1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:03,800 Speaker 1: We'll just start it all up. What did you say? 2 00:00:04,040 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: I said today? I think we should do like a 3 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:09,000 Speaker 1: bunch of searching. You gotta remind me here, I don't 4 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: know what we're talking. What are we talking about? So 5 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: I found out that Billy might have a daughter. Austin 6 00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:17,599 Speaker 1: and I are in the studio discussing the possibility that 7 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:21,920 Speaker 1: Billy Balls had a daughter named Amanda. Only. The reason 8 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: why Amanda holds such importance is because everyone else who 9 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:29,600 Speaker 1: might be able to actually shed light on like governmental 10 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:32,840 Speaker 1: things like his death certificate, they're all dead. Amanda maybe 11 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:36,840 Speaker 1: the only one who can access Billy's records. But we're 12 00:00:36,880 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: also just curious about her. According to my mom, when 13 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 1: she was two and a half, Amanda was sent to 14 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,839 Speaker 1: live with Lynne Todd's mother. We think Amanda's mom was 15 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: Lynn Todd, Billy's girlfriend before my mom and I guess 16 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: after they broke up, the family took Amanda back to 17 00:00:56,600 --> 00:01:04,559 Speaker 1: Washington State. What does she know about her father? They've 18 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: told her a story of him that is going to 19 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: be different than the story that we've already heard. Yeah, 20 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:14,880 Speaker 1: so it's also totally possible that there's a person out 21 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 1: there for whom Billy is just as folkloric as he 22 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,479 Speaker 1: is for me. What, yeah, you two have the same 23 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: relationship to Billy basically or not totally the same father. 24 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:29,759 Speaker 1: But like besides that part, oh yeah, I forgot about 25 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 1: that part well. And also if you lost a parent 26 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:39,000 Speaker 1: who was such a larger than life character, Like if 27 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 1: Billy was a legend in my life and he's not 28 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: my father, what is he going to be in her life? 29 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 1: We'll never know unless we find her. Obituaries are a 30 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 1: really great source of information because they often list family members. 31 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 1: My mom had told us that Lynta, Amanda's mother, had 32 00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: passed away. If there's non obituary for Lynn Todd, they 33 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:11,079 Speaker 1: might list her daughter, birth of daughter, Laura's birth of son, 34 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:15,680 Speaker 1: birth of daughter. We're not seeing any amand this yet. 35 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: It was actually a lot harder than we thought it 36 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 1: was going to be the grandmother. Wait, but does it 37 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: say but finally we found a name? Five? There it 38 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: is there, It is there, It is there. It is Amanda. 39 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:31,399 Speaker 1: Ohly Ship Yes, oh my god, fucking google her right now. 40 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 1: I don't know you want it. Let's just take a break. 41 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 1: You're killing mate. One public record weight up at the top. 42 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 1: One public record lived in New York, in Washington. We 43 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:49,400 Speaker 1: fucking found her years old in oh Ship. There's a 44 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 1: phone number. Are you ready to to call her today? 45 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:57,920 Speaker 1: You think yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, or at 46 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 1: least call the number that we have. Okay, my palms 47 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 1: are sweating. Your call has been forwarded to an automatic 48 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 1: voice message system Commanda. It's not available. Hi there, UM, 49 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: my name is Io, right, and I am looking for 50 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: the daughter of Lynn todd Um and I'm wondering if 51 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 1: that's you. I know this is probably a very insane 52 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:46,000 Speaker 1: phone call to get um I am, I guess connected 53 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 1: to your family and um have I would love to 54 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: tell you what I'm looking for and trying to track down. 55 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: But again, my name is Io and I would very 56 00:03:55,280 --> 00:03:57,840 Speaker 1: much love um to talk to you if you have 57 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:00,640 Speaker 1: a minute, that would be fantastic. Thank you so much. 58 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:07,279 Speaker 1: I'll talk to you soon. Bye. Oh Jesus, oh Jesus. 59 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 1: So now it's this thing where we get it's like 60 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 1: I just have to my phone's can bring him a 61 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 1: heart attack? Okay, all right, okay. And then just as 62 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:20,160 Speaker 1: we were about to leave the studio for the day, 63 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: I just got a text from them like Hey, got 64 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: your message. Didn't quite understand your name and what you're 65 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: looking for. That's it. That's it. Okay, I'm gonna write 66 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 1: her back. Hey, my name is Io. Till it right. 