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Speaker 1: Hmm, what's starting my podcast? That one wasn't very good,

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Speaker 1: so she's not proud of me. Uh, you know, they

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Speaker 1: can't all be what's cracking my peppers. They can't even

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Speaker 1: all be what's boiling my pig anus is um, which

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Speaker 1: was which was another another hit. I'm Robert Evans this

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Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards podcast where we talked about terrible people.

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Speaker 1: But you know that if you're listening, because this is

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Speaker 1: part two of the Georgia Can story, and if why

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Speaker 1: would you why would you just be listening to part

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Speaker 1: two first? Or you seem to get some kind of

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Speaker 1: sucking maniac? Did you murder a baby? Uh? Sophia Alexandra,

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Speaker 1: how are you doing? You are a guest for today, right,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for having a host of the

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Speaker 1: Private Parts Unknown podcast. Kickboxing third place finalist and uh

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Speaker 1: actually first place. Kind of upset that you would not

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Speaker 1: mention that it's actually nude kickboxing so it's actually a

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Speaker 1: lot harder than regular kickboxing. Yeah, that seems a lot.

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Speaker 1: Pretty upset that I wrote down all my credits for

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Speaker 1: you and you just kind of messed them up. But whatever,

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Sorry you are not mentioned like at least

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Speaker 1: three other things that I've done. I am also America's

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Speaker 1: favorite lasagna, America's favorite lasagna. That is right, That is right?

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Speaker 1: Thank you. So apologized for mentioning that in America's uh

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Speaker 1: second favorite macaroni and cheese. Okay, yes, I don't like

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Speaker 1: to talk about second place, but I am also america

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Speaker 1: The second favorite considering the amount of mac and cheese

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Speaker 1: in this country. Pretty good, I mean yeah, I'm not

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Speaker 1: trying to be falsely modest. I am delicious. You are delicious,

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Speaker 1: Thank you. Well, we're talking about someone who's not delicious.

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Speaker 1: Georgia Tan actually is a baby thief and murderer. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and that's what we're gonna talk about today. It's all

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Speaker 1: the murdering. Oh yeah. So Georgia Tan had a reputation

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Speaker 1: for being rather fearless. This was helpful because her habit

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Speaker 1: of abducting thousands of children from poor people occasionally brought

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Speaker 1: violent through It's down upon her head. According to Nellie, occasion,

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Speaker 1: occasionally some people, I don't know, I felt like it

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Speaker 1: wasn't right. Yeah, yeah, exactly. She had iron burglar proof

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Speaker 1: bars in the windows of windows of her home, and

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Speaker 1: over the course of her career, three separate people tried

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Speaker 1: to kill her, but all of them apparently chickened out,

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Speaker 1: either out of a reticence to take human life or

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Speaker 1: because Georgia scared them away. WHOA. Yeah, she was supposed

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Speaker 1: to be pretty terrifying. She was like a very large,

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Speaker 1: imposing presence um and and very mean and apparently at

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Speaker 1: least one case, like screamed a guy away who would

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Speaker 1: come to her house to get revenge. Yeah, she's an

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Speaker 1: imposing lady. I feel like it's like a challenge I'm

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Speaker 1: being presented, but it's like way too late in history,

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Speaker 1: or like, ya, Sophia, are you brave enough to kill her?

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Speaker 1: Are you brave enough? But it's too late now. George's

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Speaker 1: behavior was not strictly legal. There were actually laws in

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Speaker 1: the US about how to adopt babies, and she was

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Speaker 1: in violation of basically all of them. In most cases,

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Speaker 1: adoptive parents had to reside in the state they were

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Speaker 1: adopting from. Surrenders of parental rights had to be confirmed

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Speaker 1: in a court of law. Georgia tan broke both of

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Speaker 1: these rules flagrantly and regularly, in some cases on a

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Speaker 1: near daily basis. But also she had that judge in

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Speaker 1: her pocket. First was like Judge Daddy, and then the

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Speaker 1: second one was that lady that was crazy. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: she like did funk with the legal system, but she

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Speaker 1: sometimes just stole babies. I mean yes. By the midnighteen

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Speaker 1: thirties show, social workers in Tennessee who weren't in George's

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Speaker 1: pocket had started to complain about all of the laws

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Speaker 1: that she was breaking and baby she was stealing. Her

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Speaker 1: connections to Boss Crump were enough to protect her. However,

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Speaker 1: in seven, I'm sorry, Boss Crump, is that from protecting

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Speaker 1: the castle and the princess? I was going to say,

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Speaker 1: he sounds like a guy from the Duke's a hazard.

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Speaker 1: Old Boss Crump is in a real mess of trouble again.

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Speaker 1: Pissed at them Duke boys. Yeah, just really a great

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Speaker 1: fake name. Yeah, it was a great fake name, but

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Speaker 1: in this case it was a real guy who helped

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Speaker 1: Georgia Tan steal thousands of baby uh. In n seven,

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Speaker 1: she succeeded in pushing through a new law which legalized

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Speaker 1: adoption for out of state residents. This president would have

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Speaker 1: a huge impact on the way adoptions are carried out

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Speaker 1: nationwide moving forward, including today. The new law, however, did

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Speaker 1: require adoptive parents to visit Tennessee before finalizing the adoption,

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Speaker 1: but Georgia just ignored this part of it and it

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Speaker 1: was fine now. Georgia had started out as an employee

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Speaker 1: of the Tennessee Children's Home Society, which is based out

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Speaker 1: of Nashville. The director of the agency, Fannie L. Rod,

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Speaker 1: was a rather soft person, and Georgia basically bullied her

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Speaker 1: into getting whatever she wanted. Fanny was scared of Georgia

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Speaker 1: and basically refused to do anything about the many complaints

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Speaker 1: made against her employee. Since the Children's Home Society did

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Speaker 1: not have a license from the state, every adoption carried

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Speaker 1: out by Georgia Tan and its name was technically illegal,

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Speaker 1: but again, no one did anything to stop her, so

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Speaker 1: it wound up not mattering that it was illegal. Also,

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Speaker 1: once you're getting like amazing newspaper coverage with your Christmas babies,

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Speaker 1: like good luck taking that lady down, everyone's like she's

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Speaker 1: a saint, She's the Christmas Baby, and she's the angel

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Speaker 1: that gave people babies. She's the not the Angel of death.

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Speaker 1: Not the angel of death. According to the book The

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Speaker 1: Baby Thief Quote, Georgia frequently falsified the birthdates of many children.

