1 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:07,200 Speaker 1: Maybe by listening and paying attention to the bestage you're given. 2 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:10,520 Speaker 1: Everybody here is that the real value and all this 3 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:12,559 Speaker 1: is being a part of the team, getting the most 4 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 1: out of what you're capable of doing, working hard, learning 5 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: about discipline, being coachable, and if everybody can try to 6 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 1: do that and they have a great coach player relationship, 7 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: and the relationship is gonna build and build and build 8 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,080 Speaker 1: a last for a lifetime. This is the Reformed Sports Project, 9 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:31,560 Speaker 1: a podcast about restoring healthy balance and perspective in all 10 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:35,800 Speaker 1: areas of sports through education and advocacy. Hi, this is 11 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 1: Nick Bonacoor from the Reformed Sports Project podcast. Joining me 12 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:41,000 Speaker 1: today is one of the most storied coaches in the 13 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 1: history of college baseball, as well as a Reformed Sports 14 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,960 Speaker 1: Project advisory board member, Jack Legged coach Legan, and I 15 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: dig into his entire Hall of Fame career, starting at 16 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: the University of Vermont, moving to Western Carolina University and 17 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: where he's most notably known for his success the Clemson Tigers. 18 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 1: We talked about the relationships he formed along the way, 19 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 1: his coaching philosophy, and his thoughts on youth sports. Man. 20 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: I'm fired up. I almost feel like I'm talking to 21 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 1: Michael Corleone. I feel like I'm talking to the Godfather. 22 00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:11,120 Speaker 1: Not in the organized crime sense though, in the college baseball, 23 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: in the college sports sense. I've been fortunate enough to 24 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 1: build a relationship with this gentleman, this legend of the 25 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 1: last you know, year and a half or so. Man, 26 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 1: I can't meet someone or talk to someone at the 27 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: highest at the everyone knows who he is. He's just 28 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 1: a legend, a living legend. It's privileged to have had 29 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:28,120 Speaker 1: the opportunity to connect in form relationship with him. But 30 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:30,800 Speaker 1: once again, Pump to have him former coach of Clemson, 31 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:33,759 Speaker 1: Hall of Fame or all that stuff, Coach Jack Lego, 32 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,200 Speaker 1: Coach Leggo, thanks so much, seven Pump to have you. 33 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:39,039 Speaker 1: I'm glad of here, Nick, glad to talk to you. 34 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:41,400 Speaker 1: Michael cor Leo. When was the last time you were 35 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: called Don corleone first? So this is a groundbreaking interview 36 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 1: before we get started. I love it. I feel like 37 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: I am the guy on the knees at the end 38 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,320 Speaker 1: of the first Godfather when you know he kisses Michael's 39 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 1: hand and says Godfather. You know, like, that's me right now. 40 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 1: So just to give you a little vision you that's 41 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: how I feel. But coach, where where that comes from? Asition, 42 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: I know we spoke about a year or so ago 43 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: on your passionate about youth sports and development and athletics. 44 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:11,080 Speaker 1: We we really got into the importance of kids playing 45 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 1: multiple sports. What I want to talk about here with you. 46 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 1: I've been fortunate to connect with with many coaches, as 47 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:18,640 Speaker 1: you know, you've helped introduced me to quite a few. 48 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,919 Speaker 1: And what I didn't realize coaches, how how vast your 49 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: network is. And and what I mean by that is 50 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,920 Speaker 1: as someone who played at a Division three school. And 51 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:27,880 Speaker 1: I'm gonna set this up here, I'm gonna let you 52 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: go with it. I was Division three player and fortunately 53 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:33,640 Speaker 1: I got to play for another legend, Mike Fox North 54 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 1: Carolina Wesley, and we won championships, had great experience. But 55 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 1: why do I bring that up. It's because you and 56 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 1: I connected Here. I am a little D three player, 57 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 1: but I'm talking to one of the Division one goats 58 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 1: of all time. How well. One of your players, Michael Johnson, 59 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: was my teammate in the summer of We got to 60 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: play in the summer together and through that relationship, you know, 61 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: we talked eighteen twenty years later and this topic of 62 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 1: you sports comes up and he's like, you know, coach, 63 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 1: legged is I've talked doing about it. He's passionate about this. 64 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:06,359 Speaker 1: The point I'm making coaches, the intertwining and how small 65 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:09,920 Speaker 1: I want to call it the fraternity is of college sports. 66 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:13,200 Speaker 1: It's almost like the true value in my opinion, that 67 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: the relationships that you form. It doesn't matter if you're 68 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: D three, doesn't matter if you're D one. It's like 69 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: junior college doesn't matter any I. You've been in that 70 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 1: locker room, you've been in that fight. What is it 71 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:26,920 Speaker 1: about the bonding, the camaraderie that comes across? How does 72 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:30,600 Speaker 1: that happen? God knows that you've done it at every level? Well, 73 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:33,920 Speaker 1: I think inherently, I think everyone wants to be a 74 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 1: part of a team. A team means that you are 75 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 1: working together for a common goal. Uh, you're not afraid 76 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 1: to sweat and work hard and sacrifice and give up 77 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: some things. Um, everyone enjoys the highs of victory, and 78 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 1: deep down everyone wants to exhibit sacrifice discipline toward achieving success. 