Speaker 1: When I wrote, y'all all across the USC conton watch
Speaker 1: thank to l A. Come on the California the Valley.
Speaker 1: We represent that kind of county. So if you're keeping
Speaker 1: it real on your side of your town, you tune
Speaker 1: into Gangster Chronicles Gangster Chronic Goals. We're gonna tell you
Speaker 1: how we go. If I like my nose, a girl
Speaker 1: like Pinocchio, We're gonna tell you the truth and nothing
Speaker 1: but the gangster chronic goals. This is not your average show.
Speaker 1: You're now tuned into the rail m C eight, Bick
Speaker 1: James and mixtails from the streets. Hello. We like to
Speaker 1: welcome everyone to this special episode against the Chronicles and
Speaker 1: I have a very special guest and here with us
Speaker 1: a night man Um. I had a pleasure of sitting
Speaker 1: down with music executive Ron Sparling. Ron is working the
Speaker 1: music industry for almost thirty years. You know, a pro Regulus.
Speaker 1: He worked with such notable acts as Jay Z and
Speaker 1: Master Piege No Limit Records. You know his lengthy career.
Speaker 1: Ryn has had a hand in selling almost thirty billion records.
Speaker 1: That's a lot of money generated. Are you doing a
Speaker 1: later wrong? I'm doing great. Still good to see you,
Speaker 1: my brother Nicey and you too as well. You know,
Speaker 1: the first thing I gotta start off with. Man, you know,
Speaker 1: you got a real impressive resumen. How did you wind
Speaker 1: up in the business? How did you wind up in music?
Speaker 1: You know what I'll tell you, steal Um and some
Speaker 1: people do know this story. I didn't pick music. Music
Speaker 1: pick me and I kind of have lived my life
Speaker 1: like that. But I was working as an hourly employee
Speaker 1: and UM in a store in St. Louis, Missouri, and
Speaker 1: UM I ended up in their executive training program and
Speaker 1: when they promoted me up, it was a discount store
Speaker 1: called Venture Stores. I ended up becoming an assistant buyer
Speaker 1: at corporate and it was in music. So that was
Speaker 1: the very very early days of me getting a taste
Speaker 1: that there was something to do in music besides having
Speaker 1: a mike in your hand or a guitar in your hand.
Speaker 1: So you just started off. So you started off a
Speaker 1: retail there, I did. I started off in retail. And
Speaker 1: I'll tell you a funny story, steal. I got out
Speaker 1: of college and I thought I was gonna own the
Speaker 1: world and be president of the world, right because uh,
Speaker 1: you know, I had a college education. That was unusual
Speaker 1: in my family. So I'm all proud of that. And
Speaker 1: I ended up making three dollars and thirty five cents
Speaker 1: an hour right after college. So my dreams of owning
Speaker 1: and and and running the world were a little bit
Speaker 1: uh shattered at that point. You're a little bit shadow soon.
Speaker 1: Let let's jump up on the first major job you
Speaker 1: have about as soon as that Priority Records, right it is.
Speaker 1: I I had been a buyer in music and the
Speaker 1: real I had worked for an independent label before that
Speaker 1: for about a year, but my first real break in
Speaker 1: the business was at Priority Records. And I joined Priority
Speaker 1: Records in very early days in nine actually oh so nineties,
Speaker 1: So you were when m w A first came and
Speaker 1: all those guys, yep. I had had an opportunity to
Speaker 1: work with Easy and Jerry Heller and UH and you know,
Speaker 1: certainly with Cube and Wren and Yella and and UH
Speaker 1: and Dre back in those days. So as a very
Speaker 1: young sales executive at that time, that was my first taste.
Speaker 1: I'll um, when I first got the Priority Records, I
Speaker 1: didn't have, you know, listen, I grew up without having
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of exposure, certainly to black music.
Speaker 1: And black culture. I I had listened to some blues
Speaker 1: and some RMB and stuff like that, but I was really, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, I had not grown up around that space.
Speaker 1: And the first record that they sent me, um was
Speaker 1: a group that Easy had signed by the name of
Speaker 1: Penthouse Players. Click now, I'm taking you way back now,
Speaker 1: And I usual, that's exactly right. And I put that
Speaker 1: in my player and uh, in my in my car
Speaker 1: and I was driving down the street and I rolled
Speaker 1: the windows up real quick. I was like, oh my god, know,
Speaker 1: I can't believe what they're saying. So and so that
Speaker 1: was your exposure kind of like to rap music. The
Speaker 1: gangster record that started me. That was the first record
Speaker 1: I touched in in gangster rap, and in West Coast
Speaker 1: gangster rap to be more specific. Okay, yeah, so tell
Speaker 1: me about that a little bit, because you how were
Speaker 1: your interactions back then? Were easy you those guys, because
Speaker 1: you know, you got to see them come in and
Speaker 1: kind of go through the whole thing that they were
Speaker 1: going through. Yeah, you know, Um, I was an ignorant
Speaker 1: young man, just like many people are, right, because you
Speaker 1: don't have the experience to back it up. So I
Speaker 1: didn't really understand early, like everything that was involved in
Speaker 1: the game and exactly where people were coming from. It
Speaker 1: took me a minute to get my head around, you know,
Speaker 1: after sitting with a lot of great artists, with Um,
Speaker 1: you know, with Jerry, Jerry and Easy, and you know,
Speaker 1: being in meetings with Cube and being in meetings with
Speaker 1: with um, you know, the rap a lot folks and
Speaker 1: all that Southern hip hop. It took me a minute
Speaker 1: steel to get my head around the fact that these
Speaker 1: were not just at that time, it's changed a little bit.
Speaker 1: These were not just commercial initiatives, right to to make
Speaker 1: money and sell records and create some kind of hoop law.
Speaker 1: This was people talking about real life experiences. This was
Speaker 1: people expressing their frustration about police brutality, or expressing their
Speaker 1: frustration about segregation, or expressing their frustration about unequal treatment
Speaker 1: and those kind of things. And then I really got
Speaker 1: to understand people's walks and really where some of the
Speaker 1: lyrical content was coming from and what they were trying
Speaker 1: to say, and it became very, very very important to me.
Speaker 1: At that time. I was very impressed, saddened a lot
Speaker 1: of times, but very impressed about the differences of journeys
Speaker 1: between different cultures here in America and what you know,
Speaker 1: motivated people just to tell their story, you know. So
Speaker 1: so at that time, man, you know, and I will
Speaker 1: hope that that lays true for the day. You think
Speaker 1: kind of society and impressing um made an impression of
Speaker 1: fund music back then. Oh yeah, I think that you know,
Speaker 1: people typically if it's authentic, right, and it's real and
Speaker 1: stuff that stands the test of time, you know, like
Speaker 1: straight out of confident and stuff like that. These were
Speaker 1: real stories about experiences that these young men were having
Speaker 1: in their neighborhoods and in their lives, and no one
Speaker 1: had really told it in a commercial way. I mean,
Speaker 1: everybody that lived in the community, you know, had experienced
Speaker 1: certain things that you know, with the police and stuff
Speaker 1: that's really topical right now, but no one really had
Speaker 1: had brought it into the mainstream. You know. It was
Speaker 1: very very hush hush, very behind the scenes, and really
Speaker 1: exposed a lot of interesting cultural journeys that particularly at
Speaker 1: that time Black America had been on even even today
Speaker 1: that the long yeah exactly. So now let me ask
Speaker 1: you this. Did you ever had a lot of personal
Speaker 1: interaction with the guys in n w A. I had UM.
Speaker 1: I did have personal interaction, but it wasn't nearly as tight.
