Speaker 1: First of all, you don't know me all about that
Speaker 1: high school drama, Girl drama, girl, all about them high
Speaker 1: school queens.
Speaker 2: We'll take you for a ride.
Speaker 1: And our comic girl cheering for the righteen drama Queens
Speaker 1: jis go up girl fashion, which you'll tough girl. You
Speaker 1: could sit with us, Girl drama, Queen drama, queense drama,
Speaker 1: Queens drama, drama, Queens drama queens. Guys. Hello, everyone, you're
Speaker 1: all joining us in the middle of our conversation because
Speaker 1: every time we get together we can't stop gabbing. But
Speaker 1: we're talking about season six, episode nineteen, Letting Go air
Speaker 1: date March thirtieth, two thousand and nine. Paul, would you
Speaker 1: be so kind as to read in the chat there
Speaker 1: is a synopsis of this episode. Perhaps, oh my god,
Speaker 1: check yes with your episode, guys. Paul is here because
Speaker 1: he directed this episode baifully uh, and we're here to
Speaker 1: talk with him about it, in with you and all
Speaker 1: the things.
Speaker 3: Well, that is so sweeter. I do have the synopsis
Speaker 3: right in front of me, and the director's name is
Speaker 3: Bill correctly, which is fantastic. Do a gig and they
Speaker 3: give me an E or an extra S or something more.
Speaker 2: You've earned all those letters, Babe, take them.
Speaker 3: The synopsis, Julian makes Brooke a startling offer. We know
Speaker 3: who Julian is. What a wonderful later. By the way,
Speaker 3: I did watch that on the you know they do
Speaker 3: on YouTube a kind of like you know, the highlights
Speaker 3: of the season. You know, when you wan like a
Speaker 3: three minute things of that episode, and you know, he's
Speaker 3: so good looking. It's like, I really hate him. Anybody
Speaker 3: who comes on the show that's that good looking.
Speaker 2: I just was just good, isn't he? Yes? I mean, yes,
Speaker 2: of course, of course.
Speaker 3: And it was a really fun episode. But Lucas brings Nathan,
Speaker 3: Scott and Jamie to an important place from his past,
Speaker 3: and we also see him shooting baskets and that great
Speaker 3: Mustang that they had in the.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm sure Jeffrey loves fastbacks. That's one of
Speaker 3: my favorite cars.
Speaker 2: Whole garage, Paul. It's just he does. And he always
Speaker 2: gets stick shift cars that I can't drive because I'm
Speaker 2: a nerd girl, and I'm like, I want to learn.
Speaker 3: Fine, that's alert. That's a good tactic for the future
Speaker 3: for me.
Speaker 2: That's smart.
Speaker 3: Peyton prepares for the future while Pyton prepares Sam and
Speaker 3: Jack take a stand against the principal who fired Hayley.
Speaker 3: Awkward storyline.
Speaker 2: It was so fun.
Speaker 3: Isn't that an awkward storyline?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: So imposed. I mean I understand what they're trying to
Speaker 3: go for, but it was very confusing from a directing
Speaker 3: point of view to help tell that story because it
Speaker 3: felt shoved in and it felt like this is somebody
Speaker 3: else's version of what school's like. It's not what kids experience.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, it was. There was a lot that was
Speaker 1: forced about that.
Speaker 3: Okay, we'll get into that, and I'm not trying to
Speaker 3: cut down. I mean, look at you did ten years
Speaker 3: of a series. It's not everything's going to be genius, right.
Speaker 2: We like to giggle about the left turns that tree
Speaker 2: Hill takes from Tarya.
Speaker 3: What a polite way of By the way, I have
Speaker 3: so many like things. I mean, listen, I almost like
Speaker 3: I didn't know how to re because I thought when
Speaker 3: I read the episode where the Dog Ate My Heart,
Speaker 3: which is the episode before this, right.
Speaker 2: We just missed it. We just missed it happen.
Speaker 3: Okay, Well I thought it was a joke and I
Speaker 3: called Joe I think Joe Devola and laughed and said,
Speaker 3: you guys are hilarious. The real script I got to
Speaker 3: study for tomorrow and he was like, yeah, no, we did,
Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, I mean I really I
Speaker 3: like to prepare. He's like we did because he was
Speaker 3: directed that episode, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah he did. That's right.
Speaker 2: We could talk about that one too, because I missed
Speaker 2: last week. So any antel you want to give us
Speaker 2: like that mess?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: Please?
Speaker 3: Then let's quickly before I'll finished a centinemiatica question and
Speaker 3: one makes more takes Mormon on a road trip to
Speaker 3: get his mind up. Milling happy to see those two
Speaker 3: have a story that builds together from like the main six,
Speaker 3: because I think they're great characters and they deserve that
Speaker 3: time on the screen. I thought I was happy about
Speaker 3: that one. I love dirinking those two together. They're good chemistry.
Speaker 3: But did you I hear often and I read often,
Speaker 3: and I shouldn't do this because I'm sensitive When I
Speaker 3: read online. Sometimes I just want to go to the
Speaker 3: bathroom and shut the door and cry because people are very.
Speaker 2: Mean, right, who mean to us? Never?
Speaker 3: I think a lot of times people don't consider that
Speaker 3: we actually read stuff they write about it, and we
Speaker 3: do because like, what did you think and I go, well,
Speaker 3: I think you could have eaten a few more salads.
Speaker 3: So you know, I'm like, you're right, but don't say it.
Speaker 2: Don't internet etiquette. Don't be a dick.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's I didn't read that when I got
Speaker 3: on the internet. Doesn't pop up.
Speaker 2: No, that pop up should be there. But this is
Speaker 2: an infamous episode for you.
Speaker 3: It is because a lot of people ask me if
Speaker 3: I feel that the show jumped the shark with the
Speaker 3: heart because it's cartoonish in a way. It's not a
Speaker 3: realistic way that the heart's going to come in in
Speaker 3: a in a in.
Speaker 4: A you know, in a lunchbox so smart, you know,
Speaker 4: eat candy first or what not, and then the dog's
Speaker 4: just happening to be in an er room and run
Speaker 4: over and have a nice slate heart snack.
Speaker 3: It felt like a lot of things had to be
Speaker 3: wrong for that world to work. Yeah, yeah, but it
Speaker 3: was cute and it's talkable and it's you know.
Speaker 2: It's talkable. You know, that's a great way to put it.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, everybody was talking about it. That was a
Speaker 1: very water cooler moment.
Speaker 2: But wasn't That was right about the time we had
Speaker 2: gone through a year or two of what was the
Speaker 2: show that made fun of us all the time? Talks
Speaker 2: to Soup. Oh yeah, Talk made fun of us all
Speaker 2: the time, and at first we weren't in on the joke.
Speaker 2: They were just strictly making fun of us. And this
Speaker 2: felt one hundred percent like bait. This was this was
Speaker 2: us saying like, oh.
Speaker 3: Hold on it the whole segment on it.
Speaker 1: Did you see that John Oliver anyway? You mean yeah, wait,
Speaker 1: John Oliver did? I thought it was the other guy,
Speaker 1: Joel mchill.
Speaker 3: No, it's it's it's you know, John Oliver from the.
Speaker 2: Right. Yeah, John Oliver started on John Stewart show.
Speaker 1: Oh oh, that's so fun.
Speaker 2: I feel like you need to have a secondary reel
Speaker 2: that is just people reacting to the things that you've done,
Speaker 2: as Dan Scott, because to have that much of an
Speaker 2: impact on pulp culture, no, like all the dance consto
Speaker 2: realized the commentary attention. Yeah, yeah, listen, you're dastardly made
Speaker 2: the headlines.
Speaker 3: That's why I brought my own audience to the to
Speaker 3: the podsam.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you got Jim Jones looking over your shoulders there.
Speaker 1: God.
Speaker 2: So okay, So how do you go from having to
Speaker 2: commit to something so bonkers in the last episode and
Speaker 2: turn in some very heartfelt, you know, earnest performances as
Speaker 2: you're saying goodbye to everybody. Yeah, then directing this one,
Speaker 2: it's very little prep time for you, given how much
Speaker 2: your workload was in the last episode.
Speaker 3: You guys all shared the same burden I did. It
Speaker 3: wasn't unique unto me. I know you guys have had
Speaker 3: to do the same thing, So I'm probably approach it
Speaker 3: the same way you did, which is I never I
Speaker 3: take my work seriously, but I don't take myself seriously
Speaker 3: and giving yourself some humility and going okay, I made
Speaker 3: a big mistake. And actually I've never talked about this before.
Speaker 3: I'll tell you one thing. I did a serious work.
Speaker 3: The first series I was ever the co star of
Speaker 3: the star was with Elizabeth Grayson on a series, a
Speaker 3: spin up series of The Highlander called The Raven and
Speaker 3: I had been fortunate enough that they decided to make
Speaker 3: it her and I was originally supposed to be just
Speaker 3: her series, and then they brought me in because they
Speaker 3: wanted a nice sort of like somebody moment, right, Yeah, thing,
Speaker 3: she was an immortal and I was a cop and
Speaker 3: I made the mistake of going to I did a
Speaker 3: lot of research. I drew Grove around with like detectives,
Speaker 3: and I did some cop research and I went into
Speaker 3: Toronto Police Department Detective Union and did all this stuff
Speaker 3: and I was, you know, living in la But I
Speaker 3: got up there and started the series and I was like,
Speaker 3: I'm going to make this the most important acting job
Speaker 3: of my life, and I'm going to show everybody to
Speaker 3: whom whatever it is. And I got ahead of my
Speaker 3: skis a little bit because on the first episode they
Speaker 3: had a body falling into the top roof and landing
Speaker 3: on a car and denting the roof. And I was
Speaker 3: this arrogant young actor thinking I'm going to make this
Speaker 3: an emmy word when you show, and it was. It
Speaker 3: was misguided in a positive way, but poorly executed because
Speaker 3: I was young and immature and didn't understand the nature
Speaker 3: of the business and many things. And I had to
Speaker 3: go up to it to them and apologize too, because
Speaker 3: I really had to come to Jesus moment on that
Speaker 3: I said, that doesn't look like a kind of car
Speaker 3: their body would hit, As if I'm an expert what
Speaker 3: cars look like when bodies hit them.
Speaker 2: From oh wow.