67 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 1: I'm hoping that you're the Amanda this time. I asked 68 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: if she knew a William Heightsman. My headphones are backwards, 69 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 1: I'm standing up, I'm jumping around. Amanda just texted me. 70 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:50,039 Speaker 1: Holy fucking ship. Okay, she says, Hey, Io, Yes, Billy 71 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:55,159 Speaker 1: is my father. Oh my god, Oh my god. Do 72 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 1: you or your mom have any photos of him? Girl? 73 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: I have caught photos for you. I'm trying to arrange 74 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:10,120 Speaker 1: Sunday or Monday for a meeting. Yes, I see Io 75 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 1: up ahead. How'd it go? What happened? Wow? It definitely 76 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: went well, Amanda. She's very dry and very funny and 77 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 1: very unaffected and like not at all woe is me? 78 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: So did you ask her about her birth certificate? If 79 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: he's honest, she's seen her birth certificate. He is on it. 80 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: Oh my god, amazing. She's like, I'll help you with 81 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:42,799 Speaker 1: anything you need. So Amanda's life is wild. I feel 82 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 1: as though I found like a pseudo sibling today on 83 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 1: the show. Billie's daughter from Crimetown. I'm io till it right, 84 00:05:55,920 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: and this is the ballad of Billy Balls. I do 85 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 1: remember vaguely a kid at one point. Yeah. Yeah, she 86 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: was a sweet old girl. What have it happened to her? 87 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: She was the daughter of Linton and Billy's the legal father. 88 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: Did they tell you her name when they first told 89 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:48,280 Speaker 1: you about it? Amanda? Chapter six? Amanda, is it recording now? Yeah? 90 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 1: So I just recorded. It's you can see though the 91 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 1: wave forms a little bit popping. Amanda was nervous about 92 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:58,920 Speaker 1: being recorded, but ultimately decided to share her story. Unfortunately, 93 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:01,919 Speaker 1: I was across the country at the time, So Amanda 94 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 1: sat down with Austin. Hear my voice in here? Yeah, 95 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: if you want, you can put those on and hear 96 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 1: your voice. To preserve her privacy, we won't be using 97 00:07:09,279 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: her last name. I guess we could just start with, like, 98 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 1: who who is your dad? Who was my dad? My father, 99 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 1: William John Heitzman. He had a stage name, Billy Balls. 100 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:36,080 Speaker 1: He's a musician, he played piano, he played every instrument. 101 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: He My mother was also a musician and a singer, 102 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: and they worked together in a lot of things. Who 103 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:54,640 Speaker 1: was your mother? Lynn Todd. Amanda says her mom came 104 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 1: to New York City in nineteen sixty nine when she 105 00:07:57,400 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: was in her mid teens to pursue a music career. 106 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:04,920 Speaker 1: Almost as soon as she arrived, she crossed paths with Billy. 107 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:08,640 Speaker 1: She said, she met my dad on the corner. I'm 108 00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: not sure exactly what street they met on, but the 109 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 1: Lower East Side. I think she was standing there or something, 110 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 1: waiting across the street, and he came up to her 111 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 1: and he asked her she knew how to fix a 112 00:08:22,880 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 1: microphone because I guess she looked rock and roll. She 113 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: ended up saying she knew how to do it and 114 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 1: that she was she sang, and I think that that's 115 00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 1: kind of how they ended up getting involved with one another. 116 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: Sounds so cheesy. She was like fifteen when she met him, 117 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,720 Speaker 1: I know, really young, and he was nine years older. 118 00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 1: So that was pretty crazy to me. Billy and Lynn 119 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: began to make music together. Oh, this is a recording 120 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: of one of their rehearsals with them. She had a 121 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 1: low voice, and there was kind of a sadness and 122 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:12,640 Speaker 1: a darkness to that voice in that style, which I 123 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: think she had a lot in her Yeah, I think 124 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 1: they got involved with one another pretty quickly. Um, and 125 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 1: then five years later I was born. My mother was 126 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 1: still very young when she had me. You know. She 127 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 1: would tell me that my dad and who really did 128 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:46,320 Speaker 1: love each other, and that I really was born from 129 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:49,760 Speaker 1: real love that they had for one another. So that's 130 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: like what would make me strong enough to survive life. 131 00:09:53,320 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 1: I guess I remember a bit of them, of the music. 