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Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Greece.

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Speaker 2: Now they tell us, Now they tell us, why are

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Speaker 2: we just hearing that? Oh yeah, guess what, there is

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Speaker 2: a serial killer. We I and many others have been

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Speaker 2: screaming from the get go there is a serial killer

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Speaker 2: stalking Portland. But police not only deny it, they come

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Speaker 2: right out and say, point blank, we want to address

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Speaker 2: all the quote rumors that there's a serial killer. It's

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Speaker 2: absolutely not true. Now we find out what they said

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Speaker 2: is what's not true. That's kind of an outright lie.

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Speaker 2: I had to put that on the Portland PD. But

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Speaker 2: it feels like a kick in the teeth when someone

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Speaker 2: in law enforcement intentionally misleads the public. They stated that

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Speaker 2: they did not want to scare Portland women. How about

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Speaker 2: saving Portland women from a serial killer? And the number

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Speaker 2: one way to avoid being a victim is having knowledge,

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Speaker 2: knowledge that there is a serial killer and this is

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Speaker 2: his mo modus opera and die method of operation. These

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Speaker 2: are his victims. This is what they had in common.

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Speaker 2: What if anything, does that have to do with me

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Speaker 2: a woman walking down the street, getting out of my

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Speaker 2: car and going into the department store in Portland. But no,

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Speaker 2: they kept it a secret. They knew it, but they

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Speaker 2: not only no comment that didn't happen, they outright denied it.

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Speaker 2: That said Bottleshell, there is a serial killer in Portland.

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Speaker 2: I'm Nancy Grace. This is crime Stories. Thank you for

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Speaker 2: being with us here at Fox Nation and Serious XM

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Speaker 2: one eleven. Take listen to our friends at ABC and KATU.

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Speaker 3: A major development in the investigation into the deaths of

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Speaker 3: several women in Oregon. Just one month after police suggested

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Speaker 3: the mysterious deaths of six women were not connected, officials

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Speaker 3: now say they believe at least four killings are connected.

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Speaker 3: The victims' bodies were found in wooded and rural areas

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Speaker 3: between February and May. Nine agencies took part in the investigation,

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Speaker 3: leading them to a person of interest.

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Speaker 4: It's a story that has grabbed headlines across the region.

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Speaker 4: The bodies of six women found in or near the

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Speaker 4: Portland metro area in a relatively short timeframe. It sparked

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Speaker 4: weeks of speculation and rumors. Tonight we know police believe

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Speaker 4: at least four are connected.

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Speaker 5: Investigators say the deaths of Kristin Smith, Charity Perry Bridget Webster,

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Speaker 5: and Ashley Reel are linked, and sources say a person

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Speaker 5: of interest is already off the streets.

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Speaker 2: And I'd like to point out that person of interest

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Speaker 2: who is quote off the streets, Jesse Lee Calhoun. He's

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Speaker 2: thirty eight years old. When they're saying he's off the streets,

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Speaker 2: that's because they've just snabbed him. He was behind bars

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Speaker 2: already for a long string of arrests. He is a

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Speaker 2: career criminal. He has attacked police officer and a canine

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Speaker 2: in the past. He's committed all sorts of felonies. But

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Speaker 2: he got early release under the former governor because she

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Speaker 2: thought he was susceptible to COVID. Okay, he was recently

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Speaker 2: ordered picked up after there's clear links to him and

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Speaker 2: it's just got to be DNA. But that said, he

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Speaker 2: got early release, and I've got copious notes that I've

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Speaker 2: taken about the time he was released on the streets

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Speaker 2: July twenty two. By June, about a year and a

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Speaker 2: half later, twenty twenty three, report submerged in The Oregonian

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Speaker 2: that six young women's bodies have been found. That was fast.

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Speaker 2: He's out less than two years on the street. Six

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Speaker 2: women's bodies are found right now. Four of these women

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Speaker 2: are being linked I'm waiting to hear about the other two.

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Speaker 2: Now one may have been an unintentional overdose. We're waiting

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Speaker 2: to find out about that, but I don't know that.

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Speaker 2: And another thing to consider before I get to my

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Speaker 2: All Star panel is that this is a serial killer's dream.

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Speaker 2: It's a no police zone. Remember Portland, stop police, get

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Speaker 2: rid of police, make this this police free zone. Well,

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Speaker 2: you know what, here you go, six dead bodies as

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Speaker 2: a serial killer. That said, again, thank you for being

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Speaker 2: with us. I want to go first out of this

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Speaker 2: All Star panel to Cheryl McCollum, founder and director of

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Speaker 2: the Cold Case Research Institute, star of a hit new

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Speaker 2: series Zone seven. You can find her at coldcasecrimes dot org. Cheryl,

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Speaker 2: can you believe this? How long have you and I

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Speaker 2: and many others I can't take all the credit been

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Speaker 2: saying there is a serial killer. I don't care what

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Speaker 2: police are saying there's a serial killer.

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Speaker 6: It was pretty obvious to all of us. So again,

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Speaker 6: whatever decision they.

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Speaker 2: Maybe they think we're idiots.

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Speaker 6: Well, I mean, if they already identified this guy on

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Speaker 6: their own, and they knew he was already locked up,

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Speaker 6: maybe they just wanted to keep playing it because they

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Speaker 6: were interviewing.