Speaker 3: I went, look, that's a tiny dent man. That body
Speaker 3: would have gone right through. And the director goes, yeah,
Speaker 3: but you know, maybe not. And I was kind of like, well,
Speaker 3: I can't be in the scene if that car doesn't
Speaker 3: look properly down. And the director goes, okay, then you're
Speaker 3: not in the scene. Oh, and I went what And
Speaker 3: I was too arrogant to go, well, wait a minute,
Speaker 3: don't come me out of the scene. So he cut
Speaker 3: me out of the scene. And I was one of
Speaker 3: the stars of the show. And I walked my trailer like, oh, angry,
Speaker 3: and you know, I'm righteous about this. And I sat
Speaker 3: on my trailer and it seeped in very quickly, like hey, dummy,
Speaker 3: you know you're not bigger than the show. You're not
Speaker 3: bigger than anybody. Your ideas are just ideas, and everybody
Speaker 3: has a right to ideas. Yours can be wrong. And
Speaker 3: I sat there and I kind of went back and
Speaker 3: I telled him and said, hey, look, you know I
Speaker 3: might have misspoke. Whatever. He goes, okay, go back to work,
Speaker 3: and he was super cool about it, like he knew
Speaker 3: how to have a young actor. And so I wish that,
Speaker 3: you know, I hadn't done it, but I really needed
Speaker 3: the lesson.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially in television because everything moves so fast. There's
Speaker 1: just it's not the same amount of time when you're
Speaker 1: on a film and you can go and you have
Speaker 1: days to rehearse and you all this time. With actors, you.
Speaker 2: Just have to script ahead of time for months.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. So TV comes in and on episodes
Speaker 1: like these, even when you're working, you just have to
Speaker 1: take the two weeks to prep. I would say that
Speaker 1: probably one of the biggest benefits for any of us
Speaker 1: as actors jumping in to direct is that the show
Speaker 1: was sort of running itself at that point in so
Speaker 1: many ways, Paul, did that feel like did it make
Speaker 1: it more like present more challenges? Did it make it
Speaker 1: more interesting? The fact that it was Were you able
Speaker 1: to focus on other things as a director instead of
Speaker 1: trying to create a whole new environment and all that,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Yeah, when you jumped in
Speaker 1: on episodes, because like, there was so much about it
Speaker 1: that was kind of running itself. So yeah, I gave
Speaker 1: you an opportunity to to do new things, try new things.
Speaker 1: I mean, what what did you enjoy about that?
Speaker 3: Well? My mindset for directing Montree Hill, and I think
Speaker 3: you and I have had what a thousand conversations about
Speaker 3: you know this? So it's it's it's a it's a
Speaker 3: very nice it's almost like a softball question because you
Speaker 3: probably know my answers.
Speaker 1: But the audience doesn't.
Speaker 3: Oh, I forget, there's people listening.
Speaker 1: People just really want to know.
Speaker 3: I just love the Hillary's wallpaper and I can't get
Speaker 3: over it as I.
Speaker 2: Speak, slithering over here.
Speaker 3: It's great, it's it's this is. My goal wasn't to
Speaker 3: try to influence the creators of the show, the writers
Speaker 3: that you know, anybody else in that sphere when I
Speaker 3: got to the set. My goal was to encourage the
Speaker 3: actors to leave their complacency after playing the role like
Speaker 3: I had many times I walk into scene, I go, Okay,
Speaker 3: it's the same kind of dollog I said last episode,
Speaker 3: But you know what, let me try and make it
Speaker 3: fresh and let me find some nuance. It was to
Speaker 3: encourage them to challenge themselves. And I remember many instances
Speaker 3: with everybody was to say, yeah, we've seen that. What
Speaker 3: else do you got?
Speaker 5: Like?
Speaker 3: What is new in this? How do we challenge ourselves
Speaker 3: to make this a different experience so that we can
Speaker 3: light that fire again, because I want the actors to
Speaker 3: come in and be inspired by well not me particularly,
Speaker 3: but by the freedom to know that I'll let you
Speaker 3: try something you didn't try before because I want to
Speaker 3: see it too, because I'm a fan. And that was
Speaker 3: the goal was to push those buttons so that when
Speaker 3: we would get when I get phone calls from like
Speaker 3: the network or from even the creator, sometimes it's like, oh,
Speaker 3: that was a great performance you got out of somebody said,
Speaker 3: how was them? They just need permission to go there?
Speaker 2: That's nice? All well, you can tell there's certain scenes
Speaker 2: in this episode that had the Paul hallmark on them,
Speaker 2: especially like when Skills was waking mouth up and you
Speaker 2: just let the camera live on mouth after Skills left
Speaker 2: the room and watched him like just like fuddle with
Speaker 2: the pillows and try to get back to sleep. You
Speaker 2: let actors rest or linger in a moment longer than
Speaker 2: other directors would, just to see like what are they
Speaker 2: gonna do?
Speaker 3: Acting class? Remember when we were all in acting classes.
Speaker 2: Hillary did where did June Stein? I studied with June Stein,
Speaker 2: who was a professor at Columbia. She was one of
Speaker 2: the original actors in what is It? The Miss Firecracker pageant?
Speaker 2: John she was like pals with John Tatro and all them,
Speaker 2: and she did my scene study class and put me
Speaker 2: through the ringer.
Speaker 3: What was her thing? What was her thing? She owned
Speaker 3: to She really was.
Speaker 2: About like choices and being able to give as many
Speaker 2: choices as possible so that our directors, our editors had
Speaker 2: things to play with. And so for me, I I
Speaker 2: really was happy that before I went in One Tree Hill,
Speaker 2: there was an adult in my life that was telling me, cool,
Speaker 2: you got choice A, would choice be and choice C,
Speaker 2: and then also have a choice D just ready to
Speaker 2: go in case somebody asks for it. And that as
Speaker 2: you know, how old was I eighteen nineteen when I
Speaker 2: was working with her. That was a really simple way
Speaker 2: for me to understand what I needed to bring to
Speaker 2: the table when I hit a set.
Speaker 3: Do you remember that? Did you see the Bradley Cooper
Speaker 3: interview on the Round Table when he was nominated now
Speaker 3: Mastro He referenced Vince Vaughan on wedding Crashers and he said,
Speaker 3: the best lesson I ever learned in acting was watching
Speaker 3: Vince Vaughn and wedding Crashers. But Bradley Cooper only had
Speaker 3: a very tiny role, if you remember, And he said,
Speaker 3: Vince Vaughn would go take after take and everything was
Speaker 3: completely different than the last take, and he was willing
Speaker 3: to fail, like e didn miserably fail in front of
Speaker 3: the crew and cast. Didn't care, just want to keep
Speaker 3: trying things. And he said that bus lust and I
Speaker 3: ever had that kind of reminds me of what you
Speaker 3: were just explaining.
Speaker 2: Well, and my you know, my acting partner in that
Speaker 2: class is now really successful, you know, executive, executive producer
Speaker 2: and showrunner. He did Grace what is it? Grace Jones? No,
Speaker 2: he did what is it? What just came out? Daisy Jones?
Speaker 2: And the sixth Oh yeah, he did Shrinking Like James
Speaker 2: Ponsol is a brilliant director, but he was a brilliant
Speaker 2: actor before he was a director. And we used to
Speaker 2: just like try all the time. And so it was
Speaker 2: really fun to come up with someone like that and
Speaker 2: then see the things that they're making now that are
Speaker 2: all choices, it's just character driven choices.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we all felt the permission to do that from you.
Speaker 1: I know that I had studied on Guiding Light. I
Speaker 1: mean that was you know, what I mean, Like, I
Speaker 1: just did high school theater and I showed up on
Speaker 1: I got pilots and stuff. Since I was fourteen sixteen,
Speaker 1: I was doing things and lots of Broadway training in
Speaker 1: small theater classes around New York and stuff, but nothing
Speaker 1: uh substantial or of note or name. I was just
Speaker 1: picking up jobs wherever I could and learning along the way.
Speaker 2: Set education is so ill for it, it is final way.
Speaker 2: Most colleges won't let you work. We talked with MICHAELA.
Speaker 2: McManus about that. Once you get into NYU, or you
Speaker 2: get into somebody with an esteemed acting program, they don't
Speaker 2: let you audition for outside things until you graduate because
Speaker 2: they want you to complete the program.
Speaker 1: Did you have that experience, Paul, when you were training
Speaker 1: or did you even have active trait because you were basketball?
Speaker 1: And then remind me what happened.
Speaker 3: God just touched me with talent.
Speaker 1: Brilliant looks the brilliant shedding gold as he walks down
Speaker 1: the street.
Speaker 5: Trophies, he said, looks brains naw, I can only pick one.
Speaker 3: I like it. It was so easy.
Speaker 1: Where did you learn that? Where did you learn all
Speaker 1: the thing about options and being able to as a
Speaker 1: director give that permission to actors. How did you know
Speaker 1: about that?
Speaker 3: I mean, I have to say that I think a
Speaker 3: lot of us don't give enough credit to our our
Speaker 3: environment growing up as children. You know, I grew up
Speaker 3: with a father who was a you know, an alcoholic,
Speaker 3: a very difficult man who found God late in his
Speaker 3: life and converted to a very dogmatic religion, and you know,
Speaker 3: but he was tough. He was a tough man. He
Speaker 3: was the NHL won the Stanley Cup. My mom was
Speaker 3: an artist who, you know, who was unsatisfied. So that
Speaker 3: sort of like longing for something more than we are
Speaker 3: was kind of built into me. And so I think
Speaker 3: when I started playing basketball, it was kind of a
Speaker 3: way to get away from, you know, this very kind
Speaker 3: of normality of my life, and I just longed for
Speaker 3: things and and I think when I got into acting,
Speaker 3: you know, I got hired very quickly when I moved
Speaker 3: to Hollywood because I was a basketball player with the
Speaker 3: Canadian national team and I came to America and I
Speaker 3: wanted to try out the NBA and some other pro leagues,
Speaker 3: and I started getting commercials, like I did twenty commercials
Speaker 3: in one year. You know, back when they used to
Speaker 3: pay and me hired me to do a commercial with
Speaker 3: him and Magic Johnson. I did a commercial with him
Speaker 3: and Tim Hardaway, and I started in Kentucky and write
Speaker 3: Chicken and then the Diet Croke and I started doing
Speaker 3: all these commercials and I was like, Oh, this shit's easy, man,
Speaker 3: I just got to And then I realized, Oh, there's
Speaker 3: no acting in this. It's just all kind of like
Speaker 3: being a basketball guy.
Speaker 2: Sometimes it was wandling in some ways.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was like I hit the description of what
Speaker 3: they were looking for. But then I got humbled very quickly.