79 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 1: It all want success to jump in their lap. I 80 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: think everybody enjoys it much better and everybody works hard 81 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 1: together and to achieve something. And I think in that respect, 82 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 1: everybody appreciates much more than there's something that's given to you. 83 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: And I think that's where team sports come in, UM, 84 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 1: And I think you're working toward a common goal and 85 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:17,400 Speaker 1: working hard towards achieving success together with a group. UM. 86 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: Everybody's got strengths and weaknesses, and uh, it's important when 87 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:24,760 Speaker 1: you have a team to everybody leans on everybody's strengths, 88 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 1: everybody overshadows everybody else's weaknesses, and in the end it 89 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 1: becomes great satisfaction and reward and being part of that team. 90 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: The time that you put in together on and off 91 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,480 Speaker 1: the field, in the locker room, on the bus, all 92 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 1: those kinds of things, the low moments, the high moments, 93 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: the tough talks from your coach, the encouraging talks that 94 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: you get from your coach, whatever it might be, all 95 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:51,120 Speaker 1: of those lessons become indelible in your head. If you're 96 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,160 Speaker 1: paying attention to what's going on on with you, you 97 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: become indelible, and then you pass those on to somebody else. 98 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: It might be your family, it might be a team 99 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: that you coach, it might be a kids, your grandkids, 100 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 1: whoever it might be might be a neighbor, might be 101 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 1: somebody in your family or younger brother sister, But um, 102 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: the lessons learned by being a part of that team 103 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 1: get passed on down through generations. And that's what was 104 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: always exciting for me, Nick is just allowing UM baseball 105 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:23,720 Speaker 1: to be a you know, a venue and an atmosphere, 106 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 1: an environment where everybody could learn a little bit more 107 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:30,560 Speaker 1: about themselves and learn what it was the sacrifice to 108 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 1: be a part of the team and be unselfish and 109 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:36,599 Speaker 1: create those relationships that that I enjoyed, uh and still 110 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 1: enjoy with my coaches and players for the rest of 111 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 1: my life. And that's really what it was all about 112 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 1: for me, and I think that's everybody can take. That 113 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: doesn't matter what level you play, or what sport you 114 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 1: play or or whatever. I think those are the valuable 115 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,159 Speaker 1: things that you take out of team sports and being 116 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:54,919 Speaker 1: a part of the team. And I think it's a 117 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,800 Speaker 1: it's a valuable It made my college experience, made my 118 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 1: high school experience, It made my life to be a 119 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 1: part and be responsible to what the team needed. So 120 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 1: that to me, what it's all about, and that's all 121 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 1: that's it, and it's I find an interesting coach because 122 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 1: you know, and I get it. You know when we 123 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 1: spoke earlier, and I can say this is, let's face it, 124 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 1: when you think of Jack Leggett, you think of Clemson. 125 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:18,679 Speaker 1: I mean that's you know you do. But you told 126 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: me your your relationships with at Western Carolina in places 127 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: you were before Clemson are just as valuable, right, I 128 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: mean in many answers. And I know Coach Fox told me, 129 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 1: you know, after he retired from Carolina, He's like, Nick, 130 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: I got just as many calls and messages from North 131 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 1: Carolina Wesleyan people as I did from from the tar heels. 132 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: You know, there's no difference. So the reason I think 133 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:38,960 Speaker 1: this is so important articulate is because in the modern 134 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: day today, you know technology, it's it's so easy to 135 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 1: see which seventeen year old is getting offered you know 136 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 1: which eighteen years So there's almost like this idea that 137 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 1: anything less than a power five or it's always d one, 138 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: is like less than not that that shouldn't be you know, people, 139 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: you should celebrate that. I get that, but it doesn't 140 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,520 Speaker 1: mean that it should look down. A kid should feel 141 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:02,360 Speaker 1: like he's black luster because not everyone has the god 142 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 1: given abilities as a Power five athlete or a D 143 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,919 Speaker 1: one athlete, But that doesn't take away that gold, that 144 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: experience that comes from it. So can you kind of 145 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: get into, you know, the place that you cut your teeth. 146 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 1: You know, you didn't just wake up and become you 147 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 1: college coaches? I mean, you want to talk about a grind, 148 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 1: you do. Guys don't get a lot of money when 149 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: you start this thing. I mean, that's that's that's a 150 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,000 Speaker 1: tough racket to start. And can you talk about those 151 00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: relationships you for him when you were cutting your teeth 152 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 1: before you got into the big time. Well, I will 153 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: because and I'll just start high school. I had really 154 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: good high school coaches, and I was fortunate, you know, 155 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: to you know, a couple of state championship teams and 156 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: never lost the game after the middle of my sophomore 157 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 1: year in football, and then a couple of state championships 158 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:46,280 Speaker 1: in baseball, and the memories that I have with the 159 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: basketball played basketball also, So I played all three sports 160 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 1: in high school and uh, I didn't want to give 161 00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: any of them up. I went to college and it 162 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 1: wasn't about the scholarship. I went to the University of 163 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: Man and no scholarship I just wanted an opportunity to play, 164 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 1: opportunity to learn, and then it was up to me 165 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:05,239 Speaker 1: to prove that I could play at that level and 166 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: be someone of value on that team. And so I 167 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: went there, and I wanted to play football and baseball 168 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 1: because I couldn't give up either one. I love basketball 169 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 1: maybe