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Speaker 2: People, Cheryl, he was released. Oh yeah, that's how all

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Speaker 2: the women, well a lot of them got killed. And

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Speaker 2: it'll be a cold day in HG double l that

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Speaker 2: I believe this is his first rodeo. I mean, Karen Stark,

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Speaker 2: you're the renowned psychologists joining us out of Manhattan at

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Speaker 2: Karenstark dot com. That's Karen with a C. There's no

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Speaker 2: way these are his first murders. It's just not possible.

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Speaker 2: And I want to point out one more thing and

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Speaker 2: my analysis. I believe that the serial killer obviously used

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Speaker 2: a car because these women are dumped. One was behind

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Speaker 2: a barn in a rural area. One was down a

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Speaker 2: riverside parkway out in a remote area. They're found in

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Speaker 2: wooded and remote areas. He didn't drag them there on

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Speaker 2: his back. Okay, now let me throw you this detail,

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Speaker 2: Karen Stark. I understand that he has told people haven't

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Speaker 2: found any verification of it yet, but he is a

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Speaker 2: self proclaimed artist that he paints individualized, unique art on cars.

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Speaker 2: So there you go that those cars, that any car

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Speaker 2: that he has used is full forensic evidence. But what

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Speaker 2: do you say, can and start first radio? Yes?

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Speaker 7: No, no, I really I can't imagine because when you

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Speaker 7: were somebody who was a serial killer the way that

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Speaker 7: he is, and it's woman after woman after women. He

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Speaker 7: had practiced on doing this, Nancy. I don't know how

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Speaker 7: he started or where he started, but there are bodies

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Speaker 7: somewhere that this man has definitely killed, and I'm sure

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Speaker 7: they're going to find other evidence, because that's just how

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Speaker 7: serial killers work. They don't all of a sudden, most

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Speaker 7: of the time, just kill someone and say, yeah, I'm

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Speaker 7: going to try it. They practice, They practice until they

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Speaker 7: really know what they're doing, and then they keep going

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Speaker 7: and it gets worse. So it's a good thing they

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Speaker 7: found him. And by the way, I think a thousand

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Speaker 7: people who were released.

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Speaker 2: Early when he was Yeah, thanks Governor Jackie. Wasn't that

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Speaker 2: Governor Brown? Governor Brown? Now we've got kochake in. She

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Speaker 2: is the one that signed the go get him put

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Speaker 2: in behind bars order, But it was Brown that released

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Speaker 2: him as part of a giant clean out of the jail,

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Speaker 2: get out of jail free moment. Back to you, Cheryl McCollum,

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Speaker 2: director of the Cold Case Research Institute, Cheryl, what convince

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Speaker 2: to you there was a serial killer long before the

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Speaker 2: Portland police finally told the truth.

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Speaker 6: Well, the dates you're talking about February nineteenth to May seventh,

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Speaker 6: you've got four people in a small condensed area. They

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Speaker 6: all are similar in age from twenty two to thirty one.

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Speaker 6: They look kind of similar.

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Speaker 2: Again, the area that.

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Speaker 6: They were last seen is critical. So if they're all

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Speaker 6: in this downtown Portland area, a condensed area, and then

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Speaker 6: they're all dumped in a similar area, that tells you

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Speaker 6: right there you need to be looking at this as

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Speaker 6: a connection as links.

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Speaker 2: I want to go now to Annett Newell with k

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Speaker 2: x L News and she's a host of speaking freely

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Speaker 2: with Annette Mule and thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: Thanks Nancy. What finally nudged the Portland Police to admit

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Speaker 2: that there's a serial killer stalking women across the Portland area.

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Speaker 8: You know, the Portland Police actually have not admitted that yet.

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Speaker 8: The admission really came from the Moltnomah County District Attorney

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Speaker 8: because the pressure had finally been too great for them

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Speaker 8: to bear, because they've been getting Basically, we've known what's

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Speaker 8: going on here. It's pretty obvious that there are links

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Speaker 8: between these women. In fact, just this morning, I see

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Speaker 8: in the Oregonian that investigators have been searching a Riverview

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Speaker 8: apartment where Jesse Lee Calhoun, the suspect, lived with a

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Speaker 8: girlfriend after his June sixth arrest, and that girlfriend confirmed

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Speaker 8: that he had ties to two of these women, Ashley

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Speaker 8: Real and Ridget Walker. So they all knew, we knew know.

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Speaker 8: Some of these women knew each other. Two of them

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Speaker 8: were good friends growing up as kids. They were friends,

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Speaker 8: you know. So we've known that there's obvious connections here,

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Speaker 8: and I think the pressure finally got so great that

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Speaker 8: they had to come clean and say, yes, there is

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Speaker 8: a connection here.

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Speaker 2: Well, somebody's said, is going to roll a better role.

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Speaker 1: Prime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Joining me. Also Jarrett Farentino, homicide prosecutor. You can find

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Speaker 2: them on Insta and Facebook at Jarrett Farantino. Jarrett, did

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Speaker 2: you hear what Annitt Neil just said. It's always shocking

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Speaker 2: to me to find out a serial killer has like

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Speaker 2: a girlfriend at home and a Riverview apartment blending in

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Speaker 2: with the rest of us. You can't look at someone

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Speaker 2: and tell what's going on, what's lurking behind that facade?

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Speaker 2: I mean, look at the guy they've just arrested. For

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Speaker 2: the long Island serial killings. He has a wife and

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Speaker 2: two children. He's a respected architect in New York City.

