts do believe there are more victims
Speaker 2: because like, they just don't believe they were they would
Speaker 2: have been able to take as long of a break
Speaker 2: as they did, but they will never get any information
Speaker 2: unless maybe.
Speaker 1: Like they must have picked another hiding place for the eighties,
Speaker 1: Like I'm sure they killed throughout the eighties and they
Speaker 1: just found another hiding spot.
Speaker 3: Yeah right, Like, oh my god, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: That episode of Black Mirror, by the way, is called
Speaker 1: Locke Henry and it is terrifying, so check it out.
Speaker 3: But this reminded me of it. Fuck, what is happening?
Speaker 1: Yeah, crazy, crazy people just want to bury things in
Speaker 1: their own houses when there is so much forest out there. Anyway,
Speaker 1: we've got a great guest. Thank you for doing all
Speaker 1: that research and telling us about all those horrific crimes.
Speaker 1: Let's get to our interview. Our guest today has since
Speaker 1: retired from acting, but is known for some iconic roles,
Speaker 1: like from the very horrifying scene in The Ring or
Speaker 1: from the fantastical, a little princess, but you know her
Speaker 1: today as the victim of a truly fucked up family situation.
Speaker 1: Jackie Landrix. Please enjoy our chat with the lovely Rachel Bella.
Speaker 2: We are thrilled you're here. This is a very fucked
Speaker 2: up episode.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so it's just a little yeah. Yeah. How old
Speaker 3: were you when you shot it?
Speaker 6: Eighteen?
Speaker 3: Were you playing fifteen?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you knew it was fucked You were reading
Speaker 2: it being like, oh my god, oh.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: I mean it wasn't my first like fucked up, you
Speaker 5: know role that I was reading for.
Speaker 6: So yeah, I was like, no big.
Speaker 2: Deal, You've done a lot of the dark the dark
Speaker 2: Yeah gee yeah exactly.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So yeah, Like where were you in your like career
Speaker 1: when this SVU thing came along? Do you remember auditioning
Speaker 1: for it?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 3: What? Yes?
Speaker 5: So I had I think I had already. Yeah, I
Speaker 5: had done like the Ring. I was a child actress,
Speaker 5: so I had been working since I was like nine,
Speaker 5: and I grew up in New York but had lived
Speaker 5: in LA since I was like twelve and so or
Speaker 5: no even younger than that. But uh, they, I guess
Speaker 5: had trouble casting this episode. I don't know exactly why,
Speaker 5: but Dick Wolf ended up going to LA and searching
Speaker 5: for actresses for this role, and he met me one
Speaker 5: time and was like, you're at and blew me out
Speaker 5: to your interesting So.
Speaker 3: It wasn't you had Dick Wolf himself. That's cool.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I don't think we've ever talked to anybody
Speaker 1: that said they got the role directly from Dick Wolf.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I was. I was impressed.
Speaker 5: I was like, because I had grown up watching lawn Orders,
Speaker 5: so I was like, oh my god, I'm freak out.
Speaker 2: But yeah, he was really nice. Well you were, but
Speaker 2: you were booked and busy as a kid. I mean
Speaker 2: you were, you were out there booking, you.
Speaker 6: Were Yeah, yeah, comparatively Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I took a little break, but then yeah, around seventeen
Speaker 5: eighteen I started working again.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And once you get to say, I mean, what we're
Speaker 2: wondering is what do you remember.
Speaker 3: What subway stop that was?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 2: How was it filming on the subway where people like
Speaker 2: heading to work? Did they rent the platform? What are
Speaker 2: the deeds?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was kind of crazy. They rented that whole
Speaker 5: area out, like the entrance to that side of the subway,
Speaker 5: and every body in. There were extras and like going
Speaker 5: through the platform.
Speaker 6: Everything, they were all extras.
Speaker 5: I think Dick Like we had a woman director, but
Speaker 5: I think Dick Wolf came in and directed that part.
Speaker 6: I don't know why. He was like.