132 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 1: I have visuals of studios and stuff and singing and 133 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 1: people and microphones. My mother said, I always slept in 134 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 1: a guitar case. I never had a bed, But I 135 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 1: do remember being around music and them and music and music, 136 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 1: like a lot of it. Amanda says her memories of 137 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:34,240 Speaker 1: her dad are just images and fragments, memories of him 138 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:36,719 Speaker 1: painting his nails black and white, and him painting my 139 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: nails black and white. I used to do this, Miss 140 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 1: Mary mac Ryan. We would do that together. I remember 141 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 1: there was no bathtub, so we would have to He 142 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: would have to shower with me, and that's how you'd 143 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: have to wash me. I mean, I'd just remember these 144 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 1: ideas of things I don't really remember. I remember like 145 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: a lot of chords, like everywhere, black cords on the floor, 146 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:22,960 Speaker 1: like tripping over things and playing with eggs and touching things. 147 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 1: They had to leave that don and drugs, but I 148 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaker 1: didn't know that it was bad what they were doing, 149 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:37,959 Speaker 1: so it was just like they were smoking cigarettes like 150 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:49,280 Speaker 1: other people's parents did. I mean, I could just jump 151 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 1: in and tell you exactly when I remember of him. 152 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,920 Speaker 1: This is Geeta Gash in the mid seventies. She was 153 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 1: making music, going to shows and hanging out down to down. 154 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:05,600 Speaker 1: She was a friend of Billy's. I met him in 155 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:12,520 Speaker 1: uh nineteen seventy six. I was always going to clubs Max's, 156 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:16,520 Speaker 1: Kansas City and CBGB's, mostly Max's because I lived around 157 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 1: the corner. I don't know how I met him, but 158 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: somehow I met him and we hooked up. Unmust have 159 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 1: gone home with him or him with me. We were 160 00:12:27,679 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 1: like hanging out together and fling around, having sex whatever. 161 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 1: He had a phone call and said, oh, you know, 162 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: be quiet. You know, I don't say anything like why. Well, 163 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: it was pretty obvious that he was talking to a 164 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:47,440 Speaker 1: wife and or a girlfriend who turned out to be 165 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,960 Speaker 1: Lynn Todd. Eventually Geita got to know the whole family. 166 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 1: I went to visit him at his apartment on the 167 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:59,680 Speaker 1: Lower East Side, which he shared with Lynn and the 168 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 1: bay Be which turned out to be Amanda who we 169 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:09,439 Speaker 1: called the bean Beanie was her nickname. Um really really cute, 170 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 1: little blonde, little toddler. And Lynn, who was a really 171 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:17,320 Speaker 1: cool lady, and she and I like hit it off, 172 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: like right away. Billy tried to put a band together 173 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 1: with Lynn singing and myself and animal X. They wanted 174 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 1: to do the three girl harmony thing and him like 175 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 1: banging on the piano, you know, like a maniac in 176 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:48,080 Speaker 1: like Jerry Lee Louis style, black pleated pants with suspenders, 177 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: no shirt and wild, wild as a motherfucker, and playing 178 00:13:51,880 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 1: like Jerry Lee Louis styles, stumping, rumping piano. M well, 179 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 1: like one minute we're singing like this beautiful harmony or 180 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,920 Speaker 1: trying but so high that God knows what it sounded like. 181 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 1: You know. Yeah. See there's things up that that concerned 182 00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: the baby that I don't want her to learn of, 183 00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: and I don't want to hurt any feelings, you know, 184 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: But there was a situation there where you had like irresponsible, 185 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 1: active drug addicts that should not have been parenting a child. 186 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 1: Billy was a mad speed freak, I mean to the 187 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: point of like bouncing off the damn walls. They did 188 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 1: a lot of two oxen. They had shiploads of that 189 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 1: little yellow pill. Remember them breaking it up, you know, 190 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 1: and him to chumping on them constantly, like you'll be 191 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:09,200 Speaker 1: chewing on like tic TACs. Never fucking slept except maybe 192 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:12,160 Speaker 1: like crash out for a couple of hours in the afternoon. 193 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: You know, I'm talking like, never fucking sleeping in the 194 00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: bars after hours, sun comes up, still going, still going, 195 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:32,480 Speaker 1: you know, just crazy, Just shut up now. They would 196 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:36,720 Speaker 1: fight over anything. Could have been money, it could have 197 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:43,280 Speaker 1: been babysitting. That was the norm between them. A lot 198 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: of screaming whatever, we're we're not a distance from the mic, 199 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: like we had some fucking sense, so we're all going 200 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 1: into it equal, you know what I mean that we're 201 00:15:51,760 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 1: still not equal distant drugs. That makes it really hard 202 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 1: to have a functioning relationship. I think they were both 203 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 1: strong headed, so I don't think that was the best match. 