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Speaker 2: Kind of reminds me a little bit of BTK, the

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Speaker 2: dog Catcher deacon at his church, wife, children, he was

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Speaker 2: killing women left and right, dressing up in their clothes

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Speaker 2: and taking pictures. Okay, so how these people I can't

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Speaker 2: say that Brian Coburger really blended in, right, He's getting

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Speaker 2: his PhD there at Washington State University, and he had

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Speaker 2: been up to all sorts of freaky shenanigans before he

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Speaker 2: gets charged with murder. But aside from him, so many

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Speaker 2: of these prolific killers blend in with everybody else.

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Speaker 9: Well, that's so true, Nancy, And you raise a good

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Speaker 9: point to talk about BTK and Cooleberger and this latest

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Speaker 9: the architect with the Gilo Beach murders Shereman, Yes, Hewerman.

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Speaker 9: And the reality is Calhoun is a little different than

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Speaker 9: those individuals. Calhoun is a career criminal and a violent criminal.

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Speaker 9: This is a guy who choked a dog when the

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Speaker 9: swat team came to get him.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I stop right there, Jarrett Farantino, I knew that

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Speaker 2: he attacked a cop and the K nine I did

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Speaker 2: not know he tried to choke the dog.

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Speaker 9: That's what was reported when the when the police came

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Speaker 9: to get him. So the reality is this is someone

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Speaker 9: that wasn't hiding in plain sight. This is a violent

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Speaker 9: criminal who has access to five hundred rounds of ammunition

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Speaker 9: in one arrest. He is always runs when the police

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Speaker 9: come from him. He's jumped in the river. He fights with.

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Speaker 2: The Oh yeah, I saw where he actually jumped and

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Speaker 2: that was it. The Willamette River. The Willamette River. Oh okay,

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Speaker 2: you know, I thought it was Willamette. Willamette. Okay, hold

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Speaker 2: on just a moment, you know, let me just analyze

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Speaker 2: that for a moment. Jarrett Farantine. When a cop pulls

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Speaker 2: up behind me, I fell over. I turned the car off,

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Speaker 2: I let the window down, and I sit there and

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Speaker 2: wait for them to say license registration. This guy jumped

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Speaker 2: in a river. Really, it just goes.

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Speaker 9: To the wiring inside of his head. You know. That's

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Speaker 9: a fight or flight scenario. And this is my ninety

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Speaker 9: nine cent psychiatry degree. But the reality is some people react,

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Speaker 9: they're compliant, they're fearful. Others want to fight and run,

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Speaker 9: and you just.

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Speaker 2: Never know because they are guilty well, typically.

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Speaker 9: They're guilty or running from something else. This guy is

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Speaker 9: running from the bodies he has buried all over the community.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure, let's just say they're guilty of something. It

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Speaker 2: may not be running the stop sign, but I mean, really,

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Speaker 2: Karen stark As, I used to tell juries many many times.

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Speaker 2: I would tell the story about how I would stop.

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Speaker 2: But when a cop behind you, do you take off

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Speaker 2: at ninety MPAs to try to get away or jump

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Speaker 2: in a river? No, you don't, because you haven't done

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Speaker 2: anything wrong. When someone runs or jumps in a river

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Speaker 2: or tries to strangle a canine dog, I mean, yes,

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Speaker 2: they're guilty.

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Speaker 7: They're not just guilty. They have no fear of authority.

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Speaker 7: That's somebody who no, I'll just turn around and fight. So, yes,

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Speaker 7: they're guilty, but he's going to fight back no matter what.

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Speaker 7: There's a reason that this guy was incarcerated. He tried

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Speaker 7: to kill the dogs. How many people have the strength

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Speaker 7: to do that. So I hate to say this, but

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Speaker 7: just imagine what it was like for these girls, these

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Speaker 7: women to have to deal with this guy. He's got

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Speaker 7: incredible strength and no fear whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: Guys, we are talking about multiple women now, dead, Who

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Speaker 2: are they? What happened? Let's first talk about Kristen Smith.

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Speaker 2: Take a listen to our friend Drew Marine at KPTV.

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Speaker 10: Melissa Smith says Kristin was last seen here in near

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Speaker 10: Mulsule five. Take a look at this flyer they've posted

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Speaker 10: around parts of Portland. Melissa says she likes to wear

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Speaker 10: different wigs, so she may not look exactly like the

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Speaker 10: photo on this flyer, but she has a tattoo of

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Speaker 10: a red butterfly on her right hand.

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Speaker 8: It is quite like a piece of you is missing.

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Speaker 10: Each day that passes and Melissa and Hailey Smith don't

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Speaker 10: hear from twenty two year old Kristen Smith, they get

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Speaker 10: more concerned she's in danger.

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Speaker 11: A main concern of ours now is sex trafficking. We

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Speaker 11: don't know, but with things we've been told or you know,

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Speaker 11: people that know her are saying it's a possibility, because

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Speaker 11: this is not like her to just disappear.

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Speaker 2: And now I'll listen to our cut eleven KPTV.

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Speaker 12: Worland Police Bureau says they responded to reports of human

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Speaker 12: remains found in a wooded area near southeast Eerdorf Road

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Speaker 12: in Flavell Street on February nineteenth. Now authorities have confirmed

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Speaker 12: the remains belonged to Kristin.

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Speaker 2: I think of her every moment of every day.

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Speaker 12: And her family search has turned into one for answers

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Speaker 12: what happened.