Speaker 1: I was always in the meetings. I had certainly sat
Speaker 1: with Eric UM, I had certainly done a lot of
Speaker 1: business with Jerry Heller quite frankly, because he was, you know,
Speaker 1: at Ruthless at that time. That was a big deal
Speaker 1: to us and I then started that was kind of
Speaker 1: the n w A was really the beginning of where
Speaker 1: I started to get exposed to artists, start to get
Speaker 1: in front of them, start to try and you know,
Speaker 1: see them as something other than just you know, stars
Speaker 1: are you know, music artists, and start to really understand
Speaker 1: them as people. But it took time from there. I
Speaker 1: was you know, when you're at a label like that,
Speaker 1: and particularly Priority being an independent label, you know you
Speaker 1: kind of do a little bit of everything. You don't
Speaker 1: just do what you're appointed to do. So we were
Speaker 1: always in the room and such and always been part
Speaker 1: of that UM and it grew over time. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: we're gonna touch on Priority of Love because Priority has
Speaker 1: such a strong history and I'd like to tell people
Speaker 1: that outside of Deaf Jam, they're probably one of the
Speaker 1: greatest hip hop labels ever, I believe, so I mean,
Speaker 1: it's personal to me. You know. Um, we had a
Speaker 1: really tight family there, and it grew tremendously over time,
Speaker 1: but in the early days that I got there, it
Speaker 1: was really a tight family and those persons, those executives
Speaker 1: and people that worked there, and a lot of the
Speaker 1: artists that are filled with us. You know, Thank god,
Speaker 1: I'm really close friends with today, um, really close personal
Speaker 1: friends with and have maintained a fantastic relationship over the years. Okay,
Speaker 1: so let me ask you this because you were around
Speaker 1: during that time, so you got to see a lot
Speaker 1: of people come and go when that riff started happening
Speaker 1: with um, you know n w A, when they decided
Speaker 1: to break up, did that impact everything going on the
Speaker 1: building at the time that that calls the stirring the building?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you know, um, um, you know one of
Speaker 1: the things. Yeah, absolutely, and and and you know a
Speaker 1: lot of those riffs are obviously well documented, right, but
Speaker 1: you know, listen, you know we'll all for for the
Speaker 1: rest of time, and certainly during that time, it always
Speaker 1: becomes typically about money or image, right, those are the
Speaker 1: two things that are important in the entertainment business. So
Speaker 1: if you disrespect somebody or if you play with their money,
Speaker 1: or they think you're playing with your money. You don't
Speaker 1: even have to be playing with it. You know. It
Speaker 1: causes people to get pretty emotional. People getting real emotional. Now,
Speaker 1: let me ask you this run you guys had somebody
Speaker 1: and I think people often forget this in history, you
Speaker 1: guys have was probably you know, he's probably considered one
Speaker 1: of the greatest moguls and music right now, jay Z,
Speaker 1: you guys actually had an opportunity to bring Jaz over
Speaker 1: there the priority for his first to release his first
Speaker 1: album because everybody was telling them, no, do you remember
Speaker 1: an the details around the that I do. I do
Speaker 1: some of them. I I prefer to leave private. But
Speaker 1: uh uh yeah, jay Z and Damon Dash Jay and
Speaker 1: there was a gentleman there by the name of al Branch.
Speaker 1: You know, um they were the early Rockefeller Obviously everybody
Speaker 1: knows Dame and Jay Um. But we put out the
Speaker 1: reasonable Doubt record there and you know, pardon me Ja
Speaker 1: for saying this. I still think it's your best record
Speaker 1: you ever did. You thought that was the best me
Speaker 1: ever did so when you first heard that, you were
Speaker 1: impressed with it. Oh yeah, I mean I I thought
Speaker 1: that record was was you know, just off the chain
Speaker 1: at that time, and you know it went on. We
Speaker 1: did very well with it. I mean, you know, times
Speaker 1: have have certainly changed in the music. This is like
Speaker 1: it always does. But you know, our bar of success
Speaker 1: has changed over the year, whether it becomes streams or
Speaker 1: this or that. But you know, putting out records like that,
Speaker 1: anything that went a gold or above for us was
Speaker 1: considered to be a success. And I still have plaque
Speaker 1: on my wall for reasonable doubt, and I'm proud of
Speaker 1: that one that was a great record or reasonable reasonable
Speaker 1: that wouldn't go back then. That's a good thing. I think.
Speaker 1: It's one thing to say is these greatest albums too.
Speaker 1: I thought I've heard people say that, So you guys
Speaker 1: man that The thing I liked about Priority is that
Speaker 1: I think you guys, versus building just recording artists, you
Speaker 1: guys assisted a lot of moguls and building their brain.
Speaker 1: You guys created a lot of companies. Let me ask
Speaker 1: you this one of the greatest success stories ever, one
Speaker 1: of the best salesmen ever, I think in the history
Speaker 1: of rap music, Master Peak, can you take us back
Speaker 1: to the beginning of how that all came the whole
Speaker 1: no limit thing. Yeah, I will. I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: there's still there's a lot of stuff out there now.
Speaker 1: And again I stay in touch with a lot of
Speaker 1: that crew of No Limit crew. We spend an awful
Speaker 1: lot of time together. Me personally, I spend awful lot
Speaker 1: of time with each one of them, whether with Bean
Speaker 1: or Mia or serve On or KLC and and the
Speaker 1: medicine men and and that whole crew. But um, it
Speaker 1: was really an interesting time because Priority had just come
Speaker 1: off of the Chronic right, which was again probably one
Speaker 1: of the most influential hip hop route albums in history.
Speaker 1: It it really introduced, in my humble opinion, the g
Speaker 1: funk era and really commercialized hip hop, right. I mean,
Speaker 1: that was one of the first records. It was certainly
Speaker 1: the first record I was ever involved with. We got
Speaker 1: commercial radio play, right that Actually I didn't. We We
Speaker 1: were we were a street label. We put stuff out
Speaker 1: with guerilla marketing and street marketing. We used the clubs
Speaker 1: and the d days and you know, there wasn't exposure
Speaker 1: on video on major network channels. B et well, you
Speaker 1: know what, and radio was never gonna play our music, right,
Speaker 1: or the music of the artists that we so chose.
Speaker 1: But Master you know, we had just come I mean,
Speaker 1: Chronic was still blazing. I mean it's still doing great today, right,
Speaker 1: And we had found success in that, and I had
Speaker 1: I was had of sales at Priority. I worked for
Speaker 1: a man by the name of Bob Grossi there, and
Speaker 1: I was doing mainly sales, and we were doing a
Speaker 1: little bit of everything. But there was a gentleman there
Speaker 1: by the name of David Winer that worked for me
Speaker 1: at that time. He was a West Coast sales rep.
Speaker 1: And David's been on quite a bit of TV. He's
Speaker 1: a good friend of mine. He's a great man, and
Speaker 1: he really found discovered and brought Master P to Priority
Speaker 1: and and and being David's boss at that time, David
Speaker 1: and I were, you know, working to try and figure
Speaker 1: out what we had here. I'll never forget, you know,
Speaker 1: I was riding in a car before we signed Master P.
Speaker 1: And you know, um we put out the Tru Record,
Speaker 1: which again I think is one of the best records
Speaker 1: he ever did. That first Tru record was a hard record.
Speaker 1: But David, you know, had brought him in and I
Speaker 1: was sitting with P and and we had not signed
Speaker 1: him yet. We were down in San Diego and Master
Speaker 1: P and I went to Tijuana um um to go
Speaker 1: to the clubs down there that night, and I remember
Speaker 1: him saying on the on the ride down to Mexico,
Speaker 1: he was like, I'm gonna be bigger than Dr Dre right,
Speaker 1: And Dr dre was huge at that time. The chronic
Speaker 1: was gigantic still is. And I was like, you know, man,
Speaker 1: if if I could tell you how many times I've
Speaker 1: heard somebody say that to me, right, you know, I
Speaker 1: hope you are. But that's a tall order, right, being
Speaker 1: bigger than Dr Dre right, So just a further steal,
Speaker 1: not to to suck all the air out of the room.
Speaker 1: But one of the things that continued to happen is
Speaker 1: P would make these prophecies, right, he would say, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be bigger than Dr Dre. I mean, he did
Speaker 1: two d eighteen million dollars in eighteen months in volume
Speaker 1: by putting out records with the tank on him, right
Speaker 1: from all the artists that we're so familiar with now, right,
Speaker 1: that was in that crew. And you know, he came
Speaker 1: to us one day and he called me, said I'm
Speaker 1: gonna put out you know, we we He actually didn't
Speaker 1: tell us. He just shipped a load of dolls master
Speaker 1: P Dolls to the warehouse UM in Jacksonville at that time,
Speaker 1: which we were distributing our records. We weren't in the
Speaker 1: toy business, right, So I'm arguing with the guy about
Speaker 1: the dolls. Before I could get done with the argument, right,
Speaker 1: we put together a cell sheet and we put it
Speaker 1: out to our retail partners and it's strolled out and
Speaker 1: they were gone. You know. He said, I'm gonna make
Speaker 1: a movie. It's called I'm About It, right. And I
Speaker 1: watched the movie and you know, hey, I'll be the
Speaker 1: first one to tell you, and people that tell you
Speaker 1: differently may or may not be telling the truth. I
Speaker 1: didn't get it. I watched it. I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: you know, I was like, you know, that's the pretty,
Speaker 1: you know, pretty low budget movie, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: not not a big deal. And the thing just blew out.