Speaker 3: I've told the Space Pops prop story. I studied with
Speaker 3: a Daryl Hickman, who who was whose brother Wasdbe Gillis
Speaker 3: in the in this series, and and Daryl was a
Speaker 3: very intense guy. And then I started with Stephen Gosh,
Speaker 3: I'm embarrassed about these these names. But when I really
Speaker 3: started to learn the disciplines, when I joined a repertory
Speaker 3: Shakespeare company and did several seasons with them and got
Speaker 3: the discipline. And it's when I learned how to smoke.
Speaker 3: Because he goes, stay away from the catering table, have
Speaker 3: one of these and I was like, oh yeah, and
Speaker 3: you he goes, you won't be hungry and it's good
Speaker 3: for you. Oh my god, this is like nineteen twenty
Speaker 3: five or whatever it was. And so I started smoking,
Speaker 3: you know, because of theater, and we all smoked in
Speaker 3: theater because.
Speaker 2: Where are part of the uniform.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we weren't allowed to do and doing you know
Speaker 3: Steve oh yeah, Stephen Book was my acting coach, and
Speaker 3: we weren't allowed to act, were't allowed to take jobs.
Speaker 3: Carlo Kucina was in that class. And more more, Cheerney
Speaker 3: was in that class. Oh wow, lot of great actors
Speaker 3: came out of that class. I studied with there, and
Speaker 3: then I went to New York and there was a
Speaker 3: very very very interesting acting coach there that's kind of famous,
Speaker 3: who Kevin Klein uses and I worked with him for
Speaker 3: a while and he was tough. He was very much
Speaker 3: like everything that you're doing is because you're trying to
Speaker 3: do the writer's job for them. Don't do that. Don't
Speaker 3: do the writer's job. They have their job. You have
Speaker 3: your job. They give you the words. Your job is
Speaker 3: to is to know the words and do everything against
Speaker 3: them you can. Because so much of the work that
Speaker 3: everything underneath that is going to be what's called layered
Speaker 3: life and give them context. And when you say I
Speaker 3: shot scenes and I leave the camera on, it's because
Speaker 3: of this thing that you guys know called you know,
Speaker 3: that private moment. And we learn more about a character
Speaker 3: through private moments when they're alone and nobody's watching, then
Speaker 3: we do when they're in a conversation with somebody.
Speaker 1: Yes, I love that, and that's what Hillary's talking about.
Speaker 1: You leave the camera for the actor to just have
Speaker 1: a moment instead of cutting away. You leave that in
Speaker 1: the edit, and we learned so much more about where
Speaker 1: a character's coming from. It's lovely.
Speaker 2: But even if they don't, if you cut it right,
Speaker 2: I always felt like I could learn something that I
Speaker 2: could take into the next take.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you still carry it with you in your box, right.
Speaker 2: So, like if the scene ends on mouth putting those
Speaker 2: pillows over his head and just like resisting what is
Speaker 2: being offered to him, you know, you yell cut and
Speaker 2: then two seconds later you go into the next take
Speaker 2: and he's still got that energy in his body of
Speaker 2: resistance that you let him have. And it reads in
Speaker 2: this I like, you know, Hayden is one to have
Speaker 2: lots of quiet moments, and so I appreciate that we
Speaker 2: got to just settle into those because our show was
Speaker 2: so montage and fast paced and there's eight million characters,
Speaker 2: so to let people have that space is rare. Yeah, well,
Speaker 2: we have.
Speaker 3: Those to give credit to the post production team too,
Speaker 3: because at the end of the day they can veto
Speaker 3: oar cut so they can decide and if they see
Speaker 3: there's value there, you know, we you know, I always
Speaker 3: say that, you know, we have to really in this
Speaker 3: meetium particularly, we have to have so much credit to
Speaker 3: post production, and people understand, well, we hand them all
Speaker 3: these ingredients and we go here, you go, good luck,
Speaker 3: let us know what it turns out. Yeah, yeah, and
Speaker 3: we do a terrific job. You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well you did a terrific job in this episode.
Speaker 1: I really, actually really enjoyed this episode. There were a
Speaker 1: lot of pieces coming together, you know, the last one
Speaker 1: that we had. It felt like there were a lot
Speaker 1: of new open doors, a lot of endings and open
Speaker 1: doors beginnings were available now and things were starting to
Speaker 1: progress in a lot of these storylines. I loved your
Speaker 1: use of long lenses. There were so many long lens
Speaker 1: shots in this episode that were really beautiful. The lighting
Speaker 1: was amazing, and I know you were working with Pete, right,
Speaker 1: Pete KOs was on this.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I had a question about when you are working in
Speaker 1: a television format like this where the schedule is really fast,
Speaker 1: when you set up scenes, are you paying Are you
Speaker 1: walking into a set paying attention to where the lighting is,
Speaker 1: where the things and the sets are, and then you
Speaker 1: ask the actors to be in that area so you
Speaker 1: can set your shots up in those places? Do you
Speaker 1: approach things wherever it's just a free for all and
Speaker 1: it's totally up the lighting guys to set things up
Speaker 1: where the actors go, which sometime times can be a
Speaker 1: challenge on a tight schedule like we had. How do
Speaker 1: you approach that where you can still be free and
Speaker 1: artistic but also keep within the timeframe.
Speaker 3: Oh what a terrific question, because anybody who wants to
Speaker 3: get into this industry has to struggle with this because
Speaker 3: when you walk your sets before your actors are there,
Speaker 3: and we all do that, we walk them with our
Speaker 3: tech crew, right, remember those walks.
Speaker 6: You know?
Speaker 3: So I was thinking this, and I was thinking this
Speaker 3: and goes, yeah, that's too flat of a background. You
Speaker 3: mind want to do this with this? And you know
Speaker 3: that we can't put lights there because we have a
Speaker 3: kinnots over here, and they won't fit because you were
Speaker 3: going to am I going oh okay, So what I
Speaker 3: needed to do was right.
Speaker 1: And then the actors would walk in and they'd be like,
Speaker 1: I don't want to be over there. Why am I
Speaker 1: over there? I should be on this side of the room.
Speaker 2: Actors like me, you would do that.
Speaker 3: There's no other actor on the show except maybe me.
Speaker 3: You would walk in and I'd go, so I had
Speaker 3: to say, you're making popcorn and you come over here,
Speaker 3: You're like, going, you just have me popcorn. I don't
Speaker 3: like popcorn? What if I have? What if I'm making the.
Speaker 1: Jerry Cublie, you should make me popcorn if she doesn't
Speaker 1: have time to eat it. I don't have time to
Speaker 1: eat popcorn. Why would I be making it if I
Speaker 1: don't have time to eat? It doesn't any sense.
Speaker 3: Well, I remember, I don't remember exactly what this was.
Speaker 3: There was a scene in the kitchen one time in
Speaker 3: the Big House where you were. I was saying, well,
Speaker 3: what if you're you're you're trying to find something you
Speaker 3: can't find it. I remember, I'd love to find this
Speaker 3: episode And you're like, Oh, I love that idea, and
Speaker 3: you took it so far that every cabinet in the
Speaker 3: kitchen was wide open and everything was everywhere. You're just
Speaker 3: looking and we didn't even know what you were looking for.
Speaker 3: It didn't matter, but that was your scene. I remember this,
Speaker 3: so I don't know what episode there said I gotta
Speaker 3: find it. It's just like, oh boy, last time I
Speaker 3: remember giving her an idea with an open end to it.
Speaker 2: Props is freaking out what.
Speaker 1: We're gonna say.
Speaker 2: We're on the planes. Who lives close with plates?
Speaker 1: Come over with your plates?
Speaker 3: Yeah, but by the way, when you shine, because it's
Speaker 3: you lost in that I do.
Speaker 1: It's fun, but but it is. That was a hard
Speaker 1: learning curve for me because of the time frame, and
Speaker 1: I was young and stubborn and couldn't hear when people
Speaker 1: were like, joy, we literally do not have time for
Speaker 1: this idea. It's super fun, but we don't have time.
Speaker 1: I couldn't hear it. I had a really hard time
Speaker 1: with that, And that's youth is wasted on the young.
Speaker 1: But you know, how do you you were older than us,
Speaker 1: you were you know more season How do you.
Speaker 2: That you.
Speaker 3: Was when ts were circular?
Speaker 1: Oh my god?
Speaker 2: I've been listening to sixties on six with my kids
Speaker 2: and they're like, this music's so old. I'm like, this
Speaker 2: is when dad was born. Six For a time.
Speaker 3: You can also stay young though through keeping curious. I
Speaker 3: think that's I think that's the sicke of to stake.
Speaker 3: But to answer the question, because it is a good question.
Speaker 3: What I walk a set, I was going to finish,
Speaker 3: was I look for never shooting flat against walls. I
Speaker 3: always look for if I can shoot through a doorway
Speaker 3: into a room and then see a window or another
Speaker 3: doorway into something else, then I can get I get
Speaker 3: what I call like a really interesting layered dynamic for lighting.
Speaker 3: So I don't shoot flat. I always go I never
Speaker 3: walk in a room and look at the wall. That's
Speaker 3: if you do that. I don't know why you even
Speaker 3: bother shooting on a set, just shoot on a wall.
Speaker 3: I like to find as many different layers so that
Speaker 3: I can have an actor coming foreground and background and
Speaker 3: have them passed. But I love passing off. When you
Speaker 3: were talking about economy of shooting and how do you
Speaker 3: shoot so fast even in indie films, which I'm more
Speaker 3: doing involved now, it's, by the way, what a great
Speaker 3: English sentence, it's more doing involved.
Speaker 2: Now I got y'all what you were saying, we followed
Speaker 2: you all the way down.
Speaker 3: That some more involved in doing.
Speaker 5: It.
Speaker 3: It's the French that we the verbs. The idea is
Speaker 3: to is to sometimes I think pass off. Have an
Speaker 3: actor start the scene coming in and let's say they
Speaker 3: pass the sofa, somebody's sitting there, and as the dialogue hits,
Speaker 3: you want to be able to just rack to that
Speaker 3: person and then if the person can go behind them again,
Speaker 3: then I don't have to go into all these separate shots.
Speaker 3: It's kind of, you know, sleeker, more fun to have
Speaker 3: the audience because they'll go with you. Audiences will go
Speaker 3: take them on a trip.
Speaker 1: Yeah, to feel like they're there in the room. Yeah,
Speaker 1: rather than they have to they get to just face
Speaker 1: to face to face to face to face to face.