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Speaker 11: I know she didn't just suddenly die out there.

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Speaker 2: Somebody did something.

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Speaker 12: But they say closure would be finding out what happened

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Speaker 12: to Kristin for.

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Speaker 2: The truth to come out. She deserves justice. You've got

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Speaker 2: to wonder how all of these victims' families are feeling

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Speaker 2: after being told for so long there was not a

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Speaker 2: serial killer, and now the truth coming out. And then,

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Speaker 2: of course, in addition to Kristin, there's Joanna Speaks Take

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Speaker 2: us an hour cut nineteen our friends at crimeonline dot Com.

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Speaker 13: Joanna Speaks is part of a big, blended family with

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Speaker 13: three biological siblings, four step siblings, three nieces, one nephew,

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Speaker 13: as well as three incredible children of her own One thirteen,

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Speaker 13: Braxton twelfth, and Melanie seven. In a family this big,

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Speaker 13: she was still able to stand out. Her stepsister Ariel

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Speaker 13: Hanby says, as a youngster, she was loud and vibrant.

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Speaker 13: Everything that she did was like go big or go

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Speaker 13: home kind of attitude. Her older sister Robin Speak pointed

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Speaker 13: out that she was a fighter, the wild one of

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Speaker 13: all of us. Johanna Speaks was a big kid, hilarious, sarcastic,

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Speaker 13: and super witty. She defines the term one of a kind.

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Speaker 2: I'm just trying to think about Joanna Speaks. His family

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Speaker 2: standing by waiting to hear the latest on her death.

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Speaker 2: And as you just heard, she is a mom, leaving

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Speaker 2: behind children who will grow up without mom. So far,

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Speaker 2: four of the dead women have been connected, we believe

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Speaker 2: to a career criminal, jesse Lee Calhoun, and of course

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Speaker 2: there's more. Take a listen to our cut twenty three Fox.

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Speaker 14: Just before six pm, Richfield Police and Clark Cowltzfire responded

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Speaker 14: to this abandoned property and found Speaks dead.

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Speaker 1: Near the barn.

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Speaker 14: A medical examination ruled it a murderer, and Clark County

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Speaker 14: Sheriff's believe she was killed elsewhere then moved to this location.

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Speaker 14: But her killer has not been found.

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Speaker 6: And there is no way that she would have gone

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Speaker 6: down without a fight. So whoever did do this likely

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Speaker 6: had injuries or something like that personally as well from

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Speaker 6: her fighting back.

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Speaker 7: How do you continue on?

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Speaker 6: I don't know. Yeah, nothing is off the table. As

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Speaker 6: to what we're thinking could have happened.

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Speaker 14: The family of Joanna Speaks is left shock and speechless

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Speaker 14: after getting a phone call that their thirty two year

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Speaker 14: old sister from Oregon City was found near an abandoned

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Speaker 14: barn in Ridgefield, Washington.

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Speaker 2: And of course there's a Bridget. Take a listener, forensic

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Speaker 2: KOI am.

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Speaker 15: The Pope County Sheriff's Office investigating after a Milwaukee woman's

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Speaker 15: body was found abandoned in their jurisdiction. A deputy say

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Speaker 15: Bridget Webster's body was found on Sunday near Mill Creek

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Speaker 15: in northwest Polk County. They say Webster was last seen

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Speaker 15: alive in the Portland metro area. The Sheriff's office asking

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Speaker 15: anyone who knew her or has information about her death

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Speaker 15: to call detectives.

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Speaker 2: So far, we're not getting a clear cause of death

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Speaker 2: on all of the women. Those are several of the

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Speaker 2: women that have been found their bodies littering the Portland area.

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Speaker 2: Anette Newell joining us k exhale. Why are they withholding

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Speaker 2: the cood cause of death? Now? I know one of

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Speaker 2: the victims was bludgeoned, but what about the others?

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Speaker 8: Yeah, one of the family members of the one who

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Speaker 8: was bludgeoned has been in communication with me, and she

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Speaker 8: said that she believed that their bodies were further along

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Speaker 8: decomposed more than her sisters was, so that made it

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Speaker 8: more difficult to identify a cause of death. And she's

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Speaker 8: been calling for the FBI to get involved because of that,

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Speaker 8: because they've been they need more, you know, really good

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Speaker 8: crime scene investigators with the tools to really investigate this.

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Speaker 8: And and in fact, she just came up with a

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Speaker 8: list of She says there are one hundred and fifty

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Speaker 8: six missing women and female children in Oregon since January

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Speaker 8: of this year. And she's even printed out a list

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Speaker 8: of who's missing by age from the state's website. So

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Speaker 8: to me, that's just a phenomenal number. But she's she's

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Speaker 8: really gone after this. And you've spoke to her too.

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Speaker 8: Her name is Ariel. You talked to her before when

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Speaker 8: you had her on about Joanna speaks on your show.

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Speaker 8: Joanna was the only one of the six women who've

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Speaker 8: been found where they've definitively said yes, this woman was

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Speaker 8: killed and the cause was murdered, murdered by you know,

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Speaker 8: in this case, blunt force trauma. The other ones they're

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Speaker 8: saying that they don't have a cause of death at

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Speaker 8: least not yet.