Speaker 5: Randomly at the set a lot and I think it
Speaker 5: was in Chelsea. I don't know where it was supposed
Speaker 5: to be, but we were in Chelsea. Yeah, and they
Speaker 5: closed down the whole thing and it was just it
Speaker 5: was a I can't remember, like the four I think,
Speaker 5: and it was just the express to go through. And
Speaker 5: they even asked me, they were like, do you want
Speaker 5: to have like a stunt double do the like jumping
Speaker 5: towards the train. I was like, no, do and they
Speaker 5: put me in like a cord thing and I was like.
Speaker 6: No, fear. I don't know now, I'm like, oh my God, would.
Speaker 5: Never do that.
Speaker 1: But so like a real train comes by and everything
Speaker 1: and then they just yank you with a cord around
Speaker 1: your midsection almost exactly.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I thought it was awesome. I'm stressed, I.
Speaker 2: Know, right, And you didn't have you were eighteen already.
Speaker 2: Because we always with child actors, we asked like, how
Speaker 2: were your parents behaving on set?
Speaker 5: You know what I mean, right, No, I actually had
Speaker 5: so this is really embarrassing. I was very like co dependent,
Speaker 5: as you know, when I was younger, so I always
Speaker 5: had a boyfriend with me.
Speaker 6: And at the time I was dating this guy who
Speaker 6: was about nineteen years older than me WOA, and he
Speaker 6: did not like me jumping in front of the train.
Speaker 6: He did like he was on set, like staring at me.
Speaker 5: Apparently I was oblivious eighteen, you know, like, but everyone
Speaker 5: was like, I don't like him. Like Marishka literally told me.
Speaker 5: She told me a side and she's like, I don't
Speaker 5: like the way he's looking at you. I don't like him.
Speaker 5: Get away from him. I was like, okay, did you
Speaker 5: listen to I mean eventually, not right away, a little quicker,
Speaker 5: but yeah, she was right.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: How was it with Marishka and Maloney?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 5: They were great. I mean Marishka was definitely more like chatty.
Speaker 5: I remember at one point she was talking about her haircut.
Speaker 5: I don't know how much before that she had gotten
Speaker 5: her haircut, but pretty recently, and she was talking about
Speaker 5: how she almost got fired and she had been crying,
Speaker 5: I guess, but she.
Speaker 6: Was like, but it was okay in the end, and
Speaker 6: oh yes, heason four. She left it out.
Speaker 3: She did like do the pixie and that. Yeah, it
Speaker 3: was really sure.
Speaker 6: Moment, you know, yeah, yeah, yes, exactly.
Speaker 2: Well I like that she got involved. When did you
Speaker 2: break up with this person?
Speaker 6: Probably two months later?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, if you don't have them, if you don't
Speaker 1: have the Olivia Benson steal of approval, I don't think
Speaker 1: you can like keep nating somebody.
Speaker 3: Yeah right, yeah.
Speaker 6: She knew, she knew she was smarter than me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, especially on that set. You know, they're on top
Speaker 2: of they're on top.
Speaker 5: Of all that, I know, right, Yeah, so she was
Speaker 5: super like sweet and I didn't have a ton of
Speaker 5: scenes with her.
Speaker 6: Most of my scenes were with Chris I guess.
Speaker 3: Well yeah, you guys got I mean you like cried
Speaker 3: in his arms.
Speaker 1: Right, But like also that scene where you're originally acting
Speaker 1: kind of like baby ish, like a child, and then
Speaker 1: you suddenly like very vamp and like, well yeah, but
Speaker 1: I mean it's a great scene for showing how like
Speaker 1: fucked up this girl mentally has sucked her up, you know,
Speaker 1: Like but when you're like coming on to Christopher Maloney,
Speaker 1: how was that scene as like it when you're supposed
Speaker 1: to be fifteen, so it's like creepy.
Speaker 6: Yeah. No, I thought it was totally creepy.
Speaker 5: I mean I think my boyfriend at the time was
Speaker 5: like his age too, so I didn't want him to
Speaker 5: think that there.