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Speaker 1: She placed for adoption in every case, which of which

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Speaker 1: I learned, she reduced the children's age. She did this

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Speaker 1: to satisfy clients wishes for the youngest possible babies and

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Speaker 1: to make the children a pair, bright, even precocious. While

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Speaker 1: Georgia reduced the ages of babies by only weeks or months,

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Speaker 1: she's frequently subtracted years from the ages of older children.

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Speaker 1: So not done. She's like basically like, Hollywood. Yeah, She's like,

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Speaker 1: you're a little haggard at ten, so we're gonna go ahead.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna pull you down to a seven. It seems better. Also,

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Speaker 1: I just something like just smart about being like, well,

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Speaker 1: if I say this this seven year old is four,

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Speaker 1: then he seems smart. Like then he's really advanced four

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Speaker 1: year old and not just a normal seven year old,

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Speaker 1: and I can sell him to a richer family. They're like,

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Speaker 1: stop saying this girl is seven. She has a full

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Speaker 1: seecup's definitely least. It does make me wonder what Rick

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Speaker 1: Flair's real ages. Oh my god, I keep forgetting Rick

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Speaker 1: Flair's wants. It's the poor Rick Flair. It's got to

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Speaker 1: be traumatic, Like now, like the know how many babies

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Speaker 1: she stolen placed like so many Americans probably are not

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Speaker 1: living with their families. Seventy but we don't know that

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Speaker 1: he's seventy. He could be seventy two, could be seventy four,

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Speaker 1: and probably aged them down down. Made Rick Flair seems

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Speaker 1: like a super smart baby, not that he wasn't smart

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Speaker 1: as a baby. Yeah, I mean nothing against Rick Flair.

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Speaker 1: Smart guy. Sorry, Sorry you get stolen. Rick. Also, someone

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Speaker 1: stole the cave from you. Don't make stickers stay. Sorry

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Speaker 1: you got stolen. I don't even know what this podcast.

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Speaker 1: Sorry you got stolen totally. I feel like that's March.

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Speaker 1: You have fans, get on. This is the Sorry you

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Speaker 1: were stolen Ric Flair. Rick Flair March Georgia did not

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Speaker 1: abduct all of her products, of course, She trawled every

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Speaker 1: orphanage and children's home in the state in search of

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Speaker 1: fresh child flesh to sell, But once her operation was

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Speaker 1: up and running, her most common source of children were

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Speaker 1: the maternity wards of local Memphis hospitals. She hired a

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Speaker 1: network of spotters who would hang out waiting for poor

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Speaker 1: young women, particularly single mothers, to go into labor. Dude,

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Speaker 1: it's like ambulance chasers, but like baby chasers. Just looking

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Speaker 1: around for like a lady with a big baby bump

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Speaker 1: who looks like she doesn't have like I'm just big,

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Speaker 1: fuck you, I'm not even having a baby. Stop following me.

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Speaker 1: Just following a heavy set woman for a couple of days,

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Speaker 1: waiting until she she's like, please stop. Dr George loved Joy,

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Speaker 1: who delivered some of those babies, later recalled I'm sorry

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Speaker 1: love Joy, love Joy, you are loving the last names here.

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Speaker 1: The last names are kind of their own podcast because

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Speaker 1: they're amazing behind the ridiculous and Reverend love Joy is

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Speaker 1: a fake character on the and this is a real

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Speaker 1: person named love Joy. I think it is a pretty

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Speaker 1: common name. I'm running into some love Joys. Are you serious?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it is a silly name, but it's a

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Speaker 1: real one. Where are you from, Texas? Oh yeah, probably

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Speaker 1: more love Joys out there. Yeah, there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: Ukraine or California, which is where i've Ukranian name Ukraine Afornia.

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Speaker 1: Is there like a Ukrainian neighborhood in town that we

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Speaker 1: could there cultural center? They should call the neighborhood Ukraine Afornia.

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Speaker 1: Leaving money on the table. Yeah, okay, second piece of

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Speaker 1: fan arts Ukraine in the shape of California and it

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Speaker 1: just says Ukraine Afornia. It is for three people that

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Speaker 1: that's what we love doing. Here is is jokes that

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Speaker 1: that really appealed to No half a basketball team will

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Speaker 1: will identify with um okay uh. Dr George love Joy,

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Speaker 1: who delivered many of the babies later called quote Georgia

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Speaker 1: Tan's workers, stood outside the door of the delivery room

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Speaker 1: waiting the minute the baby was born, they would take

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Speaker 1: the paper in and have the mothers signed them, and

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Speaker 1: the baby would disappear. Now, many of these mothers were

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Speaker 1: still wasted from anesthesia when George's people forced them to sign,

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Speaker 1: were presented as routine papers. This ostensibly medical paperwork was,

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Speaker 1: of course, in reality, a surrender of parental rights. Babies

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Speaker 1: were taken right from their drug up mommies and flown

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Speaker 1: to new homes the same day. Part of why Jojo

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Speaker 1: was so successful in this was the fact that she

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Speaker 1: literally changed American cultures attitude towards single moms. See, being

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Speaker 1: a single mom has always been difficult, obviously, but for

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Speaker 1: most of American history there was not a huge stigma

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Speaker 1: attached to it. Husbands died, after all, it was like,

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Speaker 1: you know, there was no medicine back then, but starting

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Speaker 1: in Memphis, Georgia labored to convince courts and the public

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Speaker 1: that single white women should not be allowed to raise

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Speaker 1: their own babies. This is part of why, on the

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Speaker 1: few occasions she was taken to court over it, Georgia

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Speaker 1: nearly always won her cases. No judge was going to

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Speaker 1: take a baby from a rich or middle class too

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Speaker 1: parent household and give it to a single poor woman.

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Speaker 1: Damn yep, according to the baby would have sure had

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Speaker 1: me stolen a single mom. Yeah, that happened up until

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Speaker 1: very recently the seventies in a lot of cases, according

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Speaker 1: to the baby thief quote. By the late nineteen thirties,

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Speaker 1: single mothers were not only being prevented from bonding with

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Speaker 1: their babies, but often even from seeing them. Mothers were

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Speaker 1: sometimes blindfolded during labor. Some social workers urged pregnant way

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Speaker 1: young women to sign forms allowing doctors to circumcise their

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Speaker 1: child if it turned out to be a boy, so

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Speaker 1: that the workers could keep mothers uninformed of even their

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Speaker 1: babies gender. By the time adoption became nationally popular in

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Speaker 1: the mid nineteen forties, the reversal was complete, and for

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Speaker 1: the first time in history, white single mothers were expected

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Speaker 1: to surrender their babies for adoption. That relinquishment was endorsed

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Speaker 1: by leaders of such reputable organizations as the Child Welfare

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Speaker 1: League of America, the American Public Welfare Association, the Salvation Army,

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Speaker 1: Catholic charities, and most psychiatrists and psychologists. Lead dissenting social

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Speaker 1: scientists Clark Vincent to predict a future in which newborns

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Speaker 1: of all white single mothers would be seized by the state.