Speaker 1: I think it went four times platinum at that time.
Speaker 1: And then everything we sold on that thing went one way,
Speaker 1: which was unheard of at the retail industry at that time.
Speaker 1: We sold it all one way because you know, he
Speaker 1: was like, hey, nobody believed in me. Nobody believed in
Speaker 1: the in the movie so they can buy it one
Speaker 1: way and on it if they want to have it
Speaker 1: on the shelf. So he he really changed a lot
Speaker 1: of the marketing and a lot of the you know, ideas,
Speaker 1: and he was a real still is. I mean, he's
Speaker 1: still a great man. He was a real force to
Speaker 1: be reckoned with as it relates to marketing and concept
Speaker 1: and then making him come to a reality. I mean,
Speaker 1: there's the guy that said, hey, I'm gonna go play
Speaker 1: basketball in the NBA, right and he didn't. So one
Speaker 1: thing you can front of that guy. And I Steve
Speaker 1: say that he probably has to be one of the
Speaker 1: top five executives and black music, and I put that
Speaker 1: up there with Verry Gordon. Um, you know, Russell Simmons,
Speaker 1: you have to mention you have to mention Pee right
Speaker 1: along with Easy and those guys, because I think but
Speaker 1: he is even more profound because he wasn't exactly the
Speaker 1: best reverend the world. Yeah, I mean, look, you can
Speaker 1: never judge a man's heart, and man that that guy
Speaker 1: wanted it more than anybody I ever met, and he
Speaker 1: went and got it and I'm proud of him. And
Speaker 1: you know, hey, he uh, he just he he changed
Speaker 1: the game and he will will forever be cemented in
Speaker 1: all of our you know, history books as as a
Speaker 1: rap icon, one of a kind, big props out to Pee,
Speaker 1: no joke. He's the truth all the way through and through. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he is, And I think one of the things with
Speaker 1: no limit. I think, like you said, I think he
Speaker 1: was always kind of a step ahead of the curb
Speaker 1: with everything. Great marketing guy, fantastic on execution, and again
Speaker 1: I almost thought he was a prophet, right. He would
Speaker 1: say something and then sure enough it would always come through,
Speaker 1: and I was like, my gosh, you know, I can't
Speaker 1: argue with this man anymore because what ever he says,
Speaker 1: whether I think he's right or wrong, doesn't matter. Well
Speaker 1: one one way. You gotta look at it too. He
Speaker 1: had a kind of like a guy that was a
Speaker 1: predecessor for gangs wrapping the South. You know, I don't
Speaker 1: never discount Uncle Luke for what they were doing down there,
Speaker 1: but that was a different kind of music. I think
Speaker 1: Ja Prince brought the gangsterism from the South, that gangster
Speaker 1: element because when you listen to those um rap a
Speaker 1: Lot CDs and you heard them talk at the beginning
Speaker 1: of them, it almost like he was giving you a
Speaker 1: message about what was going on in Houston at the time,
Speaker 1: and I look forward to those as a kid growing
Speaker 1: up in the Midwest. I actoually love Rap a Lot Records,
Speaker 1: So was priority was priority was on Rap a Lot
Speaker 1: Ruppords first major distributor, weren't they. We were, We distributed
Speaker 1: records for Jay. Jay has become a good friend over
Speaker 1: the years. I know that you you' all have a
Speaker 1: relationship as well. And he's been on the show, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's been on the show. J is a great dude. Man,
Speaker 1: It's my buddy right then. So you know, you gotta
Speaker 1: get of early pioneer credit to Jay Prince, especially when
Speaker 1: it comes to Southern hip hop, because we all have
Speaker 1: our our our geography, right. We got West Coast had
Speaker 1: a little bit of a different feel and sound and
Speaker 1: a little bit of different culture quite frankly the things
Speaker 1: that people were into, right, and then you had the
Speaker 1: East Coast, which certainly had a different feel and sound
Speaker 1: and is credited with being the initial early you know,
Speaker 1: introducing rap, right, and they had a different feel and sound.
Speaker 1: And then in the South, you know, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: Rap a Lot Records certainly defined that southern feel and sound,
Speaker 1: and as far as I'm concerned, there will always be
Speaker 1: the original down there signed some fantastic artists again, people
Speaker 1: that have become friends of mine over the years, and
Speaker 1: much mad love, mad respect for I consider Rap a
Speaker 1: lot to be my my family. Those people in the
Speaker 1: office down there, and Jay Prince and and and the
Speaker 1: people that he had around him. J Is is one
Speaker 1: of the kinds straight up great music executive and I
Speaker 1: love him to death. He did a fantastic job, continues
Speaker 1: to and there's another man. Whatever he touches, whatever he
Speaker 1: gets involved in, whatever he wants to see come true,
Speaker 1: he goes and makes it happen. And guys, you know
Speaker 1: that's a beautiful thing, ain't it. Yes, it is because
Speaker 1: the thing about Jay Prince too is dead. The thing
Speaker 1: I always loved about Jay is Jay don't do a
Speaker 1: whole bunch of time and wrestling, the live wrestling. He
Speaker 1: kind of just give you that courtesy calls. He'd likes
Speaker 1: his head and that's what it deals, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. And he's tom I've never heard him raise
Speaker 1: his voice. It's always like, well, hey, this is what
Speaker 1: we want to do now right here, and this is
Speaker 1: what's gonna happen, and you gonna do this, and I'm
Speaker 1: gonna do that when we go going about our way
Speaker 1: and you never know a bunch of live wrestling them
Speaker 1: and say, there's just no nonsense. Yep, he's he's a
Speaker 1: quiet man. I've had I've had full on meetings with
Speaker 1: my staff with him, you know, because Jay and I
Speaker 1: have been in several different you know, distribution relationships. We
Speaker 1: were at Priority, we were at Warner with Asylum East West.
Speaker 1: I had, you know, I had Jay there, and then
Speaker 1: I had Jay again at Fontana. When I was at
Speaker 1: Fontana and I had whole meetings with my staff and
Speaker 1: and Jay didn't come to all of them. But when
Speaker 1: he was there, I've had meetings where he didn't say
Speaker 1: a single word during the entire meeting. People like, is
Speaker 1: he cool with what we're talking about? Is he cool
Speaker 1: with what we're planning? Is you know that's on this
Speaker 1: record releases? He in agreement? I said, If he's not
Speaker 1: an agreement, he'll let you know. Let you know. Now,
Speaker 1: let me ask you this. You've been around some pretty
Speaker 1: good executives, and you can answering this if you want
Speaker 1: to becau I don't know you can keep it one hundred.
Speaker 1: Have you ever had someone that was just an asshole
Speaker 1: that you just didn't like dealing with, but they were
Speaker 1: successful and you kind of tolerating them. Oh yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I have a whole notebook full of those people, right. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, life tends to throw us um
Speaker 1: um a lot of different kinds of people. And I'm
Speaker 1: sure there are people that have me in that same
Speaker 1: notebook on their desk too. You know, not everybody's built
Speaker 1: for everybody else, you know, and you know, see all
Speaker 1: I'll tell you, I've been around a lot of people
Speaker 1: that I didn't I want to do business with that
Speaker 1: I didn't really personally like, but I needed to do
Speaker 1: business with them because I respected him. And if I
Speaker 1: lost respect or they lost respect for me, that's the
Speaker 1: beginning of a very broken relationship. Yeah, you know, without that,
Speaker 1: you know, you can try, as at least my experiences,
Speaker 1: you can try as hard as you want, but you
Speaker 1: just can't get there. And I've worked for people who
Speaker 1: just didn't respect me and didn't respect what I brought
Speaker 1: to the table, and that's okay. And I've had people
Speaker 1: work for me that I didn't respect and didn't respect
Speaker 1: what they brought to the table, and that's just a
Speaker 1: bad relationship. You need to cut that off sooner than later. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, and I'm really I'm really good friends with
Speaker 1: um with one of you guys, biggest excellent over there.