Speaker 3: I just would rather just find something creative, especially if
Speaker 3: the scene has any length to it. I mean a
Speaker 3: short little scene like that, Oh fine, put it on
Speaker 3: some sticks and get coverage and get out of there.
Speaker 1: But like the airport scene, what you just did with
Speaker 1: what you did in this episode Julian and Brooke in
Speaker 1: the end, that airport, the long lens, the way they
Speaker 1: were crossing each other, the way he stood up and
Speaker 1: people were passing. Also, wonderful use of extras. The background actors,
Speaker 1: I feel like, are so often just placed to walk awkwardly,
Speaker 1: and I love that everybody was moving around and it
Speaker 1: felt so natural.
Speaker 3: If I remember correctly, I remember we had to I
Speaker 3: remember that I was up against the little Remember who
Speaker 3: it was. There was somebody on the set that was saying,
Speaker 3: you know that the network prefers you know, you know,
Speaker 3: those kind of shots that are more framing in the
Speaker 3: face and focused around. But I said, well, look, you know,
Speaker 3: and I just had worked with my friend Nick on
Speaker 3: a movie where he I think it was My Sister's Keeper,
Speaker 3: and he used deacons on that. I think Roger Deakins
Speaker 3: is the greatest DP alive right now. He even has
Speaker 3: a documentary out about him.
Speaker 2: I just like that you did it in a crowd
Speaker 2: because it made it mortifying had you just been framed
Speaker 2: on Austin's face.
Speaker 3: Blade Runner two thousand, nineteen seventeen, Empire of Lights Cecario,
Speaker 3: The Assassination Barton Fak No Country for Old Men.
Speaker 1: Thanks.
Speaker 2: He's brilliant, so he.
Speaker 3: Uses long lenses in interiors in a way where he
Speaker 3: puts the cameras four or not necessarily, he could take
Speaker 3: it outside of a window, but he'll put a two
Speaker 3: hundred zoom lens on a camera. And what happens is,
Speaker 3: if you're sharp in focused, everything around you looks almost
Speaker 3: like a twinkling world, like a beautiful little thing. And
Speaker 3: I didn't quite go to that for I might have
Speaker 3: used one hundred zoom or something like that.
Speaker 1: But you did that on the River Court.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I did on the River Court too. As
Speaker 3: much as I could, I tried to use long lenses.
Speaker 3: And then really what it is is it brings the
Speaker 3: actor and focus, but it gives almost a sort of
Speaker 3: like a surreal world around them, which is more glittery
Speaker 3: with the light clicking off of the of the river
Speaker 3: and things like that. It's just pretty, you know.
Speaker 2: I want to know, Paul, With a series that you're on, right,
Speaker 2: it's one thing when you go in and you are
Speaker 2: a guest director that's just cruising into somebody else's universe
Speaker 2: and you don't really have context for where the characters
Speaker 2: have been for the last few years. But with a
Speaker 2: show that you're on and you know these characters really well,
Speaker 2: and you know what Brook's been through and what Lucas
Speaker 2: has been through and all of that. I can never
Speaker 2: direct because I have opinions like I don't like Julian.
Speaker 2: I think Julian's the worst boy ever. I think ultimatums
Speaker 2: are horrendous. Not into it, Yeah, I was not a sidebar.
Speaker 1: Was not into this like random, Hey, I'm leaving in
Speaker 1: like twenty four hours, kid, I could get on a plane.
Speaker 2: N Yeah, bye of narcissism.
Speaker 3: My life is so important, that is invaluable misogyny.
Speaker 2: Sure, how do you keep your opinion out of it?
Speaker 2: Because I'm thinking, like, if I had to, you made
Speaker 2: Julian look so lovely in this airport scene that you
Speaker 2: guys are talking about, and all I could think is like,
Speaker 2: I fuck him up. I'd make him look real dumb
Speaker 2: in this airport scene because how dare he put all
Speaker 2: this pressure on this poor girl?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 2: But instead it was so romantic. Instead, you made it.
Speaker 2: You made it through sad. I couldn't keep my opinion
Speaker 2: out of it.
Speaker 3: You remember broadcast news? Oh yes, the greatest movies ever made?
Speaker 2: Am I rightly?
Speaker 1: Hunter?
Speaker 3: Holly Hunter's scene with William Hurt at the airport where
Speaker 3: he gets the tickets and he says, come with me,
Speaker 3: come with me, come with me, and she's like, okay,
Speaker 3: I'll be there. Then she finds out he cheated. He lied,
Speaker 3: not a sexual he cheated because he falsified a news
Speaker 3: report which showed he had no integrity and she couldn't
Speaker 3: go through with it. So at the airport in her
Speaker 3: like pajamas with no luggage, he goes, yeah, no, I'm
Speaker 3: not going. You know, you have fun, and he's like,
Speaker 3: you can't. You can't just forgive me for that one thing.
Speaker 3: She goes no, because it's like basically saying no because
Speaker 3: that's who you are, and I can't be with who
Speaker 3: you are.
Speaker 2: You can't see it.
Speaker 3: It's such a kind of in my mind where I
Speaker 3: was shooting that, I was thinking of like the broadcast
Speaker 3: news moment, like you know what I mean, like I
Speaker 3: love my life so much and you go have yours
Speaker 3: or whatever it is.
Speaker 1: So you were worried about Julian and how unbelievable the
Speaker 1: situation was that he was giving her this crazy ultimatum
Speaker 1: and she's running around like I've known for a.
Speaker 3: While, but I didn't feel that was my my It
Speaker 3: wasn't that would be on on my lane because I'm
Speaker 3: not going to be able to change the writers. Yeah, ideas,
Speaker 3: and I have to service the you guys. And if
Speaker 3: let's just say, I, if Sophia would have come or whatever,
Speaker 3: I would have immediately said, I love your thoughts. Can
Speaker 3: we bring the writers in because I can't overrule a
Speaker 3: story that's been in the works for weeks and they've
Speaker 3: passed through the network, through the producers, through the show runner,
Speaker 3: through everybody else, and then me to go, yeah, I'm
Speaker 3: not cool with that. I would have gone, I'll tell
Speaker 3: you what, if you have an oppisode, I will support you.
Speaker 3: Let's go together, Let's go talk and say, hey, you
Speaker 3: know what, this is, how she should take this. And
Speaker 3: if she'd have said, let's do a take where I
Speaker 3: just go, you know, basically, you know, I would have
Speaker 3: gone down to do that take. I'll shoot it. I'll
Speaker 3: shoot whatever the actors want to shoot. We'll also get
Speaker 3: our job done too.
Speaker 2: At the same time, sure, did they offer you any
Speaker 2: explanation as to why Julian had to go back the
Speaker 2: guy with very few strings attached?
Speaker 1: Yeah? The steaks were so imaginary.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I couldn't understand what the urgency was.
Speaker 3: And it felt like it was somebody I don't know.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, these there's some genius in our
Speaker 3: show and moments, there's some pure genius. And then with
Speaker 3: everything in life, there's some things that don't make as
Speaker 3: much sense. We spoke about one earlier in this episode
Speaker 3: of this podcast. But again, I think you kind of
Speaker 3: have to. If you have moral objections, you got to
Speaker 3: speak them up. If you have story objections, I think
Speaker 3: those conversations have to happen long before you get to
Speaker 3: the set.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when we didn't get to do read throughs because
Speaker 2: it was so bang bang bang bang bangs. Yeah, did the.
Speaker 3: First two seasons, didn't we the first season?
Speaker 1: The first season? What we would do?
Speaker 2: Did we feel? It was a first episode episode, but
Speaker 2: it wasn't.
Speaker 1: A regular occurrence twenty two episodes? How are you going
Speaker 1: to find time? We could barely get everybody in the
Speaker 1: same room to shoot on some days, and we had.
Speaker 3: Some seasons where we were twenty six episodes or something.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, we did.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, so for you know, for these storylines and
Speaker 2: servicing these storylines. We've been in this boat for six years.
Speaker 2: At this point, Brooke is finally like maybe going to
Speaker 2: tell someone she loves him. He has said goodbye to
Speaker 2: her thirty seven times, like they have said goodbye so
Speaker 2: many times, and are.
Speaker 3: Like, it's so good at playing, like the of of
Speaker 3: how her emotions can kind of just suck you in
Speaker 3: and make care for her. I think she was exceptional
Speaker 3: in this scene.
Speaker 1: I really she made me buy it.
Speaker 2: Every time I thought she was going to say it,
Speaker 2: She's finally going to say it, She's finally going to
Speaker 2: say it, and then she just it hurts so bad
Speaker 2: to see it well up in her throat and her
Speaker 2: just shove it back down, like never mind, I'll keep
Speaker 2: it to myself.
Speaker 3: Did they bring him back? They brought hit that character back, Juliane.
Speaker 2: Right, because yeah, he's been a couple of times.
Speaker 3: Are going to draw him the one time? Then the
Speaker 3: Hammerhead Sharks off the coast of East Carolina.
Speaker 2: They ended up getting married, Paul, Yes, that was it.
Speaker 1: That's her her end game.
Speaker 2: But what's this?
Speaker 1: These are the things that confused me so much about
Speaker 1: our show that we shot twenty two episodes. They had
Speaker 1: a board a mile long in that writer's room. How
Speaker 1: could they not map out a realistic timeline for stakes
Speaker 1: for these two characters so that you actually felt like
Speaker 1: you were invested in not He's here for four weeks
Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, Brook's heart is breaking
Speaker 1: in half because a guy she's known a month gives
Speaker 1: her three plane tickets and says, you and your new
Speaker 1: adopted kids should come live with me in La And
Speaker 1: she's not, like, that's super sweet, thank you, but maybe
Speaker 1: we can talk on the phone a little bit more
Speaker 1: before I move my whole life out, Like, why did
Speaker 1: they not take the time we had twenty two episodes?
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm done, no, no, but remember this is Hollywood
Speaker 3: is a business, and that contracts with actors. They don't
Speaker 3: know if they're going to pick them up till they
Speaker 3: see how the audiential reaction. They don't know, okay, fair,
Speaker 3: They don't know what's going on until they go, oh,
Speaker 3: look at the feedback we're getting for this storyline. We
Speaker 3: should do both this. There's a lot involved at the point.
Speaker 2: With the movie that Julian is doing being shitcanned, Like
Speaker 2: the movie's done? What's he rushing back to? He's out
Speaker 2: of a job.
Speaker 1: Dad doesn't even like working with him, right, yustic job too?