204 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: And I'm sure Toddler in that mix isn't isn't easy. 205 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 1: And I do remember they would fight. Was he violent 206 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:31,840 Speaker 1: with her? You know? See again I don't really I 207 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: don't remember her saying anything. But I also don't think 208 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:38,280 Speaker 1: she wants me to see him that way if anything 209 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,200 Speaker 1: did happen, So she never told me anything. I don't 210 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: have any memory of her telling me that he was 211 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: physically violent with her. Ever, you know it could be 212 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: because it's true. You know, I don't have any reason 213 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:51,800 Speaker 1: to believe it's not. It's not like I have memories 214 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 1: of him being physically violent with me. But you know, 215 00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 1: he did a lot of drugs, and people are unpredictable 216 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 1: when that stuff happens. If you're agitated or pushed fire enough, 217 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:09,399 Speaker 1: who knows what could happen. I have a very clear 218 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 1: memory of being in the apartment at sunrise with Lynn 219 00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:22,400 Speaker 1: and the baby and Billy just attacking the two of us, 220 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: and I remember he took a fork and he stabbed 221 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,399 Speaker 1: me in the face with a fork. I had like 222 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:32,120 Speaker 1: a you know, like the four pronged holes in my chin. 223 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 1: Oh my god. He was just like beating the ship 224 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 1: out of everybody. We're afraid for the baby and screaming. 225 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:42,119 Speaker 1: I remember screaming out the window and some guy he 226 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: just like flew up the fire escape, jumped into the 227 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 1: apartment and started like beating the ship out of Billy, 228 00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 1: and then Billy ran out like a chicken out the 229 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: window down the fire escape. Yeah. Ship, like that crazy 230 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:02,879 Speaker 1: ship used to happen all the time. Just a note, 231 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:06,359 Speaker 1: We tried to verify this story with other people and 232 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:19,920 Speaker 1: we weren't able to. Did you like Billy I did. 233 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 1: I loved him. I mean he was great. I loved 234 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 1: him a lot. His soul was warm, funny, creative, loving um. 235 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:35,240 Speaker 1: But you know, also it's like loving a mad dog. 236 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: You know, you have to be cautious, and you know, 237 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:42,960 Speaker 1: when they're calm and sweet, they're wonderful, but then they 238 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,720 Speaker 1: can turn around and rip you to shreds or you know. 239 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: But that was mainly the drug taking that you know, 240 00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 1: method and fat. I mean that's like heavy and when 241 00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: you're doing it or seven day and day out, week 242 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,359 Speaker 1: after week, month after month, your brain goes like you 243 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 1: become psychotic. You know. His relationship with Lynn was deteriorating 244 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:16,880 Speaker 1: because of the drug use, and Geeta says that Amanda 245 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 1: would often be caught between Billy and Lynn to the 246 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 1: point of like Lynn going to CBGBs with me to 247 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: hang out and Billy showing up dragging Amanda like a 248 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,680 Speaker 1: toddler two year old staying here. Take a kid because 249 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,719 Speaker 1: he was jealous of Lynn hanging out with other people 250 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:41,399 Speaker 1: and Lynn, she had been faithful to Billy for so long, 251 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 1: and then she just went hog wild, you know, when 252 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 1: she was sucking around on him, and their relationship just 253 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: hit the skids. And then she got into heroin, as 254 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:56,679 Speaker 1: we all did. She used heroine, so she was a 255 00:19:56,680 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 1: heavy drug user. You know. Obviously it was definitelyly not 256 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:02,120 Speaker 1: good when I was young with her, because she would 257 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 1: forget to take care of me a lot and give 258 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:07,199 Speaker 1: me basic needs. I think she would forget about me 259 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:12,159 Speaker 1: and like put me places I guess, and either pass 260 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:15,439 Speaker 1: out or leave. I was like keys, It's like she 261 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 1: lost me somewhere and she had to retrace her steps 262 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,160 Speaker 1: to get back to me. She forgot I was there, 263 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 1: I existed. I'm not gonna say they were neglectful, but 264 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: they were not the best