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Speaker 1: By the nineteen fifties of white singled on when we

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Speaker 1: go back to the fact that they were blindfolded when

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Speaker 1: giving birth so they couldn't say them that must have

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Speaker 1: been so terrifying. Yeah, holy sh it, it's already the

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Speaker 1: worst experience. You're all like drugged up the pain, they're

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Speaker 1: going to steal your baby, and then like they blindfold you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that is nuts. Yeah, Yeah, it's pretty fucked Like

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Speaker 1: the only game of hide and seek we're going to

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Speaker 1: ever play with your baby. It's so much sadder. What

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Speaker 1: do you think about it that way? I know, but

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Speaker 1: there's no seek, It's just a game of hides. It's

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Speaker 1: a one time pika boo situation. Yeah. By the nineteen

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Speaker 1: fifties of white women in maternity homes, which is where

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Speaker 1: poor single women tended to give birth surrendered their children

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Speaker 1: for adoption. So Sam Yeah, Georgia also trawled the various

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Speaker 1: orphanages of Tennessee in search of new inventory. One worker

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Speaker 1: recalled quote, I can still hear her steps down the

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Speaker 1: hallway and see her funny hats. She had big feet

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Speaker 1: and more black lace up shoes. She always went upstairs

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Speaker 1: to see the babies. There would be masses of them

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Speaker 1: one day and they'd be gone the next. So Georgia

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Speaker 1: would take pictures of the best babies, which were usually

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Speaker 1: blonde haired and blue eyed, and then send them off

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Speaker 1: to prospective clients. These kids were the lucky ones, you know.

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Speaker 1: The kids who were in genuinely bad situations were off

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Speaker 1: and probably helped by George's work, but not always uh well.

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Speaker 1: Many of George's kids wound up in the hands of wealthy,

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Speaker 1: loving family. She didn't actually do any kind of vetting

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Speaker 1: at all to make sure of that. The only background

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Speaker 1: check was whether or not the new mom and dad

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Speaker 1: had hundreds of dollars exactly. George's kids didn't even all

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Speaker 1: end up in families. One of them wound up at

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Speaker 1: the University of Tennessee as a ward of the Home

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Speaker 1: Economics department. Oh my god, award of a school department,

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Speaker 1: serving as a flesh and blood textbook for students. The

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Speaker 1: department changed his name from Richard House to Richard Practice House.

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Speaker 1: What also Dick House? What practice House? They were like,

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Speaker 1: just so you don't forget that you're since essentially chattel, Like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: let's fucking change her name to practice guy. A lot

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Speaker 1: of the stuff that went on then did definitely verge

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Speaker 1: on child slavery. It's pretty dark for ar is. Georgia

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Speaker 1: Tan was seen as an authority on child welfare. She was,

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Speaker 1: in essence, America's chief social worker. Eleanor Roosevelt esther for

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Speaker 1: advice on improving conditions for poor children. She was invited

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Speaker 1: to collaborate it let me, let me steal or kill them.

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Speaker 1: She was invited to collaborate on books about adoption, and

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Speaker 1: sought out by the likes of The New York Times

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Speaker 1: for her commentary on stories of abuse and children's homes

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Speaker 1: around the country. This was a dark irony because the

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Speaker 1: reality is that Georgia Tan abused children on a scale

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Speaker 1: and with a viciousness more suited for a concentration camp

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Speaker 1: than an orphanage. Children who were abducted by Georgia would

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Speaker 1: spend weeks, months, or even years in a series of

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Speaker 1: dreadfully crowded boarding homes. These were often just small apartments.

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Speaker 1: A two bedroom might be filled with as many as

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Speaker 1: ten children. On at least one instant. Six infants were

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Speaker 1: found in a single crib. Babies were fed spoiled milk,

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Speaker 1: often because functional refrigerators were not always in the budget.

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Speaker 1: Tins of children would be crammed into spaces condemned by

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Speaker 1: authorities as fire hazards. Georgia refused to pay for medical

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Speaker 1: treatment for kids with syphilis or other contagious diseases that

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Speaker 1: would have cut into her profit margin. Damn, damn. You

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Speaker 1: know what, Now is a good time for an ad pivot. Products.

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Speaker 1: We're back. I don't know how to how to lead

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Speaker 1: into that ad pivot in a graceful way. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: don't know if you can gracefully transition from baby murder

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Speaker 1: into products and then back to baby murder. But we're

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Speaker 1: doing it. We're doing it because we're going We're going

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Speaker 1: right back to Yeah. Uh so, um, we were talking

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Speaker 1: about how she often would refuse to pay for medical

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Speaker 1: treatment for kids with contagious diseases, because of course, that

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Speaker 1: ship's expensive and you're running a business here. According to

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Speaker 1: the baby thief quote, she refused to even acknowledge illness

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Speaker 1: and her children and forbade her boarding mothers from summoning

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Speaker 1: medical help. Faced with desperately sick children. However, some boarding

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Speaker 1: mothers panicked and sent them to the hospital. The trip

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Speaker 1: was often made too late. The deaths of most of

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Speaker 1: these babies were presumably recorded, and the children buried in

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Speaker 1: the area of Elmwood Cemetery used by her adoption agency,

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Speaker 1: but Georgia disposed of the bodies of children who death

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Speaker 1: she could conceal unless the regular ways. A reporter for

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Speaker 1: the Press Simitar passed George's home one night in the

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Speaker 1: nineteen forties and saw someone burying something in the backyard,

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Speaker 1: a child. The reporter believed. Former investigator Robert Taylor told

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Speaker 1: me that Georgia had had the local Thompson Brothers funeral

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Speaker 1: home cremate some of the children, getting rid of the evidence.