Speaker 2: Oh that's right. That's right. Everybody's lost their job and
Speaker 2: he's like, well, really got to uproot you and your
Speaker 2: little kid here.
Speaker 3: Wouldn't it be great if we were privileged to the
Speaker 3: conversations that the never rush we were having with our
Speaker 3: writing team, so that we could understand how they got
Speaker 3: to certain conclusions. We weren't involved in those, and we
Speaker 3: have no idea, but it'd be yeah.
Speaker 2: And also there's always that factor of was it just
Speaker 2: such a different time fifteen twenty years ago that the
Speaker 2: default was the woman would follow the man? Has it
Speaker 2: been that long that it was just the assumption at
Speaker 2: that point, because now we're all like, she probably makes
Speaker 2: more money than he does. What the yeah? You know, like,
Speaker 2: what are we doing here?
Speaker 1: I think they could have done something like I've got
Speaker 1: an offer. I'm going to go shoot a movie in
Speaker 1: Morocco and they're paying us so much money, and I
Speaker 1: want to bring you and give Sam an experience of
Speaker 1: being overseas. You can design overseas, like raise the stakes
Speaker 1: to something that's not just I got to go back
Speaker 1: to la and try and get another job.
Speaker 3: Just for everybody, we want to hear the conversations that
Speaker 3: we've never had the thought.
Speaker 2: That I had in my whole head was like, no
Speaker 2: fucking wonder. I was still thinking about Lucas the whole
Speaker 2: time she was datingly, Like no wonder. Peyton was like, Okay,
Speaker 2: we're good, go to Sundance by We're done.
Speaker 3: So end up if you could right now.
Speaker 2: I got married, I know, But now where are they?
Speaker 3: What is Peyton and what is Lucas doing right now?
Speaker 3: Ten years after those times?
Speaker 1: You and every fan they always ask us this question
Speaker 1: at conventions and stuff. Paul, Yes, so good.
Speaker 2: Peyton's doing that thing where she's in like deep therapy
Speaker 2: at this point because when you're little, you don't know
Speaker 2: how screwed up you are until you have kids and
Speaker 2: you're like, wait a second, I don't want to hit
Speaker 2: this kid. I don't want to scream at this kid.
Speaker 2: What to me? Yeah, it's just like deep.
Speaker 3: And is Lucas like Stephen kitting now or what's going on?
Speaker 2: Like I don't know. I bet he's still strong, like
Speaker 2: I love how like strong Chad is right now? And
Speaker 2: all the thirst trap pictures he posts on Instagram, I'm like,
Speaker 2: where was this? What the hell?
Speaker 3: Have you seen his new show?
Speaker 2: I haven't watched it yet. Now, what's his show Sullivans
Speaker 2: Y Suivan's Crossing. It isn't with the dude from Gilmore Girls.
Speaker 1: That's great, Yeah, yeah good.
Speaker 2: He's strong as hell. I was texting with him the
Speaker 2: other day and he was just like, I'm either working
Speaker 2: or lifting weights or playing with my kids, and that's
Speaker 2: my trifecta. He's just doing.
Speaker 3: The producer of that series is an old friend of
Speaker 3: mine who I did a movie with I think with Gosh.
Speaker 3: We shot it up in Canada and Sudbury, Ontario.
Speaker 2: Unbelieva Sudbury. I shot in Sudbury, ended up the town
Speaker 2: that blew up, like there's minds there and it blew up.
Speaker 3: Yeah that's right now, Oh the mind have you been
Speaker 3: down on the mines?
Speaker 2: Go in the mines. I was making a Christmas movie, Paul,
Speaker 2: that's so cool. I was playing with reindeer. Hilarious. Okay,
Speaker 2: So the Julian and the brook of it all, we
Speaker 2: like them. Personally, I don't like this coupling. I don't
Speaker 2: like all the pressure. It's really stressing me out.
Speaker 1: But I did love Sophia's black flip hairdoo and her
Speaker 1: black motorcycle jacket because I haven't This is like the
Speaker 1: Carol Cutshall episode.
Speaker 2: You were in a leather jacket. I noticed that too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was into your rebellious red hair. This was
Speaker 1: like the first time I really showed up. That was fun.
Speaker 2: Sick of the blandche You were rebelling two thousand and nine, right,
Speaker 2: it was two thousand nine. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, two
Speaker 2: thousand and nine.
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, So there's that. Let's talk about college party.
Speaker 1: This random college party in the middle of a day.
Speaker 2: Have any actually been to real college parties? Is my question?
Speaker 2: Because I'm gonna drop out, I would do a few.
Speaker 2: Did you have a Greek life?
Speaker 5: All this?
Speaker 3: Like, you know, it's not as I mean, that's a
Speaker 3: really American phenomenon. Greek life. You know, Canada is more
Speaker 3: clubs rather than you know, fraternity. We have them, but
Speaker 3: it's not a it's not the thing it is in America,
Speaker 3: where it's you know, I just don't it's not profound,
Speaker 3: it's it's you know, it's very different. But I would say, well,
Speaker 3: Canadians are wonderful, unique people, so it's just different.
Speaker 2: I guess We're not tacky, is what he was trying
Speaker 2: to say. We're not doing your techy clubs.
Speaker 3: I did John sears On on Beverly Hills nine O,
Speaker 3: two and O, and all of my scenes were that life,
Speaker 3: and they're kind of made up like that, a little
Speaker 3: bit to be, you know, a little more risque, a
Speaker 3: little bit more evil, a little more stuff. But I
Speaker 3: guess there's all bad stuff and good stuff. But I
Speaker 3: mean I think there's I don't know, you remember about
Speaker 3: last Night? That whole movie was about that life, wasn't it.
Speaker 3: Remember you didn't see about Last Night the original movie?
Speaker 2: To me?
Speaker 3: More and and no.
Speaker 2: Okay, no, but but I think Gigi represented a fantasy
Speaker 2: on our show of like a hot chicks throwing themselves
Speaker 2: at you, And so it makes sense that she exists
Speaker 2: within this fantasy of like, mmm, now there's a whole
Speaker 2: pack of chicks at our disposal?
Speaker 3: Would have been differently if it was if there was
Speaker 3: a predominantly female writing staff, How had that been represented differently?
Speaker 1: The college party you mean.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the college parties, Yeah, because the perspective is completely
Speaker 3: is everything, isn't it?
Speaker 1: It is? But I didn't go to any college parties.
Speaker 2: So I've never been to a friend, no party. I've
Speaker 2: never That's why I asked I was like, who of
Speaker 2: us has actually been in that situation? Because I went
Speaker 2: to school in New York City, Like, there were no
Speaker 2: frats or sororities in my college. We just went to
Speaker 2: the Blarney Stone.
Speaker 3: Academic at the University of British Columbia. I didn't, I
Speaker 3: mean to some parties, but it was never like that.
Speaker 3: Like I said, it was these are you know, brain
Speaker 3: cerebral kids really kind of studio.
Speaker 2: What we're saying is someone should invite us to a
Speaker 2: party just.
Speaker 1: For like it's just for college research.
Speaker 2: We're going to get an email and then that, you know,
Speaker 2: it's it's crazy that we were so close to you
Speaker 2: and c W and no one invited us to a party.
Speaker 2: We were so close to Were we that lame that
Speaker 2: no one wanted to party?
Speaker 1: I think James went to those parties because he.
Speaker 2: Was a young one.
Speaker 3: I forget that we were into college town too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the college kids didn't want to hang out with them.
Speaker 1: They were like no hard pass. I did love this
Speaker 1: storyline though. I really liked First of all, I love
Speaker 1: a friend who shows up at your house when you're
Speaker 1: not feeling well and is like getting the car we're
Speaker 1: taking a road drift ride or just shows up and
Speaker 1: takes you, makes you take a walk or go for
Speaker 1: coffee or something. I just love that. And as much
Speaker 1: as I disliked the college party environment for multiple reasons,
Speaker 1: mostly just because I've felt really bad for Kelsey, it
Speaker 1: just felt it felt like such a weird situation for
Speaker 1: her to constantly be put in. I liked this version
Speaker 1: of Skills trying to work out his own relationship issues
Speaker 1: like trying to have mouth do it Skills his way,
Speaker 1: and then realizing this is not who you are.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna let me actually take you, let me give
Speaker 1: you an opportunity to see what you think you're missing,
Speaker 1: and then I'm going to take you to see who
Speaker 1: you really need. You're such a good friend. I just
Speaker 1: I just liked it.
Speaker 2: I don't even think Skills was creazy. I didn't mind
Speaker 2: the party. I thought it was like fun. It reminded
Speaker 2: me of the parties that we had when we were
Speaker 2: in high school. The only thing that's creepy is like
Speaker 2: the dudes that are clearly out of school going back
Speaker 2: Flora like that's the But then I thought back to
Speaker 2: my own college days and I was dating like a
Speaker 2: twenty five year old who would come into the dorm
Speaker 2: and looking back, it's so gross. It's like embarrassing almost,
Speaker 2: that's what it is. It's embarrassing. The mouth and skills
Speaker 2: are standing there. You had them dressed very differently from
Speaker 2: everybody else, so they stick out like sore thumbs, and
Speaker 2: that that visibility was important to the storytelling. It was like, oh, actually,
Speaker 2: this isn't a world that we've fit in. We're the
Speaker 2: old guys. We should go.
Speaker 3: Do you remember how they held mouth upside down for
Speaker 3: the keg drink thing?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then Jamie with the car too.
Speaker 2: That was great.
Speaker 3: I thought I was so clever by putting Jamie upside
Speaker 3: down in there, which I had to match them.
Speaker 1: It was clever, it was cute. Those kinds of things
Speaker 1: make the show. It makes it interesting to watch in
Speaker 1: random moments Easter eggs of Hey, guys, we're here doing
Speaker 1: fun stuff for you.
Speaker 6: I like it.
Speaker 2: Well, let's get into the garage though, because because all these.
Speaker 3: Two together, right, wasn't it great to see the brothers
Speaker 3: kind of yeah, Cam.
Speaker 1: In Keith's garage.
Speaker 2: There's a real beauty to Chad and James together because
Speaker 2: they come to the same emotion from two really different places,
Speaker 2: and James has that very old Hollywood kind of huh.
Speaker 2: There's like, it's almost like a very slow Carrie Grant
Speaker 2: Jemmy Stewart kind of reaction. There's a just a classic
Speaker 2: nature to the way he reacts to news about Dan,
Speaker 2: to laying eyes on the garage after all this time,
Speaker 2: to giving advice to Lucas.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's deeply internal.