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Speaker 2: Interesting joining me right now, Doctor Todd M. Barr, Board

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Speaker 2: certified anatomic clinical forensic Pathologists featured in Thin Places Essays

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Speaker 2: from in Between, Doctor Barr, thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: It would seem to me that even if a body

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Speaker 2: had been lying out behind a barn or down a

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Speaker 2: ravine for some period of time, you would still be

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Speaker 2: able to tell if that body, if that victim had

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Speaker 2: been bludgeoned dead, because the skeleton itself is not really

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Speaker 2: conducive to deteriorating out the elements the way soft tissue is.

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Speaker 9: That's correct.

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Speaker 16: If there are you know, sometimes people can obtain fractures

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Speaker 16: that are cells from various means. But in this kind

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Speaker 16: of a situation that if a body is found and

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Speaker 16: there's evidence of hemorrhage of blood on the even with

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Speaker 16: the decomposing body, we can still tell if there's hemorrhage

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Speaker 16: within the calvarian, within the head, and whether or not

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Speaker 16: there are one force trauma applied with force to any

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Speaker 16: part of the body.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there are.

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Speaker 9: Certain things that we look for.

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Speaker 16: I had a case that I worked on for a

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Speaker 16: serial killing and his ritualistic maneuvers were to hobb tie

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Speaker 16: these women after manually asphixiating them. So there are certain

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Speaker 16: things that you can find even in decomposed bodies. In

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Speaker 16: those bodies that I was just speaking of were also decomposed,

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Speaker 16: and we were able to collect quite a bit of information.

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Speaker 2: Guys. There is also an unidentified woman. Will she be

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Speaker 2: connected to Calhoun as well? Take a listen to our

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Speaker 2: cut b from KPTV.

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Speaker 10: An unidentified woman between twenty five and forty years old

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Speaker 10: was found dead near I Tool five and Southeast Fluville Street.

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Speaker 10: The Moltnoman County Medical Examiner's Office is asking for the

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Speaker 10: public's help identifying her and provided this sketch. They say

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Speaker 10: she was possibly Native American, with medium length black hair

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Speaker 10: and about five foot one. At the time, they say

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Speaker 10: she was wearing a longsleeve green T shirt, a black

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Speaker 10: and white jacket, and black and white Adidas cleats. She

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Speaker 10: also had two tattoos, a black music note with the

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Speaker 10: letter V on her chest and the Buddha on her back.

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Speaker 2: Back to Cheryl McCollum joining us a founder and director

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Speaker 2: of the Cold Case Research Institute. You can find her

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Speaker 2: at Coldcasecrimes dot org. Cheryl, what strikes you the most

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Speaker 2: about the way the women's bodies were found and what

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Speaker 2: do you interpret from that?

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Speaker 6: Nathie, you and I both know that the cut the bluff,

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Speaker 6: they know things the street talks. I believe that there's

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Speaker 6: some witnesses here that know this perpetrator, perhaps saw him

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Speaker 6: with some of the victims, whether they knew the victims

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Speaker 6: or not. But I think law enforcement god on his

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Speaker 6: radar because of a witness. I think when you look

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Speaker 6: at the bodies again, where they were taken from and

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Speaker 6: where they were disposed of, these were not people that

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Speaker 6: had a drug overdose. You're not going to take drugs

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Speaker 6: on fourteenth STREETET and then walk four miles and drop

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Speaker 6: dead on the side of the road of a drug overdose.

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Speaker 6: That's not how it happened. They were transported and I

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Speaker 6: think that's very clear when you look at the distances

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Speaker 6: and you look at again where these started and where

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Speaker 6: they ended.

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Speaker 2: There's another victim, Ashley Real take listen to our cut

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Speaker 2: three KG.

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Speaker 17: We've heard from two of the law enforcementency agencies handling

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Speaker 17: these cases, and basically they're not ruling anything out at

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Speaker 17: this point. They're talking with partner agencies on the off

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Speaker 17: chance these cases are somehow connected, and this comes as

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Speaker 17: a relief to the family of one of the five victims.

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Speaker 17: These woods off southeast jud Road in rural Clockamus County

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Speaker 17: is where deputies discovered the remains of Ashley Reel. The

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Speaker 17: twenty two year old was last seen in late March

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Speaker 17: at a fast food restaurant and transit center in East Portland.

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Speaker 17: These photos of Reel are some of the last before

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Speaker 17: she turned up dead in that heavily wooded area.

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Speaker 2: Kristen Smith, age twenty two, Charity Perry, aged twenty four,

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Speaker 2: Bridget Webster aged thirty one, Ashley Reel age twenty two,

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Speaker 2: Joanna Speaks age thirty two, and an unidentified female as

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Speaker 2: young as twenty five. To doctor Todd m bar how

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Speaker 2: can you tell the age of someone that is unidentified?

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Speaker 2: Once they're identified, you can pull their driver's license or

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Speaker 2: get their birth certificate and get the age. What about

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Speaker 2: an unidentified female, how do you get the age on that?

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Speaker 16: It's difficult depending on the state of decomposition, if a

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Speaker 16: portion of the body skeletonized or if it isn't. We

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Speaker 16: can always do a CP examination or radiological examination to

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Speaker 16: look at the formation of the bones, We can look

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Speaker 16: at the televis, We can look at various structures of

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Speaker 16: the body that can indicate, like futures in the head,

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Speaker 16: whether or not they've fused.

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Speaker 9: There are certain diagnostic.