Speaker 6: Was like any weird.
Speaker 5: I was just like I thought of him because I
Speaker 5: had seen him on shows growing up, and so I
Speaker 5: thought of him as like a fatherly type figure or
Speaker 5: something like that. And I just it was it was
Speaker 5: really awkward and really hard for me. Like I remember
Speaker 5: we had to do that scene a ton of times
Speaker 5: because I did not want to be.
Speaker 6: Sexy towards him. Like it's just felt so awkward and weird.
Speaker 2: But well, I like I did see that the director
Speaker 2: was a woman, and I feel like I like that Joyce.
Speaker 6: Yeah, she was really good.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I liked her a lot because we do hear that
Speaker 2: it's like a go, go go, So I'm glad that
Speaker 2: you were able to do you know, yes, take your
Speaker 2: time with those scenes and stuff.
Speaker 5: That scene I actually got some time. Everything else was
Speaker 5: like go as fast as possible. Yeah, They're all like
Speaker 5: even though this was like early on in the show,
Speaker 5: everyone on the.
Speaker 6: Set was just like you know, experts at it. Yeah,
Speaker 6: it was great.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Do any other episodes stick out to you since you're
Speaker 2: a watcher of SV we like to call like our haunting.
Speaker 3: Episodes or episodes. Yeah you get excited.
Speaker 5: By Honestly, there's one right around mine, either right after
Speaker 5: maybe mine. I can't remember the name of it, but
Speaker 5: it's this younger girl around like eighteen or nineteen. She's blonde,
Speaker 5: and she has like a younger sister that she oh damaged.
Speaker 3: Yes, she gives the damage. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: yeah exactly. You're trying to scare me. I'm already dead. Yeah,
Speaker 3: we love that one. Oh my god. I was like,
Speaker 3: oh damn, that is like, well other level. Yeah, that one.
Speaker 6: Always stuck with me.
Speaker 2: I am so I'm so pumped that that's the one
Speaker 2: you mentioned. I'm like, I'm really happy.
Speaker 6: That's a great up.
Speaker 5: I mean, there are so many that stick out, but
Speaker 5: I always remember that when I was like, oh wow,
Speaker 5: like that.
Speaker 1: We talked to Ari for our podcast for that one,
Speaker 1: and she was cool.
Speaker 3: That was so cool.
Speaker 2: So what have you been up to or did you
Speaker 2: like what made you kind of, you know, pivot.
Speaker 3: Away from like acting and stuff.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I quit because I had my son and then
Speaker 5: my ex husband I had to leave. Uh, he was
Speaker 5: having some issues, and so I needed to get like
Speaker 5: a job where I knew I had a paycheck.
Speaker 6: I could have rent, you know. Unfortunately it's so unreliable.
Speaker 3: It just is.
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, no, it can. It can definitely.
Speaker 5: And if you're in like living paycheck to paycheck, which
Speaker 5: I was close to it, I was like, I can't
Speaker 5: do this.
Speaker 6: So I went back to school. I became a paralegal.
Speaker 6: And I was a paralegal for a long time.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, So do you when you watch you
Speaker 2: or different shows like that, or even listen to my
Speaker 2: favorite murderer, you you know about.
Speaker 5: I do, well, I know some of it because I
Speaker 5: worked at a law firm that did like divorce and
Speaker 5: custody and stuff. So I like there were some crazy
Speaker 5: stuff that we had to deal with. And I do
Speaker 5: know like a lot about like restraining orders and stuff
Speaker 5: like that. So I definitely when I see shows about things,
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh, they're not they're not saying that rider,
Speaker 5: they didn't use the ride. They would never get a
Speaker 5: restraining order for that, Like yeah, it kind of Yeah.
Speaker 1: Because we were recently talking about is how like in
Speaker 1: some states you can't get a divorce when you're pregnant. What.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just part of it's part of the new
Speaker 2: kind of conservative vibe that's happened, an attack on women
Speaker 2: that's happening in our country, but I think it was
Speaker 2: Missouri and a few other places.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you're pregnant, you can't get a divorce.