Speaker 2: It's really slow and it's fun to watch it on Furral.
Speaker 2: And then Chad has a very modern approach to things
Speaker 2: and he's very his emotion is very visible right away,
Speaker 2: and it's you know, stereotypically it would be described as
Speaker 2: like feminine really because women are stereotypically the ones that
Speaker 2: are vocal about their emotions. But Lucas have been raised
Speaker 2: by a mother, is someone who is quick to acknowledge
Speaker 2: his emotions. And so it's cool to see these guys
Speaker 2: in this space that's so meaningful, and for you to
Speaker 2: be the bad guy directing them through this scene, it's
Speaker 2: hard to it's hard to imagine them hitting their mark
Speaker 2: and then hearing Dan scott yell action.
Speaker 3: I think they divorce themselves from that one I'm directing.
Speaker 3: I don't know what they assume, but I will say,
Speaker 3: what do you hit? There was various student you found
Speaker 3: something really beautiful? What I call those little hidden gems
Speaker 3: is Chad seemed to me, always seems to me when
Speaker 3: he's working with James as curious about finding things out.
Speaker 3: And James, although has the wall and it's kind of
Speaker 3: reluctant to share his emotions so easily. He wants someone
Speaker 3: to work to get them out of him. And so
Speaker 3: when Chad gives him that gift, James gets to be
Speaker 3: more than what we often get because he wants people
Speaker 3: to like, please ask me, please ask me, but I
Speaker 3: don't really want to tell you because you know. And
Speaker 3: then when he does, you go, oh, oh, it's really
Speaker 3: beautiful to watch.
Speaker 2: That's such a good way to describe it. He wants
Speaker 2: someone to ask, and Chad is ready to ask.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, Yeah.
Speaker 1: I loved that, And I like the introduction of Jamie
Speaker 1: into that scenario too, that he was watching a little
Speaker 1: kid try and figure out how the world works. When
Speaker 1: he asked, is it okay for me to still miss
Speaker 1: Grandpa Dan?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 1: How do you? Is it okay for me to be
Speaker 1: angry and also miss someone? Is it okay for me
Speaker 1: to like acknowledge something that's bad but also still have love. Like,
Speaker 1: those are really big concepts and to watch a little
Speaker 1: kid struggle through them. I like being reminded of the
Speaker 1: things that we think about as a child, and we
Speaker 1: still carry those thoughts with us as we grow and
Speaker 1: grow and grow, and don't even necessarily have the answers
Speaker 1: to them. We just keep revisiting it over and over
Speaker 1: and over again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he did a great job. And seeing him in
Speaker 2: the Keith costume with the boots and the pants tucked in,
Speaker 2: you know, that legacy of what does it mean to
Speaker 2: be a Scott the father to son, uncle to nephew relationship.
Speaker 2: I like that our show perpetuated that and just like
Speaker 2: kept it going. And yeah, this idea that Dan's gonna die, Paul,
Speaker 2: I would love your take on things, because this was
Speaker 2: the episode for me as we were reaching the end
Speaker 2: of our contracts where it really solidified that they were
Speaker 2: toying with the idea of killing me, and they'd already
Speaker 2: killed Keith, and they'd put Moira on a shelf and
Speaker 2: all the actors who were being paid well from the
Speaker 2: beginning were cut off, and it occurred to me as
Speaker 2: you know, Peyton's preparing for her own death, that oh,
Speaker 2: I should do this emotional labor right now. I should
Speaker 2: prepare myself because I don't know what's going to happen,
Speaker 2: the same way Peyton doesn't know. But for you, you're
Speaker 2: also in this limbo where it's like, are they really
Speaker 2: going to kill me? And you've been living there much
Speaker 2: longer than me.
Speaker 3: I struggle sometimes because I know that all this goes public.
Speaker 2: Sure, I mean there might be a headline.
Speaker 3: Well no, no, I mean I want people to know things.
Speaker 3: But I'm also careful because, as I said, you know,
Speaker 3: I'm I get hurt easily, and so I got to
Speaker 3: be careful that I don't care. I was told at
Speaker 3: the end of that season that we're cutting your salary.
Speaker 3: It's take it or leave it. So I knew that
Speaker 3: there was some in the writing signs that if I
Speaker 3: didn't take a reduced salary that I was gone, And
Speaker 3: so I decided that I was probably going to be
Speaker 3: on because I was like feeling I'm worth whatever I'm
Speaker 3: being paid. You know, I've established myself and I think
Speaker 3: I have value to the show, and I hopefully filled
Speaker 3: the audience feels that way. But that didn't matter at
Speaker 3: that point. At the end of the day, we agreed
Speaker 3: on me only doing ten episodes the following season, I think,
Speaker 3: and I would still be directing because they didn't want
Speaker 3: to fire me as director. They just want to get
Speaker 3: rid of me as an actor because they thought they
Speaker 3: were paying me too much, or they had or they
Speaker 3: were cutting into whatever they were doing, whatever it was,
Speaker 3: and they're bringing in new cast, all kinds of stuff,
Speaker 3: and so I took over.
Speaker 2: The cast that they would pay nothing all over again.
Speaker 3: And I took a reduced salary for the last a
Speaker 3: couple of seasons and then kind of got a little
Speaker 3: bump again near the end. But it was it was hurt.
Speaker 2: Because sorry, Paul, value it's but it is. It's hurtful, Yeah,
Speaker 2: to build something and be told you're not valuable enough
Speaker 2: to maintain your salary.
Speaker 1: Especially when you know how much money they were making
Speaker 1: on the production and that the producers and the studio like,
Speaker 1: there's just it's unreasonable.
Speaker 2: It's me.
Speaker 3: It could be considered that. And what I try to
Speaker 3: do is say to myself, well, first off, the audience
Speaker 3: needs a proper sending off of this character. They deserve
Speaker 3: a storyline that means something, so let me do the
Speaker 3: ten episodes and give them that. But then Dan kind
Speaker 3: of caught fire again and they couldn't get rid of me, really,
Speaker 3: and so they kind of were like, well, but you
Speaker 3: come back, and I'm like, now, I was like, you
Speaker 3: wanted the ten episodes, I'm so happy to give it
Speaker 3: to you, and you know, but they didn't finish the storyline.
Speaker 3: Then they said, well, I have a great idea, and
Speaker 3: then they pitched me this other idea where we all
Speaker 3: know where it went, and I said, that sounds super fun.
Speaker 3: I'd love to do it. You know, I just can't
Speaker 3: do it, you know, at that price, and because I
Speaker 3: feel like, you know, it's wrong for me to take
Speaker 3: lesson what I feel i'm worth, even though I think
Speaker 3: it's a great story and I'm really happy about it.
Speaker 3: And so we worked out something else, which wasn't what
Speaker 3: it should have been. But it's like, again, nobody is
Speaker 3: a right to in our industry to say, like, you know,
Speaker 3: I deserve a certain amount of money. You deserve what
Speaker 3: you can negotiate, because that's business.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well yeah, it's in every business.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's really rare in other industries. If you
Speaker 2: worked at the bank and they came to you and
Speaker 2: they said, hey, you've been here a decade. It's so cool.
Speaker 2: We're going to pay you seventy percent of what we've
Speaker 2: been paying, you know, like any other industry, that's such
Speaker 2: a weird shoots and ladders thing to do to a person.
Speaker 2: And living in that limbo. You know, we're in six
Speaker 2: nineteen here, and there's five more episodes left in this season,
Speaker 2: and so you're working for five more episodes having to
Speaker 2: wonder am I behaving well enough? Am I making people happy?
Speaker 2: What did I do wrong? Is anyone going to give
Speaker 2: me a straight answer? Or am I getting the run around?
Speaker 2: Like the manipulation was really well?
Speaker 3: You guys felt it too. I mean, yeah, no different ways.
Speaker 3: Let me just say this on a pousitive note, I didn't.
Speaker 3: Once you make the decision, what your decision is, I
Speaker 3: do let it go and I focus on.
Speaker 2: The work because you have to argue.
Speaker 3: You know, I completely let it go. And I never
Speaker 3: have been brought it up to the producers. I never
Speaker 3: brought it up to the cast, never brought to anybody
Speaker 3: because I'm a pro and as are you guys. And
Speaker 3: once I make the decision, it's my decision and I'm
Speaker 3: going to live with it. So I didn't want it.
Speaker 3: And that's why I never speak about it.
Speaker 2: Really.
Speaker 3: I brought it up because you've brought up a point about, hey,
Speaker 3: there's a foreshadowing here. Sure was that, and well that
Speaker 3: was a negotiating thing and it was put on my plate.
Speaker 3: It was meant to scare me or whatever. And so
Speaker 3: I brought it up because it's it was a storyline
Speaker 3: that they used in a way to haggle with an
Speaker 3: actor about money.
Speaker 2: Well, it's how they haggled with Craig about his facial
Speaker 2: hair and his bandana and like the stuff he wanted.
Speaker 2: They said, either change these things or we will get
Speaker 2: rid of you. And he was like, not going to
Speaker 2: change these things, and they got rid of him. They
Speaker 2: so we are already had it.
Speaker 1: There's so many egos and power plays that go on
Speaker 1: behind the scenes that affect the work.
Speaker 2: That's he was missed.
Speaker 3: Joy, Craig was missed when he was gone. He was
Speaker 3: a whole Yeah, in me and I think in you
Speaker 3: guys too. He was such a calming and you know,
Speaker 3: a veteran, you know, lovely human being who really cared
Speaker 3: for us. All it was. It was. I know that
Speaker 3: what they had to do there to do, but I
Speaker 3: deeply missed his presence.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, he was one of the biggest hearts
Speaker 1: of the show, everybody, you know, representing a part of
Speaker 1: the body as a whole what this show was.
Speaker 3: It's so funny. I had like goosebumps in these conversations.
Speaker 3: Don't you guys get that way when you talk.
Speaker 2: About well because of the line between fact and fiction,
Speaker 2: because we were a unit off camera and obviously a
Speaker 2: unit on camera because that's the story that we're telling.
Speaker 2: But what happens on camera affects what happens off care
Speaker 2: and vice a person. So yeah, living with that loss
Speaker 2: and knowing how quickly and you know, severely it can happen,
Speaker 2: We're all prepped and ready for it to happen, you know,
Speaker 2: for our heads to roll at any point, And so
Speaker 2: I felt I felt taken care of in this moment
Speaker 2: where it dawned on me that Peyton might die because
Speaker 2: my contract was up, because you were the person who
Speaker 2: was at the helm of how I was portraying it,
Speaker 2: and every other director always wanted me to cry. I mean,
Speaker 2: every visiting director was like, can we get a tear?