as much as the other two, but it was 170 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: says in the middle there. So I kind of had 171 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 1: to give that one up and I got to college, 172 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 1: but it hurt me to do it because I really 173 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 1: wanted to play all three and so um to me, 174 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,680 Speaker 1: it was just the opportunity. I didn't need somebody to 175 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:32,480 Speaker 1: promised me anything. I didn't want anybody to tell me 176 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 1: I'm gonna start or do this, or how much I 177 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 1: was gonna play, or how much scholarship I was going 178 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 1: to get or not. It did not matter to me. 179 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:42,960 Speaker 1: I just wanted an opportunity to go to school and 180 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 1: to pursue my athletic dreams as well, and to be 181 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:49,360 Speaker 1: a part of a team. And so that's why I 182 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: chose University of Maine. And there was no guarantees about anything. 183 00:08:52,880 --> 00:08:55,600 Speaker 1: I went there earned my time. There wasn't the biggest, 184 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:59,960 Speaker 1: the fastest, the strongest. But I developed into a very 185 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 1: good player on and captain of both of those teams 186 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:06,079 Speaker 1: and All East and all Conference and all that kind 187 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:09,199 Speaker 1: of stuff and and uh, and I felt like it 188 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 1: was due to the fact that I didn't have anything 189 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 1: handed to me. I didn't have everybody tell me, you know, 190 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: how good I was. I didn't have anybody raped me 191 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,960 Speaker 1: on what kind of player I was in Vermont Um, 192 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 1: you know, before I went to school the University of Maine, 193 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 1: I didn't have. All I knew is what I could 194 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: take care of, and that was I could out work 195 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: anybody else. I could be a sponge and listen and 196 00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 1: pay attention. I could get the most out of my abilities. 197 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: And I could be disciplined, and I could be a 198 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 1: great teammate, and I could be a leader, and I 199 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:45,079 Speaker 1: could figure out how to become the best athlete, best person. 200 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: I could be on my own and uh. And I 201 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 1: had good coaching, I had good people, good structure around me, 202 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: and but we didn't have the facilities that people have now. 203 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: We didn't have. You know, my weight room in college 204 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 1: was a racquetball court with a universal machine in the 205 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: middle of it. And uh, there was no frills there 206 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:05,480 Speaker 1: was no music, there was no mirrors or it was 207 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: just go up to the racketball corps trying to lift 208 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:09,440 Speaker 1: as much as you can't get strong as you could, 209 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 1: go out of the the football field and go to work. 210 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 1: And uh so that was you know, we didn't have 211 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 1: the frills, and so it was it was really basically 212 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 1: about playing all the time. And there was nobody handing 213 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: and handing you anything, and so that was a good lesson. 214 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 1: And went back into the University of Grillington, Vermont at 215 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 1: the University of Vermont, and I was trying to kick, 216 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: and also I played every down on defense and captain 217 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: the defense, but also a field goal kick. And I 218 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 1: still hold or somebody tied it a couple of years back. 219 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 1: Fifty two yard has been hanging in there forty some 220 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 1: odd years now since nineties five, so I guess forty 221 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: five years has been hanging in there as the record 222 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:49,000 Speaker 1: at the University of Main two yards. But I was 223 00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:51,199 Speaker 1: a football player and that was just something I did 224 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:53,319 Speaker 1: on the side, and somebody told me. My coach he 225 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,839 Speaker 1: told me, and he had some experience, told me that 226 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 1: he thought I could kick in the NFL. So I 227 00:10:57,600 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 1: was trying to kick in the NFL and I go 228 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: to the outs whatever in June and I was in 229 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 1: the field house at the University of Vermont kicking and 230 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 1: my leg was very strong at the time, and so 231 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: that's my dream. And the athletic director, Susan A. D 232 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 1: comes through the uh you know, the field house, and 233 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 1: the air opens the door and he walks in and 234 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:18,680 Speaker 1: I knew him. He goes, Jack, how would you like 235 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:20,960 Speaker 1: to be the club baseball coach? Because it was just 236 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: a club team at the time at the University of Vermont. 237 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 1: I pay six hundred dollars twenty games schedule and it's 238 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 1: gonna turn their varsity status in July along with lacrosse 239 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 1: and gymnastics, and if you do a good job, we 240 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 1: may hire you at baseball coach at the University of Mont. 241 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 1: How would have been only twenty three at the time, 242 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 1: So I thought about a day or two, took the job, 243 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:45,840 Speaker 1: and uh you know, we we played our twenty games. 244 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 1: We played against Division one competition, other schools that where 245 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: varsity sports and did well, and they offered me the job. 246 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: Paid me forty nine hundred dollars. I had to get 247 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 1: my master's out of it. I had to teach in 248 00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: the physical education department. I didn't have any assistant coaches. 249 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: So I was coaching every phase of the game, every day, 250 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 1: down the practice, and uh, never thought two things about it. 251 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:09,839 Speaker 1: And then they bumped me up to nine thousand and 252 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 1: next year, then ten to ten, eight eleven, six, rolling 253 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 1: in it, just rolling in it, just rolling in the 254 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 1: dough teaching. I got an assistant coach for fifteen hundred 255 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 1: dollars for the last two years, and uh, but I 256 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 1: was teaching, and I was I had my master's now 257 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 1: by this time, and I was single, and I didn't 258 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 1: give it a second thought except I was doing what 259 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:35,240 Speaker 1: I was passionate about. And so I stayed there five years. 