parents. Eventually she took Amanda 265 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:37,200 Speaker 1: and sent her to Lynn's mother's house. My mother told 266 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,119 Speaker 1: me that my father was taken care of me because 267 00:20:39,119 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 1: she'd been bitten by a spider and was in the 268 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: hospital with a really bad infection. His version was I 269 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 1: think more that he didn't know where my well, this 270 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 1: is what he told my grandmother. He didn't know where 271 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 1: my mother was, that she just left me with him, 272 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,359 Speaker 1: and that he couldn't take care of me anymore, and 273 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 1: if she didn't come get me, he was going to 274 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 1: sell me on the black market. But he she said, 275 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: she always told me he said that. But he if 276 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,640 Speaker 1: he said that, I don't believe. It was like he 277 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: was saying it to get her to come because he 278 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:11,879 Speaker 1: knew he couldn't take care of me. It wasn't something 279 00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: that you I was gonna do. So she flew to 280 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:25,400 Speaker 1: JFK and my dad brought me there, and it was November. 281 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 1: I remember having this like furried jacket on that was 282 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,919 Speaker 1: like a pinkish white, and all my clothes were too small, 283 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:38,280 Speaker 1: my grandmother said, as wearing clothes that were sent to 284 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 1: me two years before. He had cowboy boots. I guess 285 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 1: on me that She said the heel were cut out 286 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:48,040 Speaker 1: of to make them fit me, and I was dirty. 287 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 1: He just handed me over. It was such a difficult exchange, 288 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,640 Speaker 1: if you will, at the airport that she couldn't knew. 289 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 1: She could barely look at him. She was so disgusted 290 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 1: by him, you know, he was so worried about himself 291 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:13,199 Speaker 1: when doing his thing, and she said, I had a 292 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 1: bottle and I was like four years old, and she's like, 293 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,240 Speaker 1: you're way too old for this. And she said she 294 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:21,119 Speaker 1: threw it in the garbage and she said, bye, bottle, 295 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,639 Speaker 1: and I said bye. I guess I was waiting for 296 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 1: somebody to like pay attention to me and realized that 297 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: the bottle had seen better days. She said, the milk 298 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,959 Speaker 1: was spoiled inside. But see, she I don't know, she 299 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: she said, scenes a little bit, a little embellishment. Everybody's 300 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,640 Speaker 1: point of view is very different, so it is hard 301 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 1: to know what the truth is. Amanda says when she 302 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: was four, she moved in with her grandmother in Seattle, 303 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 1: but it took her a long time to recover from 304 00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 1: her life in New York. I ended up being sick 305 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 1: after that for a while because I was neglected and 306 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 1: not cared for properly. I'd have my tonsils taken out 307 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:08,960 Speaker 1: and I had two put in my ears. I was 308 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:13,480 Speaker 1: six deaf when she got me because I wasn't really 309 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 1: cleaned properly, I don't think, so there was a lot 310 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:28,320 Speaker 1: of neglect that she had to deal with. Did he 311 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 1: keep in touch, Not that I know of. My mother 312 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:35,160 Speaker 1: did but you know, my like, I think my mom 313 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: came to or whatever the situation with her ended up being, 314 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: and she was like, what the fund did you do 315 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:44,639 Speaker 1: with Amanda? But I think that both my mother and 316 00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: father pretty quickly realized how much easier life was without 317 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:55,960 Speaker 1: a toddler, you know, without me. I'm just curious about 318 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,360 Speaker 1: your relationship with Amanda. Did you have one with her 319 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:05,400 Speaker 1: after she left the city. No? Um, she got sent 320 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:10,200 Speaker 1: to her mother's Lynn's mother, which I thought was a godsend. 321 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 1: And it's around this time that Billy met my mom, Rebecca. 