Speaker 6: Oh that is insane.
Speaker 3: Yeah, totally.
Speaker 6: That sounds like it's like a law from like one
Speaker 6: two hundred years.
Speaker 1: I mean, well those are those are coming back into
Speaker 1: fashion Arizona.
Speaker 2: They brought one back from what eighteen sixty four, like
Speaker 2: eighteen eighty or something.
Speaker 1: Yeah, insane, so scary. Do people still like text you
Speaker 1: when your SVU comes on? Like you're on the assay
Speaker 1: network right now.
Speaker 5: It's funny because that's probably what people message me the
Speaker 5: most about on like Facebook or tags.
Speaker 6: They'll be like, I just thought your nee or out
Speaker 6: of you afull They're.
Speaker 3: Still getting those checks.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's not that much anymore, but yeah, sure,
Speaker 5: yeah they come.
Speaker 6: I'm glad.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I want to know how rich Marishka is so bad?
Speaker 6: Oh she has gotta be.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's playing lot several hundred channels at the
Speaker 1: same time at all times.
Speaker 6: Like it's I mean, she's got to be just stat forever.
Speaker 1: H No, I think she easily could stop working, never
Speaker 1: work another day in her life.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what do you like?
Speaker 1: Do you have any other like memories of the set,
Speaker 1: like any other little funny stories or iced tea munch Anybody.
Speaker 5: I see was very like down to business, nice but
Speaker 5: not like he didn't really plan, like, you know, talk
Speaker 5: to me a whole lot. Yeah, I think only like
Speaker 5: one or two scenes around each other.
Speaker 6: And he was like, hey, what's up?
Speaker 3: How you doing?
Speaker 6: And the yeah, I mean Chris was Oh. The one
Speaker 6: thing Marishka kept talking about, which was funny.
Speaker 5: She kept saying that she started doing what is it
Speaker 5: called colonics.
Speaker 6: And she was like she was pushing me.
Speaker 5: She was like, so good for you. It is awesome.
Speaker 5: You've got to do it. You feel so much better after.
Speaker 5: I'm like, okay, I didn't know what it was at
Speaker 5: the time. You know, there was you know, internet was
Speaker 5: not what it is today, and I was like, I
Speaker 5: don't know what Okay, I don't any right, I was
Speaker 5: not up to Yeah, I didn't know what she was
Speaker 5: talking about. But at the time I was like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 5: I'll look into it. And Chris kept laughing and he's like, no,
Speaker 5: I'm not doing that.
Speaker 6: And then I looked it.
Speaker 3: Up later and I was like, oh, that's what she
Speaker 3: was about.
Speaker 6: I couldn't know at the time.
Speaker 1: I will say, Marishka's on trend because those were like
Speaker 1: kind of having a moment in the two thousands. Like
Speaker 1: a girl I went to high school with did an
Speaker 1: article for Playboy about doing a date to get a klonic,
Speaker 1: like going with a guy to get a klonic together
Speaker 1: and then afterwards going to have like a really decadent
Speaker 1: meal and stuff like. So that was like a hot
Speaker 1: thing people were doing at that time.
Speaker 3: That is so funny.
Speaker 6: That is hilarious. Yeah, so I always remember that. I
Speaker 6: thought that was really fun. She was like promoting it
Speaker 6: to me and Chris.
Speaker 2: I feel like she likes you, Colonix. She got really
Speaker 2: deep about your your boyfriend. I mean she yea, she
Speaker 2: was giving me advice. She was sweet. No, I really
Speaker 2: liked her. I always remembered her.
Speaker 6: Yeah, time aunt her hair. Yeah, she was really sweet.
Speaker 5: And I'm not that outgoing, like I'm kind of shy first,
Speaker 5: so I would like, I was so glad that she
Speaker 5: was so nice to me.