260 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:38,320 Speaker 1: We ended up in the New England Championship game the 261 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 1: last two years against the University of Maine, my old 262 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: Alba model who had scholarships, and we didn't have any 263 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,319 Speaker 1: scholarships at all. All our kids were there just playing. 264 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: And so those guys are now sixty years old or more. 265 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 1: And they were playing for me when I was twenty 266 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 1: four and they were probably eighteen, and I was twenty 267 00:12:57,240 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 1: five and they were nineteen and so forth. And so 268 00:12:59,679 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 1: we of this relationship we've uh, you know, it just 269 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 1: as unbelievable that they look at me as their coach. 270 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,839 Speaker 1: They look at me. There's still you know, there's a 271 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:12,280 Speaker 1: small a difference at that time, but it was big 272 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: enough so that they respected me. I respected them. Um, 273 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:18,680 Speaker 1: so that's awesome. I went to Western Carolina University, went 274 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 1: down south to get better weather, and got that job 275 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: out in in Coloe, North Carolina, and stayed there nine years. 276 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: We won five championships in a row and eighty five, six, seven, eight, 277 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 1: and nine and we're in the championship game eight out 278 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: of nine years. And uh, he was a great, great 279 00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 1: place for me. And and then I ran into coach 280 00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 1: Wilhelm at camp and in the competition when we played 281 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 1: them when I was at Western Carolina and when we 282 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: played Clemson, and he asked me to come over to 283 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: the assistant coach for a couple of years. And he 284 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: knew he was going to retire in a couple of years, 285 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:52,679 Speaker 1: and so he kind of groomed me, and that's kind 286 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:54,960 Speaker 1: of what he he wanted to see the program handed 287 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: over to me. So I was very fortunate that he 288 00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 1: respected me and went through two years as an assistant 289 00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 1: coach and then twenty two years as the head coach, 290 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 1: and then uh NICKI, you know, I got involved with 291 00:14:05,400 --> 00:14:08,960 Speaker 1: USA Baseball for three years, coach the team for two years, 292 00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:12,079 Speaker 1: and deal with the e TEENU team that traveled all 293 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,839 Speaker 1: over the world, and we had great relationship with those kids. 294 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 1: So the bottom line to your question is this, It 295 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 1: doesn't matter whether it's university or from on. It didn't 296 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 1: matter whether it's Western Carolina University. It didn't matter whether 297 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 1: it was Clemson University or the USA Baseball. Every one 298 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 1: of those kids feels a certain loyalty to me. I 299 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 1: feel it to them. We have mutual respect back and forth. 300 00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 1: We have great relationships back and forth. And so it 301 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,280 Speaker 1: doesn't matter at what level or where you're playing the 302 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: sport or what sport you're playing. If the coach does 303 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:46,760 Speaker 1: a good job and he understands he cares about you 304 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 1: more than just as a baseball player, as an athlete 305 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 1: who cares about you academically, cares about you, socially, cares 306 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: about your life. That you learn to care about him 307 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 1: in the same way or her in the same way, 308 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:00,640 Speaker 1: And the next thing you know, you've created that team, 309 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: You've created that will to win, You've created that will 310 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 1: do anything for you or run, you know, through the 311 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: wall before you You've created that mutual um respect, back 312 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 1: and forth, and that creates a relationship for lifetime. And 313 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 1: that's why I got into coaching. That's why we've been 314 00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:23,720 Speaker 1: successful for long period of time. That's why the relationships 315 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: are lasting, and that's why regardless how many games somebody 316 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 1: wins or loses, or teams win or lose or whatever, 317 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 1: the most important takeaway from from all of this is 318 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: the relationships are the things that last the longest, and 319 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: we'll always be there when you know, when things start 320 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 1: to everybody gets a little older or whatever, the relationships 321 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: are always going to be there and the lessons learned 322 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 1: are always gonna be passed on. And that's that's what 323 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: coaching and that's what being part of the team is 324 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: on any level and any sport. And that's what I 325 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: hope any kid who gets involved, you know, with athletics 326 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: or sports, um, I'm hoping if they get coaches that 327 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: care about them, and I'm hoping that they give their 328 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: coaches what the coaches are looking for. That's honest work 329 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: every day, being on time, having a great attitude, being 330 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:16,360 Speaker 1: a good teammate, being unselfish, being coachable, being eager, having 331 00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 1: a smile on your face. You do those things and 332 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 1: you're gonna find you're gonna get the most out of 333 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 1: your coach. And if the coach does those things, he's 334 00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:25,840 Speaker 1: gonna find he's gonna get the most out of his players. 335 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,880 Speaker 1: And it's a pretty simple formula, and not everybody does 336 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 1: it well. But maybe by listening and paying attention to 337 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: what the message you're you're giving everybody here is that 338 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: the real value in all this is being a part 339 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 1: of the team, getting the most out of what you're 340 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: capable of doing, working hard, learning about discipline, and being coachable. 