322 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 1: It's funny. Rebecca a lot of ways reminded me of Linn. 323 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:26,320 Speaker 1: She was very similar in stature, very tall, similar facial features, 324 00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:29,960 Speaker 1: and they seemed to be crazy and love and that 325 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:31,639 Speaker 1: I was very happy for him, and he became a 326 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 1: different person. He was a lot lighter. Why why do 327 00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: you say that? Oh, they were very affectionate in public 328 00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 1: to each other, meaning you know, they're physically and you 329 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: could tell that she loved him and was very enamored 330 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 1: by him, and he was like, so happy to have 331 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: a hot chick, you know. And they were both like 332 00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:59,679 Speaker 1: bubbly and it was they were great together. They were 333 00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:11,480 Speaker 1: great together. I remain friends with Lynn and Um. I 334 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:15,400 Speaker 1: had heard that that he had gotten shot and then 335 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 1: he was in the hospital. And then right after that 336 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: she called me and told me that he died and 337 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:27,359 Speaker 1: that he was assassinated while in the hospital, that his 338 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:39,640 Speaker 1: death was actually a murderer. I was on the last 339 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 1: day of first grade and I was living with my grandmother, 340 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 1: and she picked me up from daycare and then she 341 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 1: brought me home and she took me in the den 342 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 1: and told me to sit down because she had something 343 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:58,919 Speaker 1: important to tell me. She said, your father was in 344 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:03,479 Speaker 1: a store, like a bodega or a corner store, and 345 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:10,200 Speaker 1: there were robbers, and um, police were called and they 346 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: shot at the robbers, and your your father was caught 347 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 1: in the crossfire in between and was was killed. And 348 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 1: I remember looking at her and UM. I remember thinking, Um, 349 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,520 Speaker 1: she doesn't want me to feel sad about this, and 350 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 1: if I feel sad about this, it's gonna make her sad, 351 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: so uh. And I remember getting up and then going 352 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 1: and looking outside, and it was Seattle, so it was raining, 353 00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 1: and I looked outside and I remember looking at that 354 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:53,679 Speaker 1: a long driveway in front of their place, and it 355 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:55,760 Speaker 1: was raining, and it was black and it was dark, 356 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 1: and it looked like it almost looked like patent leather. 357 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,159 Speaker 1: And I remember just staring at it and she's like, Amanda, 358 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:02,959 Speaker 1: if you want to cry, it's okay to cry. And 359 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,679 Speaker 1: she was always like telling me all the feelings that 360 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 1: it was okay to have that I didn't have any 361 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:15,560 Speaker 1: interest in having. So I said, I haven't seen him 362 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: in a long time, and he's not in my life, 363 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:24,440 Speaker 1: so it doesn't matter, right, So I think that made 364 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 1: her sad. H So, uh oh, I'm sorry, it's okay. Yeah, 365 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: but yeah, So that's my memory of it. I just 366 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: always wondered. I always kind of didn't believe and maybe 367 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: it was a mistake and they had the wrong person. 368 00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,879 Speaker 1: My mom told me the version, you know, about what 369 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,439 Speaker 1: she knew when I was like eleven or so twelve, 370 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,360 Speaker 1: So it's like I understood from then on what really happened. 371 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:24,560 Speaker 1: That's coming up after the break. When I was younger, 372 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:27,040 Speaker 1: I used to think about at all the time. I 373 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:29,960 Speaker 1: used to think about my father all the time. When 374 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:33,000 Speaker 1: Amanda was seven years old, she learned that her dad 375 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,000 Speaker 1: had died. Her grandmother told her that he had been 376 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 1: in the wrong place at the wrong time and was shot. 377 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: When Amanda was eleven or twelve, her mom told her 378 00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 1: what she thought really happened. So what she told me 379 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 1: was that, um, there was an undercover cop and he, 380 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: I believe, kind of had a known drinking problem, and 381 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: he seemed to have this certain obsession with my father. 382 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: You know. My mom made it sound more like it 383 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 1: was because my dad was so cool, and he was. 384 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 1: He was obsessed with him because he saw my dad's 385 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:15,320 Speaker 1: lifestyle and was a little bit jealous. My mother told 386 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 1: me that he thought my father was a drug dealer 387 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 1: and that he was selling big drugs, big drugs like 388 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: what well, like speed or her when like drugs like that. 389 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 1: I think maybe he was involved in selling like a 390 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 1: little bit of weed here and there, That's what she 391 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,719 Speaker 1: would kind of say. But this cop thought that he 392 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 1: was more involved in something bigger than he actually was. 393 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: From what I understand, he was drunk and he went 394 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: over to where my father was living, pushed his way in, 395 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: and they got physical with one another, and then this 396 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: guy ended up shooting him. So that's what I've been told. 397 