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Speaker 16: Criteria that we can use to sort of give an

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Speaker 16: estimated age. In fact, we use a lot of forensic

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Speaker 16: anthropology in cases that are unidentified and skeletonized, and they've

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Speaker 16: been very very helpful and successful with rendering drawings of

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00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:43,440
Speaker 16: what these people may have looked like alive, and combined

435
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:49,120
Speaker 16: with the findings of the anticomo anthropological examination, we can

436
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 16: give it a range of ages. There's no magic wand

437
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 16: that you can see, Oh, this one is specifically twenty

438
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 16: five years old, but we would say this is a

439
00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 16: white woman between the ages of twenty five and thirty.

440
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:03,000
Speaker 9: Say look into that effect.

441
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:07,000
Speaker 2: How what is and how does a forensic anthropologist help you?

442
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 16: Well, Forensic anthropologists are well versed in the structure of

443
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 16: the human body with bones, and they can and when

444
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 16: someone is skeletonized and you can't even tell if the

445
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 16: person is male or female, they can They can look

446
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 16: at various structures of the bones that are morph fitting

447
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 16: and they can actually determine race. Many times as well,

448
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 16: because there are differences between Caucasian features and other races

449
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 16: that you can see differences in, so they're well versed

450
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 16: in being able to sort those kind of things out.

451
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: Time stories with Nancy Grace, you.

452
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 2: Know, I want toocus on how closely together the bodies

453
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 2: were found. Is for not being told the CEOD cause

454
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 2: of death on these women. We know one was bludgeoned

455
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:14,520
Speaker 2: that certainly wasn't an accident or suicide. Then she was

456
00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 2: dumped in a remote area and at Knewell. How closely

457
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 2: together were the women's bodies found?

458
00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,200
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think in one case it was like less

459
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 8: than three miles from each other, and all within you know,

460
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:32,919
Speaker 8: certainly a seventy mile radius in the greater Portland metro area.

461
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 8: They were found in different counties, which is interesting too.

462
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 8: So that's why we have Clacamus County Sheriff's office investigating one,

463
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 8: Paul County another, Moltnomah County another, and then the Portland

464
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 8: Police Bureau on the fourth one. So all four of

465
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:50,840
Speaker 8: the women who are connected to that one person of

466
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:56,960
Speaker 8: interest were found in different counties under different sheriffs jurisdictions.

467
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 8: But one question I had, maybe maybe the experts could

468
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,720
Speaker 8: answer is how they're calling him a person of interest

469
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 8: but yet not a suspect.

470
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:12,320
Speaker 2: Why might that be? Okay, Jarrett Farentino, That actually made

471
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 2: me chuckle with me. Jarrett Farentino, veteran trial lawyer and

472
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 2: homicide prosecutor. JAREDT a person of interest to POI. Once

473
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 2: you're called a suspect, you're formally named as a suspect.

474
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 2: You are then cloaked, shrouded, protected with constitutional rights. When

475
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 2: you're a person of interest, not so much. I mean,

476
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 2: let's get real about this. He's the suspect. He's actually

477
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: being detained. Of course, this guy's committed so many crimes.

478
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 2: They could say, oh, we're detaining him on a shoplifting

479
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 2: from twenty eighteen. They could say that, and it would

480
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:54,000
Speaker 2: absolutely be true. But he's behind mars right now, Calhoun,

481
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,400
Speaker 2: because he's connected to at least four of these women,

482
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 2: and I'm betting through no two of them way back

483
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 2: when in elementary or high school and day and night.

484
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:09,240
Speaker 2: That's my guess. But you go ahead and take a

485
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 2: crack at that a really good and legal explanation of

486
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 2: the difference between POI and suspect.

487
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,280
Speaker 9: Well, I'll try, but it's worse to be a suspect,

488
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 9: nancy that one seems to have the greater degree of

489
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 9: their stronger evidence, and you are likely to be gained

490
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 9: a dependent around the corner. However, person of interest has

491
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 9: become the preferred term of art. Cheryl could certainly tell

492
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:35,960
Speaker 9: you we were involved in the Britney Drexel case in

493
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 9: South Carolina. Yes, and Raymond Moody was held as a

494
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,640
Speaker 9: person of interest all the while we knew he was

495
00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 9: a suspect had already confessed to the murders at that point.

496
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 9: So although your resuscitation, your restation about what suspect and

497
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,600
Speaker 9: person of interest means is correct, it seems like the

498
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 9: term of arts are used interchangeably at this point.

499
00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,240
Speaker 2: Yeah. Basically, once you're detained, you have constitutional rise and

500
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 2: detained can be in the back of a squad car

501
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 2: or somebody saying hey, hold on, stop right there, and

502
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 2: you have to stop anytime you're not free to leave.

503
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:13,520
Speaker 2: You are detained and your constitutional rights apply. You know,

504
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 2: we were talking about a forensic anthropologist, and anthropology is

505
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 2: the scientific study of the human. It can be the

506
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 2: human body, the skin, the skeleton, the society, ways of communication, lore, history, culture,

507
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:39,120
Speaker 2: everything to do with a human. A forensic anthropologist is

508
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 2: someone that uses that knowledge, in our case is typically

509
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 2: knowledge of the bones and the teeth to help solve

510
00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 2: a crime. That's what a forensic anthropologist is, and we

511
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 2: need one, a really good one. But back to POI

512
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 2: versus suspect, Cheryl McCallum, I often say, you go from

513
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 2: walking along the street minding your own business, to POI,

514
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:14,600
Speaker 2: to suspect, to defendant to inmate. Okay, that's the congression

515
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 2: of that. So once you're a POI, you're on the

516
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 2: slippery slope right into the CI Correctional Institute.