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Speaker 1: Taylor said a grave as proof. Yeah. Pretty the Charles Carter,

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Speaker 1: a pediatrician who volunteered at the Children's Home and treated

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Speaker 1: many of Miss Tan's inventory. Told Barbara Raymond that Georgia

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Speaker 1: would even overrule his express medical guidance at times. Quote.

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Speaker 1: I had prescribed penicillin and learned later that she had

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Speaker 1: ordered her nurses to stop giving it to the baby,

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Speaker 1: but continued to chart it as if they were. Georgia

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Speaker 1: Tans simply would not listen. She would say, I'll take

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Speaker 1: your words under advisement, but she never did. She did

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Speaker 1: what she felt best, regardless of what anyone said. She

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Speaker 1: felt she knew the babies and what the babies needed.

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Speaker 1: Yeah plague death. So many of George's children got sick

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Speaker 1: that one hospital in Memphis dedicated an entire ward to

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Speaker 1: taking care of them. A Los Angeles hospital had to

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Speaker 1: do the same thing for the river of sick and

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Speaker 1: dying babies Georgia brought into the city to sell to

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Speaker 1: Hollywood types. By nineteen thirty two, Memphis, Tennessee had the

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Speaker 1: highest infant death rate of any major American city, mostly

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Speaker 1: fights to Georgia Tan. Now we don't know how many

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Speaker 1: babies died in Georgia Tan's care. We do know that

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Speaker 1: in one particularly brutal winter, the winter of nineteen forty five.

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Speaker 1: As many as fifty babies died in the children's home alone.

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Speaker 1: Babies died when they were left out in the sun unattended.

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Speaker 1: Some died within days of arriving in their adoptive homes

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Speaker 1: because no care had been taken to make sure they

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Speaker 1: were fed or medicated in the days and weeks before transit.

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Speaker 1: In at least one case, Georgia Tan abducted a set

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Speaker 1: of premature twins and removed them from the hospital before

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Speaker 1: they were stable. Both twins died. In total, it's estimated

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Speaker 1: that as many as five hundred babies died in Georgia

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Speaker 1: Tan's care. The real death toll maybe even higher, perhaps

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Speaker 1: much higher. Yeah, that's kind of what it seems. Five

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Speaker 1: doesn't seem right. It seems like you might have killed

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Speaker 1: a couple of thousand, Yeah, definitely, Yeah, five hundreds kind

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Speaker 1: of the minimum. It doesn't Yeah, it doesn't even make sun.

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Speaker 1: And if you're saying about someone they killed at least

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Speaker 1: five hundred babies, kind of I can't really imagine much worse. Like,

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Speaker 1: the only other people you can say that about are

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Speaker 1: usually like concentration camp guards, Like yeah, yeah, Like when

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Speaker 1: you talk about that many dead babies. That's so many

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Speaker 1: dead babies or people that orchestrate, like specifically genocide. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like it's Georgia Tan and genocide committers. I mean she's

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Speaker 1: a death all star. Yeah, definitely an achiever. She's over achiever.

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Speaker 1: People ask a lot, you know, you should cover more

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Speaker 1: women bastards on the show, which we're doing, But it's

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Speaker 1: Georgia Tan. She belongs on the list. Yeah. Man, she's

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Speaker 1: she's right up there, She's right up there. She's one

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Speaker 1: of the worst people I've heard about. Question. Is she single? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well no, Actually she had a partner who was I

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Speaker 1: think on paper her secretary because she was Muspian. But

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Speaker 1: did she help murder the babies? Probably right? Yeah, we

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Speaker 1: don't we not, I mean, not that I know of,

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Speaker 1: but probably probably right. Yeah. I know how you wouldn't

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Speaker 1: be aware of that if you're girlfriends like heavy into

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Speaker 1: murder and he probably seeps into your relationship. And from

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Speaker 1: what little we know about it, it it seems like it

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Speaker 1: was a pretty abusive relationship. Georgia was definitely the dominant one.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, And it would be a shocker if you

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Speaker 1: were like she was the abused one and be like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, she's that's what she's taken out on

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Speaker 1: the babies. Yea. But clearly something happened to her, right

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Speaker 1: was pretty domineering in a dick like wouldn't let her

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Speaker 1: be a lawyer and stuff? Yeah, but that that doesn't

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Speaker 1: lead to baby murder. I just feel like, do you

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Speaker 1: think she was abused to have like a weird preoccupation

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Speaker 1: with babies like that? Yeah? I think she was abused.

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Speaker 1: I think, um, she got addicted to like the sense

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Speaker 1: of setting these babies up with somebody, And I think

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Speaker 1: I think some of it is just like you know,

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Speaker 1: she came from this period of time where you didn't

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Speaker 1: really give that much of a ship about babies in

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Speaker 1: like the eighteen nineties, Like you know, I think people

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Speaker 1: like thinking of themselves as a good person even when

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Speaker 1: they're doing terrible things. So she probably was like, I

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Speaker 1: am saving these babies, and she really believed it. And

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Speaker 1: she thought the ones that died, well, they would have

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Speaker 1: grown up poor and that's worse than death, right exactly

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Speaker 1: or what does it matter? Or like they were supposed

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Speaker 1: to die? Yeah, I mean you can say anything to

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Speaker 1: yourself when you're like trying to justify some fucked up

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00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:14,000
Speaker 1: ship you really, I say that ship when I'm like getting,

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00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:16,760
Speaker 1: you know, like an extra fucking Taco Bell thing that

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Speaker 1: I don't need, it's like, you know, it's it's really

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Speaker 1: close to baby murder, basically getting that you didn't need.

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Speaker 1: Taco Bell sponsored the show, and you will stop comparing

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Speaker 1: your products to murdering babies. No, no, no, it's way

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00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:35,720
Speaker 1: better Taco Bell better than killing a baby. That's a

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00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:39,680
Speaker 1: slogan right there. It's sell some fucking again merch. I'm

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00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:41,840
Speaker 1: just coming up with all these merch ideas and I

378
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:44,399
Speaker 1: feel like you should pay me, so thank you. We'll

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Speaker 1: let you know if the Taco Bell people reach out, Yeah,

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00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:48,720
Speaker 1: I think they kind of have to. I think they're

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Speaker 1: really gonna like this is unbeatable pad campaign. Yeah, yeah,

382
00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:58,240
Speaker 1: better than murdering a baby. So one of the babies

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Speaker 1: that Georgia Tan murdered was the daughter of Alma Sipple.

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Speaker 1: In the spring of nineteen forty six, Miss Sipple moved

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Speaker 1: to Memphis with her infant daughter and two year old son.