Speaker 2: Can we get a sniffle? And I just love the scene.
Speaker 2: I have such tactile sense memory of that hat box
Speaker 2: at the end of the episode that Peyton's putting the
Speaker 2: sketches in. I wanted to keep that more than any
Speaker 2: other prop I'd ever had on the show. I wanted
Speaker 2: it so bad. And I have such memories of you
Speaker 2: being like, don't cry when you put that picture in here,
Speaker 2: Like you don't let them see you cry. You are
Speaker 2: in full control of what's going on. And that sense
Speaker 2: of like bittersweet empowerment I hold very dear because things
Speaker 2: do end, people do die, stuff falls apart, and you
Speaker 2: can keep your chin up.
Speaker 3: You know, I could get a compliment from anybody in
Speaker 3: the world, it would be just like that. That makes
Speaker 3: me feel.
Speaker 2: Well, it's a compliment to you, Paul.
Speaker 3: Well, no, it's a beautiful That's what I'm saying is
Speaker 3: I'm grateful for the recognition of how much I care
Speaker 3: about you guys. You know, I mean that means the
Speaker 3: whole ten years of my life in North Carolina. If
Speaker 3: it was just one compliment like that, it'd be worth
Speaker 3: it all. You know.
Speaker 2: I love that well, we all had those moments with
Speaker 2: you I'm glad I didn't cry. Those mother filled me.
Speaker 2: Then I don't cross some pictures. I'll leave them behind.
Speaker 2: I don't care.
Speaker 3: I never cried in public either.
Speaker 2: Our dignity you.
Speaker 1: Were always you were like the walls, Paul. You were
Speaker 1: just there kind of watching, listening, and you just you
Speaker 1: had you had just the right door window for us
Speaker 1: at the exact right moment to open up and share
Speaker 1: something or remind us of where we were and what
Speaker 1: we needed, what was important. But you were so good
Speaker 1: at that, just sort of being their hands off and
Speaker 1: showing up exactly when it was needed, like in that
Speaker 1: moment with Well.
Speaker 3: That means everything. I also remember that, you know, all
Speaker 3: you guys had come with such wide eyes, such excitement.
Speaker 3: I remember everybody's face the first time I was introduced
Speaker 3: to each one of you, you know, even even Sophie.
Speaker 3: I remember the very first time she came on the said,
Speaker 3: I remember you know everybody, and it was just kind
Speaker 3: of like, this is going to be something, going to
Speaker 3: be something, And I didn't know if it was like
Speaker 3: even the pile we show about, we know where it
Speaker 3: picked up. I felt this is going to be something.
Speaker 3: Everybody brought such hope to their work, you know, you know,
Speaker 3: I wouldn't it be great if every experience was like that.
Speaker 3: I didn't. I hadn't felt that on every experience I
Speaker 3: was on, and in fact, I felt very much an
Speaker 3: outsider on many shows I've been a guest on, and
Speaker 3: films are different because those are sort of you know,
Speaker 3: location ships with people and then you're gone. But this
Speaker 3: was never has there been anything like family? And because
Speaker 3: I was such an evil and maniacally bizarre character in
Speaker 3: many ways and unpredictable. And I love that I was
Speaker 3: the spice in the stew. I love that. But I
Speaker 3: was never unloved by people on the cast. I was loved,
Speaker 3: and that was what made it okay to go to
Speaker 3: those places in those scenes. I made it okay, you know.
Speaker 3: And I know that even the tensions that I had
Speaker 3: with certain people you know, are long forgotten and long forgiven,
Speaker 3: and those there are moments of like humanity, not moments
Speaker 3: of evil. That makes the difference.
Speaker 2: Well, so then how did you direct our new big
Speaker 2: bad this the Fall Fall? I hope that. I'm so
Speaker 2: glad she had you to hold her hand through this weirdness,
Speaker 2: because who are you talking about the principal ram Kiss
Speaker 2: who showed up in your living room? Joy, you had
Speaker 2: so much to do with this episode. Haley was in
Speaker 2: everybody's house or office. Haley graveled this episode. But then
Speaker 2: this woman had the audacity to walk her ass into
Speaker 2: your living room to my house. Children can forgive, but
Speaker 2: a grown ass woman. That's a Dan Scott move to
Speaker 2: walk into somebody else's house.
Speaker 1: It is talk about making the writing work, because that's
Speaker 1: just in the script. Like the kid says something and
Speaker 1: turns around and there she is in the living room,
Speaker 1: and you got to figure out how to make that believable.
Speaker 3: Well, asked me about that on the set. You said,
Speaker 3: how come she just shows up? How can she just said?
Speaker 1: You asked me like, yeah, I'm sure I did, And
Speaker 1: you're like, I don't know, Jo, It's in the script.
Speaker 1: If you had a question about it, you should have
Speaker 1: called the writer five days agout.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would have loved to have see her just
Speaker 2: like pop up in a window. What are you guys
Speaker 2: doing here? Yeah? It was, but it was a good
Speaker 2: It was like it was Hailey's dangerous mind moment. You know,
Speaker 2: she's got her leather jacket on. My god, teacher had.
Speaker 1: On totally was dangerous minds light. Yeah, no, it was fun.
Speaker 1: I mean we had we had a good time. It
Speaker 1: was fun working with all those kids. And yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean you always made it so easy, Paul, and just
Speaker 1: everything that you were just saying is so true. You
Speaker 1: know it is. It's a family and that's what we created.
Speaker 1: And it was a safe space for us as a
Speaker 1: family to do so many things and experiment with so
Speaker 1: many things. And yeah, thank you for being so magical
Speaker 1: and whimsical and curious. You've really kept your curiosity. It's wonderful.
Speaker 3: And so I had that conversation with Quinn the other day.
Speaker 3: I was like, I said, the only thing I hope
Speaker 3: for you is to never lose your curiosity. I said,
Speaker 3: people who are curious are so interesting and so fun
Speaker 3: to be around. And that's what I said. Remember the
Speaker 3: conversation we had.
Speaker 2: Yes, what does he think about? Has he ever watched
Speaker 2: one trio?
Speaker 3: He's never watched it. But one time when he was
Speaker 3: feeling I think it was like nine or maybe ten
Speaker 3: years old, we were somewhere and somebody recognized me and
Speaker 3: Quinn said, do you want me to take the picture?
Speaker 3: Do you want me to take the picture? My dad
Speaker 3: was Dan Scott on one trial do you want me to.
Speaker 2: Take the picture?
Speaker 3: And I'm like, going, honey, it sounds like you're very
Speaker 3: proud of me, and he goes, He goes, well, I've
Speaker 3: never seen the show, dad, you know that.
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, that's very.
Speaker 3: Quinn is the most interesting, bizarre, as Joy will.
Speaker 2: Tell you, and the best. Well when when your dad
Speaker 2: is like an iconic bad guy. I feel like your
Speaker 2: son and my children probably have a lot in common.
Speaker 2: Before people feel in ownership over you, but also in
Speaker 2: antagonism when they see you in public. And so as
Speaker 2: a child, especially like my kid, your kid entering their
Speaker 2: teenage years. For a teenage boy to have this like
Speaker 2: bad dad, it's kind of it's kind of great, like
Speaker 2: because they get to have some swagger walking into middle
Speaker 2: school and high school, like, you know, my dad will
Speaker 2: kick your ass right like you know that I come
Speaker 2: from dangerous stock. There's a there's an allure to it.
Speaker 2: I hope he utilizes that.
Speaker 3: Well, we'll see. He's a he's a he's a very
Speaker 3: unique person. You know, he has all kinds of superpowers
Speaker 3: because who he is. But he's also got some interesting
Speaker 3: challenges in his life, you know, so I find it
Speaker 3: to be I don't know what you guys think, but
Speaker 3: you know, raising a kid nowadays, I'm terrified that I'm
Speaker 3: not up to how fast things are changing. And I'm trying,
Speaker 3: but I'm more terrified that I'm not up for it
Speaker 3: than they are, that I'm not able to learn and
Speaker 3: grow and evolve and understand what the challenges they're going
Speaker 3: to be facing. Is. So the One Tree Hill world
Speaker 3: that we grew up in, which was even a televised
Speaker 3: television version of a world, is almost like the nineteen twenties.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, they're going through.
Speaker 3: And my son said, Dad, do you know that we're
Speaker 3: close that the nineteen seventies was as close to the
Speaker 3: nineteen twenties as we are to two thousand, as in
Speaker 3: ninety seventy and twenty two four?
Speaker 1: And I went, what the nineties are the best?
Speaker 3: Rude the nineteen seventies or as close to the nineteen
Speaker 3: twenties as twenty twenty four as to the nineteen seventies.
Speaker 3: So think about that, you were born when the nineteen
Speaker 3: twenties people were like the Great Depression. Yeah too, and
Speaker 3: as you as your kids are to you know, nineteen
Speaker 3: seventies to twenty twenties.
Speaker 2: It's like, Wow, it's shocking. Yeah, no, it hurts. And
Speaker 2: I remedy that by only letting my child have a
Speaker 2: flip phone, Paul, and it alleviates so much bullshit. I'm like,
Speaker 2: you're allowed to have nineties technology.
Speaker 7: Friend, Here you go the way to do it.
Speaker 1: Okay, we have a fan question. Here we go. If
Speaker 1: you had only one hour to spend in tree Hill
Speaker 1: and you have two options here, would you rather hit
Speaker 1: the night out on the town with Deb or have
Speaker 1: an insightful conversation with Karen in her cafe?
Speaker 3: Unfair the guests, and I love them. I think my
Speaker 3: favorite time is with Deb were when we were worrying
Speaker 3: each other, like the War of the Roses.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, so, and and I do.
Speaker 3: Love I do think there was chemistry with both characters.
Speaker 3: I do love the intimacy, and I mean, honestly, the
Speaker 3: weird part about working with Moira was that her her
Speaker 3: her emotions were so palpable, and then I felt hatred
Speaker 3: towards me. I tried to be smug and I tried
Speaker 3: to be like, well, she's just doing this because she
Speaker 3: really loves me. Because I have to justify these behaviors. Right,
Speaker 3: So as a character, I'm going, well, this is the
Speaker 3: only reason she's doing this because she still cares about me.