Speaker 1: Um you may know him was mc tien. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: me and him that became, you know, pretty good friends
Speaker 1: over the years. And the thing I left about MEC
Speaker 1: is he always talks about Priority with like that Priority
Speaker 1: brigs with Garden at Nostalgia, like like, man, it was
Speaker 1: the best time effort, you know, like it was a
Speaker 1: family you know what we're going in and just like
Speaker 1: you know, he tells me about the time he walked
Speaker 1: in he started who banging, and you guys just fully
Speaker 1: supported him with it. Yep, yep. Max a friend of
Speaker 1: mine as well as you know, and um, you know, honestly,
Speaker 1: you know, one of the things about Priority was funny.
Speaker 1: I see this happen in corporate America all the time.
Speaker 1: It's gotten a little bit better because you know, we've
Speaker 1: matured corporately, and music has matured, and hip hops now
Speaker 1: that it's not a it's it's not a fad, it's
Speaker 1: not a music of a culture. It's not anything like that.
Speaker 1: It is the largest most popular genre in the world
Speaker 1: right now. And so with that said, you know, the
Speaker 1: thing that was magical about Priority is that it was
Speaker 1: a community of people with really a common goal, great leadership,
Speaker 1: and more importantly, we understood and we lived the culture.
Speaker 1: You know, we still live in a world where we
Speaker 1: call people black and white and we refer to them
Speaker 1: about their ethnicity. I think that's played out and that
Speaker 1: I hope that during my lifetime we won't will refer
Speaker 1: to people as men and women or whatever they are,
Speaker 1: right instead of referring to them by ethnicity. But we're
Speaker 1: still there. So if if we're still there, I'll do
Speaker 1: the same thing. We understood black culture, and we didn't
Speaker 1: understand it because we thought we wanted to be in
Speaker 1: it or we might. We understood it because we lived
Speaker 1: it every day we went. I went to the neighborhoods,
Speaker 1: I was in you know, people's houses, I was at
Speaker 1: their parties, I was there for their holidays, you know.
Speaker 1: And as as the as much as we are the same,
Speaker 1: there are different cultural differences no matter where you're at
Speaker 1: in the north, the south, the east, and west. Like
Speaker 1: we just talked about, you know, different language, different way
Speaker 1: of speaking, sometimes different customs, lots of different things. We
Speaker 1: were in the middle of it. It was what we
Speaker 1: did for a living, and we did it together. And
Speaker 1: we did have a family atmosphere and a loyalty in
Speaker 1: a and a real camaraderie inside that that building. That
Speaker 1: was really magical. I'll leave you with this as it relates.
Speaker 1: You know, one of the one of the things that
Speaker 1: happened when Priority was purchased by E. M. I and I,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean once My purchased that, I resigned
Speaker 1: and I went to Warner Um and worked for Sylvia Rhne.
Speaker 1: Sylvia was kind enough to give me a shot to
Speaker 1: come to Warner and go to what we called the
Speaker 1: majors at the time, because I'd been an independent my
Speaker 1: whole life. As a big step and you know, I
Speaker 1: just when they bought it, I knew that they weren't
Speaker 1: going to maintain the culture of the company, whether they
Speaker 1: intended to or not. I knew that was gonna go away,
Speaker 1: and so I cut my you know, I cut ties
Speaker 1: and left Um immediately. You know, I was one of
Speaker 1: the first to leave, because I just knew it was
Speaker 1: never be the same. We were now owned by a corporation.
Speaker 1: We weren't owned by Mark Serami and Brian Turner who
Speaker 1: founded the company. You know, they were, they were still there,
Speaker 1: but but they weren't going to be the boss long term.
Speaker 1: E M I was. They paid the money, they wrote
Speaker 1: the cash. You know, Before we're going, because I know
Speaker 1: you have a long story career, before we're going, I
Speaker 1: want to ask you this, is there anyone that turned
Speaker 1: up to be super duper successful that the building might
Speaker 1: have fought? Have you ever going to bring someone into
Speaker 1: someone in the building kind of folks in it? I
Speaker 1: think that any time you go to bring any one end,
Speaker 1: people fight you on it, whether it's another executive or
Speaker 1: it's another artist or whatever. But you know, I will
Speaker 1: I will never forget. We wanted to be in business
Speaker 1: with cash money, and there was a lot of fighting
Speaker 1: in and around cash money, and I wish we'd had
Speaker 1: them to be part of that family. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: for me as a sales guy at that time, and
Speaker 1: again we did lots of other things, but I was
Speaker 1: classically trained sales guy. That's all I cared about, right,
Speaker 1: I didn't care about who was, you know, arguing or
Speaker 1: fighting with who or what colors, people were wearing, the
Speaker 1: rags they were flying. None of that hattered to me.
Speaker 1: I just cared that it would sell right, that that
Speaker 1: something would go out there and be impactful, and that
Speaker 1: we could go and create something exciting. And they always
Speaker 1: fight and steal no matter what it is, because no
Speaker 1: one's gonna have the same opinion, so there's always one
Speaker 1: side versus the other, and you know, sometimes you do so.
Speaker 1: So so you mean to tell me that Priority Ricords
Speaker 1: could have had cash money records over there, and I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure, I'm pretty sure no limit had a problem
Speaker 1: with that. There were lots of people that had a
Speaker 1: problem with it. And frankly, you know, I was I
Speaker 1: was a vote, a very uh you know minority. Well,
Speaker 1: I was an insignificant vote that I wanted them there,
Speaker 1: I bet you did. You know, those guys sold a
Speaker 1: lot of rigors, and when they came there was kind
Speaker 1: of like the you know what what what the funny
Speaker 1: thing it was about that situation. It was not I
Speaker 1: know Birdman and I know you know, I think they're
Speaker 1: both great people. But I think at that time, though,
Speaker 1: I think that with all the master p doing what
Speaker 1: he did, cash money maybe might have had the success
Speaker 1: because p kind of opened up the door for New Orleans.
Speaker 1: I will always see p as upon in ear down there.
Speaker 1: He was the one that got you know, got his
Speaker 1: shot first in a way, right, j right, but certainly
Speaker 1: for New Orleans. Um. But yeah, he went on and
Speaker 1: blaze the trail, just like Ja blaze the trail for
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Speaker 1: wore blue Unknowing Unknowing. Whatn't the part of the scheme, y'all?
Speaker 1: Whatn't the part of it? You know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: you guys, don't and use that promo code in case
Speaker 1: you know you're feeling age. You don't necessarily have to
Speaker 1: be on if you have no problems. But so you
Speaker 1: left Priority Records. You over now the major label because
Speaker 1: a lot of people you know, it's funny when you
Speaker 1: say a major, because at that time I think Priority
Speaker 1: was probably doing more volume than the major's work. We
Speaker 1: were we were doing quite well. And um, you know,
Speaker 1: we had certainly got the attention of everybody in the
Speaker 1: industry because we were on the top of the charts.
Speaker 1: Don't forget before we leave Priority that in w A
Speaker 1: for Life record, right that debuted at number one because
Speaker 1: sounds Scan changed the reporting and it was more accurate,
Speaker 1: and so n w A ended up being the number
Speaker 1: one record in the country, and that opened a lot
Speaker 1: of people's eyes. Um, the other genre that really benefited
Speaker 1: from that change that sound scan was country because country
Speaker 1: had a similar country music that is, had a similar
Speaker 1: you know path, and that they weren't quite recognized for
Speaker 1: the contributions that they were making to the retail community.