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Speaker 1: Her boyfriend, Julius Talos, was in the military and had

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Speaker 1: just left for Panama. They planned to marry. Alma later

388
00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:13,960
Speaker 1: recalled quote, we were so crazy about each other. It

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Speaker 1: didn't matter if we were married or not. So six

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00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:18,600
Speaker 1: weeks after moving to Memphis, Alma was visited by a

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Speaker 1: representative of the Children's Home Society named Georgia Tan. Georgia

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Speaker 1: said she was looking into allegations of child abuse against

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Speaker 1: one of Alma's neighbors, so at first Alma thought nothing

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Speaker 1: was wrong, at least not with her. The next day,

395
00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:33,280
Speaker 1: Georgia Tan returned in her large black limo. This time

396
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Speaker 1: she had questions about the child's father, questions Alma Sipple

397
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Speaker 1: could not comfortably answer. Next, according to the New York

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Speaker 1: Post quote, the woman looked at Irma, who had a

399
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Speaker 1: running nose, and said, your baby sick, isn't she? You

400
00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,600
Speaker 1: should get her a checkup. Simple explained that she had

401
00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:49,119
Speaker 1: no money for a doctor, so the woman generously offered

402
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Speaker 1: to take the child to the Memphis General Hospital. Looking back,

403
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:55,439
Speaker 1: Simple wonders at her own naivete How I how did

404
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,280
Speaker 1: I mess up so bad? I guess she knew the

405
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:59,960
Speaker 1: dumb ones. Still, she had been worried about her baby's health,

406
00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,760
Speaker 1: and she'd assumed that she would go with them to

407
00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:03,919
Speaker 1: the hospital, so she had signed a piece of paper

408
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:05,919
Speaker 1: when Tan had told her it would be impossible for

409
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Speaker 1: her to go along. Simple remembers, I had a weird feeling,

410
00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:13,640
Speaker 1: but I thought, well, you've got to trust somebody. Yeah,

411
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Speaker 1: paper was, of course, a surrender of parental rights of

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Speaker 1: Simple's baby went along with Georgia Tan, and that was

413
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Speaker 1: the last Alma ever saw of her. When she showed

414
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Speaker 1: up at the children's ward of the hospital the next

415
00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: day to inquire as to her child's status, the nurse

416
00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,080
Speaker 1: told her you don't have a baby in there. Those

417
00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,639
Speaker 1: children belonged to the Children's Home Society. For days, Alma

418
00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:34,560
Speaker 1: Sipple called the children's Home and Georgia Tan. No one

419
00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,959
Speaker 1: answered until weeks later, Georgia picked up and told her

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Speaker 1: that her daughter had died of pneumonia, in the same

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00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:40,679
Speaker 1: sort of way you might tell someone a carton of

422
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,480
Speaker 1: eggs had broken. Being a human, Alma said that she

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00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:45,880
Speaker 1: wanted to bury her child. Georgia told her that would

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Speaker 1: not be possible, saying the state had put her daughter away.

425
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,560
Speaker 1: After that, Alma says, I guess I went crazy. She

426
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,440
Speaker 1: left the other children in her mother's charge and went

427
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:56,480
Speaker 1: to Memphis to find her baby's grave. She never located it, because,

428
00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:58,879
Speaker 1: of course, Georgia Tan never bothered to give her baby

429
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 1: a grave cool fun story. You gotta joke to to

430
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 1: live on the sup live and that one up. Nah, Well,

431
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 1: I guess it's time for another ad pivot. Oh, I

432
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,680
Speaker 1: mean this baby murdering story was always could be a

433
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 1: rough one to pivot to products with buy stuff, but

434
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:31,919
Speaker 1: not not babies. No, the only thing you should not

435
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:38,359
Speaker 1: buy his babies. People. Yeah, grown up or small. You know,

436
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:40,680
Speaker 1: let's just let's put it. I don't want to don't

437
00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:42,560
Speaker 1: buy people. Yeah, I'm not trying to be you know,

438
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,520
Speaker 1: all uh controversial. Yeah, not trying to the anti capitalist here.

439
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:49,560
Speaker 1: Just maybe don't buy people. It's probably probably a good

440
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:59,680
Speaker 1: rule of thumb. Maybe keep that line. Products. We're back,

441
00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 1: good products, solid services. Let's get back to talking about

442
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:11,199
Speaker 1: horrible thing babies. No, at this point, I'll bet you

443
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,000
Speaker 1: might think something along the lines of Georgia Tan couldn't

444
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,199
Speaker 1: possibly get any worse. Well, straw man, listener, you were

445
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,639
Speaker 1: dumb for thinking that. Of course she can get worse.

446
00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:22,359
Speaker 1: In addition to stealing thousands of babies and killing hundreds

447
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:25,439
Speaker 1: of this is where the molestation comes in. Yeah, he

448
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,679
Speaker 1: was waiting for that. Yeah, she molested a bunch of babies.

449
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 1: One of her victims as a fifty four year old

450
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:34,280
Speaker 1: man from Memphis. You know babies. Yeah, it seems like it.

451
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:37,640
Speaker 1: You see, this is interesting. I think both genders. Uh

452
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 1: yeah what sometimes people who lost really young. So it's

453
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,280
Speaker 1: not much of a difference, not much of the difference.

454
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:49,119
Speaker 1: Just wants them to be probably like helpless. Yeah, I

455
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,919
Speaker 1: think that's sad, big part of it. So one of

456
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:54,480
Speaker 1: her victims, you know, decades later, is a year old

457
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 1: man claimed he and his twin brother were molested by

458
00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 1: Georgia when they were eight. He told the Daily Pantograph quote,

459
00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:02,959
Speaker 1: we remember being in a big bed, strip naked. Georgia

460
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 1: Tan and some other people were there reaching for us

461
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 1: and kissing us and touching us where we shouldn't be touched.

462
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 1: Sexual assault and physical assault sort of blended together for

463
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 1: many of George's victims. One of them, a young girl

464
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: named Mary, recalled Georgia beating her with a wooden spoon

465
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,919
Speaker 1: in a bathroom. She squatted over me, gouging me. She

466
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:20,440
Speaker 1: seemed like a giant. She was sadistic, evil. I thought

467
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,959
Speaker 1: of her as the devil. Another adoptive, five years old

468
00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 1: at the time of the abuse, recalled to Barbara Raymond

469
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 1: that yes, sexual abuse at the hands of Georgia Tan

470
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:30,639
Speaker 1: was very true, and it was presented as your favor.