Speaker 3: What also works with the character the shyness, right, it
Speaker 3: does help.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you had a.
Speaker 3: Big secret and you know, and you knew that your
Speaker 3: dad was scary. Yeah, yeah, tough. I did. Also, we
Speaker 3: stalk on IMDb. Obviously we do our work.
Speaker 2: But it says you were born in South Dakota, and
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you didn't stay in South Dakota. You
Speaker 2: famously meet the Dakota's on this podcast.
Speaker 5: Me too.
Speaker 6: You're against the I am too.
Speaker 3: The places I've never been and I know.
Speaker 2: But nobody goes There's what I mean, there's never a concert.
Speaker 3: If you look on.
Speaker 2: Any band, comedian, anyone's tour, no one's going to the Dakota.
Speaker 3: They don't stop it.
Speaker 5: They don't, no, no, no, I have you know, my
Speaker 5: dad still lives there, who I don't really talk to.
Speaker 5: And then I have a bunch of half sisters and
Speaker 5: cousins and like you know, nieces, and they all live there.
Speaker 5: I've not gone back since I was like eleven. My
Speaker 5: sisters come out here to visit.
Speaker 3: Of course.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, what are we going to do in the
Speaker 1: Dakotas after we see Mount Rushmore?
Speaker 3: What are we gonna do? Right? And Sturgist, I guess
Speaker 3: if you're a biker.
Speaker 5: Well, my dad loves Sturgis. Yeah there's that, oh he is, yes,
Speaker 5: yeah six Sturgiss.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so wait, talk to us about being in the ring.
Speaker 3: I saw that movie in the theater. It was I
Speaker 3: didn't find I saw it made me go yeah, oh,
Speaker 3: I remember screaming.
Speaker 2: And then of course there was one girl with us
Speaker 2: that kept be like I wasn't even scared, and it's like, Okay,
Speaker 2: you're a dumb bitch and I hate you, like we.
Speaker 3: Those are the best girls.
Speaker 6: Wasn't even scared. I didn't care.
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 3: I was.
Speaker 1: I was like, why did you make me come to this?
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have a panic attack, Like I'm god, but
Speaker 1: I'm a.
Speaker 3: Real scaredy cat.
Speaker 2: Did everyone think you were so cool like in school
Speaker 2: or in their life, like to be in such a
Speaker 2: big hit movie kind.
Speaker 5: Of you know, I wasn't in school anymore. I had
Speaker 5: tested out, I had graduated already, I was going to
Speaker 5: like college per time. So you know, it was just
Speaker 5: basically my close friends who like, you know, they already
Speaker 5: like me, and.
Speaker 6: So I couldn't really take their you know, their compliments.
Speaker 3: Seriously, we have you shown your kids a little princess.
Speaker 5: You know, I showed my twins because one is a girl,
Speaker 5: and the boys don't want to watch a little princess.
Speaker 6: That's like not on their thing. They're not that's not cool.
Speaker 6: So my daughter liked it.
Speaker 5: I still liked it too, but they didn't recognize me
Speaker 5: in the movie, which so funny because it looks too sad.
Speaker 5: I mean, it's me, but they were like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 5: that girl kind of looks like you. I didn't tell
Speaker 5: them because I wanted them to be like, oh, look,
Speaker 5: it's mom.
Speaker 6: But they didn't. I was like, it is man. They
Speaker 6: were like, no, it's not.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and so I don't think they understand that, like
Speaker 5: most moms are not in like movies randomly or TV shows,
Speaker 5: but you know, they'll figure it out.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That's kind of one of the main things that like actors,
Speaker 2: uh talk about on late night where so, yeah, my
Speaker 2: kid doesn't think I'm cool. They don't like how superhero
Speaker 2: I am. They're disrespect to me constantly, and.
Speaker 1: That's good, right, Yeah, but then it's like then it's
Speaker 1: like actors will do an animated show so their kids
Speaker 1: think it's cool, but then kids don't really like put
Speaker 1: it together, like I'll say, oh, that's you know, that person's.