517
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 6: Explain, well, let's talk about why I think he got there.

518
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 6: In twenty eighteen, Jesse Lee Calhoun is arrested with methamphetamine,

519
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 6: guns and five hundred rounds of ammunitions.

520
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,080
Speaker 2: Cheryl, I left out part of that. You go from

521
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 2: walking along the street to being named a bona fide or,

522
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 2: as my old law school professor James Rayberg would say,

523
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: bona fidee. Pos Okay, we start right there, absolutely true, okay,

524
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 2: or a POC technical legal term. Then you go to POI.

525
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 2: You go from POC pretty quickly, Okay, back to you.

526
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 6: Also in his background is burglary and stolen vehicle. So

527
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 6: if the methamphetamine he was drug dealing, he ain't very

528
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 6: good at it. Because if you're a good drug dealer,

529
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,120
Speaker 6: you don't have to burglarize or steal cars. You can

530
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 6: pay for your own stuff. So this guy is stealing

531
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 6: because he's a drug addict, I believe.

532
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 2: Have you seen his booken? Have you seen his book?

533
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 16: In photo?

534
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,400
Speaker 2: Absolutely, it looks like he just got out of a

535
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 2: fight and he looks mean as h double. Well, let

536
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:33,360
Speaker 2: me tell you what I agree with both of them.

537
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 2: I want to meet him in a dark alley unless

538
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 2: I had a bullet, right.

539
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 6: But this also goes to why the cause of death

540
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 6: may be undetermined If this was a drug overdose because

541
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 6: he's added sentinel to something, or he's got some street

542
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 6: level myth. It's not as pure as it should be.

543
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 6: Then somebody that might have used this drug before could

544
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 6: in fact overdose, but it could be deliberate.

545
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 2: Okay, hold on just a minute, boy, Can I follow

546
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 2: through your line of thinking to its logical conclusion? Are

547
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 2: you actually saying that some of these women died of

548
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:08,240
Speaker 2: an OD and then he carted their bodies away? Okay,

549
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 2: that didn't happen. He murdered them. He did not inject

550
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 2: them with bad drugs.

551
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 6: Absolutely, he did well, we don't know yet, dejective.

552
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 2: Of course, we don't know yet. But Annette Neil, I

553
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,480
Speaker 2: recognize your voice. You want to tell me these women odd?

554
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 2: And then he dragged them on his tricycle eight miles

555
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,959
Speaker 2: away and don't their bodies. No, they did not die

556
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:33,719
Speaker 2: of him oding them. And if they had od'd, he

557
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: would have left them laying right where they are. And

558
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,040
Speaker 2: one of the Portland Tints said he's full of drug

559
00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:40,440
Speaker 2: addicts and nobody's helping Nancy Karen.

560
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 7: Is that they that he bludgeoned one of them would

561
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 7: do well?

562
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 8: No weight, that's that that person is not connected yet.

563
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,200
Speaker 2: Are you talking about Joanna speaks.

564
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 8: Johanna speaks, the one that we know is bludgeoned.

565
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I still say these women, I mean, it's

566
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 2: not logical to think that he gave and bad drugs

567
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 2: and they owe deed and so then he drags their

568
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 2: bodies away. That's no. And he's connected for a reason.

569
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 2: There's got to be some kind of DNA M something

570
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:13,720
Speaker 2: more than he knewed two of them in high school.

571
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 7: Yeah, I want to add Nancy that he also I

572
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 7: can't imagine someone who's a serial killer would want to

573
00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 7: just drug somebody. There's no fun in that for him.

574
00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 7: And believe me, he had a good time killing each woman,

575
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 7: so that would be way too easy.

576
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 2: Okay, Cheryl, what were you saying now that we have

577
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 2: completely destroyed your theory of he intentionally drugged them? I

578
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 2: don't even I can't believe he even said that.

579
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 6: Are you having disorted? Let me just be clear. They

580
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,920
Speaker 6: knew this guy since high school? How long has he

581
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:45,839
Speaker 6: been a piece of crab?

582
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 2: The whole time?

583
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 6: He was a piece of crab in high school? Yeah,

584
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 6: so why are they connecting with him now? Because there's

585
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:57,839
Speaker 6: a reason, and I'm saying him having drugs is a

586
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 6: plausible reason they got together with him.

587
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:02,720
Speaker 2: What happened to ask for that.

588
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:06,400
Speaker 6: Is something different. So if he gave them pills that

589
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 6: he knew was laced with sentinel at another location to

590
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,239
Speaker 6: do what he wanted to do, they couldn't fight back.

591
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 2: Wait to do what he wanted to we're talking about

592
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 2: raping them or killing them.

593
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,279
Speaker 6: Either or we don't we don't know, we don't know

594
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 6: the information yet.

595
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,319
Speaker 2: I guarantee you he did not od them and sit

596
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:26,920
Speaker 2: back and watch him die. I agree with Karen start.

597
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 6: I guarantee you drugs is a connection.

598
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 2: Okay, Yes, I'm with you on that. He may have

599
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 2: known them, Okay, I'll go out on a limb he

600
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 2: did know them through drugs, or they're hanging out in

601
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 2: the same area where drugs are sold. But there's no

602
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:46,520
Speaker 2: way a serial killer od somebody and sits there and

603
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,719
Speaker 2: watches them die. That's not going to be their coeod

604
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:52,760
Speaker 2: cause of death. Mate. They may have drugs in their system,

605
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: but that's not going to be how he killed them.