Speaker 1: The retailers knew it, but the world didn't really know
Speaker 1: it until sound Scan changed their formula. And frankly, that
Speaker 1: was a big deal. So we had caught a priority,
Speaker 1: had gotten a lot of attention along with master p
Speaker 1: being on the chart squad every week with a brand
Speaker 1: new record that was was out there post that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we for those out there that may not know what
Speaker 1: sound scans man, because we're tell them about retail now,
Speaker 1: that's like, that's like ancient stuff to most of these
Speaker 1: keys nowadays. Scan Back in the day, children and young
Speaker 1: people listening to the episode right now, sound scan was
Speaker 1: how they tract the sales of records. You know, every
Speaker 1: time they scanned, it would give record beings at a
Speaker 1: records For one time when we went sound scan and um,
Speaker 1: I could talk about it now, we got a whole
Speaker 1: bunch of free CDs in the mail all the time.
Speaker 1: It was pretty cool. Once people in sound scan, we
Speaker 1: started getting all kinds of stuff for free, yep, and
Speaker 1: and and what you know at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: what sound scan results were what you just referred to
Speaker 1: steal is it drove the numbers on the Billboard charts,
Speaker 1: right for the top two hundred and the and the
Speaker 1: pop charts and those kind of things. And so when
Speaker 1: n w A shot to number one when we were
Speaker 1: you know, we released the record, it was because the
Speaker 1: sound scans reporting and it ended up being number one
Speaker 1: on the Billboard chart. Oh wow, So that changed a
Speaker 1: whole lot of things. Now, let me ask you this.
Speaker 1: You go into the major system, what did they Was
Speaker 1: there anything there that you just didn't like versus the
Speaker 1: old regime versus what you were used to doing. Oh,
Speaker 1: there were so many things. You know, any time you
Speaker 1: make change, things are different, right, and changes always hard
Speaker 1: because we want things to kind of remain the same,
Speaker 1: right always. Um, even if they're better, we still maybe
Speaker 1: don't know until we get in it. But yeah, the
Speaker 1: biggest change for me going to the majors is coming
Speaker 1: out of an independent like priority And I've referred to
Speaker 1: it several times during this podcast, is you can call
Speaker 1: yourself whatever you want, right, vice president of sales, You know,
Speaker 1: head a radio, but if the box needs to be moved,
Speaker 1: somebody goes and moves the box, doesn't matter what your
Speaker 1: title is. And and and that was what I missed
Speaker 1: the most is you know, I had a really great
Speaker 1: relationship with Power one oh six and Hot nineties seven
Speaker 1: in New York, and I was driving a lot of
Speaker 1: initiatives with them on the advertising side, and a lot
Speaker 1: of our records were We're getting introduced there because we
Speaker 1: had a good relationship with them, and they were starting
Speaker 1: to understand, you know, the importance, particularly of Southern hip
Speaker 1: hop when it came to master p right, because then
Speaker 1: you have to continue to break down barriers of what
Speaker 1: people think was great over time, and that when I
Speaker 1: got to the majors, all changed. If you're head of sales.
Speaker 1: I was head of sales at Elector with Sylvia. You
Speaker 1: do sales. You don't do an R, you don't do
Speaker 1: any radio promotion, you don't do any marketing. You do sales.
Speaker 1: That's your job. Stay in your lane, go do that.
Speaker 1: And that's the way larger corporations are because they have
Speaker 1: a bunch of people assigned to do everything else instead
Speaker 1: of you know a few people that have to do
Speaker 1: everything right. And that was a culture shock for me. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: And I bet you that was because one of the
Speaker 1: things that I was running joke to me about industry
Speaker 1: because I worked in the publishing industry one time and
Speaker 1: I just got offered a job. It was funny, maybe
Speaker 1: like six months ago a good friend of mine nine
Speaker 1: might leave hit me up and say, hey, you should laugh,
Speaker 1: you know, apply for this job. Right. So, I'm doing
Speaker 1: a phone interview with the woman and she's probably thirty
Speaker 1: years younger than me, and we're talking about it. We
Speaker 1: get to talking about I won't say what company it was,
Speaker 1: but we get to talking about Prince and I was
Speaker 1: talking about, you know, Purple Rain, and she didn't know
Speaker 1: what I was talking about. And and I kind of
Speaker 1: politely changed my mind as about the position. Who have
Speaker 1: to having a conversation with her because I realized, you know,
Speaker 1: this woman right here, I could possibly be working for her.
Speaker 1: And she don't know nothing about music, She don't know
Speaker 1: nothing about black music. She's just someone that's there because
Speaker 1: of whatever reason. But she had no passion for the music.
Speaker 1: And I just didn't want to go into a situation
Speaker 1: of where I was just doing paperwork and research all day.
Speaker 1: I wasn't. I wasn't getting into it like that because
Speaker 1: to me, that's what the music business has become, almost
Speaker 1: all about analytics and just the pure numbers. I'm something.
Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong, those are very important tools, but
Speaker 1: when you're trying to find that next stuff, I don't
Speaker 1: think Brian turning those dudes just in there looking at
Speaker 1: metrics back and I think they were listening to stuff
Speaker 1: that was gonna be impactful to the coaching. Yeah, yep,
Speaker 1: those guys were, you know true. I mean, one of
Speaker 1: the things that I find a little bit interesting about
Speaker 1: the music business now is it is, to your point,
Speaker 1: still very analytic driven. Right, everything's out there in front
Speaker 1: of you, all the metrics, all the numbers. You know,
Speaker 1: there's no hiding from the data, so to speak. And
Speaker 1: that I mean back in the early music days, and
Speaker 1: you know, long before my time and up through my
Speaker 1: time in the music business, these guys were signing artists
Speaker 1: that they believe we're going to be successful. And they
Speaker 1: didn't have a bunch of reports they were looking at.
Speaker 1: They went to a show watched where they're not the
Speaker 1: crowd knew the lyrics, right, they listened to of the
Speaker 1: local retailers. Were they selling the records right? They went
Speaker 1: and did some of that grassroots stuff and lots of people,
Speaker 1: and I've done it several times. I signed many artists
Speaker 1: that probably in a analytical way, did not deserve to
Speaker 1: have a record deal, but I signed him because I
Speaker 1: believe they were passionate and I believe that they were,
Speaker 1: you know, worthy of having a shot. I signed a
Speaker 1: deal at at Fontana, you know, with a good friend
Speaker 1: of mine, Mark Tanner and Chime Music, because he wrote
Speaker 1: a song that was influential to me, and I signed
Speaker 1: him based on that any of the numbers were gonna
Speaker 1: be off. You did fine. I mean, it wasn't a
Speaker 1: giant success, but I'm glad we did it well. You know,
Speaker 1: sometimes it has to be involved that dude, Like I
Speaker 1: just think, man, a lot of music has to start
Speaker 1: coming from the old. A lot of it has to
Speaker 1: mean something to somebody because we go off because it's
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff out there. It's like, let's keep
Speaker 1: it real. It's not. It's hard to get a people's
Speaker 1: attention right now, but if you've got some bs, it's
Speaker 1: easy to get people's attention. Now. This is definitely the
Speaker 1: error of just um. And I don't want to say
Speaker 1: because I like a lot of these young people's music.
Speaker 1: I'm not one of those old dudes to talk about
Speaker 1: the keys and what they're doing. But I definitely think
Speaker 1: that the system is kind of rigged right now that
Speaker 1: you know, people can have the appearance of getting attention
Speaker 1: that they want to, but it's not really going there.
Speaker 1: It's not really making an impact like it is versus
Speaker 1: somebody just being interested in the oddity just going on
Speaker 1: at that time, you follow what I'm saying. I mean
Speaker 1: I always referred to it and still referred to it
Speaker 1: like this still authenticity, right? Is it authentic? Is that
Speaker 1: really who you are? Is that really you're talking about
Speaker 1: stuff you really know something about? That meant something to me.
Speaker 1: Like we talked about the early Priority days, these guys
Speaker 1: were living that line. If they weren't fake, they weren't
Speaker 1: like you know, it wasn't stuff they didn't experience, And
Speaker 1: that meant a lot more to me than I can
Speaker 1: go and tell stories all day that aren't true, right,
Speaker 1: And I can go tell stories about things that I
Speaker 1: don't know anything about, and sooner or later, you know,
Speaker 1: game recognized game I don't care what error we're in.
Speaker 1: If you're not really authentic, at some point, somebody's gonna
Speaker 1: see through it. Now. Whether they care or not, if
Speaker 1: the beats hot enough right now is my question exactly.