471
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:33,440
Speaker 1: She says, the abuse occurred in a gorgeous room. I

472
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 1: remember the shock of the room, so overwhelming and beautiful.

473
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:37,680
Speaker 1: I remember being told to come sit in her lap.

474
00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:39,280
Speaker 1: I keep trying to block it all out, but it

475
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,679
Speaker 1: keeps coming. It's caused me a lot of problems. You

476
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:43,920
Speaker 1: won't find a whole lot of healthy adults who went

477
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 1: through there now. Over the course of this podcast, I

478
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: referred to Georgie's children as products and inventory several times.

479
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 1: This was not a joke on my part. Georgia Tan's

480
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 1: own lawyer called them products. He wrote to one of

481
00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,240
Speaker 1: her clients in n four, it is not often we

482
00:24:57,280 --> 00:24:58,720
Speaker 1: have the good luck that we have in your case,

483
00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:01,119
Speaker 1: namely of having the merchant dice in hand to stock

484
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,359
Speaker 1: and deliver to you immediately. Jesus a baby he was

485
00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:07,119
Speaker 1: talking about. On an occasion in which he couldn't fulfill

486
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 1: an order, he told another client, this is one business

487
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 1: in which we can never tell when we can fill

488
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,160
Speaker 1: an order. You know, he just never knows to hold

489
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,280
Speaker 1: on a second until we steal another baby. Yeah, human

490
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,320
Speaker 1: babies retreated very much as commodities in this industry, as

491
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 1: the baby thief records. Quote, blue eyes were decided advantage,

492
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: as was female gender. Baby girls are more feminine, alluring.

493
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:29,240
Speaker 1: They are grand little self advisors, and they know instinctively

494
00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: how to strut their stuff. They stretch out their dimpled arms,

495
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 1: gurgle at some secret baby joke, blow air bubbles from

496
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 1: moist cupids, bow mouths, and women and strong men grow mad,

497
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,399
Speaker 1: become besotted with adoration and want to kidnap them on

498
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,120
Speaker 1: the spot. The author contended that males with the wrong

499
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 1: hair color were at a distinct disadvantage. If a boy

500
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: is redheaded, his chance of finding a new mama or

501
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 1: papa is practically zero. Nobody wants him at all. I mean,

502
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:55,240
Speaker 1: we were joking about that, but that's sucked up. That's

503
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 1: super fucked up. Brandon, a young child abducted by Georgia Tan,

504
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: later recalled what it was being abducted for sale. Quote.

505
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: We were herded into the car and brought back to Memphis.

506
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 1: When we got there, they dropped my two brothers off

507
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: at another holding place, and they took me to the

508
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: house on Poplar. I remember the parties where they would

509
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 1: dress up the children and take them downstairs for a

510
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,400
Speaker 1: meet and greet. Some of the children would come back,

511
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 1: some wouldn't cool. Virginia Simmons, one of the babies sold

512
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,439
Speaker 1: by Georgia Tan, later recalled that she felt like she

513
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,440
Speaker 1: was ordered like quote out of a Sears robot catalog.

514
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:27,280
Speaker 1: When she developed scoliosis. Her new mother rejected her, saying,

515
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:28,960
Speaker 1: I spent a lot of money on you, and you're

516
00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: such a disappointment. If I knew you were going to

517
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:35,200
Speaker 1: develop that crooked back, I would never have picked you out. Cool,

518
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:38,680
Speaker 1: I'll told. Georgia is suspected of arranging at minimum five

519
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,399
Speaker 1: thousand adoptions in her career. She built the bones of

520
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 1: the modern adoption system that persists nationally and worldwide today.

521
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: In the mid forties, she was diagnosed with uterine cancer,

522
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 1: which would kill her in nineteen fifty. This coincided with

523
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,200
Speaker 1: the gradual collapse of her adoption empire. For one thing,

524
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: Boss Crump's influence had started to crumble in this period.

525
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 1: Crumb's political nemesis, Gordon Browning had been elected governor in

526
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 1: ninety eight. He'd gone after Georgia Tan as a way

527
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:06,760
Speaker 1: to attack Boss crumb crumbled, Boss Crump crumbles. Yeah, that

528
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:11,440
Speaker 1: has to have been a newspaper headline. Boss Crump crumbles, Yeah,

529
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 1: a hundred. I think it's crazy that she okay, obviously

530
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 1: crazy that she molested those kids, but that one kid

531
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 1: said there are other people in the room molesting with her,

532
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: so like she clearly arranged these like weird sex parties

533
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 1: where like her children could get abused like a mass

534
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 1: That's like, yeah, that's fucking crazy. And it was also

535
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 1: one of the things that the Baby Thief makes a

536
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 1: point of pointing this out is that in this period

537
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 1: of time at orphanages and stuff, an awful lot and

538
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: perhaps most of the employees and like you're talking about thirties, forties,

539
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,720
Speaker 1: fifties molested the kids. Like that was kind of like

540
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:50,560
Speaker 1: why you do a job that terrible like that, because

541
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 1: it's like the little bonus for you, Yeah, you're a pedophile.

542
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 1: This is a percent like like a lifetime series, you know,

543
00:27:57,800 --> 00:27:59,679
Speaker 1: like they did that, they did that one about that

544
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,040
Speaker 1: lay the who with the munchaus On syndrome. Oh god,

545
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: the m um, Yeah, I know the one you're talking about.

546
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 1: This is very much this, Like this definitely should be

547
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,959
Speaker 1: a multipart story because this is so crazy. It's one

548
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 1: of those things it should be. But also like, I

549
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: don't know how many people are gonna be able to

550
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,679
Speaker 1: listen to all of this episode. Yeah, I don't like

551
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 1: it's just so dark. Yeah, like, yeah, you would only

552
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: want to watch that movie if there's like serious come

553
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 1: up and yeah. Yeah, and the teran cancer is like

554
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 1: kind of a weird ironic cancer is ironic situation. But

555
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 1: I say that as a breast cancer survivor. Yeah, my

556
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,719
Speaker 1: my cancer was not ironic. It was just straight up

557
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: but hers, that's super ironic. Every now and then cancer

558
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 1: gets it right for real, for real. Now. As Georgia

559
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: was in the later stages of her cancer, Governor Browning

560
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 1: appointed a special investigator to look into her child abduction work.