Speaker 3: Voice on a thing. They're like, what, like they don't really.
Speaker 6: Get that, you know, No, it's not connection.
Speaker 3: When you just simply can't win with these children.
Speaker 2: Well, because my niece and nephews are tines and like
Speaker 2: they just really they really disrespect me in a way.
Speaker 3: I can't imagine.
Speaker 6: You're just not the cool ants.
Speaker 2: They're not responding to texts I try to connect, they're
Speaker 2: just I mean, sometimes they will, but it's quick.
Speaker 1: I think she is the cool ant. They just are
Speaker 1: playing it cool. They are trying to play it cool.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I think you're cool.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think that.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 2: My little nephew's always just like, yeah, I want stability
Speaker 2: in a house.
Speaker 3: Thanks, Like they're just not like my lifestyle.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, he wants to be on you know,
Speaker 2: Wall Street. He's kind of a bro. My youngest one,
Speaker 2: Oh that's hilarious. How old is sixteen? So mine are
Speaker 2: like my sister's kids are sixteen, eighteen, and twenty one.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah yeah, and they just are out and about.
Speaker 2: I was like, do you want to come visit New York?
Speaker 2: They're like, no, thanks, are serious.
Speaker 1: That's the funny, so insane, Like I would be like,
Speaker 1: I'm I'll be there tomorrow.
Speaker 6: Seriously with my aunt. Yeah, seriously, I'd be all over that.
Speaker 2: That's hilarious, you know what. And I wonder if it's
Speaker 2: the same for parents. Probably, Like I, you know, I've
Speaker 2: known them their whole lives, and the two memories they
Speaker 2: always remember is when I kind of like I called
Speaker 2: Jimmy Johnson and said the bread is stale and you
Speaker 2: better send more bread. Like that's the story. They're like,
Speaker 2: that's our ant, or like one time I had road rage,
Speaker 2: And those are the two things they bring up times.
Speaker 6: Remember, No, I know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that when you fuck up is when they're like,
Speaker 5: hey remember that.
Speaker 3: Memory.
Speaker 2: I'm like our trips to the mall nothing, I'm like
Speaker 2: all these fun meals, adventures, mini golf.
Speaker 3: You just remember when I yelled at Jimmy John's Yeah
Speaker 3: that's the Yeah, Yeah, I think that's that's the same
Speaker 3: for parents as well, that's for sure.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I'm like, even you remember when I took you to Disneyland.
Speaker 6: He's like, no, but I remember that time like my
Speaker 6: Grandma's throwing.
Speaker 5: Dishes, Like what what you remember?
Speaker 6: It's just you know, that's what the that's what they like.
Speaker 3: You know, what are we gonna do? Thank you so
Speaker 3: much for so far. This is great.
Speaker 6: Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: The second people find out about Marishka and the Colonix,
Speaker 1: you're gonna be in top.
Speaker 3: A top guests. Thank you so much for taking the time.
Speaker 2: If you've listened, like usually, people are like, she's a queen,
Speaker 2: she's a goddess, she's an angel, and it's nice to
Speaker 2: know she was getting colonnas as well.
Speaker 5: Yeah, she's a human angel, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 5: she worked on ourselves.
Speaker 3: That was fun.
Speaker 2: Oh boy, oh boy, Well yeah no, it wasn't fun.
Speaker 2: I apologize. It's like, I don't know. The episodes are
Speaker 2: such a journey where the episode like our episodes because
Speaker 2: the episode is like I don't know, it's just why
Speaker 2: I tune into s VU just fucked up twists and turns.
Speaker 2: The real crime is really upsetting. I don't like any
Speaker 2: of it. And then she was a she was amazing adult.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I love when we get I love these journame palette
Speaker 1: cleansing guests. After these fucked, very truly fucked up crimes
Speaker 1: were like, let's talk to a nice person. It is
Speaker 1: the worst crimes yes, yes, And I don't know what's
Speaker 1: our post mortem takeaway from resilience. We need to disabuse
Speaker 1: men of the notion that they need to continue their bloodline.