Speaker 1: And you know, I'd like to tell people all the time.
Speaker 1: I don't want to keep going back to Pe. But
Speaker 1: Pete broke down on so many barriers. I think Pete
Speaker 1: was the first person that proved kind of like, now,
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong with Pete, but he was by
Speaker 1: far not the worst rapper of all time. There are
Speaker 1: people that you know, actually way worse than them to
Speaker 1: call themselves rappers, you know what I mean. I think
Speaker 1: Pete proved though that if you had to beat man
Speaker 1: the hook catchy beating the catchy in the story, people
Speaker 1: were buying to the public. I don't think Joe public
Speaker 1: care about that like that. People were buying into that
Speaker 1: because of the brand, and that's what artists and labels
Speaker 1: and entities should strive to be. People bought things that
Speaker 1: came out with that tank on it, period. Whether they'd
Speaker 1: ever heard a beat or a note on it, they
Speaker 1: knew they had to have that released because it had
Speaker 1: the tank on it. And if it had the tank
Speaker 1: on it. It had to represent what they had experienced
Speaker 1: with for with the No Limit releases, and that is
Speaker 1: that was the magic there was creating a brand that
Speaker 1: people had to be a part of, remembering pulling the
Speaker 1: tanks out on the basketball court and the dependance and
Speaker 1: it went on and on and on. And he was brilliant.
Speaker 1: He was a gene He still is. I mean I'm
Speaker 1: talking like he's not still here. He just had a
Speaker 1: birthday this week. He's a genius, he really is. And
Speaker 1: watching don't get a big head. And you know that
Speaker 1: the you know the thing? You know, man, I think
Speaker 1: what it is a lot of these kids today and
Speaker 1: I hear people people hit people hit me up all
Speaker 1: the time for whatever reason. They think we could do
Speaker 1: something with their music. Everybody's looking for a break. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And um, I tell these guys, like I asked people,
Speaker 1: what is it that you want out of your career? Why? Why?
Speaker 1: Why do you want to put an album out? If
Speaker 1: they tell me if the first thing out they mass
Speaker 1: they want to make money, I never deal with it
Speaker 1: again because that's gonna be a situation that's not gonna
Speaker 1: be They're not in it for the right reasons. I
Speaker 1: think I think when you know, I know, when I
Speaker 1: was making music and I was putting out music and
Speaker 1: I was working for the publishing company and doing my thing,
Speaker 1: I was there because I love music and I would
Speaker 1: have something to do with it. Probably would have did
Speaker 1: the job for free. They had told me there's gonna
Speaker 1: pay for this job. You know, you come in and
Speaker 1: do it because I was passionate about it. I love
Speaker 1: listening to the music. I loved getting the opportunities, like
Speaker 1: when we have Warner Brothers and somebody hit us up
Speaker 1: and asks if we had a song for this, and
Speaker 1: we're looking at the scene to movie and you're trying
Speaker 1: to play something with that particular scene, it had to
Speaker 1: be all about the music. And if it's not about that,
Speaker 1: and I think that that's the same for anything, for him,
Speaker 1: for whatever, all the life you're in, I think you
Speaker 1: have to have some level of passion for it. Have
Speaker 1: you ever found throughout your courses you've been around a
Speaker 1: long time, man, have you ever just looked at this
Speaker 1: stuff and say it, Man, I'm tired of but I
Speaker 1: don't want to deal with it no more. Oh Still,
Speaker 1: It's exactly why I'm where I'm at right now, is
Speaker 1: you're a thousand percent right. I worked for thirty years
Speaker 1: and never felt like I was working. I was doing
Speaker 1: something I loved. I was doing it with people I love.
Speaker 1: Did I get an arguments, did we have fights, did
Speaker 1: we have threats? Did we have drama every day? But
Speaker 1: I loved it. And at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: I never felt like I got up and went to work.
Speaker 1: It was part of my life. It was part of
Speaker 1: what I might to your point steal. It was passion,
Speaker 1: and that's what should get people up in the morning,
Speaker 1: because if you go do what you're really passionate about,
Speaker 1: the money will always be there. You'll always find your
Speaker 1: way to success because you're not working. People would say
Speaker 1: to me all the time, I go to dinner, I'd
Speaker 1: be on my phone. I'd go to here and I'd
Speaker 1: be on my phone. I'd be They had blackberries, then
Speaker 1: they had iPhones, and all of a sudden, you know
Speaker 1: you were connected seven. I was constantly working. I was
Speaker 1: constantly on a plane, flying across the world always, and
Speaker 1: you know, hey, at the end of the day. People
Speaker 1: would say to me all time, and you're a workaholic,
Speaker 1: and be like, I'm not. This is what and who
Speaker 1: I am, it's not what I'm trying to be. It's
Speaker 1: not what I want to be. It's just part of
Speaker 1: who I am. I'm enjoying myself. This is fun for me.
Speaker 1: I love this. So at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: I never felt like I went to work a day
Speaker 1: of my life. When it started to be work for me,
Speaker 1: it's when I stepped away mhm. Because that told me,
Speaker 1: just like you just described in such great advice to anyone,
Speaker 1: no matter where you're at in the walk of your life,
Speaker 1: to listen to ma'am. When you stop enjoying what you're doing,
Speaker 1: you're doing because you have to. That truly is slavery. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is. You know, if you if you're chained because
Speaker 1: you have to go because you gotta do this or
Speaker 1: you gotta do that. Now, I know a lot of
Speaker 1: people gotta pay their bills and they gotta do this
Speaker 1: and do that. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. There's always
Speaker 1: an option to continue to look for ways to put
Speaker 1: you in line with your purpose. And if you can
Speaker 1: get aligned with your purpose, it will be so much easier.
Speaker 1: You may you may hey, you may have to be
Speaker 1: in bondage for a few years to do what you
Speaker 1: gotta do to be able to get there. But at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, that should be your goal.
Speaker 1: Not money, not this, not that, not how do I
Speaker 1: sleep more and work lass, none of that. What is
Speaker 1: it that I'm here and I'm really designed to do?
Speaker 1: Ye know, what's your purpose? And that's that's That's one
Speaker 1: of the things that I preached my key. It's right. Um.
Speaker 1: I've always told my kids, um that if you look
Speaker 1: for a job so to speak, now, there's nothing wrong
Speaker 1: with the work, because you can't staying here you sit
Speaker 1: on your tail all day. You can't stay at home,
Speaker 1: you sit on your gass all day while I go
Speaker 1: pay the bills. I don't mean that, but I think
Speaker 1: that if you're in a situation of where you're going
Speaker 1: to go work somewhere forty hours a week and it's
Speaker 1: somewhere that you hate, and you go do that until
Speaker 1: you're almost just like just pretty much just um, just
Speaker 1: pretty much not living life so to speak. You're you're
Speaker 1: not You're just existing because there's no passion and what
Speaker 1: would you do. But I think if you continue to
Speaker 1: work towards your wife, I think you'll find success. I
Speaker 1: agree with you still and and you know, hey, listen,
Speaker 1: I'm still in and around the business. I still have
Speaker 1: some publishing assets, I still have some artists I'm involved with.
Speaker 1: I'm involved with a really big artist right now. Heritage
Speaker 1: artists were working through both publishing and masters and all
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, and I've been blessed to still
Speaker 1: be called upon to do that. And you and I
Speaker 1: talked the other day a little bit because we're friends.
Speaker 1: Maybe people out there don't know that we're actually friends.
Speaker 1: Maybe they think we're not, you know. And but but
Speaker 1: you know, we talked to the you know the other day.
Speaker 1: And I never and again, I don't live and regret.