561
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 1: The case was announced in September of ninety less than

562
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 1: a month before her death. It was the sort of

563
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 1: justice you can expect from politicians, late enough to avoid

564
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 1: any real conflict or controversy. Most of the allegations against

565
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 1: Georgia had to do with her improper allocation of the

566
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 1: funds she had made through adopting out children. They only

567
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 1: care about the money, They only cared about the money,

568
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 1: not her mass kidnapping, rape or all the dead babies

569
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: after Tan's sounds like America. Right after Tan's death, Justice

570
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 1: Kelly retired from her the judge ship. She was protected

571
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:30,280
Speaker 1: from prosecution until her death in nine. George's life has

572
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 1: had a lumber of long standing impacts. For one thing,

573
00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 1: the concept of adoption was normalized on a national level.

574
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: The shame around it was gone, which was an objectively

575
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: good thing. However, another holdover from Georgia Tan's uh career

576
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 1: is the fact that adoption records were sealed and adopted

577
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: children were held back from knowing the identities of their

578
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 1: birth parents, and many parts of the United States the

579
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 1: law still works this way, a holdover from the era

580
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: of Georgia Tan because it made it easier for her

581
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: to sell an abduct in the molest Babies. Has any

582
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 1: work been done in trying to locate all the kids, Yeah,

583
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 1: a lot of that work has been done somebody, like

584
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 1: the kids themselves. There's a lot of people who have

585
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 1: tracked down their own history. Barbara Raymond, the author of

586
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 1: The Baby Thief, did a lot of that work and

587
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 1: like it has done very good journalism to try and

588
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: put it together. It's one of those things. It will

589
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 1: will never have a comprehensive list because there was no

590
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: of course, this was a criminal enterprise. Yeah, she specifically

591
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 1: hid a lot of the things so you wouldn't be

592
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 1: able to figure out. But I just feel like, what

593
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 1: what a crazy thing to grow up and then find

594
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 1: out that you were one of the babies that was abducted.

595
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 1: Whether they had a nice life with your parents or not,

596
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 1: it would still flip you out to find something like

597
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:33,440
Speaker 1: that out. Yeah, And I didn't include a lot of

598
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: the stories that she does in The Baby Thieves about

599
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 1: what these people, like, these stolen babies like, like the

600
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 1: trauma they dealt with as adults, but like a lot

601
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: of them their lives were just fucked because they were

602
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: old enough that they remembered being ripped from their mom's arms.

603
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 1: There were five or six when it happened, and they

604
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 1: spent the whole their whole lives trying to like find

605
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: their parents again, like they would turn out their mom

606
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: and died or whatever. Um, it's just it's just it's

607
00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 1: just terrible. It's it's the worst. Like I said, this

608
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:01,680
Speaker 1: might be the most depressing episode of the show we

609
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 1: ever do I have trouble imagining like obviously someone recovering

610
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 1: from this, or yeah, I have trouble imagining like a

611
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: worse tale than the tale of Georgia Tan and what

612
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,760
Speaker 1: she did. Yeah, Like there's even like obviously, like on

613
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: an objective like level of scale, stuff like a concentration

614
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: camp is worse and bigger and involved a lot more people.

615
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: But on like a level of human evil, there's something

616
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 1: about Georgia Tan specifically that's so wretched. Um, it's it's

617
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:34,720
Speaker 1: really hard. Well I think about yeah, yeah, murder obviously

618
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 1: is terrible, but when you think about like children, like

619
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: babies being murdered, who you know are the most innocent

620
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 1: of what we have, then it is like a different level.

621
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: And then yeah, when you add the slavery and the

622
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,280
Speaker 1: molestation into it, and then you think about how many

623
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: people because it broke up families. It didn't just break them, Yeah,

624
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,640
Speaker 1: the children that broke the moms, the dad's Yeah, you're

625
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: talking in their in their siblings, like you're talking talking

626
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 1: mass mass generational trauma that they're like, that's your legacy, essentially,

627
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 1: tens of thousands of victims. You know, if you're if

628
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,400
Speaker 1: you're five thousand babies stolen tens of thousands of victims.

629
00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,560
Speaker 1: It's yeah, and I mean probably those numbers are low

630
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 1: to probably those numbers are very low. Yeah, that's just

631
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,400
Speaker 1: best estimates. And I mean I feel like there's kind

632
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 1: of a weird, interesting level of maybe sexism um that

633
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 1: plays into it, where it's like women maybe are given

634
00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: more leeway and things like this because they're like, well,

635
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 1: women are natural caretakers, caregivers, women are naturally maternal, women

636
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 1: naturally are drawn to children. So I feel like then

637
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 1: when you have like a woman who's like heading and

638
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 1: spearheading a campaign and it's like I'm doing this and

639
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 1: I'm helping babies, I think people are more likely to

640
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 1: believe her or something because of that level of like

641
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 1: women are natural. Yeah, you're getting two sides of sexism there,

642
00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 1: because she's able to get away with it because of

643
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: this idea that like, you know, she's a woman doing

644
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: this is what they should be doing. She knows what's

645
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 1: best for these kids. But also they're getting taken from

646
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 1: single mothers because single mothers are seen as a table

647
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 1: of raising. Like it's it's this like double edged sort

648
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,400
Speaker 1: of sexes. Yeah, I mean it hurts everybody and Also

649
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:15,240
Speaker 1: when you think about the fact that, like who knows

650
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 1: what would have happened if she had been allowed to

651
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: be a lawyer, Right, that's also another level to be

652
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,400
Speaker 1: like maybe she just would have been terrible on a

653
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,680
Speaker 1: smaller scale without baby murder. But also like you just

654
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:30,200
Speaker 1: you don't know, and the fact that like she has

655
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 1: that abuse thing and whatever. It's like, who knows what

656
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 1: the fun her dad did to her? You know, it's like,

657
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 1: yeah he was he was domineering. Who knows there might

658
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: have been like a level of like he molested her

659
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,360
Speaker 1: and then sucked her up for the rest of her life.

660
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 1: And I feel like, yeah, just like the amount of

661
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 1: sexism and not trusting women also and letting people the

662
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:51,960
Speaker 1: signing a way parental rights and then having women have

663
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: no power to get them back. Like, yeah, it's all

664
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 1: a weird. Sexism goes both ways in a really weird

665
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:07,240
Speaker 1: way in this story. It's pretty well. Sophia also, sorry,

666
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 1: but I think it's crazy that no one talks about this.