341 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:49,480 Speaker 1: And if everybody can try to do that on both avlus, 342 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: you can have a great coach player relationship, and the 343 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 1: relationship is gonna build a build, a build, and last 344 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 1: for a lifetime Hall of Fame Baseball coach. When we return, 345 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: Coach Legan and I talk about the importance of finding 346 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,040 Speaker 1: a right fit when it comes to college and how 347 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,560 Speaker 1: if you work hard, there's an opportunity for everyone out there. 348 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Reform Sports Project podcast. Where Coach 349 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 1: Legged and I left off, we were about to dig 350 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:22,000 Speaker 1: into finding the right fit from a student athlete perspective 351 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 1: and how the best competitors always compete with respect. Coach, 352 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:28,960 Speaker 1: I did a tweet the other day and you inspired 353 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: I think. I tection and said, you kind of inspired this. 354 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 1: It was when I wrote the D three coach you're 355 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,800 Speaker 1: big leaguing is probably really good friends with the D 356 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:37,800 Speaker 1: one coach that you're dying to play for. And it 357 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: kind of goes on to say, like coaches talk, you know, 358 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: like the message to send it it's not to be 359 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: a threat, it's it's just be aware. And I think 360 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:47,679 Speaker 1: that's it's courtesy, don't burn a bridge like and I 361 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 1: think to me, the whole message was be respectful. You know, 362 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 1: I'm a parent, I have six kids, Like I want 363 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:54,080 Speaker 1: my kids to be respectful to adults, to coaches, And 364 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: that was kind of the message of takeaway. Why you 365 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 1: inspired it as this coach, I'm a D three guy. 366 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: I loved Division three. I would go on the limits. 367 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: I'm biased, right, but why you know why is that? 368 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 1: Probably because I wasn't good enough to play Clemson's I 369 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:07,679 Speaker 1: probably piste off about it. I don't know. But at 370 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 1: the end of the day, one of your best friends, 371 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,879 Speaker 1: which I found out or was, is that Flaherty. I 372 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,520 Speaker 1: didn't know. I had no idea. He's a legend. You know, 373 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:17,919 Speaker 1: he's a Division three coaching legend. I mean one of 374 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:21,200 Speaker 1: the best programs in the country is Southern Maine. Um. 375 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 1: You know they've won national titles. And I mean, you know, 376 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:25,719 Speaker 1: for me, I was at North Carolina Wesley and you're 377 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 1: talking about you know, you go to the World Series. 378 00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 1: We're running into Southern Maine, We're running into eastern Connecticut. 379 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:32,359 Speaker 1: And I find out you also know Bill Hallowaddy, right? 380 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:34,959 Speaker 1: And why why am I bringing this up? Bringing it up? 381 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 1: Because it's true? And you know, I would love for 382 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 1: you to talk about how because people will say to me, 383 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:42,200 Speaker 1: and I've actually had Division three coaches tell me no, 384 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 1: I love. I asked him, like, do you aspire to 385 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: go to the Vision one level? Some say sure, I 386 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,560 Speaker 1: love to maybe, but some say, man, I love where 387 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 1: I'm at. I'm a lifer here. I love what I 388 00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:52,760 Speaker 1: know we've built. So on and so forth. With your 389 00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 1: conversation with coach Flaherty, your relationship, like was there any 390 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:58,199 Speaker 1: ever like, oh, he didn't make it because he's not 391 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:00,880 Speaker 1: a D one, aren't there great coach? Is that every level? 392 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,639 Speaker 1: Can you kind of dig into that specifically when it 393 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:06,680 Speaker 1: comes to there's there's great teachers at every level and 394 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 1: case and point. Obviously you and coach Flarty share that 395 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 1: relationship and you're both legends in your own particular right right. 396 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 1: I think there's a great point is uh, the fact 397 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,520 Speaker 1: that there's a school for everybody out there. There's an 398 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 1: opportunity out there for everybody at every level. And not everybody. Um, 399 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:27,159 Speaker 1: if everybody like the same girl would be in trouble, 400 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: everybody like the same food, everybody like the same food, 401 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 1: there would be one restaurant. If everybody like the same car, 402 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 1: there'd be one car. This world survives on diversity. This 403 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:40,200 Speaker 1: world survives on people being different and having a different 404 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:42,879 Speaker 1: opinion and having different likes and so forth, and and 405 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:47,160 Speaker 1: different abilities, and so yeah, there's there's great coaches at 406 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:49,920 Speaker 1: the Division three level, at the junior college level, at 407 00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,680 Speaker 1: any I level, at Vision two level, you know, all 408 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:56,240 Speaker 1: levels of Division one. There's really good coaches out there. 409 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 1: Not everybody can be a Division one coach. Not everybody 410 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: can be a Power of five coach. Not everybody is 411 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 1: built that way. Not everybody is built to be a 412 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: head coach. There's there's coaches out there that just love 413 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:10,439 Speaker 1: being an assistant coach. You have to understand what your 414 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: strengths and weaknesses are, UM, what opportunities are available, what 415 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 1: life changes you have to make. UM. You know Eddie Flaherty, 416 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 1: for instance, as a Division three coach, that's his niche. 