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,360 Speaker 1: Amanda grew up without her father, but the memory of 398 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: him haunted her. She never forgot him. And I used to, 399 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 1: you know, like I would do things because I would 400 00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 1: think he was there. I would leave MTV on in 401 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 1: my room when I'd go to school so he could 402 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: watch that, just in case he was in my room 403 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,480 Speaker 1: all day all night. When I was a kid, I 404 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: thought that he should have MTV to watch music television, 405 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: you know. And I just I thought about him all 406 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: the time. I I every day I thought about him. 407 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:50,680 Speaker 1: I was playing with Linn. We had hooked up to 408 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 1: play and we did some gigs. This is Gregor Laroc, 409 00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: who you met in a previous episode in the early nineties. 410 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 1: He was performing with Lynde Odd in New York. Well, 411 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 1: Lynn at this time, I think she hadn't seen Amanda 412 00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 1: for a long time, and I think she said, well, 413 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 1: she's gonna be coming and she wanted to meet her. 414 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 1: So she was looking for a good place to get together. 415 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 1: So would it be all right for her to come 416 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 1: to my place. Gregor says that Lynn and Amanda reconnected 417 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,560 Speaker 1: at his apartment in the East Village. It was great. 418 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: I mean, she was older, and um, it was just 419 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:37,240 Speaker 1: like a nice meeting. I don't remember anything weird or 420 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: you know, it was just like amazing to see her 421 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 1: as a kid, as a little child, and then see 422 00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:48,480 Speaker 1: he's a grown up again. And he says, Amanda asked 423 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 1: about Billy, I think she I think she might have been, 424 00:31:51,440 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 1: you know, trying to get information or find out about him. 425 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,440 Speaker 1: I just always felt like the people that knew him 426 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: when I talked to him and asked about my dad, 427 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 1: like I don't know, like if they knew stuff that 428 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: made them feel like they were implicating themselves. Anybody I 429 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: met over the years growing up that knew my father 430 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: that I was so excited about meeting they kind of 431 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:21,120 Speaker 1: all responded in a similar way, just complimentary of him 432 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: and said how musically talented he was, he was funny, 433 00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 1: how smart he was, you know, stylish, he was a genius, 434 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,840 Speaker 1: Like in the same things my mom would say to me, 435 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:43,560 Speaker 1: what what happened with your mom? She like, how did 436 00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: this all end for her? She she died. She never 437 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 1: got clean, She would never able to get clean. Lynde's 438 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,960 Speaker 1: old friend Geta Gash says that towards the end, she 439 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,160 Speaker 1: and Lynne had a fall out and Lynn and I 440 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:05,760 Speaker 1: were dust of Fred. Although our relationship went to ship 441 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,000 Speaker 1: because of drugs and she got really crazy at the 442 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,840 Speaker 1: end of her life, just became a very angry, kind 443 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:18,160 Speaker 1: of nasty person, burned a lot of bridges, and she 444 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:25,200 Speaker 1: suffered some brain aneurism or something, and she had a 445 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: brain aneurism and then died pretty quickly after that. I 446 00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:35,200 Speaker 1: was a strange from my mother at that time, and 447 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,600 Speaker 1: I was getting ready to start talking to her again too, 448 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 1: but it was always a lot, so I had to 449 00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 1: take a time out and um My, my grandmother said 450 00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,840 Speaker 1: she hadn't heard from my mother and she was getting worried, 451 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 1: and I'm like, she's fine. I never believed she wasn't fine, 452 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,920 Speaker 1: because she'd been through so much that I really kind 453 00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 1: of started to think she was never going to die 454 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 1: and nothing was going to happen. She always survived it. 455 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 1: Lynn Todd died on December one, two thousand and ten. 456 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:15,799 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think about her a lot too, 457 00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:18,960 Speaker 1: especially with my daughter, and I think she would have 458 00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:23,960 Speaker 1: really liked my daughter. Amanda's daughter is two years old now. 459 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: I talked to my kid about their grandparents and they 460 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:34,439 Speaker 1: show them pictures and all of that, and my kid 461 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 1: talks about their grandparents and gets excited even though she's 462 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:43,400 Speaker 1: so young. So it's she, you know, she knows. I 