667
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 1: I know, right, how is this the first time? And

668
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 1: this is actually I should give some credit to a

669
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:18,399
Speaker 1: couple of different fans have independently suggested that I look

670
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: into Georgia Tan for some time. Yeah, that's that's incredible story.

671
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 1: I can't believe. I didn't know that. I've never heard

672
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:26,959
Speaker 1: of this lady before, and it's fucking nuts. And she's

673
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: like a big building block in our society. The modern

674
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: system of adoption. Yeah, which, like adoption, I think is

675
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 1: objectively one of the best things you can do, you know,

676
00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 1: a kid a family, but not this way, not like style, yeah,

677
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:47,920
Speaker 1: not like ordering them out of a catalog, being like

678
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 1: i'd like a blonde Yeah. Yeah, man, Yeah, that's rough. Sorry.

679
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 1: Rick Flair, Oh my god. Also, has Rick Flair ever

680
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,439
Speaker 1: talked about this? I don't know, because, oh my god,

681
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 1: can we please reach out to him and be like,

682
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 1: this is crazy, Rick Flair, what do you think? I

683
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,279
Speaker 1: mean part of me is like if he if he's

684
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 1: lucky enough to not remember it, I probably wouldn't want

685
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 1: to like push on somebody to like look into that

686
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: part of their past, like and it wasn't bad. Like

687
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,440
Speaker 1: we're afraid of upsetting Ric Flair. I mean, that's a

688
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 1: tough thing to have in your background. Rick Flair is

689
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:21,399
Speaker 1: a wrestler, but he's still a person. I'm not saying

690
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 1: he's not a person. But I'm saying like, maybe you

691
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 1: would also bring him peace to talk about it. If

692
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: Rick Flair wants to come on the show and talk

693
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: about because this is so crazy being abducted as a baby, Like, yeah,

694
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 1: we're You'd love to talk to you. And also on

695
00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:37,839
Speaker 1: any listeners that have listened to this, they're like, this

696
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 1: was part of my family or something they should reach

697
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 1: out because what an insane thing. Suspect at least one

698
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:46,640
Speaker 1: person is going to be like, oh shit, my grandma

699
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,879
Speaker 1: or my my mom or whatever like and I'm sure

700
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:52,000
Speaker 1: like at a certain point when you find that out,

701
00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 1: you want to find all the people that that this

702
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 1: has happened to, because it's such a particular awful thing

703
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: that you kind of want to have some of belonging

704
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 1: to somewhere to talk to somebody about it that knows

705
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:05,440
Speaker 1: what it's like well. And one of the things that

706
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,480
Speaker 1: occurs to me now is that you know Georgia tan

707
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 1: we're looking at her victim cauntas around five thousand or so,

708
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:15,440
Speaker 1: but like she is the reason why for decades it

709
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 1: was the norm to just take babies from single women

710
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,360
Speaker 1: when they give birth. So really that's maybe even a

711
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 1: couple of I don't know how many women had happen to,

712
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 1: but it's insane, Like I didn't know that was just

713
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,319
Speaker 1: the norm for until pretty recently, Like not when I

714
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 1: was like, but when my parents were young adults, Like

715
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,759
Speaker 1: they might have given birth to me, you know, they

716
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:42,280
Speaker 1: like the doctor who delivered me might have delivered babies

717
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 1: a few years earlier and handed them straight to an

718
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:49,480
Speaker 1: adoption agency. Basically, Like that's fucking wild. Yeah, that's crazy.

719
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 1: Who have that? Everyone hamation? Now you're ready to take

720
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 1: on the rest that year to a Yeah, I know

721
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 1: a lot of people listen to the show on the

722
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,880
Speaker 1: way home driving to work, and you're gonna have a

723
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,880
Speaker 1: lot of dead eyed people in work today thinking about

724
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:16,480
Speaker 1: all the babies Georgia stolen. We're all sorry about that. Sorry,

725
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 1: you know what podcast? I warned people up front? You

726
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,719
Speaker 1: did did you you gave a trigger warning? I did that.

727
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: This is the only time I've done that. Um, I

728
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 1: mean I feel like I'm triggered. Yeah, a little bit,

729
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,440
Speaker 1: feeling a little sad. Feel like you should be after this,

730
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: do some aftercare. Listen to I still don't know what

731
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:37,799
Speaker 1: the show is, but the name Come Town makes me laugh,

732
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: and the come Boys I'm just gonna make myself come

733
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 1: after this. That's the only way to recover. That is

734
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: the better. I want the glow, that postmasturbatory glow to

735
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: envelope me and to obscure any negativity from this, wipe

736
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 1: out the horror of Georgia Tan's existence. Yeah, and I've

737
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 1: said that, like, I'm for sure going to remain umber

738
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 1: her name. Yeah. Yeah, it'll be stuck in everybody's head

739
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: just like no, but we got to think about Rufus Raspberry,

740
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:12,240
Speaker 1: Rufus Raspberry. That's that's the walk away with that Rufus Raspberry,

741
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:18,799
Speaker 1: Boss Crumb, Yeah, Rufus Raspberry. Yeah, I think about that. Yeah. God,

742
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:23,800
Speaker 1: it does sound like an old TV show. Yeah, alright, Sophia,

743
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 1: you wanna plug them plugable? Sure? Um find me on

744
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:34,720
Speaker 1: Twitter and Instagram at the Sophia k so so f

745
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,160
Speaker 1: I y A and uh I co host a podcast

746
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 1: called Private Parts Unknown, where we're talking about love and

747
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:46,040
Speaker 1: sexuality around the world. So come listen to that. See. Um,

748
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,319
Speaker 1: I'm Robert Evans probably and I have a website behind

749
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:54,600
Speaker 1: the bastards dot com. Uh. You can find us on

750
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 1: the twin Instagram at Bastard's pot I'm doing that from

751
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 1: now on, So if you can call it on the

752
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: twin Instagram, it's the way it's gonna work. Uh. We

753
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:05,959
Speaker 1: you sell shirts uh to public dot com from behind

754
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 1: the bastards by your shirt, by stickers, cups, hand grenades.

755
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: You can buy and it could happen here shirt. If

756
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:15,680
Speaker 1: you want people to know that that it could happen here,

757
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 1: that's a good thing to do. Uh. We'll probably have

758
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 1: other shirts soon. Um tweeted us with ideas, podcasts, good times,

759
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:29,320
Speaker 1: I love let's say nine. I feel like I feel

760
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:30,799
Speaker 1: like we need to up that in light of how

761
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 1: to depress us. All is goodbye,