Speaker 1: I don't look back, have you know, Um, are there
Speaker 1: things I'd like to change? One thousand percent. Anybody goes
Speaker 1: through this life is gonna have some things that they
Speaker 1: wish they'd have done differently that they didn't. And that's
Speaker 1: all good and fine. But you know what, I just
Speaker 1: simply never I never hired a publicist. I never tried
Speaker 1: to put my name in the Marquee lights. I never
Speaker 1: did a bunch of that type of stuff. Was that
Speaker 1: smart or not smart? I don't really know. So far,
Speaker 1: I probably could afford to I haven't missed any meals,
Speaker 1: thank God. You know what I mean, I haven't. I
Speaker 1: haven't ever had to go hungry, So I think it
Speaker 1: worked out just fine. But I never did a lot
Speaker 1: of that stuff. I just followed my passion and I
Speaker 1: had three things that I tried to accomplish. I tried
Speaker 1: to be direct and honest, and it defended a lot
Speaker 1: of people oftentimes right, um, because be at the boardroom
Speaker 1: or the streets, sometimes that truth can be really sharp
Speaker 1: and sting, right, and to say it, then this is
Speaker 1: what it is. Um. And then I also just never
Speaker 1: wanted to be deceptive. I didn't want to be. My
Speaker 1: reputation and my name was very it still is very
Speaker 1: important to me. I can walk into any community anywhere
Speaker 1: in the world and find my way through no problem,
Speaker 1: and that's a gift from God. Out I'm appreciative. It's nothing,
Speaker 1: not not something I creative or something I was given.
Speaker 1: But I can go to the Calihope projects, I can
Speaker 1: go to Cabrini Green, I can go to watch and
Speaker 1: I can walk right through there and I don't have
Speaker 1: any problem holding my head up because people are people
Speaker 1: and it's all good and it's about how you carry yourself,
Speaker 1: the character who you are, and trying to be authentic
Speaker 1: to your earlier point, man, trying to live your purpose
Speaker 1: and be authentic, right, And people recognize that and they
Speaker 1: respect it, and most people want to see you do
Speaker 1: well as a result, you know what I mean. And
Speaker 1: I have a firm belief man, that how you treat
Speaker 1: people in life life is going to reciprocate that to
Speaker 1: you in return. Because and now I'm not asking this
Speaker 1: and this is my own personal opinions. If I don't
Speaker 1: want to, nobody's saying going back and seeing Ryan said this,
Speaker 1: like you're going back to those executives they actually had
Speaker 1: the opportunity to work with them. And you mentioned one earlier,
Speaker 1: Damon Dash He treated people really, really bad when he
Speaker 1: was successful on top. And see the one big misconception
Speaker 1: that people have when they're in power. They think people
Speaker 1: are bowling down to them because they respect them. No,
Speaker 1: it's not that they respect, they're tolerating. They're tolerating you
Speaker 1: because they almost have to at that point because you're
Speaker 1: in a successful situation. You're part of successful situations, so
Speaker 1: they feel like that they may have to take some
Speaker 1: of that crap, that tudition out at that time. But
Speaker 1: the minutes you fall off, instead of somebody giving you
Speaker 1: a hand to reach you, they're gonna push you down
Speaker 1: even further because they're glad to see that happening to you.
Speaker 1: So I've always been a guy getting pulled up into
Speaker 1: situations to where I've never treated anyone bad in my life.
Speaker 1: During my life, I always treated the janitor like he
Speaker 1: was the CEO. And I think how we treat people
Speaker 1: is very very important. I just think that that that's
Speaker 1: what it is now, did you know? You know what?
Speaker 1: Still at the end of the day, And again, I'm
Speaker 1: a long way from perfect, but I keep it one
Speaker 1: hundred You know me well enough. I keep it right
Speaker 1: down in the middle. I say what I feel and
Speaker 1: and doesn't mean I'm right, but I say what I feel.
Speaker 1: I'm authentic about it. I try to treat people the
Speaker 1: way that I want to be treated at the end
Speaker 1: of the day. I'm sure there are a bunch of
Speaker 1: people that can say this that about the other thing,
Speaker 1: and most of them probably don't know me very well,
Speaker 1: because if you do, I really try to live my
Speaker 1: life like that. Do I do it perfect all the time? Now?
Speaker 1: But I I'll tell you what we're talking about, in
Speaker 1: my humble opinion is respect again. Right, If I respect
Speaker 1: you as another man or another human being, then we'll
Speaker 1: at least start out on the right course, right, right,
Speaker 1: And you can destroy that right. You can lose my
Speaker 1: respect for you, right if if if you work at it,
Speaker 1: it's not hard to do. I can lose your respect
Speaker 1: for me if I work at it and show you
Speaker 1: something different than an authentic and straightforward person that I
Speaker 1: know still that you respond to. Okay, that's my choice
Speaker 1: to destroy that respect, right, not not yours. Right, that's
Speaker 1: mine if I if I choose to put myself in
Speaker 1: a position where you're not gonna respect me. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: all make choices. We all make choices. So anyway, we
Speaker 1: got off on that. I took you down a rabbit
Speaker 1: hole a little bit. You get back on your courts.
Speaker 1: It's all good. I want to ask you, you work
Speaker 1: with all of these like brilliant people that wan't to
Speaker 1: become legendary. And when I asked this question, I'm not
Speaker 1: talking about the seal Via Rohans. In the world of
Speaker 1: Mark's Ramy's Who is the best who you who? Who
Speaker 1: would you say is the best executive that you've worked
Speaker 1: with urban music. In urban music, like urban music, Like
Speaker 1: if you had to pick, like from Monst the Dang Dashes,
Speaker 1: the Masterps, the p Diddies, or whoever, who would you
Speaker 1: say was the one that had their stuff the most together.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know them all, guys. So this
Speaker 1: is just based on my experience. You know, Brian Turner
Speaker 1: and Mark's Ramy A Priority will forever being aimed in
Speaker 1: my mind as great urban executives because they were just
Speaker 1: doing what they were passionate about. Too. They weren't really trying,
Speaker 1: they weren't trying to change the world. They were trying
Speaker 1: to just do what they do, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And it did change the world, and that was really
Speaker 1: attractive to me. Um. But I gotta tell you, Um,
Speaker 1: I've had so many experiences with fantastic executives, not necessarily
Speaker 1: only in urban because once I went to the majors,
Speaker 1: I got exposed to all kinds of genres and I
Speaker 1: got to work with lots of legendary people, and I'm
Speaker 1: very appreciative of that. But Jim ury Is is a
Speaker 1: dear friend of mine, and Jim was a fantastic music
Speaker 1: executive who worked under Doug Morris for a very long time,
Speaker 1: but one of the greatest record what is certainly was
Speaker 1: a cornerstone of building, you know, the largest record company
Speaker 1: in the world at Universal, and he out me in
Speaker 1: to run Fontana and I'll forever be in his debt.
Speaker 1: I can't. I can go on and on about Jim
Speaker 1: and the things I learned from him about being a
Speaker 1: great executive music or not. The way he said things,
Speaker 1: the way he analyzed things, the way he processed things,
Speaker 1: and I was very blessed to have enough time with
Speaker 1: him too. And by the way, I'm an acquired taste,
Speaker 1: So thank you Jim for taking it at some somebody
Speaker 1: who's an acquired taste, because I didn't taste that good
Speaker 1: to everybody out there. Jim Jury and those guys like that,
Speaker 1: those are expected. I'm talking about the guys that were
Speaker 1: kind of like self made as executive, you know, the
Speaker 1: guys that were the heads of the of the Jail
Speaker 1: Bond records, of the No Limit records, and things like that,
Speaker 1: These freed executives. I mean, you know, how can you
Speaker 1: not go back to Jay Prince and start there right?
Speaker 1: I mean, Jay was I mean, Jay created a culture
Speaker 1: and genre out of Houston, Texas. That will that will
Speaker 1: never be erased. He just simply created a movement in
Speaker 1: a brand um And he's a very very very smart man. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he has to be, because if you look at what
Speaker 1: he's done outside of music and himself is incredible. I mean,
Speaker 1: if you you know, he owns a couple of islands, man,
Speaker 1: and he has a rank to where you gotta you know,
Speaker 1: you gotta. You just can't walk to his front door
Speaker 1: to deliver the mail, right, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: you have to go on the drive actually get to
Speaker 1: his crib. So I think he's done some incredible things, man,
Speaker 1: And I think the biggest thing with him is he
Speaker 1: did it all kind of on a low too, and
Speaker 1: he did it on zoom. He did he did it
Speaker 1: without you know, a lot of these other people and
Speaker 1: a lot of these people that were talking about had
Speaker 1: to have money from Corporate America or somebody else. Jay
Speaker 1: created his own success m from from nothing. M hm.