417 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:25,040 Speaker 1: He's very good at it. He's respected, he's a Hall 418 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 1: of famer, he's been successful, he's got his players are 419 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:32,840 Speaker 1: just as loyal and appreciative and respectful as the players 420 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,480 Speaker 1: that I ran into the Division one level. UM, there's 421 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: high school coaches that are incredibly successful and have loyalty 422 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 1: and respect back and forth from their players, and their 423 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 1: kids go off and come back and they remember their 424 00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 1: high school coaches like I remember mine, and I remember 425 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 1: what they did for me. I remember what they told 426 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 1: me at certain times. I remember how you know you 427 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:53,760 Speaker 1: get your rear end shoot, or I remember how you 428 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,080 Speaker 1: got encouraged. I remember all of those things. So there's 429 00:20:57,119 --> 00:21:01,560 Speaker 1: no magic formula about whether you're success or not by 430 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 1: what level of baseball or what level of sport or 431 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 1: what level uh that you're teaching at your coaching at. 432 00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 1: And you know one of my big talks, or you 433 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 1: know one of my big emphasis UM at the national 434 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,919 Speaker 1: convention this past year, the abc A Convention was I 435 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:22,880 Speaker 1: parlayed it off Garth Brooks's UM song The Dance, which 436 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:25,520 Speaker 1: is maybe my favorite song and in all of the world, 437 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:28,639 Speaker 1: and all it says is if I knew how this 438 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,400 Speaker 1: would end, would it have been worth? The dance would 439 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:33,959 Speaker 1: have been worth everything I put into it. Where you know, 440 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 1: everybody feels like a king at one time, but I 441 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 1: didn't know that the king would fall. So not everybody 442 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 1: ends up and finishes up as well as they want 443 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,840 Speaker 1: to at the end of the season or the end 444 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:46,920 Speaker 1: of their career, you know, in terms of the number 445 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 1: of wins and losses or whatever. But it's about the dance, 446 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 1: It's about the relationships, is about the work and the 447 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 1: journey toward trying to win the games and peaching the 448 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:00,040 Speaker 1: kids and developing them and so forth. So there's a 449 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: level for everybody as an athlete, and there's a level 450 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:09,440 Speaker 1: for everybody as a coach and nobody and I certainly 451 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: have got some great relationships with Vision two three coaches, 452 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:16,280 Speaker 1: junior coaches. It doesn't matter to me because I've got 453 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,800 Speaker 1: respect for what they're going through and what part to 454 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,959 Speaker 1: sacrifice to make their program working in a lot of ways. 455 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: You know, there were a lot of times, to be 456 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 1: honest with you, Nick, there were a lot of times 457 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 1: where we might Unfortunately wasn't many, but there were times 458 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,200 Speaker 1: where a team would jump on a van drive five hours. 459 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,199 Speaker 1: It was a Division one program, but they might not 460 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:38,919 Speaker 1: have had the same advantages we had it Clampson in 461 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 1: the same budget, to the same salaries or whatever it was. 462 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: But they came here and they might beat us on 463 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: a Tuesday or Wednesday. And I had been at that 464 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,439 Speaker 1: level before. I had been there before, so I knew 465 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:53,359 Speaker 1: what these guys were doing. They were getting on a 466 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,879 Speaker 1: van at twelve, new getting here at five, jumping on 467 00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: the field, putting their cleeps on and the dugout and 468 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,120 Speaker 1: putting your jerseys onto the dug out, stretching, going out 469 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:04,959 Speaker 1: and taking batter practice and then beat us. And you know, 470 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 1: I had respects for that because I knew what they got. 471 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:09,439 Speaker 1: I would it would be driving home in a van 472 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 1: and I would pick up the phone and call a 473 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: coach and I would say, you know you got us today, 474 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:16,760 Speaker 1: special program. I know what it took to get down here, 475 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 1: and he has tough pulled a Swallow and I had 476 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:21,719 Speaker 1: five thousand people in the stands and weren't excited about it. 477 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 1: But I tell you how much I respect your program. 478 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: I've done that several times because I know it's all 479 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:31,560 Speaker 1: about the different levels. And your comment is right on 480 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: the mark that it doesn't matter what level you play 481 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 1: with sport you play if you have a good relationship 482 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 1: coach player relationship and you know you're all in the 483 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:42,359 Speaker 1: same you know, I'm in the trenches with you and 484 00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:44,120 Speaker 1: you're in the trenches with me, and then that's all 485 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,160 Speaker 1: it counts. That's what's memorable. You know, you just released 486 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: your book and your course, which is phenomenal. I'm grateful 487 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,439 Speaker 1: to have been able to read the book. It was outstanding. 488 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 1: So in the book, though, as I'm reading, in the 489 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 1: middle of the book is a picture of you and 490 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: and Coach Fox. You and Mike Fox, who I look 491 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:01,680 Speaker 1: up to tremendously. I played for him for one year, 492 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 1: but I've never played for someone like that. And it's 493 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,119 Speaker 1: not because he went on to Carolina to have an 494 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,679 Speaker 1: amazing career Carolines, Because I just I think you know 495 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,600 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. When I say this, I'd still pick 496 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 1: up the phone with him now and he laughs when 497 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:14,400 Speaker 1: I tell him so. He scares me in a good way, 498 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,399 Speaker 1: like I just I want to like, I want to 499 00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,280 Speaker 1: salute him. I want to just yes, sir, like he 500 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,040 Speaker 1: You know, It's just I have the utmost respect for him. 501 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,159 Speaker 1: He brought the most out of me. I take a 502 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: picture of the book, the picture of you and him 503 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 1: shaking hands, and I sent it to my go coach. 504 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 1: I'm reading Coach Legget's book and look at this picture 505 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:30,879 Speaker 1: right in the middle of the book, and he writes 506 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 1: back one word and all capital letters. He writes back, respect. 