Speaker 3: They absolutely do not, like these.
Speaker 1: Disgusting crazy men do not need to keep procreating and like, no, and.
Speaker 2: I forgot who brought this up to me, but it
Speaker 2: was like or maybe it was event on this pod.
Speaker 2: But we don't too generate, like your great grandparents. I
Speaker 2: don't know my great grandparents' names. I know nothing about them,
Speaker 2: like after two generations it is done, like this idea
Speaker 2: that you will continue on and people like it's delusional.
Speaker 3: You don't know your great grandparents.
Speaker 2: Who the fuck's gonna care about you unless you really
Speaker 2: invented you know, penicillin.
Speaker 3: But I don't even know that guy's name.
Speaker 1: Unless you invented penicillin. Oh my god, we don't know
Speaker 1: that guy. Who is it?
Speaker 2: We don't know these people like get over yourselves, Like
Speaker 2: it's fine. You can just go with the wind Pocahonta style.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yes, you can paint with all the colors of
Speaker 1: the wind, focus on Polkanta style.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, this hunger just hit me in a way.
Speaker 1: But in both of these episode and true crime. I'm
Speaker 1: always just like and I think that the women to
Speaker 1: a certain extent are victims because you know, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of ways which in which I'm not trap them.
Speaker 2: But no, not m not Rosemary West right, No, Rosemary
Speaker 2: fucking killed his kid. She killed her stepdaughter, which she
Speaker 2: was annoying he was out of town.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wanted to believe. Angie Landrix was like,
Speaker 1: I was just doing what my husband told me to do.
Speaker 1: But she's fucked to like, come on, come on, lady, Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: she is fucked.
Speaker 2: They're all fucked. She is a killer. And it's like
Speaker 2: people get together that want to be Ferby's. I'm sure
Speaker 2: the people that want to do this are furries, not.
Speaker 3: Find each other.
Speaker 2: Yeah, people want to be Ferbies Furries, yes, Furries or
Speaker 2: star Trek like people will find each other. So it's like,
Speaker 2: but how do you Yeah, it's just these people are sick,
Speaker 2: and I wanted him to suffer more.
Speaker 3: All these guys also get off.
Speaker 2: They all but also like you're keeping the what it
Speaker 2: was it the kneecaps like there was weird.
Speaker 3: Oh god, yeah, it's like fingers. Yeah, well, and then the.
Speaker 2: Bosh also just does a great job acting where it's
Speaker 2: like the arrogance of these guys even when you're so caught,
Speaker 2: it's beyond caught. We have the woman's head or whatever,
Speaker 2: or like bought a torso it's like he still thinks
Speaker 2: he's gonna somehow weasel his way out of a consequence.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he is so good.
Speaker 1: I mean because like a Bosh, he's like a good guy,
Speaker 1: you know, and then in this he's so evil. And
Speaker 1: then later he comes back where he's like the evil
Speaker 1: lawyer and there's like the he sexually assaults that other
Speaker 1: lawyer and it's like, you know, we.
Speaker 3: Don't back and get Bosh. We got to get Bosh.
Speaker 1: If you've got the tightest wall of her connect please
Speaker 1: let us know people have been if you know anyone
Speaker 1: that's been on us for you messages, because people have
Speaker 1: been messaging us and we've been We've we've booked a
Speaker 1: couple of guests from people knowing people.
Speaker 3: So we appreciate it. We appreciate you guys keeping a
Speaker 3: look out again.
Speaker 1: Friends of Ludaicress, friends of Joan Cusack. We need you
Speaker 1: to rise up. Is that a Barbara streisand song or no.
Speaker 3: People who people who love People.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's called People by by a Barbari Streisand yes, okay, great, great,
Speaker 1: yeah yeah, I heard her like book is the greatest
Speaker 1: thing ever. I would love to maybe listen to it.
Speaker 3: I'm done pretending.
Speaker 2: I just tell people I don't read now, and some
Speaker 2: people are not impressed.