463 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 1: feel like she understands like who they are, but it's 464 00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:50,560 Speaker 1: not something I talk about all the time. But when 465 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:54,560 Speaker 1: she does think about Grandpa Billy, Amanda imagines that he's 466 00:34:54,640 --> 00:35:00,919 Speaker 1: retired and living where retired people live. My dad would 467 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 1: probably be in Florida. I could see him down there 468 00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 1: moving it up. I think he'd be tan definitely. Um 469 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:15,719 Speaker 1: it looked like he might be balding, so he might 470 00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 1: not have a lot of hair going on, which I 471 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 1: think would have really upset him. But he think he 472 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:22,279 Speaker 1: would have made peace with it by now. You know, 473 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:24,640 Speaker 1: like he's in his seven daies. He's like that ship sailed, 474 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:33,120 Speaker 1: so he's got he's bald, cleanly bald, yep, shaved, nice tan, 475 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:37,719 Speaker 1: probably like a little stomach going on. He probably would 476 00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: still be into kind of dressing cool, you know, like 477 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:45,400 Speaker 1: a fitted pant maybe, and he would keep it looser uptown, 478 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 1: you know, like a vacation style shirt, you know, like 479 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:55,120 Speaker 1: a Hawaiian print or something loose fitting. I feel like 480 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:59,480 Speaker 1: he would probably still smoke, and then he would be 481 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:05,840 Speaker 1: down there in a retirement community playing music. He would 482 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:19,880 Speaker 1: play like local events in Florida. Who knows what he 483 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:24,040 Speaker 1: could have done and it's you know, even in my mind, 484 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 1: I think that if he would have turned things around, 485 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:27,919 Speaker 1: it probably would have influenced my mom to do the same. 486 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,279 Speaker 1: Maybe she would have been like, you know, if he 487 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,400 Speaker 1: can do what I can do it, he would have 488 00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,600 Speaker 1: like come back into my life and we would have reconnected. 489 00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:56,120 Speaker 1: But that might just be a movie ending. You know, 490 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:58,360 Speaker 1: I've always thought about I. I do want to you know, 491 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: I've always wanted to know. Amanda still wonders what the 492 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,319 Speaker 1: truth is about what happened to her dad, because it's 493 00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:09,560 Speaker 1: always been a shady, kind of strange story and always 494 00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:15,640 Speaker 1: something that seemed very off. It didn't feel ever finished. 495 00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:25,640 Speaker 1: Next week, Amanda helps us track down some pieces of paper. 496 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:28,799 Speaker 1: It's kind of shocking, right, is your heart beating because 497 00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:31,839 Speaker 1: mine was when I was reading it. I'm really like 498 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:51,880 Speaker 1: shaking right now. It's pretty pretty fucking crazy. Crimetown is 499 00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:56,799 Speaker 1: Zack Stewart Pontier and Mark Smarling. The Ballad of Billy 500 00:37:56,880 --> 00:38:00,080 Speaker 1: Balls is hosted by me Io Till It Right and 501 00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:03,839 Speaker 1: made in partnership with Caden's Thirteen. You can find me 502 00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,800 Speaker 1: on the Internet. Um Io loves you on everything Say hello, 503 00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:08,880 Speaker 1: and if you want to know more, about my story. 504 00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:17,200 Speaker 1: You should pick up my memoir Darling Days. We also 505 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:19,680 Speaker 1: want to hear from you. We have a voicemail set 506 00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:23,360 Speaker 1: up for you to call us. This is Allison, This 507 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:32,120 Speaker 1: podcast for Nana. Thanks Allison. If there's somebody Billy reminds 508 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,719 Speaker 1: you of, or you have a theory on what could 509 00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:37,640 Speaker 1: have happened, or if you can make me laugh, call 510 00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:43,720 Speaker 1: and leave us a voicemail at five seven ohezo a giggle. 511 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,440 Speaker 1: Get you some stickers. You can also get into our 512 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:49,440 Speaker 1: discussion forum on our website, The Ballad of Billy Balls 513 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:57,800 Speaker 1: dot com. This show is produced by Me, Kevin Shepard 514 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:03,040 Speaker 1: and Ryan swigert A. Senior producers Austin Mitchell, editing by 515 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:07,840 Speaker 1: Zack Stewart Pontier and Mark Smirling. Fact checking by Jennifer Blackman. 516 00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:11,920 Speaker 1: This episode was mixed and sound designed by Kenny Qcak. 517 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 1: Music was by Kenny Qcak. That Guy Does a Lot. 518 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: Our title track is Dark Allies by Light Asylum. Archival 519 00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:28,520 Speaker 1: research by Brennan Reese. Thanks as always to Daniella Aria, 520 00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:33,440 Speaker 1: Rachel Lee Right, Emily Wiedemann, Green Card Pictures, Alessandro sent Toro, 521 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,360 Speaker 1: Bill Clegg, Ben Davis or In Rosenbaum and the team 522 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:43,200 Speaker 1: at Cadence thirteen, and of course, my mom, without whom 523 00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:48,800 Speaker 1: none of this would be possible. Thanks Mom, MHM