Speaker 1: So sorry, J, to keep your name in my mouth
Speaker 1: this you know, during this podcast the whole time. But
Speaker 1: you know, I love and respect you, but that's the truth.
Speaker 1: You've got to put J at the top of the list.
Speaker 1: He created an entire movement, genre and culture from nothing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, personally, like the person today, one of
Speaker 1: the newest exists and he's not that new. He just
Speaker 1: kind of he's not that new at this point. But
Speaker 1: my buddy on Anthony Tiffic, top Dog over TV and
Speaker 1: another guy man you don't never hearn of his cruise
Speaker 1: name and no miss you'll never see him on a
Speaker 1: whole bunch of stuff. And he kind of stays behind
Speaker 1: the scenes, like I think an executive kind of ship,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. He lets his artists go
Speaker 1: out and shine. He's not the main headline. Hey he
Speaker 1: he uh. He's done a fantastic job with Top Dog Entertainment.
Speaker 1: Another one that you need to mention too is Strange
Speaker 1: music what Travis Okan and Technology Travis Okwan in Tech
Speaker 1: nine are not to be trifled with. They've created an
Speaker 1: empire in Kansas City, Missouri. They've done a fantastic job
Speaker 1: again to people that I consider to be friends of mine.
Speaker 1: I think they're fantastic people. For to me, I've had
Speaker 1: the privilege of working with them on a couple of
Speaker 1: different versions. Great people from those are my buddies, and
Speaker 1: they've they've created an empire. Um, you know, you can
Speaker 1: go on and on. Listen. Sugar Night created one of
Speaker 1: the biggest brands in the business Death Row Records. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well you know mom of Sugar Gills. And that's like
Speaker 1: probably one of the great American tragedies right there, is
Speaker 1: that he really was on the cusp of being probably
Speaker 1: the greatest record label black music is black music record
Speaker 1: label of all time. He was that close. Because you
Speaker 1: think about it, if he wouldn't have, if he would
Speaker 1: have just made some better decisions and kind of stayed
Speaker 1: behind the camera a little bit and kind has made
Speaker 1: some moves, he would have wound up having eminem He
Speaker 1: would have probably wound up having bringing TV along. Are
Speaker 1: really envisioned should one day becoming like the head of
Speaker 1: Interscope one day. I envisioned that because one thing, if
Speaker 1: you take away all the bs and the Shenanigans and
Speaker 1: all that other stuff, he was a really pretty freaking
Speaker 1: brilliant dude. I mean, you can front on it that
Speaker 1: that death throws a household name. So even given all
Speaker 1: the stuff you're referring to, he still created a household
Speaker 1: name with some some of the greatest artists of our time. Yeah. Did.
Speaker 1: First of all, you know that the thing was and
Speaker 1: as you know, with that businessman, I think that sometimes
Speaker 1: it may be a little necessary to let your the
Speaker 1: lean on somebody a little bit. But after he acquired trade,
Speaker 1: you figure outside the trade, he wouldn't got a skinny tall,
Speaker 1: skinny key I from Long Beach and made him a
Speaker 1: household name. Don't get me wrong, Pray you had a
Speaker 1: lot of influence in that. But another level though, no doubt,
Speaker 1: and you you gotta give props square they're due, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know that's what this is really about.
Speaker 1: At the end of the day. You know, any success
Speaker 1: in life is not come easy. And look, they're always humans, right,
Speaker 1: always humans that are circling around trying to be a
Speaker 1: part of that or tear you down. And it's easy
Speaker 1: to get drunk with success. It's easy to feel like
Speaker 1: I'm better than you, or I'm invincible or whatever. Those
Speaker 1: emotions that come up that that you know, we think
Speaker 1: might now that we're a little bit more mature, it
Speaker 1: may seem like they're crazy. But man, you know, when
Speaker 1: you're twenty five year old, you're never gonna die. Oh no,
Speaker 1: you think you're mortal, You're gonna live forever, right, So
Speaker 1: it's easy to fall into that trap of not really
Speaker 1: you know honestly, you know you can you cannot fulfill
Speaker 1: your purpose to you can be living it and not
Speaker 1: fulfill it. Yeah, they're just dope. So man, let me
Speaker 1: ask you this one, because I know you're busy and
Speaker 1: I ain'tle hold ship the whole night. What's going on?
Speaker 1: What do you have what you're working on right now?
Speaker 1: Because I know you've got something incredible going right now
Speaker 1: that you probably won't even disclose. Well, I've got I've
Speaker 1: got three fundamental things that I'm intimately involved in. I've
Speaker 1: got a very large name brand heritage artist that has
Speaker 1: publishing masters and um UM and those rights that we're
Speaker 1: working through, which is fantastic. So we're able to create
Speaker 1: some new intent. We're able to put some contemporary flavor
Speaker 1: in and around a really really important iconic artist. So
Speaker 1: we're doing we're working creatively, and we're working on the
Speaker 1: business side to maximize that UM And I've got two
Speaker 1: other things. I've got an application that I'll talk to
Speaker 1: you about that has some patents in around it, and
Speaker 1: we're getting close to make that announcement that will really
Speaker 1: change the face of the music experience online. And we're
Speaker 1: right there. We've got the patents in place. That's fairly confidential,
Speaker 1: but it won't be long before I'll talk to you
Speaker 1: about it. Steal and then, Um, I am also a
Speaker 1: partner in an electronic motorcycle company, so we're just now
Speaker 1: starting that. As you know, I'm a big motorcycle writer.
Speaker 1: I think I wrote it to studio to see you
Speaker 1: a couple of times. Um, and uh, oh did I
Speaker 1: lose you? Oh you're back Yep for a second there,
Speaker 1: I thought I lost you. But anyway, a UM, I'm
Speaker 1: a partner in in that company, and we're just now starting.
Speaker 1: We've got kind of our design in place, and you
Speaker 1: know this green initiative and the way that the world's
Speaker 1: going in and away from that carbon footprint. We're gonna
Speaker 1: try and uh and contribute to that and be a
Speaker 1: part of that. And I'm excited about that. So those
Speaker 1: are the three whips, three things I have going on now, um,
Speaker 1: that that are interesting to me and that I'm passionate about.
Speaker 1: So God has been great. I'm I'm still you know,
Speaker 1: I'm still here, thank God. I'm still healthy, and I
Speaker 1: still love the music. You know, music business, music business.
Speaker 1: If they'll have me back and somebody wants to pay
Speaker 1: me a lot of money on part time job, I'm available.
Speaker 1: And that's the thing, man, these guys don't want to
Speaker 1: pay that much money and that that's like when I
Speaker 1: had to thought the job, I said, well, man, I'll
Speaker 1: be losing money because when you go work for those
Speaker 1: companies they want to have a say so and everything
Speaker 1: that you got going on, like they were, that's one thing.
Speaker 1: They said, Well, if you came over the podcast, let's see.
Speaker 1: Of course, I said, unless you guys got a way
Speaker 1: to paint me a whole ship to the money to
Speaker 1: come over and do that exclusively, I said, but what
Speaker 1: I'll do with my off time is my business. So
Speaker 1: that didn't work out too well, but I appreciate you
Speaker 1: coming on man, working to people hook up with you
Speaker 1: with man. Man, I'm I'm around at info at Spaulding
Speaker 1: s P A U L D I N G E
Speaker 1: n T. Edward Nancy Thomas dot com, So Spaulding E
Speaker 1: n T dot com info at you can always reach
Speaker 1: me there. I'm not hard to find. There's usually somebody
Speaker 1: around that knows who I am and has my digits.
Speaker 1: My phone number hasn't changed in twenty five years, so
Speaker 1: I'm not running from anybody, so that's the same. So
Speaker 1: if you got my digits, so you can find somebody
Speaker 1: that has them, all you gotta do is buzz me Terry,
Speaker 1: just asking it. Okay, there we go, right there. Run.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you, brother. Hey, I thank you so much
Speaker 1: for having me on. I love you man, I want
Speaker 1: wish the best for you and your family and want
Speaker 1: you guys to stay healthy and safe. I can't wait
Speaker 1: to see you again when we all start moving around, brother,
Speaker 1: and thank you man for time with you. Thank you man,
Speaker 1: Appreciate you all right, bro,