Speaker 3: They don't like that. But I'm done. I'm done.
Speaker 2: I am done pretending I do not read except when
Speaker 2: there's research involved.
Speaker 1: Yes, and then you're reading Baby, and then you're getting There, Kansas,
Speaker 1: then you're getting Wichita Eagle read there.
Speaker 2: Yes, there is an author and someone I follow online
Speaker 2: that I wanted to support, but I was like, I'm
Speaker 2: not buying another book, So I just bought it for
Speaker 2: my niece for her birthday.
Speaker 3: Oh nice. Let me know how it is.
Speaker 1: I buy a lot of my friends books, and I
Speaker 1: can't say I read all of them, but I keep
Speaker 1: them and I buy them and I put them out
Speaker 1: for display.
Speaker 2: Yes, this isn't a friend, this is someone I follow
Speaker 2: on the internet.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, but you know, I'm just saying I don't
Speaker 1: read everybody's books that I like. Someone Will I'm friends
Speaker 1: with will be like, well, you know that part in
Speaker 1: my book and I'm like, yes, I do, tell me,
Speaker 1: remind me because I can't read everybody's book.
Speaker 3: As I said, I think I've read three books since
Speaker 3: I hade kids.
Speaker 1: All right, should we scooch on over to our what
Speaker 1: would Sister Peg do for this week? This is our
Speaker 1: weekly segment where we give you guys, point you to
Speaker 1: an organization, a book, a blog post, a blog post
Speaker 1: like it's two thousand and one, no like a article,
Speaker 1: a podcast, episodes, something to give you more info about
Speaker 1: what we talked about this week. And obviously I felt
Speaker 1: for the children in this episode who were part of
Speaker 1: this extremely fucked up family, and so I wanted to
Speaker 1: point you guys to the Zero Abuse Project. The goal
Speaker 1: of this group is to eliminate child sexual abuse in
Speaker 1: all of its forms. They provide organizational education and training,
Speaker 1: as well as support for victims. They also work on
Speaker 1: the advocacy level in an attempt to create systemic legal change.
Speaker 1: I saw on their board they got a ton of lawyers,
Speaker 1: and I like that. Their strategy is to work with
Speaker 1: a holistic approach, recognizing that child sexual abuse also intersects
Speaker 1: with child maltreatment. So for more info or to donate,
Speaker 1: head over to Zero Abuse Project dot org and that
Speaker 1: will as always be in a story the day this
Speaker 1: episode comes out and then saved forever in our WWSPD highlight.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that, and sorry, I feel
Speaker 2: like I was really monotony.
Speaker 3: Yeah I was. That was a flop. That was a flop.
Speaker 2: And next week's episode we'll be doing Snitch from season nine,
Speaker 2: episode ten. Get with it. We're obsessed with all of you.
Speaker 2: Tell a friend we like doing this.
Speaker 1: Yes, your dreams message us that they found the podcast
Speaker 1: last week.
Speaker 3: We've been around guys. Tell people about us.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and stay tuned because we did just film
Speaker 2: a lot of TikTok content.
Speaker 3: So coming at you fast, yes, or on medium speed.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're gonna be on TikTok and we're making stuff,
Speaker 2: So get ready.
Speaker 1: It's going to be coming at you on medium speed,
Speaker 1: medium speed. All right, see you guys next week. Bye.
Speaker 2: That's Messed Up as an exactly right production.
Speaker 3: If you have.
Speaker 1: Compliments you'd like to give us or episod soodes you'd
Speaker 1: like us to cover, shoot us an email it That's
Speaker 1: Messed uppod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod,
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Kara Klank and at Glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our senior producer Casey O'Brien
Speaker 2: and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain, and to.
Speaker 1: Our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker Patrick Cottner,
Speaker 1: and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly
Speaker 1: gen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to our executive
Speaker 1: producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgareff, Daniel Kramer, and everybody
Speaker 1: at Exactly Right Media dot dum