507 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 1: What do you think he means by that? We had 508 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 1: mutual respect even though we had great competition. Uh we 509 00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,680 Speaker 1: battled for the same goal, to get to win a 510 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 1: national championship when the a C C Championship, and to 511 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: be each other on the weekends. We had respect for 512 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:55,760 Speaker 1: each other's program is kids worked hard. Our kids worked hard. 513 00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: We played hard. They played hard. There was no bs 514 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,920 Speaker 1: going back and forth between the dugouts or anything like that. 515 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,800 Speaker 1: It was just it was a respect back and forth 516 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: for his program and his his team for our program. 517 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 1: And uh So, I think that's regardless of the intensity 518 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: of the competition. That's one word that should always um 519 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:22,440 Speaker 1: be prevalent, and that is respect. You respect your opponent. 520 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:26,439 Speaker 1: You don't fear them, you know, you know, you're not 521 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:30,720 Speaker 1: afraid of them, you know, um just respect them, but 522 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:33,439 Speaker 1: you respect them. And if you respect your opponent and 523 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 1: you respect the people you're playing against and they earn it, 524 00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:39,159 Speaker 1: then that's where the competition is fun. That's where it 525 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:44,000 Speaker 1: was all out all seven innings that weekend three games series. 526 00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 1: It was all out on the table, all out out 527 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:49,200 Speaker 1: in the field. And that's where that's where that word 528 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 1: comes in. We had mutual respect for each other and 529 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 1: we shook hands and then it was on for three 530 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 1: days and we try to give each other our best knocks, 531 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:05,120 Speaker 1: suck each other out, but in a sportsmanship and respectful way. 532 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,160 Speaker 1: And uh, I think that's what he meant by that, 533 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: because I would use that word as well. Is there 534 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,600 Speaker 1: something about the rivalries that bring out like you might 535 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:15,400 Speaker 1: not like each other between the lines. I'm not talking 536 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:17,439 Speaker 1: about you. I'm talking about as a competitor myself. Our 537 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,520 Speaker 1: rival in college was Methodist right North Carolina, Wesley Methis. 538 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:22,200 Speaker 1: We didn't like each other. You know, it was wise 539 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:24,159 Speaker 1: because both of us were it was one of us 540 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:25,919 Speaker 1: usually was going to the World Series. Most of the 541 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,000 Speaker 1: time it was us. But nonetheless they gave us the business. 542 00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,480 Speaker 1: But it was respect. We might have hated each other 543 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: for that nine innings that day and we really didn't 544 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: like each other, but it brought out the best. Is 545 00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 1: that kind of what you mean, it's like this love 546 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,439 Speaker 1: hate relationship. Yeah, it's just like kind of pretty much anything. 547 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:44,479 Speaker 1: You know, it's uh, you know, you you always if 548 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,359 Speaker 1: you've got this respect, you can compete hard. You can 549 00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:49,920 Speaker 1: you know, you can grind it out. You can look 550 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:51,960 Speaker 1: each other in the eye and go, we're gonna beat 551 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: you today, all this kind of stuff, and you can 552 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: be on the edge, but at the same time, when 553 00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:59,919 Speaker 1: it's over, it's over. And during it you just got 554 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 1: to handling yourself like a man and yourself like a gentleman. 555 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 1: Make sure your team is always handling themselves the way 556 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 1: they're supposed to and being respectful to their opponent. If 557 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:11,520 Speaker 1: you can do that and have a very competitive team, 558 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 1: then you really got something going. And I think that's uh, 559 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 1: you know, that's the goal of all coaches, is um, 560 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 1: you don't want to be on that edge where the 561 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 1: people leave your field and they go, man, that was 562 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:24,080 Speaker 1: the bush league outfit, or that was a bush league competition. 563 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 1: I've I'll be honest with you, I've played against some 564 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:30,359 Speaker 1: teams and some players and some coaches that I didn't 565 00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:33,000 Speaker 1: want to come back to my field, and that's very rare. 566 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,439 Speaker 1: But I can I can name a few on my 567 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: on my hand that one time was enough, didn't didn't 568 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,840 Speaker 1: neither to do it together, and that's unfortunate. But you know, 569 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,560 Speaker 1: I've coached over two thousand games Indivision one baseball games, 570 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,520 Speaker 1: and we've won a lot of them, you know, but 571 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,000 Speaker 1: in the end, and we've lost. You know, we've won 572 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:54,200 Speaker 1: over thirteen hundred and sixty whatever it was, and we've 573 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,080 Speaker 1: lost something, you know. And but either way, you gotta 574 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: walk off the field knowing that your team, even their best, 575 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,639 Speaker 1: and uh hopefully that team driving away in the vans 576 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 1: or on the bus or going to grab a plane 577 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 1: or whatever it might be, says man. That was great competition. 578 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: I respect that program. The feedback I get from the 579 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 1: coaches that we competed against is always positive that way, 580 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,280 Speaker 1: and I feel good about that. I don't think anybody's 581 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:21,160 Speaker 1: out there going, man, that was a Bush leagu outfit. Man, 582 00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:23,920 Speaker 1: they were you know, I don't see that or haven't 583 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:26,680 Speaker 1: felt that in the thirty eight years or forty years 584 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:29,199 Speaker 1: I've been coaching. I think it's I think it's one 585 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 1: of the things I'm most proud of is the fact 586 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,479 Speaker 1: that people left our field or we left their field. Uh, 587 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:37,719 Speaker 1: they respected our team played, how hard they played, how 588 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:41,680 Speaker 1: tough they played, Uh, and uh, how do they want 589 00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 1: about their business? So I think that's that's what Coach 590 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:47,720 Speaker 1: Walks meant by respect. It was just mutual respect back 591 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: and forth. That's exactly what I took. Coach legged Man, 592 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: this has been awesome. You're the freaking man. I'm I 593 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 1: love it. I get nervous, I get nervous talking to 594 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,200 Speaker 1: you guys, but I love it. I'm grateful for you. Um. 595 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 1: People talk about like the Parcels coaching tree, the Belichick 596 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 1: coaching tree. Your coaching tree is just absolutely it's stupid. 