606
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,160
Speaker 2: I mean, Farantina, for Pete's sake, throw me a life

607
00:36:58,239 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 2: raft here.

608
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 9: Well, well, it's typically this guy's getting his kicks by

609
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:07,160
Speaker 9: probably bludgeoning. Looking at his background, he has a violent background,

610
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:08,399
Speaker 9: so I wouldn't take the lead.

611
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 2: He's straangled k nine Pee Paul. What's he going to

612
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:13,360
Speaker 2: do with these poor.

613
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 6: Women, Nancy.

614
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 7: He wants to see the life go out of them,

615
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:20,760
Speaker 7: you know, that's what he's about.

616
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 2: Unless he's high on meth at the time, then he's

617
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:29,440
Speaker 2: out of his mind, kicking, punching, strangling, binding, totally out

618
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 2: of his gord. Guy speaking of Jesse Calhoun, now, a

619
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,879
Speaker 2: POI in the case take a listening our cut forty

620
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 2: four our forensic ka tu.

621
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:43,680
Speaker 4: The person of interest is thirty eight year old jesse

622
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 4: Lee Calhoun. He's currently booked in the Snake River Correctional Institution.

623
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 4: The Montnoma County Sheriff's Office has described Calhoun as a

624
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,839
Speaker 4: quote prolific thief and career criminal. He was serving as

625
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:58,360
Speaker 4: says for burglary when granted clemency by former Oregon Governor

626
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,240
Speaker 4: Kate Brown in twenty twenty one. This was for fighting

627
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:05,000
Speaker 4: the twenty twenty wildfires. The clemency shaved about twelve months

628
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 4: office prison sentence. That sentence was set in July twenty

629
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:09,720
Speaker 4: twenty two.

630
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 2: And more from our friends at kat you this is

631
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 2: debornapp in our cup forty five.

632
00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:17,800
Speaker 5: US Marshalls were asked to assist the Maltnoma County Sheriff's

633
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 5: Office in apprehending Calhoun on June sixth.

634
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 2: That was successful.

635
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:25,279
Speaker 5: Oregon Governor Tina Cote's office says she revoked the commutation

636
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 5: for Calhoun July third, at the request of the Maltnonoman

637
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 5: County DA's office, and who was readmitted to the state

638
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,680
Speaker 5: on July sixth. We reached out to former Governor Brown

639
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 5: for a response on this. She replied with a statement saying, quote,

640
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 5: I'm absolutely horrified for the victims, their families, and all

641
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 5: of those who've experienced these losses.

642
00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,799
Speaker 2: Wow. See how she dodged the fact that she's the

643
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 2: one that let this guy out. And then about a

644
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 2: year and a half or so, six days bodies emerged.

645
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 2: Now four of these are being we've been told connected

646
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 2: to Calhoun, and they are Kristen Smith, Charity Lynn Perry,

647
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 2: Bridget Leanne Ramsey Webster, and Ashley Real. We don't know

648
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 2: about the other two yet. Now, we were told that

649
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:15,719
Speaker 2: these women have similar appearances, that they have similar hangouts,

650
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:21,200
Speaker 2: similar characteristics. That's what we're being told. Are they the

651
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 2: same places that Calhoun hung out. We are looking now

652
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:32,520
Speaker 2: at the possibility that his vehicle was used to transport

653
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,520
Speaker 2: these women. We're trying to find out if DNA deoxuribo

654
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 2: nucleic acid is linking him to the women. We're trying

655
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 2: to determine are they last seen in the same area,

656
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 2: and we think that they are if a vehicle was used,

657
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 2: Can we in any way get a route, even a

658
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 2: partial route, so traffic cams can be accessed. There are

659
00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 2: similar disposal methods in all of the murders. So where

660
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 2: do we go from here? Cheryl McCollum, It.

661
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 6: Is imperative that we look at every unsolved missing person

662
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:17,200
Speaker 6: that's been recovered and not recovered. It's important because again

663
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 6: we've already gone from four victims to six to possibly ten.

664
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 6: There's possibly more. He was killing at a fast rate.

665
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:29,200
Speaker 6: He had very little downtime. Again, from February nineteenth to

666
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:32,040
Speaker 6: May seventh. You're talking about four people in less than

667
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 6: three months, so there could be more. Again, I believe

668
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 6: witnesses on the street know this guy. I think now

669
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:44,160
Speaker 6: that he's in jail, they're coming forward because they feel

670
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,080
Speaker 6: safe to do so. I think he's been a terror

671
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:53,000
Speaker 6: to the sex worker population, to the homeless population. They

672
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:56,520
Speaker 6: know this guy, and I think they are cooperating with

673
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,799
Speaker 6: law enforcement. And I think once law enforcement got his name,

674
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 6: they went from videos to fell phones, to his vehicle,

675
00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 6: to cigarette butts, to hair to flock cameras, et cetera.

676
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: This three eight year old self proclaimed automobile artist with

677
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: a very long rap sheet six four to two hundred

678
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:21,120
Speaker 2: and twenty six pounds, taking advantage of the abolished police jurisdiction.

679
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:27,240
Speaker 2: It's a serial killer's dream come true, just stalking women

680
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:32,839
Speaker 2: on the street in Portland. We wait as justice unfolds.

681
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 2: Goodbye friend,