Speaker 3: That's she'd be talking to me like.
Speaker 2: This if she didn't get me, right, if she Yeah, it.
Speaker 3: Works better for the character. If she didn't care about me,
Speaker 3: she wouldn't care. She cares so much she's showing me
Speaker 3: her hatred, which means she's actually still in love with me.
Speaker 3: And that's how I would.
Speaker 2: Play it, which is.
Speaker 3: Right. That's got to make her din't matter, which is
Speaker 3: good for the character. For the show. With deb I
Speaker 3: didn't have to go there because it was more like,
Speaker 3: I don't want to say this in a bad way,
Speaker 3: but sort of like foreplay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's it. I never got the sense of the
Speaker 2: dev hated Dan. I always thought it was a version
Speaker 2: of like crazy.
Speaker 3: So there, the energies are very very interesting, but so different.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't like feelings, so I'm probably gonna go
Speaker 2: with the going out option, like I want to be
Speaker 2: I want to be out. And we've seen how tree
Speaker 2: Hill can party. We've done bachelorette parties and limos and
Speaker 2: and what else have we done in tree Hill? Riverboats? Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's a party towntown.
Speaker 1: It is apparently there's crazy college parties. I'd go out
Speaker 1: with Deb too, I'd go I mean, Deb, is are
Speaker 1: you kidding me? Deb's got people in catsuits climbing on billboards.
Speaker 1: I'm going with Deb.
Speaker 5: She did.
Speaker 3: Karen though I directed that episode, I know, but.
Speaker 1: She had convinced Karen ticket you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: Karen's great. I mean, I love it. I love a
Speaker 1: good conversation, but I have a lot of those in
Speaker 1: my life. I need. I need more like nights out,
Speaker 1: people dragging me out, doing fun stuff.
Speaker 2: Less feelings, more fun. Now you're coming to the dark side.
Speaker 1: I like it.
Speaker 2: So listen, what's our honorable mention for this episode? What
Speaker 2: was something that really stood out to you and felt meaningful?
Speaker 2: Were nice?
Speaker 6: Well?
Speaker 3: What about you? What about your the in the in
Speaker 3: the coda, that incredible moment you have there. I thought
Speaker 3: that was kind of beautiful, you know, with your artwork
Speaker 3: and your you know again moment right that. I thought
Speaker 3: that was even very well and poignant.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thank you. I I loved, loved, loved, loved, loved, loved,
Speaker 2: love loved Sam and Jack and their little first kiss
Speaker 2: and the build up to it the awkwardness of it.
Speaker 2: I wish when we had been playing teenagers we had
Speaker 2: had more awkward kisses because we were expected to be
Speaker 2: very like practiced and sexy and experienced, and these kids
Speaker 2: actually resemble teenagers, and there just their weirdness and what
Speaker 2: they say to each other. And then when she doesn't
Speaker 2: leave for l a and she comes back and sees
Speaker 2: her with the diner and says so about that kiss,
Speaker 2: and he goes, yeah, this is awkward, Like they just
Speaker 2: absolutely don't know the right thing to say.
Speaker 1: And you building the tower of creamers. That had to
Speaker 1: be your idea.
Speaker 3: Paul greg was also in a Kelsey's mom was on
Speaker 3: this set, which is nice.
Speaker 2: That was Ashley's mom.
Speaker 3: Sorry, yeah, she was on the set, And I think
Speaker 3: that really made it nice because you have, you know,
Speaker 3: the support and you know the you know, having her
Speaker 3: sit right next to me in the whole thing and
Speaker 3: having that guidance from you know, the mother and all
Speaker 3: that's nice. I don't know, just get made it though.
Speaker 3: That was so cute. He's a good actress.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's done okay for himself and having Peters is fine.
Speaker 2: He's doing right.
Speaker 1: My honorable mention goes to your your long lenses is man.
Speaker 1: They it sucked me into the storyline. It really did.
Speaker 1: Like I always feel like there's something it's more intimate
Speaker 1: when you are when I'm watching something on a long lens.
Speaker 1: And the fact that you used it to actually make
Speaker 1: some of the storylines that didn't make sense to make
Speaker 1: them work better really impressive super long lens.
Speaker 3: Don't forget Orn's song was fantastic in the episode.
Speaker 1: That's okay.
Speaker 3: I love that song. I think it was a great,
Speaker 3: great piece of music they chose for it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well should we spin a wheel. Let's spin
Speaker 2: the wheel, all right, Paul? We do our most likely too.
Speaker 2: You're familiar, are you our most frequent guest?
Speaker 6: You know?
Speaker 2: Oh? Hey, now who is most likely to date someone
Speaker 2: fifteen years younger than them? Paul Johnson?
Speaker 1: I love this is what the Google random thing pulled
Speaker 1: up the day you're on our show.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Why would the wheel ask that today?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I mean I think I would say who's the
Speaker 3: most random? Who's the most likely to do that?
Speaker 1: You have to pick a real life one, and then
Speaker 1: a character, and.
Speaker 2: Then a character.
Speaker 3: Well, Whitey doesn't have much of a choice.
Speaker 2: That's what I was gonna say. I was like, why's
Speaker 2: like flaing? Like what teacher at Tree Hill High after
Speaker 2: Camilla died? Did he have a non committed romp with
Speaker 2: in a lot?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I would have loved it. I would have loved it.
Speaker 1: No one could know about this.
Speaker 3: Uh and what about h Lewis in real life?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 2: How much older than us are you? You played like
Speaker 2: our dads. But because my parents really thought I was
Speaker 2: gonna date you during the pilot, they were just like, Hillary,
Speaker 2: don't do it. Don't like, what are you talking about.
Speaker 2: They're like, we see the way you two laugh.
Speaker 1: We see like.
Speaker 3: Saw you on your MTV show and you just charmed
Speaker 3: everybody you or everybody loves you. It could be even
Speaker 3: the camera guys loved you. They would It's like you
Speaker 3: were so you were a magnet in.
Speaker 2: A different world. Did we date in a different world?
Speaker 3: Because I want to be friends with Jeffrey, I want
Speaker 3: to know that's it?
Speaker 2: Well, I mean he he says he wouldn't have dated
Speaker 2: me if he had been on the show.
Speaker 3: He never calls me. I want to work with him.
Speaker 3: I want to hire your husband for everything.
Speaker 2: Well, come to Boston. He's filming with zombies right now
Speaker 2: and the other night he had people leaning out of
Speaker 2: the window telling him not to do any of the
Speaker 2: drugs and whatever town they're shooting it because there's Fennel
Speaker 2: in it. And I'm like, Jeffrey, where are you right now?
Speaker 2: Go on now, listen. I like an age gap. I
Speaker 2: can endorse an age gap. And I know a lot
Speaker 2: of people look down their nose at it, but I
Speaker 2: like an age gap, and I'm going to stand by
Speaker 2: that decision. Mine's seventeen to it.
Speaker 3: Everybody's consenting, and everybody's legal what it is. But love
Speaker 3: is a very peculiar thing because in my life I've
Speaker 3: been lonely and I've been with people who were you know,
Speaker 3: you know, I don't know that. I thought we're filling
Speaker 3: holes in my life. And then I've been with people
Speaker 3: that that never could fill a hole in my life.
Speaker 3: And then it's kind of like, I don't know. When
Speaker 3: you find your person and they're you know, have their
Speaker 3: own lives and themselves and are doing things and they
Speaker 3: bring joy to you and you're healthy for each other,
Speaker 3: you find a way. Because love is freaking hard. Age
Speaker 3: gap or no age, love is hard, man.
Speaker 2: Yeah, do you think?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: It is.
Speaker 1: It's it's work.
Speaker 2: I like a settled person that's like, this is what
Speaker 2: I am. Yeah, let me get it. You know that
Speaker 2: was a feeling because our lives are so frantic all
Speaker 2: the time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, at some point, the age, the number of the
Speaker 1: age just doesn't become a factor if the person is
Speaker 1: the right if it's the right match, if your baggage
Speaker 1: match matches.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot of a lot of strong opinions
Speaker 3: out there, and you know, we can't you can't control
Speaker 3: you know, how people feel about things. You can just
Speaker 3: live a good life and hopefully they'll see your good
Speaker 3: is it?
Speaker 2: Anytime? There are those like BuzzFeed articles where they're like
Speaker 2: age gaps ooh yuck. I'm like, oh no, are they
Speaker 2: gonna put us in it?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: And sometimes they do and it's okay because you know,
Speaker 2: you know, everything's cool. I like Whitey having a having
Speaker 2: a dalliance. You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we missed that storyline.
Speaker 3: You remember, Ashley's mom on the show was played by
Speaker 3: Sean Young.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Later she came back.
Speaker 2: Was that Ashley. No, that wasn't Ashley's mom, that was
Speaker 2: Abby's mom. The character Abby was played Bob.
Speaker 1: That's right. In school that was yes, earlier on you
Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about?
Speaker 2: Yeah, what was Abby? The Alison scambody Skaggliotti Skaggliotti. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Alison Scagliotti's mom was Sean Young.
Speaker 1: That's right.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Did you kiss her? Why do he could have
Speaker 2: kissed her?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 1: Yeah? She was crazy?
Speaker 3: Though, You're right, she was crazy?
Speaker 1: Was it our character crazy?
Speaker 2: Was she not?
Speaker 1: I missed it? I forgot guys. If it's not, if
Speaker 1: I haven't seen it, read it, heard it within the
Speaker 1: last like two months, it's I can't remember.
Speaker 2: It's apple sauce.
Speaker 1: Okay, Friends, next episode, Season six, episode twenty. I would
Speaker 1: for you. I would thanks for coming, Paul, thanks for
Speaker 1: coming on the show and talking with us. Always a pleasure.
Speaker 2: You're the best, Honey, You're the best.
Speaker 3: Guys.
Speaker 2: I miss you too. Give love to that boy.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah yeah, us to New York.
Speaker 2: Join us.
Speaker 8: Happy birthday, quin the y We we used the I
Speaker 8: from the birth wim Happy b Day and threw the
Speaker 8: rest of it out day and he goes down, you
Speaker 8: missed still birthday and you can catch it and he goes.
Speaker 3: I guess.
Speaker 6: I did it?
Speaker 2: Incredible, all right, buddy. We love you so much. Thank
Speaker 2: you have you.
Speaker 1: Bye everybody. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave
Speaker 1: us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram
Speaker 1: at Drama Queens O t H.
Speaker 2: Or email us at Drama Queens at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2: See you next time. We all about that.
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