597 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 1: It's ridiculous. It's real quick, I'll say, and then in 598 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 1: forty five seconds to say something about it. This is 599 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 1: all I know. It's Tim Corbin, it's uh coach slash, 600 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 1: it's Eric Beck, it it is uh the hell else, 601 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 1: it's it's O'Sullivan, O'Sullivan, Marginus, Tom Regina, Dan Pepiselli, Cornell, 602 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 1: Toma Ginus, who went through Mike Hampton at St. John's, 603 00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: you know, John Polowski at Western Kentucky. It goes on 604 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 1: and on. There's just so many guys that are out 605 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: there coaching that I'm proud of. And uh, guys that 606 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: either played for me or coached with me. Um, you know, 607 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 1: they're out there. They're spread the word, you know North 608 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: Carolina at that hall, Uh, you know, And I think 609 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,080 Speaker 1: it's Uh, there's just so many guys out there that 610 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:53,520 Speaker 1: are either assistant coaches, head coaches, that are grinding, that 611 00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 1: are teaching, that have taken lessons from the times we 612 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 1: spent together, and hopefully they're spreading them. And I keep protesting. 613 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 1: All these guys. They keep in touch with me, and 614 00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,240 Speaker 1: they asked, you know, advice, you know called and what 615 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: do you think about this? What do you think about that? 616 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 1: Or just talk um. And I think it's, uh, it's 617 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,400 Speaker 1: a testament to you know, the programs that we've run 618 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: and how we've got about it and uh, and the 619 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 1: fact that I've been lucky enough to recruit really good, 620 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 1: solid people who want to pass these things on and 621 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: want to coach. And I've been able to hire a 622 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: really good guys around me that you know, have brought 623 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 1: off the best of me as well as me hopefully 624 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,680 Speaker 1: teaching them something to let them go off and do 625 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:34,520 Speaker 1: their own thing in a different environment and different venue. 626 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 1: And I think, Uh, it's one of the things I'm 627 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,960 Speaker 1: most proud of is you know, I turn on the 628 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 1: TV and I see guys playing for national championship against 629 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: each other and and uh, they both worked in the 630 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 1: program at one point. I see another guy win a 631 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 1: national championship a couple of years ago, and he's spent 632 00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,120 Speaker 1: nine years with me, and I just see it over 633 00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 1: and over and over. Rodney end and at Georgia Southern 634 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:57,720 Speaker 1: head coach at Georgia South. I mean, it goes on 635 00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 1: and on. That there's that there's guys that have been 636 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 1: involved in our programs that are are now out there 637 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: teaching and coaching. And that's probably one of the things 638 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: I'm most excited about. Coach leggat jack leggot dot com, 639 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 1: they can pick out all of the course, it's not 640 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 1: just a book at the court. Where where can they 641 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,400 Speaker 1: find that? Jack leggot dot com, Jack Legot dot com 642 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,080 Speaker 1: they can find the book. It's called The a b 643 00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:24,760 Speaker 1: CS of Excellence, and uh it's a book for all sports, um, 644 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:31,200 Speaker 1: all coaches at any level, athletes, businesspeople, parents, anybody who's 645 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 1: striving to find a little bit more assholes in their life. 646 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 1: I think it's simple read, it's easy read. It's something 647 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:38,959 Speaker 1: that's got, you know, good lessons in it. And at 648 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: the same time, at Jack Legott dot com they can 649 00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 1: bundle it with the course, which is twenty nine videos 650 00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 1: that are all ten minutes or less and they have 651 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:49,160 Speaker 1: free access to that once they buy the book and 652 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:52,160 Speaker 1: the course together. And we had a zoom call the 653 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,120 Speaker 1: other night with a bunch of coaches. They bought it 654 00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:57,600 Speaker 1: on the launch in the early part and uh so, 655 00:31:57,760 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 1: I think it was about hundred fifty. The head of 656 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:03,280 Speaker 1: Acts sense to that either live or at a different times, 657 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 1: so that was neat. We may do some more of those, 658 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:07,360 Speaker 1: but I can go to Jack dot com or then 659 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:09,400 Speaker 1: go to Amazon and get the book alone, and pretty 660 00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: surely that will be the ability to get the book 661 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:14,280 Speaker 1: and the course separately. But I recommend both of them together. 662 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 1: I think they're very valuable tools to find out how 663 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:18,760 Speaker 1: you can be better at what you want to be. 664 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,120 Speaker 1: You need to change that website to the goat dot 665 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,680 Speaker 1: com Greatest of all time. Baby. I'm grateful for your coach. 666 00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:26,640 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Thanks Nick, I appreciate everything that's 667 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: shack legged Hall of Fame Baseball coach. Thanks for listening 668 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 1: to The Reformed Sports Project podcast Dominic Boncourt and Our 669 00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 1: goal is to restore a healthy balance and perspective in 670 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: all areas of sports through education and advocacy. For updates, 671 00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,720 Speaker 1: please follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram, or check 672 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,520 Speaker 1: out our website by searching for the Reformed Sports Project